1 00:00:03,279 --> 00:00:06,640 Speaker 1: Global business news twenty four hours a day at Bloomberg 2 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:09,800 Speaker 1: dot com, the Radio plus Mobile Act and on your radio. 3 00:00:10,080 --> 00:00:14,160 Speaker 1: This is a Bloomberg Business Flash from Bloomberg World Headquarters. 4 00:00:14,280 --> 00:00:18,000 Speaker 1: I'm Charlie Pellett. Stocks are rallying after this morning's jobs report. 5 00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:21,240 Speaker 1: The naz stack Compositive Index, trading above its record, closed 6 00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:23,520 Speaker 1: for the first time in a year, putting it on 7 00:00:23,720 --> 00:00:27,000 Speaker 1: the verge of joining the SMP five hundred index at 8 00:00:27,040 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 1: a record. SMP up fifteen to twenty one seventy nine, 9 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:33,240 Speaker 1: a gain of seven tenths of one percent. Naz stack 10 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: up one percent, now up fifty three points fifty two 11 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:40,319 Speaker 1: nineteen on the nastack Compositive Index down Industrials up one 12 00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:43,199 Speaker 1: hundred sixty one points, a gain of nine tenths of 13 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:46,919 Speaker 1: one percent to eighteen thousand, five hundred thirteen. The ten 14 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:50,760 Speaker 1: year down twenty thirty seconds yield one point five eight percent. 15 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 1: Gold down twenty three ninety ounce to thirteen thirty eight, 16 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:57,920 Speaker 1: a drop there of one point eight percent. Crude oil 17 00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 1: West Texas intermediate one eight for a barrel down nine 18 00:01:01,200 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 1: cents to drop there of two tents of one percent. 19 00:01:04,000 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 1: I'm Charlie Palatin of Bloomberg Business Flash. You're listening to 20 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:13,199 Speaker 1: Taking Stock with Kathleen and Gim Fox on Bloomberg Radio. 21 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:18,720 Speaker 1: Pakistan's gain is City Banks loss. After a decades long 22 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:22,360 Speaker 1: career on Wall Street, our next guest went on to 23 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:26,400 Speaker 1: become the Finance Minister and then the Prime Minister of Pakistan. 24 00:01:26,840 --> 00:01:30,400 Speaker 1: I want to welcome to the program shock At Aziz. 25 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:33,119 Speaker 1: He's the former Prime Minister of Pakistan and the author 26 00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:36,240 Speaker 1: of a new book entitled From Banking to the Thorny 27 00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:40,120 Speaker 1: World of Politics. Prime Minister, thank you for being with us. Pleasure. 28 00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:45,720 Speaker 1: Please describe where you were and the circumstances when you 29 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:51,160 Speaker 1: received a telephone call that changed your life. While I 30 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 1: was in New York three nine Park Avenue, City Bank Headquarters, 31 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:58,160 Speaker 1: sitting in my office, my secretary pan I was attending 32 00:01:58,200 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 1: a meeting in my conference room next to my office, 33 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 1: and she came with a little piece of paper saying, 34 00:02:03,040 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 1: there's somebody on the line from Pakistan. They say there's 35 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:10,040 Speaker 1: some general who wants to talk to you. So I 36 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:12,840 Speaker 1: thought to myself, General, I don't know many generals there, 37 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:16,079 Speaker 1: but I said whom Are you sure? She said yes, 38 00:02:16,120 --> 00:02:19,880 Speaker 1: So I went out took the call, and his secretary 39 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 1: was on the line and they connected. General but Caraf 40 00:02:23,280 --> 00:02:26,360 Speaker 1: to me for the first time ever in my life. 41 00:02:26,400 --> 00:02:30,120 Speaker 1: I spoke to him, hadn't seen him before, and he 42 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 1: talked about the fact that he had taken over if 43 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:38,400 Speaker 1: you remember, just a few days before, and he said, 44 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:42,880 Speaker 1: our economies and dire straits. I need a professional who 45 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:48,440 Speaker 1: is who can turn this whole economy around, because that's 46 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:53,560 Speaker 1: sort of the foundation of the whole country's revival. Excuse me, 47 00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:58,000 Speaker 1: and you seem to be one of the candidates. We 48 00:02:58,120 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 1: have sort of done an exercise of Pakistan. He's living 49 00:03:02,560 --> 00:03:05,600 Speaker 1: abroad and your name popped up, so I'd like you 50 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:09,919 Speaker 1: to come and see me in Islam about Pakistan. And 51 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:14,560 Speaker 1: that's how it started. I wonder, uh, Mr Prime Minister 52 00:03:14,639 --> 00:03:18,360 Speaker 1: Matt Miller here with him Fox, Uh, weren't you at 53 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:22,360 Speaker 1: all concerned? I mean, going from the what I would 54 00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:25,720 Speaker 1: assume is the fairly cushy life of a banker in 55 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: the corporate world, um too, a military government and a 56 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:35,560 Speaker 1: uh in in a fairly involuable part of the world. 57 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 1: Didn't you give it a second thought before you went 58 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:41,760 Speaker 1: ahead and joined General Masharaff. No, I didn't join him. 59 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:44,280 Speaker 1: Then I said, okay, I'll come and talk to you. 60 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:48,280 Speaker 1: And I then went to see Sandy while and John Reid. 61 00:03:48,320 --> 00:03:50,720 Speaker 1: I had two bosses at the time because we had merged, 62 00:03:50,720 --> 00:03:54,080 Speaker 1: as do you remember with City Corp, had merged with 63 00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:58,760 Speaker 1: Travelers Group, so we had from one chairman and see 64 00:03:58,760 --> 00:04:00,880 Speaker 1: who we had to And I told him this is 65 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:04,640 Speaker 1: a story, and I think I should go because he's 66 00:04:04,720 --> 00:04:07,680 Speaker 1: now the president of the country and if he wants 67 00:04:07,720 --> 00:04:10,440 Speaker 1: to see me, I think, unless you do have any objection, 68 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:14,320 Speaker 1: they said, no, no, because if he has called himself 69 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:17,560 Speaker 1: spoken to you, what do you do in the end, 70 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:20,159 Speaker 1: of course, we don't know. I didn't know. Also, I said, 71 00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 1: but at least I should go and talk to him. 72 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:24,799 Speaker 1: And at that point I wasn't certain that I would 73 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:29,719 Speaker 1: really accept it or not. I didn't, you know, I've 74 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:32,400 Speaker 1: never met the gentleman, so and I was. I told 75 00:04:32,400 --> 00:04:34,440 Speaker 1: all this to Sandy and John and they said, OK, 76 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:37,520 Speaker 1: we think you should go and at least talk to 77 00:04:37,600 --> 00:04:40,160 Speaker 1: him so that he doesn't then later on feel that 78 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:44,560 Speaker 1: you didn't respond to his request. And I took a 79 00:04:44,600 --> 00:04:48,080 Speaker 1: flight and went and saw him, and then you eventually 80 00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:50,040 Speaker 1: ended up in London on the way back to the 81 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 1: United States. And you've got another telephone call, which what 82 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:58,760 Speaker 1: this this has to do with him finally find getting 83 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:01,839 Speaker 1: to you? And can you know that that telephone call 84 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:08,039 Speaker 1: came in New York when I was back speak then, 85 00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:10,280 Speaker 1: then speak a little bit about when you actually did 86 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:14,600 Speaker 1: decide to I saw him and I had never met him, 87 00:05:14,600 --> 00:05:17,360 Speaker 1: so I was curious what he's all about. And then 88 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:22,040 Speaker 1: he had me meet his sort of core group of generals. 89 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:25,240 Speaker 1: And this is the first time I stepped into our 90 00:05:25,360 --> 00:05:27,640 Speaker 1: equivalent of the Pentagon, if you know what I mean. 91 00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:32,520 Speaker 1: So it was for that to that extent, I was curious. 92 00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:35,280 Speaker 1: I was also also went with a lot of prepartation, 93 00:05:35,400 --> 00:05:37,640 Speaker 1: not knowing what's in store and what they have in 94 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 1: mind and what will happen to the country. These were 95 00:05:40,200 --> 00:05:43,840 Speaker 1: early days. So I had a chat and they say, 96 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:45,760 Speaker 1: what do you think of our economy? I said, it's 97 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:49,000 Speaker 1: not well managed and you are and serious trouble. You 98 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: have cash flow issues, et cetera, and a lot of 99 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:58,440 Speaker 1: surgery is needed. They said, Okay, after discussion, we'll come 100 00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:01,839 Speaker 1: back to you. We're talking to seven people. I said, 101 00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:06,520 Speaker 1: no problem. Anytime you need free advice, just call me. 102 00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:08,919 Speaker 1: We can talk on the phone from now on. So 103 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:12,520 Speaker 1: no offer was made in that trip a couple of 104 00:06:12,560 --> 00:06:15,559 Speaker 1: Then I came back and that's what you're talking about. 105 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,359 Speaker 1: The second call. I came back to New York and 106 00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:20,440 Speaker 1: then I was doing my normal lives. One of the 107 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 1: seniors at City Bank, so we had a conference in London. 108 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:25,920 Speaker 1: I walked into my hotel room and the phone rank 109 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:28,800 Speaker 1: and that's what you were alluding to. That's exactly what 110 00:06:28,920 --> 00:06:33,880 Speaker 1: happened later later, did you, Mr Franister, did you effectively 111 00:06:33,920 --> 00:06:39,080 Speaker 1: act as a bridge then between Pakistan and UM the 112 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:44,240 Speaker 1: global investment banks that you were employed by before, or 113 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:47,320 Speaker 1: did Pakistan already have a decent relationship with with banks 114 00:06:47,320 --> 00:06:51,239 Speaker 1: like City Yeah, Pakistan, I mean was not really dealing 115 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:54,840 Speaker 1: much with the private banks. So like I mean private 116 00:06:54,880 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 1: meaning commercial banks sorry, like City Bank or JP Morgan, etcetera. 117 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:01,440 Speaker 1: They were mostly in the I M F World Bank 118 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:04,719 Speaker 1: or but you know what I mean. They were used 119 00:07:04,760 --> 00:07:08,760 Speaker 1: to dealing with development institutions rather than commercial They had accounts. 120 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 1: Of course, every government and every institution needs accounts to 121 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 1: clear the dollar payments in New York and so they 122 00:07:16,200 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 1: had accounts with us, but it was not an active 123 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:22,360 Speaker 1: relationship I had. There was no evidence that we were 124 00:07:22,360 --> 00:07:25,320 Speaker 1: close to the government in any way, can you just 125 00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:28,480 Speaker 1: tell the story about when you were campaigning because you 126 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:33,240 Speaker 1: had become a member of the parliament in order to 127 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:36,200 Speaker 1: assume some of your duties, and you were campaigning in 128 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:41,320 Speaker 1: the at hoc. That is correct. Tell us what happened. 129 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:44,800 Speaker 1: What happened is this was the last day of my campaign. 130 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:48,560 Speaker 1: You know, this is fast forward. I was Finance minister, 131 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:51,760 Speaker 1: and then because we did a good job, we turned 132 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:55,800 Speaker 1: things around. The general consensus was why don't we make 133 00:07:55,880 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 1: him the prime minister of the country. Prime ministers, you know, 134 00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:00,760 Speaker 1: is the chief executive, although in this case we had 135 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,720 Speaker 1: the president also very active because he came from the 136 00:08:03,760 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 1: military at the time and he had done the coup. 137 00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 1: So anyway, that was the last event, and I was euphoric. 138 00:08:12,080 --> 00:08:15,040 Speaker 1: I was very excited that the campaign has gone well. 139 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:17,880 Speaker 1: Blah blah blah. This was to be an empty member 140 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:20,520 Speaker 1: of parliament because we had the parliamentary system of government 141 00:08:20,560 --> 00:08:23,440 Speaker 1: like the British have because we were a colony of Britain. 142 00:08:23,440 --> 00:08:27,080 Speaker 1: So we followed that process, and the long story short, 143 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: I gave a very emotional, addressed and emotional rally of 144 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:38,559 Speaker 1: several thousand people, and then it's time we finished the meeting. 145 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:41,400 Speaker 1: I walked out of the canopy. There was a huge 146 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:44,800 Speaker 1: circus type canopy where these couple of thousand people were 147 00:08:44,800 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 1: there to get into my car, which was by now 148 00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:51,600 Speaker 1: in the campaign, they give you security and a bulletproof, 149 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:56,160 Speaker 1: bomb proof car in case somebody tries to act funny, 150 00:08:56,360 --> 00:09:01,920 Speaker 1: and I was. I sat in the car and about 151 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:07,439 Speaker 1: five seconds later there was a huge explosion on one 152 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:10,679 Speaker 1: side of the car. My driver just and this was 153 00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:16,520 Speaker 1: a level seven car, level seven degree of armoring of 154 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:20,600 Speaker 1: a car. So it's bomb proof, bulletproof, so they say, 155 00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 1: But in actual fact, there was a huge bomb which 156 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:29,400 Speaker 1: exploded next to my car, and it was targeted at 157 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:33,080 Speaker 1: my door. But I don't want to go into unnecessary details. 158 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:36,160 Speaker 1: But because of various reasons, the car had moved without 159 00:09:36,200 --> 00:09:39,280 Speaker 1: the person who pressed the button to explode the mom 160 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:42,719 Speaker 1: knowing that. So there's these two seconds gap, and in 161 00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:45,839 Speaker 1: that the car had moved about three ft or two feet, sorry, 162 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:48,600 Speaker 1: so it hit the driver's door rather than my door. 163 00:09:48,640 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: The driver dried instantly in my he felt like this 164 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:55,080 Speaker 1: into my arms. I was behind him. It was quite 165 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: a shock guy and not expected this coming from Manhattan 166 00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:02,800 Speaker 1: in New York, who is about to have a welcome 167 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:07,040 Speaker 1: like this. It's exact traumatic experience. It's exactly the kind 168 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:11,240 Speaker 1: of trauma that that I'm thinking of. What conclusions did 169 00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:13,680 Speaker 1: you come to then, and how do you think Pakistan 170 00:10:13,760 --> 00:10:17,760 Speaker 1: now deals with the effects of terrorism or the people 171 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:20,080 Speaker 1: that commit terrorists acts? You know, I mean, there are 172 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:23,679 Speaker 1: a lot of Americans feel like Afghani's terrorists living in 173 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:26,160 Speaker 1: Pakistan get their help, even though some of in Laden 174 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:31,719 Speaker 1: maybe no this. So these were the ultra right. They 175 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:36,040 Speaker 1: issued a statement from Cairo Egypt. Al gay that issued 176 00:10:36,080 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 1: a statement from Cairo, Egypt often the attack on me 177 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:41,760 Speaker 1: that this person had been sent by the United States 178 00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 1: as and to be he's their agent, and it was 179 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:49,960 Speaker 1: therefore decided by our high command to eliminate him before 180 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:54,559 Speaker 1: he assumes office. I think I'm gonna have to. That'll 181 00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:56,960 Speaker 1: have to be a great tease for your book, Mr 182 00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:59,480 Speaker 1: Prime Minister, because unfortunately we don't have any more time. 183 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 1: But you can at his book From Banking to the 184 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 1: Thorny World of Politics and find out exactly how former 185 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 1: Prime Minister of Pakistan child cut A Ziz dealt with 186 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:11,199 Speaker 1: that situation. I'm Matt Miller with pim Fox and the 187 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:13,560 Speaker 1: Bloomberg advantage. This is Bloomberg