WEBVTT - Ethic Co-Founder on Climate Change Financial Risks

0:00:00.440 --> 0:00:04.000
<v Speaker 1>You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and

0:00:04.120 --> 0:00:08.800
<v Speaker 1>Jason Kelly on Bloomberg Radio. All right, we're really happy

0:00:09.240 --> 0:00:12.479
<v Speaker 1>to kick off the last hour of the show today

0:00:12.520 --> 0:00:14.640
<v Speaker 1>with Jay Letman back with his co founder President of

0:00:14.680 --> 0:00:18.440
<v Speaker 1>Ethic joins us on the phone from New York City

0:00:18.600 --> 0:00:21.680
<v Speaker 1>and back in June, we talked about what was going

0:00:21.720 --> 0:00:25.160
<v Speaker 1>on in the world as it related to a reckoning

0:00:25.239 --> 0:00:28.960
<v Speaker 1>that we hope is still ongoing in a very meaningful way.

0:00:28.960 --> 0:00:31.920
<v Speaker 1>We're talking about equality a lot today with our Equality

0:00:32.000 --> 0:00:35.880
<v Speaker 1>Summit in terms of racial injustice and institutionalized racism. We're

0:00:35.920 --> 0:00:38.519
<v Speaker 1>also talking a lot over the past couple of weeks

0:00:38.520 --> 0:00:42.800
<v Speaker 1>and continuing to engage our efforts around the climate. So

0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:45.639
<v Speaker 1>we want to focus on that today with Jay. It's

0:00:45.640 --> 0:00:48.240
<v Speaker 1>really nice to have you back with us. It's a

0:00:48.280 --> 0:00:50.720
<v Speaker 1>touch to be back. Thanks having me. So Jay talk

0:00:50.800 --> 0:00:54.200
<v Speaker 1>to us about climate here, because you know, this is

0:00:54.280 --> 0:00:56.440
<v Speaker 1>something we spent a lot of time actually with our

0:00:56.440 --> 0:01:00.640
<v Speaker 1>Green Festival last week here at Bloomberg and and we

0:01:00.760 --> 0:01:03.440
<v Speaker 1>dug into a lot of the investment aspects of this.

0:01:03.520 --> 0:01:05.920
<v Speaker 1>But I wonder what your take on it is, because

0:01:06.160 --> 0:01:08.200
<v Speaker 1>this is at the core of what you're doing with

0:01:08.200 --> 0:01:12.000
<v Speaker 1>ethic right, tell us your approach of course, of course,

0:01:12.000 --> 0:01:14.160
<v Speaker 1>and I think that you know the way that we

0:01:14.200 --> 0:01:18.160
<v Speaker 1>are seeing investors consider the climate conversation. The climate crisis

0:01:18.240 --> 0:01:21.360
<v Speaker 1>right now is really a topic of risk, right, and

0:01:21.400 --> 0:01:25.240
<v Speaker 1>the kinds of risks that investors can actually proactively mitigate

0:01:25.280 --> 0:01:27.640
<v Speaker 1>from their portfolio if they know what to look for

0:01:27.800 --> 0:01:30.640
<v Speaker 1>with regards to certain information data that is out there

0:01:30.640 --> 0:01:33.200
<v Speaker 1>about companies. And we can break that down into two

0:01:33.240 --> 0:01:36.840
<v Speaker 1>primary risks, you know, whether that is physical risks or

0:01:36.920 --> 0:01:40.800
<v Speaker 1>transition risks. I'm happy to go into more detail about well,

0:01:41.200 --> 0:01:42.960
<v Speaker 1>talk to us a little bit about that in terms

0:01:43.040 --> 0:01:45.720
<v Speaker 1>of how because I'm always curious when we talk about this,

0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:47.720
<v Speaker 1>how do you look at a company Like we did

0:01:47.720 --> 0:01:50.800
<v Speaker 1>a story earlier about how Amazon doesn't have a plan

0:01:50.880 --> 0:01:54.600
<v Speaker 1>to solve emissions. The company gave itself about two decades

0:01:54.600 --> 0:01:57.880
<v Speaker 1>to reach zero emissions, you know, but it's like, can

0:01:57.880 --> 0:02:00.600
<v Speaker 1>it do what its customers and want it to do?

0:02:00.920 --> 0:02:04.160
<v Speaker 1>And also put the climate first? Can put both constituents

0:02:04.160 --> 0:02:06.320
<v Speaker 1>of you home first? And I do wonder when you

0:02:06.360 --> 0:02:08.520
<v Speaker 1>look at a company, how do you decide whether or

0:02:08.520 --> 0:02:12.840
<v Speaker 1>not they are hurting or helping or or taking the

0:02:12.840 --> 0:02:14.960
<v Speaker 1>initiatives to be better when it comes to the climate.

0:02:14.960 --> 0:02:16.880
<v Speaker 1>How do you how do you make an investment ruling

0:02:17.080 --> 0:02:21.080
<v Speaker 1>on something like an Amazon is It's a fantastic question.

0:02:21.120 --> 0:02:23.880
<v Speaker 1>What you're talking about specifically, is what you would consider

0:02:23.919 --> 0:02:26.079
<v Speaker 1>to be a transition risk, right, which is this risk

0:02:26.120 --> 0:02:31.640
<v Speaker 1>associated with the change in economic incentives um as they

0:02:31.680 --> 0:02:33.760
<v Speaker 1>transition to a low carbon economy and as you know,

0:02:34.240 --> 0:02:38.200
<v Speaker 1>increasing consumer sentiment shifts towards a desire to have more

0:02:38.240 --> 0:02:41.760
<v Speaker 1>sustainable companies they're buying from. And as companies recognize that,

0:02:42.080 --> 0:02:46.160
<v Speaker 1>you know, potential regulatory changes in the future may actually

0:02:46.360 --> 0:02:48.799
<v Speaker 1>you know, put a price on carbon. They're recognizing that

0:02:49.000 --> 0:02:51.760
<v Speaker 1>they have an incentive boat to keep their consumers happy

0:02:51.840 --> 0:02:54.320
<v Speaker 1>as well as keeping an eye on what their bottom

0:02:54.400 --> 0:02:56.440
<v Speaker 1>line is going to be, because you know, if these

0:02:56.480 --> 0:02:59.080
<v Speaker 1>regulatory changes do happen, if a price to carbon does occur,

0:02:59.160 --> 0:03:02.280
<v Speaker 1>which we believe to be an inevitability at a certain point,

0:03:02.320 --> 0:03:04.519
<v Speaker 1>you know, they are they want to be ahead of

0:03:04.560 --> 0:03:07.080
<v Speaker 1>the curve and they don't want to be caught incurring

0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:10.040
<v Speaker 1>those increased costs when a price is put on you

0:03:10.080 --> 0:03:11.880
<v Speaker 1>know what it is that they're ultimately releasing in the

0:03:12.160 --> 0:03:15.799
<v Speaker 1>form of emissions in cobbon through what you're discussing. So Jay,

0:03:15.840 --> 0:03:18.200
<v Speaker 1>you you brought up a really important point, which I

0:03:18.240 --> 0:03:21.560
<v Speaker 1>think is consumer behavior. And you know, we've been talking

0:03:21.560 --> 0:03:24.560
<v Speaker 1>about this also in the context of equality, and in fact,

0:03:24.560 --> 0:03:26.160
<v Speaker 1>part of the conversation we're gonna hear later in the

0:03:26.200 --> 0:03:29.800
<v Speaker 1>hour which John Winkle Reed and Ursula Burns addresses this,

0:03:29.800 --> 0:03:34.040
<v Speaker 1>this notion of where the economic pressure is ultimately coming from.

0:03:34.320 --> 0:03:38.360
<v Speaker 1>It's coming from consumers who are ultimately demanding more of

0:03:38.400 --> 0:03:42.120
<v Speaker 1>the companies that they buy from, but it's also needs

0:03:42.160 --> 0:03:44.720
<v Speaker 1>to come many would argue, I would be among them,

0:03:44.760 --> 0:03:47.720
<v Speaker 1>that it has to come from the institutional investors, is

0:03:47.880 --> 0:03:51.480
<v Speaker 1>as well? Are we seeing pressure from both sides? And

0:03:51.760 --> 0:03:55.200
<v Speaker 1>is it equal or how would you describe it? Well,

0:03:55.240 --> 0:03:57.160
<v Speaker 1>I think that you are seeing, you know, a two

0:03:57.160 --> 0:04:00.160
<v Speaker 1>prompt approach, because you know, it's it's impossible now to

0:04:00.320 --> 0:04:02.640
<v Speaker 1>ignore what is going on in the climate spective. We've

0:04:02.640 --> 0:04:05.240
<v Speaker 1>got fires on the West coast, we've got a historic hurricane,

0:04:05.240 --> 0:04:08.280
<v Speaker 1>sees and performing in the Gulf, and you know, the

0:04:08.360 --> 0:04:10.280
<v Speaker 1>conversation about whether this is a topic that needs to

0:04:10.280 --> 0:04:12.680
<v Speaker 1>be addressed is now over right. It's now a conversation

0:04:12.680 --> 0:04:15.120
<v Speaker 1>of how do we address this and the consumer sentiment

0:04:15.120 --> 0:04:17.960
<v Speaker 1>around that has shifted towards people recognizing that their purchasers

0:04:18.000 --> 0:04:20.680
<v Speaker 1>do make a difference. And that's why you're seeing certain

0:04:20.680 --> 0:04:22.719
<v Speaker 1>companies coming out and getting ahead of it. Right. You

0:04:22.720 --> 0:04:25.120
<v Speaker 1>had Microsoft come out talking about going carbon negative. You

0:04:25.120 --> 0:04:26.599
<v Speaker 1>are Delta coming out saying they were going to be

0:04:26.600 --> 0:04:30.000
<v Speaker 1>the first carbon neutral airline, and those first movers, we

0:04:30.040 --> 0:04:33.200
<v Speaker 1>believe are going to benefit from being you know, proactive

0:04:33.240 --> 0:04:36.680
<v Speaker 1>in this sense. But from an institutional investment perspective, you

0:04:36.760 --> 0:04:39.760
<v Speaker 1>are seeing, you know, not billions of dollars flow into

0:04:39.800 --> 0:04:43.360
<v Speaker 1>more sustainable investments. You're seeing trillions of dollars as investors

0:04:43.360 --> 0:04:45.680
<v Speaker 1>that are investing for you know, they're not investing for

0:04:45.760 --> 0:04:48.040
<v Speaker 1>ten twenty thirty years. These are investment portfolios that are

0:04:48.080 --> 0:04:50.320
<v Speaker 1>looking at the true long term fifty years, you know,

0:04:50.360 --> 0:04:53.320
<v Speaker 1>the generational investments that are saying we don't want to

0:04:53.360 --> 0:04:56.400
<v Speaker 1>be overly exposed to companies that are not being considerate

0:04:56.720 --> 0:04:59.039
<v Speaker 1>of a changing climate and the risks that you know

0:04:59.120 --> 0:05:02.720
<v Speaker 1>essentially come with that. So if I can follow in

0:05:02.880 --> 0:05:07.960
<v Speaker 1>that and that excuse me? What turned that institutional spigot on,

0:05:08.160 --> 0:05:11.680
<v Speaker 1>as it were? Was there a catalytic moment? Was it

0:05:11.880 --> 0:05:14.720
<v Speaker 1>the kind of accumulation of a lot of the things

0:05:14.800 --> 0:05:17.320
<v Speaker 1>that you've been alluding to where you just can't ignore

0:05:17.360 --> 0:05:21.000
<v Speaker 1>it anymore, or was it they needed to see performance

0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:25.560
<v Speaker 1>like what happened? Well, the you know, the performat performance

0:05:25.600 --> 0:05:27.960
<v Speaker 1>question is so interesting because if you do look at

0:05:27.960 --> 0:05:30.840
<v Speaker 1>this as a risk mitigation strategy, and as these kinds

0:05:30.839 --> 0:05:35.240
<v Speaker 1>of risks become more pertinent, with companies having their supply

0:05:35.320 --> 0:05:38.440
<v Speaker 1>chains disrupted, having their you know, physical assets to put

0:05:38.480 --> 0:05:40.840
<v Speaker 1>at risk, having an increased risk of stranded assets as

0:05:40.880 --> 0:05:43.159
<v Speaker 1>a result of a changing climate, you're actually going to

0:05:43.200 --> 0:05:46.240
<v Speaker 1>see these companies that are not taking climate change seriously

0:05:46.560 --> 0:05:48.920
<v Speaker 1>get affected and as a result, they are not going

0:05:48.960 --> 0:05:52.559
<v Speaker 1>to be great investments when you know, they are overly

0:05:52.600 --> 0:05:56.120
<v Speaker 1>susceptible to drought or their supply chains start to fail.

0:05:56.279 --> 0:05:59.880
<v Speaker 1>And so I think institutional investors are really recognizing that,

0:06:00.240 --> 0:06:02.040
<v Speaker 1>you know, they want to invest in a more sustainable

0:06:02.080 --> 0:06:04.760
<v Speaker 1>way to achieve the goals of you know, driving a

0:06:04.760 --> 0:06:07.240
<v Speaker 1>more sustainable future, but they also need to protect that

0:06:07.320 --> 0:06:09.040
<v Speaker 1>capital and they need to be thinking as long term

0:06:09.040 --> 0:06:12.800
<v Speaker 1>investors and in doing so recognizing that by mitigating risk,

0:06:12.839 --> 0:06:16.800
<v Speaker 1>you're probably insulating the portfolio from you know, the kind

0:06:16.800 --> 0:06:20.640
<v Speaker 1>of climate. I think events that we're seeing globally, Jay,

0:06:20.839 --> 0:06:23.840
<v Speaker 1>what about the other problems, big issues that face us

0:06:23.839 --> 0:06:26.599
<v Speaker 1>And it's something we've talked about with you before, but

0:06:27.040 --> 0:06:30.680
<v Speaker 1>you know, the racial inequalities um that are out there

0:06:30.720 --> 0:06:33.960
<v Speaker 1>in our society. How do you think about that. I'm

0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:38.160
<v Speaker 1>curious what you're hearing from investors about how they are

0:06:38.200 --> 0:06:41.960
<v Speaker 1>applying that too and thinking about that when they make investments,

0:06:43.720 --> 0:06:46.440
<v Speaker 1>of course, and it's you know, it remains a huge

0:06:46.480 --> 0:06:48.320
<v Speaker 1>priority for so many of our clients. And one of

0:06:48.360 --> 0:06:50.599
<v Speaker 1>the interesting things, you know, in this conversation about climate

0:06:50.640 --> 0:06:54.280
<v Speaker 1>as well, is seeing the interconnectivity between these issues, right,

0:06:54.320 --> 0:06:57.240
<v Speaker 1>and you're seeing on the West coast now with these

0:06:57.279 --> 0:07:00.320
<v Speaker 1>obviously these unprecedented fires. You know, one of the mediate

0:07:00.360 --> 0:07:02.719
<v Speaker 1>side effects that everyone is talking about is the immediate

0:07:02.720 --> 0:07:05.040
<v Speaker 1>climate migration that is going to be a factor as

0:07:05.120 --> 0:07:08.320
<v Speaker 1>people lose their homes at kind of unprecedented numbers. And

0:07:08.640 --> 0:07:11.040
<v Speaker 1>one of the natural effects of that is that, you know,

0:07:11.080 --> 0:07:13.160
<v Speaker 1>it is the most vulnerable in society that are going

0:07:13.200 --> 0:07:15.360
<v Speaker 1>to be most disproportionately affected by that if they cannot

0:07:15.360 --> 0:07:17.600
<v Speaker 1>afford to relocate their lives, if they cannot afford to

0:07:17.640 --> 0:07:20.600
<v Speaker 1>rebuild their lives, and if they are essentially forced you

0:07:20.840 --> 0:07:25.080
<v Speaker 1>into unprecedented times for themselves and that does disportionate affect

0:07:25.080 --> 0:07:28.680
<v Speaker 1>people of color as a result, and so um, you know,

0:07:28.720 --> 0:07:33.200
<v Speaker 1>as as our investors think more about racial justice investing,

0:07:33.480 --> 0:07:36.000
<v Speaker 1>I think that the entire climate conversation does factor into

0:07:36.040 --> 0:07:39.080
<v Speaker 1>so many elements of it, as well as other factors

0:07:39.680 --> 0:07:42.600
<v Speaker 1>like criminal justice reform and where their companies are profiting

0:07:42.680 --> 0:07:47.640
<v Speaker 1>from a systemically unjust and racist criminal justice system, which

0:07:47.680 --> 0:07:51.400
<v Speaker 1>companies are positioned to, you know, honestly benefit from that system,

0:07:51.400 --> 0:07:55.520
<v Speaker 1>as well as certain industries like predatory lending that disproportionately

0:07:55.840 --> 0:07:58.960
<v Speaker 1>predate upon or affect people of color in the country

0:07:59.080 --> 0:08:02.360
<v Speaker 1>right now. Yeah, And it's interesting, you know, on the

0:08:02.520 --> 0:08:06.960
<v Speaker 1>on the climate point, in the climate exacerbating inequality point.

0:08:07.200 --> 0:08:09.720
<v Speaker 1>You know, Jay, you mentioned earlier in the conversation the

0:08:09.800 --> 0:08:12.120
<v Speaker 1>hurricane season in the Gulf, and you know, it was

0:08:12.160 --> 0:08:14.080
<v Speaker 1>fifteen years ago, and I was involved in some of

0:08:14.080 --> 0:08:17.800
<v Speaker 1>the Bloombird's coverage around it. When Hurricane Katrina obviously came

0:08:17.800 --> 0:08:21.720
<v Speaker 1>on shore in Mississippi, it was a little less well covered,

0:08:21.760 --> 0:08:25.040
<v Speaker 1>but certainly when we saw what Hurricane Katrina and the

0:08:25.120 --> 0:08:29.200
<v Speaker 1>levies breaking ultimately did to New Orleans, the disproportionate effect

0:08:29.240 --> 0:08:33.360
<v Speaker 1>it had on poor black people in the lower ninth

0:08:33.360 --> 0:08:36.880
<v Speaker 1>ward and also the economic response to that, I think

0:08:37.000 --> 0:08:39.560
<v Speaker 1>is so interesting to think about as well, in terms

0:08:39.600 --> 0:08:43.000
<v Speaker 1>of what get really what gets rebuilt, and what doesn't

0:08:43.040 --> 0:08:47.239
<v Speaker 1>and who is able to essentially show any measure of resilience.

0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:49.640
<v Speaker 1>And I have to think that that's part of the

0:08:49.679 --> 0:08:54.920
<v Speaker 1>equation too, of course, of course, and you know, a

0:08:55.040 --> 0:08:57.280
<v Speaker 1>very sad part of all of the displacement that has

0:08:57.320 --> 0:09:01.040
<v Speaker 1>created either from the flooding either from fires, is that

0:09:01.160 --> 0:09:03.840
<v Speaker 1>you know, small business owners, people that are dependent on

0:09:03.880 --> 0:09:06.400
<v Speaker 1>the community element of you know, for their kind of

0:09:06.480 --> 0:09:10.280
<v Speaker 1>economic support and the economic sustenance you know, that's wiped

0:09:10.320 --> 0:09:13.000
<v Speaker 1>out as the entire community is pushed out, and you know,

0:09:13.080 --> 0:09:16.400
<v Speaker 1>does not necessarily have the financial resilience to return to

0:09:16.520 --> 0:09:19.200
<v Speaker 1>that area, and especially as you said, not to do

0:09:19.240 --> 0:09:23.479
<v Speaker 1>so quickly. So when you think about what we're increasingly

0:09:23.880 --> 0:09:27.360
<v Speaker 1>calling and we had the the creator of this concept

0:09:27.400 --> 0:09:29.840
<v Speaker 1>on our show yesterday, Peter Atwater, the economists that this

0:09:29.960 --> 0:09:33.480
<v Speaker 1>K shaped recovery. You know, I feel like investors are

0:09:33.640 --> 0:09:36.960
<v Speaker 1>sort of of of of many minds here that it

0:09:37.160 --> 0:09:41.640
<v Speaker 1>is maybe easy, as it were, to sort of invest

0:09:41.720 --> 0:09:45.360
<v Speaker 1>in in that upward part of the K in tech

0:09:45.480 --> 0:09:50.400
<v Speaker 1>and other companies, UM, and and maybe ignore some of

0:09:50.440 --> 0:09:56.280
<v Speaker 1>the the opportunity or maybe ignore some of the implications

0:09:56.480 --> 0:10:01.240
<v Speaker 1>of the other part of the k with this widening gap, Um,

0:10:01.240 --> 0:10:03.840
<v Speaker 1>how do you continue to sort of make sure that

0:10:04.240 --> 0:10:06.600
<v Speaker 1>you and and on behalf of your clients sort of

0:10:06.640 --> 0:10:10.080
<v Speaker 1>making the right sort of investments when some companies are

0:10:10.080 --> 0:10:13.600
<v Speaker 1>doing quite well A bit all this well, I think

0:10:13.640 --> 0:10:15.240
<v Speaker 1>that you know, one of the considerations we have to

0:10:15.280 --> 0:10:18.559
<v Speaker 1>make is, you know, there are obviously those larger companies

0:10:18.559 --> 0:10:20.560
<v Speaker 1>that are going to benefit from the displaces of the

0:10:20.600 --> 0:10:23.240
<v Speaker 1>market and from consolidation, and that will continue to grow

0:10:23.320 --> 0:10:27.200
<v Speaker 1>an accelerated rate through COVID and through the rebound. But

0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:29.760
<v Speaker 1>you've also got to look at the companies that are

0:10:29.960 --> 0:10:33.520
<v Speaker 1>kind of systemically positioned to benefit from you know, honestly

0:10:34.440 --> 0:10:37.000
<v Speaker 1>extracting from the communities in the country that are the

0:10:37.040 --> 0:10:39.840
<v Speaker 1>most vulnerable. Right, So as we look at industries like

0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:43.720
<v Speaker 1>predatory lending that benefit most when people are financially destitute

0:10:44.040 --> 0:10:47.560
<v Speaker 1>and are honestly in desperate need of financial support, that's

0:10:47.600 --> 0:10:50.160
<v Speaker 1>when they are strongest, right, because they're able to position

0:10:50.200 --> 0:10:54.959
<v Speaker 1>themselves as you know, a provider of financial services that

0:10:55.080 --> 0:10:59.200
<v Speaker 1>does exploit its clients right, and there's industries like that

0:10:59.200 --> 0:11:01.760
<v Speaker 1>that are going to make the situation honestly, dramatically worse

0:11:01.800 --> 0:11:03.640
<v Speaker 1>for those people that will not be part of the

0:11:03.679 --> 0:11:08.600
<v Speaker 1>economic uplift, especially if they are not you know, asset owners,

0:11:08.600 --> 0:11:11.200
<v Speaker 1>and if they're not holders in some of those companies

0:11:11.240 --> 0:11:13.160
<v Speaker 1>that are going to see the largest expansion in their

0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:16.800
<v Speaker 1>share price because they're not you know, honestly participating in

0:11:17.920 --> 0:11:20.520
<v Speaker 1>the kind of economic uplift because they don't have investment portfolios.

0:11:20.720 --> 0:11:23.800
<v Speaker 1>And so you will see that disparity grow even further,

0:11:24.080 --> 0:11:25.840
<v Speaker 1>either from that corporate activity or the fact that you

0:11:25.840 --> 0:11:28.040
<v Speaker 1>know a lot of people in the community don't actually

0:11:28.040 --> 0:11:32.080
<v Speaker 1>have ownership of equities that will grow from the benefits

0:11:32.120 --> 0:11:34.240
<v Speaker 1>of the Upland to a quick question, just kind about

0:11:34.240 --> 0:11:36.320
<v Speaker 1>a minute left here, how does your how do your

0:11:36.600 --> 0:11:40.760
<v Speaker 1>you know, algorithms, you know, how do they see Big

0:11:41.200 --> 0:11:46.360
<v Speaker 1>Wall Street pigs amid all of this. It's a great question.

0:11:46.400 --> 0:11:49.360
<v Speaker 1>I think that you know, it really depends on how

0:11:49.400 --> 0:11:52.800
<v Speaker 1>you actually judge the various practices. And I think that

0:11:53.000 --> 0:11:56.640
<v Speaker 1>you know, looking at things like carbon risk, carbon exposure, um,

0:11:56.640 --> 0:11:58.280
<v Speaker 1>you know, isn't going to be material when you're looking

0:11:58.280 --> 0:12:00.920
<v Speaker 1>at a financial institution, and so you know, deciding on

0:12:01.160 --> 0:12:03.679
<v Speaker 1>whether to invest in a company based on how much

0:12:03.679 --> 0:12:06.360
<v Speaker 1>carbon it emits is not going to be applicable to

0:12:06.480 --> 0:12:10.559
<v Speaker 1>an institution that doesn't create as part of its business activities.

0:12:11.040 --> 0:12:13.120
<v Speaker 1>And so you look at the various ways of that

0:12:13.480 --> 0:12:16.120
<v Speaker 1>bank kind of operates with regards to things like the

0:12:16.120 --> 0:12:19.760
<v Speaker 1>financial systems risk, whether or not they are participating in

0:12:19.880 --> 0:12:23.400
<v Speaker 1>or profiting from predatory lending, and look at the things

0:12:23.440 --> 0:12:27.760
<v Speaker 1>that are relevant to their honestly their business practices and

0:12:27.800 --> 0:12:31.080
<v Speaker 1>see how they connect to either you know, climate conversations,

0:12:31.040 --> 0:12:33.520
<v Speaker 1>whe justice conversations, or other things that are connected to

0:12:33.559 --> 0:12:36.760
<v Speaker 1>the factors that we consider. Well, it's so fascinating, um,

0:12:36.880 --> 0:12:40.000
<v Speaker 1>and I know hopefully you'll come back at another day

0:12:40.000 --> 0:12:41.760
<v Speaker 1>so we can just kind of continue this because it's

0:12:41.800 --> 0:12:44.880
<v Speaker 1>just kind of the investment world where it's important loading

0:12:44.920 --> 0:12:47.880
<v Speaker 1>these kinds of areas. J Littman, co founder, president of Ethic,

0:12:47.960 --> 0:12:50.600
<v Speaker 1>joining us on the phone from New York City,