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Speaker 1: This is me eat your podcast, coming at you, shirtless,

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Speaker 1: severely bug bitten, and in my case, underwear listening uncast.

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Speaker 1: You can't predict anything presented by First Light, creating proven

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Speaker 1: versatile hunting apparel from Marino bass layers to technical outerwear

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Speaker 1: for every hunt, first Light, go farther, stay longer. All right,

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Speaker 1: but I'm gonna I'm gonna set the scene for you.

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Speaker 1: We're in um hotel in Albuquerque, Chester Dirt and Rick

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Speaker 1: her own bed together, pretty nice. Carl's in his own bed.

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Speaker 1: I gotta bed to myself. It's weird that, like, you

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Speaker 1: got your own bed, but then there's three of them

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Speaker 1: in that bed. I might still be smelling bad man.

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Speaker 1: That could have something to do with it. Seth, Is

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Speaker 1: that that that that's car? That's that's a seemed frequent guest,

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Speaker 1: Carl Malcolm. Seth is sitting on a little you call

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Speaker 1: that thing now ottoman. Yeah, using the bed as a desk.

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Speaker 1: And I'm one of those little hotel desks, which I

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Speaker 1: can't bring myself to use generally. This is something kind

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Speaker 1: of depressing about him. I do it in bed, when

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Speaker 1: I got it, when I'm in a hotel, I type

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Speaker 1: in bed. She looked like it just looks like your office,

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Speaker 1: I know, And I got this little coffee making you're

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Speaker 1: breaking a big story. There's a beautiful Uh. I appreciate

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Speaker 1: the pinon cone framed art on the wall over there.

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Speaker 1: That's a nice touch for the Southwest. No, it is good.

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Speaker 1: It's got a Southwest vibe in here. We're coming off

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Speaker 1: of a um, wonderful turkey hunt in the Helo Wilderness,

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Speaker 1: which we're gonna dive into the significance of that wilderness

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Speaker 1: and wilderness is in general. Um, first off, I got

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Speaker 1: to talked about a couple of things. Uh, someone Chester

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Speaker 1: how many tests my meat submissions came in? I heard

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Speaker 1: that just that I checked that morning the podcast came

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Speaker 1: out and we had Corey said we had test my

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Speaker 1: meat submissions. Is that true? Well, I don't get all

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Speaker 1: of them, and I actually haven't had a chance to

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Speaker 1: really go through all my emails yet, just because we're

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Speaker 1: on the road. Um, but on the trail, on the trail,

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Speaker 1: this is the hotel creamer, I'm not I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I probably have fifteen, but I don't think Corey sending

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Speaker 1: me all of them. Just and then you got, um,

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Speaker 1: you got criticized by a Warner. What we're talking about

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Speaker 1: is our our metiat or laboratories, which we started out Jesse.

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Speaker 1: You don't even know yet, buddy, I got a surprise

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Speaker 1: for you. When you see your lab coat. That would

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Speaker 1: be a good look for Chester. It is for some reason,

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Speaker 1: I'm slightly afraid I went with the most appropriate Chester nickname.

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Speaker 1: Oh you're gonna be very very happy. I wasn't gonna

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Speaker 1: tell you, but I can't keep bit of secret most appropriate.

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Speaker 1: That's good, Chester the Tester me eat your laboratoryes patch

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Speaker 1: and chest of the tester embroidered on your life. Couldn't

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Speaker 1: I couldn't know. I'm not good. I couldn't keep the

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Speaker 1: secret an longer. That's killing me. So we have a

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Speaker 1: warm telling telling the machine we have Chester and what

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Speaker 1: we've been doing with it. It's a Warner Bratsler sheer

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Speaker 1: force machine. We do not have it in the hotel

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Speaker 1: with us. Basically, keep it real simple, it is it.

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Speaker 1: It's like a scale and it's got a blade, and

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Speaker 1: the blade slices the meat or shears the meat, and

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Speaker 1: that scale will give you the pounds of force that

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Speaker 1: it takes two slice through that. And there's this whole

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Speaker 1: scale on tenderness, and we're getting a bunch of submissions

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Speaker 1: in for wild game testing out how tender your wild

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Speaker 1: game is. Some people are more interesting, how tough it

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Speaker 1: is personally? Yeah, yeah, well here's the deal, dirt. It's

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Speaker 1: a little tricky. So yeah, I'm gonna get there in

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Speaker 1: one second. Like you bide into your buddy comes home

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Speaker 1: and he's like, man, that elk I shot was tough. Hell,

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Speaker 1: let's role play. You tell me, Um, you do it

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Speaker 1: to me, Steve, I shot at elk in New Mexico

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Speaker 1: in the wilderness, and I got that thing back, and man,

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Speaker 1: was it tough. Sit. It's not like that elk that

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Speaker 1: I shot up in Montana. You want to see tough,

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Speaker 1: you should taste some of my aw dad. Oh shit,

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Speaker 1: If you want to see tough, man, you should test

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Speaker 1: that twenty year old bear I shot. Well, you know what,

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Speaker 1: let's send it to me either laboratories and find out

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Speaker 1: who's is actually tough. Te my meat? What is it

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Speaker 1: you send it to send it to? No, Okay, let's

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Speaker 1: keep the role play going. I'm gonna I'm gonna retort. Yeah, well,

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Speaker 1: ship Chester, let's send it. Let's submit our proposal at

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Speaker 1: meat eater at the meat eater dot com with the

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Speaker 1: subject line all caps test my meat. I bet you

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Speaker 1: mine is going to be tougher than yours, and Chester

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Speaker 1: the tester will review your submission and decide if you

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Speaker 1: should submit your sample or not. Yep, and then we're

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Speaker 1: gonna give a prize to the toughest game meat that

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Speaker 1: we can get our hands on. It's gonna be a

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Speaker 1: heck of a good time. Hopefully I don't. There's I'm

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Speaker 1: already getting look at work on that one on the plane.

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Speaker 1: Can you think of a better retort? It's gonna be

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Speaker 1: a heck of a good time. There's uh, you should

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Speaker 1: put that on his lap coat. There's already it's long,

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Speaker 1: so down towards the bottom. I could say it's gonna

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Speaker 1: be a heck. There's already people writing in like saying

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Speaker 1: like we better do this right because there's so many variables.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Jess has already been accused in the in

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Speaker 1: keeping with the times, he's already been accused of spreading misinformation.

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Speaker 1: But this isn't about COVID. This is about meat testing. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, we tested a peep. How serious can it

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Speaker 1: really be? But I can guarantee you guys, I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: do my absolute best to make sure everything is as

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Speaker 1: accurate as possible. There's gonna be some bribery sent your

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Speaker 1: way there, chet, So what here's what they do. Here's

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Speaker 1: the conundrum, dirt. Then we'll move on just because just

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Speaker 1: keep you posting. This is a very expensive machine. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So we can't just do it once in dropics. That

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Speaker 1: would be fiscally irresponsible. So we need to do it

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Speaker 1: a whole bunch to justify having bought this damn thing

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Speaker 1: very expensive. Um, here's the thing. Here's where you out

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Speaker 1: of conundrum. If you're doing it like for real. Um,

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Speaker 1: Like you're like breeding cattle and trying to find like

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Speaker 1: what cow, what attributes whatever, diet genetics, whatever yields the

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Speaker 1: most tender blank t bone. You want great uniformity, So

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Speaker 1: they always cook the meat to the same temperature, Let

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Speaker 1: it cool overnight, cut the core, test the core, so

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Speaker 1: and doing the game meat thing. Do you stick to

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Speaker 1: that or do you do a thing where like, well,

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Speaker 1: let's do it like how one would best prepare it.

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Speaker 1: And then and then to tell people that because these

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Speaker 1: are two different interesting lines of inquiry. One is like,

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Speaker 1: because this gives a numeric value to toughness. What's like

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Speaker 1: super ass tough chester five five is superasst I mean, yeah,

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Speaker 1: five is tough. Unacceptable. Yeah, in industry terms, it's unacceptable.

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Speaker 1: What's acceptable in industry terms? Um, I think around like

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Speaker 1: two point five? Like three. It's like, and I've seen

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Speaker 1: some bulls that are if five at the top, I've

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Speaker 1: seen some sixes. Okay, yeah, so you you you get it,

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Speaker 1: and you test all these different game needs and be like, yes,

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Speaker 1: cooked to like labs SPACs. It's this. But there's an

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Speaker 1: interesting line of inquiry where you let's say someone has

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Speaker 1: a the toughest bull in the world or buck in

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Speaker 1: the world. Okay, and you're like, let's suevied a steak

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Speaker 1: and then reverse syrit and tests that result versus putting

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Speaker 1: a cold, wet, half frozen steak on a five degree

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Speaker 1: grill and and then be like, right, like what strategies

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Speaker 1: does one? Like what what might be the outcome once

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Speaker 1: you have a tough ask bowl? Or we do this,

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Speaker 1: you take the tough ask bowl. Let's say someone sends

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Speaker 1: you around off a really tough bowl. We'll test it

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Speaker 1: labs backs. Then we'd have like Kevin glaspie, cook it

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Speaker 1: a handful of ways and test those and see, follow me,

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Speaker 1: that's a good idea. Yeah that man, that's the worst

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Speaker 1: case scenario, best case scenario, and in all these and

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Speaker 1: then tell them how you already got in trouble telling

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Speaker 1: the guy. Do you want to talk about the guy

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Speaker 1: that sent you a mean email? Real quick? Would you

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Speaker 1: compare a bear then to an elk or would it

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Speaker 1: be elk category? Here's what here's the beauty of the

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Speaker 1: thing is. You could then say, yeah, you could take

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Speaker 1: what do you gotta do, like, how do you you

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Speaker 1: cook it to? What? Acording to labs backs, Well, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't really matter. I mean, sure it does, but I

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Speaker 1: was cooking it medium rare, so I just did that

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Speaker 1: one last time. But I think all of them will

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Speaker 1: be cooked to what's medium rare temp typically on like

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Speaker 1: a steak. I'm sorry, medium rare or I think over there,

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Speaker 1: I think I think what we'll do is like suvit

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Speaker 1: um to temp very similar size of meat and then

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Speaker 1: quick reverse serum so they'll all be very consistent. And

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Speaker 1: then you cut core samples. There's like a little mechanism

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Speaker 1: where you cut course samples out. You're supposed to cut

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Speaker 1: three cores. And here's the internet of thing we already

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Speaker 1: found out. Um, if you if it's rare in the

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Speaker 1: middle and you cut a core, you know, have a

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Speaker 1: core like imagine you have a cylinder. Let's say you

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Speaker 1: have a cylinder. Like let's just imagine it's your finger. Okay,

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Speaker 1: your middle knuckle is pink, let's say, and the ends

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Speaker 1: are more brown where you sheer, you're getting different scores.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, like that more cook shit is scoring to nose.

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Speaker 1: So like taking a core sample out of that middle

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Speaker 1: parallel with the grain, not perpendicular, because then yeah, there

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Speaker 1: you're cutting cross obviously. But yeah, some guy wrote in

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Speaker 1: just I don't need to go into it, but he

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Speaker 1: was just saying, like, it's very difficult to do accurate

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Speaker 1: tests like this. Was he making a play to be

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Speaker 1: the person that was he making a play to be

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Speaker 1: Chester the Tester? No, he was just basically saying, like information.

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Speaker 1: Someone wrote in, Um, this is interesting. He decided to google.

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Speaker 1: He googled Chester the Tester, and I'm disappointed to find

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Speaker 1: in this will change over time. Disappointed. I'll disappoint to

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Speaker 1: find that when you google Chest of the Tester, you

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Speaker 1: do not find Chest of the tester. You find a

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Speaker 1: ceramic figuring of a rotund, pudgy little chef testing licking

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Speaker 1: a spoon that he has dipped into a vat called

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Speaker 1: Heavenly Chocolate. The figuring in like a little I got

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Speaker 1: to look it into it more. Chester is gonna we

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Speaker 1: need to get one of them son's bitches. Chester. Um,

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Speaker 1: that's the logo Brandon Butler. Who. So, I'm gonna give

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Speaker 1: a Brandon Butler update to remind you guys who Brandon

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Speaker 1: Butler is one He's been on the podcast. Uh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I need I have hunted turkeys for him. We would

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Speaker 1: call him very much a friend to the show. Sometime back,

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Speaker 1: some friends of his were raising money for him because

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Speaker 1: he reported some poachers who then burned his cabin down. Whoa,

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Speaker 1: the guy that burned his cabin down just went back

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Speaker 1: to prison on a five year stint. But not for

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Speaker 1: the arson Brandon. This is a This is a this

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Speaker 1: is a teaser because brand is gonna come back on

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Speaker 1: the show to tell this whole sort of is a

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Speaker 1: crazy story. It involves a five ft three pound guy

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Speaker 1: named Tiny Round. Now listen, I was gonna give you

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna weet your appetites here for how if

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Speaker 1: you're gonna commit a crime, America is the country to

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Speaker 1: do it in, man America, Like, like, this is a

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Speaker 1: great place to be a criminal. They just don't do

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Speaker 1: anything to you here. So can we have murder in

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Speaker 1: this country? So none of this guy? This guy burns

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Speaker 1: down his place. How do you know that he's not

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Speaker 1: sleeping there? Burns down his place. He gets him on

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Speaker 1: trail cam burning it down, and he's not even in

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Speaker 1: jail for burning it down. Tiny's the arsonist or that

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Speaker 1: he'll he'll tell the whole story. I just like that

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Speaker 1: little detail. So he also broke into this other dude's cabin,

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Speaker 1: was living in the cabin, left his pro left his

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Speaker 1: parole papers in the cabin after stealing a four wheeler

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Speaker 1: and a generator. Okay, pleads guilty of to that, and

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Speaker 1: that constitutes a Class C felon. But he's already fell anyway.

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Speaker 1: But that constitutes a Class C felon. Burning Brandon's entire

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Speaker 1: house down, on the other hand, is a Class D felony.

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Speaker 1: Have they convicted him on both? He get to serve

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Speaker 1: those things. Concurrently, great country to commit crimes in, Like,

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Speaker 1: if you're gonna go do something bad, do too bad

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Speaker 1: things because you just do it concurrently. Anyways, it's ridiculous. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna read like a pamphlet. You know, we're gonna

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Speaker 1: do that book. Um, hunters making the cover for the book.

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Speaker 1: The book is called right if we talked about four?

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Speaker 1: But he's making the cover for the book. We're starting

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Speaker 1: with the cover. It's the books called how could I

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Speaker 1: Be Cold but my balls are balls are still sweaty?

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Speaker 1: How could I be cold but my balls are still sweaty?

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Speaker 1: The Untold Truth about Sleeping Bags? And this is gonna

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Speaker 1: be how could I be cold when my balls are sweaty?

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Speaker 1: Truth about Sleeping Bags? But I think I should write

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Speaker 1: a pamphlet like that, says UM. So you'd like to

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Speaker 1: commit some crimes, it would be tips for criminals. Apparently

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Speaker 1: if you do two really bad things, it doesn't matter

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Speaker 1: because you only get to go to jail for one

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Speaker 1: of them. Oh my god, man, Um, he's gonna come

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Speaker 1: in and tell this is this story is great. Oh,

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Speaker 1: just to titillate you a little more. Um. They also

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Speaker 1: burned down a ranger station like a Forest Service ranger station.

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Speaker 1: Burned down a Forest Service ranger station. Same individual. They

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Speaker 1: felt like they were being persecuted when they started looking

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Speaker 1: into their poaching habitat and the just terrible people. And

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Speaker 1: they didn't He didn't get in trouble for that. You know,

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Speaker 1: he's in five years. If you back, I'll burning more

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Speaker 1: ship down. Gosh, I would think, like destroying federal property,

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Speaker 1: great country to commit crimes and it would be a

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Speaker 1: bigger deal. What a jerk. Well, you know, we're cleaning

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Speaker 1: that turkey the other day and I had blood. I

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Speaker 1: was plucking a turkey. I had blood in my hands

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Speaker 1: and the feathers kept sticking in my hands. Yeah, you

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Speaker 1: got me thinking about getting tired and feathered. Oh it

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Speaker 1: would be a good let's bring that ship back. But

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Speaker 1: I think cutting appendages and shipped off should come back.

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Speaker 1: We talked about this in the car. For theft. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like for burning ship down, you should lose your your

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Speaker 1: thumb that you strike that you roll the lighter with,

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Speaker 1: or maybe get a burn. Yeah, caught your thumbofs. You

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Speaker 1: can't work a big light anymore. Burn your other figure tips. Uh. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm kind of hard on. I'm

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Speaker 1: hard on. Uh, you know, like that kind of like

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Speaker 1: potentially fate like burning people's houses. Now it feels bad,

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Speaker 1: just old fashioned with on every everyone. Everyone should see

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Speaker 1: the same. Everyone should see that the same way you do. Well,

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Speaker 1: it's it's personal to me too, because Um, he had

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Speaker 1: so many cool like hunting and fishing artifacts and stuff

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Speaker 1: in there that he lost, like really cool stuff in there.

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Speaker 1: He built the place, but he built a place by hand. Man. Um,

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Speaker 1: he's coming on top about that. Guy rode into This

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Speaker 1: is interesting because I've I've noticed this a bunch, I

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Speaker 1: haven't thought about it much. He um recently discovered, Um,

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Speaker 1: a raccoon latrine. Uh, I'm sure the group was gonna

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Speaker 1: think of a bunch of animals that use communal latrines.

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Speaker 1: Uh nil No, nil. Guy used communal latrines that are

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Speaker 1: as big as a queen'size bed and actually forms a hill. Yep,

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Speaker 1: what's that? Llamas? Yeah, but I was gonna stick to

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Speaker 1: hunting animals. Um, Lamas do a communal latrine. Swamp bread,

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Speaker 1: let's do a communal latrine, Otters do a communal latrine,

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Speaker 1: and raccoons do a communal latrine. Um, what else is

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Speaker 1: the communal do you see when you're walking through the woods?

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Speaker 1: You'll find a pile of growl ship. M do you

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Speaker 1: ever see that? I'd like to have a growlse expert

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Speaker 1: answer me that. I don't know if it's a latrine,

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Speaker 1: but it's like that thing set there for a while.

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Speaker 1: I often thought that it was in a bad snow storm.

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Speaker 1: He was sitting there under the snow. Yeah, what do

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Speaker 1: you think, Carl? Well, the other place you'll see that

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Speaker 1: oftentimes is on the back side of a drumming log

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Speaker 1: where a male likes to hang out in the spring,

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Speaker 1: strutting his stuff and you know, beating his wings to

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Speaker 1: attract a female. They'll pile up a retty significant little

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Speaker 1: heap of grouse droppings. Yeah, I've seen it where I

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Speaker 1: felt like, I said, because are you ever going out? Um?

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Speaker 1: We used to hunt grouse a lot in Michigan. If

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Speaker 1: you had a bad snowstorm and you'd go grouse hunting,

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Speaker 1: you'd bust grouse where there's no tracks. Yeah, they just

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Speaker 1: come busting right out of the snow. Was there when

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Speaker 1: it snowed and stayed under the snow. You have out

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Speaker 1: of the snow and there's no thing coming in, it's

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Speaker 1: just exiting. Yeah, you'll have a hole and then you'll

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Speaker 1: have the spot where both wings beat down on the

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Speaker 1: side of the snow rocketing out of the snow pile.

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Speaker 1: So it's kind of tube with a yeah, but I've

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Speaker 1: seen him, like you're saying, with dozens of dozens of pellets,

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Speaker 1: well you get like a pile behind a drumming log

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Speaker 1: and a quick cool aside. When it comes to trying

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Speaker 1: to capture grouse like for research purposes, one of the

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Speaker 1: most effective ways to get him is at those drumming

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Speaker 1: logs because they're very territorial. This has a nice link

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Speaker 1: to talk in turkeys as well, um, because there we're

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Speaker 1: going to kind of I know that there's nothing that

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Speaker 1: a male grouse hates more than seeing another male grouse

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Speaker 1: somewhere near his drumming spot. And so the way you

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Speaker 1: capture him is throw a little mirror up in the

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Speaker 1: back of a trap where a grouse on the drumming

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Speaker 1: log will see his own reflection, and by and large

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Speaker 1: you're gonna have that that male grouse attack his reflection

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Speaker 1: in the back of that trail off the drumming log.

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Speaker 1: We were out hunting bears of clay one time and

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Speaker 1: we made a mistake of camping at a drumming log

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Speaker 1: and that thing all night long really is walking around

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Speaker 1: like through the sleeping bags. I'm that kidney man. I

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Speaker 1: don't know if I've ever heard one drumming at night.

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Speaker 1: It was going crazy. Then you guys there and remember

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Speaker 1: that we were on that. Yeah, so he was going

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Speaker 1: on like a little generator. When I was, before I

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Speaker 1: was old enough the bowl hunt, I was sitting in

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Speaker 1: my brother's tree stand around. My dad would set multiple

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Speaker 1: tree stands up so you can sit. I'll send with

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Speaker 1: my brother. Before I was on the bow hunting. He's

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Speaker 1: bow hunting and I'm hearing and I said to him

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Speaker 1: at one point, I always mad, I said, that guy

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Speaker 1: can't get that lawnmore started. So you know, we've we've

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Speaker 1: been talking a little bit about u the sort of

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Speaker 1: emerging turkey hunting opportunity up in the Upper Peninsula, back

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Speaker 1: in our native state of Michigan. And this past spring

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Speaker 1: um I spent a bunch of times stomping around up

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Speaker 1: there looking for looking for gobblers. And one of the

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Speaker 1: super cool things about turkey hunting up there is at

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Speaker 1: first light, right when it's like time to start hearing

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Speaker 1: birds gobbling on the roost the rough grouse are going

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Speaker 1: berserk as well, so you're they're listening for gobbles in

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Speaker 1: the distance, and meanwhile you've got drumming grouse all around you.

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Speaker 1: The geese are starting to head back north. So it's

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Speaker 1: just like this embodiment of spring reawakening. And this past

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Speaker 1: spring a seriously and this past spring I was hearing

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Speaker 1: so many drummers that it, you know, it was a

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Speaker 1: great indication for what the fall hunting season was going

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Speaker 1: to look like. And that's one of the ways, of course,

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Speaker 1: that they evaluate grouse numbers on the landscapes to do

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Speaker 1: these spring drumming. But while Turkey hunting, you know, I

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Speaker 1: was already starting to text my buddies, like, come mid October,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna have some real good grouse hunting based on

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Speaker 1: what I'm hearing out here in the Turkey Woods, and

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Speaker 1: that that definitely turned out to be the case this

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Speaker 1: past fall. I read once that with roughed grouse, a

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Speaker 1: limiting factor can be the prevalence or absence of drumming logs.

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Speaker 1: That's an interesting because they're so fussy about the height

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Speaker 1: and then visibility around it. Yeah, and that you could

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Speaker 1: you could mechanically improve your grouse habitat by making appropriate

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Speaker 1: drumming logs. If you don't have them, I don't know

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Speaker 1: if you believe that or not. I'm so I will

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Speaker 1: face my skepticism by saying that I'm not a rough

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Speaker 1: grouse expert. But when I think about the things, you know,

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Speaker 1: sort of driving reproductive success, typically it's it's limiting factors

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Speaker 1: on the female side of the equation more than on

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Speaker 1: the male side. Um. Now that being said, one of

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Speaker 1: the things I love doing when I was a kid,

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Speaker 1: um up in leland Ock County, the northwest Lower Peninsula,

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Speaker 1: Michigan in the spring, when i'd be out morale mushroom

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Speaker 1: picking and just being in the woods, if i'd hear

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Speaker 1: drumming roughies, I'd try to sneak in and see if

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Speaker 1: I could see the mail. And so I've looked at

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Speaker 1: a lot of drumming logs just out of my own

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Speaker 1: curiosity as a as a kid growing up. And there

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Speaker 1: is a striking consistency in the characteristics of the places

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Speaker 1: that those males like to show off their stuff, you know,

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Speaker 1: in terms of height, in terms of having good visibility

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Speaker 1: around them, and obviously you know, not unlike a gobbling turkey.

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Speaker 1: They're making a heck of a lot of noise to

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Speaker 1: try to show off for the females. And that's a

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Speaker 1: very dangerous thing in a landscape where you've ut example,

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Speaker 1: predators who will love nothing more than a plump rough

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Speaker 1: grouse to snack on in the spring. Um people, folks

385
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:14,359
Speaker 1: at home on what we're talking about. Yeah, that was

386
00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:18,399
Speaker 1: that was actually a perfect replication, was it? Anyhow? This

387
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:22,560
Speaker 1: guy raccoon raccoon defecation piles, So he was renovating an

388
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Speaker 1: old cab and and and discovered one. It was blown

389
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Speaker 1: away by the smelling sight of the communal to trine.

390
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,600
Speaker 1: It's got him googling later that night, which led him

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Speaker 1: to the CDC page on raccoon roundworm war. Family has

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Speaker 1: ever had any experience of raccoon roundworm? Seems to be

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Speaker 1: extremely rare occurrence in humans, yet extremely common in our

394
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Speaker 1: Midwest raccoon population. I haven't had, and I've never That's

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Speaker 1: one of those many things I just choosing out to

396
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Speaker 1: paying attention to. Like the list of diseases you can

397
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:58,359
Speaker 1: get from stuff is so we're gonna talk about a

398
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,359
Speaker 1: nerd disease in a a minute is so long that you

399
00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:06,080
Speaker 1: just after a while, it just you know it sounds

400
00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:09,880
Speaker 1: gross though you don't want that ship. But now, I've

401
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 1: never taken any precautions to avoid raccoon roundworm, and I

402
00:25:13,359 --> 00:25:17,159
Speaker 1: have looked. You know, when you're trapping raccoons, you like.

403
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:19,880
Speaker 1: A great find is latrine, which usually identifies a den.

404
00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:28,360
Speaker 1: Try ah aving influenzas hitting some wild turkeys in Billings,

405
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Speaker 1: Montana um near our headquarters, not too terribly far away

406
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:36,040
Speaker 1: from my headquarters, some guy found a I was just

407
00:25:36,080 --> 00:25:39,160
Speaker 1: reading an article about this guy finds a turkey dead

408
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:43,520
Speaker 1: and things that got hit by a car. Just looking

409
00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:46,640
Speaker 1: around and find six dead turkeys laying around his place.

410
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Speaker 1: And they tested them. They tested three of them, and

411
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:55,200
Speaker 1: those those three turkeys that died Avian influenza. Jeez. So

412
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Speaker 1: it has at least in that case, UM has moved

413
00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 1: into wild turkey populations as it spreads naturally through our

414
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:09,200
Speaker 1: bird populations. I texted the wild turkey doc Michael Chamberlain.

415
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Speaker 1: He said they're at University of Georgia. They are testing

416
00:26:11,800 --> 00:26:14,680
Speaker 1: a lot of birds and and he he can speak

417
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:17,800
Speaker 1: to this if it changes, but this might be dated

418
00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:19,280
Speaker 1: by the time you hear it. But he was saying

419
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:25,679
Speaker 1: it doesn't seem to impact wild turkeys quite like is

420
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 1: in a and as devastating of a way as it

421
00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 1: seems to hit other bird species. But if covid' is

422
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:39,000
Speaker 1: any indication, you can probably expect someone to make turkey

423
00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:42,200
Speaker 1: hunting illegal now because you could get avian influenza from it.

424
00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:48,159
Speaker 1: Let's hope that doesn't uh go on? Uh, well we

425
00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:50,320
Speaker 1: have ea chat uh Chester and Seth Key give us

426
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:54,840
Speaker 1: a Wally tour update please yep um, I'm trying to

427
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 1: give a cable news that was good. The continuing wally

428
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:08,199
Speaker 1: had been shows off. Chester. The tester and Seth we

429
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:12,159
Speaker 1: jet and I went out to St. Peter, Minnesota to

430
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:15,359
Speaker 1: the Illumincraft headquarters and picked up our boat which is

431
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:20,360
Speaker 1: from headquarters. Got a tour and everything quick tour um,

432
00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:24,400
Speaker 1: real quick. It's a well can you back up, come

433
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:27,800
Speaker 1: back up for a second. My comment about them making

434
00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:30,800
Speaker 1: turkey hunting illegal. I want to point out that when

435
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:34,320
Speaker 1: the pandemic began, the state of Washington, which by and

436
00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:37,639
Speaker 1: large is no friend of the American outdoorsman. Uh, the

437
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:43,280
Speaker 1: State of Washington banned the practice of fishing as part

438
00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:46,560
Speaker 1: of their COVID response. Just remind people of this. This

439
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:48,120
Speaker 1: is not a thing to happen a long time ago.

440
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:51,600
Speaker 1: Go ahead, go ahead, soeth makes a lot of sense. Anyway,

441
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:56,439
Speaker 1: we went to Alumincraft picked up our competitor F s

442
00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,880
Speaker 1: X boat that we're gonna be fishing out for the

443
00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 1: tournament season, and brought it home and Chet and I

444
00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:09,359
Speaker 1: have been working our asses off rigging it. Like, um,

445
00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:11,200
Speaker 1: this is like when you guys get done. I think

446
00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:16,880
Speaker 1: the military is gonna want this boat. Yeah, it's it's

447
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:23,119
Speaker 1: it's like a spaceship. We got no excuses, um, but

448
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:26,399
Speaker 1: we're learning a lot on how to Like I have

449
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:30,680
Speaker 1: no not a ton of experience with like electrical work. Yeah,

450
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:32,359
Speaker 1: Chat and I have never rigged a boat before, and

451
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:35,280
Speaker 1: it has to be done in a way, a specific

452
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:40,520
Speaker 1: way so everything doesn't interfere with Yeah, all your electronics

453
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 1: package for people, Well, we have three helix twelve screens,

454
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:49,160
Speaker 1: which is you know, kind of the main unit that

455
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:54,040
Speaker 1: you're looking at. We have a Mancoda Old Treks trolling

456
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:59,480
Speaker 1: motor that has a built in UM two D. So on,

457
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 1: are you have that Hummingbird three Mega three sixty hook

458
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: to the trolling motor. We'll have a skimmer in the back.

459
00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:11,320
Speaker 1: We'll have a side imaging down imaging in the back

460
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:15,320
Speaker 1: and then we'll have a mega live unit on the

461
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:19,680
Speaker 1: side and they'll all be talking to each other like

462
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:26,200
Speaker 1: what are they talking about? Dous feel like, I'm all

463
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:27,960
Speaker 1: for it? But do you feel like you're going to

464
00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:31,040
Speaker 1: be right in line with your with the competition or

465
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:36,120
Speaker 1: you gonna be like outswinging them with the electronics. No,

466
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:39,920
Speaker 1: not outswinging them with electronics. Those dudes have that and

467
00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,840
Speaker 1: more on their boat. And is there a limit to

468
00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 1: what you can do? What do you mean? I mean? Yeah,

469
00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 1: like infficient, is there a limit to how much uh

470
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 1: technology you can introduce? Not as of now, I don't

471
00:29:54,960 --> 00:29:59,800
Speaker 1: put which is kind of crazy because you know, as

472
00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:03,040
Speaker 1: to technology gets better and better, especially in tournament fishing.

473
00:30:03,160 --> 00:30:08,400
Speaker 1: Where's the where's the line? Right? Um? But man, it's

474
00:30:08,440 --> 00:30:11,880
Speaker 1: sure fun to use that stuff, you know, like in

475
00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 1: the Olympics, you can't take a lot of drugs, right,

476
00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 1: So I could picture in the wall at tournament they

477
00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:21,800
Speaker 1: might do something down the road about electronics. Yeah, you

478
00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 1: can't be open up your electronics. Yeah, we have all

479
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 1: this stuff hooked up to some lithium batteries that at

480
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,120
Speaker 1: last minute we're supposed to get lithium batteries end up

481
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:34,720
Speaker 1: not getting them, but our friends up at Towns of

482
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:39,320
Speaker 1: Marine last minute help us out big time. Thanks to

483
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:43,160
Speaker 1: those guys. Yeah, that was big. The reason why we're

484
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 1: in such a hurry is because we went on this

485
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,240
Speaker 1: New Mexico trip. We get back, we have a few

486
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:52,240
Speaker 1: days and then we gotta head out to our first derby,

487
00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:57,200
Speaker 1: first tournament out at Fort Pack. So right before we left,

488
00:30:57,240 --> 00:30:59,840
Speaker 1: this is how we left the boat. And it's sitting

489
00:30:59,880 --> 00:31:02,960
Speaker 1: in sets garage right now. So I've been thinking about

490
00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:07,040
Speaker 1: it all weekends because I've been laying in my sleeping

491
00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:09,360
Speaker 1: bag thinking about hung I plant my garden? Really, what

492
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:16,920
Speaker 1: I'm gonna put where? Yeah? Yeah, that's why you're every

493
00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:19,280
Speaker 1: time chatting and I got like a second together on

494
00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:22,920
Speaker 1: this hunt. We're like, hey, what do you think about?

495
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:28,760
Speaker 1: What do you think about this distribution panel? Yeah, but

496
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:31,040
Speaker 1: so we this is how we left the boat. We

497
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,920
Speaker 1: got it the whole front of the boat rigged up

498
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:41,280
Speaker 1: with the um Helix twelve screen. It was going to

499
00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:43,920
Speaker 1: our battery, then to our distribution panel, then to all

500
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:46,320
Speaker 1: that stuff up, so it should have worked, should have

501
00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:49,000
Speaker 1: turned on. So like we get it all set up,

502
00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:52,840
Speaker 1: We're excited, you know, like rubbing our hands together, Like

503
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:55,840
Speaker 1: here we go, We're turning on the first unit, press

504
00:31:55,880 --> 00:32:00,320
Speaker 1: the button. Nothing. You know, when they make a movie

505
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:02,600
Speaker 1: about this, that scene is gonna be a lot like

506
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:08,000
Speaker 1: in the Chevy Chase Christmas movie. Oh yeah, yeah, Christmas

507
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:10,560
Speaker 1: lights and plugs that nothing comes on. That would be

508
00:32:10,560 --> 00:32:14,640
Speaker 1: a great scene. And yeah, after after doing a bunch

509
00:32:14,680 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 1: of troubleshooting, I determined that our fuse panel is faulty. Man,

510
00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 1: What does happen to casting and reeling? Man, We're gonna

511
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:26,560
Speaker 1: be doing a lot of that too. But no, I

512
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,400
Speaker 1: get you. Yeah, I mean you can only you can

513
00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:32,000
Speaker 1: put a shipload electronics on your boat. At the end

514
00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 1: of the day, you gotta be a good fishing still

515
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:36,880
Speaker 1: gotta work the j you gotta be. You gotta work Jay,

516
00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:41,040
Speaker 1: gotta no where fish live, how fish react to stuff?

517
00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:43,120
Speaker 1: How many episodes are you guys gonna make about this

518
00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:48,960
Speaker 1: whole thing? For um only four? Yeah, it's just like

519
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:52,600
Speaker 1: a little test makes sense because it's like three tournaments

520
00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:56,400
Speaker 1: and then and then yeah, the first one is us

521
00:32:56,680 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 1: just kind of more self filming. The next three are

522
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:03,560
Speaker 1: gonna Chris gill is going to come along with us,

523
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 1: so it'll be way higher quality great too, because he

524
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 1: likes to fish. Yea, yeah, and it's it's we're not

525
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,960
Speaker 1: we're not doing the traditional meat eat or like don't

526
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 1: break the fourth wall deal. So Chris is gonna be

527
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:18,920
Speaker 1: like a character in it. It won't be fishing, but

528
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 1: there'll be some banter. Uh, this is great, it's gonna

529
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:26,760
Speaker 1: be fun. You cannot fish. Just for everyone out there,

530
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:31,160
Speaker 1: there's people like a little bit like, oh, they're gonna

531
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:34,200
Speaker 1: have a third person in boat. We're gonna have cameras

532
00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:36,800
Speaker 1: rolling the whole time. So by all means, if you

533
00:33:36,800 --> 00:33:38,360
Speaker 1: want to sit there and look at that little go

534
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 1: Pro SD card for nine hours and watches watch watch

535
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:46,239
Speaker 1: Chris film us there you go like where you know?

536
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 1: So you're so too, because somehow having a third person

537
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:54,840
Speaker 1: on the boat it might be interpreted as a way

538
00:33:54,840 --> 00:33:56,280
Speaker 1: to cheat, I don't know, like he's got a wall

539
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 1: hidden in the camera. Competitive and well, you just have

540
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:03,320
Speaker 1: another person casting, right, That's why I'm gonna take But

541
00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:06,320
Speaker 1: but you're gonna take a go pro position that so

542
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:09,520
Speaker 1: it's filming the whole boat and then there will be

543
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:11,520
Speaker 1: no interruption in the footage and you're gonna let it

544
00:34:11,600 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 1: run all the way through and should someone ever want

545
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:16,520
Speaker 1: to say I want to know what happened on that boat,

546
00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:20,440
Speaker 1: you would provide them with the entire day that they

547
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:22,760
Speaker 1: could analyze to see if there's breaks in the footage.

548
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:25,200
Speaker 1: They could watch everything that happened on that boat for

549
00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:28,439
Speaker 1: nine hours. You gotta be careful which direction you're peeing

550
00:34:28,480 --> 00:34:32,040
Speaker 1: off that boat. Do you guys have a way you

551
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 1: guys might want to think about? UM, I don't know

552
00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 1: if it works. You have to get a big satellite

553
00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:41,080
Speaker 1: dish ship on that boat. But imagine if you were

554
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:45,120
Speaker 1: able to people that could just live stream during the

555
00:34:45,120 --> 00:34:47,800
Speaker 1: whole tournament. That would be great. That would be great.

556
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:50,360
Speaker 1: There'd be a lot of a lot of electronics, a

557
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:53,600
Speaker 1: lot more electronics. But yeah, there's no limited right you

558
00:34:53,640 --> 00:35:00,759
Speaker 1: guys like that ship Instagram live? Yeah? Great? Uh. Let

559
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:02,279
Speaker 1: me have one more question for you guys. I'm real

560
00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:06,319
Speaker 1: excited for you, but are you? UM, how would you

561
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,799
Speaker 1: rate going into the tournament season? How would you rate

562
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:16,600
Speaker 1: your cockiness? Mind? Mind? Very, I don't want I don't

563
00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:19,239
Speaker 1: want to that's a that's Carl just introduced me to

564
00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:23,080
Speaker 1: a new phrase, which value laden term. I don't want

565
00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:25,759
Speaker 1: to use a valuated term. Um, cockiness, Like no one

566
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:30,239
Speaker 1: wants to be cocky, Like are you would you? How

567
00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:32,520
Speaker 1: would you like? Okay, let me say this if if

568
00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:35,160
Speaker 1: I came, if I if I was a future seer,

569
00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 1: and in many respects I am. But if I was

570
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:39,799
Speaker 1: a future seer and I came to you and said,

571
00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:44,080
Speaker 1: turns out Chester, at the end of all this um,

572
00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:50,439
Speaker 1: you will have placed how many people? Roughly it could

573
00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:53,600
Speaker 1: be a hundred. And let's say we knew in my thing,

574
00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:55,640
Speaker 1: I was like I saw the future there were a

575
00:35:55,680 --> 00:36:01,600
Speaker 1: hundred boats you placed forty. Would you be like, damn, dude,

576
00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 1: that's great, better than I thought. Or would you be like, huh,

577
00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:11,359
Speaker 1: I'd be real happy with some top twenties. Yeah, I

578
00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:16,279
Speaker 1: think I think forty would be Like, because I know

579
00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:20,920
Speaker 1: we don't have any experience fishing tournaments. You guys got

580
00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 1: a lot of experiences. We have a lot of experience

581
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:24,800
Speaker 1: catching while I we know how to catch them and

582
00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:28,440
Speaker 1: we're gonna work. Yeah, we don't. We don't have the

583
00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:30,920
Speaker 1: experience that some of the guys have on these lakes.

584
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:35,160
Speaker 1: And like, yes, we could go to any of these

585
00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:39,120
Speaker 1: lakes and catch a bag, but some dudes are gonna

586
00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:45,800
Speaker 1: go and catch a bag of high twenties thirty because

587
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:47,759
Speaker 1: they just have it dialed and you guys are gonna

588
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:51,920
Speaker 1: roll in with five thirteens Like that could be a

589
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:53,320
Speaker 1: thing to happen. That could be a thing that happened.

590
00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:56,800
Speaker 1: I think we'll do better than that, but I would.

591
00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:00,279
Speaker 1: I think I think we have potential place in the

592
00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:03,439
Speaker 1: like I think we can place in the top ten

593
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:07,759
Speaker 1: in one of these three tournaments. That's bold. The other two.

594
00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:09,719
Speaker 1: I know we can do it, but I don't. I mean,

595
00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:14,799
Speaker 1: it's possible for sure. Are you at liberty to say

596
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:21,040
Speaker 1: where the three locations are? Yeah, it's uh Tiber Fresno

597
00:37:21,520 --> 00:37:28,960
Speaker 1: and four Pecks and Montana. There's a fourth one, Kanyon Ferry.

598
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:33,000
Speaker 1: But on my wedding day, here's the thing, his home waters.

599
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:37,040
Speaker 1: He's skipping his home water day to get married. That's

600
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 1: the stupidest thing in the world, especially when I found

601
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:42,280
Speaker 1: out that he doesn't need to be at his own wedding.

602
00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:47,160
Speaker 1: How's that because Montana lets your proxy marriage from the boat. Yeah,

603
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:51,920
Speaker 1: he could assigned, he could assigned met him and I

604
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:56,799
Speaker 1: just stend up there with his girlfriend. I'm just gonna

605
00:37:56,800 --> 00:37:58,560
Speaker 1: stay silent on this one so I don't get myself

606
00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:04,640
Speaker 1: support your decision. Just for the record, you would not bail.

607
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:06,520
Speaker 1: Let me tell you, Let me tell you a story.

608
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:08,480
Speaker 1: Let me tell you a story one time that that

609
00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 1: I don't want to say. I don't want to use names,

610
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:17,879
Speaker 1: but a very famous author told me a story. He

611
00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 1: had a kid he was mentoring, okay, and it wound

612
00:38:23,719 --> 00:38:28,200
Speaker 1: up that he got an assignment lined up for the

613
00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:33,239
Speaker 1: kid he was mentoring for a very prestigious publication, and

614
00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:37,480
Speaker 1: he's like, now is your chance. I can't because that's

615
00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:42,640
Speaker 1: my family vacation weekend. That's a little different that mentorship

616
00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:48,320
Speaker 1: ended that second, Oh totally. He's like, you don't want

617
00:38:48,360 --> 00:38:52,279
Speaker 1: this the way you need to want it, And I

618
00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 1: would say, there's nothing more important. I would say, there's

619
00:38:55,760 --> 00:39:01,000
Speaker 1: a difference. There's a giant difference there. Happily ever after

620
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:04,719
Speaker 1: wallet fish, I love walleye fishing too, but I'm with you.

621
00:39:14,360 --> 00:39:16,719
Speaker 1: I gotta tell the good. So here's a good story. Uh,

622
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 1: if you hearken back, this is the sect. We don't

623
00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:21,239
Speaker 1: normally do this. I don't like to do this this much,

624
00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:29,759
Speaker 1: but so are our beloved friend Bubbly Doug was. He

625
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:32,120
Speaker 1: was allowed to do some follow up on on c

626
00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:34,640
Speaker 1: w D after our episode with Ted Nugent. And then

627
00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:38,239
Speaker 1: so we revisited the Nugent episode with Doug doing a

628
00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:42,640
Speaker 1: rebuttal uh. And now we're revisiting our Nugent episode again

629
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:47,279
Speaker 1: with the the really detail laden story from a guy.

630
00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:50,040
Speaker 1: So when news were talking about how the news used

631
00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:52,920
Speaker 1: to do whiplash bashes and and we had attended some

632
00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:55,160
Speaker 1: whipple did you ever attend whiplash bash? I can't say

633
00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:57,080
Speaker 1: that I have. But you were passed on the highway

634
00:39:57,080 --> 00:40:01,719
Speaker 1: by Ted driving that zebra strike bris straight Bronco. That's

635
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:04,920
Speaker 1: down by Jackson, Michigan. That's that's as like important as

636
00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:09,319
Speaker 1: a whiplash bash when you're in high school. So guys

637
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:14,360
Speaker 1: like he was working backstage security for a Nugent concert

638
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:18,160
Speaker 1: up at the Castle in Charlotte. Boy, it's one of

639
00:40:18,200 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 1: the rare occasions when Ted missed a shot on stage.

640
00:40:22,840 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: Oh no. At the end of the show, Ted was

641
00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:33,640
Speaker 1: as a security guard points out, Ted was so physically

642
00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:39,359
Speaker 1: exhausted he needed help getting back to the dressing room.

643
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:46,840
Speaker 1: Was spent okay, um, the assistant said, I'm not supposed

644
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:49,319
Speaker 1: to do this, but I need to leave Ted's bow here.

645
00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:51,319
Speaker 1: While I helped him back to his dressing room. Can

646
00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:53,160
Speaker 1: you keep an eye on it until I come back

647
00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:55,880
Speaker 1: and grab it? Well, of course, I said yes and

648
00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:58,600
Speaker 1: he left. He sare's a lot of activity going on

649
00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:01,200
Speaker 1: as people were leaving and bray can things down the venue,

650
00:41:01,640 --> 00:41:07,080
Speaker 1: so it's very hectic backstage. At one point, a guy

651
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:12,960
Speaker 1: walks by the table and just nonchalantly grabs nuggets bow.

652
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:17,000
Speaker 1: Security guard goes up to him and says, what are

653
00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:19,160
Speaker 1: you doing? He said, I'm supposed to bring this back

654
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:23,360
Speaker 1: to Ted. About that time, Ted's assistant walks up and

655
00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:27,440
Speaker 1: asked what's going on. The security guard said, this guy

656
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:29,600
Speaker 1: is trying to take Ted's boat, and it was revealed

657
00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:31,840
Speaker 1: that this person is in fact trying to steal Ted's

658
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:35,919
Speaker 1: bow and has no connection to Ted. The security guard

659
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 1: summons the police officer, who then escorts the man off property.

660
00:41:42,719 --> 00:41:47,680
Speaker 1: The police officer thanked him for stopping the crime. The

661
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:50,719
Speaker 1: assistant explains that that boat is never supposed to leave

662
00:41:50,800 --> 00:41:58,960
Speaker 1: Ted's site and they made a mistake. Now she Ted

663
00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 1: gets word of this whole thing, comes out of his

664
00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:08,760
Speaker 1: dressing room and gives him the broken arrow that broke

665
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:12,120
Speaker 1: upon Ted's miss on stage. He says, Ted walked up,

666
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:14,800
Speaker 1: shook my hand, said thanks for helping out tonight and

667
00:42:14,960 --> 00:42:17,200
Speaker 1: handed me half of the broken arrow, which he had

668
00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 1: signed he's offered donated to the Land Access Initiative auction

669
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:29,279
Speaker 1: House of Oodities. I texted Ted to be like, did

670
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:33,160
Speaker 1: this ring a bell? He said, I remember everything, but

671
00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:38,600
Speaker 1: I don't remember that. Oh, but I'm gonna email him

672
00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:41,760
Speaker 1: the thing and see if it. If it feels legitimate,

673
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:45,839
Speaker 1: we will UM be adding that to the Auction House

674
00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:49,200
Speaker 1: of Oodities for our land Access initiative. Another thing I

675
00:42:49,239 --> 00:42:51,040
Speaker 1: want to point out about the Land Access Initiative, And

676
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:52,239
Speaker 1: we've got one more thing to top on the We're

677
00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:57,759
Speaker 1: ben get into the turkeys in the healer UM. We

678
00:42:57,880 --> 00:42:59,920
Speaker 1: recently got a note from the family of a guy

679
00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:03,160
Speaker 1: named John Pennewit. His wife wrote in UM and she said,

680
00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:04,600
Speaker 1: I was just a face in the crowd at one

681
00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:07,000
Speaker 1: of your live shows in Houston, and she was pointing,

682
00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:09,960
Speaker 1: and she gave us the news that I'm not sure

683
00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 1: what happened, but her husband, John Pennewit, who was a

684
00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:17,040
Speaker 1: big fan of the show UM, had passed away young

685
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:22,480
Speaker 1: with kids, and they had in lieu of any kind

686
00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 1: of flowers or anything they had requested that UM family

687
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:31,440
Speaker 1: and friends make a donation to our land Access Initiative.

688
00:43:32,239 --> 00:43:35,760
Speaker 1: This is John Pennewit from down in Texas, his family,

689
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:38,480
Speaker 1: and I had heard that a lot of donations to

690
00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:42,000
Speaker 1: the Land Access Initiative are flooding in on behalf of

691
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:45,600
Speaker 1: John Pennewit. So I don't know what happened there, man,

692
00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:51,399
Speaker 1: but really, uh um, sorry for the loss and thank

693
00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 1: you for the support. Though it seems like I'm not

694
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:59,520
Speaker 1: ideal scenario. Um, the corner crossing dudes and whylming we've

695
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:03,040
Speaker 1: been covering is real. Heavily found not guilty mm hmm.

696
00:44:03,280 --> 00:44:10,600
Speaker 1: But here's the weird part. There's a civil case. You remember,

697
00:44:10,719 --> 00:44:13,440
Speaker 1: like when O j Uh killed his wife and in

698
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:17,279
Speaker 1: a waiter, Um, he was found not guilty for the

699
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:22,359
Speaker 1: criminal thing like he didn't do it right, but then

700
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:26,040
Speaker 1: was found guilty and civil like when the family does

701
00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:29,399
Speaker 1: a civil thing. So apparently the landowner is going after

702
00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:34,719
Speaker 1: these dudes in a civil court case. See how that

703
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:38,440
Speaker 1: shakes out. Think about that. I'm looking at you, Carl,

704
00:44:38,600 --> 00:44:40,120
Speaker 1: I feel like you'd be interested in this whole thing.

705
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:42,719
Speaker 1: I am interested in it. And two thoughts that come

706
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:45,399
Speaker 1: to mind. One is you know you kicked off talking

707
00:44:45,440 --> 00:44:49,640
Speaker 1: about um America being a good place to do a crime,

708
00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:51,359
Speaker 1: and this sort of flies in the face of that, right,

709
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:54,400
Speaker 1: the idea that you could be tried while so just

710
00:44:54,520 --> 00:45:01,000
Speaker 1: from the standpoint of being um facing a court and

711
00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:06,440
Speaker 1: being tried criminally and then being tried again in a

712
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:13,000
Speaker 1: civil suit for the same allegations, right, so sort of

713
00:45:13,040 --> 00:45:17,400
Speaker 1: a you know, like the Jews didn't murder them criminally,

714
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:20,920
Speaker 1: but he murdered them civilly. I will refrain from commenting

715
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:23,560
Speaker 1: on the o J case. The other thought is, you know,

716
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:27,640
Speaker 1: the public access the corner crossing thing um. As an

717
00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:31,640
Speaker 1: outdoors man myself who spends a lot of time stomping

718
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:35,200
Speaker 1: around in public ground, that's an issue that that I

719
00:45:35,400 --> 00:45:38,040
Speaker 1: am very interested in and care a lot about, and

720
00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:41,160
Speaker 1: also one you know, as an employee for a federal

721
00:45:41,239 --> 00:45:46,239
Speaker 1: agency that you know, in a forum like this, my

722
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:49,120
Speaker 1: opinions and thoughts on it are probably best kept to

723
00:45:49,200 --> 00:45:51,960
Speaker 1: myself because it's something that affects the agency I work for.

724
00:45:52,880 --> 00:45:54,440
Speaker 1: But I can tell you, you know, there's a lot

725
00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:56,240
Speaker 1: of times I've been looking at a chunk of ground

726
00:45:57,080 --> 00:45:59,919
Speaker 1: and thinking to myself, man, would be great to great

727
00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:03,279
Speaker 1: across this, you know, this fence intersection and hunt that

728
00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:05,640
Speaker 1: other stuff, and I've gone so far in New Mexico

729
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:07,920
Speaker 1: is to call a number of wardens to ask that question,

730
00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:13,000
Speaker 1: to find out and you know, essentially gotten answers that

731
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:19,000
Speaker 1: were sufficiently um murky that I was uncomfortable doing that.

732
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:21,920
Speaker 1: And I can be more specific, like one one warden

733
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:25,800
Speaker 1: here said, from the state game and fish perspective, we

734
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:28,520
Speaker 1: wouldn't we wouldn't come after you for that, but I

735
00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:31,640
Speaker 1: can't guarantee you that the local sheriff would feel the

736
00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:36,480
Speaker 1: same way about it. Dave Wilms, who's our resident expert

737
00:46:36,560 --> 00:46:43,160
Speaker 1: on this uh situation, notified me about the verdict, but

738
00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:48,480
Speaker 1: then said, please do not think that this somehow overturns

739
00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:54,280
Speaker 1: and you understanding, this doesn't change anything about corner crossing

740
00:46:54,360 --> 00:47:01,000
Speaker 1: writ large. It's like these individuals, this instant, we're found

741
00:47:01,040 --> 00:47:03,520
Speaker 1: not guilty. This is not like a Supreme Court case

742
00:47:03,680 --> 00:47:06,560
Speaker 1: that like throws out or re established a precedent. It's

743
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:10,400
Speaker 1: just like these people. If someone got found not guilty

744
00:47:10,440 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 1: of something, that doesn't mean that what they were charged

745
00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:16,000
Speaker 1: with ceases to be a thing. So folks need to

746
00:47:16,080 --> 00:47:19,200
Speaker 1: know that, all right, Carl, tell me, tell me like

747
00:47:19,960 --> 00:47:23,920
Speaker 1: made me, make me like um, made me like wilderness areas.

748
00:47:23,960 --> 00:47:27,080
Speaker 1: Man make you like wildern I think I just did already. Actually,

749
00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:29,360
Speaker 1: I think you already did love him after it hit me,

750
00:47:29,400 --> 00:47:31,879
Speaker 1: after this week hit me with him about the HeLa. Well,

751
00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:37,840
Speaker 1: you know, I spent about ten years getting to know

752
00:47:38,320 --> 00:47:40,120
Speaker 1: the heal of wilderness. And when I you know, when

753
00:47:40,200 --> 00:47:41,879
Speaker 1: when my wife and I made the decision to move

754
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:45,120
Speaker 1: from the Midwest to the Southwest, one of the things

755
00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:48,000
Speaker 1: that really drew me to this part of the country

756
00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:54,000
Speaker 1: was the history of this landscape, these landscapes and helping

757
00:47:54,080 --> 00:47:57,960
Speaker 1: shape sort of the trajectory of conservation in America and globally.

758
00:47:58,760 --> 00:48:02,719
Speaker 1: And then also the fact that you know today this

759
00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:05,560
Speaker 1: ratio of population to public land in a place like

760
00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:09,279
Speaker 1: New Mexico is so small that ratio, there's so many

761
00:48:09,320 --> 00:48:11,879
Speaker 1: places you can go and get off the beaten path

762
00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:15,920
Speaker 1: and really, you know, be away from the masses, and

763
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:19,600
Speaker 1: the HeLa is one of those spots where, if you're

764
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:22,680
Speaker 1: willing to put the miles in, you can get into

765
00:48:22,719 --> 00:48:25,520
Speaker 1: a little corner of the universe where you're very unlikely

766
00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:29,320
Speaker 1: to have a lot of other folks around. And you know,

767
00:48:29,360 --> 00:48:32,520
Speaker 1: I anticipate as we're talking about this particular chunk of

768
00:48:32,560 --> 00:48:34,560
Speaker 1: country people are going to be wondering, like, why, you know,

769
00:48:35,280 --> 00:48:39,080
Speaker 1: why are we advertising how great the hell is um

770
00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:43,120
Speaker 1: and then simultaneously saying it's a great place to find solitude.

771
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:45,160
Speaker 1: Right if you're if you're throwing out a banner saying

772
00:48:45,719 --> 00:48:47,759
Speaker 1: the hell is an awesome place to visit, doesn't that

773
00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:50,760
Speaker 1: kind of undermine the opportunity to get away from folks?

774
00:48:51,520 --> 00:48:54,600
Speaker 1: And I would point out the heal of wilderness has

775
00:48:54,760 --> 00:49:01,640
Speaker 1: over fifty different trailheads, sixty thousand acres um and all

776
00:49:01,719 --> 00:49:05,120
Speaker 1: the travels by primitive means either walking in there on

777
00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:10,399
Speaker 1: your own legs or pack stock, and so by all means,

778
00:49:10,560 --> 00:49:13,000
Speaker 1: I want people to come around and poke around that

779
00:49:13,160 --> 00:49:16,520
Speaker 1: landscape and get to know it and also understand the

780
00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:21,920
Speaker 1: story of how the HeLa helped really shape the wilderness

781
00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:24,920
Speaker 1: movement globally. Because we're coming up on the hundred the

782
00:49:24,960 --> 00:49:31,120
Speaker 1: anniversary of the administrative designation of the HeLa in as

783
00:49:31,200 --> 00:49:38,560
Speaker 1: the first UM officially recognized wild land anywhere on the planet.

784
00:49:38,719 --> 00:49:41,319
Speaker 1: What do they call wilderness back then when there hadn't

785
00:49:41,360 --> 00:49:46,080
Speaker 1: been the Wilderness Act UM. There's an article that So

786
00:49:46,360 --> 00:49:48,640
Speaker 1: we'll talk a little bit about Aldo Leopold. I'm sure

787
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:51,280
Speaker 1: he was one of the you know, he was arguably

788
00:49:51,680 --> 00:49:56,719
Speaker 1: the greatest champion for that that sort of formal recognition

789
00:49:56,920 --> 00:49:58,880
Speaker 1: of wild lands. There were other players as well, a

790
00:49:58,920 --> 00:50:02,239
Speaker 1: guy named Arthur Carr, for example, making a case for

791
00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:07,000
Speaker 1: not developing a lake up in Colorado called Trappers Lake,

792
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:09,080
Speaker 1: and he and Leopold were going back and forth talking

793
00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:13,920
Speaker 1: about the right balance between developing federal lands, you know,

794
00:50:14,120 --> 00:50:17,480
Speaker 1: bringing in roads and trails and cabins. But then also

795
00:50:18,239 --> 00:50:20,879
Speaker 1: like where's that line where do we where do we say, Okay,

796
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:24,120
Speaker 1: we've got enough development, Let's set some places aside where

797
00:50:24,160 --> 00:50:28,799
Speaker 1: the highest and best use might be retaining there sort

798
00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:33,200
Speaker 1: of primeval characteristics um a recognition and a sense of

799
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:36,279
Speaker 1: humility that we're not going to make these places any

800
00:50:36,400 --> 00:50:41,360
Speaker 1: better through through our own management. And so, you know,

801
00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:47,320
Speaker 1: the HeLa Um that was a place that Leopold pointed

802
00:50:47,360 --> 00:50:53,319
Speaker 1: to as sufficiently unique and wild and like a last

803
00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:55,320
Speaker 1: best chance in New Mexico to have a place that

804
00:50:55,400 --> 00:50:59,320
Speaker 1: could be a two week pack string um into the wilderness.

805
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:01,600
Speaker 1: So the the language that he used in the nineteen

806
00:51:02,480 --> 00:51:06,560
Speaker 1: article for Outdoor Life magazine was a plea for wilderness

807
00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:09,880
Speaker 1: hunting grounds. That was the language as opposed to a

808
00:51:10,480 --> 00:51:14,719
Speaker 1: designated wilderness area. He wrote about a plea for wilderness

809
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:17,640
Speaker 1: hunting grounds and part of the definition he used was

810
00:51:17,680 --> 00:51:20,759
Speaker 1: a landscape large enough to contain a two week pack

811
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:26,279
Speaker 1: trip free of rhods. Really, yeah, that's what he's looking at.

812
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:30,799
Speaker 1: That's what he's looking at. Yep. And he preceded that article, Um,

813
00:51:31,520 --> 00:51:33,320
Speaker 1: you know, Outdoor Life magazine was a great place to

814
00:51:33,360 --> 00:51:36,200
Speaker 1: kind of reach the masses. But I think from a

815
00:51:36,280 --> 00:51:41,360
Speaker 1: professional standpoint, and even more important point in the timeline

816
00:51:41,719 --> 00:51:45,960
Speaker 1: was in ninete he wrote an article for the Journal

817
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:49,840
Speaker 1: of Forestry in their November issue and the title that

818
00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:54,240
Speaker 1: article was the Wilderness and its Place in forest Recreational Policy,

819
00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:58,360
Speaker 1: which sounds a little bit wonky the titles like, okay,

820
00:51:59,520 --> 00:52:02,760
Speaker 1: but it's really important because what he did in this article,

821
00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:06,040
Speaker 1: he's talking to all of his fellow professional foresters. Right.

822
00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:10,000
Speaker 1: This is like the the pre eminent outlet for the

823
00:52:10,120 --> 00:52:15,960
Speaker 1: forestry profession globally, the Journal of Forestry. And Leopold was

824
00:52:16,239 --> 00:52:19,680
Speaker 1: one of the first students from the Yale School of Forestry,

825
00:52:19,719 --> 00:52:22,040
Speaker 1: which was established by Gifford pin Show, the first chief

826
00:52:22,080 --> 00:52:25,480
Speaker 1: of the Forest Services Forestry as in chopping trees down

827
00:52:25,520 --> 00:52:29,279
Speaker 1: sel Yeah, yeah, this idea of and and you know,

828
00:52:29,360 --> 00:52:32,520
Speaker 1: Gifford pin Show is one of the one of the

829
00:52:32,600 --> 00:52:35,759
Speaker 1: giants of the conservation history of our country as well

830
00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:38,600
Speaker 1: the first chief of the Forest Service. He established the

831
00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:42,600
Speaker 1: Yale School of Forestry. He was a great thinker around conservation,

832
00:52:42,680 --> 00:52:48,840
Speaker 1: and he he had this idea of sustainable use, wise

833
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:53,000
Speaker 1: use and the language the greatest good for the greatest

834
00:52:53,120 --> 00:52:57,360
Speaker 1: number over the long run. And for a society like

835
00:52:57,480 --> 00:53:00,600
Speaker 1: ours to manage these public resource is in a way

836
00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:04,279
Speaker 1: where we're maximizing their value. And so when we talk

837
00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:07,799
Speaker 1: about multiple use on our public land system, we're trying

838
00:53:07,840 --> 00:53:13,600
Speaker 1: to balance a variety of needs and harvest a variety

839
00:53:13,760 --> 00:53:17,640
Speaker 1: of renewable resources. So we're talking about forest products, we're

840
00:53:17,680 --> 00:53:21,160
Speaker 1: talking about range land, we're talking about water, we're talking

841
00:53:21,160 --> 00:53:24,680
Speaker 1: about recreational opportunity, we're talking about habitat for fish and wildlife,

842
00:53:25,160 --> 00:53:28,120
Speaker 1: all these different uses. And it's not a matter of

843
00:53:28,239 --> 00:53:30,439
Speaker 1: just rollback for something there because when you say forest,

844
00:53:30,440 --> 00:53:35,759
Speaker 1: probably talking about like timber, Yeah, absolutely, um, minerals, yep,

845
00:53:35,880 --> 00:53:38,560
Speaker 1: minerals are part of it as well. So these water

846
00:53:38,640 --> 00:53:43,120
Speaker 1: I mean like pulling water that like like wilderness areas.

847
00:53:43,239 --> 00:53:46,520
Speaker 1: National forest land often is the top of the sort

848
00:53:46,560 --> 00:53:51,760
Speaker 1: of food chain on water like these are headwaters, so water,

849
00:53:52,360 --> 00:53:55,600
Speaker 1: clean water coming off these places that are utilized as

850
00:53:55,680 --> 00:53:59,680
Speaker 1: drinking water for people and utilized to water to eargate. Absolutely,

851
00:53:59,719 --> 00:54:01,640
Speaker 1: and in fact, when the when the when the forest

852
00:54:01,719 --> 00:54:05,680
Speaker 1: reserves were initially being established by our country, um that

853
00:54:05,840 --> 00:54:12,600
Speaker 1: recognition that advantageous flows of cleaning abundant water from these forests.

854
00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:16,600
Speaker 1: That was one of the key drivers of the establishment

855
00:54:16,680 --> 00:54:19,759
Speaker 1: of the forest reserves. That in timber production early on,

856
00:54:19,880 --> 00:54:22,480
Speaker 1: those were the things that really were focused on. And

857
00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:26,960
Speaker 1: you know, later on Congress passed the Multiple Use Sustained

858
00:54:27,040 --> 00:54:30,440
Speaker 1: Yield Act, which brought in those five that I gave

859
00:54:30,520 --> 00:54:35,160
Speaker 1: you in total. So we're talking timber, water, recreation, fish

860
00:54:35,200 --> 00:54:40,759
Speaker 1: and wildlife habitat and forage for range, you know, livestock.

861
00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:44,680
Speaker 1: And it put that that act, the Multiple You Sustained

862
00:54:44,719 --> 00:54:47,440
Speaker 1: Yield Act put those five on equal footing. And so

863
00:54:47,560 --> 00:54:50,200
Speaker 1: one of the challenges for a multiplicce agency like the

864
00:54:50,239 --> 00:54:54,440
Speaker 1: Forest Services just balancing all those competing demands. But the

865
00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:59,000
Speaker 1: brilliance of what Leopold did in this article is, you know,

866
00:54:59,120 --> 00:55:02,800
Speaker 1: to his colleague who are all deeply immersed in this

867
00:55:03,560 --> 00:55:06,200
Speaker 1: thinking around the greatest good for the greatest number over

868
00:55:06,239 --> 00:55:11,640
Speaker 1: the long run. He made the case that there's a

869
00:55:11,760 --> 00:55:19,240
Speaker 1: point where additional development starts to compromise that goal, because

870
00:55:19,280 --> 00:55:22,719
Speaker 1: as you think about all these different potential uses of

871
00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:29,360
Speaker 1: the national forests, um having some fraction of that landscape

872
00:55:29,960 --> 00:55:32,319
Speaker 1: managed in a way that it provides the unique kind

873
00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:36,319
Speaker 1: of opportunities that we've experienced this last week, that needs

874
00:55:36,360 --> 00:55:39,600
Speaker 1: to be part of the equation. And so there's a

875
00:55:39,680 --> 00:55:43,520
Speaker 1: point where additional development undermines the ability to deliver the

876
00:55:43,560 --> 00:55:45,600
Speaker 1: greatest good for the greatest number over the long run.

877
00:55:46,160 --> 00:55:49,160
Speaker 1: So he kind of used the logic and the training

878
00:55:49,239 --> 00:55:54,800
Speaker 1: that he had received this Gifford Pinchot mindset to argue

879
00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:59,800
Speaker 1: his case very eloquently for why places like the HeLa.

880
00:56:00,440 --> 00:56:02,520
Speaker 1: You know, we we walked by some timber out there

881
00:56:02,680 --> 00:56:04,640
Speaker 1: that you know, some of these ponderos of pine trees

882
00:56:04,719 --> 00:56:08,040
Speaker 1: that are over a hundred feet tall, a couple hundred

883
00:56:08,120 --> 00:56:10,719
Speaker 1: years old, straight as an arrow. I mean, they'd be

884
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:13,439
Speaker 1: they'd be beautiful lumber if they were milled. You could,

885
00:56:13,640 --> 00:56:16,240
Speaker 1: you know, you could look at some of those stands

886
00:56:16,440 --> 00:56:21,960
Speaker 1: and calculate a value of the forest products that are

887
00:56:22,560 --> 00:56:26,640
Speaker 1: not being harvested in that landscape. But you're balancing that

888
00:56:26,760 --> 00:56:31,120
Speaker 1: against values that are much more difficult to put a

889
00:56:31,160 --> 00:56:33,080
Speaker 1: price tag on, like what would be the value of

890
00:56:33,120 --> 00:56:35,600
Speaker 1: the experience we had this past week in dollars and cents.

891
00:56:35,640 --> 00:56:39,600
Speaker 1: It gets a lot more difficult to calculate than board

892
00:56:39,680 --> 00:56:44,440
Speaker 1: feet of lumber. Right. But Leopold's point was, if you're

893
00:56:44,440 --> 00:56:49,360
Speaker 1: trying to think about managing these multiple uses, um, it

894
00:56:49,480 --> 00:56:52,880
Speaker 1: makes sense for us while we have the opportunity in

895
00:56:52,960 --> 00:56:56,640
Speaker 1: the early nineteen twenties to start recognizing we're not making

896
00:56:56,680 --> 00:56:58,960
Speaker 1: more of this stuff, and if we if we go

897
00:56:59,080 --> 00:57:03,280
Speaker 1: down the path of develop uping it, it's virtually impossible

898
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:05,200
Speaker 1: that we're ever going to undevelop it. Right, We're not

899
00:57:05,239 --> 00:57:07,880
Speaker 1: gonna we're not gonna rewild these places if we go

900
00:57:08,000 --> 00:57:10,800
Speaker 1: down that path. So we have this opportunity, we have

901
00:57:10,880 --> 00:57:13,879
Speaker 1: this this this door is open now in the early

902
00:57:14,000 --> 00:57:17,800
Speaker 1: nineties to say a place like the HeLa. Yeah, there's

903
00:57:17,840 --> 00:57:20,960
Speaker 1: other values that we could potentially extract there, but the

904
00:57:21,040 --> 00:57:25,080
Speaker 1: highest and best use of this place would be preserving

905
00:57:25,160 --> 00:57:29,640
Speaker 1: it in its primitive condition, not trying to make it better,

906
00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:34,520
Speaker 1: not trying to open it up for extractive uses, retain

907
00:57:34,640 --> 00:57:38,480
Speaker 1: it for its wildness. And that was a very radical

908
00:57:38,600 --> 00:57:43,440
Speaker 1: idea in his professional circles. But he argued it on

909
00:57:43,640 --> 00:57:46,720
Speaker 1: this logic that everyone was steeped in the pin show

910
00:57:47,600 --> 00:57:50,160
Speaker 1: idea of the greatest good for the greatest number over

911
00:57:50,200 --> 00:57:55,160
Speaker 1: the long run. Uh, how could it have been that right, Like,

912
00:57:55,400 --> 00:57:57,439
Speaker 1: it couldn't have been that radical because they got it done.

913
00:57:58,000 --> 00:58:00,280
Speaker 1: You wouldn't be able to get it done. Now I

914
00:58:00,360 --> 00:58:01,960
Speaker 1: think that's true. I think you wouldn't be able to

915
00:58:02,000 --> 00:58:06,720
Speaker 1: get it done. Wade no um and it one. It

916
00:58:06,800 --> 00:58:09,200
Speaker 1: had like by the time they got around like doing

917
00:58:09,240 --> 00:58:12,200
Speaker 1: the wilderness, like codifying the Wilderness Act and what sixty

918
00:58:12,280 --> 00:58:14,400
Speaker 1: eight was it sixty four, So it was a full

919
00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:19,240
Speaker 1: forty years between the administrative designation of the HeLa and

920
00:58:19,320 --> 00:58:23,200
Speaker 1: then the National Wilderness Act, which was signed by lb

921
00:58:23,360 --> 00:58:27,360
Speaker 1: J in nineteen sixty four, and that was overwhelmingly popular.

922
00:58:27,480 --> 00:58:31,880
Speaker 1: It was overwhelmingly popular. That's right. Just to get people

923
00:58:32,000 --> 00:58:34,560
Speaker 1: sense we're talking about so we we we debated the

924
00:58:34,600 --> 00:58:37,840
Speaker 1: statistic there day two point seven percent of the land

925
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:40,960
Speaker 1: area in the lower forty eight two point seven percent

926
00:58:41,120 --> 00:58:45,120
Speaker 1: of the land areas designated wilderness. So when people were

927
00:58:45,200 --> 00:58:48,200
Speaker 1: like griping that they can't ride their bikes on designated wilderness,

928
00:58:48,240 --> 00:58:50,840
Speaker 1: it's like you could ride your bikes on the other

929
00:58:51,200 --> 00:58:55,240
Speaker 1: ninety seven point three percent of the country. Is it

930
00:58:55,360 --> 00:58:59,080
Speaker 1: really that big of a deal. Yeah, right, you have

931
00:59:02,200 --> 00:59:06,480
Speaker 1: of the country to ride bikes on. And when you're

932
00:59:06,480 --> 00:59:11,200
Speaker 1: thinking about managing these different recreational opportunities, UM, you know

933
00:59:11,240 --> 00:59:13,640
Speaker 1: there's always going to be those those points of conflict.

934
00:59:13,880 --> 00:59:18,440
Speaker 1: But having some places where you know you don't have

935
00:59:18,600 --> 00:59:24,960
Speaker 1: the mechanical advantage to cover ground, um, you know. I

936
00:59:25,000 --> 00:59:27,880
Speaker 1: think again it comes back to this idea of just

937
00:59:28,000 --> 00:59:31,680
Speaker 1: trying to provide opportunities for the different user groups that

938
00:59:32,240 --> 00:59:35,960
Speaker 1: strike a balance. And it's you know, one thing I've

939
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:38,480
Speaker 1: come to recognize in my career in natural resources at

940
00:59:38,520 --> 00:59:41,640
Speaker 1: this point is, UM, you're never going to be in

941
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:44,600
Speaker 1: a place where everybody's just like high five and then

942
00:59:44,680 --> 00:59:50,240
Speaker 1: saying yeah, this is perfect because you know, because people

943
00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:52,720
Speaker 1: don't see eye to eye. But at the core of it,

944
00:59:52,840 --> 00:59:56,080
Speaker 1: you have a lot of different angles of passion coming

945
00:59:56,160 --> 00:59:59,520
Speaker 1: in around this resource that lots and lots of people

946
00:59:59,560 --> 01:00:01,840
Speaker 1: care about the public land system and how we're managing it.

947
01:00:02,440 --> 01:00:06,040
Speaker 1: So when we're getting that that friction around an issue

948
01:00:06,440 --> 01:00:11,720
Speaker 1: like bikes and wilderness, for example, UM, rather than lamenting

949
01:00:11,800 --> 01:00:14,560
Speaker 1: the fact that you're always caught in this tension. As

950
01:00:14,560 --> 01:00:18,400
Speaker 1: a natural resources professional, I like to remind myself the

951
01:00:18,520 --> 01:00:21,240
Speaker 1: reason that tension exists is because so many different people

952
01:00:21,760 --> 01:00:25,120
Speaker 1: care about this shared resource for so many different reasons.

953
01:00:25,880 --> 01:00:27,400
Speaker 1: And I you know that that brings me a lot

954
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:32,520
Speaker 1: of optimism because people are engaged. And if people weren't engaged,

955
01:00:32,560 --> 01:00:34,800
Speaker 1: if people didn't care, I think that would be, you know,

956
01:00:34,960 --> 01:00:39,760
Speaker 1: a much less fortunate place for us to be. So mentally,

957
01:00:40,040 --> 01:00:42,000
Speaker 1: as a natural source professional, I like to try to

958
01:00:42,080 --> 01:00:45,480
Speaker 1: stand that, stand that in an optimistic place when things

959
01:00:45,520 --> 01:00:49,840
Speaker 1: are really tense and frictions arising, just remember people care,

960
01:00:49,960 --> 01:00:55,480
Speaker 1: people are engaged. That's a good thing, um when you're

961
01:00:55,560 --> 01:00:57,480
Speaker 1: wrestling with like why would you tell people about a

962
01:00:57,520 --> 01:01:01,720
Speaker 1: place like the HeLa right? Another thing to consider, I

963
01:01:01,800 --> 01:01:05,440
Speaker 1: think is that we have so many acres in this

964
01:01:05,600 --> 01:01:12,360
Speaker 1: country that are in limbo as potential future wilderness area mhm.

965
01:01:13,640 --> 01:01:15,840
Speaker 1: There's a lot of land that's like wilderness. What they

966
01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:21,200
Speaker 1: call wilderness are wilderness study areas where it's currently undeveloped.

967
01:01:23,000 --> 01:01:29,440
Speaker 1: There's sort of like temporary restrictions on certain practices, and

968
01:01:29,600 --> 01:01:32,800
Speaker 1: at some point, um there will be decisions that we

969
01:01:32,920 --> 01:01:37,080
Speaker 1: made about how that those areas are gonna roll yep,

970
01:01:38,000 --> 01:01:39,680
Speaker 1: that they're going to sort it out there in limbo

971
01:01:39,840 --> 01:01:44,360
Speaker 1: right now. Some undoubtedly some of these wilderness study areas

972
01:01:45,680 --> 01:01:51,800
Speaker 1: we'll get wilderness designation and some will lose their protections.

973
01:01:53,120 --> 01:01:55,960
Speaker 1: Right and as those debates happen, I think that the

974
01:01:56,000 --> 01:01:58,600
Speaker 1: more wilderness advocates you have are gonna land, are going

975
01:01:58,640 --> 01:02:01,120
Speaker 1: to help more of that stuff land under permanent protection

976
01:02:01,640 --> 01:02:06,080
Speaker 1: rather than temporary protection. Yes, I think there's truth to that.

977
01:02:06,760 --> 01:02:11,240
Speaker 1: And you know, another aspect of this, you know, sort

978
01:02:11,280 --> 01:02:16,680
Speaker 1: of trade off between highlighting how cool a place like

979
01:02:16,880 --> 01:02:19,800
Speaker 1: the HeLa is versus keeping you know, keeping things on

980
01:02:19,880 --> 01:02:25,600
Speaker 1: the d l um. The HeLa is not unique in

981
01:02:25,760 --> 01:02:29,200
Speaker 1: providing opportunities to do the kind of things that we

982
01:02:29,280 --> 01:02:31,360
Speaker 1: were just doing. The Heel is one place of many

983
01:02:32,280 --> 01:02:36,480
Speaker 1: where folks can go out and whether it's turkey hunting

984
01:02:36,600 --> 01:02:39,640
Speaker 1: or you know, looking for spruce grouse or going after

985
01:02:40,080 --> 01:02:45,640
Speaker 1: a mule deer or trying to catch a cutthroat trout. Um, Yeah,

986
01:02:45,680 --> 01:02:48,920
Speaker 1: the Heel is one amazing place. And take some time

987
01:02:48,960 --> 01:02:54,320
Speaker 1: to educate yourself about where your local opportunities are. Two,

988
01:02:55,040 --> 01:02:57,320
Speaker 1: work your tail off to get into a place where

989
01:02:57,840 --> 01:02:59,840
Speaker 1: you're leaving a lot of you know, the the other

990
01:03:00,000 --> 01:03:02,200
Speaker 1: folks behind at the trailhead who might not be as

991
01:03:02,240 --> 01:03:05,760
Speaker 1: willing to go as deep as you want to go. Um.

992
01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:09,720
Speaker 1: I mentioned to you this week, Steve, I've hunted wild

993
01:03:09,800 --> 01:03:14,120
Speaker 1: turkeys in wilderness on all five National forests in New Mexico.

994
01:03:14,480 --> 01:03:18,400
Speaker 1: So the Carson, the Santa Fe, the Cbola, the Lincoln,

995
01:03:18,720 --> 01:03:22,080
Speaker 1: the HeLa, they all have wilderness areas with turkeys in them,

996
01:03:22,240 --> 01:03:27,000
Speaker 1: and I've hunted turkeys in all those places. So I

997
01:03:27,080 --> 01:03:29,600
Speaker 1: want to point out real quick that we're not talking

998
01:03:29,640 --> 01:03:34,080
Speaker 1: about turkey hunting where you're like, oh, there's twenty of them. Yeah, yeah,

999
01:03:34,920 --> 01:03:42,320
Speaker 1: well yeah, yeah, it's not any many square miles of

1000
01:03:42,480 --> 01:03:45,960
Speaker 1: what would be that would strike you as phenomenal turkey

1001
01:03:46,040 --> 01:03:51,800
Speaker 1: habitat with no turkeys or with with scattered turkeys. I'm saying,

1002
01:03:51,800 --> 01:03:54,120
Speaker 1: there's a lot of square miles. Yeah, that look good.

1003
01:03:54,200 --> 01:03:57,320
Speaker 1: There's Okay, you go out. Let me put it this way. Okay,

1004
01:03:57,440 --> 01:04:02,680
Speaker 1: you go out to bubbly dogs play, yep. Okay, find

1005
01:04:02,720 --> 01:04:05,120
Speaker 1: me a square mile of turkey habitat without a turkey

1006
01:04:05,200 --> 01:04:08,280
Speaker 1: on it. Yeah, I can't do it, yeah, Okay, but

1007
01:04:08,400 --> 01:04:10,840
Speaker 1: I could go out and damn sure if someone went

1008
01:04:10,880 --> 01:04:14,400
Speaker 1: out to the HeLa, yeah and made me a square.

1009
01:04:14,880 --> 01:04:17,400
Speaker 1: You could you could square mile square. I could find

1010
01:04:17,480 --> 01:04:20,120
Speaker 1: place to put that square, and then they could like

1011
01:04:20,680 --> 01:04:23,600
Speaker 1: stop time and have people comment and they would be like,

1012
01:04:24,160 --> 01:04:28,200
Speaker 1: there is categorically wild turkey. I agree. I agree with

1013
01:04:28,280 --> 01:04:31,520
Speaker 1: your assessment on this square mile of turkey. It is

1014
01:04:31,680 --> 01:04:36,520
Speaker 1: it is absolutely a conscious decision to go past many,

1015
01:04:36,600 --> 01:04:39,800
Speaker 1: many turkeys to get to the edge of the Helo

1016
01:04:39,840 --> 01:04:46,000
Speaker 1: wilderness and then opt in on working like physically working

1017
01:04:46,240 --> 01:04:54,160
Speaker 1: much much harder to find and hunt Gobbler's physically working. Yeah,

1018
01:04:54,440 --> 01:04:57,200
Speaker 1: give some of the mileages, Like, give some of mileages

1019
01:04:57,280 --> 01:04:59,120
Speaker 1: you put in this week. I don't want it. I

1020
01:04:59,120 --> 01:05:01,200
Speaker 1: don't want to sound like, you know, like a blow harder,

1021
01:05:01,280 --> 01:05:02,720
Speaker 1: like I'm making stuff up. But you guys had a

1022
01:05:02,760 --> 01:05:05,480
Speaker 1: track function. You had a track function on I did not,

1023
01:05:05,720 --> 01:05:07,560
Speaker 1: And I'll be honest, like who had the track functions?

1024
01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:11,480
Speaker 1: I think? Yeah, Okay, you guys did You guys did

1025
01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:14,040
Speaker 1: in one day. I don't know why everybody's also acting

1026
01:05:14,040 --> 01:05:15,760
Speaker 1: like they don't know what I'm talking about. You guys

1027
01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:19,760
Speaker 1: in one day, you guys did well. No, you're rounding up,

1028
01:05:20,480 --> 01:05:24,160
Speaker 1: wasn't it fourteen point nine two? You did a fourteen

1029
01:05:24,480 --> 01:05:29,000
Speaker 1: point nine too mile loop and heard how many gobblers

1030
01:05:29,800 --> 01:05:34,000
Speaker 1: three and kill poly two to three? I would say,

1031
01:05:34,160 --> 01:05:40,160
Speaker 1: and killed how many zero? Fourteen point nine two? And

1032
01:05:40,240 --> 01:05:42,080
Speaker 1: we were joking like this idea of like we're going

1033
01:05:42,120 --> 01:05:44,560
Speaker 1: into the secret spot deep in the wilderness. You could

1034
01:05:44,640 --> 01:05:47,560
Speaker 1: share every way point tell we could you know, post

1035
01:05:47,600 --> 01:05:51,479
Speaker 1: it on mediator dot com, and very few people would

1036
01:05:51,720 --> 01:05:55,720
Speaker 1: actually go, I'll tell you, like, like here's a good

1037
01:05:55,800 --> 01:06:01,000
Speaker 1: story along these lines. Um. So April, it was like

1038
01:06:01,160 --> 01:06:03,400
Speaker 1: right at the right at the peak of you know,

1039
01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:06,720
Speaker 1: the pandemic, everybody, you know, the world was in turmoil.

1040
01:06:07,440 --> 01:06:09,440
Speaker 1: And I thought to myself, you know this length that

1041
01:06:09,560 --> 01:06:12,400
Speaker 1: the language of social distancing was just starting to kind

1042
01:06:12,400 --> 01:06:14,720
Speaker 1: of be used. And I've been toying with the idea

1043
01:06:14,760 --> 01:06:18,880
Speaker 1: of doing a backpack like a solo HeLa backpack turkey hunt,

1044
01:06:19,760 --> 01:06:21,880
Speaker 1: and you know, I was sort of joking with my wife.

1045
01:06:21,920 --> 01:06:24,200
Speaker 1: I'm like, this is gonna be social distancing to the

1046
01:06:24,280 --> 01:06:26,840
Speaker 1: extreme because the closest person will probably be, you know,

1047
01:06:27,120 --> 01:06:30,640
Speaker 1: fifteen miles from me. And I packed back in and

1048
01:06:31,080 --> 01:06:33,800
Speaker 1: you know, it's fortunate enough to to shoot two gobblers

1049
01:06:34,040 --> 01:06:38,560
Speaker 1: and I plucked them and had them hanging from my backpack,

1050
01:06:38,800 --> 01:06:41,560
Speaker 1: and they're both you know, both long beards. So I

1051
01:06:41,640 --> 01:06:44,520
Speaker 1: had I had used my shotguns sling over the back

1052
01:06:44,600 --> 01:06:47,000
Speaker 1: of my neck, and I had a gobbler hanging from

1053
01:06:47,040 --> 01:06:50,960
Speaker 1: each end of my sling by the feet, and then

1054
01:06:51,000 --> 01:06:54,720
Speaker 1: I had these plucked birds with their beards dangling, plus

1055
01:06:54,800 --> 01:06:57,400
Speaker 1: my my big backpack, and I hiked out, you know,

1056
01:06:57,520 --> 01:07:00,480
Speaker 1: in one trip out and I was just getting back

1057
01:07:00,520 --> 01:07:03,440
Speaker 1: to the trailhead and I ran into another group of

1058
01:07:03,480 --> 01:07:06,320
Speaker 1: guys coming in there like they were they were real

1059
01:07:06,400 --> 01:07:10,920
Speaker 1: excited about they were well, I don't know exactly what

1060
01:07:11,000 --> 01:07:13,640
Speaker 1: their plans were. They had pretty good packs on um,

1061
01:07:15,040 --> 01:07:17,800
Speaker 1: but they were excited to see a successful hunter coming

1062
01:07:17,840 --> 01:07:20,600
Speaker 1: out with two long beards. And so, you know, we

1063
01:07:20,640 --> 01:07:23,800
Speaker 1: started having a little conversation and I said, I'll tell

1064
01:07:23,800 --> 01:07:25,920
Speaker 1: you guys exactly where I was. And I pulled out

1065
01:07:25,960 --> 01:07:29,560
Speaker 1: my map and pointed to him on the map where

1066
01:07:29,600 --> 01:07:32,960
Speaker 1: I was going. And the looks on their faces because

1067
01:07:33,000 --> 01:07:34,640
Speaker 1: they'd come in, you know, I'm like, so we're here,

1068
01:07:35,680 --> 01:07:38,440
Speaker 1: and I shot these birds. Is over here, well some

1069
01:07:38,600 --> 01:07:40,640
Speaker 1: of them, some of them may not even believe you,

1070
01:07:40,720 --> 01:07:43,840
Speaker 1: but believe me when Carl tells you he was like,

1071
01:07:44,080 --> 01:07:46,640
Speaker 1: way the heck over there, he was probably there. And

1072
01:07:46,680 --> 01:07:52,080
Speaker 1: then he went even farther. So I'm not condoning the

1073
01:07:52,200 --> 01:07:55,919
Speaker 1: idea of putting coordinates on on the Mediator website people

1074
01:07:55,960 --> 01:07:57,760
Speaker 1: to go out there and if you know, figure it out.

1075
01:07:57,880 --> 01:08:01,960
Speaker 1: But um, I think it. Actually, I'm just saying like

1076
01:08:02,080 --> 01:08:05,720
Speaker 1: for most part have at it, have had it, and

1077
01:08:05,800 --> 01:08:08,520
Speaker 1: those spots that we hunted that we're Yeah, turkey densities

1078
01:08:08,520 --> 01:08:10,439
Speaker 1: are not super high, but those are like my best

1079
01:08:10,480 --> 01:08:14,120
Speaker 1: spots that I took took this group into. And you

1080
01:08:14,200 --> 01:08:17,679
Speaker 1: know that was that was after trying over a dozen

1081
01:08:17,760 --> 01:08:23,120
Speaker 1: different trailheads. Um hiking, I'm sure hundreds of miles. I

1082
01:08:23,160 --> 01:08:25,800
Speaker 1: mean we we totaled it up. I think somewhere over

1083
01:08:25,920 --> 01:08:29,760
Speaker 1: seventy miles this week is what we put on. Well,

1084
01:08:29,880 --> 01:08:32,679
Speaker 1: you you did a marathon one day. I did close

1085
01:08:32,720 --> 01:08:35,320
Speaker 1: to marathon. Yeah, that's another important thing to point out

1086
01:08:35,360 --> 01:08:38,120
Speaker 1: to people. Yeah, that is an important point. Go ahead

1087
01:08:38,240 --> 01:08:42,880
Speaker 1: when it's hot. It's during the daytime. So let's say

1088
01:08:42,920 --> 01:08:47,519
Speaker 1: you wander eight nine miles into the wilderness and kill

1089
01:08:47,560 --> 01:08:49,760
Speaker 1: it turkey. Yeah, I guess what your ass is doing

1090
01:08:51,600 --> 01:08:54,599
Speaker 1: going back to the truck to drop the turkey off.

1091
01:08:55,320 --> 01:08:58,840
Speaker 1: It's not like it's not like red meat, it's not

1092
01:08:59,000 --> 01:09:03,240
Speaker 1: like big legs of deer that are pretty durable. Yeah,

1093
01:09:03,360 --> 01:09:07,040
Speaker 1: it's poultry. It's not durable. Um, it doesn't hold up

1094
01:09:07,479 --> 01:09:09,840
Speaker 1: and heat. So you then got to turn around. It's

1095
01:09:09,840 --> 01:09:11,679
Speaker 1: not like you're gonna have like a butt pole strong

1096
01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:14,040
Speaker 1: with turkeys after a week hunting. Once you get when

1097
01:09:14,040 --> 01:09:17,280
Speaker 1: you got all of his ass back, like within twenty

1098
01:09:17,360 --> 01:09:21,519
Speaker 1: four hours. Yeah, yeah, your timing was fortuitous because you

1099
01:09:21,600 --> 01:09:26,000
Speaker 1: got to send your bird back with me. So yeah,

1100
01:09:26,040 --> 01:09:29,040
Speaker 1: there's a there's another seventeen miles. I think that. Yeah,

1101
01:09:29,120 --> 01:09:31,800
Speaker 1: that day helped me out with the numbers. You guys

1102
01:09:31,880 --> 01:09:36,519
Speaker 1: have a better sense. But that morning Garrett, Garrett and

1103
01:09:36,680 --> 01:09:40,240
Speaker 1: Chester and I hunted the morning and you figured that

1104
01:09:40,320 --> 01:09:43,960
Speaker 1: was around eight miles. And then we came back to

1105
01:09:44,040 --> 01:09:49,960
Speaker 1: our camp. I loaded up with the two birds, eight

1106
01:09:50,040 --> 01:09:53,439
Speaker 1: dead batteries because we we've been filming and wanted to

1107
01:09:53,479 --> 01:09:56,040
Speaker 1: get a bunch of those batteries out. Batteries sound each,

1108
01:09:57,760 --> 01:10:02,000
Speaker 1: So filled up my pack, hiked back to the trailhead.

1109
01:10:02,200 --> 01:10:06,080
Speaker 1: We're saying it's six and then back to camp twelve

1110
01:10:06,720 --> 01:10:09,760
Speaker 1: plus eight and then we and then we relocated camp

1111
01:10:09,880 --> 01:10:13,800
Speaker 1: that night another how far back in four? Three or four? Yeah,

1112
01:10:13,880 --> 01:10:17,600
Speaker 1: we're thinking four in the bottom so whatever, that is

1113
01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:22,360
Speaker 1: eight plus twelve plus four, so twenty four miles that

1114
01:10:22,479 --> 01:10:24,400
Speaker 1: day to get the birds out. And you were bummed

1115
01:10:24,439 --> 01:10:29,000
Speaker 1: we weren't camped deeper in yea when Yeah, I told

1116
01:10:29,040 --> 01:10:31,040
Speaker 1: you guys to know, we gotta be careful about using

1117
01:10:31,080 --> 01:10:33,920
Speaker 1: place names. But I told you guys, like, go to this,

1118
01:10:34,280 --> 01:10:36,439
Speaker 1: go to this point on the map, and the last

1119
01:10:36,520 --> 01:10:40,320
Speaker 1: mile to get there is it's a rugged it's a

1120
01:10:40,400 --> 01:10:42,760
Speaker 1: rugged drop down through this canyon. And I've been back

1121
01:10:42,800 --> 01:10:44,800
Speaker 1: in there before, so I was getting myself all pumped

1122
01:10:44,840 --> 01:10:48,360
Speaker 1: up for that final mile, and you know, I'm just like,

1123
01:10:48,439 --> 01:10:50,599
Speaker 1: all right, I only got a mile to go. I'm

1124
01:10:50,600 --> 01:10:52,920
Speaker 1: gonna beat the darkness and get back to where these

1125
01:10:52,960 --> 01:10:54,519
Speaker 1: guys are. And then I round the bend and there's

1126
01:10:54,520 --> 01:10:56,639
Speaker 1: a tent sitting there in this little meadow. I was like, oh,

1127
01:10:56,680 --> 01:10:59,200
Speaker 1: it's such a such a left down man, Because I

1128
01:10:59,240 --> 01:11:01,040
Speaker 1: was I was all to get that least. But then

1129
01:11:01,240 --> 01:11:04,720
Speaker 1: when Steve came back that evening, Yeah, there was really

1130
01:11:04,760 --> 01:11:17,160
Speaker 1: good news. Yeah, you almost shout a bad back to

1131
01:11:17,160 --> 01:11:18,760
Speaker 1: you give people sense of what it's like hunt here.

1132
01:11:19,040 --> 01:11:20,760
Speaker 1: Like a lot of the traveling, not all, but a

1133
01:11:20,840 --> 01:11:24,559
Speaker 1: lot of the traveling is down in canyon bottoms. Um,

1134
01:11:25,160 --> 01:11:27,920
Speaker 1: and in what year is that big fire? That was

1135
01:11:29,479 --> 01:11:32,840
Speaker 1: the white Water Baldy Complex fire. So it obliterated a

1136
01:11:32,920 --> 01:11:36,240
Speaker 1: lot of the trail system. And you might be like,

1137
01:11:36,280 --> 01:11:38,240
Speaker 1: how does it obliterate the trail system when you get

1138
01:11:38,280 --> 01:11:40,639
Speaker 1: a big fire. Bunch of things happened. Uh. One, it's

1139
01:11:40,680 --> 01:11:43,040
Speaker 1: all the trees fall over, so the trees are laying

1140
01:11:43,040 --> 01:11:45,080
Speaker 1: on everything. And then also a lot of rock moves,

1141
01:11:45,240 --> 01:11:47,840
Speaker 1: like a surprising amount of rock moves when trees die,

1142
01:11:49,160 --> 01:11:52,640
Speaker 1: so you lose the you lose the vegetation, and then

1143
01:11:52,720 --> 01:11:54,880
Speaker 1: all this kind of like glue holding the rocks together,

1144
01:11:55,600 --> 01:11:59,760
Speaker 1: so rocks just start falling everywhere, um, and you lose

1145
01:11:59,760 --> 01:12:02,639
Speaker 1: a lot soil. Soil comes because everything runs off because

1146
01:12:02,640 --> 01:12:05,439
Speaker 1: the vegetation is not protecting it. So in the bottom

1147
01:12:05,439 --> 01:12:08,200
Speaker 1: of these canyons there's all this like relatively new rock

1148
01:12:09,040 --> 01:12:11,840
Speaker 1: all over the place and trees down and just obliterates

1149
01:12:11,880 --> 01:12:16,040
Speaker 1: trail systems. Still, you're traveling in canyon bottoms, and a

1150
01:12:16,120 --> 01:12:19,040
Speaker 1: weird thing from a turkey hunting perspective is when you're

1151
01:12:19,040 --> 01:12:22,040
Speaker 1: in some of these canyon bottoms, it's like lizards and

1152
01:12:22,080 --> 01:12:25,479
Speaker 1: ship running around. You're just getting baked by the sun.

1153
01:12:25,760 --> 01:12:29,120
Speaker 1: It's all rock, everything's burnt. You're like, like, this is

1154
01:12:29,200 --> 01:12:31,720
Speaker 1: the there's no way a turkey goes back in here.

1155
01:12:32,680 --> 01:12:34,960
Speaker 1: But you climb out of these canyons and you have

1156
01:12:35,200 --> 01:12:37,000
Speaker 1: these sort of you almost want to think of them

1157
01:12:37,040 --> 01:12:40,240
Speaker 1: as like these like islands and this whole network of canyons.

1158
01:12:40,280 --> 01:12:44,600
Speaker 1: You have these like islands of pines that were like

1159
01:12:44,720 --> 01:12:47,840
Speaker 1: big enough and rugged enough to withstand the fire. And

1160
01:12:47,920 --> 01:12:51,240
Speaker 1: you have these little green oases, not in the bottoms

1161
01:12:51,960 --> 01:12:55,840
Speaker 1: flat tops, but in the tops. And if you go

1162
01:12:56,080 --> 01:13:01,360
Speaker 1: look at enough of these, you'll find one where there's

1163
01:13:01,600 --> 01:13:06,439
Speaker 1: maybe like a gobbler, yea who will gobble once in

1164
01:13:06,520 --> 01:13:11,760
Speaker 1: a while. We had some cooperatives did, but it was

1165
01:13:11,800 --> 01:13:14,920
Speaker 1: like you know, we did we got turkeys. But there's

1166
01:13:14,920 --> 01:13:19,440
Speaker 1: also like you could also see that to go explore

1167
01:13:19,520 --> 01:13:24,600
Speaker 1: it without years of your own explorations to add on

1168
01:13:24,760 --> 01:13:27,360
Speaker 1: to it could be like you have to you'd have

1169
01:13:27,479 --> 01:13:30,800
Speaker 1: to like walking and listening. And it's not like a

1170
01:13:31,439 --> 01:13:33,240
Speaker 1: going in there and blast no way of turkeys. No,

1171
01:13:33,560 --> 01:13:35,679
Speaker 1: this is a This is a form of turkey hunting

1172
01:13:35,800 --> 01:13:39,200
Speaker 1: for a fraction of the folks that like to go

1173
01:13:39,320 --> 01:13:42,559
Speaker 1: turkey hunting. I think it's not for the faint of heart.

1174
01:13:42,960 --> 01:13:46,280
Speaker 1: And you know, again you drive by a lot of

1175
01:13:46,360 --> 01:13:49,639
Speaker 1: turkeys just to get to the trailhead where where you'd

1176
01:13:49,640 --> 01:13:52,200
Speaker 1: start hiking. I mean, the surrounding hell And National Forest

1177
01:13:52,320 --> 01:13:55,320
Speaker 1: is fantastic. Turkey hunt you have to go to the wilderness.

1178
01:13:55,840 --> 01:13:58,200
Speaker 1: But if you decide to go to the wilderness, you know,

1179
01:13:58,280 --> 01:14:01,960
Speaker 1: you have to be thinking about turkeys as a small

1180
01:14:02,080 --> 01:14:06,200
Speaker 1: piece of a much bigger set of experiences. When I

1181
01:14:06,600 --> 01:14:08,920
Speaker 1: heard that we were going turkey hunting in New Mexico,

1182
01:14:10,080 --> 01:14:12,800
Speaker 1: I knew we were going in the back country, but

1183
01:14:12,880 --> 01:14:19,240
Speaker 1: I was not mentally prepped for what we actually did. Like,

1184
01:14:19,560 --> 01:14:21,680
Speaker 1: I knew we were going in the back country, but

1185
01:14:22,960 --> 01:14:27,880
Speaker 1: it wasn't what I expected. How So, because because of

1186
01:14:27,960 --> 01:14:33,560
Speaker 1: the little problem you developed the HeLa monster. That's not

1187
01:14:33,680 --> 01:14:41,479
Speaker 1: worry about that. The miles. I mean, I knew there

1188
01:14:41,840 --> 01:14:44,479
Speaker 1: probably well, I guess I didn't really know what to

1189
01:14:44,560 --> 01:14:48,160
Speaker 1: expect for bird numbers. I think I heard somebody say

1190
01:14:48,240 --> 01:14:50,080
Speaker 1: they were you know, you had to they were a

1191
01:14:50,120 --> 01:14:52,000
Speaker 1: little more sparse and you had to work for him.

1192
01:14:52,360 --> 01:14:56,479
Speaker 1: But I didn't know We're gonna, uh, you know, start

1193
01:14:56,560 --> 01:14:59,559
Speaker 1: the day by climbing up an eight hundred ft cliff.

1194
01:15:02,240 --> 01:15:05,040
Speaker 1: It was it was closer. In my opinion, it was

1195
01:15:05,160 --> 01:15:08,120
Speaker 1: closer to and a backcountry elk hunt than it was

1196
01:15:09,120 --> 01:15:12,400
Speaker 1: like a turkey hunt that I'm used to. And I'm

1197
01:15:12,439 --> 01:15:17,040
Speaker 1: not comparing turkeys to elk. People get fired up, but

1198
01:15:18,400 --> 01:15:21,840
Speaker 1: we just you're packing a lot of shoot on your

1199
01:15:21,880 --> 01:15:25,120
Speaker 1: back camp food for multiple days, You're hiking a lot

1200
01:15:25,200 --> 01:15:29,080
Speaker 1: of miles and you're yeah, you're hunting out of a backpack,

1201
01:15:29,160 --> 01:15:30,519
Speaker 1: deep in the wilderness, and a lot of what you're

1202
01:15:30,520 --> 01:15:34,200
Speaker 1: doing is dictated by water availability, which I trying to

1203
01:15:34,200 --> 01:15:37,720
Speaker 1: find water that changed dramatically since the last time we

1204
01:15:37,760 --> 01:15:39,519
Speaker 1: were in there. Yeah, yeah, you know, we we were

1205
01:15:39,600 --> 01:15:42,080
Speaker 1: talking logistics before this trip and I was, you know,

1206
01:15:42,200 --> 01:15:44,599
Speaker 1: telling you guys, oh yeah, great water, No, don't worry

1207
01:15:44,600 --> 01:15:48,800
Speaker 1: about water at all. And we did fine. But you know,

1208
01:15:48,880 --> 01:15:52,360
Speaker 1: like our first camping spot, the last time I hunted

1209
01:15:52,400 --> 01:15:56,559
Speaker 1: that in, I was filling up my filtration bag from

1210
01:15:56,640 --> 01:16:02,120
Speaker 1: a waterfall, and this year we were like skimming. We

1211
01:16:02,240 --> 01:16:06,080
Speaker 1: were skimming rocks, not out of our nalgene bottles, from

1212
01:16:06,120 --> 01:16:09,960
Speaker 1: a little puddle. It was it was like a totally

1213
01:16:10,000 --> 01:16:15,479
Speaker 1: different canyon. And um, you know, to Steve's point, I

1214
01:16:15,520 --> 01:16:18,680
Speaker 1: think you mentioned the water kind of bringing life to

1215
01:16:18,760 --> 01:16:23,439
Speaker 1: the landscape, the turkey sign that we saw around those

1216
01:16:23,800 --> 01:16:26,599
Speaker 1: limited water sources, the place where you got your second bird,

1217
01:16:26,680 --> 01:16:29,760
Speaker 1: that was a beautiful little spring and meadow. UM. And

1218
01:16:29,840 --> 01:16:32,200
Speaker 1: we had that really great encounter with the fans of

1219
01:16:32,320 --> 01:16:35,439
Speaker 1: the bear family that had been splashing around near our

1220
01:16:35,479 --> 01:16:38,320
Speaker 1: one little you know, mud puddle of drinking water that

1221
01:16:38,360 --> 01:16:41,000
Speaker 1: we had at our first camp. So you know, those

1222
01:16:41,000 --> 01:16:43,840
Speaker 1: little points of water on the landscape become epicenters for

1223
01:16:44,720 --> 01:16:49,520
Speaker 1: all manner of wildlife, including the turkeys. I was surprised

1224
01:16:49,560 --> 01:16:53,519
Speaker 1: on how many mountain lion and bobcat. Yeah, I've never

1225
01:16:53,640 --> 01:16:56,720
Speaker 1: I've never seen so many lion and bobcat tracks as

1226
01:16:56,760 --> 01:17:02,360
Speaker 1: we did. And you know, we've been theorizing what might

1227
01:17:02,439 --> 01:17:05,080
Speaker 1: have resulted in the lower turkey numbers, because while we

1228
01:17:05,120 --> 01:17:08,960
Speaker 1: did find birds, I would say somewhere in like the

1229
01:17:10,840 --> 01:17:14,320
Speaker 1: two thirds of what I'm used to seeing range of birds,

1230
01:17:14,840 --> 01:17:19,280
Speaker 1: so pretty significant UM declined from past hunts. And it

1231
01:17:19,320 --> 01:17:22,519
Speaker 1: could be any number of factors. But there's no shortage

1232
01:17:22,520 --> 01:17:27,000
Speaker 1: of predators on that landscape. UM. Lots of mountain lions, UH,

1233
01:17:27,280 --> 01:17:32,160
Speaker 1: lots of bobcats obviously, coyotes, UM, Mexican wolves are in

1234
01:17:32,200 --> 01:17:36,920
Speaker 1: the area. UM, no shortage of critters, mean, black bears,

1235
01:17:37,000 --> 01:17:38,960
Speaker 1: no shortage of critters that would be more than happy

1236
01:17:39,040 --> 01:17:41,479
Speaker 1: to to eat a turkey. And I think that might

1237
01:17:41,520 --> 01:17:44,000
Speaker 1: have something to do with their you know, they're willingness

1238
01:17:44,040 --> 01:17:46,760
Speaker 1: to vocalize as well. Potentially, Yeah, that that was my

1239
01:17:46,880 --> 01:17:51,400
Speaker 1: pet theory is that you're just average. You're you're you know,

1240
01:17:51,479 --> 01:17:53,880
Speaker 1: you're advertising your location to like a host of things

1241
01:17:53,960 --> 01:17:57,120
Speaker 1: that would love to know where you're at. Uh. One

1242
01:17:57,160 --> 01:17:59,360
Speaker 1: of the things that was consistent from turkeys everywhere that

1243
01:17:59,439 --> 01:18:05,439
Speaker 1: I found is that there conscious to them or not.

1244
01:18:05,680 --> 01:18:08,280
Speaker 1: They're like attitude changes so much from one day to

1245
01:18:08,280 --> 01:18:11,160
Speaker 1: the next. That would be like if someday, if you

1246
01:18:11,200 --> 01:18:14,040
Speaker 1: can imagine like that you die, right and you get

1247
01:18:14,080 --> 01:18:16,400
Speaker 1: some glimpse into like all like you get a glimpse

1248
01:18:16,439 --> 01:18:20,599
Speaker 1: into the answers of the universe, right, like it's all

1249
01:18:20,720 --> 01:18:23,880
Speaker 1: revealed to you. The first thing I'd be like, is, what, like,

1250
01:18:25,520 --> 01:18:34,479
Speaker 1: what's the turkeys us? One question? What happens in the

1251
01:18:34,520 --> 01:18:38,160
Speaker 1: turkey's brain from Monday to Tuesday. I think of a

1252
01:18:38,200 --> 01:18:40,679
Speaker 1: turkey in particular, we get to like a camp spot

1253
01:18:40,720 --> 01:18:42,720
Speaker 1: and we go to a known one of Carl's known

1254
01:18:42,760 --> 01:18:45,600
Speaker 1: turkey hangouts, and we're just doing a listening post in

1255
01:18:45,640 --> 01:18:48,759
Speaker 1: the evening and there's a bird. I wouldn't say he's hammering,

1256
01:18:48,840 --> 01:18:54,040
Speaker 1: but he's definitely gobbling at dark. Okay. And if a

1257
01:18:54,160 --> 01:18:58,599
Speaker 1: bird gobbles, this is my ratio. If a bird gobbles

1258
01:18:58,680 --> 01:19:01,719
Speaker 1: once at dust, he's gonna gobbel ten times in the morning,

1259
01:19:02,720 --> 01:19:06,320
Speaker 1: meaning way more apt to gobble in the pre dawn

1260
01:19:06,520 --> 01:19:10,479
Speaker 1: moments than the evening. Gobbles his ass off for a

1261
01:19:10,600 --> 01:19:14,000
Speaker 1: nighttime gobble. Go back in the morning and some bits

1262
01:19:14,080 --> 01:19:19,680
Speaker 1: never gobbles once from the tree, hits the ground we're

1263
01:19:19,760 --> 01:19:22,680
Speaker 1: calling to it, hits the ground, gobbles twice, and then

1264
01:19:22,760 --> 01:19:24,720
Speaker 1: never gobbles again the rest of the day, as far

1265
01:19:24,760 --> 01:19:29,360
Speaker 1: as I can tell. We go back that night to

1266
01:19:29,479 --> 01:19:33,040
Speaker 1: listen for him to God to find out where he's

1267
01:19:33,040 --> 01:19:36,880
Speaker 1: gonna hold up for the night. Never gobbles once that night.

1268
01:19:39,200 --> 01:19:43,080
Speaker 1: Zip go back in the morning. He gobbles what a

1269
01:19:43,160 --> 01:19:47,960
Speaker 1: hundred times? We kill him? What happened? Like? He gobbles

1270
01:19:47,960 --> 01:19:52,160
Speaker 1: a hundred times across a little canyon, flies down, gobls,

1271
01:19:52,160 --> 01:19:54,840
Speaker 1: a bunch crosses the canyon, comes up to us, and

1272
01:19:54,880 --> 01:19:58,960
Speaker 1: Steve kills gobling his ass off. What was going on today?

1273
01:19:59,479 --> 01:20:03,280
Speaker 1: There was not going on yesterday. In your little walnut,

1274
01:20:04,760 --> 01:20:06,800
Speaker 1: you can see see a hen with him at all?

1275
01:20:08,200 --> 01:20:11,160
Speaker 1: Did we never heard of him? No Jake's either, right,

1276
01:20:12,880 --> 01:20:17,720
Speaker 1: Ja Jakes don't exist there. They all get killed by

1277
01:20:17,800 --> 01:20:22,000
Speaker 1: bob kids because they're born. They're born long beers. They're

1278
01:20:22,040 --> 01:20:26,439
Speaker 1: born long beers, and they drink dirt. I think, I

1279
01:20:26,479 --> 01:20:28,559
Speaker 1: think what happened that morning is, you know, this week

1280
01:20:28,640 --> 01:20:32,120
Speaker 1: we had Venus and Jupiter really close to a lining,

1281
01:20:32,320 --> 01:20:36,520
Speaker 1: and that morning it was those planets, the planetary proximity

1282
01:20:36,600 --> 01:20:38,719
Speaker 1: that he just couldn't take it. He had to hammer

1283
01:20:38,720 --> 01:20:40,960
Speaker 1: away on the roosts when he saw those planets lined up.

1284
01:20:41,080 --> 01:20:46,160
Speaker 1: I would love to understand. And then our last morning hunting, yeah,

1285
01:20:46,280 --> 01:20:49,400
Speaker 1: we that was a great morning man. Seth, bionic Seth

1286
01:20:49,560 --> 01:20:52,719
Speaker 1: was his purpose in life is here in Gobbls. Seth

1287
01:20:52,800 --> 01:20:57,639
Speaker 1: has Seth has great ears. He alerts to here's a gobbler,

1288
01:20:57,880 --> 01:20:59,880
Speaker 1: and we decided to go and find that gobbler. And

1289
01:20:59,920 --> 01:21:04,280
Speaker 1: a morning and we go up. Gobbles is ass off

1290
01:21:05,040 --> 01:21:08,559
Speaker 1: from the tree and I think his body gobbled once

1291
01:21:08,640 --> 01:21:14,639
Speaker 1: or twice. We start calling to him, not really replying.

1292
01:21:15,160 --> 01:21:17,439
Speaker 1: Hissed the ground and shuts up, or so we think.

1293
01:21:18,479 --> 01:21:20,760
Speaker 1: Later the day we track it down. Here he is

1294
01:21:20,840 --> 01:21:26,240
Speaker 1: gobbling again and there's two gobblers just kind of wandering around,

1295
01:21:26,640 --> 01:21:32,360
Speaker 1: one of them gobbling, no hands, no hands. We're calling

1296
01:21:32,439 --> 01:21:37,120
Speaker 1: to them, and it's like it's like zero interested and

1297
01:21:37,200 --> 01:21:42,280
Speaker 1: you'd be like, what exactly are you doing in life?

1298
01:21:43,120 --> 01:21:48,439
Speaker 1: Just browing out like what like keeping the predators? What

1299
01:21:48,600 --> 01:21:50,960
Speaker 1: are you doing keeping the predators? Guessing? Why are you

1300
01:21:51,080 --> 01:21:54,479
Speaker 1: gobbling now? And then? But you have zero interests and

1301
01:21:54,640 --> 01:21:59,040
Speaker 1: anything like what is your day's plan? When you woke

1302
01:21:59,160 --> 01:22:05,559
Speaker 1: up this morning, you thought, what man trying to get

1303
01:22:05,600 --> 01:22:07,320
Speaker 1: in ahead of a turkey? Like you don't want to

1304
01:22:07,400 --> 01:22:10,080
Speaker 1: do I'm gonna walk around and gobble. It could have

1305
01:22:10,120 --> 01:22:12,280
Speaker 1: been if I hear a hand, I'm gonna go the

1306
01:22:12,360 --> 01:22:16,599
Speaker 1: other way. They're just sick of that. Well, here here's

1307
01:22:16,600 --> 01:22:20,200
Speaker 1: the theory. I mean the day so, the day before,

1308
01:22:20,360 --> 01:22:23,160
Speaker 1: the morning before, twenty four hours prior to what you

1309
01:22:23,280 --> 01:22:28,280
Speaker 1: just laid out. Ah, you had shot a gobbler in

1310
01:22:28,400 --> 01:22:32,760
Speaker 1: that vicinity who made the mistake of coming to the call.

1311
01:22:33,640 --> 01:22:35,880
Speaker 1: And I'm you know, I'm certainly not. I'm not going

1312
01:22:35,920 --> 01:22:40,719
Speaker 1: to give more or less credit to a turkey's brain

1313
01:22:40,880 --> 01:22:44,320
Speaker 1: than a turkey deserves. I just don't know. But there

1314
01:22:44,439 --> 01:22:46,080
Speaker 1: was something that happened the day before out of the

1315
01:22:46,160 --> 01:22:50,719
Speaker 1: ordinary on that ridge and ways away, but ways away.

1316
01:22:51,479 --> 01:22:57,200
Speaker 1: And you know, if a hen really needs some male companionship,

1317
01:22:57,400 --> 01:22:59,000
Speaker 1: she's going to be motivated to get over there and

1318
01:22:59,040 --> 01:23:01,680
Speaker 1: get to those gobblers. And I think the way that

1319
01:23:01,760 --> 01:23:05,479
Speaker 1: we set up as turkey hunters, um, you know, it

1320
01:23:05,560 --> 01:23:07,000
Speaker 1: kind of flies in the face of that, Like we

1321
01:23:07,200 --> 01:23:11,080
Speaker 1: we are never just like aggressively calling and trying to

1322
01:23:11,160 --> 01:23:12,720
Speaker 1: get to that tom the way a hen would be.

1323
01:23:13,200 --> 01:23:15,080
Speaker 1: You know, when when she is ready to be bred,

1324
01:23:15,720 --> 01:23:18,040
Speaker 1: she is just as motivated to get to that gobbler

1325
01:23:18,200 --> 01:23:20,200
Speaker 1: as any gobbler would be to get to a hen. Right,

1326
01:23:20,280 --> 01:23:24,240
Speaker 1: She's going to find that tom. And so this idea

1327
01:23:24,360 --> 01:23:26,040
Speaker 1: that you know, we're always trying to pull him off,

1328
01:23:26,160 --> 01:23:27,559
Speaker 1: like trying to get out in front of him, pull

1329
01:23:27,640 --> 01:23:29,080
Speaker 1: him off the ridge, get him to come to us.

1330
01:23:29,600 --> 01:23:33,520
Speaker 1: If we were an actual hen needing to be fertilized,

1331
01:23:34,120 --> 01:23:35,960
Speaker 1: we're gonna be getting our butts over there. And those

1332
01:23:36,040 --> 01:23:39,800
Speaker 1: two gobblers were doing plenty for a hen to meet

1333
01:23:39,880 --> 01:23:42,560
Speaker 1: them halfway, shall we say, or even a percent of

1334
01:23:42,560 --> 01:23:44,800
Speaker 1: the way. And you know, we spend all this time

1335
01:23:44,840 --> 01:23:47,040
Speaker 1: trying to get into the mind of a of a tom, right,

1336
01:23:47,120 --> 01:23:49,360
Speaker 1: trying to think about what we can do to convince

1337
01:23:49,400 --> 01:23:51,760
Speaker 1: the gobbler to come to us. But it's interesting to

1338
01:23:51,840 --> 01:23:56,920
Speaker 1: think from the standpoint of a female turkey, if she

1339
01:23:57,400 --> 01:24:00,640
Speaker 1: has that urge, if she's at that point where she

1340
01:24:00,720 --> 01:24:06,040
Speaker 1: needs to have her eggs fertilized, I would suppose she

1341
01:24:06,280 --> 01:24:09,000
Speaker 1: is very, very motivated to get to that gobbling tom

1342
01:24:09,720 --> 01:24:13,320
Speaker 1: mm hmm. Did you guys try a gobble that more in?

1343
01:24:13,720 --> 01:24:17,400
Speaker 1: We sure did and no response. Didn't didn't get any

1344
01:24:17,479 --> 01:24:20,439
Speaker 1: kind of response from that. Yeah, we're laughing. Did uh?

1345
01:24:20,800 --> 01:24:23,280
Speaker 1: He wanted to try the gobble, and I was like,

1346
01:24:23,439 --> 01:24:25,600
Speaker 1: if we get shot after doing this, I'm gonna be

1347
01:24:25,760 --> 01:24:30,920
Speaker 1: very surprised. Yeah. Man, the heel is one of those

1348
01:24:30,960 --> 01:24:34,639
Speaker 1: places where, Yeah, I'm not big on using like gobble

1349
01:24:34,720 --> 01:24:37,599
Speaker 1: calls on public ground in the Midwest or places where

1350
01:24:37,600 --> 01:24:40,439
Speaker 1: there's high hunting pressure, but yeah, if some dude, if

1351
01:24:40,479 --> 01:24:43,000
Speaker 1: some dude came strolling into the sound of my gobbl call,

1352
01:24:43,160 --> 01:24:47,080
Speaker 1: I would be absolutely shot. Now that I'm hunting turkeys

1353
01:24:47,160 --> 01:24:50,280
Speaker 1: with my kids, I made a you have to like

1354
01:24:50,400 --> 01:24:53,640
Speaker 1: make rules, you know, so you avoid all these like

1355
01:24:53,720 --> 01:24:58,400
Speaker 1: case by case by case things like in terms of

1356
01:24:58,479 --> 01:25:01,080
Speaker 1: social media, just like made rules about our kids in

1357
01:25:01,160 --> 01:25:04,599
Speaker 1: social media. Uh, and that way you're not every day

1358
01:25:04,680 --> 01:25:06,560
Speaker 1: being like, wow, we you know about this. We just

1359
01:25:06,640 --> 01:25:09,680
Speaker 1: like made up rule and then we lived by the rule. Um.

1360
01:25:10,640 --> 01:25:16,920
Speaker 1: I said to myself, I will never gobble with my

1361
01:25:17,000 --> 01:25:21,400
Speaker 1: kid next to me. I think that's sensible. And even

1362
01:25:21,600 --> 01:25:23,280
Speaker 1: yesterday I thought about it. I was like, would I

1363
01:25:23,400 --> 01:25:25,679
Speaker 1: violate my no gobble with my kid next to me rule?

1364
01:25:25,720 --> 01:25:27,439
Speaker 1: And I was like, no, I wouldn't violate my no gobble.

1365
01:25:27,600 --> 01:25:28,960
Speaker 1: It's good to have a rule and stick to it.

1366
01:25:29,280 --> 01:25:31,920
Speaker 1: I know you're a fan of the slippery slope arguments. Well,

1367
01:25:31,960 --> 01:25:34,040
Speaker 1: if I get peppered with it, that's me. But if,

1368
01:25:35,080 --> 01:25:38,320
Speaker 1: oh man, if I gobbled my kid got shot, dude one,

1369
01:25:38,479 --> 01:25:42,639
Speaker 1: I'd never hear the end of it from my wife too,

1370
01:25:42,720 --> 01:25:46,080
Speaker 1: I feel bad as well. Yeah. Well, we talked about,

1371
01:25:46,640 --> 01:25:49,600
Speaker 1: you know, the use of fans a little bit and

1372
01:25:50,400 --> 01:25:55,320
Speaker 1: how effective and also how dangerous that strategy is in

1373
01:25:55,439 --> 01:25:58,960
Speaker 1: some states. Going go in the direction of outlining it,

1374
01:26:00,520 --> 01:26:04,679
Speaker 1: and you use use the verb fanning, which I wasn't

1375
01:26:04,720 --> 01:26:07,600
Speaker 1: familiar with, but i'd heard the term reaping. Yeah, that

1376
01:26:07,720 --> 01:26:09,760
Speaker 1: seems more like a heavy metal term to me. Yeah,

1377
01:26:10,320 --> 01:26:13,840
Speaker 1: I don't know, it seems like a heavy metal band. Yeah, yeah,

1378
01:26:14,040 --> 01:26:18,839
Speaker 1: and reaping do they mean like like like like reaping

1379
01:26:18,920 --> 01:26:23,360
Speaker 1: the harvest, reaping the wheat. Maybe there's like a grim

1380
01:26:23,439 --> 01:26:26,000
Speaker 1: reaper tie. I don't know, I don't get it what

1381
01:26:26,080 --> 01:26:28,200
Speaker 1: we're talking about. Why just get people that don't turkey

1382
01:26:28,280 --> 01:26:33,800
Speaker 1: good idea? Um, there's been a sort of arms race

1383
01:26:34,040 --> 01:26:38,719
Speaker 1: in decoy quality, and then at some point some brilliant

1384
01:26:38,760 --> 01:26:40,560
Speaker 1: person realized that the thing that looks most like a

1385
01:26:40,600 --> 01:26:46,840
Speaker 1: turkey is a turkey. So some guys like you want

1386
01:26:46,880 --> 01:26:50,320
Speaker 1: to look like a turkey, haven't been a turkey. So

1387
01:26:50,439 --> 01:26:55,160
Speaker 1: you take a turkey's fan. Um, and and I've done it,

1388
01:26:55,439 --> 01:26:58,559
Speaker 1: and you've done it. You can take a turkey's fan

1389
01:26:58,600 --> 01:27:02,280
Speaker 1: and mounting out a handle and dry it so the

1390
01:27:02,360 --> 01:27:04,960
Speaker 1: fans open. And when you get a couple of gobblers

1391
01:27:05,000 --> 01:27:06,800
Speaker 1: that are out strutting around and all carried away, or

1392
01:27:06,840 --> 01:27:10,200
Speaker 1: all gobbler, all strutting around, all carried away, you can

1393
01:27:10,840 --> 01:27:13,040
Speaker 1: slink along like a worm, holding the fan out in

1394
01:27:13,120 --> 01:27:15,599
Speaker 1: front of you, and then when you're get in range,

1395
01:27:15,640 --> 01:27:19,920
Speaker 1: you just slip the shotgun barrel between feathers on the fan. Yeah,

1396
01:27:20,000 --> 01:27:22,360
Speaker 1: that is if they don't just come running from three

1397
01:27:22,439 --> 01:27:25,600
Speaker 1: hundred yards away when they see that fan. They't like

1398
01:27:25,920 --> 01:27:28,759
Speaker 1: running at you. It's like when they there's something about

1399
01:27:28,760 --> 01:27:31,720
Speaker 1: that eradescence of feathers that like, like you know how

1400
01:27:31,800 --> 01:27:35,519
Speaker 1: we see whatever, like we see neon colors. There's something

1401
01:27:35,520 --> 01:27:38,840
Speaker 1: about the they see it. They just don't they know

1402
01:27:39,000 --> 01:27:41,040
Speaker 1: what they're looking at. The like they're looking at a turkey.

1403
01:27:41,600 --> 01:27:45,000
Speaker 1: Who's who's your buddy? Who glues on? Down in South Carolina,

1404
01:27:45,200 --> 01:27:50,759
Speaker 1: Robert Abernew the buys a shitty bought a shitty foam

1405
01:27:51,120 --> 01:27:53,960
Speaker 1: turkey decoy and then took a hot glue gun. I

1406
01:27:54,040 --> 01:27:56,840
Speaker 1: made one as well. Took a hot glue gun and

1407
01:27:56,880 --> 01:27:59,080
Speaker 1: glued all the feathers from a turkey back onto the

1408
01:27:59,120 --> 01:28:02,120
Speaker 1: turkey decoy for that air desk. I lost track when

1409
01:28:02,160 --> 01:28:05,320
Speaker 1: it was up in the sixties. He showed, He showed that.

1410
01:28:05,520 --> 01:28:08,160
Speaker 1: He said, they're at one time it was in the thirties,

1411
01:28:08,200 --> 01:28:11,720
Speaker 1: and it was in the sixties that sixty gobblers had

1412
01:28:11,800 --> 01:28:16,679
Speaker 1: laid eyes on that decoy, and it was fifty nine

1413
01:28:18,120 --> 01:28:23,920
Speaker 1: came within two of it. Yeah, very effective. But this

1414
01:28:24,200 --> 01:28:27,719
Speaker 1: this fanning thing and then he remember these one guys

1415
01:28:27,760 --> 01:28:31,400
Speaker 1: and they got annihilated on social media, but they took

1416
01:28:31,479 --> 01:28:37,320
Speaker 1: to they took to making little hats for themselves. Dude,

1417
01:28:38,000 --> 01:28:40,320
Speaker 1: they took to making little hats. It's a great idea.

1418
01:28:42,040 --> 01:28:44,800
Speaker 1: And if you had like a private farm with electrified

1419
01:28:44,880 --> 01:28:47,000
Speaker 1: fence around it, I would absolutely do it. Like if

1420
01:28:47,040 --> 01:28:49,840
Speaker 1: you could somehow say like no human being could be

1421
01:28:49,920 --> 01:28:54,280
Speaker 1: anywhere near here, tire red bandana around your face. So

1422
01:28:54,960 --> 01:28:58,920
Speaker 1: they were a little They wear a little hat, a

1423
01:28:59,000 --> 01:29:02,639
Speaker 1: turkey fan hat, and they slink through the bushes. Their

1424
01:29:02,720 --> 01:29:06,840
Speaker 1: slink up usually crawling across egg fields. That turkey hat

1425
01:29:07,080 --> 01:29:11,000
Speaker 1: ain't making turkey sounds. Turkey sounds and then you can

1426
01:29:11,080 --> 01:29:13,160
Speaker 1: get right up on turkeys. But here's the thing, man,

1427
01:29:13,280 --> 01:29:17,440
Speaker 1: like in in in UH. In some states, like in Wyoming,

1428
01:29:17,680 --> 01:29:21,400
Speaker 1: you can hunt spring gobblers with a rifle. It's just

1429
01:29:21,520 --> 01:29:27,080
Speaker 1: a recipe for disaster. And here's a turkey fan slinking

1430
01:29:27,160 --> 01:29:30,280
Speaker 1: through the slinking through the grass. You see where it's

1431
01:29:30,320 --> 01:29:34,920
Speaker 1: gonna lead. So states have uh. I think Michigan, like

1432
01:29:35,640 --> 01:29:40,960
Speaker 1: Michigan clarified it. And there's two mallards down in the

1433
01:29:41,080 --> 01:29:44,000
Speaker 1: hotel swimming pool. There is If you look at my

1434
01:29:44,080 --> 01:29:46,400
Speaker 1: instant story, you'll get a closer look at them. I

1435
01:29:46,439 --> 01:29:48,000
Speaker 1: don't need to I can look at the mallards in

1436
01:29:48,040 --> 01:29:57,080
Speaker 1: the swim pool. That signs underscore West so, uh was

1437
01:29:57,120 --> 01:29:59,880
Speaker 1: it a time about Oh? So Michigan made it the

1438
01:30:00,040 --> 01:30:03,160
Speaker 1: You can still use real feather decoys, but they have

1439
01:30:03,280 --> 01:30:05,240
Speaker 1: to be out of the however they word it, and

1440
01:30:05,439 --> 01:30:07,280
Speaker 1: I took interest in how they worded it, but I forgot.

1441
01:30:07,479 --> 01:30:10,200
Speaker 1: They can't be attached to your head. You can't move him. Yeah,

1442
01:30:10,720 --> 01:30:13,640
Speaker 1: you can't use it moving. It has to be stationary.

1443
01:30:14,000 --> 01:30:16,559
Speaker 1: So you can, like I use a decoy. I use

1444
01:30:16,600 --> 01:30:20,120
Speaker 1: a Dave Smith, a d S D. David Smith Decoy's decoy.

1445
01:30:20,280 --> 01:30:23,160
Speaker 1: He makes that. It comes with a fan, a fake fan,

1446
01:30:24,240 --> 01:30:27,679
Speaker 1: or you just take your own turkey fan and screw

1447
01:30:27,760 --> 01:30:31,360
Speaker 1: it on there. And so you can't You can have

1448
01:30:31,600 --> 01:30:33,400
Speaker 1: the fan with you and you can place it on

1449
01:30:33,439 --> 01:30:37,320
Speaker 1: a decoy, but you can't move the fan around. I

1450
01:30:37,520 --> 01:30:40,840
Speaker 1: have even and I've killed turkeys this way. I have

1451
01:30:41,040 --> 01:30:43,880
Speaker 1: even been where I'm calling to a tom and he

1452
01:30:43,920 --> 01:30:47,080
Speaker 1: won't close the distance or won't come over the hill

1453
01:30:47,160 --> 01:30:48,920
Speaker 1: or whatever, and I can just see his top of thing.

1454
01:30:49,400 --> 01:30:51,040
Speaker 1: You just take the fan and hold it up in

1455
01:30:51,080 --> 01:30:54,400
Speaker 1: the air. If he's fired up enough, take the fan

1456
01:30:54,680 --> 01:30:58,439
Speaker 1: and wave it in the air and then lower it down.

1457
01:30:58,560 --> 01:31:01,519
Speaker 1: And oftentimes that's enough to get that to come. But

1458
01:31:01,520 --> 01:31:04,240
Speaker 1: it's also a good way to get shot. And if

1459
01:31:04,320 --> 01:31:06,400
Speaker 1: you revisit the episode we do with Press and Pittman,

1460
01:31:06,479 --> 01:31:10,240
Speaker 1: he's been shot twice. That's so crazy from Goblin. Yeah,

1461
01:31:10,640 --> 01:31:13,960
Speaker 1: shot twice from gobling. You know what I thinking you

1462
01:31:14,040 --> 01:31:17,000
Speaker 1: were talking about. The hands usually will go to the gobbler,

1463
01:31:17,880 --> 01:31:21,840
Speaker 1: but the rope draggers that you shot did that was

1464
01:31:21,880 --> 01:31:24,599
Speaker 1: a limb hanger or lim hanger lim hanging rope drag

1465
01:31:25,800 --> 01:31:28,680
Speaker 1: But he did the same thing, like once he saw

1466
01:31:28,800 --> 01:31:31,760
Speaker 1: that the the decoy wasn't coming his way, he just

1467
01:31:31,840 --> 01:31:33,920
Speaker 1: kept cruising. Yeah, I think that was a situation where

1468
01:31:33,960 --> 01:31:36,760
Speaker 1: the decoy didn't do me any favors, but he was

1469
01:31:36,840 --> 01:31:39,280
Speaker 1: like we talked about this a little bit. And and

1470
01:31:39,320 --> 01:31:41,280
Speaker 1: then the other one on the last day when we

1471
01:31:41,360 --> 01:31:45,280
Speaker 1: were in deep it seemed like that gobler he was like, yeah,

1472
01:31:45,320 --> 01:31:47,760
Speaker 1: I'm here, but he just kept moving too. So that

1473
01:31:47,840 --> 01:31:49,960
Speaker 1: seems like that holds up. Maybe it look kind of

1474
01:31:50,120 --> 01:31:52,720
Speaker 1: like that the bird, the bird that we got, it

1475
01:31:52,800 --> 01:31:54,439
Speaker 1: did seem like he kind of cruised through. There's no

1476
01:31:54,560 --> 01:31:58,920
Speaker 1: way he'd missed seeing the decoy, Like he came within

1477
01:31:59,439 --> 01:32:02,599
Speaker 1: fifty rds of the decoy and just strutted on by,

1478
01:32:02,720 --> 01:32:04,960
Speaker 1: like come on, baby, let's let's head on out of here.

1479
01:32:05,000 --> 01:32:07,720
Speaker 1: We've been making a lot of noise. Let's uh, let's

1480
01:32:07,760 --> 01:32:10,559
Speaker 1: mosey on down to this ridge. So it some love

1481
01:32:10,760 --> 01:32:14,559
Speaker 1: quietly quietly down here. But he didn't pause in that area.

1482
01:32:14,600 --> 01:32:16,599
Speaker 1: He was just he was strutted by. He's like here,

1483
01:32:16,640 --> 01:32:19,760
Speaker 1: I am, let's roll. And you know, I had a

1484
01:32:19,800 --> 01:32:24,120
Speaker 1: situation with that bird where um he was. He was

1485
01:32:24,200 --> 01:32:26,320
Speaker 1: sort of just above the crest of the hill where

1486
01:32:26,320 --> 01:32:29,439
Speaker 1: I could barely see his white head. At that point,

1487
01:32:29,520 --> 01:32:31,720
Speaker 1: he had the full on white head going through the

1488
01:32:31,760 --> 01:32:35,320
Speaker 1: grass and I had to sit up and I didn't

1489
01:32:35,360 --> 01:32:37,519
Speaker 1: have a very good shot. And just before that bird

1490
01:32:37,600 --> 01:32:41,920
Speaker 1: was going to be gone with that drive by the decoy, um,

1491
01:32:42,680 --> 01:32:44,479
Speaker 1: I thought to myself, I'm gonna give a couple of

1492
01:32:44,560 --> 01:32:47,280
Speaker 1: yelps and if he picks his head up, I'm gonna shoot.

1493
01:32:47,520 --> 01:32:49,240
Speaker 1: And if he doesn't pick his head up, he's gone.

1494
01:32:49,760 --> 01:32:52,519
Speaker 1: Because he he was like two ft from being out

1495
01:32:52,560 --> 01:32:55,280
Speaker 1: of sight. And I yelped a couple of times and

1496
01:32:55,360 --> 01:32:57,040
Speaker 1: he gobbled and picked his head up, and I was

1497
01:32:57,080 --> 01:32:58,720
Speaker 1: able to shoot him at that point just before he

1498
01:32:58,760 --> 01:33:01,479
Speaker 1: disappeared out of sight. But and I was the only

1499
01:33:01,600 --> 01:33:03,519
Speaker 1: limb hanger you ever saw come out of that area.

1500
01:33:04,520 --> 01:33:08,639
Speaker 1: That that is the only like legit limb hanger Miriams

1501
01:33:08,680 --> 01:33:11,800
Speaker 1: that I've ever seen in my life in person. I

1502
01:33:11,840 --> 01:33:13,640
Speaker 1: mean I've shot a lot of birds that have you know,

1503
01:33:13,800 --> 01:33:19,920
Speaker 1: like the triangular spurs of like a two year old gobbler. Um,

1504
01:33:20,040 --> 01:33:23,519
Speaker 1: this one had like the just dark black hooks with

1505
01:33:24,160 --> 01:33:27,640
Speaker 1: sharp sharp points on the tips. Yeah, I mean that

1506
01:33:27,760 --> 01:33:30,960
Speaker 1: was That was a sweet gobbler and a lot of

1507
01:33:31,000 --> 01:33:34,040
Speaker 1: weight too. You know, I've I've not seen I don't.

1508
01:33:34,080 --> 01:33:37,519
Speaker 1: I think that the first bird you got and the

1509
01:33:37,640 --> 01:33:40,320
Speaker 1: one I got were two of the heaviest Miriams I've

1510
01:33:40,360 --> 01:33:43,680
Speaker 1: ever seen. I mean those were meaty birds and oftentimes

1511
01:33:43,760 --> 01:33:46,599
Speaker 1: you know, grown up hunting Easterns in the Midwest. When

1512
01:33:46,640 --> 01:33:48,600
Speaker 1: I first got out here and got my hands on

1513
01:33:49,160 --> 01:33:51,519
Speaker 1: Miriam's turkeys, I was like, God, these things are like

1514
01:33:51,640 --> 01:33:54,679
Speaker 1: half as big. But the two that we got, we're

1515
01:33:54,840 --> 01:33:58,960
Speaker 1: just dandies. What's your real quick uh, what's your take

1516
01:33:59,080 --> 01:34:03,800
Speaker 1: on turkey hunting with a red dot site? Um, it's

1517
01:34:03,840 --> 01:34:05,599
Speaker 1: kind of like wall is a little bit like Walleye

1518
01:34:05,600 --> 01:34:11,680
Speaker 1: fishing with fifty million. Yeah, I would say system set up. No, Joe,

1519
01:34:12,000 --> 01:34:15,840
Speaker 1: it's not that bad. Just like so so here here,

1520
01:34:15,880 --> 01:34:17,519
Speaker 1: here's a couple of here's a couple of things I'll

1521
01:34:17,520 --> 01:34:23,080
Speaker 1: say about that. I'd never used one before. Um, Yanni

1522
01:34:23,280 --> 01:34:25,040
Speaker 1: was kind enough to set me up with a shotgun

1523
01:34:25,120 --> 01:34:28,400
Speaker 1: that he recommended I test out, and so I had

1524
01:34:28,400 --> 01:34:32,960
Speaker 1: a loner shotgun for this trip. And I think if

1525
01:34:32,960 --> 01:34:35,040
Speaker 1: I had my druthers, I would have just had a

1526
01:34:35,080 --> 01:34:40,200
Speaker 1: bead on there. Um not like not like an iron sight, No,

1527
01:34:40,560 --> 01:34:42,960
Speaker 1: just a like. So, so the gun I typically shoot

1528
01:34:43,040 --> 01:34:45,680
Speaker 1: has a vent rib with a bead on the end

1529
01:34:45,720 --> 01:34:47,639
Speaker 1: and then a little bead like halfway down the barrel,

1530
01:34:47,960 --> 01:34:50,080
Speaker 1: so you can can line those up, get tight to

1531
01:34:50,160 --> 01:34:53,719
Speaker 1: your shoulder, get your cheek down, and I I haven't

1532
01:34:53,760 --> 01:34:58,840
Speaker 1: had issues with missing turkeys. Um. Now that being said,

1533
01:34:59,800 --> 01:35:04,720
Speaker 1: I've got a twenty gauge pump youth shotgun that my

1534
01:35:04,800 --> 01:35:08,080
Speaker 1: wife shoots, and I did put a red dot on

1535
01:35:08,240 --> 01:35:13,800
Speaker 1: that because we've had a couple of very close encounters

1536
01:35:14,160 --> 01:35:18,519
Speaker 1: where you know, I feel like she's she's at you know,

1537
01:35:18,720 --> 01:35:21,160
Speaker 1: she's at an awkward angle or just trying to line

1538
01:35:21,160 --> 01:35:23,040
Speaker 1: the shot up. And if you have a bird that's

1539
01:35:23,040 --> 01:35:25,400
Speaker 1: super close in your shot pattern is very very tight,

1540
01:35:25,960 --> 01:35:27,559
Speaker 1: you know, it's much easier to miss a bird at

1541
01:35:28,040 --> 01:35:29,800
Speaker 1: ten yards than it is to miss one at twenty

1542
01:35:29,880 --> 01:35:35,519
Speaker 1: five yards. And you know, I think for her, she's

1543
01:35:35,560 --> 01:35:37,800
Speaker 1: more comfortable being able to just see that dot at

1544
01:35:37,840 --> 01:35:39,960
Speaker 1: whatever angle her head is and not have to worry

1545
01:35:40,000 --> 01:35:43,360
Speaker 1: about lining up the beads. So I think there's there's

1546
01:35:43,400 --> 01:35:47,800
Speaker 1: an element to it of um, you know, having an advantage.

1547
01:35:47,800 --> 01:35:50,519
Speaker 1: But the other thing is just being in the being

1548
01:35:50,560 --> 01:35:55,439
Speaker 1: in the hinterlands with another electronic device where you know

1549
01:35:55,560 --> 01:35:58,439
Speaker 1: you might break something like I'm I'm I'm pretty hard

1550
01:35:58,479 --> 01:36:01,760
Speaker 1: on my year and around the way we are, and

1551
01:36:01,800 --> 01:36:03,120
Speaker 1: so it's always kind of weighing in the back of

1552
01:36:03,160 --> 01:36:04,880
Speaker 1: my mind, am I gonna scratch this thing up? Am

1553
01:36:04,920 --> 01:36:08,080
Speaker 1: I gonna knock it off kilter? Whereas with a with

1554
01:36:08,200 --> 01:36:10,200
Speaker 1: a shotgun barrel that's got a couple of beads on,

1555
01:36:10,280 --> 01:36:11,880
Speaker 1: it just doesn't seem like there's a heck of a

1556
01:36:11,920 --> 01:36:13,960
Speaker 1: lot that could go wrong. So the short answer is

1557
01:36:14,439 --> 01:36:17,360
Speaker 1: I see the advantage. Personally, I think I'd prefer the

1558
01:36:17,439 --> 01:36:20,800
Speaker 1: lower tech option. What I'd like to do. I can

1559
01:36:20,840 --> 01:36:25,240
Speaker 1: see having a one on a quick detached mount. Yeah.

1560
01:36:25,320 --> 01:36:29,600
Speaker 1: I wonder about how consistently you could like reattach it

1561
01:36:29,640 --> 01:36:31,240
Speaker 1: and have it beat Oh, that's what. That's the whole

1562
01:36:31,240 --> 01:36:34,080
Speaker 1: point of quick attach. You'd have a you could you

1563
01:36:34,120 --> 01:36:36,240
Speaker 1: could have a rifle's zero tards and take on and

1564
01:36:36,320 --> 01:36:41,599
Speaker 1: off a quick detatch mount. It goes right back to zero. Yeah.

1565
01:36:41,640 --> 01:36:44,000
Speaker 1: I guess I would just stick by my statement for

1566
01:36:44,160 --> 01:36:46,920
Speaker 1: for me personally, give me a bead. He did make

1567
01:36:46,960 --> 01:36:50,800
Speaker 1: a good shot with that, though, I appreciate. Yeah, I

1568
01:36:50,800 --> 01:36:59,840
Speaker 1: mean it worked out great. No complaints, um lower text

1569
01:37:00,080 --> 01:37:05,760
Speaker 1: by me. Let me tell you something. This isn't about

1570
01:37:05,800 --> 01:37:09,479
Speaker 1: red dots. Okay. If there's two things I like in life,

1571
01:37:09,520 --> 01:37:13,479
Speaker 1: it's about wallet boat. It's just two things I like

1572
01:37:13,600 --> 01:37:20,519
Speaker 1: in life. It's federally designated wilderness and turkeys. Okay. If

1573
01:37:20,560 --> 01:37:26,960
Speaker 1: there's three, it's my family. I was he's not necessarily

1574
01:37:27,000 --> 01:37:34,280
Speaker 1: giving him order turkeys, No, federally designated wilderness, my children.

1575
01:37:35,520 --> 01:37:38,439
Speaker 1: That's saying something. So I'm gonna focus on the two

1576
01:37:38,479 --> 01:37:43,400
Speaker 1: were here. I'm not I'm not agreeing. I'm not agreeing

1577
01:37:43,439 --> 01:37:45,760
Speaker 1: with Steve, but I'll say this, Steve has had an

1578
01:37:45,760 --> 01:37:50,240
Speaker 1: appreciation for turkeys and federally designated wilderness longer it predates

1579
01:37:50,280 --> 01:37:54,200
Speaker 1: my children. Yeah, it's like a longer romance dates them. Yeah,

1580
01:37:54,200 --> 01:37:56,600
Speaker 1: there's something to say, for years under your belt with

1581
01:37:56,680 --> 01:37:59,000
Speaker 1: those first two. So I'm just I'm sticking to my

1582
01:37:59,080 --> 01:38:02,600
Speaker 1: guns here predates them and just they don't listen to

1583
01:38:02,680 --> 01:38:06,320
Speaker 1: the show. So I can I can get away with

1584
01:38:06,400 --> 01:38:10,559
Speaker 1: hell the truth here? What word you it wasn't love?

1585
01:38:10,640 --> 01:38:14,880
Speaker 1: What was it? Federally designated wilderness. If there's two things

1586
01:38:15,080 --> 01:38:17,640
Speaker 1: I love, two things I love, I love, So what

1587
01:38:17,720 --> 01:38:21,000
Speaker 1: about hunting turkeys in federally designated That's what I want

1588
01:38:21,040 --> 01:38:27,439
Speaker 1: to say. Okay, I'll feeling the So. Uh, we can

1589
01:38:27,520 --> 01:38:31,640
Speaker 1: hunt turkeys and states everywhere but Alaska. In in the

1590
01:38:31,800 --> 01:38:37,040
Speaker 1: US at the time of European contact, there were turkeys.

1591
01:38:37,120 --> 01:38:40,960
Speaker 1: They were probably turkeys, and what is now thirty nine states. Okay,

1592
01:38:42,120 --> 01:38:46,160
Speaker 1: so there are ten states running around out there that

1593
01:38:46,760 --> 01:38:50,680
Speaker 1: have turkeys that didn't. I happen to live in one

1594
01:38:50,720 --> 01:38:58,280
Speaker 1: of them. Uh, California probably did not have turkeys. Montana

1595
01:38:58,400 --> 01:39:00,120
Speaker 1: not have turkeys. I Hadaho did not have turkey is

1596
01:39:00,160 --> 01:39:03,679
Speaker 1: Washington did not have turkeys. Hawaii did not have turkeys.

1597
01:39:03,960 --> 01:39:09,920
Speaker 1: Oregon did not have turkeys. Okay, but but but the

1598
01:39:10,000 --> 01:39:15,400
Speaker 1: Heila damn sure did. Um it's big enough if you

1599
01:39:15,520 --> 01:39:19,479
Speaker 1: have like a romance with the wild turkey. Yeah. Uh,

1600
01:39:22,560 --> 01:39:25,320
Speaker 1: in the wild turkey hasn't to to some degree, has

1601
01:39:25,360 --> 01:39:28,840
Speaker 1: the romance with us. I mean that the turkeys are

1602
01:39:28,880 --> 01:39:30,759
Speaker 1: one of the are kind of one of the winners

1603
01:39:30,800 --> 01:39:35,840
Speaker 1: of civilization, right, they like crops, Okay, one of the

1604
01:39:35,920 --> 01:39:38,080
Speaker 1: things in Montana, like one of the things that allows

1605
01:39:38,160 --> 01:39:42,720
Speaker 1: turkeys to exist in Montana's agriculture. Right, Why were there

1606
01:39:42,760 --> 01:39:47,000
Speaker 1: not turkeys there? Why did turkeys not spread up from

1607
01:39:48,040 --> 01:39:51,040
Speaker 1: areas of like come up from Colorado or come over

1608
01:39:51,160 --> 01:40:00,320
Speaker 1: from the eastern Dakota's into Montana. Too severe? Yeah, too severe? Uh,

1609
01:40:00,720 --> 01:40:04,200
Speaker 1: not enough food? Too severe? Why are there there now?

1610
01:40:04,760 --> 01:40:10,120
Speaker 1: They're there now because agriculture. They they most if you're shooting,

1611
01:40:10,200 --> 01:40:13,320
Speaker 1: if you're in southeast Montana, whatever you're shooting at a turkey,

1612
01:40:13,400 --> 01:40:18,000
Speaker 1: that turkey probably almost certainly spend its winter picking grain

1613
01:40:18,080 --> 01:40:21,080
Speaker 1: out of cow ship. Yeah. I love those turkeys to

1614
01:40:21,160 --> 01:40:30,080
Speaker 1: death more than my kids. Uh but right. But but

1615
01:40:30,479 --> 01:40:32,439
Speaker 1: to go so to be able to go into a

1616
01:40:32,520 --> 01:40:38,680
Speaker 1: wilderness area, yeah, and hunt turkeys that have no reliance on,

1617
01:40:39,960 --> 01:40:47,400
Speaker 1: no relationship to folks, gives you kind of a glimpse

1618
01:40:47,720 --> 01:40:49,960
Speaker 1: back to I mean, there was you know, gives you

1619
01:40:50,000 --> 01:40:53,360
Speaker 1: a glimpse back to a time when so much of

1620
01:40:53,439 --> 01:40:59,840
Speaker 1: the landscape hadn't been kind of influenced interrupted manipulated by humans.

1621
01:40:59,880 --> 01:41:02,959
Speaker 1: A like you're watching you're you're looking at native turkeys

1622
01:41:04,080 --> 01:41:08,439
Speaker 1: living on a native landscape, and you're going, like, so

1623
01:41:08,840 --> 01:41:12,000
Speaker 1: that's kind of what they did. Yes, it might even

1624
01:41:12,040 --> 01:41:14,920
Speaker 1: be like that's kind of the density in which they

1625
01:41:15,000 --> 01:41:19,800
Speaker 1: occur where you know, it's not like, what's so hard

1626
01:41:19,840 --> 01:41:22,120
Speaker 1: about hunting turkeys. My grandma's got a hundred in her

1627
01:41:22,200 --> 01:41:25,640
Speaker 1: yard right now. She lives next to the cemetery. You know,

1628
01:41:26,479 --> 01:41:28,639
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, but that's not one of the turkeys

1629
01:41:28,680 --> 01:41:30,519
Speaker 1: I'm talking about. I don't love the I like my

1630
01:41:30,600 --> 01:41:36,160
Speaker 1: kids mordinals, turkeys, um. But to see that like like

1631
01:41:36,520 --> 01:41:42,640
Speaker 1: this is probably what it seemed like. There's scatterings of this,

1632
01:41:42,880 --> 01:41:45,200
Speaker 1: their scatterings of that. Here and there there's a turkey.

1633
01:41:46,800 --> 01:41:51,479
Speaker 1: It's really the educational and they I think you're painting

1634
01:41:51,520 --> 01:41:55,080
Speaker 1: a great picture. And the birds at that at that

1635
01:41:55,240 --> 01:42:01,440
Speaker 1: point become in my mind, the embodiment of the landscape.

1636
01:42:02,840 --> 01:42:08,520
Speaker 1: It's like an integral part of what makes that landscape

1637
01:42:08,560 --> 01:42:13,560
Speaker 1: what it is, and there is no artificiality about it.

1638
01:42:13,680 --> 01:42:18,960
Speaker 1: There's no supplemental support. You know, those birds are out

1639
01:42:19,000 --> 01:42:23,559
Speaker 1: there existing the way they have for thousands of years. Um,

1640
01:42:23,920 --> 01:42:27,080
Speaker 1: they'd be there with or without people doing what they're doing,

1641
01:42:27,520 --> 01:42:34,240
Speaker 1: strutting and gobbling and reproducing and eating and go into

1642
01:42:34,240 --> 01:42:38,120
Speaker 1: those little water supplies. And you know, I think there's

1643
01:42:38,160 --> 01:42:42,040
Speaker 1: places where we're calling birds that have never heard an

1644
01:42:42,160 --> 01:42:44,800
Speaker 1: artificial call before you know they're hearing they're hearing a

1645
01:42:46,120 --> 01:42:49,519
Speaker 1: man made turkey call for the first time. UM. But

1646
01:42:49,640 --> 01:42:52,560
Speaker 1: it gives you a chance to experience the place in

1647
01:42:52,640 --> 01:42:57,840
Speaker 1: a very speaking evaluate in terms of very pure sort

1648
01:42:57,880 --> 01:43:00,360
Speaker 1: of way. And I love, you know, I of hunting

1649
01:43:00,400 --> 01:43:03,840
Speaker 1: turkeys in places where there there is you know, an

1650
01:43:03,880 --> 01:43:09,000
Speaker 1: agricultural presence and supplemental calories on the landscape. UM. And

1651
01:43:09,080 --> 01:43:15,240
Speaker 1: it's worth pointing out that you know, historically turkey habitat

1652
01:43:15,640 --> 01:43:18,360
Speaker 1: it's always been widely variable in terms of the productivity

1653
01:43:18,360 --> 01:43:22,440
Speaker 1: of the land. So there would have been more Easterns

1654
01:43:23,240 --> 01:43:27,400
Speaker 1: that more Easterns, let's say, in Wisconsin, a higher density

1655
01:43:27,560 --> 01:43:29,680
Speaker 1: than there would have been Miriams in New Mexico, just

1656
01:43:29,760 --> 01:43:34,559
Speaker 1: given the productivity of the lands. But once you start

1657
01:43:34,680 --> 01:43:42,280
Speaker 1: layering on the human presence, UM, it's it's a different

1658
01:43:42,600 --> 01:43:45,400
Speaker 1: kind of experience, and it's it's it's it's a different

1659
01:43:45,479 --> 01:43:48,760
Speaker 1: kind of connection to a different kind of place. And again,

1660
01:43:48,840 --> 01:43:51,120
Speaker 1: the word in my mind that keeps keeps coming around

1661
01:43:51,200 --> 01:43:54,840
Speaker 1: is this idea of just a pure representation of a

1662
01:43:55,000 --> 01:44:03,280
Speaker 1: wild landscape and an interaction with an animal that embodies

1663
01:44:03,400 --> 01:44:06,599
Speaker 1: a very very cool place. And every you know, everybody

1664
01:44:06,600 --> 01:44:10,600
Speaker 1: of these turkeys that we're eating, um, those are calories

1665
01:44:10,880 --> 01:44:15,080
Speaker 1: that have come in the form of crickets and grasshoppers

1666
01:44:15,600 --> 01:44:19,160
Speaker 1: and gamble oak acorns. You know, it's like this litany

1667
01:44:19,240 --> 01:44:22,600
Speaker 1: of food resources that are sparsely distributed on the landscape,

1668
01:44:23,320 --> 01:44:28,400
Speaker 1: but also embodiments of that place where humans are not

1669
01:44:28,720 --> 01:44:32,680
Speaker 1: the predominant factor. It's just the land doing what the

1670
01:44:32,800 --> 01:44:38,800
Speaker 1: land has always done. It's good stuff, man, other good stuff.

1671
01:44:38,920 --> 01:44:41,720
Speaker 1: I love it too, man. Uh you know how, I

1672
01:44:41,840 --> 01:44:44,559
Speaker 1: let's say I got two final things to say about you. Okay,

1673
01:44:45,680 --> 01:44:47,200
Speaker 1: when I was going to introduce you, you know how,

1674
01:44:47,479 --> 01:44:49,240
Speaker 1: we were talking about a thing yesterday where I was

1675
01:44:49,280 --> 01:44:54,519
Speaker 1: saying that that I've been all around the country. Everywhere

1676
01:44:54,560 --> 01:45:02,240
Speaker 1: you go. Everywhere you go, Alaska, Florida, New York, California,

1677
01:45:02,800 --> 01:45:06,280
Speaker 1: every ago, you'll find two outdoorsman, two types of outdoorsman.

1678
01:45:08,280 --> 01:45:13,559
Speaker 1: There's the one where everything's all funked up now, fishing

1679
01:45:13,680 --> 01:45:18,560
Speaker 1: game ruined it. There's too many people now, the wolves

1680
01:45:18,720 --> 01:45:26,040
Speaker 1: got it all whatever, Right, there's that guy always there,

1681
01:45:26,400 --> 01:45:32,760
Speaker 1: lost his spot. Everything's used to be good, right, And

1682
01:45:32,840 --> 01:45:34,680
Speaker 1: then there's always the guy that when he wakes up

1683
01:45:34,680 --> 01:45:38,679
Speaker 1: in the morning, he can't get to it all because

1684
01:45:38,760 --> 01:45:43,280
Speaker 1: he's in Eden. Totally right. We were talking about that,

1685
01:45:43,280 --> 01:45:44,720
Speaker 1: and I didn't point out one of the things that

1686
01:45:44,720 --> 01:45:48,280
Speaker 1: I respected admire about you is you're the ladder. I've

1687
01:45:48,360 --> 01:45:51,760
Speaker 1: known you in a lot of places, and you're the

1688
01:45:51,800 --> 01:45:55,479
Speaker 1: guy that's like, you just can't get to it all right,

1689
01:45:55,840 --> 01:45:57,439
Speaker 1: and you're gonna carry that with you no matter where

1690
01:45:57,479 --> 01:46:00,360
Speaker 1: you go. Thanks man, And that that makes that that

1691
01:46:00,479 --> 01:46:04,840
Speaker 1: that makes you like a good outdoorsman. Right. The same

1692
01:46:04,840 --> 01:46:06,439
Speaker 1: thing that I was gonna say is like, I U

1693
01:46:08,240 --> 01:46:11,880
Speaker 1: having a life working for a federal agency. I don't.

1694
01:46:11,880 --> 01:46:15,760
Speaker 1: I hope that someday you don't get UM. I hope

1695
01:46:15,800 --> 01:46:24,280
Speaker 1: your enthusiasms hold out. I guarantee they will, UM, because

1696
01:46:24,360 --> 01:46:27,320
Speaker 1: just the criticism and stuff could just drag you down. Man,

1697
01:46:27,880 --> 01:46:33,080
Speaker 1: well man, to having your work, to having your work

1698
01:46:33,200 --> 01:46:37,600
Speaker 1: like misinterpreted, you know what I mean? That ship is

1699
01:46:37,600 --> 01:46:41,240
Speaker 1: gonna I hope that doesn't ruin you, it's not going

1700
01:46:41,320 --> 01:46:47,280
Speaker 1: to UM. And in part it's because I feel sincerely

1701
01:46:48,840 --> 01:46:53,200
Speaker 1: privileged and fortunate to be making a living in a

1702
01:46:53,320 --> 01:46:56,720
Speaker 1: line of work where the things that we're the things

1703
01:46:56,760 --> 01:46:58,560
Speaker 1: that we're thinking about and talking about and trying to

1704
01:46:58,600 --> 01:47:04,799
Speaker 1: work through um go far beyond a job or collecting

1705
01:47:04,800 --> 01:47:07,240
Speaker 1: a paycheck. You know, both of us, probably all of

1706
01:47:07,360 --> 01:47:10,000
Speaker 1: us here in this room, have had a lot of

1707
01:47:10,080 --> 01:47:13,120
Speaker 1: jobs where you're just like, I gotta make some money

1708
01:47:13,280 --> 01:47:16,040
Speaker 1: to be able to feed myself and pay my rent.

1709
01:47:16,880 --> 01:47:19,200
Speaker 1: But to be in a line of work where every

1710
01:47:19,240 --> 01:47:22,160
Speaker 1: single day there's a connection between the things that you're

1711
01:47:22,200 --> 01:47:29,200
Speaker 1: working on and places and animals and relationships between people

1712
01:47:29,840 --> 01:47:34,479
Speaker 1: and land that matter to you in a deeply personal way.

1713
01:47:36,400 --> 01:47:39,600
Speaker 1: What percentage of the global population has the privilege to

1714
01:47:39,720 --> 01:47:41,960
Speaker 1: make a living in a way like that, where there

1715
01:47:43,080 --> 01:47:47,960
Speaker 1: their personal identity and passion and value set are so

1716
01:47:48,240 --> 01:47:51,320
Speaker 1: closely aligned with the way that they get to earn

1717
01:47:51,360 --> 01:47:56,160
Speaker 1: their keep. And I give you my word, I will

1718
01:47:56,200 --> 01:47:59,840
Speaker 1: never get to a point where I am jaded. You

1719
01:48:00,000 --> 01:48:04,400
Speaker 1: will never hear me complain about what I'm doing or

1720
01:48:06,200 --> 01:48:11,280
Speaker 1: the challenges of the job, because this work is supremely important.

1721
01:48:11,600 --> 01:48:15,920
Speaker 1: We're talking about literally the places and the resources and

1722
01:48:16,000 --> 01:48:21,240
Speaker 1: the questions that define our prosperity as human beings in

1723
01:48:21,320 --> 01:48:24,640
Speaker 1: this country in my opinion. M hm. And it is

1724
01:48:24,920 --> 01:48:28,920
Speaker 1: a privilege to be in that line of work. Thank you, man,

1725
01:48:29,840 --> 01:48:33,840
Speaker 1: I appreciate it. Next time someone's like those assholes that

1726
01:48:33,960 --> 01:48:41,719
Speaker 1: the Forest Service and be like you mean, like Carl, Carl,

1727
01:48:42,360 --> 01:48:46,000
Speaker 1: it's not so bad, oy. One other thing I want

1728
01:48:46,040 --> 01:48:48,680
Speaker 1: to say, man, you know that that idea of um,

1729
01:48:49,120 --> 01:48:53,200
Speaker 1: the two different kinds of outdoors people and the folks

1730
01:48:53,240 --> 01:48:57,000
Speaker 1: who like to you know, sort of see the negative,

1731
01:48:57,040 --> 01:48:58,680
Speaker 1: and then the folks who there aren't enough hours in

1732
01:48:58,680 --> 01:49:03,400
Speaker 1: the day to soak it all up. It um just

1733
01:49:03,439 --> 01:49:05,800
Speaker 1: getting a chance to stomp stomp around in the hills

1734
01:49:05,880 --> 01:49:10,240
Speaker 1: with this group of friends and colleagues, you know, like

1735
01:49:10,360 --> 01:49:12,960
Speaker 1: every single person in this room, and you know, the

1736
01:49:13,000 --> 01:49:17,719
Speaker 1: folks who are affiliated with the work that you guys

1737
01:49:17,800 --> 01:49:23,680
Speaker 1: all are doing, I think are wise enough to recognize

1738
01:49:24,200 --> 01:49:28,000
Speaker 1: that there aren't enough hours in the day, There aren't

1739
01:49:28,040 --> 01:49:29,560
Speaker 1: enough days in the week, there aren't enough weeks in

1740
01:49:29,560 --> 01:49:31,720
Speaker 1: the year to get to it all. And I don't

1741
01:49:31,720 --> 01:49:35,479
Speaker 1: care where you are in the United States. If you

1742
01:49:37,080 --> 01:49:43,600
Speaker 1: look around where you live, there is some fantastic and

1743
01:49:43,760 --> 01:49:47,519
Speaker 1: likely untapped outdoor opportunity for you to capitalize upon if

1744
01:49:47,560 --> 01:49:50,280
Speaker 1: you're creative and open minded about it. Whether you're in

1745
01:49:50,280 --> 01:49:54,080
Speaker 1: a big city or whether you're in New Mexico or

1746
01:49:54,920 --> 01:49:59,280
Speaker 1: wherever the heck you might be, the opportunity abounds. And

1747
01:50:00,400 --> 01:50:03,639
Speaker 1: that is not the case in many other countries around

1748
01:50:03,680 --> 01:50:09,759
Speaker 1: the planet today, like the context of America. More broadly,

1749
01:50:09,880 --> 01:50:13,439
Speaker 1: we are in the land of plenty. And if you're

1750
01:50:13,479 --> 01:50:18,599
Speaker 1: whining about a lack of opportunity, you are missing the boat, man,

1751
01:50:19,280 --> 01:50:21,599
Speaker 1: So get out there and enjoy it. Land of milk

1752
01:50:21,640 --> 01:50:26,520
Speaker 1: and honey, Grand of milk and honey, gratitude of expectations, gratitude,

1753
01:50:26,920 --> 01:50:31,040
Speaker 1: gratitude above expectations. Man, there's a lot, a lot of

1754
01:50:31,080 --> 01:50:32,840
Speaker 1: good stuff to do out there, Land of milk and

1755
01:50:32,920 --> 01:50:37,160
Speaker 1: walls that might be an electronics, that might be need

1756
01:50:37,240 --> 01:50:42,240
Speaker 1: to name that boat. That's even the name of our movie. Yeah,

1757
01:50:42,280 --> 01:50:43,960
Speaker 1: when we make a movie later on A bought you guys,

1758
01:50:45,120 --> 01:50:49,080
Speaker 1: Matt Dame is gonna play Chester. Can you see that, Jester,

1759
01:50:49,120 --> 01:50:53,000
Speaker 1: Matt Dame. Look, Matt Damon is not handsome enough. Seth

1760
01:50:53,120 --> 01:51:01,880
Speaker 1: would be uh so funny if Josh he retired, is

1761
01:51:02,000 --> 01:51:04,640
Speaker 1: Josh Broland was a lot younger at Josh Broland to

1762
01:51:04,680 --> 01:51:10,360
Speaker 1: play Seth. Yeah, he needs a haircut, but I was

1763
01:51:10,400 --> 01:51:12,240
Speaker 1: just watching the Josh Broland movie where he had long

1764
01:51:12,280 --> 01:51:15,240
Speaker 1: hair like Seth American Gangster. I tried to get Steve

1765
01:51:15,320 --> 01:51:16,760
Speaker 1: to telling me that he didn't like my hair, and

1766
01:51:16,840 --> 01:51:18,519
Speaker 1: he didn't do it, so I think he likes it.

1767
01:51:19,040 --> 01:51:22,360
Speaker 1: I like it Seth. A lot of people like, yeah,

1768
01:51:22,360 --> 01:51:25,400
Speaker 1: I want dog on one dog on a close friend. No,

1769
01:51:25,560 --> 01:51:30,920
Speaker 1: I never right, don't do that. Everybody thanks to join

1770
01:51:31,040 --> 01:51:31,160
Speaker 1: him