Speaker 1: Hi Catherine, Hi, oh everyone.
Speaker 2: This is our first episode that we're recording since the election.
Speaker 1: So that didn't really go the way we wanted it to.
Speaker 2: No, it did not come and people are very, very down,
Speaker 2: and I have have been sifting through my dms with
Speaker 2: lots of messages of fear and defeat and people who
Speaker 2: want to give up, and that's kind of just what
Speaker 2: they want, you know, they want us to give up.
Speaker 2: So while we have to lick our wounds and realize
Speaker 2: that this didn't go our way and all of the
Speaker 2: reasons it didn't go our way, I think one of
Speaker 2: the most important things to remember is to activate and
Speaker 2: to actually turn and channel that anger and that rage
Speaker 2: into something powerful, like we did in twenty sixteen when
Speaker 2: this happened, and when we had the Midterns two years later.
Speaker 2: It was because so many people activated and organized and
Speaker 2: got involved. And while that may feel like a big,
Speaker 2: you know, hopeless idea, it matters and it makes a difference.
Speaker 2: And it's been proven time and time again to make
Speaker 2: a difference. Getting involved in politics, getting involved with local groups,
Speaker 2: support groups if you need a support group, instruction like
Speaker 2: places like ACLU who are constantly fighting legal battles and
Speaker 2: have been preparing to fight legal battles against this administration.
Speaker 2: That's one good source. But we are going to do
Speaker 2: We have many episodes. Now we're going to do a
Speaker 2: miniso that will come out tomorrow with all sorts of
Speaker 2: resources for you guys, so that you can actually join
Speaker 2: a group, donate to a group, go and volunteer for
Speaker 2: these group all of the groups that are fighting for
Speaker 2: LGBTQ rights that we are very well aware of, human rights,
Speaker 2: immigrants rights, all of these groups that are here doing
Speaker 2: work on the ground. We are going to put together
Speaker 2: a big list of places that are reliable and have
Speaker 2: avenues for you to actually get involved and start making
Speaker 2: a difference. Because we can't just lie down and take
Speaker 2: it and just say, well, they're going to do what
Speaker 2: they're going to do. There are ways to delay what
Speaker 2: doing what they want to do. There are ways to
Speaker 2: get involved, and there are good things that have come
Speaker 2: out of the election.
Speaker 1: Even though this feels very very dark. I'm with you.
Speaker 2: I just spent the whole weekend doing stand up which
Speaker 2: thank god I had to do that because it served.
Speaker 1: As not only a reprieve for hopefully my audience.
Speaker 2: But for me I mean, it made me forget about
Speaker 2: all of this for at least an hour. And I'm
Speaker 2: with you. I understand how dark it is and how
Speaker 2: it can feel hopeless, but that energy doesn't get us anywhere.
Speaker 2: Hopelessness and giving up and defeatism doesn't get us anywhere.
Speaker 1: So we really have to work.
Speaker 2: Together in community, knowing that there is half of this
Speaker 2: country that feels the same way we do. There is
Speaker 2: half this country that wants to protect all of these rights,
Speaker 2: and probably more than half. You know, a lot of
Speaker 2: people just voted because of their They voted because of
Speaker 2: their pocketbooks, and some people are voting for their fucking lives.
Speaker 2: So it would be nice if everyone was on board
Speaker 2: with humanity. But clearly with all this divisiveness and the
Speaker 2: ugliness of Elon Musk and his whatever he did with
Speaker 2: Russia for this election, Like, I don't even want to
Speaker 2: go down that rabbit hole because I don't like, I mean,
Speaker 2: you go online if you even mention it. I mean,
Speaker 2: there's so many conspiracy.
Speaker 1: Theories out there.
Speaker 2: It's just so gross and uneducated and stupid.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and the algorithms are so dangerous.
Speaker 1: Sense.
Speaker 3: It's like I've seen people that I love who are brilliant,
Speaker 3: who are discerning, who are politically savvy, and even they
Speaker 3: are getting like sucked down these weird YouTube rabbit holes.
Speaker 3: And I'm like, where are you getting this rhetoric from?
Speaker 2: I know, and it's they're everywhere. It's permeating everywhere. And
Speaker 2: that's Russia for sure, because that's what they and that's
Speaker 2: what Elon Musk did you know when he bought Twitter,
Speaker 2: that was with this intention to do this, which is
Speaker 2: exactly you know, he was victorious. So it's like we
Speaker 2: have to you know, we have to not lie down and.
Speaker 3: Let this roll over on us.
Speaker 1: So I don't know what the answers are.
Speaker 2: I feel everyone's pain, and I've responded to probably thousands
Speaker 2: of dms, but I will continue to go through them
Speaker 2: and respond to more, just trying to convey some sort
Speaker 2: of comfort and understanding that we can't be paralyzed by this.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I saw so many people saying, you know, this week,
Speaker 3: we're going to take our time to more and we're
Speaker 3: going to take our time to wallow, and like next
Speaker 3: week we get up and we start fighting. And I
Speaker 3: think like we've taken our time and now we get brave,
Speaker 3: you know, we start getting active too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And if you're in Texas and you're feeling lonely
Speaker 2: and dispirited, I will be coming through there this week
Speaker 2: to Austin, Houston, Dallas, going to sugar Land Friday, Saturday, Sunday, actually,
Speaker 2: so I'll see you guys there and I'll pump you
Speaker 2: up for the night and and we'll just take it
Speaker 2: one day at a time, you know. But just remember,
Speaker 2: whoever you are and however hopeless you feel, you are
Speaker 2: not alone. There are so many millions of people that
Speaker 2: are feeling the same way you are. So I would
Speaker 2: really encourage people who are feeling very insulated or insular
Speaker 2: like and they don't have community around them, I would
Speaker 2: really encourage you to join support groups. Go online, look
Speaker 2: for LGBTQ support groups, look for people who are worried
Speaker 2: about their family members being deported. There are support groups
Speaker 2: for everything, and I would really encourage you to try
Speaker 2: and find a group like that, you know, to seek
Speaker 2: out support. And now we have an interview with one
Speaker 2: of the only celebrities I don't think I've ever met
Speaker 2: in my entire life, and not the only one, but
Speaker 2: one of them who I would have thought I had
Speaker 2: met before, but I haven't, and she's been in so
Speaker 2: many of my childhood memory making core memory movies like Mermaids.
Speaker 2: You probably know are most recently from Yellowjackets. Please welcome
Speaker 2: Christina Ricci. Hi, Christina Ricci.
Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, I'm really excited to be here.
Speaker 5: I've been such a fan of yours and we've never
Speaker 5: I've never community.
Speaker 2: Yet, I said earlier. I'm like, I don't think i've
Speaker 2: met you, But then again, I don't remember, because sometimes
Speaker 2: I've interviewed somebody and completely forgotten. Yeah, you have no
Speaker 2: reason for.
Speaker 5: Do people get really upset when you've interviewed them.
Speaker 2: I forgot. Typically it's not a great it's not a
Speaker 2: great look. But I'd rather be honest. And I mean,
Speaker 2: I've been to you like fifty thousand people.
Speaker 1: It's true.
Speaker 4: I mean, it's justifying to understanding.
Speaker 2: But now as I'm looking at your face, I'm like, oh,
Speaker 2: because obviously I've known you for as long as everybody
Speaker 2: else in this world has. I'm older than you, I'm
Speaker 2: five years older than you, and so I grew up
Speaker 2: with you, and so you are a familiar face to me.
Speaker 2: But as I'm looking at you in person, I realize.
Speaker 1: I've never met you.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we haven't met No.
Speaker 2: But first of all, this is the most exciting part, well,
Speaker 2: not the most exciting part, but one of the most
Speaker 2: exciting part is that Christina is here today because she
Speaker 2: is releasing a tarot card collection, which is very unexpected
Speaker 2: but also kind of right on track for your brand.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's weird for me too, because I love Taro.
Speaker 4: I've always thought it was.
Speaker 5: I'm not one of those people who like fully buys
Speaker 5: into anything, really like, I don't really believe in anything,
Speaker 5: So I don't believe in the like mystical aspects of this,
Speaker 5: but I really love it for like self expiration, it
Speaker 5: postes lots of questions, So it's a funny thing for
Speaker 5: me to put out because you would think, like I'm
Speaker 5: putting out a tarot deck, I must believe in fate, which.
Speaker 4: Yes, and I really don't.
Speaker 5: I believe more like we're totally in control of ourselves.
Speaker 5: If we ask ourselves the right questions, we can you know,
Speaker 5: see situations fully and understand where we're going. And that's
Speaker 5: really what Tara is. You know.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm glad you said that pre amble because sometimes
Speaker 2: when people think you were talking about tarot cards.
Speaker 1: They think you're like out to lunch.
Speaker 4: Yes, I used to Barley Nobles.
Speaker 5: I would ask for the crazy Lady section when I
Speaker 5: was going to get my you know, birthday book. Remember,
Speaker 5: you'd have to like immediately go find out what his
Speaker 5: birthday was.
Speaker 4: And they're like, you gotta get the birthday book.
Speaker 2: And then you start by by the way, when you
Speaker 2: go to the birthday book and you look at the
Speaker 2: guy that you're dating, and you look at you, and
Speaker 2: then you go to any random guy, any other birthday,
Speaker 2: and it also aligns like they never once said this
Speaker 2: is a bad match.
Speaker 4: There's always too many.
Speaker 1: There are a few, but.
Speaker 2: I think this tarot I'm looking through the tarot cards now,
Speaker 2: now did you design these?
Speaker 4: No?
Speaker 5: So it was so my husband and I came up
Speaker 5: with this idea and he's the creative director.
Speaker 4: Well here's the idea. The idea basically is that they're
Speaker 4: all me just like.
Speaker 5: An individual has a million different facets and potentialities and
Speaker 5: versions of themselves. So my husband's creative directing it. And
Speaker 5: we found this amazing artist, Felipe Flores, and he did
Speaker 5: all the artwork and came up like all the cards
Speaker 5: have little like two sentenced stories, backstories for the characters
Speaker 5: that then are metaphors for the theme or question that's
Speaker 5: being posed.
Speaker 2: This is very good for Christmas, you guys. This is
Speaker 2: good for your family Christmas.
Speaker 5: So west em One too with a collectible set that
Speaker 5: comes with like a tray and a muss smudging thing
Speaker 5: and candles smudging.
Speaker 1: What kind of smudging that we're talking about.
Speaker 3: I had to smudge your house.
Speaker 1: Energy just smudge my house once a week. It's called
Speaker 1: Cat Full of Spiders.
Speaker 2: It's a tarot deck with a guidebook, you guys, and
Speaker 2: it's from Christian to Ricci because you know what, I
Speaker 2: was looking at your history of all of the movies
Speaker 2: that you've ever been in, and most of them are
Speaker 2: pretty scary, like most of them, well not scary, but
Speaker 2: you are.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you play spooky like that's kind of You're.
Speaker 5: The ones that have stood out. I've made a lot
Speaker 5: of ones and nobody ever paid anything.
Speaker 4: I mean, there was not scary.
Speaker 2: Well like Mermaid wasn't scary, that was not but a
Speaker 2: lot of your roles are spooky scary, and I was like, yeah,
Speaker 2: that's interesting for a woman.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, you know, I've always been somebody who
Speaker 5: I just like, can't be normal.
Speaker 4: So I can't be in romantic comedies.
Speaker 1: Why do you think you can't be normal?
Speaker 5: If I say I love you on camera, it's not believable.
Speaker 5: It is not you don't believe me for a second.
Speaker 5: I also can't be in horror films where I have
Speaker 5: to be afraid, Like I don't. I'm not convincingly fearful.
Speaker 4: Even though I spend my life in fear. For some reason,
Speaker 4: I can't convey that on screen.
Speaker 1: So do you know that though?
Speaker 2: Have you tried to get scared on cass?
Speaker 4: I've done horror.
Speaker 5: I remember I did this one and I went to
Speaker 5: see it with my boyfriend at the time, and he
Speaker 5: was just like very I don't know, wasn't it a
Speaker 5: lot there?
Speaker 4: But he was like, wow, you should never do a
Speaker 4: horror movie again. And I was like, no, you're right.
Speaker 5: He's like, you just seemed like you didn't really care
Speaker 5: about anything.
Speaker 2: That's pretty funny, what a great review. You're like, thank
Speaker 2: you for coming with me.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I I guess I brought my apathy to that performance.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I mean at some point you would. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's not like you can hit a home run every
Speaker 2: single movie or job that you get. It's like a doctor.
Speaker 2: Doctor's not hitting it out of the park every single time.
Speaker 4: I'm unfortunately unfortunately it's true.
Speaker 5: That is so true, And I'm really glad you said that,
Speaker 5: because I think it's fine to admit that you weren't
Speaker 5: very good in certain things. Yeah, it's also it's always
Speaker 5: so horrified and I'm like, no, I'm terrible in that movie.
Speaker 4: I'm glad you like it, but I'm not good, right,
Speaker 4: That's okay. Because I was twelve.
Speaker 2: My friend has a number one movie that's on Netflix
Speaker 2: right now, and she's like, oh, I put the least
Speaker 2: amount of effort into this movie, and I didn't.
Speaker 1: Even like my perform, not the least amount of effort.
Speaker 2: She said. I was very dissatisfied with the outcome, and
Speaker 2: it ends up being the biggest movie I've ever done.
Speaker 2: And I'm like, there you go.
Speaker 4: You never know it's gonna hit.
Speaker 2: But it's so true, though, because I can relate to
Speaker 2: that because I in my work experiences, even though I'm
Speaker 2: not an actress per se, I have done not per se.
Speaker 2: I'm not I know why I'm saying it that way,
Speaker 2: but we're all actresses exactly. I have definitely performed at
Speaker 2: higher levels and lower levels depending on what the fuck
Speaker 2: is going on in my life and how grounded I am.
Speaker 2: And I would imagine with your career that's about what. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean, you've been acting since you.
Speaker 4: Were a five, no, seven, oh well so.
Speaker 3: Much older song.
Speaker 5: But it is my first movie till I was nine,
Speaker 5: so I never know whether it's seven or nine, so
Speaker 5: in that area.
Speaker 2: So at some point along the way between seven and
Speaker 2: forty five, I'm sure that you were not batting a
Speaker 2: thousand every single time.
Speaker 5: Uhuh No, it's been a rough road, so occasionally the
Speaker 5: performances have suffered your great.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's to be expected.
Speaker 2: And I think this is a very refreshing conversation actually
Speaker 2: to be having about acting, because some people take acting
Speaker 2: very seriously and the idea that.
Speaker 5: You can never have made mistakes or you're not talented
Speaker 5: because you once made a bad choice, or you know
Speaker 5: what I mean, right, or there are things that like
Speaker 5: I think it's okay for me as an actress to
Speaker 5: be like I can't do romance, Like I just can't, right, right, right.
Speaker 5: I think it's fine, but I've I've had things. But
Speaker 5: a lot of people react as though you're like, oh no,
Speaker 5: don't bash yourself, or you're not allowed to be self critical,
Speaker 5: Like we're not allowed to be self critical anymore, and
Speaker 5: one's always so worried about ourselves.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, exactly, I know.
Speaker 2: And I'm like, that's not happy fire, I'm being objective.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So was there ever a point in your career where
Speaker 2: you had a lull where you didn't know if you
Speaker 2: were going to continue acting? Yes, so I just can't
Speaker 2: doing something for that many years that's your whole life,
Speaker 2: Yeah it is, Yes, I like, you never wanted to
Speaker 2: be a secretary or anything I did.
Speaker 5: I wanted to be all those stereotypical things that actresses
Speaker 5: want to be, a therapist or interior decorator, so I like,
Speaker 5: you know, tooy around with those things. And then when
Speaker 5: I went to high school, I was sort of like,
Speaker 5: I already have this thing, and if I just do
Speaker 5: this thing, I don't have to do any more homework.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so I'll never have to study again, so le'tll
Speaker 4: just do this.
Speaker 5: My end of my twenties, I really wasn't working very much,
Speaker 5: and then I did a TV show pan Am, and
Speaker 5: then when that was canceled, I really didn't work very
Speaker 5: I mean I worked, but not the level I wanted
Speaker 5: to work at.
Speaker 1: And so were you able to afford to like live financially?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 5: I thought I was able to support myself, but by
Speaker 5: doing things that like, you know, I like watching Lifetime movies.
Speaker 5: I don't really want to be in them, right, but
Speaker 5: you know that is one way that I supported myself
Speaker 5: during that lull, and.
Speaker 4: There's you know, there are other things.
Speaker 5: Well.
Speaker 2: It's also nice also be able to come out of
Speaker 2: that low and now look back and be like wow,
Speaker 2: because some people would have too much pride to do
Speaker 2: something like that. Oh not that Lifetime is the bottom
Speaker 2: of the barrel, because I also enjoy watching Lifetime movies.
Speaker 1: I mean that's what.
Speaker 2: Dreams in bed were made of. You know, like Sunday
Speaker 2: days before we had all of these streamers, that's what
Speaker 2: you did on a Sunday was watch one Lifetime movie
Speaker 2: after another.
Speaker 1: But I hear you about not wanting to be in.
Speaker 3: Them, you know, ye, not your hurt's desire.
Speaker 5: No, no, no, So But then this TV show I'm
Speaker 5: on now, yellow Jackets, really changed that for me.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Of course, huge hit Yellow Jackets, which is on
Speaker 2: Showtime with Melanie Lynsky.
Speaker 1: I mean you have such a great cast.
Speaker 4: Yes, anybody's so incredible.
Speaker 1: That's the other thing.
Speaker 2: You've worked with so many incredible women, from Winona Rider
Speaker 2: to Share to this whole cast of Yellow Jackets. Talk
Speaker 2: to me about that those relationships, Like, is there someone
Speaker 2: who's had a huge impact on you that you only
Speaker 2: spend a short amount of time with.
Speaker 5: Well, I think that all of the women I worked
Speaker 5: with when I was very young, you know, Like my
Speaker 5: first movie was with Share, my second movie was with
Speaker 5: Angelica Houston. I worked with Ellen Burston in between those movies, Like,
Speaker 5: I worked with a lot of older women at the
Speaker 5: time that were just so self possessed and powerful without
Speaker 5: being dickheads and smart and just educated me in so
Speaker 5: many ways. And I think that that was really helpful
Speaker 5: for me to see as a little girl.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, because it sometimes I think when you have
Speaker 2: experiences with people like that that are like huge, kind
Speaker 2: of almost figureheads, it's not even about them necessarily teaching you.
Speaker 2: It's about watching them do their thing exactly and learning
Speaker 2: from them, right. Yeah, because Share is such a force,
Speaker 2: and I think I heard you talk about her once
Speaker 2: that she was like kind of you know took care
Speaker 2: of you on set since you were such a young kid.
Speaker 5: She would hide me in the back of her trailer
Speaker 5: when they had production meetings because she didn't want me
Speaker 5: to ever feel like I didn't know what was happening,
Speaker 5: and it made me feel nervous.
Speaker 2: Oh wow.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: So, and she was like, I know they're not going
Speaker 5: to like going to think I'm crazy if I want
Speaker 5: you to be in the production meeting, So you just
Speaker 5: sit in the back so you can hear what's going on.
Speaker 3: Oh that's very cool.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: And there was also I didn't realize it at the time,
Speaker 5: but we were well I did realize this.
Speaker 4: We were changing.
Speaker 5: The director was being replaced, and one of the reasons
Speaker 5: he was replaced was because he really didn't like my performance.
Speaker 5: And I think that she was afraid that somehow I
Speaker 5: would hear that, like some little bit of that, and
Speaker 5: then turn it into something bigger. So she wanted me
Speaker 5: to hear the actual production meetings.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yah.
Speaker 2: So when you have a career that that is this long,
Speaker 2: right and successful, even though you've had some lows, which
Speaker 2: is to be expected. I don't know anybody who hasn't.
Speaker 2: What is your relationship to your work and to your career.
Speaker 5: Well, it took me a really long time to consider
Speaker 5: myself an artist, really, not until I was in my thirties.
Speaker 5: Uh yeah, like late thirties, like after all the opportunities
Speaker 5: had passed, and I was like, I was an artist
Speaker 5: I never appreciated.
Speaker 7: You know.
Speaker 5: That was when I really came to terms of it
Speaker 5: and finally accepted myself.
Speaker 4: But I feel very strongly now about my work, whereas
Speaker 4: in the past I didn't.
Speaker 1: Really.
Speaker 5: I had a very sort of nihilistic attitude towards many things,
Speaker 5: and one of them was my work. But now I
Speaker 5: feel very connected. I feel very passionate about it. I
Speaker 5: feel very protective of it. And I think I used
Speaker 5: to view all that stuff as someone being pretentious, and
Speaker 5: so as I've gotten older, I've gotten more comfortable with like,
Speaker 5: that's not pretentious. It's just somebody who you know, is
Speaker 5: treating their talent or skill the way it should be treated.
Speaker 2: It's kind of how you feel when you're in a
Speaker 2: situation when it's mostly like male dominated, like in most
Speaker 2: every industry basically, and you want to be like the
Speaker 2: girl that gets along with everybody, you know. Like I've
Speaker 2: had that experience where I want to be the girl
Speaker 2: that's like the cool girl. But you don't realize in
Speaker 2: doing that, you're sublimating what you need. And then you're
Speaker 2: also sublimating the women around you because you're trying to
Speaker 2: make in real with the guy. I'm not talking about
Speaker 2: you right now, I'm talking about me with the guys,
Speaker 2: so that you're not the problem.
Speaker 1: You're not difficult, you're fun. You get the joke. You
Speaker 1: know you guys can be dirty around me.
Speaker 2: I get it, I get it, And you don't realize
Speaker 2: how damaging that is until you are older.
Speaker 1: And realize that that's false.
Speaker 2: You're basically feeding into this whole male domination by acting
Speaker 2: like that instead of congregating with the women. Yeah, so
Speaker 2: I would imagine that's how you feel about like how
Speaker 2: many people feel about their craft too. It's like what
Speaker 2: makes you a strong actor? Like you saying that you
Speaker 2: thought that was pretentious is actually empowering, right to know
Speaker 2: what your skill set is, yes.
Speaker 5: And standing up for yourself and you know, being able
Speaker 5: to come and say, you know, I do my best
Speaker 5: work when this is what I need, but also like
Speaker 5: being willing to reciprocate that for other people. And yeah,
Speaker 5: and what I've noticed too, is like the more you
Speaker 5: stand up for yourself, it inspires people around to sort
Speaker 5: of set their boundaries and their needs, which is kind
Speaker 5: of put in line with what you're saying as well.
Speaker 5: You know, it's beneficial to everybody.
Speaker 2: Because it's like you've saw the example of people like
Speaker 2: Sharon Ellen Burston, Angelica Houston, and then you want to
Speaker 2: set that example also for the younger people that you're
Speaker 2: going to be working with.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and it's easier for other people to stand up
Speaker 5: for themselves when someone else is doing it right next
Speaker 5: to them, you know what I mean. When especially on
Speaker 5: a cast with many actors, like if one actor agrees
Speaker 5: to like sit on the side of the road in between.
Speaker 4: Setups, then everybody has to sit on the side of
Speaker 4: the road, you know what I mean.
Speaker 5: But like, the more people stand up and say like, no, actually,
Speaker 5: I'm going to go to my negotiated place to sit
Speaker 5: down until you're ready for you know, the more other
Speaker 5: people stand up for themselves, the more everybody can't know.
Speaker 2: Okay, and you're a mom, that's right, you have two children,
Speaker 2: I do.
Speaker 4: I have a ten year old and a two Oh wow,
Speaker 4: she's almost three years old.
Speaker 1: Okay, and so how is that being a mother? It's good.
Speaker 4: I mean, I love being a mother.
Speaker 5: I love my kids, but I think, just like most mothers,
Speaker 5: sometimes it's absolutely awful.
Speaker 2: What are the awful It's.
Speaker 5: Just like fighting with your kid to do homework, school,
Speaker 5: anything school related to a nightmak's.
Speaker 2: Worse in these towns than it is everywhere else in
Speaker 2: the world. New York and LA like, for school is
Speaker 2: a nightmare on multiple levels for children and the work,
Speaker 2: but also because of the parrying to get into schools
Speaker 2: and having to like, you know, basically submitted like a.
Speaker 3: College admission time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, when you're when you're six months pregnant, it's really scary.
Speaker 4: Stuff is scary.
Speaker 5: And then when you have a child that turns into
Speaker 5: like a wolverine feral creature anytime you're like, do your
Speaker 5: thirty minutes of reading, Wow, and that's your ten year old,
Speaker 5: Like it's yeah, it's that partly don't enjoy.
Speaker 4: But there's lots of fun stuff too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, obviously, obviously I just always like to focus on
Speaker 2: the negative.
Speaker 4: I did do, though, and then I end up sounding
Speaker 4: like such a jerk.
Speaker 2: No, no, okay, well tell us your favorite parts too,
Speaker 2: So we don't only have that in the interview.
Speaker 4: Of being a mother. Mom like what, they're very snugly.
Speaker 1: It's snugly, but think about them all.
Speaker 2: I want you to, like think about a moment that
Speaker 2: really made you go, oh my god, Like this is magic.
Speaker 4: I think.
Speaker 5: Well, I spend a lot of time with my son
Speaker 5: and we travel together, and the last couple of flights
Speaker 5: we've taken, Like, he's just it's it's just fun to see.
Speaker 4: Them learn and grow.
Speaker 5: And like now the way he travels is exactly the
Speaker 5: way I travel. I like he knows everything and like
Speaker 5: how even to ask for things and how we do
Speaker 5: it and where we line up and how early we
Speaker 5: need to be at the gate because mommy's crazy, and.
Speaker 4: It's just it's just really it's just fun to see it.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And have you been married or is that Yeah?
Speaker 4: I've been married twice. This is my I'm on my
Speaker 4: second marriage.
Speaker 2: Oh you're on your second marriage. Well, congratulations, so exciting.
Speaker 4: I got through that first one.
Speaker 3: That's great.
Speaker 4: That's a practice marriage exactly exactly.
Speaker 1: And how did you two meet?
Speaker 5: Well, he has been doing hair in for fashion for
Speaker 5: god like twenty years and I met him on a
Speaker 5: photo shoot, but I was still married, so I didn't
Speaker 5: really meet him until after I was separated, like two
Speaker 5: years later.
Speaker 1: And did you get married when you were young your
Speaker 1: first marriage?
Speaker 4: No, I was thirty one.
Speaker 2: Oh okay, so you know, well it's not his day
Speaker 2: because you have your son from that, So there you go.
Speaker 2: That's your net gain. Yes, yes, right, did you find
Speaker 2: I mean I wonder what it's like because you weren't
Speaker 2: married to a famous person, right, So what did you
Speaker 2: feel like? How did you feel about that dynamic when
Speaker 2: one person is famous and the other person is it?
Speaker 4: I mean, it's not great all the time, you know.
Speaker 2: I wonder what it would be like though to I
Speaker 2: mean two famous people? Is that better or is that worse?
Speaker 6: I don't know.
Speaker 5: I have never dated anyone famous. Yeah, so I don't know. Yeah,
Speaker 5: I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't.
Speaker 5: You know, it's it's weird, like people defer to you
Speaker 5: a lot of times, don't acknowledge the other person totally.
Speaker 4: Things like that that just aren't nice.
Speaker 1: You become a plus one, yeah, person becomes a.
Speaker 5: Plus one, and you know, I'm not comfortable with that,
Speaker 5: but you know, it's just human nature.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is human nature. And some people are okay
Speaker 2: in that role? You know, that's saying there's a gardener
Speaker 2: and there's a flower. Like, there's a flower and there's
Speaker 2: a gardener. I love that because like I want to
Speaker 2: be the flower and I want my person to be
Speaker 2: the gardener. Yes, I'd like to, but that sometimes you
Speaker 2: have two flowers and you're like, where's the fucking gardener?
Speaker 4: Now there's no water, just like.
Speaker 1: And that's a really hard I think, Yeah, dynamic.
Speaker 4: I can't even imagine.
Speaker 2: And do you think it keeps you more grounded because
Speaker 2: you seem fairly normal and this short time we've spent together,
Speaker 2: you seem fairly normal.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 4: I don't actually like attention.
Speaker 2: I don't like attention, and I just find that interesting
Speaker 2: when actors say that.
Speaker 5: I know it's weird. I don't like my picture taken.
Speaker 5: I don't like attention. I love being in like the
Speaker 5: outside of the room and watching people. I'm not overly friendly,
Speaker 5: but my husband is like incredibly like carrious and warm
Speaker 5: and takes.
Speaker 4: Care of everyone in the room.
Speaker 5: So it really works with Mark because even if somebody
Speaker 5: would were to treat us as me with a plus
Speaker 5: one and he's my plus one, well, the plus one's
Speaker 5: the only one talking to you, so you know, so
Speaker 5: he actually becomes the guest.
Speaker 4: You know, great, it works.
Speaker 2: That's cute.
Speaker 1: And who what about your so your daughter's too with Mark?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 1: And what's her personality?
Speaker 4: Like, she's amazing.
Speaker 2: She looks exactly like you. I would imagine you have
Speaker 2: very strong, dominant features.
Speaker 4: She looks a lot like me. I think we have
Speaker 4: the same eyes.
Speaker 5: And then my son has my eyes but they're bright blue,
Speaker 5: which is pretty amazing. He's really quite gorgeous. And she's
Speaker 5: so beautiful and adorable. But she's like a feral creature
Speaker 5: and she's very she has a lot of boundaries and
Speaker 5: she's very strong. And I was like, my son was
Speaker 5: just like attached to me, needed me all the time.
Speaker 5: And you have to ask her permission to kiss.
Speaker 4: Her, like Cleo, Momy's gonna kiss you good bye now,
Speaker 4: and she's like, no, Mommy, not today.
Speaker 1: That's funny.
Speaker 2: I was actual this trigger treating thing for my nieces
Speaker 2: and refews on. My assistant Karen has a daughter, Willow,
Speaker 2: who's three, and she kisses everyone on the lips. Everyone
Speaker 2: was like, you have to meet Willow, She'll kiss you
Speaker 2: on the lips. I'm like, I'm coming over. I want
Speaker 2: to kiss on the lips from a little fat nugget.
Speaker 2: She's such a nugget. And of course I didn't get one,
Speaker 2: you know, but I was like, what are you guys
Speaker 2: going to do when you send her to school?
Speaker 1: She can't just go around kissing everybody on the lips
Speaker 1: like she'll grow.
Speaker 4: But when I'm like to learn about.
Speaker 2: Strangers, I kiss everybody on the lips. But I like
Speaker 2: having boundaries at three. That's pretty funny.
Speaker 4: Yeah, she's amazing. She just she will say no.
Speaker 5: She will say no touching right now, please, And I
Speaker 5: need some space. Wow, I frustrated.
Speaker 4: I need some space.
Speaker 5: And then I'm like, okay, cool, go take your space.
Speaker 5: And yeah, she's just very willful, very strong. She's big,
Speaker 5: very tall, which is surprising because I'm not very tall.
Speaker 5: But yeah, she's she has like a cat like personality.
Speaker 5: So when she finally does that completely melt just is
Speaker 5: all over you. It feels really good because you feel
Speaker 5: like it's really based on something.
Speaker 4: Yeah, like with cats.
Speaker 2: That's an interesting way to describe your relationship with your daughter.
Speaker 1: I think that's intriguing.
Speaker 5: I have a lot of respect for her.
Speaker 2: That's great.
Speaker 1: I have respect her too, just a.
Speaker 5: You also respect her. She really commands a lot of respects.
Speaker 2: Okay, so we're gonna take a break and we'll be
Speaker 2: right back with Christina Ricci. And we're back with Christina Ricci.
Speaker 5: Well.
Speaker 3: Our first email comes from Rebecca. She says, Dear Chelsea,
Speaker 3: I'm a twenty eight year old codependent millennial who was
Speaker 3: in a controlling relationship. I finally sought professional help, and
Speaker 3: therapy and medicine helped me begin healing. In my journey
Speaker 3: of healing, rediscovery and homecoming, I met a man who
Speaker 3: helped me become a better version of myself. We met
Speaker 3: a little over a year ago and have been together
Speaker 3: ever since. It's the partnership I want in my life.
Speaker 3: He supported me when I'm down, held me when I'm anxious,
Speaker 3: took care of me when I'm sick, and motivates me
Speaker 3: to want to be a better and higher version of myself. However,
Speaker 3: he feels that I have not been honest with him
Speaker 3: about my body count. It's like the number of people
Speaker 3: you've slept with.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he.
Speaker 4: Doesn't like that.
Speaker 5: I'm surprised, but I knew his body count. But I'm
Speaker 5: just surprised he's upset about this, right, seems so trivial.
Speaker 6: If he's so as.
Speaker 3: Great, Yeah it's not over fifteen, but it's more than eight.
Speaker 4: Oh, for God's sakes.
Speaker 3: The only it's the only contentious point in our relationship
Speaker 3: and the only thing we argue about. I fear this
Speaker 3: will never be resolved.
Speaker 1: That is so stupid. I mean, this is so stupid.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I was going to say.
Speaker 4: You're fine.
Speaker 1: I do you have a time.
Speaker 2: I tried to count how many people I've had sex with,
Speaker 2: you know, when you're in your twenties, and you're like one, two,
Speaker 2: and then I can't even And then three days later
Speaker 2: you were like, I remember three more guys I had?
Speaker 4: Like I had? I actually wrote them down at one
Speaker 4: point and then found the list and was adding.
Speaker 2: To it forget.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, as you remember, and now do you have
Speaker 1: more counters? Absolutely?
Speaker 2: But it should be limit. I mean, who gives a
Speaker 2: shit how many people anyone had sex with?
Speaker 1: Agreed, The more the merrier, as far as I'm concerned.
Speaker 3: Right, And she says, you know, she doesn't want to
Speaker 3: keep arguing about this, but you know, one of the
Speaker 3: qualities he wants in a girl someone with a lower
Speaker 3: body count.
Speaker 5: Maybe he needs to do some work on himself and
Speaker 5: his insecurities.
Speaker 4: I think that's true.
Speaker 2: You can't.
Speaker 1: This is the beginning of it.
Speaker 2: Like that is it somebody who's hiding their jealousy and
Speaker 2: they're hiding their controlling like behavior, and that is going
Speaker 2: to come out because anyone who cares what you did
Speaker 2: in your past before you met them, Like, everyone has
Speaker 2: had sex with lots of people. Some people have had
Speaker 2: sex with fewer people. But that can't be a stipulation.
Speaker 2: So if the answer is above the number he feels
Speaker 2: comfortable with, then what then you're broken up? What does
Speaker 2: he want her to do?
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's no way changes exactly.
Speaker 4: But so but he thinks she's lying.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he thinks it's more than what she's saying.
Speaker 2: I would just say that this is a harbinger of
Speaker 2: things to come, not a good sign.
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you're seeing these little controlling things come out
Speaker 3: now and you were previously in a controlling relationship, that
Speaker 3: should be a big red flag that maybe this is
Speaker 3: more of a controlling relationship than he's let on.
Speaker 2: Like you said, absolutely, because I had a relationship with
Speaker 2: somebody who tried to pretend like he wasn't controlling, that
Speaker 2: wasn't Oh I love the way you are. I love
Speaker 2: that you're so free, I love that you ski topless.
Speaker 2: Blah blah blah. Guess what he didn't like any of
Speaker 2: those things that I didn't come out until about seven
Speaker 2: months into our relationship, and I was like, oh, you
Speaker 2: were pretending that you were okay with my personality, and
Speaker 2: you're not okay with my personality. So yeah, I would
Speaker 2: just say that's that doesn't look good. That's a big
Speaker 2: red flag.
Speaker 3: Yeah. His deal breaker should be your deal break.
Speaker 2: Because it's judgment also, and you're not why are you
Speaker 2: judging the person that you are in love with? Like,
Speaker 2: why would you judge them?
Speaker 3: It has no impact on your current relationship.
Speaker 4: No, it has no impact at all.
Speaker 3: Yeah right, so goodbye guy.
Speaker 4: Yeah the whistle and get out of there.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, your emotional whistle.
Speaker 4: Emotionally unsafe whistle.
Speaker 5: Oh I wanted to one really badly. I could be
Speaker 5: in any situation just like and then like my protective
Speaker 5: troll like come out from somewhere and be like, oh,
Speaker 5: what have you done again?
Speaker 4: Like pick me up and take me to.
Speaker 2: Side, Like I feel emotionally unsafe, right, now.
Speaker 3: Well, our next question comes from Dolly, and she'll a
Speaker 3: Dolly parton.
Speaker 2: Didn't we try to get Dolly on the podcast?
Speaker 5: Did?
Speaker 3: And we're still trying.
Speaker 1: She better come on, Dolly, come please? Oh look at
Speaker 1: this cutie.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Dolly, says dear Chelsea. I've been listening to the
Speaker 3: pod since the beginning. I feel excited to finally have
Speaker 3: an issue that I feel is worthy of input. My
Speaker 3: brother in law and sister in law are both thirty six.
Speaker 3: Let's call them Victor and Kathy. They've been married for
Speaker 3: almost ten years and have two kids in elementary school.
Speaker 3: My husband and I have been marginally privy to their
Speaker 3: ongoing fights, tit for tat, jabs, revenge spending, and recurring
Speaker 3: threats of divorce over the last five years. My husband
Speaker 3: is a decent relationship with his brother, and I do
Speaker 3: with my sister in law Kathy, but there's always a
Speaker 3: feeling of walking on eggshells around them. Through the years,
Speaker 3: I've encouraged couples therapy, individual therapy, and given a book
Speaker 3: on building a healthy marriage. Even had conversations encouraging them
Speaker 3: to reflect on what this relationship is doing to their children.
Speaker 3: It always seems like things get a little bit better,
Speaker 3: and then no work is invested into the relationship. She
Speaker 3: can tell us a little bit more about this, but
Speaker 3: recently there was a situation where they got in a
Speaker 3: fight late at night, Kathy left Victor also left the
Speaker 3: kids at home, and now Kathy's gotten into therapy. It
Speaker 3: just feels like a vicious cycle where things get better
Speaker 3: and then the fights keep escalating. I'm at a loss
Speaker 3: because I feel I can no longer act as a
Speaker 3: blissfully ignorant bystander, knowing the negative impact their relationship has
Speaker 3: on each other and their kids. How do I encourage
Speaker 3: them to invest time into bettering their marriage or maybe
Speaker 3: better yet calling it quits. Dolly, Hi there, Hello, Hi,
Speaker 3: Hi Dolly.
Speaker 1: This is our special guest, Christina Ricci today.
Speaker 3: Hi.
Speaker 7: Oh my gosh, how cool?
Speaker 2: I know, right?
Speaker 1: Okay, So she just started going to therapy.
Speaker 7: She was supposed to this week, and I haven't heard
Speaker 7: any progress on that, so I'm not sure if that
Speaker 7: has actually been or not.
Speaker 1: But so, what kind of like, how do these fights escalate?
Speaker 2: What happens? They scream and yell.
Speaker 7: What I've seen is it's more like passive aggressive comments,
Speaker 7: and then it sort of escalates into them talking poorly
Speaker 7: about each other in front of the kids, in front
Speaker 7: of other people. And then it's always alcohol involved too,
Speaker 7: so you know that always kind of escalates emotions and
Speaker 7: people aren't acting like their best selves. And yeah, I mean,
Speaker 7: it just really depends on the situation of what triggers them.
Speaker 7: It's not like one thing necessarily right.
Speaker 2: And what Have you ever had a conversation with your
Speaker 2: sister in law?
Speaker 7: I have, Yeah, and it always kind of gets cut
Speaker 7: short in a way. It's like a sensitive subject and
Speaker 7: if I try to bring it up, it will be
Speaker 7: shut down pretty quick. So that's also a sticking point
Speaker 7: because it doesn't feel like she's really receptive to anything
Speaker 7: that I have to say.
Speaker 2: Well, she's probably not because they're stuck in this kind
Speaker 2: of like bad cycle of behavior. So they're probably not
Speaker 2: very open to hearing any criticism about it because they're
Speaker 2: both just kind of like swimming, you know, trying to
Speaker 2: stay afloat. So what are you and your husband thinking
Speaker 2: about doing? Has he spoken to his brother?
Speaker 7: Yeah, we both have talked to the same gender partner,
Speaker 7: you know, spouse. But yeah, we've really encouraged therapy and
Speaker 7: going individually and as a couple, and it just has
Speaker 7: always met with like, we don't have time the kids this,
Speaker 7: and then we offer to watch the kids and there's
Speaker 7: like no follow up for them asking for help either.
Speaker 6: So I don't know.
Speaker 7: I feel like at a loss of not really knowing
Speaker 7: what to do because I feel that we've both encouraged
Speaker 7: what we think they should do.
Speaker 2: I just think you can't make somebody force people to
Speaker 2: like go work on their marriage. It's nice that you
Speaker 2: care and that you're thinking about them and you're observing it.
Speaker 2: The only thing you can really do is have like
Speaker 2: a meaningful conversation that is very pointed to say, listen,
Speaker 2: I see that you're like are you happy? Do you
Speaker 2: feel happy in this relationship? Like I want to know,
Speaker 2: because if you do feel happy, then fine, then that's it.
Speaker 2: From what I'm seeing, it just feels really damaging for
Speaker 2: you guys to be talking about each other in front
Speaker 2: of the kids, and there just seems to be a
Speaker 2: lot of fighting, and I just feel like it doesn't
Speaker 2: have to be this way. Not that she should leave him,
Speaker 2: but they should at least try to work together towards
Speaker 2: a more common ground where they can get along in
Speaker 2: a nicer way and be more pleasant to be around.
Speaker 2: But beyond that, I just don't think that it's anyone's
Speaker 2: place to be. Like, Okay, you guys, it's time to
Speaker 2: get divorced, or it's time to whatever. You can only
Speaker 2: be whatever your tactic has been up till now should
Speaker 2: probably flip because that hasn't yielded any result, right, and so, so,
Speaker 2: how would you describe the tactic that you've used thus far?
Speaker 7: Pretty conflict averse or anti confrontation. So it's more just
Speaker 7: conversations if it comes up naturally with her, and then
Speaker 7: I'll give my thoughts on things, but I'm not ever
Speaker 7: the one that's driving the conversation, if that makes sense,
Speaker 7: But it's always kind of lingering back there.
Speaker 6: When the next fide doesn't happen.
Speaker 2: Would you describe their behavior towards each other as like abusive?
Speaker 7: I mean, I haven't seen it, but from their personal
Speaker 7: accounts of things, yes, there is some abusive like verbal abuse,
Speaker 7: some physical intimidation, some yeah of that other stuff going
Speaker 7: on too. So that's also why I feel like a
Speaker 7: push against like I need to do something because of
Speaker 7: the kids, and like it's impacting their whole household. How
Speaker 7: old are the kids their elementary age.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's really bad for them.
Speaker 5: I mean, if anything, I would say, just really be
Speaker 5: there for those kids, you know. But I think having
Speaker 5: an honest conversation with the parents about what this sort
Speaker 5: of stuff actually does to children's brains, right, how negatively
Speaker 5: it affects them, Like it can change a child's brain
Speaker 5: and development, and.
Speaker 3: In what kind of partner they choose.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, it.
Speaker 5: Has incredibly negative impacts. Fighting in front of children and
Speaker 5: if it's abusive in nature, then they could already have
Speaker 5: PTSD and you know what I mean, like really be traumatized.
Speaker 5: So I think that's the conversation to have. Like, you, guys,
Speaker 5: you're grown ups. You get to make all your choices,
Speaker 5: but there's two little kids here who have no say,
Speaker 5: and you're supposed to protect them. So they have to
Speaker 5: do something about if I would think that they would
Speaker 5: do something about their marriage based on their concern for
Speaker 5: their children, Right.
Speaker 2: Is there any scenario that you could imagine where you
Speaker 2: and your husband sit down with him and his wife
Speaker 2: together and have this kind of conversation.
Speaker 7: I think so, yeah, because.
Speaker 1: Maybe that's a different tact that's serious.
Speaker 2: You know, if you're sitting down and you're like, listen,
Speaker 2: we're here because we're seeing the impact of your relationship
Speaker 2: and the impact it's having on the children, and we
Speaker 2: want to support you in whatever way we can. But
Speaker 2: there is a discussion to be had and all the
Speaker 2: things that Christina's talking about, like there's all these books
Speaker 2: to support I mean.
Speaker 4: The deal research.
Speaker 2: Bring some facts exactly, and bring some and be like,
Speaker 2: you know, this has such a deleterious impact on kids'
Speaker 2: brains growing up with that, And you know, you might
Speaker 2: not think of anything because you guys are used to
Speaker 2: talking to each other like this, But then you're creating
Speaker 2: a situation where your kid grows up thinking that's the
Speaker 2: way you talk to other people, and then they're going
Speaker 2: to find themselves in a similar relationship or it could
Speaker 2: have an even more serious impact on them.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 1: I think you like you show up armed with stuff.
Speaker 2: And and in the most loving way obviously to be
Speaker 2: there for them, But you should make it all about
Speaker 2: the kids, so that it's that's the focus.
Speaker 1: Then they have they're both motivated to do something right.
Speaker 4: Yeah, they can be heroes instead of being to blame.
Speaker 3: Right, you know, right, And one thing that might be
Speaker 3: a little bit less confrontational for you or feel a
Speaker 3: little less confrontational is to ask questions like, is this
Speaker 3: how you guys want to be behaving in front of
Speaker 3: your kids? You guys don't want to be fighting, do you?
Speaker 3: And another thing is I think people think and a
Speaker 3: lot of times it doesn't, but people think that like
Speaker 3: couples counseling doesn't really do a lot. But when you
Speaker 3: get a good counselor and you're really like in it
Speaker 3: to win it, they give you tools to actually like
Speaker 3: disrupt these fights.
Speaker 5: You know.
Speaker 3: For example, when Brad and I were first married, we
Speaker 3: went to a couple's counselor for like two years, and
Speaker 3: it was great because it gave us these tools, like,
Speaker 3: for example, if you're kind of arguing about the same
Speaker 3: thing for more than like half an hour, you just stop,
Speaker 3: especially late at night, especially if you've been drinking. So
Speaker 3: it's like actual practical tools that they can get to
Speaker 3: like disrupt these patterns that they've developed.
Speaker 5: And if they shouldn't be together, a couple's therapist will
Speaker 5: help them become more comfortable with the idea of separating.
Speaker 2: Right, And I think you should like present you present
Speaker 2: yourselves as a support system, like we're, you know, in essence,
Speaker 2: the closest people to you because we're related to you,
Speaker 2: so we want to help you. We want to be
Speaker 2: here for you. We would hope you would do the
Speaker 2: same thing for us. And this isn't a judgment, it's
Speaker 2: just it's a little you know, dysfunctional. So like, do
Speaker 2: you want to help yourselves, because we want to help you.
Speaker 2: We want to help take care of the kids. So
Speaker 2: you guys can have time to go to a couple's
Speaker 2: counselor or spend more time alone together and go on
Speaker 2: date nights. Present it as that you know you're their
Speaker 2: best ally and that you're there to help them.
Speaker 6: Yeah, for sure, Yeah, thank you.
Speaker 1: Your husband will be down with that, right.
Speaker 7: Oh definitely. We're on the same page of everything, so
Speaker 7: it will be an easy set.
Speaker 2: And you know, there is a chance it'll all blow
Speaker 2: up in your face because they're not going to want
Speaker 2: to hear the truth, but you have to be prepared
Speaker 2: for that.
Speaker 7: Yeah, And I guess that's also why I'm cautious, because
Speaker 7: I value the relationship that we have. But yeah, I
Speaker 7: think that it's worthy.
Speaker 2: I think so too.
Speaker 1: I think it is very worthy.
Speaker 2: What I find to be very disgrestling or I find
Speaker 2: myself very annoyed by is when people do not.
Speaker 1: I'm an interloper.
Speaker 2: I like to get involved in people's problems and it
Speaker 2: doesn't always go well, believe me. But it takes a
Speaker 2: lot to say something to somebody that is uncomfortable, especially
Speaker 2: when you're a conflict averse like it an. It's an effort.
Speaker 2: It's not like you enjoy telling people, Hi, this is
Speaker 2: unhealthy and this dynamic is unhealthy. No one likes that.
Speaker 2: I don't get off on that, nor to you. But
Speaker 2: it's when you have concern for someone and they're like yeah,
Speaker 2: and especially when there are children involved, there's no better
Speaker 2: reason to get involved.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you wouldn't be doing it unless you love them
Speaker 3: really deeply, and that's obviously where this is coming from.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Sure, yeah, you want to follow up with us. If
Speaker 3: you guys have this conversation, I'll let us know how
Speaker 3: it goes, for sure.
Speaker 7: I will.
Speaker 2: Okay, cool, best of luck, dollly bye, Dolly, thanks for
Speaker 2: calling it.
Speaker 6: Thank you.
Speaker 4: Well.
Speaker 2: That was very she was sweet.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I know. I hope that all kind of work.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's just so interesting because sometimes are you
Speaker 2: are you an interloper at all.
Speaker 1: Do you get involved with like if.
Speaker 5: I know, but I don't really have I have a few. Well,
Speaker 5: actually I have a few, very few close friendships where
Speaker 5: I would, but I have in the past been like
Speaker 5: yeah with certain girlfriends.
Speaker 1: Time to cool it or get your shit together.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but it's very difficult.
Speaker 2: It is very difficult. Yeah, especially if somebody would can't
Speaker 2: hear anything you're saying. Yes, you know, but most people can't.
Speaker 2: In my experience, most people are like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: thank you so much. And when people have interfered in
Speaker 2: my life and told me like, hey, you're a little
Speaker 2: bit off the rails right now, I have never been
Speaker 2: more grateful.
Speaker 1: And I love it I experienced. Yes, feedback means people
Speaker 1: care about you, exactly. Yeah, it's take it.
Speaker 2: It's so it's effortful to actually have that uncomfortable conversation.
Speaker 1: So you have to know it's coming from love.
Speaker 2: It's not like people want to like, what would be
Speaker 2: the motivation otherwise.
Speaker 3: Right, right, exactly. Well, our next question comes from Beth.
Speaker 3: She says, Dear Chelsea, I'm at thirty three year old
Speaker 3: female that is sick of my familial bullshit. I'm a
Speaker 3: middle child of four, and we grew up in a
Speaker 3: church cult and were raised by emotionally neglectful parents, one
Speaker 3: with alcoholism and the other a shopaholic. I was the
Speaker 3: happy child who has all turned out so well for people. Yes,
Speaker 3: Elias right always is a good story. I was the
Speaker 3: happy child who was always eager to please and stay
Speaker 3: out of trouble. As I left home, I met the
Speaker 3: man I called my husband of eleven years. From the
Speaker 3: moment my family met my spouse, they've been nothing but unsupportive.
Speaker 3: They judged him for his looks, for his wealth, and
Speaker 3: god knows what else made their minds deem him unfit
Speaker 3: for me. It's caused contention with my siblings, and I
Speaker 3: had to come to Jesus moment with my parents eight
Speaker 3: years ago when my therapist suggested I write a letter
Speaker 3: to discuss the hurt my parents caused me and how
Speaker 3: I wanted to reconcile and move forward. This was not
Speaker 3: only thrown in my face, but has ruined their relationship
Speaker 3: ever since. Slowly, I've realized over the years that my
Speaker 3: family is just kind of a bunch of assholes. So
Speaker 3: my question is, when you feel like you've done what
Speaker 3: you can to have a relationship with your family. But
Speaker 3: it hurts too much. When is it time to move on?
Speaker 3: Thank you? Beth, Hi, Hi, hi hi.
Speaker 2: Look at you your standing while you're sitting, and you're alive,
Speaker 2: and you survived a cult.
Speaker 1: Look at you.
Speaker 6: I did it was you know, a lot of speaking
Speaker 6: in tongues and weekend retreats for church. But here we
Speaker 6: are a blessed non believer.
Speaker 1: Christina just said she was born into a mini cult.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but mine had no religious not mine, my father's,
Speaker 5: not my faults, had no religious affiliations. It was pure
Speaker 5: therapy based therapy. It was called the Center for Emotional
Speaker 5: re Education, and it started with he had a primal
Speaker 5: scream therapy group that then became his Wow, hecolytes.
Speaker 2: But why does it that doesn't sound I mean, cults
Speaker 2: have a very negative connotation. They're not positive.
Speaker 5: Really, No, because yeah, because the whole one person wanting
Speaker 5: to control everybody else is right, doesn't always want normal impulse. No,
Speaker 5: So that's usually a man healthy, yes, usually genuinely nefarious, not.
Speaker 1: A man who's having sex with everyone. Yeah.
Speaker 6: Probably.
Speaker 2: I'm of the notion I think when you have exhausted
Speaker 2: all possibilities, like I understand families, family. I'm very close
Speaker 2: to my family. I think highly of remaining trying as
Speaker 2: hard as you can to be close with your family.
Speaker 2: But when you're dealing with that situation, it's so irrational,
Speaker 2: you know. And I'm a fan of just saying enough
Speaker 2: is enough and moving on so that you can enjoy
Speaker 2: yourself and enjoy your life and be happy with your partner.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I hadn't seen my father since I was fifteen
Speaker 5: when he died. I was like thirty eight for context,
Speaker 5: But mus you died, Yeah, and don't I don't speak
Speaker 5: to one of my siblings, And it is you know,
Speaker 5: you do have. I've experienced a lot of guilts over
Speaker 5: the years about it. But at the same time, it's
Speaker 5: those are negative influences on me. They were toxic. It
Speaker 5: was not healthy for me. So you need to protect yourself.
Speaker 2: You do. And like the idea, like the toxicity that
Speaker 2: these people have, like the impact it has on you
Speaker 2: is really never Like you can't overstate that enough that
Speaker 2: the impact that having that kind of negativity around you
Speaker 2: will yield in your life. You really you're choosing, like
Speaker 2: this is your opportunity. You didn't get to choose whether
Speaker 2: or not you were born into a cult. Now you
Speaker 2: get to choose what your future is going to look like,
Speaker 2: and so you have every right to just say enough
Speaker 2: is enough. Do you have other brothers and sisters that
Speaker 2: you do talk to?
Speaker 1: How many siblings do you have?
Speaker 5: I have three siblings, and I'm really close with my
Speaker 5: sister and my oldest brother, and then I'm close with
Speaker 5: my mother. But you know, my father was a crazy person,
Speaker 5: and unfortunately one of my brothers was. You know, it's
Speaker 5: not his fault because he was an abusive situation, but
Speaker 5: it resulted in behavior that was not safe for the
Speaker 5: other children around, right, and.
Speaker 2: When it's a big and when that happens, then there
Speaker 2: is it doesn't of course, it's no one's fault of
Speaker 2: the circumstances they're born into. But that kid doesn't mean
Speaker 2: that you're allowed to be around them like that. You
Speaker 2: have to allow yourself to you know, allow them to
Speaker 2: be around you or what have you.
Speaker 6: Yeah, there's just so many outside opinions, and I was
Speaker 6: just so curious to hear thoughts from you gals of
Speaker 6: you know what that looks like? Of you know, well,
Speaker 6: you should be thankful your parents are alive. And it's like, well,
Speaker 6: when everything they say is a judgmental comment or something
Speaker 6: you know coming at you that isn't loving and accepting.
Speaker 6: Should I You know, I don't think so. With my
Speaker 6: own maternal mother, it's it's never been accepting and loving.
Speaker 6: There's always been judgment.
Speaker 5: Yeah. I mean, you get to choose now as an adult,
Speaker 5: how you want to be treated and who you want
Speaker 5: around you. And families should be held in almost the
Speaker 5: same standards as friends, you know. If they don't, Yeah,
Speaker 5: if you don't enhance each other's lives, then what's the point.
Speaker 5: We can all feel bad enough on our own.
Speaker 6: Why are you in it exactly?
Speaker 4: Don't need like an extra person to make you feel worse.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's just something that's always felt, Like, you know,
Speaker 6: it's a guilt that I haven't been able to let
Speaker 6: go of of. Well, they're alive and they're there, so
Speaker 6: why don't you keep trying. We'll both parties have to try,
Speaker 6: and it's just been such a hard thing to try
Speaker 6: to let go of of. Yeah, they're alive, but they're
Speaker 6: just kind of shitty. It's just not healthy.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think one thing I would encourage you to do, Like,
Speaker 3: if you are making this decision to go no contact,
Speaker 3: like for forever or for an extended period of time
Speaker 3: is to maybe this is through meditation, maybe this is
Speaker 3: through therapy, but find a way for yourself to sort
Speaker 3: of release some negativity around it.
Speaker 4: And the guilts.
Speaker 5: The guilt can be a real killer, you know, like
Speaker 5: it's it's I used to wake up in the middle
Speaker 5: of the night.
Speaker 6: That's my biggest problem is the guilt. Because right now
Speaker 6: I'm doing so well on my mental health space, but
Speaker 6: when I'm not, that guilt seeps back in and it's like,
Speaker 6: you know, you're a bad daughter, You're a bad child,
Speaker 6: you know, whatever the case, and it's like, but no,
Speaker 6: I'm not.
Speaker 5: I think the more you do I don't know, just
Speaker 5: from personal experience, the more I did work on feeling
Speaker 5: like I was the most important person to myself, you know,
Speaker 5: then you feel less guilt or viewing yourself as your
Speaker 5: own child in a way, you're protecting you, you know,
Speaker 5: you little you from things you couldn't protect yourself from before.
Speaker 5: Just there are different ways that you'll learn in therapy
Speaker 5: to view the situation or from doing research or reading
Speaker 5: that will help you feel less guilty.
Speaker 2: I guess, yeah, I think the guilt is a big
Speaker 2: thing for everybody because you can always go back to that.
Speaker 1: But I love what she just said.
Speaker 2: Christina just said about acting like it's your own child, Like,
Speaker 2: would you allow your child to be treated this way?
Speaker 2: Would you allow your child to be in a relationship
Speaker 2: where they're constantly being judged and made to feel bad,
Speaker 2: and then the partner, the person that they chose, is
Speaker 2: also you know, being judged. No, you're setting yourself up
Speaker 2: for just all sorts of negativity and guilt patterns. Like
Speaker 2: part of the reason why you feel guilty is because
Speaker 2: of the manipulation, you know, and so you really do
Speaker 2: want to do work to get rid of that guilt,
Speaker 2: Like you're you're empowering yourself by saying no more. It's
Speaker 2: like talking to an abuser. I mean, if the relationship
Speaker 2: isn't feeding you, it's doing something else. So what's the
Speaker 2: opposite of feeding you, It's taking from.
Speaker 6: You, right exactly. Yeah. The biggest revelation I had this
Speaker 6: year was I have a couple family members who have
Speaker 6: had children, and you know, they're getting to an age
Speaker 6: where now I had those memories as a child, and
Speaker 6: my mom said to me, and I'm like, I would
Speaker 6: never say that to my nephew and my niece ever
Speaker 6: and my own mother, you know, and dad did that,
Speaker 6: and it's like, I would never do that, you know,
Speaker 6: as their aunt who loves them. Why would you?
Speaker 1: Ever?
Speaker 6: It's are your.
Speaker 2: Parents still in the cult?
Speaker 1: Did you say?
Speaker 2: Or are they out of it?
Speaker 6: No? But they're still avid Christians and love to use
Speaker 6: that guilt against.
Speaker 2: You, which is stupid. Yeah.
Speaker 1: All religion, you know, like just it's insane. Is the
Speaker 1: root of all discord in our world? You know, yes,
Speaker 1: it all comes down to religion.
Speaker 6: Like yeah, And what's crazy is so yes, they're avid Christians,
Speaker 6: but so were my in laws, the most loving and
Speaker 6: accepting humans who know I don't believe in God, but
Speaker 6: couldn't care less, you.
Speaker 2: Know, with them, Go be with them, you know, that's
Speaker 2: where the light is. Go towards the light.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm swimming towards it.
Speaker 2: Okay, great, you can swim, walk, you know, rollerblade however
Speaker 2: you want to get whatever? Yeah, yeah, girl, get after it. Well,
Speaker 2: that's good. I'm glad. Do you feel better now?
Speaker 6: My only question, I guess would be because right now
Speaker 6: I am so good mentally what I've worked on throughout
Speaker 6: this year. When I am in my darkest places, in
Speaker 6: my depression and anxiety, and that guilt comes in. You know,
Speaker 6: what would be your biggest advice there to try to
Speaker 6: talk myself out of that. That's where I struggle the most,
Speaker 6: is when I'm not doing okay mentally.
Speaker 2: Well, that's where everyone struggles the most, and so well,
Speaker 2: you know a good example of this is that book
Speaker 2: Letting Go. You should pick up that.
Speaker 6: I just started listening to it.
Speaker 2: You did, Oh yeah.
Speaker 1: Then there you go.
Speaker 2: It's there's a whole section about guilt and it's really
Speaker 2: quite beautiful. And I actually tried this the other night.
Speaker 2: I was stoned. So I just want to put that
Speaker 2: out there because that helps me get to a little
Speaker 2: like more of a meditative place when I'm trying to
Speaker 2: be in touch with myself. But I had I was
Speaker 2: having all these kind of like negative emotions and I
Speaker 2: hadn't for a couple of weeks. I was feeling pretty
Speaker 2: high and vibing pretty high, right, and I had read
Speaker 2: Letting Go, and I just just.
Speaker 1: Set me straight.
Speaker 2: I read it every couple of years. It's this book
Speaker 2: by David Hawkings. Have you ever heard of it?
Speaker 4: I have?
Speaker 2: Okay, And I was sitting there and I was like, okay,
Speaker 2: the negative feelings you can't repress or suppress. You have
Speaker 2: to acknowledge, and guilt is one of those feelings. So
Speaker 2: you acknowledge that it's there, and you kind of think
Speaker 2: about where it is in your body. You know, when
Speaker 2: you're feeling anxious or uneasy, it's usually in your stomach,
Speaker 2: or it can be in your chest, and sometimes it's
Speaker 2: in your head, right, like you feel pressure.
Speaker 1: And so I.
Speaker 2: Remember I was lying in bed, I smoked a little bowl,
Speaker 2: and I was like, I wonder where these feelings are
Speaker 2: coming from. What is the motion behind it? Just like
Speaker 2: the book says like am I feeling insecure? Am I
Speaker 2: feeling fearful? Do I feel scarcity? Like where is this
Speaker 2: coming from? And I was like, don't try to figure
Speaker 2: out what it is, just acknowledge that the feeling is there.
Speaker 2: And it was a very spiritual experience I had every
Speaker 2: I felt it in my stomach and then it started
Speaker 2: to move and I was like, it's okay, it's okay,
Speaker 2: just let it be here and it's going to disappear.
Speaker 2: So you're acknowledging it. You're not denying it right or
Speaker 2: repressing or suppressing it. And then I felt it kind
Speaker 2: of move up through my chest and it was really heavy,
Speaker 2: and I felt it go through my throat and then
Speaker 2: it was gone. And that's what this book talks about.
Speaker 2: And I've never been able to accomplish that. I'm always like, oh, okay,
Speaker 2: how do you let go of these emotions that aren't
Speaker 2: serving you? You know, because it's not serving you. Guilt
Speaker 2: it never serves anybody. And I woke up in the
Speaker 2: morning and I just felt like so much lighter than
Speaker 2: I had the day before, and I was back on track.
Speaker 2: So when you get to that part about guilt in
Speaker 2: this book, listen to it over and over and over
Speaker 2: again until you understand how it's just not of use
Speaker 2: to you, and practice that. Like it's good to acknowledge
Speaker 2: where you feel something in your body because then you're
Speaker 2: not running from it. And when you run from it
Speaker 2: is when it keeps coming back because you're not facing it.
Speaker 5: And you make terrible choices, right, And I didn't behavior
Speaker 5: just leave it to let me tell you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so you seem awesome and you seem, you know,
Speaker 2: like a beautiful person, and I don't want you to
Speaker 2: feel like, you know, hampered by your family or this
Speaker 2: obligation to them. You know they've worn out there welcome
Speaker 2: and you don't have to write them off forever. But
Speaker 2: when they want to come around in a loving, positive way,
Speaker 2: then you will welcome them with open arms.
Speaker 6: Yeah, that makes complete sense. I'm looking forward to that chapter,
Speaker 6: just a couple of chapters in not there yet.
Speaker 2: Okay, good, you'll see what I'm talking about.
Speaker 6: That's wonderful.
Speaker 3: Thank you, Thank you so much, Beth.
Speaker 6: Thanks everyone, have a good day.
Speaker 2: Do you guys have any idea what I'm talking about
Speaker 2: when I say that you.
Speaker 5: Describing, I had no idea that you could, that you
Speaker 5: would ever be able to have that experience in such
Speaker 5: a tangible way. I mean, neither felt like letting things
Speaker 5: go to me is always felt like a metaphor yea,
Speaker 5: not just like.
Speaker 2: It right right, but it is book. They tell you
Speaker 2: exactly what to do, like you know, to sit with
Speaker 2: these feelings that are uncomfortable and then surrender like Okay,
Speaker 2: I feel I feel envy or whatever the feeling, because but.
Speaker 5: Do you engage with thoughts like do you like delve
Speaker 5: in and you're like, great, so I feel envious. I'm
Speaker 5: going to really experience how jealous I am of.
Speaker 1: No, No, it's not like I feel envy.
Speaker 2: I accept it. It's here, Okay, okay, it's here, like
Speaker 2: I'm not in denial because you know, sometimes if I
Speaker 2: felt envy in the past, I would go I'd push
Speaker 2: it away, like oh no, no, I just don't like
Speaker 2: that person. It's like, no, no, you're envious. You don't
Speaker 2: not like this person, You're.
Speaker 1: Just being you know.
Speaker 2: I would just just completely ignore what's behind all those thoughts.
Speaker 2: So that was a pretty metaphysical thing that happened to
Speaker 2: me the other night, and I was like, oh, and
Speaker 2: it's a constant, like you don't just surrender that and
Speaker 2: then the feeling is gone forever. It can come back
Speaker 2: and then you have to do the same thing again.
Speaker 2: But now I know that I actually felt it, like
Speaker 2: moved through my system.
Speaker 4: That's crazy. I want to try that.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 3: It's like the min body connection, like when you when
Speaker 3: you start to be able to feel okay, I have
Speaker 3: this emotion, but where is it physically? And then you
Speaker 3: realize like, oh yeah, it's in my stomach or it's here,
Speaker 3: or it's here, it's here, and then you kind of
Speaker 3: process it a little bit more.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well all right, we got to share that today.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, let's take a quick break and we'll do
Speaker 3: a little QUICKI sister drama.
Speaker 1: Oh I love it.
Speaker 2: Okay, we're gonna take a break and we're going to
Speaker 2: come back and wrap up with Christina Riccie.
Speaker 1: And we're back.
Speaker 3: We are back. So our last email comes from Missy.
Speaker 3: Her subject line is my sister got pregnant to compete
Speaker 3: with me here, Chelsea, I've had a long history of
Speaker 3: my two years older sister trying to take every milestone
Speaker 3: in my life and turn it into a traumatic event
Speaker 3: in her life. When I got engaged years ago, she
Speaker 3: faked a cry for help suicide attempt. I've always had
Speaker 3: her back, despite her obvious hatred of me. She's married
Speaker 3: now with a four year old son, and she's told everyone,
Speaker 3: friends and family that she is done have kids. My
Speaker 3: husband and I have been trying for about a year,
Speaker 3: started fertility treatments two months ago, and I've purposely kept
Speaker 3: this a secret from my sister. Long story short, my
Speaker 3: mom spilled the beans to her and I get a
Speaker 3: call from my sister five weeks later telling me she's
Speaker 3: four weeks pregnant. Way too early to tell anyone. Let alone,
Speaker 3: you're infertile, sister, like she couldn't wait to tell me
Speaker 3: and my husband. I can't wrap my mind around why
Speaker 3: she would secretly try at the same time as me,
Speaker 3: if it wasn't out of competition. I know this sounds crazy,
Speaker 3: but all of my friends that have known her past
Speaker 3: behavior are not shocked at all by this. I'm struggling
Speaker 3: to deal and now I'm being alienated from my family.
Speaker 3: I can't, for the life of me, understand why my
Speaker 3: sister would want me to feel this hurt? Am I
Speaker 3: wrong for being angry? Missy complicated?
Speaker 1: What do you think?
Speaker 2: It's a tricky want?
Speaker 5: It's tricky because I do think that a lot of
Speaker 5: this has to do with.
Speaker 4: Perspective, you know what I mean?
Speaker 5: Well, like she's it outside of in another context.
Speaker 1: All of this could just be coincidence, yeah.
Speaker 5: And like people living their lives and things happening at
Speaker 5: unfortunate times. But if you're a person who's been in
Speaker 5: the relationship and knows that it's more loaded than that,
Speaker 5: then there's that element too. But I think in situations
Speaker 5: like this, I always feel like the only power I
Speaker 5: have is to not is to choose to not.
Speaker 4: Be affected by it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, like, why does it lessen your pregnancy any to
Speaker 5: have someone else get pregnant?
Speaker 2: Also, yeah, I would say that you're you're actively being
Speaker 2: You're part of the problem because of your reaction to
Speaker 2: your sister. And if if your sister really is doing
Speaker 2: these things to get a rise out of you, or
Speaker 2: that is part of her agenda, it's working. So you
Speaker 2: actually have to like retreat and actually figure out that
Speaker 2: your life doesn't have to be impacted so negatively by her.
Speaker 2: And I know that you're probably going, but you don't
Speaker 2: understand what she's done, all the things she's done to me.
Speaker 2: Yet I believe you that your sister's done a lot
Speaker 2: of things to you, and you feel like she's undercutting
Speaker 2: you and stealing your thunder, But your behavior is as
Speaker 2: responsible for this dynamic as hers, Like your reaction to
Speaker 2: this is exactly what she's looking for. If everything you
Speaker 2: say is true and your motivations are what you think,
Speaker 2: she is trying to get a rise out of you,
Speaker 2: and she does want to compete with you, So you
Speaker 2: have to withdraw from that, and you have to do
Speaker 2: that with a lot of work on yourself with your therapist,
Speaker 2: because you can't change her. But you can change yourself
Speaker 2: and you can change the way that you respond to her.
Speaker 2: And her baby is not your baby. That's a totally
Speaker 2: separate situation. Your marriage is different from her marriage. You're
Speaker 2: going to have your sister unfortunately for a long time,
Speaker 2: So you better figure out a better way to cope
Speaker 2: with this. And what if you thought of it and thought,
Speaker 2: oh my god, how wonderful that my sister got pregnant. Well,
Speaker 2: how fun we can raise our kids together. What if
Speaker 2: you just like turn the table so far on the
Speaker 2: situation that you create a completely different reality between you
Speaker 2: and your sister.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think especially since you are going through
Speaker 3: fertility stuff, like it makes everything feel so much more heightened.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just in general, this is a very difficult time. Yeah,
Speaker 2: we're dealing with this a major election, We're dealing with
Speaker 2: women's rights being rolled back. You're dealing with that IVF,
Speaker 2: which is a total dipsy doodle on your brain, chemistry
Speaker 2: and everything. So you have to also just like sometimes
Speaker 2: take your emotions out of the situation and look at
Speaker 2: the situation like you're not involved in it. And I'm
Speaker 2: not saying any of the stuff you're saying is untrue,
Speaker 2: but you have to find a better way to deal
Speaker 2: with this, because otherwise this is just a cycle that
Speaker 2: will continue.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I also feel like she may be doing stuff
Speaker 3: to intentionally hurtful, But there's also a world in which
Speaker 3: it's possible that she's just so self involved and like thoughtless,
Speaker 3: that she doesn't think about how it's impacting you at all,
Speaker 3: and the result is the same hurt and everything, and
Speaker 3: the what you need to do as far as like
Speaker 3: freeing yourself from this is the same. But she may
Speaker 3: also just be like not thinking about anybody but herself, right, yeah, yeah, right.
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, on that note, Christina, how would you rate
Speaker 2: your advice giving today?
Speaker 4: I mean, I think I'm not bad. I need to
Speaker 4: learn a few more words.
Speaker 5: I need to increase my vocabulary and perhaps my confidence,
Speaker 5: but I think.
Speaker 2: I did Okay, Actually I would give you an a.
Speaker 4: But I do think that we should make emotionally unsafe whistles.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well maybe that's what we'll name this episode, emotionally
Speaker 2: unsafe whistles.
Speaker 1: That's not a bad idea. Do you have a whistle?
Speaker 5: No?
Speaker 4: I don't.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm going to get your I'm going to get that.
Speaker 2: Such my next offering to oh yes, a great holiday present,
Speaker 2: great Valentine's Day present.
Speaker 1: Great all of the things that are coming up.
Speaker 2: It's cat full of Spiders, Tarot deck and guidebook Christina
Speaker 2: Reachie's Personal Guidebooks. So this is going to be really
Speaker 2: fun for your family members and your friends and all
Speaker 2: of the things that we have coming up in the world.
Speaker 2: So please get yourself a copy. I'm going to take
Speaker 2: this to Whistler and play this with my friends. Not
Speaker 2: that you play tarot cards.
Speaker 5: I say that to you sometimes I keep making my son,
Speaker 5: ten year old son sit through readings.
Speaker 1: What is your BITI so what is your favorite like
Speaker 1: thing to add?
Speaker 2: Like when do you go to tarot cards when you
Speaker 2: have a question about your life? Do you go?
Speaker 5: I have trouble focusing in on the issue at hand
Speaker 5: many times in my life, So sometimes I'll just kind
Speaker 5: of shuffle and draw a card, and that theme or
Speaker 5: question allows me to like approach whatever sort of confusion
Speaker 5: I'm going through from a different perspective, like just the
Speaker 5: idea that like, sometimes you're asking yourselves the wrong questions
Speaker 5: and so this is a way of bringing in different
Speaker 5: questions and ideas to what you're going through. So a
Speaker 5: lot of times I'll draw a card and just be like, well,
Speaker 5: how does that relate to what I'm going through? And
Speaker 5: does that give me insight? And you know, okay, yeah.
Speaker 2: Okay, well great.
Speaker 1: I love it. You were so fun.
Speaker 2: I love me.
Speaker 4: He was really happy to be on. I've been a
Speaker 4: huge hand of your so.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, why weren't you ever on Chelsea lately?
Speaker 5: I don't know why wasn't I I was during my drive,
Speaker 5: I was during my dry spell when I couldn't get
Speaker 5: couldn't get it.
Speaker 1: You're like that has been you could have at least
Speaker 1: been on the round table. All right, thank you, Christina.
Speaker 2: We'll see you next week. Okay, guys, stand up shows
Speaker 2: that I have coming up, I am going to Texas
Speaker 2: this weekend.
Speaker 1: I'm going to Houston.
Speaker 2: I'm going to Austin, Houston and then Sugarland, Texas. Then
Speaker 2: I have my Specials taping in Montclair, New Jersey. Those
Speaker 2: are all sold out. I have San Diego on eleven
Speaker 2: twenty nine that has tickets available.
Speaker 1: Oh.
Speaker 2: I'm coming to Vegas on November thirtieth, right after Thanksgiving,
Speaker 2: and there are tickets available for that. And then I'll
Speaker 2: be in Des Moines, Iowa December fifth, December sixth is Omaha,
Speaker 2: and then December twenty eighth, I'm coming to New Orleans
Speaker 2: right before New Years, and then I'll be in Atlanta,
Speaker 2: Georgia on December twenty ninth.
Speaker 1: And those are the rest of my stand updates for
Speaker 1: this year. It's over New Tour New Year.
Speaker 3: If you'd like advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email
Speaker 3: at Dear Chelsea podcast at gmail dot com and be
Speaker 3: sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited
Speaker 3: and engineered by Brad Dickert executive producer Catherine Law and
Speaker 3: be sure to check out our merch at Chelseahandler dot
Speaker 3: com