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Speaker 1: Live from Our Nation's All Talk here in Washington, d

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Speaker 1: C turns to President elect Joe Biden's administration, historically speaking

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Speaker 1: the markets that performed better when there is divided government.

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Speaker 1: The biggest pressure for physical stimulus is an off taking cases.

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Sound On The Insiders, the Influencers, the inside biding

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Speaker 1: has Thomas again and again it he will unite the

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Speaker 1: country's state government's control elections as in the Constitution. I

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Speaker 1: think that we can expect a smooth, thoughtful, methodical transition.

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Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Sound On with Kevin Shirley on Bloomberg Radio.

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Speaker 1: The latest from the Senate. Eric Wasasson gives us a

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Speaker 1: full congressional briefing. This as the transition team continues to

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Speaker 1: try to make inroads on how to disseminate the vaccine

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Speaker 1: A lot to get through the big story. Tonight, Senate

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Speaker 1: Majority Leader Mitch McConnell closing off chances that the Senate

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Speaker 1: would pass anytime soon a House bill that would give

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Speaker 1: most Americans two thousand dollars stimulus checks. The Kentucky Republicans

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Speaker 1: said that the House legislat ation approves and a bipartisan

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Speaker 1: vote has no realistic path it's a quick passage in

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Speaker 1: the Senate, and then it falls short of the demands

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Speaker 1: of President Donald Trump. I'm reading from the Bloomberg terminal

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Speaker 1: from Eric Lawson's report. Eric joins me, Now, Eric, what

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Speaker 1: is in terms of next for the for for when

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Speaker 1: this might actually get to fruition? Is it now officially over? Uh?

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Speaker 1: And and we'll have to wait for a Biden administration.

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Speaker 1: I think that's probably a safe bat. You know, McConnell's

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Speaker 1: really putting a sloot down here. Despite President Trump saying

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Speaker 1: this would be a death wish for Republicans to reject

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Speaker 1: this idea. Uh, you know, we're really not seeing any enthusiasm.

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Speaker 1: I think one of the tactical mistakes has Democrats did

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Speaker 1: was in designing this bill, they made it so that

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Speaker 1: at least some small payments would be able to go

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Speaker 1: to people who make six figures. And this is something

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Speaker 1: that Republicans are really laying into McConnell saying, where they're

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Speaker 1: not going to be bullied into giving money to Democrats

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Speaker 1: rich friends. We have John Corner just now saying targeted

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Speaker 1: it's going and so it's a waste of money to

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Speaker 1: give people who you know, haven't lost income and are

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Speaker 1: making six figures. So that's really coming a sort of

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Speaker 1: a point of contention that Republicans can exploit and basically say, well,

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Speaker 1: we'd have to mold this and looks something more targeted. Uh.

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Speaker 1: The other thing that McConnell made clear was he wants

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Speaker 1: to combine, uh, you know, President Trump's drive to uh

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Speaker 1: investigate voter fraud as well as to roll back you know,

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Speaker 1: Facebook and Twitter's liability protections into one bill. And Democrats say, well,

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Speaker 1: that's just nonsense. That's gonna be something we can't support.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, I think it's it's bractically dead in the

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Speaker 1: Senate right now. We've got sound on that from coming

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Speaker 1: from Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. Take a listen to

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Speaker 1: Leader McConnell. The Democrats have tried to warp, but President

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Speaker 1: Trump actually laid out the Senate is not going to

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Speaker 1: split apart the three issues that President Trump linked together

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Speaker 1: just because Democrats are afraid to address two of them. Democrats,

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Speaker 1: in terms of the messaging, Eric, we're able to get

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Speaker 1: out front of this. But what I've heard in the

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Speaker 1: past porting four hours is precisely what Leader mc donald

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Speaker 1: just said, which was President Trump wanted both Section to

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Speaker 1: thirty two repealed and for there to be additional two

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Speaker 1: thousand dollar stimulus checks. That's exactly what Leader McConnell gave him. Well, right,

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Speaker 1: but you know Trump wasn't so specific as thing had

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Speaker 1: to be in the same bill and then I needed

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Speaker 1: to have them all in the same bill or but

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Speaker 1: you know I'm gonna step in here. You know, the

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Speaker 1: leader McConnell is a political chess player, and he is

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Speaker 1: getting President Trump exactly what he asked for, even if

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Speaker 1: he wasn't. If you're going to ask for it via tweet, well,

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Speaker 1: leader McConnell said, okay, that's what you want. Here's a

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Speaker 1: bill proposing based upon your tweet. I mean it was,

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Speaker 1: in a way political chessmanship. I don't know if chessmanships

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Speaker 1: are work. Go ahead, right, and I mean chuck the chuck.

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Speaker 1: Schumer pointed out in a statement on the City mcconunell's

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Speaker 1: had to pass the bill, and he knows how to

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Speaker 1: kill a bill, and this is how how you would

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Speaker 1: kill it. I mean, putting even though the bill just

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Speaker 1: creates a commission to study ninety days allegations of voter fraud,

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Speaker 1: Democrats really can't vote for that, because it just legitimized

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Speaker 1: to what Trump has been saying, that there's something, some

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Speaker 1: massive fraud problem to be looked into. Maybe Biden is

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Speaker 1: not a legitimately elected president. You know, we see uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, Josh Holley now raising objections isn't going to

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Speaker 1: cause a lengthy debate on January six over this issue.

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Speaker 1: So putting that in the bill just makes it so

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Speaker 1: toxic that it wouldn't get Democratic support. It wouldn't, you know,

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Speaker 1: probably get more than a handful of votes. So, yes,

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Speaker 1: you're right, it's very clever, you know. Uh. And it

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Speaker 1: was something that m'connell promised to Trump apparently over the

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Speaker 1: weekend to get him to sign the billion dollar released

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Speaker 1: still that he was holding up. And here we are,

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Speaker 1: the two checks is really going nowhere remarkably clever. We've

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Speaker 1: got more sound on coming from Speaker of the House

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Speaker 1: Nancy Pelosi. Here's her reaction to the political maneuverings of

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Speaker 1: Leader McConnell. The President of the United States has expressed

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Speaker 1: his support for the two thousand dollars. The Democrats and

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Speaker 1: Republicans in the House have passed that legislation. Who is

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Speaker 1: holding up that distribution to the American people, Mitch McConnell,

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Speaker 1: and the Senate Republicans. So I mean to take an

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Speaker 1: outsider's perspective for a second, it's quite remarkable that Congress

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Speaker 1: as a whole took so long to pass any type

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Speaker 1: of economic stimulus and then in the final weeks both

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Speaker 1: sides saying finger pointing and saying, well, we could have

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Speaker 1: gotten more if they didn't do this, or we could

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Speaker 1: have had this if they didn't do that. Well, sure,

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Speaker 1: I mean that's something that Congress is very good at.

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Speaker 1: I think the Rubbert really meets the road with the

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Speaker 1: Georgia runoffs that are coming on January six. A lot

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Speaker 1: of positioning ahead of that vote well determine control of

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Speaker 1: the Senate. And we really saw a remarkable flip from

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Speaker 1: David Purdue and Kelly Lausler. Purdue is long in the

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Speaker 1: one of the leading budget hawks in the Senate UH

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Speaker 1: and had resisted endorsing the two thousand dollar checks idea

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Speaker 1: came out in favor of it, just realizing the political

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Speaker 1: heat he was getting and the need to try to

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Speaker 1: win over voters and what's you know, if you flow

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Speaker 1: polesit to we believe is as a super tight race

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Speaker 1: against John Ausus. So, you know, we'll we'll see how

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Speaker 1: this all plays out. But I think we can't have

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Speaker 1: to keep in mind McConnell's preventing his vote from happening,

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Speaker 1: in part because it's just too politically risky. If you

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Speaker 1: if you held this vote, you divide the conference, you're

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Speaker 1: going to alienate some part of the Republican voter base,

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Speaker 1: either the Trump supporters who like the idea, who has

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Speaker 1: an art checks, or you know, the donors and others

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Speaker 1: who are in the party who don't want to see

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Speaker 1: you know, depicit spending on the order of five billion dollars.

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Speaker 1: So you know, this is something you know a lot

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Speaker 1: of people are pointing out that Republicans are trying to

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Speaker 1: to really get on the deficit hawk footing. With a

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Speaker 1: Biden administration coming in. They want to get consistent on

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Speaker 1: their messaging to prevent Biden from being able to pass large,

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Speaker 1: you know, spending bills and this this whole Trump pushes

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Speaker 1: sort of messing with that. So they're they're looking to

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Speaker 1: head to the future, to the Biden and sort of

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Speaker 1: sidestepping Trump's demands. At this point. Meanwhile, Senator Josh Holly

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Speaker 1: really emerging as someone who is trying to inherit the

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Speaker 1: president's political uh rhetoric policies. But can you tell us

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Speaker 1: about his movements today in the Senate with regards to

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Speaker 1: the January six certification of the electoral College vote. You know,

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Speaker 1: some people say this is just a formality on January six,

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Speaker 1: and many ways it is, but also the first vote

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Speaker 1: in many ways in the primary. You know, this is

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Speaker 1: Holly uh saying, you know, he's raising objections that there

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Speaker 1: might be some voter fraud or irregularities. He doesn't necessarily

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Speaker 1: have evidence before us right now, so maybe you're gonna

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Speaker 1: present that. But that was a key decision because it

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Speaker 1: allows a group of House Republicans who already saying you're

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Speaker 1: gonna object, to actually force votes in the Senate and

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Speaker 1: House on the certification of certain states electoral votes. Now,

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Speaker 1: this is their doomed to fail because it happens to

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Speaker 1: have to agree in There's no way Nancy Pelosi's House

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Speaker 1: is going to go along with delegitimizing or ending the

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Speaker 1: Biden candidacy here. But you know, at least it gives

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Speaker 1: positioning for Holly, who was trying to you know, become

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Speaker 1: the Trump uh. You know, Mantel candidate four, soll beg

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Speaker 1: to see if others come at ted. Cruz is clearly

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Speaker 1: also positioning for those Trump supporters. He had promised that

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Speaker 1: he would argue a case if it got before the

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Speaker 1: Supreme Court on a voter fraud. You know, we'll see

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Speaker 1: how Tom Cott, another one who's looking for those votes,

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Speaker 1: will do as well. Uh, you know, And of course

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Speaker 1: we have others who are thinking perhaps of twenty four

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Speaker 1: where it's Mit Romney and Chris Christ you're looking for

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Speaker 1: the non Trump voter to try to take back the party.

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Speaker 1: So it's an interesting early salvo and what will probably

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Speaker 1: be the contentious up primary, especially if Trump does not

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Speaker 1: run for real, uh for for election again. When do

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Speaker 1: we expect to get the timing for January six on

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Speaker 1: one precisely that certification will happen. Well, you know, we're

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Speaker 1: asking how many states Basically each state you can have

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Speaker 1: two hours of debate and a vote. So let's say

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Speaker 1: they're going to object to Pennsylvania, which is what Holly

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Speaker 1: said in a statement, Well that's two hours if you're

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Speaker 1: gonna do six or seventh states. If so, it could

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Speaker 1: be you know, a twelve fourteen ordeal. Uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: for everyone to go through before the final certification happens

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Speaker 1: and could come well in the middle of it. Now,

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Speaker 1: can only the senators from those states object or can

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Speaker 1: anyone object to any of the states? Anyone can object,

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Speaker 1: So Holly is in fact staying he's going to object

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Speaker 1: to Pennsylvania's procedure. And they get two hours total or

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Speaker 1: two hours per objection per state. So the Pennsylvania can

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Speaker 1: be a d It could be fifty times too, it

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Speaker 1: could be a hundred. Yeah, but I think it's really

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Speaker 1: six states that are really you know, they've focused on you,

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Speaker 1: Wisconsin and Arizona gonna be it's gonna be a lot

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Speaker 1: of it's going to be a lot of interesting dynamics.

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Speaker 1: But they can if they can organize. I mean Mo Brooks,

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Speaker 1: who is organizing in the House says he's trying to

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Speaker 1: get you know, seventy two uh, you know, different speeches organized.

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Speaker 1: But we'll see if you can call it together, it'll

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Speaker 1: be remarkable. And Eric, I know that you will be

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Speaker 1: busy for us all next week. Eric Cross and Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: can National reporter such incredible reporting. Eric, congratulations on a

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Speaker 1: great year, and thank you for your coverage. We'll check

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Speaker 1: in with you next week. My name is Kevin CEREALI.

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Speaker 1: I'm the chief Washington correspondent for Bloomberg TV and Radio.

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Speaker 1: Coming up next we check in on what happened in

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Speaker 1: the markets and coming up later on in the next hour,

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Speaker 1: Congressman Denver Riggleman, you don't want to miss that interview.

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Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg. This is Bloomberg Sound On with

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Speaker 1: Kevin Surley on Bloomberg and one oh five point seven

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Speaker 1: f M h D two. I'm Kevin CEREALI, chief Washington

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Speaker 1: correspondent for Bloomberg Television and for Bloomberg Radio. Wishing you

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Speaker 1: and your family and your friends a safe, happy, and

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Speaker 1: healthy new year, and also the acknowledgement of how difficult

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Speaker 1: this year has been for so many millions of Americans,

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Speaker 1: and acknowledging that as we moved through towards the end

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Speaker 1: of the year, all of us hoping that one will

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Speaker 1: bring some type of fresh start, new start, new beginning,

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Speaker 1: turn the page, new chapter, whatever you want to call it.

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Speaker 1: Let's just get over with am I right? First, though,

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Speaker 1: Let's dive into what happened in the markets today. Because

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Speaker 1: US stocks climbed with small cap shares outperforming in one

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Speaker 1: of the final trading sessions of It's almost over, folks

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Speaker 1: I promised. The dollar continued its slide, weakening to the

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Speaker 1: lowest and two and a half years. Automakers were among

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Speaker 1: the best performers as the SMP five hundred index edged higher,

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Speaker 1: while the Russell two thousand gauge of smaller companies rallied

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Speaker 1: about one percent for its biggest gain in almost two weeks.

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Speaker 1: This is important. Travel and leisure companies rose in Europe

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Speaker 1: after the UK approved a coronavirus shot by Astra Zeneca

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Speaker 1: and the University of Oxford, off setting pessimism sparked by

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Speaker 1: a slower than planned rolled out of shots in the

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Speaker 1: United States. Joining me now is Eric Quen, a Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: Markets Live team leader and the author of two books.

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Speaker 1: I don't know where he found time to write two books,

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Speaker 1: two books about Wall Street, What Goes Up and the

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Speaker 1: Shadow Market. Eric, I do want to ask you about

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Speaker 1: your writing habits, but first I want to follow up

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Speaker 1: on what happened in the markets today. Sure, well, you

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Speaker 1: know it's sort of um if you want to talk

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Speaker 1: about turning a page, as you were saying, I'm all

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Speaker 1: about turning the page go ahead, you're all about turning.

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Speaker 1: We all, well, the markets are too, I mean you

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Speaker 1: you talked about the small caps thing, and you talked

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Speaker 1: about the travel and leisure cars. Uh. The assumption is

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Speaker 1: that there's going to be money to spend. Um. It

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Speaker 1: was interesting we saw it emerging market stocks went up

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Speaker 1: a lot and are at the highest that they've been

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Speaker 1: since two thousand seven. And that's stuff that you buy

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Speaker 1: when you're feeling good about the global economy. It does

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Speaker 1: really well when people feel comfortable taking risks. So we're

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Speaker 1: seeing that across a bunch of ass that's precious metals,

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Speaker 1: a bunch of different places, and the market is kind

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Speaker 1: of assuming that things will get better eventually. Um. But

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Speaker 1: you know, we're all kind of you know, you know,

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Speaker 1: gripped for what's coming next. So meanwhile, I find this

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Speaker 1: fascinating that this narrative has emerged, the market narrative, the

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Speaker 1: Washington narrative, that there have been fewer vaccines than anticipated

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Speaker 1: for the rollout here, but there's been two million plus

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Speaker 1: vaccines already in the United States. I guess I find

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Speaker 1: that a little bit confusing, because there's only been like

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Speaker 1: four million worldwide in the sixteen developed countries that have

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Speaker 1: started administering them. There was never based I mean, I

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Speaker 1: go back to March. No one said that there would

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Speaker 1: be snap our fingers, clap our hands, wave a magic

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Speaker 1: wand and everyone's vaccinated. Are the markets forgetting that or

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Speaker 1: are they just I don't understand that. Well, what you

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Speaker 1: see now, To be honest with you, I think actually

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Speaker 1: the markets understand that. Um, what you're seeing right now

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Speaker 1: is a lot of people aren't in. It's pretty thin,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's like holiday times. So you see these

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Speaker 1: exaggerated moves, and you know a lot of different things

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Speaker 1: bubble up. But in general, anything involving vaccines sends stuff up, um,

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Speaker 1: send well, sends bonds down, sends stock up, sends things

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Speaker 1: that are that people buy when they're feeling good up.

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Speaker 1: So vaccines are definitely, you know, the reason why people

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Speaker 1: feel good. I think you have this nervousness about what's

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Speaker 1: to come for the next you know, two to three months.

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Speaker 1: But I the market, I think, just in terms of positioning,

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Speaker 1: appears to be expecting you know, the middle of next year,

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Speaker 1: you know, June July kind of being the time when

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Speaker 1: things start kicking in and real you know, we've returned

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Speaker 1: to a bit of normalcy and and that I don't think,

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Speaker 1: you know, is unrealistic. So but what in terms of

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Speaker 1: what more clarity does do the markets need on the

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Speaker 1: US vaccination front? What are they looking for in terms

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Speaker 1: of that would provide for them some more clarity about

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Speaker 1: the direction of it. You need, they're going to need

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Speaker 1: to know that beyond the first wave is getting vaccinated.

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Speaker 1: So you what we hear a lot about is like, sure,

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Speaker 1: we're getting and it's absolutely necessary. You know, we're getting

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Speaker 1: them the first front line workers getting are getting vaccinated. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, the elderly and people who are very much

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Speaker 1: at risk are getting vaccinated. But it won't be until

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Speaker 1: you get into the general population that people will start

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Speaker 1: sensing that things are returning to normal, because that's when

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Speaker 1: you'll start going back to the office, That's when kids

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Speaker 1: will go to school or camp. You know, that's when

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Speaker 1: the broad workings of the economy sort of kick in.

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Speaker 1: So like in terms of is Wall Street or is

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Speaker 1: the market impressed with what's going on with vaccines, Everything

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Speaker 1: that involves vaccines is kind of a amzing to everybody.

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Speaker 1: But in terms of what it needs to see, it

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Speaker 1: needs to get into that second layer where people who

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Speaker 1: are normal workers, you know, the guys who are going

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Speaker 1: to be at restaurants that you know, wait waiters and

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Speaker 1: cooks and all that sort of stuff. Uh, and the

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Speaker 1: people who are at hotels and all that are vaccinated

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Speaker 1: to When that starts happening and businesses can start returning

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Speaker 1: to normal, that's when the you know, you start seeing

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Speaker 1: the enthusiasm kick in. Eric ween Or Bloomberg Markets Live

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Speaker 1: team leader, author of two books about Wall Street What

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Speaker 1: Goes Up and secondly the Shadow Market. Do you write

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Speaker 1: in silence or with music? I write it with noise.

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Speaker 1: I actually wrote both books with NPR in the background.

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Speaker 1: People don't know. Can you say that Christine Rada are executive?

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Speaker 1: Do we have like a button? The reason is because

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Speaker 1: you can tune it out. It's sort of you can't

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Speaker 1: do cav out am I right? Am? I right? Turn

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Speaker 1: you out? No, I could never tune this out, That's

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Speaker 1: what I'm saying. But you could. Actually I can go

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Speaker 1: for four straight hours and it's essentially white noise. So

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Speaker 1: I fall states of white noise. I cannot be white noise.

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Speaker 1: I can't. I can't do it anymore. I have to

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Speaker 1: have white noise on in the background. But what about music?

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Speaker 1: Do you can you can you write to music? Um No?

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Speaker 1: Because I start getting distracted. I do notes to music,

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Speaker 1: like I do research to music and all that. What's

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Speaker 1: the best sitting down to write? What's the best music

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Speaker 1: to research too? Oh? I am very like uh, much

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Speaker 1: more alternative type stuff. So I listened to it. Like

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Speaker 1: during my first book, it was a lot of the

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Speaker 1: super furry animals and pavement. If the replacements, I have

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Speaker 1: the hope this replacement set. Um. So I went through

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Speaker 1: all of that. Speaking of replacements, the EU signing a

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Speaker 1: trade deal in China. Are they trying to replace the

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Speaker 1: United States? Um No? I mean, look, they've been talking

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Speaker 1: about doing this for a while. I think that, um.

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Speaker 1: Trump made a big deal out of it. And really

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Speaker 1: what it means is that I mean, if you look

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Speaker 1: at the amount of trade that they do with the EU,

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Speaker 1: it's incredible double um. But we're still right in the

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Speaker 1: middle of all this. I think it's it's more about

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Speaker 1: this is kind of the EU cadrolling US to get

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Speaker 1: involved again. Uh. And I think that the market and

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Speaker 1: you know, most economists I speak to expect that from

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Speaker 1: the Biden administration. What are they expecting the first step

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Speaker 1: will be for the United States in terms of trade policy. Well,

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Speaker 1: that's hard because you have a lot of like a

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Speaker 1: lot of what Trump did with with China gives Biden

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Speaker 1: a lot of chips. So you know, if you don't

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Speaker 1: really care that much about the tariffs but it kind

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Speaker 1: of annoys China, then it's what do I want from

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Speaker 1: you that would help with You know that I could

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Speaker 1: release these tariffs and that would help me. And I

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Speaker 1: think most of that on the Biden side would probably

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Speaker 1: be intellectual property, um, you know, all that that stuff,

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Speaker 1: which was really a big deal before Trump. Um, then

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Speaker 1: it became the trade deficit and stuff. But I think

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Speaker 1: it's gonna be more about intellectual property detections and things

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Speaker 1: like that. And then also geopolitical stuff, you know, um,

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Speaker 1: dealing with the with all the countries in South Asian whatnot.

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Speaker 1: I think writing books is on my mind. Should you

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Speaker 1: write in the morning or the evening? What's the best?

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Speaker 1: I'm a night guy. I am like I sleep And

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Speaker 1: this was part of the problem with writing the books

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Speaker 1: and my wife because she's very much a morning person.

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Speaker 1: So I would often like literally be going to bed

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Speaker 1: as she was getting up. Um, because I would write

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Speaker 1: until fourth you know, five in the morning times it's sunlight,

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Speaker 1: and then you know, like wake up at noon. Um.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, I just my life. It's all turned around

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Speaker 1: when I'm doing books. You know what, It's all worth it.

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Speaker 1: Eric wien Or Bloomberg Markets Live team leader and the

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Speaker 1: author of two books about Wall Street, What Goes Up

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Speaker 1: and the Shadow Market. I could talk to Eric forever.

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Speaker 1: Thanks so much, Eric for uh for breaking all of

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Speaker 1: that down for us. Oh and talking about the markets too.

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Speaker 1: Coming up next to check in with Congressman Denver Riggleman.

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Speaker 1: I'm Kevin silly. You're listening to Bloomberg nine and nine one?

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Speaker 1: Why from our nations All talk here in Washington, d C.

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Speaker 1: Turns to President elect Joe Biden's administration. Historically speaking, the

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Speaker 1: markets that perform better when there is divided government. The

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Speaker 1: biggest pressure for physical stimulus is an up taking cases

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg sound on the insiders, the influencers, the inside. Biden

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Speaker 1: has Thomas again and again a tb unite. The country's

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Speaker 1: state government control elections as in the Constitution. I think

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Speaker 1: that we can expect a smooth, thoughtful, methodical transition. This

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Speaker 1: is Bloomberg Sound On with Kevin Shirley on Bloomberg Radio

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Speaker 1: set a Matority leader Mitch McConnell closes the door on

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Speaker 1: a vote combining section to thirty as well as two

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Speaker 1: thousand dollars stimulus checks. Meanwhile, outgoing now Congressman Denver Riggleman

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Speaker 1: with a warning akin to George Washington's parting parting remarks

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Speaker 1: when he was President of the United States, and it

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Speaker 1: was made on the House floor. The Congressman X in

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Speaker 1: with us, but a lot to get through. And I

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Speaker 1: gotta say, if you're in your car on your way

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Speaker 1: home from work, or if you're working from home, or

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Speaker 1: you're in an office, make sure you look up at

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Speaker 1: the sky. Right now. The sunset coming out of the

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Speaker 1: nation's capital is absolutely stunning. For what has been a

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Speaker 1: very difficult here, I gotta say we've been incredibly I've

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Speaker 1: I've been incredibly blessed to be able to look at

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Speaker 1: these sunrises and sunsets in the in the last couple

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Speaker 1: of days. I sent a picture to my father. Just

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Speaker 1: the other day, on the morning, I went up to

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Speaker 1: the roof of our building here in the downtown Washington

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Speaker 1: d C Bureau and I said Dad VIATEX. You gotta

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Speaker 1: look at this sunrise over the Capitol. I mean, it

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Speaker 1: was just absolutely remarkable. Gotta look at the little things, right,

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Speaker 1: Gotta look at the little things. We've begin tonight with

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Speaker 1: the big story, No, not my text to my father,

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Speaker 1: but the big story with regards to stimulus. As son

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Speaker 1: of Majority Leader Mitch McConnell has officially closed the door

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Speaker 1: now on two thousand dollars stimulus checks. This despite the

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Speaker 1: urging coming from Democrats. We've got sound on that from

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Speaker 1: Leader McConnell. Take a listen. The Democrats have tried to

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Speaker 1: warp what President Trump actually laid out. The Senator is

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Speaker 1: not going to split apart the three issues that President

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Speaker 1: Trump linked together just because Democrats are prayed to address

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Speaker 1: two of them. Speaker Pelosi says that Republicans had the

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Speaker 1: opportunity to vote on two thousand dollar checks. The President

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Speaker 1: of the United States has expressed his support for the

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Speaker 1: two thousand dollars. The Democrats and Republicans in the House

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Speaker 1: have passed that legislation. Who is holding up that distribution

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Speaker 1: to the American people. Mitch McConnell and the Senate Republicans.

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Speaker 1: Drew Littmann is policy director at Brownstein Hyatt, Farber and Shrek.

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Speaker 1: The former chief of staff are Senator Al Franken and

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Speaker 1: the former policy director for Senator Barbara Boxer. Ash right

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Speaker 1: as a senior vice president at FSB Core Strategies and

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Speaker 1: a senior political advisor to George P. Bush. Ash thank

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Speaker 1: you for being here. You know, I gotta be honest

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Speaker 1: with you, Leader McConnell, and and lumping together a bill

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Speaker 1: that would establish a ninety day type of commission to

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Speaker 1: investigate the integrity of the elections, as well as to

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Speaker 1: repeal parts of Section to thirty and have the two

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Speaker 1: thousand dollar stimulus checks. This was exactly what President Trump

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Speaker 1: tweeted and Leader McConnell said, if you're going to do

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Speaker 1: this last minute, this is your opportunity. Did Leader McConnell

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00:23:23,880 --> 00:23:27,000
Speaker 1: know what he was doing. I guess yeah. I mean

430
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,159
Speaker 1: I think for him he does. I don't think it

431
00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:32,159
Speaker 1: was a you know, the best thing for the party,

432
00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:35,119
Speaker 1: um for the country. I think he should have given

433
00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:37,000
Speaker 1: the two thousand dollar checks. I think I would have

434
00:23:37,040 --> 00:23:40,959
Speaker 1: helped Republicans in Georgia. UM. But you know, it's, you know,

435
00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:44,639
Speaker 1: the typical d C lockdown, And I think is what

436
00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:47,080
Speaker 1: he's really trying to do is he's trying to use

437
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:50,040
Speaker 1: the uh He's trying to get the Defense Bill passed

438
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:53,160
Speaker 1: without the section to thirty and the tech groups there,

439
00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:56,359
Speaker 1: and then use these two thousand dollars similar stimulus checks

440
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,639
Speaker 1: to really have his battle against the tech companies. But

441
00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:02,760
Speaker 1: I think ultimately it's just gonna hurt Republicans um as

442
00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:04,520
Speaker 1: we you know, as we go into an election in

443
00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:07,360
Speaker 1: Georgia and then into a long winter break where Congress

444
00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:09,520
Speaker 1: won't be in session and able to pass it at all.

445
00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:11,800
Speaker 1: Ash let me follow up here before I bring in

446
00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:16,840
Speaker 1: Drew from your perspective as as someone who is in

447
00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:23,280
Speaker 1: Texas and and an influencer within Republican Party, who what's

448
00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:26,560
Speaker 1: your what's the what's the read in your part of

449
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:30,680
Speaker 1: the party right now about heading into Georgia with Leader

450
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:34,000
Speaker 1: McConnell and President Trump having what many are describing as

451
00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:37,240
Speaker 1: some type of political stare down. Do you both lose?

452
00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:42,200
Speaker 1: Does anyone anyone win? Yeah? I mean it's it's tough

453
00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:44,679
Speaker 1: to say here in Georgia. I mean it's a you know,

454
00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:47,000
Speaker 1: it's a true swing state. I think DEM's are leading

455
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:49,760
Speaker 1: here as of today. But I think ultimately the Republicans

456
00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:52,840
Speaker 1: will prevail here. It will just be by uh, you know,

457
00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:55,359
Speaker 1: by half a point versus the you know three and

458
00:24:55,359 --> 00:24:57,359
Speaker 1: a half four percent that they should win by on

459
00:24:57,400 --> 00:25:00,520
Speaker 1: election day. But yeah, I mean, I think ultimately this

460
00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:03,119
Speaker 1: is the problem with our party, and what Leffler and

461
00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:05,600
Speaker 1: Perdue are having to deal with on these campaigns is

462
00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:10,080
Speaker 1: navigate a party that is essentially lost and we don't

463
00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:12,440
Speaker 1: know who our leader is. That's the party is having

464
00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:14,639
Speaker 1: a debate whether we stay with Donald Trump, move on

465
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:18,040
Speaker 1: from Donald Trump, and where the where is this kind

466
00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:19,800
Speaker 1: of is there going to be a new big tent

467
00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:22,719
Speaker 1: that includes everybody, or we're gonna section off and silo

468
00:25:22,840 --> 00:25:25,080
Speaker 1: off and kind of stay in our far ride in

469
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:28,640
Speaker 1: the middle of the road, uh, different segments of the party.

470
00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:30,600
Speaker 1: Which is where we're at now. Which has been part

471
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:32,679
Speaker 1: of the problem that we've had through the course of

472
00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:35,040
Speaker 1: the Trunk years, is we don't really know what it

473
00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:37,119
Speaker 1: means to be a Republican or a member of the

474
00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:40,520
Speaker 1: Republican Party anymore. And so hopefully, you know, I think

475
00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 1: that I think that ultimately will be successful. I'm actually

476
00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:45,359
Speaker 1: here in Georgia today, so I think ultimately we'll be

477
00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:47,800
Speaker 1: successful here in Georgia um, and then the party is

478
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:49,960
Speaker 1: going to have a long, tough four years to figure

479
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,680
Speaker 1: out where we actually go from here. We're going to

480
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,359
Speaker 1: talk much more about Georgia coming up, and in a minute,

481
00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:58,040
Speaker 1: Drew come in here just says that's what's happening on

482
00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:01,080
Speaker 1: the Republican side. That Meanwhile, for Demick hats Uh, there's

483
00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:05,080
Speaker 1: been quite an open debate about just how Speaker Pelosi

484
00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:08,160
Speaker 1: will be governing once President Elect Biden does in fact

485
00:26:08,200 --> 00:26:10,959
Speaker 1: take take office. That but the past week has been

486
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:14,120
Speaker 1: really focused on set a majority. Leader Mitch McConnell drew,

487
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,840
Speaker 1: but think it has indeed, and I think Pelosi faces

488
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:24,240
Speaker 1: challenges on multiple fronts. Looking at this Politically, she's got

489
00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:28,560
Speaker 1: to preserve her frontline members because she really has a

490
00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:33,439
Speaker 1: tiny working majority and mid terms generally are unfavorable to

491
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,000
Speaker 1: the party that holds the White House. This is maybe

492
00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:38,520
Speaker 1: different piece we have slipt government if the Republicans retained

493
00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 1: control of the Senate, but generally they're harder on the

494
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:45,120
Speaker 1: party that they see being in control. Between Pelosi will

495
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:48,679
Speaker 1: really face a hard time keeping a Democratic majority for

496
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,960
Speaker 1: the certain fourth year of Joe Biden's first term. And

497
00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:56,280
Speaker 1: even as that happens. The Democrats who are running in

498
00:26:56,280 --> 00:27:01,400
Speaker 1: Georgia are drew are are much more moderate than perhaps

499
00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:08,600
Speaker 1: even the Senator Bernie Sandy Sanders crowd would like. That's true,

500
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:13,200
Speaker 1: but there there's also uh, probably more liberal than past

501
00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:17,760
Speaker 1: recent past Georgia Senate candidates. West Georgia Democrat was Max

502
00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:22,240
Speaker 1: cleland Um. Michelle Nunn, the daughter of former Senator Sam Nunn,

503
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:25,960
Speaker 1: ran a pretty good campaign up a while back, but

504
00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:30,120
Speaker 1: they were more conservative than Warnock and off Off, who

505
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:33,119
Speaker 1: were running I think pretty much as progressive. They're certainly

506
00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:36,040
Speaker 1: not running like their AOC, but for Georgia, I think

507
00:27:36,040 --> 00:27:40,600
Speaker 1: they're running pretty progressive campaigns. Meanwhile, all of this comes

508
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:43,080
Speaker 1: at a time in which Ash, as you correctly pointed out,

509
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:46,320
Speaker 1: the Defense Authorization Act uh the top of the mind

510
00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:49,840
Speaker 1: for Republicans h And for someone like Senate Majority Leader

511
00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:52,680
Speaker 1: Mitch McConnell. He was how he was forced to look

512
00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:56,199
Speaker 1: at the political play clock and say, these are all

513
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 1: of the competing interests and no doubt from national security

514
00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:04,879
Speaker 1: spective uh, the Defense Authorization Bill was so incredibly important

515
00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,520
Speaker 1: and and his hand was forced in many ways by

516
00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:10,160
Speaker 1: the President's tweets and the last week on the two

517
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 1: thousand dollar stimulus checks. But at the end of the day,

518
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:16,000
Speaker 1: this is the first time that that President Trump Sevito

519
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:19,600
Speaker 1: is going to be overridden quickly as Yeah, I mean, look,

520
00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:21,919
Speaker 1: I think it's a it's a clear fact that Donald

521
00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:24,320
Speaker 1: Trump is now a lane duck and people are starting

522
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 1: to look long term at their political plays, and this

523
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:29,920
Speaker 1: is the first maneuver in that um. And that's exactly

524
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:32,679
Speaker 1: what this is. Mitch McConnell knows that he has to

525
00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:35,040
Speaker 1: have a Defense Spending Act. He cannot go home to

526
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:37,679
Speaker 1: his state or send anyone else onto their states without

527
00:28:37,720 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 1: funding the military have multiple months without being able to

528
00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:43,840
Speaker 1: pay military members. And so it's it's kind of a

529
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:46,560
Speaker 1: political play to say, hey, look, I lose more capital

530
00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 1: by by not funding the military than the political capital

531
00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 1: that I lose by not getting two thousand dollars singlish checks.

532
00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,920
Speaker 1: So it's clear that he chose to prioritize the military

533
00:28:56,960 --> 00:28:59,360
Speaker 1: sing So you know, but look, it's a it's a

534
00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 1: clear lay duck maneuver against the sitting brother. All right,

535
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: stay right there, Astrid drew Lettman, like my dad always

536
00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:08,120
Speaker 1: tells me, keep doing what you're doing and you'll be

537
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:11,360
Speaker 1: doing it. I'm Kevin SURRELLI. You're listening to Bloomberg nine

538
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:21,120
Speaker 1: nine one. You're listening to Bloomberg. Sound On with Kevin

539
00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:25,240
Speaker 1: Surrelei on Bloomberg and one oh five point seven FM

540
00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:29,440
Speaker 1: h D two. I'm Kevin SERELLI, Chief Washington correspondent for

541
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:33,760
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Television and Bloomberg Radio. Coming up, Congressman Denver Riggleman.

542
00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:36,680
Speaker 1: You don't want to miss that. He is an outgoing

543
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:40,000
Speaker 1: congressman and he's been very, very chatty about the future

544
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:43,360
Speaker 1: of the Republican Party. Drew Lettman still with me, Aster

545
00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 1: writes with me as well, Ash, how's George P. Bush Newing?

546
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:51,680
Speaker 1: He's great, He's great, Uh, you know, gearing up, trying

547
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 1: to figure out what we're gonna do for two obviously

548
00:29:54,520 --> 00:29:57,719
Speaker 1: keeping all of our options open, but um, you know,

549
00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,920
Speaker 1: but and then working hard for the great citizens of

550
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:03,440
Speaker 1: stay to Texas. It'll be interesting to see. I gotta say,

551
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 1: no matter what, and maybe I'm biased, Ash, I'm never

552
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,320
Speaker 1: going to root for the Dallas Cowboys. I don't know

553
00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 1: what that says about me, I know, and I just

554
00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 1: feel like every time you come on the show, I

555
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:15,280
Speaker 1: have to own it because otherwise, you know, I just

556
00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 1: I get I get nervous, you know, I I don't

557
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:20,880
Speaker 1: want anyone to feel like I'm go ahead, Well, I

558
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:22,800
Speaker 1: only root for the Dallas Cowboys, So I don't know

559
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:27,200
Speaker 1: if that says. I know, you and my boss Craig Gordon,

560
00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:29,960
Speaker 1: and you guys ripped my heart out and ended our

561
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:33,040
Speaker 1: playoff chances. And I don't even want to talk about it.

562
00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:38,239
Speaker 1: Moving on, Drew Littman, A huge development developing story that

563
00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:41,920
Speaker 1: I think many people are carefully monitoring for the incoming

564
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:46,280
Speaker 1: Biden administration is on geopolitics and and precisely how the

565
00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 1: Biden administration will deal with China. And I bring this

566
00:30:50,040 --> 00:30:52,040
Speaker 1: up because you are, as the former chief of staff

567
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 1: to Senator Al Franken, knows so much about the important

568
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:58,240
Speaker 1: trade deals, and of course the former policy director for

569
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:04,000
Speaker 1: Senator Barbara Boxer about how trade deals impact UH constituents

570
00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 1: like former Senator Frankins and and Barbara Boxer's constituents. The

571
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,560
Speaker 1: EU signs a trade deal with China in a period

572
00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 1: of transition for the United States administrations, how should the

573
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:22,280
Speaker 1: incoming Biden administration react to that? So I think the

574
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 1: bid the administration is going to have to assess a

575
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 1: lot of last minute activity by the Trump administration. And

576
00:31:28,960 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 1: this is part of this review. I think they're going

577
00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:35,680
Speaker 1: to look at national security implications. They're going to look

578
00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 1: at as you just constituent implications. They're going to look

579
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 1: at the US this relationship with the EU, all of

580
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 1: the US wouldn't have been a party to that agreement.

581
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:47,920
Speaker 1: They want to be on the same Biden will want

582
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:50,040
Speaker 1: us to be on the same page as EU leaders

583
00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 1: in dealing with China, because if we are divided, China

584
00:31:55,120 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 1: will leverage us against each other. The EU and US

585
00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:01,280
Speaker 1: roughly too, roughly equal side trade markets with a lot

586
00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 1: of the same assets resources in needs. So you need

587
00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:10,480
Speaker 1: multilateral I think coordination, and you need multilateral defense coordination,

588
00:32:10,560 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 1: with which Trump didn't Trump affirmatively undercut um, but which

589
00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:17,040
Speaker 1: is an important part of the way that we deal

590
00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 1: with China. And so and and ash come in here

591
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:24,320
Speaker 1: because in Texas is so heavily impacted by the trade

592
00:32:24,360 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 1: negotiations of the current administration. And in fact, there have

593
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,080
Speaker 1: been some Republicans in the Republican Party who are who

594
00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 1: are a bit apprehensive in terms of how the President

595
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:38,840
Speaker 1: utilized some some national security declarations in terms of the

596
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 1: in terms of the trade debate. I mean, what are

597
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:44,280
Speaker 1: are you? How are Republicans in the state of Texas,

598
00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 1: for example, Uh, are they optimistic? Are they pessimistic about

599
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:52,000
Speaker 1: what a Biden administration will need for trade? Well, I mean,

600
00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 1: I think ultimately they're optimistic. I mean, I think that's

601
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:58,760
Speaker 1: right in a sense that the economy in Texas boomed

602
00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:01,760
Speaker 1: except for our trade and oil and gas and our

603
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:05,560
Speaker 1: poorts along the coast um all struggled under his foreign

604
00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:07,920
Speaker 1: policies because of decisions that he made. And so I

605
00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:10,520
Speaker 1: think it's it's optimistic to get back to some of

606
00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:13,960
Speaker 1: the policies that that were in place under the Obama administration.

607
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 1: I don't know about all of them, but I definitely

608
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,840
Speaker 1: think there's more optimism than pessimism, at least among the

609
00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:22,160
Speaker 1: business community in those areas. All Right, switching gears, we

610
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,600
Speaker 1: have to talk about a huge, major development that has emerged,

611
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:27,240
Speaker 1: and it's something that we do deserve to talk about.

612
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:29,160
Speaker 1: And that is not just what's happening in Georgia, but

613
00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 1: the day after because January six, of course, is when

614
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:38,320
Speaker 1: the Senate will ratify the electoral College results. And as

615
00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:40,520
Speaker 1: we got an outline of from my colleague Garrick Kass

616
00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:45,200
Speaker 1: and Bloomberg Congressional reporter in the last hour, It's it

617
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:50,440
Speaker 1: really could prove to be a political theatrical moment on

618
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:54,440
Speaker 1: January six. But Senator Josh Holly has already said that

619
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:58,040
Speaker 1: he is looking to deliver some type of floor speech

620
00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:01,000
Speaker 1: that could last up to two hours per state. But

621
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:03,120
Speaker 1: there's only a handful of states that were that the

622
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:07,480
Speaker 1: President is questioning, and that could really put the spotlight

623
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 1: on Republican candidates, ash including people like Senator Ted Cruz,

624
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:17,360
Speaker 1: Vice President Mike Penn's, Senator Josh Holly, Mark Overrubio. The

625
00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:20,160
Speaker 1: list goes on and on, Tom Cotton, Mitt Romney. I mean,

626
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:24,560
Speaker 1: it really is shaping up to be the first dynamic

627
00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:27,640
Speaker 1: starting mark of what are you going to be looking

628
00:34:27,680 --> 00:34:31,480
Speaker 1: for as a Republican insider. Yeah, I mean, look, I

629
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:35,200
Speaker 1: hope ultimately, Um, there will be a few detractors like Holly,

630
00:34:35,280 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 1: but I think ultimately and I hope ultimately for our party,

631
00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:41,680
Speaker 1: we you know, we accept the results of the election

632
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:43,760
Speaker 1: and and just kind of use us as a moment

633
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,680
Speaker 1: to move on. Um. You know, I mean, look, making

634
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:49,320
Speaker 1: two hour speeches on the floor isn't going to change

635
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:52,440
Speaker 1: the final vote and so to me, it just it

636
00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 1: doesn't seem like you're actually gaining anything. I mean, maybe

637
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:58,640
Speaker 1: the grand standing politically helps you, but it doesn't help

638
00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 1: us as a party. And and I think really what

639
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:04,200
Speaker 1: we need is to pass that, figure out I guess,

640
00:35:04,239 --> 00:35:07,359
Speaker 1: except the vote UM, and then really figure out whether

641
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:10,160
Speaker 1: Trump has any future plans to run in I think

642
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:12,760
Speaker 1: the party split on whether he would, you know, continue

643
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:15,160
Speaker 1: to have his support, and I think some people who

644
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:17,640
Speaker 1: voted for him a lot, like myself, I was a

645
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:19,960
Speaker 1: big Trump supporter, but but honestly, at this point, I

646
00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:22,040
Speaker 1: think I'm ready to move on UM and see what's

647
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:24,560
Speaker 1: there for the future of our party. And so yeah,

648
00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:27,000
Speaker 1: I hope that's what happens UM, and I think there'll

649
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:29,560
Speaker 1: be some grand standing, but ultimately, you know, Joe Biden

650
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:32,600
Speaker 1: will be president on January. We've got sounds on this

651
00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:37,040
Speaker 1: topic coming from the transition scene briefing of the Biden administration.

652
00:35:37,080 --> 00:35:44,760
Speaker 1: Here's Jen Saki. This is merely a formality. It certainly

653
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:48,560
Speaker 1: should be treated as such by people who are covering it,

654
00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: and regardless of whatever antics anyone is up to, on

655
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:55,800
Speaker 1: January six, President elect Biden will be sworn in on

656
00:35:57,480 --> 00:36:00,399
Speaker 1: Drew Litman, Do you think the incoming administration is doing

657
00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:04,839
Speaker 1: everything that they can to move through this. I think

658
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,680
Speaker 1: that the incoming administration has actually played this pretty intelligently,

659
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:12,239
Speaker 1: and I think they've done the kind of conventional work

660
00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:15,600
Speaker 1: that you can do with that cooperation of the outgoing administration,

661
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:19,560
Speaker 1: like naming a cabinet, demonstrating that you have a cabinet

662
00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:25,480
Speaker 1: that represents America now, talking about getting a hundred vaccinations

663
00:36:25,480 --> 00:36:30,080
Speaker 1: in a hundred days once uh Biden is president, that

664
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 1: sort of thing where they're proceeding as if it's a

665
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:37,120
Speaker 1: foregone conclusion. Legally it is. But not getting down in

666
00:36:37,120 --> 00:36:40,160
Speaker 1: the mud with Trump and even with people like Holly

667
00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:42,520
Speaker 1: on a daily basis. All Right, we're gonna have to

668
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 1: leave it there. My sincereus gratitude to Drew Littman, policy

669
00:36:46,040 --> 00:36:48,759
Speaker 1: director at Brown Brownstein, Hyatt Farber and Shrek and former

670
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 1: chief of staff to Senator Ralph Frankin, and of course

671
00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:53,560
Speaker 1: to Ash Right a Dallas Cowboys then but a senior

672
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:57,000
Speaker 1: vice president of FSB Corps Strategies and senior political advisor

673
00:36:57,280 --> 00:36:59,640
Speaker 1: to George Pete Bush. Tell George to come on and

674
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:02,480
Speaker 1: talk with us. Ash. Happy new year to both of you.

675
00:37:02,600 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 1: And your families. Much more coming up next with Congressman

676
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:15,240
Speaker 1: Denver Riggleman. I'm Kevin Sirelli. You're listening to Bloomberg. This

677
00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:20,799
Speaker 1: is Bloomberg Sound On with Kevin Surreley on Bloomberg and

678
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:23,040
Speaker 1: one oh five point seven f M h D two.

679
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:26,480
Speaker 1: My name is Kevin Surreal. I'm the Chief Washington correspondent

680
00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:31,760
Speaker 1: for Bloomberg Television and for Bloomberg Radio. After nearly twenty

681
00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:38,399
Speaker 1: years serving in politics, the politician, before he returned home

682
00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:42,759
Speaker 1: to his home in Mount Vernon, decided to write a

683
00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:48,920
Speaker 1: letter to constituents, his friends and fellow citizens before leaving office.

684
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:52,720
Speaker 1: Of course, I'm talking about General George Washington, having served

685
00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 1: two terms in the presidency, and he published the letter

686
00:37:55,600 --> 00:38:01,600
Speaker 1: in one of America's first daily newspapers dubbed the American

687
00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:05,640
Speaker 1: Daily Advertiser, which was actually the publisher was John Dunlap,

688
00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:09,200
Speaker 1: who was one of the publishers that helped mass publicize

689
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 1: the Declaration of Independence. And it's been now known in

690
00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 1: the history books as George Washington's farewell address, in which

691
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:24,240
Speaker 1: he warns against foreign interference and of course against political parties.

692
00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:28,760
Speaker 1: I'll read now from our first president's first a portion

693
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:33,200
Speaker 1: of it, a line that that really feels important, as

694
00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:36,280
Speaker 1: Tom Keane would always tell me in the in this era,

695
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:39,920
Speaker 1: he writes, the political parties they serve to organize faction,

696
00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:43,839
Speaker 1: to give it an artificial and extraordinary force, to put

697
00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:47,800
Speaker 1: in the place of the delegated will of the nation,

698
00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:52,160
Speaker 1: the will of a party, often a small but artful

699
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:56,840
Speaker 1: and enterprising minority of the community, and, according to the

700
00:38:56,920 --> 00:39:01,480
Speaker 1: alternate triumphs of different parties, to make public administration the

701
00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:06,600
Speaker 1: mirror of the ill, concerted and incongruous projects of faction,

702
00:39:07,239 --> 00:39:11,839
Speaker 1: rather than the organ of consistent and wholesome plans digested

703
00:39:11,880 --> 00:39:17,160
Speaker 1: by common counsels and modified by mutual interests. Earlier this month,

704
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:20,880
Speaker 1: on December tenth, Congressman Denver Riggleman made the following remarks

705
00:39:20,920 --> 00:39:24,359
Speaker 1: on the House floor in his farewell address. My two

706
00:39:24,360 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 1: decades of intelligence, war fighting, and counter terrorism experience, coupled

707
00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:31,800
Speaker 1: with serving and Congress, is why I will not allow

708
00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:35,680
Speaker 1: conspiracy pellars to hijack our ability to conduct reasonable policy

709
00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 1: discussions for the betterment of all Americans. Just like creating

710
00:39:39,160 --> 00:39:42,880
Speaker 1: a vaccine to eradicate COVID nineteen, we must work together

711
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:51,080
Speaker 1: to inoculate against the social contagion of disinformation, conspiracies, anti semitism, dehumanization, racism,

712
00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:55,640
Speaker 1: deep state, cabald nonsense, cults, and those grifters posing his

713
00:39:55,760 --> 00:40:00,360
Speaker 1: servants of the people. Congressman Denver Riggleman joins us now

714
00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 1: and Congressmen have to say, just in the last couple

715
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:10,480
Speaker 1: of weeks, the Appomattox County Republican Committee passed a resolution

716
00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:15,280
Speaker 1: of censure against you for the remarks that you've been

717
00:40:15,320 --> 00:40:18,440
Speaker 1: making and the warning that you've been making with regards

718
00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:21,560
Speaker 1: to those sentiments that you conducted on the House floor.

719
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:26,799
Speaker 1: Your reaction, oh, I, um, you know, thanks Kevin. My

720
00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:28,960
Speaker 1: reaction when I saw the censorship and what they were

721
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:32,440
Speaker 1: actually centering me for actually does hearken back to what

722
00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:35,840
Speaker 1: you read from George Washington. It's the factions. It's the

723
00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:40,920
Speaker 1: parties that pollute real discourse between individuals. And the fact

724
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:44,359
Speaker 1: is is much of that and you know that what's

725
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:47,160
Speaker 1: scary about this as much of that resolution to center

726
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:50,960
Speaker 1: me was based on fantasy, It was based on conspiracy theories,

727
00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:54,200
Speaker 1: it was based on directed disinformation. And I find it

728
00:40:54,239 --> 00:40:57,680
Speaker 1: interesting that the very thing I thought that people should

729
00:40:57,719 --> 00:41:00,760
Speaker 1: be applauded for, which is fighting for the American people

730
00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:04,000
Speaker 1: in a facts based basis, where we're doing what's right

731
00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:07,920
Speaker 1: on the information that is real and verifiable and concrete.

732
00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:10,239
Speaker 1: Is the thing that you know, Kevin, over the last

733
00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:13,000
Speaker 1: two years has got me in the most trouble. And

734
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:14,960
Speaker 1: I think we have to have a time now that

735
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:17,799
Speaker 1: we fight, we fight for the American Republic in a

736
00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:21,880
Speaker 1: way that these sort of social media contagion, this this

737
00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:25,920
Speaker 1: digital disease that we have is eradicated through almost a

738
00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 1: digital inoculation of facts based analysis, machine learning right, and

739
00:41:30,160 --> 00:41:33,640
Speaker 1: the ability for public trust companies to highlight the evil

740
00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:35,960
Speaker 1: that we see out there. And and Kevin, I, you

741
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:37,480
Speaker 1: know what, I'm going to keep being me. And as

742
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:40,279
Speaker 1: far as the censorship from county committees, I have many

743
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:43,120
Speaker 1: of them. I'll hang them on my wall with pride,

744
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:46,040
Speaker 1: because I think that is really what defines me, is

745
00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:49,480
Speaker 1: that if I'm willing to get censured for using facts,

746
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:51,480
Speaker 1: I think that sort of separates me from a lot

747
00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:54,960
Speaker 1: of politicians. I'm reading from the censure that the appomatics

748
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:59,520
Speaker 1: County Republicans posted on their Facebook page with the document

749
00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 1: on there. If they're show Facebook page, and I'm gonna

750
00:42:01,320 --> 00:42:05,480
Speaker 1: quote from it quote whereas on October, during his appearance

751
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:09,600
Speaker 1: with CNN Denver, Riggelman made claims that he would consider

752
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:13,600
Speaker 1: voting for former Vice President Joe Biden for President of

753
00:42:13,600 --> 00:42:16,799
Speaker 1: the United States, stating in that very interview that the

754
00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:21,640
Speaker 1: actions of President Trump as irresponsible and dangerous and dangerous,

755
00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 1: as well as for refusal to denounce Q and On

756
00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:31,680
Speaker 1: that that's the part what first. First of all, for

757
00:42:31,719 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 1: those listening, I have to ask you to define for

758
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,120
Speaker 1: us what Q and On is sure to and On

759
00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:39,759
Speaker 1: started not long after Pizza Gate, and really it's a

760
00:42:39,880 --> 00:42:42,600
Speaker 1: it was a conspiracy theory that started as a deep

761
00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:45,759
Speaker 1: state cabal or deep state coup against the president run

762
00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:49,560
Speaker 1: by Democrats who happened to be Statan worshiping pedophiles. And

763
00:42:49,560 --> 00:42:52,480
Speaker 1: that's how they were funding this deep state cabal, almost

764
00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:55,680
Speaker 1: similar to blood libel, anti Semitism, like the protocols of

765
00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:58,279
Speaker 1: voters of Zion and to and on has become sort

766
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:01,960
Speaker 1: of a conspiracy theory sticky bomb, whether it's n s

767
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 1: a getting in the way of elections, whether it's martial

768
00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:08,680
Speaker 1: law being called for, whether it's in Germany, UH, the

769
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:11,879
Speaker 1: United States attacking the barracks there or a building there

770
00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:16,759
Speaker 1: to remove dominion voter machines. It is a massive conspiracy theory.

771
00:43:16,800 --> 00:43:18,800
Speaker 1: I want to simplify it, and I want to interrupt.

772
00:43:18,920 --> 00:43:21,680
Speaker 1: I want to interrupt. You use the word a sticky

773
00:43:21,920 --> 00:43:25,120
Speaker 1: a digital sticky bomb. That's that's you know. I still

774
00:43:25,160 --> 00:43:27,920
Speaker 1: think that the most no, no, but I think it's

775
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:32,520
Speaker 1: it's clear. I would argue that it provides horrific digital

776
00:43:32,680 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 1: vertigo to individuals, unknowingly clouding their vision. But but from

777
00:43:39,200 --> 00:43:44,480
Speaker 1: a simple term, what is what is the infectious disease

778
00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:47,640
Speaker 1: that is Q and on on the internet? Just just

779
00:43:47,880 --> 00:43:51,080
Speaker 1: not not explaining the conspiracy theory. That's where people get confused.

780
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 1: But what exactly is it chewing on? Is a conspiracy

781
00:43:57,080 --> 00:43:59,480
Speaker 1: theory on the internet that spread that way, whether it's

782
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:02,960
Speaker 1: from the chain ends or whether it's from shave, Twitter

783
00:44:03,080 --> 00:44:05,680
Speaker 1: or anything like that people on there that says that

784
00:44:05,719 --> 00:44:08,920
Speaker 1: there's a deep state coup and then attaches everything to

785
00:44:08,960 --> 00:44:10,920
Speaker 1: this deep state coup or this deep state at cabal

786
00:44:11,200 --> 00:44:13,880
Speaker 1: of deep state actors that are working against president. And

787
00:44:13,920 --> 00:44:16,040
Speaker 1: it's subtle. And that's the thing that I don't think

788
00:44:16,040 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 1: people understand is that it's subtle. It's not you go

789
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:22,200
Speaker 1: on a certain website, you click it, and people believe it.

790
00:44:22,200 --> 00:44:25,840
Speaker 1: It's logarithms, It attaches itself a tentacles very subtly, and

791
00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:29,080
Speaker 1: it sucks you in do a wormhole. So how can

792
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:34,080
Speaker 1: Republicans and Democrats work together to stamp this out of

793
00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:41,840
Speaker 1: America's intellectual discourse. What's gonna take courage, and it's gonna

794
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:45,879
Speaker 1: take a lack of partisanship. It's gonna take a nonpartisan

795
00:44:45,920 --> 00:44:49,239
Speaker 1: look at what's happening on the internet and how malignant

796
00:44:49,320 --> 00:44:51,560
Speaker 1: it is. And it's going to take people who are

797
00:44:51,560 --> 00:44:55,040
Speaker 1: willing to not get re elected to go against massive

798
00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:57,440
Speaker 1: groups of people who've been infected by this. I mean,

799
00:44:57,520 --> 00:44:59,880
Speaker 1: it's that simple, Kevin. And it's gonna it's gonna take

800
00:44:59,880 --> 00:45:02,880
Speaker 1: a massive amount of analysis. That's going to take away

801
00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 1: to to sort of overcome the algorithmic targeting, uh in

802
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:09,800
Speaker 1: the in the specific digital targeting of these individuals, but

803
00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:12,600
Speaker 1: people who are trapped in these echo chambers and who

804
00:45:12,600 --> 00:45:14,960
Speaker 1: are believing this, And I don't know where that courage

805
00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:17,399
Speaker 1: is right now, but it's gonna take. It's gonna take

806
00:45:17,480 --> 00:45:20,719
Speaker 1: an amazing amount of courage and facts based sort of

807
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:24,000
Speaker 1: beating people about the brains with it right to get

808
00:45:24,040 --> 00:45:26,719
Speaker 1: them to to turn off on this craziness. What what

809
00:45:26,760 --> 00:45:29,040
Speaker 1: can the private sector do? What does the private sector

810
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:32,719
Speaker 1: have to do well? I'm doing it. I joined the

811
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 1: Network Contagion Research Institute, the n c r I. We're

812
00:45:35,800 --> 00:45:39,840
Speaker 1: doing fact space analysis, using metal traffic analysis, social network analogies,

813
00:45:39,960 --> 00:45:42,359
Speaker 1: is something called pattern of life where we actually look

814
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:44,879
Speaker 1: at how the computer networks work. And what we're doing

815
00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:48,000
Speaker 1: is we're privately funding the sort of facts based way

816
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:50,640
Speaker 1: of trying to identify the conspiracy theories at the roots.

817
00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:53,760
Speaker 1: And I'll give you an example. Kevin Obama gate Septero Obama.

818
00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 1: You remember that how crazy that went back in May.

819
00:45:56,640 --> 00:46:00,920
Speaker 1: That started on Reddit forty four hours forty four hours,

820
00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:03,360
Speaker 1: forty to forty four hours after start on Reddit, it

821
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:06,520
Speaker 1: bubbled up from the bottom using centers of gravity, your

822
00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:09,920
Speaker 1: critical notes. People that actually pushed this toward the president

823
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:13,080
Speaker 1: tweeted something completely ridiculous less than forty eight hours after

824
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:15,360
Speaker 1: it bubbled up in the dark corners of the Internet.

825
00:46:15,560 --> 00:46:18,759
Speaker 1: It is sophisticated, it is subtle, it is sophisticated. This

826
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:21,760
Speaker 1: is how it works. And Kevin, you know, I've tried

827
00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:24,760
Speaker 1: to use data to beat people about the face and shoulders,

828
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:26,840
Speaker 1: like listen in a kind way, this is what we

829
00:46:26,880 --> 00:46:28,640
Speaker 1: got to do. But we're to a point that we're

830
00:46:28,640 --> 00:46:30,600
Speaker 1: gonna have to get pretty brutal on how we identify

831
00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:32,799
Speaker 1: these bad actors. We have to drag these vampires into

832
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:35,839
Speaker 1: the sunlight digitally, and I'm ready to do that. Stay

833
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:37,640
Speaker 1: with me, because coming up next, I want to get

834
00:46:37,640 --> 00:46:40,920
Speaker 1: more of your reaction Congressman Denver Riggleman, Republican from Virginia,

835
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:43,759
Speaker 1: outgoing congressman about this, and we've got much more to

836
00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:45,840
Speaker 1: talk about in terms of the future of Congress, what

837
00:46:46,000 --> 00:46:49,080
Speaker 1: you know as a congressman, what needs to change about

838
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:52,239
Speaker 1: the institution in and of itself, and more about your

839
00:46:52,320 --> 00:46:55,360
Speaker 1: future plans. Congressman Denver Riggleman joins us. He is the

840
00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:58,560
Speaker 1: course of Republican from Virginia, UH and really has found

841
00:46:58,640 --> 00:47:03,560
Speaker 1: himself as the emerging national voice on these issues pertaining

842
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:07,680
Speaker 1: to digital security and the digital conversation and and how

843
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:11,360
Speaker 1: did address the infrastructure. It's it's so much more complex

844
00:47:11,360 --> 00:47:14,759
Speaker 1: than just avoiding talking to your relative who has a

845
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:17,640
Speaker 1: different political party affiliation than you do. Stay with me, folks,

846
00:47:17,680 --> 00:47:20,600
Speaker 1: I'm Kevin Cereli, chief Washington correspondent for Bloomberg TV and Radio.

847
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:28,400
Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg nd I one, you're listening to

848
00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:33,200
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Sound On with Kevin Surrel on Bloomberg and one

849
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:36,560
Speaker 1: oh five point seven m h D two. I'm Kevin Surlei,

850
00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:39,440
Speaker 1: chief Washington correspondent for Bloomberg TV and Radio. Wishing you

851
00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:41,799
Speaker 1: and your family a safe, happy, and healthy new year.

852
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:46,080
Speaker 1: Congressman Denver Riggleman, Republican of Virginia's with me, outgoing Congressman. Congressman,

853
00:47:46,120 --> 00:47:49,799
Speaker 1: what's your new Year's resolution? Oh, my goodness, My new

854
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 1: year's resolution to spend some time with my grandchildren, more

855
00:47:52,560 --> 00:47:56,400
Speaker 1: time than I have. That's also that's yeah, that's my

856
00:47:56,480 --> 00:47:58,840
Speaker 1: new year's resolution. I got two brand new grand babies

857
00:47:58,960 --> 00:48:01,200
Speaker 1: with two weeks of are. Two of my three daughters

858
00:48:01,200 --> 00:48:03,440
Speaker 1: had kids right next to each other, and so I've

859
00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:05,800
Speaker 1: been spending a lot of time with them. That's very awesome.

860
00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:09,200
Speaker 1: Why should why should there be a why should hate

861
00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:13,399
Speaker 1: speech be able to be spread on social media platforms

862
00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:19,040
Speaker 1: when you rightfully cannot do so on a television network. Yeah,

863
00:48:19,040 --> 00:48:21,759
Speaker 1: I mean that's that's been the question, right is, is

864
00:48:21,760 --> 00:48:24,279
Speaker 1: where does the First Amendment begin and end? And you know,

865
00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:26,239
Speaker 1: I've had this discussion, Kevin, and you know me and

866
00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:28,600
Speaker 1: you have talked about this is that I think the

867
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:31,600
Speaker 1: only way, um that we can fight that is to

868
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:34,560
Speaker 1: use the First Amendment to our advantage. Right. But the

869
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:36,560
Speaker 1: issue that we have, and I think that's where we

870
00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:39,000
Speaker 1: get with hate speech, is that and but it's not

871
00:48:39,080 --> 00:48:41,719
Speaker 1: just hate speech, right, It's it's beyond that. It's it's

872
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:46,479
Speaker 1: actually sort of egregious grievance politics based on conspiracy theories

873
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:49,239
Speaker 1: that are so outlandish they're hard to believe from sort

874
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:51,279
Speaker 1: of people that are living in a fact based world

875
00:48:51,360 --> 00:48:54,239
Speaker 1: right now. The issue is a number of ways that

876
00:48:54,360 --> 00:48:59,080
Speaker 1: you can mainline disinformation directly into your brain. And if

877
00:48:59,080 --> 00:49:00,960
Speaker 1: you think about Twitter and Facebook, I was like, well,

878
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:04,279
Speaker 1: there's Twitter, there's Facebook, there's Instagram for sort of the

879
00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:07,680
Speaker 1: legacy platforms. But you also have gab, you have Parlor,

880
00:49:07,760 --> 00:49:09,680
Speaker 1: you have bits Shoot, you have Rumble Kevin, you have

881
00:49:09,920 --> 00:49:13,960
Speaker 1: obviously YouTube, you have encrypted image ports, you have message poorts,

882
00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:16,120
Speaker 1: you have people who do use email. You know, you

883
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:19,480
Speaker 1: have all these electronic ways of spreading this information. And

884
00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:21,200
Speaker 1: I think that's the fear that I have is we're

885
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:23,680
Speaker 1: at the time now that there's never been so many

886
00:49:23,719 --> 00:49:27,480
Speaker 1: ways to lock yourself into a digital echo chamber, and

887
00:49:27,520 --> 00:49:32,560
Speaker 1: I don't know how to fix that right now. I

888
00:49:32,640 --> 00:49:35,800
Speaker 1: do you think there's an educational components of this, because

889
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:40,880
Speaker 1: if our generation, if baby boomer generation, doesn't understand the

890
00:49:40,920 --> 00:49:44,879
Speaker 1: digital infrastructure in which this hate speeches spreading, how can

891
00:49:44,920 --> 00:49:48,440
Speaker 1: we educate the news the up and coming generation to

892
00:49:48,560 --> 00:49:52,040
Speaker 1: be on the lookout for this. That's a great question

893
00:49:52,080 --> 00:49:54,360
Speaker 1: because I was talking to something about can we have

894
00:49:54,400 --> 00:49:57,040
Speaker 1: a curriculum either at the university level at the high

895
00:49:57,040 --> 00:50:00,160
Speaker 1: school level that teaches disinformation? But I don't of you.

896
00:50:00,200 --> 00:50:01,799
Speaker 1: I think it's Sweden, and you might want to just

897
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:04,959
Speaker 1: make sure I'm gonna remember everything that I read. Um

898
00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:10,600
Speaker 1: Sweden say maybe have disinformation centers, and those disinformation centers

899
00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:13,759
Speaker 1: actually go out and try to fight disinformation at the

900
00:50:13,760 --> 00:50:16,279
Speaker 1: computer level, at the baseline level of the node level.

901
00:50:16,320 --> 00:50:19,920
Speaker 1: The person right who's getting fed this this garbage. And

902
00:50:19,960 --> 00:50:21,920
Speaker 1: I think we have to figure out, as a country

903
00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:26,279
Speaker 1: with three million people, how we fight this garbage at

904
00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:29,520
Speaker 1: the bit level, at the node level, where we attack

905
00:50:29,600 --> 00:50:33,080
Speaker 1: it with everything we have with fact based sort of information.

906
00:50:33,120 --> 00:50:35,160
Speaker 1: But you know, we're trying to figure that out. But

907
00:50:35,200 --> 00:50:37,799
Speaker 1: I do think there's an education component at the high

908
00:50:37,840 --> 00:50:39,919
Speaker 1: school level. I would say it at the university level,

909
00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:43,880
Speaker 1: and how disinformation spreads in this network that we have today,

910
00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:48,239
Speaker 1: and listen, I'm not hardly is the mainstream media immune

911
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:54,759
Speaker 1: from criticism, especially political journalists of the current era. How

912
00:50:54,800 --> 00:50:57,880
Speaker 1: do you tell? How do you offer this? And if

913
00:50:57,880 --> 00:51:00,960
Speaker 1: I'm struggling with questions, it's because I've believe that this

914
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:04,239
Speaker 1: is an important and delicate topic. How do you respond

915
00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:07,960
Speaker 1: to someone on the left or the right who is

916
00:51:08,680 --> 00:51:12,920
Speaker 1: scrolling through their phone and consuming what they feel is

917
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:17,920
Speaker 1: factual information. Maybe it's a meme, maybe it's an article.

918
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:22,799
Speaker 1: How do you dig past the impulse of consuming that

919
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:27,759
Speaker 1: information to educate that person to say, listen, this is

920
00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:34,520
Speaker 1: actually being pedled by foreign adversaries. Source. You know, I

921
00:51:34,520 --> 00:51:37,920
Speaker 1: find it interesting. People will um even congressman. I had

922
00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:39,799
Speaker 1: a concressman say, my god, Demna, I did not know

923
00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:43,520
Speaker 1: I retweeted a q an account, right right? Say that again?

924
00:51:43,560 --> 00:51:47,960
Speaker 1: You had a lawmaker in Congress tell you privately that

925
00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:51,520
Speaker 1: they didn't know they retweeted a Q and on account.

926
00:51:51,560 --> 00:51:54,319
Speaker 1: Go ahead, Let that sink in, folks, go ahead. That

927
00:51:54,440 --> 00:51:56,560
Speaker 1: is correct, That is correct. And I've had a lot

928
00:51:56,560 --> 00:51:59,399
Speaker 1: of people asking me how do I stop this? How

929
00:51:59,400 --> 00:52:02,600
Speaker 1: do I know there's one word that I hope everybody

930
00:52:02,640 --> 00:52:05,600
Speaker 1: if there's anything from this conversation, Kevin, here's the word.

931
00:52:05,680 --> 00:52:07,279
Speaker 1: And you notice a journalist. And when I say it,

932
00:52:07,280 --> 00:52:09,960
Speaker 1: you're gonna say, of course, so that was an intelligence officer.

933
00:52:10,040 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 1: It's source sourcing. If you're scrolling and you're about to

934
00:52:15,320 --> 00:52:19,720
Speaker 1: retweet that says Gateway Pundit, that's shite, right, that's crap.

935
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 1: You have to look at the source of where it's

936
00:52:21,920 --> 00:52:24,359
Speaker 1: coming from. And when you talk about the media, you

937
00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:28,040
Speaker 1: have the media has such an important role here Bloomberg,

938
00:52:28,440 --> 00:52:33,680
Speaker 1: major networks, cable right to absolutely report the truth regardless

939
00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:36,840
Speaker 1: of the circumstances. And it's so hard and and you know,

940
00:52:37,120 --> 00:52:39,120
Speaker 1: and I was thinking about this when people say, well,

941
00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:41,880
Speaker 1: why is a politician afraid of their base? You know,

942
00:52:41,920 --> 00:52:44,080
Speaker 1: why wouldn't they say what's true no matter what, just

943
00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:47,200
Speaker 1: like media has to report something that's unpopular. Can you

944
00:52:47,200 --> 00:52:49,640
Speaker 1: imagine me going to Appomattox County right now with sixty

945
00:52:49,640 --> 00:52:52,080
Speaker 1: people in a committee meeting and say, listen, the crack

946
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:55,080
Speaker 1: in isn't real. I would be running at people would

947
00:52:55,120 --> 00:52:58,520
Speaker 1: be screaming and cursing and running me out of that

948
00:52:58,560 --> 00:53:01,640
Speaker 1: meeting because they're involved in this. It's the same thing

949
00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:04,800
Speaker 1: with media. You have to look at the source. I

950
00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:07,160
Speaker 1: I would, I would humbly submit not just the first source,

951
00:53:07,200 --> 00:53:09,439
Speaker 1: but the source beneath it. And that's what I try

952
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:14,239
Speaker 1: to do. And primary sources, primary sources. You have to

953
00:53:14,280 --> 00:53:17,279
Speaker 1: look at the source. And if it sounds funny, it

954
00:53:17,400 --> 00:53:20,480
Speaker 1: probably is funny. And I've made mistakes and I'll go

955
00:53:20,520 --> 00:53:22,359
Speaker 1: back in admitute like I didn't source it all the way.

956
00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:26,080
Speaker 1: I'm usually not wrong, right, But again, sourcing is so important.

957
00:53:26,120 --> 00:53:28,560
Speaker 1: If you make a mistake, you immediately corrected. And a

958
00:53:28,560 --> 00:53:31,000
Speaker 1: politician won't do that because that's gonna hurt their fundraising.

959
00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:33,320
Speaker 1: But that's what you gotta do. You have got to

960
00:53:33,320 --> 00:53:35,839
Speaker 1: look at the source first. And anything you're looking at,

961
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:39,319
Speaker 1: you know I should. Congressman Denver Riggleman's with me. I

962
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:41,279
Speaker 1: want to I want to move beyond that. And this

963
00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:43,879
Speaker 1: is also a delicate question. But because you're you're you're

964
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:45,920
Speaker 1: no longer going to be in office. I feel like

965
00:53:45,960 --> 00:53:48,560
Speaker 1: you've been a lie. You've you've even been more chatty

966
00:53:48,680 --> 00:53:50,720
Speaker 1: than even you were, and you were always pretty chatty.

967
00:53:50,880 --> 00:53:54,400
Speaker 1: But I I gotta ask you from an American perspective,

968
00:53:54,480 --> 00:53:57,120
Speaker 1: these are issues that should unify us. This should be

969
00:53:57,600 --> 00:54:00,440
Speaker 1: something that unites Republicans and Democrats. I'm not talking from

970
00:54:00,440 --> 00:54:04,560
Speaker 1: the cereally soapbox. This should unite people. And yet because

971
00:54:04,600 --> 00:54:08,919
Speaker 1: of our party structure, there are other countries. Dare I say,

972
00:54:09,000 --> 00:54:12,000
Speaker 1: China where they have a hundred fifty year plan, A

973
00:54:12,080 --> 00:54:15,239
Speaker 1: hundred year plan? Does the United States? How does the

974
00:54:15,320 --> 00:54:20,719
Speaker 1: United States get to an area of agreements where it's

975
00:54:20,760 --> 00:54:25,920
Speaker 1: not centrism policies in terms of economics, but actually standards

976
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:29,400
Speaker 1: on something like this for example, or five G for example,

977
00:54:29,960 --> 00:54:34,319
Speaker 1: that is an American strategy. So I had a UM,

978
00:54:34,560 --> 00:54:36,959
Speaker 1: I was I'm running an outed about that right now.

979
00:54:37,080 --> 00:54:39,239
Speaker 1: And what I'm looking at is there's has to be

980
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:44,080
Speaker 1: treaties or agreements with foreign countries on what disinformation looks

981
00:54:44,120 --> 00:54:46,320
Speaker 1: like and how we combat it. Also, when I was

982
00:54:46,360 --> 00:54:48,879
Speaker 1: in the Pentagon, and sorry, you're in my wheelhouse right now, Kevin,

983
00:54:48,920 --> 00:54:51,760
Speaker 1: I really enjoyed when I was Pedagon, when we were

984
00:54:51,880 --> 00:54:55,000
Speaker 1: when we were talking about, UM, how we how information

985
00:54:55,080 --> 00:54:58,160
Speaker 1: is inserted into our critical infrastructure or of our critical

986
00:54:58,239 --> 00:55:01,960
Speaker 1: infrastructure is attacked. We need an offensive capability where it's

987
00:55:02,000 --> 00:55:05,239
Speaker 1: almost I would say, and I'm not again, this is

988
00:55:05,320 --> 00:55:07,480
Speaker 1: this is things that are being discussed in the d

989
00:55:07,680 --> 00:55:11,240
Speaker 1: D in the intelligence community, But we need a nonproportional

990
00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:15,880
Speaker 1: response to disinformation, whether it's foreign or internal. And that's

991
00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:19,120
Speaker 1: really what it comes down to, is our critical infrastructure.

992
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:22,279
Speaker 1: People that we love, you know, people that that that

993
00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:24,719
Speaker 1: we we respect, a lot of these people are being

994
00:55:24,760 --> 00:55:26,799
Speaker 1: overtaken by this. But the thing is is that our

995
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:30,360
Speaker 1: critical infrastructures are also at risk. We can't become a

996
00:55:30,400 --> 00:55:33,360
Speaker 1: country that's so dumbed down that we can't even have

997
00:55:33,400 --> 00:55:36,239
Speaker 1: a discussion on policy. This is a ripple effect. It's

998
00:55:36,280 --> 00:55:39,239
Speaker 1: a cascading effect of awfulness that starts with at the

999
00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:43,759
Speaker 1: at the person level and sort of expands into I

1000
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:46,480
Speaker 1: would say, the infrastructure level. And I don't And I

1001
00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:50,319
Speaker 1: feel like, right now is such an incredible time. Why

1002
00:55:50,400 --> 00:55:54,640
Speaker 1: aren't we, Kevin, why aren't we mobilizing against conspiratorial gas

1003
00:55:54,680 --> 00:55:57,640
Speaker 1: bags like Mike Flynn who called for martial law right

1004
00:55:57,760 --> 00:55:59,920
Speaker 1: a retired three star, Why aren't we doing that? Or

1005
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:03,360
Speaker 1: Thomas McInerney who said that n s A and planted

1006
00:56:03,440 --> 00:56:06,320
Speaker 1: code into machines. Why aren't we doing this? Why aren't

1007
00:56:06,320 --> 00:56:09,719
Speaker 1: we mobilizing against conspiracy theories? That said Joe Biden killed

1008
00:56:09,719 --> 00:56:12,200
Speaker 1: Seal Team six, or that Osama bin Lana had a

1009
00:56:12,200 --> 00:56:16,520
Speaker 1: body double, or there's nuclear isotope watermarks. On balance, this

1010
00:56:16,600 --> 00:56:20,279
Speaker 1: is all unmedicated shite. It's bullcraft. But again, we have

1011
00:56:20,320 --> 00:56:23,520
Speaker 1: people pushing this for fundraising for griff. They are destroying

1012
00:56:23,560 --> 00:56:26,320
Speaker 1: the American people and the confidence we have in our government,

1013
00:56:26,320 --> 00:56:29,560
Speaker 1: and we have got to turn around now. We've got

1014
00:56:29,600 --> 00:56:33,200
Speaker 1: to turn around now. Congressman Denver Riggleman, a Republican from Virginia,

1015
00:56:33,320 --> 00:56:36,480
Speaker 1: joining us in his final days serving in the United

1016
00:56:36,480 --> 00:56:39,040
Speaker 1: States House of Representatives. Happy New Year to you and

1017
00:56:39,040 --> 00:56:42,200
Speaker 1: your grandkids. Congressman. I'm Kevin CURRELLI, Chief Washington correspondent for

1018
00:56:42,200 --> 00:56:54,440
Speaker 1: Bloomberg TV and radio. You're listening to Bloomberg and Nigent one.