1 00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:02,760 Speaker 1: Hello, Stuff you should Know listeners, if you want to 2 00:00:02,759 --> 00:00:05,120 Speaker 1: come see s Live, You've only got a couple of 3 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:07,560 Speaker 1: more cities this year that still have tickets, and that 4 00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:10,840 Speaker 1: is Orlando in New Orleans. Yeah, we'll be in Orlando 5 00:00:10,920 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 1: on October nine at the Plaza Live, and we'll be 6 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:16,320 Speaker 1: in New Orleans at the Civic Theater the following night 7 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:19,720 Speaker 1: October t and friends like Chuck said, you better go 8 00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:22,680 Speaker 1: get your tickets. Go to s Y s K live 9 00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 1: dot com for info and ticket links and everything you 10 00:00:26,920 --> 00:00:31,080 Speaker 1: need to come see us. Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, 11 00:00:31,280 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hey, 12 00:00:39,840 --> 00:00:43,400 Speaker 1: and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, There's Charles 13 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:47,560 Speaker 1: w Chuck Bryant, there's Jerry over there, and the three 14 00:00:47,600 --> 00:00:51,839 Speaker 1: of us are um going riding on the Freeway of 15 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:56,240 Speaker 1: Love and a pink Cadillac. There's no looking back. Jack. 16 00:00:56,440 --> 00:00:59,480 Speaker 1: Who is that Aretha? Yes? A good song for later 17 00:00:59,720 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 1: stuff for sure. That and then knew you were waiting 18 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:06,200 Speaker 1: with George Mike Leving. Come on, yeah, I mean it 19 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 1: doesn't hold up to me for the against like the 20 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:12,119 Speaker 1: stuff from the sixties and seventies. But you're like, it's 21 00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:16,480 Speaker 1: no Zeppelin. I'm just talking about Aretha's earlier work. I know, 22 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:19,920 Speaker 1: I know what you mean. I felt like I would 23 00:01:19,959 --> 00:01:21,320 Speaker 1: have liked to have seen her sing with Zeppelin. That 24 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:25,600 Speaker 1: would have been neat. Yeah, what what would have it? Songs? 25 00:01:25,640 --> 00:01:28,760 Speaker 1: She would have song? I don't know, But how about 26 00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:30,839 Speaker 1: a whole lot of love? A whole lot of love? 27 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:34,080 Speaker 1: We'll go with that one. All right, We're getting in 28 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:42,320 Speaker 1: to get to reanimating Aretha and John Bonham mm hmmm, alright, Chuck, 29 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,720 Speaker 1: enough of this. It's high time that we got to 30 00:01:45,840 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 1: talking about the United States Highway Interstate system. Yeah. I 31 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:58,040 Speaker 1: love this stuff, are you too? You know? I was like, 32 00:01:58,080 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: what is it about this that I do love? Because 33 00:02:00,880 --> 00:02:02,640 Speaker 1: I've been meaning to do this one for a really 34 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:05,840 Speaker 1: long time. And I guess it's the fact that it's 35 00:02:05,880 --> 00:02:09,360 Speaker 1: a huge mass of public works. That's where it gets 36 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:12,480 Speaker 1: civil engineering. We kind of have a thing for civil engineering, 37 00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:15,160 Speaker 1: don't we. I think so man like subways and bridges 38 00:02:15,240 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 1: and like all that stuff seems to delight both of us. 39 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:20,960 Speaker 1: But then also the other thing I like about it 40 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:23,360 Speaker 1: that really kind of came to the to the fore 41 00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:28,160 Speaker 1: through this research is the enormous impacts, both like good 42 00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:33,480 Speaker 1: and bad that this huge, massive, sweeping public work project 43 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 1: had on on America and still has today like just 44 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:41,680 Speaker 1: completely restructured America inside and out. Yeah, and this also 45 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:44,440 Speaker 1: makes me want to do a commission a piece on 46 00:02:45,720 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: the suburbs. Yes, dude, I think that's a great idea. 47 00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:52,080 Speaker 1: That's a that's a big one to unpack and commission 48 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:54,160 Speaker 1: a piece. I'm glad you said that because this was uh, 49 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 1: this is based on an article written by the great 50 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:03,880 Speaker 1: egg Grabanowski, the Grabster. That's right. So um, we should 51 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 1: probably say what we're talking about. If you've never been 52 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:08,959 Speaker 1: to the United States, or if you've never been out 53 00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:10,880 Speaker 1: of your house and you live in the United States, 54 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:22,760 Speaker 1: the America has um a really extensive system of roadways, 55 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 1: like really really fast, really well designed interstates. That's what 56 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:30,359 Speaker 1: they're called. They're highways, their expressways, speedways, whatever you want 57 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 1: to call them. But they connect every major city in 58 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:36,640 Speaker 1: the United States to every other major city in the 59 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:40,720 Speaker 1: United States. You can get anywhere from anywhere, and there's 60 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 1: something like forty eight thousand plus miles of interstate just interstate, 61 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 1: not not highways, not by ways, not roads. I think 62 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:52,760 Speaker 1: that comes to something like a hundred and fifty thousand miles, 63 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:55,560 Speaker 1: but there's like forty eight thousand miles of just this 64 00:03:55,840 --> 00:04:03,760 Speaker 1: incredibly well engineered, well constructed, super fast UM road artery 65 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 1: system cardiovascular system for cars in the United States. Yeah, 66 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 1: it's kind of what looks like sometimes on a map. 67 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:15,760 Speaker 1: For sure. It's like a central nervous system for the US. 68 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:17,800 Speaker 1: So shall we go back in time a bit? Though? 69 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:19,680 Speaker 1: I think we should, but we had to lay down 70 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:24,720 Speaker 1: while we were talking about first in complete UM contrariness 71 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 1: to the standard s Y s K. Fan. That's right, Okay, 72 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:30,400 Speaker 1: So let's go back in time, Chuck. So we're going 73 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 1: back to the beginning of the twentieth century here and 74 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:36,840 Speaker 1: at the time roads in the United States, and we're 75 00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:39,920 Speaker 1: talking about, you know, roads outside of the major, major 76 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 1: urban centers. Uh, they had a little bit better roads, 77 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 1: but the rural roads were not good by any standard. 78 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:50,880 Speaker 1: They were dirt roads. So when it rained, and we're 79 00:04:50,880 --> 00:04:54,400 Speaker 1: not even talking gravel roads, we mean literally dirt roads, um, 80 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:56,240 Speaker 1: which seems like a catch all tern but a gravel 81 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:59,280 Speaker 1: road is much much better than a dirt road because 82 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:03,039 Speaker 1: I've lived on both. Oh fancy, man, you lived on 83 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:06,000 Speaker 1: a gravel road. Yeah, growing up, had a gravel road 84 00:05:06,040 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 1: until I was like ten or eleven they paved it. 85 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:10,880 Speaker 1: When did you live on a dirt road before they 86 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:14,560 Speaker 1: put gravel down? Okay, so you looked on the same road, 87 00:05:14,640 --> 00:05:16,480 Speaker 1: but it was a dirt road once and then so 88 00:05:16,720 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 1: I think when they put the gravel down, that's called 89 00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:21,719 Speaker 1: an improved road. Yeah, I went from dirt to gravel 90 00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 1: improved two paved, which I and I said this on 91 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 1: one episode, but I remember very distinctly they paved it 92 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:30,760 Speaker 1: after my whole life going up that gravel road. It 93 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:33,800 Speaker 1: felt like we were driving on putting. Oh. Yeah, it 94 00:05:33,880 --> 00:05:37,120 Speaker 1: was so smooth and weird and we felt so modern. 95 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 1: So so you grew up on a road back in 96 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:43,359 Speaker 1: nineteen o six, chewing tobaccy and working in the mines, 97 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:48,520 Speaker 1: Is that is that where you grew up? Uh? No, 98 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:50,840 Speaker 1: it was the seventies. But it was just a dead 99 00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:54,039 Speaker 1: end road. It wasn't a big neighborhood, which talked about before. 100 00:05:54,160 --> 00:05:56,360 Speaker 1: I bet that was a pretty big difference in um 101 00:05:56,440 --> 00:05:59,360 Speaker 1: in in feeling. When you had it paved, it was 102 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 1: really weird. But rural roads at the early twenty century 103 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 1: were dirt and when it rained, it was terrible mud. 104 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:10,240 Speaker 1: And then when that dried up. There were terrible ruts, 105 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 1: and it was not the biggest deal at the time 106 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:16,960 Speaker 1: because cars were still pretty new and we're very much 107 00:06:17,279 --> 00:06:20,320 Speaker 1: for the rich. But the horse and buggy and the 108 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 1: horse drawn carriage did not enjoy these roads either. Sure No, 109 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: and then um, another mode of transportation, the bicycle, actually 110 00:06:29,440 --> 00:06:34,599 Speaker 1: created something called the better roads movement. Good roads, good 111 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:38,960 Speaker 1: roads movement. I like mine better. Yeah, you got good, 112 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:43,400 Speaker 1: but wouldn't we rather have better? Sure in the meeting, 113 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:47,400 Speaker 1: let's think old timey folks. So um, the good roads 114 00:06:47,440 --> 00:06:50,159 Speaker 1: movement was was created by bicycle enthusiasts who said, like, 115 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:54,080 Speaker 1: these you know, dirt track, muddy roads aren't gonna work 116 00:06:54,080 --> 00:06:58,719 Speaker 1: for bikes. And when people started using automobiles, especially like 117 00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:01,479 Speaker 1: you said, wealthy people, at first they were like, these 118 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:04,320 Speaker 1: bike people are onto something. I'm a car guy, but 119 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:06,600 Speaker 1: the same apply. So let's kind of adopt this good 120 00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:11,080 Speaker 1: road movement and we're gonna start agitating for better roads. 121 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 1: And those better roads are, like you said, just laying 122 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:16,560 Speaker 1: down a layer of gravel was a vast improvement over 123 00:07:16,600 --> 00:07:20,160 Speaker 1: what they had before. Yeah, and there was also UM 124 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:26,559 Speaker 1: legislation in for what's called rural free Delivery RFD. Mail 125 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 1: because at the time, if you lived in the country, 126 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:31,560 Speaker 1: you went and picked up your mail, they didn't bring 127 00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:35,480 Speaker 1: it to you. It seems appropriate, and so in they 128 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:38,080 Speaker 1: finally passed legislation that said, you know, we need to 129 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:40,720 Speaker 1: get mail to people, and that was a big part 130 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:44,080 Speaker 1: of improving the roads as well. They're never gonna find 131 00:07:44,120 --> 00:07:48,000 Speaker 1: out about Circuit City's newest sale if we don't get 132 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:51,040 Speaker 1: them their mail out in the out in the rural sticks. 133 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 1: That's right. So, um, there are people agitating for road improvement, 134 00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:59,680 Speaker 1: but at the time it was it was kind of 135 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:04,840 Speaker 1: take and on by the wealthy people who owned cars, um, industrialists, 136 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:08,680 Speaker 1: philanthropist benefactors. This is all like within the first twenty 137 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:12,520 Speaker 1: twenty years of the twentieth century, I think, um, where 138 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:15,360 Speaker 1: clubs were formed where they said we're going to take 139 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:20,320 Speaker 1: over responsibility for improving roads and just basically getting things 140 00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:23,240 Speaker 1: up to snuff so that um, you know, we can 141 00:08:23,320 --> 00:08:26,440 Speaker 1: drive our cars on these things. And I think they 142 00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: did it fairly locally at first, but by the Lincoln 143 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:34,160 Speaker 1: Highway was built, and that was the first transcontinental highway 144 00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:39,080 Speaker 1: that was basically built four cars. Yeah, I went from 145 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:42,680 Speaker 1: Times Square in New York to Lincoln Park in San Francisco. 146 00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:46,320 Speaker 1: And it didn't just carve it out of you know, 147 00:08:46,400 --> 00:08:48,319 Speaker 1: barren earth. That used a lot of the roads that 148 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:52,920 Speaker 1: are already there, improved on those connected stuff together. Uh. 149 00:08:52,960 --> 00:08:55,400 Speaker 1: There was a dude named Carl G. Fisher. Did you 150 00:08:55,400 --> 00:08:58,760 Speaker 1: look into this guy. Yeah, he was an entrepreneur from Indiana, 151 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:03,920 Speaker 1: real estate mogul and really big time auto slash auto 152 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:09,520 Speaker 1: raceing enthusiasts who had a way of marketing and like 153 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:12,480 Speaker 1: drumming up support for stuff like this. Yeah, he was. 154 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:15,400 Speaker 1: He was big time into racing cars. But he had 155 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:18,760 Speaker 1: like such severe stigmatism. He had like coke bottle glasses. 156 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:22,600 Speaker 1: But he's still raced cars and um, he actually set 157 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: the record, the land speed automobile record. He made it 158 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:28,920 Speaker 1: around a two mile. He made it around a track 159 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 1: two miles on a track in two minutes. Broke the record. 160 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 1: That's not a joke. That's adorable. It is. It's pretty cute, 161 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 1: isn't it. Yeah, he had he had the calm down. 162 00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 1: He took five days for his nerves to you know 163 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 1: stabilize after that top speed. But he was the champion 164 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 1: of this highway, of the Lincoln Highway. Um, it became 165 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,640 Speaker 1: famous for you know, kind of like Root six sixty six, 166 00:09:53,679 --> 00:09:56,440 Speaker 1: We did an episode on that, Um, Lincoln Highway was 167 00:09:56,520 --> 00:10:00,440 Speaker 1: notable for its famous roadside giants and attraction and things, 168 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 1: just like Root sixty six was yep, so then um, 169 00:10:04,400 --> 00:10:06,920 Speaker 1: but still there was this idea that that private groups 170 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 1: of auto enthusiasts were kind of the ones who are 171 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 1: responsible for taking care of roads or designating highways, that 172 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 1: kind of thing. And this group called the American Association 173 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:20,199 Speaker 1: of State Highway Officials now it's the American Association of 174 00:10:20,280 --> 00:10:25,120 Speaker 1: State Highway and Transportation Officials. They sound like this very um, 175 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:28,679 Speaker 1: legal important group, and they are, but they're not an 176 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:33,960 Speaker 1: actual like government group. They're non government organization that basically 177 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:37,200 Speaker 1: started and I think nineteen fourteen saying we're in charge 178 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:40,200 Speaker 1: of saying what the best practices are for roads, what 179 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:43,160 Speaker 1: roads should be made into highways, And they managed to 180 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:49,199 Speaker 1: basically insinuate themselves in between the government and the highway 181 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 1: system and said, hey, these roads should be highways. Why 182 00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:55,440 Speaker 1: don't you go fund and improve these these roads right 183 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:57,360 Speaker 1: here in the government said sure, we'll do that, and 184 00:10:57,400 --> 00:10:59,080 Speaker 1: that's kind of how we started to get our first 185 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 1: highway system. Yeah, so they were nineteen fourteen. Then two 186 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:05,840 Speaker 1: years later the Federal Aid Road Act came along to 187 00:11:05,920 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 1: provide funding, and I guess future libertarians started to weep 188 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:14,960 Speaker 1: because the public couldn't take care of their own roads anymore, 189 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 1: or maybe they were sad because it came clear that 190 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:20,640 Speaker 1: the public taking care of its own roads was not 191 00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 1: a workable solution for the future. So they had to 192 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 1: rely on the federal government to come in and they did. 193 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:29,320 Speaker 1: And this this group, uh, as you said, now, the 194 00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:34,319 Speaker 1: A s h t O. Not only did they designate 195 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:38,040 Speaker 1: highways and connect cities, but they said, you know, you 196 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:41,360 Speaker 1: should get funds, this road should be improved. We need 197 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 1: to get a numbering system, we need to get signage 198 00:11:43,840 --> 00:11:46,760 Speaker 1: that makes sense. And we'll get to the numbering system. 199 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 1: But the basics of it are that highways are numbered 200 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:53,880 Speaker 1: in reverse order from inner states, because what you don't 201 00:11:53,920 --> 00:11:57,760 Speaker 1: want is like those numbers to be too close to 202 00:11:57,800 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 1: one another, right, which is which I actually led to. 203 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:04,080 Speaker 1: One of the corks of the US interstate system is 204 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:07,560 Speaker 1: that there's actually no I fifty in the United States 205 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:11,719 Speaker 1: because there's a US Highway fifty and they would be 206 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:15,840 Speaker 1: in the exact same spot basically, and US Highway fifty 207 00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:18,520 Speaker 1: I looked into It's called the loneliest road in America 208 00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:21,920 Speaker 1: because it goes through some of the most desolate stretches 209 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:25,000 Speaker 1: in the entire country. Doesn't look like a fun trip 210 00:12:25,040 --> 00:12:28,360 Speaker 1: to me. Where where does it go through? Um? The 211 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:34,880 Speaker 1: flyover states basically the drive through states kind of yeah, 212 00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:38,000 Speaker 1: but it's like it goes I can't remember exactly where 213 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:39,960 Speaker 1: it goes through, but from from what I was reading, 214 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 1: it's like there's huge long stretches between gas stations and 215 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:46,760 Speaker 1: towns and stuff like that, far more than the average 216 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:51,240 Speaker 1: even back road highway. Interesting. I'm wondering. I'm just trying 217 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: to think if I've been on it. I'll have to 218 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:54,520 Speaker 1: look at the map I looked. I wondered if you, 219 00:12:54,559 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 1: me and I have been on it between Scottsdale in 220 00:12:57,600 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 1: Las Vegas, because I was like, man, we were death 221 00:13:00,040 --> 00:13:03,640 Speaker 1: really on desolate stretches. No, that was I think like 222 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 1: ninety three or something like that, or sixty maybe sixty. 223 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:09,600 Speaker 1: It wasn't fifty though. Yeah. When I did my big 224 00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:12,079 Speaker 1: Outwest trips, I was definitely on some roads where I thought, 225 00:13:12,960 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 1: if I have car trouble, I'm you know, the buzzards 226 00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:20,160 Speaker 1: will be circling doomed. Yeah. Yeah, so the highway systems going, 227 00:13:21,280 --> 00:13:23,840 Speaker 1: not the interstate system yet. Yeah, that's a big, big 228 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 1: thing to remember. We're talking about two different things here, Yeah, 229 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:30,200 Speaker 1: big deaf because these roads were still many, most of 230 00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:33,560 Speaker 1: them two lane roads, and they still had some you know, 231 00:13:34,200 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 1: dangerous curves, and they had stop lights, and they went 232 00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: through little towns in big towns, and they were just 233 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:44,440 Speaker 1: connected together at least that's right. So around this time, though, 234 00:13:44,480 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 1: is this highway system is is um coming along and improving. 235 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:51,920 Speaker 1: They were just constantly adding to it and designating new 236 00:13:52,120 --> 00:13:55,880 Speaker 1: roads that were you know, traditional horse and buggy paths 237 00:13:55,920 --> 00:14:00,480 Speaker 1: to be improved into US highways. The autumn beal is 238 00:14:00,559 --> 00:14:03,880 Speaker 1: becoming more and more important. Is going from you know, 239 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:07,760 Speaker 1: a luxury of the very rich to something that just 240 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:11,079 Speaker 1: about every American was starting to depend on, especially people 241 00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:15,840 Speaker 1: who didn't live in the center of a city. So um, 242 00:14:15,880 --> 00:14:18,880 Speaker 1: as the car gets more important, the highways start to 243 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:22,120 Speaker 1: get more and more important, and people started to say, look, 244 00:14:22,160 --> 00:14:24,680 Speaker 1: I think we might be able to do better than 245 00:14:24,760 --> 00:14:28,120 Speaker 1: what we have now. And that actually was the fire 246 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:32,160 Speaker 1: that ignited the interstate system as we understand it today. 247 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:35,200 Speaker 1: That sounds like a great time to stop. As I 248 00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:37,320 Speaker 1: was saying at Chuck, I was like, God, this is 249 00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 1: such a great segue into a message. Yeah, we'll take 250 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 1: a little break and come back and talk about FDR 251 00:14:42,800 --> 00:15:00,920 Speaker 1: right after this. Well, now we're on the road, driving 252 00:15:01,040 --> 00:15:03,560 Speaker 1: in your truck. Want to learn a thing or two 253 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:10,080 Speaker 1: from Josh Camp Chuck stuff you should know? All right? 254 00:15:12,400 --> 00:15:16,400 Speaker 1: All right, So highways are being built, they're being connected. 255 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 1: But uh, in N seven, Franklin Delano Roosevelt said, here's 256 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:28,560 Speaker 1: a plan. Uh to the Bureau Public Roads, it's seven 257 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:33,680 Speaker 1: they're six super highways. And everyone went, what he's like, 258 00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,600 Speaker 1: these are going to connect our nation. And they had 259 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:39,760 Speaker 1: all these reports done and that sort of formed the 260 00:15:39,760 --> 00:15:42,960 Speaker 1: basis of what would become our highway system. But we 261 00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:45,240 Speaker 1: couldn't afford to do this at the time. World War 262 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 1: two came along and everything just sort of was put 263 00:15:47,960 --> 00:15:53,080 Speaker 1: on hold, right um understandably so. But then afterward America 264 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:55,800 Speaker 1: was like, man, we've got a lot of money. And 265 00:15:55,880 --> 00:15:59,200 Speaker 1: from what I've read, there was a concern that this 266 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 1: post war boom that had been generated by World War two, 267 00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 1: because you know, one of the big knock on effects 268 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:08,200 Speaker 1: of World War two, it pulled us right out of 269 00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:11,960 Speaker 1: the great depression and put us into a pretty great 270 00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:14,680 Speaker 1: um boom period. I think they were scared to death 271 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:17,320 Speaker 1: that we were going to go back to a recession 272 00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:20,440 Speaker 1: or lose this boom. And so some people say that 273 00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:23,120 Speaker 1: one of the main reasons, one of the great unstated 274 00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 1: reasons for why the federal government was suddenly so um 275 00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 1: happy over the idea of spending billions and billions and 276 00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:34,760 Speaker 1: billions of dollars to create this interstate system was to 277 00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:38,760 Speaker 1: put significant numbers of people to work and just flood 278 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:43,400 Speaker 1: the economy throughout the entire country with government money to 279 00:16:43,760 --> 00:16:46,040 Speaker 1: um just keep that post war boom going. And it 280 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:48,880 Speaker 1: worked like an absolute charm. It still works. I mean, 281 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:55,040 Speaker 1: that's still a stimulus package that's reliable is a lot 282 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 1: of times now it's improving stuff obviously, but you know, 283 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 1: that's what a lot of presidents turned to, like, let's 284 00:17:00,360 --> 00:17:03,400 Speaker 1: get people working on these roads that are falling apart. Yeah, 285 00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:07,000 Speaker 1: look at these slackers, Somebody give them some asphalt. So 286 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 1: Eisenhower is obviously most associated with the interstate system because 287 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:14,159 Speaker 1: it was when he was in office and he pushed 288 00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:17,160 Speaker 1: for the Federal Aid Highway Act of nineteen fifty six, 289 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:22,800 Speaker 1: which really kind of made everything legit um. For many reasons, 290 00:17:22,840 --> 00:17:26,439 Speaker 1: this was like a very necessary thing, not least of 291 00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:30,000 Speaker 1: which was for the military. We talked about, you know, 292 00:17:30,040 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 1: since World War One, we needed bigger roads, Like we 293 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: didn't have railroad capacity to take all the armaments and 294 00:17:37,600 --> 00:17:40,320 Speaker 1: all the things we needed and supplies, and then we 295 00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:43,360 Speaker 1: didn't have the highways that could do it either. So 296 00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 1: in nineteen one, this guy named Thomas McDonald, he's ahead 297 00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:50,639 Speaker 1: of the Bureau of Public Roads. He and his staff 298 00:17:50,680 --> 00:17:55,080 Speaker 1: really drew up this this map, this proposed system of 299 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:59,240 Speaker 1: seventy eight thousand miles. Handed it over to General John Pershing, 300 00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:03,200 Speaker 1: who presented it to Congress and said, we need these 301 00:18:03,240 --> 00:18:06,000 Speaker 1: for you know, this is critical for the military. Became 302 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 1: known as the Pershing Map, even though he just handed 303 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 1: it over to Congress. It should be the Thomas McDonald map. Sure, 304 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:14,359 Speaker 1: but nobody knew who he was, and they would have 305 00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:16,280 Speaker 1: been like, get out of here, McDonald, you know, buddy, 306 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:19,320 Speaker 1: probably General Pershing. They were like yes, sir, and like 307 00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:23,199 Speaker 1: clicked their heels together and started building things. So, but 308 00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:25,199 Speaker 1: that was back in the twenties. I think that the 309 00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:28,480 Speaker 1: Pershing map was handed over right, but it was apparently 310 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,280 Speaker 1: such a good map. The pershing slash McDonald map. That's 311 00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:33,760 Speaker 1: what we're gonna read, Christen it okay, Yeah, And it 312 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:36,280 Speaker 1: was pretty I mean they drew it up in a 313 00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:38,440 Speaker 1: way that made sense. But it wasn't like here's your 314 00:18:38,440 --> 00:18:41,400 Speaker 1: exact blueprint. It's just like we've connected all the places 315 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:44,720 Speaker 1: we think we should connect. But it was basically the 316 00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:48,280 Speaker 1: general blueprint that was used for the interstate system. So 317 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:51,720 Speaker 1: it was pretty pretty well done map. As Yes, it 318 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:54,880 Speaker 1: wasn't research, but they weren't you know, thirty years later 319 00:18:54,920 --> 00:18:57,880 Speaker 1: they didn't go with this McDonald guy was way off there, 320 00:18:57,880 --> 00:19:00,960 Speaker 1: basically like this this works really well, that's right. An 321 00:19:01,119 --> 00:19:04,800 Speaker 1: Eisenhower himself had traveled the Lincoln Highway during World War 322 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:07,959 Speaker 1: One in a military convoy and he was like this 323 00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: kind of stinks. And all the military brass in Europe 324 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:14,480 Speaker 1: saw the Auto Bahn and they saw the highways in 325 00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:16,800 Speaker 1: Italy and they were like, we need some of this stuff. 326 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:20,359 Speaker 1: Plus also not just the military, but related to the military. 327 00:19:20,440 --> 00:19:22,679 Speaker 1: This was done during the Cold War. You know, this 328 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:25,400 Speaker 1: is nineteen fifty six that the legislation was signed into 329 00:19:25,480 --> 00:19:29,000 Speaker 1: law to create the interstate and this is you know, 330 00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:32,440 Speaker 1: a pretty uneasy time. So there was a real concern 331 00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:36,840 Speaker 1: that with the existing original US highway system, if atomic 332 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:39,840 Speaker 1: bombs started getting dropped out of the United States, we'd 333 00:19:39,880 --> 00:19:42,560 Speaker 1: have a really hard time moving people from place to place, 334 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 1: from bomb cities to unaffected cities. And um, this interstate 335 00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:51,160 Speaker 1: was a big solution to that too. Yeah. And uh, 336 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:55,720 Speaker 1: not to oversell the military importance, but it was literally 337 00:19:55,760 --> 00:20:00,520 Speaker 1: called at first the National System of Interstate and Defense Highways, right, 338 00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:05,760 Speaker 1: defense highways. Yeah. Interesting, At least it's not the offense highways, 339 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:08,560 Speaker 1: you know what I mean, they're real aggressive, the pokey 340 00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:13,399 Speaker 1: in the chest where they're talking to you. So. Um. 341 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 1: There was another another reason. There's a whole list of reasons. 342 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:19,480 Speaker 1: A lot of people say, oh, it's all military. That's 343 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:21,600 Speaker 1: that was large part of it, but that certainly was 344 00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:23,680 Speaker 1: not the only reason that the interstates were built in 345 00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: the United States. Another one was that people were starting 346 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:30,360 Speaker 1: to move into the cities more and more, and they 347 00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:33,400 Speaker 1: had been for decades already. People were moving, leaving their 348 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:37,960 Speaker 1: farms for factories. But this is putting an enormous strain 349 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 1: on the cities themselves, as huge influx of people that 350 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:43,920 Speaker 1: the infrastructure couldn't really support. So they said, well, wait, 351 00:20:43,960 --> 00:20:46,400 Speaker 1: a minute. If we build these interstates, we'll be able 352 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 1: to more easily connect these rural areas with the cities. 353 00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:53,120 Speaker 1: And then I've got this genius idea that people can 354 00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:56,199 Speaker 1: continue to live in the rural areas but go to 355 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:59,520 Speaker 1: and from work each day in the city. What do 356 00:20:59,560 --> 00:21:02,240 Speaker 1: you think of out that? And everyone said, that's that's 357 00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:05,840 Speaker 1: probably the best most flawless idea anyone's ever had in 358 00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:08,920 Speaker 1: the history of the world. Right, and then que upcoming 359 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:13,119 Speaker 1: podcast on the suburbs, right exactly and excerbs nice. I 360 00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:15,720 Speaker 1: think we just did like a choose your own adventure 361 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:20,880 Speaker 1: wedge in their trucks is pretty sweet. Another couple of reasons, uh, 362 00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:24,280 Speaker 1: leisure travel. You know, people hitting getting in their car 363 00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:27,320 Speaker 1: with the family and going on a vacation, driving across 364 00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:31,320 Speaker 1: country to see these roadside attractions and stay in hotels 365 00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:34,080 Speaker 1: and swimming swimming pools. It was all very new stuff 366 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:39,600 Speaker 1: in America. Safety interstates, no matter which way you slice it, 367 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:42,119 Speaker 1: are a lot safer, even though you're going faster, a 368 00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:44,320 Speaker 1: lot safer than these highways that they had out there. Yeah, 369 00:21:44,359 --> 00:21:46,600 Speaker 1: which is really funny to think of if like I 370 00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:49,320 Speaker 1: think of highways like crash on a highway it's just 371 00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:53,120 Speaker 1: like you know, limbs everywhere and just blood all over 372 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:56,199 Speaker 1: the place. But the thing is like, yes, you you 373 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,159 Speaker 1: can get into big serious trouble going very fast on 374 00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:01,800 Speaker 1: on the highway or on an interstate. But on a 375 00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:06,200 Speaker 1: highway you don't have things like this designated um set 376 00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:11,760 Speaker 1: distance between the incoming and on oncoming traffic. UM. You 377 00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 1: don't have like gentle slopes to the shoulders so that 378 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:17,119 Speaker 1: if you do, you know, fall off the side of 379 00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: the road, you're not necessarily go yeah, you're not necessarily 380 00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:22,800 Speaker 1: going to bear overall. You might just like keep driving straight. 381 00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:26,560 Speaker 1: There's all these designs that are created to make highways safer, 382 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:30,240 Speaker 1: interstates safer than highways, And part of it is like 383 00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:34,560 Speaker 1: you can't get in an head on collision with another car. 384 00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:38,480 Speaker 1: It's basically impossible on a United States interstates. Well, and yeah, 385 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 1: unless somebody gets on going the wrong way, which happens, 386 00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:45,719 Speaker 1: it does happen very infrequently, but under normal conditions, you're 387 00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:48,000 Speaker 1: not gonna veer out of your lane. You'll veer into 388 00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:51,960 Speaker 1: the median and go, what the heck happened? I'm driving 389 00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:55,880 Speaker 1: on grass right exactly the other the other there's two 390 00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:59,280 Speaker 1: other things that make interstates distinct from highways that improve 391 00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:04,760 Speaker 1: their safety safety tremendously. One is that there's there controlled 392 00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:10,040 Speaker 1: h entrance and exits right. So that means that when 393 00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:14,679 Speaker 1: you get onto a highway or an interstate, man, I'm 394 00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:18,840 Speaker 1: gonna do that all episode apparently you're you're traveling in 395 00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:23,840 Speaker 1: the same direction as traffic and ideally at speed. So 396 00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:28,160 Speaker 1: I remember very distinctly in UH driver's ed the first 397 00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:31,240 Speaker 1: time I emerged onto the highway and how nerve wracking 398 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:34,159 Speaker 1: that is, and the dude telling me to punch it, 399 00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:37,280 Speaker 1: and I'm like, but the speed limit and he was 400 00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:41,240 Speaker 1: he was correct, He was correct, and saying like, no, man, 401 00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:43,879 Speaker 1: it doesn't matter, like you gotta go as fast as 402 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:47,040 Speaker 1: they're going or it's dangerous. That's right, But that's a 403 00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 1: that's a huge difference. Then, say like a highway where 404 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:54,040 Speaker 1: somebody turns right into traffic and all the people behind 405 00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:56,399 Speaker 1: them have to slow while they speed up to the 406 00:23:56,440 --> 00:23:59,520 Speaker 1: flow of traffic. So that's a huge thing. And then 407 00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:02,320 Speaker 1: also the reason why people don't turn right onto the 408 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:07,080 Speaker 1: highway is because any criss cross with the interstate, I 409 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:11,400 Speaker 1: should say, did it again, any any criss cross with it, 410 00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:14,679 Speaker 1: um is goes over like it's a bridge. You have 411 00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:17,760 Speaker 1: an overpass. That's how you get across the highway. There's 412 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:21,080 Speaker 1: no stop lights, there's no you know, somebody just driving, 413 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:24,639 Speaker 1: you know, perpendicular with the flow of traffic. You go 414 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:27,480 Speaker 1: over that with an interstate I love it. At the 415 00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 1: beginning of this, he said, this is a very important distinction. 416 00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:33,680 Speaker 1: You should have said, which I will fail to make 417 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:38,960 Speaker 1: over and over, which I will blur in your mind forever. Uh. 418 00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:40,920 Speaker 1: And then the other one of the other big things, 419 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:43,720 Speaker 1: you know, and Ed said, they don't have stop lights. Um, 420 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:46,120 Speaker 1: there are traffic lights now and a lot of cities 421 00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:50,200 Speaker 1: to more safely get you onto the highway, but they 422 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:53,000 Speaker 1: still give you enough ramp time to get up to speed. 423 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,959 Speaker 1: That's it. That's for to ease congestion. Yeah, just so 424 00:24:58,000 --> 00:24:59,720 Speaker 1: there's not a hundred cars trying to pile on it. 425 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:03,000 Speaker 1: One it's it's one car every whatever, three or four seconds. 426 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:05,760 Speaker 1: I think we talked about that in our traffic episode. 427 00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 1: Not pretty sure like that really really helps ease congestion. Traffic. Yeah, 428 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:15,480 Speaker 1: that yeah, you coin that I did, didn't I didn't 429 00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:19,119 Speaker 1: I break bubble one of the bubbles. I think it 430 00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:21,760 Speaker 1: was the break bubble. I think so I certainly talked 431 00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:24,920 Speaker 1: about a lot. I remember that. Uh. And then one 432 00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:27,440 Speaker 1: of the other big reasons kind of to kind of 433 00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:30,160 Speaker 1: jump back here, why we needed these highways. I'm sorry, 434 00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:34,520 Speaker 1: here we go again, interstates with simple economics. If you 435 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:40,160 Speaker 1: could get these, uh, urban centers connected to rural towns 436 00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:44,359 Speaker 1: and these efficient roads where you could ship goods faster 437 00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:47,160 Speaker 1: and further than you ever have, and extend the range 438 00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 1: of the workforce more than you ever have, It's just 439 00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:53,960 Speaker 1: cannot be overstated what that did for the American economy. Yeah, 440 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:57,840 Speaker 1: because I mean connecting those rural areas and eventually suburban areas. 441 00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:02,520 Speaker 1: It's like you have a way bigger workforce pool if 442 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:05,480 Speaker 1: you're a company located downtown then you did with these highways, 443 00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:09,439 Speaker 1: because you know, the commute would have just been unsustainable, unbearable. 444 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:12,400 Speaker 1: I mean it's already bad enough on the interstates, but 445 00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:15,480 Speaker 1: with just you know, original US highways, it just wouldn't 446 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:19,560 Speaker 1: you couldn't do it. Here's to me, one of the 447 00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:23,520 Speaker 1: more interesting parts of this is that originally the US 448 00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:27,880 Speaker 1: interstate system and Eisenhower wanted them to all be toll 449 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:31,439 Speaker 1: roads because he's like, what's better than having something that 450 00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:34,560 Speaker 1: people just it pays for itself. But they did all 451 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:36,879 Speaker 1: these studies and it turns out, and I think this 452 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:40,399 Speaker 1: is still pretty much true, toll roads aren't a super 453 00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:44,800 Speaker 1: great idea. And there have to be very specific conditions 454 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:47,520 Speaker 1: where in a toll road will actually pay for itself 455 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:51,200 Speaker 1: or even you know, bring in a profit right like 456 00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 1: you have. It has to be in a very um 457 00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:57,120 Speaker 1: heavily trafficked area, and then there has to be basically 458 00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:00,160 Speaker 1: no other alternative but that road to get from point 459 00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:02,439 Speaker 1: to point be Otherwise people are just gonna say I'm 460 00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:04,840 Speaker 1: gonna save my nickel or whatever it was back then. 461 00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:08,600 Speaker 1: That's why remember four hundred Georgia four hundred. It was 462 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:11,359 Speaker 1: really successful as a toll road because it was so 463 00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:14,119 Speaker 1: successful that it paid for the road. It paid for 464 00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:16,439 Speaker 1: itself within twenty years, and they ripped the toll booths 465 00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:18,439 Speaker 1: out because Republicans were in charge of the time. They 466 00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:22,120 Speaker 1: said no more tolls. Do you remember, Yeah? I think 467 00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,560 Speaker 1: they were up longer than they said they were going 468 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,080 Speaker 1: to be up, though, and people started complaining like, hey, 469 00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:30,160 Speaker 1: I thought the plan was these are going down. Yeah. 470 00:27:30,160 --> 00:27:32,040 Speaker 1: And Sonny Perdue, I think, was the guy who was like, 471 00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 1: all right, we're getting rid of them, or maybe it 472 00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:37,640 Speaker 1: was deal, I can't remember. But the the reason four 473 00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:40,040 Speaker 1: hundred was so successful as a toll roads because there 474 00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:43,119 Speaker 1: really weren't very many other ways to to get you know, 475 00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:46,280 Speaker 1: from uh, the Buckhead area of Atlanta up to the 476 00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:51,000 Speaker 1: northern north Eastern suburbs except for four hundred. Yeah, that 477 00:27:51,040 --> 00:27:53,120 Speaker 1: was I mean, I don't I don't have to pay 478 00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:55,199 Speaker 1: two dollars to go see my brother now, and I 479 00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:57,639 Speaker 1: had to do that for many years, except for the 480 00:27:57,640 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 1: two dollars he charges me when I show up at 481 00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:02,520 Speaker 1: his front door to play is Adams Family Pimball, He's like, 482 00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:04,239 Speaker 1: give me two dollars. It has to be a two 483 00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:07,800 Speaker 1: dollar bill to will not accept anything else. That's so 484 00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:11,960 Speaker 1: scott so um. The toll roads don't pay for themselves. 485 00:28:12,080 --> 00:28:14,000 Speaker 1: One reason why I chuck. They don't typically pay for 486 00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:17,879 Speaker 1: themselves because especially if you're talking about interstates, there's really 487 00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:21,560 Speaker 1: long stretches of interstate that are not heavily traffics and 488 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:23,400 Speaker 1: you would have to pay for that with the toll Well, 489 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,159 Speaker 1: if somebody's coming through, you know, once a day and 490 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:29,280 Speaker 1: paying a dollar, that's not going to pay for the upkeep. 491 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:31,479 Speaker 1: So much so that they actually there was a study 492 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,320 Speaker 1: that was done I think ahead of time. Uh that 493 00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:37,080 Speaker 1: when they were planning the interstates, and they found that 494 00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:41,000 Speaker 1: a lot of these, even like fairly successful toll roads 495 00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:44,560 Speaker 1: or toll interstates, probably would just barely pay for the 496 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:48,400 Speaker 1: salaries of the tollbooth workers. So like that's a wash 497 00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:50,640 Speaker 1: of all washes. So they said, okay, no toll roads. 498 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:55,200 Speaker 1: How about instead we'll start taxing gasoline. Yeah, not just gasoline, 499 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:58,960 Speaker 1: but let's let's propose a bill that taxes the rubber 500 00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:03,160 Speaker 1: industry because of tires um the trucking industry, and they 501 00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:07,240 Speaker 1: all said, no, I don't want to be taxed forget this. 502 00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:09,880 Speaker 1: I don't like it. So they said, all right, we're 503 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:12,040 Speaker 1: not gonna do this. Yeah, they managed to beat the 504 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:15,480 Speaker 1: bill to create the interstate system. Yeah, they beat it down. Uh, 505 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:20,640 Speaker 1: Congress goes into recession. And then the trucking industry went, uh, 506 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:23,480 Speaker 1: what do we just do because this actually would have 507 00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:27,760 Speaker 1: been a really great thing for trucking. Uh, and so 508 00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:30,320 Speaker 1: maybe we do want that after all. And they came 509 00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:33,640 Speaker 1: back with a different bill that was pretty much the same, 510 00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: and that one passed. Yeah, and you can understand why 511 00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:38,560 Speaker 1: they were They were a little shortsighted. They said, well, 512 00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:41,320 Speaker 1: we don't want to pay extra for tires and for gasoline. 513 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:43,920 Speaker 1: We used that stuff, but then somebody crunches the numbers 514 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:47,080 Speaker 1: and said, well everybody showed up. But the idea that 515 00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:49,600 Speaker 1: that it would be done through tax dollars rather than 516 00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:54,040 Speaker 1: toll roads. That was a big um result of a 517 00:29:54,160 --> 00:29:58,120 Speaker 1: PR push that was taken up by UM, the Triple A, 518 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:02,520 Speaker 1: General Motors, other car companies. They formed something called the 519 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:08,880 Speaker 1: National Highway Users Conference and UM. From this they basically 520 00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:13,880 Speaker 1: managed to create this this change of mentality in Americans 521 00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:17,680 Speaker 1: minds from oh yeah, roads are created and supported by 522 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,160 Speaker 1: rich people and auto enthusiasts too. It is a national 523 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:24,560 Speaker 1: duty to build and maintain roads, and it is the 524 00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:28,360 Speaker 1: federal government's responsibility to create inner states. And that was 525 00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:30,760 Speaker 1: the result of a PR push. And part of that 526 00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:34,640 Speaker 1: PR push is how we got freeways. That was meant 527 00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:37,320 Speaker 1: to really kind of point out how bad an idea 528 00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:40,480 Speaker 1: toll roads were. The ideas you don't want toll roads, 529 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:43,280 Speaker 1: you want free roads, which came to be called freeways, 530 00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:50,520 Speaker 1: and freeways are basically supported by gas tax. That's great, 531 00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:53,200 Speaker 1: I thought so too. That's a good little dinner party 532 00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:57,520 Speaker 1: if you want to be super obnoxious. Yeah, oh, you 533 00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:00,200 Speaker 1: drove over on the freeway. You know where they can that. 534 00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:03,720 Speaker 1: So the inshot of all this, or the upshot I 535 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:08,600 Speaker 1: guess there is no inshot, is that these taxes would 536 00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:12,320 Speaker 1: be placed into the Highway Trust Fund, and it's a 537 00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:15,000 Speaker 1: pretty good deal for for states. It's sort of like 538 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:19,680 Speaker 1: Social Security. The government is going to tax uh letty 539 00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:23,360 Speaker 1: these taxes to pay for more highways, but provide of 540 00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,959 Speaker 1: that funding to states to do it themselves. So the states, 541 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:31,000 Speaker 1: they're getting lots of jobs created, these big, huge public 542 00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:33,640 Speaker 1: works projects, they only have to pay ten percent of 543 00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:36,680 Speaker 1: that and they get a highway on top of that. Yeah. So, 544 00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:40,480 Speaker 1: like mayors and governors loved this idea because it made 545 00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:43,200 Speaker 1: them look like they were just so like all this 546 00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:46,280 Speaker 1: job creation and economic growth was happening under them, and 547 00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:49,080 Speaker 1: it just got dropped in their laps by by Ike 548 00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:50,920 Speaker 1: and the Feds and they're only on the hook for 549 00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:54,200 Speaker 1: ten percent of it. And the idea was every American 550 00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:57,760 Speaker 1: city with at least fifty people, uh, we're going to 551 00:31:57,840 --> 00:32:01,240 Speaker 1: connect to them all within thirteen years, which did not happen. No, 552 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:04,400 Speaker 1: it didn't. As a matter of fact, officially, the first 553 00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:11,240 Speaker 1: UM original plan was completed in Yeah, it was a 554 00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:14,480 Speaker 1: little more than thirteen years from nineteen fifty six. Yeah, 555 00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:16,920 Speaker 1: and that points out it's i mean, it's technically finished, 556 00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:20,320 Speaker 1: but it's never finished. It's always being worked on and 557 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:24,120 Speaker 1: tweaked and changed here and there. Ye, so Chuck. Before 558 00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:28,720 Speaker 1: they got started, they had to actually do some research first. 559 00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:31,200 Speaker 1: This is pretty cool. They didn't just say, sure, we 560 00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:34,240 Speaker 1: we've been building highways, we know how to build interstates. Um, 561 00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:37,440 Speaker 1: They really, you know, did a lot of examination on 562 00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:40,480 Speaker 1: how to best build these because the interstate is much 563 00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 1: different from the highway. Like the highway just kind of 564 00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:47,920 Speaker 1: went around, Um, the terrain and the landscape. It was 565 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:51,440 Speaker 1: bent to the will of the landscape, subservient to it. 566 00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:57,800 Speaker 1: Interstates are not like that. They are American muscle carving 567 00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:01,479 Speaker 1: through mother Earth. Were over that. Interstate wants to go 568 00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:06,080 Speaker 1: fast as you please. And they use something called cut 569 00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:08,440 Speaker 1: and fill, which is exactly what it sounds like. They 570 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:11,400 Speaker 1: just cut out the track for the interstate and then 571 00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:14,120 Speaker 1: they filled it with the stuff that makes up the 572 00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:17,320 Speaker 1: interstate roads. But to figure out what to use for 573 00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:19,760 Speaker 1: the interstate roads, they actually did a tremendous amount of 574 00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:23,120 Speaker 1: research first. Yeah, they this is really cool. They built 575 00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:28,400 Speaker 1: these test tracks near Chicago, Illinois, and assigned a U. S. 576 00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:31,920 Speaker 1: Army company to live there for two years and load 577 00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:35,520 Speaker 1: up trucks and drive them around nineteen hours every day 578 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:39,719 Speaker 1: for two years. Sounds so awful to see, Like, you know, 579 00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:42,840 Speaker 1: you can't just willy nilly build a road that's supposed 580 00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:46,640 Speaker 1: to last forever, you know, with with upkeep obviously, but 581 00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:49,080 Speaker 1: you got to really really test the stuff out over 582 00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:53,280 Speaker 1: time and wait and duration to to make sure that 583 00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:55,920 Speaker 1: it holds up. So they had to do all this 584 00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:58,040 Speaker 1: to determine how thick it needed to be, in what 585 00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:00,440 Speaker 1: the layers need to be, and what the final player 586 00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:03,800 Speaker 1: is going to be. And uh, not only that, they 587 00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:06,680 Speaker 1: had to decide like hey, what about signage, It's got 588 00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:09,520 Speaker 1: to be all the same. Uh. They ended up settling 589 00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:14,400 Speaker 1: on green with reverse messaging, so green background white lettering, 590 00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:18,600 Speaker 1: which apparently is they did test. It's more visible if 591 00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:21,400 Speaker 1: you have a reverse message then the other way around, 592 00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:24,600 Speaker 1: especially at night, rather than like say, black letters on 593 00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:28,680 Speaker 1: a white field. Yeah, exactly. Which speed limit signs are 594 00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:31,120 Speaker 1: like that, but you know they they have to distinguish 595 00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:33,640 Speaker 1: like the exit signs and the highway signs because the 596 00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:38,480 Speaker 1: actual highway badge interstate badge is blue and red, red, 597 00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:40,280 Speaker 1: white and blue. I guess if you count the white. 598 00:34:41,080 --> 00:34:44,279 Speaker 1: I just got that. Yeah, there's white on their right 599 00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:46,800 Speaker 1: and the outlined in white. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Uh. 600 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:50,440 Speaker 1: And they tested colors. They decided green generally means go, 601 00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:55,480 Speaker 1: so we're gonna stick with green. Uh, but red, white, 602 00:34:55,480 --> 00:34:58,560 Speaker 1: and blue for the shields for interstates, but green shields 603 00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:01,600 Speaker 1: for business loops and spur Oh yeah when you see 604 00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:03,560 Speaker 1: this weird thing, Yeah, it does look a little weird. 605 00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:07,759 Speaker 1: But the the font that they used is actually on 606 00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:12,080 Speaker 1: the green signs in particulars called highway Gothic, which is great, 607 00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:15,440 Speaker 1: which I feel like we've talked about that before. I'll 608 00:35:15,480 --> 00:35:17,400 Speaker 1: bet it was in the Traffic episode now that I 609 00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:20,440 Speaker 1: think about it. Yeah. Yeah, So they get all this 610 00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:23,200 Speaker 1: stuff done, they figured it out. The poor army company 611 00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:25,239 Speaker 1: that had to live on these tracks in Chicago for 612 00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:31,640 Speaker 1: two years are all discharged. Um, and the building begins. 613 00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:35,799 Speaker 1: But it doesn't really go according to plan. Like we 614 00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,200 Speaker 1: said that it was supposed to take thirteen years to 615 00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:41,640 Speaker 1: complete the first forty thousand miles of interstate, and they completed, 616 00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:45,919 Speaker 1: but they ran into issues pretty much from the get 617 00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:48,680 Speaker 1: go quick question. When you say they were discharged, you 618 00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:53,239 Speaker 1: mean they just stopped that project. I'm I'm assuming here 619 00:35:53,239 --> 00:35:55,400 Speaker 1: that they were discharged because they were just they were 620 00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:57,040 Speaker 1: forced to do that for two years that they said, 621 00:35:57,080 --> 00:35:58,760 Speaker 1: you're fine. You don't have to do anything else because 622 00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 1: you're out of the army, right if you want to be. 623 00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:05,160 Speaker 1: And here's some extra money. Uh. This Yellow Book comes 624 00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:07,120 Speaker 1: into play here, and this is when the what the 625 00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:11,960 Speaker 1: federal officials um finally officially submitted as the proposed map. Uh. 626 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:14,759 Speaker 1: And this one, much like the Perching map, wasn't super detailed, 627 00:36:15,400 --> 00:36:18,200 Speaker 1: just had rough lines and spurs and belt ways. And 628 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:20,879 Speaker 1: they said, all right, states, since you're getting a really 629 00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:23,759 Speaker 1: sweet deal here, you need to figure out how best 630 00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:27,480 Speaker 1: to do this within your state. Right. So, um, before 631 00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:30,200 Speaker 1: we go on actually talk about what happened when they 632 00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:32,719 Speaker 1: started building it, you want to take a last break. Yeah, 633 00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:49,480 Speaker 1: let's do it. Okay. Yeah. Well, now we're on the road, 634 00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:52,799 Speaker 1: driving in your truck. Want to learn a thing or 635 00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:56,759 Speaker 1: two from Josh Damp Chuck. It's stuff you should know, 636 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:04,240 Speaker 1: all right, Okay, Chuck. So, when you're building an interstate 637 00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:07,439 Speaker 1: and you're building it through pasture land or fields, or 638 00:37:07,800 --> 00:37:12,840 Speaker 1: you know, even desert whatever, UM, sparsely inhabited regions, you 639 00:37:12,880 --> 00:37:15,440 Speaker 1: don't run into too much problem. You can do it 640 00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:18,919 Speaker 1: fairly cheaply, you can do it pretty quickly. Um. There's 641 00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:20,960 Speaker 1: just not a lot of stuff you have to get 642 00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:23,279 Speaker 1: done aside from building the road. But when you start 643 00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:27,879 Speaker 1: to approach cities, everything changes. It gets way more expensive, 644 00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:31,680 Speaker 1: it takes way longer, and the the effects that it 645 00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:34,800 Speaker 1: has on that area, on the city can be really 646 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:38,360 Speaker 1: really bad. And when they started to approach these cities 647 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:42,360 Speaker 1: and started creating the interstate system around the cities, UM, 648 00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:47,080 Speaker 1: some some towns, especially the well to do wealthier people 649 00:37:47,120 --> 00:37:50,440 Speaker 1: in the towns, said whoa, whoa, wait, this map shows 650 00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:53,200 Speaker 1: this highway going through my neighborhood and that's not happening. 651 00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:55,839 Speaker 1: That's not going to happen. And there were what we're 652 00:37:55,840 --> 00:38:01,120 Speaker 1: called highway revolts where local local groups, sometimes in in 653 00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:06,960 Speaker 1: um collaboration with UH, like local politicians who felt the 654 00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:09,279 Speaker 1: same way or probably lived in the same areas, kind 655 00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:11,520 Speaker 1: of rose up against the Feds or even the state 656 00:38:11,560 --> 00:38:14,080 Speaker 1: government and said this is we need to re plan 657 00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:17,520 Speaker 1: where this highway is going. And some were successful. There's 658 00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:20,759 Speaker 1: one in northwest DC that never got built, and there 659 00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:23,560 Speaker 1: was one probably the most famous of all was the 660 00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:26,640 Speaker 1: one in Manhattan that was led by Jane Jacobs, who 661 00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:29,759 Speaker 1: wrote the Life and Death of Great American Cities, who 662 00:38:29,760 --> 00:38:34,120 Speaker 1: took on Robert Moses, the guy who revamped Central Park 663 00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:37,000 Speaker 1: into what it is now today. And one because they 664 00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:40,880 Speaker 1: were going to build the Interstate right through Soho, the 665 00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:45,000 Speaker 1: Lower east Side, Greenwich Village, Chinatown, and Little Italy. They 666 00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:47,479 Speaker 1: were just gonna tear it up and go right through there, 667 00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:50,759 Speaker 1: and Jane Jacobs managed to stave it off. Yeah. It 668 00:38:50,840 --> 00:38:52,960 Speaker 1: was you know when the when the rich people said 669 00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:54,680 Speaker 1: not in my neighborhood. What do you what do you 670 00:38:54,719 --> 00:38:57,560 Speaker 1: think happened? They went to the people that couldn't fight 671 00:38:57,600 --> 00:39:00,120 Speaker 1: back as much. They ran them through poor neighborhoods, use 672 00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:03,160 Speaker 1: eminent domain to kick people out. Uh. And there was 673 00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:07,479 Speaker 1: some grassroots, grassroots resistance and like you said, sometimes it worked, 674 00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:10,520 Speaker 1: but most times it did not. Yeah, and so this 675 00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:13,080 Speaker 1: is this is in cities where there was resistance. There 676 00:39:13,080 --> 00:39:14,919 Speaker 1: were plenty of cities who are like, this is going 677 00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:19,399 Speaker 1: to be breathe new life into our city. So that's fine, 678 00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:22,560 Speaker 1: tear down whatever you want. Let's get this super highway 679 00:39:22,600 --> 00:39:27,560 Speaker 1: of the future going through you know, uh, Topeka, Sure, 680 00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:35,080 Speaker 1: you know, I'm pretty sure forty goes through Topeka or Manhattan, Kansas. Okay, sure, Manhattan, 681 00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:37,600 Speaker 1: Kansas to get it in New York. It's ironic that 682 00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:43,960 Speaker 1: we said that because UM, the first UM, the first 683 00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:48,239 Speaker 1: project that was started on the interstate system began in 684 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:53,600 Speaker 1: Kansas and Missouri. Is that right? Yeah? I seventy Kansas 685 00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:57,759 Speaker 1: and Missouri as usual leading the country forward in progressive 686 00:39:57,800 --> 00:40:01,520 Speaker 1: new ways. That's right. And then in the reason why 687 00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:05,200 Speaker 1: they consider the interstate system having been completed is because 688 00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:08,240 Speaker 1: that section I think it's ice seventy, not forty UM 689 00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:12,160 Speaker 1: was completed in Kansas, connected onto itself and they said 690 00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:15,640 Speaker 1: we're done. Yeah, it's seventy. So I think we should 691 00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:17,200 Speaker 1: talk a little bit about just some of the nuts 692 00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:20,840 Speaker 1: and bolts of UM, what an interstate is, and what 693 00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:23,040 Speaker 1: they needed to be. When they were first designing these 694 00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:26,640 Speaker 1: we talked about getting away from you know, they need 695 00:40:26,640 --> 00:40:29,439 Speaker 1: to go fast and they need to be safe. Those 696 00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:32,960 Speaker 1: are like the two big requirements. So all these big 697 00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:37,240 Speaker 1: curvy roads and absence of sight lines and blind bends 698 00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:39,000 Speaker 1: and things that you had in the highway system was 699 00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:43,200 Speaker 1: no good super steep grades so they wanted to streamline 700 00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:45,719 Speaker 1: all that make it more gentle, good sight lines, nice 701 00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:49,000 Speaker 1: and straight. You gotta have at least two traffic lanes 702 00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:53,719 Speaker 1: in each direction for the divided interstate. You know, now 703 00:40:53,719 --> 00:40:56,919 Speaker 1: we have what are we max out Atlanta, like six 704 00:40:57,000 --> 00:41:00,399 Speaker 1: or eight lanes across. It's gonna be eleven. The plan 705 00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:02,960 Speaker 1: is for eleven on each side eventually, so twenty two 706 00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:06,520 Speaker 1: lanes of traffic. It's just gonna be a monstrosity. Oh boy. 707 00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:10,440 Speaker 1: The lanes and shoulders have minimum ws twelve feet for lanes, 708 00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:14,960 Speaker 1: ten feet for shoulders, and four feet for the that 709 00:41:15,560 --> 00:41:19,000 Speaker 1: very scary inside shoulder which you never want to be 710 00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:22,680 Speaker 1: pulled over on. UH. And then as far as speed 711 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:25,200 Speaker 1: limit goes, it's sort of varied over the years. I remember, 712 00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:29,000 Speaker 1: UH after nineteen seventy four. I mean it was only 713 00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:31,920 Speaker 1: three in nineteen seventy four, but that is when the 714 00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:36,120 Speaker 1: fifty five mile per hour speed limit was mandated. UH 715 00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:38,840 Speaker 1: in most states. UH, if you wanted to receive federal 716 00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:41,640 Speaker 1: funding for highway projects, get in line with that, because 717 00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,640 Speaker 1: you went on we had the gas crisis, oil crisis, 718 00:41:45,120 --> 00:41:47,480 Speaker 1: So if you wanted your dough, drop it to fifty five. 719 00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:50,799 Speaker 1: And it was fifty five for a while, Jammy Hagar 720 00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:53,600 Speaker 1: wrote a song about it. Oh yeah, he couldn't drive it. No, 721 00:41:53,960 --> 00:41:57,560 Speaker 1: despite you know, the um the oil crisis, he just 722 00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:00,280 Speaker 1: could not drive it. But I remember when they started 723 00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:03,759 Speaker 1: relaxing that and when sixty and seventy started popping up, 724 00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:06,480 Speaker 1: it was just like it was a really big deal. Hey, 725 00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:08,120 Speaker 1: I don't know if I ever told you this or not, 726 00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:10,640 Speaker 1: but Sammy Hagar's son is a fan of stuff. You 727 00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:14,560 Speaker 1: should he is. He wrote in um Maybe to the 728 00:42:14,640 --> 00:42:18,080 Speaker 1: End of the World to one of them and basically said, hey, 729 00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:20,399 Speaker 1: I heard you guys shout out my dad or make 730 00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:22,960 Speaker 1: a joke about, you know, Sammy Hagar or whatever. I 731 00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:24,759 Speaker 1: just want you to know I'm a big fan. And 732 00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:27,400 Speaker 1: he sent a picture of him and his dad hanging 733 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:31,239 Speaker 1: out on stage down in um Kabbo Sam Lucas. Yeah, 734 00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,480 Speaker 1: so shout out to Sammy Hagar's boy, and I bet 735 00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:36,359 Speaker 1: you we made and I can't drive fifty five joke. 736 00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:40,280 Speaker 1: We certainly did well. Emily is very famous for liking 737 00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:44,319 Speaker 1: Van Hagar more than David Lee Roth van Halen. I 738 00:42:44,360 --> 00:42:47,240 Speaker 1: don't know why you have to choose, They're so different. 739 00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:50,200 Speaker 1: I liked him both. I went and saw Van Hagar 740 00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:52,560 Speaker 1: live on the o U eight one two tour in 741 00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,200 Speaker 1: high school and it was great. And I love that 742 00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:58,600 Speaker 1: fifty one fifty album too. Man. I could air drum, 743 00:42:58,719 --> 00:43:02,000 Speaker 1: air guitar and air ace that entire album. Could you 744 00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:06,040 Speaker 1: air keyboards? Um? Not very well, I have fat fingers. 745 00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:09,359 Speaker 1: Well that's sort of the most boring air instrument. Yeah, 746 00:43:11,719 --> 00:43:13,960 Speaker 1: no it's not, but it's easy. It's the easy it's 747 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:15,960 Speaker 1: the best one to start out on. All right. Well, 748 00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:18,000 Speaker 1: shout out to the Red Rocker and his son. Then, 749 00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:22,520 Speaker 1: So Red Rocker, I haven't heard that one. Yeah, so 750 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:26,919 Speaker 1: um Montrose that was his big band, is that right? Yeah? 751 00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:29,799 Speaker 1: Before he went solo, he was in Montrose. Okay, I 752 00:43:29,800 --> 00:43:31,640 Speaker 1: didn't know that. I only knew him. I only picked 753 00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:34,279 Speaker 1: him up around that. I can't drive fifty. I hope 754 00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:38,200 Speaker 1: his son is listening, because he's probably quite delighted with Uh. 755 00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:42,120 Speaker 1: He's like, my name, isn't Sammy Hagar's son? By the way, guys, 756 00:43:42,440 --> 00:43:45,239 Speaker 1: Sammy Hagar's son Hagar. We should look up his name 757 00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:49,040 Speaker 1: because that would be very nice. Okay, are you doing it? Yes? 758 00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:52,279 Speaker 1: All right, I'll just continue on. Are we are we 759 00:43:52,440 --> 00:43:54,560 Speaker 1: editing this little combo? Are yeah, we should have it 760 00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:57,000 Speaker 1: in there, and I'll talk about Montana because Montana. As 761 00:43:57,040 --> 00:43:59,520 Speaker 1: everyone knows, you don't mess with Montana. They like to 762 00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:02,279 Speaker 1: make up their own rules. They were they were very 763 00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:05,160 Speaker 1: famou what's his name? Oh man, he's got two sons, 764 00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:07,600 Speaker 1: Aaron and Andrew. It's one of the two. Maybe both 765 00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:11,120 Speaker 1: of them are fans. I bet you they are. Okay. 766 00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:15,040 Speaker 1: So Montana is very famous for saying like, we just 767 00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:17,200 Speaker 1: are going to drive however fast we want to drive. 768 00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:19,680 Speaker 1: We may not even have a speed limit. For a while, 769 00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:22,799 Speaker 1: became known as the basic law, and it was the 770 00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:25,799 Speaker 1: speed limit in the daytime was whatever is reasonable and 771 00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:31,279 Speaker 1: proper as determined by us. You hear me. No one's 772 00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:34,439 Speaker 1: gonna tell us like Sammy Hagar to drive fifty five. 773 00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:38,319 Speaker 1: Don't tread on me. I think that's er mind, okay, 774 00:44:38,360 --> 00:44:43,120 Speaker 1: is it? No? That's the tea party, Aaron Hagar. I 775 00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:46,040 Speaker 1: just found it, Evan, So that forward that to me, 776 00:44:46,080 --> 00:44:50,680 Speaker 1: will you? Yeah? Um? So Montana eventually, I think right 777 00:44:50,719 --> 00:44:55,000 Speaker 1: now they do have a daytime speed limit finally, but 778 00:44:55,040 --> 00:44:59,239 Speaker 1: I'm not sure what it's probably like ninety five uh yeah, 779 00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:03,520 Speaker 1: probably is pretty high up there, actually. But the idea 780 00:45:03,560 --> 00:45:07,279 Speaker 1: of just not having a posted a numerical speed limit 781 00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:09,680 Speaker 1: at they which apparently they did for a little while. 782 00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:14,680 Speaker 1: That's just astounding. Yeah, but the idea of driving sixty 783 00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:19,000 Speaker 1: through rural Montana is ridiculous. Well, yeah, you need to 784 00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:22,320 Speaker 1: be going eight right exactly. I'm guessing that the cops 785 00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:25,719 Speaker 1: probably look the other way. Yeah, cops in Montana, they 786 00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:29,560 Speaker 1: get smaller fish to fry. So, I mean, because you 787 00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:32,200 Speaker 1: can go so fast, that's the danger of the highways. 788 00:45:32,239 --> 00:45:35,800 Speaker 1: But again, because it's closed access or controlled access where 789 00:45:36,040 --> 00:45:38,799 Speaker 1: there are very few places you can get on and off, 790 00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:41,759 Speaker 1: and those places are designated and designed for you to 791 00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:44,439 Speaker 1: get on and off of the highway, that the rest 792 00:45:44,520 --> 00:45:47,160 Speaker 1: of the highways just for go go going. Um, it 793 00:45:47,320 --> 00:45:50,279 Speaker 1: is typically safer. I don't think we said compared to 794 00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:57,000 Speaker 1: highways an interstate per million car miles driven, is it 795 00:45:57,000 --> 00:46:00,960 Speaker 1: a million million? I'm sorry, you're right, I believe per 796 00:46:01,080 --> 00:46:03,840 Speaker 1: hundred million. I'm I'm tapped ending here because I cannot 797 00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:08,640 Speaker 1: find it. Um, per hundred million car miles driven. I 798 00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:11,680 Speaker 1: know that the the interstate death talt rate is only 799 00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:19,520 Speaker 1: point eight two the highways. That's overgoing with stats wise, 800 00:46:19,640 --> 00:46:22,879 Speaker 1: I got it right here, friend, Um one point four 801 00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:27,760 Speaker 1: six deaths for all other US roads, that's per hundred 802 00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:32,320 Speaker 1: million vehicle miles driven. On interstates, it's point eight deaths 803 00:46:32,320 --> 00:46:36,320 Speaker 1: per hundred million vehicle miles driven. That's a substantial, almost 804 00:46:36,440 --> 00:46:40,680 Speaker 1: almost half the rate of fatality as every other US road. 805 00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:43,040 Speaker 1: And it's because of the way it's designed. Even though 806 00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:45,680 Speaker 1: you can go really really fast, the thing is designed 807 00:46:45,760 --> 00:46:48,160 Speaker 1: like bumper bowl to where you can't really get a 808 00:46:48,160 --> 00:46:52,400 Speaker 1: gutter ball very easily. So here's the thing we talked about. 809 00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:54,640 Speaker 1: All these uh, like you gotta have a media in 810 00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:57,520 Speaker 1: this big and you know, all these regulations that define 811 00:46:57,560 --> 00:47:01,960 Speaker 1: what an interstate is. Uh, it's not the case everywhere 812 00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:05,520 Speaker 1: you go. There are plenty of examples um of turnpikes 813 00:47:05,520 --> 00:47:07,680 Speaker 1: and three ways that we're sort of grandfathered in here 814 00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:12,520 Speaker 1: and there. Um toll roads that were grandfathered in states 815 00:47:12,560 --> 00:47:15,160 Speaker 1: that don't have the medians that they need, or do 816 00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:18,080 Speaker 1: have some steep grades and curves just because of the 817 00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:21,880 Speaker 1: terrain and stuff, or you know, speed limit differences, and 818 00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:24,799 Speaker 1: they relax some of that here and there. So that 819 00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:28,319 Speaker 1: was that stuff was more of a general requirement, not 820 00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:31,879 Speaker 1: like the hard and fast rule and the fist will 821 00:47:31,920 --> 00:47:34,640 Speaker 1: come down and you will not be an interstate unless 822 00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:37,040 Speaker 1: you have a medium that kind of thing. Right, Yeah, 823 00:47:37,080 --> 00:47:39,400 Speaker 1: the stuff that got grandfathered and it's still around. But 824 00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:42,160 Speaker 1: when they rebuild these roads or update them or improve them, 825 00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:44,400 Speaker 1: which is constantly going on, you know they're going to 826 00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:47,000 Speaker 1: get rid of that light and put in an overpass instead. 827 00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:50,440 Speaker 1: That's right. So when you have like a public works 828 00:47:50,480 --> 00:47:53,200 Speaker 1: project this big and supposedly this is the biggest in 829 00:47:53,239 --> 00:47:55,440 Speaker 1: the history of human kind is does that? Does that 830 00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:58,520 Speaker 1: sound right? I mean that's some have said that, Okay, 831 00:47:58,840 --> 00:48:03,120 Speaker 1: we're gonna go with that because we live in the USA. Um. 832 00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:06,040 Speaker 1: But uh, when you have a project that big, it's 833 00:48:06,080 --> 00:48:09,080 Speaker 1: going to have some weird quirks and foibles and that 834 00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:13,920 Speaker 1: kind of stuff, all the Dave Barry adjectives. Um. And 835 00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:16,720 Speaker 1: one of the things is that because of the way 836 00:48:16,800 --> 00:48:20,200 Speaker 1: that some some roads come up against one another, you 837 00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:24,960 Speaker 1: have something called concurrency where sometimes two different interstates will 838 00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:28,400 Speaker 1: share the same roadbed for a stretch, and so you 839 00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:32,000 Speaker 1: can literally be driving on two different interstates by game. Right, 840 00:48:32,480 --> 00:48:35,560 Speaker 1: And then one particular stretch of Virginia ten miles stretch 841 00:48:35,640 --> 00:48:39,840 Speaker 1: around where Virginia and Tennessee come together, there's a concurrent 842 00:48:39,920 --> 00:48:44,880 Speaker 1: stretch that's technically a wrong way concurrent stretch. Did you 843 00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:47,200 Speaker 1: know about this one? Yeah, So there's a stretch in 844 00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:51,360 Speaker 1: Virginia Interstate eighty one in Interstate seventy seven, and they're concurrent. 845 00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:54,160 Speaker 1: So when you're driving on this ten mile stretch, you're 846 00:48:54,239 --> 00:48:57,040 Speaker 1: on both of these these interstates. But the weird thing 847 00:48:57,160 --> 00:49:00,319 Speaker 1: is IS eighty one and seventy seven because they're odd 848 00:49:00,440 --> 00:49:04,239 Speaker 1: numbered highways or interstates, they run north to south, but 849 00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:08,239 Speaker 1: this ten mile stretch runs east to west. Pretty weird, right, 850 00:49:08,840 --> 00:49:12,880 Speaker 1: it gets even weirder, Chuck for this wrong way concurrent 851 00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:17,640 Speaker 1: stretch of highway, this ten mile stretch, you're actually going 852 00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:22,520 Speaker 1: on I eighty one north but I seventy seven south 853 00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:26,120 Speaker 1: when the actual direction of travel you're on is going 854 00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:29,600 Speaker 1: east to west. Yeah. I mean when you think about 855 00:49:29,600 --> 00:49:33,560 Speaker 1: perimeters to uh, there are times in Atlanta around the 856 00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:38,080 Speaker 1: five where you're you know, is it marked north or 857 00:49:38,120 --> 00:49:41,000 Speaker 1: is it marked west or is it mark south or 858 00:49:41,040 --> 00:49:43,800 Speaker 1: west or north and east. It's very confusing and on 859 00:49:43,840 --> 00:49:46,640 Speaker 1: where you are in that circle. Right, And we should 860 00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:49,359 Speaker 1: say that with with the interstate numbering system, we got 861 00:49:49,360 --> 00:49:51,640 Speaker 1: to talk about that it's not meant to be a 862 00:49:51,760 --> 00:49:57,239 Speaker 1: navigational guide. It's meant to keep from duplicating, um the 863 00:49:57,360 --> 00:50:01,000 Speaker 1: same interstate route in different parts of the country, and 864 00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:04,120 Speaker 1: for the same interstate or for the same numbered interstates 865 00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:07,319 Speaker 1: to um come up against one another. They're meant to 866 00:50:07,440 --> 00:50:10,719 Speaker 1: keep everything quite separate. Yeah. From the beginning, they're like, 867 00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:13,680 Speaker 1: get a map, people like, don't rely on these signs 868 00:50:13,680 --> 00:50:17,880 Speaker 1: to get you places. So, so, if you were looking 869 00:50:17,920 --> 00:50:20,000 Speaker 1: at a map of the United States going from the 870 00:50:20,040 --> 00:50:24,879 Speaker 1: west to the east, UM, odd number highways that run 871 00:50:25,040 --> 00:50:28,360 Speaker 1: run from north to south. The low numbers start in 872 00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:30,480 Speaker 1: the west, So I five is the first one, and 873 00:50:30,520 --> 00:50:34,239 Speaker 1: that's over in California. That's right, Great Great Highway goes 874 00:50:34,320 --> 00:50:40,319 Speaker 1: up to which is on the eastern seaboard, Great Great Expressway, 875 00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:43,000 Speaker 1: and then in between you have all the other fives, 876 00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:45,200 Speaker 1: the odd number ones. They run from north to south. 877 00:50:45,400 --> 00:50:49,600 Speaker 1: Now east to west you have even numbered ones, and 878 00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:55,240 Speaker 1: they start at the lowest in the south, well, starting 879 00:50:55,239 --> 00:51:00,719 Speaker 1: with ten. I'm a big faded by twenty twenties. I've 880 00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:04,080 Speaker 1: driven that thing from here to California quite a few times, Okay, 881 00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:05,680 Speaker 1: so I can see why you'd be a fan of 882 00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:07,759 Speaker 1: my twenty. Then it's a nice that's a nice drive 883 00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:09,960 Speaker 1: right there. They get you there, that's their motto. But 884 00:51:10,080 --> 00:51:13,960 Speaker 1: if you go up, up, up, you you ten sixty. 885 00:51:14,280 --> 00:51:17,200 Speaker 1: There is no fifty. And apparently ED says the Department 886 00:51:17,239 --> 00:51:19,960 Speaker 1: of Transportations used to get letters from people saying like 887 00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:23,400 Speaker 1: you guys, screwed up. There's no interstate fifty, oh people, 888 00:51:23,840 --> 00:51:26,719 Speaker 1: which is hilarious. Too much time on their hands. Here's 889 00:51:26,719 --> 00:51:31,279 Speaker 1: an interesting thing. Alaska and Puerto Rico they don't have 890 00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:35,680 Speaker 1: to meet these federal interstate standards, and technically they're not 891 00:51:36,360 --> 00:51:39,680 Speaker 1: federal interstates, their interstates in name only. And then in 892 00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:45,239 Speaker 1: Hawaii you have three inner states, all on Oahu, and 893 00:51:45,360 --> 00:51:49,319 Speaker 1: they are designated with an H instead of an eye 894 00:51:49,360 --> 00:51:53,480 Speaker 1: instead of interstate. It's whatever. H. I don't even know. 895 00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:55,360 Speaker 1: I've never been there. What are what are the numbers? 896 00:51:56,040 --> 00:51:58,560 Speaker 1: I think there's an H five maybe, but the thing 897 00:51:58,640 --> 00:52:00,839 Speaker 1: about it even weirder, and the fact that it's an 898 00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:03,799 Speaker 1: H instead of an eye, there's no dash. It looks 899 00:52:03,880 --> 00:52:08,320 Speaker 1: really like like Western European, like the like the M 900 00:52:08,440 --> 00:52:10,719 Speaker 1: five or whatever, like I see palm trees, but I 901 00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:15,360 Speaker 1: feel like I'm in Budapest right exactly. So what the 902 00:52:15,640 --> 00:52:18,040 Speaker 1: we talked about, Like at the very beginning, I said 903 00:52:18,080 --> 00:52:20,040 Speaker 1: that like, one of the things that fascinates me are 904 00:52:20,160 --> 00:52:23,520 Speaker 1: the massive sweeping effects that interstates have had on the 905 00:52:23,640 --> 00:52:27,480 Speaker 1: United States. And a lot of people have studied the effects, 906 00:52:27,760 --> 00:52:29,840 Speaker 1: and there have been some good and some bad. And 907 00:52:29,920 --> 00:52:32,040 Speaker 1: I came across the forum I can't remember on what 908 00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:36,759 Speaker 1: um what site, but the question was is a net 909 00:52:37,440 --> 00:52:41,720 Speaker 1: gain or a net loss for America with the interstate systems? 910 00:52:41,920 --> 00:52:44,040 Speaker 1: And it seemed pretty evenly divided. You can make a 911 00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:47,440 Speaker 1: case both ways that you know, in these ways it helped. 912 00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:49,759 Speaker 1: In these ways it was really terrible. And it's kind 913 00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:53,040 Speaker 1: of a subjective judgment whether when you add all those up, 914 00:52:53,239 --> 00:52:55,960 Speaker 1: it was actually a gain for America or you know, 915 00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:59,960 Speaker 1: a loss. Well, we already talked about safety definitely, say, 916 00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:04,120 Speaker 1: for UH, if you listen to our Root sixty six episode, 917 00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:09,759 Speaker 1: you'll hear lots of stories about quote unquote dead towns. UM. 918 00:53:09,960 --> 00:53:13,440 Speaker 1: These these small towns and junctions where people traveled on 919 00:53:13,480 --> 00:53:17,520 Speaker 1: these pretty popular highways UH, and restaurants and local mom 920 00:53:17,600 --> 00:53:21,080 Speaker 1: and pops they went away, UH in large part because 921 00:53:21,120 --> 00:53:26,520 Speaker 1: of these expressways built right beside them sometimes and that 922 00:53:27,160 --> 00:53:30,520 Speaker 1: that real estate where you get off on these exits 923 00:53:30,600 --> 00:53:34,719 Speaker 1: is super expensive. So it's not like you're you're gonna 924 00:53:34,760 --> 00:53:38,560 Speaker 1: see very few, you know, mom paw restaurants at these exits. 925 00:53:38,600 --> 00:53:42,480 Speaker 1: You're gonna see the major chains, the major gas stations, 926 00:53:42,520 --> 00:53:46,319 Speaker 1: and major major restaurants and shopping centers. All right, they're 927 00:53:46,400 --> 00:53:49,200 Speaker 1: kind of congregated on the highways, right, So they produced 928 00:53:49,239 --> 00:53:54,200 Speaker 1: homogenus across America, the inter state there I go. But 929 00:53:54,360 --> 00:53:57,040 Speaker 1: that so that created this sense of homogeneity where it 930 00:53:57,120 --> 00:53:59,319 Speaker 1: was like the same national brands, the only ones who 931 00:53:59,360 --> 00:54:02,080 Speaker 1: are big enough to buy up this real estate were 932 00:54:02,120 --> 00:54:04,400 Speaker 1: the ones that you find at any given exit, you know, 933 00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:07,120 Speaker 1: the same handful of them across the United States. So 934 00:54:07,280 --> 00:54:10,880 Speaker 1: it lost its local flavor for sure. That's a big effect. 935 00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:17,560 Speaker 1: That's a huge loss for America. Yeah, rail use definitely declined. UM, 936 00:54:17,800 --> 00:54:22,759 Speaker 1: trucking definitely improved or benefited at least. Uh what else? 937 00:54:22,920 --> 00:54:25,680 Speaker 1: Ed says? Crime, which is something I never really thought about, 938 00:54:25,800 --> 00:54:29,640 Speaker 1: but there have definitely been a lot of interstate killers 939 00:54:30,440 --> 00:54:33,840 Speaker 1: who could uh pick someone up at a truck stop 940 00:54:33,920 --> 00:54:36,200 Speaker 1: and kill them and get on that highway and get 941 00:54:36,239 --> 00:54:38,840 Speaker 1: out of there quick like. That was the I five strangler, 942 00:54:38,920 --> 00:54:42,239 Speaker 1: the I seventy killer, UM, a series of murderers along 943 00:54:42,320 --> 00:54:44,560 Speaker 1: I forty. I think that was like where they were 944 00:54:44,640 --> 00:54:47,359 Speaker 1: like people are driving around shooting other people at high 945 00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:50,120 Speaker 1: speeds on the highway. Do you remember that, like the 946 00:54:50,239 --> 00:54:53,759 Speaker 1: eight or nineties. Yeah, you can't have that without the interstate. No, 947 00:54:54,120 --> 00:54:56,560 Speaker 1: So you know that's an effect. But another way that 948 00:54:56,680 --> 00:55:00,279 Speaker 1: it affected crime to UM is found really pronounced lee 949 00:55:00,400 --> 00:55:03,560 Speaker 1: in l A. Like l A became the bank robbery 950 00:55:03,680 --> 00:55:06,000 Speaker 1: capital of the world from what I understand, at least 951 00:55:06,000 --> 00:55:08,359 Speaker 1: the United States. And the reason why is because it's 952 00:55:08,560 --> 00:55:12,640 Speaker 1: massive system of interstates throughout the entire city. UM allowed 953 00:55:12,719 --> 00:55:17,080 Speaker 1: for really easy escape routes for bank robbers. I can 954 00:55:17,120 --> 00:55:21,040 Speaker 1: see that. There's a really great article by I think 955 00:55:21,120 --> 00:55:25,560 Speaker 1: his name's Jeff man Off Um. Anyway, he had the 956 00:55:25,719 --> 00:55:29,440 Speaker 1: he has like the the building blog and it's UM 957 00:55:30,239 --> 00:55:32,120 Speaker 1: it's really interesting. I'll see if I can find I'll 958 00:55:32,120 --> 00:55:34,280 Speaker 1: tweet it out. It's a really great article. I should 959 00:55:34,280 --> 00:55:37,080 Speaker 1: have looked it up. Yeah. So in the end, like 960 00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:39,080 Speaker 1: you said, I guess it's sort of split on how 961 00:55:39,239 --> 00:55:41,399 Speaker 1: people view this. It's hard to measure some of these 962 00:55:42,120 --> 00:55:44,520 Speaker 1: effects and put like a number on things like the 963 00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:46,960 Speaker 1: death of the mom and pop store. Some of those 964 00:55:46,960 --> 00:55:50,360 Speaker 1: are a little more esoteric and emotional, but it is 965 00:55:50,400 --> 00:55:54,920 Speaker 1: interesting to think about. Yep, yeah, I like them too, 966 00:55:55,000 --> 00:55:57,160 Speaker 1: but at the same time, it stinks that they're you know, 967 00:55:57,400 --> 00:56:02,239 Speaker 1: they're super congested. Sometimes the cities better than suburbia, but 968 00:56:02,560 --> 00:56:07,719 Speaker 1: you know, the Interstates funneled people out into suburbia urban sprawl. Yeah. Um, 969 00:56:07,880 --> 00:56:10,279 Speaker 1: but yeah, it's fascinating to think, like it's got the 970 00:56:10,320 --> 00:56:13,759 Speaker 1: good and the bad. Just the sweeping effects are just 971 00:56:13,880 --> 00:56:17,280 Speaker 1: so ingrained that you're just they're tough to see sometimes, 972 00:56:17,320 --> 00:56:20,400 Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, I got one more thing, actually, the 973 00:56:20,440 --> 00:56:23,600 Speaker 1: whole notion of the especially in California, of putting the 974 00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:27,239 Speaker 1: word the in front of the highways on the two ten, 975 00:56:27,280 --> 00:56:30,160 Speaker 1: the one oh one, whereas here on the East Coast 976 00:56:30,320 --> 00:56:34,839 Speaker 1: we say, uh, it is not just an l a thing. 977 00:56:34,920 --> 00:56:37,840 Speaker 1: Apparently it's a lot of the Western States, especially on 978 00:56:37,920 --> 00:56:41,640 Speaker 1: the West coast. Because my my friend and fellow podcaster 979 00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:45,520 Speaker 1: Adam Pranica, was in Atlanta recently and he said, do 980 00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:48,560 Speaker 1: I take of the twenty? I just thought it sounded 981 00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:50,480 Speaker 1: so funny, did you say, did you hit your head? 982 00:56:50,719 --> 00:56:52,839 Speaker 1: And he's a Seattle guy, so they definitely say it there, 983 00:56:53,400 --> 00:56:55,120 Speaker 1: and I was just kind of curious where that came from. 984 00:56:55,160 --> 00:56:58,480 Speaker 1: And that's just a holdover, like you mentioned California had 985 00:56:58,520 --> 00:57:02,080 Speaker 1: some of the first freeway, uh not interstates, but just 986 00:57:02,239 --> 00:57:05,360 Speaker 1: larger highways, and they had they were named. It was 987 00:57:05,440 --> 00:57:07,800 Speaker 1: before they were numbered. So this was in like the 988 00:57:07,920 --> 00:57:11,440 Speaker 1: nineteen forties. They had the Santa Monica Freeway, the Kawanga 989 00:57:11,480 --> 00:57:15,000 Speaker 1: Pass Freeway. It was designated by where it went, and 990 00:57:15,040 --> 00:57:17,080 Speaker 1: they were you know, it would make sense to put 991 00:57:17,120 --> 00:57:19,480 Speaker 1: a D in front of those, and that just sort 992 00:57:19,520 --> 00:57:22,520 Speaker 1: of held over. Once they started numbering him. They couldn't 993 00:57:22,560 --> 00:57:25,680 Speaker 1: shake it. But even still we still didn't use the 994 00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:27,640 Speaker 1: back then because if you think about it, there was 995 00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:31,640 Speaker 1: a famous highway from Indiana down to Miami called Dixie Highway, 996 00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:35,600 Speaker 1: and here you call it Dixie Highway or Old Dixie Highway, 997 00:57:35,640 --> 00:57:38,240 Speaker 1: not the Old Dixie Highway or the Dixie Highway. We 998 00:57:38,360 --> 00:57:41,240 Speaker 1: just don't like the here maybe so coast. It was 999 00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:43,800 Speaker 1: too hot and everybody had too much hookworms to say 1000 00:57:43,880 --> 00:57:47,480 Speaker 1: the I guess it was unnecessary. So if this kind 1001 00:57:47,520 --> 00:57:49,800 Speaker 1: of thing floated your boat, go check out UM. I 1002 00:57:49,920 --> 00:57:53,560 Speaker 1: read some many good articles, but one was by Linda 1003 00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:56,080 Speaker 1: Poon on City Lab Look that up. Another was by 1004 00:57:56,080 --> 00:57:59,600 Speaker 1: a guy named Joseph Stromberg Vox. And then that Jeff 1005 00:57:59,760 --> 00:58:02,360 Speaker 1: Man in a Um, he doesn't have the building blog. 1006 00:58:02,400 --> 00:58:05,000 Speaker 1: He has. Cabinet is the name of his site. In 1007 00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:07,520 Speaker 1: that article about l A being the bank robbery capital 1008 00:58:07,600 --> 00:58:11,360 Speaker 1: is called forensic Topology and our own Grabster of course, 1009 00:58:11,440 --> 00:58:14,680 Speaker 1: hats off to Grabster. And since we said Grabster, that 1010 00:58:14,800 --> 00:58:18,600 Speaker 1: means everybody's time for listener mail. All right, I'm gonna 1011 00:58:18,640 --> 00:58:23,400 Speaker 1: call this follow up on the punk episode. Hey, guys, 1012 00:58:23,440 --> 00:58:25,840 Speaker 1: just finished listening to your punk podcast. Being a hardcourt 1013 00:58:25,920 --> 00:58:28,880 Speaker 1: kid since I was in elementary school and the such 1014 00:58:28,960 --> 00:58:31,360 Speaker 1: stuff you should know fans since high school, I was 1015 00:58:31,640 --> 00:58:33,640 Speaker 1: stoked to see these two very different things that I 1016 00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:36,840 Speaker 1: listened to come together. First of all, I'm sorry you 1017 00:58:36,880 --> 00:58:40,160 Speaker 1: guys ever felt intimidated by punks. Uh. The time when 1018 00:58:40,240 --> 00:58:43,560 Speaker 1: punk quote died end quote is really when the scene 1019 00:58:43,640 --> 00:58:46,880 Speaker 1: got in general way more enjoyable to be a part of. 1020 00:58:47,440 --> 00:58:49,840 Speaker 1: The old heads got jobs and families and stopped coming 1021 00:58:49,880 --> 00:58:52,640 Speaker 1: out to shows that weren't the bands they listened to 1022 00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:55,920 Speaker 1: coming up, So the kids took over and created a 1023 00:58:56,000 --> 00:58:59,240 Speaker 1: more positive and inviting environment. In my lifetime, I've seen 1024 00:58:59,280 --> 00:59:01,320 Speaker 1: this go even for there. In the last ten years 1025 00:59:01,440 --> 00:59:05,720 Speaker 1: or so, hardcore fans have gone from at times hyper masculine, 1026 00:59:06,400 --> 00:59:11,560 Speaker 1: you know what, UH measuring contests to a safe place 1027 00:59:11,680 --> 00:59:13,880 Speaker 1: for queer kids and people of color to talk about 1028 00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:16,840 Speaker 1: their struggles. The scene is very much alive from my 1029 00:59:16,880 --> 00:59:20,480 Speaker 1: birthplace in the Upper Midwest. Do I currently live in Appalachia. 1030 00:59:21,600 --> 00:59:23,880 Speaker 1: I am in the early stages of running d I 1031 00:59:24,080 --> 00:59:26,200 Speaker 1: Y shows out of my basement. So if you ever 1032 00:59:26,280 --> 00:59:28,560 Speaker 1: want to go to a hardcore show, just let me 1033 00:59:28,680 --> 00:59:33,040 Speaker 1: know and make the drive up to Knoxville. Okay, that's fair. 1034 00:59:33,320 --> 00:59:35,080 Speaker 1: I promise I won't let anyone beat you up for 1035 00:59:35,160 --> 00:59:38,800 Speaker 1: calling the sex pistols punk. Wink wink. Thanks for all 1036 00:59:38,800 --> 00:59:40,520 Speaker 1: the great listening you guys provided me over the years, 1037 00:59:40,560 --> 00:59:43,120 Speaker 1: and please keep delving into different genres even if you 1038 00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:46,120 Speaker 1: feel out of your depths. That is from Evan and Uh. 1039 00:59:46,640 --> 00:59:48,640 Speaker 1: You also sent a very nice ps. It's just about 1040 00:59:49,160 --> 00:59:51,000 Speaker 1: how we've been there for him and and we want 1041 00:59:51,040 --> 00:59:53,440 Speaker 1: to say thanks for that too. Evan. That's really cool man. 1042 00:59:53,520 --> 00:59:57,240 Speaker 1: Thanks a lot, Evan, and also, I mean, hats off 1043 00:59:57,360 --> 01:00:00,680 Speaker 1: for having hardcore shows in your basement. It's awesome. That 1044 01:00:00,880 --> 01:00:03,040 Speaker 1: is very awesome. Well, if you want to be like 1045 01:00:03,200 --> 01:00:06,200 Speaker 1: Evan and be super cool and hardcore and also super 1046 01:00:06,280 --> 01:00:09,480 Speaker 1: inclusive and nice, we want to hear from you. You 1047 01:00:09,640 --> 01:00:11,600 Speaker 1: can go on to stuff you Should Know dot com 1048 01:00:11,720 --> 01:00:14,760 Speaker 1: and check us out on social media while I pulled 1049 01:00:14,840 --> 01:00:16,960 Speaker 1: that one out, or you can send us an email 1050 01:00:17,240 --> 01:00:24,920 Speaker 1: to stuff Podcasts at iHeart radio dot com. Stuff you 1051 01:00:24,920 --> 01:00:27,400 Speaker 1: Should Know is a production of iHeart Radio's How Stuff Works. 1052 01:00:27,720 --> 01:00:29,960 Speaker 1: For more podcasts for my heart Radio, visit the iHeart 1053 01:00:30,040 --> 01:00:32,520 Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your 1054 01:00:32,560 --> 01:00:33,200 Speaker 1: favorite shows.