WEBVTT - Introducing: Mayhem in the Morgue  

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<v Speaker 1>Crime Stories with Nancy Grace joining me right now is

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<v Speaker 1>a longtime colleague and dare I say friend, Doctor Kendall Crowns.

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<v Speaker 1>You know him well and he is launching an incredible podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>He is joined by his all star panel behind him.

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<v Speaker 1>He always has a full blown skeleton and a skull.

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<v Speaker 1>You know that doesn't come along every day a guy

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<v Speaker 1>that travels with a skeleton and a skull. Doctor Kendall

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<v Speaker 1>Crowns is always the star of the show. Always. I

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<v Speaker 1>could listen to him for hours and I have. Doctor

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<v Speaker 1>Kendall Crowns is a renowned medical examiner, typically joining us

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<v Speaker 1>out of Tyrant County. That's Fort Worth. As I like

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<v Speaker 1>to say, never a lack of business in the Morgue

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<v Speaker 1>in Fort Worth. He is an esteemed lecturer at the

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<v Speaker 1>Burnett School of Medicine at TCU, and he is launching

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<v Speaker 1>Mayhem in the Morgue. Now. You may think that medical

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<v Speaker 1>examiners are dry as dust. Not true. When I listened

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<v Speaker 1>to his first episode of Mayhem in the Morgue, it

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<v Speaker 1>made me laugh, it made me sad, but most of all,

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<v Speaker 1>it made me curious, very curious. Doctor Kendall Crown's thank

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<v Speaker 1>you for being with us.

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<v Speaker 2>Of course, thank you, Nancy.

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<v Speaker 1>Tell me how you got in the business.

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<v Speaker 2>So how I got interested in forensic pathology and ultimately

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<v Speaker 2>became a medical examiner is my dad was a criminologist,

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<v Speaker 2>and so when I grew up, it wasn't we heard

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<v Speaker 2>the stories like Doctor Seuss and things of that nature.

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<v Speaker 2>We actually heard about helter skelter and crime scenes and

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<v Speaker 2>things of that nature. One of the books I had

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<v Speaker 2>as a that I absolutely loved was called A Catalog

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<v Speaker 2>of Crime, and it just had stories after stories of

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<v Speaker 2>convicted murderers and what they did and all those things,

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<v Speaker 2>and I always just found it fascinating. As a kid,

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<v Speaker 2>I'd sit in his library at the house and just

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<v Speaker 2>flip through the different books, looking at all the different pictures,

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<v Speaker 2>and it just was part of my life. And when

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<v Speaker 2>I was getting older and I thought I wanted to

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<v Speaker 2>be a doctor, my dad said to me, Hey, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>there's this thing called a forensic pathologist or a medical examiner,

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<v Speaker 2>and I know the local one, and you want to

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<v Speaker 2>go see an autopsy? And I thought that sounded great.

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<v Speaker 2>I went to the medical examiner's office and saw my

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<v Speaker 2>first autopsy, and it just was incredible to me. It

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<v Speaker 2>was a suicide, a single gunshot wounded the head, and

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<v Speaker 2>I thought it was the most interesting thing I had

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<v Speaker 2>ever seen in my life. And at the end of

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<v Speaker 2>the autopsy, said to the medical examiner, how do I

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<v Speaker 2>become you? And he told me, well, you know, you

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<v Speaker 2>got to go to college, you got to finish medical school,

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<v Speaker 2>and then he'd do residency and then eventually you're a

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<v Speaker 2>forensic pathologist. And that's what I did. From that moment on,

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<v Speaker 2>I did everything I could to become a medical examiner.

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<v Speaker 2>I bought books about it. When I was in college,

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<v Speaker 2>I was a autopsy tech, and when I was in residency,

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<v Speaker 2>I did autopsy tech work on the side to make

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<v Speaker 2>a little extra money. And then I also worked at

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<v Speaker 2>the medical Examiner's office on the weekend as well because

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<v Speaker 2>my residency program would pay for it. So I've just

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<v Speaker 2>kind of always been around it. And it really started

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<v Speaker 2>in ninth grade in nineteen eighty four.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow, talking about you growing up looking at crime scene

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<v Speaker 1>photos and talking about cases with your dad. I will

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<v Speaker 1>never forget when John David we were watching something, it

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<v Speaker 1>was a murder mystery on BritBox, and he jumped up

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<v Speaker 1>and said, where's the PC Probable calls, and in my

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<v Speaker 1>mind I ticked a box brainwashing complete and I'll never forget.

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<v Speaker 1>We were actually talking about Jody Arius and Lucy said, oh, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>she's a guilty girlfriend that changed her story three times.

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<v Speaker 1>I was so happy. I could not have been prouder

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<v Speaker 1>of my sweet little girl that said. Can I ask

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<v Speaker 1>you how did you get women? I mean, you certainly

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<v Speaker 1>can't say I hang around the morgone weekends. That's not

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<v Speaker 1>sexy unless you target another medical examiner. I mean, or

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<v Speaker 1>do you just say I'm going to medical school That

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<v Speaker 1>usually works and leave out the dead body part? How

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<v Speaker 1>did you manage to somehow catch missus Kendall Crown.

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<v Speaker 2>My wife, Beth, is not in the medical field. She

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<v Speaker 2>had worked as a volunteer emergency medical technician, but we

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<v Speaker 2>met by happenstance at a comic book store where one

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<v Speaker 2>of my do nothing friends was hanging out or was working,

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<v Speaker 2>and I would go there after getting done with rotations

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<v Speaker 2>in medical school, and then he and I would go

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<v Speaker 2>play pool at a local pool hall, and she happened

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<v Speaker 2>to come in there because she knew the owner and

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<v Speaker 2>was dropping something off, and we met and we started talking,

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<v Speaker 2>and two months later I finally got up the nerve

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<v Speaker 2>to ask her out, which is one of the most

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<v Speaker 2>pathetic asking out moments of all time, which I.

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<v Speaker 1>Got to hear the whole thing.

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<v Speaker 2>Tell me, I learned when I used to vandalize things

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<v Speaker 2>that when duct tape catches on fire, it smells like pine.

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<v Speaker 2>And I told her that so I and she was like, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>that's interesting. And I said, well, you know, I have

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<v Speaker 2>a roll of duct tape in my car. I could

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<v Speaker 2>show you.

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<v Speaker 1>And she was like, away, I got to meet this woman.

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<v Speaker 1>Because when you say, hey, baby, I got duct tape

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<v Speaker 1>in the car, everybody runs you say, nothing but tailhole

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<v Speaker 1>on elbows. But your wife, Oddleie was attracted to that.

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<v Speaker 2>She could take me to fight. I'll just say that.

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<v Speaker 2>So we went out to the car and I got

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<v Speaker 2>out the roll of duct tape, rolled it up, a

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<v Speaker 2>little piece of it and lit it with my car lighter,

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<v Speaker 2>and sure enough it smelled like pine. And I said

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<v Speaker 2>the classic nag.

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<v Speaker 1>Talking charmer, silver tong ken little Crown's okay, so that's

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<v Speaker 1>how you managed to get your wife. Now you were mentioning,

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<v Speaker 1>it's a story. I didn't know you were mentioning the

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<v Speaker 1>first time you saw an autopsy. I believe you said

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<v Speaker 1>it was a suicide by shooting. You know, isn't it interesting?

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<v Speaker 1>You never forget your first.

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<v Speaker 2>That's correct, you really don't. It was through them through

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<v Speaker 2>gun shoveling in the head. The guy was playing Russian ulette.

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<v Speaker 2>He was drunk and shot himself in the head contact

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<v Speaker 2>range wound. And one of the things I always remember

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<v Speaker 2>is they took out his liver and it was bright

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<v Speaker 2>yellow instead of the normal brown. And I asked the doctor,

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<v Speaker 2>I go, why is it discolor Then he said, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>that's from drinking. You know, it causes damage to your

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<v Speaker 2>liver and all that.

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<v Speaker 1>Right? Yellow? Like what yellow are you talking about? Because

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<v Speaker 1>I've got to know the answer to this, Like what yellow?

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<v Speaker 1>Like yellow? Mustard yellow, like kind.

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<v Speaker 2>Of a bright yellow, like a French's mustard yellow.

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<v Speaker 1>I can't wait to tell my children if you drink

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<v Speaker 1>when you go to college, your liver will turn yellow,

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<v Speaker 1>ask doctor Kendall Crowns.

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<v Speaker 2>That's because it's a toxic.

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<v Speaker 1>I have another question for then. I'm going to get

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<v Speaker 1>to your radio show, uh Dtor Kendall Crowns. When you go,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know if you even do out to dinner

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<v Speaker 1>or you go to a party of some sort, do

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<v Speaker 1>you find yourself totally bored out of your skull unless

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<v Speaker 1>people are talking about murder or crime.

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<v Speaker 2>So usually when I go out to dinner, it's a bout.

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<v Speaker 2>We talk about other things in my workplace, but parties.

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<v Speaker 1>Actually around other people.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't have a lot of friends, Nancy, But anyway,

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<v Speaker 2>when i'm mad to behind you, there's the perfect friends.

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<v Speaker 2>They don't talk.

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<v Speaker 1>But by the way, I've never asked you that, have

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<v Speaker 1>you named them? No? I have not, So I'm going

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<v Speaker 1>to come up with names. I'm not going to do

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<v Speaker 1>it on the spot because I may think better of

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<v Speaker 1>it later. So when you're around other people that are

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<v Speaker 1>not in the business, are you or do they totally

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<v Speaker 1>bore you? Or am I just projecting? Because when I

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<v Speaker 1>go somewhere and somebody tries to talk about politics, I'm like,

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<v Speaker 1>I'll be right back, or if they were anything, because

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<v Speaker 1>when it's in your blood, it's in your blood and

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<v Speaker 1>everything else seems low watted.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I agree with you on that, although when I'm

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<v Speaker 2>around other people, I like to just talk to them

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<v Speaker 2>and hear their stories and get information about them because

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<v Speaker 2>I find people to be fascinating in that regards, because

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<v Speaker 2>you never know when you're talking to someone what else

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<v Speaker 2>they got going on at home, because who knows, they

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<v Speaker 2>might have a you know, a sex dungeon in the

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<v Speaker 2>basement that they're never going to tell you about. But

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<v Speaker 2>one day you'll think.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, it's funny that your mind to go immediately

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<v Speaker 1>to sex dungeon in the basement. You could have said anything,

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<v Speaker 1>but you went with sex dungeon in the basement. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>not ashamed that people that means something only to you,

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<v Speaker 1>which brings to mind Rex hereer men, I've got so

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<v Speaker 1>many cases I could ask you about, but I really

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<v Speaker 1>want to talk about you, So just give me. I

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<v Speaker 1>think i've heard it. Give me a tiny taste. Don't

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<v Speaker 1>give away the end if it's the one I'm thinking about,

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<v Speaker 1>which was awesome. What is your first story on your

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<v Speaker 1>first radio show, translation podcast Mayhem in the Morgue. What's

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<v Speaker 1>the first one about? Don't give away the end?

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<v Speaker 2>The first one is when I am on the first

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<v Speaker 2>day of my forensic pathology rotation in medical school. I

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<v Speaker 2>arrived at the office and right away they get a

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<v Speaker 2>phone call in that there's a possible homicide crime scene,

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<v Speaker 2>and we go out there and I'm super excited, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>it's first day. I get to see this really exciting thing.

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<v Speaker 2>And we get out to the scene. It turns out

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<v Speaker 2>to not be a homicide.

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<v Speaker 1>We just had to cut Doctor Crown's giving away the end.

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<v Speaker 1>I can't believe I just said, don't give away the end,

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<v Speaker 1>and you gave away the end. But I will say

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<v Speaker 1>that near the end, something shoots out of the victims behind.

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<v Speaker 2>That's correct, that would be the true the end of

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<v Speaker 2>that situation.

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<v Speaker 1>Stop, don't say another word now. Can I ask you,

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<v Speaker 1>while I know your two friends behind you, I've always

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<v Speaker 1>wondered what is on that pillow? It looks like the

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<v Speaker 1>evil Eye, four of them multicolor. What is that?

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<v Speaker 2>My daughter is an ad crowcheer and she made that

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<v Speaker 2>pillow for me.

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<v Speaker 1>Wait tell me about your daughter. Don't give me any names.

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<v Speaker 2>She has a degree in computer science and is now

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<v Speaker 2>getting a degree in geology or a master's degree in

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<v Speaker 2>geology and then trying to pursue a paleontology career. But

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<v Speaker 2>she is. She really loves to crochet, and she really

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<v Speaker 2>loves her bones and dinosaurs. And we just went out

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<v Speaker 2>with her a couple of weeks ago to a dig

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<v Speaker 2>site so she could look for dinosaur bones for her

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<v Speaker 2>master's project.

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<v Speaker 1>Wow. You know, because when you and I talk, it's

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<v Speaker 1>always about dissecting a dead body and figuring out the

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<v Speaker 1>cod cause of death and tissue and DNA and body cavities.

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<v Speaker 1>I rarely ask you about Beth, your wife or your daughter.

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<v Speaker 1>Are there any other children I need to know about?

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<v Speaker 2>So? I have a total of five children, two girls,

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<v Speaker 2>three boy. So my oldest is the largest one wife.

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<v Speaker 2>That's correct?

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<v Speaker 1>And uh okay, so I don't need to ask what

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<v Speaker 1>you do in your spare time.

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<v Speaker 2>Five children, that's correct.

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<v Speaker 1>Just give me the breakdown? How many boys and how

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<v Speaker 1>many girls?

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<v Speaker 2>Three boys? Two girls?

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<v Speaker 1>Wow? Okay, I always wanted four, but when I got

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<v Speaker 1>the two that I have, I knew I was lucky

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<v Speaker 1>in anyone to quit. Obviously, some people don't know where

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<v Speaker 1>babies come from, and amazing you're a doctor, doctor Kendall Crowns.

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<v Speaker 1>Where Okay, you know where they come from, but do

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<v Speaker 1>you know how they got there?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh? I know that too. I also know how to

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<v Speaker 2>take them out and can't put it back in.

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<v Speaker 1>Though, so you really do? So how happy are you

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<v Speaker 1>that you're a medical examiner and not let's just say,

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<v Speaker 1>a plastic surgeon, or I don't know, let's just go

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<v Speaker 1>a plastic surgeon.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, plastic surgery is a funny one because that is

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<v Speaker 2>one of the rotations in medical school that was actually

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<v Speaker 2>pretty good at and they told me that I should

0:13:07.840 --> 0:13:10.000
<v Speaker 2>think about going into that, but I did not want

0:13:10.040 --> 0:13:13.480
<v Speaker 2>to do the surgery lifestyle where you were constantly at

0:13:13.520 --> 0:13:16.840
<v Speaker 2>work and on call and all the stress associated with that.

0:13:17.280 --> 0:13:21.520
<v Speaker 2>I really loved being forensic pathology from the beginning of

0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:26.079
<v Speaker 2>medical school, and my mind never changed throughout all the rotations,

0:13:26.080 --> 0:13:28.800
<v Speaker 2>and I really actually enjoy what I do on a

0:13:28.880 --> 0:13:34.280
<v Speaker 2>daily basis. It's always different, it's always something exciting, and

0:13:34.600 --> 0:13:38.240
<v Speaker 2>you get to do testify, you get to do autopsies.

0:13:38.320 --> 0:13:42.000
<v Speaker 2>It's just it's a great job. I cannot complain. I'm

0:13:42.360 --> 0:13:43.680
<v Speaker 2>very happy with my life.

0:13:44.400 --> 0:13:46.800
<v Speaker 1>Do you normally have people in the room with you

0:13:46.920 --> 0:13:49.960
<v Speaker 1>when you perform an autopsy or you normally by yourself?

0:13:51.320 --> 0:13:55.200
<v Speaker 2>So usually an autopsy, when you're doing the autopsies, there's

0:13:55.280 --> 0:13:57.440
<v Speaker 2>usually two to three other doctors working in the room

0:13:57.480 --> 0:14:01.120
<v Speaker 2>with you, to autopsy technicians to a body. So the

0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:04.200
<v Speaker 2>room is very loud and a lot of people moving around,

0:14:04.240 --> 0:14:07.760
<v Speaker 2>a lot of talking noise, of the saws, the cutting

0:14:07.840 --> 0:14:11.000
<v Speaker 2>and all that. So it's actually not very quiet. It's

0:14:11.160 --> 0:14:17.120
<v Speaker 2>very very very noisy, very stimulating, and there's usually music

0:14:17.120 --> 0:14:17.560
<v Speaker 2>playing there.

0:14:17.600 --> 0:14:19.440
<v Speaker 1>We'll say, you know, doctor Kendall Crowns, that's not the

0:14:19.480 --> 0:14:21.800
<v Speaker 1>way it is on TV and movies. There's always a

0:14:21.800 --> 0:14:26.440
<v Speaker 1>medical examiner and everything's pristining quiet, you know. It made

0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:31.320
<v Speaker 1>me think back to days as a trial lawyer, where

0:14:31.480 --> 0:14:34.600
<v Speaker 1>there was so much happening in the courtroom. People were

0:14:34.600 --> 0:14:38.400
<v Speaker 1>coming in and out, spectators getting up and down talking

0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:41.760
<v Speaker 1>behind me, the defense attorneys whining and gnashing their teeth

0:14:41.800 --> 0:14:44.040
<v Speaker 1>and twitching their tails on the other side of the room.

0:14:44.440 --> 0:14:50.000
<v Speaker 1>But you zone completely out of all that and focus

0:14:50.200 --> 0:14:53.160
<v Speaker 1>on what you're doing. It's like all of that just disappears.

0:14:54.000 --> 0:14:57.800
<v Speaker 1>I wouldn't even be conscious of it. I remember, this

0:14:57.840 --> 0:15:01.320
<v Speaker 1>is funny. The first time I'm court TV, where I

0:15:01.400 --> 0:15:05.120
<v Speaker 1>later went to work, covered a case of mine that

0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:07.760
<v Speaker 1>was when women still had to wear pantyhose, and I

0:15:07.840 --> 0:15:12.800
<v Speaker 1>was so not focusing on anything but the case. They

0:15:12.840 --> 0:15:15.760
<v Speaker 1>got me from behind hitching up my pantyhose as they

0:15:15.800 --> 0:15:19.000
<v Speaker 1>inevitably would start going down now in the middle of

0:15:19.080 --> 0:15:23.960
<v Speaker 1>its trial. So you totally zone out and focus on

0:15:24.080 --> 0:15:27.440
<v Speaker 1>nothing but what you're doing. On the other hand, I

0:15:27.480 --> 0:15:31.360
<v Speaker 1>also loved being in the law library on weekends when

0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:34.920
<v Speaker 1>it would be totally quiet and I would be completely

0:15:35.000 --> 0:15:41.560
<v Speaker 1>alone with my legal thoughts and analysis. After you perform

0:15:41.680 --> 0:15:47.680
<v Speaker 1>the autopsy, when do you do all of the written reports.

0:15:47.680 --> 0:15:50.200
<v Speaker 1>You probably dictate during the autopsy.

0:15:50.880 --> 0:15:53.640
<v Speaker 2>Sometimes I dictate during the case, and sometimes I wait

0:15:53.680 --> 0:15:56.160
<v Speaker 2>till after. It just depends on the complexity of the case.

0:15:56.160 --> 0:15:59.360
<v Speaker 2>If it's a multiple gunshot wound with multiple wounds, the

0:15:59.400 --> 0:16:01.840
<v Speaker 2>dictations self can take quite a while and it can

0:16:01.880 --> 0:16:04.120
<v Speaker 2>be very in depth, so I usually do those when

0:16:04.120 --> 0:16:06.120
<v Speaker 2>I can sit in my office and just read through

0:16:06.160 --> 0:16:08.840
<v Speaker 2>my notes and make sure I get everything accurate. If

0:16:08.880 --> 0:16:11.280
<v Speaker 2>it's as simple like just heart attack or drug overdose,

0:16:11.360 --> 0:16:15.040
<v Speaker 2>those can be dictated quite quickly at the autopsy, right

0:16:15.080 --> 0:16:17.400
<v Speaker 2>as soon as the autopsy is done. So it kind

0:16:17.440 --> 0:16:18.960
<v Speaker 2>of just depends on the case of when I do

0:16:19.040 --> 0:16:21.920
<v Speaker 2>the dictations. But I do have some alone time in

0:16:21.960 --> 0:16:24.800
<v Speaker 2>my office usually at the after the autopsies are done,

0:16:24.840 --> 0:16:27.280
<v Speaker 2>to go through things and then process the paperwork.

0:16:27.800 --> 0:16:29.080
<v Speaker 1>Are you in your office right now?

0:16:30.240 --> 0:16:33.880
<v Speaker 2>I am in I have actually two offices connected by

0:16:33.880 --> 0:16:35.920
<v Speaker 2>a hallway, and this is a kind of a conference

0:16:36.000 --> 0:16:39.200
<v Speaker 2>room office, and my other office is through the hallway

0:16:39.200 --> 0:16:40.040
<v Speaker 2>on the other side.

0:16:40.440 --> 0:16:42.760
<v Speaker 1>Because it looks to me that you're never alone with

0:16:42.840 --> 0:16:45.760
<v Speaker 1>your two friends behind you. All I know is this

0:16:46.840 --> 0:16:50.080
<v Speaker 1>or the voice never gets old talking to you. Yeah,

0:16:50.240 --> 0:16:53.640
<v Speaker 1>them too, it never gets old talking to you. The

0:16:53.640 --> 0:16:56.400
<v Speaker 1>more you talk, the more questions I have, and the

0:16:56.440 --> 0:16:58.160
<v Speaker 1>more I want to listen. You're one of the few

0:16:58.200 --> 0:17:00.640
<v Speaker 1>guests that don't get interrupted. Just look on Twitter. People

0:17:00.640 --> 0:17:04.480
<v Speaker 1>hate it. I know that because you have so much

0:17:04.920 --> 0:17:07.320
<v Speaker 1>to say, and I don't ever want to miss a word,

0:17:07.720 --> 0:17:11.199
<v Speaker 1>and I don't want anyone else to miss a word.

0:17:11.880 --> 0:17:15.119
<v Speaker 1>You hear about the autopsies, you hear about the investigations,

0:17:15.119 --> 0:17:19.479
<v Speaker 1>but you hear a whole another side of what really

0:17:19.720 --> 0:17:24.000
<v Speaker 1>happens in the morgue and on crime scenes death scenes.

0:17:24.840 --> 0:17:28.040
<v Speaker 1>If I am judging by the first one I've heard,

0:17:28.600 --> 0:17:31.560
<v Speaker 1>I can't wait to hear the second one. Doctor Kendall

0:17:31.600 --> 0:17:36.800
<v Speaker 1>Crown's launching mayhem in the Morgue, and I am looking

0:17:36.840 --> 0:17:39.880
<v Speaker 1>forward to the next one. I love the first one,

0:17:40.520 --> 0:17:42.360
<v Speaker 1>and I will leave it a mystery as to how

0:17:42.400 --> 0:17:45.040
<v Speaker 1>something shoots out of the dead person's rear end. I

0:17:45.040 --> 0:17:48.040
<v Speaker 1>will let you tell that story at the right time,

0:17:48.119 --> 0:17:51.160
<v Speaker 1>Doctor Kendall Crowns, thank you for joining me.

0:17:54.000 --> 0:17:56.840
<v Speaker 2>Hello, I'm doctor Kendall Crown's, host of your favorite new

0:17:56.880 --> 0:18:00.439
<v Speaker 2>weekly crime online podcasts, Mayhem and The Morgue. I have

0:18:00.520 --> 0:18:04.040
<v Speaker 2>been around forensics for over thirty five years and performed

0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:08.240
<v Speaker 2>thousands of autopsies. I have been everything from an autopsy

0:18:08.240 --> 0:18:11.120
<v Speaker 2>tech to finally, a medical examiner, and each week we'll

0:18:11.160 --> 0:18:15.080
<v Speaker 2>be discussing stories from my lengthy career. The stories will

0:18:15.160 --> 0:18:20.119
<v Speaker 2>range from courtroom dramas, explosions, maulings, shootings, drug overdoses. The

0:18:20.160 --> 0:18:23.000
<v Speaker 2>cases will never end, and the stories will range from

0:18:23.000 --> 0:18:26.320
<v Speaker 2>the humorous to horrifying, covering a wide variety of topics,

0:18:26.560 --> 0:18:29.399
<v Speaker 2>and it will never be a dull moment. Hopefully you

0:18:29.440 --> 0:18:32.399
<v Speaker 2>will find the stories entertaining and maybe you'll learn something.

0:18:32.680 --> 0:18:35.960
<v Speaker 2>So tune in and I can guarantee your nightmares will

0:18:36.000 --> 0:18:36.800
<v Speaker 2>never be the same.