WEBVTT - 102123 The Hamas-Israel War (Part 2)

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<v Speaker 1>If you just tuned in a civic cipher, I am

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<v Speaker 1>your host. Ramsey's job is Ramsey's job. I am q Ward.

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<v Speaker 2>Welcome back, if you've been here, and if you have not,

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<v Speaker 2>welcome to another day in the Life Size Life, Excite

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<v Speaker 2>Life Life.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, indeed, today we are talking about the war, the

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<v Speaker 1>Israel Hamas War. And again, for those that weren't here earlier,

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<v Speaker 1>we understand that this show is exists to foster solidarity

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<v Speaker 1>between you know, marginalized groups and the powers that be

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<v Speaker 1>in this country. Today we're talking about something that is

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<v Speaker 1>taking place on foreign soil, but there are a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of people with a lot of passion who are activists,

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<v Speaker 1>who are connecting the struggles, and it just felt important

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<v Speaker 1>for us to provide as much insight into this conflict

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<v Speaker 1>as we can so that we're understanding each other and

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<v Speaker 1>we're not othering each other. Before we continue that conversation,

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<v Speaker 1>let's discuss BABA becoming a better ally BABA. Today's BABA

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<v Speaker 1>is sponsored by Friends of the Movement to support Black

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<v Speaker 1>businesses and allied businesses. You can sign up for the

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<v Speaker 1>free voter wallet at fotmglobal dot com and make an

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<v Speaker 1>impact with your spending Again that's fotmglobal dot com. This

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<v Speaker 1>comes from stop aap I hate and I'll just read

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<v Speaker 1>how they wrote it. We are horrified and devastated to

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<v Speaker 1>learn that a six year old child in Illinois, Wadia

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<v Speaker 1>al Fayome, was brutally murdered and his mother critically wounded

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<v Speaker 1>by their landlord simply for being Muslim. Law enforcement has

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<v Speaker 1>charged a man with a hate crime, stating he attacked

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<v Speaker 1>the Palestinian American family due to them being Muslim and

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<v Speaker 1>the ongoing Middle Eastern conflict involving Hamas in Israel. This

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<v Speaker 1>is a very sad story. This a little boy. He

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<v Speaker 1>died from his stabbing. We grieve for the loss, the

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<v Speaker 1>tragic loss of his young life, and as a coalition

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<v Speaker 1>dedicated to tracking and preventing acts of hatement, we are

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<v Speaker 1>deeply concerned for our communities across the nation, many of

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<v Speaker 1>which are living in a heightened state of fear that

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<v Speaker 1>in many ways mirrors what American Muslims, Arabs, and South

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<v Speaker 1>Asians experienced post nine to eleven. In addition to many

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<v Speaker 1>Southeast Asian Americans who are Muslim, about a quarter of

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<v Speaker 1>Asian Americans who trace their ethnic origin to South Asia

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<v Speaker 1>or have some connection to Islam. Now thousands of miles

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<v Speaker 1>away from the devastation than the least, we're seeing dangerous

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<v Speaker 1>political rhetoric and news coverage here that is encouraging people

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<v Speaker 1>to conflate the actions of leaders at war with innocent

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<v Speaker 1>people and children like Wadia. Lastly, when we encourage Asians

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<v Speaker 1>and Asian Americans who have experienced and activate including racial profiling,

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<v Speaker 1>verbal harassment, and other attacks based on religion, ethnicity, and

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<v Speaker 1>national origin or race, to visit stop aapi hate dot

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<v Speaker 1>org and you can support Wadia al fayomes fundraiser at

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<v Speaker 1>launch good dot com. Just be sure to search for

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<v Speaker 1>his name. That's a horrible story, but you can support

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<v Speaker 1>his family in the aftermath, and that way you can

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<v Speaker 1>become a better out life. Sure, so now we are

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<v Speaker 1>going to discuss Israel, discuss a little bit of powers.

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<v Speaker 1>We're going to discuss both because there's no way to

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<v Speaker 1>really separate them too. But there's no teams. Yeah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>thank you for saying that, man, because this is tough. Man.

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<v Speaker 2>The reason we're even speaking about this bro is because

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<v Speaker 2>innocent civilian people are being murdered on both sides. That's

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<v Speaker 2>the conversation. We don't sit on here and talk about

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<v Speaker 2>or yeah, right, the Russian Ukraine conflict, maybe we mentioned

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<v Speaker 2>on our show, but maybe I can't recall. There's tons

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<v Speaker 2>of different contexts and different nuances as to why people

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<v Speaker 2>have separate opinions. We should not have separate opinions once again.

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<v Speaker 2>But the image that I saw and man holding rocking

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<v Speaker 2>his lifeless baby, that should be a terrible image to everyone,

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<v Speaker 2>no matter who you are, how you pray, how you love,

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<v Speaker 2>or how you look, that should be something that breaks

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<v Speaker 2>your heart.

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<v Speaker 1>There was an image that I saw that broke my heart.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't even want to say it, but I'm here now,

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<v Speaker 1>so here we go. It was of a mother. She

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<v Speaker 1>had two babies and they both were gone, and they

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<v Speaker 1>were laying there, and she was, in my estimation, visibly

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<v Speaker 1>a Muslim woman because of how she was dressed. I

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<v Speaker 1>believe ethnically the people are all the same. But you know,

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<v Speaker 1>these people pray this way and these people pray that way,

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<v Speaker 1>but they look very similar. I suppose it's probably and

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<v Speaker 1>I don't mean anything when I say that, just but

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<v Speaker 1>this mother was I would yes, Palestinian, and she was

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<v Speaker 1>laying and it was a hospital, and she had her too.

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<v Speaker 1>They're very young, and they had to right on the

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<v Speaker 1>bellies of the baby, the babies because maybe that's how

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<v Speaker 1>they're keeping track or something. I'm sorry, yeah, I'm not

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<v Speaker 1>going to finish that one, so okay, so let's move on.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry you not my father, I can't even tell

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<v Speaker 1>you that story. But anyway, so here's what happened.

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<v Speaker 2>But you should not have to be a father to empathize, right,

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<v Speaker 2>you can empathize more specifically from the viewpoint of a parent,

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<v Speaker 2>but you should not have to be a father. In

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<v Speaker 2>the same way that you should not have to be

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<v Speaker 2>Jewish to empathize with Jewish civilians being murdered, you should

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<v Speaker 2>not have to be Palestinian to empathize and feel bad

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<v Speaker 2>for Palestinian civilians being murdered, or black civilians being murdered,

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<v Speaker 2>or white civilians being murdered, or whatever your ethnicity. Again,

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<v Speaker 2>the way that you pray, the way that you love,

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<v Speaker 2>the way that you look does not take away from

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<v Speaker 2>the fact that you are a human being and one

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<v Speaker 2>thing that we all need to get to the core of,

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<v Speaker 2>right when it comes down to the science, get down

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<v Speaker 2>to what we are made of on a molecular level,

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<v Speaker 2>You get down to what we are singularly a race

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<v Speaker 2>from the same source, from the same place in Africa.

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<v Speaker 2>So again, these differences that we imagined, that we constructed

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<v Speaker 2>and then used to divide ourselves, you know, really a

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<v Speaker 2>singular group. I don't have to point it out. Just

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<v Speaker 2>read a history book or read all the history books.

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<v Speaker 1>Right.

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<v Speaker 2>We want to elevate ourselves as more than in everyone

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<v Speaker 2>else less than, and hear all the reasons why they

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<v Speaker 2>are less. And once I've made them less, when I

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<v Speaker 2>murdered them, rape them, kidnap them, traffic them, beat them

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<v Speaker 2>into their last breath, decent people won't feel guilty about

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<v Speaker 2>it and won't make me feel guilty about it because

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<v Speaker 2>they will understand that those people are others and they

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<v Speaker 2>are less than.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so I'm glad you brought us here, because here's okay.

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<v Speaker 1>So we heard in the first half of the show

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<v Speaker 1>the activist again, his name is Gabriel Miller. He was

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<v Speaker 1>drawing some connections between the experience of black people in

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<v Speaker 1>this country and the experience of Palestinians, right, and suggesting

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<v Speaker 1>that there's some solidarity there. Now, I do want to

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<v Speaker 1>point out that a lot of media attention was given

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<v Speaker 1>to a post by BLM Chicago, where whoever posted this

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<v Speaker 1>posted a picture of a paratrooper saying you know, I

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<v Speaker 1>stand with Palestine or something like this. Effectually, that was

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<v Speaker 1>what it was communicated in this social media post, and

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<v Speaker 1>then the caption said, you know that's it, that's the post, right,

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<v Speaker 1>But because it was a paratrooper, it's the implication was that,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, I stand with hamas the terrorist group, not

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<v Speaker 1>I stand with the Palestinians, right, because the paratroopers were

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<v Speaker 1>the people that kind of landed in I believe they

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<v Speaker 1>landed around go ahead.

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<v Speaker 2>So this is the interesting thing about saying I stand

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<v Speaker 2>with in this moment, right, you draw a direct opposition

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<v Speaker 2>to everyone else. And in this case there's a conflict

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<v Speaker 2>between two peoples, two groups of people, to ethnicities, if

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<v Speaker 2>you will, If you say I stand with one, then

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<v Speaker 2>you stand other or opposed the other. That's the trick

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<v Speaker 2>bag here. You want to I want to show support

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<v Speaker 2>from my Jewish friends, so I stand with Israel, and

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<v Speaker 2>saying is that you're opposed again to these children and

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<v Speaker 2>mothers and fathers and workers and healthcare professionals and doctors

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<v Speaker 2>and nurses being murdered because they're not Jewish, well because

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<v Speaker 2>they're not Palestinian, and that should be a crazy thing

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<v Speaker 2>to say out loud. But we have this tribalism about

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<v Speaker 2>us where we feel like we have to stand quote

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<v Speaker 2>unquote in solidarity with someone in a case where there

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<v Speaker 2>are two entire groups of people, civilian people's being harmed.

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<v Speaker 1>And what you're saying is, let us not forget the

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<v Speaker 1>human beings that are paying the costs for this on

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<v Speaker 1>the ground. And so again, when this post started making

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<v Speaker 1>the rounds, it's like, oh my gosh, BLM Chicago posted

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<v Speaker 1>something blah blah blah. It turns out that there are

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<v Speaker 1>people who are trying to say, hey, don't just let

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<v Speaker 1>the version of the story that's out right now be

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<v Speaker 1>the whole truth for you, that there is a Palestinian

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<v Speaker 1>cost that has been being paid for some time prior

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<v Speaker 1>to this attack by hamas right. And so I think

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<v Speaker 1>this is what maybe the bo and people were trying

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<v Speaker 1>to say, they missed the market, they admitted that whatever,

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<v Speaker 1>but in any event, not that that's right or wrong.

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<v Speaker 1>That's what brought it to my attention.

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<v Speaker 2>This is what happens situations like that. Though there is

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<v Speaker 2>a house on fire, so you call the fire department

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<v Speaker 2>to that house, every house that's ever been burned is

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<v Speaker 2>not the it's not the call to action in that moment.

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<v Speaker 2>So it's just like black lives matter, will so do

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<v Speaker 2>white lives You're right, sure, except I'm talking about.

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<v Speaker 1>That right right now, Yeah, right now, we're doing this.

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<v Speaker 2>So even that post when you see a hospital blow

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<v Speaker 2>up full of Palestinian people, that I stand with Palestine is.

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<v Speaker 1>Not opposed to any other group.

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<v Speaker 2>It's hey, that group right now is being murdered mercilessly, civilians, women, children, babies.

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<v Speaker 1>So let me let me offer this. Okay. So there

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<v Speaker 1>are people who have said, you know, Hamas is a

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<v Speaker 1>radical group and they have done these horrible attacks and

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<v Speaker 1>blah blah blah, Palestine is you know whatever, and they

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<v Speaker 1>feel like Israel's response is justified. I talked with Amy

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<v Speaker 1>Orwitz on the Black Information Network Daily podcast, the show

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<v Speaker 1>that I do at the BIM, and he explained some

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<v Speaker 1>things to me that made the story become a little

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<v Speaker 1>bit more complicated. I just want to share a little

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<v Speaker 1>bit with you here, but please check out the content.

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<v Speaker 1>I believe I have it on YouTube, but it's at

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<v Speaker 1>the bi I mean, you can Black Information Network, you

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<v Speaker 1>can just look for it, you'll see my face big o' afro.

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<v Speaker 1>Click it, it'll be right there, and it'll give you

0:11:44.760 --> 0:11:49.120
<v Speaker 1>some insight and from a Jewish man's perspective on the

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<v Speaker 1>state of Israel and their response and why things are

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<v Speaker 1>more complicated than they seem. So it's important for me

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<v Speaker 1>to say this because I know it. Hamas is a

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<v Speaker 1>group that is not a traditionally organized military. They operate

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<v Speaker 1>in a very unorthodoxed manner. They might have a base

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<v Speaker 1>or a headquarters in the basement of a school, of

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<v Speaker 1>a hospital or whatever. Right. Jewish intelligence is aware of

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<v Speaker 1>this because they're more fortified because they feel like they're

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<v Speaker 1>not going to get attacked if they're in a hospital

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<v Speaker 1>or if they're at a school or something like this. Right,

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<v Speaker 1>So this is how Hamas works. Israel needing precision to

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<v Speaker 1>get Hamas and can't just blow up the whole city,

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<v Speaker 1>might target a hospital or a school with a missile. Right,

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<v Speaker 1>But there's a human cost. And Ami told me he's like,

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<v Speaker 1>at present, Israel's cost for getting one Hamas soldier is

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<v Speaker 1>one civilian, which is both good and bad. It's bad

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<v Speaker 1>because it's always going to be bad. There should never

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<v Speaker 1>be a civilian cost to get rid of the soldier.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's good because it's such a condensed area that

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<v Speaker 1>only getting you know, the racial only being one person

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<v Speaker 1>per one soldier. It shows how precise they are. Obviously

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<v Speaker 1>they have a lot further to go. The problem, however,

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<v Speaker 1>is the accuracy of that data. Sure, and it comes

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<v Speaker 1>from Ami. But this is just what I'm told him.

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<v Speaker 1>So I'm sharing you the way I was told the paraphra.

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<v Speaker 2>Just because people will hear this after so much more

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<v Speaker 2>information has been provided.

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<v Speaker 1>You know that that's more than fair. Ramses does not

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<v Speaker 1>know that it's not one for one sure. Sure, and

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<v Speaker 1>this this was I had this conversation maybe a week

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<v Speaker 1>or so ago. So there's been a lot more death

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<v Speaker 1>and destruction since I've had this conversation. Quoted. No, no, no,

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<v Speaker 1>not at all. I'm doing my best record now. He

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<v Speaker 1>said to me, He's like the israel The Israeli government

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<v Speaker 1>will send information, drop leaflets, whatever, say hey, you have

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<v Speaker 1>an hour to vacate. We're going to blow this building up.

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<v Speaker 1>And the people that get out cool. The people that

0:14:09.920 --> 0:14:12.760
<v Speaker 1>don't they're just there in the aftermath. And so this

0:14:12.800 --> 0:14:16.959
<v Speaker 1>is what Amy told me. The the Israeli government's position

0:14:17.080 --> 0:14:18.680
<v Speaker 1>is now to be just to give you a little

0:14:18.720 --> 0:14:22.800
<v Speaker 1>bit of background, Amy has spent time with This is

0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:25.960
<v Speaker 1>what he told me. He spent time with hamas undercover.

0:14:26.040 --> 0:14:29.800
<v Speaker 1>He's a journalist, so think like those journalists that go overseas,

0:14:29.800 --> 0:14:35.720
<v Speaker 1>and you know, and of course, because because he's I

0:14:35.760 --> 0:14:36.440
<v Speaker 1>got to make sure.

0:14:36.360 --> 0:14:41.040
<v Speaker 2>Some of us being a militant political group now seen

0:14:41.080 --> 0:14:42.840
<v Speaker 2>as a terrorist organization.

0:14:42.480 --> 0:14:45.960
<v Speaker 1>Right right, And and Amy's been on our show before.

0:14:46.560 --> 0:14:50.200
<v Speaker 1>We don't agree about much politically speaking, but we do

0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:53.720
<v Speaker 1>respect Amy as a journalist, and we respect him as

0:14:53.840 --> 0:14:57.160
<v Speaker 1>our Jewish brother. And I think he's a good man.

0:14:57.240 --> 0:15:01.920
<v Speaker 1>He means well. His tactics and his policies and his

0:15:01.960 --> 0:15:04.960
<v Speaker 1>thoughts and you know that sort of stuff that's all debatable,

0:15:05.000 --> 0:15:07.320
<v Speaker 1>but I know that I feel that he has a

0:15:07.320 --> 0:15:10.040
<v Speaker 1>good heart, and that's really the measure of a man

0:15:10.160 --> 0:15:12.480
<v Speaker 1>to me, Right, we all have lessons to learn. I'm

0:15:12.480 --> 0:15:14.520
<v Speaker 1>still growing and so is he. With that in mind,

0:15:14.520 --> 0:15:15.920
<v Speaker 1>I wanted to share that, and I do want to

0:15:15.960 --> 0:15:20.280
<v Speaker 1>share a bit about what John Stewart said about Israel

0:15:20.320 --> 0:15:23.200
<v Speaker 1>and Palestine, because John Stewart is a tremendous voice in

0:15:23.200 --> 0:15:28.440
<v Speaker 1>this space, and he's a Jewish man, and so he

0:15:28.480 --> 0:15:34.000
<v Speaker 1>doesn't I don't think he would naturally side with Palestine,

0:15:34.160 --> 0:15:36.280
<v Speaker 1>nor would he because he's a critical thinker, nor would

0:15:36.280 --> 0:15:39.600
<v Speaker 1>he side with Israel. But he is Jewish, and so

0:15:39.720 --> 0:15:42.720
<v Speaker 1>I think that he sits at a particular intersection where

0:15:42.960 --> 0:15:45.520
<v Speaker 1>maybe we can learn something from him that we You

0:15:45.640 --> 0:15:47.840
<v Speaker 1>and I certainly wouldn't be able to offer the conversation.

0:15:47.960 --> 0:15:51.440
<v Speaker 1>And just you, the listener, on your own travels, maybe

0:15:51.640 --> 0:15:53.880
<v Speaker 1>you might not come to these conclusions on your own souls.

0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:57.040
<v Speaker 2>I challenged a listener to listen to the lack of

0:15:58.800 --> 0:16:02.320
<v Speaker 2>extremism in his belief Yeah, that's not his His views

0:16:02.320 --> 0:16:05.640
<v Speaker 2>are not polarizing, Like you said, He's a critical thinker

0:16:05.640 --> 0:16:07.520
<v Speaker 2>and he presents them with nuance in a way that

0:16:07.760 --> 0:16:10.120
<v Speaker 2>a simple person should be able to hear the language

0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:12.080
<v Speaker 2>that he uses and understand what he means.

0:16:12.120 --> 0:16:22.120
<v Speaker 3>Okay, yeah, now speaking of colonialism, like God right here.

0:16:24.040 --> 0:16:27.440
<v Speaker 4>I appreciate you as an artist and as a humanitarian,

0:16:27.440 --> 0:16:30.840
<v Speaker 4>as a human being, because I imagine it can be difficult

0:16:31.360 --> 0:16:37.800
<v Speaker 4>because you are someone who is righteously speaks out against

0:16:38.160 --> 0:16:43.080
<v Speaker 4>the disgusting, violent, terrible anti Semitism that comes from all

0:16:43.160 --> 0:16:47.920
<v Speaker 4>facets of our society. But you also are humanitarian enough

0:16:48.160 --> 0:16:52.320
<v Speaker 4>to speak on behalf of Palestinians who are being being

0:16:52.360 --> 0:16:53.800
<v Speaker 4>treated like second class citizens.

0:16:54.240 --> 0:16:56.600
<v Speaker 3>And do you get any pushback as a Jewish person

0:16:56.600 --> 0:16:56.960
<v Speaker 3>because of.

0:16:56.960 --> 0:17:03.360
<v Speaker 5>This, No, everybody's cool. Everybody's cool with it until they

0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.439
<v Speaker 5>find your email, of course.

0:17:07.240 --> 0:17:07.439
<v Speaker 3>You know.

0:17:07.520 --> 0:17:10.240
<v Speaker 5>Again, it's and there are a lot of reasons for that,

0:17:10.280 --> 0:17:12.879
<v Speaker 5>but one of them is that as a Jewish person,

0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:16.639
<v Speaker 5>you are saddled with the idea that you are not

0:17:17.240 --> 0:17:20.159
<v Speaker 5>a citizen of America or a citizen of the world.

0:17:20.520 --> 0:17:23.680
<v Speaker 5>You are a citizen of Israel and you must back

0:17:24.280 --> 0:17:28.200
<v Speaker 5>their actions or the actions of and one has nothing

0:17:28.240 --> 0:17:30.000
<v Speaker 5>to do with the other, and one has nothing to

0:17:30.040 --> 0:17:33.240
<v Speaker 5>do with being Jewish or not being Jewish or whatever

0:17:33.280 --> 0:17:36.199
<v Speaker 5>it is that people choose on their religion, or on

0:17:36.280 --> 0:17:39.520
<v Speaker 5>their history, or on their background. It has to do

0:17:39.600 --> 0:17:45.080
<v Speaker 5>with in the way that I view governments that don't

0:17:45.119 --> 0:17:48.280
<v Speaker 5>act on behalf of or that you know, what has

0:17:48.320 --> 0:17:54.920
<v Speaker 5>happened in that part of the world is tragic and unfortunately,

0:17:54.960 --> 0:17:58.160
<v Speaker 5>I think the biggest problem is it's to nobody's benefit

0:17:59.040 --> 0:18:02.719
<v Speaker 5>but the Palestinian people that it get resolved. It's not

0:18:02.760 --> 0:18:04.840
<v Speaker 5>to the benefit of the Israeli government. They use the

0:18:04.840 --> 0:18:08.240
<v Speaker 5>Palestinian issue as a cudgel, and they continue to build

0:18:08.560 --> 0:18:10.359
<v Speaker 5>settlements and whatever it is that they want to do.

0:18:10.440 --> 0:18:13.680
<v Speaker 5>And no one's suggesting that, like terror attacks are okay,

0:18:13.800 --> 0:18:16.879
<v Speaker 5>and that's a good thing. But if you're held to

0:18:16.920 --> 0:18:21.280
<v Speaker 5>that standard that you don't get your state until nobody

0:18:21.320 --> 0:18:23.720
<v Speaker 5>tries to kill anybody else, then you're never going to

0:18:23.720 --> 0:18:25.960
<v Speaker 5>get your state. It's not to the benefit of the

0:18:26.080 --> 0:18:29.960
<v Speaker 5>other Arab leaders in the region because their people can

0:18:29.960 --> 0:18:33.520
<v Speaker 5>be mistreated in the same way by their autocracies. So

0:18:33.560 --> 0:18:36.680
<v Speaker 5>why do they want to fix the Palestinian situation when

0:18:36.720 --> 0:18:40.240
<v Speaker 5>they can use Israel as an easy code to get

0:18:40.280 --> 0:18:41.200
<v Speaker 5>their people in line.

0:18:42.040 --> 0:18:43.760
<v Speaker 1>Don't look at us, Look at.

0:18:43.600 --> 0:18:46.119
<v Speaker 3>Israel right right, We're working with you.

0:18:46.160 --> 0:18:48.480
<v Speaker 5>Look how they with the Palestinians. It's not to the

0:18:48.560 --> 0:18:51.719
<v Speaker 5>United States benefit because we have an ally in the

0:18:51.720 --> 0:18:54.720
<v Speaker 5>region that's a lot more complicated for us than in

0:18:54.760 --> 0:18:57.399
<v Speaker 5>other ways because they rely on our military aid and

0:18:57.440 --> 0:19:01.000
<v Speaker 5>all kinds of other things. So if it's not in

0:19:01.119 --> 0:19:05.719
<v Speaker 5>anybody's interests in the powers of status quo, what chance

0:19:05.880 --> 0:19:06.600
<v Speaker 5>do they have.

0:19:07.359 --> 0:19:10.560
<v Speaker 3>It's a very efficient way of looking at it, that's

0:19:10.600 --> 0:19:11.479
<v Speaker 3>exactly what it is.

0:19:11.680 --> 0:19:14.800
<v Speaker 5>But what chance And it's not really to Hamas's benefit

0:19:15.040 --> 0:19:19.000
<v Speaker 5>And it's not to FATA's benefit because then they lose

0:19:19.080 --> 0:19:22.560
<v Speaker 5>their grip on power. So there's only people who always

0:19:22.640 --> 0:19:25.440
<v Speaker 5>lose are the day and day out palastin in p

0:19:26.840 --> 0:19:30.040
<v Speaker 5>because it's to no one's benefit to help them put them.

0:19:30.119 --> 0:19:35.760
<v Speaker 2>Yes indeed, wow, yeah, what do we say after that?

0:19:36.880 --> 0:19:37.040
<v Speaker 1>Right?

0:19:37.119 --> 0:19:39.600
<v Speaker 2>If we could have tried to put all of our

0:19:39.680 --> 0:19:43.200
<v Speaker 2>thoughts into chat GPT and heave it, give us the ai,

0:19:43.400 --> 0:19:46.560
<v Speaker 2>give us the right way to talk about this. A

0:19:46.800 --> 0:19:49.359
<v Speaker 2>white Jewish American.

0:19:49.040 --> 0:19:54.800
<v Speaker 6>Rich, rich, well off successful, he'd be fine if he

0:19:54.800 --> 0:19:59.159
<v Speaker 6>didn't talk about these things, but offering some humanitarian perspective

0:20:00.240 --> 0:20:02.840
<v Speaker 6>on behalf of a people that are not his, but

0:20:02.920 --> 0:20:04.399
<v Speaker 6>that he sees that are under the thumb.

0:20:04.560 --> 0:20:06.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeap. You know, we talked about Zionism.

0:20:06.480 --> 0:20:08.840
<v Speaker 2>And the important part that I left out is that

0:20:09.920 --> 0:20:15.600
<v Speaker 2>what is now Palestine is now is the land that

0:20:16.240 --> 0:20:21.919
<v Speaker 2>those that believe in Zionism want to reclaim for Jewish

0:20:21.960 --> 0:20:25.439
<v Speaker 2>or Israeli people, and that's where that conflict started one

0:20:25.520 --> 0:20:27.640
<v Speaker 2>hundred years ago or probably longer ago than that.

0:20:27.920 --> 0:20:30.560
<v Speaker 1>So let me make sure that we say this here.

0:20:31.920 --> 0:20:35.320
<v Speaker 1>We are learning about this in real time. Along with

0:20:35.760 --> 0:20:39.040
<v Speaker 1>most everyone else. We do our best to not let

0:20:39.119 --> 0:20:44.080
<v Speaker 1>any conversation devolve into fighting and that sort of stuff

0:20:44.119 --> 0:20:47.280
<v Speaker 1>that doesn't help anyone. This show was created out of love.

0:20:49.160 --> 0:20:54.840
<v Speaker 1>We are on record having stood with our Jewish brothers

0:20:54.840 --> 0:21:01.320
<v Speaker 1>and sisters against a super megastar thing a trademark away

0:21:01.320 --> 0:21:06.440
<v Speaker 1>from him so that he couldn't maneuver in anti black

0:21:06.480 --> 0:21:14.360
<v Speaker 1>spaces and effectively challenging his anti Semitic rhetoric and media outlets.

0:21:14.359 --> 0:21:17.520
<v Speaker 1>That's well documented. You could google that, google civic ciphers,

0:21:17.520 --> 0:21:21.359
<v Speaker 1>see what comes up. And then historically we've always stood

0:21:21.400 --> 0:21:25.600
<v Speaker 1>with our Muslim brothers and sisters. You know, for a

0:21:25.600 --> 0:21:33.840
<v Speaker 1>long time it felt very we felt very connected, and

0:21:33.960 --> 0:21:38.560
<v Speaker 1>I know that personally and individually we celebrate our relationships

0:21:38.600 --> 0:21:43.720
<v Speaker 1>with our brothers and sisters of Islam. Every word that

0:21:43.760 --> 0:21:45.720
<v Speaker 1>we've uttered on this show has come from a place

0:21:45.760 --> 0:21:50.600
<v Speaker 1>of love, and I hope that this conversation has kind

0:21:50.600 --> 0:21:52.920
<v Speaker 1>of let a little air out of the ball. There's

0:21:52.960 --> 0:21:55.320
<v Speaker 1>no need for people to be so angry or so oppositional.

0:21:55.359 --> 0:21:58.680
<v Speaker 1>It's complicated, it's changing, we're all learning, and our hope

0:21:58.680 --> 0:22:02.119
<v Speaker 1>is that it resolves as peacefully as it can. With

0:22:02.240 --> 0:22:04.400
<v Speaker 1>that in mind, we have to leave it right there.

0:22:04.440 --> 0:22:06.119
<v Speaker 1>So I'd like to thank you once again for tuning

0:22:06.160 --> 0:22:08.080
<v Speaker 1>in a civic ccipher. I'm host rams' jaw.

0:22:08.000 --> 0:22:12.200
<v Speaker 2>He is ram Jaw, I am qboard. Let's continue conversations

0:22:12.240 --> 0:22:14.160
<v Speaker 2>like this where we're building bridges and trying to lead

0:22:14.200 --> 0:22:15.840
<v Speaker 2>with love instead of the other way around.

0:22:16.040 --> 0:22:19.080
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and I for people that know way more than

0:22:19.119 --> 0:22:21.280
<v Speaker 1>we do. We know it might sound like we're just

0:22:21.400 --> 0:22:24.080
<v Speaker 1>naive and we don't understand the complexities. And maybe you're right,

0:22:24.119 --> 0:22:29.680
<v Speaker 1>but I'd rather die on this hill where I'm optimistic

0:22:29.760 --> 0:22:31.640
<v Speaker 1>and hopeful and I'm trying my best to make sure

0:22:31.640 --> 0:22:33.239
<v Speaker 1>that people have a little bit more love in their

0:22:33.320 --> 0:22:37.040
<v Speaker 1>voice than any other one.

0:22:37.200 --> 0:22:40.040
<v Speaker 2>So you and someone want to challenge us on semantics,

0:22:40.480 --> 0:22:43.040
<v Speaker 2>here the actual message, and don't try to tear us

0:22:43.040 --> 0:22:45.080
<v Speaker 2>down about the details or data.

0:22:44.880 --> 0:22:46.000
<v Speaker 1>Points that were wrong about you.

0:22:46.080 --> 0:22:48.639
<v Speaker 2>Appreciate people, Innocent, people shouldn't be murdered no matter how

0:22:48.680 --> 0:22:49.040
<v Speaker 2>they look.

0:22:49.080 --> 0:22:52.280
<v Speaker 1>Love or pray. Yeah. Follow us on all social media

0:22:52.320 --> 0:22:57.840
<v Speaker 1>as civic scipher. We're booming. Yeah, And until next week, y'all. Peace, Peace,