Speaker 1: It used to be accepted that you left your life
Speaker 1: at home when you got to the office, but that's changing.
Speaker 1: We're going to talk about the sensitive, uncomfortable, or even
Speaker 1: just playing private things that seep into our work lives,
Speaker 1: and whether workplace etiquette can catch up or whether it
Speaker 1: even should. This is game plan. Hi, I'm Francesca Levi
Speaker 1: and I'm Rebecca Greenfield, and today we are going to
Speaker 1: talk about all of the things it's really hard to
Speaker 1: talk about at work. Yeah, And what first got us
Speaker 1: thinking about this was politics. Um, these days, with so
Speaker 1: much news and u divisive president, it seems like people
Speaker 1: cannot stop talking about politics in the office. Yeah. It's
Speaker 1: it's pretty undeniable that politics or even talking about how
Speaker 1: to talk about politics is just like it's in the
Speaker 1: air right now. You had a story on this shortly
Speaker 1: after the election. Yeah, I wrote a story about how
Speaker 1: employees that companies are asking their bosses to be more
Speaker 1: political or getting mad at their bosses for being too
Speaker 1: political in the wrong ways. So companies like can't win
Speaker 1: really if they make any comment or make no comment
Speaker 1: on what President Donald Trump is doing, and employees are
Speaker 1: quitting or petitioning or organizing against their bosses, which is
Speaker 1: something that is unprecedented. Yeah, your story was interesting to
Speaker 1: me because it's we often hear about like whether it's
Speaker 1: okay to talk about politics at work or whether your
Speaker 1: individual views have any place in the office. But this
Speaker 1: was employees going one step further and saying, not only
Speaker 1: do I want to talk about it at work, but
Speaker 1: I want my boss to have a stand on this. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And then the bosses were kind of struggling to figure
Speaker 1: out the right place to land in the way they
Speaker 1: never really had to think about it before. Yeah, nobody
Speaker 1: knows exactly how to handle this stuff. I think that's
Speaker 1: part of the problem. It's coming up more, but there
Speaker 1: are no really rules for it. And another story that
Speaker 1: our colleague Dinashenka wrote exemplifies that she she reported on
Speaker 1: a study that showed that people were talking more about
Speaker 1: politics at work, and some of them, we're getting really
Speaker 1: anxious about it, like all this politics talk was just
Speaker 1: driving them a little bit crazy. And then others felt
Speaker 1: good about it. They felt like talking about politics with
Speaker 1: their colleagues gave them common ground and made them feel
Speaker 1: closer to the people that they worked with. So it's
Speaker 1: like no one can agree on whether this is okay
Speaker 1: or not or how we should do it, and the
Speaker 1: anxious people are still doing it. It sounds like from
Speaker 1: the studies there's an element of like not being able
Speaker 1: to look away. Yeah. Another thing that comes up more
Speaker 1: in the office, whether we like it or not, is
Speaker 1: just our personal lives. I feel like, even if you
Speaker 1: aren't a big oversharer, social media is going to do
Speaker 1: the work of oversharing for you. And you don't know
Speaker 1: if you're supposed to what you're supposed to tell your
Speaker 1: coworkers and not, and what they kind of already know
Speaker 1: from your Facebook life anyway, or your Instagram life anyway.
Speaker 1: And it's just like this, I don't want to do
Speaker 1: it personally, but it just happens. Keeping your colleagues out
Speaker 1: of your expression of yourself in various social media platforms
Speaker 1: is it feels to me like a losing battle that
Speaker 1: I have just given up on. There was a time
Speaker 1: when I was like, I will never be friends on
Speaker 1: Facebook with anybody I work with, and that's just not
Speaker 1: practical anymore. It's also kind of it's naughty, but that
Speaker 1: means that like, even if I'm not putting really intensely
Speaker 1: personal stuff on Facebook, which I might want to occasionally,
Speaker 1: but even if I'm not doing that, like just liking
Speaker 1: somebody else's post or I don't know if my relationship
Speaker 1: status changed, Like little things you might not think about
Speaker 1: are going to be common knowledge in your office. And
Speaker 1: then as you wonder what you're supposed to say to
Speaker 1: the person at work if you know that they're going
Speaker 1: through this personal thing and you definitely liked their post
Speaker 1: or even commented on it, but you come to the
Speaker 1: office and it's like, well, are we gonna talk about
Speaker 1: your I don't know, family issues. Yeah, people could have
Speaker 1: illnesses and their families. People could have breakups, and there's
Speaker 1: this underlying sort of assumption that everybody knows about it
Speaker 1: without without really getting into it. And some people think
Speaker 1: we should be talking about these things just because I'm
Speaker 1: uncomfortable with it. But for example, Cheryl Sandberg, the CEO
Speaker 1: of Facebook, that is her whole brand, is sharing her
Speaker 1: personal life not like with her coworkers and through her
Speaker 1: platform that she's trying to sell. And when her husband died,
Speaker 1: she was very vocal on Facebook. Um and that's the
Speaker 1: thing that she's trying to sell. And there are a
Speaker 1: lot of companies that think that people should bring their
Speaker 1: whole selves to work, but it's uncomfortable to talk about
Speaker 1: your whole self at work. Yeah. I wonder how that
Speaker 1: works in practice at the Facebook offices, Like do you
Speaker 1: think that they really are bigger into sharing in a
Speaker 1: personal way. I'm sure they're in their heads about it
Speaker 1: if they're anything like me. And there's one issue that
Speaker 1: comes to mind that is is kind of the ultimate
Speaker 1: combination of what's personal and what's political, and it's just
Speaker 1: really difficult to talk about it work. And that's race.
Speaker 1: And even though we understand the importance of talking about this,
Speaker 1: we're not even sure exactly how to go about it. Like,
Speaker 1: I can't say that you and I feel really comfortable
Speaker 1: talking about race in the office as a day to
Speaker 1: day thing. Yeah. Very many people that's the reality of
Speaker 1: their lives, and you and I have the privilege of
Speaker 1: not thinking about it um when we get to work.
Speaker 1: That being said, that doesn't mean that we shouldn't talk
Speaker 1: about it. Like a lot of these things, maybe we
Speaker 1: should have a vocabulary and office etiquette about talking about it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So we reached out to somebody who's literally writing the
Speaker 1: book on this. Idioma Olio is a writer speaker and
Speaker 1: editor at large at the Establishment. She's writing a book
Speaker 1: called So You Want to Talk About Race, which will
Speaker 1: be out in January, and we're happy to have her here.
Speaker 1: I do thanks for having me. So let's just start
Speaker 1: with a big question. Should people talk about race at work? Yes?
Speaker 1: I mean I think it's it's not even a question
Speaker 1: because people are talking about race at work. So I
Speaker 1: think a good question to ask is should we be
Speaker 1: intentionally talking about race at work? And yes, we definitely
Speaker 1: should because right now we talk about race at work
Speaker 1: in many ways, and some of them are more open
Speaker 1: than others, and some are silent. But we're already talking
Speaker 1: about it, and I think the question is whether or
Speaker 1: not we should be more careful and intentional in the
Speaker 1: way in which we do that. I want to get
Speaker 1: out more what you mean by we're already talking about it?
Speaker 1: Can you give some specific examples? I mean, some things
Speaker 1: come to mind for me, but I want to know
Speaker 1: what you're thinking of. Yeah, we already talked about race
Speaker 1: at work. By you know, it's the way in which
Speaker 1: we decide things like our dress code, what we declined
Speaker 1: as professional unprofessional behavior here um, the way in which
Speaker 1: we set up our hiring practices, who gets promote it,
Speaker 1: who doesn't get promoted, who gets a manager's meaning, and
Speaker 1: who isn't you know what sort of rules we put
Speaker 1: down in our HR manuals. We talked about race all
Speaker 1: of the time, and sometimes we talk about it by
Speaker 1: the lack of saying it when we say that we
Speaker 1: are talking about all of our employees, but we're discussing
Speaker 1: things that primarily impact only white employees. We're talking about right,
Speaker 1: you know, when we use cold language to define professionalism,
Speaker 1: to mirror, you know, the way in which white men
Speaker 1: find themselves in the office, we're talking about race. So
Speaker 1: we really are talking about it all of the time.
Speaker 1: We're just we just like to pretend that we're not.
Speaker 1: So how do we become more intentional? As you say
Speaker 1: in talking about it? You know, the primary advice I
Speaker 1: like to give people, especially in our environments, because this
Speaker 1: is an area where you know, the impetus really does
Speaker 1: lie with those in power, is to say who isn't
Speaker 1: in the room? So every discussion that you have at work,
Speaker 1: if you're looking around and the majority of the people
Speaker 1: in the room are the only people in the room
Speaker 1: are people who look just like you. Um, you need
Speaker 1: to realize that you are injecting at one sided racial
Speaker 1: viewpoint into everything you're discussing, even if you don't think
Speaker 1: it has anything to do with race, and you need
Speaker 1: to start asking who else should be in here? So
Speaker 1: I would say, you know, that's something to start investigating.
Speaker 1: Looking around you know, your work, You'll be shocked to
Speaker 1: realize who you work for. You know who gets praised
Speaker 1: and why, who gets promoted, you know who's coming up
Speaker 1: with these company policies all these things. If you ask
Speaker 1: who's not in this room? I think that's a really
Speaker 1: good start, because you're you're not going to know what
Speaker 1: you don't know. And the first things first is you
Speaker 1: have to get the voices that are typically heard a
Speaker 1: space to safely speak. Hearing that as somebody who's not
Speaker 1: particularly high up in the hierarchy. How could I do
Speaker 1: that realistically? You know? Definitely, One thing I would look
Speaker 1: at are things like, you know, even if you just
Speaker 1: you know, feel like, oh, I'm just a team member.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm not I'm not a supervisor, I'm not
Speaker 1: a boss. Is to look at, you know, if you're
Speaker 1: in a group situation and a person of color is
Speaker 1: trying to talk to make sure that space is being
Speaker 1: given for them. You have the privilege of being heard, right,
Speaker 1: and that's a great a great place to make space. Also,
Speaker 1: just you know, to know that you have the safety
Speaker 1: to speak up. And the most it's going to do
Speaker 1: is make things that you look at awkward. But for
Speaker 1: a person of color, speaking up can get them fire. Um,
Speaker 1: So really keep your eyes open and say, you know
Speaker 1: what am I missing here? And so when you talk
Speaker 1: about things like company policy, I remember when I used
Speaker 1: to work, you know and keep a cool land and
Speaker 1: we would you know, talk about things like you know, um,
Speaker 1: child care policies, occasionally time off, you know, we would
Speaker 1: talk about what sort of social events we were going
Speaker 1: to do, and it always struck me how you know,
Speaker 1: it was really what it feels to the majority, and
Speaker 1: the majority was always going to be like But that
Speaker 1: meant that any employees of color always really left out
Speaker 1: of that discussion. And if any even white teammates had
Speaker 1: just said, hey, what do you think, um, it would
Speaker 1: have given more weight to anything that I or anyone
Speaker 1: like me had to say, because otherwise people of color
Speaker 1: are just viewed as you know, always being negative or
Speaker 1: being these slayers and What they really need is support,
Speaker 1: and they need people to realize that if you're only
Speaker 1: hearing from people like you, you're not hearing the whole story.
Speaker 1: One thing that I have noticed when I'm in environments
Speaker 1: where I'm trying to to speak up for let's say,
Speaker 1: issues of women are issues of people of color, is
Speaker 1: that I feel this obligation to try and do it
Speaker 1: in an unemotional way because I don't want my own
Speaker 1: point to be discredited by sounding emotional about it. But
Speaker 1: and I feel like that's a taboo that makes it
Speaker 1: harder for people to talk about these things in the office.
Speaker 1: Is there a way we should be talking about these
Speaker 1: things at work or should we just not be even
Speaker 1: worrying about whether we sound emotionally connected to an issue
Speaker 1: when we talk about it. You know, that fallacy, I
Speaker 1: feel is so misleading, and it kind of you know,
Speaker 1: that infects all of the ways in which we discuss
Speaker 1: issues like race and gender so often, even you know,
Speaker 1: as a writer, I will hear people say you're obviously
Speaker 1: emotionally invested. But the truth is is what type of
Speaker 1: person would you have to be to not be emotionally
Speaker 1: is that you know these are That's the human nature.
Speaker 1: And if you think you're not emotionally invested, um, that's
Speaker 1: kind of betraying your own bias as law in order
Speaker 1: to be so far removed that issues that impact you know,
Speaker 1: the lives and the humanity of people different from you
Speaker 1: don't affect you emotionally. Um, what type of teammate and
Speaker 1: co worker are you? Really? So I wouldn't be afraid
Speaker 1: of being emotional, But one thing I would definitely say
Speaker 1: if you, if you're worried about how effectively these things
Speaker 1: will be heard, is to talk about why it's emotional.
Speaker 1: A lot of times we stop at the feeling, right,
Speaker 1: We're like this, I feel awful, this is you know,
Speaker 1: this is disenfranchising, this is silencing, This makes me angry,
Speaker 1: This makes me sad, and it does. But what people
Speaker 1: need to understand if they're not sitting in those emotions
Speaker 1: with you, is why. And I think that there's a
Speaker 1: great opportunity, UM in these conversations. And this is why
Speaker 1: I always recommend you know, none of us are born
Speaker 1: with the language to describe oppression and systems of race
Speaker 1: in the way in which it impacts us. That language
Speaker 1: is empowering, and because it's empowering, it's kept from us.
Speaker 1: And it's really important to understand if you're going to
Speaker 1: work and you're feeling beaten down, or if you're feeling
Speaker 1: like something is wrong. If you see an interaction and
Speaker 1: they're like, that didn't seem right. You know what what
Speaker 1: they did to that to my teammates, I didn't seem right.
Speaker 1: It's important then to sit with that and trying to
Speaker 1: figure out why, because then when you talk about it,
Speaker 1: and when you say, you know, watching the way that
Speaker 1: you talk to so and so really angered me, you
Speaker 1: can say because talking to a black man in the
Speaker 1: office in this way reinforces stereotypes about black men that
Speaker 1: keeps them unemployed, that keeps them looking at lower pay,
Speaker 1: that keeps them, you know, more likely to be fired,
Speaker 1: to be disciplined, to even find themselves in the criminal
Speaker 1: justice system. And that is something to be angry about,
Speaker 1: but you have to really tie it to the larger
Speaker 1: issue for people who aren't making that connection automatically, and
Speaker 1: then you know that anger makes sense. It doesn't mean
Speaker 1: that you have to always consent everyone, especially if you
Speaker 1: are a person of color. You really don't owe someone
Speaker 1: this exhaust is investigation into your heart and soul because
Speaker 1: people should be taking this upon themselves. But especially if
Speaker 1: you are, let's say, an ally trying to have these
Speaker 1: kind versations UM, it will make it more effective if
Speaker 1: you can really tie to the downstream impacts of these actions.
Speaker 1: We're talking about these things not just because it makes
Speaker 1: people of color feel more welcome in the oppose. We
Speaker 1: talk about these issues because it has real measurable impacts
Speaker 1: on the ability of people's color to be able to
Speaker 1: pay their bills and support their families. And that matters.
Speaker 1: And that is something you know that you should be
Speaker 1: upset about and concerned about and sad about and angry
Speaker 1: about UM. But if you express it and people don't
Speaker 1: know why, it's easy for them to dismiss. So it
Speaker 1: sounds like you think that we shouldn't try away from
Speaker 1: our emotions. But are there things that we should avoid
Speaker 1: when talking about issues of race that work? You know,
Speaker 1: I would definitely say I would avoid jumping into discussions
Speaker 1: about race if you can't first be able to a
Speaker 1: set kind of your intentions in the discussion. I think
Speaker 1: a lot of times we find ourselves in these kind
Speaker 1: of confrontational areas and our emotions are high, and it's
Speaker 1: it's really public, and you know, things really start boiling.
Speaker 1: But we didn't set out what our intention was, and
Speaker 1: I think that it is almost never going to go
Speaker 1: well if you jump into these discussions without first thing,
Speaker 1: I'm talking to you about this, or I'm going to
Speaker 1: make this an issue because I want you to understand,
Speaker 1: you know, why this impacts me, or I want to
Speaker 1: make sure that we are creating an environment that is
Speaker 1: welcoming and supportive of employees of color, but definitely set
Speaker 1: that out first um and get people to buy in
Speaker 1: on that, because what often happens in these discussions is
Speaker 1: people will say, well, this isn't what we're talking about anyway,
Speaker 1: So this isn't what we're doing. I think it's very
Speaker 1: clear that that's why you're having this discussion, that people
Speaker 1: can commit to that goal on it. It gets people
Speaker 1: in these conversations in a different mindset, you know, from
Speaker 1: less of a why are you're taking this here too? Oh, okay,
Speaker 1: you are taking this conversation here, and now I have
Speaker 1: to decide if I'm the type of person who says
Speaker 1: I don't want to talk about how I can make
Speaker 1: this work environment more inclusive, or from the type of
Speaker 1: persons who does want to talk about that, and it
Speaker 1: changes the mindset of everyone in the conversation. So we
Speaker 1: would definitely say, don't get into these conversations, don't get
Speaker 1: heavy into them without setting that out first and kind
Speaker 1: of get that mutual buy in. So we've been talking
Speaker 1: a lot about dealing with racism at work and how
Speaker 1: you talk about that and as a working person, But
Speaker 1: I'm wondering how you think we should talk about race
Speaker 1: when there's say a police shooting or a racially motivated crime,
Speaker 1: or some sort of news story where it is affecting
Speaker 1: people at work and they want to talk about it,
Speaker 1: but they're they're not sure how they should. What do
Speaker 1: you think people should do in that situation? You know,
Speaker 1: this sort of thing can always be a little difficult,
Speaker 1: but I would definitely say, especially in situations like this,
Speaker 1: it's important to recognize but it when something like this happens,
Speaker 1: you have grieving, scared, heartbroken coworker, and your tought priority
Speaker 1: should be the health and safety of your teammates of
Speaker 1: color and really reaching out to them and offering support
Speaker 1: and making sure that you are creating an environment that
Speaker 1: sees them. You know, one of I'll never forget. One
Speaker 1: of the most you know, mentally damaging things for me
Speaker 1: around the time of trade Horn Martin was I was
Speaker 1: actually working in advertising at the time, is that no
Speaker 1: one was talking about it. And I would go to work,
Speaker 1: which is where I spend most of my time, and
Speaker 1: people would talk about any other big issue, you know,
Speaker 1: would talk about celebrity depths. I would talk about tone
Speaker 1: x oversee. I talked to all of these things, and
Speaker 1: it was like the murder of this boy that I
Speaker 1: had spent days crying over and looking at my own
Speaker 1: son and whondering if it could be him. It didn't exist,
Speaker 1: and it as a co worker, as a community member,
Speaker 1: I felt like I did make sense. And regardless of
Speaker 1: what you personally think about that issue, I don't think
Speaker 1: it's too much to ask that people recognize that when
Speaker 1: you see the death of one of your own um
Speaker 1: and such an unjust death, it's going to be traumatizing
Speaker 1: and you should care about your teammates and your co
Speaker 1: workers enough to acknowledge that, and I would. You can't
Speaker 1: acknowledge that. You can acknowledge no matter what you think
Speaker 1: of police brutality. You can say, I am really sorry
Speaker 1: that someone is dead and it shouldn't be like this,
Speaker 1: And I'm sorry that this is hurting my teammates and
Speaker 1: my coworkers, and it hurts me because it hurts them,
Speaker 1: and that that empathy, you know, that recognition of the
Speaker 1: humanity of people of color and the experiences that they
Speaker 1: have in the world is really important and it's something
Speaker 1: that you get in the office all of the time
Speaker 1: for any other tragedy except for what it has to
Speaker 1: do with race. So do that. That is the least
Speaker 1: you can do. And then if you want to have
Speaker 1: further conversations, um, you know, I would, I would definitely
Speaker 1: say that it's important to do. So don't bring it
Speaker 1: to choose the people of color, don't you know. Don't
Speaker 1: show up at the desk of a black person the
Speaker 1: day after you see video of a black person being
Speaker 1: shot by cops and say, oh, my gosh, isn't that awful?
Speaker 1: It's you know, and so upset because they're already upset.
Speaker 1: Just say, you know, are you okay? How can I
Speaker 1: s import you fall advice? Because I wouldn't no to
Speaker 1: not say exactly what you just said. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's really one of those things where you know you're
Speaker 1: you're greeting you're suffering, and the least thing you want
Speaker 1: to do at the time then is kind of hand
Speaker 1: holding one else who isn't correctly impacted by it through
Speaker 1: that process. And you know, plenty of people are just
Speaker 1: trying to go to work and not break down crying
Speaker 1: at work, and so, you know, being known, yes we
Speaker 1: see you, we hope you're okay, and we hope we
Speaker 1: can support you in any way that is a loving
Speaker 1: opening gesture, But burdening people with your processing of their
Speaker 1: pain is not. So I just want to wrap up
Speaker 1: by asking, can you leave us with some other assumptions
Speaker 1: that people make that they need to get rid of
Speaker 1: before we can have more productive conversations at work about race? Yeah?
Speaker 1: You know, I would say, if there's one thing I
Speaker 1: would love for people to keep in mind, especially white people,
Speaker 1: to keep in mind, is that when you were talking
Speaker 1: to some one about a specific issue on race, something
Speaker 1: that happened. Let's say someone says, so and so you
Speaker 1: know said this to me, and I think they said
Speaker 1: it to me because I'm Hispanic, right. Um, when we're
Speaker 1: talking about issues of race or ethnicity with people of color,
Speaker 1: you're not talking about just one issue and so if
Speaker 1: you look at it and go, oh, I wouldn't think
Speaker 1: that what you're doing is you're ignoring the fact that
Speaker 1: this isn't the first time this has happened, and that
Speaker 1: these issues you cannot divorce one instance from a lifetime
Speaker 1: of similar instances. And so often when we talk at work,
Speaker 1: people like to say that people of color are blowing
Speaker 1: things out of proportion, but they're not. What they're doing
Speaker 1: is they're able to see a lifetime of this experience.
Speaker 1: What you're seeing is not just that specific issue. You're
Speaker 1: also seeing what is another rock on the pile that
Speaker 1: is crushing up, and you need to give it that
Speaker 1: full of gravity and weight and recognize how much larger
Speaker 1: that impact is that it seems to you because you
Speaker 1: don't have to experience that every single day. Well as
Speaker 1: with everything, it sounds like taking a little bit of
Speaker 1: effort to think outside one's own experience really has a
Speaker 1: huge effect, and there's something we should all be doing
Speaker 1: more of. I really appreciate you taking the time to
Speaker 1: talk to us. Thanks for having me. The thing that
Speaker 1: stuck with me from that interview was when she was
Speaker 1: talking about the ways in which when you bring up
Speaker 1: this stuff, it can be unproductive, and she talked about
Speaker 1: how at times it can feel like someone else putting
Speaker 1: their issues on you, and that I think is my
Speaker 1: issue with a lot of these conversations when they happen
Speaker 1: at work, Like it stresses me out to hear people
Speaker 1: talk about politics or even their personal lives, because I
Speaker 1: feel like I'm supposed to be acting as their therapist,
Speaker 1: and I don't want to do that at all. Yeah,
Speaker 1: one thing that we didn't get too deeply into in
Speaker 1: this interview, but which I think is relevant here is
Speaker 1: what happens when you have a colleague or someone that
Speaker 1: you're talking to who has really opposite political views from you,
Speaker 1: or views on race, and in those instances it may
Speaker 1: be not productive and maybe even damaging to just bring
Speaker 1: all your issues up and dump them out on the table.
Speaker 1: So I kind of feel like what we're learning here
Speaker 1: is that there are there are tools were talking about
Speaker 1: this stuff right, and we have filters for a reason.
Speaker 1: It's not necessarily that we should just like hang on
Speaker 1: too outdated taboos and not talk about things for the
Speaker 1: sake of not talking about them. But we also don't
Speaker 1: need to just completely spill our unexamined views out before
Speaker 1: we've really thought about how that's going to affect our
Speaker 1: coworkers and what we're trying to get out of it.
Speaker 1: And for a totally unproductive and easy to talk about thing,
Speaker 1: it's now time for a half baked takes, half fake takes.
Speaker 1: You can call us and leave a voicemail with your
Speaker 1: half bake take and we might play it on the
Speaker 1: show It's too into six one seven zero one six
Speaker 1: six and take a minute to subscribe to our newsletter
Speaker 1: if you want to hear from me and Becca throughout
Speaker 1: the week. This week's newsletter features a playlist of perfect
Speaker 1: songs to listen to at work, which we pulled together
Speaker 1: from your responses to our call out last week. Becca,
Speaker 1: what is your not fully formed thought that you want
Speaker 1: a platform for today? Very passionate about this. I think
Speaker 1: that talking about the weather is totally legit and cool
Speaker 1: and not dumb small talk. You know, I'm pro small talk. Basically,
Speaker 1: I walk outside my apartment and if it's nice out,
Speaker 1: the first thing that will come out of my mouth is,
Speaker 1: oh my god, it's such a beautiful day, and I
Speaker 1: feel like I'm really appreciating the world and that I
Speaker 1: want to share that with somebody, and then I feel
Speaker 1: bad because that's like grand pa talk, but it's not.
Speaker 1: It's our lives. I can't say small talk. But small
Speaker 1: talk isn't supposed to be original, Like you don't have
Speaker 1: to come at somebody with like the most dazzling in
Speaker 1: site for the first thing you say to them that day, like,
Speaker 1: let's talk about something that we all agree on that
Speaker 1: we can all get on the same page about it's
Speaker 1: rainy outside. Also, weather affects me a lot, so to
Speaker 1: not talk about it is a big deal for me.
Speaker 1: When it's sunny out, I'm in a much better mood
Speaker 1: when it's cold and miserable. Like it's an important factor
Speaker 1: in my life. And if you don't want to talk
Speaker 1: about it with me, then you don't be my friend.
Speaker 1: Bang frantiska, what is your not fully formed idea that
Speaker 1: you really need to share with the world. Mine is
Speaker 1: also about how you talk to people in the office. Um.
Speaker 1: I feel like it should be an enforced law that
Speaker 1: everyone should say good morning to their colleague, to the
Speaker 1: to the people in their immediate vicinity, like the person
Speaker 1: sitting immediately next to you or across from you, somebody
Speaker 1: who you're going to make eye contact with as soon
Speaker 1: as you walk into the office, say good morning. It's
Speaker 1: not that hard. If you're an introvert. It's two words
Speaker 1: like say good morning and then carry on with your work.
Speaker 1: There's really there's no obstacle to say good morning and not.
Speaker 1: When people don't say good morning to me, it makes
Speaker 1: me feel sad. I want to agree with this, but
Speaker 1: I am just to be and I just don't say
Speaker 1: good morning. And I'm not an introvert either, I just
Speaker 1: don't do it. You don't feel like, well, okay, So
Speaker 1: here's here's my thing. I think the next best thing
Speaker 1: to saying good morning every morning is never saying good morning.
Speaker 1: The worst thing you could do. I think I'm this one,
Speaker 1: the worst one. The worst person you can be is
Speaker 1: someone who sometimes says good morning and sometimes doesn't because
Speaker 1: you just you were. I never know what to expect
Speaker 1: from that person. So it's like I might say good
Speaker 1: morning and get a good morning back, I might not
Speaker 1: get a good morning back. If I know if I
Speaker 1: sit next to you and I know you're never going
Speaker 1: to say good morning, I'm just gonna give up on
Speaker 1: it eventually and stuff thinking respond to you. Jeez. Also
Speaker 1: then so You're not that bad because there are some
Speaker 1: people who it's like, did they hear me? They probably
Speaker 1: didn't hear you. That had probably didn't hear me. Can
Speaker 1: I give an anecdote? I know this, this half big
Speaker 1: take is going on for a while, but um I
Speaker 1: met someone from Guatemala who said, the custom there and
Speaker 1: the culture is everybody gives each other like a hug
Speaker 1: and a kiss on the cheek when they walk into
Speaker 1: the office. Different world hugs or a whole lot of Yeah,
Speaker 1: save it, We'll save it. No huwgs. Please say good
Speaker 1: morning to me, Good morning Francesca, Thanks Becca, good morning
Speaker 1: back and this has been half big takes, half baked takes.
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to game Plan. You can find me
Speaker 1: on Twitter at Francesca today and I'm at rs Greenfield.
Speaker 1: Tweet us your half big tags or any anything. Just
Speaker 1: tweet us anything literally, anything nice. If you like our show,
Speaker 1: please go to Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen, subscribe, rate,
Speaker 1: and review as we say it every week because every week,
Speaker 1: it's true, every review really helps get the word out
Speaker 1: about our show. You can also check out a cool
Speaker 1: new product from Bloomberg called Bloomberg Lens. It gives you
Speaker 1: a bunch of really nifty financial information along with all
Speaker 1: of your favorite articles. Yeah I heard that that's not
Speaker 1: only an iOS app, but also a Google Chrome extension. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's pretty great. This podcast is produced by Liz Smith
Speaker 1: and Magnus Hendrickson. Head of Podcasts is Alec McKay. See
Speaker 1: you next week. Yeah, come on, you're probably the second soprano. Anyway.
Speaker 1: It was when I didn't know how to read music
Speaker 1: that way, so I was like, I don't know