1 00:00:02,240 --> 00:00:04,960 Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, it's Bill Courtney again with an army of 2 00:00:05,040 --> 00:00:08,840 Speaker 1: normal folks. Let's continue with part two of our conversation 3 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:12,840 Speaker 1: with Sonya Agron. Right after these brief messages from our 4 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:31,280 Speaker 1: generous sponsors, you decide you've got to do something. And 5 00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:39,240 Speaker 1: this is where I find you amazing. Is I don't 6 00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:44,400 Speaker 1: explain it to us, But so I understand now. I 7 00:00:44,440 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 1: didn't that the Red Cross had centers for the first responders, 8 00:00:49,479 --> 00:00:52,159 Speaker 1: and some of these guys would work all day and 9 00:00:52,159 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: wouldn't even go home. And they would go and sleep 10 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: in a center near ground zero and get a little 11 00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:02,040 Speaker 1: rest and rust up and then go back. And they 12 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:06,119 Speaker 1: would never go home. So they actually worked and slept there. 13 00:01:07,040 --> 00:01:09,800 Speaker 1: And these sinners need to be need to be run, 14 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:14,759 Speaker 1: and you volunteered there. Yeah, and so tell me what 15 00:01:15,360 --> 00:01:18,520 Speaker 1: go into what I just said, Explain that how it worked. 16 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:22,319 Speaker 2: How it worked was my first responsibility was just to 17 00:01:22,360 --> 00:01:25,959 Speaker 2: help them get food. So many amazing people donated so 18 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:30,279 Speaker 2: much food I couldn't eat. I felt I was taking 19 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:34,240 Speaker 2: something away from someone else. And about two days later, 20 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:37,240 Speaker 2: and I wouldn't talk to anybody. For the first time 21 00:01:37,240 --> 00:01:40,280 Speaker 2: in my life, I wasn't this bubbly person I didn't 22 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:44,760 Speaker 2: know how to be, and I I started doing these 23 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 2: hero sticks, making little flags saying they were hero sticks 24 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:49,640 Speaker 2: you did to fight. 25 00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 1: Crime andold you making them out of they. 26 00:01:52,280 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 2: Were chapsticks, and I just put little rabels on them, 27 00:01:56,760 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 2: hear your hero And then I would buy a bunch 28 00:01:59,680 --> 00:02:01,880 Speaker 2: of life savers, put them in a bag and just 29 00:02:02,560 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 2: say because you are a lifesaver. Because many of them 30 00:02:05,360 --> 00:02:07,760 Speaker 2: weren't feeling that. But it was the only way I 31 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:12,320 Speaker 2: could speak. I could not speak. And about two days 32 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 2: after my midnight shift, my leader with a bunch of 33 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:18,919 Speaker 2: others say we're going to ground zero and I asked, 34 00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:21,120 Speaker 2: are we aloud? And she goes, have you ever looked 35 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 2: at your ID? It's the first time I did, and 36 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 2: it said access everywhere, and I thought, oh, well, this 37 00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:29,880 Speaker 2: is not going to please my husband. 38 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:32,480 Speaker 1: You had more access than me. 39 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:36,160 Speaker 2: But we went down to pray. I know now where 40 00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:38,120 Speaker 2: I was, because as you both know, I have no 41 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 2: sense of direction. 42 00:02:39,440 --> 00:02:43,040 Speaker 1: Well, but the bottom line is also there's really no 43 00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 1: clues anymore because it's just rubble. 44 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:49,040 Speaker 2: But I know now that I was near the North 45 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:52,120 Speaker 2: Tower and the North Tower Bridge, and the way it 46 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:54,600 Speaker 2: looked it was like I'm standing up here, and all 47 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:56,400 Speaker 2: of a sudden, I can see this big hole and 48 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:58,920 Speaker 2: it wasn't even as big as it turned out to 49 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:00,480 Speaker 2: be at the end when they had cleaned it. 50 00:03:00,400 --> 00:03:03,160 Speaker 1: All up, and that was because it was filled with 51 00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:03,640 Speaker 1: the building. 52 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 2: Yes, And I just said, naively, where is everything? And 53 00:03:10,520 --> 00:03:12,360 Speaker 2: one of them grabbed me and hugged me, says, so 54 00:03:12,400 --> 00:03:16,639 Speaker 2: you're the New Yorker, And I said, but where is everything? 55 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 2: I knew it was gone. I've seen the pictures, but 56 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:21,880 Speaker 2: when you see it up close, it is totally different. 57 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:27,240 Speaker 1: Okay, So paint that picture for me all my senses. 58 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:31,360 Speaker 1: What did it sound like? What did it smell like? 59 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:33,280 Speaker 1: Could you taste it? 60 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 2: I could taste it like rotten peaches, rotten peaches. I 61 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:43,440 Speaker 2: only eat nectarines now I can't deal with peaches really rotten, 62 00:03:44,160 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 2: just rotten, and it. 63 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:49,360 Speaker 1: Could so you could still taste it. What did it 64 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: smell like? 65 00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 2: Oh, well, Nia mesked me know what death smells like. 66 00:03:54,200 --> 00:03:57,480 Speaker 2: They give us these little bats, So like, oh it 67 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:00,839 Speaker 2: was death, it was it was flesh. 68 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 1: You could smell that. Still. 69 00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 2: I go into the historical exhibit and I know there 70 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 2: are no smells there, There's nothing there. But as soon 71 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:11,800 Speaker 2: as I walk into a certain area and I have 72 00:04:11,880 --> 00:04:14,920 Speaker 2: to walk back up because I'm right there. Again, my 73 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:17,840 Speaker 2: husband's only done it once and that was when they 74 00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:20,839 Speaker 2: gave us an exhibit and he went in. I said, 75 00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 2: you have to you know, you were part of this. 76 00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:25,240 Speaker 2: We're trying to tell a story that people don't understand. 77 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 2: And he said, just get me to the site and 78 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:28,760 Speaker 2: let's get out. 79 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:29,919 Speaker 1: What did it feel like? 80 00:04:32,440 --> 00:04:39,719 Speaker 2: Scary? Scary to a point? After that visit with my 81 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:42,400 Speaker 2: team leader, I went back and everything looked different for me. 82 00:04:42,880 --> 00:04:46,400 Speaker 2: I understood why people were hugging. I understood the reason 83 00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 2: why people were just holding hands. I didn't want to 84 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:49,520 Speaker 2: do any of that. 85 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:51,840 Speaker 1: Strangers really yeah, but. 86 00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:54,080 Speaker 2: You know, like, how are you doing this? You don't 87 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:56,640 Speaker 2: really know each other. But I understood as soon as 88 00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:59,279 Speaker 2: I came back from the site and I looked in, 89 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:04,840 Speaker 2: I said, they're comforting each other. And at that moment, 90 00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 2: they told me your assignment has been changed, and I said, 91 00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:09,440 Speaker 2: where am I going? You're going up stairs take care 92 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 2: first responders. And I thought that was a blessing because 93 00:05:13,839 --> 00:05:15,120 Speaker 2: I couldn't help my husband. 94 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:23,440 Speaker 1: So you're standing there and it smells like rotten peaches. No, 95 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:30,200 Speaker 1: it tastes like speeches like it smells like burning, and 96 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:31,440 Speaker 1: there were. 97 00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:35,159 Speaker 2: Other smells and I knew there were fires from the 98 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:38,640 Speaker 2: building smoke still, yeah, oh there was definitely it smelled. 99 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 1: Liked Sophiel at all. 100 00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:41,719 Speaker 2: You know, I don't recollect that. 101 00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:44,760 Speaker 1: I just I've always wondered from the planes, because that's 102 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:47,840 Speaker 1: what started the fire. If you could still smell that. 103 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 2: It might happen the first week or two, but I 104 00:05:50,839 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 2: didn't smell it when I came in on. 105 00:05:52,279 --> 00:05:56,920 Speaker 1: Okay, So it tastes the smell? Did it feel gritty? 106 00:05:57,440 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 2: Every gritty gritty? Everything was gritty from my shoes. When 107 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:03,240 Speaker 2: we got outside. We had to get another vest on. 108 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 1: Okay. And you see a hole that's basically a building filled? 109 00:06:07,040 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 1: Could you? And I guess you see people working on 110 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:15,320 Speaker 1: top of the rubble and what did you hear? Wow? 111 00:06:15,760 --> 00:06:18,560 Speaker 2: You hear a lot of trucks. You hear the sounds. 112 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:22,680 Speaker 1: Of those big excavators, machinery. 113 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:25,800 Speaker 2: The machinery, but the wind, the lights, a. 114 00:06:25,839 --> 00:06:27,800 Speaker 1: Big light, oh, the generators. 115 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:30,719 Speaker 2: Okay, they were going on. And it didn't look like nighttime. 116 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:32,560 Speaker 2: It looked like you were in Vegas when it's nine 117 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:33,760 Speaker 2: and all that you see as left. 118 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:36,479 Speaker 1: Okay, Well that's Another thing to see is so middle 119 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:39,119 Speaker 1: of the night, but it's bright everywhere because it's twenty 120 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:39,640 Speaker 1: four hours. 121 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 2: You see fires. And I remember when I got out 122 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:45,960 Speaker 2: the first time, how did my shoes get so muddy? 123 00:06:46,920 --> 00:06:47,240 Speaker 1: Really? 124 00:06:47,320 --> 00:06:51,160 Speaker 2: Yeah? And I was standing No, it was mudpiles because 125 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:55,240 Speaker 2: they had been spraying the whole entire area to you know, 126 00:06:55,240 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 2: break down any flax and this was the residue. And 127 00:06:57,920 --> 00:07:00,800 Speaker 2: you know, I wondered, where are my shoes us I'm 128 00:07:00,880 --> 00:07:02,920 Speaker 2: standing right here, and somebody said, just put them out, 129 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 2: we'll get them cleaned for you. And okay, And I was. 130 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:11,560 Speaker 2: I was so robotic at that moment, but something changed 131 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:13,880 Speaker 2: when they put me into work as first responders. 132 00:07:13,960 --> 00:07:18,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, and so from there, you that's the thing you get. 133 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:23,120 Speaker 1: What you're volunteering to do is actually tend to the 134 00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 1: first responders that are coming to these what. 135 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:29,080 Speaker 2: Are they called respit censors. They're each. 136 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 1: So they set up restpit centers so that a fireman 137 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:36,680 Speaker 1: or any first responder or police officer whatever, they work 138 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 1: until they're about to drop, they're covered. The reason I 139 00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:43,960 Speaker 1: wanted these senses. They're covered in the soot and this 140 00:07:44,120 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 1: mud and this filth, and they must stink like death. 141 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 1: And rotten peaches. They have to have it all over them. 142 00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:59,320 Speaker 2: What I remember is how dirty they looked. I would 143 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:02,200 Speaker 2: give them enough close to shower just to change it 144 00:08:02,240 --> 00:08:08,360 Speaker 2: under garments, And what didn't go away was the smell 145 00:08:08,400 --> 00:08:12,440 Speaker 2: of smoke. Even though they had clean undergarments, they still 146 00:08:12,480 --> 00:08:13,840 Speaker 2: had to wear their uniforms. 147 00:08:14,120 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 1: Oh, so that stench. 148 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:18,680 Speaker 2: Now, that does not And we did everything. We banged 149 00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:21,920 Speaker 2: it whatever I could. It didn't matter. 150 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:25,640 Speaker 1: So you're you're in these respite centers taking care of 151 00:08:25,680 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: the first responders. They're in this mess, breathing this crap 152 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:38,720 Speaker 1: andhaling it, trying to clean and find, frankly body parts 153 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:43,040 Speaker 1: so that some family can have just a piece of 154 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 1: their loved one. I can't even believe I'm saying this, 155 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:51,559 Speaker 1: but this is what. This is reality, And they're coming 156 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:55,320 Speaker 1: to a respite center that you're now at to with 157 00:08:55,480 --> 00:08:58,439 Speaker 1: other volunteers to help these folks get a little rest, 158 00:08:58,520 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 1: and they don't even go home. And then they get 159 00:09:00,360 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 1: and they go right back to it. And this went 160 00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:02,880 Speaker 1: on for months. 161 00:09:02,960 --> 00:09:06,319 Speaker 2: Yeah, this went on for months. One of the issues 162 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:10,880 Speaker 2: we had on our team was firefighters could take off 163 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:14,840 Speaker 2: their garments and put it on the edge of the floor, 164 00:09:14,880 --> 00:09:17,240 Speaker 2: and we also had engineers and all that, but when 165 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 2: it came to police officers, they couldn't take their guns off. 166 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:23,480 Speaker 2: And so a lot of the people that I was 167 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:25,080 Speaker 2: working would say, we don't know how to wake them 168 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 2: up because they jump, And I go, I know how 169 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:30,719 Speaker 2: they jump and gun? Yeah, And so I said, here, 170 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 2: follow me, this is what you do. What's their first name? 171 00:09:33,640 --> 00:09:37,160 Speaker 2: So I just go up to the head, rub their faces, 172 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:40,000 Speaker 2: whisper in their ears their name, and they're going to 173 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:44,680 Speaker 2: think their home. And that's exactly what happened. These guys 174 00:09:44,720 --> 00:09:49,280 Speaker 2: bleach strangers didn't matter. They weren't strangers. They were family. 175 00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:52,640 Speaker 1: Because you're literally rubbing these guys. 176 00:09:52,760 --> 00:09:55,520 Speaker 2: Rubbing some other's women's husband's face. But it didn't matter. 177 00:09:55,559 --> 00:09:58,040 Speaker 2: They didn't wake up in shock. They didn't wake up 178 00:09:58,080 --> 00:10:02,640 Speaker 2: thinking something else is happening. And for those who are 179 00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:06,120 Speaker 2: working with me, they say thank you because we would 180 00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 2: just shine flashlights in their face hoping they would wake up, 181 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:10,520 Speaker 2: and they would still jump up. 182 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:14,319 Speaker 1: One of the things I've read about shock, and one 183 00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:16,400 Speaker 1: of the things I've read about people that come home 184 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:20,120 Speaker 1: from war is one of the hardest things they have 185 00:10:20,200 --> 00:10:24,920 Speaker 1: to do is actually sleep. That in closing their eyes, 186 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:28,840 Speaker 1: their mind immediately goes to the horror that they've experienced, 187 00:10:29,320 --> 00:10:33,079 Speaker 1: and by not sleeping and keeping your eyes open, your 188 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:36,360 Speaker 1: mind doesn't trick you into having to relive that horror. 189 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:41,640 Speaker 1: And what that leads to, though, is people who are 190 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:45,080 Speaker 1: already in a stressful situation, they don't get enough sleep, 191 00:10:45,880 --> 00:10:49,559 Speaker 1: and then it exacerbates the problem. So it's like, damned 192 00:10:49,559 --> 00:10:53,200 Speaker 1: if you're damned if you don't. Were any of the guys, 193 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:59,120 Speaker 1: I mean, we're talking about firefighters and policemen. We're talking about, 194 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:03,040 Speaker 1: you know, goud guys rolling in these splices, and so 195 00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:06,000 Speaker 1: I got to believe they're walking in with this facade 196 00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:08,640 Speaker 1: of I'm tough as hell. But then they shower and 197 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:10,480 Speaker 1: they try to get cleaned up, and now they're supposed 198 00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:15,040 Speaker 1: to get rested. Did any of them struggle? Was just sleep? 199 00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:22,320 Speaker 2: The few that I had when I would get them 200 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:25,560 Speaker 2: to their assigned cots, would grab my hand to wrist 201 00:11:25,600 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 2: and tell me, can you just sit with me for 202 00:11:27,080 --> 00:11:30,079 Speaker 2: a minute. And it was at that moment that I 203 00:11:30,160 --> 00:11:33,840 Speaker 2: understood why my husband couldn't sleep. And they, some of them, 204 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:35,560 Speaker 2: said I can't. I don't want to see what I 205 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:38,960 Speaker 2: just saw, and whatever they wanted me to do, I 206 00:11:38,960 --> 00:11:41,200 Speaker 2: would do so. If it was a dumb joke, I 207 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:44,840 Speaker 2: would say and I'd invent one. Some of them wanted 208 00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:47,439 Speaker 2: to pray, some of them just wanted to put their 209 00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:49,680 Speaker 2: heads on my shoulder. And I did it because I 210 00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:52,320 Speaker 2: felt I couldn't do it for my husband. Maybe somebody 211 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:55,120 Speaker 2: in the day too, it would do it for him. 212 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 2: Just payd forward. 213 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: And did you let these guys know that you were married. 214 00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:00,959 Speaker 2: To a Absolutely I had money. 215 00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:02,760 Speaker 1: So they knew that you knew what the job was. 216 00:12:02,840 --> 00:12:04,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I show them, I says, listen, you know 217 00:12:05,160 --> 00:12:07,920 Speaker 2: I'm not on the job, but I am on the job. 218 00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:10,760 Speaker 2: And they would smile, they would talk to me, and 219 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:14,679 Speaker 2: that would mean their whole entire forty minute rest. 220 00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:15,960 Speaker 1: Forty minutes. 221 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, some of them got an out because some of 222 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:20,640 Speaker 2: them were still on duty. They were given an hour break, 223 00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:22,560 Speaker 2: and they decided, oh, that's where I'm going to go. 224 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 2: And then they realized that's where we can't go because 225 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:28,520 Speaker 2: we can't we were not resting. And imagine you and 226 00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 2: police officer with all this equipment on, couldn't take any 227 00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:34,719 Speaker 2: part of your uniform on because if they called you, 228 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:38,320 Speaker 2: you had to be ready to respond. And so for me. 229 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:41,880 Speaker 2: The best part and the worst part of my job 230 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 2: was bringing comfort anybody who wanted. It didn't matter to 231 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:48,520 Speaker 2: me who you were, what you were crying about, whatever 232 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:52,280 Speaker 2: you wanted to tell me. Stayed with me. And as 233 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:55,280 Speaker 2: the days went on, I understood why my husband wouldn't talk. 234 00:12:55,559 --> 00:12:57,480 Speaker 2: I understood a lot about him. 235 00:12:57,840 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 1: Well, you didn't have to do this. You were voluntar. 236 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:04,960 Speaker 2: I volunteered because it's your responsibility. Whether you're emt or not, 237 00:13:05,120 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 2: this is your community. You have to get involved with 238 00:13:07,559 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 2: your community. If you're not, then what's the point. It 239 00:13:10,360 --> 00:13:13,760 Speaker 2: takes a village. And I was part of that village. 240 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 1: So that's the point is you know, you're sure, you're 241 00:13:20,520 --> 00:13:24,920 Speaker 1: an empty sure your husband's on the job, but you know, 242 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:31,959 Speaker 1: you just you're Sonia from the Brons and and the 243 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:35,640 Speaker 1: worst thing that's happened in our country since Pearl Harbor, 244 00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:40,440 Speaker 1: and in the midst of what we've described of true 245 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 1: human horror. You go down there every day simply to 246 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:48,480 Speaker 1: try to console and take care of the people that 247 00:13:48,520 --> 00:13:50,320 Speaker 1: are trying to take care of this mess. 248 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:52,160 Speaker 2: I think everyone should have. 249 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:53,360 Speaker 1: And how long did you do that? 250 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:58,520 Speaker 2: I was there until the mid December when my husband 251 00:13:58,559 --> 00:14:04,520 Speaker 2: asked me to please not go anymore. So four months, Yeah, 252 00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:07,320 Speaker 2: he didn't want me to go back anymore. And my 253 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:09,840 Speaker 2: daughter was also. It was his mom, I can't sleep, 254 00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:14,439 Speaker 2: I can't go to school. And I said, okay, I 255 00:14:14,880 --> 00:14:16,319 Speaker 2: have to be a wife and I have to be 256 00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:20,440 Speaker 2: a mom. But I felt I did something and I continue. 257 00:14:20,640 --> 00:14:23,960 Speaker 2: I started from there doing other things just for people 258 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:25,160 Speaker 2: who weren't there here. 259 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:27,960 Speaker 1: How close are these rest but centers if you're only 260 00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:30,960 Speaker 1: getting a forty five minute break, they must be right 261 00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:31,680 Speaker 1: on top of it. 262 00:14:31,960 --> 00:14:36,960 Speaker 2: Saint John's was I think three blocks away Stuyvesant. 263 00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:37,920 Speaker 1: So three blocks, two or three blocks? 264 00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:39,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, and then they had tents. 265 00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:43,600 Speaker 1: Okay, Well, even when you're not on ground zero, even 266 00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:46,400 Speaker 1: working at these places, you're in the midst of it all. 267 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 2: We sort of smoke and fire for months. 268 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:52,480 Speaker 1: So how many volunteers were there like you? 269 00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:55,040 Speaker 2: Oh wow? For the Red Cross? All I can tell 270 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:59,720 Speaker 2: you is my midnight team had about twenty, with myself included. 271 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:03,760 Speaker 2: You couldn't leave unless somebody came to replace us. But 272 00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 2: it was round the clock, and some of them that 273 00:15:05,800 --> 00:15:06,840 Speaker 2: I spoke to weren't. 274 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:08,520 Speaker 1: Even And there were many respite centers. 275 00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:14,040 Speaker 2: Yes, you had the Married Hotel, that had respite centers whatever. Well, 276 00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:16,320 Speaker 2: I can't say Burger King because that was a center 277 00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:20,920 Speaker 2: for the police department. But wherever there was a hotel 278 00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 2: or something big enough to house people, that was what 279 00:15:25,520 --> 00:15:28,880 Speaker 2: was done for thousands, I would say, yeah, and a 280 00:15:28,880 --> 00:15:32,360 Speaker 2: lot of those stories don't even exist anymore, all. 281 00:15:32,200 --> 00:15:41,080 Speaker 1: Of whom breathed in this toxic crowd YEP, we'll be 282 00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:58,520 Speaker 1: right back. So we're twenty years later and you're still volunteering. 283 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 2: I never left. I mean, except for the seven years 284 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:05,720 Speaker 2: that we couldn't talk about nine to eleven, I never left. 285 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:08,960 Speaker 2: My heart was always there. And when the opportunity came 286 00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:12,280 Speaker 2: up after my mom passed. Before she passed, she reminded 287 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 2: me that I said I was still going to do 288 00:16:15,040 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 2: something for the community, and she goes, you've been taking 289 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:20,080 Speaker 2: care of me too long. And the day after we 290 00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:22,760 Speaker 2: buried her, I got the email from Tribute. Are you 291 00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:23,680 Speaker 2: still interested? 292 00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:26,520 Speaker 1: Tell me to explain to our listeners attributed The. 293 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:30,240 Speaker 2: Nine to eleven Tribu Museum was the first museum on 294 00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:34,240 Speaker 2: ground zero and it was started by the September eleventh 295 00:16:34,240 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 2: Families Association, and we actually started on the streets. We 296 00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:41,000 Speaker 2: didn't have offices or anything. We would just pull people 297 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:43,040 Speaker 2: the next would you like to go? And we can 298 00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:46,080 Speaker 2: tell you. And the criteria of the nine to eleven 299 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:48,920 Speaker 2: Tribune Museum was that the only people who could do 300 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:51,600 Speaker 2: this were people who had a personal connection. 301 00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:54,480 Speaker 1: So the only people who could do tours or talks. 302 00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 2: We've gone to school, I've gone to Japan, and so 303 00:16:58,120 --> 00:17:01,400 Speaker 2: it's either first responder recovery work, or a survivor, a 304 00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:04,720 Speaker 2: family member or a resident. Because we were directly affected, 305 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:09,679 Speaker 2: and that became the difference between what we do and 306 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:13,880 Speaker 2: what the National Museum does. And it was not only 307 00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 2: to tell the stories. That's what we thought we were doing. 308 00:17:16,840 --> 00:17:20,440 Speaker 2: What we realized very soon was that we were healing 309 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 2: because you're talking to strangers who aren't going to tell 310 00:17:24,040 --> 00:17:27,440 Speaker 2: you move on and get over it. And at the end, 311 00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:31,000 Speaker 2: those strangers became our friends. They hugged us. Some of 312 00:17:31,040 --> 00:17:34,680 Speaker 2: them have kept in touch with us. They've come back three, 313 00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:36,639 Speaker 2: four or five times and they will say, oh, we 314 00:17:36,680 --> 00:17:38,479 Speaker 2: want to tour with Sonya and I go. There are 315 00:17:38,480 --> 00:17:40,639 Speaker 2: so many other people. Yeh know, we want to hear 316 00:17:40,680 --> 00:17:43,879 Speaker 2: it from you, and we put a face on nine 317 00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:47,480 Speaker 2: to eleven. But people forget about the flight ninety three 318 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:50,159 Speaker 2: where there were forty people, which used to be always 319 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 2: two hundred. That flight took off late, and these forty 320 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:56,000 Speaker 2: people knew they were being hijacked, they knew where they 321 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:59,280 Speaker 2: were going, and they made the democratic decision when that 322 00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:02,680 Speaker 2: plane was over land or water, that they would take 323 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 2: over that cockpit, even though they knew they would die. 324 00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:09,280 Speaker 2: And I always say not to take away from any 325 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:12,440 Speaker 2: of our first responders, but those were our first heroes. 326 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:14,600 Speaker 2: They knew what was going to. 327 00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:17,440 Speaker 1: Happen, because whatever that plane was going to hit, they 328 00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:22,840 Speaker 1: saved and whatever. Some think it was the Capital, some 329 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:23,520 Speaker 1: think it was the. 330 00:18:23,840 --> 00:18:26,639 Speaker 2: White It was it was the Capital because Congress was 331 00:18:26,680 --> 00:18:27,119 Speaker 2: in session. 332 00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:28,720 Speaker 1: That was the first day I had to have been. 333 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:30,480 Speaker 1: I think it was New. 334 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:35,119 Speaker 2: York's the world's economy, world's military, which was the Pentagon 335 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:37,400 Speaker 2: and the Capitol, and they got two out of three. 336 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:40,680 Speaker 2: But we owe these forty people are dead, a gratitude 337 00:18:40,760 --> 00:18:43,920 Speaker 2: that they knew. They didn't know why, but they knew. 338 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:46,919 Speaker 2: They were getting calls information, and they said, we're not 339 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:49,560 Speaker 2: letting this happen. By that time, I believe both captains 340 00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:54,320 Speaker 2: were murdered, and there is a black box that was taken. 341 00:18:54,680 --> 00:18:57,960 Speaker 2: We've gone to Shanksville, and there is a display of 342 00:18:58,000 --> 00:18:59,960 Speaker 2: how the plane was. People were fighting and you can 343 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:02,439 Speaker 2: see the plane going deep to the right, deep to 344 00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:05,199 Speaker 2: the left, and the terrorists would say, we're not going 345 00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:08,320 Speaker 2: to make our mark. Let's just kill them, and so 346 00:19:08,359 --> 00:19:11,200 Speaker 2: they flew the plane up, twisted the plane upside down, 347 00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 2: and that was that they didn't care. 348 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:20,040 Speaker 1: And saved countless lives. The hundreds maybe. 349 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:22,720 Speaker 2: Even those are my favorite people of all time. 350 00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:29,600 Speaker 1: Okay, so my my question to you about the about 351 00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:37,280 Speaker 1: the volunteer work is I've been really fortunate to meet 352 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:44,800 Speaker 1: some of the first responders recently, and every one of 353 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:47,959 Speaker 1: them I've met her sick with some kind of weird 354 00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:54,080 Speaker 1: leukemia or stomach stuff. And they all have this this 355 00:19:54,280 --> 00:19:58,639 Speaker 1: cough that's odd call it. And you have that. 356 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:01,160 Speaker 2: And my husband and I compete every morning whose bark 357 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:02,240 Speaker 2: is your husband? 358 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:02,440 Speaker 1: What? 359 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:05,560 Speaker 2: And I compete every morning whose bark is allowed as it? 360 00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:07,960 Speaker 2: And you call it the bark because it sounds like 361 00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:08,640 Speaker 2: we're barking. 362 00:20:09,040 --> 00:20:15,400 Speaker 1: And tell me, tell me what what has cost medically 363 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:18,480 Speaker 1: among the group of people. 364 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 2: We had insurance and then the VCF came. 365 00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:26,919 Speaker 1: The Victim's Compensation Fund, a federal program to cover the 366 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:31,280 Speaker 1: medical bills for illnesses resulting from the toxic environment that 367 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:32,800 Speaker 1: was ground zero. 368 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:38,240 Speaker 2: And basically we get free medicine. But it's hard to 369 00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 2: get certified for any illness. We have to prove you 370 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:44,640 Speaker 2: were there. We have to get Affter Davids, my husband, 371 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 2: for one, was there. I mean he signedist timesheets and 372 00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 2: when he went after he got sick. He got sick 373 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 2: ten years later. He had already been retired. And when 374 00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:58,359 Speaker 2: he they told him, you can get three quarters for this. 375 00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:01,480 Speaker 2: This was on the job. Don't let go. They denied 376 00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:06,359 Speaker 2: him four times because you can still work, and he goes, no, 377 00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:10,359 Speaker 2: I'm a bodyguard and there are things I have to 378 00:21:10,440 --> 00:21:13,840 Speaker 2: do while I'm protecting someone that I cannot do, and 379 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:17,000 Speaker 2: so it's their life or my job, and I'm here 380 00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:19,960 Speaker 2: to protect their lives. And he literally had to go 381 00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:22,920 Speaker 2: to another hearing and pull his pants down and show 382 00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:23,919 Speaker 2: his diapers. 383 00:21:25,040 --> 00:21:25,760 Speaker 1: Are you kidding me? 384 00:21:25,840 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 2: No? No? And then the wives left behind, some of 385 00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:37,040 Speaker 2: these men and women. But I can only speak for 386 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:39,919 Speaker 2: the women. I know. I'm in a support group, private 387 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:43,919 Speaker 2: support group, because we have our husbands did not come home. 388 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:48,080 Speaker 2: They didn't that their bodies did, put their minds, their 389 00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:52,360 Speaker 2: attitude everything is. We're married to two different men. They 390 00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:55,080 Speaker 2: get angry, they don't they won't do as they're told 391 00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:58,000 Speaker 2: in terms of medical Then we have to watch them 392 00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:01,560 Speaker 2: get sick. We have to watch them get worse. We 393 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:04,800 Speaker 2: have our children have to watch it, and then that's time. 394 00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:07,680 Speaker 2: Then we have to watch them die. And then after 395 00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:12,520 Speaker 2: that we depend on what on our benefits because we've 396 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:14,520 Speaker 2: been spending all this time taking care of them, and 397 00:22:14,560 --> 00:22:17,199 Speaker 2: then they're denied. Well no he didn't sign this. Oh no, 398 00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:19,200 Speaker 2: he was there. 399 00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:20,760 Speaker 1: He was there. 400 00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:23,879 Speaker 2: We have proof he was there, and that's never enough. 401 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:27,920 Speaker 2: Our city failed us, our government failed us. 402 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 1: Are you Are you dealing with health issues? 403 00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:35,600 Speaker 2: I gave up? Yes I have. Oh wow. They won't 404 00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:39,640 Speaker 2: approve my fibromiologia, which I never had before nine to eleven. 405 00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:43,679 Speaker 2: They won't approve my thyroid illness. They only gay. They 406 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:51,280 Speaker 2: only approve my finess and my gird. That's it, and 407 00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:55,280 Speaker 2: I'm in constant pain. I've tried every treatment available to me, 408 00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:58,640 Speaker 2: but I only have one kidney do to cancer, and 409 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:03,200 Speaker 2: there's a lot of things I can't take. My husband 410 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:06,919 Speaker 2: had bladder cancer. Last year. They removed a tumor occupying 411 00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:10,679 Speaker 2: eighty five percent of his spine. But if you go 412 00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:13,160 Speaker 2: to a doctor now and you put down your medical 413 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 2: history and you say anything about nine to eleven, they 414 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:17,879 Speaker 2: do this now. We don't want to have anything to 415 00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:20,879 Speaker 2: do with that. These are doctors, These are doctors. They 416 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:22,359 Speaker 2: won't have anything to do with you. They don't want 417 00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:24,560 Speaker 2: to fill out any paperwork. And there is no paperwork 418 00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:25,920 Speaker 2: to fill out. Just write a letter. 419 00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:32,679 Speaker 1: So can we say that the penalty that you and 420 00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:37,119 Speaker 1: your family are experiencing in many families that volunteered and 421 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:39,560 Speaker 1: gave their time in the aftermath, and non one one 422 00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:42,439 Speaker 1: literally is killing you. 423 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:43,680 Speaker 2: It is. 424 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:46,199 Speaker 1: I got to ask you, would you change it? 425 00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:48,480 Speaker 2: Would I change mind going down there. 426 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:54,200 Speaker 1: Even though you're in constant pain, and even though you're 427 00:23:55,200 --> 00:24:00,120 Speaker 1: strapping cop husband had to demoralize himself to try to 428 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:04,320 Speaker 1: get all of it, You wouldn't change a bit of it. Why? 429 00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:10,239 Speaker 2: Because it's humanity. It's humanity at its best. We have 430 00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:13,200 Speaker 2: to do what we can for each other. Otherwise your 431 00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:17,640 Speaker 2: community suffers. And what happens when there's another attack. Your 432 00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:21,560 Speaker 2: community isn't strong enough. People don't care enough for each other. Oh, 433 00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:25,880 Speaker 2: that's not my business, has nothing to do with me. Yes, 434 00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:28,560 Speaker 2: nine to eleven have to do with everybody. It was 435 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:31,560 Speaker 2: a global event, ninety two nations were affected, but it 436 00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 2: was also a personal event, and there are a lot 437 00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:36,920 Speaker 2: of people that died. No, I don't want to be bothered, 438 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:40,040 Speaker 2: or some people that just can't because it's too hard. 439 00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:43,080 Speaker 2: I have friends that have moved out. I don't want 440 00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:43,480 Speaker 2: to be here. 441 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:52,680 Speaker 1: Sonya, you know you were in your early twenties when 442 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:59,920 Speaker 1: you saw the Lady fall out, and it started a 443 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:04,479 Speaker 1: It started a decade's long journey for you of just 444 00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:09,679 Speaker 1: serving other people. And it's at this point cost you 445 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:15,480 Speaker 1: and your husband your health. It's cost you your It 446 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,919 Speaker 1: sounds to me like it's cost some of your happiness. 447 00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:20,359 Speaker 2: It's cost us our daughter. 448 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:22,520 Speaker 1: It's cost you your daughter. 449 00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:28,080 Speaker 2: We're speaking now, but at one point she screamed and 450 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:29,720 Speaker 2: yelled and she said, I'm sick and tired of you 451 00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,680 Speaker 2: guys being so sick. I'm tired of this. And we 452 00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:37,080 Speaker 2: didn't hear from her for about six months, and my 453 00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:41,800 Speaker 2: husband I thought, this is the price we picked. She's 454 00:25:41,800 --> 00:25:45,240 Speaker 2: come back around since then, but she's angrier than ever 455 00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:49,040 Speaker 2: and we feel so guilty that we had a part 456 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:55,560 Speaker 2: of that. There are a lot of people who I know, 457 00:25:55,640 --> 00:26:00,399 Speaker 2: one woman a good friend, husband is PD and his 458 00:26:00,520 --> 00:26:04,119 Speaker 2: attitude has changed so much that three of her children 459 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:07,520 Speaker 2: want to die. They've actually attempted murder and she had 460 00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:14,000 Speaker 2: to leave the house because of abuse. And that's why 461 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:17,359 Speaker 2: we have a private group survivors wives of nine to 462 00:26:17,359 --> 00:26:20,040 Speaker 2: eleven survivors, because we're paying at pray so that nobody 463 00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 2: seems to understand. And we get told, well, you can 464 00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:25,720 Speaker 2: go to the group therapy. We don't want to talk 465 00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:27,960 Speaker 2: to a group of women that don't understand what we're 466 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,720 Speaker 2: dealing with. And then we are told how ungrateful we 467 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:34,440 Speaker 2: were that they came back, so you should be happy 468 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:38,800 Speaker 2: that you're dealing with this. No, I didn't marry that guy, 469 00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:42,800 Speaker 2: and I didn't expect to lose my daughter either. And 470 00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:45,600 Speaker 2: though she's in our life and we have a beautiful granddaughter, 471 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:49,160 Speaker 2: there's still that anger between us. And we just tried 472 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:53,280 Speaker 2: that's a blessing. I just turn it off because it 473 00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:55,439 Speaker 2: might right now. It's like, I don't have time to 474 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:58,119 Speaker 2: be a mother. I can only be a grandmother. And 475 00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:01,400 Speaker 2: these are the things we tell ourselves. But it's hurting us, 476 00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:05,239 Speaker 2: it's killing us. And we're not the only ones. There 477 00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:08,600 Speaker 2: are a lot of my girlfriends just says my daughter left, 478 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,840 Speaker 2: my son left, or because my husband is this way. 479 00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 2: So as wives, we've you know, we got to take 480 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:16,040 Speaker 2: care of our partner, but we also have to take 481 00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 2: care of our children, and if we try to do 482 00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:21,719 Speaker 2: either one, someone's always going to be angry at us. 483 00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:28,440 Speaker 2: I just live every day thanking God that he trusted 484 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:31,320 Speaker 2: me enough to live another day. That's the way I 485 00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:33,159 Speaker 2: have to see it. Otherwise I know I will go 486 00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:36,919 Speaker 2: absolutely bonkers, and I don't have any intentions of doing that. 487 00:27:39,640 --> 00:28:02,840 Speaker 1: We'll be right back. Talk a lot about on this 488 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:07,879 Speaker 1: show about common people doing extraordinary things. That's that's the 489 00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:11,879 Speaker 1: whole idea of the army of normal folks. And you know, 490 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:15,280 Speaker 1: there's just not much more normal than a than a 491 00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:17,919 Speaker 1: than a paramedic and a cop getting married in the 492 00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:22,159 Speaker 1: Bronx and living life. And the extraordinary things that you 493 00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:26,760 Speaker 1: did after Note to eleven just to serve and then 494 00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:31,480 Speaker 1: the extraordinary things you've done in the last few years 495 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:36,800 Speaker 1: to tell the real story of Note eleven to people 496 00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:41,680 Speaker 1: who wanted to know what was going on, and all 497 00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:44,880 Speaker 1: that it's cost you, and you still say I wouldn't 498 00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:47,240 Speaker 1: change a bit of it, because it was just the 499 00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:48,120 Speaker 1: right thing to do. 500 00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 2: I mean, you have to do the right thing. 501 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 1: But that is so inspirational. That is I just listen 502 00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:59,720 Speaker 1: some things that we've talked to people who are in 503 00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:03,120 Speaker 1: javer twenty something years and then they turn their life 504 00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:06,440 Speaker 1: around and they help others. We're talking to people who 505 00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:12,200 Speaker 1: take homeless people jogging and actually turn their lives around, 506 00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:17,120 Speaker 1: and all these stories. But the point is you are 507 00:29:17,240 --> 00:29:19,479 Speaker 1: living proof that you don't have to start a five 508 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:21,440 Speaker 1: OHO one C three, You don't have to start a 509 00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:25,760 Speaker 1: massive organization, you don't have to raise a bunch of money. 510 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:31,280 Speaker 1: You can be just a common living, trying to figure 511 00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:34,400 Speaker 1: it out person, just like the vast majority of us, 512 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,200 Speaker 1: and still find ways to do amazing things to serve 513 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:42,360 Speaker 1: their fellow man. And even in the face of sickness 514 00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:47,760 Speaker 1: and death, you still say that's what we have to do. 515 00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:51,840 Speaker 2: We're responsible for each other. And I think that's what 516 00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:54,960 Speaker 2: we've lost an entire year f to nine to eleven. 517 00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:56,800 Speaker 2: You could look at someone in the face and say 518 00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:00,320 Speaker 2: how are you need stop and tell you you would 519 00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:02,760 Speaker 2: let people stand in front of you on the line 520 00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:04,920 Speaker 2: because they only had three items and you've been there 521 00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:07,560 Speaker 2: for twenty minutes. I believe you are where you're supposed 522 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:12,800 Speaker 2: to be. Don't question it. It's just what we have 523 00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:21,000 Speaker 2: to do. And I our country has gone down the tubes. 524 00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:24,239 Speaker 1: But so you're saying it's not a good thing to 525 00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 1: give back. It's a responsibility. 526 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:27,120 Speaker 2: It's a good thing. 527 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:29,400 Speaker 1: No, it's not just a good thing. 528 00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,560 Speaker 2: It's a major responsibility. I mean, think about one thing 529 00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:36,960 Speaker 2: where I live. I live in a tall building. I 530 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 2: might have twelve people who live on the same floor. 531 00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:43,840 Speaker 2: I know there's about three elderly. If our internet is 532 00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:46,920 Speaker 2: off or we know we're getting a bad storm, I 533 00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:49,640 Speaker 2: immediately turn on make some soup, and I just leave 534 00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:51,400 Speaker 2: it in front of their door. Because some people are 535 00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:54,200 Speaker 2: very proud, and they looked at that as, oh, you 536 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,160 Speaker 2: feel sorry for me. No, it's just being neighborly, just 537 00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,440 Speaker 2: to let you know there's somebody here to help you. 538 00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:02,480 Speaker 2: And I've had several people knock on my door who 539 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:04,880 Speaker 2: you know, we just say hello to. And one of 540 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,320 Speaker 2: them did do that a few years ago, and my 541 00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:10,680 Speaker 2: husband I Meana. She was working around the hallways crazy 542 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:13,280 Speaker 2: and I bought her in. I went ran back to 543 00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:15,600 Speaker 2: apartment and I took all her meds and I called 544 00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:17,720 Speaker 2: nine one one. I just went on her cell phone 545 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:20,560 Speaker 2: called the daughter and oh my god, they're transporting her. 546 00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:22,200 Speaker 2: I'll stay with you. No, I'm going to be there. 547 00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:25,720 Speaker 2: And two weeks later she came back. And in our culture, 548 00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:29,880 Speaker 2: an elephant is a good luck, blessing thing, and so 549 00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:32,960 Speaker 2: she brought me an elephant with some plants on it. 550 00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:36,000 Speaker 2: And you know, sadly, she would die six months later. 551 00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:39,000 Speaker 2: But I'm forever grateful that she knew at one point 552 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:40,840 Speaker 2: in her life when she was all alone, that she 553 00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:45,440 Speaker 2: wasn't and no one should be alone. I love the holidays, 554 00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:48,000 Speaker 2: but I also hate them because I know so many 555 00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:50,840 Speaker 2: people are alone and they shouldn't be. And when my 556 00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:52,800 Speaker 2: daughter was in college, I would bring all the kids 557 00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:55,760 Speaker 2: over who couldn't afford to fly home. I mean, isn't 558 00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:58,200 Speaker 2: that what Mom's supposted. Wouldn't you, as a mother want 559 00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:01,479 Speaker 2: to know that someone's taking care of your kid and 560 00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:05,000 Speaker 2: nobody cares anymore. It's we don't live in the same 561 00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:07,400 Speaker 2: world we used to live in. I don't know this world, 562 00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:10,040 Speaker 2: but I refuse to give up. I'm not afraid either. 563 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:18,400 Speaker 1: Well. I think the human spirit and the very things 564 00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:22,320 Speaker 1: that you're talking about, that that that that to demonstrate 565 00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:26,400 Speaker 1: our humanity. I think it still exists, but I think 566 00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:30,240 Speaker 1: it's examples of people just like you who help to 567 00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:36,000 Speaker 1: inspire people to remember that that humanity is important. 568 00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:38,000 Speaker 2: Yeah. I don't see any rich people helping us. We 569 00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:39,880 Speaker 2: do it on our own. Yeah, we do it on 570 00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:43,959 Speaker 2: our room because we can. Doesn't whatever, it's what you listen. 571 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:46,680 Speaker 2: I always tell anybody I have a spare room. It's 572 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:49,280 Speaker 2: a little messy, but you're entitled to come over and stay. 573 00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:53,320 Speaker 2: You've got a private bathroom. And I do cook. There's 574 00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:55,640 Speaker 2: always a way. And just I just think. 575 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:59,479 Speaker 1: Chicken and rice precisely what the world is that. 576 00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:04,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's rice mixed with the chicken with peas, and 577 00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:07,760 Speaker 2: you cook it so that the rice tastes like chicken. 578 00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:15,160 Speaker 2: That's his favorite. He just recently got into Sloppy Joe's 579 00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:16,720 Speaker 2: and he goes, why didn't you have a cook back 580 00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:18,160 Speaker 2: from me and says, that's what I cooked when I 581 00:33:18,200 --> 00:33:20,520 Speaker 2: was single and couldn't afford to do anything. Goes, please 582 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:25,280 Speaker 2: bring back those meals. So we're very listen. I married 583 00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 2: a great guy. When I don't want to cook, if 584 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:32,320 Speaker 2: it's not food, I'll take food he cooks. I you know, 585 00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:36,240 Speaker 2: I married the top of the mind. That's it, That's 586 00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:36,960 Speaker 2: all there is to it. 587 00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:43,600 Speaker 1: Sonya, you are again, You're an inspiration, You're you're adorable 588 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:46,400 Speaker 1: to talk to you you got I wish, I wish 589 00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:50,320 Speaker 1: people could see this big, pretty smile. It just you 590 00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:55,719 Speaker 1: you talk with your hands. Yeah, you're just You're just 591 00:33:56,000 --> 00:34:03,240 Speaker 1: You're blast to talk to. And again, you know, I 592 00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:07,120 Speaker 1: don't want to overdo this, but I don't want to 593 00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:11,080 Speaker 1: sensationalize for the purposes of a show the story we've 594 00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:14,240 Speaker 1: talked about today. But I think it's really important people 595 00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:19,799 Speaker 1: understand just the depth of the carnage. And I think 596 00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:24,280 Speaker 1: it's important people understand that nine to eleven still hasn't 597 00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:29,000 Speaker 1: stopped killing. But more importantly, I want people to understand 598 00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:37,000 Speaker 1: that the hidden silver lining of the whole event is 599 00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:41,360 Speaker 1: that it did bring out some of the best of 600 00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 1: our humanity. 601 00:34:42,160 --> 00:34:46,480 Speaker 2: That whole year is beautiful year. My whole year is 602 00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:47,920 Speaker 2: a beautiful, beautiful year. 603 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:53,160 Speaker 1: And despite all the illness and pain and suffering those 604 00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,400 Speaker 1: that serve down there, I can't find any one of 605 00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:58,480 Speaker 1: them that would say, no, I wish I had to 606 00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:01,319 Speaker 1: go on ahead first, had to be there. But see, 607 00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:03,000 Speaker 1: isn't that what it means? To be an army of 608 00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:07,759 Speaker 1: normal folks, just normal folks as an army helping one 609 00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:11,120 Speaker 1: another out and trying to serve. Just for the love 610 00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:11,800 Speaker 1: of humanity. 611 00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:16,560 Speaker 2: That's what's that's what's missing. But I've also seen it. 612 00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:21,759 Speaker 2: I've seen it lately, some people taking charge. How about 613 00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:24,000 Speaker 2: if we do this, how about do we build this garden? 614 00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:26,759 Speaker 2: How about if we do that. That's what I'm talking about. 615 00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:29,360 Speaker 2: You don't you don't need to go through written proposals 616 00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:31,920 Speaker 2: and you don't need to go to a Congress, and 617 00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:34,440 Speaker 2: they're not going to do I don't believe that they 618 00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:34,759 Speaker 2: do it. 619 00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:37,160 Speaker 1: No, I have said plenty that I think the government 620 00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:40,800 Speaker 1: proves woefully inadequate. Yeah, in serving. 621 00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:44,239 Speaker 2: And it's the people that are living this that know 622 00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:46,719 Speaker 2: how it's done and know what to do and know 623 00:35:46,880 --> 00:35:48,120 Speaker 2: the cost involved. 624 00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:51,200 Speaker 1: So anybody listening to it, you don't. You don't have 625 00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:54,239 Speaker 1: to go join something. You just do it. Just go 626 00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:57,439 Speaker 1: do something, thank you, just serve. Just just do it. 627 00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,640 Speaker 1: Serve somebody that needs and. 628 00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:02,360 Speaker 2: You're going to feel ten times better. 629 00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:05,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, that is kind of the payoff that it is 630 00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:08,560 Speaker 1: my payoff. You get so much more out of it. 631 00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:12,440 Speaker 2: Listen, since I decided to start doing tours on my 632 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:16,040 Speaker 2: own until Tribute gets back on its feet. I can't 633 00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:18,200 Speaker 2: tell you how many people come in and go, you're 634 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:20,760 Speaker 2: doing this for free. And I go for now, because 635 00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:23,200 Speaker 2: you know Tribute needs to come back, and they go, 636 00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:24,680 Speaker 2: but you came all the way down here, I says, 637 00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:27,359 Speaker 2: but where did you come from? And we start that 638 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 2: conversation and then I tell them things that I think 639 00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:33,799 Speaker 2: everyone should know, and they go, we didn't know that. Well, 640 00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:36,400 Speaker 2: now you do. Now go back home and tell other people. 641 00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:43,480 Speaker 1: And the irony is, you were supposed to have a 642 00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,480 Speaker 1: shift today to go volunteer to tell these stories. 643 00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:47,520 Speaker 2: This was important. 644 00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:49,959 Speaker 1: Yeah, but that's what you're still doing. 645 00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:53,000 Speaker 2: I am. I decided to do it on Saturday instead. 646 00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:59,600 Speaker 2: I just said, Georgia, he won't. He stopped doing tours 647 00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:00,720 Speaker 2: about four years. 648 00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:01,960 Speaker 1: But he did do something. 649 00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:05,040 Speaker 2: He did just some under the condition that I do 650 00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:07,400 Speaker 2: it with him. He would not talk with anyone else 651 00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:09,319 Speaker 2: in Tribute. You have a lead and then you have 652 00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:13,279 Speaker 2: a support. The support he After a while, he says, 653 00:37:13,360 --> 00:37:15,560 Speaker 2: I can't keep my story straight because so many things 654 00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:16,799 Speaker 2: keep coming back. 655 00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:21,200 Speaker 1: And oh soo. As he was doing tours, he would 656 00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:23,040 Speaker 1: start remembering more and more stuff, and. 657 00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:24,839 Speaker 2: So one day, I just took down and says, talk 658 00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:27,319 Speaker 2: to me. I made a list of questions, talk to me, 659 00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:29,919 Speaker 2: tell me, okay, what happened to this? And then and 660 00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:32,080 Speaker 2: I put it all together and go, hear, that's your story. 661 00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:36,600 Speaker 2: And if it's okay to tell people, I don't recall, 662 00:37:36,719 --> 00:37:40,480 Speaker 2: I don't remember. That evades me because they need to 663 00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:44,160 Speaker 2: also understand that our brains give us as much as 664 00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:44,840 Speaker 2: we can handle. 665 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:47,239 Speaker 1: Yeah, sometimes suppressive. 666 00:37:47,120 --> 00:37:52,280 Speaker 2: But he I think when COVID started and he lost 667 00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:56,440 Speaker 2: his good partner who was also sick from nine to eleven, 668 00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,239 Speaker 2: and we saw him one day and the finally she 669 00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:04,400 Speaker 2: was dead from it, that just that was enough for 670 00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:08,200 Speaker 2: him and he will go with me. We've spoken in 671 00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:11,239 Speaker 2: the precincts to the rookies. They don't know about nine 672 00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:11,640 Speaker 2: to eleven. 673 00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:14,439 Speaker 1: We'll see. That's the other thing. I mean, you think 674 00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:16,560 Speaker 1: about what a rookie cop is what I twenty three, 675 00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:17,520 Speaker 1: twenty four, twenty five. 676 00:38:17,680 --> 00:38:18,479 Speaker 2: They have no idea. 677 00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:21,040 Speaker 1: They weren't even alive, some of them, and. 678 00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:23,120 Speaker 2: If they were two three years old, and if they 679 00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:26,360 Speaker 2: had parents who were affected by nine to eleven, dad shows. 680 00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,799 Speaker 1: So Joe's going and talking to the rookie cop. 681 00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:33,319 Speaker 2: No I go, I book everything, and then I tell 682 00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:34,399 Speaker 2: I need you to be there. 683 00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:37,080 Speaker 1: Oh really, so you kidnap them? 684 00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:37,359 Speaker 2: Yes? 685 00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:38,400 Speaker 1: Are you kidnapper? 686 00:38:38,719 --> 00:38:43,240 Speaker 2: Absolutely? With pride. And when I get I go, gee, 687 00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:46,000 Speaker 2: I'm just so exhausted. Can you handle this part for me? 688 00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:49,200 Speaker 2: And he yeah, okay, so you did it again? No, seriously, 689 00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:50,440 Speaker 2: you don't have to go if you don't want to. 690 00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:53,839 Speaker 2: I just know that game so well. When you become 691 00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:57,120 Speaker 2: a parent, you learn a lot more things. And he'll 692 00:38:57,120 --> 00:38:59,600 Speaker 2: do it. He'll just talk briefly, but once he. 693 00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:02,920 Speaker 1: Gets to he won't. My man is back, yeahcha. 694 00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:05,040 Speaker 2: And so I don't force him. But if I know 695 00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:07,400 Speaker 2: that this is an opportunity where he gets to speak 696 00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:09,439 Speaker 2: to other officers, that's his thing. 697 00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:12,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, it's the brotherhood. 698 00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:17,040 Speaker 2: Otherwise, can you talk to my friend? You know, she'll 699 00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:17,840 Speaker 2: never understand. 700 00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:20,560 Speaker 1: And I believe that, you know, But that's a lot 701 00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:24,920 Speaker 1: like you hear people from war coming back and they 702 00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:27,080 Speaker 1: won't talk with their families, but if you get them 703 00:39:27,080 --> 00:39:29,320 Speaker 1: around a bunch of vets, they'll all talk about My 704 00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:32,000 Speaker 1: father never talked about it because they can identify with 705 00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:32,480 Speaker 1: each other. 706 00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:36,000 Speaker 2: My father never told us he was shot in the 707 00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:38,680 Speaker 2: Korean War. He never told us how bad it was. 708 00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:41,160 Speaker 2: He did show us his bayonet and said, so this 709 00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:42,520 Speaker 2: is what you do. You going like this and you 710 00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:44,120 Speaker 2: do like that. Yeah, No, I don't want to go 711 00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:46,320 Speaker 2: to war. I have to be that close to someone 712 00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:48,799 Speaker 2: and stab him. Yet, No, that's all he told us. 713 00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:51,359 Speaker 2: That's all he had. My mother lived during the war, 714 00:39:52,560 --> 00:39:56,960 Speaker 2: came over from the Netherlands with my grandfather, was sent 715 00:39:57,040 --> 00:40:00,120 Speaker 2: to Puerto Ricos. She would never talk about it. 716 00:40:00,480 --> 00:40:04,879 Speaker 1: And so Joe will open up when he's in the 717 00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:07,600 Speaker 1: safety of people that are in that place. 718 00:40:07,680 --> 00:40:09,719 Speaker 2: He knows that no one's going to judge him, and 719 00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:10,920 Speaker 2: he knows that they know. 720 00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:12,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's good though. 721 00:40:12,239 --> 00:40:16,040 Speaker 2: Well what's important for me was I started writing notebooks 722 00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:20,399 Speaker 2: to our granddaughter. And then about four years ago, Joe 723 00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:22,680 Speaker 2: had a child from a previous marriage and she would 724 00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:24,880 Speaker 2: not allow the child to come around. And now we 725 00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:26,000 Speaker 2: have another granddaughter. 726 00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:26,960 Speaker 1: Well that's awesome. 727 00:40:27,040 --> 00:40:30,520 Speaker 2: So I've started dividing what I have and doing it 728 00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:34,120 Speaker 2: for her. Because nobody told us in our family their history, 729 00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:36,920 Speaker 2: and it has to start some matter, It has to 730 00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:39,279 Speaker 2: start somewhere. I want them to know that there's a 731 00:40:39,360 --> 00:40:40,960 Speaker 2: lot they can do, and. 732 00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:45,279 Speaker 1: That's what they need to know is that their grandfather 733 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:51,520 Speaker 1: Joe and their grandmothers Sonya are heroes. Well, you know, 734 00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:54,520 Speaker 1: I know the self effacing thing, and I know it 735 00:40:54,520 --> 00:40:59,880 Speaker 1: feels bad to hear that, but I'm telling you. You know, 736 00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:02,960 Speaker 1: you guys, you guys have given your life to serving 737 00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:08,800 Speaker 1: this community and it's it's inspiring and you're still dealing 738 00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:15,640 Speaker 1: with with with physical and mental and psychological pain from it. 739 00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:19,200 Speaker 1: Yet you wouldn't change a minute about what you did. 740 00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:22,600 Speaker 1: And you know you can. You can all shox it 741 00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:24,759 Speaker 1: all you want, but that is the definition of it. 742 00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:27,160 Speaker 2: I change some of the things that I did do 743 00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:30,360 Speaker 2: to protect myself, but that wasn't what was on my mind. 744 00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:34,160 Speaker 1: I understand. But that is that's heroic work, and it's 745 00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:38,160 Speaker 1: inspiring work, and it encapsulates what it means to be 746 00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:44,360 Speaker 1: just a member of the army of normal folk, just 747 00:41:44,440 --> 00:41:48,640 Speaker 1: normal folk doing amazing things. And I'm inspired by you. 748 00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:52,080 Speaker 1: And I can't tell you how much I've enjoyed visiting 749 00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:52,440 Speaker 1: with you this. 750 00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:56,719 Speaker 2: I'm inspired by you in that wonderful documentary. Oh now 751 00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:57,919 Speaker 2: you're doing what I did well. 752 00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,320 Speaker 1: No, I coached football, you say it's. 753 00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:02,960 Speaker 2: Not, but you saved lives. Maybe you don't know that 754 00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:05,600 Speaker 2: but you saved lives of all those people you touched. 755 00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:09,000 Speaker 2: So you are a hero, is an ordinary person who 756 00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:11,399 Speaker 2: does extraordinary things, and that's what you did. 757 00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:13,840 Speaker 1: Well, then there were just kindred spirits. 758 00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:15,960 Speaker 2: Okay, then then I'll take the hero. If you take 759 00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:18,160 Speaker 2: the here, I'll take it. Okay, we're good. Then. 760 00:42:19,880 --> 00:42:22,759 Speaker 1: So we do a lot of stories on a lot 761 00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:25,000 Speaker 1: of different things, like I said earlier, and one of 762 00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:28,719 Speaker 1: the things we really encourage folks to do is just 763 00:42:28,760 --> 00:42:33,279 Speaker 1: to I give out my email address. If someone is 764 00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:36,840 Speaker 1: listening today and says, you know, I can't start a 765 00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:39,000 Speaker 1: five oh one C three or I can't start a 766 00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:42,440 Speaker 1: big organization, but I'm sure seck just find a place 767 00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:46,359 Speaker 1: to volunteer. Or even if they're in New York and 768 00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:50,759 Speaker 1: they have an experience that they want to share, do 769 00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:54,240 Speaker 1: you mind giving our listeners your email address so somebody 770 00:42:54,239 --> 00:42:55,000 Speaker 1: can reach out to you. 771 00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:58,400 Speaker 2: Absolutely not. I will give you the one email address. 772 00:42:58,440 --> 00:42:59,360 Speaker 2: It's mine. 773 00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:02,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, emails, it's all your. 774 00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:05,600 Speaker 2: Personal stuff, but it's uh sonya s O n I 775 00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:09,799 Speaker 2: A A gron a g r O N night Tom. 776 00:43:09,840 --> 00:43:16,200 Speaker 2: I'm giving you my age fifty seven at gmail dot com. 777 00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:18,520 Speaker 1: All right, say it one more time and remember that 778 00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:21,280 Speaker 1: our This is a national audience and people from Memphis 779 00:43:21,320 --> 00:43:22,799 Speaker 1: think you guys talk funny, So. 780 00:43:23,160 --> 00:43:24,440 Speaker 2: Should I talk little flying? 781 00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:24,719 Speaker 1: Yeah? 782 00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:28,319 Speaker 2: I want me okay, sadly, but more time, Sonya s 783 00:43:28,360 --> 00:43:31,960 Speaker 2: O N I A A gron A g R O n. 784 00:43:32,600 --> 00:43:35,400 Speaker 2: Nineteen fifty seven at gmail dot com. 785 00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:40,440 Speaker 1: Awesome high five in the in this shadow of the 786 00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:43,560 Speaker 1: Freedom Tower. I say to you, thank you so much 787 00:43:43,600 --> 00:43:46,520 Speaker 1: for the time this morning, and it has been an 788 00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:47,360 Speaker 1: honor to get to meet you. 789 00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:49,840 Speaker 2: Thank you so much. It was an honor to be here. 790 00:43:52,640 --> 00:43:56,160 Speaker 1: And thank you for joining us this week. To join 791 00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:59,320 Speaker 1: an army of normal folks, go to normal folks dot 792 00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:01,800 Speaker 1: us sign up to become a member of the movement. 793 00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:05,840 Speaker 1: We would love to hear what you're doing in your community. 794 00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:07,919 Speaker 1: And if there's stories you know about that you think 795 00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:12,680 Speaker 1: we should tell, write me anytime at Bill at normalfolks 796 00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:16,640 Speaker 1: dot us. And if you enjoy this episode, subscribe, rate 797 00:44:16,680 --> 00:44:18,880 Speaker 1: and review it, share it with friends and on social 798 00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:22,520 Speaker 1: all the things that can help us grow an army 799 00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:26,719 Speaker 1: of normal folks. I'm Bill Courtney. I'll see you next week.