Speaker 1: Okay, I'm very excited for this episode of Sauce on
Speaker 1: the side. You know why why I'm talking to Andrew
Speaker 1: and Diamond. By the way, they're both.
Speaker 2: Here producers today.
Speaker 1: Hey, building a team. Guys, we're building a team.
Speaker 2: I love it. It's great.
Speaker 1: So today's guest is a guy named Milo Rossi, who
Speaker 1: is an archaeologist. You know what archaeologists do, Diamond.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they look at rocks.
Speaker 1: They do that a little.
Speaker 4: Thought.
Speaker 5: They like inspect rocks and like dig up old dark rocks.
Speaker 5: Shut up they Oh, okay, they dig up old rocks
Speaker 5: and inspect them.
Speaker 1: No, I'm sure that's part of the Andrew, would you
Speaker 1: like to chime in on what archaeologists do?
Speaker 5: You know?
Speaker 2: They uncover hidden history and they're well versed in history,
Speaker 2: and they do dig up rocks and artifacts and all
Speaker 2: these other things.
Speaker 3: Like dinosaur but yes, oh, here we go.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because Diamond has no belief that dinosaurs actually existed, right.
Speaker 5: I just I have questions, and I don't really know
Speaker 5: what my questions are, but I have questions.
Speaker 3: Something doesn't work.
Speaker 1: I would like you to think of what your questions
Speaker 1: would be, because I really want you to ask him.
Speaker 2: I will remain set for this interview, specifically for that part,
Speaker 2: so well.
Speaker 1: Where your questions are, like both of you, if you
Speaker 1: guys have questions, because I have a billion, but I
Speaker 1: feel like I'm coming from a place where I accept
Speaker 1: a lot of the information that they present and Diamond doesn't.
Speaker 1: So I just want you to ask your questions so
Speaker 1: that you can have clarity in one direction or the other.
Speaker 5: Yeah, sure, I think it's I think this is a setup,
Speaker 5: but you know what, I'm just gonna roll with it.
Speaker 5: And I can't wait.
Speaker 3: Have you setting you up for I don't.
Speaker 5: Know, to make me look dumb? What happened the last
Speaker 5: time the dinosaurs.
Speaker 2: Are actually real?
Speaker 6: Were you there?
Speaker 4: Was I?
Speaker 2: There were you the billions of years ago? No? I wasn't.
Speaker 3: I was, and nobody alive right now was.
Speaker 1: So let's just I don't know if I believe in reincarnation,
Speaker 1: and I think I have raptor like tendencies. I think
Speaker 1: I might have been there, all right.
Speaker 2: I think maybe mention that to him. I love the
Speaker 2: way he tears down all the history. I'm so excited
Speaker 2: for this one. Oh.
Speaker 1: By the way, Hi, I'm Gandhi. This this is my
Speaker 1: podcast on the side with my friends Diamond and Andrew
Speaker 1: Aka also my producers. I think, have you ever seen
Speaker 1: the skeleton of a bunny?
Speaker 3: No, who's seen a skeleton of a bunny?
Speaker 1: Pull it up here. I'm gonna tell you something. The
Speaker 1: skeleton of a bunny. It looks terrifying. And I think
Speaker 1: that we have these ideas of what dinosaurs look like.
Speaker 1: Look at that. Look at that. That's terrifying.
Speaker 3: You would not that is terrifying.
Speaker 1: That's a dinosaur. No, that's a bunny.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 1: So I just want to know how we know that
Speaker 1: these things looked so lizardy when we clearly say that
Speaker 1: their closest living relative is a bird. How would they
Speaker 1: not be giant, massive like big birds running around?
Speaker 3: We don't know, that's my point.
Speaker 1: But they were still dinosaurs.
Speaker 5: What if they weren't really dinosaurs? What if they were
Speaker 5: just birds? But I don't I'd still be done.
Speaker 1: When there were sixty five million year old birds that
Speaker 1: were dinosaurs, like a pterodactyl.
Speaker 3: We don't know because we weren't there.
Speaker 2: The new Jurassic Park actually changed the raptor design to
Speaker 2: be more like what you're saying, more bird like, because
Speaker 2: it has become I think they would be giant birdy,
Speaker 2: weird things like talent.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know, hair, feathers, fur, A lot of
Speaker 1: that stuff doesn't necessarily get preserved the way a bone does,
Speaker 1: so all you have to go on is a skeleton.
Speaker 1: So these things could have looked completely different. And I
Speaker 1: just want to know how we know that they look
Speaker 1: so terrifying. That's all Diamond is rolling her eyes. You
Speaker 1: can't hear that. Sorry the microphone.
Speaker 3: I'm so into this.
Speaker 6: Yeah, okay, let me ask you this.
Speaker 1: Who would you like to have on as a guest
Speaker 1: that would interest you?
Speaker 3: Bethany Frankel.
Speaker 1: I knew she was gonna say, a freaking housewife. Do
Speaker 1: you think we can get Bethany Frankle?
Speaker 5: I could try, Okay, Carol rads A, Well, now you
Speaker 5: think I would? I think you'd love her? Oh my god,
Speaker 5: maybe Carol. She's done podcasts before, but I think she's
Speaker 5: friends with them. But you're a smart woman. She loves
Speaker 5: smart women.
Speaker 4: Come on, Carol.
Speaker 1: All right, so we're gonna go from an archaeologist to
Speaker 1: Carol Ratswell maybe at some point, perfect, But before we
Speaker 1: do anything else, I think we should have our friend
Speaker 1: Mila Rossi come in so we can just get right
Speaker 1: to it.
Speaker 3: Okay, Hi, great to meet you, to meet me.
Speaker 5: Oh well, let's hope that we feel the same way
Speaker 5: about each other when you're leaving.
Speaker 4: Absolutely absolutely, we're discussing, you know, opinions and things. That's
Speaker 4: nothing personal.
Speaker 1: Okay, So here we go. He's here, Milo Rossi. By
Speaker 1: the way, thank you so much for joining me. I
Speaker 1: know you're really busy and you've had like twenty stops
Speaker 1: and we were trying to go back and forth about
Speaker 1: when we could get you in here, and you're here.
Speaker 4: It's wonderful to be here. Thank you very much for
Speaker 4: having me. It really is an honor to be in
Speaker 4: the big Apple.
Speaker 6: Oh that's nice.
Speaker 1: Yeah, stay here for like five for minutes, and you'll
Speaker 1: be wanting to get the hell out.
Speaker 4: I gotta say, the twenty minute walk it took me
Speaker 4: to get here was a test. I bet, I know,
Speaker 4: I bet.
Speaker 1: I have you here for so many reasons. So first
Speaker 1: of all, Milo Rossi has a very popular short series,
Speaker 1: and I watched a bunch of them called The Minute,
Speaker 1: Mini Minute Man. Yes, yes, okay.
Speaker 6: By the way.
Speaker 1: His background, he is an environmental scientist, an archaeologist, and
Speaker 1: now a science educator from Boston.
Speaker 6: Got it where I used to live.
Speaker 1: Love Boston represent I always say, like, the smartest people
Speaker 1: I think come from Boston also the mainest.
Speaker 4: It's a double edged sword.
Speaker 1: Smart and mean. So I have you here because I
Speaker 1: have a billion questions to ask you about a lot
Speaker 1: of different things, but also because I our lovely producer here, Diamond,
Speaker 1: who you were.
Speaker 6: Just saying hi to.
Speaker 1: Diamond has some things that she does not believe in,
Speaker 1: and it has to do specifically with your field.
Speaker 5: I just don't know if dinosaurs were actually real. Okay, okay,
Speaker 5: because I'll go through my list please. So number one,
Speaker 5: fossils literally just look like rocks, and so it's like, okay,
Speaker 5: well we could have been told that these are dinosaur bones,
Speaker 5: but they're not really, you know what I mean. Also
Speaker 5: number two, I think that people over exaggerate what they
Speaker 5: could have actually looked like, which makes me feel like,
Speaker 5: could somebody step in and tell us what they actually
Speaker 5: looked like rather, I mean repti and stuff like that,
Speaker 5: and like, were they actually that big? We go to
Speaker 5: museums and we see these huge things.
Speaker 1: And then also.
Speaker 5: Lastly, I know you're gonna rip me apart. It's fine
Speaker 5: here to you know, we don't know, like none of
Speaker 5: us were alive. There's not one photo or something like that.
Speaker 1: Oh no, no, sixty five million years ago.
Speaker 3: It's just like, we don't know.
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna throw this out here for a second.
Speaker 1: She will go back and forth about all of this dinosaurs.
Speaker 1: You know, we don't know that they existed, there's no proof,
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. But she wholeheartedly believes in God, and
Speaker 1: I say, oh, prove that, and she's like, just show
Speaker 1: I can't.
Speaker 5: But then also it's like I don't fault people for
Speaker 5: believe in dinosaurs. Are just not the same way the
Speaker 5: atheists don't believe in God.
Speaker 4: Okay, you know, I think that's another important thing is that,
Speaker 4: like I've had people on my channel ask me, you know, stuff.
Speaker 1: Like, ok, can you get closer to yeah?
Speaker 4: Sorry, no, no, no, no worries answer over podcast etiquette.
Speaker 4: You know. That's actually, you know, an interesting point. And
Speaker 4: I've had a lot of people on my channel ask me,
Speaker 4: you know, throughout the years of like, oh, do something
Speaker 4: like talking about God or the existence of God. And
Speaker 4: I'm like, no, like that has nothing to do like
Speaker 4: it's not a matter of you know, weighing the evidence
Speaker 4: or not weighing the evidence is like, if you believe
Speaker 4: in it, you believe in it, and I'm never going
Speaker 4: to try and take that away from you, Like that
Speaker 4: has nothing to do with you know, we're not trying
Speaker 4: to weigh these things. And the moment you do try
Speaker 4: and take that in, I think it kind of bastardizes
Speaker 4: what we're all here to talk about and the faith
Speaker 4: system that it sort of guides for you. As for dinosaurs,
Speaker 4: so to your first point kind of talking about how
Speaker 4: they look like rocks, the reason they look like rocks
Speaker 4: is because they are rocks. So there's no dinosaur bones
Speaker 4: left over. When a bone is buried, Normally these bones
Speaker 4: are found in sedimentary rock deposits, so something that was
Speaker 4: you know, flowing water at one point or something like that,
Speaker 4: and the bone gets buried and over time it mineralizes,
Speaker 4: so the bone structure, if it is replaced with rocks,
Speaker 4: this can lead to most of the time the bone
Speaker 4: bearing a very similar resemblance to the rock around it.
Speaker 4: You know, I want to kind of follow a question
Speaker 4: back to you. I hear what you're saying about, you know,
Speaker 4: they look like rocks. How do we really know? You know,
Speaker 4: how big they are. What would your explanation be if
Speaker 4: you were in you know, the fossil beds like the
Speaker 4: Hell Creek formation out west and you were looking at
Speaker 4: a Tyrannosaurus rex. What would your explanation be for how
Speaker 4: a rock would end up looking like that?
Speaker 7: I don't know, man, maybe like, uh, that's ancient.
Speaker 5: To be like, okay, the skull was smaller at one
Speaker 5: point and because now it's you just gave an explanation
Speaker 5: of the rocks. Now uh you said mineralizing, Yes, what
Speaker 5: if that caused it to like look bigger than it is?
Speaker 5: I don't know, listen, don't even I don't know.
Speaker 6: No, these are good questions. Do you want to ask
Speaker 6: if I'm just saying yeah.
Speaker 4: I think no. I think that's the other important thing is,
Speaker 4: you know a lot of what I do is, you know,
Speaker 4: it's a bit one sided because the people that I'm
Speaker 4: talking about can't talk back, and so you know, I
Speaker 4: have to do my stick and I have to you know,
Speaker 4: keep the engagement and all that. But really, I do
Speaker 4: think conversations like this are important and there are no
Speaker 4: you know, stupid questions, but you know, the because it's
Speaker 4: a replacement process where there is a existing bone that
Speaker 4: is deposited and then buried. Over time, it's replaced with something,
Speaker 4: so it doesn't actually really change the mass of it.
Speaker 4: It's sort of just you know, changing the existing structure
Speaker 4: into something else. And you know, honestly, questions like this
Speaker 4: are important to ask because those things are huge. It
Speaker 4: looks like something that is very alien to us. It's
Speaker 4: something that's kind of hard to wrap your head around,
Speaker 4: and so it's important to kind of understand the processes
Speaker 4: by which something like this happens, because without that, it
Speaker 4: almos seems a little bit unbelievable, you know, especially because
Speaker 4: there's no pictures exactly.
Speaker 1: So to Diamond's point, though, I mean, I know she
Speaker 1: was talking about things maybe getting bigger, but over time,
Speaker 1: if something is buried, even just a human body, doesn't
Speaker 1: it get a little bit smaller. Don't things eat at
Speaker 1: it and it actually shrinks. So maybe some of the
Speaker 1: stuff we're finding is actually smaller than what these things were.
Speaker 4: It could be, so a lot of what you see
Speaker 4: is over time, geologic forces will warp more than shrink.
Speaker 4: So you know, if you were to like deposit just
Speaker 4: a body on the ground, it would be like eaten
Speaker 4: and scavenged and things like that. But a lot of
Speaker 4: the remains that we find are you know, they've been
Speaker 4: buried over time and so there's not as much decomposition
Speaker 4: happening to the bones. So a lot of the specimens
Speaker 4: that we find are examples that have been you know,
Speaker 4: rapidly buried. When something just dies on the ground, it's eaten,
Speaker 4: it's scavenge and the bones are scattered. So a lot
Speaker 4: of bones that we find are of individuals that have
Speaker 4: fallen and sunk into a place where they're not going
Speaker 4: to be disturbed that much. That's why we find so
Speaker 4: many fossils of like marine deposits and things like that,
Speaker 4: because all these shells settle to the bottom and there's
Speaker 4: nothing to move them, and so makes a lot of sense. Yeah, exactly, exactly.
Speaker 4: So there's a really famous dinosaur fossil. I don't remember
Speaker 4: exactly what it's called, but it's of an Anklosaurus, which
Speaker 4: is one of the ones with an armored back and
Speaker 4: like a big heavy club on the tail that it
Speaker 4: would it would swing around, and it's beautiful. It almost
Speaker 4: looks like it's mummified because it's it's preserved the texture
Speaker 4: of the skin and so it was buried very rapidly
Speaker 4: and covered and over time because the earth moves and
Speaker 4: it's become stone. It's sort of like a little bit warped.
Speaker 4: It's the same size that it was. But it's one
Speaker 4: of the best dinosaur fossils we have, and it's one
Speaker 4: of the you know, first instances we have of you know,
Speaker 4: understanding what a dinosaur's actual skin texture was instead of
Speaker 4: just their bones.
Speaker 1: Okay, so that brings us to Diamond's other points and
Speaker 1: mine as well. I have a lot of questions as
Speaker 1: far as how we and by we, I mean you guys,
Speaker 1: the smart people who are doing this have reconstructed what
Speaker 1: a dinosaur actually looked like because as everything that we've
Speaker 1: learned more recently, their closest living ancestor would be a bird, right,
Speaker 1: not alligators and crocodiles, which everybody likes to call dinosaurs. Yes, birds,
Speaker 1: but hair feathers for that kind of stuff doesn't necessarily
Speaker 1: stand the test of time. Yeah, right, So how do
Speaker 1: we know? And when you look at this is my example,
Speaker 1: when you look at the skeleton of a rabbit or
Speaker 1: even maybe a little baby, it's terrifying. A skeleton is
Speaker 1: a terrifying looking thing. How do we know that these
Speaker 1: giant creatures that you guys are unearthing weren't actually like
Speaker 1: massive bunnies or a massive big bird looking thing. It
Speaker 1: was this terrifying lizard looking thing. How do we know that?
Speaker 1: Where did that come from?
Speaker 4: Well, that's a really good question. And I don't want
Speaker 4: to preface all of this by saying just in the
Speaker 4: field that I'm in, I'm not a paleontologist, so this
Speaker 4: is not coming from want. Okay, Yeah, I would give
Speaker 4: my most informed guests that I can. I'm sure maybe
Speaker 4: there'll be a few paleontologists who will disagree with me,
Speaker 4: but I'm going I'm going to represent as much as
Speaker 4: I can. Okay, So that question of what do dinosaurs
Speaker 4: actually look like is still a very hotly debated question,
Speaker 4: and we were all kind of right in saying we're
Speaker 4: not entirely sure. We have some pretty good guesses. Take,
Speaker 4: for example, the Ancleosaurus that we looked at. We know
Speaker 4: what the texture of its skin was like, and so
Speaker 4: there's a pretty good way of being able to figure out,
Speaker 4: you know, what its body would have looked like. But
Speaker 4: for a lot of other dinosaurs, we're kind of just
Speaker 4: working with educated guesswork of you know, trying to you know,
Speaker 4: put muscle back onto bone in a way that we
Speaker 4: think it would have been to your point. You know,
Speaker 4: an example that I kind of saw was somebody did
Speaker 4: a dinosaur reconstruction on a modern swan skeleton, and it
Speaker 4: is one of the scariest things I've ever seen. It
Speaker 4: looks nothing like a swan, you know, like you look
Speaker 4: at like a penguin or something like that. Penguins when
Speaker 4: you look at them, it's a little guy and it's
Speaker 4: got a little fee at the bottom, but they have
Speaker 4: little knees, they have like little like legs that are
Speaker 4: bent up inside their body. If you look at a whale,
Speaker 4: they have vestigial limbs from when they ancestors that lived
Speaker 4: on land. And so if you went and you know,
Speaker 4: into the future sixty million years and you looked at
Speaker 4: any of these animals, you would be trying to reconstruct
Speaker 4: it based off of the things that you understand in
Speaker 4: the world, and you know, it's a little bit hard
Speaker 4: to tell. The issue that I experience with archaeology and
Speaker 4: all archaeologists experience, is you are trying to put together
Speaker 4: a puzzle where you've lost pretty much all of the pieces,
Speaker 4: and so you have very fragmentary evidence and you have
Speaker 4: to kind of fill in the gaps as best you can,
Speaker 4: and that can be very challenging to do. Paleontology is
Speaker 4: a whole nother ballgame because you're going so far back
Speaker 4: in time. With archaeology, you can kind of infer because
Speaker 4: you're also human, you can kind of think in the
Speaker 4: same way that they did. But if you're going all
Speaker 4: the way back to the time of dinosaurs, you're not
Speaker 4: dealing with the human animal anymore. You have like fragmentary
Speaker 4: geologic evidence of what the environment was like that they
Speaker 4: were in. So there's so many factors that you have
Speaker 4: to work into it that it can be really challenging
Speaker 4: to figure out exactly what dinosaurs look like.
Speaker 1: So there is a chance that they were massive bunnies.
Speaker 4: You know, other than you know, the mammal the mammal
Speaker 4: side of things. Our ancestors at the time were massive
Speaker 4: bunnies or I guess tiny bunnies, but yeah, cool.
Speaker 1: I just want to have some hope that that's in
Speaker 1: fact what it looked like like. Jurassic bar would have
Speaker 1: been a completely different ballgame because they were just like
Speaker 1: big bird it was a bunch of big bird running
Speaker 1: around and that tyrannosaurs chasing the car.
Speaker 4: Well, you know that's what you want to believe. Don't
Speaker 4: let anybody take that away from you, because that is
Speaker 4: such a much more beautiful idea.
Speaker 1: I just like to save space because all I know
Speaker 1: is that I don't know anything, and I have a
Speaker 1: lot of questions. So I will I will hold space
Speaker 1: for that diamond. How you doing over there?
Speaker 3: I'm into it?
Speaker 1: Okay, that is a good ask my questions.
Speaker 5: I don't my wheels are turning please, as they should be.
Speaker 4: You know, never let your wheels stop turning.
Speaker 5: I'm just at this point we can't go back to
Speaker 5: see what they actually look like. So I'm always gonna
Speaker 5: have these questions.
Speaker 3: But you're enlightening me.
Speaker 4: So absolutely, and ask away, ask away. A lot of people,
Speaker 4: especially when kind of talking about science, will be like, ah,
Speaker 4: you guys don't know how this happened, and therefore none
Speaker 4: of it makes sense.
Speaker 1: Oh that's so annoying.
Speaker 4: The most important part there, Yeah, the most important part
Speaker 4: of science is that scientists are able to admit that
Speaker 4: we don't know everything, so we are will speak with
Speaker 4: confidence on the things that we do know, but there
Speaker 4: is as you're kind of you're asking the right questions
Speaker 4: because those are all scientists that your questions of scientists
Speaker 4: are asking. You're doing the scientific process right now, and
Speaker 4: so it's important to keep asking those and also knowing
Speaker 4: when to say, man, we have no idea.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 1: I think one of my favorite things about scientists and
Speaker 1: one of my least favorite things about society as a whole,
Speaker 1: is that scientists spend so much of their time trying
Speaker 1: to prove themselves and their peers wrong.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 6: I love that because.
Speaker 1: That's how you get better, and that's how you get
Speaker 1: to the theories and the facts ultimately a fact because
Speaker 1: you can't prove it wrong. Every time you do it,
Speaker 1: you get the same answer. Changing your opinion based on
Speaker 1: evidence is not flip flopping. That is learning, yes, yeah,
Speaker 1: and changing your mind based on learning. And so many people,
Speaker 1: because we have so much technology now at our fingertips,
Speaker 1: you can google everything. It seems like a lot of
Speaker 1: the masses think, Okay, we know everything, and if we
Speaker 1: find something new and we don't know about it, something's wrong.
Speaker 1: Someone's lying to us, someone's not telling us the truth,
Speaker 1: as opposed to, hey, maybe this is a new thing
Speaker 1: that is going to take some learning before we figure
Speaker 1: it out, and let's give it some time. It seems
Speaker 1: like people are not interesting and giving things time anymore,
Speaker 1: and I find it fascinating and quite irritating.
Speaker 6: Yes, but I digress.
Speaker 1: I can't help but notice you're kind of dressed like
Speaker 1: Indiana Jones right now?
Speaker 6: Well, you know, is he your hero because that he
Speaker 6: was an archaeologist? Right?
Speaker 4: Yes, you know, I think that it would be hard
Speaker 4: to find someone in the last thirty years who's in
Speaker 4: archaeology who didn't have Indiana Jones. And you know, Harrison
Speaker 4: Ford be some sort of inspiration, you know, it was.
Speaker 4: At the disappointing part of going to school Ford is
Speaker 4: learning that archaeology is absolutely nothing like Indiana Jones, which, yeah,
Speaker 4: a damn shame. I know, That's what I said. You know,
Speaker 4: I was waiting for them to give me a whip
Speaker 4: and a pistol, but no, you know, so, so I
Speaker 4: definitely do I feel a big, you know, sort of
Speaker 4: connection with that. But I've been interested in archaeology for
Speaker 4: my entire life. I sort of attributed as being my
Speaker 4: oldest interest. I first became interested in when I was
Speaker 4: about four or five years old with the discovery of
Speaker 4: Otzi the Iceman, which is a five thousand year old
Speaker 4: mummy that was found in the Outzel Alps in northern Italy,
Speaker 4: and he is the oldest tattoos ever discovered. Actually, as
Speaker 4: a bit of an homage to him for where he
Speaker 4: kind of got me today, I actually have all of
Speaker 4: his tattoos. They're down my back and on my legs
Speaker 4: and stuff. He is I think like sixty something individual lines.
Speaker 8: Wow.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And so it was a fascinating discovery. And I
Speaker 4: heard about him for the first time in like National
Speaker 4: geographic when I was, you know, four or five years old.
Speaker 4: Now I'm here, so you know, clearly was something that
Speaker 4: I was I was pretty interested in, and you know,
Speaker 4: it's really been something that's kind of driven me through
Speaker 4: my whole life.
Speaker 1: So to that point, they find a five thousand year
Speaker 1: old mummified man and they basically start thawing him out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And as that happens, Decay beggins. Well, now we're reading
Speaker 1: all of these stories about how the polar ice caps
Speaker 1: are melting and in these ice cabs, viruses that are
Speaker 1: tens of thousands of years old are coming out. How
Speaker 1: scary is that how real is that and what is
Speaker 1: the concern with that?
Speaker 6: To you?
Speaker 4: That's a good question. I've seen a lot of sort
Speaker 4: of anecdotal like articles about that, most of them just
Speaker 4: kind of like sources sort of speculating on it. So yeah, yeah,
Speaker 4: so I have to admit I haven't seen a lot
Speaker 4: of you know, actual scientific research on it. That doesn't
Speaker 4: mean that there isn't any, but I'm just unfamiliar with it.
Speaker 4: And the thing that I've always kind of been skeptical about,
Speaker 4: which is more of an opinion than anything else, is
Speaker 4: viruses are not like universal, Like a virus can't just
Speaker 4: apply to anything like That was the big thing, you know,
Speaker 4: when COVID start is it made the jump from like
Speaker 4: bats to people, Like that's really big for it to
Speaker 4: make that jump between two different very in two very
Speaker 4: different biological biological forms. And so the thing I always
Speaker 4: kind of wondered about the you know, the ice caps
Speaker 4: melting is would whatever is coming out of the ice
Speaker 4: actually be able to jump to humans like was the
Speaker 4: last time it was prevalent, And were the you know,
Speaker 4: host organisms that it was working with close enough to
Speaker 4: humans that it would not only be able to survive
Speaker 4: that long, but be able to make contact with humans,
Speaker 4: infect a human, be strong enough to infect other humans,
Speaker 4: and go on to you know, end the world.
Speaker 7: So you know, I'm not saying yes, the answer is yes, yes,
Speaker 7: one hundred percent. Yeah, and they're all, yeah, exactly. So
Speaker 7: I have no idea, but it's definitely some cause for thought.
Speaker 1: You know, I read these things, I'm like, oh, that's
Speaker 1: gonna get us. Huh, this is gonna get us.
Speaker 4: And it's fun reads. You know, it keeps me thinking,
Speaker 4: you know, absolutely.
Speaker 1: I mean it's just it's stuff that I would have
Speaker 1: never thought of until you know, the environment really came
Speaker 1: under attack. And now when you don't treat Mother Nature right,
Speaker 1: you don't treat the Earth's right, She's gonna come for you.
Speaker 4: She's pissed.
Speaker 1: Seen a lot of movies, Yes, she is pissed. So
Speaker 1: as an archaeologist, you well, in an environmental scientist, what
Speaker 1: are some of the things that you like, the coolest
Speaker 1: things that you have done? Because I know you did
Speaker 1: a motorcycle ride out yeah, and you just spent time
Speaker 1: investigating things out there. Tell us some of the stuff
Speaker 1: that you have found.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, Well, that's a great question. I guess to kind
Speaker 4: of you know, I got a two answers here. So
Speaker 4: the motorcycle ride, Yeah, that was my most recent I
Speaker 4: did that this past summer, and that was for a
Speaker 4: documentary series that I did called Dark Roots. It was
Speaker 4: my first sort of solo endeavor. But do you find
Speaker 4: that on YouTube at many minute? Man? So, So anyway,
Speaker 4: when I did Dark Roots, my goal was to kind
Speaker 4: of tell the story of the land itself. I think
Speaker 4: so much of our history that we learn here is
Speaker 4: you know, like, you know, the settlers showed up and
Speaker 4: like maybe you get a little bit of indigenous history,
Speaker 4: but like, you know, it's then they founded this city
Speaker 4: and they did this, and they found gold in the hills,
Speaker 4: and then you know, like and now we have America,
Speaker 4: and like that's kind of it. But the story goes
Speaker 4: way farther back.
Speaker 1: You can't found a place a bunch of people already live.
Speaker 4: Exactly exactly we did not find this place. Yeah, so
Speaker 4: so you know, they they My goal with that documentary
Speaker 4: series is not only to take it back to the
Speaker 4: indigenous people who here you know, before us, but also
Speaker 4: to take it back to all the geologic forces that
Speaker 4: you know, created this country. It's not enough to know
Speaker 4: why you know that there was gold mining in these mountains?
Speaker 4: Why is their gold in these mountains? Why can't I
Speaker 4: just go dig on the street here and find gold?
Speaker 4: You know? Like why is you know when you think
Speaker 4: of you know, any Western movie and you get some
Speaker 4: beautiful mason, there's you know, cowboy riding on it. Why
Speaker 4: are there maces there and not here? So there's so
Speaker 4: many you know, the earth is a giant book, and
Speaker 4: we are a very you know, lucky species to be
Speaker 4: able to decipher it. Where some of the first you
Speaker 4: know that we know can really look at the world
Speaker 4: own us and ask why. And so I think that,
Speaker 4: you know, it's really interesting to be able to find
Speaker 4: a way to interpret those stories and really tell it
Speaker 4: a deep history is kind of the way that I
Speaker 4: refer to it. Anyway, I digress. Your original question was,
Speaker 4: you know, what is some of the places I've been
Speaker 4: that I think are the most interesting.
Speaker 1: Like if you were to recommend to other people, Hey,
Speaker 1: there's this place, yeah, not a lot of people know
Speaker 1: about and you should go check it out, what would
Speaker 1: it be? Because let me tell you, Andrew Diamond and
Speaker 1: I we are trying to go off the grid and
Speaker 1: do a trip we've done it before and we had
Speaker 1: a blast. But tell us some places to go.
Speaker 4: That's an excellent question. Well, I cannot recommend the US enough.
Speaker 4: I think that, yeah, you know, the US is something
Speaker 4: and everyone's like, we've done the classic American road trip,
Speaker 4: but like there's so much history in this country that
Speaker 4: like is just so easy to drive by on the interstate,
Speaker 4: you know.
Speaker 1: And is there something that's like, not to bring it
Speaker 1: back to Indiana Jones, but like a holy grail of
Speaker 1: things that are out there, something that all archaeologists think
Speaker 1: if I can just find this one thing that would
Speaker 1: be amazing.
Speaker 4: Well, I think that it might be a little bit
Speaker 4: different for every archaeologist because you know, many of them
Speaker 4: are our marriage for all of them, yeah, you know,
Speaker 4: they're very specific in the things they like. But I
Speaker 4: could speak to mine personally. When I was young, I
Speaker 4: always had a fascination with the Seven Wonders of the
Speaker 4: ancient world. And we know about we know a lot
Speaker 4: about every single one of them, except for one, which
Speaker 4: is the Hanging Gardens. We have no idea anything about
Speaker 4: the Hanging Gardens. We don't know if it actually existed,
Speaker 4: we don't know exactly where it would have been. We
Speaker 4: don't know if it's sort of like anecdotal, you know,
Speaker 4: sort of evidence of what Babylon looked like, and they
Speaker 4: think some people think that it was Alexander the Great,
Speaker 4: like describing it on his deathbed or something like that,
Speaker 4: and so we don't actually know if it exists. But
Speaker 4: my personal thing, just loving the Seven Wonders is to
Speaker 4: find the seventh one.
Speaker 1: You know, that would be amazing. Okay, so where would
Speaker 1: you even start with.
Speaker 4: That, Well, Babylon, But unfortunately, you know, it's a part
Speaker 4: of the world that right now is really challenging to
Speaker 4: do work in. So yeah, I was recently, well last
Speaker 4: year around this time, I was working with doctor Brad
Speaker 4: Hafford at the Penn Museum. He is a Near East
Speaker 4: archaeologist who's been working there for years, and he was
Speaker 4: telling me a lot about his work in you know,
Speaker 4: like modern day Iraq and Syria and stuff like that,
Speaker 4: and it's just a very challenge part of the world
Speaker 4: to do work in which you're.
Speaker 1: Saying, they're not welcoming a bunch of white people with
Speaker 1: shovels to discup their land.
Speaker 4: Right now, that's a little hard weird, I know, I know,
Speaker 4: kind of shocking. I can't imagine why, you know, but
Speaker 4: he was telling me about all the kind of checks
Speaker 4: and balances and just how difficult it is to do
Speaker 4: work there, which you know is a large problem that
Speaker 4: I think a lot of scientific communities face. Is just
Speaker 4: you know, geopolitics often gets in the way of scientific development.
Speaker 1: So a lot of what you do too, and how
Speaker 1: our lovely producer Andrew found you was through your YouTube
Speaker 1: videos at many minute man maybe seven seven seven, We're
Speaker 1: not sure, but one of the things you do is
Speaker 1: you find people presenting ideas what are some of the
Speaker 1: craziest things that you have seen, and thought, oh no,
Speaker 1: not on my watch, We're not going to do.
Speaker 4: That, man. Well, well, a lot of what we see,
Speaker 4: I think recently is a sort of modern interpretation of
Speaker 4: a very early nineteenth century archaeological concept called hyper diffusion.
Speaker 4: And hyper diffusion was a idea that all of the
Speaker 4: major civilizations on Earth are descended from one lost master civilization.
Speaker 4: You can see why this was very popular at the
Speaker 4: beginning of nineteen hundreds and so this, you know, can
Speaker 4: go to things like you know, lost continents like Lemuria
Speaker 4: or Tartaria, but more commonly Atlantis, and so Atlantis is
Speaker 4: a very old story, but it's used a lot recently
Speaker 4: to sort of back up the idea that there was
Speaker 4: this lost civilization, and more recently it's sort of, you know,
Speaker 4: been used to back up the idea that it was
Speaker 4: at the end of the Ice Age and that there
Speaker 4: was some major cataclysm at the Ice Age that you know,
Speaker 4: destroyed this civilization and left the rest of the world
Speaker 4: to rise up from the ashes. And there's a litany
Speaker 4: of evidence against that. What is irrefutable is that the
Speaker 4: end of the Ice Age, the Earth was home to
Speaker 4: people that are exactly like you and I. What is
Speaker 4: undeniable is that the end of the last Ice Age
Speaker 4: and the rising of the seas about four hundred feet
Speaker 4: had a massive impact on humanity. What it did not
Speaker 4: do was break down a you know, global civilization that
Speaker 4: spanned the entire world. Pseudoscientists will never bring up is
Speaker 4: the genetic evidence to support their idea that the entire
Speaker 4: world was once connected only twelve thousand years ago, because
Speaker 4: there is no genetic evidence for it. If you look, you're.
Speaker 1: Talking about pseudoscientists on TikTok.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's fair, that's the foretic evidence. Well, the other
Speaker 4: thing is access to it. Yeah, yeah, well that's fair.
Speaker 4: But that's that I mean that that raises another really
Speaker 4: important point is that, like I almost can't blame people
Speaker 4: for falling for pseudoscience because the actual science feels so inaccessible.
Speaker 4: And that's why I, you know, predominantly put myself as
Speaker 4: a science communicator.
Speaker 1: The words aig, the words are really big.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And so it leaves them open to you know,
Speaker 4: if they want to go, you know, smoke a joint
Speaker 4: on the couch with their friends. They are going to
Speaker 4: watch Graham Hancock like there's nothing else out there that's
Speaker 4: going to connect with them. So I almost can't blame
Speaker 4: them for listening to him. But you know, to give
Speaker 4: kind of the end of my genetic example there, we
Speaker 4: can look at archaeological discoveries throughout the entire world. We
Speaker 4: can look at their genomes, and we can look at
Speaker 4: how humanity traveled across the planet. Like we know, you
Speaker 4: can literally make a map of how humanity spread across
Speaker 4: the world looking at our genes, which on its own
Speaker 4: is the one piece of evidence that fully refutes any
Speaker 4: hyper diffusion theory, because if that did exist, we would
Speaker 4: find the same genes all over the world. Because that's
Speaker 4: what people do. We reproduce, that's why we're all here,
Speaker 4: and so you would find evidence that in all of
Speaker 4: our blood, which you don't find.
Speaker 1: So you do not believe that everybody came from one place.
Speaker 4: Well, if you trace it, if you trace it all
Speaker 4: the way back, you could say that the hyperd diffusion
Speaker 4: came out of Africa, you know, like two million years
Speaker 4: ago or something like that. But as far as like
Speaker 4: a civilization that suddenly just mastered everything and sailed across
Speaker 4: the seas and populated distant lands and.
Speaker 6: Wat know where that came from, didn't happen.
Speaker 1: Ye, yeah, that did not happen. You said something interesting
Speaker 1: a minute ago, though, You said the rising seas really
Speaker 1: had an impact on society, on what was around and
Speaker 1: on the landscape of things, and the sea levels are
Speaker 1: rising again. Correct, Yes, So where does that go? As
Speaker 1: an environmental scientist? What is it that you're seeing?
Speaker 4: A scientist? I am absolutely horrified. I the the the
Speaker 4: single greatest existential threat that humanity faces is climate change.
Speaker 1: It is not aliens.
Speaker 4: I know, it's hard to believe. I wish it was aliens.
Speaker 4: That would at least be fun, you know.
Speaker 6: Like that narrative right now.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, and it's really frustrating. Something I haven't talked
Speaker 4: a lot about in my channel, but I mean, climate
Speaker 4: denihilism is that is at an all time high, and
Speaker 4: you know, the unfortunate reality of it is the inability
Speaker 4: of people to understand the data does not make the
Speaker 4: data any less true. Climate change is happening. Humans are
Speaker 4: causing it, and it is the greatest existential threat we've
Speaker 4: ever faced. If you look at just a graph of
Speaker 4: the temperature on the planet, which we can go farther
Speaker 4: back since before we had thermometers, because we have ice cores,
Speaker 4: we have a lot of scientific ways of actually figuring
Speaker 4: these things out. It's not just us, you know, blown
Speaker 4: it out our ass. The trend is mortifying. The thing
Speaker 4: that I kind of think is it is kind of
Speaker 4: interesting to look back in time when our ancestors were
Speaker 4: heavily influenced by climate change. That time natural the end
Speaker 4: of you know, the ice age, But this time we're
Speaker 4: facing something that is much worse because we're actually doing
Speaker 4: it and humans have a nasty habit of being pretty
Speaker 4: much indestructible. We are descended from little rats that survived
Speaker 4: the metior hitting the Earth when all the dinosaurs died,
Speaker 4: killed every single non avian dinosaur, and we somehow came
Speaker 4: out on top, which is pretty amazing. We're gonna be okay,
Speaker 4: We're going to make our way out of this. But
Speaker 4: the toll that it will take on the planet, unless
Speaker 4: we reverse what we're doing or alter what we're doing,
Speaker 4: is going to be unbelievable. And I don't know if
Speaker 4: it's going to be a future that many people are
Speaker 4: going to want to live in. And you know, not
Speaker 4: to get too doom around this, I'll try and keep
Speaker 4: it light. I'll end there it.
Speaker 6: Stare people out.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, what do you think you can do to
Speaker 1: change that? Do you think it's even changeable? Or do
Speaker 1: you think we've gone too far down the road now
Speaker 1: of destroying the planet that it might not be fixable.
Speaker 4: I think that maybe this is me kind of viewing
Speaker 4: it from the lens where I work, right I do
Speaker 4: science communication. I think that the biggest challenge is going
Speaker 4: to be actually getting the public on board with it,
Speaker 4: because right now there is so much lobbying from oil
Speaker 4: companies that are intentionally spreading disinformation that is responsible for
Speaker 4: all of the climate denihalism. People who name them.
Speaker 1: What are the companies?
Speaker 4: Oh, I don't want to get shot. They'll find me.
Speaker 4: They'll find me right outside.
Speaker 1: I'm going to Google and I will name this later.
Speaker 4: I mean literally, just like you know, this is another
Speaker 4: I think, really important thing. When we talk about conspiracy theories.
Speaker 4: There's so many of these accounts that talk about how
Speaker 4: they're like, we know the truth, and this is what
Speaker 4: the governments hiding from us. This is this is the
Speaker 4: other thing.
Speaker 1: I love it because there's always someone in their mom's
Speaker 1: basement being crazy.
Speaker 4: It's a big goalp And I'm like, you really think
Speaker 4: that the thing the government is hiding from us is
Speaker 4: you know, like that the giants used to walk the
Speaker 4: earth and the Smithsonian destroyed skeletons in this, that and
Speaker 4: the other thing. Well they like we have plastic in
Speaker 4: our blood. Like look around you. The conspiracies are right
Speaker 4: in front of your faces. Like major news organizations being
Speaker 4: owned and supported by oil lobbyists, Like politics and business
Speaker 4: are so heavily tied that like we are being like
Speaker 4: force fed misinformation. So I almost can't blame people for
Speaker 4: being climate denialists. A because it's absolutely terrifying and B
Speaker 4: because you have major news organizations that are being paid
Speaker 4: by companies that are incentivized to not allow climate change
Speaker 4: policy to be passed, you know, feeding them what they
Speaker 4: should believe. It's less of a matter of can we
Speaker 4: alter course now, it's more of a matter of are
Speaker 4: we all going to band together for the first time
Speaker 4: ever as a human race and save the fucking world?
Speaker 4: Because we can't do that. Like, this is the very
Speaker 4: first thing that all of humanity has to worry about.
Speaker 4: Even look back in time of like plagues and things
Speaker 4: like that, they were localized. Yeah, they spread and it's dangerous,
Speaker 4: but like every single human on the planet is going
Speaker 4: to be affected by this, and if we don't put
Speaker 4: on our big boy pants, were fucked.
Speaker 1: But there's also an argument that the plagues and all
Speaker 1: of these things come from environmental changes they do.
Speaker 4: That's a very good point. I mean, we just saw
Speaker 4: that we just lived through a pandemic, and normally they
Speaker 4: say it's you know, once every hundred years or something
Speaker 4: like that. I wouldn't be surprised if all of us
Speaker 4: in this room will live through another one in our lifetime.
Speaker 4: We have, like your tongue, Yeah, I know, horrifying. I
Speaker 4: wish like I almost don't want to jinx it likeno
Speaker 4: on something I'm going, you know, and it's it's it's
Speaker 4: really I don't know, it's just frightening. I don't want
Speaker 4: to live through another one anymore than anyone else does.
Speaker 4: But we don't seem to ever really learn our lesson.
Speaker 4: We sort of just keep plowing ahead. We're like, wow,
Speaker 4: that was bad anyway, and then we just keep doing it.
Speaker 6: You know, it doesn't happen again.
Speaker 1: There's nothing I can do about it exactly, looking around
Speaker 1: and seeing what's happening as far as rising sea levels.
Speaker 1: Which area of the world is in most danger right
Speaker 1: now because the king tides in Miami are wild those
Speaker 1: things are coming in hot. But I don't have access
Speaker 1: to the rest of the information around the world, but
Speaker 1: you might, yeah, yeah, what's in danger?
Speaker 4: Well, you know, I think that even without having access
Speaker 4: to the specific information, all of you would be correct
Speaker 4: in guessing that, you know, it's the lowest lying places.
Speaker 4: I'm glad you brought up Florida. Actually, a kind of
Speaker 4: fun fact I learned the other day is the highest
Speaker 4: point in Florida is three hundred feet above sea level,
Speaker 4: and it's like the very top left corner of the
Speaker 4: state where it's like it's practically in like I don't know,
Speaker 4: it's not like Georgia. I can't remember, but either way,
Speaker 4: it's like way up there the sea level. I'm pretty
Speaker 4: sure that if all the ice oh I'm not even
Speaker 4: gonna speak on I don't remember exactly what the level is,
Speaker 4: that the seas will rise of all the ice melts.
Speaker 4: But Florida's gone gone, Like Atlantis, they're going, okay, you know,
Speaker 4: can you imagine.
Speaker 1: What those fossils will look like Florida?
Speaker 6: Man, oh my.
Speaker 4: God, oh horrifying, you know, but a lot of low
Speaker 4: lying areas, I mean my home city of Boston. I
Speaker 4: now live in Vermont, but I was looking at some
Speaker 4: stuff on you know, Instagram. My dad sent me a
Speaker 4: thing in like the seaport district. There was just a
Speaker 4: really big tide and like by the EU there's just
Speaker 4: like the benches are in the water and like there's
Speaker 4: like a sea wall there and it's like up in
Speaker 4: the It's crazy. Our airport was built on reclaimed land,
Speaker 4: which I think is a hilarious idea, Like you never
Speaker 4: owned the ocean in the first place, you just fill
Speaker 4: that in greatest. Yeah, yeah, I get out of here,
Speaker 4: and so that that's you know, pretty much at sea level.
Speaker 4: Like what are you gonna do when the airport goes underwater?
Speaker 4: Like that's kind of a problem, you know.
Speaker 1: I So when I was living in Boston, there was
Speaker 1: a giant snowstorm and ice storm, and it actually brought
Speaker 1: flowing ice into the seaport district And it was crazy.
Speaker 1: Was this This was two thousand and seventeen in December.
Speaker 4: Oh, I think I have vague memories.
Speaker 6: It was wild.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was crazy, and I just thought, oh my god,
Speaker 1: we are going to be washed away.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: New York's on the water, Boston's on the water. DC's
Speaker 1: on the water.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Would it not make sense to move some of the big,
Speaker 1: big cities and the big important things inside well into the.
Speaker 4: That's really that's a really good question. When you think
Speaker 4: about states that are going to be impacted the most
Speaker 4: by climate change, you think of the coastal ones. And
Speaker 4: I even just said that, but I I want to
Speaker 4: take this a little bit farther and move out of
Speaker 4: sort of the sea level rise narrative, because a lot
Speaker 4: of people will view climate change like the ice is melting,
Speaker 4: the sea is rising, which, yes, that's a very big
Speaker 4: part of it. But both tornadoes and hurricane exactly just
Speaker 4: like you said, the weather. The weather is a really
Speaker 4: big part of it. So take for example, Vermont. Vermont
Speaker 4: is a landlocked state, but they are actually thinking about
Speaker 4: moving their capital of Montpillier because in this most recent summer,
Speaker 4: as many of you probably heard on the news, they
Speaker 4: were hit with colossal floods. They were hit with like
Speaker 4: massive rainstorms. It's a very mountainous area, it to the
Speaker 4: Green Mountains, and so all that water just runs down
Speaker 4: these mountain sides into these channels and creates like the
Speaker 4: most roaring water I've ever seen in New England. And
Speaker 4: because of that, the whole capital city of Montpellier was
Speaker 4: really badly flooded, like the whole downtown district along the river.
Speaker 4: So there's actually been a proposition, I'm not sure where
Speaker 4: it's at right now, but I was reading about it
Speaker 4: a few months ago of trying to move all the
Speaker 4: administration of Montpillier uphill to sort of a different area
Speaker 4: and get that out of the danger zone of that river,
Speaker 4: even though they're not living on the coast. So that's
Speaker 4: really the big part is like this is gonna affect
Speaker 4: everyone you don't have to live on the coast like
Speaker 4: it's coming for you.
Speaker 1: It's already affecting us here. Yeah, you know what happens
Speaker 1: when these streets flood.
Speaker 4: It's I know. I was like, I was living in
Speaker 4: Boston at the time. But my friend that I'm in
Speaker 4: town with here, he's lived in New Jersey forever, and
Speaker 4: he was just telling me about the effect that Hurricane
Speaker 4: Sandy had on New York. That was insane, and like
Speaker 4: it's gonna keep happening, Like we are gonna keep getting
Speaker 4: stronger and stronger storms, and like we're gonna just sit
Speaker 4: here and just get wet.
Speaker 1: I guess you know, nature always wins, right.
Speaker 4: I know it is. It's it's the one the one truth.
Speaker 4: You know, every ancient civilization that you find the ruins
Speaker 4: of they're in ruins, you know. But nature she's she's
Speaker 4: doing fine.
Speaker 1: You know, she's doing just whine. She's always gonna win.
Speaker 1: We love that. Diamond. Hold on, let me turn this microphone.
Speaker 4: Uh oh, you're back on the spot.
Speaker 1: Diamond and Andrew, the two of you, after listening through
Speaker 1: all of this and sitting through all this, do you
Speaker 1: guys have any questions for him?
Speaker 3: I think you answered all of mine earlier.
Speaker 4: I'm so glad.
Speaker 1: Do you believe in dinosaurs anymore now than you did before?
Speaker 3: Maybe a little bit?
Speaker 6: You don't have to say that, You're not to say that.
Speaker 4: No, no, no, I'm not wine. I encourage you to get
Speaker 4: more information than just this to change your mind on
Speaker 4: something like that.
Speaker 5: No, it's the fact that we're having a conversation about
Speaker 5: it exactly whereas before I was just called stupid and
Speaker 5: I'm like, well, how do you expect me but to
Speaker 5: believe it if you're not.
Speaker 4: Giving me in me, I'm glad you actually brought that up.
Speaker 4: I know we're ending here, but I want to interduct
Speaker 4: single second here. You know, in a lot of my content,
Speaker 4: like my shtick that I do, especially in short form,
Speaker 4: is just like I'm just a fucking hater. Like I'll
Speaker 4: just be like, oh this thing, and.
Speaker 1: Like, yeah, you're calling people stupid exactly.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And like, I'm glad you brought that up because
Speaker 4: this is something that I really am trying to kind
Speaker 4: of talk about in longer form content where you know,
Speaker 4: I have to do that because that is unfortunately what
Speaker 4: gets like views. People love a good like cat fight,
Speaker 4: So people are like okay, like you know, see this
Speaker 4: guy be a bastard, But like I don't find that
Speaker 4: like fulfilling. I'm like taking the piss doing it. I'm like, okay,
Speaker 4: I can do this all day. Like these are so easy,
Speaker 4: just give it to me. And that's why I've tried
Speaker 4: to branch out and do stuff on like YouTube and
Speaker 4: like you know, science communication on a broader level than
Speaker 4: just being like an influencer. Like I really do abhorror
Speaker 4: that term because I like to think that I'm doing
Speaker 4: something a little bit broader than that. And so like
Speaker 4: I think it's really important to have these conversations where
Speaker 4: it's like nobody is stupid. We all just have like
Speaker 4: differing information, and it's our job to you know, inform
Speaker 4: one another. It's our job to ask those questions when
Speaker 4: you know, push comes to shove and it's like we
Speaker 4: sit down in a room and talk together. Nobody's stupid.
Speaker 4: So you know, I.
Speaker 1: Have met stupid people. I have been in a room
Speaker 1: with them and had conversations. I think it's very big
Speaker 1: of you to say there are no stupid questions. I
Speaker 1: do think it's really important to ask questions totally. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but there are definitely stupid people. Diamond is not one of.
Speaker 4: Them, exactly, exactly for the sake of this conversation.
Speaker 1: There are some idiots out there, and I'm sure they're
Speaker 1: going to leave comments talking about how all of this
Speaker 1: is politicized and I am pushing an agenda because I'm
Speaker 1: trying to save the earth like a bighead.
Speaker 4: You can't talk about climate change without someone and that's
Speaker 4: what I mean about the You know, I'm not even
Speaker 4: going to get into it again. Okay to ask a question.
Speaker 4: Oh we got another question.
Speaker 1: We have a question from Andrew.
Speaker 2: No if you talked religion at all.
Speaker 1: Brief at the beginning.
Speaker 4: Okay, Tommy, what do you got?
Speaker 2: I was just gonna ask religious artifacts when people are
Speaker 2: convinced that like this is this is holy, but then
Speaker 2: they also say it existed at the same time as
Speaker 2: like dinosaurs and stuff. I'm just confused, like timeline wise,
Speaker 2: like where that's coming from you and me both? But
Speaker 2: I guess my question is like, say the flood, right, yes,
Speaker 2: Noah's arc that flood, Where in your opinion, timeline wise,
Speaker 2: did that happen? And also when they have like people
Speaker 2: in the Bible that lived hundreds of years, how does
Speaker 2: it history kind of write itself different biblically than actual reality.
Speaker 4: Well that's wow, that is a broad question. Yeah, I
Speaker 4: really like that. I mean, there's people archaeologists in the
Speaker 4: field of biblical archaeology, and they are amazing. They are
Speaker 4: very knowledgeable and exactly those questions. So I will do
Speaker 4: my best to sort of answer that. I've covered a
Speaker 4: lot of kind of what you're touching on is Young
Speaker 4: Earth creationism, which is, you know, the idea that the
Speaker 4: Earth is around six thousand years old and that you know,
Speaker 4: maybe we co existed with dinosaurs and stuff like that.
Speaker 4: And I'm gonna be totally honest, I've covered a lot
Speaker 4: of Young Earth creationist content and I have absolutely no
Speaker 4: idea what the narrative is, Like I really don't. I
Speaker 4: don't know, like where did dinosaurs come from? When did
Speaker 4: they die out? What is it?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 4: Where does the flood fit into it? Like there is
Speaker 4: such a like disconnect between how their timeline works that
Speaker 4: I genuinely do not understand it. So that is an
Speaker 4: awesome question that I don't think I can actually answer.
Speaker 6: It's like when a.
Speaker 1: Little kid draws a picture and somehow like they're the
Speaker 1: same size as the tree and the house. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: we just accept it.
Speaker 4: Okay, cool, if you say it, I guess I believe it.
Speaker 1: You know, No, that's a good question, Andrew, because I
Speaker 1: wonder that stuff all the time. I mean, you actually
Speaker 1: had a video that I watched talking about what was
Speaker 1: called the enigmatic handbag. Was it something like that? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: where people were noticing what looked like a little purse
Speaker 1: or even maybe a lock in some respect, and a
Speaker 1: lot of ancient what like like hieroglyphics, right, and a
Speaker 1: lot of carvings, and everybody was convinced that it was
Speaker 1: this purse that people carried around that was, in your opinion.
Speaker 6: Not the case.
Speaker 4: Yes, And you know, I had someone ask me on
Speaker 4: that question. They're like, Milo, like, why didn't you actually
Speaker 4: debunk it? I'm like, what is there to debunk? Like
Speaker 4: the idea is these carvings sort of look the same
Speaker 4: and therefore aliens, there's no through line, Like it doesn't
Speaker 4: even make sense, and so, like, you know, things like.
Speaker 1: That, were going to start presenting arguments like.
Speaker 4: That, like you can't just say a thing and then
Speaker 4: another thing and be like, yes, I need a little
Speaker 4: more than that.
Speaker 1: Okay, Okay, maybe this is my last question I could
Speaker 1: keep going, I swear so on the topic of aliens,
Speaker 1: when you have been looking around and traveling the world
Speaker 1: and checking out these different like digs and excavation sites,
Speaker 1: have you found anything that people just cannot figure out
Speaker 1: where it came from and just maybe it is not
Speaker 1: of this world?
Speaker 4: Ooh ooh, I do have one, okay, so oh yeah.
Speaker 4: Recently I was in Peru doing some work in the
Speaker 4: Sacred Valley, and while I was there, we visited this
Speaker 4: like remote mountain village and the elder of the village
Speaker 4: has a couple like you know, things that are his
Speaker 4: like personal you know, accoutrements. He has like a staff,
Speaker 4: and then he also has a conch shell, one of
Speaker 4: those big ones that you know you see people blow into.
Speaker 4: And the conch shell comes from way down in the
Speaker 4: valley by Lima. So it's from one of the other
Speaker 4: genous groups down there, and it was taken from the
Speaker 4: sea and gifted to this group that lives way in
Speaker 4: the mountains where at like sixteen thousand feet. Like I
Speaker 4: couldn't breathe. These people were running around, you know, they're
Speaker 4: used to it, but I was like, okay, I help me,
Speaker 4: you know, And so I'm talking to this man and
Speaker 4: he hands reaches out the shell to me and I
Speaker 4: take it and it's heavy and it's alive. It is
Speaker 4: a marine organism that has lived for probably upwards of
Speaker 4: fifty years in the mountains. The spines of it have
Speaker 4: broken off and they've healed, like they've grown back a
Speaker 4: conch shell like. Granted I didn't do like an X
Speaker 4: ray on it. I don't know. Maybe it's like mammified.
Speaker 4: I couldn't even tell you, but like it had the
Speaker 4: weight of a living organism in it, and it had healed.
Speaker 4: The physical spines of it had healed. And I am
Speaker 4: a very science oriented person. I was standing there holding
Speaker 4: this thing in my hands and I was like, I
Speaker 4: have no fucking idea what is going on here? And
Speaker 4: that has been like in my head since. I'm like,
Speaker 4: there is some magic going on with this that I
Speaker 4: cannot explain.
Speaker 1: What was the city in case I want to go?
Speaker 4: Patakanca? Okay, it's a little village. It's if you like
Speaker 4: really twisty roads and feeling like you're gonna fall to
Speaker 4: your death down a cliff at any second, enjoy that. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 4: well it's the place for you.
Speaker 1: Awesome. Oh, we love you, and thank you so much
Speaker 1: for stopping by and spending so much time with me.
Speaker 1: This has been very informative and wonderful. You're amazing. I
Speaker 1: really appreciate it.
Speaker 4: Thank you, thank you. I appreciate you guys having me here.
Speaker 4: It's been an absolute pleasure. Thank you for having me on.
Speaker 4: This is an honor. And uh, you know, follow me
Speaker 4: on YouTube Mini minute.
Speaker 1: Man, Many minute Man on YouTube.
Speaker 4: Milo Rossi, you can find me there. I'm trying to
Speaker 4: go away from many minute Man more Malo Rossi. You
Speaker 4: feel like it's a little better branding.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Many minute Man. Maybe in the future could get
Speaker 1: you caught up in some other nonsense.
Speaker 4: I know, I know I've heard about that. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 4: we'll stick with Milo Rossi for now. Thank you for
Speaker 4: having Thank you.
Speaker 1: Okay, so let's get to the burn book. Because this
Speaker 1: burn book, I think Andrew was upset about it as
Speaker 1: well as me.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, I was more shocked by your response.
Speaker 1: Oh were you Yes, you didn't expect that from me?
Speaker 2: Well, you said you were going to do it, and
Speaker 2: then it was like and did and then I saw
Speaker 2: the response and I was like, like I almost fell
Speaker 2: off my chair.
Speaker 4: I was shocked.
Speaker 1: I have a new reply to people who upset me. So,
Speaker 1: first of all, Billy McFarlane, you're getting burned. Billy McFarland,
Speaker 1: if you don't know, he was the genius behind Firefest.
Speaker 1: We remember Firefest right where the one guy was going
Speaker 1: to go suck some dick for water because it was
Speaker 1: so so crazy everything that was going on. Do you
Speaker 1: remember that?
Speaker 5: Not that not that par I didn't watch the dock,
Speaker 5: but I knew all about it, Like I knew what
Speaker 5: was going on. See I watch enough crappy TV and
Speaker 5: crappy like you know, circumstances on my Real Housewives that
Speaker 5: I don't have time for things that are actually crappy
Speaker 5: in real real life that happened to people.
Speaker 1: So okay, okay. This was a good one though, because
Speaker 1: it really shows the power of or at least not
Speaker 1: the power of. It really shows how quickly influencers will
Speaker 1: just jump on a bandwagon for no reason with no
Speaker 1: evidence or research, and why you should never trust influencers,
Speaker 1: which we've known for a while anyway, So Firefest, we
Speaker 1: know it was a shit show. It was a dumpster fire.
Speaker 1: All of the things that was terrible. He got in trouble.
Speaker 1: He would do jail for all of the stuff that
Speaker 1: happened with Firefest. Fast forward, he's out now and he
Speaker 1: thinks he's gonna throw a Firefest too, and he's really
Speaker 1: trying to make this little comeback, which is bizarre. So
Speaker 1: I thought, oh, this would be great. Let's talk to
Speaker 1: him because we could have some fun with that. So
Speaker 1: I reached out on Instagram directly to Billy McFarlane's page.
Speaker 1: I got a response that said, absolutely, I would love
Speaker 1: to do this. Email me here, Andrew sends the email.
Speaker 1: Suddenly some guy is copied in on it. Who was it?
Speaker 2: Oh me, no, omar, I don't know.
Speaker 1: Okay, someone gets copied in on this email and we're like, oh,
Speaker 1: who's this guy? This guy is his very stupid manager
Speaker 1: or marketing person who hit us with the gem of
Speaker 1: Billy would love to do your podcast. His typical fee
Speaker 1: for radio is five thousand dollars an hour.
Speaker 2: It is crazy an hour, not like total five thousand
Speaker 2: dollars for an hour of his time.
Speaker 1: So immediately I just slammed my laptop shut and I'm like,
Speaker 1: this is probably the stupid thing I've ever seen. And
Speaker 1: then I thought, now I'm not gonna let people get
Speaker 1: away with this anymore. And I think there's a very
Speaker 1: simple response that conveys a lot. So I just wrote back,
Speaker 1: and I told Andrew I was gonna do it. I said,
Speaker 1: please let me respond to this. I'm just gonna write
Speaker 1: lawl and that is my new response to anything that
Speaker 1: upsets me. Ever again, I'm just gonna lull at you.
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh. Did you get a response from that?
Speaker 1: No, of course not. What are you gonna say? What
Speaker 1: are you laughing at? You know what I'm laughing at?
Speaker 1: How dare you laugh why? You know why I'm laughing?
Speaker 3: You're right, you could do that just lol.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I lalled at old Corin Stuffan's superhead.
Speaker 7: Ye.
Speaker 1: I just wrote back, law very weird.
Speaker 2: I feel like your bird book is just people who
Speaker 2: are doing ridiculous things, either not coming on the podcast
Speaker 2: or charging you to be on the podcast.
Speaker 1: You're right, this is very selfish.
Speaker 3: No, I'm here for it. Let them burn.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Last episode, Diamond and I actually lit people up on
Speaker 1: like the Greater Good of Society. We were talking about
Speaker 1: how horrible it is when people don't wear headphones and
Speaker 1: decide that they want to watch whatever they're watching. On
Speaker 1: their iPad or their phone. That's horrible.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, that kid. I'm still thinking about your kid.
Speaker 5: Don't know your name, but I'm still thinking about you.
Speaker 1: So, Billy McFarlane, you've been burned. That's my flame. Sound wow,
Speaker 1: I love book. You have a permanent place fucker. Okay, Andrew,
Speaker 1: do you have an ask me anything I do?
Speaker 2: Amanda Kozar asks what's your favorite snack?
Speaker 6: I like that.
Speaker 1: Of all the things, that's what we're gonna I thought
Speaker 1: these were gonna be like deep and good. Oh it's
Speaker 1: my favorite snack.
Speaker 2: See it is?
Speaker 3: It is?
Speaker 1: I mean I like all snacks.
Speaker 8: You know me.
Speaker 1: I'm a snack person. If there's something to munch on,
Speaker 1: I'm doing it.
Speaker 3: That sounded dirty, Yeah it kind of did, but I
Speaker 3: liked it.
Speaker 1: I meant snack wise, I would have to say I'm
Speaker 1: a sucker for Chex Mix.
Speaker 3: Oh come on, I love it.
Speaker 4: I don't disagree with you.
Speaker 1: Thank you, Andrew. From Afar.
Speaker 2: On United, they now give you a little snack bag
Speaker 2: that is basically checks Mix. I forgot how good it was.
Speaker 2: The bagel chips, the pretzels, the weird cracker thing that's
Speaker 2: just like a bland cracker I'm confused by it, but
Speaker 2: it's also good and if you throw some cheesy parts
Speaker 2: in there too, like.
Speaker 1: What so, did you know there's a cheddar checks mix
Speaker 1: that has a cheese mix in there. There's Bold that's
Speaker 1: my favorite one, the Bold, but also just regular checklis
Speaker 1: Man here for it.
Speaker 3: Okay, guys, you have got to step up your paletts honestly.
Speaker 1: Oh really's your diamonds? Its super exotic? What is it?
Speaker 6: I'm allergic to most things, so if he's.
Speaker 5: Gluten free, I like old Babe gluten free chips.
Speaker 1: But then I also eat olive oil chips.
Speaker 2: From the local jelly, which goes against my gluten allergy.
Speaker 6: But whatever.
Speaker 3: Okay, is that how you feel? I say with your chest?
Speaker 3: I like siete is it? Cassava chips?
Speaker 6: Oh?
Speaker 3: Ten out of ten with a lime on them?
Speaker 4: I love it?
Speaker 6: I love it?
Speaker 3: Or nothing could beat a good green grape okay?
Speaker 1: Nothing you do eat green grapes in the morning?
Speaker 5: Yep?
Speaker 1: You have that often? Okay, Yeah, let's hear about you, loser, Andrew.
Speaker 2: I like the jipeno chips from uh what's the one?
Speaker 2: I love those? I think that's my favorite snack. It's spicy,
Speaker 2: it's delicious. You can't go wrong. Asshole burns afterwards, but
Speaker 2: I have to put.
Speaker 1: That in your assholes from jalapeno chips.
Speaker 2: I'm just saying spicy things are not good for me personally.
Speaker 2: My Chicken bindoaloo incident.
Speaker 1: Is not great to talk about the chicken.
Speaker 2: I ate chicken Vndulu. The next day was the Casey
Speaker 2: Musk Graves concert. I was with my best friend Miranda.
Speaker 2: The two of us are at the concert. May have
Speaker 2: had an edible, and I feel like on an edible,
Speaker 2: you just become very aware of where you are in
Speaker 2: your body. And all of a sudden, I was like, huh,
Speaker 2: gastro intestinal distress and not great. And the concert did
Speaker 2: not start yet, and I'm literally like, oh God, oh God,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna put my pants in Madison Square card in
Speaker 2: this most embarrassing thing in my life. Luckily, power Through
Speaker 2: made it through the whole show. But then afterwards, I
Speaker 2: was with my friend and we're like, Okay, what are
Speaker 2: we doing? Where are we going out? I'm like, I
Speaker 2: cannot go out. I cannot go out.
Speaker 6: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I'm literally gonna die if I like we walked into
Speaker 2: the path. It's at twenty minutes, I go, I'm gonna
Speaker 2: shit my pants, Like I cannot take the path train
Speaker 2: right now. I'm so sorry we got outside. I called
Speaker 2: an uber. The uber dropped me off at the old
Speaker 2: studio because I was like, I will not make it
Speaker 2: home and I'm so sorry.
Speaker 4: I need to like go now.
Speaker 2: It dropped me off at the old studio and it
Speaker 2: wasn't great. It wasn't a great day for me. So
Speaker 2: chicken Mindalu repeated the next day.
Speaker 4: Okay, not happy.
Speaker 1: I argue this one. It definitely could have been the
Speaker 1: chicken Vndalu because it is spicy and there's oil and
Speaker 1: like gee and all kinds of stuff in there. But
Speaker 1: a lot of times these edibles, like even with shrooms,
Speaker 1: they make you have to shit your pants. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: was that's a part of it.
Speaker 2: Well, I learned my lesson and I will not be
Speaker 2: doing it for any of the Casey munscrape shows I'm
Speaker 2: coming to this year.
Speaker 1: I love that for you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I can't believe you held it the entire show.
Speaker 1: I can't race a God.
Speaker 4: I was just like focus Andrew.
Speaker 2: Focus.
Speaker 1: Was it one of those things where like if I move,
Speaker 1: it's coming out.
Speaker 2: The pain I felt was immeasurable. I cannot explain. It's
Speaker 2: just the cramps. It was like one of those where
Speaker 2: you're just like.
Speaker 1: I think one of my favorite things is that, like
Speaker 1: you don't realize how intense your thoughts are about it
Speaker 1: until that moment comes and you're like, I'm thinking of
Speaker 1: nothing else, nothing else matters in the world right now.
Speaker 1: Dear God, just let me get through this because I
Speaker 1: cannot ship myself in public. It happened to me in Thailand.
Speaker 1: We were there yourself. No I thought I was going
Speaker 1: to We may or may not have eating a bunch
Speaker 1: of mushrooms, and that's that's that happens. Sometimes people throw up.
Speaker 1: Sometimes you have to like crap, whatever it is.
Speaker 2: It is like you are eating like a tainted mushroom,
Speaker 2: like it's going to cause you absolute.
Speaker 1: It's like fermented and fungified whatever it is. It Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: we're having a great time. I'm like in paradise. This
Speaker 1: boat is rocking, it's wonderful. And then all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: I was like, oh no, oh, no, no, thankfully we
Speaker 1: had pulled up to this island. But it's not like
Speaker 1: there were just bathrooms all around, but there were a
Speaker 1: few boats. So I said, please, God, tell me that
Speaker 1: there is a restroom somewhere. They're like, yeah, you just
Speaker 1: got to walk through those trees. There's this public bathroom
Speaker 1: over there. When I tell you, the walk was probably
Speaker 1: half a mile. It was awful. You also had to
Speaker 1: walk through this like temple area. Mind you, I have
Speaker 1: on a bikini top and I'm like scurrying through a
Speaker 1: temple ready to ship myself. Went into the bathroom. Oh
Speaker 1: my god. And the worst part getting off the little
Speaker 1: boat that we were on. A wave came top of
Speaker 1: my bathing suit, flipped right up, boots everywhere.
Speaker 3: Oh wow, yeah wow.
Speaker 1: And here's my boyfriend and my friend's on the boat.
Speaker 1: They're like, nice titday. No, couldn't get worse too, But
Speaker 1: I made it so it wasn't so bad.
Speaker 2: You should have done an aquedumpt.
Speaker 1: Excuse me, you know exactly.
Speaker 5: No, no, no, no, no, no, we got to cut.
Speaker 4: You don't have to talk to either Michelle.
Speaker 2: We're talking about this. Either of them were on Survivor.
Speaker 2: They said, like people, when you're on Survivor, you aquaedump.
Speaker 2: So you just go in the water, and you have
Speaker 2: to make sure you go out far enough so this way,
Speaker 2: the wave doesn't carry in the food, but you would
Speaker 2: just like float and then you just do your business.
Speaker 1: Okay, that sounds like the dirtiest. Also, i'd be very
Speaker 1: nervous that something would come up come up on me
Speaker 1: while we were doing that. And also, I mean, I
Speaker 1: know they're not eating in the ocean, and everything else
Speaker 1: craps in the ocean, so I guess it's not really
Speaker 1: that weird, but I feel like you can't shit that
Speaker 1: close to where you eat.
Speaker 2: Literally, so you swim again, as it's been explained to me,
Speaker 2: you swim out a little bit, and then you just
Speaker 2: are floating. And if someone's just like out there floating,
Speaker 2: you're like, ah, they're doing the thing. Or they dig holes.
Speaker 2: But the problem is they film at the same location
Speaker 2: now for like all the seasons, so you can if
Speaker 2: you're back on the island or it's a new season
Speaker 2: and you're on that island, can actually find the poop holes.
Speaker 3: We're going okay, all right, okay, Oh.
Speaker 1: Diamond's gonna call it. Diamond's calling it. She doesn't want
Speaker 1: to talk about the poop anymore.
Speaker 8: Yeah, I'm gonna go shit tot and a toilet in
Speaker 8: a toilet by the way here, I can't I know,
Speaker 8: I can't say who it is, but there is a
Speaker 8: mad shitter in this building.
Speaker 1: Oh yes, Oh Diamond somehow has encountered multiple times.
Speaker 5: She needs to be burned. Can we burn her the
Speaker 5: next episode? Can I burn her right now?
Speaker 1: Burner? Wait, let's save it for the next episode. It's
Speaker 1: gonna be a good burn. Absolutely, absolutely yeah. By the way,
Speaker 1: I went to the bathroom today to pee and I
Speaker 1: encountered it. Said, oh my god, and then she tried
Speaker 1: to speak to me. On my way out, I was like,
Speaker 1: I can't.
Speaker 6: I can't.
Speaker 7: I know.
Speaker 3: Shame, No, shame, I know, shame.
Speaker 2: Wait for the next episode.
Speaker 6: Okay.
Speaker 1: And on that note, we're out. If you want to like,
Speaker 1: follow and subscribe, I would love that. Uh Sauce on
Speaker 1: the side with Gandhi anywhere you get your podcasts, preferably
Speaker 1: iHeart but Apple, Spotify all that stuff at Baby Hot Sauce.
Speaker 1: If you can find me on Instagram, still living through
Speaker 1: a shadow band and Andrew and Diamond where can they
Speaker 1: find you, guys?
Speaker 2: Andrew go at Andrew Pug on Instagram and.
Speaker 3: Diamond at diamond Sincera on Instagram.
Speaker 1: All right, come find us and if you have questions
Speaker 1: or you want to hit us with an ask me anything,
Speaker 1: because apparently a snap question can lead to talks about
Speaker 1: where you nearly crapped yourself. Hit us. We would love
Speaker 1: to know and we'll see you next time. Say bye bye,