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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds. And Americans have spent twenty four billion

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Speaker 1: dollars extra in gas since Trump started his war in Iran.

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Speaker 1: We have such a great jow for you today. The

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Speaker 1: host of the Latino Vote podcast, Mike Madrid, stops by

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Speaker 1: to talk about Republicans being completely out of options before

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Speaker 1: the midterms. Then we'll talk to civil rights advocate and

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Speaker 1: law professor Gimberley Crenshaw about her new memoir, Backtalker in

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Speaker 1: American Memoir. But first of the news, Smiley.

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Speaker 2: The budget for the ballroom, the big beautiful ballroom, four

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Speaker 2: hundred million dollars. But since we have the bootlicker Congress

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Speaker 2: that loves to say yes, sir, may I have more,

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Speaker 2: they want to give them a billion dollars because they

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Speaker 2: don't give a fuck about being conservative or saving our

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Speaker 2: tax dollars.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, this is.

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Speaker 1: An amazing story in the fact that it is just

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Speaker 1: shows that these people don't believe in anything. So Republicans

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Speaker 1: got Trump into office and they said that they were

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Speaker 1: going to do what cut the deficit, They were going

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Speaker 1: to stop waste fraud and abuse. And you know who

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Speaker 1: was the face of that, the richest man in the world,

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Speaker 1: Elon Musk. Well, fast forward. They're not so interested in waste, fraud,

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Speaker 1: and abuse anymore, except if they're doing the waste, the fraud,

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Speaker 1: and the abuse. And here we are. Republicans demand one

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Speaker 1: billion dollars for Trump's ballroom. Now you'll remember that I

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Speaker 1: was told that taxpayers were not going to pay anything

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Speaker 1: for this ballroom, and instead of that, we're paying a

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Speaker 1: billion dollars. So I don't know how that works, but

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Speaker 1: now we are paying a billion dollars in taxpayer money.

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Speaker 1: And it is in this reconciliation package. It is for

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Speaker 1: security and adjustments and upgrades. That's the waste, fraud, and

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Speaker 1: abuse right there, related to the ballroom's construction. An additional

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Speaker 1: thirty billion for Ice. You'll remember ICE as having already

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Speaker 1: billions and billions of dollars which they used to murder

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Speaker 1: American citizens and jail children. Three point five billion for

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Speaker 1: customs and border patrol. I wonder how much of that

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Speaker 1: is for Christy Nome horseback riding videos. Oh, actually she's

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Speaker 1: been fired, so that money has already been spent. This

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Speaker 1: is Chuck Grassley. Remember Chuck Grassley, the pretend normal Republican

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Speaker 1: who is ten thousand years old. Well, this is Chuck Grassley.

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Speaker 1: This is the Senate Judiciary Committee, and they're taking action

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Speaker 1: to provide for federal law enforcement and safer streets to

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Speaker 1: the American families, because that's what this is really about.

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Speaker 1: Safer streets for the American family is a billion dollars.

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Speaker 2: Hold On, he may be concerned about safer streets. He's

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Speaker 2: tweeted numerous times about hitting deer on the streets with

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Speaker 2: his car.

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Speaker 1: Listen, he is not a good driver. He is a

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Speaker 1: very good vacuumer. If you go on, if you are

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Speaker 1: on X, which we do not recommend by any stretch

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Speaker 1: of the imagination giving money to Elon Mush, but if

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Speaker 1: you are on there, you will see that Charles Grassley,

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Speaker 1: who is nine thousand years old, has a vacuum. It

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Speaker 1: has a name, and we're all going to die.

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Speaker 2: But we should talk a little bit more about this

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Speaker 2: because this spending bill really is just a big pretend

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Speaker 2: that the assassination attempt at the White House correspondence dinner

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Speaker 2: is this huge threat that they need. And now they

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Speaker 2: also have to give Ice more money because an American

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Speaker 2: citizen was angry at Trump.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: By the way, the whole premise of this insanity is

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Speaker 1: that the White House Correspondent dinner would take place in

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Speaker 1: the White House. The White House Correspondence Association is not

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Speaker 1: part of the federal government, so that party was never

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Speaker 1: going to take place in the White House.

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Speaker 4: So there's that.

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Speaker 1: But beyond that, and I think that this is an

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Speaker 1: important point here. This is ridiculous, right, like Donald Trump

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Speaker 1: should not have leveled the East twin point one second point,

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Speaker 1: this should be put together with in the purview of

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Speaker 1: the federal government and not in Donald Trump's fever dream. Okay,

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Speaker 1: this is not about Donald Trump, right, This is about

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Speaker 1: the White House, which belongs to us, the taxpayers, and

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Speaker 1: not Donald Trump. But also more than that, what is

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Speaker 1: happening here is that they are trying to approve bazillions

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Speaker 1: of I mean literally billions of our taxpayer dollars to

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Speaker 1: do whatever the fuck they want. And again, in this

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Speaker 1: there's money for ICE, CBP and DHS, and it's got

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Speaker 1: an enormous amount of flexibility with less accountability and less

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Speaker 1: oversight than typical annual appropriations for DHS funding. That means

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Speaker 1: that it is giving money that is gonna have even

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Speaker 1: less oversight. And this is an administration that is very,

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Speaker 1: very focused on not having oversight. So this is just

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Speaker 1: an insane, insane way to be. It is like, absolutely

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Speaker 1: not the way that any of this should work, and

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Speaker 1: none of this. No Democrat should vote for this. But

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Speaker 1: John Fetterman, who is not a Democrat and probably going

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Speaker 1: to switch part.

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Speaker 2: John Fetterman, who's running as my brand is more important

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Speaker 2: than my constituents.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, John Fetterman, who is running on his one term

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Speaker 1: and then never again exactly.

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Speaker 2: But branding is important. So anyway, we need to shift

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Speaker 2: gears and talk about the Supreme Court and this abortion

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Speaker 2: ruling on meph pristone.

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Speaker 4: What are you seeing here?

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Speaker 1: This is an incredible unforced error for Republicans. And here's

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Speaker 1: what happened. The Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals had a

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Speaker 1: decision on Friday which said basically, no more metha pristone.

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Speaker 1: That's a real problem for Republicans because you know, two

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Speaker 1: thirds of all abortions are medication abortions, and they use

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Speaker 1: these drugs. These drugs also have other uses for you

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Speaker 1: from contractions, et cetera. But the point is the Fifth

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Speaker 1: Circuit was like new, we're done, no more. Now here's

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Speaker 1: the problem. So the Supreme Court ruled Justice Alito, you

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Speaker 1: may know him as being a partisan hack. He appealed

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Speaker 1: this day and said, now they can sell it again.

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Speaker 1: But here's the problem. In eight days, they're going to

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Speaker 1: go on They're basically going to go on the shadow

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Speaker 1: dock and decide what's going to happen with this. So

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Speaker 1: either they will pull this drug from the market, thus

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Speaker 1: setting a precedent that judiciaries that have been politicized can

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Speaker 1: pull drugs from the market because they don't like what

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Speaker 1: they do. And it will mean no more medication abortions,

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Speaker 1: or it will mean more restrictions. And that will happen

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Speaker 1: six months before the midterms. And you'll remember abortion pretty popular.

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Speaker 1: People don't like taking it away, even Republicans. A lot

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Speaker 1: of Republicans are pro choice. So this will be a

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Speaker 1: real fucking problem for Republicans. And remember this is a

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Speaker 1: very partisan court. So it's six'. Three this is the

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Speaker 1: court that Overturned roe. V. WADE i can see a

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Speaker 1: real world where they say like no more metha pristo

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Speaker 1: and like that's, It we're. Done and if they do,

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Speaker 1: that then that's a huge becomes a huge issue for the.

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Speaker 1: Midterms another, thing, though is if they don't do, that

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Speaker 1: then it also becomes a huge issue for the midterms

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Speaker 1: because then the anti choice vote is, furious they're, engaged

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Speaker 1: and they start turning On, trump and they're already very

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Speaker 1: mad about. This and in, fact you have this woman

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Speaker 1: From Pro Life, America marjorie dan And, felzer who said

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Speaker 1: that it is shameful that The trump administrations in action

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Speaker 1: has forced pro life states to take the battle to

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Speaker 1: the federal. Courts so you can see already attention here

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Speaker 1: AND i could see. THIS i, mean there are real

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Speaker 1: ideologues on this court who would be delighted to pull

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Speaker 1: this medicine off the. Market AND i could see that.

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Speaker 1: Happening SO i think it'll be very. INTERESTING i think

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Speaker 1: it could be really problematic For.

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Speaker 2: Trump, YEAH i, agreed and feels like a real. Mess

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Speaker 2: so we have had a real spat of sexual impropriety

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Speaker 2: among congressional members this, term and it's not ending For.

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Speaker 2: Republicans we have Now Representative Chuck, edwards who is in

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Speaker 2: A r plus eight, district which means it's very very in,

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Speaker 2: play who has numerous witnesses to him acting inappropriately with.

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Speaker 1: Staffers, yeah and this guy sounds like a.

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Speaker 2: KOOK i would never guess that from this.

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Speaker 1: PARTY i mean sexual, harassment really really really. Bad cool,

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Speaker 1: though that this house is starting to really focus on

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Speaker 1: getting these guys out Of. Congress so he told a

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Speaker 1: young female staff or that she had written a complex

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Speaker 1: chapter in my heart in a handwritten note that he sent,

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Speaker 1: her which she then gave To, axios as one. Should

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Speaker 1: when your boss writes a letter like, that why it.

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Speaker 1: Matters it matters because a fucking. Creeper and three sources

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Speaker 1: Told axios they witnessed contact By edwards towards two female

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Speaker 1: staffers in their. Twenties do you want to guess how

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Speaker 1: Old Chuck edwards?

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Speaker 2: Is AM i going to have nightmares WHEN i learned this.

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Speaker 1: Knowledge edwards sixty five has been married since nineteen.

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Speaker 2: Eighty nineteen, eighty that's like two years younger than. Us

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Speaker 2: we were, deil we were.

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Speaker 1: Due we're forty. Seven now we were.

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Speaker 4: Taking, well one of us is forty.

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Speaker 1: Seven he brought the staffer personal gifts while she was

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Speaker 1: employed by, him including. Jewelry one, gift this is the

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Speaker 1: one that really gets me, upset included a custom puzzle,

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Speaker 1: that when, ASSEMBLED i swear To, god this is like

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Speaker 1: the freakiest one revealed an image of After Adam, sandler

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Speaker 1: along with a handwritten note inviting the staffer to attend

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Speaker 1: one Of sandler's comedy shows with. Him according to a

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Speaker 1: photo you By axios and three sources with knowledge of the,

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Speaker 1: gift it's unclear if the staffer attended the. SHOW i

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Speaker 1: bet you a million dollars That stafford did not attend the.

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Speaker 1: Show edwards also gave, gifts including a, purse to another

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Speaker 1: young female staffer in her, twenties and did this second

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Speaker 1: staffer as his guest to events including The White House

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Speaker 1: Christmas party in twenty twenty. Four the three sources, SAID i, mean, look,

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Speaker 1: MAN i like this. LINE a member buying gifts for

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Speaker 1: staffers is not explicitly Against house. Rules stop being, creeps

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Speaker 1: men In, Congress stop being Creep stop all. Change they

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Speaker 1: can't do.

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Speaker 4: It it's a real.

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Speaker 1: Challenge by the, way my favorite part of. This edward's

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Speaker 1: office has one of the highest turnover rates In, congress

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Speaker 1: with a fifty nine percent turnover and twenty twenty.

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Speaker 2: Five, wow that's almost as much As Nancy.

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Speaker 1: Mace, yeah, hey, man let's not bring this back To. Nancy,

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Speaker 1: hey It's Molly john. Here my, Memoir how To Lose

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Speaker 1: Your mother is out now on, paperback arriving just ahead

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Speaker 1: Of Mother's. Day how To Lose Your mother has garnered

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Speaker 1: a lot of praise From Good Morning, america Then Your,

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Speaker 1: Time Book, Review, Vogue Vanity, fair and a lot of other.

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Speaker 1: Outlets Washington. Post the book is about what it's like

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Speaker 1: to be part of The sandwich, generation to take care

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Speaker 1: of your mother and your. Children AND i talk about

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Speaker 1: being a mother and a daughter and the RELATIONSHIP i

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00:11:31,679 --> 00:11:35,560
Speaker 1: have with my mother and all of its. Complexities it's

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Speaker 1: funny and it's, fraught and it's, sad and it's about.

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Speaker 1: Life my. Story this, story the story Of how To

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Speaker 1: Lose Your, mother follows a year in which my, Mother Erica,

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Speaker 1: johng is diagnosed with, dementia my husband faces a life threatening,

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Speaker 1: illness and what unfolds is a really honest story about

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Speaker 1: what happens when the shit hits the and everything goes.

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Speaker 1: Wrong as The Washington post, said the book is filled

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Speaker 1: with lines so good you won't just want to underline.

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Speaker 1: Them it's a memoir that continues to, Resonate so please

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Speaker 1: pick it. Up Mike madrid is a political consultant and

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Speaker 1: the host Of The Latino vote, podcast and he's the

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Speaker 1: author Of The Latino. Century Mike, Madrid.

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Speaker 4: Mollie great to be with.

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Speaker 1: You diesel is six dollars a, gallon, right six dollars a.

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Speaker 1: Gallon Donald trump as unpopular as he has ever, been

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Speaker 1: underwater on everything from immigration to, crime to cost of

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Speaker 1: living to. Inflation why Did republicans not see this?

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Speaker 4: COMING i think the insuller bubble within which they LIVED

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Speaker 4: i think has burst and they don't know what reality

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Speaker 4: actually looks like. Anymore but, look we're a that like

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Speaker 4: Post GEORGE. W bush in your seven, phase when like

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Speaker 4: you could blame the, weather bad weather On George bush

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Speaker 4: and one's, like, yeah of course THAT sob did. THIS i,

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Speaker 4: mean that's where we're. At it's gonna keep getting. Worse

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Speaker 4: by the. Way he's positive on no. Issue there's not

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Speaker 4: a single thing that he's touching that is working for.

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Speaker 4: HIM i don't know what their message is going to

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Speaker 4: be going into the.

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Speaker 1: Midterms the thing, is we still have the, summer so It's,

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Speaker 1: may and we're coming up on this gas price. Situation,

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Speaker 1: Right gas is really Expensive americans hate paying for. Gas

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Speaker 1: they really. Do like that is the one. Thing it's

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Speaker 1: a nonpartisan. Issue the moment gas gets even a tiny

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Speaker 1: bit more, expensive people get. Apoplectic it's like we feel

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Speaker 1: we are entitled to cheap. GAS i always.

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Speaker 4: Thought it would be a million people dying of in the,

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Speaker 4: pandemic but, no it's five dollars gallon. Gas it's the.

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Speaker 1: Gas and it's like anti democratic. Stuff, nah it's the.

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Speaker 1: Gas it's the. Gas, yeah can you explain to. Us

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Speaker 1: you do a lot of polling follow The latino vote really.

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Speaker 1: Carefully that is a vote that is sort of the

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Speaker 1: new swing. Voters talk us through.

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Speaker 4: It that's kind of the new soccer.

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Speaker 1: Mom.

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Speaker 4: Right, yeah but, YEAH i think what the difference is

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Speaker 4: like with soccer, moms there was an attempt to kind

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Speaker 4: of appeal to what they were clearly telling the. Pollsters

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Speaker 4: latinos are a little bit different because both parties are really

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Speaker 4: struggling to kind of understand, them because both parties, Believe,

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Speaker 4: okay this is a minority, voter let's talk to them

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Speaker 4: the way we've always talked to other minority, voters and

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Speaker 4: that doesn't seem to be. Working and then there's also

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Speaker 4: this kind of feeling Like republicans are just, like, well

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Speaker 4: let's just pretend like they're like everybody, else which of

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Speaker 4: course doesn't work because they're not like everybody. Else and

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Speaker 4: so you end up in this scenario where both parties

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Speaker 4: don't really understand, it And latinos are the least racially

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Speaker 4: polarized and the most likely to be independent. Voters they're

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Speaker 4: the least likely to be registered with a party of

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Speaker 4: any major ethnic. Group and it's growing so, Fast, molly

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Speaker 4: that we're witnessing as. Dealignment they're moving away from both

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Speaker 4: parties and they're banishing whichever part is in. Power so,

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Speaker 4: yes it's increasingly going to be this swing voter that

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Speaker 4: is not voting for a, party it's really voting against a.

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Speaker 1: Party so this gets us back to this idea that they.

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Speaker 1: Dropped The republicans dropped the ball because we are seeing

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Speaker 1: people vote, again, Right we're seeing this anti incumbent. Hostility

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Speaker 1: so if you were A, republican if you Were Donald

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Speaker 1: trump and you had been watching what happened With Joe

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Speaker 1: biden for four, years you had been running on this

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Speaker 1: idea That Joe biden was old And Donald trump was,

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Speaker 1: young a completely insane statement because they're both very close in.

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Speaker 1: Age wouldn't you have been a little bit prepared for

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Speaker 1: the idea that the anti incumbent sentiment might come and

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Speaker 1: bite you when you were the. Incumbent.

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Speaker 4: YEAH i don't Think Donald trump lives in that, reality.

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Speaker 4: RIGHT i, mean like If Donald trump had just gone

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Speaker 4: golfing At mar Al lago instead of Like Liberation day

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Speaker 4: and tariffs and wars in The Middle east and Like epstein,

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Speaker 4: files all he had to do is going golf and

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Speaker 4: he could be built is arct The trump and you,

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Speaker 4: know putting his name all over whatever. Currencycy he would

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Speaker 4: be sitting in the mid high fifties right now in support.

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Speaker 4: Levels but he. Didn't he can't help. Himself and The,

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Speaker 4: republicans of, course fealty has become the, driving animating characteristic

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Speaker 4: of the, party so they're going to go walk step with.

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Speaker 4: It but what, Happened molly was after The epstein, stuff

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Speaker 4: you start to see this, break and this break starts

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Speaker 4: to happen with the, influencers the right, wing you, know.

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Speaker 4: Influencers it's the fight Between tucker And megan And candae

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Speaker 4: And Mark levine And. Shapiro AND i hate myself for

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Speaker 4: knowing who all these people. Are it's not even. Ideological

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Speaker 4: it's like this high school of middle school spat and

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Speaker 4: but that's the that's the animating politics of The Republican.

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Speaker 4: Party and so without, that what happens now is you're

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Speaker 4: Seeing Donald trump's base level support. Level he's at sixty

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Speaker 4: eight percent approval Amongst. Republicans, molly in ten years of

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Speaker 4: watching this every, morning waking up having my, coffee look

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Speaker 4: looking at this, number trying to figure out to break

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Speaker 4: it below eighty, eight he's now twenty points below anywhere

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Speaker 4: he's ever been, before ever With republicans.

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Speaker 1: And republican leaners. Too right there are the Indie. Republicans

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Speaker 1: explain that to, us because that is the that's a

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Speaker 1: group that he cannot win.

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Speaker 4: Without that's even more. DAMAGE i, mean it's all. Damaging

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Speaker 4: but let's talk about it independent for just a. Second

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Speaker 4: we know that a lot of people will Say i'm

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Speaker 4: not Either republican Or, democrat but we also know that,

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Speaker 4: demographically for, example an, older white homeowning male who's Saying

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Speaker 4: i'm independent is going to Vote republican ninety percent of the,

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Speaker 4: time right the same way a Young hispanic woman In

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Speaker 4: Santa Monica. California maybe, independent but she's gonna vote for

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Speaker 4: A democrat ninety percent of the. Time so these are leaners,

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Speaker 4: demographically we know how they're going to. Break but these,

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Speaker 4: leaners These republican, leaners are at a historic. Low and

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Speaker 4: WHEN i say, historic it's worse Than GEORGE. W bush In.

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Speaker 4: Iraq it's worse Than Jimmy carter, stagflation it's worse Than

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Speaker 4: nixon Water. Gates, yeah we've never seen numbers this. Bad

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Speaker 4: and so that that historic break with just. Independence even

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Speaker 4: if he were holding The republican, base which is, not

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Speaker 4: he would be in, deep deep. Trouble but he's losing

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Speaker 4: Core Republican maga constituency. Now and that's why It's Katie

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Speaker 4: BARADOR i want.

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Speaker 1: To talk about why he's losing him because so The

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Speaker 1: epstein file was The Epstein files fiasco was this first,

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Speaker 1: break and you Saw Pam bondi is no longer employed

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Speaker 1: basically because of. That right she did The. Binders it

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Speaker 1: got everybody in That maga world very. Excited there was

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Speaker 1: nothing in, there and then she went into a sort of.

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Speaker 1: Tailspin she did this hearing where she, said why won't

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Speaker 1: you thank Mister trump for The dow at fifty, thousand

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Speaker 1: which was like a little Too North korean propaganda even

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Speaker 1: for trump.

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Speaker 4: Discuss you're exactly. Right the break point is The Epstein,

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Speaker 4: files because one of the animating characteristics again of Trump

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Speaker 4: ism is his visceral hate For, democrats so much so

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Speaker 4: that they paint them as. Pedophile there's nothing worse you

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Speaker 4: can be than somebody who abuses, children, right, Yes and

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Speaker 4: it's all in this conspiracy about The Epstein, files and

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00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:17,480
Speaker 4: like everything In trump rolled its, projection and so that

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Speaker 4: becomes the focal point of this reelection and keeps the base.

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Speaker 4: Together we've got to go get the, demonic Horrible democrats

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Speaker 4: who are trying to eat our children and do all

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Speaker 4: these bad. Things, well once he turns on, that once

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Speaker 4: he betrays them on, that everything else becomes. Suspect and

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Speaker 4: then suddenly all these bad policy, decisions whether It's venezuela

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Speaker 4: for no real good, reason or whether it's monetary, policy

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Speaker 4: whether it's Attacking canada or threatening to Invade, greenland and

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Speaker 4: then certainly Invading iran with no, objective no, mission and

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Speaker 4: no exit, strategy people realize this has all been a.

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Speaker 4: Ruse like it took a lot of people to get

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Speaker 4: out of the. Cult but once you're out of the,

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Speaker 4: cult you're not going. Back and that's where he's. At

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Speaker 4: that's what the problem. Is and that's why the likelihood

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00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:04,760
Speaker 4: of this getting far worse is much greater than it

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Speaker 4: getting better for.

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Speaker 1: Him, Right and that's so let's talk through. That so

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Speaker 1: you had these. Influencers those influencers are not they are

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Speaker 1: Not Walter. Cronkite they are sticking their finger up and being,

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00:20:16,880 --> 00:20:21,200
Speaker 1: like my people are, mad and that's why they're turning On, trump, Right.

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Speaker 4: Yeah they're gonna you can't defend the indefensible. Anymore and

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Speaker 4: that's the. Problem and how what you saw was The

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Speaker 4: Candice owens and The Tucker carlson sees the opportunity to be, Like,

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Speaker 4: okay the gazelle is wounded on THE serengeti attack. Him,

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Speaker 4: now NOW i go after, him and they become the.

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Speaker 4: Predator right at, first they were, there you, know they

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Speaker 4: were getting followers by being part of the cheerleading crowd

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Speaker 4: and the you, know rallying it on once he's, wounded

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Speaker 4: and they you, KNOW i guess hat tip to them

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Speaker 4: for understanding having a finger on the pulse of where

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Speaker 4: this was. Going and realizing he's, done like he's mortally.

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Speaker 4: Wounded this is a bridge too. Far they turn on

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Speaker 4: him And carlson, like you're gonna start seeing his numbers

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Speaker 4: moving up in this next presidential discussion very. Shortly it's

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Speaker 4: not as high AS i would expect it to be right,

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00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:13,720
Speaker 4: now but as anti Trump ism sets, in now that

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00:21:13,880 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 4: he is the, establishment he is the, swamp he is the. Liar,

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Speaker 4: yeah betrayal is a deep. Emotion it's why they hated

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Speaker 4: Us Lincoln project guys so. Much we were as bad

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Speaker 4: as they much as they Hate. Democrats it was the

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Speaker 4: betrayers the, terms and that's what's going to drive a,

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00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:34,200
Speaker 4: deep deep passionate Anti trump. Sentiment and you're gonna have

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00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:36,720
Speaker 4: the Ten, cruises you, know The Marco rubios and The

384
00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:40,960
Speaker 4: jadevan's apologists trying to hold it, together and the old

385
00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:44,080
Speaker 4: Feeble man you, know still doing his you, know crazy,

386
00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:47,520
Speaker 4: talks trying to gin back support. Up it's not coming

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00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:51,600
Speaker 4: back like if they've turned it across The. Rubicon so let's.

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Speaker 3: Talk LET i.

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Speaker 1: Want to do another minute with These trump influencers because

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00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:58,480
Speaker 1: you have to explain to us what happened With Ben,

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00:21:58,480 --> 00:22:01,760
Speaker 1: Shapiro BECAUSE i Think Ben shapiro for these people is

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Speaker 1: a real cautionary.

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Speaker 4: Tale so Remember Ben shapiro literally catapults during the rise

394
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,920
Speaker 4: Of trump and twenty fifteen as an Anti trump. Voice

395
00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:15,200
Speaker 4: he's the one who is saying this is not, conservatism

396
00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:18,040
Speaker 4: this is, bad this is going to go. Wrong he,

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00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:20,560
Speaker 4: then you, know is one of the first people to

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00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:23,399
Speaker 4: turn And Jenny fleck and, Say, OKAY i get. IT i,

399
00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:25,399
Speaker 4: LOST i was. WRONG i got the feel of the

400
00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:29,119
Speaker 4: of The Republican party wrong and becomes This trump. Acolyte

401
00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:34,399
Speaker 4: and there's the beneficiary of that that, becomes you, know

402
00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:38,840
Speaker 4: part of this, fissure which is not really as much

403
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:41,960
Speaker 4: ideological as a as A i believe it's a network.

404
00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:46,000
Speaker 4: Disagreement WHAT i mean by that is the following sticks

405
00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:50,560
Speaker 4: With Ben shapiro until somebody else's network starts to get,

406
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:53,120
Speaker 4: bigger and in this case It's Tucker. Carlson this fight

407
00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:57,320
Speaker 4: Between Tucker carlson And Ben shapiro presumably On, israel although

408
00:22:57,320 --> 00:23:00,840
Speaker 4: it's really about a bigger. Worldview it's starts With, israel

409
00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:03,439
Speaker 4: but now it's going to become about monetary policy and

410
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:08,480
Speaker 4: About america first and protectionism and nativism and Who's american

411
00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:11,840
Speaker 4: and who's not, Right and so it starts as this

412
00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:16,200
Speaker 4: you Know, israel you Know gaza, story but it's really a,

413
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:19,359
Speaker 4: deep deep demarcation line where we used to have moderates versus.

414
00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:23,960
Speaker 4: Conservatives it's now about two different worldviews of our engagement

415
00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:26,960
Speaker 4: in foreign alliances and who's pulling the, strings as they,

416
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:32,320
Speaker 4: say and the Protectionist america first, isolationists which Is tucker,

417
00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:37,320
Speaker 4: saying you were, You, maga you were never, Wrong we

418
00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:39,960
Speaker 4: never should have got involved in. This you were betrayed By.

419
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:44,520
Speaker 4: Trump you are betrayed By Ben. Shapiro they suckered us into,

420
00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:48,439
Speaker 4: This so you don't have anything to apologize. For there to.

421
00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:50,680
Speaker 4: Blame and that's WHAT i think is so appealing about

422
00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:53,040
Speaker 4: What tucker is doing and Why Ben shapiro's spiraling and

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00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:53,760
Speaker 4: collapsing right.

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00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:57,600
Speaker 1: NOW i also, THINK i, Mean i'm no fan Of Ben,

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Speaker 1: shapiro but clearly Anti semitism is, huge.

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00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:06,000
Speaker 4: Huge broadly by the, Way, yeah we're in a moment

427
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:10,199
Speaker 4: where there's there's danger signs and red alarms going off and,

428
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:14,800
Speaker 4: saying you, know Anti semitism is a unique hatred because

429
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:18,760
Speaker 4: it's the sign of coming hatreds beyond, that M, m

430
00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:22,440
Speaker 4: it's always the, first but it opens the door to everything.

431
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:25,160
Speaker 4: Else and that's what that moment has. Been and it's

432
00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:25,960
Speaker 4: across both.

433
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,040
Speaker 1: Parties, yeah though it's much worse on the, RIGHT i

434
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:31,480
Speaker 1: mean for, sure for, Sure, YEAH i MEAN i definitely

435
00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:34,000
Speaker 1: THINK i see certainly see shades of it on the.

436
00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:39,240
Speaker 1: Left book not the. Same, no just watch. Out yes

437
00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:43,440
Speaker 1: that's right. NOW i wonder if we could talk, About

438
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:48,520
Speaker 1: uh so we're talking about like How trump found himself

439
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:52,720
Speaker 1: in this moment where he was no longer controlling the.

440
00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:56,840
Speaker 1: Narrative AND i think it started With. Epstein then it

441
00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:01,200
Speaker 1: was this wild foreign war. Adventures AND i remember being

442
00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:05,320
Speaker 1: on television the day before The venezuela thing and, saying,

443
00:25:05,760 --> 00:25:09,399
Speaker 1: Well trump will never go To venezuela because he hasn't

444
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 1: tried to sell it at all to The american. People

445
00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:15,720
Speaker 1: and you, know Even republicans try to sell a war

446
00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:20,760
Speaker 1: before doing. It AND i was completely. Wrong SO i

447
00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 1: just want you to explain what you think happened there

448
00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:28,040
Speaker 1: and then how it got us To. IRAN i think properly.

449
00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:30,920
Speaker 4: Understood It's Donald trump think he had already sold. It

450
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 4: he thinks that's what the campaign. Was hegsith becomes A

451
00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:37,040
Speaker 4: secretary of, war Not secretary Of, Defense like we're going

452
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:39,359
Speaker 4: on the. Offense and he believed that the election was

453
00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:41,919
Speaker 4: a mandate for, that and so in his mind he

454
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:47,040
Speaker 4: had sold this you, know, muscular you know foreign, policy

455
00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:48,800
Speaker 4: That america is going to Be america. Again we're going

456
00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:51,440
Speaker 4: to go start taking stuff as a way of defending

457
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:55,879
Speaker 4: our currency and taking on The. Chinese he starts flexing Against. Greenland,

458
00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:59,320
Speaker 4: right let's start. Negotiating we'll buy. It if, not we'll take.

459
00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 4: It he Slaps canada in the. Face he starts you, know,

460
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:07,280
Speaker 4: dropping you, know signs Into mexico with the, cartels like

461
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 4: this is all, Ours it's all. Ours it's just a

462
00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:14,320
Speaker 4: matter of. Sequencing, look he's still going to Take, cuba you,

463
00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:18,919
Speaker 4: know AND i Think taiwan becomes just a chess, Piece,

464
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:22,160
Speaker 4: like are we going to really Defend taiwan now with

465
00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:25,760
Speaker 4: with as extended as we. Are, no if she Wants,

466
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 4: taiwan he'll take it in a. Meccicas we're not gonna do

467
00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:28,399
Speaker 4: a thing about.

468
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:32,840
Speaker 1: It so let's talk first about what's happening With, iran

469
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:37,760
Speaker 1: because today there was this press conference heg. Seth you, know,

470
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:40,600
Speaker 1: basically there are a lot of people who think that

471
00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:44,919
Speaker 1: the ceasefire is, over and that they are really just

472
00:26:45,040 --> 00:26:50,800
Speaker 1: doing like a military action under the guise of not

473
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 1: and that we're sort of we're in this moment Where

474
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 1: trump is sort of saying something isn't, happening that is really.

475
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 1: Happening that was the net net of the press CONFERENCE

476
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:05,840
Speaker 1: i saw this, morning and SO i wonder what you think, That,

477
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:09,520
Speaker 1: like how is that? Tenable and also the big thing

478
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:12,800
Speaker 1: that is Making Donald trump the most unpopular more than

479
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:13,800
Speaker 1: anything is the gas.

480
00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:17,280
Speaker 4: Prices so first of, all this is not tenable under any.

481
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:20,359
Speaker 4: Scenario the only possible way he gets out of this

482
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:22,399
Speaker 4: he can't even like wake up to the and go,

483
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 4: okay let's pull out in declare. Victory his base isn't

484
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:27,760
Speaker 4: gonna believe that even, now because of The epstein, stuff

485
00:27:27,760 --> 00:27:30,720
Speaker 4: because of getting into this, war because they feel. Betrayed

486
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 4: the only possible WAY i see it is there's got

487
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,399
Speaker 4: to be a bigger. Distraction there's got to be another

488
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:39,639
Speaker 4: war he's got to move to to, Say, okay, well declare.

489
00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 4: Victory we took care of. This now we've got to

490
00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:43,479
Speaker 4: go fight this. War No one's going to buy that.

491
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:45,800
Speaker 4: Much but that's kind Of trump's world of. VIEW i

492
00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:48,800
Speaker 4: think that's the only possible escape patch he can. Pull

493
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:51,639
Speaker 4: the likelihood of this going all the way to the

494
00:27:51,760 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 4: end of The trump, PRESIDENCY i think is very very.

495
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:57,080
Speaker 4: High and as you just correctly pointed, out we are

496
00:27:57,280 --> 00:27:59,880
Speaker 4: just now seeing the spiking gas prices in a meaning

497
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 4: way just. Now like the last tankers have come Into

498
00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:06,280
Speaker 4: Long beach In california with two hundred thousand barrels of,

499
00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:10,160
Speaker 4: oil that's. It when it's, done the prices are gonna.

500
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:13,399
Speaker 4: Spike even if we opened the straits, tomorrow there's going

501
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,760
Speaker 4: to be dramatic. Spikes so you could see nine dollars

502
00:28:16,760 --> 00:28:20,280
Speaker 4: ten dollars a gallon gas In. California that's like six

503
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:23,160
Speaker 4: dollars six fifty seven in other parts of the. Country

504
00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:26,280
Speaker 4: and as you correctly pointed, out like gas prices, are

505
00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 4: that's our religion In, america like, that don't mess with.

506
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:32,920
Speaker 1: That AND i think like an important caveat is that,

507
00:28:33,359 --> 00:28:37,600
Speaker 1: diesel for whatever, reason is even more. Expensive and diesel

508
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:40,880
Speaker 1: is the airplane. Fuel so when you have what happened

509
00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:45,040
Speaker 1: with With Spirit, airlines that doesn't exist in a vacuum

510
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:47,120
Speaker 1: that comes directly from these diesel.

511
00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:50,200
Speaker 4: Prices boeing was projecting a four billion dollar profit that

512
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:51,680
Speaker 4: they've had to come back from revised and say it's.

513
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 4: Gone four billion dollars is gone with current current diesel,

514
00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:59,400
Speaker 4: prices and it's not going. Down so we're hitting the

515
00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:02,880
Speaker 4: point where the economy is going to start. Choking we're

516
00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:05,680
Speaker 4: choking the economy right. Now and it's all self. Owned

517
00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 4: none of this had to, happen not one bit of,

518
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 4: it and The american people know. It.

519
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:14,800
Speaker 1: Yeah it's interesting because it's LIKE i, have you, KNOW

520
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 1: i have this theory that want That trump is suffering

521
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,160
Speaker 1: from a lot of the problems of the. Seventies i'm

522
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 1: not going to say who was president, then because everybody

523
00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,440
Speaker 1: of my let all my listeners love that, person including. Me,

524
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:30,600
Speaker 1: yeah but he. Was he ran a foul of things

525
00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:33,160
Speaker 1: that were not his, fault, right Don trump is the exact.

526
00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 1: Opposite he's running a foul of things that are actually his.

527
00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:37,320
Speaker 3: Fault.

528
00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:39,320
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah that's Why i'm saying if he had just

529
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:41,720
Speaker 4: gone golfing at Mar A lago and drooled on himself

530
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:43,440
Speaker 4: a little, bit and then we'd, laugh and you, know

531
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:46,360
Speaker 4: we'd still be frightened by who he. Is but all

532
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:48,880
Speaker 4: of this is all his own. Fault this is a

533
00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 4: self owned in soccer parlor self goal like you scored on,

534
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:56,640
Speaker 4: Yourself like this is. Everything everything he's, done the overreach

535
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 4: on the immigration, stuff the ice, raids the, crackdowns the masque,

536
00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:04,280
Speaker 4: porte the mass jack booted, thugs the tariff policy On Liberation,

537
00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:07,280
Speaker 4: day the offending The, canadians the you, know the the

538
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:12,040
Speaker 4: slapping the face OF, nato the invasions Of, venezuela like

539
00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:16,840
Speaker 4: the war In, iran The epstein, file literally all of,

540
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:21,240
Speaker 4: It all of, It molly is all a function of

541
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:25,040
Speaker 4: his owning. Competence and when you realize it's not just

542
00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:27,680
Speaker 4: like a bad string of bad, decisions it's just he's

543
00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:32,040
Speaker 4: not capable mentally of managing this. Anymore and he's surrounded

544
00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 4: himself not with talented. People say what you will About Joe,

545
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:36,600
Speaker 4: biden the people around him knew how to run the damn.

546
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:41,480
Speaker 1: Government that means, yes, YES i mean, right but, yes

547
00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:46,480
Speaker 1: but there was but it was all And Tulci gabbard AND. R.

548
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:50,400
Speaker 4: F K junior, like, yes these were these were maybe the, mistakes,

549
00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 4: absolutely but.

550
00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:54,240
Speaker 1: Yeah but you can't compare that you had real government

551
00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:57,720
Speaker 1: people who knew how to. Government, yeah. PRECISELY i wonder,

552
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,600
Speaker 1: now would you if you were Down trump and you

553
00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:03,800
Speaker 1: were woke up and Were Donald, trump what would what

554
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 1: would the first thing you would?

555
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:06,760
Speaker 4: Do. Babic so here's the real, conundrum and it's a

556
00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:08,760
Speaker 4: conundrum not just for, him but it's for everybody. Else

557
00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:11,200
Speaker 4: is you have to literally make one hundred and eighty degree. Pivot,

558
00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:13,400
Speaker 4: yeah you have to SAY i made a, mistake which

559
00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 4: is not In trump's. Vernacular he's literally not capable of.

560
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:19,200
Speaker 4: It he'd rather lie about it and make that. Pivot

561
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 4: but he's still not doing. That maybe he. Does but

562
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:25,440
Speaker 4: even if he, does LIKE i, said that, believability that

563
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:29,040
Speaker 4: that blind trust after The epstein files lies is. GONE

564
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 4: i Mean Marjorie Taylor green left like where we're out

565
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:34,560
Speaker 4: mass he's. Gone and so the Other republicans who are,

566
00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:37,640
Speaker 4: looking you, know These republican plus ten districts that are

567
00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:40,719
Speaker 4: probably gonna. Lose what's the incentive anymore to defend. Him

568
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:42,720
Speaker 4: you're gonna have to start running away from. Him and

569
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,120
Speaker 4: that's gonna be the next round of this by. Summer

570
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 4: is not only are they gonna not Want trump out

571
00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:50,440
Speaker 4: on the, Stump you're gonna start SAYING i. Disappear you're

572
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 4: start hearing people disagree with, him which you have never

573
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 4: seen in The trump. Era it is all new new territory.

574
00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 1: And you're gonna AND i think it's important to realize

575
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:03,280
Speaker 1: is that these people are Being they're making the craven

576
00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:07,160
Speaker 1: calculus That trump is so unpopular that they have to

577
00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:07,520
Speaker 1: break with.

578
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:10,520
Speaker 4: Him and that's such an important point because, Again trump

579
00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 4: has always been we can't live with, him we can't

580
00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 4: live without. Him he is now more demonstrably more reliability

581
00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 4: than an. Asset that has never been the case in

582
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:21,840
Speaker 4: The republican. Base so now that's going to change the

583
00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:25,160
Speaker 4: entire dynamics of The republican. Caucus you Have Ted kruss

584
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,680
Speaker 4: already flexing For. Iowa Tucker carlston is leaning into, this

585
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:30,840
Speaker 4: the debate about whether it's it's going to Be vance

586
00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:33,920
Speaker 4: Or Rubio Don junior showing, up you know with a

587
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:35,840
Speaker 4: walking into the high is it going to Be Don?

588
00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:38,680
Speaker 4: Junior Like trump is not going to do well when

589
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:40,680
Speaker 4: everyone else is talking about who's going to be the next.

590
00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:44,480
Speaker 4: President this gets more, erratic this gets more, difficult and

591
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:47,280
Speaker 4: there's going to be more incentive to be Against trump

592
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 4: than for. Him and we've never been in that scenario

593
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:51,040
Speaker 4: since twenty.

594
00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:54,800
Speaker 1: Sixteen if you're The Republican party at this moment and

595
00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:58,440
Speaker 1: you are running Against, trump doesn't that mean that you

596
00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:02,960
Speaker 1: are coming, like won't you alienate what's left OF maga

597
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:03,560
Speaker 1: by doing? That?

598
00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:07,840
Speaker 4: Yeah and that's for somebody like. Me that's the beauty

599
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:09,400
Speaker 4: of the. Moment we've been waiting for this for ten.

600
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:12,480
Speaker 4: Years we all knew this was. Coming Lindsey graham knew

601
00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:14,479
Speaker 4: this was. Coming Marco rubio knew this was. Coming they

602
00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:18,080
Speaker 4: were saying. It this is the reckoning you are choosing

603
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:20,440
Speaker 4: now Between it's a damned if you, do damned if you.

604
00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:22,920
Speaker 4: Don't you always chosen to be with him rather than against.

605
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 4: Him you are going to see more and More republicans

606
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:27,360
Speaker 4: making the opposite. Choice that's What tucker's, Doing that's What

607
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:30,040
Speaker 4: Megan kelly's, Doing that's What Candice owen's. Doing that's what

608
00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:30,760
Speaker 4: all these people are.

609
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:34,040
Speaker 1: Doing if you're a billionaire Like Jeff bezos and you've

610
00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:38,320
Speaker 1: been like basically trying to obey in advance With The

611
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:42,120
Speaker 1: apprentice and you, know wanting to do The Don Junior

612
00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:46,479
Speaker 1: apprentice And, milania when do you make the calculus that

613
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:47,720
Speaker 1: you were always against.

614
00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:51,520
Speaker 4: This you'll make the calculus as late as, possible and

615
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:54,200
Speaker 4: when there's new, leadership because they've got enough money to

616
00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 4: buy their way back in regardless of his, there they don't.

617
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:01,880
Speaker 1: Care Mike madrid really, smart so, interesting a lot of

618
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:04,880
Speaker 1: questions THAT i felt like you really answered for. Me thank.

619
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:06,480
Speaker 4: You, thanks great to be with you.

620
00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:12,480
Speaker 1: Always Kimberly crenshaw is a civil rights lawyer and the

621
00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:18,200
Speaker 1: author of Back, talker An american. Memoir, Welcome, Welcome. Kimberly

622
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:24,239
Speaker 1: you're like the iconic law, professor law, scholar legal, genius

623
00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:27,919
Speaker 1: and now you're here with a. Memoir, Hi, Hi, hi

624
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:31,799
Speaker 1: thanks for having me. On i'm so. EXCITED i wrote

625
00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 1: a memoir, too SO i know what it's like to

626
00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 1: come from one lane and not try but like you're

627
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:39,799
Speaker 1: shifting into another. LANE i think of you as like

628
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:43,800
Speaker 1: one of the fundamental legal scholars who created an idea

629
00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:47,800
Speaker 1: which has a lot of salience in any which. Way

630
00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:52,960
Speaker 1: and now here you are doing a, memoir which is

631
00:34:53,000 --> 00:34:56,239
Speaker 1: so it's like the preface and the, PostScript and so

632
00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:57,799
Speaker 1: talk us through how different that.

633
00:34:57,920 --> 00:34:59,239
Speaker 3: Is, well you, know a.

634
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:05,719
Speaker 5: Legal, scotl especially among, academics is framed as somebody who

635
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:14,200
Speaker 5: just analyzes legal, principles applies the special magic legal, analysis you,

636
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:17,600
Speaker 5: know to come to some kind of legal. Conclusion, WELL

637
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:21,480
Speaker 5: i never really bought into. That that's partly why the

638
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:25,399
Speaker 5: entire field That i've been part of exists to sort

639
00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:28,799
Speaker 5: of challenge that. Idea but even when you challenge the,

640
00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:33,319
Speaker 5: idea you usually do so by moving around ideas and.

641
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:37,400
Speaker 5: Principles you don't often, say, well WHEN i was five years,

642
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:40,640
Speaker 5: OLD i really wanted to Be Thorne. Rosa it is very,

643
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:45,080
Speaker 5: much you, know a different, register yet it is deeply

644
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:50,240
Speaker 5: connected to critical or e, sia to, intersectionality because those

645
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:54,200
Speaker 5: ideas didn't simply come from my sitting in an office

646
00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:57,960
Speaker 5: somewhere in a light bulb you, know. Flashes it's instead

647
00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:02,560
Speaker 5: trying to make sense of my life over, time being

648
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 5: born in the sixties in the middle of The civil rights,

649
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 5: movement coming of age in the seventies in the middle

650
00:36:09,600 --> 00:36:13,080
Speaker 5: of The women's, movement and really trying to trace the

651
00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:17,080
Speaker 5: kind of experiences THAT i had that always raised a,

652
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:20,720
Speaker 5: question what about? This how come we're not talking about?

653
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:24,720
Speaker 5: That so just bringing all those questions together over time

654
00:36:25,400 --> 00:36:28,920
Speaker 5: is what led me to ask some of the questions

655
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:32,680
Speaker 5: of the law that led to, intersectionality that led to

656
00:36:32,719 --> 00:36:33,200
Speaker 5: critical a.

657
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:35,080
Speaker 3: Theory so it's a.

658
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:38,760
Speaker 5: Response to the way that these ideas have traveled into,

659
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:42,400
Speaker 5: culture but it's a response that locates it in the

660
00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:47,759
Speaker 5: experience of lived lives here in this country in the

661
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 5: twentieth twenty first, century not something that came From europe

662
00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:55,040
Speaker 5: or not something that's, fantastical but something that's material and.

663
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:57,480
Speaker 1: Real it's funny BECAUSE i was going to ask, you

664
00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:01,080
Speaker 1: AND i want to ask you about the insane ruling

665
00:37:01,239 --> 00:37:04,919
Speaker 1: from This Supreme court to just strike down the voting

666
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:06,920
Speaker 1: right To, act Which i'm sure you could have told

667
00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:11,400
Speaker 1: me a long time was, coming especially because you worked

668
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:14,000
Speaker 1: on The Anita hill. HEARINGS i.

669
00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:17,800
Speaker 5: DID i did so WHEN i came into law, teaching

670
00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:20,239
Speaker 5: there were so few black women that most of, us

671
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:23,399
Speaker 5: if we didn't know each other, personally we knew of each.

672
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:26,880
Speaker 3: Other so when it WAS i, mean you have to

673
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:28,640
Speaker 3: go back to the.

674
00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:30,880
Speaker 1: Hearings in nineteen ninety.

675
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:33,040
Speaker 3: One nineteen ninety, one it was very.

676
00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 5: Contested even When Clarence thomas was nominated by the First

677
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:41,120
Speaker 5: President bush to Replace Thurgood, marshall who was a civil rights.

678
00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:45,719
Speaker 5: Hero so obviously there was controversy Because Clarence thomas was

679
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:47,240
Speaker 5: never seen as pro civil.

680
00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:49,839
Speaker 3: Rights Now i've never seen as someone who.

681
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:54,319
Speaker 5: Is about trying to Continue Thirdgood marshall's. Legacy so it

682
00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:58,360
Speaker 5: was controversial from the. Start and then there was a

683
00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:03,799
Speaker 5: report that he had been accused of sexual harassment by

684
00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:05,799
Speaker 5: someone who was.

685
00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:06,680
Speaker 3: Not trying to come.

686
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:09,600
Speaker 5: Forward she just had shared the story with someone and

687
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:12,200
Speaker 5: it made its way to The Judiciary, committee and then

688
00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:17,560
Speaker 5: she was subpoena to. Come WHEN i realized it was

689
00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:19,680
Speaker 5: SOMEONE i, KNEW i reached out to her just to

690
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:22,319
Speaker 5: see if she needed support and, help and in, fact

691
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:25,319
Speaker 5: she was pulling together her legal. Team so that NIGHT

692
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:28,239
Speaker 5: i was on a plane heading To, washington D. C

693
00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:31,120
Speaker 5: SO i was at a front seat at one of

694
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:35,360
Speaker 5: the most consequential moments In american. Politics and WHAT i

695
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:41,160
Speaker 5: write about in this moment is how the failure of

696
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:47,560
Speaker 5: anti racism to anticipate a gendered reality for black women

697
00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:50,360
Speaker 5: that might be different from the way black men experienced.

698
00:38:50,440 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 5: Racism AND i would say a similar failure in the

699
00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:57,520
Speaker 5: part of some feminists to understand that although all feminists

700
00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:00,279
Speaker 5: are subject to or all women are subject to some

701
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 5: form of sexual harassmen and other people as, well the

702
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:09,480
Speaker 5: history of black people with respect to you, know stereotypes

703
00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:14,240
Speaker 5: about deviant sexuality and the way in Which black people

704
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:17,799
Speaker 5: are diminished by these stereotypes made it that much more

705
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 5: complicated for a black women to come. Forward nobody wanted

706
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:26,840
Speaker 5: to talk about those. Complications so When Clarence thomas waltzes

707
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:29,439
Speaker 5: in and says this is nothing but a high tech,

708
00:39:29,560 --> 00:39:34,040
Speaker 5: lynching millions of, people Especially black, people who were kind

709
00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:37,600
Speaker 5: of sitting on the fence About Clarence, thomas went way

710
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:41,600
Speaker 5: over to the other, side and their justification for it

711
00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:45,160
Speaker 5: was sexual harassment is not a black woman's. Issue that

712
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:49,719
Speaker 5: blew my mind because sexual harassment actually sort of came

713
00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:52,760
Speaker 5: from black women's. Experiences they were some of the primary.

714
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:56,680
Speaker 5: Plaintiffs so this was a history that our community didn't.

715
00:39:56,719 --> 00:40:01,560
Speaker 5: Know it hadn't been told. Much so the split was

716
00:40:01,680 --> 00:40:06,400
Speaker 5: easier to break the coalition against this anti civil rights.

717
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:10,560
Speaker 5: Nomination so it was traumatizing in so many. Ways it

718
00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:14,080
Speaker 5: really challenged my sense of the. We but what it

719
00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:18,239
Speaker 5: did do When Clarence thomas was finally confirmed by the

720
00:40:18,280 --> 00:40:21,920
Speaker 5: smallest margin in, history a colleague of mine AND i

721
00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:24,680
Speaker 5: one of the only black men who came TO dc

722
00:40:25,239 --> 00:40:28,480
Speaker 5: to Support, anita we both, said this is going to

723
00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:30,880
Speaker 5: change the rest of our, life and it.

724
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:32,000
Speaker 3: Did it changed our.

725
00:40:32,040 --> 00:40:35,360
Speaker 5: Lives we're, looking you, know right now to a moment

726
00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:38,799
Speaker 5: where the crown jewel of the civil rights movement has

727
00:40:38,920 --> 00:40:43,360
Speaker 5: been crushed by A Supreme court that's largely led By Clarence.

728
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:47,920
Speaker 5: Thomas we lost so much of the civil rights infrastructure

729
00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:50,400
Speaker 5: that people, fought bled and died.

730
00:40:50,480 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 3: For and much of this was made.

731
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:58,960
Speaker 5: Possible when we don't have effective coalitions and effective interface

732
00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:02,719
Speaker 5: between many of the issues that we fight. Against our

733
00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:07,919
Speaker 5: fight against, racism in our fight against patriarchy often aren't smoothly,

734
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 5: interactional and that's what my work has always been trying

735
00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:13,040
Speaker 5: to help.

736
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:16,120
Speaker 1: Facilitate it's funny because you, KNOW i Had my mother

737
00:41:16,360 --> 00:41:20,320
Speaker 1: was Is Eric, johng who's like very white, feminist you,

738
00:41:20,360 --> 00:41:23,560
Speaker 1: know just did not have a lot of ability to

739
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:27,360
Speaker 1: see any struggle beyond her, own which you know is

740
00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:30,400
Speaker 1: a real. Failing and one of the things when you

741
00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:33,360
Speaker 1: talk about, this you, know she was born in nineteen forty,

742
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:36,279
Speaker 1: two and she couldn't put together that what she was

743
00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:40,160
Speaker 1: trying to do was orders of magnitude harder and more

744
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 1: complicated for black. Women but WHEN i think so much

745
00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 1: about what we know about sexual, harassment and we know.

746
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:49,359
Speaker 1: That you, know there's it's much more about power than

747
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:50,239
Speaker 1: it is about.

748
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:55,640
Speaker 5: Sex absolutely, Right and it is also ABOUT i call

749
00:41:55,680 --> 00:42:00,120
Speaker 5: it asymmetric, solidarities And i'll just correct. Way women are

750
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 5: expected to stand strong and, firm you.

751
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:05,160
Speaker 3: Know with the men in their.

752
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:09,960
Speaker 5: Communities black women in, particular are often disciplined by this

753
00:42:10,160 --> 00:42:15,040
Speaker 5: idea that our primary battle is around race where we,

754
00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:19,760
Speaker 5: diverge you, know where black women experience something different from black.

755
00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:22,920
Speaker 5: Men the idea is we can wait to deal with.

756
00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:26,080
Speaker 5: That we have to deal with the primary, directive and

757
00:42:26,160 --> 00:42:31,239
Speaker 5: the primary directive is racial. Advancement, well what about the

758
00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:35,120
Speaker 5: fact that you, Know Clarence thomas wasn't standing in solidarity

759
00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:39,440
Speaker 5: With Anita hill in her career, advancement sexually harassed. Her

760
00:42:39,719 --> 00:42:42,520
Speaker 5: so this is sort of WHAT i mean WHEN i

761
00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:47,280
Speaker 5: say we're often expected to ride or die with, men

762
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:50,200
Speaker 5: and men are not expected to ride or die with.

763
00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:54,160
Speaker 5: Us this is across the, board but it's particularly challenging

764
00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:58,880
Speaker 5: when you are collectively fighting against. Racism but some forms of,

765
00:42:58,960 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 5: racism they're sort of a footnote or.

766
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:06,080
Speaker 3: Asterisk you. Know we can come back and consider that, lately.

767
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:07,839
Speaker 1: AND i, mean we saw that in the sixties from

768
00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:10,920
Speaker 1: some black men, too that the idea that black women

769
00:43:11,160 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 1: they could be disposable to us to some, extent that

770
00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:17,759
Speaker 1: their plight was not as important as the larger. Plight

771
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:19,920
Speaker 1: and you, know you see with white women right that

772
00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:24,640
Speaker 1: they overlay identify with their whiteness over they're being disempowered

773
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:26,880
Speaker 1: and the marriage.

774
00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:29,440
Speaker 3: Gender is often secondary and we forget.

775
00:43:29,480 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 5: That like so many people were surprised about the fact

776
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:37,960
Speaker 5: that the majority of white women did not Support harris

777
00:43:38,000 --> 00:43:39,800
Speaker 5: and instead Supported.

778
00:43:39,520 --> 00:43:42,680
Speaker 3: Trump kind of, like, well what are we forgetting about?

779
00:43:42,760 --> 00:43:46,920
Speaker 5: Gender that we've learned over and over again the primary

780
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:53,200
Speaker 5: identification often among all women is with, men regardless of

781
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:56,359
Speaker 5: what the men the male agenda. Is so it could

782
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:59,319
Speaker 5: be you, Know i'm going to take away your reproductive,

783
00:43:59,320 --> 00:44:03,560
Speaker 5: freedom going to take away your right to work to

784
00:44:03,640 --> 00:44:04,200
Speaker 5: pursue a.

785
00:44:04,280 --> 00:44:09,520
Speaker 3: Career too many women are willing to abide by that

786
00:44:09,640 --> 00:44:13,680
Speaker 3: because of the larger investment that they have with their

787
00:44:13,719 --> 00:44:17,200
Speaker 3: communities as defined and led and dictated by the men

788
00:44:17,239 --> 00:44:18,520
Speaker 3: in their. Lives is.

789
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:21,759
Speaker 5: Interesting it's the one thing you know that women across

790
00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:26,200
Speaker 5: all races kind of have in common is primary. Orientation

791
00:44:26,719 --> 00:44:31,120
Speaker 5: SO i try to talk to women and other people

792
00:44:31,560 --> 00:44:36,239
Speaker 5: about the damaging dimension of that primary, affiliation and the

793
00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:40,080
Speaker 5: refusal to think about what happens when all of these

794
00:44:40,239 --> 00:44:43,600
Speaker 5: isms come, together but our politics do not come together

795
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 5: to fight.

796
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:46,160
Speaker 1: THEM i want to ask you about the sort of

797
00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:50,200
Speaker 1: polite racism of the rejection Of Harris, yea because one

798
00:44:50,239 --> 00:44:53,240
Speaker 1: of the things we would hear on the, trail WHICH,

799
00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:56,319
Speaker 1: i being, NAIVE i thought it meant what they were,

800
00:44:56,320 --> 00:44:59,400
Speaker 1: saying but NOW i realized they were being polite. Racist

801
00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:03,319
Speaker 1: but polite, racist they would, say we like hars we

802
00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:05,240
Speaker 1: just don't know enough about.

803
00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:14,600
Speaker 5: Her so we know about the, racist sexually assaulted stranger

804
00:45:14,719 --> 00:45:18,400
Speaker 5: to the truth That trump. Is so it's more important

805
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:21,840
Speaker 5: to know his failings than it is.

806
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:25,400
Speaker 3: To take a chance with someone who has none of those.

807
00:45:25,160 --> 00:45:29,080
Speaker 5: Things in a. RESUME i couldn't agree. More it is polite.

808
00:45:29,400 --> 00:45:32,439
Speaker 5: Racism it is a way of justifying AND i think

809
00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:35,040
Speaker 5: so many things were going, on you, know really across the.

810
00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:39,520
Speaker 5: Board so of course all candidates have issues that make

811
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:42,920
Speaker 5: them less than. Ideal we've never had a candidate who was,

812
00:45:43,160 --> 00:45:46,400
Speaker 5: ideal so let's just put, that you, know out. There

813
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:52,480
Speaker 5: but what seems to be operative here is a reluctance

814
00:45:52,520 --> 00:45:57,440
Speaker 5: to imagine a woman as the chief, executive and then

815
00:45:57,520 --> 00:46:00,919
Speaker 5: on top of that a set of rhetorics that were

816
00:46:00,920 --> 00:46:03,280
Speaker 5: particularly racialized that.

817
00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:06,480
Speaker 3: Made her even more of a target of.

818
00:46:06,560 --> 00:46:09,800
Speaker 5: Disdain, so, look people said horrible things About Hillary, clinton

819
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:11,560
Speaker 5: but they didn't call her a.

820
00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:16,680
Speaker 1: Slut they did not invoke sexuality With Hillary. Clinton and

821
00:46:17,080 --> 00:46:21,520
Speaker 1: both of them dressed in that same, way the only

822
00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:27,719
Speaker 1: available lane for women, politicians, right pan, suits, subtle casual,

823
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 1: jewelry short.

824
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:32,480
Speaker 5: Hair you, know they don't the professional look, Right and

825
00:46:32,560 --> 00:46:35,719
Speaker 5: we understand why they felt they needed to dress that.

826
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:39,719
Speaker 5: Way that's the sexiest part of, it the massogyn, noir you,

827
00:46:39,760 --> 00:46:43,759
Speaker 5: know is even Though Kamala harris dressed that, way she

828
00:46:43,800 --> 00:46:47,080
Speaker 5: could not escape the pre existing stereotypes that were always

829
00:46:47,120 --> 00:46:50,560
Speaker 5: available to toss at any black, woman no matter her,

830
00:46:50,600 --> 00:46:55,200
Speaker 5: authority her, accomplishment her. Intelligence she was still going to

831
00:46:55,280 --> 00:46:59,880
Speaker 5: be called a, slut and the media were not really

832
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:01,360
Speaker 5: going to call people to task on.

833
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:03,239
Speaker 3: It it was, like what can you?

834
00:47:03,400 --> 00:47:06,640
Speaker 1: Do and it's funny because WHEN i interviewed her For Annie,

835
00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:09,960
Speaker 1: FAIR i just went through the things she had. Done.

836
00:47:10,120 --> 00:47:13,200
Speaker 1: Right she had Been Attorney, general she had been you,

837
00:47:13,239 --> 00:47:15,319
Speaker 1: know she had had all of these. Jobs she had

838
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:17,200
Speaker 1: been A da she had been the govern you, know

839
00:47:17,239 --> 00:47:19,200
Speaker 1: she hadn't been the, governor but she had had she

840
00:47:19,320 --> 00:47:22,120
Speaker 1: been a, Senator she had all these. Jobs she had

841
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:25,719
Speaker 1: been the first black woman in many of these jobs and.

842
00:47:25,719 --> 00:47:29,040
Speaker 3: Had been successful at. Them of, course.

843
00:47:29,200 --> 00:47:32,080
Speaker 1: Of course that you reckon with right and had gotten

844
00:47:32,080 --> 00:47:35,120
Speaker 1: elected from each, job you, know and it just it didn't,

845
00:47:35,160 --> 00:47:37,040
Speaker 1: Matter it didn't. MATTER i want to go back to

846
00:47:37,080 --> 00:47:41,280
Speaker 1: this idea Of Thurgood marshall To. Thomas there's another thought

847
00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:44,760
Speaker 1: experiment here which was so upsetting to, me but now

848
00:47:44,960 --> 00:47:47,719
Speaker 1: it seems like really makes sense in, history which IS

849
00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:49,880
Speaker 1: rbg to. Justice.

850
00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:55,920
Speaker 5: Amy, yeah that's a, parallel that is, definitely you, know

851
00:47:56,000 --> 00:48:01,840
Speaker 5: the relevant. Parallel SO i wonder when other organized women

852
00:48:02,000 --> 00:48:06,520
Speaker 5: learned a lesson from organized black, people Because thomas had

853
00:48:06,640 --> 00:48:11,959
Speaker 5: a lot of, support even from some traditional. GROUPS, sclc

854
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:18,000
Speaker 5: which Was Martin Luther king's, organization supported, him The nation Of,

855
00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 5: islam you, know The Black nationalists supported. Him so there

856
00:48:22,719 --> 00:48:25,640
Speaker 5: was sort of across the board support and even those

857
00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:30,880
Speaker 5: organizations that opposed, him like The National Bar association or THE.

858
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:32,479
Speaker 5: Naacp it was a big.

859
00:48:32,520 --> 00:48:33,200
Speaker 3: Fight it was.

860
00:48:33,239 --> 00:48:37,840
Speaker 5: Split but When Amy coley came, ALONG i think the

861
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:43,840
Speaker 5: women's community was a bit more unified in opposition Than African.

862
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:48,600
Speaker 5: Americans SO i do wonder whether the idea, that, well

863
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:51,760
Speaker 5: having a black person is better than having no black.

864
00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:55,360
Speaker 5: Person we saw that that wasn't necessarily. True so it

865
00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:59,320
Speaker 5: could be that women sort of learned a lesson from

866
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:02,160
Speaker 5: hoping that there's some internal woman that was going to

867
00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:05,880
Speaker 5: jump out and suddenly repudiate all the things that made her,

868
00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:09,040
Speaker 5: attractive you, know To trump in the first. Place that

869
00:49:09,239 --> 00:49:12,320
Speaker 5: was never going to. Happen With Clarence, thomas it. Didn't,

870
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:16,960
Speaker 5: fortunately people seem to understand For amy Colly rant that

871
00:49:16,960 --> 00:49:19,640
Speaker 5: that was. Unlikely at the end of the. Day of,

872
00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:22,279
Speaker 5: course she still does her. Damage at the end of the,

873
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:26,560
Speaker 5: day her being on that court doesn't, Matter, yeah doesn't.

874
00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:30,280
Speaker 5: Matter it really just helps to legitimize the anti woman

875
00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:31,960
Speaker 5: agenda that's playing out.

876
00:49:31,800 --> 00:49:35,120
Speaker 1: There right right, Right and you Have thomas doing the

877
00:49:35,160 --> 00:49:38,360
Speaker 1: same with the same Right so, clearly like one of

878
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:42,399
Speaker 1: the big failings of second wave feminism was the inability

879
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:48,240
Speaker 1: to imagine that being woman was different for different groups of, people,

880
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:51,200
Speaker 1: right and that you would have different, challenges and that

881
00:49:51,239 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 1: they and those different challenges would need different. Solutions now

882
00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:58,799
Speaker 1: we're in a moment Where trump has really clearly there

883
00:49:58,840 --> 00:50:01,440
Speaker 1: was a lot of progress. Coming So Donald, trump you,

884
00:50:01,440 --> 00:50:04,160
Speaker 1: know became this sort of vehicle for a pushback of.

885
00:50:04,239 --> 00:50:07,880
Speaker 1: Progress you don't get a backlash like this unless there's.

886
00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:09,160
Speaker 3: Progress serious forward.

887
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:12,160
Speaker 1: Momentum, yeah so what do you think of the next? Move?

888
00:50:12,280 --> 00:50:15,200
Speaker 3: Is, oh, gosh you, know people has me all the.

889
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:20,239
Speaker 5: Time so my standard response, is you, KNOW i can't call.

890
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:23,480
Speaker 5: IT i can't call it because we are we are

891
00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:27,319
Speaker 5: living a history that we've lived before in, which you, know,

892
00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:32,000
Speaker 5: like let's let's take. Reconstruction we had eight years a

893
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:36,520
Speaker 5: forward momentum towards really creating an inclusive. Democracy we had

894
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:38,960
Speaker 5: a retrenchment period that lasted seven.

895
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:41,200
Speaker 3: Decades Jesus, christ seven.

896
00:50:41,280 --> 00:50:45,560
Speaker 5: Decades so you, know this is clearly a one to

897
00:50:45,640 --> 00:50:49,440
Speaker 5: two steps forward twenty steps, back you, know kind of

898
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:53,520
Speaker 5: momentum that we've had in our. Society and the case

899
00:50:53,560 --> 00:50:59,760
Speaker 5: that was just Decided wednesday is absolutely, devastating not only

900
00:50:59,840 --> 00:51:03,800
Speaker 5: to The Voting Rights act, itself but to this idea

901
00:51:03,880 --> 00:51:07,280
Speaker 5: that there are imperatives that came out of that movement

902
00:51:07,480 --> 00:51:10,200
Speaker 5: that we still all sign on. To that that is

903
00:51:10,440 --> 00:51:14,080
Speaker 5: actually what is disintegrating in front of our. Eyes and

904
00:51:14,239 --> 00:51:18,520
Speaker 5: while that disintegration is. Happening there is ambivalence on the

905
00:51:18,600 --> 00:51:21,960
Speaker 5: part of progressives about how much to fight for those in.

906
00:51:22,080 --> 00:51:24,600
Speaker 5: Pair it where we can still say the words that

907
00:51:24,640 --> 00:51:25,600
Speaker 5: we used to, Say.

908
00:51:25,560 --> 00:51:28,120
Speaker 1: Like if you think About, mississippi, right that's a state

909
00:51:28,320 --> 00:51:33,320
Speaker 1: that should have black senators or at least not white racist.

910
00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:36,840
Speaker 1: SENATORS eli, right at the very. LEAST i, mean that's a,

911
00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:40,359
Speaker 1: state is a, mean it's a majority block. State, yeah

912
00:51:40,400 --> 00:51:42,880
Speaker 1: so what the fuck is going? On i'm, SORRY i

913
00:51:42,880 --> 00:51:45,080
Speaker 1: don't mean to, curse but it's, just you, KNOW.

914
00:51:45,640 --> 00:51:48,239
Speaker 5: I think those are appropriate words for this moment to

915
00:51:48,320 --> 00:51:48,759
Speaker 5: tell you the.

916
00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:50,880
Speaker 3: Truth you, know here's the shocking.

917
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:56,839
Speaker 5: Reality mississippi has always been a minority rule. State when

918
00:51:56,880 --> 00:52:00,600
Speaker 5: we look at the former slave, states many of, states

919
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:05,239
Speaker 5: and clearly some of the sub political divisions were always

920
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:09,520
Speaker 5: about how to maintain power in white hands over and

921
00:52:09,600 --> 00:52:14,040
Speaker 5: against majorities or near majorities of black. People what was

922
00:52:14,080 --> 00:52:17,120
Speaker 5: so brilliant about The Voting Rights act is that it

923
00:52:17,239 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 5: anticipated that that instinct to try to maintain control would

924
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:26,200
Speaker 5: find mechanisms and. Tactics as soon as one got struck,

925
00:52:26,239 --> 00:52:28,600
Speaker 5: down they'd come up with another, one and another one

926
00:52:28,640 --> 00:52:29,160
Speaker 5: and another.

927
00:52:29,239 --> 00:52:31,160
Speaker 3: One what The Voting Rights act.

928
00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:33,960
Speaker 5: Said is we're not going to outlaw or name any

929
00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:37,560
Speaker 5: specific things that they can't. Do we're going to say

930
00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:41,320
Speaker 5: that what you cannot do is undermine the voting power

931
00:52:41,640 --> 00:52:46,560
Speaker 5: of these substantial. Populations and because of those, protections that's.

932
00:52:46,360 --> 00:52:48,400
Speaker 3: Why we had so many elected.

933
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:51,680
Speaker 5: Officials that's why we had the ability of people In

934
00:52:51,719 --> 00:52:56,319
Speaker 5: mississippi And louisiana to elect someone of their. Choice it

935
00:52:56,440 --> 00:52:59,480
Speaker 5: is because of the effectiveness of The Voting Rights act

936
00:52:59,520 --> 00:53:02,960
Speaker 5: that there was such a desire to get rid of.

937
00:53:03,040 --> 00:53:07,040
Speaker 5: It as you AND i are talking right, now in those,

938
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:09,799
Speaker 5: states they've gotten the green light OR i like to,

939
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:12,399
Speaker 5: say you, know, yeha, boys let's go at.

940
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:13,839
Speaker 3: It and they're going at.

941
00:53:13,880 --> 00:53:19,080
Speaker 5: It they're suspending, elections they're redrawing districts because they know

942
00:53:19,239 --> 00:53:22,920
Speaker 5: that there's not a substantial pushback to the erasure of

943
00:53:23,040 --> 00:53:27,400
Speaker 5: black political power and black. Presence that's what we've shown

944
00:53:27,600 --> 00:53:30,319
Speaker 5: over the last two years that we're not going to

945
00:53:30,360 --> 00:53:34,400
Speaker 5: the mat to fight over these. Things my only hope

946
00:53:34,440 --> 00:53:38,319
Speaker 5: is that the devastation From calais impacts so many other

947
00:53:38,520 --> 00:53:42,759
Speaker 5: interests that they're finally is this fire and desire to

948
00:53:43,120 --> 00:53:47,400
Speaker 5: name the problem of racism and white supremacy and, Politics

949
00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:52,600
Speaker 5: White christian nationalism in our cultural, politics and there comes

950
00:53:52,640 --> 00:53:55,279
Speaker 5: out of that a commitment to fight. It but that's

951
00:53:55,280 --> 00:53:57,759
Speaker 5: WHY i can't call it BECAUSE i look at some

952
00:53:57,840 --> 00:54:00,719
Speaker 5: of my allies and it's almost the last thing they

953
00:54:00,760 --> 00:54:02,600
Speaker 5: want to talk about rather than the first.

954
00:54:02,600 --> 00:54:05,640
Speaker 1: Thing you really do see, that, like were you registering

955
00:54:05,680 --> 00:54:09,279
Speaker 1: voters In? Mississippi this is a problem that should be

956
00:54:09,360 --> 00:54:14,080
Speaker 1: solved by righting the wrong that is black voter, disenfranchisement, Right,

957
00:54:14,160 --> 00:54:16,279
Speaker 1: like that's what, this you, know if you want to

958
00:54:16,280 --> 00:54:18,520
Speaker 1: solve this, problem you solve this problem by registering those,

959
00:54:18,560 --> 00:54:22,400
Speaker 1: voters and then you don't have any of these senators In.

960
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:24,759
Speaker 1: Mississippi you have the real people who live.

961
00:54:24,840 --> 00:54:27,680
Speaker 5: There, well they can't vote an election in which they

962
00:54:27,719 --> 00:54:30,760
Speaker 5: have an opportunity to actually elect someone of their choice

963
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:34,720
Speaker 5: because of all the gerrymandering and. Rigging we are told

964
00:54:34,800 --> 00:54:38,279
Speaker 5: that to actually address that problem is to create the.

965
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:43,480
Speaker 5: Problem so addressing racism is racism. Itself they've been able

966
00:54:43,520 --> 00:54:46,359
Speaker 5: to screw us with that framework for the last ten,

967
00:54:46,520 --> 00:54:49,120
Speaker 5: years and now the chicken has really come home to.

968
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:52,000
Speaker 1: Roost thank, you thank, you thank, you thank.

969
00:54:52,040 --> 00:54:53,719
Speaker 3: You this my, leasure.

970
00:54:55,640 --> 00:54:57,239
Speaker 4: No, Moment.

971
00:54:58,840 --> 00:55:02,920
Speaker 2: Jesse Canna, By we're just talking About Nancy mason the

972
00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:06,439
Speaker 2: intro this. Podcast this is actually. Interesting she's pushed so

973
00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:09,680
Speaker 2: that we have newly released documents that reveal we've paid

974
00:55:09,719 --> 00:55:12,640
Speaker 2: out more than three hundred thousand dollars in taxpayer funded

975
00:55:12,680 --> 00:55:14,719
Speaker 2: sexual harassment subtlements involving our.

976
00:55:14,760 --> 00:55:19,239
Speaker 1: Wallmakers what are the interesting things happening right now, is

977
00:55:19,360 --> 00:55:22,320
Speaker 1: even though we are in this moment of complete fuck

978
00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:25,440
Speaker 1: right when it comes to our rights and The american,

979
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:30,960
Speaker 1: government there are small moves towards progress and it's. Wild

980
00:55:31,200 --> 00:55:34,080
Speaker 1: so what's happened here is there are three women In

981
00:55:34,200 --> 00:55:39,520
Speaker 1: congress who are complete, lunatics but who are focused on

982
00:55:39,520 --> 00:55:43,800
Speaker 1: one good. Thing and they Are Nancy mays And Lauren

983
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:50,399
Speaker 1: beaupert And Appaulina, luna AND i would not trust them

984
00:55:50,440 --> 00:55:54,320
Speaker 1: with anything except. This the three of them are working

985
00:55:54,360 --> 00:55:58,440
Speaker 1: together to try to expose the culture of sexism and

986
00:55:58,719 --> 00:56:03,520
Speaker 1: all of this sort of terrible stuff that is going

987
00:56:03,600 --> 00:56:08,480
Speaker 1: on with women and sexual. Harassment and, look it's good

988
00:56:08,560 --> 00:56:11,600
Speaker 1: that they're doing, it AND i think it's. GOOD i

989
00:56:11,680 --> 00:56:15,680
Speaker 1: think you have to be really suspicious of whatever this

990
00:56:15,880 --> 00:56:18,160
Speaker 1: crew is doing it with the exception of, THIS i

991
00:56:18,160 --> 00:56:21,759
Speaker 1: actlutely think this is. Good So i'm really glad to

992
00:56:21,880 --> 00:56:25,160
Speaker 1: see this, happening AND i think this is, good and,

993
00:56:25,640 --> 00:56:27,680
Speaker 1: like there was a really good piece written about this

994
00:56:27,719 --> 00:56:29,680
Speaker 1: By Annie karney and The New York. Times i'm a

995
00:56:29,680 --> 00:56:32,880
Speaker 1: Big Annie karney. Fan she Covers congress really, well but

996
00:56:32,960 --> 00:56:36,279
Speaker 1: she's also just it's a very nuanced thing to have

997
00:56:36,560 --> 00:56:40,600
Speaker 1: members Of congress who are both for the good and

998
00:56:40,760 --> 00:56:45,600
Speaker 1: also kind of. Kooky and so it's a really nuanced.

999
00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:49,160
Speaker 1: Piece it's worth, reading and it's worth digesting that this

1000
00:56:49,320 --> 00:56:53,880
Speaker 1: is a sort of weird step forward for us As american.

1001
00:56:53,960 --> 00:57:01,920
Speaker 1: Women that's it for this episode Of Fast. Politics tune In, Monday, Wednesday,

1002
00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:06,640
Speaker 1: thursday And saturday to hear the best minds and politics

1003
00:57:06,719 --> 00:57:10,319
Speaker 1: make sense of all this. Chaos if you enjoy this,

1004
00:57:10,400 --> 00:57:14,320
Speaker 1: podcast please send it to a friend and keep the conversation.

1005
00:57:14,480 --> 00:57:16,360
Speaker 1: Going thanks for. Listening