WEBVTT - Tori Amos 0:00:02.320 --> 0:00:05.320 Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the 0:00:05.360 --> 0:00:08.559 Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan runt Dog, 0:00:08.680 --> 0:00:12.080 but enough about me. My guest today is a piano 0:00:12.119 --> 0:00:15.800 prodigy and for my money, a genius of the human soul. 0:00:16.440 --> 0:00:19.000 I feel like I may have inavertently stolen that ho horrific, 0:00:19.120 --> 0:00:22.200 but it doesn't make it any less true. Her seminal 0:00:23.200 --> 0:00:26.880 solo debut, Little Earthquakes, was forged from the searing pain 0:00:26.960 --> 0:00:32.120 of feeling simultaneously ostracized from and wounded by the environment 0:00:32.159 --> 0:00:35.920 of her upbringing. In channeling her fears and rage, she 0:00:36.000 --> 0:00:38.720 gave voice to those struggling to find themselves in their 0:00:38.720 --> 0:00:42.360 place in the world and offered hope for redemption. Her 0:00:42.440 --> 0:00:46.600 latest album, due out October, took form amid an equally 0:00:46.600 --> 0:00:51.159 tempestuous emotional Maelstrom called Ocean to Ocean. It's a musical 0:00:51.240 --> 0:00:54.240 message in a bottle. Written during in forest isolation in 0:00:54.280 --> 0:00:58.160 her adopted home of Cornwall, England, amid the COVID nineteen lockdown. 0:00:59.000 --> 0:01:02.720 Grappling with the globe crisis, political turmoil in her home country, 0:01:03.000 --> 0:01:05.840 and the recent death of her mother, she took solace 0:01:05.880 --> 0:01:08.399 in the songs, which are among the most soul bearing 0:01:08.440 --> 0:01:12.319 of her career. Whether she's using words or music, or 0:01:12.360 --> 0:01:16.080 speaking to human beings, trees, or the metaphysical beings she 0:01:16.160 --> 0:01:20.240 refers to as her muses, her skill for communicating strength 0:01:20.280 --> 0:01:25.240 and vulnerability remains undiminished and unparalleled. I'm so happy to 0:01:25.280 --> 0:01:35.120 welcome Tory Anus. Well, I don't even know where to begin. 0:01:35.200 --> 0:01:38.960 I mean, your new album is absolutely astonishing. I guess 0:01:39.000 --> 0:01:41.520 my my first question for you is the last year 0:01:41.560 --> 0:01:44.759 and a half has changed just in in so many ways. 0:01:45.360 --> 0:01:48.040 How has it changed your relationship to music or has it? 0:01:51.200 --> 0:01:56.720 H Well, I I guess I was writing a different 0:01:56.840 --> 0:01:59.920 type of record if you were going to talk to 0:02:00.040 --> 0:02:04.480 me over a year ago, and um well, over a 0:02:04.520 --> 0:02:07.280 year ago, so a year and a half ago. But 0:02:09.080 --> 0:02:13.520 then it seemed as if the energy of those songs 0:02:13.600 --> 0:02:17.280 that wasn't where I wanted to go anymore. It wasn't 0:02:17.320 --> 0:02:19.960 going to take me. It wasn't my sonic rocket ship 0:02:20.000 --> 0:02:24.560 that was going to take me into a different um well, 0:02:24.840 --> 0:02:30.600 I'm saying the word frequency, but just a different magical 0:02:30.639 --> 0:02:35.280 space that I wanted to be in. And so the 0:02:35.880 --> 0:02:40.240 new songs kind of started coming in in a strange 0:02:40.280 --> 0:02:43.600 way because I just said to the muses I need 0:02:43.680 --> 0:02:45.880 something different. And then they said, well, then you have 0:02:45.960 --> 0:02:49.919 to walk away from the old, handed over and then 0:02:50.240 --> 0:02:54.760 be receptive to the new and right from where you 0:02:54.800 --> 0:02:59.160 are right now, which is you're grieving. So start there 0:02:59.639 --> 0:03:01.840 and let see what happens. And that was really the 0:03:01.880 --> 0:03:06.600 beginning with with Metal water Wood. What is it about 0:03:06.880 --> 0:03:10.680 songwriting that makes it such an effective method for for 0:03:11.040 --> 0:03:14.280 processing emotions and and also pulling you out of those 0:03:14.360 --> 0:03:20.080 dark places? Oh well, I think songwriting can be a 0:03:20.200 --> 0:03:28.760 very lonely a place to be. It can be um 0:03:28.840 --> 0:03:32.120 a place where you have to kind of confront things, 0:03:33.000 --> 0:03:37.480 confront your part in things, look at sides to yourself 0:03:37.560 --> 0:03:40.600 that you might not really want to look at, and 0:03:40.640 --> 0:03:44.920 then you begin framing. Then you begin thinking, okay, so 0:03:44.960 --> 0:03:48.200 how do we want to tell this story? I understand 0:03:48.280 --> 0:03:50.720 some of the components, some of the emotions, but then 0:03:51.120 --> 0:03:54.360 how do we want to convey this? Because we can 0:03:54.400 --> 0:03:58.560 bring characters in, we can bring people in, some that 0:03:58.640 --> 0:04:02.440 we know, some at our composites of people we know, 0:04:02.600 --> 0:04:05.280 so that we we tell the story. And then you're 0:04:05.320 --> 0:04:07.760 making choices all along. This is when you get out 0:04:07.800 --> 0:04:10.440 your skill set and your toolbox and your sonic paints 0:04:11.160 --> 0:04:16.159 and you start then really forming this and working with 0:04:16.279 --> 0:04:21.640 structure and and sometimes, um, you know, you find that 0:04:21.839 --> 0:04:25.160 you're not crazy about that verse. You like maybe the 0:04:25.720 --> 0:04:28.839 middle eight, but you're not crazy about the verses, So 0:04:28.960 --> 0:04:32.719 maybe you keep this bit. And what happens is I 0:04:32.760 --> 0:04:35.080 come to the studio and I show Mark, who I've 0:04:35.120 --> 0:04:37.960 been working with for a long for a long time 0:04:38.000 --> 0:04:41.360 now in the studio. I happened to be married to him, 0:04:42.160 --> 0:04:47.720 and we've been making records since Boys for Plee together, 0:04:48.560 --> 0:04:50.760 and I'll show the song, and then that will be 0:04:50.880 --> 0:04:54.200 the beginning of Okay, where does this want to go? 0:04:56.920 --> 0:05:01.839 You mentioned communing with the muses. How you write your work? 0:05:02.440 --> 0:05:04.680 How much control do you have over the process when 0:05:04.680 --> 0:05:07.200 you write? How much of it is thinking versus stepping 0:05:07.240 --> 0:05:08.880 back and kind of getting out of the way and 0:05:09.520 --> 0:05:14.400 letting it come through. That's a good question. Sometimes it 0:05:14.480 --> 0:05:19.880 seems like it's paradox because on one hand, you're trying 0:05:19.920 --> 0:05:22.760 to listen to what's coming through. It's sort of it 0:05:22.839 --> 0:05:25.800 feels sort of like you're being zapped, but zapped in 0:05:25.839 --> 0:05:32.200 a good way. Um, and then I record that and 0:05:32.240 --> 0:05:35.400 then listen back. So sometimes it's a stream of consciousness 0:05:36.560 --> 0:05:40.000 and then In the listening back, I start to try 0:05:40.040 --> 0:05:46.560 and figure out, Okay, what is um bold dash and 0:05:46.720 --> 0:05:51.320 what is worth working with and what should I throw 0:05:51.360 --> 0:05:54.719 away because it was just getting me from one place 0:05:54.800 --> 0:05:58.239 to another during the stream of consciousness type of session. 0:06:00.240 --> 0:06:02.760 Have you ever finished a song and listen to it 0:06:02.800 --> 0:06:05.400 back and learned something else about yourself from it, almost 0:06:05.440 --> 0:06:11.880 like a really good dream analysis or something. Sometimes it's 0:06:11.920 --> 0:06:19.280 horrifying what you learned about yourself. Well, because I think 0:06:19.320 --> 0:06:23.400 if you're listen, if you're honest, then you can kind 0:06:23.400 --> 0:06:27.640 of yes, you can have a chuckle, but then you go, oh, 0:06:27.680 --> 0:06:32.280 I'm a bit mortified that, Um, I don't know that 0:06:32.440 --> 0:06:38.000 I responded in a certain way or um I think 0:06:38.600 --> 0:06:41.520 sometimes there's you know, Gallows humor. The Brits are very 0:06:41.560 --> 0:06:44.480 good at that, and I have been surrounded by Brits, 0:06:44.560 --> 0:06:48.880 my friend. They they are everywhere because I've I've sort 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:53.160 of been in exile here in England for eighteen months. 0:06:53.560 --> 0:06:57.599 And the funny thing though about the Brits is that 0:06:57.960 --> 0:07:00.200 they're at their best, and I've said this for a 0:07:00.240 --> 0:07:03.000 long time, when I think things are at their worst, 0:07:03.920 --> 0:07:07.839 they find a way they go to their humor. That's 0:07:07.880 --> 0:07:10.679 that's what they turned to as a culture is their humor. 0:07:11.480 --> 0:07:15.120 And and when things are good, like if it's a 0:07:15.160 --> 0:07:20.600 beautiful sunny day and maybe it's like degrees within two hours, 0:07:20.760 --> 0:07:24.680 Brits are going to complain to you, I'm boiling. It's 0:07:24.720 --> 0:07:30.400 so bloody hot, and it's never it's never gonna be okay. 0:07:30.440 --> 0:07:32.880 This is gonna last a long time. So I think 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:37.360 they're very they are more comfortable when they're being challenged, 0:07:37.880 --> 0:07:43.280 and I think they're humor did help me through this time. 0:07:43.960 --> 0:07:46.520 There there's no question about it. And I have no 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:52.280 idea what I'm saying to I'm just rambling. Oh you know, 0:07:52.320 --> 0:07:54.600 It's It's funny because what you said to me really 0:07:54.640 --> 0:07:58.080 resonated with me because as I was listening to your album, 0:07:58.200 --> 0:08:01.400 for some reason, the Churchill quote popped into my head. 0:08:01.680 --> 0:08:04.640 If you're going through hell, keep going, and I that 0:08:04.800 --> 0:08:07.080 was something that really that struck me while listening to 0:08:07.120 --> 0:08:09.239 your music. I mean, that's something I've always loved about 0:08:09.240 --> 0:08:12.440 your music because your your honesty and your vulnerability, and 0:08:12.480 --> 0:08:16.600 so much about ocean. The ocean is your willingness to 0:08:16.680 --> 0:08:19.040 sort of you give us permission to sort of not 0:08:19.160 --> 0:08:21.760 be okay. And because in the last year and a half. 0:08:21.800 --> 0:08:23.880 We've all had those moments when we haven't been okay, 0:08:24.080 --> 0:08:25.880 and you've been willing to sort of meet us in 0:08:25.960 --> 0:08:28.640 that place with these with these songs. And I think 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:31.800 that that's that's so valuable and I'm precious right now 0:08:31.840 --> 0:08:33.679 because I think that's something we all need. We all 0:08:33.720 --> 0:08:38.000 need that kind of compassion. I do think we need compassion. 0:08:38.040 --> 0:08:45.160 You're spot on right there, and and sometimes sometimes I 0:08:45.200 --> 0:08:51.199 think that's it's like gold when somebody has it, just 0:08:51.240 --> 0:08:54.840 holds a space, just holds a space for you to 0:08:54.960 --> 0:08:58.040 be where you are in that moment. And the record 0:08:58.559 --> 0:09:02.119 I wanted to do that. It wanted to also reflect 0:09:02.760 --> 0:09:06.079 what I was getting from the Earth once I started 0:09:06.080 --> 0:09:08.600 going outside and it was cold, and it was the winter, 0:09:08.760 --> 0:09:11.080 and it was and you know cornwall, so you know 0:09:11.120 --> 0:09:13.720 what that can be like. Even though it's beautiful, it 0:09:13.760 --> 0:09:19.439 can be really traumatic and freezing and wet and all 0:09:19.480 --> 0:09:23.120 those things. But at the same time, it was invigorating. 0:09:23.600 --> 0:09:26.760 It was like, Okay, so we've been under house arrest 0:09:27.559 --> 0:09:32.600 and yet Mother Earth is regenerating and at the same 0:09:32.640 --> 0:09:35.640 time dealing with a huge crisis with the fires on 0:09:35.679 --> 0:09:38.040 the West coast in the States and with the flooding 0:09:38.120 --> 0:09:42.600 in Europe and other places, and and yet in Cornwall 0:09:43.400 --> 0:09:48.880 it seemed to be her finding um the balance going 0:09:48.960 --> 0:09:53.880 from winter and spring. And I watched that evolution happening 0:09:53.920 --> 0:09:59.120 before my eyes, really seeing the change that happened in 0:09:59.120 --> 0:10:04.280 the transfer Asian and things being reborn again, so that 0:10:05.000 --> 0:10:08.600 there was a death that was happening, and that's something 0:10:08.640 --> 0:10:10.719 that I was going through. I was having to let 0:10:10.840 --> 0:10:17.559 songs go and let my mom, you know, go, except 0:10:17.600 --> 0:10:23.160 that she has passed to the other side and um, 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:27.959 and yet now step into the rebirth energy and that 0:10:27.960 --> 0:10:31.960 that's quite you know, it's a process. And the whole 0:10:32.000 --> 0:10:47.920 album is really exploring that process. And I got the 0:10:48.200 --> 0:10:51.640 impression that your mother is a major presence on the 0:10:51.679 --> 0:10:54.320 album and the first single you release, speaking with Trees, 0:10:55.800 --> 0:10:58.760 I think it hits anybody who who has dealt with loss, 0:10:58.800 --> 0:11:01.360 which unfortunately is you know, pretty much all of us. 0:11:01.840 --> 0:11:05.559 Um intensely personal song, and it didn't realize. Took me 0:11:05.600 --> 0:11:07.800 a moment to realize that the lyrics in it, which 0:11:07.800 --> 0:11:10.679 I thought were metaphors, were in fact very literal. Tell 0:11:10.720 --> 0:11:13.920 me more about that song. It's it's really for me. 0:11:13.960 --> 0:11:18.400 It's one of my favorite tracks on the album. Well, 0:11:18.440 --> 0:11:22.520 I was when I was going outside, it seemed as 0:11:22.600 --> 0:11:25.800 if I was guided to just sit and listen to 0:11:26.120 --> 0:11:32.880 the trees and the rhythm um. And then at the 0:11:32.960 --> 0:11:37.559 same time I started getting books and reading about, um, 0:11:37.559 --> 0:11:43.800 how trees communicate with each other. Um there there there's 0:11:43.800 --> 0:11:47.640 a book out by Susanne Simard. If I'm I hope 0:11:47.679 --> 0:11:51.400 I'm saying her name correctly, and if not, I apologize 0:11:52.000 --> 0:11:56.320 because her book really talks about the network underneath the trees. 0:11:57.360 --> 0:12:00.760 Made up a fun guy and again not a scientist, 0:12:00.800 --> 0:12:04.840 so I'm not gonna explain this correctly. But how it 0:12:04.880 --> 0:12:10.480 made me feel was this amazing world, a lot of 0:12:10.520 --> 0:12:16.400 it underground that is interconnected. And so just the alchemy 0:12:16.440 --> 0:12:21.160 of that, the alchemical idea concept of what is really 0:12:21.160 --> 0:12:25.680 going on down there, got me all very excited and 0:12:25.679 --> 0:12:29.000 and put me, I don't know, in a state of 0:12:29.240 --> 0:12:34.800 um collaboration with nature and and wanting to be a 0:12:34.880 --> 0:12:41.720 student of Earth mother and watching her deal with everything 0:12:41.880 --> 0:12:45.120 at one time, and of course that's the paradox that 0:12:45.240 --> 0:12:49.320 was going on there, with the climate crisis happening on 0:12:49.440 --> 0:12:53.679 different in different countries around the globe, and then her 0:12:53.760 --> 0:12:59.240 rebirthing herself as well. That must have been a really 0:12:59.280 --> 0:13:01.480 special because I of traveling has been such a huge 0:13:01.480 --> 0:13:03.360 part of your life since you know, you were with 0:13:03.520 --> 0:13:06.240 thirteen on going on tour, and also you you have 0:13:06.280 --> 0:13:08.520 your your home in Florida, so kind of being on 0:13:08.559 --> 0:13:11.360 the move a lot, being stationary, weill. I'm sure it's 0:13:11.400 --> 0:13:13.680 hard for a million different reasons. Being able to sit 0:13:13.760 --> 0:13:18.000 and see that process take place that really requires you 0:13:18.080 --> 0:13:21.520 to be to be still. Uh, must have been a 0:13:21.640 --> 0:13:25.160 nice silver lining of what I must, you know, imagine 0:13:25.200 --> 0:13:29.880 as being a very difficult time. M At first, I 0:13:29.960 --> 0:13:35.320 don't think my patience. I didn't have a lot. I 0:13:35.360 --> 0:13:41.480 didn't have the amount of patients that I found I 0:13:41.559 --> 0:13:46.320 needed in order to really observe like we're talking about, 0:13:46.760 --> 0:13:51.080 I needed to discipline myself a bit and stop the chatter, 0:13:51.880 --> 0:13:57.719 the inner chatter that we all have, and and really observe. 0:13:58.440 --> 0:14:01.160 You know I've said before, list and with ears size 0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:05.640 of Kansas, really listen. And and to do that you 0:14:05.720 --> 0:14:10.480 have to to stop the inner voices, the inner critic, 0:14:10.640 --> 0:14:15.439 the mur mur mur will you know? And that took 0:14:15.520 --> 0:14:18.680 some effort, if I'm honest with you, and it did 0:14:18.720 --> 0:14:22.960 take some time. It took time, and then I was 0:14:23.000 --> 0:14:26.200 going down to the little vege patch in the garden, 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:33.440 and I really found that so rewarding. These things became huge, 0:14:33.600 --> 0:14:38.480 joy joyful moments for me. I know there was some 0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:42.200 slightly less joyful moments with nature. I I know. You 0:14:42.320 --> 0:14:45.920 just released the song spies uh the other day, which 0:14:46.200 --> 0:14:50.960 was about some uninvited winged guests coming into your home 0:14:51.120 --> 0:14:53.520 during during lockdown. Can you tell me a little about 0:14:53.640 --> 0:15:00.040 the background of that song. Yeah, the background the the 0:15:00.200 --> 0:15:04.280 windows in the old farmhouse. So it's very hot. It 0:15:04.400 --> 0:15:07.960 was very hot in July, even hot hot for Britain. 0:15:08.600 --> 0:15:11.360 And that's an American telling you it's really hot. That's 0:15:11.400 --> 0:15:15.920 not just the Brids complaining about it's so hard and 0:15:15.960 --> 0:15:18.760 you're kind of going, this is sixty degrees are you 0:15:18.920 --> 0:15:23.000 kidding me? But no, it was hot. So we had 0:15:23.040 --> 0:15:27.880 the windows open, and the bats we're getting in the 0:15:27.920 --> 0:15:30.920 house like in the middle of the night, and our 0:15:31.040 --> 0:15:36.000 daughter would be texting us it's saying, there are bats, 0:15:36.000 --> 0:15:41.240 and then you'd hearse this running around power upstairs, and 0:15:41.240 --> 0:15:45.200 and so Tash camped out downstairs, not in her bedroom 0:15:45.280 --> 0:15:49.560 but in the living room, and she was really not 0:15:50.000 --> 0:15:55.080 overjoyed with this. That situation. Now, why they didn't come 0:15:55.120 --> 0:16:00.440 find me because I love bats, I really I adore them, 0:16:00.480 --> 0:16:05.640 but she does not. So I figured in order to 0:16:05.680 --> 0:16:08.760 get her back into her room, it looked like almost 0:16:08.840 --> 0:16:13.680 ten days. Um, she needed a lullaby. But to write 0:16:13.720 --> 0:16:18.000 a lullaby for year old is very different than when 0:16:18.080 --> 0:16:20.120 I would write for a six and seven year old. 0:16:20.480 --> 0:16:23.120 So I thought, okay, let's listen to some drilling bass 0:16:23.880 --> 0:16:26.800 and let's make spot let's make this happen. So they're 0:16:27.000 --> 0:16:31.120 benevolent beings from Cornwall to London, through the through the 0:16:31.200 --> 0:16:36.280 British isles in Ireland that are tracking the scheming meanies 0:16:36.760 --> 0:16:39.760 so that children can actually get to sleep at night 0:16:39.800 --> 0:16:44.920 and get some shut I that's a wonderful song. I 0:16:45.160 --> 0:16:49.040 you mentioned earlier about the communication between trees and all 0:16:49.080 --> 0:16:52.200 the different ways that that elements of nature communicate. I 0:16:52.200 --> 0:16:54.880 mean bats with you know the ways that they communicate. 0:16:54.920 --> 0:16:59.120 And there's articles about how dolphins communicate and um, you 0:16:59.160 --> 0:17:01.760 know the secret life plants and stuff. I'm wanna ask 0:17:01.760 --> 0:17:05.680 you a question about communication. How much of your your 0:17:05.800 --> 0:17:08.159 desire to write, your impetus to write, comes from a 0:17:08.200 --> 0:17:13.119 desire to communicate versus exercising something inside of you. If 0:17:13.119 --> 0:17:15.040 you were on a desert island somewhere. Would you would 0:17:15.080 --> 0:17:23.919 you continue songwriting? Huh? I don't know. Probably probably because 0:17:23.960 --> 0:17:29.160 I think it's a it's a compulsion. It's something that 0:17:30.880 --> 0:17:34.680 wants to happen when it wants to happen. Now, my 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:38.760 husband would like it to happen sooner than it happened 0:17:38.800 --> 0:17:45.800 this time. I mean the words divorce a tory. We're 0:17:46.119 --> 0:17:49.879 probably close to his lips and his and on his 0:17:50.000 --> 0:17:53.200 brain because I was, I know, I was driving them 0:17:53.200 --> 0:17:56.920 all kind of mad. We I was still writing while 0:17:56.960 --> 0:18:02.440 we were mixing, and that is something that you never 0:18:02.480 --> 0:18:05.920 want to put put the musicians and the mixers through, 0:18:06.720 --> 0:18:10.080 that's for sure. But that's just what happened this time. 0:18:10.160 --> 0:18:13.320 That's just how it was. Because he would be like, 0:18:13.440 --> 0:18:16.200 can't you make those muses move any faster? I said, 0:18:16.880 --> 0:18:21.520 you try. Good luck with that. They come when they come, 0:18:22.480 --> 0:18:27.640 they leave when they leave, and you know they don't 0:18:27.640 --> 0:18:30.719 need a passport. They show up when they want to 0:18:30.720 --> 0:18:34.280 show up. And I really know when they show up, 0:18:34.280 --> 0:18:36.800 because it's a totally different thing when they're around than 0:18:36.840 --> 0:18:40.240 when I'm doing it myself. I'm not kidding you about this. 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:44.560 I'm not weaving a tale here. I can write a 0:18:44.600 --> 0:18:48.240 song a day. I don't think it's necessarily anything anybody 0:18:48.240 --> 0:18:53.000 should listen to. But when there's this collaboration happening, then 0:18:53.760 --> 0:18:59.320 kiss met, something can happen that that has a little 0:18:59.359 --> 0:19:03.720 sprinkle of magic to it. Oh. I absolutely believe that. 0:19:04.000 --> 0:19:06.280 Is there an element of superstition in a way that 0:19:06.600 --> 0:19:09.000 is there something that you can kind of do to 0:19:09.000 --> 0:19:11.240 to coax them to come in these music or is 0:19:11.240 --> 0:19:15.080 it purely on their own, on their own time? M hm. 0:19:19.600 --> 0:19:24.800 You know they're not gullible. They're really not coaxing them. 0:19:24.840 --> 0:19:28.320 I think they know every trick that every songwriter has 0:19:28.440 --> 0:19:32.359 had for thousands of years trying to get them to 0:19:32.440 --> 0:19:38.240 hurry up. So I you know, it's hard, it's it's 0:19:38.280 --> 0:19:41.960 hard to fool them, and I think it's best to 0:19:42.240 --> 0:19:47.600 just surrender to it and and then and then you 0:19:47.680 --> 0:19:50.960 might find that they are there. I just have to 0:19:51.080 --> 0:19:54.720 listen a bit harder. I just have to steal myself 0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:58.399 and be open. Because another thing to this is that 0:19:58.480 --> 0:20:02.080 sometimes they want to go some where that I'm I'm 0:20:02.160 --> 0:20:07.400 resisting going there. Resisting very different than the word resistance. 0:20:07.600 --> 0:20:11.920 I don't see the word resistance as a pejorative, which 0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:14.960 it gets used all the time. I mean, if we're 0:20:14.960 --> 0:20:19.880 saying I have a resistance to creativity, well that then 0:20:19.960 --> 0:20:24.880 that is negative. But a resistance to tyranny, which is 0:20:24.960 --> 0:20:29.000 what you know, I wrote the book Resistance about that's 0:20:29.040 --> 0:20:32.440 a very different thing. So I've had to monitor am 0:20:32.440 --> 0:20:35.679 I being open to where they want to go? Or 0:20:35.720 --> 0:20:37.720 am I digging my heels? And because I want them 0:20:37.720 --> 0:20:41.240 to go somewhere else? Well, then if I need to 0:20:41.280 --> 0:20:47.160 surrender and surrendering, they know when you're just pretending to surprender. 0:20:49.520 --> 0:20:52.639 I speaking of resistance, I I think you meant you 0:20:52.720 --> 0:20:58.160 mentioned this before about being inspired by by artists who 0:20:58.359 --> 0:21:01.560 use their medium in this case long to to to 0:21:01.600 --> 0:21:06.560 reflect the time around them. People like Marvin Gaye, Nina Simone, um, 0:21:06.640 --> 0:21:10.080 who are some people who who did that for you? 0:21:10.160 --> 0:21:12.480 Sort of pointed you in that direction of what you 0:21:12.520 --> 0:21:17.520 could use your your art form for m Well, well, 0:21:17.560 --> 0:21:28.560 you know, the late sixties was the time of huge revolution. Um. 0:21:28.600 --> 0:21:31.639 I was having to relive it today for for another 0:21:31.840 --> 0:21:37.720 conversation about and I was five at the time, and 0:21:37.760 --> 0:21:42.280 I just remember how music was affecting people, how songs 0:21:42.280 --> 0:21:45.240 were affecting people. I just had been accepted into the 0:21:45.280 --> 0:21:51.000 Peabody and the conservatory, the prep and I was surrounded 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:55.840 by teenagers, and I was watching how they were being 0:21:56.240 --> 0:22:02.960 motivated by this music, whether the Beatles, Marvin Gay, Simon, 0:22:03.040 --> 0:22:08.760 m Garif and Golden, all the Motown artists of Wreath, Franklin, Um, Yes, Nina, 0:22:08.880 --> 0:22:14.360 Nina Simone, and and the list goes on, of all 0:22:14.400 --> 0:22:20.199 the all the bands and artists that really, um, what 0:22:20.359 --> 0:22:25.440 do you uh? Got a generation to stand up and 0:22:25.560 --> 0:22:30.280 questioned the Vietnam War. During that year we lost Dr 0:22:30.359 --> 0:22:34.399 Martin Luther King he was killed, and we lost Robert 0:22:34.440 --> 0:22:38.240 Kennedy who was killed. So it was such a time 0:22:38.800 --> 0:22:42.679 where music was crystallizing for me how important it was 0:22:43.160 --> 0:22:47.639 and what songs could do. It could start off, it 0:22:47.680 --> 0:22:52.359 could start a whole new well revolution really and that's 0:22:52.440 --> 0:23:07.520 and that's what it did. I think noticing over over 0:23:07.760 --> 0:23:12.000 the course of our discussion talking about muse it coming 0:23:12.040 --> 0:23:15.159 from inner life and the music coming from you know 0:23:15.440 --> 0:23:18.400 in the world, you derive more inspiration from looking outward 0:23:18.480 --> 0:23:24.600 or looking inward. M hmmm mm hmm. I think I 0:23:24.640 --> 0:23:29.600 think that's the for me. The key is finding the 0:23:29.640 --> 0:23:35.919 balance in that because one it gets the other. So 0:23:37.400 --> 0:23:41.639 observing I take I would take pilgrimage a lot before 0:23:41.800 --> 0:23:46.280 this pandemic. I would go somewhere wherever that was, the desert, 0:23:46.480 --> 0:23:49.960 wherever that was, I would go and observe, and my 0:23:50.080 --> 0:23:56.480 senses were different. And it just in doing that activity alone, 0:23:57.000 --> 0:24:00.800 you're breaking a pattern. You're breaking your own routine, which 0:24:00.840 --> 0:24:03.680 then puts you sort of in a different It puts 0:24:03.720 --> 0:24:07.760 me anyway, in a different space of Okay, I'm I'm 0:24:07.760 --> 0:24:11.600 in a different place where my senses now are heightened 0:24:12.880 --> 0:24:16.919 and I'm able to push myself into hearing and seeing 0:24:16.960 --> 0:24:24.880 and feeling different things. So when that wasn't offered, when 0:24:24.880 --> 0:24:27.679 that was off the table because of the restrictions that 0:24:27.720 --> 0:24:31.800 we've all been under, then I had to find other 0:24:31.880 --> 0:24:35.840 ways and that that has been a challenge, but it's 0:24:35.880 --> 0:24:41.000 also been really eye opening because this record wouldn't have 0:24:41.040 --> 0:24:45.359 happened without everything happening the way it happened in the 0:24:45.440 --> 0:24:49.439 last eighteen months. What were some ways that that you 0:24:49.440 --> 0:24:52.920 you challenge you sort of take a trip mentally, I mean, 0:24:53.000 --> 0:24:56.359 was it through reading or meditation. What were some ways 0:24:56.400 --> 0:24:58.520 that in lieu of travel that you were able to 0:24:58.520 --> 0:25:03.520 to take yourself out of your familiar mental space and 0:25:03.520 --> 0:25:07.080 and try other things. I'm going to be really honest 0:25:07.119 --> 0:25:10.639 with you. I am the crappest person to meditate. You 0:25:10.680 --> 0:25:14.600 don't nobody wants to meditate with me. I'm auntie and 0:25:14.680 --> 0:25:17.600 a pain in the ass. It's just not what I'm sorry, 0:25:17.680 --> 0:25:22.720 it's not what I do. However, hanging out if somebody's 0:25:22.800 --> 0:25:27.080 lighting a fire outside and you're wrapped up in blankets 0:25:27.200 --> 0:25:33.800 and um, you know Oliver Tasha's boyfriend puts on Oliver's 0:25:33.840 --> 0:25:38.960 tracks and you know, whether it's some great jazz that 0:25:39.240 --> 0:25:42.000 uh is being written by some of his friends, or 0:25:42.760 --> 0:25:45.399 or drilling bass which he's a fan of. And he 0:25:45.520 --> 0:25:49.399 turned me onto that from the nineties. That's how that's 0:25:49.440 --> 0:25:53.359 kind of how I roll. That's where I get, That's 0:25:53.400 --> 0:25:57.920 where I was traveling. That's how my imagination got fired up. 0:25:58.880 --> 0:26:03.879 Is and have in conversations and sharing music uh tash 0:26:03.880 --> 0:26:09.520 showing me documentaries UH different through different art forms, and 0:26:09.520 --> 0:26:13.159 and then a whole new world starts to open up 0:26:13.160 --> 0:26:17.760 to me. How gardeners were approaching you know, the VEGGI 0:26:17.960 --> 0:26:21.160 the veggie patch. That was a whole new world for me. 0:26:21.200 --> 0:26:23.640 Because I do not have a green thumb. I would 0:26:23.680 --> 0:26:26.720 just go and sing to the tomatoes every day. So 0:26:26.880 --> 0:26:29.200 I was singing. I'd go down there and I'd sing. 0:26:29.760 --> 0:26:32.680 I talked to the plants. I sing to them, and 0:26:32.720 --> 0:26:36.000 I think they I think they're making songs with me 0:26:36.640 --> 0:26:39.600 in my mind. I have quite a relationship with the 0:26:39.800 --> 0:26:43.879 vedge patch. Oh that's a real thing. I've absolutely heard 0:26:44.200 --> 0:26:47.720 about music therapy for plants that that farmers and gardeners do. 0:26:47.840 --> 0:26:50.640 I've I've heard quite a lot of good things about that. 0:26:51.840 --> 0:26:54.760 While I was taking my show down there, my repertoire, 0:26:55.080 --> 0:26:57.879 the new songs that I was testing them out on 0:26:57.960 --> 0:27:01.120 the squash and seeing how we were going, and then 0:27:01.160 --> 0:27:03.800 if the squash started to grow within a few days. 0:27:03.840 --> 0:27:07.600 I mean sometimes this the squash cut really big pumpkins 0:27:07.920 --> 0:27:10.399 and it was okay. I think that song is a keeper. 0:27:11.760 --> 0:27:14.200 I mean, that's a great response to your music. I mean, 0:27:15.240 --> 0:27:18.040 when you when you are playing for for for humans, 0:27:18.080 --> 0:27:21.919 I'll say, what is the best thing that's someone that 0:27:22.000 --> 0:27:24.080 you can hear from someone who's listened to your music. 0:27:24.200 --> 0:27:26.320 Is there a response that you can hear from somebody 0:27:26.520 --> 0:27:28.840 where you think to yourself, Okay, I know all the 0:27:28.880 --> 0:27:31.600 pain that I went through and lost that went into 0:27:31.640 --> 0:27:34.359 this song, but that response really made it worth it 0:27:34.400 --> 0:27:36.280 for me. Is there something that anyone can say that 0:27:36.320 --> 0:27:40.520 can make you feel that well, I have to tell you, 0:27:40.560 --> 0:27:43.600 I'm very fortunate to have people come to the shows 0:27:43.600 --> 0:27:47.679 that are open that aren't really you know, they're open 0:27:47.760 --> 0:27:52.399 to having an experience, they're open to traveling together and 0:27:52.520 --> 0:27:55.080 kind of saying, I don't know where we're going to 0:27:55.200 --> 0:27:58.520 go tonight, but you do need to know Tory that 0:27:58.640 --> 0:28:02.200 this happened in Chicago over the last week. So there's 0:28:02.320 --> 0:28:06.040 sort of informants. They're like boots on the ground in 0:28:06.160 --> 0:28:11.360