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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal.

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Speaker 2: Here, independent media just played a truly massive role in

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Speaker 2: this election, and we are so excited about what that

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Speaker 2: means for the future of this show.

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Speaker 3: This is the only place where you can find honest

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Speaker 3: perspectives from the left and the right that simply does

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Speaker 3: not exist anywhere else.

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Speaker 2: So if that is something that's important to you, please

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Speaker 2: go to Breakingpoints dot com. Become a member today and

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Speaker 2: you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad free,

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Speaker 2: and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.

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Speaker 3: We need your help to build the future of independent

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Speaker 3: news media, and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints

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Speaker 3: dot com.

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Speaker 4: It is Friday, June twenty sixth. Here at Breaking Points.

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Speaker 4: We have an amazing show for you this morning, don't we, Crystal.

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Speaker 5: Indeed we do.

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Speaker 2: I don't never really get to do about it on Friday.

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Speaker 2: It is a little bit of an unusual show, though.

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Speaker 2: We've got two major interviews. I would say, We've got

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Speaker 2: Maggie Haberman and Johnson Swan coming on to talk about

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Speaker 2: their new blockbuster book, which is like the Uh Look

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Speaker 2: Inside the Trump Administration. You've probably seen a bunch of

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Speaker 2: their reporting already about the Iran War, about the Epstein files,

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Speaker 2: about the way these debates have played out, So very

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Speaker 2: excited to speak with the two of them, like fancy

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Speaker 2: guests for our show, so it was exciting.

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Speaker 5: To get them on.

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Speaker 2: And then we've got a long time front of the show,

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Speaker 2: Rokana coming on to talk about his big fight with

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Speaker 2: Elon Musk, which I think is actually really important and

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Speaker 2: significant because you've got the richest man on the planet

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Speaker 2: threatening Rocana for having the audacity to cite publicly available

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Speaker 2: studies about the impact of what Elon Musk's cuts at

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Speaker 2: USAID have meant to real human beings in the world.

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Speaker 5: So you've got the specter of the richest.

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Speaker 2: Man on the planet contributing to the death of many people,

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Speaker 2: and Elon doesn't apparently like that being pointed out, which

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Speaker 2: I think is interesting in and of itself. And then also,

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Speaker 2: of course we want to talk to Roe about the

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Speaker 2: events of the week, which I think have been as

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Speaker 2: politically consequential as you could possibly imagine, so should be

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Speaker 2: an interesting one.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, and on on Maggie and Jonathan. You know they

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Speaker 6: I don't think they get enough credit for the quality

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Speaker 6: of journalism that they produce because they're often surrounded by

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Speaker 6: people in their immediate field that are total hacks.

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Speaker 1: Like, because what they do is they they do that kind.

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Speaker 6: Of gal where you have extraordinarily good access at very

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Speaker 6: high levels, and people like Barack Revite have just given

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Speaker 6: a very very bad kind of reputation to that kind

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Speaker 6: of reporting because he just becomes a conveyor belt for

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Speaker 6: whatever somebody is saying, and it becomes news because the

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Speaker 6: person who's saying it is a news maker, even though

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Speaker 6: they are lying and have been lying and are constantly lying,

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Speaker 6: and you end up miss misleading the world. But if

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Speaker 6: you notice, they don't really do that. They have that

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Speaker 6: type of access, but they they write in a much

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Speaker 6: more contextualized way, in a way that allows people to

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Speaker 6: actually learn things about the world.

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Speaker 5: And that's yeah, they're not going to just put it

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Speaker 5: in access.

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Speaker 2: I mean, the Barock Revied approach is just basically like

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Speaker 2: to funnel a press release into your you know, into

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Speaker 2: your copy, Like you're getting whatever the regime line is

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Speaker 2: and you're just printing it unquestioningly and then it's up

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Speaker 2: to the rest of us to sort of sort through.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's still interesting to know what their line is,

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Speaker 2: but there's none of that scrutiny on what it means.

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Speaker 2: And you know, I know Jonathan in particular has done

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Speaker 2: one of the toughest interviews with Trump that I've ever seen,

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Speaker 2: one of the best. You know, Trump is difficult to

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Speaker 2: interview on TV, and Jonathan did not pull any punches.

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Speaker 2: So it's not like they've been shrinking violets either here.

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Speaker 2: So that'll be really interesting, role be really interesting. We'll

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Speaker 2: do the AMA at the end, and you know, guys,

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Speaker 2: really appreciate your support. Thank you for hanging with us

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Speaker 2: through the transition. I think it's gone pretty smoothly. Everybody

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Speaker 2: seems pretty happy with us back on Supercast. And of course,

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Speaker 2: if you want to continue to support us and get

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Speaker 2: access to all the things Breakingpoints dot com.

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Speaker 7: That's right. Well, now a little bit of regime change.

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Speaker 2: Well, guys, we are very fortunate to be joined this

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Speaker 2: morning by the two foremost journalists and chroniclers of the

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Speaker 2: Trump presidency, both one point zero and two point zero,

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Speaker 2: Maggie Haberman and Jonathan Swann, who are out with a

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Speaker 2: new book that you must pick up and read because

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Speaker 2: it has so many extraordinary anecdotes from inside the rooms

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Speaker 2: where all the things are happening regime change inside the

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Speaker 2: imperial presidency of Donald Trump.

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Speaker 5: Welcome guys, great.

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Speaker 1: To have you, Thanks for having us, Thank you, Yeah, of.

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Speaker 5: Course, of course.

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Speaker 2: So Maggie, let me start with you and with kind

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Speaker 2: of a general question to dive into some of the

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Speaker 2: specifics of the book. We've seen Trump make some what

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Speaker 2: I would consider sort of inexplicable decisions over the course

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Speaker 2: of Trump two point zero. In particular, just this week,

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Speaker 2: he blew up his own affordable housing bill, holding it

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Speaker 2: hostage to some other election priorities. What do you think

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Speaker 2: are the top priorities and top influencers of the way

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Speaker 2: that he has operated in this administration.

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Speaker 1: It's a good.

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Speaker 8: Question, and the housing bill is actually a great example

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Speaker 8: of so much of what we write about in this book,

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Speaker 8: which is Trump operating on pure gut and he is

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Speaker 8: his infla ruence the people around him who influences thinking.

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Speaker 8: It's like a half a dozen people in the room

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Speaker 8: of this government and this White House who are making

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Speaker 8: the decisions every day. And if you were in this

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Speaker 8: government and you're not in that room, you often have

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Speaker 8: no idea what's going on. And that includes top officials

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Speaker 8: at the State Department, Justice, Department, CIA, and so forth.

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Speaker 8: He is not especially interested in domestic politics. This term,

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Speaker 8: I mean as one of this term is in so

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Speaker 8: many ways not recognizable to the first one. It's not

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Speaker 8: a binary. It doesn't mean that he's never going to

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Speaker 8: pay attention. But certainly, if he had been seeing the

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Speaker 8: poll numbers that he has now that he does actually

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Speaker 8: have by all external metrics and some from his own

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Speaker 8: internal pollsters, if he had been seeing the complaints about

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Speaker 8: affordability from his own base, if he had been seeing

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Speaker 8: how vocally angry members of his own bab were about

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Speaker 8: the Warren Iran, he would have been more responsive in

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Speaker 8: term one. Now he is really doing the things that

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Speaker 8: he wants to do because he is very, very concerned

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Speaker 8: with and focused on leaving his indelible imprint on.

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Speaker 1: Washington and on the world. And we write about this.

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Speaker 8: You can't argue that he has been an unbelievably consequential figure.

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Speaker 8: He's certainly the most consequential president of my lifetime. I'm

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Speaker 8: in my fifties, but I think he will be the

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Speaker 8: most consequential figure for the next few years going forward,

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Speaker 8: and so on. Something like the housing bill, just to

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Speaker 8: bring it back to your question, he wasn't interested in

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Speaker 8: this housing bill. This was a bipartisan housing bill that

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Speaker 8: Republicans wanted, that Democrats wanted. That's not his personal priority,

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Speaker 8: and he doesn't really care that it is going to

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Speaker 8: hurt the Republican Party because he is not on the

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Speaker 8: ballot this fall.

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Speaker 5: But Jonathan may have another thought on this.

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Speaker 1: Not I co sign, Maggie, I co sign what you

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Speaker 1: just said. Don't do that one.

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Speaker 2: I'm drinking, donthan just a really quick follow up though

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Speaker 2: on that. You know, I've been trying to discern whether

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Speaker 2: or not he cares about the midterms, because I mean

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Speaker 2: he'll say things like I don't think at all about

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Speaker 2: Americans kind of financial conditions. You know, He'll say I

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Speaker 2: love the inflation. Things that anyone with like a you know,

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Speaker 2: basic understanding of politics, let alone someone who's been savvy

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Speaker 2: enough to wind up in the presidency twice now, would

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Speaker 2: know we're completely politically toxic, not to mention the tariffs

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Speaker 2: being politically toxic, the Iron War being politically toxic, all

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Speaker 2: of these sorts of things. And I look at that

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Speaker 2: and I'm like, he just doesn't care that there's midterms

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Speaker 2: at all. But then to go back to the housing example.

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Speaker 2: At the same time, what is he pushing here? He's

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Speaker 2: pushing this, you know what I would call an election

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Speaker 2: rigging bill to tilt the playing field in favor of Republicans,

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Speaker 2: which indicates that maybe he does care what happens in

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Speaker 2: the midterms. So how does he is he seeing the polls?

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Speaker 2: Is he aware of how he's viewed? Does he care

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Speaker 2: if there is a sort of electoral reckoning that happens,

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Speaker 2: you know, in the midterms and moving forward?

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Speaker 9: It's not It's not black and white, right, It's kind

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Speaker 9: of nuanced. His as we report in the book, his

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Speaker 9: aides wished he cared more about the midterms. They really

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Speaker 9: care about the midterms. It's not that he doesn't want

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Speaker 9: to hold the House. Of course, he wants to hold

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Speaker 9: the House, you know, all things can you know, he

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Speaker 9: doesn't want to be impeached again and realizes that he

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Speaker 9: will be, But he's also not that worried about these

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Speaker 9: things happening. The Supreme Court gave him sweeping immunity. It

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Speaker 9: gave all presidents swipping immunity in their twenty twenty four decision.

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Speaker 1: He's already we have reporting in that book.

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Speaker 9: He's told people he's going to pardon anyone who comes

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Speaker 9: within two hundred and fifty feet of the Oval Office.

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Speaker 9: Sometimes he says two hundred feet, sometimes he says twenty

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Speaker 9: five feet.

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Speaker 1: But some radius around the Oval Office is a pardon zone.

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Speaker 1: And so what's he really got to fear. Not very much.

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Speaker 9: And his family's making more money than they've ever made

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Speaker 9: ever by orders of magnitude.

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Speaker 1: So he's in that position. Maggie's right.

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Speaker 9: The information ecosystem around Trump is much more sealed off

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Speaker 9: than it was in term one. He would scroll Twitter

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Speaker 9: and he would be exposed organically to a lot more

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Speaker 9: just opinions and whatever this time, and by the way,

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Speaker 9: in Turn one, of course, you know it's become this

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Speaker 9: tiresome cliche, but it also happens to be true.

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Speaker 1: He was surrounded by a bunch of aids.

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Speaker 9: Who, and we know because we talked to them, held

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Speaker 9: him in contempt, viewed him as dangerous and detestable, and

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Speaker 9: in many cases pushed back very aggressively on all kinds

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Speaker 9: of issues with him.

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Speaker 1: He doesn't have that anymore.

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Speaker 9: He has aids who like him, believe in him, want

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Speaker 9: to implement essentially whatever he says. And so you don't

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Speaker 9: get a lot of friction there, and then of course

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Speaker 9: when he goes to mar Lago, he's surrounded by flatterers saying,

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Speaker 9: great job, you're crushing the eyatola. Keep at it, you know,

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Speaker 9: rah rah rah. He doesn't travel really. Last time he

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Speaker 9: would do quite a bit of domestic travel. He's really

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Speaker 9: quite housebound. So again, all presidents live in a bubble.

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Speaker 9: This just happens to be a smaller, tighter bubble, although

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Speaker 9: at the end I guess Biden was in a very

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Speaker 9: small type bubble too, so but it's very small and

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Speaker 9: it's very tight.

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Speaker 6: So.

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Speaker 9: Part of me he does care to some extent, just

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Speaker 9: not as much as his aides would like to pick.

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Speaker 6: Up on the point that Maggie was making about the

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Speaker 6: kind of indelible legacy that he wants to leave behind.

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Speaker 6: I noticed in his very long press conference recently around

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Speaker 6: the Iran mlu he twice brought up the idea of

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Speaker 6: him becoming Herbert Hoover as driving why he didn't for

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Speaker 6: the more prosecution of the war and why he wanted

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Speaker 6: to end why he wanted to end the war. So

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Speaker 6: it was it seemed like he was shifting from kind

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Speaker 6: of the positive things that he wanted to leave on

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Speaker 6: the world, Like he's getting rid of the Ryan Revolution,

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Speaker 6: he's overthrowing the government of Bene Venezuela to like the

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Speaker 6: other guardrail, which is I don't want to be Carter,

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Speaker 6: I don't want to be har Renouver. So with that

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Speaker 6: in mind, what else is left for him? I mean,

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Speaker 6: Cuba seems like something that he clearly has his eye on.

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Speaker 6: That's kind of thing he can say, I'm the guy

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Speaker 6: that ended the Cuban Revolution. What else? Like the world

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Speaker 6: is a fairly small place, and there are not as

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Speaker 6: many spots where he may want to kind of leave

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Speaker 6: his mark, then you might otherwise think so like if

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Speaker 6: you're him and you now have two and a half

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Speaker 6: years God help us of time left, Like where do

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Speaker 6: you think he's going to look, especially if he doesn't

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Speaker 6: care about domestic policy here in the US.

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Speaker 8: A couple of things, Ryan, It's interesting that you pointed

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Speaker 8: out the Herbert Hoover moment. I was fascinated by that,

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Speaker 8: And you know he did that at that G seven

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Speaker 8: press conference where he just talked and talked and talked

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Speaker 8: for quite some time. That used to be something he

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Speaker 8: would say in term of one and he would say

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Speaker 8: it during the campaign a lot, you know, he would

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Speaker 8: he would use nineteen twenty nine had tipped Andrew Russ

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Speaker 8: Sorkin as like, you know, an epithet.

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Speaker 10: It was.

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Speaker 8: It was something that you know, you don't want to

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Speaker 8: see a crash, you don't want to see a bubble

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Speaker 8: burst on the economy, and he was very mindful of that.

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Speaker 10: And then he really.

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Speaker 11: Stopped talking about it last year in our reporting that

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Speaker 11: was not coming up over and over again in fact,

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Speaker 11: and we again have a very vivid scenes about this

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Speaker 11: the lead up to Liberation Day, which was his you know,

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Speaker 11: global teriff for global trade war, which was something he

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Speaker 11: wanted to try for decades.

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Speaker 8: He didn't have an economic theory of the case around tariffs.

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Speaker 8: He saw terriffs as a blunt instrument and a tool

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Speaker 8: of power, and he had wanted to do this sweeping

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Speaker 8: terriff implementation program. In turn one, AIDS kept it pretty tailored.

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Speaker 8: It turns out with the reason you know, they used

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Speaker 8: this formula that was sort of incoherent and indescribable and

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Speaker 8: is asking AIDS. We have this vivid scene where he

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Speaker 8: doesn't believe the numbers that his own Commerce secretary is

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Speaker 8: giving him and he tells his ever present aid Natalie Harp.

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Speaker 8: You know, get me the real numbers. Go find literally

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Speaker 8: just googling whatever these numbers were. The degree of fear

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Speaker 8: and terror, frankly that a number of his advisors had

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Speaker 8: and cabinet officials had the lead up to Liberation Day

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Speaker 8: and then the lead up to the almost total meltdown

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Speaker 8: of the bond markets on April ninth. When he finally

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Speaker 8: pulls back, we weren't hearing a ton about Herbert Hoover.

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Speaker 8: It was you know, he tried this, He took it

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Speaker 8: as far as he could. It's sort of hard to

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Speaker 8: argue otherwise right now with the reality that he just

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Speaker 8: can't bend to his will on this front.

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Speaker 5: The gas prices are what they are.

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Speaker 8: This MoU might be the paddle that gets them out

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Speaker 8: of this particular creak, but it hasn't yet, and they're

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Speaker 8: still moving toward it. I was surprised to hear him

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Speaker 8: just say that, but at a press conference. But as

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Speaker 8: we write in the book, whatever thin filter he once

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Speaker 8: had on what he says has pretty much evaporated. So

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Speaker 8: I don't know how much he wants to conquer left Cuba. Obviously,

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Speaker 8: he talks about quite a bit. Cuba is very important

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Speaker 8: to Marco Rubio, his secretary of State. This has been

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Speaker 8: a subject of focus for months and months and months.

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Speaker 8: Whether that will happen remains to be seen. Whether he

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Speaker 8: re ups his Greenland push, I think remains to be seen.

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Speaker 8: I think the Canada one has receded to the background.

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Speaker 8: But what you do see as a president who is

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Speaker 8: focused on spheres of influence, hemispheric spheres of influence as

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Speaker 8: opposed to, you know, sweeping imprints in far off lands.

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Speaker 8: For the most part, when we talk about leaving his imprint,

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Speaker 8: what we're referring to, and we describe this in the

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Speaker 8: book a lot is imprint all over Washington, the Ballroom,

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Speaker 8: the Arc de Trump, the Kennedy Center, which you know

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Speaker 8: is still an ongoing fight. This these beautification projects he

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Speaker 8: has all over the yielding of the Oval Office, which

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Speaker 8: we saw when we went in to see him in March,

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Speaker 8: and we hadn't neither of us had been there in

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Speaker 8: the Oval since that had happened, And it really is

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Speaker 8: it takes a second to take it in. One of

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Speaker 8: the things to remember about him is he was infuriated

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Speaker 8: during and after his first term that his name kept

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Speaker 8: being taken off of buildings in New.

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Speaker 1: York, that he lost a PGA.

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Speaker 8: I don't remember if his tour PGA forgive me for

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Speaker 8: being a precise tournament that he really wanted at Bedminster,

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Speaker 8: that New York City took away his lease and that

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Speaker 8: ultimately had to give it back for a Trump Links

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Speaker 8: golf course that was city property. In the Bronx, he's

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Speaker 8: not waiting for anyone else to recognize him this time,

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Speaker 8: and that is really the imprint that he's leaving. But

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Speaker 8: also it's across the culture, and Jonathan I think can

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Speaker 8: speak better to that than I can.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, I mean, one thing we cover in the book

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Speaker 9: is his efforts to influence the arts and the museum.

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Speaker 9: You know, it's sort of flown under the radar a

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Speaker 9: little bit. Obviously there's been a lot of coverage about

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Speaker 9: eradicating DEI from universities and the government and corporate America.

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Speaker 9: But we have a portion of the book where they're

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Speaker 9: trying to essentially influence what artwork is shown in different

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Speaker 9: museums around the country. And there's a pretty extraordinary scene

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Speaker 9: where there are these Board of Regents meetings of the

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Speaker 9: Smithsonian that we got inside and you've got like Lonie Bunch,

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Speaker 9: you know, the first African American director of the Smithsonian.

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Speaker 9: You have the Chief Justice, John Roberts, various other luminaries

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Speaker 9: in the room, and Vance is in there and he

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Speaker 9: leaves the room and one of his aides, who's like

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Speaker 9: in his early thirties, holds up an iPad and it's

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Speaker 9: a photo of that Amy Sheryld painting the Transforming Liberty,

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Speaker 9: the trans woman with the torch. You know, she canceled

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Speaker 9: her exhibition, and he's holding up this thing. It's like

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Speaker 9: John Roberts Lonie, but actually goes, this is not what

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Speaker 9: an Americans want to see, you know. So these are

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Speaker 9: the kind of it's you know, they are trying to

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Speaker 9: influence the culture, and it's a big, big part of

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Speaker 9: this administration that I think has flown under the radar

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Speaker 9: to a large extent with all the other reporting.

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Speaker 6: So it's another realtion.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that makes sense in light of the

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Speaker 2: birthday celebration and all of that, these big cultural events

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Speaker 2: that they're spending a lot of time and money and

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Speaker 2: focus on, right and.

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Speaker 7: The rendering of history. Maggie and John.

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Speaker 4: Another question just about his mindset with how he's handling

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Speaker 4: the Iran War. We feel like a kind of a cycle,

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Speaker 4: like a vortex of repetitive agreements and then rescinding those agreements.

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Speaker 4: Jeremy Scahill with Ryan at drop Site News did some

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Speaker 4: reporting that the Iranians have enlisted psychologists mental health experts

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Speaker 4: to analyze how Trump is thinking about this, and that

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Speaker 4: he might actually be mentally ill in some way. Has

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Speaker 4: any reporting in the book covered Trump's health or uncovered anything.

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Speaker 4: I mean, you know a lot of pictures about the

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Speaker 4: makeup on his hands and just anything into his internal

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Speaker 4: mental health mindset that you might have uncovered.

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Speaker 8: We say with humility that this was any area of

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Speaker 8: reporting in this book.

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Speaker 5: This was a failure.

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Speaker 8: You know, we spent a lot of time trying to

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Speaker 8: understand what's happening with his health. You know, there are

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Speaker 8: so many secrets this administration keeps. They make these great

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Speaker 8: displays of transparency. He's the most transparent president in the world.

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Speaker 8: He takes every reporter's phone call, blah blah. They're actually

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Speaker 8: very good. It's obviously a canard. They're also very good

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Speaker 8: at keeping secrets when they want to, And his health

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Speaker 8: has always been a lock box for him over decades,

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Speaker 8: not just since he became president. Many of his aides

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Speaker 8: don't have a full picture of what is happening with

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Speaker 8: his health.

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Speaker 6: You know.

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Speaker 8: They put out that statement recently when he went to

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Speaker 8: Walter Read again that he had been seen by twenty

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Speaker 8: two specialists. We can't get an answer on what those

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Speaker 8: specialists treat or who they were. I can't even really

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Speaker 8: begin to imagine what it would have been or if

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Speaker 8: it was twenty two. We know what you know, which

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Speaker 8: is he's an eighty year old man who you know

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Speaker 8: when this we do talk about in the book is hearing,

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Speaker 8: by all accounts, is not as good as it was.

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Speaker 8: He obviously is falling asleep in these meetings. His sleeping

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Speaker 8: habits are a little more unusual than they were in

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Speaker 8: Turn one, and they were strange, you know initially too.

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Speaker 8: He sleeps a few hours a night. We write about

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Speaker 8: how you know, at about ten am one morning, when

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Speaker 8: he hadn't been heard from, a Trust to aid went

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Speaker 8: up to the residence and he was still asleep, and

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Speaker 8: they assumed that he had had some late night of

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Speaker 8: posting or reading or whatever, and he went back to

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Speaker 8: sleep for a while. He's got the makeup on his hands.

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Speaker 8: They've been saying it's because of handshaking forever, but we

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Speaker 8: certainly don't have any greater visibility into it than anyone else,

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Speaker 8: and definitely not mental health.

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Speaker 2: Jonathan, I wanted to ask you a little bit more

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Speaker 2: about what things have served to check Trump at all

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Speaker 2: in this second administration, because one of the themes that

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Speaker 2: you all tease out is certainly the fact that in

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Speaker 2: the interim period, the effort was all, Oh, the problem

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Speaker 2: with Trump one point zero was I had these people

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Speaker 2: who were trying to rain me in, and I had

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Speaker 2: these institutions that would stand in my way. What can

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Speaker 2: we do to make sure there's none of that the

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Speaker 2: second time around? And they've been pretty effective at destroying

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Speaker 2: any of the bounds or guardrails that existed. He had

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Speaker 2: made some extraordinary comment like, well, the only limit is

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Speaker 2: I think he said, my own mind or my own morals,

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Speaker 2: both of which are are pretty scary. But there have

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Speaker 2: been times when they've been forced to pull back, you know,

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Speaker 2: on the tariffs. Now you was talking earlier about the

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Speaker 2: bond markets were a problem. We were just talking about

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Speaker 2: how with the Iran warris like, oh my god, I

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Speaker 2: might be courting being Herbert Hoover here, so it seems

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Speaker 2: like the markets are one piece. We're also seeing some

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Speaker 2: significant it seems like at least public pullback on the

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Speaker 2: most maximalist version of the immigration agenda. They're selling some

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Speaker 2: of these warehouses that they had acquired. You've got Christy

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Speaker 2: Noam out, mark Wayne Mullen in. So what are the

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Speaker 2: things that have limits him over the course of the administration.

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Speaker 2: I am particularly curious about the immigration agenda, since that's

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Speaker 2: something that has been so core to Trump since he

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Speaker 2: wrote down the Golden Escalator.

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Speaker 6: Totally.

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Speaker 9: It's a great question, and the story is shifting a

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Speaker 9: little bit in the last few months, but through twenty

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Speaker 9: twenty five it was pretty extraordinary. We haven't really seen

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Speaker 9: an unbridled expression of executive power like that, certainly not

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Speaker 9: in our lifetime, and in some respects, with some areas,

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Speaker 9: we've never seen it. Congress essentially just ceded the field

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Speaker 9: to Trump. I mean, when Bush went to war in

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Speaker 9: Iraq and Afghanistan, as we all know, every all the

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Speaker 9: problems with that lead up and the intelligence and everything,

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Speaker 9: it still went through Congress, right there was still a

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Speaker 9: congressional debate. In the congressional vote, Trump didn't even talk

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Speaker 9: to Congress just went He just did it. He just

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Speaker 9: went in, sent Delta force into Karrakas and snatched a

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Speaker 9: sovereign head of state out of his bedroom in his pajam.

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Speaker 9: He didn't talk to Congress. He determined himself in his

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Speaker 9: own mind that fishing boats carrying cocaine were quote unquote

438
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:11,040
Speaker 9: enemy combatants, and they just blew them up. You don't

439
00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:13,480
Speaker 9: get a back season that one when you kill someone.

440
00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:16,720
Speaker 9: So you talk about, you know, an expression of power,

441
00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:20,440
Speaker 9: taking someone's life without any discussion with Congress, without any

442
00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:23,240
Speaker 9: authorization for the use of military force. It doesn't really

443
00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:25,560
Speaker 9: get more profound than that. And that's before I even

444
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:29,320
Speaker 9: get to, you know, using leaders of government to coerce

445
00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:31,880
Speaker 9: law firms and universities and all.

446
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:32,159
Speaker 1: The rest of it.

447
00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:36,520
Speaker 9: So let's let's acknowledge all of that. What is also

448
00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:38,760
Speaker 9: true is that so far, at least, they have not

449
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:40,680
Speaker 9: disobeyed Supreme Court rulings.

450
00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:43,040
Speaker 1: There is pretty extensive.

451
00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:48,400
Speaker 9: Reporting that they have been in many cases either ignoring, disobeying,

452
00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:52,000
Speaker 9: or fudging around with lower court rulings, particularly on immigration.

453
00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:54,119
Speaker 9: A lot of examples of that, and we have a

454
00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:56,960
Speaker 9: lot of reporting in our book about how serious the

455
00:22:57,080 --> 00:22:59,960
Speaker 9: discussions were inside the most senior level of the Trump

456
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:04,280
Speaker 9: administration about suspending habeas corpus, one of the most basic

457
00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:06,720
Speaker 9: human rights you could have the right if you get

458
00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:09,560
Speaker 9: locked up by the government to challenge your detention. They

459
00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:13,880
Speaker 9: Stephen Miller absolutely was looking at wanting to and Trump

460
00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:19,439
Speaker 9: himself suspend that right for illegal immigrants. The conversations were

461
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:22,320
Speaker 9: so serious the staff Secretary of the White House, Willschaft,

462
00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:25,800
Speaker 9: wrote confidential memos to the Chief of Staff, essentially outlining

463
00:23:25,840 --> 00:23:28,000
Speaker 9: why this was a line the White House shouldn't cross.

464
00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:31,800
Speaker 9: But they didn't cross that line. Supreme Court decisions on

465
00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:35,920
Speaker 9: tariffs they have obeyed. And then Congress. Now you're starting

466
00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 9: to see in the Senate some signs of life, and

467
00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:43,120
Speaker 9: that's I think the natural outgrowth of Donald Trump alienating

468
00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,640
Speaker 9: a few key senators. You know, it turns out when

469
00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:49,000
Speaker 9: you drive someone into retirement and you support their opponent,

470
00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:50,840
Speaker 9: they feel somewhat liberated.

471
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:52,440
Speaker 1: But I don't think people who are you.

472
00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:54,800
Speaker 9: Know, I hear this sort of Oh, Donald Trump's it's

473
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:57,760
Speaker 9: the end of Donald Trump in his power whatever. Anyone

474
00:23:57,760 --> 00:24:00,320
Speaker 9: who's opposed him in the Republican Party is basically out

475
00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:06,160
Speaker 9: of a job. I mean, Thomas Massey MTG retired, till

476
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:09,280
Speaker 9: Us is out. Cassidy, you know, go down the list

477
00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,600
Speaker 9: in the Republican Party. As unpopular as Donald Trump is

478
00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:17,439
Speaker 9: nationally and with independence, he's still an incredibly dominant figure.

479
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:20,200
Speaker 9: So I do think there are limits. I think on immigration,

480
00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:22,199
Speaker 9: he is not as hardcore as Stephen Miller. We have

481
00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,119
Speaker 9: a thing in a book where Trump privately joked that

482
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:27,320
Speaker 9: if it was up to Stephen Miller, the country would

483
00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:29,000
Speaker 9: only have one hundred million people and they'd all look

484
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:32,440
Speaker 9: like Stephen Miller. So Trump on immigration is much more

485
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:36,639
Speaker 9: of a it's just the truth, It is the truth.

486
00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:38,520
Speaker 9: But Trump is much more of a finger in the

487
00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:41,760
Speaker 9: wind on immigration, and when he sees bad press, he's

488
00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:44,359
Speaker 9: much more willing to pull back, where Stephen Miller, you know,

489
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:46,359
Speaker 9: has been obsessed with this issue since he was a

490
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:51,199
Speaker 9: child and is a passionate ideologue. So that's that's an

491
00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:53,840
Speaker 9: example of where Trump, after he sees all the bad press,

492
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:56,119
Speaker 9: after the killings of re An A Good and Alex Pretty,

493
00:24:56,520 --> 00:25:00,520
Speaker 9: you know, he pulls back. But there aren't that many gils.

494
00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:02,760
Speaker 9: There are certainly no guard rauls inside the executive branch.

495
00:25:02,800 --> 00:25:06,879
Speaker 9: They've removed every pocket of independence and the very quaint

496
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:11,520
Speaker 9: notion after Watergate that the president doesn't interfere with Justice

497
00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:16,639
Speaker 9: Department investigations, that is obviously obliterated. He's ordering up investigations

498
00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:21,879
Speaker 9: of named individuals. So you know that's the overall landscape.

499
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:23,840
Speaker 5: Can I had one point. I'm sorry, just very quickly, Ryan,

500
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:25,040
Speaker 5: just on the immigration point.

501
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:29,280
Speaker 8: We're recording this at a time when the Supreme Court

502
00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 8: has actually just granted the administration pretty sweeping hand to

503
00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:40,560
Speaker 8: end temporary protective status for Hitian immigrants and other groups.

504
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 8: I think that's going to affect at least three hundred

505
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:47,200
Speaker 8: and fifty thousand people, possibly more. And essentially the Court

506
00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:49,679
Speaker 8: is saying, you know, we can't interfere with executive branch

507
00:25:50,080 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 8: decisions that way. The TPS is entirely an executive branch choice.

508
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:58,120
Speaker 8: And so it is true that they did as Jonathan said,

509
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 8: they pulled back from these you know, very very splashy

510
00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 8: pushes into cities. But Tom Holman keeps saying they're going

511
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:10,240
Speaker 8: to do it in New York. They are selling these warehouses.

512
00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 8: But we have a bid in the book about how

513
00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:14,960
Speaker 8: Stephen Miller was telling people he thought the warehouses were

514
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:17,320
Speaker 8: crazy and he didn't understand why they were being bought,

515
00:26:17,359 --> 00:26:19,879
Speaker 8: and so you did have this visure of the NOME

516
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:26,080
Speaker 8: run DHS NOME slash Corey Lewandowski run DHS and what

517
00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:29,719
Speaker 8: Stephen Miller actually was pushing versus what he was tolerating

518
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:31,720
Speaker 8: in the name of having officials who would go along

519
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:34,639
Speaker 8: with what he wanted. They still have a deeply, deeply

520
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:39,560
Speaker 8: restrictionist immigration policy and for the most part it's working well.

521
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:42,560
Speaker 6: I wanted to ask you briefly about Stephen Miller. I

522
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:46,199
Speaker 6: remember Trump when he was introducing him to maybe it

523
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:48,119
Speaker 6: was MBZ and the UE. He said, this is the

524
00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 6: guy who runs my government. I've heard he's jokingly referred

525
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:55,679
Speaker 6: to as the kind of prime minister. What is his

526
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 6: relationship like with Trump now? But also more importantly perhaps

527
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:01,560
Speaker 6: for us as we go on in the world when

528
00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:05,600
Speaker 6: Trump is gone, what's his purchase in the Trump orbit

529
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:09,280
Speaker 6: kind of absent Trump, Like, if we're in a post

530
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 6: Trump world, does he maintain this status or is he

531
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:16,480
Speaker 6: pretty connected to Trump's project?

532
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:21,240
Speaker 9: Stephen Miller did a pretty good job in the off years,

533
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:24,479
Speaker 9: you know, twenty one through twenty four, of cultivating a

534
00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:28,160
Speaker 9: wide range of relationships in the Republican Party. A lot

535
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:32,359
Speaker 9: of members of Congress consult him. You know, they see

536
00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:36,640
Speaker 9: him as a big brain, a sort of a policy luminary.

537
00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:44,320
Speaker 9: We write in the book that he's arguably, maybe even objectively,

538
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:48,439
Speaker 9: the most powerful domestic policy staffer in recent White House memory.

539
00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:54,320
Speaker 9: In Turn one, he was young, inexperienced, very valued for

540
00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:56,400
Speaker 9: sure as the speech writer, but he was pretty narrowly

541
00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 9: focused on immigration. He's got a much broader remit. Now

542
00:28:00,560 --> 00:28:03,640
Speaker 9: he's got this other title as Homeland Security Advisor, which

543
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:08,119
Speaker 9: gives him a much broader remit. You know, Western Hemisphere, Mexico.

544
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:11,760
Speaker 9: He was heavily involved in the drug bombing, planning for

545
00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:14,880
Speaker 9: the drug bombing campaign, the drug boats, so he's really

546
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:17,440
Speaker 9: got his hands in everything. He's often in the room

547
00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:21,680
Speaker 9: for foreign leader phone calls and meetings. We have reporting

548
00:28:21,680 --> 00:28:23,760
Speaker 9: in the book that he wanted to be National Security

549
00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 9: Advisor to succeed Mike Waltz. Many people in their belief

550
00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:30,520
Speaker 9: that he has designs on the Chief of Staff role. Eventually,

551
00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,960
Speaker 9: Trump values him because he gets things done, he said,

552
00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 9: and he also talks to Trump in a way that

553
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:41,280
Speaker 9: instills a lot of confidence. You know, yes, sir, we

554
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:44,320
Speaker 9: can do it, and don't worry like weill bulldoze through anything.

555
00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:46,120
Speaker 9: We have a lot of reporting in the book about

556
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:49,920
Speaker 9: these phone calls that Steven Miller would have inside the government,

557
00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:52,080
Speaker 9: which became sort of legendary.

558
00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:53,840
Speaker 1: He would brate.

559
00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:58,440
Speaker 9: These staffers at DHS and ICE and the agencies and

560
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:01,479
Speaker 9: basically threatened to fire that if they didn't pick up

561
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:02,800
Speaker 9: the deportation pace.

562
00:29:03,080 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 1: He just drives them relentlessly. So I think he's.

563
00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 9: Got a big future in the Republican Party almost no

564
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,400
Speaker 9: matter what happens, because he sort of made himself indispensable

565
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,080
Speaker 9: with someone who has real experience in the executive branch,

566
00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:20,160
Speaker 9: knows how to get things done, and has lots of

567
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:21,680
Speaker 9: relationships across the party.

568
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 8: One of the key relationships, just to add to what

569
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,280
Speaker 8: Jonathan just said, and I don't think you said this,

570
00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:30,520
Speaker 8: but I apologize there was a siren outside was Elon Musk.

571
00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:34,000
Speaker 8: In these off years, he developed a very close relationship

572
00:29:34,000 --> 00:29:37,280
Speaker 8: with Musk, was advising him on political donations. That is

573
00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:41,840
Speaker 8: a relationship that as far as we know, continues and

574
00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:45,320
Speaker 8: will be quite useful endurable for him going forward.

575
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:51,840
Speaker 4: Speaking of other close friendships, zorroon Mom. Donnie has been

576
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:56,200
Speaker 4: to the White House now twice to visit Trump kind

577
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:57,160
Speaker 4: of shocked the world.

578
00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:00,720
Speaker 7: How much of a romance it seemed that they now have.

579
00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:04,040
Speaker 4: What was the reaction from the rest of the administration

580
00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 4: from such a positive experience, You know, the DSA now

581
00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 4: is a national topic and Trump is calling them these

582
00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:16,280
Speaker 4: crazy communists, but he still has nice words for Zoron

583
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,920
Speaker 4: tell us a little bit about Uh, those Zoron trips

584
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:19,640
Speaker 4: to the White House.

585
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:25,400
Speaker 8: It's interesting that the Zoron Trump UH text messaging back

586
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:28,040
Speaker 8: and forth is like one of the lock boxes that

587
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:32,240
Speaker 8: I've certainly been trying to understand for a while. It

588
00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:35,800
Speaker 8: certainly wasn't a surprise to us that that Trump was

589
00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:40,600
Speaker 8: so enthralled by Zoron mom Donnie's presence, because a Trump

590
00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:45,400
Speaker 8: doesn't He'll attack people online, but one on one interpersonal

591
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:49,600
Speaker 8: direct conflict is not always his thing. Uh, Zoron mom

592
00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:53,920
Speaker 8: Donnie is a really good political performer, and like he is,

593
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:57,440
Speaker 8: he's a generational talent, and so that didn't really surprise

594
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,920
Speaker 8: us either. He has attracted crowds he was for that meeting.

595
00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:03,520
Speaker 8: Apparently in their meeting he talked about how there was

596
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 8: overlap between some of his own rally attendees and Trump's

597
00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:11,640
Speaker 8: or you know, campaign event attendees. And Trump's and that

598
00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:13,800
Speaker 8: is true. It was actually a little less than I

599
00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:17,200
Speaker 8: thought it was going to be. It might get challenging

600
00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:21,200
Speaker 8: for Trump because, as you say, not everyone in his government.

601
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 8: By the way, I don't think, for instance, that the

602
00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:26,200
Speaker 8: White House Chief of Staff, Susie Wiles, objects to having

603
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:28,400
Speaker 8: a good relationship with the mayor of New York. We

604
00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:31,840
Speaker 8: certainly know that Trump. You know, we're at the Simon

605
00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:34,480
Speaker 8: and Schuster offices right now, and Trump Tower is a

606
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:37,640
Speaker 8: few blocks away. So it's just a reminder that the

607
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:41,760
Speaker 8: Trumps have a business interest in this city and maintaining

608
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:45,000
Speaker 8: a good relationship with the mayor is something they care about.

609
00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:49,360
Speaker 8: But yes, it's going to be hard for Trump to

610
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:53,320
Speaker 8: use everyone everyone in the extended Maga orbit, who I

611
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 8: speak to, was very excited about the elections in New

612
00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:58,200
Speaker 8: York the other day, as this will give fresh life

613
00:31:58,200 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 8: to Trump's attacks on democratic social And it's true, except

614
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:05,040
Speaker 8: it's harder to maintain that when Trump is is yucking

615
00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 8: it up with Zorn Mamdani. So it's there are many

616
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:10,480
Speaker 8: places where Trump is not always in lockstep with everyone

617
00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 8: around him, and this is.

618
00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:14,240
Speaker 2: One, yeah, even a million problem for at least a

619
00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 2: phonic Yeah, but there's also.

620
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:18,560
Speaker 9: An element of like, we don't need to over complicate

621
00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:21,840
Speaker 9: too much. He also just likes handsome men. I mean,

622
00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:24,120
Speaker 9: I don't know if he saw who does his reaction

623
00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:27,800
Speaker 9: to Jelani over and when I was traveling with Trump

624
00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:32,840
Speaker 9: in the Middle East, I mean it was almost like, yeah,

625
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:35,000
Speaker 9: so you know, we've seen this a parade of these,

626
00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:38,960
Speaker 9: you know, handsome men he likes.

627
00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:41,040
Speaker 1: Here's a type, he has a there's a there's a type.

628
00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:43,520
Speaker 1: There's a type. He likes to be looking men and women.

629
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:47,280
Speaker 5: But yes, better look at the time cruise, big strong.

630
00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 1: Guy exactly talks about theles well.

631
00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:53,080
Speaker 2: I really appreciate you guys taking the time, and I

632
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:54,880
Speaker 2: just want to also applaud you for spending so much

633
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:57,520
Speaker 2: time in the book on Trump the Trump family corruption,

634
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,840
Speaker 2: which you know is truly world historic, hard to wrap

635
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:04,280
Speaker 2: your head around, and difficult to cover because there is

636
00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 2: just such an overwhelming flood of it. So we didn't

637
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:09,960
Speaker 2: get a dig into that part this morning. People just

638
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:11,640
Speaker 2: have to go and buy the book and read it

639
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:14,960
Speaker 2: to see all of the reporting there. But Jonathan and Maggie,

640
00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:17,280
Speaker 2: thank you both so much for joining us this morning.

641
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 2: We really appreciate it and congrats on the book. It's spectacular.

642
00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 1: Thanks, thank you.

643
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 6: Thanks for having us guys.

644
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:24,800
Speaker 4: Yes, and I like that it's gold. I like the

645
00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 4: book is gold. It'll fit nicely too.

646
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:32,400
Speaker 9: It's actually it's gorgeous covering, beautiful.

647
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:33,840
Speaker 1: Look at it's all behind me.

648
00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:34,320
Speaker 10: Look at this.

649
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:34,840
Speaker 1: It's great.

650
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,960
Speaker 4: I think gets Trump a copy. I think it'll be

651
00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:39,479
Speaker 4: on the wall there. Thank you very much.

652
00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:41,440
Speaker 1: Thank I think he's aware. I think he's aware of it.

653
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:48,640
Speaker 8: Thanks God, ask them all right.

654
00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 1: Thank you very much, guy, guys, thanks for having us.

655
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:56,720
Speaker 2: Sia joining us now about to talk about the political

656
00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:59,480
Speaker 2: earthquake in New York City and potentially across the country,

657
00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:02,200
Speaker 2: as well as his major fight and the threats coming

658
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:05,120
Speaker 2: from Elon musk Is Conresson, Rocanagrit Caesar.

659
00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 10: Great to see you, Thanks for having me back.

660
00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:10,360
Speaker 2: On what do you think is the import of these

661
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:14,680
Speaker 2: elections this week? All of Zoron's candidates winning, the rise

662
00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:17,680
Speaker 2: of DSA, especially in the context of New York, but

663
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 2: you obviously see candidates like Graham Plattner Abdolsayed also rising

664
00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:25,440
Speaker 2: in a way that would have been perhaps hard to

665
00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 2: imagine previously. The base of the Democratic Party supporting these

666
00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:33,520
Speaker 2: candidates fullheartedly or full thwartedly, whatever the term is. What

667
00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:35,600
Speaker 2: do you think is the political import of what we

668
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:36,760
Speaker 2: saw unfold this week?

669
00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:41,439
Speaker 12: So, Crystal, you were right about a year ago and

670
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:46,480
Speaker 12: you said that any candidate who does not acknowledge that

671
00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 12: there was a genocide in Gaza is going to lose

672
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:52,840
Speaker 12: a moral credibility with the base, that this is going

673
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:54,880
Speaker 12: to be sort of a moral test for a party.

674
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:58,000
Speaker 12: And I know people talk about affordability and it's important,

675
00:34:58,040 --> 00:34:59,759
Speaker 12: and they talk about a lot of other issues, but

676
00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:02,960
Speaker 12: at its core, many of these elections came down to

677
00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:07,959
Speaker 12: candidates who recognized what was happening on their phones and said,

678
00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:09,919
Speaker 12: I'm not going to be beholden to anyone. I'm going

679
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:12,560
Speaker 12: to say it was a genocide, and I'm going to

680
00:35:12,600 --> 00:35:15,960
Speaker 12: be very clear we need a new moral direction versus

681
00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 12: those candidates who were at best op fuse skating or

682
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:23,600
Speaker 12: at worse still getting support from APEC and other pro

683
00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:28,319
Speaker 12: Israel groups. That was the central issue in many of

684
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:30,919
Speaker 12: those New York races, and of those race and grab

685
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:33,800
Speaker 12: Platner's race. And the other central issue is the massive

686
00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:36,560
Speaker 12: economic inequality, not just worthing the mounts. I want to

687
00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:38,759
Speaker 12: bottom up economy I want a middle class economy. I

688
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:41,880
Speaker 12: want to work in class economy. Are you four wealth

689
00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:45,120
Speaker 12: tax on billionaires? Are you for medicare for all? Are

690
00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:48,160
Speaker 12: you four universal childcare at ten dollars a day? Do

691
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,359
Speaker 12: you actually stand for these policies?

692
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 10: And you had.

693
00:35:54,040 --> 00:36:00,360
Speaker 12: In these candidates a clear willingness to take on extreme

694
00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:01,759
Speaker 12: wealth and extreme power.

695
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:06,640
Speaker 6: And they're supposed to speaking of support for Israel, there's

696
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,239
Speaker 6: supposed to be a vote what was it today on

697
00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:12,880
Speaker 6: a foreign ops appropriations measure that were MASSI is pushing

698
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:16,440
Speaker 6: an amendment to cut funding to Israel. There's some apparently

699
00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 6: there was some uh, some real drama or tensions, and

700
00:36:19,640 --> 00:36:23,399
Speaker 6: the Democratic Caucus meeting about it yesterday. Were you at

701
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:25,719
Speaker 6: that meeting? What have you heard about this? Like the

702
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:28,120
Speaker 6: reporting is that a lot of rank and file Democrats

703
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:32,440
Speaker 6: are now very kind of uncertain about how they should

704
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,359
Speaker 6: be approaching this issue, which a couple of years ago

705
00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:38,359
Speaker 6: they were quite certain it was just whatever Stanny, Hoyer

706
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:40,880
Speaker 6: and Apak told them to do, they did it, and

707
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,840
Speaker 6: now they're kind of at sea. What what is this

708
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 6: massive vote and how are Democrats thinking about it? Were

709
00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 6: you in the were you in the meeting yesterday where they.

710
00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 12: I wasn't really heard about it, and there's been a

711
00:36:52,239 --> 00:37:00,799
Speaker 12: sea change in the perception Adred Democrats are to the

712
00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:05,080
Speaker 12: extent that moderate Democrats are saying that we shouldn't ever

713
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:08,120
Speaker 12: vote for funding for Israel, that I don't want to

714
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:11,719
Speaker 12: vote for a bill that has funding for Israel, And

715
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,000
Speaker 12: a number of Democrats came up to me saying, we

716
00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:18,239
Speaker 12: are going to vote for your in Massy effort when

717
00:37:18,280 --> 00:37:21,080
Speaker 12: the NDAA comes up to strike section two twenty four,

718
00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:26,240
Speaker 12: and we don't want to have foreign Appropriations bill passed

719
00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:29,760
Speaker 12: that has Israel funding. So it'll be interesting to see

720
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:34,080
Speaker 12: how many Democratic knows they're going to be. But I

721
00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:36,959
Speaker 12: would argue at this point we're getting to at least

722
00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:40,880
Speaker 12: half the caucus that is opposed to funding for Israel.

723
00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:46,000
Speaker 2: How freaked was were your colleagues this week, because we're

724
00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:49,720
Speaker 2: seeing some public signs of meltdown, you know, James Carvel's

725
00:37:49,719 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 2: I know there should be a schism in the Democratic Party,

726
00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 2: a lot of hand ringing going on. I know there

727
00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:59,000
Speaker 2: was some anonymous Democratic House me member perhaps rhymes with Rothheimer,

728
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 2: who's saying maybe he's looking at switching parties because he

729
00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:06,800
Speaker 2: can't he can't possibly coexist with someone like Daria Liza,

730
00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:09,200
Speaker 2: or with Claire Valdez or other you know, candidates that

731
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:13,120
Speaker 2: would be supported by the Zoron Mamdani wing of the party.

732
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:16,080
Speaker 2: So I wonder what you're hearing and seeing and is

733
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 2: this serving as a sort of wake up call, because

734
00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:20,839
Speaker 2: that's what the angst over this vote would indicate that

735
00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:23,840
Speaker 2: it's suddenly their eyes are open, like, oh, we actually

736
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:26,719
Speaker 2: have a big problem here. People actually want us to

737
00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:29,400
Speaker 2: signal some moral direction and are not going to just

738
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:32,399
Speaker 2: stand by and watch us run cover for a genocide.

739
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 12: Suddenly they have are seeing what we've been seeing for

740
00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:41,799
Speaker 12: the past year. I mean, this New York election was

741
00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:42,680
Speaker 12: a wake up call.

742
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:45,000
Speaker 10: It's in the epicenter of democratic power, right.

743
00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:47,600
Speaker 12: I mean, you can't dismiss it as oh, that's just

744
00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:51,080
Speaker 12: one of rose districts in the West Coast, or this

745
00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:53,560
Speaker 12: is where all the media is. This is where Hillary

746
00:38:53,560 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 12: Clinton came from. Sure when it comes from a team

747
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:59,279
Speaker 12: comes from where the Clintons that live near New York City.

748
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:01,759
Speaker 12: It's where all the funding is for the party. A

749
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:03,880
Speaker 12: lot of the funding comes out of there. And suddenly

750
00:39:04,040 --> 00:39:09,480
Speaker 12: they're electing progressive Democrats and the epicenter of democratic power

751
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:11,839
Speaker 12: so absolutely it.

752
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 10: Has been a wake up vote.

753
00:39:13,239 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 12: One of the things that drives me crazy is are

754
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:21,800
Speaker 12: a bit inability to stand by progressive Democrats or Democrats

755
00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:26,400
Speaker 12: for that matter, because of some dumb thing or inaccurate

756
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 12: thing they may have said in their past, Like how

757
00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:32,600
Speaker 12: about all of the collective idiocy of Donald Trump and

758
00:39:32,719 --> 00:39:34,719
Speaker 12: JD Vans, Like I don't want to ever hear a

759
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:38,919
Speaker 12: lecture from the Republicans about some statement that someone may

760
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:42,520
Speaker 12: have made. And yet we freak out about the mildest

761
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:44,319
Speaker 12: things that someone may have said in the past and

762
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 12: drive and feed into Fox's narrative as opposed to simply

763
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:53,000
Speaker 12: saying the Republican Party should never lecture us about any

764
00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:59,000
Speaker 12: issue of morality, patriotism, or normalcy. Ever, for a generation,

765
00:40:00,480 --> 00:40:04,200
Speaker 12: anyone on our side has incredibly more patriotic and a

766
00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:07,239
Speaker 12: moral vision than anyone on their side who has been

767
00:40:07,280 --> 00:40:10,239
Speaker 12: complicit with Donald Croup. And so you know this is

768
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,000
Speaker 12: not in good faith what they're doing. And it's because

769
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:17,399
Speaker 12: they fear that the Progressive Party winning. And I saw

770
00:40:17,440 --> 00:40:19,560
Speaker 12: your tweet that the Progressives have already won. I don't

771
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:22,000
Speaker 12: know if I I don't know if I'm ready to.

772
00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:23,600
Speaker 10: Go that far.

773
00:40:23,680 --> 00:40:26,200
Speaker 12: We still have a long battle and go and underestimate

774
00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:28,759
Speaker 12: these folks, but we certainly have the momentum.

775
00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:32,160
Speaker 2: Well, they've won the ideological war, is what I meant

776
00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:33,640
Speaker 2: by that. You know, if you look at the poll

777
00:40:33,640 --> 00:40:35,680
Speaker 2: and you see the media talking motto the divide on

778
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:38,799
Speaker 2: Israel with the Democrats, and there is no divide, you know,

779
00:40:38,880 --> 00:40:41,960
Speaker 2: in terms of the Democratic base. Divide is between that

780
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:44,760
Speaker 2: base and the elected officials who were trying to figure

781
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:47,200
Speaker 2: out how to catch up real quick, or at least

782
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:48,959
Speaker 2: some of them are at least trying to figure that out.

783
00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:51,120
Speaker 2: But there is no real divide with the base. My

784
00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:52,560
Speaker 2: last question on this, then, I want to talk about

785
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:55,480
Speaker 2: your fight with Elon is you've been willing to endorse

786
00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:59,120
Speaker 2: against incumbents. You know, you endorse Bradlander against Dan Goldman

787
00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:01,400
Speaker 2: even though he is your your colleague. I don't have

788
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:02,759
Speaker 2: a list in front of me, but I know you've

789
00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:04,719
Speaker 2: in other instances, not that you do all of them,

790
00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:09,400
Speaker 2: but you will selectively endorse against incumbents. It seems like

791
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:11,600
Speaker 2: people still like you, like it seems like you're still

792
00:41:11,600 --> 00:41:14,240
Speaker 2: able to be effective in the Congress, that this doesn't

793
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:16,880
Speaker 2: just poison the well with everybody there. You know, how

794
00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:19,600
Speaker 2: how do you think about endorsing against your colleagues and

795
00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:22,879
Speaker 2: the discomfort that that brings. Has there been have there

796
00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:26,120
Speaker 2: been repercussions for you internally within the caucus?

797
00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:26,880
Speaker 5: What does that look like?

798
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:29,640
Speaker 12: You got to have lunch to the capitol. I can

799
00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:31,320
Speaker 12: introduce you to the people who hate my guts?

800
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 7: Are you not allowed to sit with them anymore?

801
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:40,600
Speaker 12: You know you're going to make some people upset. And

802
00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:44,839
Speaker 12: you know, I think if there's one thing I've done,

803
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:47,480
Speaker 12: I've been willing to take some risks, and I'm willing

804
00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:49,919
Speaker 12: to not be liked by some folks. Now, you can't

805
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:53,400
Speaker 12: make everyone upset, and and that's where I've tried to

806
00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:56,520
Speaker 12: have some balance. But you know, I just after we've

807
00:41:56,520 --> 00:41:59,000
Speaker 12: done this, I'm cutting an ad for Elijah many who's

808
00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:00,640
Speaker 12: running against a DEBI Wahltz.

809
00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:02,880
Speaker 10: That's another place I had uplifted.

810
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:06,440
Speaker 12: I'm an endorse, but I lifted Milt, who's, by the way,

811
00:42:06,440 --> 00:42:08,360
Speaker 12: an extraordinary candidate, has a great.

812
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:10,360
Speaker 10: Shot in Colorado.

813
00:42:10,560 --> 00:42:13,359
Speaker 12: And there are other places where I mean in claar

814
00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:15,680
Speaker 12: Valdez wasn't against an incomment, but it might as well

815
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:18,880
Speaker 12: been against any comment because Nydia was basically acting like

816
00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:24,200
Speaker 12: endorsing her was burning a bridge with Nydia. And I

817
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:26,680
Speaker 12: guess what I do is I one, I'm transparent. I

818
00:42:26,719 --> 00:42:29,480
Speaker 12: will give leadership a heads up if I'm going to

819
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:32,120
Speaker 12: do it. I give them the rationale.

820
00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:32,880
Speaker 10: They know that.

821
00:42:32,920 --> 00:42:36,760
Speaker 12: I don't do it gratuitously in every case.

822
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:39,040
Speaker 10: And in some cases I'll endorse.

823
00:42:39,120 --> 00:42:42,239
Speaker 12: In other cases I'll lift people up on social media,

824
00:42:42,280 --> 00:42:45,560
Speaker 12: short up endorsement, and other cases I'll help get some funding.

825
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:48,120
Speaker 10: And I look, I beat my Conda. I ran against

826
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:48,600
Speaker 10: him twice.

827
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:50,759
Speaker 12: I ran against Tom Lantos against the war, and I

828
00:42:50,840 --> 00:42:53,520
Speaker 12: promised myself that if I ever got there, I wouldn't

829
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:58,839
Speaker 12: close the drawbridge and I would help other people. I

830
00:42:58,880 --> 00:43:01,319
Speaker 12: remember what it was like running the anst incumbent and

831
00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:04,200
Speaker 12: seeing the entire party endorse the incumbent and walk away

832
00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:04,480
Speaker 12: from me.

833
00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:08,239
Speaker 10: And so I'm not perfect, but I've tried to do that.

834
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 12: And you know what, when you do that and you're

835
00:43:10,719 --> 00:43:15,080
Speaker 12: transparent and you have some strength, people often respect that

836
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:20,160
Speaker 12: and you don't have to always tow the exact line.

837
00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 12: Of course, politics is an art more than a science,

838
00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:26,120
Speaker 12: and you can go too far and it's always a judgment.

839
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:29,239
Speaker 6: Congress, and you appeared on Jennifer Welch's show a while

840
00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:33,239
Speaker 6: ago and created a storm that is still going, that

841
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:35,319
Speaker 6: is still ranging. I want to play a little bit

842
00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:39,080
Speaker 6: of your comments from that interview.

843
00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:42,280
Speaker 12: To come out in huge numbers. And I do believe

844
00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:45,040
Speaker 12: that once we take power, there has to be accountability.

845
00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:47,319
Speaker 12: There needs to be accountability for Elon Musk. You know,

846
00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:50,520
Speaker 12: they're celebrating that he created forty four hundred millionaires, but

847
00:43:50,560 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 12: they don't talk about the four point five million children

848
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:56,399
Speaker 12: around the world who he possibly sentenced to death by

849
00:43:56,400 --> 00:44:00,319
Speaker 12: dismantling USA. He needs to answer for. That needs to

850
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:04,200
Speaker 12: be subpoena. He needs to face investigation. He needs to

851
00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:06,799
Speaker 12: answer for what he did with Doge. That it's not

852
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:11,080
Speaker 12: just let's move on and we will use the Oversight

853
00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:15,080
Speaker 12: Committee and the Judiciary Committee. The whole people accountable. Who

854
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:19,360
Speaker 12: violated the law on ice and abused power with ice,

855
00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:23,200
Speaker 12: who violated the law on killing people on boats in

856
00:44:23,239 --> 00:44:26,880
Speaker 12: the Caribbean, who violated the law when it came to Iran,

857
00:44:27,000 --> 00:44:30,120
Speaker 12: and some of the strikes who violated the law with Doge.

858
00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:34,760
Speaker 12: There will be accountability. There needs to be accountability before reconciliation.

859
00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:38,560
Speaker 6: Out of that, you've had Elon Musk say he wants

860
00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:42,279
Speaker 6: to arrest you, say he's going to sue you. You

861
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:48,799
Speaker 6: responded with a decent amount of data and also an

862
00:44:48,880 --> 00:44:51,880
Speaker 6: offer to kind of debate him publicly on this question.

863
00:44:54,120 --> 00:44:56,880
Speaker 6: Has he any chance you think that that's going to

864
00:44:56,920 --> 00:44:58,799
Speaker 6: happen now?

865
00:44:59,440 --> 00:45:02,359
Speaker 12: First of all, shows the power of independent media, right.

866
00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:05,799
Speaker 12: I mean, I'm on a podcast with Jennifer Walsh and

867
00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:11,080
Speaker 12: I say this and Musk goes crazy. He literally has

868
00:45:11,120 --> 00:45:12,600
Speaker 12: I don't know if he still has it, but few

869
00:45:12,920 --> 00:45:17,040
Speaker 12: till yesterday had a pin tweet on his acts of

870
00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:21,520
Speaker 12: Jennifer Walsh and me like, the guy who's a trillionaire

871
00:45:21,560 --> 00:45:24,920
Speaker 12: doesn't have better things to do other than spending a

872
00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:27,399
Speaker 12: week responding. But I think it goes to a core

873
00:45:27,480 --> 00:45:31,320
Speaker 12: of what I believe about politics, which is it shouldn't

874
00:45:31,360 --> 00:45:33,759
Speaker 12: just be performative, it should be effective. Right that the

875
00:45:33,840 --> 00:45:39,480
Speaker 12: Epstein files, we actually got legislation done. There was just

876
00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:43,160
Speaker 12: a lawsuit yesterday that succeeded with the Administrative Procedure Act

877
00:45:43,200 --> 00:45:45,160
Speaker 12: that could get more of the files released.

878
00:45:45,200 --> 00:45:47,719
Speaker 10: It was a coalition that was effective. And there are

879
00:45:47,719 --> 00:45:47,960
Speaker 10: a lot of.

880
00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:51,000
Speaker 12: People who tweeted out in Musk and who've tweeted out studies.

881
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:54,000
Speaker 12: Why was this effective in actually getting a response and

882
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:56,959
Speaker 12: driving a national conversation in the USA because I talked

883
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:01,359
Speaker 12: about the subpoena power and he's not dumb that when

884
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:04,760
Speaker 12: I said I'm on the Oversight Committee and I'm with Garcia,

885
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:07,000
Speaker 12: we're gonna subpoena you and we're gonna have the votes,

886
00:46:07,719 --> 00:46:12,280
Speaker 12: and that it's criminal contempt to avoid the subpoena. Suddenly

887
00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:14,560
Speaker 12: he said, Wow, these guys are serious. They're not just

888
00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:18,160
Speaker 12: tweeting or going after me. They may actually hold me

889
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:21,200
Speaker 12: to Congress. And this is when people say they want

890
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:23,480
Speaker 12: fight from the Democratic Party. I think what they want

891
00:46:23,560 --> 00:46:26,759
Speaker 12: is not just tweets or speeches. They want things that

892
00:46:26,800 --> 00:46:30,360
Speaker 12: are going to have in effect. And this the reason

893
00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:33,319
Speaker 12: that had in effect is the combination of indimendal media

894
00:46:33,320 --> 00:46:36,040
Speaker 12: and the combination of the threat of the subpoena.

895
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 7: Power and Congressman.

896
00:46:37,680 --> 00:46:39,760
Speaker 4: There's been, like you said, quite a bit of cope

897
00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:42,400
Speaker 4: from Elon I'm outside the pin tweets. I wanted you

898
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:45,759
Speaker 4: to react to a video of his thoughts on on

899
00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:47,120
Speaker 4: doge in USA.

900
00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:48,440
Speaker 7: I d let's take a listen.

901
00:46:49,280 --> 00:46:52,880
Speaker 13: Thoughts of usaid that we found to be even slightly useful.

902
00:46:53,000 --> 00:46:55,279
Speaker 13: We're transferred to the stage profits. They have not been

903
00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:57,480
Speaker 13: deleted there, so we've been transferred to the stage PUBMIT.

904
00:46:58,239 --> 00:47:01,960
Speaker 13: But many, many times with yours and other organizations, when

905
00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:05,880
Speaker 13: they said, oh, well this is going to help you know, children,

906
00:47:05,960 --> 00:47:10,120
Speaker 13: or it's going to help some disease eradication or something

907
00:47:10,160 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 13: like that. And then when we ask for any evidence whatsoever,

908
00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:16,160
Speaker 13: I say, well, please connect us with this group of

909
00:47:16,239 --> 00:47:18,440
Speaker 13: children so we can talk to them and understand more

910
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:19,200
Speaker 13: about their issue.

911
00:47:19,360 --> 00:47:20,040
Speaker 6: We get nothing.

912
00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:23,440
Speaker 13: We don't they even try to prevent show. I come

913
00:47:23,520 --> 00:47:26,680
Speaker 13: up with a with a show, often meaning like it's

914
00:47:26,719 --> 00:47:28,880
Speaker 13: sort of like, well, can we at least see a

915
00:47:28,920 --> 00:47:32,160
Speaker 13: few kids, like where are they if they're in trouble,

916
00:47:32,239 --> 00:47:35,200
Speaker 13: we'd like to talk to them and talk to their caregivers.

917
00:47:35,280 --> 00:47:36,759
Speaker 6: And then we get something.

918
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:40,920
Speaker 13: As a response, because it's what we find is an

919
00:47:41,040 --> 00:47:46,520
Speaker 13: enormous amount of fraud and graft. Example, very little actually

920
00:47:46,520 --> 00:47:48,640
Speaker 13: gets to the kids, if anything at all.

921
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:53,280
Speaker 7: Your reaction to that, Congressman, most people know it's absurd.

922
00:47:53,719 --> 00:47:57,840
Speaker 12: Basically, USA is giving food and medicine to the world's porous.

923
00:47:58,280 --> 00:48:02,000
Speaker 12: And Elon Mus didn't go to Africa, he didn't go

924
00:48:02,040 --> 00:48:05,399
Speaker 12: to South America, he didn't go to Asia where these

925
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:08,440
Speaker 12: programs were He's sitting in Washington, d C.

926
00:48:08,800 --> 00:48:09,680
Speaker 10: And he ends.

927
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:12,440
Speaker 12: Eighty three percent of these programs. Eighty three percent of

928
00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:15,000
Speaker 12: the programs. It does so much damage that Congress or

929
00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:19,360
Speaker 12: Republican Congress has to reauthorize some of these programs. So

930
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:21,719
Speaker 12: it's not as bad as what he did. Now it's

931
00:48:21,800 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 12: maybe twenty or thirty percent cut. But he has just

932
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:32,040
Speaker 12: oblivious to what he has done. But he's afraid because

933
00:48:32,040 --> 00:48:33,959
Speaker 12: he now knows that he's going to have to start

934
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:38,200
Speaker 12: explaining this. So this entire week he's been out there

935
00:48:38,239 --> 00:48:40,640
Speaker 12: trying to cover for Doge.

936
00:48:40,680 --> 00:48:42,240
Speaker 10: But we've had this conversation before.

937
00:48:42,440 --> 00:48:45,960
Speaker 12: There's a new generation, Robert Carcia, myself, others who are

938
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:48,680
Speaker 12: not going to say let's just kumbaya move on, who

939
00:48:48,719 --> 00:48:51,920
Speaker 12: are going to expect accountability, not just for Elon Musk,

940
00:48:52,160 --> 00:48:57,400
Speaker 12: but for the Trump officials who engaged in into main conduct.

941
00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:00,640
Speaker 12: And that is part of the healing and rec conciliation

942
00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:03,359
Speaker 12: of this country, is to take on the people who

943
00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:06,320
Speaker 12: have caused the divisions and the cruelty.

944
00:49:06,680 --> 00:49:09,920
Speaker 2: Ro you actually know Elon, I mean he I guess

945
00:49:09,960 --> 00:49:13,720
Speaker 2: he's not your constituent anymore, but was at one point.

946
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:18,319
Speaker 2: I presume and you've spoken with him, you know, you've

947
00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:20,360
Speaker 2: met him in person, Like, what is the deal with

948
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:22,719
Speaker 2: this guy? How do you view him? Why do you

949
00:49:22,719 --> 00:49:25,799
Speaker 2: think this touched such a nerve? What do you think

950
00:49:25,880 --> 00:49:29,080
Speaker 2: of his arc here to you know, really hard right

951
00:49:29,200 --> 00:49:32,120
Speaker 2: politics where now he's getting involved like inciting race riots

952
00:49:32,120 --> 00:49:32,719
Speaker 2: in Ireland.

953
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:37,440
Speaker 12: That's why I feel like I have some objectivity because

954
00:49:37,960 --> 00:49:39,960
Speaker 12: we were on friendly terms for.

955
00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:44,040
Speaker 10: I would say at least a decade.

956
00:49:44,200 --> 00:49:47,920
Speaker 12: I mean, he blurbed my first book after the Obama

957
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:51,520
Speaker 12: administration on bringing manufacturing back to the US.

958
00:49:51,560 --> 00:49:52,799
Speaker 10: We had a disagreement back then.

959
00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:56,480
Speaker 12: I had pushed that we linked the Obama grant to

960
00:49:57,320 --> 00:49:59,680
Speaker 12: labor neutrality, which I wish we did. Tesla would be

961
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:01,400
Speaker 12: Union eyes if we had done that. It was the

962
00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:05,120
Speaker 12: biggest miss in the Obama administration. I was public as

963
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:08,080
Speaker 12: a Deputy Assistant Sedior Commerce, low level person, saying we

964
00:50:08,080 --> 00:50:11,440
Speaker 12: should link it to labor neutrality. But ELIN was begging

965
00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:14,520
Speaker 12: Anna Ashoe, who is my neighboring member of Congress, for

966
00:50:14,640 --> 00:50:17,280
Speaker 12: that loan. I mean every week she would call Ani issue,

967
00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:20,120
Speaker 12: I need this loan to be able to get Tesla.

968
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:23,839
Speaker 12: After that, he blurred the book We had on and

969
00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:27,160
Speaker 12: off conversation. He was very passionate about climate. He was

970
00:50:27,160 --> 00:50:30,840
Speaker 12: a very strong supporter, at least of immigration in Silicon Valley.

971
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:36,880
Speaker 12: And I thought that the reason he initially was upset

972
00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:39,760
Speaker 12: was that we didn't invite him to the EV summit

973
00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:44,760
Speaker 12: with Biden, even because people didn't want him there in Union,

974
00:50:45,480 --> 00:50:46,919
Speaker 12: that the union didn't want him there, and I thought,

975
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:49,440
Speaker 12: you know, even though he should be unionized, we probably

976
00:50:49,440 --> 00:50:53,440
Speaker 12: should have had him there, and we had conversations, but.

977
00:50:53,480 --> 00:50:54,520
Speaker 10: Then he just has gone.

978
00:50:54,680 --> 00:50:57,279
Speaker 12: We gets to Dulge, and you know, I gave him

979
00:50:57,280 --> 00:50:59,000
Speaker 12: initially the benefit of doubt. We were going to have

980
00:50:59,040 --> 00:51:00,759
Speaker 12: a meeting with him and Bernie and Warren't on the

981
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:03,719
Speaker 12: defense budget and cutting the defense budget because that's something

982
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:06,320
Speaker 12: we've all wanted to do. He gets there and he

983
00:51:06,360 --> 00:51:08,680
Speaker 12: does nothing with defense, He does nothing with any of

984
00:51:08,719 --> 00:51:12,720
Speaker 12: these agencies, and he starts on an ideological agenda against USA,

985
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:17,560
Speaker 12: and he goes on an ideological agenda on immigration, an

986
00:51:17,640 --> 00:51:20,960
Speaker 12: ideological agenda on krans Kids. And I think he's just

987
00:51:21,000 --> 00:51:27,479
Speaker 12: been swept in to this right wing ecosystem and that's

988
00:51:27,480 --> 00:51:30,160
Speaker 12: how he governed. And even his responses to me aren't

989
00:51:30,200 --> 00:51:35,080
Speaker 12: trying to convince the independent person there he's getting affirmation

990
00:51:35,200 --> 00:51:37,640
Speaker 12: from this right wing media ecosystem, and that's who he's

991
00:51:37,640 --> 00:51:38,040
Speaker 12: playing to.

992
00:51:38,760 --> 00:51:40,280
Speaker 10: It's very sad and very scary.

993
00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:43,640
Speaker 6: And the problem that he has here and I'll put

994
00:51:43,640 --> 00:51:47,520
Speaker 6: this element up here. This is February third, twenty twenty five.

995
00:51:47,600 --> 00:51:52,840
Speaker 6: He said, we spent the weekend feeding usaid into the

996
00:51:52,840 --> 00:51:56,600
Speaker 6: wood chipper. Could have gone to some great parties, did

997
00:51:56,600 --> 00:52:00,120
Speaker 6: that instead. And so if you contrast that with what

998
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:04,279
Speaker 6: you what he's saying less than two weeks into Trump's term,

999
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:08,080
Speaker 6: with the deliberative process that he claims that he engaged in,

1000
00:52:08,120 --> 00:52:10,759
Speaker 6: where they went, you know, program by program and aid

1001
00:52:10,840 --> 00:52:14,920
Speaker 6: recipient by aid recipient asking to be connected with you

1002
00:52:15,200 --> 00:52:18,799
Speaker 6: orphans or otherwise to like get some validations for the program.

1003
00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:23,239
Speaker 6: What actually happened is he did literally destroy it and

1004
00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:27,359
Speaker 6: then when there were attempts to reach out to the

1005
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:31,920
Speaker 6: aid recipients, they failed because he had shut down all

1006
00:52:31,960 --> 00:52:35,520
Speaker 6: the programs. Like the employees were literally like locked out

1007
00:52:35,520 --> 00:52:38,640
Speaker 6: of their out of their emails and otherwise you couldn't

1008
00:52:38,800 --> 00:52:42,439
Speaker 6: couldn't communicate. He shut the entire thing down. And that's

1009
00:52:42,520 --> 00:52:44,520
Speaker 6: literally what happened. But I do want to get you

1010
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:47,080
Speaker 6: to respond to some of the right wing counter arguments,

1011
00:52:47,120 --> 00:52:49,799
Speaker 6: some of which I'm sympathetic to, which is a lot

1012
00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:51,719
Speaker 6: of the good work that they do is in this

1013
00:52:51,800 --> 00:52:56,120
Speaker 6: direct giving. They also have a political and ideological element

1014
00:52:56,160 --> 00:52:59,080
Speaker 6: to them, where they they'll fund kind of quote unquote

1015
00:52:59,120 --> 00:53:02,560
Speaker 6: pro democracy organizations that will you know, back like you know,

1016
00:53:02,600 --> 00:53:06,200
Speaker 6: an opposition party that is actually just sympathetic with whatever

1017
00:53:06,200 --> 00:53:08,800
Speaker 6: the US interests are or whatever the US cut slash

1018
00:53:08,800 --> 00:53:11,799
Speaker 6: corporate interests are it. And so Musk is able to

1019
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:16,160
Speaker 6: accurately cite a decent number of foreign leaders in Central

1020
00:53:16,160 --> 00:53:18,800
Speaker 6: America or Africa who say, you know what, actually USA

1021
00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:20,760
Speaker 6: idea is not helpful to us.

1022
00:53:21,080 --> 00:53:21,480
Speaker 1: We don't.

1023
00:53:21,840 --> 00:53:28,799
Speaker 6: We think that it's overly interventionists and undermines our internal politics. Obviously,

1024
00:53:29,360 --> 00:53:31,360
Speaker 6: you can, you know, both things can be true, and

1025
00:53:31,400 --> 00:53:34,719
Speaker 6: you can protect the formula for infants while also addressing

1026
00:53:36,239 --> 00:53:39,319
Speaker 6: the political dimension. But what is your what is your

1027
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:41,960
Speaker 6: response to that critique that that there are a lot

1028
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:45,120
Speaker 6: of people in Africa and in South and Central America

1029
00:53:45,120 --> 00:53:47,680
Speaker 6: we're like, yeah, actually we don't like us A I d.

1030
00:53:49,400 --> 00:53:52,640
Speaker 12: I acknowledge some of the critique, And if he had

1031
00:53:52,680 --> 00:53:55,360
Speaker 12: come in to reform it, he could have come to

1032
00:53:55,440 --> 00:53:58,759
Speaker 12: Congress and made those arguments, and maybe he would have

1033
00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:00,680
Speaker 12: gotten some support. And that's this is why I say

1034
00:54:00,719 --> 00:54:05,600
Speaker 12: that initially I was open minded about Doge. Sometimes journalist

1035
00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:07,480
Speaker 12: asked me that as a gotcha, Oh you were open

1036
00:54:07,560 --> 00:54:09,840
Speaker 12: minded about Doge. I said, that's not gotcha. Yeah, I

1037
00:54:09,960 --> 00:54:12,440
Speaker 12: was open minded about it. I'm usually open minded to

1038
00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:16,480
Speaker 12: working with people for constructive solutions. And he would have

1039
00:54:16,640 --> 00:54:18,880
Speaker 12: found an audience if he had said, look, bro, I

1040
00:54:18,920 --> 00:54:22,759
Speaker 12: want to go after programs that are overly interventionist and

1041
00:54:22,840 --> 00:54:26,319
Speaker 12: undermining popular sovereignty and other nations. Maybe he would have

1042
00:54:26,360 --> 00:54:30,400
Speaker 12: gotten even Democrats, progressive Democrats to do that.

1043
00:54:30,440 --> 00:54:31,239
Speaker 10: But he didn't do that.

1044
00:54:31,320 --> 00:54:35,719
Speaker 12: He basically took a sledgehammer with no one's input by Fiat,

1045
00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:39,080
Speaker 12: as he himself says, and put it in a wood chopper.

1046
00:54:39,120 --> 00:54:43,120
Speaker 12: And that's why we have so many potential potential debts

1047
00:54:43,160 --> 00:54:45,120
Speaker 12: now in the rebuilding. And this, I think is a

1048
00:54:45,160 --> 00:54:48,520
Speaker 12: broader point in the rebuilding of all of these agencies.

1049
00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:53,080
Speaker 12: We want to do it with human rights, with progressive values,

1050
00:54:53,800 --> 00:54:55,920
Speaker 12: with a sense of what the future is going to require,

1051
00:54:56,280 --> 00:54:59,000
Speaker 12: and not just let's just you know, get Samantha Power

1052
00:54:59,000 --> 00:55:01,640
Speaker 12: back in there and and do exactly what we were

1053
00:55:01,680 --> 00:55:04,000
Speaker 12: doing in the past, and that's the opportunity why I

1054
00:55:04,000 --> 00:55:06,279
Speaker 12: think we can have a new deal for our time,

1055
00:55:06,320 --> 00:55:10,120
Speaker 12: that there could be really a rebuild of government around

1056
00:55:10,200 --> 00:55:14,720
Speaker 12: a progressive vision, around an effective vision for government.

1057
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:15,920
Speaker 10: And that's the opportunity.

1058
00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:22,279
Speaker 4: Row I had a question about the future political relationships

1059
00:55:22,280 --> 00:55:24,279
Speaker 4: of all these tech billionaires. Now, you mentioned that you

1060
00:55:24,320 --> 00:55:26,799
Speaker 4: and Elon were friends. A lot of these you know,

1061
00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:31,640
Speaker 4: tech CEOs were seen more as liberal democrats in before

1062
00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:34,439
Speaker 4: the Trump era, but now we see Zuckerberg, we see

1063
00:55:34,440 --> 00:55:39,719
Speaker 4: these AI CEOs, you know, CosIng up to Trump. Where

1064
00:55:39,719 --> 00:55:42,560
Speaker 4: do you think they go post Trump? Do you think

1065
00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:46,120
Speaker 4: that they will be sort of always now marked as

1066
00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:50,000
Speaker 4: more conservative tech CEOs or will they flip back over

1067
00:55:50,640 --> 00:55:53,640
Speaker 4: and be good Democrats again if there's a Democrat in office.

1068
00:55:54,440 --> 00:55:55,560
Speaker 10: They're opportunists.

1069
00:55:55,640 --> 00:55:59,880
Speaker 12: I mean, some of them will play ball with wh

1070
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:03,040
Speaker 12: who ever is in office. But you're going to lose

1071
00:56:03,120 --> 00:56:07,080
Speaker 12: thirty percent of them if we take a real platform issue,

1072
00:56:07,080 --> 00:56:09,120
Speaker 12: which is a wealth tax. If we're saying, look, we're

1073
00:56:09,120 --> 00:56:11,480
Speaker 12: going to tax these folks, then you're not going to

1074
00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:12,719
Speaker 12: get thirty percent of them.

1075
00:56:12,719 --> 00:56:13,440
Speaker 10: There'll be some.

1076
00:56:14,239 --> 00:56:17,640
Speaker 12: Who either on billionaires or who get that we don't

1077
00:56:17,680 --> 00:56:23,279
Speaker 12: want revolution, who will be fine with that coalition, but

1078
00:56:23,440 --> 00:56:25,640
Speaker 12: will you have to lose some of those folks? And

1079
00:56:25,680 --> 00:56:28,560
Speaker 12: this is the big basic fight I'm having with Gavin

1080
00:56:28,600 --> 00:56:32,120
Speaker 12: newsomwhere I've supported a five percent tax on two hundred

1081
00:56:32,120 --> 00:56:35,000
Speaker 12: and fifty billionaires in California so three million Californians don't

1082
00:56:35,000 --> 00:56:38,360
Speaker 12: lose health insurance. He then is opposed to it, is

1083
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:41,640
Speaker 12: leading the charge against it because these two hundred and

1084
00:56:41,680 --> 00:56:46,359
Speaker 12: fifty billionaires are important donors and political contributors. And he says, well,

1085
00:56:46,360 --> 00:56:50,000
Speaker 12: I'm for a national billionaire's tax, But he doesn't want

1086
00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:52,160
Speaker 12: to do with Bernie is time out or I five

1087
00:56:52,200 --> 00:56:54,239
Speaker 12: percent tax on billionaires. He doesn't even want to do

1088
00:56:54,239 --> 00:56:56,719
Speaker 12: what Warren is time about three percent tax. He wants

1089
00:56:56,760 --> 00:57:00,319
Speaker 12: to just say, Okay, they can't borrow against act and

1090
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:02,920
Speaker 12: it should be taxed on that, which is exactly what

1091
00:57:02,960 --> 00:57:05,759
Speaker 12: the tech billionaires are proposing, I mean, and and would

1092
00:57:05,800 --> 00:57:08,360
Speaker 12: raise the fracture of the revenue. So at some point

1093
00:57:08,400 --> 00:57:10,239
Speaker 12: you got to be choos. Are we going to be

1094
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:13,200
Speaker 12: against the oligarchs or for the oligarchs? Yes, we can

1095
00:57:13,200 --> 00:57:15,400
Speaker 12: be against them, and which is what Bernie and I

1096
00:57:15,520 --> 00:57:18,880
Speaker 12: and Warren are, And then some of them may come

1097
00:57:18,920 --> 00:57:20,640
Speaker 12: along and then new social Contract.

1098
00:57:20,640 --> 00:57:23,439
Speaker 10: But what we can't do is pander to them.

1099
00:57:24,200 --> 00:57:26,480
Speaker 2: Hey, Roe, just to remind everybody, what percent of the

1100
00:57:26,560 --> 00:57:30,040
Speaker 2: vote did your billionaire back to primary opponent?

1101
00:57:30,120 --> 00:57:31,000
Speaker 5: What did he end up with?

1102
00:57:31,600 --> 00:57:32,680
Speaker 10: Six percent?

1103
00:57:32,880 --> 00:57:35,160
Speaker 12: They spent over a million dollars and we didn't spend

1104
00:57:35,200 --> 00:57:37,120
Speaker 12: a dollar on it because I wanted to kind of see.

1105
00:57:37,160 --> 00:57:40,320
Speaker 12: I mean, we were doing town halls and they spent

1106
00:57:40,400 --> 00:57:42,280
Speaker 12: over a million dollars. He gets six percent of the vote.

1107
00:57:42,320 --> 00:57:44,800
Speaker 12: We got sixty two percent, and the Republicans got the rest.

1108
00:57:45,240 --> 00:57:48,080
Speaker 12: And he did worse than kendidates who haven't spend a

1109
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:51,520
Speaker 12: dollar against me. And I think it's that people really

1110
00:57:51,640 --> 00:57:56,120
Speaker 12: understood that, you know, he was the candidate of the

1111
00:57:56,160 --> 00:57:57,200
Speaker 12: tech holigarchs.

1112
00:57:57,400 --> 00:58:00,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I want people to understand, you represent Silicon

1113
00:58:00,520 --> 00:58:04,720
Speaker 2: Valley and that is the level of popularity of those views.

1114
00:58:05,200 --> 00:58:07,840
Speaker 2: So just so people get out there in the democratic

1115
00:58:07,960 --> 00:58:13,400
Speaker 2: elite world how absolutely toxic and abhorrent pro billionaire politics

1116
00:58:13,440 --> 00:58:16,040
Speaker 2: are to the democratic to the population at large, but

1117
00:58:16,080 --> 00:58:18,240
Speaker 2: certainly in the Democratic Party are at this point. I

1118
00:58:18,240 --> 00:58:20,880
Speaker 2: think that's a very good example. But you know, if

1119
00:58:20,920 --> 00:58:23,479
Speaker 2: I could actually answer a little bit of Griffin's question here,

1120
00:58:23,680 --> 00:58:26,440
Speaker 2: I don't think that Silicon Valley ever stopped playing both sides.

1121
00:58:26,720 --> 00:58:28,720
Speaker 2: You know, it's not like they abandoned giving money to

1122
00:58:28,760 --> 00:58:31,440
Speaker 2: the Democratic Party, and Gavin Newsom's perfect example of that.

1123
00:58:32,280 --> 00:58:34,640
Speaker 2: But you know, also the Abundance Movement is very much

1124
00:58:34,640 --> 00:58:37,360
Speaker 2: funded by these guys, and I think that's their entree

1125
00:58:37,400 --> 00:58:39,400
Speaker 2: into Okay, how do we keep our relevance and how

1126
00:58:39,440 --> 00:58:41,720
Speaker 2: do we make sure we've still got a hand on

1127
00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:44,120
Speaker 2: what's going on with these people. So it's going to

1128
00:58:44,160 --> 00:58:47,000
Speaker 2: be a real choice I think going forward for party

1129
00:58:47,080 --> 00:58:50,960
Speaker 2: voters to understand the differences. And I think, and you

1130
00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:53,280
Speaker 2: can tell me if you think this is true. Elon's

1131
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:55,800
Speaker 2: mad about what you said about usaid. He's mad because

1132
00:58:55,840 --> 00:58:59,080
Speaker 2: it's true. He's mad because he knows how disgusting it

1133
00:58:59,160 --> 00:59:01,440
Speaker 2: is to people the op of the world's first trillionaire

1134
00:59:01,520 --> 00:59:05,120
Speaker 2: and world's rich just man, you know, stealing literally like

1135
00:59:05,600 --> 00:59:09,080
Speaker 2: the life force of some of the poorest people in

1136
00:59:09,120 --> 00:59:11,080
Speaker 2: the world and ripping away from them some of the

1137
00:59:11,080 --> 00:59:13,560
Speaker 2: basic needs that they have. He understands that that doesn't

1138
00:59:13,560 --> 00:59:15,880
Speaker 2: look great. But he's also mad at you because you

1139
00:59:15,960 --> 00:59:17,680
Speaker 2: have been a leading voice in terms of saying, hey,

1140
00:59:17,680 --> 00:59:20,080
Speaker 2: maybe we should tax these guys, Hey maybe we shouldn't

1141
00:59:20,120 --> 00:59:23,440
Speaker 2: have trillionaires. Maybe that doesn't Maybe we can't have a

1142
00:59:23,440 --> 00:59:26,560
Speaker 2: democracy and actually have that level of wealth. And I

1143
00:59:26,560 --> 00:59:28,480
Speaker 2: think that's exactly what a lot of people are waking

1144
00:59:28,560 --> 00:59:29,600
Speaker 2: up to right now.

1145
00:59:30,560 --> 00:59:34,640
Speaker 6: Yeah. And on that point, if twenty twenty nine comes

1146
00:59:34,640 --> 00:59:37,600
Speaker 6: and Democrats have come back into power, are we on

1147
00:59:37,720 --> 00:59:40,680
Speaker 6: track to get to a place where they can actually

1148
00:59:40,760 --> 00:59:44,560
Speaker 6: implement a wealth tax? Is it getting enough energy within

1149
00:59:45,040 --> 00:59:48,960
Speaker 6: democratic circles? Because if it's the push for it can't

1150
00:59:48,960 --> 00:59:52,400
Speaker 6: really start then like it's gotta it's gotta be happening now.

1151
00:59:52,960 --> 00:59:53,480
Speaker 10: So that's it.

1152
00:59:54,720 --> 00:59:57,000
Speaker 12: Yeah, I mean, that's why this fighting California is so

1153
00:59:57,040 --> 01:00:00,320
Speaker 12: important em raids. You know, California started the anti tax

1154
01:00:00,360 --> 01:00:03,160
Speaker 12: moment with Prop thirteen in nineteen seventy eight, that leads

1155
01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:06,080
Speaker 12: to Reagan winning in nineteen eighty. We can get the

1156
01:00:06,120 --> 01:00:10,280
Speaker 12: five percent tax in California in twenty twenty six, that

1157
01:00:10,320 --> 01:00:13,040
Speaker 12: could lead to that nationally in twenty twenty eight.

1158
01:00:13,480 --> 01:00:15,040
Speaker 10: And you really have.

1159
01:00:16,440 --> 01:00:20,880
Speaker 12: You know, the SEIU United Health Career Workers West supporting it.

1160
01:00:21,040 --> 01:00:24,480
Speaker 12: I'm one of the leading voices for it. And then

1161
01:00:24,480 --> 01:00:27,760
Speaker 12: you have the governor leading the opposition against it, not

1162
01:00:27,960 --> 01:00:31,960
Speaker 12: just saying okay, I'm neutral and let this play out.

1163
01:00:32,000 --> 01:00:35,640
Speaker 12: He's literally out there trying to kill the ballot measures.

1164
01:00:35,680 --> 01:00:39,400
Speaker 12: So we need to win this fight, and we need

1165
01:00:39,440 --> 01:00:42,720
Speaker 12: to start to get more people on board, because then

1166
01:00:42,720 --> 01:00:44,240
Speaker 12: it's going to be a fight in the Supreme Court.

1167
01:00:44,280 --> 01:00:47,440
Speaker 12: I personally believe the sixteenth Amendment makes it constitutional, but

1168
01:00:47,520 --> 01:00:50,720
Speaker 12: we should not be naive that it won't be a

1169
01:00:50,760 --> 01:00:52,120
Speaker 12: fight in the Supreme Court.

1170
01:00:52,320 --> 01:00:53,080
Speaker 10: But the first thing we.

1171
01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:55,680
Speaker 12: Got to do is get the get our own party

1172
01:00:55,720 --> 01:00:58,680
Speaker 12: on board and not fall for these gimmicks. You know, Okay,

1173
01:00:58,720 --> 01:01:01,360
Speaker 12: I'm for a billionaire tax, but it's not really a

1174
01:01:01,400 --> 01:01:04,560
Speaker 12: billionaire's tax. It's really just a tax, and they're borrowing,

1175
01:01:04,600 --> 01:01:06,960
Speaker 12: which is going to raise a fraction of the revenue.

1176
01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:10,000
Speaker 12: I mean, these people are really clever and they're trying

1177
01:01:10,160 --> 01:01:14,320
Speaker 12: every means to preserve their wealth. But you know, Elon,

1178
01:01:14,560 --> 01:01:16,840
Speaker 12: that is his fundamental problem. And it's not just that

1179
01:01:16,920 --> 01:01:20,000
Speaker 12: he cares about the wealth, though he does.

1180
01:01:20,040 --> 01:01:21,160
Speaker 10: He cares and control.

1181
01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:24,840
Speaker 12: He doesn't like the fact that I'm calling him out

1182
01:01:24,880 --> 01:01:27,960
Speaker 12: and calling these billionaires out is being sort of part

1183
01:01:28,000 --> 01:01:30,960
Speaker 12: of a broken social contract. But the reality of how

1184
01:01:31,000 --> 01:01:32,960
Speaker 12: you know what's broken is you go around the country

1185
01:01:33,000 --> 01:01:35,680
Speaker 12: and you say, okay, Elon Musk has become a trillionaire,

1186
01:01:36,240 --> 01:01:39,000
Speaker 12: and I hear booze right from the audience. It's not

1187
01:01:39,040 --> 01:01:40,800
Speaker 12: even I'm not even saying anything. I'm not saying you

1188
01:01:40,840 --> 01:01:42,560
Speaker 12: did anything wrong. It just said and did you hear

1189
01:01:42,600 --> 01:01:44,720
Speaker 12: Elon Musk became a trillionaire? Sort of the setup to

1190
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:47,040
Speaker 12: what I'm going to say, and the audience starts booing.

1191
01:01:47,080 --> 01:01:50,480
Speaker 12: They started booing at the team stirs. You know Trump

1192
01:01:50,560 --> 01:01:53,400
Speaker 12: voters in there, and that should tell you something, right,

1193
01:01:53,440 --> 01:01:55,880
Speaker 12: I mean, I'm not sure there are other times, you know,

1194
01:01:56,240 --> 01:01:58,160
Speaker 12: in our history where people have done these things and

1195
01:01:58,160 --> 01:02:01,440
Speaker 12: they're just reflexibly hated. If there was much more shared

1196
01:02:01,440 --> 01:02:04,600
Speaker 12: prosperity in this country, you wouldn't have that same reaction.

1197
01:02:05,000 --> 01:02:07,280
Speaker 12: But you have all this wealth being accumulated. Well, people

1198
01:02:07,280 --> 01:02:10,040
Speaker 12: can't buy a house, can't have childcare, can't have healthcare.

1199
01:02:10,720 --> 01:02:12,560
Speaker 12: And this, to me is going to be the central

1200
01:02:12,640 --> 01:02:17,440
Speaker 12: fight for the Democratic Party. Two central fights gaza and genocide.

1201
01:02:17,440 --> 01:02:19,800
Speaker 12: Are you going to really take it on? And are

1202
01:02:19,800 --> 01:02:22,120
Speaker 12: you really going to take on the billionaires and trillionaires

1203
01:02:22,200 --> 01:02:26,040
Speaker 12: or are you going to mouth the focus group tested

1204
01:02:26,080 --> 01:02:28,840
Speaker 12: stuff because we all know that it's affordability and we

1205
01:02:28,880 --> 01:02:30,680
Speaker 12: all know people want to hire a tax on the bridge,

1206
01:02:30,680 --> 01:02:32,680
Speaker 12: and we all know that people don't like Israel are

1207
01:02:34,160 --> 01:02:37,520
Speaker 12: malth enough to get by, But then when you get in,

1208
01:02:38,120 --> 01:02:39,720
Speaker 12: you really haven't taken the actual fight.

1209
01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:43,080
Speaker 10: So there's no structural check and that's really the question.

1210
01:02:44,080 --> 01:02:45,840
Speaker 2: One last thing that I would just add to that,

1211
01:02:45,960 --> 01:02:48,720
Speaker 2: in terms of the billionaire's right wing turn, I think

1212
01:02:48,720 --> 01:02:52,040
Speaker 2: this is sort of inevitable because you know, the moment

1213
01:02:52,080 --> 01:02:55,439
Speaker 2: of immense inequality that is only set to skyrocket more

1214
01:02:55,440 --> 01:02:56,600
Speaker 2: with the advances of AI.

1215
01:02:57,040 --> 01:02:58,280
Speaker 5: There's really two directions.

1216
01:02:58,320 --> 01:03:01,040
Speaker 2: One is that you do bring the oligarchs to heal

1217
01:03:01,360 --> 01:03:03,680
Speaker 2: so you can have a democratic society so that the

1218
01:03:03,720 --> 01:03:06,160
Speaker 2: you know, abundance that we already enjoy if it was

1219
01:03:06,200 --> 01:03:08,840
Speaker 2: even you know, distributed not evenly, but in some sort

1220
01:03:08,880 --> 01:03:11,560
Speaker 2: of a relatively equitable way where people are able to

1221
01:03:11,600 --> 01:03:14,960
Speaker 2: live and survive. You can either go in that direction

1222
01:03:15,320 --> 01:03:17,760
Speaker 2: of taxing the oligarchs, or you can go in the

1223
01:03:17,800 --> 01:03:21,200
Speaker 2: scapegoat direction, which is you know, the right wing fascist

1224
01:03:21,720 --> 01:03:23,920
Speaker 2: rise that we've seen here and around the world of

1225
01:03:23,960 --> 01:03:26,760
Speaker 2: it's the immigrants fault, it's the transperson fault, right, it's

1226
01:03:26,840 --> 01:03:29,880
Speaker 2: the you know, pitting people against each other. And so

1227
01:03:29,960 --> 01:03:33,320
Speaker 2: in order for these billionaires to avoid scrutiny on themselves

1228
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:36,960
Speaker 2: and the possibility of their own wealth being taxed at

1229
01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:40,880
Speaker 2: some you know, reasonable level. The most obvious direction for

1230
01:03:40,920 --> 01:03:43,080
Speaker 2: them to go in is, you know, to start inciting

1231
01:03:43,160 --> 01:03:47,200
Speaker 2: race riots, as Elon has become wont to do with

1232
01:03:47,320 --> 01:03:50,840
Speaker 2: the social media platform that he purchased. So in a sense,

1233
01:03:50,880 --> 01:03:52,560
Speaker 2: I think that this right wing turn is is sort

1234
01:03:52,600 --> 01:03:53,240
Speaker 2: of inevitable.

1235
01:03:55,120 --> 01:03:59,400
Speaker 12: Yeah, I think you're absolutely right, because they fundamentally are

1236
01:03:59,560 --> 01:04:02,800
Speaker 12: about protecting their their their their capital.

1237
01:04:03,280 --> 01:04:03,400
Speaker 13: Uh.

1238
01:04:03,640 --> 01:04:07,560
Speaker 12: And they were fine with it when the Democratic Party

1239
01:04:08,400 --> 01:04:12,640
Speaker 12: was a party focused on women's rights, focused on immigrant rights,

1240
01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:15,080
Speaker 12: focused on voting rights.

1241
01:04:15,360 --> 01:04:16,560
Speaker 10: But now that the.

1242
01:04:16,480 --> 01:04:22,080
Speaker 12: Party is also focused fundamentally on economic uh, inequality and

1243
01:04:22,160 --> 01:04:26,600
Speaker 12: going after the capital class, they are much more uncomfortable

1244
01:04:26,640 --> 01:04:28,720
Speaker 12: with the with the Democratic Party. I mean they are

1245
01:04:28,760 --> 01:04:31,120
Speaker 12: not They don't want it to be an FDR party.

1246
01:04:31,160 --> 01:04:35,280
Speaker 12: I mean, they wanted to be a party like Clinton

1247
01:04:36,000 --> 01:04:38,880
Speaker 12: focused on the social issues, which is not to discount

1248
01:04:38,920 --> 01:04:41,960
Speaker 12: the social issues. Those social issues matter, but it is

1249
01:04:42,000 --> 01:04:45,120
Speaker 12: the economic issues that they find threat.

1250
01:04:45,880 --> 01:04:48,240
Speaker 4: All right, Congressman, thank you for your time. We hope

1251
01:04:48,240 --> 01:04:51,000
Speaker 4: Elon sees this interview and gets so triggered that we

1252
01:04:51,040 --> 01:04:54,280
Speaker 4: are the next pin tweet on his Twitter.

1253
01:04:53,960 --> 01:04:56,520
Speaker 12: Account or you may get soon. Are you set up?

1254
01:04:56,560 --> 01:04:57,480
Speaker 12: Are you ready for that?

1255
01:04:58,360 --> 01:05:02,040
Speaker 4: We're hoping for just the pin before a lawsuit.

1256
01:05:02,240 --> 01:05:05,680
Speaker 2: Oh sorry, really quickly, just any sign that he's actually

1257
01:05:05,760 --> 01:05:07,720
Speaker 2: suing you ro and are.

1258
01:05:07,600 --> 01:05:12,280
Speaker 12: You He's made threats before with journalists and he hasn't

1259
01:05:12,280 --> 01:05:14,600
Speaker 12: followed through, and he has followed through with the German

1260
01:05:14,640 --> 01:05:16,800
Speaker 12: government and others, so you know, I.

1261
01:05:16,720 --> 01:05:18,840
Speaker 6: Mean he's also he also sues suit a lot of

1262
01:05:18,920 --> 01:05:22,560
Speaker 6: people at media matters and is continuing to sue them.

1263
01:05:23,360 --> 01:05:25,600
Speaker 10: So you know, it could be either way. I mean,

1264
01:05:25,640 --> 01:05:27,000
Speaker 10: I uh, he is.

1265
01:05:27,120 --> 01:05:30,560
Speaker 12: It just depends on what mood he is in and

1266
01:05:30,560 --> 01:05:33,360
Speaker 12: and you know, but it wasn't just his Whether he

1267
01:05:33,400 --> 01:05:36,120
Speaker 12: sues me, of course that matters to me personally and

1268
01:05:36,120 --> 01:05:39,640
Speaker 12: how much headache it'll be though it'll also obviously give

1269
01:05:39,680 --> 01:05:42,600
Speaker 12: me the chance for discovery in Dolge, which is uh,

1270
01:05:42,720 --> 01:05:46,280
Speaker 12: which which I don't know if he's fully realized.

1271
01:05:46,440 --> 01:05:46,920
Speaker 6: Interesting.

1272
01:05:47,400 --> 01:05:50,240
Speaker 12: But the bigger issue is he's sending a message to

1273
01:05:50,280 --> 01:05:51,920
Speaker 12: everyone on that overside committee.

1274
01:05:52,080 --> 01:05:54,400
Speaker 10: Look, you come after me. I'm going to come after you.

1275
01:05:54,960 --> 01:05:56,800
Speaker 12: It's not just that I have more than one vote

1276
01:05:56,840 --> 01:05:59,000
Speaker 12: and I get millions of dollars and I could spend

1277
01:05:59,200 --> 01:06:02,720
Speaker 12: five million dollars against your race. I can actually tie

1278
01:06:02,760 --> 01:06:05,960
Speaker 12: you up in court for years and spend unlimited money

1279
01:06:05,960 --> 01:06:08,040
Speaker 12: against you. So you know what, why don't you just

1280
01:06:08,160 --> 01:06:10,480
Speaker 12: focus on a hundred other things you have to do

1281
01:06:10,480 --> 01:06:12,440
Speaker 12: as a member of Congress and leave me alone, Like

1282
01:06:13,080 --> 01:06:15,480
Speaker 12: go refund the USA, but don't subpoena.

1283
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:18,320
Speaker 10: I mean, it's not worth your time, not worth your headache. Right,

1284
01:06:18,360 --> 01:06:19,120
Speaker 10: that's the message.

1285
01:06:19,480 --> 01:06:22,080
Speaker 2: The headline we need row is Rocana to Elon Musk.

1286
01:06:22,200 --> 01:06:22,640
Speaker 5: Bring it on.

1287
01:06:24,440 --> 01:06:26,480
Speaker 10: That's what I said. I'm not going to be intimidated,

1288
01:06:26,920 --> 01:06:27,160
Speaker 10: you know.

1289
01:06:27,680 --> 01:06:31,320
Speaker 12: It's uh that that that's but that's that's what we need.

1290
01:06:31,480 --> 01:06:33,400
Speaker 12: That's that's where I think we've got to fight. I

1291
01:06:33,640 --> 01:06:36,120
Speaker 12: wish we had a Democratic party, but where we've got

1292
01:06:36,160 --> 01:06:38,520
Speaker 12: other people saying, yeah, bring it on, sue me too,

1293
01:06:38,600 --> 01:06:40,520
Speaker 12: sue me too, Right, I mean we've got to show

1294
01:06:41,240 --> 01:06:45,000
Speaker 12: actual fight where there's where there's some risk, where there's

1295
01:06:45,000 --> 01:06:49,120
Speaker 12: some inconvenience, and that uh, because that's what the activists

1296
01:06:49,120 --> 01:06:51,000
Speaker 12: are doing every day, Right, They're going out to pro

1297
01:06:51,240 --> 01:06:56,800
Speaker 12: they're getting arrested, they're uh putting their careers on at risk.

1298
01:06:57,280 --> 01:07:01,040
Speaker 12: And I think that's that's really where what they want

1299
01:07:01,120 --> 01:07:04,720
Speaker 12: to see from elected officials is some actual risks, some

1300
01:07:04,880 --> 01:07:07,480
Speaker 12: skin in the game, and we saw that with those

1301
01:07:07,480 --> 01:07:08,240
Speaker 12: candidates who won.

1302
01:07:08,200 --> 01:07:08,720
Speaker 10: In New York.

1303
01:07:09,560 --> 01:07:14,120
Speaker 4: All right, well they can't sue us all. Congressman Rocanna,

1304
01:07:14,240 --> 01:07:16,280
Speaker 4: thank you much for your time and we'll see you soon.

1305
01:07:16,840 --> 01:07:19,360
Speaker 10: Thank you, guys, appreciate you all.

1306
01:07:19,480 --> 01:07:22,400
Speaker 4: Right now, time for a little bit of AMA, and

1307
01:07:22,480 --> 01:07:25,640
Speaker 4: of course, if you're a new subscriber, you can submit

1308
01:07:25,680 --> 01:07:28,640
Speaker 4: written questions for the Friday AMA at the link in

1309
01:07:28,760 --> 01:07:32,600
Speaker 4: every Daily show email. With that, let's get to our

1310
01:07:32,600 --> 01:07:36,120
Speaker 4: first question. Some reactions to Ryan on the streets of

1311
01:07:36,240 --> 01:07:40,800
Speaker 4: NYC for the DSA elections. Here, let's start with this

1312
01:07:40,840 --> 01:07:44,840
Speaker 4: one from sebas one oh one for amazing BP. With

1313
01:07:44,960 --> 01:07:47,440
Speaker 4: the deaf cult nature of the Israel government threats of

1314
01:07:47,520 --> 01:07:49,480
Speaker 4: using nuclear weapons in the US and in the region,

1315
01:07:49,680 --> 01:07:52,640
Speaker 4: should we do what the older gentleman from Ryan's great

1316
01:07:52,680 --> 01:07:56,240
Speaker 4: interview at NYC said and bomb them, making the region

1317
01:07:56,280 --> 01:07:59,000
Speaker 4: a true nuclear weapons free zone and protecting ourselves from

1318
01:07:59,040 --> 01:08:03,280
Speaker 4: their threats. If you that clip, Ryan was around a

1319
01:08:03,320 --> 01:08:08,200
Speaker 4: group of Spayat voters up in Harlem and he spoke

1320
01:08:08,360 --> 01:08:11,439
Speaker 4: to one older gentleman who I believe was reacting to

1321
01:08:12,160 --> 01:08:16,960
Speaker 4: pro Palestine protesters and sort of sarcastically said, if you

1322
01:08:17,000 --> 01:08:19,320
Speaker 4: want to stop the genocide, bomb Israel.

1323
01:08:20,680 --> 01:08:25,360
Speaker 6: Funny. A funny coda to that interaction is that the

1324
01:08:25,400 --> 01:08:27,120
Speaker 6: next day somebody was like, by the way, you know

1325
01:08:27,120 --> 01:08:31,040
Speaker 6: who that was. That was Larry Seabrook, And I looked up, Yes,

1326
01:08:31,080 --> 01:08:35,080
Speaker 6: that was Larry Seabrook. Larry Seabrook was a state representative,

1327
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:38,880
Speaker 6: state assemblyman, and a city councilman in the city in New.

1328
01:08:38,800 --> 01:08:43,920
Speaker 14: York who went to prison from the prison yep, because really,

1329
01:08:44,640 --> 01:08:48,800
Speaker 14: because he was setting up all of these fake nonprofits

1330
01:08:48,840 --> 01:08:53,120
Speaker 14: in Harlem and then appropriating money from the city to

1331
01:08:53,479 --> 01:08:56,520
Speaker 14: those nonprofits, and then she's keeping the money for himself

1332
01:08:56,560 --> 01:08:57,559
Speaker 14: and his friends and family.

1333
01:08:57,840 --> 01:09:00,320
Speaker 6: So in like twenty thirteen, he got sent to like

1334
01:09:00,320 --> 01:09:03,040
Speaker 6: five years in federal prison for corruption.

1335
01:09:03,120 --> 01:09:05,680
Speaker 7: I'd ask you he's going to do this guy's do

1336
01:09:06,120 --> 01:09:06,400
Speaker 7: you know?

1337
01:09:07,200 --> 01:09:09,400
Speaker 6: Spat like, what's your history with him? He's like, I've

1338
01:09:09,400 --> 01:09:11,479
Speaker 6: none of the decades. I was like, what any good stories?

1339
01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:15,160
Speaker 6: He's like, doesn't matter with me, I I doesn't. It

1340
01:09:15,160 --> 01:09:17,240
Speaker 6: doesn't really matter. It's about It's about him. He's a

1341
01:09:17,280 --> 01:09:20,559
Speaker 6: fighter for the people. Ironically, in twenty twenty one, when

1342
01:09:20,560 --> 01:09:23,599
Speaker 6: Mom Donnie was an assembly they restored fell in voter rights.

1343
01:09:24,240 --> 01:09:26,960
Speaker 6: Uh so, I believe he would be able to vote

1344
01:09:27,640 --> 01:09:28,759
Speaker 6: thanks to mom Donnie.

1345
01:09:29,280 --> 01:09:29,920
Speaker 1: But yeah, so.

1346
01:09:29,840 --> 01:09:32,640
Speaker 2: He's so the bomb Israel guy is prosed.

1347
01:09:32,200 --> 01:09:37,080
Speaker 6: By it hardcore. He's an Spaiot machine. Yeah nice, he was.

1348
01:09:37,200 --> 01:09:39,720
Speaker 6: I don't not profit product that he was making, but

1349
01:09:40,080 --> 01:09:44,759
Speaker 6: I mean amazing. Yeah, Like, hopefully Israel will just listen

1350
01:09:45,120 --> 01:09:46,639
Speaker 6: to the United States and doesn't.

1351
01:09:46,840 --> 01:09:49,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's I don't think it's really necessary. How about

1352
01:09:49,600 --> 01:09:54,200
Speaker 2: we just try not funding their genocidal actions anymore, not

1353
01:09:54,400 --> 01:09:57,840
Speaker 2: sending the weapons to do their crimes, and forcing them

1354
01:09:57,840 --> 01:10:01,040
Speaker 2: to act like a normal nation that has to amongst

1355
01:10:01,040 --> 01:10:04,160
Speaker 2: their neighbors and not constantly wage war against every way.

1356
01:10:04,160 --> 01:10:05,480
Speaker 5: You should try that first.

1357
01:10:05,479 --> 01:10:08,080
Speaker 6: And if not, then then I wouldn't want the US

1358
01:10:08,120 --> 01:10:09,240
Speaker 6: to do it alone. I think you would need a

1359
01:10:09,320 --> 01:10:13,160
Speaker 6: UN mandate, and then I think UN peacekeepers would I

1360
01:10:13,160 --> 01:10:14,120
Speaker 6: think be appropriate.

1361
01:10:14,680 --> 01:10:17,599
Speaker 2: A lot of tools in you get here, Yeah, sanctions regime,

1362
01:10:17,760 --> 01:10:20,519
Speaker 2: like I think all of that is uh is before

1363
01:10:20,560 --> 01:10:23,440
Speaker 2: we get to going to war with them, in my opinion.

1364
01:10:23,160 --> 01:10:27,759
Speaker 4: Yes, So next question for Crystal here from Jasmine Crystal,

1365
01:10:27,800 --> 01:10:31,120
Speaker 4: I'm genuinely curious is how you view slus withstand all

1366
01:10:31,160 --> 01:10:35,519
Speaker 4: the misogynist vitriol directed towards you on social media. While

1367
01:10:35,600 --> 01:10:38,439
Speaker 4: Ryan gets some hate online, the tenor of comments is

1368
01:10:38,439 --> 01:10:42,280
Speaker 4: on a totally different scale. Seems like the troll's biggest

1369
01:10:42,320 --> 01:10:45,479
Speaker 4: trigger is okay, this is their words, A hot leftist

1370
01:10:45,520 --> 01:10:49,120
Speaker 4: woman with strong opinions and insightful analysis.

1371
01:10:50,160 --> 01:10:54,640
Speaker 2: Stay triggered. I honestly, I'm a little bit oblivious. I

1372
01:10:54,720 --> 01:10:57,240
Speaker 2: just don't really look that much at the replies and

1373
01:10:57,320 --> 01:11:00,400
Speaker 2: the comments, and I have developed a thicker skin now

1374
01:11:00,400 --> 01:11:02,680
Speaker 2: where it just doesn't really bother me, you know, when

1375
01:11:02,720 --> 01:11:05,519
Speaker 2: you've done this for And sometimes I'll send things out

1376
01:11:05,560 --> 01:11:08,200
Speaker 2: that I that I know are like kind of going

1377
01:11:08,240 --> 01:11:10,800
Speaker 2: to stir the pot and get a big reaction. And

1378
01:11:10,840 --> 01:11:12,479
Speaker 2: one of my favorite things to do is just sort

1379
01:11:12,479 --> 01:11:15,040
Speaker 2: of like drop that bomb and then go away and

1380
01:11:15,080 --> 01:11:17,840
Speaker 2: not really pay attention of what happens in the aftermath.

1381
01:11:17,960 --> 01:11:20,840
Speaker 2: So that's how I handle it. It's uh, it's it

1382
01:11:20,960 --> 01:11:21,559
Speaker 2: is what it is.

1383
01:11:22,560 --> 01:11:23,759
Speaker 10: Mm hmmm. Okay.

1384
01:11:23,800 --> 01:11:26,559
Speaker 4: And one last quick fun one because we're about to

1385
01:11:26,600 --> 01:11:31,120
Speaker 4: run out of time. This is from Matthew c Ryan.

1386
01:11:31,840 --> 01:11:34,560
Speaker 4: How did you first meet Crystal and Sagar and what

1387
01:11:34,680 --> 01:11:39,120
Speaker 4: surprised you the most about them? After working together whit

1388
01:11:39,280 --> 01:11:39,559
Speaker 4: I did.

1389
01:11:39,560 --> 01:11:42,240
Speaker 5: We've I don't remember when we first met, right, I don't.

1390
01:11:42,200 --> 01:11:44,800
Speaker 6: Think that we interacted. When you ran for Congress, I

1391
01:11:44,840 --> 01:11:47,639
Speaker 6: covered the race, but I don't remember if I interviewed

1392
01:11:47,640 --> 01:11:50,480
Speaker 6: you or not. And then I remember when you launched

1393
01:11:50,840 --> 01:11:53,600
Speaker 6: the I mean, and I did the five or the

1394
01:11:53,600 --> 01:11:55,240
Speaker 6: cycle or whatever the cycle.

1395
01:11:56,920 --> 01:12:00,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, so we definitely met it in MSNBC context then.

1396
01:12:00,439 --> 01:12:02,720
Speaker 6: But then I remember you reached out when you were

1397
01:12:02,760 --> 01:12:04,920
Speaker 6: launching the Working Class of.

1398
01:12:05,000 --> 01:12:06,120
Speaker 5: The People's House Project.

1399
01:12:06,600 --> 01:12:10,559
Speaker 6: Yeah, and then and there, and there were several candidates

1400
01:12:10,560 --> 01:12:13,439
Speaker 6: that you Johanna Hayes, I think you were working with

1401
01:12:13,640 --> 01:12:14,720
Speaker 6: Richard of Jeta.

1402
01:12:16,000 --> 01:12:16,200
Speaker 9: J D.

1403
01:12:16,280 --> 01:12:16,679
Speaker 5: Shulten.

1404
01:12:16,920 --> 01:12:19,320
Speaker 6: You have such a good memory. She was such a cool,

1405
01:12:19,520 --> 01:12:23,760
Speaker 6: interesting candidate, j D. Shulten. And and I think you

1406
01:12:23,800 --> 01:12:27,240
Speaker 6: also flagged that the D Triple C was actively working

1407
01:12:27,240 --> 01:12:31,200
Speaker 6: against a bunch of them, and that was so. And

1408
01:12:31,240 --> 01:12:33,599
Speaker 6: then we've basically been in touch since then, right.

1409
01:12:33,640 --> 01:12:36,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I would say that's that's my recollection as well.

1410
01:12:36,960 --> 01:12:39,679
Speaker 2: And then you met Sager just through the context of Rising,

1411
01:12:39,760 --> 01:12:44,280
Speaker 2: right right, yeah, same, which is how I met Sager too.

1412
01:12:45,200 --> 01:12:48,439
Speaker 2: People who uh maybe don't know all the lore Rising

1413
01:12:48,479 --> 01:12:51,960
Speaker 2: originally launched me and Buck Sexton and uh, but they

1414
01:12:51,960 --> 01:12:53,479
Speaker 2: wouldn't let us have a YouTube channel.

1415
01:12:53,520 --> 01:12:54,160
Speaker 5: It was crazy.

1416
01:12:54,200 --> 01:12:57,759
Speaker 2: Anyway, it was kind of a mess, that whole Hill organization,

1417
01:12:57,920 --> 01:13:00,320
Speaker 2: total mess. That's like you could write a book about

1418
01:13:00,360 --> 01:13:03,640
Speaker 2: all the things that happened there. Anyway, Buck was going

1419
01:13:03,680 --> 01:13:06,720
Speaker 2: to leave, and Sager had filled in for him a

1420
01:13:06,720 --> 01:13:08,720
Speaker 2: couple of times because they knew each other, and so

1421
01:13:08,800 --> 01:13:10,840
Speaker 2: Sager was the person that I wanted to come in

1422
01:13:10,880 --> 01:13:14,679
Speaker 2: because I thought we had an interesting an unusual dynamic

1423
01:13:14,800 --> 01:13:17,480
Speaker 2: in terms of where we agreed and where we disagreed.

1424
01:13:17,760 --> 01:13:19,880
Speaker 5: And my vision was always.

1425
01:13:19,960 --> 01:13:23,880
Speaker 2: To have this like, Okay, what's the best faith version

1426
01:13:23,960 --> 01:13:27,800
Speaker 2: of trump Ism? Like what's the most honest, intellectual, like

1427
01:13:28,400 --> 01:13:31,479
Speaker 2: truth centric version of trump Ism? What if we had

1428
01:13:31,520 --> 01:13:33,479
Speaker 2: a show where you're like working with that, and then

1429
01:13:33,520 --> 01:13:35,640
Speaker 2: you've got the burning wing, which of course is completely

1430
01:13:35,800 --> 01:13:39,800
Speaker 2: unrepresented continues to this day to be basically wholly unrepresented

1431
01:13:40,200 --> 01:13:43,240
Speaker 2: in mainstream press. What does that dialogue look like? Because

1432
01:13:43,280 --> 01:13:44,960
Speaker 2: it's not being modeled anywhere else. And I think this

1433
01:13:45,000 --> 01:13:47,000
Speaker 2: show's evolved a lot from that time, you know, as

1434
01:13:47,080 --> 01:13:49,680
Speaker 2: events have changed all of our political views and you know,

1435
01:13:49,760 --> 01:13:51,960
Speaker 2: et cetera. But that was kind of the original the

1436
01:13:52,000 --> 01:13:54,759
Speaker 2: original conception of what we were going to do there.

1437
01:13:56,160 --> 01:13:56,719
Speaker 7: Very nice.

1438
01:13:57,240 --> 01:13:59,960
Speaker 4: Well with that, That'll do it for this Friday show

1439
01:13:59,720 --> 01:14:02,600
Speaker 4: and we will see you all on Monday.

1440
01:14:02,800 --> 01:14:03,439
Speaker 6: Stay tuned.

1441
01:14:03,439 --> 01:14:03,840
Speaker 10: Bye bye,