1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:02,000 Speaker 1: The volume. 2 00:00:15,520 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 2: All right, well, good hoops tonight here at the volume 3 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 2: heavy Friday. Everybody, oh ball, if you guys are having 4 00:00:19,360 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 2: a great end to your week. It's our first mail 5 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 2: bag that will be debating our player rankings. Lots of 6 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 2: similar complaints down the list. Obviously, as you guys know, 7 00:00:29,040 --> 00:00:31,720 Speaker 2: I'm leaving, I'm leaving effect that I'm recording this on Tuesday, 8 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:33,479 Speaker 2: the twenty ninth. I'm leaving on the thirtieth to go 9 00:00:33,479 --> 00:00:35,839 Speaker 2: to Alaska. So our first mail bag is going to 10 00:00:35,880 --> 00:00:39,040 Speaker 2: be primarily focused on that first video. So like final cuts, 11 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:43,959 Speaker 2: questions about Kat and James Harden, complaints about Jamal Murray, 12 00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:47,000 Speaker 2: some talks along those lines, and then a lot of 13 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:49,680 Speaker 2: people are wondering where the injured guys would have ranked, 14 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:52,880 Speaker 2: guys like Tyrese Haliburt and Jason Tatum and Damian Lillard. 15 00:00:52,880 --> 00:00:54,959 Speaker 2: So we'll talk a little bit about that. For our 16 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 2: mail bags that are going to cover the rest of 17 00:00:56,920 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 2: our player rankings list. It won't be until two fridays 18 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:02,960 Speaker 2: from now because obviously I'll still be in Alaska, but 19 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:05,480 Speaker 2: job plenty of time to if you guys disagree with 20 00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:08,000 Speaker 2: any of our player rankings at all, drop him in 21 00:01:08,120 --> 00:01:11,319 Speaker 2: the mail bag questions, and we'll get to them in 22 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:14,840 Speaker 2: our Friday Debate mail bags over the course of the 23 00:01:14,880 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 2: rest of the summer. You guys have the Joe before 24 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:18,080 Speaker 2: we get started. Subscribe to Hoops and O my YouTube channels. 25 00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:19,400 Speaker 2: You don't miss any more of our videos. Follow me 26 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:22,360 Speaker 2: on Twitter, Underscore, json LTC. You guys don't miss show announcements. 27 00:01:22,440 --> 00:01:24,039 Speaker 2: Don't forget about a podcast feed where we get your 28 00:01:24,040 --> 00:01:26,120 Speaker 2: podcast uner Hoops Tonight. It's also super helpful if you 29 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:29,240 Speaker 2: leave a rating and a review on that front. Jackson's 30 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:31,760 Speaker 2: doing great work on our social media feeds Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, 31 00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:33,440 Speaker 2: and TikTok. Make sure you guys follow us there. In 32 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 2: last but not least, keep dropping those mail bag questions 33 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:37,280 Speaker 2: like we saw, like we talked about earlier in the 34 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:40,800 Speaker 2: YouTube comments, so we can get to them in our 35 00:01:40,840 --> 00:01:44,119 Speaker 2: Friday mail bags over the course of the rest of 36 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:46,000 Speaker 2: the summer. All right, let's talk some basketball. So a 37 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 2: couple of similar questions like this, here's one. I totally 38 00:01:48,680 --> 00:01:51,040 Speaker 2: understand why you would leave someone like Tyre's Halliburton off 39 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 2: this list, but I also have to say I'm a 40 00:01:52,560 --> 00:01:54,200 Speaker 2: little bit frustrated with it because I think he made 41 00:01:54,200 --> 00:01:56,880 Speaker 2: some real strides this season, particularly in the playoffs. Could 42 00:01:56,880 --> 00:01:58,640 Speaker 2: we just get a general sense of where he would 43 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:00,840 Speaker 2: rank if he went into the season hell, because I'm 44 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:03,120 Speaker 2: really curious if you would rank him top fifteen or 45 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:06,400 Speaker 2: top ten. Similarly, had someone ask about Tatum and Damian 46 00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 2: Lillard as well. So obviously I'm not gonna reveal the 47 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 2: top part of my list and talk about like where 48 00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:16,120 Speaker 2: they rank in respect to other players, because that would 49 00:02:16,200 --> 00:02:18,640 Speaker 2: kind of spoil the whole version, the whole reason why 50 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:20,360 Speaker 2: we're doing this list. But what I will do is 51 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:22,880 Speaker 2: I will tell you, guys where I would place all 52 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 2: of these three guys strictly by number going into next 53 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:28,840 Speaker 2: season if there was no Achilles tear and they were 54 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:30,480 Speaker 2: going into next season at one hundred percent. 55 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 1: Jason Tatum, to me, would be the easiest one. I 56 00:02:33,880 --> 00:02:36,320 Speaker 1: had a really hard time with the number five spot. 57 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:39,040 Speaker 2: I viewed there to be four players that are the 58 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:41,519 Speaker 2: clear top tier guys in the league. You can all 59 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:43,359 Speaker 2: probably guess who those guys are. We'll get to the 60 00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:45,400 Speaker 2: order when we get there, and then after that you 61 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 2: fall into that second tier superstars, and kind of what 62 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:50,680 Speaker 2: I've viewed as the differentiator is like the top tier 63 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 2: guys are just like consistently night tonight at that top 64 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:56,639 Speaker 2: tier level, whereas the next tier for whether whatever reason, 65 00:02:56,680 --> 00:02:59,119 Speaker 2: if it's because they're just old, or they've had really 66 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 2: bad injury luck over the years, or maybe they're too young, 67 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:05,120 Speaker 2: and so they're kind of sporadic in their quality of 68 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:08,680 Speaker 2: play just simply because they're inconsistent young basketball players. All 69 00:03:08,760 --> 00:03:12,919 Speaker 2: those players can reach the top tier of Superstar play, 70 00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 2: but they're inconsistent in one reason or another. And I think, Tyree, 71 00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 2: I think Jason Tatum very clearly to me, is in 72 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:24,800 Speaker 2: between those two groups. He still has these frustrating moments 73 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 2: like he fell apart in the playoffs, in fell apart 74 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:29,920 Speaker 2: as a jump shooter in the playoffs, in the title 75 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 2: run or last year, he was like so good, and 76 00:03:32,880 --> 00:03:35,080 Speaker 2: then in the first couple games of the Knick series 77 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 2: he's like abysmally bad. He's just not quite as consistent 78 00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:42,560 Speaker 2: as the four guys above him. But there's also no 79 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 2: way you can argue any of the guys below him 80 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:48,200 Speaker 2: ahead of him anywhere at this point. So like Jason 81 00:03:48,200 --> 00:03:50,800 Speaker 2: Tatum to me is like the most obvious guy on 82 00:03:50,840 --> 00:03:53,560 Speaker 2: the entire list, aside from the number one spot. It's 83 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:57,440 Speaker 2: like you cannot argue anybody below him above him, and 84 00:03:57,480 --> 00:04:00,040 Speaker 2: you can't argue anybody above him below him. He's like 85 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:04,360 Speaker 2: the most clear cut obvious number five on this list. 86 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:06,320 Speaker 2: If he's healthy, you guys will find out who I 87 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 2: have at number five when we get there. Tyre's Aliburton 88 00:04:10,040 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 2: would come in at number nine for me. Now again, 89 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:14,760 Speaker 2: this is firmly on that next tier. These are all 90 00:04:14,800 --> 00:04:17,160 Speaker 2: guys that you could argue him as high as number five, 91 00:04:17,279 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 2: or you could argue him as low as number fourteen. 92 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:23,920 Speaker 2: In my opinion, I'm extremely high on these like advantage 93 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 2: creator offensive engine types like Tyrese Haliburton, Like it's hard 94 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 2: to explain, but above and beyond anything that would show 95 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:34,680 Speaker 2: up in Tyreese Haliburton's box scores, he is the engine 96 00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 2: that drives the Indiana Pacers. They play the way they 97 00:04:37,680 --> 00:04:41,000 Speaker 2: play because of him. And so even though his scoring 98 00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:44,320 Speaker 2: volume isn't anything exceptional, and obviously he puts up big 99 00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:47,039 Speaker 2: assist totals, but the box score doesn't look like a 100 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:49,680 Speaker 2: guy who's like driving a ton of offense. But he 101 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:52,840 Speaker 2: is flat out obviously driving a ton of offense for 102 00:04:52,880 --> 00:04:54,280 Speaker 2: the Pacers, And I thought it was evident by the 103 00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:56,400 Speaker 2: fact that they just really struggled to score when he 104 00:04:56,440 --> 00:04:59,000 Speaker 2: was off the floor last year in the postseason. I 105 00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:01,280 Speaker 2: just view him as one of the top tier offensive 106 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:05,440 Speaker 2: engines in the NBA. Even though the scoring volume isn't 107 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:08,640 Speaker 2: anything like exceptional. He somehow just finds a way to 108 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:11,800 Speaker 2: score enough to give his team what they need, including 109 00:05:11,839 --> 00:05:14,840 Speaker 2: the craziest stretch of clutch shooting I've ever seen in 110 00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 2: my life, hitting game winners in every single round of 111 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:20,600 Speaker 2: the playoffs. He's he hit the first NBA Finals game 112 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:23,960 Speaker 2: winners since Michael Jordan did almost thirty years ago. So 113 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:27,880 Speaker 2: it's a total package of offense that is more than 114 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:30,160 Speaker 2: enough to be one of the great offensive engines in 115 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:31,680 Speaker 2: the league, which is going to put you very high 116 00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:34,080 Speaker 2: on my list no matter what. I also think he's 117 00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:37,839 Speaker 2: an underrated defender. He's fast, he does his job within 118 00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:40,720 Speaker 2: the defensive scheme. He's got good length and active hands, 119 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 2: so he gets lots of deflections and lots of steals. 120 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:45,800 Speaker 2: So if you give me like a bona fide top 121 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:50,479 Speaker 2: tier offensive engine with decent scoring chops and you can 122 00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 2: realistically build a good playoff defense around him, that's a 123 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:56,560 Speaker 2: top ten player in the modern NBA. So I had 124 00:05:56,960 --> 00:06:00,240 Speaker 2: Tyrese Halliburton at number nine Dame For me, this a 125 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:03,760 Speaker 2: little tougher. I I think I'd put him right around 126 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:07,719 Speaker 2: number twenty. He scored thirty points in just one of 127 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:11,240 Speaker 2: his last seventeen games last season, including the playoffs. He 128 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:14,360 Speaker 2: was clearly losing some of that juice before the injury. 129 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:17,240 Speaker 2: He was already a bad defender, but he became a 130 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 2: truly awful defender when he was in Milwaukee. I was 131 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 2: just much lower on him than most people before the injury, 132 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:25,240 Speaker 2: and I loved him. I'm a big believer in what 133 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:26,680 Speaker 2: he was when he was at his peak, but he 134 00:06:26,760 --> 00:06:28,120 Speaker 2: just clearly is on the other side of the hill 135 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:30,800 Speaker 2: at this point. I would have had him down at 136 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:35,640 Speaker 2: number twenty. A couple of questions along these lines, Like Kat, 137 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:37,600 Speaker 2: it was all NBA, So how did he not make 138 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 2: your top twenty five based on him making an Eastern 139 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:41,280 Speaker 2: Conference Finals run. 140 00:06:41,440 --> 00:06:42,440 Speaker 1: Here's another one. 141 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 2: I got Cat not making the list as wild To me, 142 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:47,080 Speaker 2: there's no big in the East better than Kat, especially 143 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:49,400 Speaker 2: when you add the durability factor. Unless you just have 144 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:51,360 Speaker 2: Jokic as the only big in the top twenty five. 145 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:53,040 Speaker 2: You talk about not being able to scale up with 146 00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:55,480 Speaker 2: him defensively in the playoffs. But Kat has been a 147 00:06:55,520 --> 00:06:58,360 Speaker 2: major contributor in the best defense in the NBA and 148 00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:00,240 Speaker 2: locked up the MVP in a game set. And you 149 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:03,039 Speaker 2: also talk about his Game six in Indiana, But before 150 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 2: Game six, there was a Game three the Knicks were 151 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 2: on the brink of going down three to zero and 152 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:09,720 Speaker 2: Kat carried all by himself. That isn't scaling up in 153 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 2: the biggest moment. I don't know what is Murray ahead 154 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:16,080 Speaker 2: of Kat is ridiculous. So I want to get I 155 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:18,080 Speaker 2: want to start with I have a lot of people 156 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 2: complaining about Jamal Murray and including Nuggets fans, which is 157 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:24,720 Speaker 2: the funny part. I think some of that stems from 158 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 2: there is a good amount of just like natural frustration 159 00:07:27,920 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 2: with Jamal for not reaching his individual ceiling as a 160 00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 2: player the way that he should have. But I think 161 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:36,800 Speaker 2: it extends beyond to like, I think there's a lot 162 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:39,440 Speaker 2: of like Jokic Stan behavior. And I've seen this with 163 00:07:39,520 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 2: Lebron fans over the years. I've seen this with Steph 164 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:45,160 Speaker 2: fans over the years. They always like get super hyper 165 00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:49,520 Speaker 2: critical of teammates and then never criticize their guy. That's 166 00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 2: the thing like, and that's that's the thing that gets 167 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:53,480 Speaker 2: kind of frustrating. You guys know, I'm a big Lebron fan. 168 00:07:53,960 --> 00:07:57,440 Speaker 2: I have ripped him many new ones on this show before. Right, Like, 169 00:07:57,880 --> 00:08:00,360 Speaker 2: there's a certain amount of like stand behavior where it's 170 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:03,160 Speaker 2: like we're going to elevate our star by like being 171 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:05,560 Speaker 2: hyper critical of the other guy. And that's not to 172 00:08:05,600 --> 00:08:08,200 Speaker 2: say that Jamal has some sort of you know, perfect 173 00:08:08,560 --> 00:08:11,200 Speaker 2: criticism proof resume. Of course he doesn't. He deserves some 174 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 2: of the criticism that he gets. But I think that's 175 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:16,440 Speaker 2: why we see so much negativity from Nuggets fans regarding 176 00:08:16,480 --> 00:08:20,360 Speaker 2: Jamal Murray. For me, like I would start with like 177 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:23,240 Speaker 2: Murray and Kat, and then I'll talk a little bit 178 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 2: about Kat individually. So putting Jamal Murray over Kat was 179 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:32,360 Speaker 2: a relatively easy decision for me. I think he's I 180 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:35,679 Speaker 2: think he's a better playoff score. I just think he is. 181 00:08:36,200 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 2: Even just last year, Jamal Murray had a higher point 182 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:42,280 Speaker 2: per game average and was roughly in the same neighborhood 183 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:45,760 Speaker 2: of efficiency in the high fifties. I think over the years, 184 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:48,120 Speaker 2: from playoff run to playoff run, he's been a more 185 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 2: dependable playoff score. He's been like, arguably the best clutch 186 00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:55,680 Speaker 2: shot maker in the NBA over the last three playoff runs. Like, 187 00:08:56,240 --> 00:08:58,760 Speaker 2: I think he's a better passer. I literally just think 188 00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:01,920 Speaker 2: Jamal Murray's a better place player than Karl Anthony Town's 189 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:04,240 Speaker 2: on offense and on defense. I don't think Jamal Murray 190 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:06,559 Speaker 2: is a good defender by any stretch of the imagination, 191 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:10,120 Speaker 2: but you can build a defensive scheme around Jamal. He's 192 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:14,480 Speaker 2: going to do his job. He's not a downright damaging defender. 193 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 2: So like, honestly, putting Jamal Murray ahead of Karl Anthony 194 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 2: Towns was kind of an easy decision for me. The 195 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:24,280 Speaker 2: discussion between him and James Harden gets a little bit 196 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 2: more complicated, which we'll get to in a later question. 197 00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:28,920 Speaker 2: But as I zum it on Kat before we move 198 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:32,439 Speaker 2: on again, like when you look at the Knicks and 199 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:34,480 Speaker 2: the big picture, there were some big moments, right, Like 200 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:38,040 Speaker 2: you're right, Kat had a massive comeback at the tail 201 00:09:38,160 --> 00:09:41,600 Speaker 2: end of Game three, Right, that was an amazing performance 202 00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:45,240 Speaker 2: from him beating the Celtics. That was a big moment 203 00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 2: for the Knicks in this postseason run. You know, obviously 204 00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:50,959 Speaker 2: upsetting the team that I picked to win the title 205 00:09:51,040 --> 00:09:54,760 Speaker 2: last year. But if you zoom out from that. It 206 00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 2: has been an incredibly disappointing season for the Knicks. They 207 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:01,080 Speaker 2: made all those moves and they wanted to be like 208 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 2: one of the bona fide top tier contenders in the league, 209 00:10:03,400 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 2: and they came right out the gates and got the 210 00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:07,960 Speaker 2: living shit kicked out of them by Boston. All season long, 211 00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 2: they underachieved on defense and pretty consistently were farther below 212 00:10:12,920 --> 00:10:14,920 Speaker 2: in the standings than where they should have been for 213 00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:17,520 Speaker 2: a team as talented as they were. They were downright 214 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:19,840 Speaker 2: abysmal every single time they played one of the top 215 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:21,160 Speaker 2: teams in the league. What did they go like h 216 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 2: to eight or something like that against the top three 217 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:27,040 Speaker 2: records in the NBA, Like, they just got their butts 218 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:29,560 Speaker 2: kicked every time they played the good teams. I thought 219 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 2: they were disappointing against Detroit, that's a team they should 220 00:10:32,040 --> 00:10:34,199 Speaker 2: have disposed of in four or five games. They got 221 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 2: dragged to six and every game was close. And go 222 00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:39,520 Speaker 2: to the Pacers series, Yeah, sure you won Game five, 223 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:43,000 Speaker 2: but you got ran out of the building basically the 224 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 2: rest of the series, in large part because Karl Anthony 225 00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:50,560 Speaker 2: Towns was downright damaging to your defensive scheme. That was 226 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:53,400 Speaker 2: not just a playoff series problem. That was not just 227 00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 2: an Indiana Pacers problem. That was not just a Detroit 228 00:10:56,800 --> 00:11:00,360 Speaker 2: Pistons problem. That was an entire season from October all 229 00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 2: the way to late May when you got eliminated. Karl 230 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:06,120 Speaker 2: Anthony Towns was a problem for your ability to run 231 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:09,280 Speaker 2: that like coherent defensive scheme. There are certain things that 232 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:12,760 Speaker 2: are like out of your control, right Like Jamal Murray's 233 00:11:12,760 --> 00:11:15,679 Speaker 2: had some rough shooting performances over the years in the playoffs. 234 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 2: There's a certain amount of that that is just basketball. 235 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:21,760 Speaker 2: Like guys like Carl Anthony Towns. You remember last year 236 00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:24,360 Speaker 2: two years ago in the Dallas Maverick Series and the 237 00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:26,560 Speaker 2: conference finals where he just couldn't make a three point 238 00:11:26,640 --> 00:11:31,080 Speaker 2: shot to save his life. That's just basketball, brother, that's basketball. 239 00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 2: Sometimes the jump shots don't go in. Sometimes they don't 240 00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:37,400 Speaker 2: go in for Cat, sometimes they don't go in for Jamal. 241 00:11:37,760 --> 00:11:42,000 Speaker 2: That is literally just basketball. The floor, the basement of 242 00:11:42,040 --> 00:11:44,640 Speaker 2: who you are as a basketball player is what happens 243 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 2: when those shots aren't going in. And I can trust Jamal, 244 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 2: let's just say take a replacement level player. So if 245 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:54,960 Speaker 2: you could take Jamal in a replacement level center or 246 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 2: Karl Anthony Towns in a replacement level guard which player 247 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 2: which combination there do you have a better chance to 248 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 2: build a functional playoff defense, a functional playoff like foundation floor. 249 00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:13,959 Speaker 2: I like my chances with Jamal. Karl Anthony Towns is 250 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:18,360 Speaker 2: the type of player that kind of prevents you from 251 00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:22,160 Speaker 2: ever winning the championship. If he is your foundational center, 252 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:24,480 Speaker 2: you have to surround him with such an insane amount 253 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:27,440 Speaker 2: of talent to cover for his weaknesses on the back 254 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:31,400 Speaker 2: line defensively, the reckless hedges, the bad floor balance, the 255 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:33,959 Speaker 2: bad transition defense, getting just out run up and down 256 00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:36,920 Speaker 2: the floor by opposing bigs. Every single time I was 257 00:12:36,960 --> 00:12:39,640 Speaker 2: watching the Knicks tape last year, Karl Anthony Towns was 258 00:12:39,679 --> 00:12:43,000 Speaker 2: front and center on their defensive issues. Even Jalen Brunson, 259 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:45,679 Speaker 2: for the issues that he had, I never felt like 260 00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:50,000 Speaker 2: Brunson was the breaking point of their defense the way 261 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:54,080 Speaker 2: that Karl Anthony Towns was. It's just too low a floor. 262 00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:55,800 Speaker 2: And again, I want to be clear about where we 263 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:58,520 Speaker 2: were arguing here. I had had at twenty seven, so 264 00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:02,440 Speaker 2: it's not like I had him demonstrably lower than where 265 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:05,480 Speaker 2: you guys are arguing for him to be. I just 266 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:08,360 Speaker 2: think a guy like Jamal is a better basketball player 267 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:11,360 Speaker 2: for me to build around and to thrive in the 268 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:13,960 Speaker 2: like in that like, they're both players that we're going 269 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:16,040 Speaker 2: to consider to be number twos, right, Like, no one's 270 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 2: winning a championship of Cats your best player. No one's 271 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:20,600 Speaker 2: winning a championship with Jamal Murray as your best player. 272 00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:24,760 Speaker 2: But in that secondary supporting star role. I like my 273 00:13:24,880 --> 00:13:26,920 Speaker 2: chances with Jamal Murray more than I like him with Cat. 274 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:28,600 Speaker 2: It was pretty It was actually kind of an easy 275 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:31,959 Speaker 2: decision for me. Okay, I'm gonna give you, guys one 276 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:36,200 Speaker 2: of the James Harden comments, and I have like literally 277 00:13:36,280 --> 00:13:38,800 Speaker 2: like six that I mark down here, various people just 278 00:13:38,840 --> 00:13:41,160 Speaker 2: saying that they viewed James Harden as a as a 279 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:45,880 Speaker 2: better player than Jamal Murray. Nothing says summer like long days, 280 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:48,920 Speaker 2: clutch plays and firing off a few bets on the game, 281 00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:51,640 Speaker 2: ah with DraftKings Sportsbook. As the season heats up, so 282 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:54,200 Speaker 2: do the bats. 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Jamal has such 311 00:15:23,360 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 2: an advantage playing with Jokic that other guards don't. I 312 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:27,560 Speaker 2: don't think it's fair to bring up his points per 313 00:15:27,560 --> 00:15:30,080 Speaker 2: possession in pick and roll when comparing him to other guards. 314 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:32,440 Speaker 2: As for the playoffs, like you said, Jamal himself has 315 00:15:32,480 --> 00:15:34,960 Speaker 2: a lot of lows. I think if Harden had Jokic 316 00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 2: taking up the defensive attention and pick and roll, he 317 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 2: would do much better than Murray and his playoff lows 318 00:15:39,160 --> 00:15:41,960 Speaker 2: wouldn't be as frequent or bad. He doesn't have the 319 00:15:41,960 --> 00:15:43,680 Speaker 2: same mid range that Jamal has coming off of a 320 00:15:43,760 --> 00:15:46,080 Speaker 2: Jokic screen, but in these recent years, Harden has been 321 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:48,640 Speaker 2: more willing to take middies. Plus Harden's floaters in a 322 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:50,920 Speaker 2: different tier than Jamal's, not to mention, He'll also do 323 00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:52,800 Speaker 2: a better job of running the offense in the non 324 00:15:52,880 --> 00:15:55,560 Speaker 2: Yokich minutes. And even if Jamal does fit better than 325 00:15:55,640 --> 00:15:58,400 Speaker 2: Joki with Jokic than Harden does. What about every other 326 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:01,160 Speaker 2: team given the criteria is about their current team. If 327 00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:03,320 Speaker 2: Jamal Murray had to play in a physical playoff series 328 00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:06,240 Speaker 2: with Jokic, I think his production would pale in comparison 329 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:11,000 Speaker 2: to Harden's. Jamal's struggles getting past good defenders, struggles generating 330 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:14,200 Speaker 2: advantages for his teammates, and isn't in the same tier 331 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 2: as a passer as Harden. He also isn't as good 332 00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 2: at beating bigs in switches. Plus, Harden is the more 333 00:16:19,640 --> 00:16:22,120 Speaker 2: valuable regular season player. Okay, So when we're talking about 334 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:24,160 Speaker 2: this ranking, and so let's kind of zoom out a 335 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:27,240 Speaker 2: little bit. Remember I'm having kat at twenty seven and 336 00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:30,880 Speaker 2: Harden at twenty six and Murray at twenty five. So 337 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:33,160 Speaker 2: if I have Murray and Harden at twenty six and 338 00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:34,840 Speaker 2: twenty five, I have them very close. 339 00:16:35,040 --> 00:16:35,400 Speaker 1: Okay. 340 00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:39,320 Speaker 2: What that means is I leaned very slightly towards Jamal 341 00:16:40,440 --> 00:16:43,920 Speaker 2: over James Harden. So obviously James Harden has some advantages. 342 00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 2: I agree. I think James Harden is the better regular 343 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:51,360 Speaker 2: season player because he is the better offensive engine. I 344 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:53,880 Speaker 2: agree too that if we plucked James Harden and just 345 00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:57,280 Speaker 2: put him on his own team where the only goal 346 00:16:57,880 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 2: is to just get through the regular season and get 347 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 2: beat in the first round, which is exactly what would 348 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:04,120 Speaker 2: happen if Jamal was the best player on a team, 349 00:17:04,280 --> 00:17:06,159 Speaker 2: and exactly what would happen if James Harden is on 350 00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 2: the best team. Yeah, James Harden's probably gonna give you 351 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:11,359 Speaker 2: a little bit better regular season offense, but when you 352 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:14,040 Speaker 2: get into the postseason, you consistently run into the same 353 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:17,280 Speaker 2: issue with Jamal or with James Harden, which is, Jamal's 354 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:21,439 Speaker 2: gonna shoot, Jamal is gonna be mentally engaged. Jamal is 355 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:25,200 Speaker 2: a less damaging defender than James Harden. Jamal is going 356 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:29,359 Speaker 2: to bring me a certain a certain floor as a 357 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:33,639 Speaker 2: basketball player. Once we get into those high intensity playoff environments, 358 00:17:33,960 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 2: James Harden time and time and time and time and 359 00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 2: time again, literally loses what makes him James Harden, like 360 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:43,960 Speaker 2: he won't even look at the basket anymore. And you know, 361 00:17:44,080 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 2: I kind of push back on this idea that, oh, well, 362 00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:49,720 Speaker 2: Jamal has an advantage playing with Jokic. I literally watched 363 00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:54,159 Speaker 2: James Harden play with Joel Embiid, Joel Empiiede at the 364 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:57,600 Speaker 2: peak of his powers with a very similar level of 365 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:00,119 Speaker 2: role gravity when he would work his way in to 366 00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:02,359 Speaker 2: the mid range of the floor. What happened when they 367 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:05,600 Speaker 2: got to the postseason. Outside of two games where James 368 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:07,719 Speaker 2: Harden was great and hit a couple of game winners, 369 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:12,840 Speaker 2: he was fucking terrible. He was fucking terrible again alongside 370 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:15,880 Speaker 2: Joel Embiid. So like for all of the talk about like, well, 371 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:19,280 Speaker 2: what if you gave Jamal you know, a different roster 372 00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:23,720 Speaker 2: and you gave James Harden some Apex superstar to play with, 373 00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:26,879 Speaker 2: We've literally seen that. We've literally seen it, and it 374 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:29,960 Speaker 2: was the same. There are so many examples of James 375 00:18:30,000 --> 00:18:32,840 Speaker 2: Harden running into that exact same issue when they get 376 00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:36,120 Speaker 2: to the postseason that it similar to kat it almost 377 00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:40,360 Speaker 2: like disqualifies you from competing for a championship. The amount 378 00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:42,639 Speaker 2: of support you would have to have for James Harden, 379 00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:45,440 Speaker 2: Like you'd have to have so much support around James 380 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:47,960 Speaker 2: Harden that you could weather him having a single digit 381 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:51,040 Speaker 2: scoring game in a must win playoff game, Like not 382 00:18:51,080 --> 00:18:53,800 Speaker 2: just single digits, but single digit shot attempts, Like you 383 00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:55,760 Speaker 2: have to have so much support that you can bank, 384 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:59,960 Speaker 2: like literally bank on James Harden completely shitting the bed 385 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:02,160 Speaker 2: in a big moment and you still winning like that. 386 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:05,760 Speaker 2: That's a lot to overcome because it happens literally year 387 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:08,440 Speaker 2: after year after year after year after year after year 388 00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 2: after year. 389 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 1: It just is. It has happened too many times. 390 00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:13,680 Speaker 2: So if we're talking about the ultimate goal of this, 391 00:19:14,520 --> 00:19:17,080 Speaker 2: and again, I agree, James Harden has some specific things 392 00:19:17,080 --> 00:19:19,040 Speaker 2: he's better at, Like he's better at getting to the 393 00:19:19,080 --> 00:19:22,320 Speaker 2: foul line. He's better I haven't looked at the floater stats, 394 00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:23,919 Speaker 2: but I think you're probably right if I remember correctly, 395 00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:26,040 Speaker 2: I think Harden's a better floater shooter. I think Carden 396 00:19:26,119 --> 00:19:28,760 Speaker 2: generally is a better regular season offensive engine. But if 397 00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:31,359 Speaker 2: our goal is to get from the first day of 398 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:34,560 Speaker 2: the regular season to hoisting the trophy, I flat out 399 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,560 Speaker 2: think that I have a better chance with Jamal Murray 400 00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:40,080 Speaker 2: because when we get to the postseason, I can count 401 00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 2: on him to be roughly Jamal Murray at that point, 402 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:45,800 Speaker 2: and in that environment, I can then at least count 403 00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:48,280 Speaker 2: on And again, we're talking about them in secondary roles here, 404 00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:50,320 Speaker 2: because neither of them are winning a championship in a 405 00:19:50,680 --> 00:19:53,760 Speaker 2: starting role. I can count on him at least pulling 406 00:19:53,800 --> 00:19:57,720 Speaker 2: his weight as that secondary player alongside Nikola Jokic in 407 00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:00,000 Speaker 2: a way that I could never count on James Harden 408 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:02,240 Speaker 2: and doing that alongside Joe l Embiid, and that that 409 00:20:02,359 --> 00:20:06,480 Speaker 2: really is the uh is the separator. And like I've 410 00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:09,240 Speaker 2: had a lot of cause I had another question here 411 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:11,120 Speaker 2: talking about Jamal. I'll read this one for you guys. 412 00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:12,439 Speaker 2: You keep seeing you guys can kind of get a 413 00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:15,160 Speaker 2: feel for how Nuggets fans feel. Not really a debate, 414 00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:16,800 Speaker 2: but I thought i'd throw this out anyways. I'm a 415 00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:19,440 Speaker 2: Nuggets fan and I love Jamal and everything he's done 416 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:21,840 Speaker 2: for us, but he's a really he is really frustrating 417 00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:23,760 Speaker 2: as a fan because we've seen how highest ceiling can be, 418 00:20:23,800 --> 00:20:26,280 Speaker 2: and from the outside in looking in, it seems like 419 00:20:26,280 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 2: he's just satisfied with winning only one ring. He comes 420 00:20:29,000 --> 00:20:31,320 Speaker 2: into seasons out of shape, doesn't seem to take good 421 00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:33,840 Speaker 2: care of his body. He's flying the MMA fights, during 422 00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:36,200 Speaker 2: the playoffs or out of casinos. The narrative around Jamal 423 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:38,640 Speaker 2: before twenty twenty three was he was a gym rat 424 00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:40,879 Speaker 2: and he worked incredibly hard. There was that famous story 425 00:20:40,920 --> 00:20:43,480 Speaker 2: that got mentioned during the title run a million times 426 00:20:43,520 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 2: by the announcers where his dad had him doing push 427 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:49,080 Speaker 2: ups on ice and taught him to meditate for difficult moments. 428 00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:50,840 Speaker 2: Also almost as if he was training him to be 429 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:56,159 Speaker 2: a fucking samurai. Where's that Jamal Murray? Like, seriously, what 430 00:20:56,200 --> 00:20:58,280 Speaker 2: happened between twenty twenty three and now I want to know? 431 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 2: Is the coaching staff and Nuggets oranization just letting his 432 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:03,919 Speaker 2: lack of work ethics slide? Has nobody brought this up 433 00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:05,720 Speaker 2: to him? I don't know if the ACL tear in 434 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:08,040 Speaker 2: twenty twenty one affected him more than people know, but 435 00:21:08,119 --> 00:21:09,879 Speaker 2: even though he's been in his late twenties, it seems 436 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:11,359 Speaker 2: to he seems to have to wear and tear and 437 00:21:11,359 --> 00:21:14,080 Speaker 2: bodily breakdowns of a late thirty year old. Jason, do 438 00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:15,840 Speaker 2: you have any team insiders, I know you speak with 439 00:21:15,880 --> 00:21:18,760 Speaker 2: Adamars quite a bit that have given you any deeper 440 00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:21,200 Speaker 2: insight into the Jamal Murray situation. And now him and 441 00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:23,200 Speaker 2: the organization have handled his lack of conditioning. 442 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:24,160 Speaker 1: So that's a. 443 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 2: Really, really good comment that kind of gives you, guys, 444 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:29,639 Speaker 2: like an understanding of how Nuggets fans feel about it, 445 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:32,840 Speaker 2: and like, I want to be really clear about this. 446 00:21:33,240 --> 00:21:36,160 Speaker 2: In twenty twenty three, Jamal was in a different tier, 447 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:39,160 Speaker 2: like he was one of those guys that on any 448 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:42,639 Speaker 2: given night could rise to the level literally of the 449 00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,800 Speaker 2: top tier superstars. He average twenty six, six and seven 450 00:21:45,880 --> 00:21:48,200 Speaker 2: on sixty percent true shooting. He had like a ton 451 00:21:48,280 --> 00:21:53,119 Speaker 2: of like monster thirty thirty five point playoff games, tons 452 00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:57,880 Speaker 2: of huge shots, tough shots, and everyone's face. Like Jamal 453 00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:01,159 Speaker 2: was at a different level, is now a level below 454 00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:04,280 Speaker 2: that where in my opinion, he's worthy of the salary 455 00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:06,480 Speaker 2: that he's on, but you probably can't be the best 456 00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:08,439 Speaker 2: player on a championship team, and he clearly isn't in 457 00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:10,680 Speaker 2: that next tier the way that he was now. If 458 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:12,639 Speaker 2: he can get back to that tier, I mean, if 459 00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:14,159 Speaker 2: Jamal Murray can get back to what he was in 460 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:15,879 Speaker 2: twenty twenty three, you guys can just go ahead and 461 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:18,240 Speaker 2: cash the check that Denver's gonna win the title next year, 462 00:22:18,280 --> 00:22:21,320 Speaker 2: because that's just an insanely good team. If you have 463 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:24,639 Speaker 2: awesome Jamal Murray with Nikole Yoki's best player in the world, 464 00:22:24,680 --> 00:22:28,080 Speaker 2: with Aaron Gordon now able to shoot threes, with Cam 465 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:30,760 Speaker 2: Johnson as a legitimate upgrade over Michael Porter Junior, and 466 00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:33,840 Speaker 2: a depth of talent beyond that, if Jamal gets back 467 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:36,920 Speaker 2: to that level, cash the check. Denver's hoisting the trophy. 468 00:22:37,119 --> 00:22:39,520 Speaker 2: But as we look in that other tier, a couple 469 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 2: things I want to answer some of your specific questions. 470 00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:45,720 Speaker 2: When I've talked to Adam and other people around the Nuggets, 471 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:46,840 Speaker 2: it's pretty simple. 472 00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:49,080 Speaker 1: They are frustrated. They're frustrated, but. 473 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:51,160 Speaker 2: I think they all also are aware of the fact 474 00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 2: that they need Jamal, and that's really the key. I 475 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:57,080 Speaker 2: talked about this in my bit on Jamal Murray the 476 00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:03,919 Speaker 2: other day. But like, Jamal is a very rare combination 477 00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:07,600 Speaker 2: of like truly elite one on one scorer, but also 478 00:23:07,600 --> 00:23:09,800 Speaker 2: a high level pick and roll player. And like, yes, 479 00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,040 Speaker 2: I know that he plays alongside the best pick and 480 00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:14,640 Speaker 2: roll big in the league, And yes, that certainly makes 481 00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 2: things easier for him. I don't want to like discount 482 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:20,520 Speaker 2: that necessarily, But like he shoots over forty percent on 483 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:22,359 Speaker 2: pull up threes, you don't think he'd be able to 484 00:23:22,400 --> 00:23:25,480 Speaker 2: do that in ball screen somewhere else. Like he is 485 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:28,680 Speaker 2: a good floater shooter, He's an awesome mid range shot maker. 486 00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:31,879 Speaker 2: He is a legitimately great one on one player. Like 487 00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 2: those are all traits that do translate elsewhere now in 488 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:39,680 Speaker 2: his archetype as like a scoring guard, who's a mediocre playmaker. 489 00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:41,840 Speaker 2: He's a better playmaker than people think. He's over six 490 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 2: assists per games since his knee injury. But like as 491 00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:47,159 Speaker 2: a guy in that archetype, like he certainly if you 492 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:49,480 Speaker 2: ask him to be the offensive engine for a team, 493 00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:51,320 Speaker 2: he's not gonna go win you the title. But neither 494 00:23:51,359 --> 00:23:54,719 Speaker 2: is James Harden, like we talked about, Like his archetype 495 00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 2: is immensely valuable in the NBA and quite frankly indispensable 496 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:03,439 Speaker 2: to what the Denver Nuggets are trying to do. I like, 497 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:06,639 Speaker 2: if you swapped him, I mean, like literally, if you 498 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:09,359 Speaker 2: swapped him for any other guard in the league that 499 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:12,360 Speaker 2: is like in the similar kind of tiar or below him, 500 00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:16,359 Speaker 2: Like obviously Devin Booker would be awesome alongside Nikola Jokic, 501 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:19,600 Speaker 2: Guys like that, Donovan Mitchell. These are all guys that 502 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,720 Speaker 2: I have above Jamal Murray. But there's not a guard 503 00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:26,239 Speaker 2: like the guards that are below, like Jahn Morant's not 504 00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:30,080 Speaker 2: like a natural fit alongside Nikola Jokic. That's a weird, 505 00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:33,560 Speaker 2: clunky fit, you know, Like there's a read and react 506 00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:36,760 Speaker 2: element with Jamal Murray, with Nikola Jokic that is super important. 507 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:39,320 Speaker 2: As you go further back on the list, like, I 508 00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:42,120 Speaker 2: don't think James Harden would be an awesome fit alongside 509 00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:45,240 Speaker 2: Nikola Jokic. Like, first of all, Jamal is a really 510 00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:47,840 Speaker 2: high IQ defender that's generally in the right spots and 511 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:50,240 Speaker 2: does the right things in a big moment. James Harden 512 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:53,119 Speaker 2: is the opposite of that. There's a certain amount of uh, 513 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:55,600 Speaker 2: there's a certain amount of like straight up one on 514 00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:58,119 Speaker 2: one shot making from the mid range that Jamal has 515 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:00,960 Speaker 2: that James Harden does not have. That's an important piece 516 00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:05,040 Speaker 2: of what Denver does against switching defenses. Like, I just 517 00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:09,160 Speaker 2: think Jamal's generally underrated. And like again, Nuggets fans disagree 518 00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:10,920 Speaker 2: with me, guys, this is just how I feel about 519 00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:15,440 Speaker 2: him as a basketball player. Next question, Hi, Jason, great 520 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 2: work as always. I really respect your basketball mind. Your 521 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,040 Speaker 2: analysis consistently challenges me to think more deeply about the game. 522 00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:23,280 Speaker 2: You shift my perspective from just focusing on physical tools 523 00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:26,320 Speaker 2: and high end upside to considering a player's full impacting 524 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 2: growth that set. This might be one of those cases 525 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:30,679 Speaker 2: where I'm still drawn to the upside, especially when it 526 00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:33,560 Speaker 2: comes to John Rank, Karl Anthony Towns versus Trey Young, 527 00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:36,680 Speaker 2: and Jamal Murray, particularly Jamal. I'll focus on Jaw for 528 00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 2: this mailbag. While I agree with your point that he 529 00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 2: hasn't added much to his game recently and he's missed 530 00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:43,800 Speaker 2: significant time, I still find his high end value as 531 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 2: a number one option hard to ignore. Even without the 532 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 2: notable development lately, his passing, rim pressure, and ability to 533 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:53,480 Speaker 2: blow by defenders remain so freakishly etlite elite that I 534 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:56,280 Speaker 2: think they outpace what Tray and Jamal bring, especially considering 535 00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:58,600 Speaker 2: Jamal as a number two option. To me, Jos still 536 00:25:58,600 --> 00:25:59,840 Speaker 2: has the potential to be the best player on a 537 00:25:59,880 --> 00:26:02,480 Speaker 2: championship team, even if that possibility is fading with time. 538 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:04,720 Speaker 2: I don't feel the same way about Trey or Jamal. 539 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:07,040 Speaker 2: So while I understand why John might be left off 540 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:08,840 Speaker 2: a list like this, it's tough for me to give 541 00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:11,239 Speaker 2: Murray the nod over someone like Jaw who's already made 542 00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 2: an All NBA team and carried a franchise. Curious how 543 00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:15,600 Speaker 2: much weight do you put on a player's role when 544 00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:17,919 Speaker 2: making these kinds of comparisons. Where do you draw the 545 00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:20,760 Speaker 2: line when deciding to rank a high level secondary option 546 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 2: like Murray over a true number one like job. Thanks again, 547 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:25,320 Speaker 2: for all the great work looking forward to the next piece. 548 00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,400 Speaker 2: This is a great question, and I think there's two 549 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,280 Speaker 2: angles that I want to get into. First of all, 550 00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:34,040 Speaker 2: once again, John only played in fifty games last year. 551 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:36,760 Speaker 2: Once again John got hurt in the playoffs, couldn't finish 552 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:39,240 Speaker 2: the series. It's not even the first time that's happened. 553 00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:41,919 Speaker 2: He managed to play in sixty games just once in 554 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,399 Speaker 2: the last four years. So there's a theoretical element just 555 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:47,760 Speaker 2: with him being able to stay on the floor. Then 556 00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:50,639 Speaker 2: there's another theoretical element, which is, like, anybody who's listened 557 00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:52,000 Speaker 2: to the show over the course of the last year 558 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 2: has seen I've three or four different times come on 559 00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:57,160 Speaker 2: the show and been like, John Morant has the potential 560 00:26:57,200 --> 00:26:59,119 Speaker 2: to be the best player on a championship team. I 561 00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:02,560 Speaker 2: genuinely agree with you, but he's not there yet. In 562 00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:04,520 Speaker 2: order for him to get to that point, he needs 563 00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:07,000 Speaker 2: to turn He's a jaw like, we'll have these really 564 00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:09,560 Speaker 2: good defensive possessions. He needs to turn that into a 565 00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:12,800 Speaker 2: higher floor where he's more consistent possession to possession. Right 566 00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:16,080 Speaker 2: on offense, there's a jump shooting piece and a playmaking 567 00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:19,280 Speaker 2: piece that he needs to continue to refine over time, 568 00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:21,600 Speaker 2: there's a decision making at the rim piece that he 569 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:24,919 Speaker 2: has to refine over time. He has the potential to 570 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:27,720 Speaker 2: be the best player on a championship team, but right 571 00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:30,960 Speaker 2: now he is neither that nor available. So when I'm 572 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:34,920 Speaker 2: looking at this season, just this season, like if you're 573 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:36,919 Speaker 2: asking me who do I want for the next five years, 574 00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:41,199 Speaker 2: John Ray or Jamal Murray, different question, but specifically for 575 00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:43,960 Speaker 2: this list, when we're just talking about who's the best 576 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:46,560 Speaker 2: guy for me to have to lead this team this 577 00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:51,159 Speaker 2: coming year from October to June, I feel like I 578 00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:54,800 Speaker 2: can count on more from Jamal Murray than the super 579 00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:57,240 Speaker 2: wide range of outcomes from job. Now, for the record, 580 00:27:57,359 --> 00:28:00,199 Speaker 2: I know that there's a chance that Jaw happens to 581 00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:02,879 Speaker 2: come into camp in great shape and puts on a 582 00:28:02,920 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 2: little bit more muscle, takes really good care of his body, 583 00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:09,680 Speaker 2: plays seventy games, spends all summer in the gym working 584 00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:12,560 Speaker 2: on his three point shot, shoots thirty eight percent from 585 00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:17,040 Speaker 2: three finishes fourth and MVP voting. Memphis gets the five 586 00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:20,640 Speaker 2: or four seed, and he just looks fucking awesome. They 587 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:23,119 Speaker 2: win a couple playoff rounds, losing the conference finals. That 588 00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:27,199 Speaker 2: is an upside that Jaw has that. I know Jamal 589 00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:31,560 Speaker 2: is not going to do this year obviously, right, But 590 00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:34,320 Speaker 2: that's the high end of the potential John Morant outcomes. 591 00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:38,280 Speaker 2: There's a very wide range of outcomes, and there's one 592 00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:42,520 Speaker 2: over here where they miss the playoffs. He plays in 593 00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:47,160 Speaker 2: forty three games and they and he shoots twenty eight 594 00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:50,120 Speaker 2: percent from three. That's still a potential outcome for John 595 00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 2: Ran And I'd argue that's every bit as likely, if 596 00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:55,960 Speaker 2: not more likely, than the top end of that spectrum. 597 00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:58,360 Speaker 2: And so I'm a believer in Josh talent. We've talked 598 00:28:58,360 --> 00:29:00,760 Speaker 2: about this, his supreme ability to beat p off the dribble. 599 00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:03,000 Speaker 2: I actually think he has a really reliable shot making 600 00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:05,280 Speaker 2: piece close to the basket in that like short range 601 00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:06,760 Speaker 2: and it pops up off the ground and shoots those 602 00:29:06,760 --> 00:29:09,920 Speaker 2: little floaters. I'm a believer in jaw. But it's theoretical 603 00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 2: in terms of availability, and it's theoretical in terms of 604 00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:15,160 Speaker 2: upside right now. So yeah, John's probably going to be 605 00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:17,480 Speaker 2: in that twenty eight twenty nine range for me on 606 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:20,000 Speaker 2: this list, but he didn't crack the top twenty five 607 00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:21,800 Speaker 2: for me because of that theoretical element. 608 00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:23,960 Speaker 1: Two more questions. 609 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 2: These are both one related to the Lakers at large, 610 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:29,000 Speaker 2: and another one is related to Lebron and his ranking 611 00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:30,800 Speaker 2: on this list, which we haven't gotten to yet, but 612 00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:35,000 Speaker 2: it's just more about theoretically where he would be. Hey, Jason, 613 00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:37,000 Speaker 2: I have a question, as a Lakers Austin Reeves fan, 614 00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:38,600 Speaker 2: what do you think Austin needs to add to his 615 00:29:38,640 --> 00:29:41,120 Speaker 2: game to breach this tier of top twenty five ish players. 616 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:43,960 Speaker 2: He's obviously nowhere near guys like Trey joh and playoff Jamal, 617 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:45,480 Speaker 2: but I wonder how long it'll take him to reach 618 00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:48,040 Speaker 2: a ceiling. Considering he's already twenty seven. It would be 619 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:50,640 Speaker 2: interesting to see some of Austin's stats as an offensive engine, 620 00:29:50,720 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 2: close out attacking next to Luca and Lebron, his defense rebounding, 621 00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:56,240 Speaker 2: which is obviously an issue. Thanks keep it up. So 622 00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 2: I think there's a couple pieces for Austin. I don't 623 00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:00,640 Speaker 2: know that he'll ever breach the top twenty five on 624 00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:02,560 Speaker 2: this list, but to me, it's more like can he 625 00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:04,440 Speaker 2: get into that top forty? Like can he get into 626 00:30:04,480 --> 00:30:06,760 Speaker 2: the list of guys that I'm considering for the top 627 00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:07,240 Speaker 2: twenty five? 628 00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:07,640 Speaker 1: And you could. 629 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:09,600 Speaker 2: I actually had him on an early version of the 630 00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:12,040 Speaker 2: list when I had like forty seven names and then 631 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:14,440 Speaker 2: I cut seven guys and Austin was one of those 632 00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:16,640 Speaker 2: guys that I got cut before I like refined it 633 00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:17,360 Speaker 2: down to forty. 634 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:20,240 Speaker 1: And it's a couple things. 635 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:25,400 Speaker 2: One physicality, Austin pretty generally, especially against teams that can switch, 636 00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:28,560 Speaker 2: struggles to deal with big, physical perimeter defenders. So like 637 00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:31,160 Speaker 2: putting on a little bit more muscle and just getting 638 00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:33,520 Speaker 2: a little bit better at shedding physical ball pressure I 639 00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:35,440 Speaker 2: think will go a long way towards helping him. And 640 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:38,959 Speaker 2: then the second pieces is his inconsistent jump shooting, Like 641 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,880 Speaker 2: he is just very streaky, especially from the three point 642 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:46,040 Speaker 2: line and especially in catch and shoot situations, and that 643 00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:48,680 Speaker 2: is a thing that limits his off ball utility, especially 644 00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:51,280 Speaker 2: in the context of playing alongside a guy like Luka Doncic. 645 00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:53,880 Speaker 2: I want to see Austin improve just generally as a 646 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:56,800 Speaker 2: jump shooter from the three point from the three point line, 647 00:30:56,880 --> 00:30:59,280 Speaker 2: and then again that strengthened physicality so that he can 648 00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:03,320 Speaker 2: deal with ball sure better than he has been last one. 649 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:06,200 Speaker 2: This was just an opportunity for me to vent about something. 650 00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:09,080 Speaker 2: How do you justify having Lebron in the top ten 651 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:11,720 Speaker 2: when the Lakers were almost two points per game better 652 00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 2: without him than with him on the floor and go 653 00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:17,920 Speaker 2: to a from a positive to a negative plus minus team. 654 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:20,760 Speaker 2: It clearly isn't because the Lakers bench is that dominant, 655 00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:22,840 Speaker 2: nor because he makes the key plays in fourth quarter, 656 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:25,280 Speaker 2: and that wasn't the case for either ad or Luca 657 00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:27,600 Speaker 2: or the other two comparable players. Don't get me wrong, 658 00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:29,800 Speaker 2: Lebron is still good, but you simply aren't nowhere near 659 00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:32,000 Speaker 2: a top ten player if your team is better without 660 00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:34,640 Speaker 2: you than with you on the floor. So let's talk 661 00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:37,400 Speaker 2: about what this has been caused by so per cleaning 662 00:31:37,440 --> 00:31:40,440 Speaker 2: the glass. The Lakers this year were six point nine 663 00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:44,720 Speaker 2: points worse with Lebron on the floor versus off, so 664 00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:48,920 Speaker 2: he had a bad plus minus year. Okay, there are 665 00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:51,640 Speaker 2: some reasons for that, which we'll get into for a minute, 666 00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:55,760 Speaker 2: but I think it's fucking hilarious because every Lebron hater, 667 00:31:56,280 --> 00:32:00,560 Speaker 2: every troll account, every sports media personality that doesn't like 668 00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:02,600 Speaker 2: Lebron that wants to have a moment at his expense, 669 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:06,160 Speaker 2: every single one of those guys has flocked to this 670 00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:10,280 Speaker 2: damn plus minus number like it is the last TV 671 00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:13,520 Speaker 2: on a sale rack on Black Friday, Like it is 672 00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:18,600 Speaker 2: crazy to watch them piranha around this stat like it's 673 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:23,480 Speaker 2: the craziest Lebron truth, truth or moment in the history 674 00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:26,360 Speaker 2: of his career in the league. Let me just read 675 00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:30,720 Speaker 2: a couple stats for you. These are Lebron's plus minus 676 00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:33,760 Speaker 2: stats is on off numbers in a Lakers jersey over 677 00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:36,560 Speaker 2: the course of his entire tenure there so twenty twenty five. Yeah, 678 00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:39,600 Speaker 2: they were roughly seven points worse with Lebron on the 679 00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:43,000 Speaker 2: floor versus off twenty twenty four, eight point three points 680 00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:46,160 Speaker 2: better per one hundre possessions twenty twenty three, nine point 681 00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:48,880 Speaker 2: seven points better per one hundre possessions twenty twenty two 682 00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:51,480 Speaker 2: three point one points better those the worst Laker team 683 00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:53,320 Speaker 2: in that era that was after the Russell Westbrook trade. 684 00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:55,600 Speaker 2: Still three points better with Lebron on the on the 685 00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:59,200 Speaker 2: floor versus off twenty twenty one, thirteen points better per 686 00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:02,560 Speaker 2: one hundre possession with Lebron versus off twenty twenty eleven 687 00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:07,040 Speaker 2: points better, twenty nineteen, nine points better. So consistently, literally 688 00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 2: every single year, except for the twenty twenty two year 689 00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:11,680 Speaker 2: where Ad was hurt the whole season and Russ was 690 00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:14,920 Speaker 2: on the team, he was at least eight points as 691 00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:18,280 Speaker 2: a positive plus minus guy on the floor versus off 692 00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 2: He is consistently throughout his entire career for decades, the 693 00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:26,400 Speaker 2: plus minus monster of the NBA. And he has one 694 00:33:26,640 --> 00:33:31,479 Speaker 2: season where there's this obvious statistical outlier and every Lebron 695 00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:33,960 Speaker 2: hater flocked to it like it was the craziest fucking 696 00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:38,040 Speaker 2: thing in the world. And it's just so transparent because 697 00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:40,080 Speaker 2: every one of you who jump on that, you're just 698 00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:43,360 Speaker 2: telling on yourself as someone that's unwilling to look more 699 00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:45,240 Speaker 2: than two inches in front of your face, like this 700 00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:49,520 Speaker 2: is completely absurd. It is literally the definition of a 701 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:53,560 Speaker 2: statistical outlier. Because of the injuries to Anthony Davis and 702 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:56,760 Speaker 2: Luka Doncic last year, and because J. J. Reddick made 703 00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:59,560 Speaker 2: a decision to try to pair Austin with Anthony Davis 704 00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:02,480 Speaker 2: as much as possible because they needed each other for offense, 705 00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:04,840 Speaker 2: and he trusted Lebron to try to lead those groups. 706 00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:08,600 Speaker 2: Lebron had to play over eight hundred possessions last year 707 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:12,759 Speaker 2: with Austin, Luca and ad all off the floor at 708 00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:17,200 Speaker 2: the same time, and those groups got absolutely rolled. They 709 00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:20,080 Speaker 2: were minus eight point four points per one hundred possessions. 710 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,719 Speaker 2: That's awful and It's not hard to see why their 711 00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:26,040 Speaker 2: most used lineup in that data set had Christian Coloco 712 00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:28,759 Speaker 2: at center. That's a two way contract, Dalton Connect, a 713 00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:30,960 Speaker 2: rookie who you guys know, I'm just not very high on, 714 00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:34,560 Speaker 2: and gave Vincent and DiAngelo Russell, who probably shouldn't be 715 00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:37,759 Speaker 2: in any starting lineup anywhere around the league. Of course, 716 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:42,280 Speaker 2: those groups were getting rolled. That large chunk of data 717 00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:46,080 Speaker 2: is the kind of thing that's one of the elements 718 00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:49,239 Speaker 2: that can lead to a statistical outlier. Another way to 719 00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:51,759 Speaker 2: look at it is like this, Austin Reeves was an 720 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:54,680 Speaker 2: awesome plus minus guy for the Lakers last year. Do 721 00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:57,120 Speaker 2: you think Austin is a much better basketball player than 722 00:34:57,360 --> 00:34:59,840 Speaker 2: Lebron James or do you think that it was just statistical? 723 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:04,760 Speaker 2: It was obviously statistical noise. We have decades worth of data, 724 00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:08,319 Speaker 2: including as recently as last year, and various points in 725 00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:11,360 Speaker 2: last excuse me, as recently as the year before last, 726 00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:13,719 Speaker 2: and even in last year certain stretches, like in the 727 00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:15,960 Speaker 2: middle of the season where Lebron is a plus minus 728 00:35:15,960 --> 00:35:19,800 Speaker 2: monster in between the Anthony Davis injury and Luka Doncic 729 00:35:19,920 --> 00:35:22,879 Speaker 2: joining the Lakers. He was incredible during that strays during 730 00:35:22,920 --> 00:35:25,520 Speaker 2: that phase. Do we have so much data where they're 731 00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:27,759 Speaker 2: just clearly better when he's on the floor versus off. 732 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:31,120 Speaker 2: So all of you people who suddenly fixated on that metric, 733 00:35:31,480 --> 00:35:33,800 Speaker 2: you're literally making a fool of yourselves. You sound stupid 734 00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:36,480 Speaker 2: when you're talking about it. So, like, I just I 735 00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:39,239 Speaker 2: just had to take a second to get that off 736 00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:42,360 Speaker 2: my chest because it just is completely absurd that everyone's 737 00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:45,680 Speaker 2: jumped on that like it's some sort of revealing metric 738 00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:49,360 Speaker 2: that shows, like it's some conspiracy theory that has finally 739 00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:51,560 Speaker 2: been brought to light. Like, oh, yeah, you're right, guys, 740 00:35:51,920 --> 00:35:54,359 Speaker 2: Lebron actually hurts the team. He's playing for good one. 741 00:35:54,600 --> 00:35:56,520 Speaker 2: You did good stuff there. All right, guys, It's all 742 00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:58,440 Speaker 2: I have for today. As always, as sincerely appreciate you 743 00:35:58,440 --> 00:35:59,959 Speaker 2: guys for supporting us, in supporting the show. 744 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:00,319 Speaker 1: Again. 745 00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:02,320 Speaker 2: It's gonna be two weeks before our next player rankings 746 00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:05,319 Speaker 2: mail bag. I have a pre recorded one that we're 747 00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:07,080 Speaker 2: running next Friday, just because I'll be on the cruise 748 00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:09,360 Speaker 2: ship and it's just impossible for me to work in 749 00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:13,960 Speaker 2: that environment. But keep dropping your mailbag questions, any disagreements 750 00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:17,000 Speaker 2: in the mail uh. The YouTube videos from now to 751 00:36:17,280 --> 00:36:18,600 Speaker 2: two weeks from now, and you guys will get an 752 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:21,000 Speaker 2: opportunity to get those questions in, and I will see 753 00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:22,120 Speaker 2: you guys then