1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,639 Speaker 1: My rule for the position players was to respect ninety 2 00:00:02,640 --> 00:00:05,400 Speaker 1: feet and my rules for the pitchers were too. I 3 00:00:05,440 --> 00:00:08,200 Speaker 1: wanted you to work on your defense on a daily basis. 4 00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:11,320 Speaker 1: Whatever that meant, just please, I want good defensive pitchers. 5 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 1: Other than that, man, you were on your own. 6 00:00:17,440 --> 00:00:18,000 Speaker 2: Here we go. 7 00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:21,480 Speaker 3: We got Joe Madden joining us right now, former longtime skipper, 8 00:00:21,560 --> 00:00:23,400 Speaker 3: and many ways to check out what Joe's doing. 9 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:24,959 Speaker 2: We'll talk about the pod and all of that coming 10 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:26,240 Speaker 2: up in a moment. Joe. 11 00:00:26,560 --> 00:00:29,040 Speaker 3: Great to have you on. I'm sure you've been listening 12 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:32,280 Speaker 3: to some of our banter here. AJ wants to know 13 00:00:32,320 --> 00:00:35,720 Speaker 3: if you've ever code read him before to hit him, 14 00:00:35,720 --> 00:00:37,920 Speaker 3: and what you thought about the recent back and forth 15 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:38,960 Speaker 3: with the Padres and Dodgers. 16 00:00:38,960 --> 00:00:42,680 Speaker 1: How you doing good? Thanks for having me boys, and yeah, listen, 17 00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:44,560 Speaker 1: we had a lot of reason to code red AJ, 18 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:46,040 Speaker 1: but never did. Right. 19 00:00:46,159 --> 00:00:46,880 Speaker 4: That is a lie. 20 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 5: That is a bull faced lie, Joe, because calviam Basketball 21 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:52,440 Speaker 5: hit me after we beat you oh five. 22 00:00:52,479 --> 00:00:55,320 Speaker 4: The next year my first bat and you weren't the manager, 23 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:56,400 Speaker 4: but you were the bench coach. 24 00:00:56,440 --> 00:01:00,560 Speaker 5: So I'm playing in Sosia and you and then and 25 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 5: then there was. 26 00:01:01,360 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 4: One in twenty twelve. 27 00:01:02,640 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 5: You were still in you were still in Tampa and 28 00:01:05,560 --> 00:01:07,760 Speaker 5: Alex cob hitting me after you guys thought I had 29 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:11,080 Speaker 5: a dirty slide on Zobras, and then Katana threw behind 30 00:01:11,160 --> 00:01:12,000 Speaker 5: Ben Zobris. 31 00:01:12,240 --> 00:01:15,119 Speaker 4: You guys all whined, and that was the famous hawk Harrelson. 32 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:19,040 Speaker 1: Wagner, what are you doing? See, when you have a 33 00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:21,480 Speaker 1: really good veteran team, the manager never has to say anything, 34 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 1: and you know that really should should never have to 35 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:26,400 Speaker 1: come from the manager. These are the kind of things 36 00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:29,000 Speaker 1: you talk about in spring training. Uh, And it's always 37 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 1: about defending your own brood. My experience has been most 38 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 1: of the times when this has red, it's obviously obvious 39 00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:38,480 Speaker 1: when it should happen. But what normally occurs is that 40 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:40,959 Speaker 1: a veteran pitcher will mosey up to somebody, whether it's 41 00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:42,959 Speaker 1: somebody in a bullpen coming into the game, a guy 42 00:01:42,959 --> 00:01:45,560 Speaker 1: in the pen, or somebody on the bench itself. But 43 00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 1: these are conversations we all have in spring training. I 44 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:50,840 Speaker 1: could honestly tell you I've never went up and told 45 00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 1: or asked anybody to hit a batter, but it's it's 46 00:01:53,840 --> 00:01:56,680 Speaker 1: been done because of the unwritten rules. And you guys 47 00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 1: were talking about something previous to this about a pitcher's 48 00:01:59,680 --> 00:02:01,960 Speaker 1: or pitch that cannot do it. I'll tell you why. 49 00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:04,760 Speaker 1: I mean, I had a young pitcher with the Rays 50 00:02:04,800 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 1: that one of the dudes asked him to hit somebody, 51 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:09,440 Speaker 1: and this guy was totally freaked out of it. He's 52 00:02:09,440 --> 00:02:11,600 Speaker 1: a really good picture because he had never done it 53 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:13,960 Speaker 1: before and he didn't want to do it, and this 54 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:16,240 Speaker 1: is it puts the guy in a very difficult situation. 55 00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 1: So really, when you asked, when it's asked of a 56 00:02:20,040 --> 00:02:22,240 Speaker 1: pitcher to do something like this, and I know, like 57 00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:24,800 Speaker 1: Ozzie would get upset if somebody didn't drow somebody at 58 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:27,560 Speaker 1: the right time. I know that, but you have to 59 00:02:27,560 --> 00:02:29,480 Speaker 1: ask the right guys. Chuck Philly one of the best. 60 00:02:29,720 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 1: Chuck you would pick out a thigh. That was this 61 00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: big thing like I think Eric brought up about or 62 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:36,240 Speaker 1: somebody brought up about throwing behind the guy at his butt. 63 00:02:36,440 --> 00:02:38,480 Speaker 1: Pick out a thigh is always the most effective way. 64 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:43,200 Speaker 6: Joe I one time got in trouble from a manager 65 00:02:44,040 --> 00:02:48,160 Speaker 6: because I told one of our pitchers to hit somebody 66 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:51,600 Speaker 6: because they hit Yelly three times in a row and 67 00:02:51,639 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 6: the Cardinals just nobody on our team, and I got 68 00:02:55,480 --> 00:02:58,840 Speaker 6: aired out by Craig counsel. So have you seen it 69 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 6: where managers only want to be the one that's ordering 70 00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:03,440 Speaker 6: the code read. 71 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:08,320 Speaker 1: I can't. I can't say that specifically because I know so. 72 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:10,120 Speaker 1: She never wanted to throw at anybody. I'm going to tell 73 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 1: you that right straight up. So she did not like 74 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:14,360 Speaker 1: that at all. And again, like I've started, I've not 75 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 1: specifically seen that. No, But again back to my original point, 76 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 1: conversation in spring training was always about protecting one another. 77 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:23,200 Speaker 1: You talk about the Cardinals. The time I was with 78 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 1: the Cubs, the Cardinals as much as anybody would throw 79 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:28,600 Speaker 1: at somebody that was part of their culture there, and 80 00:03:28,639 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 1: you knew that. And I remember specifically there's a situation 81 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:34,840 Speaker 1: in Wrigley where I felt that was happening against us. 82 00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:37,880 Speaker 1: And my comment afterwards was that we don't start anything, 83 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:40,640 Speaker 1: but we're going to stop stuff. We'll stop something that occurs. 84 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:43,960 Speaker 1: So if you in fact believe you're being attacked, of 85 00:03:44,040 --> 00:03:46,600 Speaker 1: course you have to retaliate. I don't care what anybody says. 86 00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 1: I don't care about the narrative that's been created in 87 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:51,720 Speaker 1: today's games. It's just the way things need to be done. 88 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:54,080 Speaker 1: I'll tell you the two thousand and eight Rays send 89 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:56,360 Speaker 1: it as quickly as we did because of the fight 90 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 1: we had in spring training with the Yankees and then 91 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:00,440 Speaker 1: the fight we had with the Red Sox there season, 92 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:03,720 Speaker 1: because we had to take that division. Nobody was going 93 00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 1: to give it to us, and these guys were pushing 94 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: the Devil Rays around for years. So I think the 95 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:11,560 Speaker 1: two of the biggest moments there seven of moments in 96 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:13,840 Speaker 1: the history of the Rays was the fight when Elliot 97 00:04:13,880 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 1: Johnson pancaked Francisco Servelli at home plate in a spring 98 00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:20,719 Speaker 1: training game, and the other one was when Shields got 99 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 1: Cocoa Crispin the thigh to start the game after there 100 00:04:24,080 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 1: was in issue of the night before these You know, 101 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:27,960 Speaker 1: some people could argue all they want, but these are 102 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:31,240 Speaker 1: the kind of things that may be necessary to galvanize 103 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 1: a team, and all of a sudden, yeah, you start 104 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:36,120 Speaker 1: believing in yourself. He become a little bit tougher, quite frankly. 105 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:37,960 Speaker 1: And I don't I don't see anything wrong with it. 106 00:04:37,960 --> 00:04:40,240 Speaker 1: I don't want anybody throw on anybody's head, Absolutely not. 107 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:42,600 Speaker 1: That's not the point. Picking out of thighs the pro 108 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:44,520 Speaker 1: way of doing it, all right. 109 00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:47,240 Speaker 4: Two things, One, Ozzie, once you mentioned that he got mad. 110 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:49,400 Speaker 5: I was there for that. I was catching I got 111 00:04:49,480 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 5: hit twice. He told somebody to throw it a guy. 112 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:54,599 Speaker 5: He missed, he got he didn't took him out. It's 113 00:04:54,640 --> 00:04:57,840 Speaker 5: a whole song. It's still is raging today because the 114 00:04:58,160 --> 00:05:00,560 Speaker 5: kid got sent down. He was getting sent down or regardless, 115 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:02,839 Speaker 5: but he missed. And then Azzie came out put on 116 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 5: a show and it was a big and I had 117 00:05:04,960 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 5: nothing to I didn't tell anybody to hit anybody. Somehow 118 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:09,000 Speaker 5: I get that I was told I didn't tell anybody 119 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:11,040 Speaker 5: hit anybody. I didn't know what was going on. I 120 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:12,840 Speaker 5: knew that he was getting sent down. After the game. 121 00:05:13,080 --> 00:05:15,880 Speaker 4: It just sucked for the kid. Whatever, I apologize, I 122 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 4: had none do with it. 123 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:18,760 Speaker 5: So but then my question is is I've also seen 124 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:21,040 Speaker 5: this one because Tom Okay, So I had Tom Kelly. 125 00:05:21,160 --> 00:05:22,840 Speaker 5: Tom Kelly wouldn't put a young kid in to hit 126 00:05:22,839 --> 00:05:25,440 Speaker 5: a guy. He would say, Rookie, no, I want a 127 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 5: veteran because of what you said. Now, have you ever 128 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:30,120 Speaker 5: had a guy tell you no, Because I've seen that 129 00:05:30,160 --> 00:05:33,400 Speaker 5: happen too, where a manager has gone to a player 130 00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:34,919 Speaker 5: and said I want you to hit this guy, and 131 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 5: this picture said no, I'm not doing it again. 132 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:42,000 Speaker 1: I've never said that directly to a picture. I have not. 133 00:05:42,160 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 1: I know that you'll see that. Like I said, a 134 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:47,359 Speaker 1: vet might mosey up to somebody in between innings, or 135 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:49,240 Speaker 1: it could come from the bullpen, comes from all a 136 00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:52,240 Speaker 1: bunch of different directions. I've seen guys attempt to hit 137 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:54,600 Speaker 1: somebody and miss, and at some point you got to 138 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:56,640 Speaker 1: stop trying. I mean, you just can't keep throwing at 139 00:05:56,720 --> 00:05:59,240 Speaker 1: him like he's a dartboard. That's not the point. So 140 00:05:59,320 --> 00:06:01,800 Speaker 1: I've seen that where it's failed, and then you've got 141 00:06:01,839 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 1: to move on. At some point. You don't want to 142 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 1: hurt anybody, even when it's when you throw at and 143 00:06:07,240 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 1: sometimes miss intentionally, at least the message has been sent. 144 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 1: Of course, the guy on your team that had been 145 00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:16,200 Speaker 1: hit really would prefer a pound of flesh. I understand that, 146 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:19,160 Speaker 1: But there's these little the nuance of doing something like this. 147 00:06:20,000 --> 00:06:22,920 Speaker 1: The hit needs to be below the waist, I believe, 148 00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:25,960 Speaker 1: and sometimes it has to be done. The message has 149 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 1: been sent, and I'll argue that with anybody today's world, 150 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:32,520 Speaker 1: especially let's just say the sports world in baseball, doesn't 151 00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 1: believe in this kind of stuff where where you get 152 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 1: to the point where there's an instant replay going on 153 00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 1: things that are being reviewed, and you have guys from 154 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:41,760 Speaker 1: two different teams standing on second base, arm in arm 155 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:45,160 Speaker 1: practically looking at the scoreboard because score all this stuff 156 00:06:45,160 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 1: really I think subtracts emotion from the game. The technology, 157 00:06:48,440 --> 00:06:51,760 Speaker 1: more technology involved, the less emotion involved. So that part 158 00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:54,880 Speaker 1: of it I don't like. So you're seeing that bore today. 159 00:06:55,320 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: Nobody really wants to be that crew. But I didn't 160 00:06:57,520 --> 00:07:00,240 Speaker 1: see the Padre Dodger exchange, by the way. I have 161 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:02,520 Speaker 1: to check that out. But in today I can see 162 00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:05,440 Speaker 1: shilty shilty with the Padres. I get that day with 163 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:07,640 Speaker 1: the Dodgers, you know, and these are two of the 164 00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:10,080 Speaker 1: better teams. You have to take your own turf man. 165 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:11,320 Speaker 1: Nobody's going to give it to you. 166 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:13,200 Speaker 4: Agreed. I agree. 167 00:07:14,720 --> 00:07:17,720 Speaker 3: It is summertime. We are in the thick of golf season. 168 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:20,040 Speaker 3: It's always golf season down in Florida, but we're in 169 00:07:20,080 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 3: the thick of golf season across the country and someone's 170 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:24,000 Speaker 3: looking to get a new club. 171 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 2: That logo should say it all p XG. What do 172 00:07:28,760 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 2: they do? 173 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:31,360 Speaker 5: Don't get fitted? Go get fitted by one of their 174 00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 5: master fitters, professional fitters. I've done it. It's helped shave 175 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 5: many strokes off my handicap. It is worth it. It's educational. 176 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 5: You learn about not only clubs, you learn about chefs, 177 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 5: You learn about grips, you learn about angles. They have 178 00:07:43,560 --> 00:07:45,760 Speaker 5: all the numbers, all the setups that you need to 179 00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 5: help improve your handicap. 180 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 2: You feel like of VIP when you're there one hundred percent. 181 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:52,880 Speaker 4: They even help my putting which needed. 182 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:56,160 Speaker 2: Help there, They help your putting there there. That's how 183 00:07:56,200 --> 00:07:56,720 Speaker 2: cool it is. 184 00:07:56,960 --> 00:07:59,520 Speaker 3: So schedule you're fitting today and for a limited time 185 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 3: you could save up to twenty percent on your entire order. 186 00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:05,760 Speaker 3: Head over to PXG dot com slash foul. That's PXG 187 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:07,920 Speaker 3: dot com slash foul to save up to twenty percent 188 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:12,000 Speaker 3: on your entire order. P XG dot com slash foul. 189 00:08:12,160 --> 00:08:14,520 Speaker 3: Restrictions apply se site for details. 190 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:16,600 Speaker 5: All right, let's go on to something a little bit 191 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:20,360 Speaker 5: just as crazy as throwing it. Guys Rafield Devers talking 192 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:23,080 Speaker 5: about emotion. Well, it's got emotional for the Red Sox 193 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:25,760 Speaker 5: and for him. How would you have handled this situation 194 00:08:25,920 --> 00:08:28,840 Speaker 5: if you were the manager of the Red Sox. I mean, 195 00:08:28,840 --> 00:08:31,520 Speaker 5: what's your thoughts on this? Because you've been through a lot. 196 00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:35,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, it starts it starts in the beginning. I guess 197 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 1: that's yogiism. You know, the moment that they knew they 198 00:08:38,200 --> 00:08:40,439 Speaker 1: wanted to get Bregman and they had a chance to 199 00:08:40,440 --> 00:08:42,320 Speaker 1: get Bregman. I think that's when the dialogue needed to 200 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:46,440 Speaker 1: be created. Now with Devers, I know that the concern 201 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:48,200 Speaker 1: there is that, well, what if we don't sign him 202 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:50,200 Speaker 1: and we've broke the subject and all of a sudden 203 00:08:50,200 --> 00:08:53,640 Speaker 1: he's going to be upset. So I'm going to talk 204 00:08:53,679 --> 00:08:56,000 Speaker 1: to Devers. We might get Bregman, all of a sudden, 205 00:08:56,040 --> 00:08:59,079 Speaker 1: it doesn't happen. Are we going to inflict some kind 206 00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 1: of a mental injury on it? Because we've talked about it. 207 00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:06,280 Speaker 1: There's a fairness about that point. However, if they knew 208 00:09:06,280 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 1: they were really down the road to pregnant, this stuff 209 00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:09,520 Speaker 1: was going to happen. I think at that point the 210 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:13,560 Speaker 1: conversation had to begin. So a that number two Bregman 211 00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:15,520 Speaker 1: has to be the third basement, no question, there's no 212 00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:19,079 Speaker 1: parceling around that. The point I think where they made 213 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:20,560 Speaker 1: the mistake is to tell them to put his glove 214 00:09:20,559 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 1: down completely at that point there, I really I kind 215 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 1: of believe I would have asked him to continue to 216 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:29,200 Speaker 1: take ground balls if both third and first base, and 217 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:31,080 Speaker 1: then beyond that, you try to get them a game 218 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:34,040 Speaker 1: maybe once a week on defense somewhere, either at third 219 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:36,480 Speaker 1: or first, or maybe one at each place. Give Bregmant 220 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:38,000 Speaker 1: a day off, give the first base in the day off, 221 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:40,400 Speaker 1: et cetera. And keep this guy solving and keep him 222 00:09:40,400 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 1: on the field. Because when you get guys that young, 223 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 1: you just want to turn them into dhs. It's not easy. 224 00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:47,960 Speaker 1: I had was part of four outfielders with the Angels 225 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:52,080 Speaker 1: erstat Samon Edmunds and Ga Garrett Anderson in the nineties 226 00:09:52,120 --> 00:09:54,000 Speaker 1: at some point there with oh, this is a great idea. 227 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:56,000 Speaker 1: One of them will DH per week. We'll give the 228 00:09:56,040 --> 00:09:57,800 Speaker 1: other so they get one day off a week and 229 00:09:58,920 --> 00:10:01,320 Speaker 1: we'll rotate it that way. It's be wonderful. They hated it. 230 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:05,040 Speaker 1: They absolutely hated it. When you're talking about young, younger players, 231 00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:09,560 Speaker 1: the thought of kind of being castrated, I'm not a 232 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:12,000 Speaker 1: player anywhere I can't be on the field bothers them 233 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 1: a lot, and you're you're you're really slicing an ego 234 00:10:14,440 --> 00:10:16,439 Speaker 1: at that point too. So those are the points that 235 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:18,439 Speaker 1: need to be you have to be careful with in 236 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:21,920 Speaker 1: the conversation has to be Frank has to be honest, 237 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 1: don't dissemble, none of the executive talk. Front office, stay 238 00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:28,840 Speaker 1: out of this. Let Alex handle that. Too many chefs 239 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:31,719 Speaker 1: not good. So there's a lot of things that went 240 00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:34,560 Speaker 1: wrong with this. But from the beginning, I call Jack 241 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:37,800 Speaker 1: Ryan as a protagonist and all the Clancy novels not 242 00:10:37,880 --> 00:10:40,320 Speaker 1: mister President. He wasn't your friend. He wasn't just a 243 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:42,600 Speaker 1: friend of yours. He was your best friend. Go right 244 00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:45,520 Speaker 1: to it. Run towards the issue, don't tap dance around it, 245 00:10:45,559 --> 00:10:48,960 Speaker 1: because eventually it turns into devers playing in San Francisco. 246 00:10:50,280 --> 00:10:54,679 Speaker 6: Does this feel like something that the front offices nowadays 247 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:59,640 Speaker 6: maybe overstep the manager And did you need to keep 248 00:10:59,679 --> 00:11:01,680 Speaker 6: that did you need to keep that at length when 249 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:04,400 Speaker 6: you were a manager, like, Hey, I need you to 250 00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:07,280 Speaker 6: stay up in your front office. I'll take care of 251 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:09,800 Speaker 6: what's going on in the field in the clubhouse. Or 252 00:11:09,920 --> 00:11:13,280 Speaker 6: is that something that the game has changed since the 253 00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:15,400 Speaker 6: years you've been you know how long you have been 254 00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:15,640 Speaker 6: in it. 255 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:19,720 Speaker 1: The game hasn't changed. The administration of the game has changed. Yes, 256 00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:21,880 Speaker 1: I mean everybody always talks about the game has changed, 257 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:24,880 Speaker 1: and I dispute that it's the same game. But how 258 00:11:24,920 --> 00:11:28,480 Speaker 1: we're administrating it is different. And yes, when I was 259 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:30,600 Speaker 1: back in you know, the eighties and nineties whatever, when 260 00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:33,280 Speaker 1: I was trying to get to the big leagues, gms 261 00:11:33,280 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 1: were afraid to come in clubhouses. You never saw them. 262 00:11:35,720 --> 00:11:40,319 Speaker 1: You never saw front office personnel in clubhouses there. You know, 263 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:43,640 Speaker 1: they did their job, which was to acquire players, keep 264 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:47,839 Speaker 1: everything rolling properly, put seats in this, fannies and butts 265 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:49,560 Speaker 1: in the seats, et cetera, et cetera. But they weren't 266 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:53,080 Speaker 1: necessarily they were never really involved in the coaching of 267 00:11:54,440 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 1: you know, the distribution of information. Whatever. You had, You 268 00:11:58,160 --> 00:12:01,160 Speaker 1: had advanced scouts, you had your your your coaches on 269 00:12:01,200 --> 00:12:03,679 Speaker 1: the team, you had your manager who normally set the 270 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:07,439 Speaker 1: patterns for the whole organization. Now I'm not here to 271 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:08,920 Speaker 1: tell that that was all correct. I used to get 272 00:12:08,960 --> 00:12:11,280 Speaker 1: upset with that because I thought, we we have a 273 00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 1: new manager with every two or three years. With the 274 00:12:12,880 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 1: Angels back in the day, and you're constantly turning over 275 00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 1: your cutoffs and relays, your first and third place. You know, offensively, 276 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:22,560 Speaker 1: what was important is the bunt, could you know Buck 277 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:26,080 Speaker 1: Rogers like the stink play like stealing third base on 278 00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:28,200 Speaker 1: a fake a butt with the say with the delay, 279 00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:31,160 Speaker 1: steal a second. Every manager brought his own stuff into 280 00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:35,080 Speaker 1: the mix. Today, That's not true, and I, like I said, 281 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:37,240 Speaker 1: I disputed that I wanted to see more of a 282 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:41,240 Speaker 1: homogenized method of the Angels play regardless of who the 283 00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:44,520 Speaker 1: manager was. Now it's gone to the absolute opposite extreme 284 00:12:44,559 --> 00:12:48,800 Speaker 1: where the homogenation comes from. Emogenization comes from the front office, 285 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 1: and the manager pretty much is at the at the 286 00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:55,240 Speaker 1: whim of all that, or at the edict of all that. 287 00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:59,960 Speaker 1: We as managers today definitely is a middle manager. It's 288 00:13:00,040 --> 00:13:02,720 Speaker 1: Jean Bak would would not get a job today. Early 289 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:05,160 Speaker 1: would not get a job today. White and Herzog would 290 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 1: not get a job today. That kind of authoritarian authority figure. Uh, 291 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:14,440 Speaker 1: you know, somebody that really knew what he wanted and 292 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 1: what he liked would have never been listened to. That 293 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:19,280 Speaker 1: guy would have never had this opportunity. You'd have never 294 00:13:19,320 --> 00:13:21,960 Speaker 1: heard of these people if the game was administrated back 295 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:24,400 Speaker 1: then like it is now. So game is the same, 296 00:13:24,880 --> 00:13:29,520 Speaker 1: the way it's being uh, like I said, processed on 297 00:13:29,559 --> 00:13:32,439 Speaker 1: a daily basis is completely different. And so the other 298 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:37,760 Speaker 1: front office is way more involved in daily conversations analytical departments, 299 00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:41,480 Speaker 1: way more involved in instruction, quite frankly, and they're they're 300 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:43,360 Speaker 1: down in the field before the game, they're in they're 301 00:13:43,400 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 1: in bullpens, are in batty cages, or every place they 302 00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:51,760 Speaker 1: should not be. So yes, that's what's different about the game, 303 00:13:51,800 --> 00:13:52,680 Speaker 1: not the game itself. 304 00:13:54,120 --> 00:13:56,439 Speaker 6: Have you ever needed to stand on business, as the 305 00:13:56,520 --> 00:14:02,400 Speaker 6: kids say, when a player says something to you? Rob Thompson, 306 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:06,120 Speaker 6: Rob Thompson said, Nick Castianos after he got taken out 307 00:14:06,160 --> 00:14:09,480 Speaker 6: of the game, went too far? What his comments went 308 00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:13,800 Speaker 6: too far? And Rob Thompson was standing on business and said, 309 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:17,719 Speaker 6: you know what, you're not playing today. 310 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:22,400 Speaker 1: I don't think I've ever told somebody's not playing based 311 00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:24,960 Speaker 1: on what he said to me, I'm pretty sure. Although 312 00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:27,480 Speaker 1: I did have one situation though i'll go back. I'm 313 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:30,200 Speaker 1: not going to name names, but I had an issue 314 00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:33,320 Speaker 1: with one player called him in, had a couple of 315 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:35,080 Speaker 1: the coaches with me so that everything I said was 316 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:38,640 Speaker 1: verified or validated, and told me he wasn't going to play 317 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:41,880 Speaker 1: until a certain thing occurred, and so I did that. 318 00:14:42,240 --> 00:14:44,240 Speaker 1: But it wasn't something he had said. It's something that 319 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:47,600 Speaker 1: I did not like on the field. So that's what 320 00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 1: that was. From and then after a day or two, 321 00:14:50,960 --> 00:14:53,000 Speaker 1: I thought to myself, you know what, I'm wrong. He 322 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:54,680 Speaker 1: was not wrong, he was wrong in a sense, but 323 00:14:54,920 --> 00:14:56,960 Speaker 1: I was totally wrong the way I presented it to him. 324 00:14:57,120 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 1: So I apologized to him and I put him back 325 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 1: in the lineup after couple of dates, because after I 326 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 1: evaluated what I had said and the process that I 327 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 1: went through, I thought my process was wrong even more 328 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:11,920 Speaker 1: than his was. So that happened one time. Otherwise, you know, 329 00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:14,600 Speaker 1: I've taken guys out of games for different reasons, but 330 00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:19,320 Speaker 1: this always like a warning in advance if they're breaching 331 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:22,720 Speaker 1: some of the I have some really easier or no 332 00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:25,200 Speaker 1: rules at all. My rule for the position players was 333 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:28,080 Speaker 1: to respect ninety feet, and my rules for the pictures 334 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:30,520 Speaker 1: were too. I wanted you to work on your defense 335 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:33,600 Speaker 1: on a daily basis. Whatever that meant, just please, I 336 00:15:33,640 --> 00:15:36,440 Speaker 1: want good defensive pictures. Other than that, man, you were 337 00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 1: on your own. I'm not a big believer in rules. 338 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:42,840 Speaker 1: I think integrity has no need. There's no need of rules. 339 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:46,280 Speaker 1: If you have integrity, you answer these questions to yourself. 340 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:49,400 Speaker 1: And one of my opening dialogues to all my players 341 00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:52,040 Speaker 1: always was, you know the difference between right or wrong. 342 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:53,880 Speaker 1: You don't have to wait for me to tell you that. 343 00:15:54,400 --> 00:15:56,880 Speaker 1: You grew up with some great parents. I think we 344 00:15:56,960 --> 00:16:00,760 Speaker 1: all are born with this inate ability to determine what 345 00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:03,040 Speaker 1: is right and what is wrong. Choose right. That's exactly 346 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:06,400 Speaker 1: what I tell my guys, so excuse me. The situation 347 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 1: with rob he had a choice there. He could have 348 00:16:10,960 --> 00:16:12,920 Speaker 1: chosen not to say anything at all. He could have 349 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:17,480 Speaker 1: just taken what nick said after the game, called in 350 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:19,680 Speaker 1: the office, he yelled at one another and then figured 351 00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 1: it out after then. But he made up his mind 352 00:16:22,040 --> 00:16:24,440 Speaker 1: to do what he did. But I do respect what 353 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:28,360 Speaker 1: he did Robbie. That is, he was honest with the press. 354 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 1: He didn't have to tell him exactly what was said, 355 00:16:30,480 --> 00:16:33,680 Speaker 1: but he told him why Nicky wasn't playing. He didn't dissemble, 356 00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:35,880 Speaker 1: he didn't give it any execu you talk, and I 357 00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 1: love that about him. 358 00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:42,640 Speaker 5: What would you tell Dave Roberts about handling Showhy now 359 00:16:42,680 --> 00:16:44,600 Speaker 5: that he's back pitching and hitting. 360 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:45,480 Speaker 4: Is there anything? 361 00:16:45,600 --> 00:16:47,400 Speaker 5: Is there a difference in handling him as just a 362 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:49,760 Speaker 5: hitter versus when he has to pitch and hit. 363 00:16:50,920 --> 00:16:53,800 Speaker 1: The thing I did with him was we had a 364 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 1: conversation every night before the next day so after the 365 00:16:56,520 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 1: game's over, how you feeling? The big thing? He had 366 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:01,520 Speaker 1: told me early on a show. We first determined that 367 00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:02,920 Speaker 1: we're going to do both things with him. In that 368 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:05,720 Speaker 1: spring training, he was only concerned about his legs and 369 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:08,119 Speaker 1: how his legs felt. So it was fair. It's a 370 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:11,160 Speaker 1: fair point, I said. Okay, So every night e pay 371 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:14,560 Speaker 1: is at that time as assistant, I would text Epay 372 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 1: or talk to e Pay and he would go to 373 00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:18,439 Speaker 1: show and we would say, okay, what do we got 374 00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:20,840 Speaker 1: for tomorrow? How are we feeling for tomorrow? Is there 375 00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 1: anything you don't want to do tomorrow that kind of 376 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:24,840 Speaker 1: a thing. Are you good? And that would be the conversation. 377 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 1: So the only thing I would do. See, there's the 378 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:30,679 Speaker 1: issue here. Don't think that you know. I mean, we 379 00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:32,919 Speaker 1: don't know. We've never done what show does? I did 380 00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:35,640 Speaker 1: it in little league maybe twice a week, right, never 381 00:17:35,640 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: did it every day on a big league level, you know, 382 00:17:37,600 --> 00:17:40,800 Speaker 1: played multiple positions, so nobody's ever done this. So to 383 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:42,520 Speaker 1: think that you know, or to think that there's some 384 00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:44,879 Speaker 1: kind of algorithm that's going to determine what's going to 385 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 1: prevent him from getting injured, not true. So I would 386 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:51,199 Speaker 1: just communicate with him nightly after the tonight's game we're 387 00:17:51,240 --> 00:17:54,440 Speaker 1: playing tomorrow day or whatever. Show what he got? He said, 388 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:55,720 Speaker 1: let me, let me get to you in the morning, 389 00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:57,880 Speaker 1: get back to you in the morning, and then that's it. 390 00:17:58,160 --> 00:18:00,639 Speaker 1: I'm going to go off of his converse because you 391 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:03,679 Speaker 1: have to understand he is It's an overused term, but 392 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:05,960 Speaker 1: he is the unicorn. Nobody's done what he's done before, 393 00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:07,760 Speaker 1: So you have to listen to him in this situation. 394 00:18:08,760 --> 00:18:10,479 Speaker 6: What kind of answer would he give you? Would it 395 00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:13,160 Speaker 6: just be like, yeah, yeah, I'm good to go, thumbs up? 396 00:18:13,560 --> 00:18:15,680 Speaker 6: Or is it when he when he get into it, like, hey, 397 00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:17,480 Speaker 6: my legs are really sore. I don't think I can 398 00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:20,400 Speaker 6: give you. I don't think I can give you stolen bases, 399 00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:22,159 Speaker 6: but I'd love to be in the lineup. You know 400 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:24,960 Speaker 6: how How in depth would he give you exactly? 401 00:18:25,040 --> 00:18:27,760 Speaker 1: That's pretty much. That's pretty accurate right there. Normally he 402 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:30,440 Speaker 1: would always be good show likes to play. He likes 403 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:32,199 Speaker 1: to play. And if you remember, when we first did this, 404 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:36,399 Speaker 1: we didn't have the show hey rule, So when he pitched, 405 00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:39,440 Speaker 1: we'd played with the regular National League lineup at that time, 406 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:41,280 Speaker 1: and then once we took him out of the game, 407 00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:43,040 Speaker 1: I put him in right field, the dach would come 408 00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:47,359 Speaker 1: out of the game and we would play that excuse 409 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 1: we play the right We took him out of the 410 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:50,240 Speaker 1: game and had to move things round so it was 411 00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:52,159 Speaker 1: a nationally game. And then once I took him out 412 00:18:52,160 --> 00:18:54,000 Speaker 1: of the game, it's next to that bat. I'd have 413 00:18:54,040 --> 00:18:55,800 Speaker 1: to put a right field there, but but the pitcher 414 00:18:55,800 --> 00:18:58,440 Speaker 1: would be in the lineup. So that's how it began. 415 00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:00,560 Speaker 1: So there was a little bit more involve I had 416 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 1: to be aware of how he felt taking him out 417 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:04,679 Speaker 1: of the game, like six to in eighty five and 418 00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:07,680 Speaker 1: two thirds, whatever it was. Harry comes, when we're at bat, 419 00:19:07,760 --> 00:19:09,280 Speaker 1: you feel good enough to well out the right field 420 00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:11,640 Speaker 1: right now play you know, play an out or two 421 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:13,159 Speaker 1: and then come back and get your bat and then 422 00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:15,840 Speaker 1: be done. That was like the most difficult decision at 423 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:20,560 Speaker 1: that particular point was how to utilize that. Otherwise, gosh, 424 00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:23,639 Speaker 1: he he would he would. I think he pitched the 425 00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:26,879 Speaker 1: first game of a double hitter and then played a 426 00:19:27,040 --> 00:19:30,000 Speaker 1: d h in the second game, and no problem. He's 427 00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:33,320 Speaker 1: just an incredible his whatever he does in his workout routine, 428 00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 1: which is pretty private because you know, you don't see 429 00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:37,560 Speaker 1: a lot of him before the game. He's always doing something, 430 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:40,959 Speaker 1: but he's incredibly strong, so I never I can't remember 431 00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:44,439 Speaker 1: me once or twice I might have like asked him 432 00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:47,040 Speaker 1: like strongly, because I really, come on, you got to 433 00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 1: take a break at some point, and I think he 434 00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:52,320 Speaker 1: did and I can't remember specifically went, but it was 435 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:55,879 Speaker 1: an easy conversation. He wants to play, You got to 436 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:57,919 Speaker 1: watch him, but you gotta trust. 437 00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:01,320 Speaker 3: Him, Joe, So what would you do now? I mean, 438 00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:04,560 Speaker 3: he's almost thirty one, and there's been some surgeries right 439 00:20:04,800 --> 00:20:08,320 Speaker 3: the elbow again, shoulder, all of that. Of course, for 440 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 3: most baseball fans, we want to see him do this 441 00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:13,919 Speaker 3: hitch and hit for as long as possible because this 442 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:15,560 Speaker 3: might be the only time we get to see it 443 00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:19,000 Speaker 3: for most of us in our lifetime. Would you try 444 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:22,639 Speaker 3: to see if you can talk him into an extra 445 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:25,600 Speaker 3: off day here and there, even from hitting, especially once 446 00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:27,639 Speaker 3: he's built up to five or six innings, or is 447 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:30,400 Speaker 3: it still just all hey, you tell me how you're 448 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:32,720 Speaker 3: feeling and what you want to do, Because I mean 449 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:34,959 Speaker 3: the topic that our guys have brought up obviously they 450 00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:37,919 Speaker 3: haven't done both, but they're like, can it affect is 451 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:40,199 Speaker 3: hitting in any way? It didn't in the past, but 452 00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:42,880 Speaker 3: ken it now surgeries and years later in his life. 453 00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:46,800 Speaker 1: Well, I think you could talk about it. I think again, 454 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:48,800 Speaker 1: I always like to be proactive in front of the 455 00:20:48,880 --> 00:20:51,480 Speaker 1: situations like this, and so you would probably try to 456 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:56,639 Speaker 1: create different potential scenarios that we might want to adjust 457 00:20:56,720 --> 00:21:00,879 Speaker 1: to as this thing is in progress. I mean, right now, 458 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:04,639 Speaker 1: that was one ending the other day. He probably handled 459 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:07,080 Speaker 1: that very very well. I think once we get to 460 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:08,679 Speaker 1: the All Star break, I think they're going to rap 461 00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 1: him up to about four or five innings by the 462 00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:12,800 Speaker 1: time he gets to the break in an effort to 463 00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:14,879 Speaker 1: get him to become more of a normal member of 464 00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:18,280 Speaker 1: the rotation. After that, I think when you get post 465 00:21:18,520 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 1: All Star break, that's when you may want to really 466 00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:23,919 Speaker 1: start checking in on things like this. But again, he 467 00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:27,160 Speaker 1: will tell you there's one thing about him, and that's 468 00:21:27,160 --> 00:21:29,240 Speaker 1: what you got to do. You just establish the trust 469 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:32,240 Speaker 1: through conversation and the fact that he gets to know 470 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:33,879 Speaker 1: you and and you know that you're being honest and 471 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:36,440 Speaker 1: upfront with him. I think that's not. 472 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 2: Called for. 473 00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:42,639 Speaker 1: Unlikely that maybe he may require a day off after 474 00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,640 Speaker 1: he pitches, and then who knows, they could even line 475 00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:47,240 Speaker 1: it up to the point where maybe there's a day 476 00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:49,760 Speaker 1: off after the day pitches. They can be very creative 477 00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:52,280 Speaker 1: with this in an effort to not miss any time 478 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:54,159 Speaker 1: on the field. So there's you can look at this 479 00:21:54,240 --> 00:21:57,200 Speaker 1: so many different ways in regards to how you want 480 00:21:57,240 --> 00:21:59,160 Speaker 1: to get this done. And maybe the schedule just runs 481 00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:01,440 Speaker 1: for like two or three and then we might say, show, 482 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:03,320 Speaker 1: we just need you to take a day here somewhere, 483 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:05,800 Speaker 1: because there's no real built in break in the schedule, 484 00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:09,040 Speaker 1: So just just look at it. You always got to 485 00:22:09,040 --> 00:22:10,719 Speaker 1: have to get in advance of this kind of stuff, 486 00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:12,920 Speaker 1: And I've talked about this before. They're probably going to 487 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:16,520 Speaker 1: look at the World Series postseason and work it backward 488 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:18,679 Speaker 1: when we get right after the All Star break, and 489 00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 1: then determine how many innings potentially he's going to pitch 490 00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:24,760 Speaker 1: and how comfortable they are with that. But knowing that 491 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,240 Speaker 1: they have to be keep in mind next year, they're 492 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:28,639 Speaker 1: going to want to have them scratched out to a 493 00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:30,960 Speaker 1: certain number so that we don't go through this same 494 00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:33,439 Speaker 1: routine next year of trying to figure out how many 495 00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:34,360 Speaker 1: innings we can pitch him. 496 00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:37,640 Speaker 5: So last one, before we let you go, you mentioned 497 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:41,399 Speaker 5: communications and talks, and someone in the chat had a 498 00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:43,480 Speaker 5: great I think it was Mike g He had a 499 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:45,439 Speaker 5: great He's a Cubs fan, so he wants to know 500 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:48,320 Speaker 5: if you had such great communication, how come you couldn't 501 00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:50,359 Speaker 5: get John Lester to throw over to first base. 502 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:53,200 Speaker 1: Dude, we've tried. That was a big part of it. 503 00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:57,000 Speaker 1: We h we did. We went, We had a special 504 00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,480 Speaker 1: sessions out on the half field that's low Park. Here's 505 00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:03,719 Speaker 1: what we did. Eventually, Okay, would bother John more than 506 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:07,879 Speaker 1: anything throwing over to first space. Well, my final determination 507 00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:10,159 Speaker 1: was John, You're never gonna have to throw over to 508 00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:11,880 Speaker 1: the first space. This is what we're gonna do instead. 509 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:15,240 Speaker 1: What we did instead was John, you have a couple 510 00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:16,760 Speaker 1: of different things you can do. You could hold the 511 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:19,320 Speaker 1: ball a little bit longer at that time, you can 512 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 1: step off John. You could quick pitch, or we could 513 00:23:24,320 --> 00:23:28,200 Speaker 1: pitch out. Furthermore, riz I wanted Rizz to dance back 514 00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:30,520 Speaker 1: and forth off the bag and back to try to 515 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:32,840 Speaker 1: create doubt in the in the base runner's mind and 516 00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:35,240 Speaker 1: from home play, whether it was rossy or contrast. We 517 00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:37,600 Speaker 1: had really good throwers. I wanted a lot of back 518 00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:39,800 Speaker 1: pitch at first base because if they're in their first 519 00:23:39,880 --> 00:23:42,280 Speaker 1: base in any way shape or formed decides so maybe 520 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,080 Speaker 1: I'm gonna go there and says no, and he gets 521 00:23:44,080 --> 00:23:45,920 Speaker 1: in that nowhere's land. He knows we have really good 522 00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:48,800 Speaker 1: throwing catchers. Furthermore, when these runners used to get so 523 00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:51,960 Speaker 1: far off because they thought they could and they could, 524 00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:54,800 Speaker 1: they became uncomfortable. There have never been that far off 525 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:57,440 Speaker 1: the bag and they were always regardless of they they 526 00:23:57,520 --> 00:23:59,960 Speaker 1: in the back of their mind they knew Johnny would 527 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:01,480 Speaker 1: do it, But what if we just did a quick 528 00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:03,800 Speaker 1: step pitch up, He's going to be out also. So 529 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:06,000 Speaker 1: I wanted to focus on the things that he can 530 00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:08,600 Speaker 1: do and felt comfortable with, as opposed to the one 531 00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 1: thing he could not do it was uncomfortable with. 532 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:13,840 Speaker 2: That's good stuff, Joe. This was great. 533 00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:16,800 Speaker 3: We always really enjoy it booking Joe the Pod with 534 00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:19,080 Speaker 3: Joe and Tom Berducci, who we love having on here 535 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:19,480 Speaker 3: as well. 536 00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:20,520 Speaker 2: It's really good stuff. 537 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:20,920 Speaker 1: Joe. 538 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:22,159 Speaker 2: Thanks, good to see it. 539 00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:25,040 Speaker 1: I appreciate it, gentlemen anytime. And I'm just playing a 540 00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:27,560 Speaker 1: lot of golf and growing my tomatoes. It's kind of fun. 541 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:29,400 Speaker 2: We love that. We love that. 542 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:31,199 Speaker 3: That's what happens. You age, when you manage, and then 543 00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:33,400 Speaker 3: you go backwards. Actually, now, now Joe's getting young. 544 00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,840 Speaker 1: I'm a teenagers dude. I'm I'm back to seventeen, eighteen 545 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:37,840 Speaker 1: years old. It's awesome. 546 00:24:38,440 --> 00:24:40,760 Speaker 2: I wear the shirt for you too today. Well you 547 00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:41,359 Speaker 2: know what this is. 548 00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:42,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, I can see it now. 549 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:44,879 Speaker 2: Grateful that Expo shirt for you. 550 00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 1: Love it, brother, love it. 551 00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:48,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, got you, Joe. 552 00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:51,280 Speaker 1: You guys keep it going, keep it going. Appreciate it.