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Speaker 1: Why don't always forget our what is our damn opening? Hey?

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Speaker 1: You know that's Tiffany find bad so I always forget,

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Speaker 1: you know, My memory is like yo, okay, wait wait

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Speaker 1: oh yeah, okay, hey, hey hey we're back.

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Speaker 2: We're black.

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Speaker 1: We're extra brown today in the studio. AMBI should ambition,

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Speaker 1: AMBI should ambition, ambition. We're back in a studio. Well,

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Speaker 1: the stew Manny's still out with the bibby, but we

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Speaker 1: have some extra brown in the studio today. Actually, one

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Speaker 1: of the first brown people that've ever seen in personal finance.

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Speaker 1: I remember I was like a fan, a fan far

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Speaker 1: news to hobbies in the studio.

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Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, I am beyond honored, tiff Do you

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Speaker 2: know do you remember when we first met?

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Speaker 1: I do, girl, because I was sweating you so hard.

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Speaker 1: I was like, my god, hild I was like.

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Speaker 2: You were over our bread and butter. We were eating

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Speaker 2: like bread and butter, ice ice water. It was a't

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Speaker 2: some dinner at finn Con and we had just luck

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Speaker 2: would have it. We were seated next to each other

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Speaker 2: and I was just blown away by you because you

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Speaker 2: were like, I'm a preschool teacher right now, but wait, wait, world,

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Speaker 2: I have a plan. I'm gonna help millions of women

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Speaker 2: get out of debt, make money, get rich. I was

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Speaker 2: like wow, but.

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Speaker 1: I remember it was funny because like I remember, it

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Speaker 1: was like I'm not gonna say her name because we're

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Speaker 1: cool now, but I just have I was mad at

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Speaker 1: her for years for this because initially your seat was

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Speaker 1: someplace else, like you were sitting someplace else. Oh, and

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Speaker 1: I wanted to sit next to you because I was like,

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Speaker 1: oh my god, I want to say it's for news.

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Speaker 1: I talked to her at this event, but then the

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Speaker 1: other person like moved my stuff and sat in the seat,

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Speaker 1: assuming that you were going to come back and sit

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Speaker 1: in your seat. And I remember I was like, oh

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Speaker 1: my god, so much trauma. You have the scene and

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Speaker 1: I was like no, So then I sat at the

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Speaker 1: other table like and I was just like, oh, I

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Speaker 1: guess I was just.

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Speaker 2: Know the universe, yes found us. It was like, no,

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Speaker 2: that's like my plan.

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Speaker 1: And then you end up sitting next to me. And

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Speaker 1: I looked at the lady like, eh, no, she's not

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Speaker 1: a cool now, so I want to call her name out.

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Speaker 1: But but I just remember, like, yes, we had some teeth.

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Speaker 1: I know, we had like the best conversation and you

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Speaker 1: were just like so gracious and honestly you were just

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Speaker 1: an example of like, wow, this thing can be bigger

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Speaker 1: than well one. You can be brown in this space,

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Speaker 1: you could be a woman in this space. You could

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Speaker 1: be yourself in the space, and it could be bigger

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Speaker 1: than you know, like just like what was possible. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you've had your own shows, you you know, your podcast

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Speaker 1: So Money is huge. Some of y'all forgot I'm just

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Speaker 1: talking for a newss Like like, I'm like, wait, let

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Speaker 1: me int to do that.

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Speaker 2: Everybody who the F I am?

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Speaker 1: So I'm like, hey girl, So anyway for news? So

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Speaker 1: I'm saying it right to Robbie right, yes, yes, yes, okay.

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Speaker 1: She's one of America's the leading personal financial authorities, hooked

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Speaker 1: on helping you live your richest and happiest life. She's

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Speaker 1: a multi best selling financial author former She's a former

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Speaker 1: CNBC host and creator of the Webby nominated podcast So Money,

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Speaker 1: which I have been on. Yes, she has become one

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Speaker 1: of the country's favorite go to money experts. The New

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Speaker 1: York Times calls her advice perfectly practical and you already

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Speaker 1: know you know they may know what they say and whatever.

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Speaker 2: They're really good to the literation that New York Times.

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Speaker 2: Let Me Tell You So.

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Speaker 1: Farnus's award winning, critically acclaimed podcast, So Money, has surpassed

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Speaker 1: twenty five million downloads thanks to one of her kind

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Speaker 1: interviews and deep conversations about money. On the show Spotlights.

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Speaker 1: She spotlights leading experts, authors, and influencers from Arianna Huffington

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Speaker 1: to Margaret Chow, Queen Latifah, You Got Queen Latifah and

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Speaker 1: I Love her and Tim Gunn and me about their

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Speaker 1: financial perspectives, money failures, and habits. She also answers listeners

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Speaker 1: personal financial questions each week, and she has a new

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Speaker 1: book coming out called A Healthy State of Panic, which

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Speaker 1: if you could have seen us before we got all,

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Speaker 1: we were both running a little raggedy and crazy and

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Speaker 1: so welcome to the podcast for news.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Thank you so much, Tiffany. What a full

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Speaker 2: circle moment for me. Yeah, I'm I'm just excited to

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Speaker 2: be sharing the stage with you, the spotlight with you.

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Speaker 2: It's been amazing watching you help so many people, make

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Speaker 2: such differences in people's lives. And thank you so much

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Speaker 2: for endorsing A Healthy State of Panic, one of the

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Speaker 2: first to get their hands on it and say, yes, yes, world,

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Speaker 2: let's let's read this. But you know how hard is

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Speaker 2: to sell a book. You know, I got you and

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Speaker 2: Margaret cho and Kelly Rippa and maz Ja Brownie for

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Speaker 2: those of you who don't know, he's an Iranian comedian

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Speaker 2: and actor. I was blessed to have this sort of

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Speaker 2: early praise for the book and just excited to share

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Speaker 2: it with your audience. Now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well if you can't say, oh, like Forarnuci is

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Speaker 1: not just like this dope, badass financial educator. She's my

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Speaker 1: friend friend. We're dinner, like what's that? Didn't know that

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Speaker 1: was lunch at that? Like? What was that place?

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Speaker 2: For? My husband calls it fubu, you know that's it's

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Speaker 2: like boo, I studied friendshop. I should know this. It's

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Speaker 2: got a lot more letters than what it sounds like.

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Speaker 2: But it's a lovely, amazing my favorite restaurant in Montclair.

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Speaker 2: You know, they tried to open up during the pandemic

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Speaker 2: and they couldn't and now it's just like blowing up

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Speaker 2: and it's it's wonderful. We went there, you and I I.

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Speaker 1: Was like so yummy and so yeah, I so first, Sharah,

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Speaker 1: how did you get into this space? Like, you know,

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Speaker 1: was it because you know, like I said, I was

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Speaker 1: a preschool teacher. But how did you get into the

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Speaker 1: personal finance space?

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Speaker 2: Well, two things I think were the tailwinds. I will

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Speaker 2: start with the earlier, uh I think piece of the story,

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Speaker 2: which is that I'm the daughter of immigrants from Iran.

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Speaker 2: And I mean, you know, I don't care where your

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Speaker 2: parents are from. If you're a daughter or a son

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Speaker 2: of immigrants in America, you're going to be somebody. Like

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Speaker 2: it's inevitable, something will happen. You will make it happen.

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Speaker 2: I think that one thing that was culturally unique for

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Speaker 2: us in our home was that we talked about money

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Speaker 2: a lot, the good and the bad. As I write

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Speaker 2: in my book, a healthy state of panic, like the

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Speaker 2: fear of money was instilled in me early, and learning

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Speaker 2: to have a relationship with money was instilled in me early.

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Speaker 2: So when I think about when I get afraid of money,

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Speaker 2: what does it sound like? What does it taste like?

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Speaker 2: What does it smell like, it's like fists banging on

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Speaker 2: a laminate kitchen table. Because my parents argued about money

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Speaker 2: a lot. Also though they laughed about money, and they

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Speaker 2: enjoyed money, and they worked hard for their money. So

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Speaker 2: I got to see all these dimensions around money. But

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Speaker 2: I will be dishonest if I said that this relationship

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Speaker 2: that I have with money isn't sometimes fear based. But

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Speaker 2: it's good because it's helped me really figure out what

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Speaker 2: my money narrative is, what I want in my financial relationship.

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Speaker 2: It's for helping recognize some of the myths that I've

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Speaker 2: held onto about money and those myths that have gotten

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Speaker 2: in my way sometimes in the early stages. So I

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Speaker 2: credit my upbringing for giving me really a mature relationship

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Speaker 2: and an emotional relationship with money that I don't think

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Speaker 2: anybody really gets growing up, let alone the literacy, but

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Speaker 2: the actual having that emotional strength around money. And then

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Speaker 2: fast forward, I studied finance in college. I went to

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Speaker 2: journalism school, got my master's in journalisms, and very early

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Speaker 2: on knew that I was interested in telling financial stories

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Speaker 2: and I wasn't interested in doing Excel spreadsheet work, Like

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Speaker 2: I didn't want to go work for a bank, which

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Speaker 2: is what a lot of my classmates did. You know,

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Speaker 2: with a finance degree, that's a natural progression. But I

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Speaker 2: was the crazy one who was like I want to

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Speaker 2: make a lot less money, and I want to write

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Speaker 2: articles and tell stories about money. But I think my

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Speaker 2: sense of business and sales spirit that I got in

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Speaker 2: college and working a lot carried with me into the

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Speaker 2: work of journalism, which they don't teach you in journalism schools,

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Speaker 2: like how to be entrepreneurial in this space, how to

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Speaker 2: really have ownership in your with your content, at least

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Speaker 2: not when I was starting out, and so fast forward.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's I guess it's no coincidence that I

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Speaker 2: am or I am, But it's not like I grew

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Speaker 2: up going, oh, I can't wait to one day have

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Speaker 2: a financial podcast. You know, that's not really what a

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Speaker 2: four year old goes around thinking. But I knew that

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Speaker 2: I wanted to be in service. I knew that I

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Speaker 2: wanted to help people, and I knew that I wasn't

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Speaker 2: uncomfortable about money around money. I didn't think that was taboo,

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Speaker 2: and I knew that was special, so I ran with it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that, And so I mean, you made

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Speaker 1: this transition to like being visible, Like was that really weird?

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Speaker 1: Because there were like very few women, let alone women

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Speaker 1: of color, you know, who were like visible on TV.

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Speaker 1: I remember you had I remember vaguely, like I think,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if you're you had a show. You

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Speaker 1: had like a couple of shows, but I remember one

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Speaker 1: like the set was like red. Was that called So Money?

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Speaker 1: I can't remember. But then you had this other show

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Speaker 1: when you were like interviewing like billionaires, like oh, private jets,

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Speaker 1: like you had so many different lives in this personal

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh.

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Speaker 2: People, you know, it's funny. People be like, oh my god,

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Speaker 2: you have a podcast. That's amazing. I'm like, I have

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Speaker 2: been around so long, Like you don't even know the

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Speaker 2: rest of it. That's good. I guess. I guess I've

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Speaker 2: been using some good skincare all these years and they

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Speaker 2: stay out of the sun. But like, I mean, I

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Speaker 2: remember being at a press conference for that show that

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Speaker 2: you're referring to, was for CNBC called Follow the Leader.

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Speaker 2: It was such an incredible opportunity. It was I've had

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Speaker 2: a lot of these one hit wonders in the television world.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: It's like before streaming, before before even really like the

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Speaker 2: social media world took off and you could have your

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Speaker 2: own show on your own TikTok or Instagram, like you

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Speaker 2: had the powers that be were the studios and the

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Speaker 2: networks and these like you know, you really it was

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Speaker 2: really hard to make a show fly. And so I

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Speaker 2: got this opportunity with CNBC to follow billionaires and mega

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Speaker 2: CEOs who were like CEOs slash rock stars, you know,

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Speaker 2: and just be flats on the wall, be a fly

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Speaker 2: on the wall, get to learn, you know, what was

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Speaker 2: the secret to their success. And it was very exciting.

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Speaker 2: I had to go on lots of private planes and

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Speaker 2: eat like a lot of fancy food, and it was

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Speaker 2: it was one for the books, but we didn't get renewed.

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Speaker 2: I remember going to the press conference for that show

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Speaker 2: and a journalist stood up and he said, I remember

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Speaker 2: you when you were like, you know, you were like

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Speaker 2: writing for am New York which audience that is a

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Speaker 2: free subway newspaper that is distributed widely in New York City,

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Speaker 2: and I had a byline. I mean I got more

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Speaker 2: recognition from that sometimes and anything because I had my

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Speaker 2: picture in my byline. And when you're on the subway

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Speaker 2: and you're reading a you know, it's like a captive audience.

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Speaker 2: I remember going to a Banana Republic and showing my

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Speaker 2: ID and the woman was like, are you the fernish

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Speaker 2: truby that writes me, I am New York. I'm like, well,

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Speaker 2: I also have a book, which clearly you have not read.

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Speaker 2: But yes, that is me. Now can I get the discount?

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: This this entitle me to some sort of discount. Yeah, but

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Speaker 2: I have I've done. I've had the privilege of having

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Speaker 2: so many different experiences, and I think I really went

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Speaker 2: after that, you know, I want I'm I get bored easily.

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Speaker 2: I don't know about you. I don't think I have ADHD.

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Speaker 2: My son does. And I've talked about that a lot.

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Speaker 2: If they say it runs in the family, who knows.

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Speaker 2: Maybe I have it and I have never been tested.

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Speaker 2: But I'm just somebody who get I don't idle. Well,

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Speaker 2: I need a lot of variety. I like appetizers. I

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Speaker 2: cannot commit to an entree, Tiffany, I need like three appetizers.

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Speaker 2: Can I have some of yours?

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Speaker 1: You know?

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Speaker 2: And So this idea that I was going to pursue

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Speaker 2: journalism and just be a writer, or just be a

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Speaker 2: radio host, or just do television frightened me. Speaking of

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Speaker 2: panic and healthy fear, and I think it led me

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Speaker 2: to try to design a life and a career that

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Speaker 2: allowed me to try and do a lot of things

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Speaker 2: and not everything sticks, but at least you have fun trying.

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Speaker 1: I was going to ask you, is that how you

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Speaker 1: got to your book? Because first of all, what number

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Speaker 1: book are you on now?

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Speaker 2: For?

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Speaker 1: Wow? So is that how you got to this book

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Speaker 1: Healthy State of Panic? Like, because you're just like, because

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Speaker 1: you have this super successful podcast that's doing really well,

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Speaker 1: so money, you know, you speak, I know you do

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Speaker 1: like brand partnerships, and then you've added this other because

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Speaker 1: I know how hard I want to write a book

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Speaker 1: than to to market it to sell it. So is

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Speaker 1: that why you've written A Healthy State of Panic? Because

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Speaker 1: you're like, I have something else to say, and like,

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Speaker 1: I'm not quite busy.

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Speaker 2: Enough right, Oh my gosh, I don't.

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Speaker 1: I think.

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Speaker 2: So, this has been nine years since I've published a book.

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Speaker 2: I think because I needed the time to recover from

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Speaker 2: the last book launch. As you know, it's a lot

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Speaker 2: of work. And I think if the genesis of this

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Speaker 2: book again, I think goes back to my upbringing as

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Speaker 2: a little girl who was raised in an immigrant family. Terrified.

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Speaker 2: I was a terrified little girl, Tiffany, my mother even

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Speaker 2: will say I did that on purpose. I raised you

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Speaker 2: to be afraid on purpose, because let's remember my mother,

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Speaker 2: she's nineteen when she had me, doesn't speak the language,

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Speaker 2: isn't familiar with the culture, newly married, newly apparent living

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Speaker 2: in Worcestern, Massachusetts, which at the time and still was,

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Speaker 2: you know, known for a lot of just five o'clock

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Speaker 2: news crime, you know, like break ins and theft and kidnappings.

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Speaker 2: It was the eighties, right, So she was scared and

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Speaker 2: she channeled that into her daughter me. And so I

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Speaker 2: was afraid of strangers and eating other people's snacks because

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Speaker 2: she told me they had poison in them.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 2: I was afraid of being abandoned. I was afraid of

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Speaker 2: like getting lost at the mall. I was afraid of

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Speaker 2: being home alone. And so the fear wasn't always a friend,

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Speaker 2: Like it got me into a lot of comical mischief

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Speaker 2: and you know, backfired. But I will say that I

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Speaker 2: had an early kind of developmental relationship with fear, and

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Speaker 2: it transpired to the point where even as I was

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Speaker 2: a young adult, I wouldn't say that I had mastered

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Speaker 2: my fears. I was still like letting fear as it does,

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Speaker 2: take me for a ride. And I was allowing it

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Speaker 2: to block me from opportunities and realizing my real potential.

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Speaker 2: So I had to, like a lot of a young adults,

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Speaker 2: sort of like retrain and reparent yourself, but not abandoning

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Speaker 2: the fear, saying, Okay, fear keeps showing up, I cannot

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Speaker 2: be this fearless person. So maybe there is a way

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Speaker 2: to work with fear, to listen to fear, to appreciate fear,

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Speaker 2: to honor fear, to then be able to make the

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Speaker 2: decisions that matter at life's crossroads. And I wanted to

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Speaker 2: write a book. Like with all of my books, I

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Speaker 2: feel like I want to say something that's new, that's different,

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Speaker 2: that's also capturing the zeitgeist. Like my last book was

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Speaker 2: about female breadwinners and what happens when you make more

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Speaker 2: in your hetero relationship as a woman, and that was

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Speaker 2: very taboo back then. We talk about it now, but

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Speaker 2: it was like really really under wraps into in the

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Speaker 2: early two thousands, and I was living that reality, and

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Speaker 2: I was like, this is a great book topic, because

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Speaker 2: when nobody wants to talk about something, that's when you

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Speaker 2: know you have a good idea fast forward. I was like, Okay,

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Speaker 2: right now in our world, we're dealing with still a

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Speaker 2: lot of big financial conundrums, but also at the intersection

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Speaker 2: of mental health and mental wellness. And year after year,

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Speaker 2: day after day, there was like all these books about

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Speaker 2: being fearless, and I felt like we were not appreciating

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Speaker 2: fear in our culture in the way that I have

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Speaker 2: that I've learned to really embrace. And so A healthy

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Speaker 2: state of panic is a book that's going to help

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Speaker 2: anybody out there like me who has gone through life

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Speaker 2: realizing that fear just doesn't go away. This idea of

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Speaker 2: being fearless that is not working. So my offer is

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Speaker 2: what if we actually when fear shows up, we look

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Speaker 2: at it, We ask it questions, We say, Okay, why

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Speaker 2: are you here? Sometimes fear is there to help us,

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Speaker 2: It doesn't want to derail us. We allow it. But

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Speaker 2: I think that we can have agency here now that

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Speaker 2: we're adults, and we can say, okay, fear, what you

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Speaker 2: got for me? And I have done this over and

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Speaker 2: over again in my life, whether it's when making big

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Speaker 2: high stakes financial decisions, career choices, decisions about who to marry,

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Speaker 2: who to not marry, raising my kids, being good to myself.

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Speaker 2: I think that fear when we listen to it, like

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Speaker 2: all emotions. All emotions are valid. Fear too. There was

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Speaker 2: actually a study this year because they probably knew how

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Speaker 2: a book coming out, but a bunch of scientists got

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Speaker 2: together and they were like, you know what, they looked

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Speaker 2: at all these sort of like bad emotions that we

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Speaker 2: have branded bad. They're not really bad, but we just

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Speaker 2: as a culture have decided that things like fear, sadness,

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Speaker 2: and anger, we don't want anything to do with them. Happiness, joy, laughter,

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Speaker 2: let's all focus on that. But those feelings, those that

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Speaker 2: we have breed bad. So they did a study and

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Speaker 2: they've said that those they found that those who perceive

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Speaker 2: actually fear and anger and said is as bad or problematic,

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Speaker 2: are unhappier than those of us who accept these emotions

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Speaker 2: even just as neutral. And I would go a step

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Speaker 2: further and say, no, these these emotions actually have wisdom,

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Speaker 2: and we should listen to them and honor them, because

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Speaker 2: when we do, we are honoring ourselves. Fear for me

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Speaker 2: is very personal for you, Tiffany, It's different when it

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Speaker 2: shows up, it's for different reasons, and so wouldn't you

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Speaker 2: want to explore that. I just feel like when we

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Speaker 2: get closer to how we feel. We get closer to

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Speaker 2: who we are and what our values are. And that's

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Speaker 2: the offering in this book. It's it's looking at money

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Speaker 2: and work and all these really big, big, big moves

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Speaker 2: that we make in our lives through the lens of

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Speaker 2: your fears. And you know, I think it can be

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Speaker 2: funny sometimes. I hope. I don't want this to be

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Speaker 2: a serious book, you know, like it's not. It's not

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Speaker 2: meant to be too too, too too serious. I want

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Speaker 2: people to be on it, to be approachable, because a

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Speaker 2: book about fear can be scary, yes, overwhelming.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, these big like because you're right, like you know,

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Speaker 1: like even in grief. This is one thing I learned

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Speaker 1: from my therapist. She was like, grief, even with grief,

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Speaker 1: it brings gifts, she calls them, like the gifts of grief. Yes,

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Speaker 1: you know, so much clarity, just like you know, like

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Speaker 1: is that what I really want to do? Is this?

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Speaker 1: You know, is this direction? I want to go to?

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Speaker 1: Same thing with fear, right, because fear is an indicator,

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Speaker 1: Like wait, this is like you're something internally is saying

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Speaker 1: pay attention, pay attention, pay attention. You know, like if

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Speaker 1: I'm feeling this way, maybe you know that's actually it's

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Speaker 1: because that's I don't want to become. Like I remember

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Speaker 1: after graduating, I was going to graduate college and I

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Speaker 1: was really afraid of graduating college. It's because what I

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Speaker 1: had lined up this boring. I had done this internship

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Speaker 1: which was so boring, and they'd offer me a job

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Speaker 1: and I was like, okay, even though I hated it.

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Speaker 1: I used to cry every day. So I was afraid

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Speaker 1: to graduate. And because I dove into that fear, what

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Speaker 1: I was really saying was I don't want the life

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Speaker 1: I've got lined up because I don't want to work there.

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Speaker 1: But I know that my parents will be like, oh,

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Speaker 1: that's so good, you know, And I just remember, like

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Speaker 1: I quietly, you know, declined and decided. I accepted a

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Speaker 1: job at a local daycare center. And I did not

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Speaker 1: tell my parents because it was like telling them I've

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Speaker 1: decided to become a drug dealer. Especially with immigrant parents

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Speaker 1: are like, we did it work so hot for you too?

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Speaker 2: Yes?

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, I can see I can see how

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Speaker 1: fear really it's like a it's a mechanism that you

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Speaker 1: can use to say, wait, what am I actually really saying?

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Speaker 2: You know, Like, and I think with your story, Tiffany,

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Speaker 2: I think what you were What I try to do

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Speaker 2: in the book is try to distill the fear even further.

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Speaker 2: So there's nine chapters and each chapter is dedicated to

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Speaker 2: a kind of fear because well, we typically what we

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Speaker 2: tend to do in our culture is were like fear

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Speaker 2: four letter word monolith. Fear has many brands and flavors.

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Speaker 2: Fear of failure is I think what you were probably

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Speaker 2: experiencing in that moment, this idea that you were going

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Speaker 2: to take on this opportunity. And although all the the

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Speaker 2: you know, everybody was excited for you, but like you personally,

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Speaker 2: were not going to feel successful in that. And so

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Speaker 2: fear of failure is one of the chapters. It's one

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Speaker 2: of the biggest chapters because I got a lot of

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Speaker 2: stories about my fears of failure. But there is wisdom.

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Speaker 2: Every time failure, fear of failure shows up, it could

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Speaker 2: be telling you multiple things. And I think in that instance,

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Speaker 2: you were right to sort of listen to that fear

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Speaker 2: was telling you that you want to move towards a

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Speaker 2: new definition of success. Yes, so that's an opportunity that

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Speaker 2: had you not experienced that fear, had you not said like, hey, fear, what's.

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Speaker 1: The girl, I'll be working a cubicle right now talking

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Speaker 1: about listening to so money in a cubicle.

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Speaker 2: Like, what a shame for all of us? What a

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Speaker 2: shame for all of humanity? If that was your if

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Speaker 2: that was your plight. So I I journey through the book.

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Speaker 2: There's nine chapters, nine different fears, starting with the ones

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Speaker 2: that we tend to develop early on in our lives.

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Speaker 2: Fear of rejection and fear of loneliness because who hasn't

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Speaker 2: been rejected and who hasn't felt lonely? And then it

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Speaker 2: goes into fomo because it is a twenty first century book,

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Speaker 2: and the fear of missing out on other people's fun

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Speaker 2: what is that actually telling you to do? Lots of stuff?

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Speaker 2: The fear of exposure. I kind of made this one up,

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Speaker 2: but I'm sticking with it. So there is a big

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Speaker 2: push in our culture to be vulnerable, which I can appreciate.

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Speaker 2: I have gone there, I've gone to the depths with

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Speaker 2: certain audiences, certain people. I've shown my true self when

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Speaker 2: it felt right. But I think there is a push

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Speaker 2: to be vulnerable all the time, and some people don't

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00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:54,119
Speaker 2: know the boundaries, and then they get in trouble.

431
00:21:54,440 --> 00:22:00,600
Speaker 1: They say all the things that's not the plexus. No.

432
00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:04,120
Speaker 2: I mean it may sound to us like because maybe

433
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:06,680
Speaker 2: we've we've experienced it, and we're like, yeah, you don't

434
00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:10,359
Speaker 2: do that, But for the person reading the book, who

435
00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:12,720
Speaker 2: might be in her early twenties or his early twenties,

436
00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:14,680
Speaker 2: and they're like, but I thought I was supposed to

437
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:16,639
Speaker 2: being my whole self to work. I thought I was

438
00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:18,800
Speaker 2: supposed to tell everybody all the things I was supposed

439
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:22,959
Speaker 2: to speak up all the time. Well, in theory, that

440
00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:25,879
Speaker 2: would be great, but we don't live in a euphoria

441
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:28,600
Speaker 2: like that, Like the world is not always so forgiving

442
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,359
Speaker 2: of people that have different opinions or different backgrounds. And

443
00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:34,679
Speaker 2: not to say that you have to hide that or

444
00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:37,120
Speaker 2: lie about that, but I think this chapter is really

445
00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:40,760
Speaker 2: about how to be discerning when fear of exposure, which

446
00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:43,080
Speaker 2: means like you're afraid of like someone finding out something

447
00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:47,560
Speaker 2: personal about you that is sacred, Like I don't think

448
00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,520
Speaker 2: that everyone needs to know everything about me, Yeah, you know,

449
00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,600
Speaker 2: like I share that with certain people, but not everybody.

450
00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:57,000
Speaker 2: And so how to read the room when that fear

451
00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:59,000
Speaker 2: shows up. It's telling you to read the room. Case

452
00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:02,000
Speaker 2: in point I was at con and I was on

453
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,760
Speaker 2: stage with a bunch of uh with. It was a

454
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:08,679
Speaker 2: panel on how to negotiate and earn your value as

455
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:12,600
Speaker 2: a creator and an entrepreneur and personal finance and touche

456
00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:15,680
Speaker 2: that this person asked this question because it was about

457
00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,159
Speaker 2: negotiating and earning your value, and she said, got up

458
00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:20,840
Speaker 2: in the audience full of people I don't know, raised

459
00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:23,320
Speaker 2: your hand and said, farnush, how much money do you make?

460
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:28,399
Speaker 1: Like actually, and they like, girl, I'm how to get

461
00:23:28,440 --> 00:23:29,040
Speaker 1: robbed on the rain?

462
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:32,800
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, thank you for thinking I make that

463
00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:36,040
Speaker 2: much money. But that was just like I was, like,

464
00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 2: I appreciate the question, but in this forum, in this moment,

465
00:23:40,160 --> 00:23:43,119
Speaker 2: not appropriate for me. Some people may be willing to

466
00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:46,600
Speaker 2: go there. But that fear of exposure crawled up in

467
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:48,800
Speaker 2: that moment and like showed up and like was staring

468
00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:50,119
Speaker 2: at me in the face, like you really want to

469
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:52,399
Speaker 2: go there, farnush with all these strangers. You want to

470
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:55,160
Speaker 2: tell these people what's on your w two And I'll

471
00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:58,920
Speaker 2: tell you why I was afraid. It wasn't because I

472
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,800
Speaker 2: was afraid of maybe what people might think. I don't

473
00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:03,280
Speaker 2: even know what people might think, but I'll tell you

474
00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:05,560
Speaker 2: what my personal fears there were telling me. It was

475
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:09,520
Speaker 2: that you don't know who's in the room. You don't

476
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:10,959
Speaker 2: know who's in the room. I would love to think

477
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:13,119
Speaker 2: that everybody in this room is like an advocate and

478
00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:15,480
Speaker 2: supports me, and would be like, yeah, you should earn

479
00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:18,639
Speaker 2: that and then some But I know, because I've lived

480
00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:20,760
Speaker 2: my life and I have experience in this that when

481
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,480
Speaker 2: people sometimes find out how much you make, they judge

482
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:25,720
Speaker 2: you for that in ways that I don't want the

483
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:29,280
Speaker 2: distraction and I don't also want to get penalized. So

484
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:33,399
Speaker 2: there was a story that before this happened, I'd experienced

485
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:37,920
Speaker 2: something that was completely complete BS. But I was negotiating

486
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 2: a deal with a brand. This was round two of

487
00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:43,760
Speaker 2: the negotiations. We had already worked together, I had delivered

488
00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:48,479
Speaker 2: on all points, and they were coming back to do

489
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:52,560
Speaker 2: another term. So I obviously asked for more money, and

490
00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:55,720
Speaker 2: I was negotiating this through my agent. But my agent

491
00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:57,480
Speaker 2: came back to me and he said, you'll never believe

492
00:24:57,480 --> 00:24:59,359
Speaker 2: what they just said. I said, what did they say

493
00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:02,119
Speaker 2: was actually for more? But I wasn't asking for you know,

494
00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:04,240
Speaker 2: crazy amounts. It was. It would have been a lot

495
00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:06,160
Speaker 2: for me, but not a lot for them, also considering

496
00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:08,840
Speaker 2: that they were getting a lot of value. He said,

497
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:13,040
Speaker 2: the woman who's their rep, the brand rep said, doesn't

498
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:14,240
Speaker 2: furnish already make enough?

499
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:16,400
Speaker 1: Oh?

500
00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:21,120
Speaker 2: Yes, see, so this is going on in the world, Tiffany, right,

501
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,720
Speaker 2: and this is a woman, a woman. So I said

502
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 2: to my agent, please go back with the following transcript.

503
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 2: Are you sure you want to go on the record

504
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:35,680
Speaker 2: for saying that to a woman? And I got my lunch.

505
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:37,800
Speaker 2: Long story short, I got my money.

506
00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:39,760
Speaker 1: Wait wait, wait, wait, wait for news. Should give me

507
00:25:39,840 --> 00:25:42,439
Speaker 1: one second. We need to pay some bills. We're going

508
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:45,399
Speaker 1: to be right back. Have to pay some bills. You

509
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 1: can hear more about for news and how to lean

510
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:52,720
Speaker 1: into fear. We'll be right back, black and brown and

511
00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:56,080
Speaker 1: weird back far what you're saying again.

512
00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:58,960
Speaker 2: My point is is that there's a reason employers are

513
00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:00,840
Speaker 2: not allowed to ask you how much should you make

514
00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:03,880
Speaker 2: in your previous job? Okay, so if you can accept that,

515
00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 2: that is cool like that. I get that. I get

516
00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:10,480
Speaker 2: why I shouldn't be cornered during a job interview to

517
00:26:10,520 --> 00:26:13,800
Speaker 2: give somebody my salary history because it can be used

518
00:26:13,840 --> 00:26:14,320
Speaker 2: against me.

519
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 1: Sangos.

520
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:19,159
Speaker 2: When you're an entrepreneur working in a field where you

521
00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:23,800
Speaker 2: know there are people unfortunately out there that devalue you

522
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:27,399
Speaker 2: and will use what you make as a weapon against you. Now,

523
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:31,560
Speaker 2: having said all that, back to that fin Con moment

524
00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:33,960
Speaker 2: on stage, this woman's asking me how much I make?

525
00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:37,080
Speaker 2: I said, look, I will happily have this conversation with

526
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:40,560
Speaker 2: you one on one. Yes, And I said, anybody else

527
00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:42,760
Speaker 2: in this room who wants to talk about, you know,

528
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:46,240
Speaker 2: negotiating brand contracts and all that, like, I'll beat the

529
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:49,840
Speaker 2: Starbucks downstairs. And a table of seven or eight of

530
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:51,919
Speaker 2: us got together and we talked and we are still

531
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:55,399
Speaker 2: in touch. So I think that when the fear of

532
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:57,800
Speaker 2: exposure shows up, and this is like a real important

533
00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:00,240
Speaker 2: chapter in the book, especially now, because it may not

534
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 2: seem like has anything to do with money or work,

535
00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 2: but it shows up in these contexts, right, that you

536
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 2: should take a beat. And it doesn't mean you run

537
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:13,040
Speaker 2: away or you hide like sometimes we think fear is

538
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 2: nudging us to do. No, it's just saying, read the room,

539
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:22,679
Speaker 2: figure out if you reveal this piece of information about yourself, Like,

540
00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:26,520
Speaker 2: is the audience going to be receptive? Does it deserve

541
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:30,879
Speaker 2: to know your goods? Not every audience deserves to know

542
00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 2: all the special things about you, at least not right

543
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,359
Speaker 2: away or in certain contexts like find your own time,

544
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 2: find your own place, find your own people.

545
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:41,360
Speaker 1: So you're saying that one of the things I hear

546
00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:44,120
Speaker 1: you saying is that fear helps to create like an

547
00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:45,280
Speaker 1: internal awareness.

548
00:27:45,680 --> 00:27:50,360
Speaker 2: Yes, it's all about that. It's all about turning you inward, Tiffany,

549
00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:52,800
Speaker 2: And I think in a world where there are a

550
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:55,359
Speaker 2: lot of distractions, and there's a lot of push pull,

551
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:58,840
Speaker 2: and you're being driven in million directions and you're looking

552
00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 2: at someone's in Instagram or you're looking at you know,

553
00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:04,640
Speaker 2: what your parents thought you wanted, should do, could do,

554
00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:08,760
Speaker 2: and we forget to just quiet all of that and

555
00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:11,320
Speaker 2: think about what it is that we want. Who am

556
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:15,160
Speaker 2: I at the end of the day. And fear is

557
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 2: like this icebreaker that that that gets us to do that,

558
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:22,040
Speaker 2: that wants us to do that ultimately. I mean, look,

559
00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:24,800
Speaker 2: if not for fear, you and I would not be here.

560
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:26,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, So why is our.

561
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:30,760
Speaker 2: Culture so anti fear? Why are we so like, oh

562
00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:33,720
Speaker 2: my god, you need to be fearless. You got to

563
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 2: ignore your fears, fight your fears. Poor fear, poor old fear.

564
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:42,400
Speaker 2: You know, like it's just trying to help us out fear.

565
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:44,280
Speaker 1: I feel like you are fear as new pr agent.

566
00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 1: You're like, I mean, I mean, that's the.

567
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,160
Speaker 2: First page of the book. It's my it's my first

568
00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 2: line of the intro. I said, Uh, you know, fear

569
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:55,000
Speaker 2: has had some really bad pr for as long as

570
00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:57,720
Speaker 2: I can remember, since the days of the Great Depression,

571
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 2: when President rose Belt told a see of hungry, penniless

572
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 2: Americans during the Great Depression that you have nothing to

573
00:29:07,840 --> 00:29:11,120
Speaker 2: fear but fear itself. What kind of a privileged statement

574
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:17,040
Speaker 2: is that? I'm I am hungry, mister President, I'm afraid

575
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,360
Speaker 2: that I will not find work. And you know what,

576
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 2: in every moment in my life where I have been afraid,

577
00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:27,240
Speaker 2: I have found opportunity. I have gotten creative.

578
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 1: Yes, I was gonna say, like, what are some of

579
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:32,440
Speaker 1: the benefits that you have found? Like I would love

580
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:34,959
Speaker 1: for to see her like yeah, Like, oh my gosh,

581
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:37,280
Speaker 1: Like you know, you don't have to necessarily share what

582
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:39,080
Speaker 1: you were afraid of if you're not comfortable. But like,

583
00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:41,400
Speaker 1: on the other side of that, what are some of

584
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:43,120
Speaker 1: those Oh? Thank God for that fear of that moment,

585
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,840
Speaker 1: because as a result, this thing came out of it.

586
00:29:46,160 --> 00:29:50,200
Speaker 2: The gosh, every chapter there are so many stories tivity.

587
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:52,120
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, what would you like to know about

588
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 2: I mean, I mean it's cliche, but like moving in

589
00:29:56,400 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 2: the pandemic, right, I was afraid of staying where I

590
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,400
Speaker 2: was with my family four in Brooklyn, in our small

591
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 2: apartment that we were already planning to move to the suburbs.

592
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:10,720
Speaker 2: But the pandemic as a tailwind, it like got us

593
00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:13,440
Speaker 2: out of that city real fast. And it was one

594
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 2: of those moments where I thought, I'm either making the

595
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:19,520
Speaker 2: best decision or the worst decision. But I was afraid

596
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 2: and I was gonna. I had to move. I had

597
00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:27,479
Speaker 2: to do something. What made that decision viable? Even if so,

598
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 2: I was ready for it to blow up in my face.

599
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:31,600
Speaker 2: I was, I'm always ready for I always have a

600
00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:33,960
Speaker 2: plan B, C or D. My son is My son

601
00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 2: is nine, and uh he knows like I'm like, Okay,

602
00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 2: my job as a parent is done because I'll say,

603
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:40,920
Speaker 2: what if they don't have the thing that you want

604
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 2: at the store, what's your plan? B? He mom, Mommy,

605
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:45,320
Speaker 2: I have a plan C and a D.

606
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:50,360
Speaker 1: Okay, that's really smart though, because you got as bad

607
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 1: as the hell out, Like where is my car ranger? Right?

608
00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 2: I was like, what if they don't have Sonic and

609
00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 2: they don't have teenage meaning Minsta Turtles, and you're gonna

610
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:02,880
Speaker 2: have to get like Pokemon, which was like last season's obsession.

611
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:06,720
Speaker 2: And so I think that that's teaching them that life

612
00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:09,880
Speaker 2: won't go your way. Usually it won't and not only

613
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 2: And I love my Plan b's and c's and d's.

614
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:15,280
Speaker 2: I think they're equally as great as Plan A. You

615
00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:18,080
Speaker 2: got to get yourself there and rallying behind those alternate

616
00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:22,640
Speaker 2: plans because that's how you get through life feeling good

617
00:31:22,800 --> 00:31:25,800
Speaker 2: and happy, you know. And so that was one reason.

618
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:29,960
Speaker 2: That was one obvious like fear driven. I talk about how,

619
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:33,120
Speaker 2: oh my gosh, we were about to embark on a

620
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:36,959
Speaker 2: big renovation project in Brooklyn. We were going to come

621
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:40,160
Speaker 2: we were combining apartments, and we were going to have

622
00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:42,760
Speaker 2: to move out of our apartment for four months to

623
00:31:42,840 --> 00:31:45,080
Speaker 2: do this. And I had a baby at the time.

624
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 2: I didn't have my second yet. I was just evan

625
00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 2: was I think, I don't know, six months, seven months,

626
00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:55,320
Speaker 2: and the night before we're about to like do this,

627
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 2: and I've got movers coming to take my stuff into storage.

628
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:02,640
Speaker 2: I've signed the sublet to go basically uproot my family

629
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,240
Speaker 2: to another to Williamsburg, which is like, you know for

630
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:07,800
Speaker 2: Brooklyn people in Brooklyn. I was going from like downtown

631
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 2: Brooklyn to Williamsburg is basically like banning myself from the

632
00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 2: world and.

633
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:16,880
Speaker 1: Near Promozoto radical it comes to their areas.

634
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:20,880
Speaker 2: Were such snobs. We're such like you know, micro city.

635
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:21,400
Speaker 1: You know.

636
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:27,040
Speaker 2: So the contractor that we had hired, who was recommended

637
00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:30,760
Speaker 2: by an architect whom we had met several times, lovely man.

638
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:35,040
Speaker 2: We're about to meet for our final budget meeting to

639
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 2: go over the budget and he comes into my apartment.

640
00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:40,480
Speaker 2: I swear to a kid, you not hitting. He was

641
00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:42,240
Speaker 2: like Tiffany. He was like sideways.

642
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:45,360
Speaker 1: He was like he was like that that like that.

643
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 2: Slip was it a V eight commercial where they come

644
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:47,880
Speaker 2: in like.

645
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:49,120
Speaker 1: Side He drunk.

646
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:55,000
Speaker 2: He was holding it together and he wasn't like falling

647
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:57,880
Speaker 2: over himself. But he was like a different person. He

648
00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 2: was loud, he was snippetty.

649
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:02,280
Speaker 1: He insulted me.

650
00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 2: At one point I said, I said, I want to

651
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 2: just talk about the flooring because the flooring was really expensive.

652
00:33:08,200 --> 00:33:10,360
Speaker 2: I was like, can we shop this around? And he goes,

653
00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:14,760
Speaker 2: I thought, you like nice things? And I was like oh, okay, okay.

654
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:18,560
Speaker 2: Suddenly got really hostile in the room and like my architect,

655
00:33:18,600 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 2: I'm looking at her like, do you are you watching

656
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:23,360
Speaker 2: this movie? Like I don't know what's going on? Like

657
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:26,480
Speaker 2: this is the part of nice nice contractor is now

658
00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:29,200
Speaker 2: by like belligerent? I don't know what's going on.

659
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:31,000
Speaker 1: Man, it you know how like when they watch it

660
00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:32,760
Speaker 1: when you do him play and it's like what was that?

661
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:35,440
Speaker 1: Like your your like if you can't do the play,

662
00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:38,000
Speaker 1: like let's just say understudy, yes, your understudy.

663
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:40,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was totally the understudy. And I was like,

664
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:44,120
Speaker 2: I don't know what his deal is. And also I

665
00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:45,760
Speaker 2: was like, all right, let's look at the budget. And

666
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:48,000
Speaker 2: he didn't bring the budget to the budget meeting.

667
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 1: Wow.

668
00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 2: So I said, you know what, let's just wrap well

669
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:55,120
Speaker 2: convened in the morning, but between you and me, like

670
00:33:55,400 --> 00:33:56,640
Speaker 2: I need to know what was going on. I just

671
00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 2: get to the bottom of this guy. So I pulled

672
00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:00,240
Speaker 2: my architect aside, I said, can you please follow with

673
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:03,280
Speaker 2: him and find out what is going on? And so

674
00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:05,840
Speaker 2: she called him that night and at first he denied everything.

675
00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:08,360
Speaker 2: He's like, oh, I thought the meeting went great. She's like,

676
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:11,719
Speaker 2: you clearly weren't there, like what was going on? And

677
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,920
Speaker 2: then after a little bit of you know, here and there,

678
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:19,920
Speaker 2: he said, well, actually I my cousins were in town.

679
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,440
Speaker 2: We went out for some beers, and then I took

680
00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:25,560
Speaker 2: my back paid medicine, and then he thought it was

681
00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:29,759
Speaker 2: a good idea to come to a meeting. Now, I

682
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:34,759
Speaker 2: don't fault him for that, like taking his medicine with

683
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:37,640
Speaker 2: his beers four hours apart, but whatever, Like do that

684
00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:40,240
Speaker 2: in your home. Don't come to a meeting at someone's

685
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:44,359
Speaker 2: house and then pretend like everything is okay. Yeah, if

686
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:48,280
Speaker 2: he had just canceled that meeting, he would have been fine.

687
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:51,040
Speaker 2: He would have been covered. And because here's what happened.

688
00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:54,400
Speaker 2: When I found out that he did that to us

689
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:57,799
Speaker 2: and thought it was cool. And he's the contractor, he's

690
00:34:57,880 --> 00:35:01,239
Speaker 2: not like, he's not the man man. You know, he's

691
00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:04,919
Speaker 2: dealing with heavy machinery and he's dealing with a team

692
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:08,240
Speaker 2: and New York City laws. And I said, I cannot

693
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:12,759
Speaker 2: hire him. And this was this specific fear that I had,

694
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 2: was the fear of failure. I feared that if I

695
00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:23,120
Speaker 2: hired him, the project would fail because he would show

696
00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:26,799
Speaker 2: up again. I couldn't trust him, and there's a whole

697
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:30,760
Speaker 2: section in that chapter about red flags. I love red flags.

698
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 2: Red flags are your friends. When people show up as

699
00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:38,440
Speaker 2: they are in their truth, believe them.

700
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:40,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know.

701
00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:43,239
Speaker 2: And I just felt like I was gonna I was

702
00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:45,719
Speaker 2: afraid that if I fired him that I was going

703
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 2: to lose out on all this money. I was not

704
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:48,719
Speaker 2: I was supposed to move into a sublet, Like, how

705
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:50,600
Speaker 2: could I do this? I should just people wanted me

706
00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:53,560
Speaker 2: to turn a cheek. My architect even was like, I've

707
00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:55,200
Speaker 2: never seen him like this. I don't think it's going

708
00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:57,759
Speaker 2: to happen again. But I was like, I just here's

709
00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:00,560
Speaker 2: what you ask yourself. If in a year or three

710
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 2: months something blows up and it's him doing his thing again,

711
00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:08,439
Speaker 2: who would you just be like, Oh, I didn't see

712
00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:11,960
Speaker 2: that coming, because you did, because I did. And it

713
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:14,920
Speaker 2: was not a small thing. Yeah, and these were it

714
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:19,600
Speaker 2: was a huge six figure project. People were involved, lives

715
00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:23,520
Speaker 2: were involved, the law was involved, and I just couldn't know.

716
00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:26,960
Speaker 2: So I did bite the bullet. I mean, I cut

717
00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:30,040
Speaker 2: losses there. I moved into a sublet that I didn't

718
00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 2: need to. For the first month, I had to somehow

719
00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:34,960
Speaker 2: scramble to find a new contractor. I had things in

720
00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:36,799
Speaker 2: storage that I didn't need to so I had spent

721
00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:38,919
Speaker 2: all this money that was just sunk costs to that point.

722
00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 1: But I knew that.

723
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:42,360
Speaker 2: There was a bigger fear waiting for me, a bigger

724
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:44,799
Speaker 2: disaster waiting for me. And that's really what a lot

725
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:46,640
Speaker 2: of times it comes down to. When you feel fear

726
00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:49,200
Speaker 2: and you're thinking, do I do something? Do I not?

727
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:52,319
Speaker 2: Here's what I want to offer you. Think about if

728
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:55,200
Speaker 2: you don't do anything with this fear, if this fear

729
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:58,040
Speaker 2: does what it sometimes does does when we're not really

730
00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:01,120
Speaker 2: really being thoughtful or calculating, just like it stops us

731
00:37:01,160 --> 00:37:04,080
Speaker 2: in our tracks, like it freezes us. You don't want that,

732
00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:07,680
Speaker 2: because think about in a year or down the road,

733
00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:10,080
Speaker 2: you ignored this, you didn't do anything, you thought you

734
00:37:10,160 --> 00:37:14,760
Speaker 2: were gonna be fearless, something else bigger happens. That's scarier.

735
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:18,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, honestly, And this just really resonates with me, especially

736
00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:20,640
Speaker 1: over the last two years. I remember like so like

737
00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 1: I didn't give I have my stepdaughter, Alyssa. She's awesome

738
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 1: who for the first time today she sent me like

739
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:27,480
Speaker 1: this jit that said I love you, and I was like, oh,

740
00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:31,640
Speaker 1: I mean, she's a teenager. So that's why get so sweet.

741
00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:33,400
Speaker 1: I know, that's what I'm saying. Like I was like,

742
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:35,400
Speaker 1: what I mean, I always tell her I love her,

743
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:37,279
Speaker 1: like I dropped off for school. I love you, you know,

744
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:38,960
Speaker 1: I get up to I love you. She always responds.

745
00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:42,440
Speaker 1: But this is like the first unprompted like not I

746
00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 1: love you. So these Jordans, I really like, you know,

747
00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:49,000
Speaker 1: yeah yeah yeah, not a tea up. It was just

748
00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:52,920
Speaker 1: sounds super sweet. But like I remember, like I was

749
00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:54,600
Speaker 1: never really sure. I mean, if you guys listen to

750
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:56,920
Speaker 1: the podcast for a while, like I'm like, I mean,

751
00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,799
Speaker 1: I love kids, like I taught preschool because I love kids,

752
00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 1: but I was never one hundred thousand percent like I

753
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:04,759
Speaker 1: definitely want to be a mom. But I remember that

754
00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:07,640
Speaker 1: I had this fear that if I didn't try, I

755
00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:10,640
Speaker 1: would live to regret it. I knew that for sure.

756
00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:12,560
Speaker 1: I was like and it was like and I knew

757
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:15,719
Speaker 1: Durell was like like an amazing dad, so I was like,

758
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:17,880
Speaker 1: you know, worst case scenario, this kid got an awesome da,

759
00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:21,200
Speaker 1: like just in case I don't work out. So but

760
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:25,040
Speaker 1: I just remember distinctly thinking I'm not sure. I mean,

761
00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:26,399
Speaker 1: I think I want to be a mom, I'm not sure,

762
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:29,080
Speaker 1: but I know one hundred percent that if I don't try,

763
00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:31,000
Speaker 1: I'm going to regret it. Because there was this fear

764
00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:34,960
Speaker 1: that was like pulsing, and so I was able to

765
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:38,279
Speaker 1: conceive naturally. I did IVF for like three years and

766
00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:41,520
Speaker 1: it didn't work out. Actually did our last implementation like

767
00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:44,720
Speaker 1: with the embryo, like the in October, and Drel passed

768
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:48,680
Speaker 1: away in November. But because I did those three years,

769
00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:50,640
Speaker 1: because I asked my therapist, I said, of all the

770
00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:52,960
Speaker 1: things I'm going through with grief, why is it I

771
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:56,160
Speaker 1: don't feel bad that I didn't give birth any kids?

772
00:38:56,200 --> 00:38:58,640
Speaker 1: She said, because you did everything possible. Yes, And to

773
00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:02,279
Speaker 1: your point, I, of all the other emotions I have

774
00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:04,759
Speaker 1: to deal with, that's not one of them. Because that

775
00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 1: fear made me take action, and because I did everything.

776
00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:10,000
Speaker 1: I remember at the time, my IVF doctor was like, Tiffany,

777
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:12,399
Speaker 1: you're like my best patient. You're here every single week.

778
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:14,720
Speaker 1: You've taken all the meds, you haven't skipped, You've done everything.

779
00:39:14,760 --> 00:39:17,319
Speaker 1: I even went vegan for like almost like a year

780
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:19,800
Speaker 1: and a half because I wasn't sure, like like anything

781
00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:23,000
Speaker 1: possible to make sure that I could be prepared. So

782
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:26,399
Speaker 1: it took that. I you know, so many people when

783
00:39:26,400 --> 00:39:29,400
Speaker 1: someone passes away to live with regret, you know, and

784
00:39:29,560 --> 00:39:32,000
Speaker 1: that wasn't something that wasn't a regret which would have

785
00:39:32,000 --> 00:39:33,920
Speaker 1: been a heavy one because what if I had let

786
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:35,680
Speaker 1: the budget needs to get in the way, you know,

787
00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:37,440
Speaker 1: I was a workaholic. What if I had let that

788
00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:39,120
Speaker 1: because it was I was this close to being like

789
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:41,480
Speaker 1: later later, later, then I would be sitting here with

790
00:39:41,680 --> 00:39:44,600
Speaker 1: so much regret, like why didn't I try? What was

791
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:47,040
Speaker 1: more important than try? You know, But I don't have

792
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 1: that because I did. And so to your point, that

793
00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:54,120
Speaker 1: is a that was a beautiful fear that allowed me

794
00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:57,560
Speaker 1: to do something that now I can like rest easy

795
00:39:57,640 --> 00:39:59,880
Speaker 1: when it comes to that component of my life because

796
00:39:59,880 --> 00:40:01,959
Speaker 1: I I did all that I was capable of doing,

797
00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:04,680
Speaker 1: and if it was supposed to happen, it wasn't because

798
00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:06,160
Speaker 1: I didn't do all that I was capable. So I

799
00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:08,840
Speaker 1: can let that, let that go. So I'm grateful. And

800
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:11,320
Speaker 1: there's so many instances of that, you know, for me,

801
00:40:11,480 --> 00:40:13,680
Speaker 1: like grateful for that fear. So I'm super excited to

802
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:17,120
Speaker 1: read your book because to your point, you know, I

803
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:19,239
Speaker 1: think so many of us were taught to lean back

804
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:22,239
Speaker 1: from fear, and what it sounds like is that your

805
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:24,759
Speaker 1: book really teaches us to lean into it and use

806
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:27,680
Speaker 1: it as a tool that it was intended, I know, and.

807
00:40:27,760 --> 00:40:31,239
Speaker 2: It's available to all of us. We are all experts.

808
00:40:31,719 --> 00:40:33,600
Speaker 2: I mean, if we were going by Malcolm Glodwell's ten

809
00:40:33,640 --> 00:40:37,239
Speaker 2: thousand hour rule, we are bona fide fear experts. Just

810
00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:38,720
Speaker 2: add it to your LinkedIn profile.

811
00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:39,480
Speaker 1: Just do it.

812
00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:43,000
Speaker 2: You are there, my friends. I mean, thinking about this

813
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:45,560
Speaker 2: world that we live in and how so many resources

814
00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 2: are inaccessible, right, there's just not equity when it comes

815
00:40:49,080 --> 00:40:52,920
Speaker 2: to the availability of tools and resources to help us

816
00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:55,120
Speaker 2: navigate life. Fear is abundant.

817
00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:55,640
Speaker 1: It is.

818
00:40:56,160 --> 00:41:00,319
Speaker 2: It is a natural resource, and what a gift if

819
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:02,560
Speaker 2: we just allow it to be that, if we just

820
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,600
Speaker 2: allow it, if it's just a reframe, it's a simple reframe.

821
00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:08,960
Speaker 2: And to your story about you know, doing all the

822
00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 2: things you can do that taking control of what is

823
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:17,640
Speaker 2: a completely uncertain moment. I mean, anyone trying to get pregnant,

824
00:41:18,719 --> 00:41:21,880
Speaker 2: you know, you just have to like cross your fingers.

825
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:24,359
Speaker 2: It's just, you know, you think you have so much

826
00:41:24,400 --> 00:41:26,440
Speaker 2: of a role in that. But I think what I'm

827
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:28,319
Speaker 2: hearing from you in that story is that you had

828
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:33,799
Speaker 2: this fear of uncertainty, and you decided to create order

829
00:41:33,840 --> 00:41:36,480
Speaker 2: in the disorder, and your best way of doing that

830
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:39,720
Speaker 2: was to do what you could do, what can you control?

831
00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:41,800
Speaker 2: And that's often what the fear of uncertainty is nudging

832
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 2: us towards. It's not asking us to spiral, it's not

833
00:41:44,640 --> 00:41:47,160
Speaker 2: telling us to chase our tails. It's not telling us

834
00:41:47,239 --> 00:41:50,640
Speaker 2: to bury ourselves in uncertainty or not make a decision.

835
00:41:50,719 --> 00:41:54,239
Speaker 2: It's saying, what do you have at your disposal? What

836
00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,879
Speaker 2: are the resources that you have where you can feel

837
00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:00,719
Speaker 2: empowered and in control. And it's still may not work out,

838
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:03,680
Speaker 2: but to your point, at least you can say I

839
00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:05,520
Speaker 2: did everything I could exactly.

840
00:42:06,360 --> 00:42:08,600
Speaker 1: And that's totally what I realized I was asking of myself,

841
00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:11,560
Speaker 1: like because I'm like, I can't. So there are more

842
00:42:11,600 --> 00:42:13,600
Speaker 1: people who have not been born than born. You know,

843
00:42:13,719 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: we realized that when you really try to have a baby,

844
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:18,640
Speaker 1: especially if you go through like the scientific component of it,

845
00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:21,120
Speaker 1: you start to realize what a miracle it is that

846
00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:24,120
Speaker 1: you're sitting here, because like if your mom would have

847
00:42:24,160 --> 00:42:25,920
Speaker 1: coughed instead of sneezed, if she would have had a

848
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 1: coffee instead of tea, you know, like anything. Literally, like

849
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:31,400
Speaker 1: if your dad had a unibra and your mom was

850
00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 1: like not really unto your brows, you literally might not

851
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 1: be here, you know, And so it's such a miracle.

852
00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:39,400
Speaker 1: So you realize, like I knew that, but yeah, I

853
00:42:39,560 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 1: just think I love this. I can't wait honestly for

854
00:42:42,080 --> 00:42:44,040
Speaker 1: it to like like, I know you gave me the

855
00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:47,560
Speaker 1: gap change the world, but honestly, I really I'm someone

856
00:42:47,600 --> 00:42:49,279
Speaker 1: honestly I love like these days, I love to have

857
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:51,200
Speaker 1: my physical book, but I can't wait. Are you reading

858
00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:52,120
Speaker 1: the audiobook versus?

859
00:42:52,200 --> 00:42:55,400
Speaker 2: Oh yes, I just finished recording it, and one of

860
00:42:55,440 --> 00:42:57,279
Speaker 2: the ways we wanted to make it extra special was

861
00:42:57,360 --> 00:43:00,960
Speaker 2: to incorporate actual audio of people that I have interviewed

862
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:03,680
Speaker 2: from the podcast that I have exerted, so you get

863
00:43:03,719 --> 00:43:07,760
Speaker 2: to hear their voices. You also hear me impersonating my parents,

864
00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:11,000
Speaker 2: like your beautiful Nigerian accent from your parents. I have

865
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:13,959
Speaker 2: the Persian mom and the Persian dad, and it's just fun,

866
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:17,839
Speaker 2: you know. I I'm not going to pretend that I'm

867
00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:20,040
Speaker 2: going to be revolutionizing anything here, but I just hope

868
00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:23,640
Speaker 2: that people will give themselves more credit and give their

869
00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:27,320
Speaker 2: feelings more credit, and to know that we're all scared

870
00:43:27,480 --> 00:43:30,200
Speaker 2: all the time. You can be scared and successful, you

871
00:43:30,280 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 2: can be afraid and fulfilled that they're not. They don't

872
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:38,359
Speaker 2: cancel each other out and that you know, I'm living

873
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:42,600
Speaker 2: proof of that, and I am continuously terrified. Like there

874
00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:44,719
Speaker 2: was a man taking photos of my house from his

875
00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:47,080
Speaker 2: car the other day. Wasn't the other day. It was

876
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:49,360
Speaker 2: during the pandemic, so even scarier. And I was like,

877
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:54,120
Speaker 2: oh my god, he's totally plotting a home invasion, like

878
00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:59,759
Speaker 2: he is figuring out my routine. He was a home

879
00:44:00,520 --> 00:44:00,840
Speaker 2: to me.

880
00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:05,239
Speaker 1: He's gonna say if I was the home appraiser, Like

881
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:06,359
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, that makes sense.

882
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:08,600
Speaker 2: All the houses are selling on our block. It's the pandemic.

883
00:44:09,719 --> 00:44:14,080
Speaker 2: That's what he's doing. Yes, because no actual home invader

884
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:19,719
Speaker 2: is going to be that out. So but that's me,

885
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:22,719
Speaker 2: you know, I'm still that terrified little girl inside, but

886
00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:25,200
Speaker 2: I have just learned how to like play with it

887
00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:28,160
Speaker 2: in a way that works for me instead of the

888
00:44:28,239 --> 00:44:29,800
Speaker 2: other way around. Because I know fear does have that

889
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:34,239
Speaker 2: ability to run us rampant and make us doubt ourselves

890
00:44:34,360 --> 00:44:37,560
Speaker 2: and feel stuck and insecure. This is not what I'm sam.

891
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:38,560
Speaker 1: Fear can do.

892
00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:41,560
Speaker 2: All of those things, but and it can also be

893
00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:43,799
Speaker 2: a tool, and it's our choice to decide what we're

894
00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:44,360
Speaker 2: going to do with it.

895
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:48,160
Speaker 1: Well, where can people get your book? A Healthy State

896
00:44:48,239 --> 00:44:48,720
Speaker 1: of Panic?

897
00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:53,120
Speaker 2: All your favorite independent booksellers. I want to lead with that.

898
00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:57,919
Speaker 2: I want to support our independence. But also if you can't,

899
00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:00,640
Speaker 2: if you don't have access to an indie online everywhere

900
00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,760
Speaker 2: you'd like to shop, you know, And if we're airing

901
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:06,120
Speaker 2: this before the pub date, which is October third, you

902
00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:10,480
Speaker 2: can go to a Healthy Stateapanic dot com and submit

903
00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:13,640
Speaker 2: your receipt and you'll get my free program. It's called

904
00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:18,520
Speaker 2: Scared Smart and it's a three video course workbook plus

905
00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:22,160
Speaker 2: the introduction. I figured, why wait till October third to

906
00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 2: get a handle on your financial fears? So that's what

907
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:28,759
Speaker 2: that program walks you, walks you through and it's my

908
00:45:28,960 --> 00:45:31,400
Speaker 2: thank you to those who want to support the pre sales.

909
00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 1: I love it. So a Healthy State of Panic dot

910
00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:35,960
Speaker 1: com will list all the places that people can purchase.

911
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:38,319
Speaker 2: You can purchase it there, yeah, through there, and then

912
00:45:39,200 --> 00:45:41,080
Speaker 2: that's also where you can submit for the bonuses.

913
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:42,839
Speaker 1: I love that. And first of all, did you hear

914
00:45:42,920 --> 00:45:45,279
Speaker 1: what she said? She didn't say? Go to ournews to

915
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:47,920
Speaker 1: Robbie dot com for sas two to nine one one

916
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:50,279
Speaker 1: one like some I've been talking to them all the time.

917
00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:52,520
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh my goodness, if you don't go and

918
00:45:52,600 --> 00:45:54,440
Speaker 1: pay the two dollars and the ten dollars for that

919
00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:57,759
Speaker 1: you are around, Yeah, just do it, yes, because you

920
00:45:57,800 --> 00:45:59,759
Speaker 1: know you get it for ten bucks. And then even

921
00:45:59,800 --> 00:46:01,359
Speaker 1: if like let's just say a Healthy State of Panic,

922
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:03,000
Speaker 1: which I can't believe you got. That's such an awesome

923
00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:06,399
Speaker 1: name that it was available, right, but let's just say

924
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:08,880
Speaker 1: that wasn't available, you could buy a Healthy State of

925
00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:11,200
Speaker 1: Panic book Like this is like.

926
00:46:11,239 --> 00:46:13,640
Speaker 2: Me like telling everything with a book, sure, you.

927
00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:15,200
Speaker 1: Know, like but like you can put a book after

928
00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:17,520
Speaker 1: before whatever. But I just they know, I'm always getting

929
00:46:17,520 --> 00:46:18,960
Speaker 1: on them that like when you're gonna do a thing,

930
00:46:19,040 --> 00:46:22,040
Speaker 1: it's literally ten bucks buy the dag on ur l

931
00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:24,399
Speaker 1: so people don't have to try to figure out like wait,

932
00:46:25,360 --> 00:46:27,919
Speaker 1: you know, and so yes, I love that a Healthy Panic.

933
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:30,239
Speaker 2: Do you ever get emails from like go daddy or

934
00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:33,400
Speaker 2: whoever that's like you're your URLs are about to expire

935
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:35,120
Speaker 2: and it's like the ones that I bought in like

936
00:46:35,400 --> 00:46:37,759
Speaker 2: two thousand and eight that I had an idea in

937
00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:39,360
Speaker 2: the middle of the night and I just went and

938
00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:41,799
Speaker 2: bought the and I was like, what was I even thinking?

939
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:42,720
Speaker 2: What is this site?

940
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:45,680
Speaker 1: You know, I have one that's like what was it?

941
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:50,360
Speaker 1: It's like responsibility te for like T shirt because I

942
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:51,960
Speaker 1: was like, ooh, I'm gonna do I wanna do T

943
00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:54,080
Speaker 1: shirts to have like these responsible messus.

944
00:46:54,200 --> 00:46:54,439
Speaker 2: Girl.

945
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:57,000
Speaker 1: I was like, that was ten dollars not well spent,

946
00:46:57,080 --> 00:46:58,600
Speaker 1: but either way, I got it. And so.

947
00:47:00,160 --> 00:47:04,799
Speaker 2: I mean it's a business expense. You can write it off, okay, And.

948
00:47:04,960 --> 00:47:08,279
Speaker 1: Literally it's typically the average you are around, unless it's like,

949
00:47:08,320 --> 00:47:11,279
Speaker 1: you know, something like super super popular. It's about ten

950
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:13,000
Speaker 1: bucks for the year, and you don't have to set

951
00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:15,160
Speaker 1: it on an automatic renewal. So I just tell people

952
00:47:15,200 --> 00:47:16,600
Speaker 1: go ahead and get it, and then if you don't

953
00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:19,799
Speaker 1: use it, that's fine. But a healthy datapanic dot com

954
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:21,480
Speaker 1: And for our news, where can they follow you on

955
00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:22,440
Speaker 1: all the socials?

956
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:26,520
Speaker 2: Well, you mean the social I'm really just on Instagram.

957
00:47:26,719 --> 00:47:28,800
Speaker 2: I can't. I mean, I know there's threads now and

958
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:33,200
Speaker 2: of course TikTok and what's Facebook. But Instagram is like,

959
00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:36,080
Speaker 2: again going back to my book, like the fear of exposure,

960
00:47:36,200 --> 00:47:38,920
Speaker 2: like that's for my people crowd. I'm not going to

961
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:41,239
Speaker 2: be going bearing all on TikTok. You're never going to

962
00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:45,480
Speaker 2: see me doing that. I've tried. It's not working. The

963
00:47:45,560 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 2: algorithm and I are just like not mixing. And so

964
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:51,920
Speaker 2: Instagram at furnish to Rabbi, it's where I'm having a

965
00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:56,000
Speaker 2: lot of fun. Everyone there's very nice and that's how I.

966
00:47:56,040 --> 00:47:58,920
Speaker 1: Like to keep it. Yes, I love our news to Rabbi.

967
00:47:59,239 --> 00:48:03,239
Speaker 1: F ar n O O s h to Robbie T

968
00:48:03,520 --> 00:48:04,160
Speaker 1: spell it for me.

969
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:07,040
Speaker 2: T O r A B I yes, you can read

970
00:48:07,080 --> 00:48:09,600
Speaker 2: it is. But you know, there was a time many

971
00:48:09,680 --> 00:48:11,319
Speaker 2: times in my life. Did you ever want to change

972
00:48:11,320 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 2: your name?

973
00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:13,880
Speaker 1: I mean your name was Tiffany, but no, no, my

974
00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:15,920
Speaker 1: name was actually Adochi and so I did change. My

975
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:16,560
Speaker 1: name is six.

976
00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:22,600
Speaker 2: So okay, I mean that makes sense. I my parents

977
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:24,640
Speaker 2: allowed me to change my name. I never went with

978
00:48:24,800 --> 00:48:31,640
Speaker 2: the like I test a test ransom names. I was Ashley, Christina, Tina, Nikki.

979
00:48:32,960 --> 00:48:36,400
Speaker 2: It's all Nikki's kind of cute it is, and it

980
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:39,680
Speaker 2: was I always like had in my mind a girl

981
00:48:39,880 --> 00:48:42,560
Speaker 2: like I had a vision of a girl obviously like

982
00:48:42,640 --> 00:48:45,360
Speaker 2: and Nikki was a real girl from my past life,

983
00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:48,640
Speaker 2: past life like we had moved and the girl that

984
00:48:48,719 --> 00:48:51,560
Speaker 2: I knew for my old town who was like super

985
00:48:51,960 --> 00:48:56,840
Speaker 2: super cool, like just like Kashmir sweaters. I mean like

986
00:48:56,920 --> 00:48:59,839
Speaker 2: this girl had her style down and the parents loved

987
00:48:59,880 --> 00:49:01,160
Speaker 2: her and the kids loved her, and I was like,

988
00:49:01,760 --> 00:49:02,440
Speaker 2: I'm going to beat her.

989
00:49:04,320 --> 00:49:06,160
Speaker 1: Well, we glad just stayed for news. I mean, I'll

990
00:49:06,239 --> 00:49:08,760
Speaker 1: say that, like I semi, I don't say I regret

991
00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:11,040
Speaker 1: because well whatever, we're here now. But I tried to

992
00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:13,800
Speaker 1: go back to Adochi and in college, and I remember

993
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:15,279
Speaker 1: why I changed it because no one can say it

994
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:18,080
Speaker 1: used to piss me off. And so like all I

995
00:49:18,120 --> 00:49:19,880
Speaker 1: can tell how well you know me by or how

996
00:49:19,920 --> 00:49:22,120
Speaker 1: long you've known me by what you call me. Like

997
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:24,320
Speaker 1: there are every once in a while, I'll meet somebody

998
00:49:24,400 --> 00:49:26,960
Speaker 1: from like elementary school, like you know, like I'll be

999
00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:28,399
Speaker 1: at the Marshalls and somebody be like, oh my god,

1000
00:49:28,480 --> 00:49:31,440
Speaker 1: is that you Adochi? And I'm like, wait what because

1001
00:49:31,480 --> 00:49:33,880
Speaker 1: I changed it in sixth grade. I'm like, wait roads

1002
00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:38,320
Speaker 1: from second grade? Oh my god? So like yeah, so

1003
00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:40,360
Speaker 1: when I was sixth grade, ye, and my dad was like,

1004
00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:42,520
Speaker 1: you guys can pick a name, and so so Adote

1005
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:44,960
Speaker 1: is still my name, is my middle name. But yeah,

1006
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:48,000
Speaker 1: I picked well at first, I wanted I think I

1007
00:49:48,040 --> 00:49:51,160
Speaker 1: wanted Crystal. I wanted Oh, there was something else that

1008
00:49:51,360 --> 00:49:53,520
Speaker 1: was like Renee, which I think I'd make a few Renee.

1009
00:49:53,719 --> 00:49:55,719
Speaker 1: That's a great name. It's like there was some other,

1010
00:49:55,880 --> 00:49:59,359
Speaker 1: like non sensual name, like I wanted Jenny, which girl, now,

1011
00:50:00,480 --> 00:50:01,719
Speaker 1: no shade to you Jenny's but I'm just.

1012
00:50:01,719 --> 00:50:04,440
Speaker 2: I don't nicky to Jenny. I feel like I know.

1013
00:50:04,640 --> 00:50:06,279
Speaker 1: But Tiffany I was just like my dad's like, Okay,

1014
00:50:06,320 --> 00:50:08,480
Speaker 1: that's a good name. So yeah, so I yeah, my

1015
00:50:08,600 --> 00:50:10,400
Speaker 1: name is I mean, like you know, if y'all want

1016
00:50:10,400 --> 00:50:11,800
Speaker 1: to call me a duty, just say it right, just

1017
00:50:11,880 --> 00:50:12,480
Speaker 1: call me Tiffany.

1018
00:50:12,560 --> 00:50:15,160
Speaker 2: I mean, if you want some comedy. My brother, his

1019
00:50:15,320 --> 00:50:16,000
Speaker 2: name is Todd.

1020
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:20,080
Speaker 1: No, what was his other name? Was he born to

1021
00:50:20,160 --> 00:50:21,680
Speaker 1: Todd or does.

1022
00:50:21,200 --> 00:50:23,279
Speaker 2: He have like yeah, it's his actually it's his middle name.

1023
00:50:23,560 --> 00:50:26,600
Speaker 2: But and it's your name is Ali, like literally every

1024
00:50:26,920 --> 00:50:29,440
Speaker 2: Middle Eastern boy who's born like that's going to be

1025
00:50:29,520 --> 00:50:33,920
Speaker 2: part of your name. But he went with Todd. And

1026
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:37,800
Speaker 2: my parents changed their names when they became naturalized citizens.

1027
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:40,880
Speaker 2: My dad is Adam, my mom is Sheila. I'm the

1028
00:50:41,000 --> 00:50:44,839
Speaker 2: only one who's stuck with the Iranian n it okay.

1029
00:50:44,920 --> 00:50:46,920
Speaker 1: I love it though, because when we google you, we

1030
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:48,440
Speaker 1: gonna find you, you know what I mean. I'm just

1031
00:50:48,480 --> 00:50:51,120
Speaker 1: glad that my last name is very unique, Alice, because

1032
00:50:51,160 --> 00:50:53,279
Speaker 1: then you know, when people look me up, like if

1033
00:50:53,320 --> 00:50:56,120
Speaker 1: my name was, like, you know, Tiffany Smith, then it

1034
00:50:56,200 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 1: doesn't like you know, but if I google for Anish

1035
00:50:58,120 --> 00:50:59,239
Speaker 1: to Robbie, it's only you.

1036
00:50:59,440 --> 00:51:01,840
Speaker 2: Well, I don't know, but so it's so funny. I

1037
00:51:01,880 --> 00:51:04,279
Speaker 2: don't even know how I forgot to write about this

1038
00:51:04,360 --> 00:51:06,280
Speaker 2: in the book, but I'll share it here. It's an exclusive.

1039
00:51:07,440 --> 00:51:11,400
Speaker 2: The title of the book came out of a conversation

1040
00:51:11,800 --> 00:51:16,480
Speaker 2: with another far Nouche, one of the few Farniches I

1041
00:51:16,560 --> 00:51:18,479
Speaker 2: have ever met in the world. She and I found

1042
00:51:18,520 --> 00:51:21,759
Speaker 2: each other on Facebook. We met for a coffee. She

1043
00:51:21,920 --> 00:51:24,320
Speaker 2: lives in the South, I live up East. She was

1044
00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:27,640
Speaker 2: visiting New York. We finally met for coffee and I said,

1045
00:51:27,680 --> 00:51:30,120
Speaker 2: and I actually had had her on my podcast because

1046
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:34,560
Speaker 2: she is an author and has just a great career.

1047
00:51:35,080 --> 00:51:36,399
Speaker 2: But I said to her, and it was on the show,

1048
00:51:36,440 --> 00:51:39,560
Speaker 2: I said, if you had she's Iranian. Obviously as farnw

1049
00:51:39,640 --> 00:51:42,160
Speaker 2: she's Iranian. I said, if you had to describe your

1050
00:51:42,239 --> 00:51:46,160
Speaker 2: childhood the way your parents raised you, Like, how would

1051
00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:49,800
Speaker 2: you describe it? Because we were finding all sorts of commonalities,

1052
00:51:49,880 --> 00:51:51,560
Speaker 2: you know, because you know, I can believe like children

1053
00:51:51,640 --> 00:51:54,480
Speaker 2: of immigrants girls Iranian And she said, uh, it was

1054
00:51:54,600 --> 00:51:58,719
Speaker 2: like a healthy state of fear or something like that,

1055
00:51:58,920 --> 00:52:02,360
Speaker 2: or like it was like a healthy dose of panic

1056
00:52:02,560 --> 00:52:05,080
Speaker 2: or something. And it wasn't exactly healthy state of panic.

1057
00:52:05,120 --> 00:52:07,359
Speaker 2: But I was like, I was like, far noush. I'm

1058
00:52:07,400 --> 00:52:09,400
Speaker 2: going to steal that for like the title of my

1059
00:52:09,480 --> 00:52:11,600
Speaker 2: next book is that, okay? And actually have it recorded

1060
00:52:11,640 --> 00:52:13,520
Speaker 2: on my podcast, Like you can go and listen to

1061
00:52:13,600 --> 00:52:16,880
Speaker 2: that episode, and she said it's yours. I said, we

1062
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:20,359
Speaker 2: are so two peas in a pod. And I'm such, yeah,

1063
00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:25,640
Speaker 2: it's like so much reinforcement to me that another farnuche

1064
00:52:26,400 --> 00:52:29,239
Speaker 2: born on a you know, different different parents, different part

1065
00:52:29,239 --> 00:52:31,320
Speaker 2: of the country, but still had that same like a

1066
00:52:31,400 --> 00:52:33,320
Speaker 2: bit of fear, born in the eighties. All of that.

1067
00:52:33,880 --> 00:52:35,879
Speaker 2: That that's how you would that's how you would sum

1068
00:52:35,960 --> 00:52:38,359
Speaker 2: it up. Well, guess what that's going to be my book?

1069
00:52:38,400 --> 00:52:40,760
Speaker 1: And she said, go for it. I called those god nods,

1070
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:42,759
Speaker 1: you know, that's what I call Oh, yeah, you know,

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00:52:42,920 --> 00:52:45,080
Speaker 1: but I love that so par nous to Robbie follow

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00:52:45,120 --> 00:52:47,880
Speaker 1: her on Instagram. A Healthy state of Panic. If you

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00:52:48,040 --> 00:52:50,000
Speaker 1: want to learn how to lean into your fear and

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00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:52,000
Speaker 1: use it as a tool that it is, go to

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00:52:52,080 --> 00:52:54,960
Speaker 1: a Healthy State Ofpanic dot com. We encourage you, you

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00:52:55,040 --> 00:52:59,440
Speaker 1: know to support small book and bookstores and yeah far News,

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00:52:59,440 --> 00:53:01,040
Speaker 1: thank you so much coming on worse.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Tiffany Well if you I mean, you know,

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Speaker 2: we do.

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00:53:03,880 --> 00:53:06,799
Speaker 1: The Baqa Produce has agreed to come and answer your

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00:53:07,040 --> 00:53:11,560
Speaker 1: raggedy questions. No just joking. So so if you listened

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00:53:11,600 --> 00:53:13,279
Speaker 1: in a couple of days, Baqa would come out and

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00:53:13,320 --> 00:53:15,040
Speaker 1: Produce is gonna come. She is one of the top

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00:53:15,120 --> 00:53:17,279
Speaker 1: minds in personal finance. She's gonna lead into some of

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Speaker 1: your questions. Until next week, y'all, Bye bye, Hey, ba Fam.

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Speaker 3: We could not do this show without your support or

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00:53:26,800 --> 00:53:29,520
Speaker 3: the support of our team behind the scenes. The Brann

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00:53:29,640 --> 00:53:33,680
Speaker 3: Edition podcast is produced by Imani Crosby and Dennis Simplinsky

1089
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:36,400
Speaker 3: is our in house tech guru. I am your co

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00:53:36,560 --> 00:53:39,480
Speaker 3: host Mandy Woodrif Santos, and we will see y'all next week.

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Speaker 3: Ba Fam.