1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:07,640 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grease. 2 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:17,600 Speaker 2: A beautiful young girl is dead, her life before her, 3 00:00:18,680 --> 00:00:23,919 Speaker 2: doing grade in college and loving life. Mattie Brooks is dead. 4 00:00:24,079 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 2: Her mother will never have her back. But not only 5 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:34,920 Speaker 2: is Mattie dead, she was raped by one person for sure, 6 00:00:35,720 --> 00:00:44,479 Speaker 2: two people for sure, may be more just before her death. 7 00:00:46,080 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 2: Yet now, believe it or not, the rape defendants are 8 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 2: actually complaining about how they are treated. Yeah, that's happening 9 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 2: in our great country. That is happening. The woman, the 10 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:07,679 Speaker 2: young college girl is dead. She's been raped by we're 11 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 2: not really sure how many people before. She's dead, and 12 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:18,360 Speaker 2: they're complaining about how they feel this while their defense 13 00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:23,400 Speaker 2: lawyers go on a fishing expedition trying desperately to get 14 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 2: Maddie's cell phone data because they want to try and 15 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:31,880 Speaker 2: argue that, oh, someone else must have raped her, someone 16 00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:34,120 Speaker 2: else must have anally sodomized her. 17 00:01:34,360 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 3: Not our clients. Yeah, that's why they want her cell phone. 18 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:40,800 Speaker 2: They want to show she had another boyfriend, or that 19 00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:46,039 Speaker 2: maybe she's had sex before. Well, really, you know what, 20 00:01:46,120 --> 00:01:48,120 Speaker 2: it's enough to make you take your daughter and go 21 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 2: hide her under the bed. I Nancy Grace, this is 22 00:01:51,400 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 2: Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at 23 00:01:54,440 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 2: Crime Stories and on series XEM one eleven. 24 00:01:57,680 --> 00:01:59,919 Speaker 3: First of all, take a listen to our friends at WAFB. 25 00:02:00,600 --> 00:02:04,680 Speaker 4: The defense US asked for the last seventy two hours 26 00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 4: of Madison Brooks cell phone data. 27 00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:10,800 Speaker 5: In the coroner's autopsy of Brooks, he mentioned signs of 28 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:14,079 Speaker 5: anal trauma. Carver's attorney says, it's their right to get 29 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:15,760 Speaker 5: to know the origin of that injury. 30 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:22,160 Speaker 4: We know from other things that my client certainly did 31 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:26,400 Speaker 4: not cause any injury to Madison Brooks, and so we 32 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:28,800 Speaker 4: are entitled then to find out if someone other than 33 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:31,760 Speaker 4: the defendants caused this injury. 34 00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:37,840 Speaker 2: Well, correct me if I'm totally wrong. To doctor Michelle Dupre, 35 00:02:38,040 --> 00:02:42,760 Speaker 2: forensic pathologist, medical examiner, former detective with the Lexington County 36 00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:47,080 Speaker 2: Sheares Department, she is actually the author. She wrote the 37 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:50,920 Speaker 2: book on homicide investigation Field Guide. She shot to the 38 00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:55,080 Speaker 2: forefront of our nation's consciousness during the Alex and Murdog trial. 39 00:02:55,800 --> 00:03:00,200 Speaker 2: She has written Money, Mischief and Murder the Murdog Saga, 40 00:03:00,360 --> 00:03:02,120 Speaker 2: Doctor Dupree, As much as. 41 00:03:02,080 --> 00:03:04,680 Speaker 3: I'd love to go on and on and on about. 42 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:09,720 Speaker 2: Your three page resume, if they want to know if 43 00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:11,600 Speaker 2: somebody else raped Maddie. 44 00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 3: Can't they tell from the DNA. 45 00:03:15,919 --> 00:03:21,720 Speaker 2: If there's nobody else's DNA there, then there was nobody else. Ridiculous, 46 00:03:22,080 --> 00:03:27,560 Speaker 2: doctor dupree. Have you seen rape victims on the stand 47 00:03:28,600 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 2: get totally eviscerated? Are you on the birth control pill? 48 00:03:33,200 --> 00:03:35,520 Speaker 2: Do you have a boyfriend? Were you a virgin before 49 00:03:35,560 --> 00:03:38,440 Speaker 2: your rape? And the defense attorney puts it in quotes, 50 00:03:39,040 --> 00:03:41,160 Speaker 2: you know what, they need to be run out of 51 00:03:41,160 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 2: town on a rail tar and feathered. 52 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:46,280 Speaker 6: I have Nancy, and it's terrible the way that a 53 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 6: rape victim is treated. Absolutely, you know, no wonder. It 54 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 6: is hard sometimes to get people to testify and we 55 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 6: can tell, you know, they often founds say, well it 56 00:03:55,640 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 6: was consensual. We can tell whether it was by the 57 00:03:57,960 --> 00:03:59,280 Speaker 6: injuries to that person. 58 00:03:59,520 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 7: We can tell whether was. 59 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 6: Consensual or not. And this sounds like a very horrible situation. 60 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 6: And these defendants are absolutely crazy trying to think that 61 00:04:08,280 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 6: they're going to blame it on somebody else. 62 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:14,480 Speaker 2: With me right now, Kieren Shala Emmy and Murrow Award 63 00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 2: winning investigative reporter. You can find him on Facebook and 64 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:24,600 Speaker 2: YouTube Unfiltered with Kieren. Thank you for being with us, Kieren, Karen, 65 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 2: let me understand this. So the defense attorneys and oh yes, 66 00:04:29,480 --> 00:04:34,640 Speaker 2: I would try all the defendants together. The defense attorneys 67 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:42,560 Speaker 2: want a jury to believe that this young girl, Maddie, 68 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:48,240 Speaker 2: consensually had vagual and anal sex in the backseat of 69 00:04:48,279 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 2: their car with multiple of the defendants while they videoed it. 70 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 2: Am I supposed to believe that's what she wanted? According 71 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 2: to the defense. 72 00:04:57,400 --> 00:04:59,479 Speaker 8: I think that's exactly what they want you to believe. 73 00:04:59,480 --> 00:05:03,240 Speaker 8: That's what they're saying, that she was absolutely in control 74 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:07,280 Speaker 8: of sanius to the sex and that it was consensual. 75 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:10,240 Speaker 8: Six And it all goes back to law enforcement saying 76 00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:13,480 Speaker 8: that actually, shit, her blood alcohol content came back at 77 00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:17,000 Speaker 8: point three one point nine. Now, in the beginning, I 78 00:05:17,080 --> 00:05:19,600 Speaker 8: myself kept saying, okay, it's four times over the legal limit, 79 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:22,000 Speaker 8: but you have to remember she was underage, so the 80 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:25,880 Speaker 8: legal limit for anyone under age is point zero two. Actually, 81 00:05:25,920 --> 00:05:29,479 Speaker 8: she was sixteen times over the legal limit. So for 82 00:05:29,600 --> 00:05:32,840 Speaker 8: someone that age at sixteen times over the limit. Law 83 00:05:32,880 --> 00:05:35,400 Speaker 8: enforcement has also said there's no possible way that she 84 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:37,560 Speaker 8: could have consented to it, making it riach. 85 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:39,599 Speaker 3: Isn't that true? 86 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 2: Jarrett Farantino, homicide prosecutor, Pennsylvania You can find him at 87 00:05:43,520 --> 00:05:47,760 Speaker 2: Jarrettfarantino dot com, host of True Crime Boss podcast. 88 00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:50,000 Speaker 3: Again, I don't have. 89 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 2: Time to read all you You're all fantastic and wonderful. That's 90 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:57,360 Speaker 2: why we begged you on. I have time to read 91 00:05:57,360 --> 00:06:01,799 Speaker 2: your full resume. Look him up, Jarrett Farantino, Jared, There's 92 00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:07,280 Speaker 2: no way this little girl consented to have sex in 93 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:12,280 Speaker 2: the backseat of a car while somebody's videoing it and laughing, 94 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:16,880 Speaker 2: and she's saying no, and she's drunk, and they find 95 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:22,840 Speaker 2: I believe it's ainal tears and bruising, and they find 96 00:06:23,200 --> 00:06:26,440 Speaker 2: the defendants DNA on her person. 97 00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 3: I mean, is it that hard for. 98 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:33,159 Speaker 2: You to believe, Farantino, that the purpose withdrew and then ejaculated. 99 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:36,000 Speaker 2: I mean, there's really no nice way to explain that. 100 00:06:36,800 --> 00:06:40,480 Speaker 2: But is that so hard for anybody to believe? Because 101 00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:42,279 Speaker 2: I find it very easy to believe. 102 00:06:42,279 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 9: You're just looking at the numbers here in Nancy. This 103 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:48,200 Speaker 9: is what I'd call rape per se sixteen times the 104 00:06:48,279 --> 00:06:48,839 Speaker 9: legal woman. 105 00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 2: How No, we do not use Latin phrases on crime stories. 106 00:06:54,920 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 2: I love Jarrett Farantino. I love to get on a 107 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:00,160 Speaker 2: packed elevator, and of course there might be one or 108 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:02,800 Speaker 2: two is yours on there and lawyers are on it, 109 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:05,200 Speaker 2: and they start spounding out Latin terms they learned in 110 00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:10,960 Speaker 2: law school that they I mean, love it, but please, 111 00:07:11,480 --> 00:07:16,400 Speaker 2: no per se, no race, hips, al locuator, nothing, go ahead. 112 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:18,800 Speaker 9: You got it. So just looking at these numbers, Nancy, 113 00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:22,640 Speaker 9: they're staggering. This is clearly someone who is in no 114 00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:27,680 Speaker 9: position to consent to anything, let alone sexual behavior with 115 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:32,400 Speaker 9: four individuals in a vehicle. If that number isn't staggering enough, 116 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:35,080 Speaker 9: it's how she was essentially dumped on the side of 117 00:07:35,120 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 9: the road after what they're claiming was a consensual. 118 00:07:38,920 --> 00:07:41,360 Speaker 2: Rise in the middle of the night, in the rain, 119 00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:45,360 Speaker 2: heavy traffic flying by, They put her out of the 120 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:50,280 Speaker 2: car and bam, she gets run over and dies after 121 00:07:50,640 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 2: she gets raped. 122 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:52,640 Speaker 3: That's what the state says. 123 00:07:52,720 --> 00:07:56,200 Speaker 9: That's not how someone who was part of a consensual 124 00:07:56,480 --> 00:08:01,360 Speaker 9: sexual escapade is treated. That's how a victim is revictimized 125 00:08:01,480 --> 00:08:04,440 Speaker 9: and thrown out like garbage. And that's what they did. 126 00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:08,040 Speaker 2: Bill Hernandez joining me, domestic violence and sex assault detective 127 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:12,520 Speaker 2: in California. Bill, every time I start talking about Mattie's case, 128 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 2: I get so madic at you and nail in half 129 00:08:15,480 --> 00:08:20,320 Speaker 2: her mother lost her best friend that day. Her mother 130 00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 2: is being so strong and trying to get through this, 131 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:26,560 Speaker 2: but it seems like every time I turn around, there's 132 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:28,880 Speaker 2: another attack on Maddie. 133 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:30,960 Speaker 3: That's what this is. She's dead. 134 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:34,920 Speaker 2: She can't defend herself, but you know what, we can 135 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:38,680 Speaker 2: defend her. Do you ever get tired of the victim 136 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:42,319 Speaker 2: getting blamed? I mean you see it every day, Bill Hernandez, 137 00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:42,720 Speaker 2: I do. 138 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:45,200 Speaker 10: I see it all the time, and it's so frustrating. 139 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:49,040 Speaker 10: And to walk a victim through something like that, and 140 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:51,960 Speaker 10: to try to prepare them when they're living it is 141 00:08:52,040 --> 00:08:53,960 Speaker 10: so difficult to let them know, hey, this is what's 142 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 10: going to happen, and it's so embarrassing for them because 143 00:08:57,160 --> 00:09:01,760 Speaker 10: their history gets attacked, they get billed, they get embarrassed, 144 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:03,040 Speaker 10: and it's horrifying. 145 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:07,559 Speaker 2: You know. The other issue here is there is something 146 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:12,520 Speaker 2: called the rape shield law. I know a lot about 147 00:09:12,559 --> 00:09:16,079 Speaker 2: it in the state of Georgia. I remember that was 148 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 2: one of two years that I worked with the Georgia 149 00:09:19,160 --> 00:09:25,640 Speaker 2: Assembly and I learned a lot about politics doing that. 150 00:09:25,840 --> 00:09:31,079 Speaker 2: But we were in a committee meeting and we actually 151 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:34,840 Speaker 2: went out in the hall. I can't take much credit 152 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:36,679 Speaker 2: for it, but I can take a little credit for it. 153 00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:41,520 Speaker 2: The guy who helped hire me in the District Attorney's office, 154 00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 2: great fantastic appellate lawyer worked on the Wayne Williams trial, 155 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:47,760 Speaker 2: Joe Jolay. He said, we've got to do this, We've 156 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:51,160 Speaker 2: got to do it fast. We wrote the rape shield law. 157 00:09:51,400 --> 00:09:52,360 Speaker 2: He did most of it. 158 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:53,400 Speaker 3: I threw in a little bit. 159 00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:58,960 Speaker 2: And that is the rape shield law in the state 160 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:03,040 Speaker 2: of Georgia today. And I am so proud that I 161 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:04,960 Speaker 2: had even a tiny part of that. What is the 162 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 2: rape show law. It's been enacted in practically every jurisdiction 163 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 2: that when you have a sex attack victim, their prior 164 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:17,240 Speaker 2: sex history, if there is any, cannot be brought in 165 00:10:17,280 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 2: to evidence unless it has proven an emotion in lemony, 166 00:10:21,440 --> 00:10:26,240 Speaker 2: which means very simply, I'm explaining it in regular English Garantino, 167 00:10:26,880 --> 00:10:31,240 Speaker 2: it's emotion heard before trial, typically out always outside the 168 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 2: present of the jury, where you try to get something 169 00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:37,240 Speaker 2: in or you try to stop something before it happens. 170 00:10:38,520 --> 00:10:42,960 Speaker 2: So you would the defense would approach the judge and say, hey, 171 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:45,200 Speaker 2: I want to get in evidence that she had sex 172 00:10:45,240 --> 00:10:48,080 Speaker 2: with somebody else, just you know, three minutes before the 173 00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:52,360 Speaker 2: alleged rape, and see that seems like it could be 174 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:56,880 Speaker 2: an issue, right, But here nobody else's d and A 175 00:10:57,440 --> 00:10:58,160 Speaker 2: was found. 176 00:11:13,640 --> 00:11:15,720 Speaker 1: Time Stories with Nancy Grease. 177 00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:21,000 Speaker 2: Back to our very special guest, Emmy and Murrow Award 178 00:11:21,080 --> 00:11:23,200 Speaker 2: winning investigative reporter Kieran Shalla. 179 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:28,440 Speaker 3: Let's talk about what we know of the autopsy report. 180 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:32,760 Speaker 8: So, the autopsy did reveal that she had injury. I 181 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 8: guess downstairs for lack of better word. 182 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:37,160 Speaker 3: Okay, we don't do that. 183 00:11:37,640 --> 00:11:43,959 Speaker 2: We use the actual words, such as vagina, penis, anus, 184 00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:48,520 Speaker 2: hold on, I will give you, I'll give you a little. 185 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 2: Actually they say the same thing. Take a listen to 186 00:11:53,240 --> 00:11:56,120 Speaker 2: our cut fifty from wb RZ. 187 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:59,680 Speaker 11: This report produced by the State Police Crime Lab. It's 188 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 11: the DNA tests conducted on Brooks after she died in January. 189 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:07,320 Speaker 11: That DNA test was finished twenty days after four men 190 00:12:07,360 --> 00:12:11,360 Speaker 11: were arrested on rape charges. The DNA test examined her 191 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:14,480 Speaker 11: front and back private areas and found none of the 192 00:12:14,559 --> 00:12:18,960 Speaker 11: suspects DNA inside. Furthermore, a test of the area outside 193 00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:24,000 Speaker 11: her genitals did detect Kevon Washington's DNA, but excluded Everett 194 00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 11: Lee Case and Carver and Desmond Carter, who were also 195 00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:29,000 Speaker 11: charged with rape. 196 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:34,440 Speaker 2: So Kevon Washington's DNA is found outside her genitals, So 197 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:36,839 Speaker 2: it's going to be argued to the jury that he 198 00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:39,679 Speaker 2: withdrew from her body and then ejaculate. 199 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:41,400 Speaker 3: That's what's going to happen right there, and. 200 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:45,200 Speaker 2: He can't get away from that. The other three, in 201 00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 2: my mind, Kieran have the issue of a little video 202 00:12:52,360 --> 00:12:53,800 Speaker 2: that was taken in the car. 203 00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:56,840 Speaker 3: What on the video, Well. 204 00:12:56,640 --> 00:12:59,760 Speaker 8: It depends on who you talk to. Madison's mom says 205 00:12:59,840 --> 00:13:03,560 Speaker 8: that on this video you clearly see her daughter saying, 206 00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:05,200 Speaker 8: get off of me, Get off of me, Get. 207 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:05,440 Speaker 9: Off of me. 208 00:13:05,679 --> 00:13:11,320 Speaker 2: Isn't it true that even that night one of the 209 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:15,880 Speaker 2: guys didn't want anything to do with the rape going 210 00:13:15,920 --> 00:13:16,840 Speaker 2: down in the backseat. 211 00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:20,880 Speaker 8: Yes, the driver, actually, Casin Carver, actually did not want 212 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:23,200 Speaker 8: to be there. But then on the flip side, he's 213 00:13:23,240 --> 00:13:24,640 Speaker 8: also the one who recorded it. 214 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:26,800 Speaker 3: How do you know he didn't want to be there. 215 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:30,679 Speaker 8: Well, that's what was in the reports. The initial reports 216 00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 8: when they were all arrested were very detailed, and I 217 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 8: remember covering that he did not want to be there 218 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 8: and he didn't want to use his vehicle. But then 219 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:44,160 Speaker 8: he also one of the main reasons that the district 220 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:47,480 Speaker 8: attorney actually helped his charge to first degree principal to 221 00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:50,120 Speaker 8: first degree is because he did allow that and he 222 00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:50,720 Speaker 8: didn't leave. 223 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:55,080 Speaker 3: According to reports, Maddy Brooks, his rape suspect, recorded a 224 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:58,320 Speaker 3: very disturbing selfie video from the front seat of the 225 00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:02,080 Speaker 3: car before the Louisiana co ed was killed. 226 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:07,760 Speaker 2: Saying, quote, these guys are crazy, quote they fit and 227 00:14:07,960 --> 00:14:12,439 Speaker 2: rape her. Joining me right now, Karen Start renounced psychologist, 228 00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 2: TV and radio trauma expert. You can find her at 229 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 2: Karenstart dot com. That's Karen with to ce. These guys 230 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 2: are crazy, They're about to rape her. It's his car. 231 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:26,760 Speaker 2: He's videoing it. That makes him a party to it. 232 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:28,680 Speaker 2: They're all a party to this. 233 00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:33,320 Speaker 12: He's definitely a party to it. He said he felt uncomfortable, 234 00:14:33,400 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 12: he hated it, but he didn't stop it, and he 235 00:14:36,800 --> 00:14:41,880 Speaker 12: videoed it, and he knew what was happening. And actually, 236 00:14:42,120 --> 00:14:46,320 Speaker 12: if supposedly allegedly, you can see in the video that 237 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 12: you can see her legs, you could see one of 238 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:53,920 Speaker 12: them on top of her, and despite very loud music, 239 00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:57,400 Speaker 12: you can hear her say get off me. 240 00:14:57,880 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 2: You know. 241 00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:01,560 Speaker 3: Another issue here is, of course, Jarrett. 242 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 2: Fiarantino hold on Rachel Fisher and Toby Wilson Jarrett Fuarantino, 243 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 2: The fact that you don't stop a crime is not 244 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:13,440 Speaker 2: actionable actionable in our jurisprudence system. 245 00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 3: You don't have a duty to be a good samaritan. 246 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:16,680 Speaker 3: You may be. 247 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 2: A POC for not helping, but it's not actionable. You 248 00:15:21,880 --> 00:15:26,520 Speaker 2: can't be prosecuted for not helping or saving a crime victim. 249 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:31,560 Speaker 2: If you have a fiduciary duty, like you are the 250 00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:34,840 Speaker 2: parent or the guardian or the chaperone on a trip, 251 00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:37,040 Speaker 2: you have taken on a responsibility. 252 00:15:37,240 --> 00:15:39,600 Speaker 3: There was no fiduciary duty to help here. 253 00:15:39,800 --> 00:15:42,640 Speaker 2: However, if you ate in a bet you let your 254 00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 2: car be used for a gang rape, if that's what 255 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:49,600 Speaker 2: happened here, and according to the video and the state 256 00:15:49,760 --> 00:15:52,560 Speaker 2: it is, we'll see if that's proven in court. 257 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:54,720 Speaker 3: If you let your car be. 258 00:15:54,840 --> 00:16:01,400 Speaker 2: Used, you video it, you egg it on in anyway 259 00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:02,640 Speaker 2: that makes you. 260 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:03,320 Speaker 3: Part of it. 261 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 9: Absolutely, Nancy, this was a conspiracy. He was involved in 262 00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:12,120 Speaker 9: him driving that car, which was essentially the crime scene. 263 00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:16,080 Speaker 9: He set the table, he provided the location for this 264 00:16:16,160 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 9: to happen, his videoing, and his encouraging of this. He 265 00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 9: could regret everything all he wants when this is over. 266 00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:26,520 Speaker 9: I'm sure he could say now in hindsight, I didn't 267 00:16:26,560 --> 00:16:29,200 Speaker 9: want to be there, but he could have driven her 268 00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:33,080 Speaker 9: somewhere to safety. He could have tried to intervene. He's 269 00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:36,320 Speaker 9: in trouble because of the affirmative acts he committed, which 270 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:39,760 Speaker 9: is he parked the car, he drove around and allowed 271 00:16:39,760 --> 00:16:42,560 Speaker 9: for this to happen. He put her out of the car, 272 00:16:42,840 --> 00:16:45,400 Speaker 9: and it was all his scene of the crime and 273 00:16:45,440 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 9: he was in control. So he's responsible for all of 274 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:49,760 Speaker 9: the acts of the conspiracy. 275 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:54,280 Speaker 3: Essentially joining me right now. Rachel D. Fisher forensic nurse expert. 276 00:16:55,200 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 2: She is a saying sex assault nurse examiner. She's a 277 00:17:00,200 --> 00:17:06,800 Speaker 2: private investigator. She's author of Taking Back the Pen. She 278 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:10,720 Speaker 2: is a forensic nursing, consulting and education expert. You can 279 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:15,360 Speaker 2: find her at legal r in consult dot org. Rachel Fisher, 280 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:17,840 Speaker 2: I know you have studied this case and know it 281 00:17:17,920 --> 00:17:20,360 Speaker 2: like the back of your hand. What do you make 282 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:23,200 Speaker 2: of what we have learned about the evidence taken from 283 00:17:23,400 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 2: Maddie Brooks's body? 284 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:28,320 Speaker 7: But unfortunately the evidence is taken while she was deceased 285 00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:30,600 Speaker 7: straight so the moving out of the corner can do 286 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:34,439 Speaker 7: this sexual assaulting down and so you're working with a 287 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:38,240 Speaker 7: dead body. So the crime scene is her body and 288 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 7: the evidence is her voice. And when you take swabs 289 00:17:41,520 --> 00:17:44,640 Speaker 7: inside of her vagina and said the anus, you can 290 00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:47,040 Speaker 7: see the injury. So she has injuries that are known 291 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:51,360 Speaker 7: acute injuries, which means they happened recently, they're not old, 292 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:55,480 Speaker 7: they're acute. And then the evidence that doesn't lie. That's 293 00:17:55,520 --> 00:17:57,600 Speaker 7: the crime scene, that's her body, and the evidence in 294 00:17:57,640 --> 00:18:00,080 Speaker 7: the swabs that's her voice. And that's what we have 295 00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:00,520 Speaker 7: to work on. 296 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:02,840 Speaker 2: I want to talk to you about your characterization of 297 00:18:02,840 --> 00:18:07,080 Speaker 2: her injuries as being cute. Could you explain that in 298 00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:11,240 Speaker 2: more detail so us lay people can understand. 299 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:13,359 Speaker 7: So the sense what they like to say is you 300 00:18:13,400 --> 00:18:16,560 Speaker 7: can't say when the injrew's got there. And when a 301 00:18:16,640 --> 00:18:18,639 Speaker 7: corner looks at a body and says, well, there's a 302 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:23,040 Speaker 7: tear or there's a bleeding tear, or there's bruising. You 303 00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 7: can't age bruises, but you can say that it's present. 304 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:29,760 Speaker 7: And she obviously can't say whether it's tender or not, 305 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:32,320 Speaker 7: but we can say it is there, there's a tear, 306 00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:35,360 Speaker 7: it's not healed. If it's a healed terar scapped over, 307 00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:37,560 Speaker 7: then you can say, okay, it was prior. But these 308 00:18:37,560 --> 00:18:41,600 Speaker 7: are acute, meaning this just happened, and it's consistent with 309 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:45,680 Speaker 7: the history that we know of her being intoxicated. The 310 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:48,440 Speaker 7: blood alcohol level that was drawn. This is a drug 311 00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:52,360 Speaker 7: facilitated sexual assault. There being marijuana and alcohol in her system. 312 00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:57,600 Speaker 7: You can't consent whatsoever, whether you're underage or not, she 313 00:18:57,720 --> 00:19:01,080 Speaker 7: can't consent. And so the toxicology kit, rape kit was done, 314 00:19:01,280 --> 00:19:03,359 Speaker 7: and that is her voice. That's the evidence that we 315 00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:07,520 Speaker 7: have from her dead body, is that this happened. These 316 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 7: are the samples of DNA. These are the injuries that 317 00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:13,600 Speaker 7: were caused after she was seen fumbling out of a 318 00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:17,200 Speaker 7: bar and intoxicated. This is our evidence. This is true. 319 00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:18,399 Speaker 3: Nancy, Yeah, Japan. 320 00:19:18,720 --> 00:19:21,879 Speaker 6: So Nancy, also, in addition to what she just said, 321 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:25,119 Speaker 6: we can tell that this was non consensual by the 322 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:28,840 Speaker 6: location of the injuries. For example, tears at the six 323 00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:32,520 Speaker 6: o'clock position in the national area means that it was trauma, 324 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:35,719 Speaker 6: because when it is consensual, that doesn't happen. That's not 325 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:38,399 Speaker 6: the same location. And so not just by looking at 326 00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:41,359 Speaker 6: the injuries to tell that they are acute or most recent, 327 00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:44,520 Speaker 6: we can tell by the position where they are that 328 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:45,879 Speaker 6: it was not consensual. 329 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:49,800 Speaker 2: You know, another is sure issue to Karen Charlotte joining us. 330 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:53,960 Speaker 2: You can find Kieran it unfiltered with Kiaren dot com, 331 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:57,679 Speaker 2: big presence on Facebook and YouTube. Kieren again, thank you 332 00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:01,040 Speaker 2: for being with us, Kieren. I understand and that an 333 00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:06,720 Speaker 2: abrasion which is a cut and bruising on her backside. 334 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:10,080 Speaker 3: I'm using their language, not mine. 335 00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:16,280 Speaker 2: Prompted for a forensic pathologist to note it was highly suspicious. 336 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:27,640 Speaker 2: A separate lab report finds male DNA but on her body. 337 00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 2: Is that correct A belief? So that is correct, guys, take. 338 00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:34,720 Speaker 3: A listen our friends at w AFB. 339 00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:37,280 Speaker 5: The state pushed back, arguing they did not have a 340 00:20:37,359 --> 00:20:39,960 Speaker 5: right to her cell phone data or her sexual history. 341 00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:42,560 Speaker 5: The judge, however, ruled in favor of Carver. 342 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:45,359 Speaker 4: They made a plethora of arguments. The judge denied all 343 00:20:45,400 --> 00:20:47,080 Speaker 4: of their arguments and ruled in our favor. 344 00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:49,760 Speaker 5: Today, Carver is not the only one asking for brooks 345 00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:52,840 Speaker 5: his cell phone data. Desmond Carter, who was seventeen at 346 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:55,640 Speaker 5: the time and was charged with first and third degree rape. 347 00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:58,000 Speaker 5: He and his attorney are asking for it as well. 348 00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:01,720 Speaker 2: What they want is her cell phone. They want her 349 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:04,159 Speaker 2: cell phone to find out if she had been with 350 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:05,640 Speaker 2: another guy. 351 00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:09,040 Speaker 3: But I believe their biggest. 352 00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:11,680 Speaker 2: Problem is going to be the video one of them 353 00:21:11,720 --> 00:21:15,520 Speaker 2: took for fun as she was being raped according to 354 00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 2: the state, Kieran, isn't it true that also someone hung 355 00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:23,520 Speaker 2: a T shirt up covering up the car window so 356 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:25,160 Speaker 2: no one could see what was happening. 357 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:27,679 Speaker 8: I believe so. And the other thing that I wanted 358 00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:30,639 Speaker 8: to add on to at the Attorney four case in 359 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 8: Carver Joe Long and speaking with him, the other thing 360 00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:36,520 Speaker 8: that he's mentioning is that the reason he wants these 361 00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:39,880 Speaker 8: cell phone records for the last seventy two hours, he's 362 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,520 Speaker 8: claiming it is under the rap shield law that the 363 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:49,560 Speaker 8: exemption under Code for twelve basically allows that. And he 364 00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:51,760 Speaker 8: wants to be able to say that maybe this injury 365 00:21:51,800 --> 00:21:55,040 Speaker 8: came from somebody other than these people who were in 366 00:21:55,080 --> 00:21:57,800 Speaker 8: the vehicle and the defendants in this case. 367 00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:02,520 Speaker 3: And how do you respond to to that? To Rachel D. 368 00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:07,440 Speaker 2: Fisher, forensic nurse expert, when you say, if the injuries 369 00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 2: are acute, that means they just. 370 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:15,439 Speaker 7: Happened, correct, It means that happened within a relatively recent 371 00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:17,680 Speaker 7: time period. And by the time the exam was done, 372 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:20,040 Speaker 7: it wasn't done immediately, It wasn't done in the er. 373 00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 7: It was done you know later, well she was she 374 00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:27,879 Speaker 7: was at the Corners office, right, So it's not gonna 375 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:30,600 Speaker 7: show field injuries on an acute exam. 376 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:31,480 Speaker 9: So the fact that they. 377 00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:34,439 Speaker 7: Found that and they found DNA, those are both consistent 378 00:22:34,720 --> 00:22:36,720 Speaker 7: with every other piece of evidence that we have here. 379 00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:42,240 Speaker 2: Guys, we are talking about an obvious bid to drag 380 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 2: Maddie Brooks's name through the mud. Video has already been leaked, 381 00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:50,919 Speaker 2: we are told by the defense of her slurring her words. 382 00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:54,280 Speaker 2: She was at a bar where she actually had worked 383 00:22:54,520 --> 00:22:56,280 Speaker 2: and was fed and fed. 384 00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:57,800 Speaker 3: And fed and fed alcohol. 385 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:02,360 Speaker 2: A video has already been leaked where her words were 386 00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:05,000 Speaker 2: being sorted, and it's said it was leaked by the 387 00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:09,760 Speaker 2: defense to make her look bad. Now we understand that 388 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:13,120 Speaker 2: part of her autopsy report. 389 00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:13,639 Speaker 3: Has been leaked. 390 00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:16,200 Speaker 2: I mean, how many times does this young girl, even 391 00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:20,200 Speaker 2: in depth, have to be victimized. Toby Wilson is joining 392 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:24,439 Speaker 2: me for is It Consultant specializing in DNA erology and 393 00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:30,120 Speaker 2: bloodstained pattern analysis at no Slow Forensic dot Com. Toby 394 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:31,399 Speaker 2: jump in. 395 00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:35,680 Speaker 13: Well, you know, I've done through many sexual assault cases 396 00:23:35,720 --> 00:23:41,160 Speaker 13: in my career, and the defense is almost always one 397 00:23:41,240 --> 00:23:45,840 Speaker 13: of trying to make the victim the problem they put 398 00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:48,480 Speaker 13: them on trial rather than the defendants, and it always 399 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:52,080 Speaker 13: comes down to, well, consensual. But the thing is is 400 00:23:52,119 --> 00:23:56,719 Speaker 13: that in this case, consensual doesn't work. A point three 401 00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:01,399 Speaker 13: to one blood alcohol level is believable. Normally you only 402 00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 13: see that type of level with people who are alcoholics 403 00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 13: and have developed in tolerance to drinking. Point three one 404 00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:13,520 Speaker 13: is you know, you can't want as the articles or 405 00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:16,399 Speaker 13: the indications are, you can't walk, you can't talk, you 406 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:19,400 Speaker 13: can't you you slur your words. If you are able 407 00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:23,000 Speaker 13: to talk, that's that is severely drunk. So you know, 408 00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:26,800 Speaker 13: this really comes down to the idea of content. A 409 00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:31,760 Speaker 13: person that drunk can't give consent to anything. So the 410 00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:35,680 Speaker 13: argument that it was consensual, you know, I can't see 411 00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:38,680 Speaker 13: any jury buying that if they bring in toxic forensic 412 00:24:38,760 --> 00:24:42,879 Speaker 13: toxicologists to talk about the effects of a point three 413 00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:45,600 Speaker 13: to one level on someone you know, uh, you know 414 00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:51,720 Speaker 13: whose body size you know is small, and how how 415 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:57,639 Speaker 13: much the alcohol affects your mobility of situation. For the DNA, 416 00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:01,719 Speaker 13: the lack of DNA doesn't mean there wasn't sex. It 417 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:04,560 Speaker 13: doesn't mean there wasn't a rape. It just means that 418 00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:08,080 Speaker 13: there's no ejaculation that occurs, and the one ejaculate that 419 00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:11,400 Speaker 13: they do test, you know, ties the one guy in 420 00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:14,760 Speaker 13: and it then becomes a case of did she say 421 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:17,080 Speaker 13: you could? And as I said, point three one is 422 00:25:17,080 --> 00:25:21,040 Speaker 13: not not going to be working for a consensual argument. 423 00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:25,919 Speaker 13: So the lack of DNA is not an issue that 424 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 13: says there was no sex, that says there was no rape. 425 00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,679 Speaker 13: It just means that there was no ejaculation. But it 426 00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:36,359 Speaker 13: can also be argued the alternative interpretation of that is 427 00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:39,199 Speaker 13: there was no sex. But you know, I think with 428 00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:42,879 Speaker 13: the video and all that, that's again a mooved point. 429 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:47,440 Speaker 13: So going back one more area, the male DNA that 430 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:54,040 Speaker 13: was found in her anal area. That's an interesting thing 431 00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:57,480 Speaker 13: because there are other technologies that could be used now 432 00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:01,840 Speaker 13: that are very sensitive to asked that male DNA to 433 00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:06,520 Speaker 13: determine the genetic line that it came from. So when 434 00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:09,960 Speaker 13: you get a male only profile, all you can say 435 00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,879 Speaker 13: is that it was that that individual, his brother, is 436 00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:15,639 Speaker 13: his father, anyone who's in a direct line of that 437 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:19,080 Speaker 13: because male DNA, just like mitochondrial DNA, which is female, 438 00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:22,640 Speaker 13: is passed down the same from generation to generation by 439 00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:25,560 Speaker 13: the men in the family. So you know, I'm kind 440 00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:27,879 Speaker 13: of surprised that there wasn't further analysis. 441 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:32,400 Speaker 2: Speaking of the DNA, Jeriff Farantino with me veteran homicide prosecutor, 442 00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:35,199 Speaker 2: but he certainly tried rate cases as well. This is 443 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:39,439 Speaker 2: how I would put this case together. Number one, you 444 00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:45,400 Speaker 2: have the DNA of one of the defendants in her 445 00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:49,359 Speaker 2: genital area. I believe it's kvon Washington. Correct me if 446 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:55,680 Speaker 2: I'm wrong, Kieran. So you've got kvon Washington with DNA. 447 00:26:56,720 --> 00:27:02,200 Speaker 2: You've got the driver of the car taking the video. 448 00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:04,960 Speaker 2: Isn't that right, Karen? 449 00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:06,880 Speaker 8: Yes, yes, that's correct. 450 00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:12,480 Speaker 2: So you've got the driver of the car taking a video, 451 00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:16,280 Speaker 2: which one is the driver Karen Jason Carver, And you 452 00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:19,960 Speaker 2: have the driver stating they're about to rape her. 453 00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:24,639 Speaker 3: And they're crazy. Okay. 454 00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:28,040 Speaker 2: So you even have one of the defendants saying the 455 00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:31,000 Speaker 2: other three are about to rape her, Nancy. 456 00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:33,160 Speaker 12: You mind if I add one other thing? 457 00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:34,680 Speaker 3: Please do so. 458 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:39,720 Speaker 12: When he was pressed, Carver was asked, how could it 459 00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:43,080 Speaker 12: be that it was consensual when she was so drunk? 460 00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,840 Speaker 12: Didn't he think that she was too drunk? And allegedly 461 00:27:46,960 --> 00:27:51,520 Speaker 12: he said, yeah, I guess, I guess exactly. So even 462 00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:57,399 Speaker 12: he admitted that and you also had them laughing. 463 00:27:57,359 --> 00:28:04,800 Speaker 2: Laughing, and in the video reportedly you see guys swapping 464 00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 2: out being in the back seat. 465 00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:08,760 Speaker 3: Is that true, Kieren Shallott? 466 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:09,240 Speaker 7: You do? 467 00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:13,639 Speaker 8: In fact, they took turns if Cape on Washington was 468 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:16,359 Speaker 8: in the back, and I believe Lee was in the back, 469 00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,679 Speaker 8: and then the uncle of one of these kids was 470 00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:21,560 Speaker 8: in the front along with Casey and Karper. 471 00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:24,920 Speaker 2: So with the video that they took because they thought 472 00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:28,920 Speaker 2: it was funny to video a girl who was completely 473 00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:31,280 Speaker 2: inebriated being raped in the back. 474 00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:32,560 Speaker 3: Seat, they thought that was a good thing. 475 00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:36,639 Speaker 2: That fun video they took is now going to be 476 00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:42,000 Speaker 2: States Exhibit number one. So in my mind, Jarrett Farantino, 477 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:44,120 Speaker 2: I don't need all their DNA. 478 00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:46,440 Speaker 3: What I was supposed to believe them are my lion 479 00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:47,920 Speaker 3: eyes when I look at that video. 480 00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 9: What do they see, Nancy? Absence of evidence is not 481 00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 9: evidence of absence. 482 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 2: Okay, I'm totally stealing that. I said that not you 483 00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 2: go ahead. 484 00:28:57,400 --> 00:28:59,840 Speaker 9: You got it. It's yours. I stole it from someone. 485 00:29:00,480 --> 00:29:05,040 Speaker 9: But this is just a cocktail of evidence that suggests 486 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,360 Speaker 9: what was going on. It's great evidence you have one 487 00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:12,000 Speaker 9: of their DNA, but it's not this positive of anything. 488 00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:15,000 Speaker 9: Because some of other DNA was not on her body. 489 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:19,959 Speaker 9: They were there. The video, the ride, the statements, It 490 00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:24,120 Speaker 9: all put together paints a picture of a horrific situation 491 00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:28,600 Speaker 9: inside that car. This girl was gang raped, Matt, She 492 00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:31,960 Speaker 9: was gang raped. And when you have a situation like that, 493 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:34,200 Speaker 9: you're going to have some DNA, You're not going to 494 00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:37,120 Speaker 9: have all of it, and you have just a plethora 495 00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:39,040 Speaker 9: of other evidence here to play out in front of 496 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 9: a jury. These guys are in big trouble. 497 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:42,680 Speaker 8: Nancy. May I add one thing? 498 00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:44,680 Speaker 3: Please do so. 499 00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:47,240 Speaker 8: In my conversations with Joe Long and again Joe Long 500 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:50,040 Speaker 8: as who is representing Tason Carver. The other reason he 501 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,760 Speaker 8: says he wanted the text messages from seventy two hours 502 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,800 Speaker 8: before is to show that if she was texting, maybe 503 00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:59,200 Speaker 8: in the minutes or hours leading up to what happened 504 00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:01,640 Speaker 8: in the car, that he wants to be able to 505 00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:06,840 Speaker 8: say that she was okay enough, not inuburated enough to 506 00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:11,320 Speaker 8: be sending text messages, possibly coherent text messages, and to 507 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:14,040 Speaker 8: show that she actually wasn't as drunk as everybody is 508 00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:14,960 Speaker 8: claiming she was. 509 00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:19,360 Speaker 2: You mean, as her blood alcohol says that she is, yes, okay. 510 00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:22,400 Speaker 8: Of course the mom has also told me Madison's mom 511 00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:25,520 Speaker 8: that she actually left her cell phone in the bar, 512 00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:27,800 Speaker 8: so she didn't even have it with her when she 513 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:28,960 Speaker 8: left out for that. 514 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 1: Night time stories with Nancy Grace. 515 00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:51,480 Speaker 2: Guys, believe it or not, the rape defendants, and they're 516 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:54,440 Speaker 2: really lucky. And I don't get it that they haven't 517 00:30:54,480 --> 00:31:00,320 Speaker 2: been charged of Sellingny murder because she is dead. A 518 00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:05,000 Speaker 2: felony was ensuing they raped her according to the state, 519 00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:07,280 Speaker 2: it's got to be proven in a court of law, 520 00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:11,200 Speaker 2: of course, then put her out of the car on 521 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:15,320 Speaker 2: a busy freeway which is abandoned. And malignant heart, which 522 00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:19,240 Speaker 2: is a theory of murder, and she died. There's two 523 00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:22,920 Speaker 2: theories of murder here. Felony murder. A death occurs during 524 00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:25,400 Speaker 2: the commission of a felony. The death does not have 525 00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:28,040 Speaker 2: to be intentional. It's like Jackie and I go rob 526 00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:31,400 Speaker 2: another bank. I say, don't pull your gun. She gets 527 00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:34,960 Speaker 2: a wild hair, she shoots the teller. I'm charge of 528 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,800 Speaker 2: felony murder because a death occurred while I was committing 529 00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 2: a felony. I didn't mean for it to happen, but 530 00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:44,800 Speaker 2: I'm still charged with felony murder. There's that theory, and 531 00:31:44,880 --> 00:31:48,160 Speaker 2: there is abandoned and malignant heart. For instance, if I 532 00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:51,640 Speaker 2: get in my minivan and I plow through let's say 533 00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:56,000 Speaker 2: a street fair at ninety mph, and I kill somebody, 534 00:31:56,160 --> 00:32:00,360 Speaker 2: I was acting with an abandoned heart with no thought 535 00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:04,080 Speaker 2: for human life. That's two theories of murder. So these 536 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:07,000 Speaker 2: guys should be thanking. They're lucky stars they're not charged 537 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,480 Speaker 2: with murder. Not quite sure why they're not charged with murder, 538 00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:15,080 Speaker 2: but yet they are actually complaining. Take a listen our 539 00:32:15,400 --> 00:32:17,200 Speaker 2: forty our friends at WBRZ two. 540 00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:20,600 Speaker 11: Carver didn't say anything to reporters, but his lawyer had 541 00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 11: plenty to say. That's correct about the rape charge Carver 542 00:32:24,120 --> 00:32:24,680 Speaker 11: is facing. 543 00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:30,000 Speaker 14: My client has been devastated. The allegations on an eighteen 544 00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:33,120 Speaker 14: year old now nineteen year old man are very sobering, 545 00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:37,800 Speaker 14: and he's getting through at the best he can. He's 546 00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,240 Speaker 14: got a good support system with his family behind him. 547 00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:46,560 Speaker 14: But the media publicity by the civil lawyer does not help. 548 00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:49,680 Speaker 14: Going on Fox and trashing my client, calling him a murderer, 549 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:53,160 Speaker 14: calling him a rapist and a murderer, that does not help. 550 00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:57,560 Speaker 3: Well, whose fault is it that he's being charged? Why 551 00:32:57,720 --> 00:32:58,080 Speaker 3: was he. 552 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:02,880 Speaker 2: Even in the car when this was happening to Maddy Brooks. 553 00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 2: Karen Chalotte joining me. You can find Kieren unfiltered with Kieren, 554 00:33:10,080 --> 00:33:13,000 Speaker 2: Karen and Challa. What more can you tell us? When 555 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:14,719 Speaker 2: will the case go to trial? What more do we 556 00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:18,040 Speaker 2: know about the defense efforts to get her cell phone? 557 00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:19,320 Speaker 6: So what else? 558 00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:23,640 Speaker 8: We're expecting a trial possibly next fall. So it's going 559 00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:25,400 Speaker 8: to be at least another year, and I know that 560 00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:28,280 Speaker 8: seems like it's going to be a very long time. 561 00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:31,080 Speaker 8: But you have four cases that have to go to trial. 562 00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:34,440 Speaker 8: The other one that kind of comes up as a 563 00:33:34,520 --> 00:33:38,400 Speaker 8: caveat is Kavon Washington. Now he's actually facing a first 564 00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:42,640 Speaker 8: degree rape charge also in Livingston Parish. That's a neighboring parish. 565 00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:48,360 Speaker 2: Oh, dear, gravy, he's got a similar transaction. 566 00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:52,040 Speaker 3: Oh yes, well, whoa, whoa? I need to write this down. 567 00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:56,200 Speaker 2: So Kvon Washington, who I might add, is also on 568 00:33:56,280 --> 00:34:04,480 Speaker 2: the video, according to Miller, pushing shoving Maddie down in 569 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:08,399 Speaker 2: the backseat. He's the one whose DNA is in her 570 00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:12,160 Speaker 2: genital area. Okay, he's got another rape charge. Tell me 571 00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:13,320 Speaker 2: about that, Karen. 572 00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:16,879 Speaker 8: Yes, we covered this case, and after all this came 573 00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:20,319 Speaker 8: to light, I had somebody reach out to us, and 574 00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:23,439 Speaker 8: the young girl was twelve years old at the time 575 00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:26,600 Speaker 8: that it happened and she's now fifteen. So granted, this 576 00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:29,120 Speaker 8: happen three years ago, and an arrest was never made 577 00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:32,000 Speaker 8: in the case, not even I think the day after 578 00:34:32,160 --> 00:34:35,520 Speaker 8: we did the report, Cavon Washington was arrested in connection 579 00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:39,239 Speaker 8: to this rape and the police department locally telling us, oh, 580 00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:42,719 Speaker 8: the witness from three years ago just came forward that 581 00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:46,799 Speaker 8: her friend was with her and saw it happens. 582 00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:49,239 Speaker 3: They didn't follow through on the investigation. 583 00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,719 Speaker 8: So yes, and he's been arrested in that case, and 584 00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:55,920 Speaker 8: he's facing another first degree rape charge there and obviously 585 00:34:55,960 --> 00:34:59,640 Speaker 8: first agree rape in Louisiana carried's mandatory life, so that's 586 00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:02,719 Speaker 8: a big play as well because he's facing two first 587 00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:04,480 Speaker 8: degree rates in two different parishes. 588 00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:12,839 Speaker 2: Kavon Washington and Desmond Carter have both admitted to, as 589 00:35:12,880 --> 00:35:17,640 Speaker 2: they say, sex activity with Mattie, the young girl who's 590 00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:19,759 Speaker 2: so out of it she leaves her phone behind and 591 00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:21,680 Speaker 2: is seen in the video being pushed down in. 592 00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:22,200 Speaker 3: The back seat. 593 00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:29,239 Speaker 2: So with Kvon Washington, who admits and has another rape 594 00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:33,719 Speaker 2: charge that was never prosecuted, it will be Now that's 595 00:35:33,719 --> 00:35:35,839 Speaker 2: a day late and a dollar short because Mattie's dead. 596 00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 2: If he had been prosecuted in that case, he might 597 00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:41,000 Speaker 2: have been behind bars and Matti would be alive today. 598 00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:45,960 Speaker 2: Kvon Washington and Desmond Carter, according to reports, both admit 599 00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:49,880 Speaker 2: to sex activity, as they call it with the victim 600 00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:56,120 Speaker 2: the driver case. In Carter, it's his car and he 601 00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:59,640 Speaker 2: says on video they're about to rape her. 602 00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:04,719 Speaker 3: Then we have Everett Lee. Now, if I were trying it, Jarrett. 603 00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:08,600 Speaker 2: Farantino, I would get the one who is the least culpable, 604 00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:10,440 Speaker 2: if I could even figure out who that would be, 605 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:16,440 Speaker 2: turn them over, give them a deal of course that 606 00:36:16,520 --> 00:36:21,040 Speaker 2: has substantial jail time, and have them that person rat 607 00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:23,080 Speaker 2: out on the other three so I could get them 608 00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:24,080 Speaker 2: twenty to lie. 609 00:36:24,239 --> 00:36:27,560 Speaker 9: Thoughts, I think that's likely to happen here in Nancy. 610 00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:29,840 Speaker 9: If you don't have that, I still think there's a 611 00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:32,680 Speaker 9: strong case. Obviously, if you can get the driver or 612 00:36:32,719 --> 00:36:35,840 Speaker 9: somebody to flip, it just seals the fate of these guys. 613 00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:37,439 Speaker 3: Really don't need to flip, though. 614 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:41,200 Speaker 2: I mean, I've said before to a jury, sometimes you 615 00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:42,719 Speaker 2: got to go to hell to get the witness to 616 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,319 Speaker 2: put the devil in jail. I really believe if you 617 00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:48,000 Speaker 2: tried these four together, put them all in the same 618 00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:52,839 Speaker 2: pot to steal that there would be a conviction on 619 00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:55,239 Speaker 2: every one of them because they're in it together in 620 00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:58,440 Speaker 2: the video. It's really the video that they thought was 621 00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:02,360 Speaker 2: such a great idea. That is the nail and their coffin, 622 00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:07,040 Speaker 2: Rachel Fisher, What do you believe is the strongest evidence 623 00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:10,360 Speaker 2: for the state as a rape kit nurse? 624 00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:13,879 Speaker 7: So the toxicology kit obviously, because it shows the lack 625 00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:17,440 Speaker 7: of consent because it was drug facilitated sexual assault. And 626 00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:21,879 Speaker 7: then the evidence of an acute abrasion meaning the skin 627 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:24,800 Speaker 7: is freshly off the skin and not a healed abrasion. 628 00:37:25,600 --> 00:37:30,040 Speaker 7: And then the DNA on her It wasn't in her 629 00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:32,080 Speaker 7: vagina from what I've read it was. It was from 630 00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:36,120 Speaker 7: on the genitals. But anybody's DNA on somebody else's genitals 631 00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:39,879 Speaker 7: being found, that just shows that you shouldn't be there. 632 00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:44,120 Speaker 7: She wasn't consensible. The taxcology kit shows that. So whether 633 00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:46,560 Speaker 7: they admitted to doing it, she wanted it. They could 634 00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:48,680 Speaker 7: admit that all day, but it wasn't consensual. That it 635 00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:52,799 Speaker 7: was drug facilitated, so either way, they knowingly facilitated it 636 00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:54,000 Speaker 7: and it was done it's there. 637 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:59,120 Speaker 2: Maddie Brooks, just nineteen, died in the hospital after allegedly 638 00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:03,879 Speaker 2: being gang raped than struck by a car. As we 639 00:38:04,120 --> 00:38:10,319 Speaker 2: all know, and let me emphasize strongly, these young men 640 00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:18,160 Speaker 2: are presumed innocent. Everything that we have discussed is based 641 00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:22,600 Speaker 2: on video that we have seen. The video we're talking about, 642 00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:27,359 Speaker 2: we've seen it, the autopsy report, and the statements of 643 00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:33,440 Speaker 2: the defendants. That's where we're getting this analysis. That and 644 00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:37,040 Speaker 2: more will be brought out at trial should this case 645 00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:41,920 Speaker 2: go to trial. But in our system of jurisprudence, everyone 646 00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:47,040 Speaker 2: is presumed innocent unless and until the state meets the 647 00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:52,960 Speaker 2: burden of proving their guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. If 648 00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:58,720 Speaker 2: the state fails under the law, they walk free. 649 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:03,520 Speaker 3: We wait as just as some fules. Goodbye friend.