1 00:00:02,480 --> 00:00:10,280 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. I'm Hannah Elliott and 2 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:11,040 Speaker 1: I'm Matt Miller. 3 00:00:11,200 --> 00:00:19,079 Speaker 2: This is Hot Pursuit coming up. On today's show, we 4 00:00:19,160 --> 00:00:22,560 Speaker 2: are all in on Tesla Plus. We dabble a little 5 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:26,520 Speaker 2: bit in Rivian and Lucid, Portia and Ferrari. 6 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:31,840 Speaker 3: That's right, I mean all the good stuff. Back to Tesla. 7 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:35,519 Speaker 3: It did announce this week some new less expensive models 8 00:00:35,680 --> 00:00:40,320 Speaker 3: that were rather stripped down, and the response has been underwhelming. 9 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:44,519 Speaker 2: Yes, aside from the newly redesigned Chevy Bolt. It was 10 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:47,760 Speaker 2: probably the biggest car news this week, and we get 11 00:00:47,760 --> 00:00:51,720 Speaker 2: a deep dive with one of the most famous, one 12 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:55,200 Speaker 2: of the earliest and most outspoken investors in Tesla. We're 13 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:58,800 Speaker 2: joined by Ross Gerber, president and CEO of Gerber Kawasaki. 14 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:03,160 Speaker 2: For the listeners of our podcasts who don't know, how 15 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:04,319 Speaker 2: did you get started? 16 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:05,200 Speaker 4: How did you. 17 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:07,720 Speaker 2: Become essentially the most famous Tesla investor? 18 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:10,360 Speaker 4: Not by choice, that's for sure. 19 00:01:11,720 --> 00:01:16,120 Speaker 5: You know, it's been an extremely painful, fortunately profitable journey 20 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 5: for me. But it really started. I think it was 21 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:25,640 Speaker 5: twenty thirteen when the model s came out and or 22 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:28,680 Speaker 5: Tesla went public and it was like a four billion 23 00:01:28,720 --> 00:01:30,880 Speaker 5: dollar company. They were down the street from us in 24 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:33,240 Speaker 5: Santa Monica, so I knew who they were. And my 25 00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:36,760 Speaker 5: parents had dealt with Elon because my dad, my stepfather, 26 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:39,400 Speaker 5: had done some work with NASA and he was part 27 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:43,680 Speaker 5: of the group that was working with SpaceX to move 28 00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 5: our space program to SpaceX. This was you know, ten 29 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 5: fifteen years ago, and so they had dinner with Elon 30 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:52,080 Speaker 5: and my mom said, you know this Elon Musk guy, 31 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:55,280 Speaker 5: he's a genius. He's doing amazing things. You should check 32 00:01:55,320 --> 00:01:57,080 Speaker 5: him out. And I said, oh, there's this Tesla thing 33 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 5: down the street. They go public, so we start looking 34 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:03,120 Speaker 5: the company, you know, and so at the time, they 35 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:05,080 Speaker 5: had no Model S. So we waited about a year 36 00:02:05,120 --> 00:02:07,960 Speaker 5: and then the Model S was like being launched and 37 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:11,600 Speaker 5: we go down to Santa Monica to the showroom and 38 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:13,480 Speaker 5: I looked at the models and I said, Wow, this 39 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:14,359 Speaker 5: is a pretty nice car. 40 00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 4: And then I got in it and we drove it, 41 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:17,040 Speaker 4: and I said. 42 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,160 Speaker 5: You know, if this is this electric car, you know, 43 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:22,560 Speaker 5: like this is like actually better than other cars. So 44 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:24,480 Speaker 5: I was one of the first people in the world 45 00:02:24,680 --> 00:02:27,840 Speaker 5: to really realize like these were going to be better 46 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:31,359 Speaker 5: cars than ice cars, you know, like actually electric cars 47 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 5: are better cars, and there's a lot of reasons why 48 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:38,040 Speaker 5: they're better, but they just are. And so we invested 49 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 5: in Tesla right then and there because I was like, 50 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:44,880 Speaker 5: if they can make these cars like this will sell, 51 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:45,480 Speaker 5: like there's. 52 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:46,560 Speaker 4: No doubt in my mind. 53 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 5: And so that worked pretty quickly because the Model S 54 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:53,160 Speaker 5: did sell. And even at the time, there were lots 55 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:55,400 Speaker 5: of problems with the Model S with build. You know, 56 00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:58,040 Speaker 5: Tesla was known for building some of the worst cars 57 00:02:58,080 --> 00:03:01,639 Speaker 5: at that time. They built great technology, but they had 58 00:03:01,680 --> 00:03:03,480 Speaker 5: not mastered scaling automotive. 59 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 2: They did get I remember Consumer Reports loved the first 60 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:07,519 Speaker 2: Model Ass remember. 61 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:10,880 Speaker 5: And yeah, but they had to fix every car that 62 00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 5: came off the line, like literally every Model ASS had 63 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:16,400 Speaker 5: like the roof was misaligned, and so they'd have to 64 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:19,280 Speaker 5: reglue on the roof of every Model ASS at a 65 00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 5: shop before they would deliver it to customers. Tesla's been 66 00:03:22,600 --> 00:03:25,520 Speaker 5: doing this for years, where they weren't good at manufacturing 67 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:28,920 Speaker 5: till the Model three, really till the Texas factory. The 68 00:03:28,960 --> 00:03:32,680 Speaker 5: Texas Factory was their first really good factory because Fremont's 69 00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 5: like a bunch of different things put together. So so 70 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:40,640 Speaker 5: basically like Tesla was a great investment off the bat 71 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:43,000 Speaker 5: it rallied for us. We made five times our money 72 00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 5: within the first like year, so we took a bunch 73 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 5: of profits because that's what we do, you know, if 74 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 5: we make five times our money, like really quickly, and 75 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 5: you know, crazily enough. I had like about one hundred 76 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:00,960 Speaker 5: thousand dollars worth of Tesla from the IP and if 77 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 5: I wouldn't have sold any of it, God, I don't 78 00:04:03,000 --> 00:04:04,280 Speaker 5: even know how much that'd be worth today. 79 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:05,840 Speaker 4: It's kind of like my bitcoin. I wish I never 80 00:04:05,880 --> 00:04:06,440 Speaker 4: sold any of my. 81 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:10,000 Speaker 5: Bitcoin too, but you know, so I sold some of 82 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 5: it at the time because I made money, and I 83 00:04:11,560 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 5: was like, this is great. And then Tesla went through 84 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:17,320 Speaker 5: this like five years of rockiness when they launched. They 85 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:20,280 Speaker 5: launched the Model X after the Model S, and that 86 00:04:20,320 --> 00:04:22,400 Speaker 5: was kind of a disaster too, because of the doors 87 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:24,839 Speaker 5: didn't work very well and it was super hard to 88 00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:27,080 Speaker 5: make these cars, and they weren't making money on the 89 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:30,039 Speaker 5: cars even though they were super cool, and the stock 90 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:32,360 Speaker 5: really hadn't done anything. And then that was like, we're 91 00:04:32,360 --> 00:04:35,000 Speaker 5: doing all this to launch the Model three. And so 92 00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:38,919 Speaker 5: when the Model three, the scaled Tesla, was supposed to 93 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:42,799 Speaker 5: come out, this is about twenty eighteen. That's when things 94 00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 5: got really difficult for Tesla. So they were running out 95 00:04:45,800 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 5: of money. Basically, they had about a billion dollars in 96 00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:52,440 Speaker 5: the bank. They're losing money. They got two expensive models 97 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:54,960 Speaker 5: that people like, but they're having you know, they can 98 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:56,920 Speaker 5: only make one hundred thousand a year of these cars, 99 00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:00,480 Speaker 5: so they're making one hundred thousand cars. They're selling them great, 100 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:04,359 Speaker 5: but we're trying to scale this Model three. And what 101 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:07,680 Speaker 5: happened was they Elon had this idea that he was 102 00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:11,320 Speaker 5: going to build all these cars with robots, and he 103 00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:13,960 Speaker 5: built a factory filled with robots, and when they tried 104 00:05:13,960 --> 00:05:17,480 Speaker 5: to scale Model three in twenty eighteen, the robots didn't work, 105 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 5: and so they couldn't get up to five thousand cars 106 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:22,880 Speaker 5: a week, which is what they needed to do to survive, 107 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:26,480 Speaker 5: and so they were stuck at about two thousand cars 108 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:28,239 Speaker 5: a week with the process they had. 109 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:29,040 Speaker 4: And it was desperate. 110 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:31,960 Speaker 5: So what happened was I was on the news a 111 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:34,800 Speaker 5: lot because I was a Tesla bull. And then it 112 00:05:34,839 --> 00:05:37,800 Speaker 5: got very lonely because the short sellers decided that Tesla 113 00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:40,479 Speaker 5: was going to go bankrupt. So every short seller in 114 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:44,960 Speaker 5: the world started shorting Tesla from Chainos to Michael Burry, 115 00:05:45,000 --> 00:05:50,440 Speaker 5: from the Big Shore to Einhorn to Andrew Left, like 116 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:53,800 Speaker 5: like it was literally like a cabal of investment firms 117 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:57,839 Speaker 5: against Tesla, and then there was like me, Kathy Wood, 118 00:05:58,120 --> 00:06:00,880 Speaker 5: and Ron Barrett. So we were like the only three 119 00:06:01,560 --> 00:06:06,719 Speaker 5: investor people that actually stuck with Elon and invested in Tesla. 120 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,200 Speaker 5: So in twenty eighteen, they raised money in a convertible 121 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:11,719 Speaker 5: bond offering. They were really desperate. It was such a 122 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 5: good deal and that ended up being extremely profitable, so 123 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:18,640 Speaker 5: we invested more money into Tesla at that point. Because 124 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:21,919 Speaker 5: I went to the factory myself and this was like 125 00:06:22,279 --> 00:06:24,560 Speaker 5: early twenty nineteen, and I brought my wife because I 126 00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:28,000 Speaker 5: was wanted to make sure that my eyes were not crazy. 127 00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:30,320 Speaker 5: And I was like, if they're willing to open up 128 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:34,760 Speaker 5: everything to let me see it, like cool, like awesome. 129 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 5: So like I wanted to meet Elon, but I didn't 130 00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:39,279 Speaker 5: get to meet him that time, but I met Jerome Gillion, 131 00:06:39,400 --> 00:06:43,480 Speaker 5: who was actually the guy in charge of operations. I 132 00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 5: tour the whole factory, went to the tent, so I 133 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:48,719 Speaker 5: learned how to build electric cars that day, like it 134 00:06:48,839 --> 00:06:50,680 Speaker 5: was amazing day. 135 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:52,039 Speaker 4: And at the end of that day. 136 00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:54,279 Speaker 5: I was like, this is the most incredible company I've 137 00:06:54,320 --> 00:06:56,760 Speaker 5: ever seen. They're going to make these cars, and Jerome's 138 00:06:56,760 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 5: gonna make these cars. And they threw the robots out 139 00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 5: into the field and they put humans in to finish 140 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:04,640 Speaker 5: the cars. And within two or three months they were 141 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:07,279 Speaker 5: up to five thousand a week and Tesla was safe. 142 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:10,240 Speaker 4: But yet the market was like still thinking. 143 00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:12,360 Speaker 5: It was going to collapse. But I was like, no, 144 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 5: they've scaled. I went on TV. I was like, they've scaled. 145 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 5: There was an article on Electric because they had it's 146 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:21,960 Speaker 5: a blog and they had gone the day before me, 147 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 5: and they thought the same thing. There's like everything's going great, 148 00:07:25,400 --> 00:07:27,440 Speaker 5: Like why is everybody shorting the stock saying it's going 149 00:07:27,480 --> 00:07:30,680 Speaker 5: to collapse? And we had this conversation. I don't know, 150 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 5: maybe they just haven't been to the factory. But I'm 151 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:35,920 Speaker 5: going on TV saying I went to the factory like 152 00:07:36,040 --> 00:07:36,720 Speaker 5: it's working. 153 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 4: You know. It wasn't like it was a secret. 154 00:07:38,600 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 5: I was telling everybody, and so I became kind of 155 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:46,120 Speaker 5: like so then like Tesla took off, you know, so 156 00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:50,080 Speaker 5: then you know, we made a lot of money, and 157 00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:54,440 Speaker 5: all the Internet people that followed me made a lot 158 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:55,320 Speaker 5: of money on Tesla. 159 00:07:55,760 --> 00:07:58,120 Speaker 4: So there was this cult that sort of formed. 160 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:00,360 Speaker 2: You were big on Twitter. You were big on Twitter, right. 161 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:01,960 Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm still big on Twitter. 162 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:06,040 Speaker 5: And and it's like, you know, I got huge in 163 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:08,840 Speaker 5: twenty and twenty one when Tesla took off and the 164 00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 5: markets took off and everybody went online and everybody's like 165 00:08:13,120 --> 00:08:16,560 Speaker 5: stuck in the pandemic trading stocks, and then there's me 166 00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:20,480 Speaker 5: and Tesla and the thing goes like, you know, crazy, 167 00:08:20,920 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 5: and we're and we like, twenty twenty was like one 168 00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 5: of my best years ever in the markets. And we 169 00:08:25,440 --> 00:08:27,680 Speaker 5: just made a fortune. We made hundreds of millions of 170 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 5: dollars on Tesla, So it was just great. 171 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:32,400 Speaker 2: You know, dude, how many Tesla's have you had? Have 172 00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:34,800 Speaker 2: you had every single you know, the I had every test, 173 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:35,520 Speaker 2: the three. 174 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:38,960 Speaker 4: Every TESTA yeah, so but I have the cyber truck. 175 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 2: Now, is it your favorite the ball? 176 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:42,120 Speaker 4: What is it your. 177 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:44,320 Speaker 5: Favorite one of It's not my favorite of all because 178 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 5: if Elon would let me sit down with him for 179 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:48,839 Speaker 5: thirty minutes and tell him the things that need to 180 00:08:48,880 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 5: be fixed on this truck, it could be incredible. 181 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:53,040 Speaker 4: But there's things on the truck that make it annoying, 182 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:56,680 Speaker 4: and they can fix them, like what they just aren't what. 183 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:58,480 Speaker 2: Tell us and maybe he'll listen to this podcast. 184 00:08:58,520 --> 00:09:00,520 Speaker 5: Well, I'll give you an example. The car is too big. 185 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:03,840 Speaker 5: It's just too big. It doesn't fit anywhere very easily. 186 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:06,760 Speaker 5: And if it was a little smaller, it would be 187 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:09,600 Speaker 5: just as good a truck, but it would actually fit 188 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:11,480 Speaker 5: in people's garages and parking space. 189 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:13,200 Speaker 1: I mean the dimensions over. 190 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 4: It's a tank. 191 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:19,880 Speaker 5: It's a massive tank, and it drives incredibly well for 192 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 5: its size and weight. So like if you made it 193 00:09:23,760 --> 00:09:27,200 Speaker 5: a little smaller, it would be the super dope truck, right, 194 00:09:27,280 --> 00:09:29,400 Speaker 5: you know. And then there's things like you can't see 195 00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:31,040 Speaker 5: out the back of the truck, you know, like you 196 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 5: can't see out the back. So they put this mirror 197 00:09:33,240 --> 00:09:35,800 Speaker 5: like a rearview mirror, but it actually doesn't show anything. 198 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:38,360 Speaker 5: Now that when you're a human, that fucks you up, 199 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:41,440 Speaker 5: you know, because you keep looking at a blank rearview mirror. 200 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 5: I was like, why they put the mirror there, Well, 201 00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:46,199 Speaker 5: they have to by law, but there's nothing happens in 202 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,360 Speaker 5: the mirror. But yet right below the mirror they have 203 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:51,439 Speaker 5: the video of what's happening behind you. And I said, well, 204 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 5: and they just put it in the mirror, you know, 205 00:09:54,040 --> 00:09:55,760 Speaker 5: So you end up like going like this half the 206 00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:58,120 Speaker 5: time of your head because your eyes just you can't 207 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:00,000 Speaker 5: retrain yourself not to look at a rearview mirror. 208 00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:00,720 Speaker 2: You know. 209 00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:03,840 Speaker 3: I have to say, I'm very surprised you haven't had 210 00:10:03,840 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 3: time with Elon considering recently. 211 00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:06,760 Speaker 4: On. 212 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:10,880 Speaker 5: Elon has a very simple philosophy. If you tell him 213 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:13,800 Speaker 5: things he does not want to hear, he hates you. 214 00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:15,960 Speaker 1: Okay, so maybe. 215 00:10:17,360 --> 00:10:20,840 Speaker 5: I'm not the guy to make him feel good. My 216 00:10:20,960 --> 00:10:23,040 Speaker 5: lot in life is to be a pain in the butt. 217 00:10:23,280 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 5: And I invest now four billion dollars for people. I 218 00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:31,240 Speaker 5: invest in companies, and these people pay me to represent 219 00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:35,719 Speaker 5: them against companies that are very self interested. Executives make 220 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:39,280 Speaker 5: tons of money, tons and tons of money at every company, 221 00:10:39,920 --> 00:10:40,440 Speaker 5: and they. 222 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 4: Need to be accountable with shareholders. 223 00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:45,760 Speaker 5: I represent public shareholders, people like you, people like me. 224 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:49,240 Speaker 5: I represent the public. I don't represent super rich people. 225 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 5: We have fourteen thousand clients from twenty five dollars of 226 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:58,439 Speaker 5: investment to one hundred million dollar client. 227 00:10:58,520 --> 00:10:59,319 Speaker 4: You see what I'm saying. 228 00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 5: My whole firms guk it like functions around helping people 229 00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:07,320 Speaker 5: build a financial future, no matter where you're starting okay. 230 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:10,560 Speaker 5: And so the way I look at it is I'm 231 00:11:10,600 --> 00:11:13,520 Speaker 5: the guy that represents the public shareholders in the stock 232 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 5: market against an industry that makes billions of dollars off 233 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:22,240 Speaker 5: of us and should take treat us well because we 234 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:26,319 Speaker 5: fund them. Okay, so we fund the businesses. We're funding 235 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,439 Speaker 5: AI right now. You want to start an AI company? 236 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:31,960 Speaker 5: And who do you think they call? They call investors. 237 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:35,120 Speaker 5: They come by my office every day, these private guys. 238 00:11:35,440 --> 00:11:37,080 Speaker 5: They want money all the time. I go, I only 239 00:11:37,080 --> 00:11:38,199 Speaker 5: do public stuff. 240 00:11:37,880 --> 00:11:40,560 Speaker 2: You know, And so wait, what's the real talk? Ross 241 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:44,880 Speaker 2: when you're when you see the new lower priced versions 242 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:49,240 Speaker 2: of the Model Y and what's uh, what's actually going 243 00:11:49,280 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 2: on there? 244 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:53,439 Speaker 1: This is based off the listeners? Yeah, it sucks to 245 00:11:53,640 --> 00:11:53,960 Speaker 1: use this. 246 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:58,040 Speaker 3: Tesla has introduced new versions of its top selling models 247 00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:01,080 Speaker 3: for less than forty grand, right. 248 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 4: But it's like they suck. 249 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:05,360 Speaker 5: It's like we're introducing a crappy version of our car 250 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:08,560 Speaker 5: to get to make up for losing the tax credit. 251 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:13,040 Speaker 5: And so see, you know, when you build a product, 252 00:12:13,400 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 5: you want to build the best product ever. You want 253 00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 5: to build it for a price that people can afford it, 254 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:20,160 Speaker 5: but you want people coming home with the best product ever. 255 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:22,200 Speaker 4: Let's use Apple as an example. 256 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 5: That was one of my first grade investments as a 257 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:27,440 Speaker 5: young person, and Steve Jobs was one of my main 258 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:30,400 Speaker 5: Like I loved Steve Jobs back and when I was younger, 259 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:33,680 Speaker 5: and we made a ton of money on Apple still 260 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,480 Speaker 5: top holding and Apple. I just bought my kid a 261 00:12:36,559 --> 00:12:39,559 Speaker 5: new Apple MacBook Air and he ran around the yard twice. 262 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:42,320 Speaker 5: He was so excited for this thing. And I open 263 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:45,440 Speaker 5: up this product and it's phenomenal, you know, like Apple 264 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:49,000 Speaker 5: products like you know, innovation, this and that. No, they're 265 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 5: phenomenal products. We all use them across the world. They 266 00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:56,000 Speaker 5: seem to never disappoint. We all want more and more. 267 00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:59,640 Speaker 5: But actually they make phenomenal products, right, And so if 268 00:12:59,679 --> 00:13:02,719 Speaker 5: you want an iPhone that is cheaper, you just get 269 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:06,240 Speaker 5: an older model, Okay, but they work really well. You know, 270 00:13:06,320 --> 00:13:08,120 Speaker 5: I was using a thirteen for a long time. I 271 00:13:08,160 --> 00:13:11,840 Speaker 5: finally upgraded, you know. So Tesla was always built in 272 00:13:11,880 --> 00:13:15,679 Speaker 5: my mind in the same model it was Apple. It 273 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 5: was a hardware product with great software. It literally was Apple. 274 00:13:20,559 --> 00:13:22,320 Speaker 5: And I was like, Elon could be in the next 275 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:24,240 Speaker 5: Steve Jobs. And that's what I'm saying. If we can 276 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:26,920 Speaker 5: make cars that drive themselves and they're electric, we could 277 00:13:26,920 --> 00:13:30,040 Speaker 5: sell ten to twenty million a year. That was the 278 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:31,600 Speaker 5: original business plant of Tesla. 279 00:13:32,040 --> 00:13:32,400 Speaker 4: Okay. 280 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:37,439 Speaker 5: So when you see a company rip out, what makes 281 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:40,920 Speaker 5: that company so great? Out of the product just to 282 00:13:41,000 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 5: make it cheaper. That is never a good sign for 283 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:45,880 Speaker 5: a company. It's never a good sign. 284 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:46,400 Speaker 4: I think. 285 00:13:46,400 --> 00:13:48,840 Speaker 5: When you think about Tesla as a brand, what made 286 00:13:48,920 --> 00:13:51,640 Speaker 5: the brand cool was that it had fart sounds that 287 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:53,960 Speaker 5: you could do in your car. What made the brand 288 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:55,800 Speaker 5: cool was that you had a screen in the back 289 00:13:55,840 --> 00:13:58,000 Speaker 5: seat that your kids could watch YouTube when you're driving 290 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:00,320 Speaker 5: three hours. It's kind of nice. What made the brand 291 00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:03,440 Speaker 5: cool was that the sound system was so good. One 292 00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:05,560 Speaker 5: of the things I love about electric cars is that 293 00:14:05,600 --> 00:14:08,480 Speaker 5: you don't have noise from the engine. The cars are 294 00:14:08,559 --> 00:14:11,320 Speaker 5: like silent, and then they have this great sound system 295 00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:13,920 Speaker 5: in there, and I could play my jazz music, you know, 296 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:17,040 Speaker 5: if it's recorded on a good you know, more modern music. 297 00:14:17,640 --> 00:14:20,560 Speaker 4: It's like they're sitting right there. It was so good. 298 00:14:20,720 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 4: So if you spent forty dollars on a model Y 299 00:14:24,400 --> 00:14:27,800 Speaker 4: like last month and you got the new model, why 300 00:14:28,280 --> 00:14:34,760 Speaker 4: it's a great car. Okay, So you take this great car, you. 301 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:38,160 Speaker 5: Help elect a guy that hates electric vehicles, who then 302 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:41,640 Speaker 5: takes away all the benefits to society for fighting climate 303 00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 5: and then you respond by making a crappier version of 304 00:14:46,880 --> 00:14:48,760 Speaker 5: your car because. 305 00:14:48,520 --> 00:14:51,920 Speaker 3: I should say the new models have less battery range. 306 00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:55,040 Speaker 3: They have are stripped of features like the screens that 307 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 3: you mentioned, and people covered them. 308 00:14:59,160 --> 00:15:02,560 Speaker 4: The best things. Sit back and see ye stars. I 309 00:15:02,600 --> 00:15:04,960 Speaker 4: mean it really did people buy Teslas. 310 00:15:05,240 --> 00:15:07,240 Speaker 5: They would buy a Tesla. They would get in this 311 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:09,800 Speaker 5: car and they came from a Toyota, a BMW or 312 00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:12,720 Speaker 5: Mercedes or whatever, and they'd be like, this thing is fast, 313 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:15,280 Speaker 5: it's quiet, I don't have to go to gas stations. 314 00:15:15,320 --> 00:15:18,680 Speaker 5: The software is amazing, plays great music. I can make 315 00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:21,320 Speaker 5: my kids laugh. It's got screened in the back like 316 00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 5: it was a great deal. It was just a great car. 317 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:29,520 Speaker 2: Do you think Ross, Do you think the the startups 318 00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:33,080 Speaker 2: like Lucid or Rivian have anything to match that or 319 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:34,280 Speaker 2: are doing a better job. 320 00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:37,760 Speaker 5: Well, what those companies did was from the beginning they 321 00:15:37,760 --> 00:15:41,120 Speaker 5: didn't need or rely on the on the incentives because 322 00:15:41,120 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 5: the cars were too expensive, so they they sell to 323 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 5: a different market. 324 00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 4: You know, what, do you like them? 325 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:51,160 Speaker 5: I like my Rivian a lot, you know, I have 326 00:15:51,240 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 5: the RS one or it's my wife's and like, so 327 00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 5: I drive both, and I really like the Rivian. 328 00:15:57,880 --> 00:15:59,040 Speaker 4: I think they did a great job. 329 00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:02,000 Speaker 5: I think Rivian had other issues which are more operational, 330 00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:04,520 Speaker 5: like when you're trying to get stuff fixed. But it's 331 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 5: just like you're buying a new company, you know, it 332 00:16:06,760 --> 00:16:08,400 Speaker 5: is what it is. 333 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:10,960 Speaker 2: Even to stick with the four hundred vold architecture though, 334 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 2: I mean to me, that feels like almost decontenting a model. Why, 335 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:16,920 Speaker 2: you know, when they had when they had the choice 336 00:16:16,920 --> 00:16:19,520 Speaker 2: to go to an eight hundred volt architecture and faster charging, 337 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 2: they decided to stick with the old thing. 338 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:24,360 Speaker 5: Well, there's lots of different challenges with faster charging versus 339 00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:29,200 Speaker 5: slower charging, depending on battery degradation and quality and all 340 00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:32,560 Speaker 5: these other factors. So the thing about fast charging is 341 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:35,920 Speaker 5: the faster you charge, the more issues you have with 342 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:39,200 Speaker 5: battery life, you know. So there's this trade off of 343 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:41,320 Speaker 5: like how fast we want the car to charge, but 344 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:43,720 Speaker 5: also we don't want the battery to like die after 345 00:16:43,760 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 5: six years, and so that's one of the challenges. But 346 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 5: they just did these five hundred volt megabal new chargers, 347 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:55,440 Speaker 5: and I saw them charging it over twelve hundred miles 348 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:58,920 Speaker 5: per hour added to the car, which is faster than 349 00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:01,160 Speaker 5: I've ever seen. And I'm like, dude, you can charge 350 00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:04,240 Speaker 5: your car completely in fifteen minutes now a regular Tesla. 351 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:06,600 Speaker 5: So so I think, you know, a lot of companies 352 00:17:06,640 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 5: are trying different ways to address charging and battery technology, 353 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:15,840 Speaker 5: whether in Tesla's doing this too with forty six to eighty, 354 00:17:16,280 --> 00:17:19,600 Speaker 5: and I think Tesla is the best at this, you know, 355 00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:22,879 Speaker 5: by far, Like they get charging in batteries better than 356 00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 5: anybody in. 357 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:24,440 Speaker 4: The world by far. 358 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:30,280 Speaker 5: What is so Loosid vehicles I also like but don't 359 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:33,160 Speaker 5: love because the battery is too big. And the Lucid 360 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:37,040 Speaker 5: and you know, it's kind of like this hulking luxury 361 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:40,920 Speaker 5: vehicles and it's turned out to sell pretty well because 362 00:17:40,960 --> 00:17:44,760 Speaker 5: people are buying those now instead of modelesses. So so 363 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:46,879 Speaker 5: I like the Lucid and I like the Rivian. I 364 00:17:46,880 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 5: think they're good brands. I just think that they serve 365 00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:52,080 Speaker 5: the wealthy market and not the masses in any way, 366 00:17:52,119 --> 00:17:54,800 Speaker 5: and so there's a limited you know, potential for those 367 00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:57,560 Speaker 5: companies until they have cheaper products. And if they make 368 00:17:57,640 --> 00:18:00,439 Speaker 5: cheaper products, it hurts being a luxury brand. And I 369 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:02,480 Speaker 5: don't think it's bad to be a luxury brand in 370 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:04,920 Speaker 5: ev because it seems like all the luxury brands don't 371 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:05,719 Speaker 5: want to make EV's. 372 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 4: Now that Elon, you know, kind of got everybody out 373 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:10,640 Speaker 4: of making evs. 374 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:15,040 Speaker 3: Now you're listening to Hot Pursuit from Bloomberg Radio. We 375 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:19,439 Speaker 3: have more with Gerbert Kawasaki, President and CEO Ross Gerber 376 00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:20,280 Speaker 3: after this. 377 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:31,639 Speaker 2: Now back to our deep dive on Tesla with Ross 378 00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:33,600 Speaker 2: Gerber of Gerber Kawasaki. 379 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:40,200 Speaker 3: So can Tesla straddle that balance between you just said 380 00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 3: it's not great that they're selling these cheap products that 381 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:45,760 Speaker 3: have been stripped, but they're more affordable. 382 00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:47,240 Speaker 1: You know that is not. 383 00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:52,040 Speaker 5: I mean, you know, women are very brand conscious, Okay, 384 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:55,040 Speaker 5: So when you think about how men think about brands 385 00:18:55,119 --> 00:19:00,440 Speaker 5: versus women, it's very different. And men are buying process 386 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:02,400 Speaker 5: is much shorter, you know, like. 387 00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:05,640 Speaker 1: We know about that I may make, I may beg 388 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:06,159 Speaker 1: to differ. 389 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:08,239 Speaker 3: I think, well, I know a lot of men are 390 00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:09,880 Speaker 3: pretty if you talk about wristwatches. 391 00:19:10,400 --> 00:19:12,760 Speaker 1: Men are very about. 392 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:14,240 Speaker 4: Like how we perceive a brand. 393 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:16,199 Speaker 5: Now, when a woman buys a brand, Let's say we 394 00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:18,960 Speaker 5: go into a Prada or a Chanel and we're buying 395 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:22,479 Speaker 5: a very high end brand. Okay, if there's anything in 396 00:19:22,520 --> 00:19:26,360 Speaker 5: that store that's cheap. It hurts that store, you see 397 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:29,400 Speaker 5: what I'm saying. So there's nothing in the store that's cheap. 398 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:33,199 Speaker 5: The brand that's done the best at this is Tiffany's. Tiffany's, 399 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:36,320 Speaker 5: you can buy really expensive stuff, but you can find 400 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:38,240 Speaker 5: some things that you can afford there. 401 00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:41,960 Speaker 3: You know, it's important to have a lipstick, and maybe 402 00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:45,560 Speaker 3: the lipstick costs eighty dollars because it's omez, but I 403 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:49,600 Speaker 3: have bought an eighty dollars a Mez lipstick just because 404 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:52,840 Speaker 3: it felt special another mess store, and that is a 405 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:54,120 Speaker 3: relatively affordable thing. 406 00:19:55,080 --> 00:19:55,560 Speaker 1: You know what I mean. 407 00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:58,120 Speaker 5: I guess, but you're saying that. But most people are 408 00:19:58,160 --> 00:20:00,560 Speaker 5: like gasping right now that you spend eighty dollars. 409 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 1: I know it's completely irrational, but I did. 410 00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:05,359 Speaker 5: It right exactly because of the brand though, And I 411 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:08,000 Speaker 5: do this too, And you brought up watches, which is 412 00:20:08,080 --> 00:20:11,480 Speaker 5: exactly what men spend money on based off the brand. 413 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:15,960 Speaker 5: One hundred percent, okay, And so there. We don't care 414 00:20:15,960 --> 00:20:18,120 Speaker 5: about a lot of jewelry, but watches is one of them. 415 00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:20,960 Speaker 5: And especially if you're so sophisticated whatever, you know, you 416 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:22,480 Speaker 5: got to have one of these. You got to have 417 00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 5: an AP or something like that, you know. 418 00:20:24,680 --> 00:20:25,000 Speaker 4: And so. 419 00:20:26,440 --> 00:20:31,240 Speaker 2: Speaking of brand, so brand really yeah, you know, like brands. 420 00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:33,600 Speaker 5: Like Louis Vauton is a stock we owned once, and 421 00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 5: I spent in Ferrari, and I spent some time studying 422 00:20:36,920 --> 00:20:41,080 Speaker 5: the brand philosophy of Ferrari, and it's genius. Like Ferrari 423 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:44,600 Speaker 5: is a genius brand. They literally make one hundred thousand 424 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:48,040 Speaker 5: dollars minimum profit on every car they sell. These people, 425 00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:50,760 Speaker 5: they sell the cars to the same people over and 426 00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:53,400 Speaker 5: over again. They don't even need new customers. They make 427 00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:57,640 Speaker 5: eight thousand a year. They can charge four hundred, five hundred, 428 00:20:57,880 --> 00:21:01,879 Speaker 5: eight hundred thousand car people pay it right, Margin's always 429 00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:02,560 Speaker 5: forty percent. 430 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:04,600 Speaker 1: Everything he wants to be free. 431 00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:06,760 Speaker 4: You're in the club. 432 00:21:06,960 --> 00:21:12,560 Speaker 5: You can't just go buy a Ferrari, okay, so allands. 433 00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:15,440 Speaker 4: Once I had enough money, I started figuring this out. 434 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 5: You go into an AP store and you're like, oh, 435 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:19,359 Speaker 5: I want to look at your watches, and they go, 436 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:21,320 Speaker 5: we don't have any. You have to come in for 437 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:24,720 Speaker 5: an interview, you know, and we'll decide what watch we 438 00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:26,960 Speaker 5: think was great for you. And I go, dude, I 439 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:29,480 Speaker 5: got fifty grand to spend, right, fucking now I want 440 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:31,920 Speaker 5: to watch, you know, like and the guys like, I 441 00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:33,840 Speaker 5: can't sell you watch this way, you know. 442 00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:36,600 Speaker 4: And that's when I learned the lesson. I go, what 443 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:39,320 Speaker 4: is this? This like a fucking game? It's a game. 444 00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 4: I got it. 445 00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 5: I'm a capitalist. You have to go to I was 446 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:45,440 Speaker 5: ready to buy a watch that day. I made a 447 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 5: good trade. I made fifty g's. I was going to 448 00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:50,359 Speaker 5: spend it, and now I'm gonna save it. You know, 449 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:53,080 Speaker 5: I gotta pay for private school now, sorry. And so 450 00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:56,480 Speaker 5: so I paid for private school. What a watch or 451 00:21:56,520 --> 00:21:59,480 Speaker 5: my kid? You're in private school. It's done. Now my 452 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:01,399 Speaker 5: kid's in public school. And I was like, I'm going 453 00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:03,399 Speaker 5: to buy a Ferrari. So you go to the Ferrari 454 00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:06,320 Speaker 5: dealership because actually private school costs the same as a 455 00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:09,640 Speaker 5: Ferrari or an ap It's fifty dollars a year. So 456 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:11,159 Speaker 5: I was like, oh, I'll buy a Ferrari now that 457 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:13,119 Speaker 5: my kid's back in public school. Right, So you go 458 00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:14,639 Speaker 5: down a Ferrari like I want to FRAI. They go, 459 00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:15,720 Speaker 5: I gotta even to sell you. 460 00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:17,600 Speaker 4: You. You got to go to Italy. You got to 461 00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:18,960 Speaker 4: convince them to sell you a car. 462 00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:23,480 Speaker 1: You need to be the Catholic that bluxury is. 463 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 4: Like, how exclusive can we make? 464 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 2: Dud On that note, I have to ask because this 465 00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:33,119 Speaker 2: week Ferrari had its biggest share drop since the IO. Okay, 466 00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:37,000 Speaker 2: the the the outlook was a little bit conservative, but 467 00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:39,240 Speaker 2: one of the other things that they told us is 468 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:42,399 Speaker 2: they're going to scale back on their EV ambitions. So 469 00:22:45,119 --> 00:22:48,840 Speaker 2: would you buy a fully ev Ferrari or when you 470 00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:51,479 Speaker 2: buy a Ferrari, is the whole point of it to 471 00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:54,240 Speaker 2: have the internal combustion engine. 472 00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,320 Speaker 5: I'm not the traditional market for Ferrari, so my opinion 473 00:22:58,440 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 5: doesn't matter. 474 00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,000 Speaker 2: But that's why we have you here who want. 475 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:03,040 Speaker 4: To write yeah for me. 476 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:07,119 Speaker 5: For me, I'm waiting for somebody to understand they can 477 00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:11,840 Speaker 5: build the best supercar ever that's electric because they drive 478 00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:17,280 Speaker 5: better and faster and handle better than gas cars period. 479 00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:22,920 Speaker 4: What Remacnavara, Yeah, that's a fast car. 480 00:23:23,119 --> 00:23:26,359 Speaker 5: But I'm just saying, like the Plaid was the fastest 481 00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:28,359 Speaker 5: car on the road when I was driving it, like 482 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:30,520 Speaker 5: one point nine zero the sixty. I mean, it's hard 483 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:32,440 Speaker 5: to beat that, and if you are beating it, you're 484 00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:34,119 Speaker 5: at the risk you might just take off, you know, 485 00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:36,159 Speaker 5: Like it's it's fast, right. 486 00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:40,400 Speaker 4: But like the the Elon thing. 487 00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:42,520 Speaker 5: This is what bothers me the most is that these 488 00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:46,720 Speaker 5: companies are now dialing back electric vehicle ambitions because the 489 00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 5: pressure isn't going to be on them like it was 490 00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:52,160 Speaker 5: to make these cars, or they're not going to compete now. 491 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,480 Speaker 5: The problem with the Ferrari electricity is it's a half 492 00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:56,880 Speaker 5: a million dollars for the car, so it's really hard 493 00:23:56,920 --> 00:24:00,119 Speaker 5: to get people to buy into a new concept to 494 00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 5: Ferrari without the big engine, which is kind of what 495 00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:08,119 Speaker 5: Ferrari's about a little bit Like I had this Maserati 496 00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:10,120 Speaker 5: once and when I bought it, they were like, it's 497 00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:10,920 Speaker 5: a Ferrari, you know. 498 00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:13,199 Speaker 4: It's the same engines as ferraris. And you get in 499 00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:14,120 Speaker 4: the car and you turn it on. 500 00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:17,200 Speaker 5: Its cora and it makes you feel like a man. 501 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:20,800 Speaker 5: I'm more of a man, you know, Like I got 502 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:21,360 Speaker 5: a Ferrari. 503 00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:24,199 Speaker 4: You know. It's like having a good horse. You know. 504 00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:26,919 Speaker 4: It's like in the old days. If you had a good. 505 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:31,119 Speaker 5: Horse in the old days, you're a better cowboy. That 506 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:35,359 Speaker 5: you get in the car and you push a button 507 00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 5: and it doesn't make any sound. 508 00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 4: It seems to be very hard for older Ferrari owners, 509 00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:41,280 Speaker 4: you know, And. 510 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:43,159 Speaker 5: I'm like how about the idea that it's just a 511 00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:46,680 Speaker 5: dope car and it drives super good and you don't 512 00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:47,600 Speaker 5: need the engine. 513 00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:47,879 Speaker 4: You know. 514 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:50,320 Speaker 2: What do you think about the Porsche Taekon, by the way. 515 00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:54,800 Speaker 5: I think it's a beautiful car, Like the Porsche did 516 00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:58,399 Speaker 5: a great job with luxury, and the pricing is expensive, 517 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:01,720 Speaker 5: like it's almost two hundred K, but it's a great 518 00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:06,239 Speaker 5: looking vehicle. The problem is Porsche sucks at software and 519 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:07,679 Speaker 5: the cars have software issues. 520 00:25:07,680 --> 00:25:09,960 Speaker 4: And I don't know if they've solved it this year 521 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:11,600 Speaker 4: or not, but if you buy one. 522 00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:13,639 Speaker 5: Of these cars, expect and they don't do over the 523 00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:16,119 Speaker 5: air updates. So when you have a software problem, you 524 00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:18,159 Speaker 5: got to take it to Porsche. Now, this is like 525 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:21,920 Speaker 5: the like I would call the anti technology technology, where 526 00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:24,760 Speaker 5: you make technology that's better that makes your car worse, 527 00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:28,720 Speaker 5: you know, And so that's my issue with that. They've 528 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:30,840 Speaker 5: they've got to get better software and they've got to 529 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:33,719 Speaker 5: figure out that they that car companies in the future 530 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:36,320 Speaker 5: are software companies more than their hardware companies, and they 531 00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:38,720 Speaker 5: don't know that yet and they're still trying to be 532 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:43,119 Speaker 5: hardware companies. But really they're building iPhones not that drive, 533 00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:48,440 Speaker 5: not cars, and that's what Tesla innovated that still most 534 00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:50,240 Speaker 5: companies haven't really fully grasped. 535 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:51,280 Speaker 1: Ross. 536 00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:53,520 Speaker 3: I just want to put a pin and a bow 537 00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:57,080 Speaker 3: on our Tesla conversation just to wrap things up. Where 538 00:25:57,119 --> 00:26:00,000 Speaker 3: do you see us going from here? After this announced 539 00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:02,600 Speaker 3: meant about the lower priced cars? 540 00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:05,800 Speaker 1: You know, how are you? What's your outlook now? 541 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:12,160 Speaker 5: So the next six So in the next six months, 542 00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:17,119 Speaker 5: all this stuff comes to roost, right, Like, there's no 543 00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:20,359 Speaker 5: credits anymore. So how many Tesla's are we going to 544 00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:21,600 Speaker 5: sell in the next six months? 545 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,040 Speaker 4: And I don't know. I just don't know. I know 546 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:25,600 Speaker 4: from my. 547 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:29,480 Speaker 5: Experience as an economics person in some of you studies 548 00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,440 Speaker 5: business that we should see a pretty dramatic drop off 549 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:36,960 Speaker 5: in sales this quarter as we pulled demand forward with 550 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:39,200 Speaker 5: the end of the credits and a great new car 551 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:41,720 Speaker 5: and and people use that. And they had a great 552 00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:45,119 Speaker 5: quarter because people, you know, went out and bought Tesla's. 553 00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:47,440 Speaker 4: Hold their nose. They don't like Elon, who cares? It's 554 00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:47,920 Speaker 4: a great car. 555 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:49,520 Speaker 1: I've seen the store. 556 00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:52,280 Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean it's funny, the stickers. I feel bad 557 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:54,360 Speaker 5: for the people that feel like they need to justify it. 558 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:57,720 Speaker 5: How about you just care about the environment, like it's okay, 559 00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:02,240 Speaker 5: like you know that of so many companies suck, so 560 00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:04,719 Speaker 5: like you know, if you want to get into that, 561 00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:07,040 Speaker 5: Elon's just another one of the bad guys who runs 562 00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:09,840 Speaker 5: another company, you know. But I want to do what's 563 00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 5: best for me and the environment, and Tesla still is 564 00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:16,960 Speaker 5: a great vehicle for that. So I think that it's 565 00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:18,560 Speaker 5: going to be a hard time for Tesla because they 566 00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:21,840 Speaker 5: still don't advertise. Elon doesn't think he's doing anything wrong, 567 00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:25,320 Speaker 5: insulting people constantly, and people hate him in Europe. 568 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 4: They won't even buy the car. You know. 569 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:30,639 Speaker 5: China is now getting ahead of us, and they're making 570 00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:34,960 Speaker 5: extremely good electric vehicles and they're extremely competitive and the 571 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 5: government's all in. So what I also fear out of 572 00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:42,640 Speaker 5: this Trump administration philosophy of going away from electric vehicles, 573 00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:44,680 Speaker 5: then now we're going to lose the race to build 574 00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,520 Speaker 5: the best electric vehicles. So China knew that when they 575 00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 5: let the Tesla factory in, and that was why they 576 00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:50,679 Speaker 5: did it. 577 00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:52,560 Speaker 4: And then who would think. 578 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:53,879 Speaker 5: It would be so far to it is that we 579 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:57,359 Speaker 5: would actually stop making great electric vehicles and now they 580 00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:00,720 Speaker 5: can take the entire market from everybody. That's exactly what's 581 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 5: going to happen is in the next five years, Chinese 582 00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:06,200 Speaker 5: evs will be like the top vehicles in the electric 583 00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:07,080 Speaker 5: vehicle market. 584 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:09,800 Speaker 1: I have no doubt you think they'll be here in 585 00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:10,280 Speaker 1: the US. 586 00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:12,600 Speaker 5: Well, we're going to try to stop them, right, because 587 00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:17,200 Speaker 5: isn't that capitalism stop the competitors, not free market capitalism? 588 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,320 Speaker 4: You know. So I don't know they're in Europe. I 589 00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:22,639 Speaker 4: see them in Mexico, so you know. 590 00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:24,200 Speaker 1: Got Chinese buses here. 591 00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:26,480 Speaker 4: I believe Chinese BYD buses. 592 00:28:27,040 --> 00:28:29,200 Speaker 5: So if you're a free market guy like me, you're 593 00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:30,840 Speaker 5: kind of like, yeah, why shouldn't I be able to 594 00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:31,800 Speaker 5: buy a BYD? Did? 595 00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:34,080 Speaker 2: I feel you on every level? I feel like we're 596 00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:35,400 Speaker 2: soul brothers. 597 00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:35,880 Speaker 4: You guys. 598 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:37,640 Speaker 3: I was going to say, are you long last brothers? 599 00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:39,520 Speaker 3: Because Matt is just sitting. 600 00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:40,800 Speaker 4: Back podcast together. 601 00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:42,800 Speaker 5: You know, this is why I don't have my own podcasts, 602 00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:44,920 Speaker 5: because I try to find great podcasters to be on 603 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:45,520 Speaker 5: their shows. 604 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:47,120 Speaker 1: You need to come on more often. 605 00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:48,080 Speaker 2: I'm so glad we got you. 606 00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:50,440 Speaker 4: You love to? Yeah, I love to. Well, that's what 607 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 4: I'm saying. 608 00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:52,720 Speaker 5: I see you know, I look at Bloomberg a lot, 609 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:54,760 Speaker 5: and because there's nothing else to look at any more, 610 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:58,160 Speaker 5: that I believe in and and sadly, Reuters in Bloomberg 611 00:28:58,280 --> 00:28:59,240 Speaker 5: is all I've got now. 612 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:02,360 Speaker 4: And so, you know, no offense to all the other 613 00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:04,480 Speaker 4: channels I'm on. You know, I love you all too, 614 00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 4: But the quality is you guys are getting worked. 615 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:10,880 Speaker 2: You know, I will get you everywhere. 616 00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:12,560 Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm like, you. 617 00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:15,320 Speaker 5: Know, I love your podcast, and I love cars, and 618 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 5: you know, I love technology, and I think that this 619 00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:21,520 Speaker 5: is one of the most exciting times in technology. You know, 620 00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:23,680 Speaker 5: you didn't ask me about what I think about putting 621 00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,400 Speaker 5: Groc on the car. You know, he put the AI 622 00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:30,000 Speaker 5: thing on the Tesla too, and it totally screwed up 623 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:33,400 Speaker 5: the infotainment system because Groc is an integrated. 624 00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:34,920 Speaker 4: I didn't even know when you push the. 625 00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:36,960 Speaker 5: MIC to like make a phone call now and you're 626 00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:39,680 Speaker 5: like call my mom. Groc's like, well, I can't do that. 627 00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 5: And I was like, then, why are you on my car? 628 00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:43,480 Speaker 5: And It's like, well, elon, put me on your car. 629 00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:45,320 Speaker 5: And I was like, but if you can't run anything 630 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:47,360 Speaker 5: on the car, like, why are you on my car? 631 00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 5: And how do I get back to the thing that 632 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,240 Speaker 5: used to do stuff? And it's like, you can't. And 633 00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:53,280 Speaker 5: I was like and I was like I'm going to 634 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:56,000 Speaker 5: record this and post this because groc will tell you, like, 635 00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:57,680 Speaker 5: it doesn't make any sense why I'm on the car 636 00:29:57,760 --> 00:29:59,000 Speaker 5: right now, because I can't. 637 00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 4: Do anything that's great. Wow. 638 00:30:01,920 --> 00:30:04,840 Speaker 5: But it's the beginning of a big innovation that's about 639 00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:08,840 Speaker 5: to happen in cars, where in our lives, where AI 640 00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:10,080 Speaker 5: will actually. 641 00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:12,680 Speaker 4: Do stuff for us. Right now it's telling us stuff 642 00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:15,640 Speaker 4: and it's great for research, but next it's going to 643 00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:18,920 Speaker 4: do stuff for us. Buy me those tickets, yes, order 644 00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:22,840 Speaker 4: me that plan, that plan that trip for me, use 645 00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:25,400 Speaker 4: my bloom tickets. Yeah. 646 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:29,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, Actually, I just I was just driving the new 647 00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:33,120 Speaker 2: Aston Martin Vanquish and they are the. 648 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:34,440 Speaker 4: First that's a great car. 649 00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:38,560 Speaker 2: It's insanely good. I'm so blown away, dude, the way I. 650 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:40,560 Speaker 4: Hadn't asked Martin once that I loved it to. 651 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 2: Be handling on this, I don't know how the engineers 652 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,160 Speaker 2: did it. Like it's not it doesn't jar you, but 653 00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:48,200 Speaker 2: it's also so sporty. But the one thing that on 654 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:51,560 Speaker 2: the outside, on the tech side, they are the first 655 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:54,720 Speaker 2: company or the first car maker to use Apple car 656 00:30:54,800 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 2: Play Ultra, so it's car Play, but it also controls 657 00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:02,760 Speaker 2: everything in your cars mode and climate, controls and you know, 658 00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:05,040 Speaker 2: so you don't have to switch back and forth. 659 00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:06,600 Speaker 4: It's really so did it work well? 660 00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:07,880 Speaker 2: It worked really well. 661 00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:11,520 Speaker 5: It really well because Apple failed in this whole car 662 00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:15,000 Speaker 5: thing pretty bad, and the original car play was like 663 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,880 Speaker 5: kind of a joke and manufacturers were just putting it on. 664 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:21,160 Speaker 5: But it was basically like a cheap integration. But a 665 00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:24,520 Speaker 5: full auto integration makes a lot of sense because car 666 00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:27,040 Speaker 5: makers can't make software, as I was just saying, and 667 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 5: so let Apple just take exact car. It makes sense, 668 00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:33,960 Speaker 5: be your iOS, you know, of your car. It's it's 669 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:37,960 Speaker 5: sort of like the next big battles who controls your car? 670 00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:40,560 Speaker 4: You know? Apple, And that was. 671 00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:42,240 Speaker 5: Sort of like, oh, we're going to license the Tesla 672 00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:45,160 Speaker 5: software and all this kind of stuff too, which which 673 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:47,360 Speaker 5: could have happened if that's what they were focused on, 674 00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:50,719 Speaker 5: because you know, even when you get in like a 675 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 5: good new car, most of that software to me is 676 00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:58,800 Speaker 5: pretty like ridiculously bad. Yeah, it doesn't compare to anything 677 00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:00,000 Speaker 5: like a video game or anything. 678 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:00,760 Speaker 4: You know. 679 00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:04,000 Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, dude, I agree, We're gonna have to 680 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:08,160 Speaker 2: have you back on again because this has been great. 681 00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:09,000 Speaker 4: Love. 682 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:12,760 Speaker 1: I think this is the beginning of a long relationship. 683 00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:17,440 Speaker 2: Uh my final, My final tipics. 684 00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:19,080 Speaker 4: We're going to talk about cars like I. 685 00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: Love or music. I got my Springsteen t shirt on 686 00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:23,680 Speaker 1: Talk About. 687 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:31,840 Speaker 2: Special. Thanks to my new best friend Ross Gerber for 688 00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:34,320 Speaker 2: joining us today. He is the president and CEO of 689 00:32:34,400 --> 00:32:35,520 Speaker 2: Gerber Kawasaki. 690 00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:38,000 Speaker 3: That does it for this week's show. Remember to follow 691 00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:42,000 Speaker 3: us and subscribe to Bloomberg Hot Pursuit on Apple, Spotify, 692 00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:45,600 Speaker 3: and anywhere else you listen. You can also send us 693 00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:50,360 Speaker 3: your comments. Please email us your comments at Hot Pursuit 694 00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:51,520 Speaker 3: at Bloomberg. 695 00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:54,280 Speaker 2: Dot net, and check out Hannah's columns and stories on 696 00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:57,680 Speaker 2: Bloomberg dot com and the Bloomberg Business app. Go there 697 00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:00,600 Speaker 2: for car reviews, events and stories that you won't find 698 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:03,880 Speaker 2: anywhere else. Find it all at Bloomberg dot com, slash Pursuits, 699 00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:08,080 Speaker 2: slash Autos. I'm Matt Miller and I'm Hannah Elliott. 700 00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:10,840 Speaker 3: Will be back in your podcast speed again next week