1 00:00:03,680 --> 00:00:09,160 Speaker 1: I'm t T and I'm Zakiah, and this is Dope Labs. 2 00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:14,600 Speaker 1: Welcome to Dope Labs, a weekly podcast that mixes hardcore 3 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:17,639 Speaker 1: science with pop culture and a healthy dose of friendship. 4 00:00:22,520 --> 00:00:24,400 Speaker 1: Should we say Happy New Year? I don't know? Is 5 00:00:24,440 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 1: it too late? I feel like, what's the rules? I 6 00:00:27,120 --> 00:00:28,720 Speaker 1: saw something to say that after the eighth you're not 7 00:00:28,760 --> 00:00:36,519 Speaker 1: supposed to. Oh, well, I've been messing up relate. Okay, 8 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:38,840 Speaker 1: Well I won't say Happy New Year. I'm just gonna 9 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:43,120 Speaker 1: say it's a new year. It's January. It's January, and 10 00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:46,120 Speaker 1: our calendar year has changed. It has That's right. 11 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:49,480 Speaker 2: And listen, we've been away for a while, been getting 12 00:00:49,479 --> 00:00:52,519 Speaker 2: some reruns that I think are important to hear in 13 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:55,800 Speaker 2: a new year. But we're back with a grab bag, 14 00:00:55,880 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 2: and today's grab back has ranged. 15 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:01,520 Speaker 1: Yes, honey, we going over it all, everything that you've 16 00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:03,160 Speaker 1: been like. I wonder if teen's the key you're going 17 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:11,160 Speaker 1: to talk about this? Yes, it is here, Yes, today, Yes, today, 18 00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:16,160 Speaker 1: Let's start with Venezuela first. Yes, Oh my goodness. So 19 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:21,640 Speaker 1: we know that the US government went into Venezuela, captured 20 00:01:21,680 --> 00:01:25,119 Speaker 1: their current president and brought him back here. 21 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:30,240 Speaker 2: It's given homeland it's given political thriller, but also it's 22 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:32,880 Speaker 2: giving history book, and so. 23 00:01:34,400 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 1: We've talked about this TT. 24 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 2: I think what this is revealed for me is just 25 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:41,880 Speaker 2: how weak my like geopolitical knowledge is. 26 00:01:41,800 --> 00:01:45,440 Speaker 1: Absolutely because I was like, why what's going on? I 27 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 1: don't understand. That was like the first questions that popped 28 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:51,720 Speaker 1: into my head, like why are we doing this? Why 29 00:01:51,720 --> 00:01:54,080 Speaker 1: are we doing this now? If he was a problem, 30 00:01:54,080 --> 00:01:56,120 Speaker 1: hasn't he always been a problem? And we have like 31 00:01:56,200 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 1: there was just so many questions and not enough answers. 32 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:02,640 Speaker 2: And I think we had to do the digging. So 33 00:02:03,040 --> 00:02:05,880 Speaker 2: now you don't have to. Let's just give folks a 34 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 2: fast timeline, I think, so they have some context now. 35 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:12,120 Speaker 2: A lot of people start the clock in nineteen fourteen 36 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:15,520 Speaker 2: because that was when Venezuela had its first big oil weal, 37 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:19,600 Speaker 2: but there's history before that. In Venezuela. The indigenous peoples 38 00:02:19,639 --> 00:02:22,680 Speaker 2: there used oil and asphalts, so from like natural places 39 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:24,840 Speaker 2: or what they call like seeps where you can get 40 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:27,000 Speaker 2: access to it without drilling. They were using that for 41 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:30,639 Speaker 2: purposes like waterproofing fuel, and it was also thought that 42 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:33,160 Speaker 2: there were medicinal purposes, and so they were using it 43 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:36,680 Speaker 2: in medicinal ways, and that was adopted by colonizers that 44 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:39,679 Speaker 2: later came to Venezuela in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries. 45 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:43,200 Speaker 2: So oil has been around and has been known about 46 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:46,320 Speaker 2: and used in Venezuela since the sixteenth and seventeenth century 47 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:47,000 Speaker 2: and before then. 48 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:49,760 Speaker 1: So it's a part of their culture and a part 49 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:53,799 Speaker 1: of their national history and story. Yes, in nineteen twenty eight, 50 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:59,320 Speaker 1: Venezuela became the world's top oil exporter. Yeah, so now 51 00:02:59,320 --> 00:03:02,080 Speaker 1: there are foreign he's involved. And around nineteen forty three, 52 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 1: the Venezuelan government claimed fifty percent of the profits. I 53 00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:11,040 Speaker 1: don't blame them, right, because there's a lot of money there. Okay. 54 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:13,920 Speaker 1: If you fast forward to nineteen fifty eight, there was 55 00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:18,640 Speaker 1: more state share and no new concessions to outside oil companies. 56 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:22,360 Speaker 2: So when I was reading about this, I was like, Hey, 57 00:03:22,440 --> 00:03:25,400 Speaker 2: if I'm Venezuela, I'm not gonna let y'all milk all 58 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:28,400 Speaker 2: the profits off of my land, exactly. And so by 59 00:03:28,480 --> 00:03:31,799 Speaker 2: nineteen seventy five to nineteen seventy six, Venezuela said, hey, 60 00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:34,560 Speaker 2: y'all get on out of here. We we're gonna take over. 61 00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 2: And so like they had their own kind of company. 62 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:41,160 Speaker 2: It's the PDVSA, and it's like petrol to Venezuela. You 63 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 2: know my Spanish, you know, none of my stuff is 64 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 2: right there, but you speak Japanese. 65 00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:47,520 Speaker 1: She do, y'all? 66 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,600 Speaker 2: She do so shady. I don't care if people know. 67 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 2: I was a president of the Japanese club in high school. 68 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 2: Now my Japanese has fallen off since then, but I 69 00:03:54,840 --> 00:04:01,160 Speaker 2: still claim it. So nineteen seventy five, Venezuela takes and 70 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:03,960 Speaker 2: they're like, hey, we can do this on our own. 71 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 2: But by the nineties they're reaching out to private partners 72 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:09,240 Speaker 2: for heavy oil. 73 00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:13,440 Speaker 1: So crude oil is the raw material, and it is 74 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:18,279 Speaker 1: a naturally occurring yellowish black liquid found underground in reservoir. 75 00:04:18,880 --> 00:04:24,599 Speaker 1: So again that is unprocessed and raw material. What petroleum is. 76 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,720 Speaker 1: It is a broad category that encompasses crude oil. And 77 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:33,240 Speaker 1: so you have crude oil, the unprocessed form that is petroleum. 78 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:37,760 Speaker 1: You have natural gas, which is often found in crude oil. 79 00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:42,040 Speaker 1: Then you have petroleum products, so that's refined crude oil 80 00:04:42,120 --> 00:04:45,880 Speaker 1: that gives you gasoline, jet fuel, diesel, heating oil, asphault, 81 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:49,159 Speaker 1: and plastics. And so we call all of these fossil 82 00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:52,520 Speaker 1: fuels because they're from the ground and they're actually made 83 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 1: from fossilized materials, so fossilized plants and animals, and that's 84 00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:59,680 Speaker 1: where we get that oil from. So even within crude oils, 85 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:02,280 Speaker 1: there's heavy crude oil and then there's light crude oil. 86 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:05,800 Speaker 1: Heavy crude oil is more viscous, so it's thicker. The 87 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:09,560 Speaker 1: higher the viscosity, the thicker the liquid. Light crude oil 88 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:12,640 Speaker 1: is thinner, so it has a lower viscosity. And refineries 89 00:05:12,760 --> 00:05:15,560 Speaker 1: run on a mix of crude oils to run efficiently 90 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:19,080 Speaker 1: and have maximum output. And the statistics says that nearly 91 00:05:19,160 --> 00:05:24,160 Speaker 1: seventy percent of US refining capacity runs most efficiently on 92 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 1: heavier crude oil. And that's why ninety percent of crude 93 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 1: oil imports into the United States are heavier than US 94 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:37,200 Speaker 1: produced SHLLE crude, and we get most of that from 95 00:05:37,279 --> 00:05:42,200 Speaker 1: Venezuela and Canada. Yes, exactly, and that's the reason why 96 00:05:42,360 --> 00:05:45,520 Speaker 1: it is such a big deal. Heavy oil requires a 97 00:05:45,560 --> 00:05:48,279 Speaker 1: lot for you to get it out. If somebody just 98 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:51,120 Speaker 1: takes over an oil well, there's still a lot of 99 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:54,599 Speaker 1: technology that has to be invested in keeping those kind 100 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:57,360 Speaker 1: of that drilling up. There's a lot of safety measurements 101 00:05:57,360 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 1: you need a lot of maintenance. You need skilled laborers, 102 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 1: you need all that. So Venezuela said, hey, we took 103 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:03,840 Speaker 1: over all this. Actually we want to move into these 104 00:06:03,880 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 1: other areas of the nation. We need help from outside 105 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:09,800 Speaker 1: investors to do that. And so they opened it back 106 00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:14,320 Speaker 1: up to private partners, right, and then we enter into 107 00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:17,800 Speaker 1: the Hugo Chavez era in nineteen ninety eight, and he 108 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 1: uses the PDVSA, you know what Takia was talking about. 109 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:25,520 Speaker 1: That took over and he uses that money to fund 110 00:06:25,680 --> 00:06:29,960 Speaker 1: social programs. And what that does is that it creates 111 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:33,800 Speaker 1: a lot of tension and tension spike. And in two 112 00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:37,080 Speaker 1: thousand and two there was a massive strike. All production 113 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:40,839 Speaker 1: stalled and Hugo Chavez, the president of the time, fired 114 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:46,360 Speaker 1: eighteen thousand workers and packed the PDVSA with his loyalists. 115 00:06:46,839 --> 00:06:50,600 Speaker 1: He said, you have an objection, get out of here. Right, 116 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:52,640 Speaker 1: I'm gonna just bring in all my friends. They're gonna 117 00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:53,680 Speaker 1: do what I say. Hmm. 118 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 2: But then by two thousand and seven, the government forces 119 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 2: those foreign firms that were there to their stakes. They're like, 120 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:02,359 Speaker 2: all right, we got a little help from y'all. Now 121 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 2: y'all get out of here. So Conicco Phillips and Exon Mobile. 122 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:08,360 Speaker 2: They get out of there, but they know them. 123 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:12,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, we know them. But they also sue because they're like, hey, 124 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:15,040 Speaker 1: we had a contract or, we said we were gonna 125 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:16,840 Speaker 1: be here investing in this much. We spent a lot 126 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:19,800 Speaker 1: of money here and that became a problem. And later 127 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:21,680 Speaker 1: they were awarded billions, but I think some of the 128 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 1: issues that they weren't able to recoup a lot of 129 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:27,080 Speaker 1: those funds. Who is they in that situation? The foreign 130 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:30,640 Speaker 1: companies that we know Exxon and Conicco, Phillips. So now 131 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:34,600 Speaker 1: we're in twenty fourteen to twenty seventeen. Moduro, the Maduro 132 00:07:34,680 --> 00:07:36,680 Speaker 1: that we have now captured and brought back to the 133 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 1: United States, became president in twenty thirteen. Twenty thirteen. That's 134 00:07:40,800 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 1: a long time to be president if you're thinking, you know, 135 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:46,880 Speaker 1: up to twenty twenty five, and then there's a big 136 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:52,680 Speaker 1: crash and global prices tank for oil, and the PDVSA 137 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:56,560 Speaker 1: was already cash strapped, and so in twenty seventeen, the 138 00:07:56,760 --> 00:08:02,200 Speaker 1: US sanctions officials and the PDVSA over repression and Maduro's 139 00:08:02,240 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 1: power graph. 140 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:05,800 Speaker 2: Now, I think this is interesting that the US was 141 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:10,320 Speaker 2: sanctioning them because that repression that they're talking about is 142 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:14,680 Speaker 2: contested elections, power consolidation, intimidating the media. 143 00:08:14,920 --> 00:08:16,120 Speaker 1: Doesn't that sound familiar? 144 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:21,120 Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, Oh my goodness, pattern recognition, So you know, 145 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:24,640 Speaker 2: that was interesting. But when we keep going past twenty 146 00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:28,360 Speaker 2: seventeen and into the early twenty twenties, we see the 147 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:34,439 Speaker 2: Venezuelan economy kind of nose diving. They're experiencing hyperinflation, food insecurity, 148 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:36,960 Speaker 2: and a health system collapse, and a lot of that 149 00:08:37,040 --> 00:08:39,920 Speaker 2: is tied to them having historic lows in oil output 150 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:41,840 Speaker 2: because a lot of the funds were coming from there, 151 00:08:42,080 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 2: and they're also having power failures and that affects drilling 152 00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:48,680 Speaker 2: and oil rigs in its own way. So that's what 153 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:50,240 Speaker 2: we see moving into the twenty twenties. 154 00:08:50,320 --> 00:08:52,960 Speaker 1: Then we are almost present day. So twenty twenty five, 155 00:08:53,559 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 1: there is a pivot. The Trump administration ramps up military 156 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:01,840 Speaker 1: presence in the Caribbean, and this sends a signal that 157 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 1: they have an intent to push Moduro out of his 158 00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:06,199 Speaker 1: presidential seat. 159 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:12,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, and January seventh, after Maduro is captured, US officials 160 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 2: basically say, hey, this is our plan to effectively run 161 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:21,680 Speaker 2: Venezuela's oil sales. They say outright, like this is about oil, 162 00:09:22,000 --> 00:09:25,440 Speaker 2: and Trump says that US companies are going to invest 163 00:09:25,480 --> 00:09:29,280 Speaker 2: billions in Venezuela. They're going to rebuild the infrastructure and 164 00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:32,840 Speaker 2: make money. Now I think that's interesting because that's easy 165 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:33,559 Speaker 2: to say. 166 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 1: And very hard to do. To remove a president, regardless 167 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:56,959 Speaker 1: of your feelings about his presidency, to remove a president 168 00:09:56,960 --> 00:10:00,800 Speaker 1: from a country, we'll send that country into a tailspin. 169 00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:04,240 Speaker 1: Like there's so much political imbalance. Now, this is all 170 00:10:04,320 --> 00:10:09,000 Speaker 1: very interesting because it is all about power and these 171 00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:12,680 Speaker 1: large displays of power. So like to go in and 172 00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:15,680 Speaker 1: capture somebody, to capture a president of a country, like 173 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:19,440 Speaker 1: when you do that show of power and force and violence, 174 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: even though they show like okay images of him, like 175 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:24,120 Speaker 1: here's proof of life. All you know, there were some 176 00:10:24,160 --> 00:10:26,719 Speaker 1: people on the internet given and conspiracy theories and they 177 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:29,520 Speaker 1: were like, hey, who has three outfit changes? I think 178 00:10:29,559 --> 00:10:32,480 Speaker 1: there were a lot of plot twists even since then. 179 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:34,400 Speaker 1: So did you see the press conference where I don't 180 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:36,280 Speaker 1: know if you used to get caught passing notes in class, 181 00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:38,240 Speaker 1: but basically somebody passed a note of Trump and he 182 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:39,960 Speaker 1: raised his hand and read it out loud. Basically that 183 00:10:40,040 --> 00:10:41,680 Speaker 1: was the effectively what happened. 184 00:10:42,120 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 2: And in that same press conference, though, an representative from 185 00:10:46,120 --> 00:10:50,720 Speaker 2: Exion said that Venezuela is uninvestable. And I think this 186 00:10:50,800 --> 00:10:55,680 Speaker 2: is really interesting because there's a lot of science behind 187 00:10:55,679 --> 00:11:00,720 Speaker 2: all of this. Since we've been producing dope labs the 188 00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:02,720 Speaker 2: thing I have seen even though I knew it, like 189 00:11:02,760 --> 00:11:04,959 Speaker 2: when we said it, like there's science everywhere. There's a 190 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:07,040 Speaker 2: lot of science to this, And so when they talk 191 00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:10,199 Speaker 2: about things being when they talk about Venezuela being uninvestable, 192 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:12,200 Speaker 2: from Exxon's perspective, they're probably like. 193 00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:13,640 Speaker 1: We got burned before. 194 00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:15,839 Speaker 2: We spent billions there, and how are you going to 195 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 2: make sure you enforce this stuff in the countries that 196 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:21,280 Speaker 2: are like the top producers for all you'll find the 197 00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:24,160 Speaker 2: United States involved in the politics there, you know what 198 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:24,520 Speaker 2: I'm saying. 199 00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:28,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's a little interesting to me because this 200 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 1: current administration ran on quote unquote America first and not 201 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:39,360 Speaker 1: being involved in international disputes or being involved internationally really 202 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:42,320 Speaker 1: at all, Like we have retreated from a lot of 203 00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:47,160 Speaker 1: international engagements. But then we are going into another country, yeah, 204 00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:51,400 Speaker 1: and removing their president. Yes, it's very very contradictory to 205 00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:53,840 Speaker 1: what he said that he was running on. 206 00:11:54,440 --> 00:11:56,760 Speaker 2: I think it's also really interesting. One of the things 207 00:11:56,800 --> 00:11:58,880 Speaker 2: you brought up is like, how upsetting. And when I 208 00:11:58,920 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 2: say upsetting, I mean yes, emotionally upsetting, but the ripple 209 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:07,840 Speaker 2: effects of removing very disrupting, the disruption of this type 210 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 2: of removal, removing a president. And it I was like, 211 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:12,760 Speaker 2: we can think back to what it looked like. We 212 00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:14,880 Speaker 2: didn't even see the removal of a president. We didn't 213 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:17,160 Speaker 2: see a coup, but we saw the attempt of a 214 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:19,559 Speaker 2: coup January sixth, twenty twenty one. 215 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 1: You know, we've seen these big power grabs and how 216 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:26,480 Speaker 1: it makes people feel and how it destabilizes, like even 217 00:12:26,559 --> 00:12:29,680 Speaker 1: the kind of social fabric of a nation. And I 218 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:31,920 Speaker 1: think we don't even just to think about things that 219 00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:34,840 Speaker 1: are upsetting or violations of what we consider to be 220 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:38,680 Speaker 1: decorum or social contracts or how we govern. We don't 221 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:40,240 Speaker 1: even have to go all the way back to January sixth, 222 00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:43,160 Speaker 1: twenty twenty one. We can just go back to January 223 00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:47,840 Speaker 1: sixth this year, and if we pivot when we stayed stateside, 224 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:52,120 Speaker 1: like we saw Minnesota just become the center of one 225 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:56,600 Speaker 1: of the biggest immigration enforcements, having ICE there and we're 226 00:12:56,600 --> 00:13:00,400 Speaker 1: talking like thousands of agents descending on their city. And 227 00:13:00,760 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 1: that led to a fatal shooting of Renee Good exactly. 228 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:07,680 Speaker 1: Imagine you have all of these ICE agents coming to 229 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:10,960 Speaker 1: your city, some of them in unmarked vehicles, they're wearing 230 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:15,360 Speaker 1: their gear, their sirens, and there's so much more enforcement 231 00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:20,160 Speaker 1: than you are used to. And so during one of 232 00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:24,280 Speaker 1: these ICE operations, a thirty seven year old US citizen, 233 00:13:24,559 --> 00:13:27,040 Speaker 1: Renee Good, was shot and killed by an ICE officer. 234 00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:30,120 Speaker 1: And there's a bunch of videos that capture the moments 235 00:13:30,400 --> 00:13:34,240 Speaker 1: before and after, who was doing, what, what was said, 236 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:38,360 Speaker 1: and now the evidence is under federal control and the 237 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:42,400 Speaker 1: state investigators say that complicates their work a lot. Yeah, 238 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:45,360 Speaker 1: I'll watch a lot of political thrillers and crime like. 239 00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:48,920 Speaker 1: I know that's fiction, but a lot of times it 240 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:50,480 Speaker 1: mimics the truth. 241 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:54,080 Speaker 2: And it's just like, who has jurisdiction over this? And 242 00:13:54,120 --> 00:13:56,000 Speaker 2: if it's in federal hands and we're saying, hey, this 243 00:13:56,160 --> 00:13:59,600 Speaker 2: was a federal operation that maybe went wrong, there feels 244 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:01,240 Speaker 2: like a comp ventrist, you know what I mean. 245 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 1: And you already have the federal government saying the ICE 246 00:14:04,280 --> 00:14:06,800 Speaker 1: agent did nothing wrong and that this is just what 247 00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:11,199 Speaker 1: happens when you are defiant, and it's like, but you're 248 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:15,040 Speaker 1: supposed to do an investigation How are you already coming 249 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:18,400 Speaker 1: to a conclusion without an investigation that doesn't make sense, 250 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:22,080 Speaker 1: that is unprecedented, that doesn't follow the methods that we 251 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:25,160 Speaker 1: say we uphold for sure. And so now you're having 252 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 1: some suits from the state, from the city of Minneapolis 253 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:31,400 Speaker 1: and Saint Paul, and they're saying this is like a 254 00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:36,320 Speaker 1: federal invasion basically causing this disruption. And so then they. 255 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 2: Had protests, spreading agents were deployed, tear gas, and so 256 00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 2: now this makes us consider like, where are the constitutional lines, 257 00:14:43,440 --> 00:14:45,400 Speaker 2: what is a tactic that is okay? How do we 258 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:48,240 Speaker 2: even address accountability when we have officers that are masked. 259 00:14:48,520 --> 00:14:50,760 Speaker 2: All I can think about is like, how does this 260 00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:52,560 Speaker 2: feel on the ground? 261 00:14:52,760 --> 00:14:52,920 Speaker 1: Right? 262 00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:54,840 Speaker 2: I hear a lot of people saying, like, I'm watching 263 00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 2: the news in this upsetting, which I totally get. But 264 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:00,240 Speaker 2: can you imagine if this is outside your door? I 265 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:01,240 Speaker 2: could not imagine. 266 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:05,560 Speaker 1: And it feels like so much bad happens in Minneapolis. 267 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:08,600 Speaker 1: The amount of anxiety that you would have moving around 268 00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:12,840 Speaker 1: that city, I would imagine is just so exponentially high. Yeah. 269 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:15,960 Speaker 2: I was watching some of the interviews right after Renee 270 00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:20,000 Speaker 2: Good was shot and killed, and there was a person 271 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 2: saying this feels like George Floyd in twenty twenty, you know, 272 00:15:23,880 --> 00:15:27,920 Speaker 2: all over again. But I'm like just thinking biologically, like 273 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:32,560 Speaker 2: the cortisol that must be coursing through your veins, the 274 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:35,080 Speaker 2: fight or flight always going off because you don't know 275 00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:39,240 Speaker 2: who's who or what's beyond this next traffic, Like, like, 276 00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:42,520 Speaker 2: what are going to be the lingering effects of that? 277 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:45,720 Speaker 2: You know, thinking about the loss of your loved ones, 278 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:48,760 Speaker 2: people in your community, your neighbors, people being taken just 279 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:52,360 Speaker 2: taken off the streets, out of their homes, like that 280 00:15:52,440 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 2: feels really scary. 281 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:10,840 Speaker 1: Again, We've talked about ripple effects. The ripple effects from 282 00:16:10,880 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 1: this will be felt for a very very long time. 283 00:16:14,200 --> 00:16:17,840 Speaker 1: It is so seeds of distrust of our government. It's 284 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:22,440 Speaker 1: so seeds of distrust of law enforcement and will feel 285 00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:26,080 Speaker 1: it across this country in our interactions with law enforcement 286 00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:29,440 Speaker 1: and our interactions with the government. And I really I 287 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:31,080 Speaker 1: feel like we would be remiss if we did not 288 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:34,040 Speaker 1: talk about Keith Porter, a black man who was killed 289 00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:37,360 Speaker 1: by an off duty ice officer on New Year's Eve. 290 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:40,760 Speaker 1: He hasn't made a lot of headlines, but I really 291 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:43,040 Speaker 1: just want to say his name and make sure that 292 00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:46,880 Speaker 1: Keith Porter we talk about getting justice for him. He 293 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:50,240 Speaker 1: was outside on New Year's Eve and his community one 294 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:54,120 Speaker 1: of the traditions is to shoot rounds into the sky 295 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:58,040 Speaker 1: and celebration. An off duty ice officer sees him with 296 00:16:58,120 --> 00:17:01,680 Speaker 1: a gun and kills him right there. It just doesn't 297 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:04,760 Speaker 1: seem right because all of the people of that community 298 00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 1: was saying, this is a normal thing that we do 299 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:10,199 Speaker 1: every single year for decades, and so it was just 300 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:13,600 Speaker 1: really really heart wrenching. This happened in la and I 301 00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:16,960 Speaker 1: think this just also speaks to understanding community and context. 302 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:18,840 Speaker 1: Exactly what we're seeing is people are being deployed to 303 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:21,000 Speaker 1: communities that they are not a part of, where you 304 00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:25,120 Speaker 1: lack context, where you lack an understanding of what is typical, 305 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:27,960 Speaker 1: and so you're responding to something and the atypical thing 306 00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:30,240 Speaker 1: is you. You are the variable, you know. 307 00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:34,600 Speaker 2: And then we have a person having their life taken 308 00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:37,639 Speaker 2: because of an action that you weren't even on duty, 309 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 2: wasn't even necessary, you know. And so I'm glad you 310 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:43,159 Speaker 2: did bring that up. And I think it also just 311 00:17:43,800 --> 00:17:46,240 Speaker 2: this feels like the same thing we just talked about 312 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:49,440 Speaker 2: when we see people in the media being targeted, when 313 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:55,560 Speaker 2: we see organizations not sharing their perspective for fear of 314 00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:59,560 Speaker 2: retribution or for fear of retaliation, but who's getting ready 315 00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:03,280 Speaker 2: to sanction us for repression? Because this feels like the 316 00:18:03,320 --> 00:18:07,680 Speaker 2: same things that made the US sanction Venezuela years ago. 317 00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:10,199 Speaker 2: I think, yes, there's some science behind all of this, 318 00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:13,199 Speaker 2: but also there's a lot of humanity there that and 319 00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:15,000 Speaker 2: so we're keeping our eyes on it. We hope you're 320 00:18:15,040 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 2: keeping your eyes on it too, and we're trying to 321 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:18,800 Speaker 2: be hopeful. 322 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:23,800 Speaker 1: And yes, yes, and part of being hopeful is being informed. Yes, 323 00:18:23,880 --> 00:18:26,560 Speaker 1: I know I fall victim to this too sometimes where 324 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:28,480 Speaker 1: it's just I just can't watch the news, I can't 325 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:32,840 Speaker 1: take this anymore. But we have to remain informed, know 326 00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:36,640 Speaker 1: what's going on, understand what that means for our personal 327 00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:39,639 Speaker 1: rights and what that means for us as global citizens 328 00:18:40,080 --> 00:18:42,320 Speaker 1: and how we move through this world. We have to 329 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:44,760 Speaker 1: fight back. We have to keep talking about it, because 330 00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:46,840 Speaker 1: that's what they hope is that we will get so 331 00:18:46,920 --> 00:18:50,919 Speaker 1: frustrated that we will stop talking. And we can't let 332 00:18:50,960 --> 00:18:58,679 Speaker 1: that happen. Yeah, for sure. You can find us on 333 00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:02,720 Speaker 1: x and Instagram at Dope Labs podcast. You can find 334 00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:08,720 Speaker 1: me ct on X threads and Instagram at dr Underscore 335 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:13,240 Speaker 1: t Sho and you can find Zakiya at Ze said so. 336 00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:17,680 Speaker 1: Dope Labs is a production of Lemonada Media. Our supervising 337 00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:22,119 Speaker 1: producer is Keegan Zemma. Dope Labs is sound designed, edited, 338 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 1: and mixed by James Sparber. Lemonada's Senior Vice President of 339 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:29,520 Speaker 1: Content and Production is Jackie Danziger. 340 00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:33,320 Speaker 2: Executive producer from iHeart Podcast is Katrina Norvil. 341 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:37,920 Speaker 1: Marketing lead is Alison Kanter. Original music composed and produced 342 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:42,240 Speaker 1: by Taka Yasuzawa and Alex suki Ura, with additional music 343 00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:47,040 Speaker 1: by Elijah Harvey. Dope Labs is executive produced by us 344 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:49,480 Speaker 1: T T Show Dia and Zakiah Wattley.