1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:01,520 Speaker 1: Taking a Walk. 2 00:00:01,560 --> 00:00:05,040 Speaker 2: We couldn't get signed. We were rejected by every label 3 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:09,200 Speaker 2: in the United States five times. Every five times. We 4 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:12,280 Speaker 2: eventually went to England to get an independent record deal 5 00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:17,600 Speaker 2: and reverse broke like Joon Jett has done, Great Cat did. 6 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:21,119 Speaker 2: Hendrix also went to England and broke out out of 7 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:25,280 Speaker 2: the UK. We had to do that because as popular 8 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 2: as we were in the Tri State area, we could 9 00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:30,760 Speaker 2: not get a record deal. They would not sign us. 10 00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:34,040 Speaker 1: This is the Taking a Walk Podcast with Buzz Night. 11 00:00:34,600 --> 00:00:37,680 Speaker 1: This episode, Buzz talks with one of the most colorful 12 00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 1: figures in music history. D Snyder, was the frontman for 13 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:45,840 Speaker 1: the legendary heavy metal band Twisted Sister. He also continues 14 00:00:45,880 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 1: to host the House of Hair radio show Joined Buzz 15 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:52,640 Speaker 1: Talking with d Snyder. Next on Taking a Walk. 16 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 3: D Snyder, Welcome to a virtual edition of the Taking 17 00:00:57,560 --> 00:00:59,760 Speaker 3: a Walk Podcast. I wish it could be in person, 18 00:00:59,840 --> 00:01:03,000 Speaker 3: but maybe you could add the huffing and puffin effects 19 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:04,120 Speaker 3: in Well. 20 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:07,120 Speaker 2: I'm in really good aerobic shape, Buzz, so I'll have 21 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:08,720 Speaker 2: trouble faking that I'm winded. 22 00:01:09,760 --> 00:01:12,679 Speaker 3: Do you take walks though? I mean, do you do 23 00:01:12,680 --> 00:01:16,240 Speaker 3: you do that? Out in uh uh sunny California? 24 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 2: You know what one of my favorite things. I grew 25 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:23,000 Speaker 2: up in New York and my wife and I now 26 00:01:23,040 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 2: live by the beach in California and we have a 27 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:31,440 Speaker 2: house on the Caribbean in Belize, and so walking on 28 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:35,120 Speaker 2: the beach is one of my favorite things. Uh, which 29 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:37,559 Speaker 2: is you know which I never you know? That's that's 30 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:41,199 Speaker 2: definitely goes against the the pale, ghost whiteness of normal 31 00:01:41,280 --> 00:01:44,640 Speaker 2: rock stars who are vampires. But in my older age, 32 00:01:44,680 --> 00:01:47,360 Speaker 2: I want to be tan and healthy and happy. 33 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:50,920 Speaker 3: So what was it like growing up in those mean 34 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:53,160 Speaker 3: streets of Astoria? 35 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:59,480 Speaker 2: Well, you know, uh, families who go to New York 36 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:03,440 Speaker 2: grant families. My family, my parents or children of immigrants, 37 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:08,480 Speaker 2: they moved to Brooklyn, they moved to Queens Astoria. It 38 00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:11,240 Speaker 2: was where my parents lived and grew up in that area. 39 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 2: But then the dream is too as a dreams for 40 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:17,120 Speaker 2: a better life. We're all always dreaming for a better 41 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:18,760 Speaker 2: life for our kids. We all want it better than 42 00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:20,880 Speaker 2: we had it. And so back then, the better life 43 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:24,520 Speaker 2: was to go out to Long Island, the suburbs, you know, 44 00:02:24,560 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 2: and live in the track housing and get away from 45 00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:32,440 Speaker 2: the mean streets of New York City and Queens and 46 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 2: you know, I'm it's just you said it. I didn't. 47 00:02:35,560 --> 00:02:39,400 Speaker 2: But they didn't realize that there was a whole suburban 48 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 2: gang scene going on where I lived, which I've written 49 00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 2: about in my new novel called Fratce, which you can't 50 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 2: see when we're walking, but and I was. I was 51 00:02:50,720 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 2: in as much danger there as I was in Queens 52 00:02:54,960 --> 00:02:58,919 Speaker 2: And and if not more, because because they were called 53 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 2: fraternity's high school fraternities, they didn't exist anywhere else in 54 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:05,519 Speaker 2: the world except in a small microcosm in South Shore 55 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 2: of Nasa County when in the in the seventies and 56 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 2: eighties they were They had charters with the police department 57 00:03:13,840 --> 00:03:16,560 Speaker 2: and had Greek letters, and so the school viewed them 58 00:03:16,639 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 2: as as being, Oh, they're legitimate, they're like college fraternities, 59 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:23,600 Speaker 2: but it's high school. They marched in the parades, they 60 00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:26,760 Speaker 2: would have their colored walk with their banners. Yet they 61 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:32,440 Speaker 2: basically only did was fight and beat people up notice gangs, 62 00:03:32,440 --> 00:03:35,400 Speaker 2: but they were allowed to roam the halls wearing their 63 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 2: colors and their jackets. And France is based on actual 64 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 2: events about that period of time in the seventies when 65 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:43,000 Speaker 2: that existed. 66 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 3: So tell me about frats and what's going to happen. 67 00:03:47,040 --> 00:03:50,600 Speaker 3: That is a future evolution of that book. 68 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:53,640 Speaker 2: So France is you know, I've been writing for many, 69 00:03:53,640 --> 00:03:55,920 Speaker 2: many years, and people, if you check it out, I 70 00:03:56,120 --> 00:03:59,160 Speaker 2: promise you I've been writing over thirty years, whether it 71 00:03:59,200 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 2: was screen plays or short stories or you know, or 72 00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:08,400 Speaker 2: just articles and memoirs, all kinds of things. I finally 73 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:13,960 Speaker 2: decided to do a a novel and the reviews are excellent. 74 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:18,200 Speaker 2: People are kind of stunned, but I said, it's a 75 00:04:18,279 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 2: craft and I've developed it and I can write. But 76 00:04:20,760 --> 00:04:22,680 Speaker 2: it was published because you know, when you when a 77 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:26,680 Speaker 2: rock star writes book, people will take you seriously. So 78 00:04:27,080 --> 00:04:30,720 Speaker 2: it's on a small independent you know, read Penguin books, 79 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:34,320 Speaker 2: available in stores anywhere you get books. But you know, 80 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:38,240 Speaker 2: I didn't expect much more. But it's a very rich story, 81 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:42,560 Speaker 2: and I got contacted by major studio can't name them. 82 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:45,360 Speaker 2: Now we're putting a deal together who wants to make 83 00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:48,159 Speaker 2: a movie out of it? And trying I want to say, well, 84 00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:51,400 Speaker 2: what's it about? I just told you, but think Outsiders 85 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:55,400 Speaker 2: set in the suburban seventies. You remember the movie Outsiders. 86 00:04:55,839 --> 00:04:58,880 Speaker 2: This is about gang violence in suburbia in the seventies 87 00:04:59,279 --> 00:05:02,320 Speaker 2: and anyway, so that was a really exciting meeting I 88 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:05,080 Speaker 2: had earlier this week, and so I'm hoping it gets 89 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:08,360 Speaker 2: bouts of the screen because the story is worthy. It's 90 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:11,160 Speaker 2: a powerful story, it's a coming of age story. It's 91 00:05:11,200 --> 00:05:15,600 Speaker 2: also about male toxicity, you know, that whole thing that 92 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:18,000 Speaker 2: I didn't realize I was writing about that, but it is. 93 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:21,039 Speaker 2: So if you're wondering why we still have a lot 94 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 2: of very violent men in the world, it's because it 95 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:27,839 Speaker 2: because many of us were raised like I don't know 96 00:05:27,839 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 2: what we were raised like, but we were raised like animals, 97 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:34,480 Speaker 2: and you know, and and and we we continue to 98 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:37,960 Speaker 2: It was very hard for me, being raised by a 99 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:42,520 Speaker 2: cop VET, the heavy handed dad, to not inflict this 100 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:45,400 Speaker 2: that of my child own children, because it turned me 101 00:05:45,480 --> 00:05:48,480 Speaker 2: into a tough guy. It made me colder, It made 102 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 2: me a guy who's you know, tear ducts dried up. 103 00:05:51,320 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 2: It made me that a hard person. And I didn't 104 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 2: want my sons to still to be affected by it, 105 00:05:57,320 --> 00:05:59,719 Speaker 2: but they still, to be honest, they still were. It's 106 00:05:59,720 --> 00:06:01,839 Speaker 2: hard not to be affected when your dad's a tough guy. 107 00:06:02,680 --> 00:06:06,480 Speaker 3: So and mister tough guy was in the church choir, 108 00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:07,080 Speaker 3: wasn't he. 109 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, tough guy was in a lot. I became 110 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 2: tough guy. You know, it was like I wasn't. I 111 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:17,719 Speaker 2: was like an outcast. You know, in the book France, 112 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:21,919 Speaker 2: it's about the fraterniteys. I am not one of the guys, 113 00:06:21,960 --> 00:06:25,159 Speaker 2: the guy who the books about Bobby, of the main character. 114 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:29,520 Speaker 2: I'm not Bobby. I am one of the nerds that 115 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:32,520 Speaker 2: is getting always in danger of getting their asses kicked 116 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 2: by the gangs. You know. I spent my life trying 117 00:06:35,240 --> 00:06:37,400 Speaker 2: to avoid him. I was a big nerd and I 118 00:06:37,440 --> 00:06:39,839 Speaker 2: was a big weird nerd. So they kind of said, 119 00:06:40,080 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 2: you know, I got to stay away from him. That 120 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:44,479 Speaker 2: might just might go back, it might go you know, 121 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:47,520 Speaker 2: go wildly wrong. But at the same time I did 122 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:51,240 Speaker 2: that my moments of getting jumped, but I was not 123 00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:56,719 Speaker 2: that tough a guy. Growing up your life makes you 124 00:06:56,800 --> 00:06:59,839 Speaker 2: that way and you just sort of have to protect 125 00:06:59,839 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 2: your self and defend yourself. I mean, you live in 126 00:07:02,480 --> 00:07:04,200 Speaker 2: not you know, in the world that I grew up in, 127 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:07,520 Speaker 2: and it just makes you stronger. Hey, if nobody bothered me, 128 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:10,720 Speaker 2: a pick on me, I'd just be a I don't know, 129 00:07:10,840 --> 00:07:15,119 Speaker 2: I'd just be a geek crying watching sad movies or something. 130 00:07:15,120 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 2: I don't know what. But but that's not me. We'll 131 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:18,679 Speaker 2: be right. 132 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:24,800 Speaker 3: Back with more of the Taking a Walk podcast. Welcome 133 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:28,400 Speaker 3: back to the Taken a Walk Podcast. Well, when Twisted 134 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 3: Sister first really broke out big, I was working in 135 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:40,000 Speaker 3: that period in Connecticut programming at I ninety five and 136 00:07:40,040 --> 00:07:44,520 Speaker 3: seeing you and the band at a number of salty 137 00:07:44,600 --> 00:07:47,760 Speaker 3: places like the Fore and Aft. Remember the Fore and Aft. 138 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:51,559 Speaker 2: These are places that make you toss a goora a goora. 139 00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 2: So many there was. There was Toad's Place, there was 140 00:07:54,760 --> 00:07:58,840 Speaker 2: a great American Music hall, there's there's so many legendary 141 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:01,480 Speaker 2: clubs in the New York are four and a half 142 00:08:01,480 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 2: for sure. 143 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:06,960 Speaker 3: And so we saw you regularly there as you guys 144 00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:09,560 Speaker 3: were out playing all the time. We would do our 145 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:15,080 Speaker 3: you know, station promotion nights there frequently. And then I remember, 146 00:08:15,680 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 3: you know, suddenly there's an explosion of Twisted Sister fame 147 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:25,680 Speaker 3: over your music. Were you guys taken by surprise about 148 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:27,520 Speaker 3: how quickly that all happened? 149 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:30,560 Speaker 2: Well, the band was the other for a long time. 150 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:33,160 Speaker 2: And the reason why I ninety five, which, by the way, 151 00:08:33,400 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 2: my radio show House of Hair is on ninety five 152 00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:40,640 Speaker 2: still all these years later. The reason why you guys 153 00:08:40,679 --> 00:08:43,280 Speaker 2: came down to our shows is because they're always packed. 154 00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:46,640 Speaker 2: You knew the place there'd be a thousand kids there, 155 00:08:46,920 --> 00:08:51,160 Speaker 2: you know, you know, teenagers, so you knew. You know 156 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:53,080 Speaker 2: what I'm saying, That's why people came to our shows. 157 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:58,280 Speaker 2: We packed them in. People kept expecting us to move 158 00:08:58,320 --> 00:09:01,240 Speaker 2: on and leave, and we just were there for a 159 00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:04,880 Speaker 2: year after year. We couldn't get signed. We were rejected 160 00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 2: by every label in the United States five times. Every 161 00:09:09,400 --> 00:09:12,320 Speaker 2: five times. We eventually went to England to get an 162 00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:16,319 Speaker 2: independent record deal and reverse broke like Joan Jett has done, 163 00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:22,120 Speaker 2: Dray Cats did. The Hendricks also went to England and 164 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:24,960 Speaker 2: broke out out of the UK. We had to do 165 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:28,280 Speaker 2: that because as popular as we were in the Tri 166 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 2: State area, we could not get a record deal. They 167 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:37,160 Speaker 2: would not sign us. So when it finally happened, yeah, 168 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 2: it started, it's like when you finally broke through. It 169 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 2: just a wall came down and we plowed through. But 170 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:45,760 Speaker 2: as a band, we had done so much experience, so 171 00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:50,040 Speaker 2: much it was like, I don't say too little, too late, 172 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:54,040 Speaker 2: but it was like almost bit big whoop is not 173 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:56,679 Speaker 2: the word either, But we had already played arenas, opening 174 00:09:56,760 --> 00:09:59,160 Speaker 2: up for people that were in the Tri State area, 175 00:09:59,360 --> 00:10:02,120 Speaker 2: but Ju and Blois to Coulton. We had been to 176 00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:05,240 Speaker 2: arenas we recorded in the top recording studios. Our demo 177 00:10:05,280 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 2: is an Electric Lady with Eddie Kramer and remember the 178 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:10,800 Speaker 2: Rolling Stones doing some girls down the hall. I mean, 179 00:10:11,080 --> 00:10:14,640 Speaker 2: so we had we had bodyguards in the Tri State area, 180 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:17,280 Speaker 2: we had thousands of thousands of fans, and we had 181 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:20,680 Speaker 2: had in a microcosm, we were rock stars, but we 182 00:10:20,760 --> 00:10:23,800 Speaker 2: hadn't received it on an international level. So when it 183 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:27,280 Speaker 2: finally happened, it was like, it's about time. That was 184 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:29,240 Speaker 2: a feeling, It's about damn time. 185 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:35,200 Speaker 3: I remember at the Episcopal Church that my wife and 186 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:39,240 Speaker 3: I belonged to in Connecticut actually during that period, and 187 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 3: I know you ultimately turned to the Episcopal Church as well, 188 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:48,960 Speaker 3: but I remember being called after a particular Mass to 189 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 3: a meeting almost of the church elders about the whole 190 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:57,319 Speaker 3: PMRC thing that was going on, which was pretty awkward, 191 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:01,360 Speaker 3: I might say. Can you describe what it was like 192 00:11:02,440 --> 00:11:07,680 Speaker 3: being there with John Denver Frank Zappa in the middle 193 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:08,720 Speaker 3: of all of that fight. 194 00:11:09,679 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 2: You know, at the time we were in the center 195 00:11:13,160 --> 00:11:15,720 Speaker 2: of the controversy. There was a list called the Filthy 196 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:19,640 Speaker 2: fifteen and that you know, and well, we're not gonna 197 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:22,560 Speaker 2: take it was on there for violence. We were it 198 00:11:22,600 --> 00:11:25,840 Speaker 2: was a violent song apparently, and we were dealing with 199 00:11:26,280 --> 00:11:30,880 Speaker 2: protests at our shows and picket lines, and especially down 200 00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:36,240 Speaker 2: in the Bible Belt. Shows canceled because our New York males. 201 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:39,080 Speaker 2: The things we said on stage got me arrested down 202 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:43,640 Speaker 2: in Texas. So I was very much in the middle 203 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:46,640 Speaker 2: of it, and it felt we were twisted. E Fing's 204 00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:49,760 Speaker 2: sister man. I mean, I kind of expected it, and 205 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:53,040 Speaker 2: when they asked me to go to Washington to testify, 206 00:11:53,760 --> 00:11:57,840 Speaker 2: I viewed it as carrying the flag into battle. I said, wow, 207 00:11:57,960 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 2: you know, I'm gonna lead the army into battle. I 208 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:04,319 Speaker 2: didn't know until well later that it was that John 209 00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:07,079 Speaker 2: Denver and Frank Zappa, both by the Rest in Peace, 210 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:10,959 Speaker 2: were both going to be there, neither who was on 211 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:14,240 Speaker 2: the list, neither who was a targeted band or artist. 212 00:12:14,280 --> 00:12:17,120 Speaker 2: And to their credit, they stepped forward at a time 213 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:21,240 Speaker 2: it turned out not many people did. Not many people 214 00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:24,200 Speaker 2: stepped up as a matter of fact, after those Senate hearings, 215 00:12:24,640 --> 00:12:27,079 Speaker 2: and I was I was pretty much canceled. It was 216 00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:30,000 Speaker 2: before they called the canceling, but I became public enemy 217 00:12:30,040 --> 00:12:33,440 Speaker 2: number one, and I was portrayed, and it really hurt 218 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:37,440 Speaker 2: Twist's career that I stepped forward like that. You know. 219 00:12:37,480 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 2: Alice Cooper once said to me, why'd you do that? 220 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:42,079 Speaker 2: He said, you should have just said it's all true. 221 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:45,400 Speaker 2: It's all true, you know, and just you know, because 222 00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:49,280 Speaker 2: if what they were accusing us of fed the rock 223 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:52,640 Speaker 2: and roll ethos, if I fed the image of rock 224 00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:56,400 Speaker 2: and roll me stepping forward and showing them they were wrong. 225 00:12:56,679 --> 00:12:59,000 Speaker 2: And I was intelligent and I didn't drink, and I 226 00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:01,240 Speaker 2: didn't do drugs, and I was married, and I was 227 00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:03,880 Speaker 2: a Christian, and I had a child that was not 228 00:13:04,040 --> 00:13:07,400 Speaker 2: rock and roll. And it was damaging to my image 229 00:13:07,520 --> 00:13:10,960 Speaker 2: because unknown to me, people want lifestylers. They didn't. They 230 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:13,760 Speaker 2: want not just people who were rocking on on stage. 231 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:17,160 Speaker 2: They want you doing the same thing off stage. And me, 232 00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 2: I was just recovering from every show, so I would 233 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:21,840 Speaker 2: I didn't, you know, I didn't live the rock and 234 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:25,360 Speaker 2: roll lifestyle. I was rock and roll, but be that 235 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:30,360 Speaker 2: as it may too. I didn't know what Frank and 236 00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 2: John would be about. Frank, of course, is always fucking 237 00:13:33,880 --> 00:13:39,800 Speaker 2: disdainful of anything normal. So and and meeting him was 238 00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:42,480 Speaker 2: amazing and uh, and he went in there and kicked ass. 239 00:13:42,559 --> 00:13:45,760 Speaker 2: John Denver was a big surprise at that point. He 240 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:49,319 Speaker 2: was so mom and apple pie with his annual Christmas 241 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:53,240 Speaker 2: special and and we thought he might turn on rock 242 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:55,640 Speaker 2: and roll, but he didn't. And Frank and I were 243 00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:57,880 Speaker 2: cheering in the back room when he did, and when 244 00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 2: he said, I like him. These this censorship hearing to 245 00:14:02,800 --> 00:14:07,720 Speaker 2: Nazi book burnings. Wow, people don't remember. They know John 246 00:14:07,880 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 2: was there, but he hid the power of his words. 247 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:14,360 Speaker 2: What a much greater effect on those senators because they 248 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:17,200 Speaker 2: liked him and they thought he would be on their side, 249 00:14:17,360 --> 00:14:17,960 Speaker 2: which he was not. 250 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:22,120 Speaker 3: Isn't it sort of chilling thinking about the world we 251 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:26,760 Speaker 3: live in today and certainly how books and stuff are 252 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 3: being banned, and about the fight that you know that 253 00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:31,560 Speaker 3: you led. 254 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:37,280 Speaker 2: It is and the you know, look, censorship has been 255 00:14:37,320 --> 00:14:39,600 Speaker 2: a thing since the beginning of time. If it really 256 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:42,760 Speaker 2: stepped back from it, and if I really step back, 257 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:47,960 Speaker 2: I almost feel sorry for Puritan people. Puritan's a general 258 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:53,080 Speaker 2: word meaning people have very conservative belief system because they 259 00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 2: keep trying to stop the treep, trying to draw a 260 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:59,600 Speaker 2: line is to stop you know, like things like and 261 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:02,520 Speaker 2: and and every time they give an inch, the people 262 00:15:02,600 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 2: on the other side keep stepping over the line and 263 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:07,000 Speaker 2: try to push it further. If we go to television 264 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:09,000 Speaker 2: at a time when a husband and wife couldn't be 265 00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:13,960 Speaker 2: in the same bed together on TV, eventually you have 266 00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:18,200 Speaker 2: shows like Friends on primetime TV, where everybody's sleeping around 267 00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:21,640 Speaker 2: and the whole thing's about you know, sexual inter relationships. 268 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:24,320 Speaker 2: Not everything's about it, but it was open like that 269 00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:28,240 Speaker 2: was just acceptable thing. That's a far cry from, you know, 270 00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 2: from from where things started on TV, and and it's 271 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:35,040 Speaker 2: always been like that. They've always tried to the conservative 272 00:15:35,040 --> 00:15:39,960 Speaker 2: people try to control expression, beating expression, and every time 273 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 2: they give a little bit, we keep pushing more and 274 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 2: more and more. The odd thing about the pendulum is 275 00:15:47,120 --> 00:15:51,520 Speaker 2: that now we're seeing the censorship coming more from the 276 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 2: left than the right, even though they're getting back to it. 277 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 2: The right is getting back to it with their you know, 278 00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:00,000 Speaker 2: was there certain things that they're doing. Won't get into that, 279 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:06,480 Speaker 2: but the PC cancel cancel culture. That is censorship. We 280 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:08,880 Speaker 2: were talking the other day and Buzz you. You know, 281 00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:12,200 Speaker 2: there's a movie, one of the legendary comedy movies of 282 00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:17,960 Speaker 2: all time by mel Brooks Blazing Saddles in the seventies. 283 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:22,800 Speaker 2: This thing, man, it pushed everybodon offended everybody, and it 284 00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:26,480 Speaker 2: was a hit, and it was hysterical. And you could 285 00:16:26,600 --> 00:16:29,120 Speaker 2: make that movie. Today you could not make a movie 286 00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:32,080 Speaker 2: openly using the N word, and and and was and 287 00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 2: everybody and talking about rape and as a joke and 288 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:38,840 Speaker 2: talking about you know, all groups, all religious groups, all. 289 00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:42,560 Speaker 2: It's just nobody was safe in Blazing Saddles. But but 290 00:16:42,680 --> 00:16:44,920 Speaker 2: now you can't make a movie like that because it 291 00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 2: offends people. You don't want to offend people, you know. 292 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:53,840 Speaker 2: And that's that is that's another extreme of censorship. You know, 293 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:58,200 Speaker 2: that's extreme of censorship. Wanting to ban records and blot 294 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:01,680 Speaker 2: and label records. That was one side of censorship. Another 295 00:17:01,920 --> 00:17:04,719 Speaker 2: is saying, well, you can't say those things because they 296 00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:08,840 Speaker 2: hurt people's feelings. These are offensive. You know. I was 297 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:12,359 Speaker 2: writing a song on my last album, Uh Leave a Scar, 298 00:17:12,760 --> 00:17:15,320 Speaker 2: called into the Kill and at some point, and it 299 00:17:15,359 --> 00:17:18,199 Speaker 2: was metaphorical, it was about going for it. You know 300 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:21,560 Speaker 2: that that that moment I'm into the kill, fire fire 301 00:17:21,600 --> 00:17:23,920 Speaker 2: at will. You know, I've been waiting my whole life 302 00:17:23,920 --> 00:17:27,320 Speaker 2: for this moment. I'm not gonna my time is now 303 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:29,760 Speaker 2: and I and I found myself going, oh wait a 304 00:17:29,800 --> 00:17:32,520 Speaker 2: second in for the kill fire at will Let's I 305 00:17:32,560 --> 00:17:34,840 Speaker 2: don't know, are they gonna can I say that? And 306 00:17:34,880 --> 00:17:39,480 Speaker 2: I was like, holy crap, I'm the Snyder. I fought 307 00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:45,199 Speaker 2: censorship and I'm sitting here censoring myself from saying words 308 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:49,840 Speaker 2: because I might offend somebody with a metaphor. Needless to say, 309 00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:52,720 Speaker 2: the songs on the record leave a scar. 310 00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:59,320 Speaker 3: I admire your tenacity, your resilience, your creativity. The book, 311 00:17:59,680 --> 00:18:05,200 Speaker 3: congratulations on it, and the future film, congratulations on it. 312 00:18:05,720 --> 00:18:08,439 Speaker 3: Thank you, and it's so great to reconnect with you. 313 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 3: D Sneyder on Taking a Walk. 314 00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:12,960 Speaker 2: Buzz a pleasure as always, look forward to talking to 315 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:15,320 Speaker 2: you again. We ain't finished, brother, we got a lot 316 00:18:15,359 --> 00:18:15,880 Speaker 2: more to say. 317 00:18:17,119 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to this episode of the Taking a 318 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:23,520 Speaker 1: Walk podcast. Share this and other episodes with your friends 319 00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:27,080 Speaker 1: and follow us so you never miss an episode. Taking 320 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:31,040 Speaker 1: a Walk is available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 321 00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:33,520 Speaker 1: and wherever you get your podcasts.