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Speaker 1: Welcome back, guys to another episode of Couch Talks. My

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Speaker 1: name is Kat and I am the host. In today

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Speaker 1: is a nice special Couch Talks episode because I have

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Speaker 1: my friend, my colleague. What else are you to me?

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Speaker 1: Spirit animal? Are you my spirit animal? I was gonna say,

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Speaker 1: my spiritual guide. I don't know. You're just a human

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Speaker 1: and you're here and your name is Stacy. Hello, and

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Speaker 1: she is also a therapist and somebody who actually works

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Speaker 1: at Three Courts Therapy with me, which is the practice

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Speaker 1: that I have in Nashville. So I brought her on

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Speaker 1: today because there are two questions specifically I wanted to

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Speaker 1: ask her because you hear me talk about my perspective

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Speaker 1: as a therapist all day long, and sometimes it's nice

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Speaker 1: to have somebody else. So if you're new and you

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Speaker 1: don't know what couch Talks is, it is a special

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Speaker 1: bonus episode of You Need Therapy where I answer questions

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Speaker 1: that you guys send into me. And we always like

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Speaker 1: to remind everybody that although I am a therapist, this

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Speaker 1: is not therapy or a substitute for therapy. It's just

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Speaker 1: a way to help you either get into the conversations

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Speaker 1: that you want to really get into in your life,

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Speaker 1: or maybe it will encourage you to go to therapy,

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Speaker 1: or maybe it would encourage you to talk about something

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Speaker 1: different in therapy. So this week we're doing it a

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Speaker 1: little bit different one because Stacy's here too. Because I

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Speaker 1: put a note out on social media asking for quick,

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Speaker 1: rapid fire ish questions for the podcast, and I'm going

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Speaker 1: to save some of them for a Monday episode, but

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Speaker 1: then I thought we could answer some of them today.

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Speaker 1: And usually we just do one answer and I take

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Speaker 1: a long time to answer it. Well, not a long time,

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Speaker 1: but we're gonna have like five questions if we can

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Speaker 1: get to all of them. So let's get to number one.

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Speaker 1: I'm ready for the rapid fire. Okay. So the first

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Speaker 1: question was what growth made you the most proud of

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Speaker 1: a client? And this one is hard to answer, and

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Speaker 1: I feel it's unfair to answer because I I believe

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Speaker 1: a lot of my clients have had really amazing growth

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Speaker 1: and I don't really like to rank it, but there

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Speaker 1: is just one really special memory that sticks out, and

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Speaker 1: I'm just pulling one. So if you're listening to this

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Speaker 1: and you're like, i've worked with cap before, it doesn't

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Speaker 1: mean that I wasn't proud of you, or didn't think

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Speaker 1: your growth was important or any of that. This was

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Speaker 1: just a really cool story. So I had a client

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Speaker 1: and I actually was her therapist in a treatment center.

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Speaker 1: Then I started private practice and she found me in

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Speaker 1: my private practice. I worked with her for years and

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Speaker 1: she did a lot of really awesome work. She was incredible,

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Speaker 1: and then at some point she just like ghosted me.

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Speaker 1: And she had like owed me a couple of sessions

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Speaker 1: worth of like money, but it wasn't that big of

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Speaker 1: a deal. I really was more concerned with, like, why

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Speaker 1: isn't she answering she didn't show up from our session

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Speaker 1: and then didn't answer my emails or my calls, and

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Speaker 1: she was not like that. And eventually you just kind

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Speaker 1: of have to like let it go. If they choose

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Speaker 1: not to answer you, that's that. And I'm not going

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Speaker 1: to send collections after her. Like getting those two sessions

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Speaker 1: paid for it was not that important to me, So

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Speaker 1: I kind of just like let it go, and I

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Speaker 1: was sad and a little worried. And then two years

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Speaker 1: later I got a phone call and it was her,

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Speaker 1: and she was calling from a treatment center in another state,

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Speaker 1: and she called to say she was sorry it was

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Speaker 1: so cool. She called to say she was sorry, and

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Speaker 1: she was like, I ended up struggling and I relapsed

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Speaker 1: and I didn't want to tell you, and I knew

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Speaker 1: I owed you money and I couldn't pay for it,

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Speaker 1: and I just had so much shame that I just

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Speaker 1: like blocked you out of my life. And thankfully I

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Speaker 1: got some help. And I think she was struggling with

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Speaker 1: something at that point and she needed my perspective as

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Speaker 1: her past therapist, and so I talked to her and

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Speaker 1: her therapist in the treatment center. But it was so

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Speaker 1: cool to get that phone call because I knew what

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Speaker 1: it took for her to reach back out after she

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Speaker 1: felt like so much shame and the fact that she

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Speaker 1: had relapsed and then ended up back in treatment to

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Speaker 1: get help again. Now I don't know where she is now.

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Speaker 1: I hope she's like on a good path. But that

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Speaker 1: was one of my favorite sports because I did not

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Speaker 1: expect that phone call. You imagine just getting ghosted from

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Speaker 1: a client and te years later they call you and

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Speaker 1: they're like, I'm so sorry, but I'm okay. That's literally

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Speaker 1: like the best message. Yeah. So that's that answer. And

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Speaker 1: in the next question, is do any of your clients

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Speaker 1: listen to the podcast, and yes, the answer is yes.

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Speaker 1: I don't know who. I know some clients who listen

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Speaker 1: to it because they tell me, but I'm sure more

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Speaker 1: could listen to it. A lot of my clients listen

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Speaker 1: to your poet, and a lot of our clients find

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Speaker 1: our practice through the podcast, So that is a thing,

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Speaker 1: and I don't mind it. I mean, obviously I want

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Speaker 1: people to hear the information that's talked about on here,

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Speaker 1: and my clients here a lot of this information firsthand

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Speaker 1: from me. So some of them don't listen to it

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Speaker 1: because it's like, well, I don't really need to, or

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Speaker 1: they might want that its boundary. And a lot of

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Speaker 1: times when my clients are bringing it up, it's because

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Speaker 1: they've heard something helpful that they bring intocitions. So I

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Speaker 1: love that. So the answer is yes, how do you

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Speaker 1: feel about all of the online therapy options? Well, to

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Speaker 1: be honest, I don't know too much about them. I

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Speaker 1: know that they're there, and I know that they're less

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Speaker 1: expensive than therapy like normal therapy in person, and what

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Speaker 1: I believe is that's better than nothing. So if that's

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Speaker 1: what helps somebody get their foot in the door when

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Speaker 1: it comes to therapy. Who am I to say that

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Speaker 1: it's bad or wrong. I don't have enough information about

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Speaker 1: it to say that it's bad or wrong. I think

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Speaker 1: it serves a really good purpose. It's accessible, and it's

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Speaker 1: less expensive, and it might not be the same kind

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Speaker 1: of therapy. You might not be able to do E. M,

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Speaker 1: d R or experiential therapy or any of that, but

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Speaker 1: you can still have a helpful experience, I believe. Now

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Speaker 1: this is where I bring Stacey in, and I have

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Speaker 1: two questions. In the first one, I'm asking Stacy because

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Speaker 1: she is a marriage and family therapist, so I am

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Speaker 1: a licensed professional counselor. So we have different degrees and

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Speaker 1: we have different licensing boards, but we're both mental health professionals.

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Speaker 1: And I don't work with couples, and I wasn't trained

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Speaker 1: to work with couples. Stacy Canon does work with couples

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Speaker 1: and was trained to work with couples. So I have

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Speaker 1: my own perspective on this as a therapist. But I

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Speaker 1: wanted to ask Stacy because this is more of her wheelhouse.

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Speaker 1: So the question is should you to your therapist for

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Speaker 1: your couple's therapist or should you get a separate couple's therapist. Oho,

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Speaker 1: that's such a good question. Of course, I always lean

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Speaker 1: on supervision and consultation for each individual case like this,

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Speaker 1: But I will say that I typically lean toward separating

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Speaker 1: the two mainly because I guess if we pose it

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Speaker 1: as I'm seeing an individual and then they would like

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Speaker 1: to have a couple of therapy, I've already really established

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Speaker 1: some rapport and relationship with that person, and I just

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Speaker 1: as a human being, I feel like, not that necessarily

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Speaker 1: that it's hard, but it's just fair. It's hard to

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Speaker 1: not have a biased and just to like acknowledge that

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Speaker 1: about myself and to keep it fair. Well, I like

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Speaker 1: what you said of I leaned towards supervision and consultation

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Speaker 1: for each individual case because I think there are definitely

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Speaker 1: places where that would be appropriate and there are definitely

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Speaker 1: places where that could actually be harmful, and so it's

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Speaker 1: not just a one and done answer. I actually have

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Speaker 1: a case in which I started with a couple and

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Speaker 1: one of the two, because of work, would be out

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Speaker 1: of town, and I kind of brought that to supervision

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Speaker 1: and consultation because a part of the couple wanted to

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Speaker 1: remain as an individual client and that and you're doing that,

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Speaker 1: and I think that what they like preach to us

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Speaker 1: in school, and I think generally gets thrown around is

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Speaker 1: when you're a couple's therapist, the couple is your client,

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Speaker 1: and so it would be like a conflict of interest

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Speaker 1: if you then we're seeing one of them individually. However,

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Speaker 1: part of couple's work could be a couple of sessions

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Speaker 1: individually with each person. But if you're really wanting to

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Speaker 1: get into the woods of of your own stuff outside

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Speaker 1: of that couple's work, then it is definitely case by case,

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Speaker 1: I think, but the general rule of thumb was always no.

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Speaker 1: That's not to say there aren't spaces where that would

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Speaker 1: be appropriate. So there's that. And then my last question

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Speaker 1: for today, I feel like I get versions of the

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Speaker 1: a lot and I think we have addressed it before,

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Speaker 1: but we're going to address it again, and I want

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Speaker 1: to hear Stacy as well say her piece, and it's

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Speaker 1: how much should I be talking in a therapy session

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Speaker 1: versus my therapist? And I feel like this question comes

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Speaker 1: from people who generally are wanting more from their therapist

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Speaker 1: and we don't know how to ask or maybe but

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Speaker 1: this is hard to answer because it can It's like

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Speaker 1: there's not like it should be seventy, it should be

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Speaker 1: fifty fifty, it should be It definitely depends. And there

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Speaker 1: are some clients who like I barely talk, and there

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Speaker 1: are some clients who need a lot of direction and guidance.

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Speaker 1: And there are some sessions where I'm doing a lot

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Speaker 1: of education, and there's some sessions where the client just

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Speaker 1: needs to like process and just here have me be

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Speaker 1: a sounding board. So how would you answer that question,

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Speaker 1: how much should you be talking versus the client? I'd

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Speaker 1: start with independs, because we are they're assisting what the

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Speaker 1: client needs, what they are bringing in. I would respond

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Speaker 1: to that to your point of some days, clients, do

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Speaker 1: you just need processing time. I'm really careful about letting

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Speaker 1: that go on for multiple stations, because sometimes clients look

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Speaker 1: up and they're like, oh, she just lets me talk

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Speaker 1: all the time. That's not really helpful. But I think

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Speaker 1: it really is important to just stay attuned to what

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Speaker 1: do they need, what are they bringing. Sometimes I'll even

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Speaker 1: say what is important today? And like, what do you

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Speaker 1: need today? Because I noticed that you're talking a lot today?

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Speaker 1: What do you need today? You said, I don't exactly

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Speaker 1: how you said this earlier but it makes me think

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Speaker 1: about does the client or to the person who's asking

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Speaker 1: this question know how to appropriately ask for what they

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Speaker 1: need in session? Because I ask all my clients who

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Speaker 1: have been to therapy before in our intake and have

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Speaker 1: you had a therapist before? What did you like? What

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Speaker 1: did you not like? Number one thing I get is

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Speaker 1: my therapists didn't really help me. She kind of just

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Speaker 1: like let me talk and then this session was over.

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Speaker 1: And so the question I always have in the back

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Speaker 1: of my head is like, well, did you let them know, like,

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Speaker 1: did you tell them that you wanted more? Did you

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Speaker 1: ask for this? Was there a conversation around this or

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Speaker 1: did you just like sit there and hope that they

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Speaker 1: would do something. And a lot of therapy and a

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Speaker 1: lot of how the therapists might work is they might

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Speaker 1: not give you something until you learn to actually ask

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Speaker 1: for it. And if we just like tell you what

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Speaker 1: you need, you're not learning how to figure that out.

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Speaker 1: And I also just don't think that's helpful. I don't

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Speaker 1: know what you need, do what you need? Yes, So

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Speaker 1: I think that is again a case by case, which

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Speaker 1: oftentimes that's how I leave you guys with these like

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Speaker 1: open ended answers, but I would really encourage whoever is

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Speaker 1: asking that or wondering that themselves, even if you didn't

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Speaker 1: ask that. Is, if I'm wondering this inside of my

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Speaker 1: body when I'm in a session, what is keeping me

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Speaker 1: from actually wondering it out loud to my therapist? Like

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Speaker 1: what's keeping you from saying, am I talking too much?

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Speaker 1: Or what keeping you from saying I really am looking

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Speaker 1: for more direction here or I'm not I don't feel

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Speaker 1: like I'm getting what I need? Like, what is keeping

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Speaker 1: you from saying that? And that might actually lead you

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Speaker 1: to what you need? I like it? So that really

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Speaker 1: does it for our rabid We did a good job.

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Speaker 1: I feel like I did that very rapidly. I probably

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Speaker 1: was talking extra fasts, so just the idea of rapid

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Speaker 1: fire questions. I feel like I should be speaking faster,

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Speaker 1: and I already speak really fast. So sorry to all

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Speaker 1: you guys who you might want to, like, can't you

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Speaker 1: half time it? When you're listening to a podcast, You

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Speaker 1: can't speed it up, but you might want to. We've

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Speaker 1: already listened to it by now, so never mind. We

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Speaker 1: meet the assignment. Yeah, we did meet the assignment. Well,

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Speaker 1: thank you for being here for this quick little jaunt,

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Speaker 1: and we're about to go possibly go for a walk.

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Speaker 1: It's about so you might just go to a restaurant anyway,

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Speaker 1: we're going to think about it. Wish us luck. I

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Speaker 1: will talk to you guys on Monday for our normal episode,

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Speaker 1: and I hope you have the day you need to

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Speaker 1: have By