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Speaker 1: hi there, Welcome to another episode of Thinking Sideways. I

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Speaker 1: am Joe Joint as always, by and Steve and uh.

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Speaker 1: This week it's time for another fascinating mystery. We're going

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Speaker 1: to talk about what they call in the Philippines. See

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Speaker 1: Michael my Ring Mystery. Michael Myering was a shadowy person

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Speaker 1: and uh, well, nobody knows exactly what he was or

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Speaker 1: because he claimed to be a treasure hunter. Some people

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Speaker 1: thought he might have been something else, like maybe a

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Speaker 1: terrorist or a CIA operative. Well, we'll tell you everything

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Speaker 1: you need to know and you can make up your

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Speaker 1: own mind. Well, by the way, I want to quick aside,

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Speaker 1: I want to thank Landon who suggested this. Thanks dude,

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Speaker 1: appreciate it if you are a dude. By the way,

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Speaker 1: that anyway, but thanks Landing. So let me let's start

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Speaker 1: from the beginning here. The date was May sixteen, two

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Speaker 1: thousand two. So, yeah, there's an old turn of the

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Speaker 1: century story. Uh. Yeah, remember the turn of the century. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: things are a lot different. Cars looked a little different.

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Speaker 1: Hair was longer or maybe shorter. I don't remember it. Both.

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Speaker 1: Cellphones was different. Yeah, hair, it was different. Cell phones

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Speaker 1: remember cellphones that they were big? Uh they were big.

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Speaker 1: This started kind of big, okay. Um. So May sixteen,

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Speaker 1: two thousand two, there was an explosion in room three

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Speaker 1: oh five at the Evergreen Hotel in Davo. Mend to

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Speaker 1: now the Philippines. So as you know, men and now

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Speaker 1: is that big island at the south end of the

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Speaker 1: archipelago that is the Philippines. Uh, and it was a

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Speaker 1: big city there, and uh, there have been other terrorist

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Speaker 1: bombings which had recently been taking place across the Philippines. Uh,

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Speaker 1: and there was a big one just three weeks before.

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Speaker 1: They killed fifteen people wounded fifty five. So a while

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Speaker 1: bombing going on, people are a little bit on edge, understandably,

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Speaker 1: So there's an explosion in room three oh five at

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Speaker 1: the hotel was occupied by a band named Michael Terrence

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Speaker 1: my Ring, who was an American oncologist that's a cancer

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Speaker 1: doctor for those who them. Now. He'd been a regular

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Speaker 1: guest at this hotel for the past eight to ten years.

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Speaker 1: He's been spending a lot of time in the Philippines,

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Speaker 1: says the early nineteen nineties, and on his most recent visit,

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Speaker 1: he checked into the Evergreen Hotel December fourteen, two thousand one.

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Speaker 1: Several months before that's yeah, it's like six months before.

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Speaker 1: Four months before, yeah, I guess six months. He seemed

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Speaker 1: to frequent the same hotels. There was I think it

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Speaker 1: was like three different hotels that he liked to stay at,

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Speaker 1: depending on where he was. Yeah, and he spent like

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Speaker 1: somewhere from six to eight months a year in the Philippines,

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Speaker 1: so he was a regular at these places. I'm surprised

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Speaker 1: he didn't try to find time shares. I was just

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Speaker 1: going to even just buy a house, yeah, rent an apartment, yeah,

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Speaker 1: for the exchange rate from what I know, the exchange

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Speaker 1: rate in the Philippines. Like you can it doesn't take

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Speaker 1: very much American dollars to live like a king in

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Speaker 1: the Philippines. So I don't know why buiep. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you can hire a housekeeper for pretty cheap there. Oh,

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Speaker 1: I'm just I'm guessing maybe he just decided it was

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Speaker 1: easier not to and why he was doing it this

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Speaker 1: way might have been a commitment fobe. Yeah, yeah, it

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Speaker 1: might have been. It might have been one of these

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Speaker 1: people like my dad was kind of this way. He

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Speaker 1: just didn't want to buy into real estate because he

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Speaker 1: was sure the bubble was going to burst. My dad

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Speaker 1: was totally right about that. He was just stopped by

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Speaker 1: several decades. I mean, if you maintain that for long enough,

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Speaker 1: it will eventually be true. Oh, totally true. Yeah. Well,

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Speaker 1: whatever the reasons he was staying at this hotel. Uh, so,

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Speaker 1: of course there had been a big kaboom. The police,

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Speaker 1: paramedics show up. They found that Myering was pretty mangled.

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Speaker 1: His legs were really badly mangled. Unfortunately they had to

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Speaker 1: be amputated. So they were amputated because some of the

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Speaker 1: stories just talked about how they were he was wounded

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Speaker 1: and messed up. Yeah. Once the one version I read

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Speaker 1: that only one leg was amputated, but most, mostly the

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Speaker 1: more authoritative ones like in the Manila Times, etcetera, said

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Speaker 1: both legs were amputad. Okay, so we'll go with that,

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Speaker 1: all right. I just want to clarify because I was

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Speaker 1: I was never sure. No, it is hard to tell.

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Speaker 1: Was it just his legs that were injured or was

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Speaker 1: the rest of his body injured. He got yeah, some

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Speaker 1: some big third degree burns over a lot of the

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Speaker 1: rest of his body. So pretty much what you would

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Speaker 1: expect by somebody being hot off guard by their room exploding.

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Speaker 1: Uh yeah, pretty much. Yeah. So he was taken to

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Speaker 1: the Davo Doctors Hospital, which is where his legs were amputated.

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Speaker 1: But before he lost consciousness, he told police that somebody

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Speaker 1: had lobbed a grenade into his room. But then later

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Speaker 1: on with the police, bomb experts took a close look

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Speaker 1: at the scene. Well, the evidence to them looked like

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Speaker 1: the blast was from a bomb and not a grenade,

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Speaker 1: and Miring had had two metal boxes that he kept

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Speaker 1: in his room, and it looked like the bomb had

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Speaker 1: actually been inside one of those boxes. So I'm curious, right,

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Speaker 1: And but here's where the story thickens a little bit.

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Speaker 1: While my Ring was in the hospital in Davos and

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Speaker 1: FBI agents came by to ask him some questions. This

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Speaker 1: is where it gets controversial. According to some sources, local

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Speaker 1: police who were there guarding Meyring tried to stop the

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Speaker 1: FBI from getting into his room, but the FBI guy,

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Speaker 1: the FBI guys apparently were kind of bullying and they

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Speaker 1: just basically insisted on going in and talking to him. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And then they took my Ring out of the hospital,

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Speaker 1: flew into another hospital in Manila, which is of course

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Speaker 1: at the far other end of the Philippines, of course,

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Speaker 1: of course, yeah, yeah. And then after I don't know,

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure exactly when this happened, he Ring left

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Speaker 1: the country. Apparently, according to some people, the FBI spirit

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Speaker 1: Admiring out of the Philippines and back to the U S.

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Speaker 1: Apparently he was taken to San Diego. Ostensibly, to quote

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Speaker 1: a famous podcaster person, uh, it was for more advanced

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Speaker 1: treatments than what you could get in the Philippines. So

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Speaker 1: here's the But Okay, when I read this stuff about this,

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Speaker 1: and I was reading the stuff that, oh, gosh, which

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Speaker 1: US government organs? I want to say it's the State Department,

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Speaker 1: but it probably is. And whoever it was, they were like,

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Speaker 1: oh yeah, no, they went there with police officers, local

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Speaker 1: police officers in tow to comply with the rules, like

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Speaker 1: they they you know, they're accounting of it is that

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Speaker 1: they followed the book and the locals were with them.

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Speaker 1: And the US government says yeah as well. And so

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Speaker 1: there's a there's a lot of conflicting accounts in this one.

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Speaker 1: I think they probably they did. They did obey the rules.

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Speaker 1: You know, the FBI that says that they had a

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Speaker 1: liaison with the Philippine National Police. They totally cooperated and

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Speaker 1: coordinated with them. So that's what that's how they put it.

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Speaker 1: Um not to disparage the Philippine police is something you

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Speaker 1: always say before you're gonna disparase someone exactly. But you know,

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Speaker 1: I in my talkings with people from the Philippines, which

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Speaker 1: I've had actually haven't had extensive talkings with people from

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Speaker 1: the Philippines, um most of their citizens generally feel like

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Speaker 1: the police are pretty corrupt and it doesn't take very

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Speaker 1: much to get them to do what you want. So

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Speaker 1: you know, whether or not the FBI or you know,

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Speaker 1: the US officials were complying, or they had paid them off,

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Speaker 1: or maybe they hadn't paid them off, and so the

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Speaker 1: police were like, hey, you didn't follow a protocol, you

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Speaker 1: didn't pay us off. What's going on? And you know,

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Speaker 1: later reported that they had had been done without their consent.

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Speaker 1: There's just so much to not know about it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there is. That's just that's there's once again something that

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Speaker 1: we said for impartial, law abiding law enforcement. And I'll

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Speaker 1: just add that if I had gotten my legs blown

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Speaker 1: off and third degree burns all over my body in

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Speaker 1: a foreign country, I would be super thankful for my

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Speaker 1: government coming and taking me home. Yeah, that's a good point,

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Speaker 1: you know. So you know, it's a whole question. The

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Speaker 1: whole question here is not so much that they did it,

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Speaker 1: but why they did it. You could ask for it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it might have been um but but back to the

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Speaker 1: bomb scene, it looked like the bomb, according to the

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Speaker 1: Philippine police, was mostly most likely an improvised type. Initially,

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Speaker 1: they concluded dynamite, but that they decided it was some

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Speaker 1: other higher tech explosive like ammoni nitrate, which had ammonium

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Speaker 1: nitratee in if they found traces of ammonium nitride, isn't

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Speaker 1: that the same thing that was in Oklahoma City in

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Speaker 1: the same kind of bomb essentially, Yeah, I mean that's

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Speaker 1: that's one way to get your ammonium nitrate. You don't

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Speaker 1: have to use fertilized they did there. You can actually

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Speaker 1: get more purified versions of it. But yeah, you can

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Speaker 1: bind your ammonium nitrate with some fuel oil vaida you've

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Speaker 1: got a nice unstable explosive. My My reason for saying

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Speaker 1: it was kind of like I was thinking that it

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Speaker 1: had to be something akin to a fertilizer bomb. Is

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Speaker 1: he is in the Philippines, and fertilizer is probably easy

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Speaker 1: to get. Ahold of the higher tech stuff maybe not

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Speaker 1: so much. Yeah, and there are and this is the

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Speaker 1: whole range. You can improvise something with fertilizer and diesel

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Speaker 1: or there's some more higher tech stuff that also uses

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Speaker 1: his ammonium nitrate, same kind of similar thing or refined

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Speaker 1: process and it's a it's a better explosive. But you know,

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Speaker 1: but as far as what he had there, was it

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Speaker 1: improvised or was it you know, high tech stuff. I'm

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Speaker 1: not totally sure, but of course, uh, if Myron did

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Speaker 1: have himself a bomb, which appeared that he did, that's

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Speaker 1: illegal in the Philippines. Even so that made him kind

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Speaker 1: of a wanted man of course at this but by

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Speaker 1: this point he's out of the Philippines. They wanted him back.

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Speaker 1: They they actually filed charges against him in the the Philippines,

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Speaker 1: but the U. S Government did nothing to return him. Instead,

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Speaker 1: Byron lives out the rest of his days here in

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Speaker 1: the US, maybe at his hometown of out of Mesa, California,

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Speaker 1: although there was one report that he'd been seeing in Texas.

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Speaker 1: But it doesn't really matter because apparently he's died since

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Speaker 1: I think he died in two thousand twelve, because I

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Speaker 1: believe he was about sixty six when this bombing happened.

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Speaker 1: So you know, seventy six, you know, plus take off

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Speaker 1: a couple of years for having your body burned and

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Speaker 1: you're blown off, you know, you know, so that's not outrageous.

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Speaker 1: The controversy didn't die. Two weeks after the bombing, the

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Speaker 1: mayor of Davo Rodrigo dore tab a guy who likes

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Speaker 1: to scream. Yeah, he's kind of he's he's kind of bombastic,

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Speaker 1: I would say the one way of putting it. He

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Speaker 1: reminds me of another certain politician in our country a

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Speaker 1: little bit, but a lot worse in my opinion. Yeah, well,

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Speaker 1: I'm talking to me. I'm gonna make judgments. Yeah. But

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Speaker 1: he went public and blasted the U. S Government for

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Speaker 1: taking my Ring out of the country. He accused of

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Speaker 1: see I of conducting a false flag operation in the Philippines.

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Speaker 1: Explain to folks, what's the false flag operation? Yeah? A

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Speaker 1: false flag is where you uh commit some sort of

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Speaker 1: usually some sort of a crime or an operation, but

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Speaker 1: you make it look like some other country has done it.

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Speaker 1: So the idea is here would be like, well, okay,

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Speaker 1: we'll playing some bombs, will blame it on some Muslim

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Speaker 1: separatist group, and then if we do that in public

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Speaker 1: opinion and the Philippines will turn against these guys, and

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Speaker 1: then the national government will adopt a policy that's more

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Speaker 1: anti Muslim, which is well engineering okay. And so in

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Speaker 1: this telling, my Ring was an agent of the CIA.

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Speaker 1: He was running this operation, which is why the US

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Speaker 1: got him out. Of the country so quickly DETERCTI was

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Speaker 1: very angry about this situation. He threatened unspecified violence towards

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Speaker 1: the FBI if he they ever came back to Dabo again.

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Speaker 1: I know he's that's the kind of guy he is. Actually,

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Speaker 1: he's actually he actually claims to have killed people in

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Speaker 1: his drug wards. This is the same guy he's obviously

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Speaker 1: president of the Philippines today. If you don't know that

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Speaker 1: he does. He just claim in the past to have

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Speaker 1: actually summarily executed people who were caught with drugs. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I know they had. I can't remember who it is.

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Speaker 1: Some humans rights group is totally in arms because you

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Speaker 1: get caught with drugs, essentially they're they're just taking you out.

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Speaker 1: And the number of deaths capital punishment style deaths had

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Speaker 1: just skyrocket. And once he came into office, like to

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Speaker 1: an absurd rate. Well, it began long before he was president.

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Speaker 1: I mean, when he was mayor of Dabo, he cleaned

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Speaker 1: up quote unquote the situation down there, and the same

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Speaker 1: thing happened. They were they were what they called death squads.

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Speaker 1: At least there were some accusations that there were death

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Speaker 1: squads killing people outright all over the place then, and

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Speaker 1: and apparently the Philippine people liked his style of after

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Speaker 1: they went ahead and made him president. You know, um,

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Speaker 1: so whatever, you know, they're they're tied up to elect

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Speaker 1: whoever they want. But this might explain while U. S.

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Speaker 1: Philippines relations have gone downhill. If this particular incident is

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Speaker 1: what sour Detarty so much on the United States and

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Speaker 1: our relationship with the Philippines. Um, I'm not sure if

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Speaker 1: it's not. Maybe he was already kind of anti American

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Speaker 1: and this was just an excuse. I don't know, and

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Speaker 1: I don't know when he's made his speeches. Was May thirty,

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Speaker 1: two thousand to just two weeks after the explosion. I

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Speaker 1: don't know if he had any any special knowledge of

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Speaker 1: the situation or if he had just been reading the

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Speaker 1: newspapers like everybody else. But he wasn't mad. I mean

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Speaker 1: you read that article, right, did he strike you as angry?

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Speaker 1: He strikes me as angry constantly. Well, there's that. That's

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Speaker 1: that's why he's yeah. But but that's why this is

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Speaker 1: still controversial and still a mystery because who exactly was

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Speaker 1: Michael Myering and just what exactly was he up to?

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Speaker 1: So that's what we're going to figure out here. Ostensibly there,

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Speaker 1: I know, he was a citizen of South Africa who

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Speaker 1: emigrated to the U S. And was naturalized towards the

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Speaker 1: end of the apartheid era. As I said before, he

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Speaker 1: was not colleges. He was Caucasian, Yeah, he was. And

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Speaker 1: supposedly he was affiliated with the African National Congress, although

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Speaker 1: I'm not too sure about that. I mean, there's in

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Speaker 1: this story you read that he was affiliated with all

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Speaker 1: kinds of groups. That's I'm sure you're aware, very disparate groups.

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Speaker 1: I would say he's also been accused of being affiliated

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Speaker 1: with another group of people who are like white supremacists

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Speaker 1: and Nazis back in the U S. Which is aththetical

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Speaker 1: the whole African National Congress thing. What do you think

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Speaker 1: about it? But there is one story that was told

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Speaker 1: by as a friend of his name David Hawthorne, who

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Speaker 1: said that my Ring told him once that he'd given

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Speaker 1: a box of old US federal notes to the South

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Speaker 1: African government after apartheime. So this is after Nelson Mandela

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Speaker 1: became president of South Africa. He made them a gift

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Speaker 1: of this box of notes had, according to my Iring,

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Speaker 1: five million dollars in it. I know a lot of money,

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Speaker 1: that's whole bank notes. I don't know how big the

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Speaker 1: denominations were. I did a little checking, and I know

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Speaker 1: back on the day they used to print bills as

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Speaker 1: large as ten thousand dollars and denominations. Wait, where where's

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Speaker 1: my ring saying he got the money from? Well, that's

287
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Speaker 1: a little hazy. This is he's a get a treasure hunter,

288
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Speaker 1: because I see you've got information here about dates and

289
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Speaker 1: types of bills, and so I'm trying to figure out

290
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Speaker 1: it's not like he just went down to the bank

291
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Speaker 1: and made a cash withdrawal. No, no, got at all,

292
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Speaker 1: not at all. These were These were old bank notes.

293
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Speaker 1: Of course, since I don't I'm not sure what the

294
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Speaker 1: biggest the biggest denomination is today's a five d. They're

295
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Speaker 1: still making it. They're still making a five dollar bill, right,

296
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Speaker 1: I'm not sure I do. None of us are rich

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Speaker 1: enough to know that. But just opened my wallet. I

298
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Speaker 1: know it's But but again, back in the day, they

299
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Speaker 1: used to make him a lot bigger. Ten thousand bush

300
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Speaker 1: was the biggest one. Yeah, So assuming that this box

301
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Speaker 1: with five million bucks in it was in ten thousand dollars, denominations.

302
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Speaker 1: My back of the envelope calculation is that that would

303
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Speaker 1: be a hundred ten pounds. Well that's a lot of bucks,

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Speaker 1: and of course you know it's you know, yeah, My

305
00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:36,520
Speaker 1: calculation is that if if it was a hundred dollar bills,

306
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Speaker 1: it would weigh a little over a ton. Soy box.

307
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Speaker 1: But asked as for where he got these, well, this

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Speaker 1: is the Philippines, you know, ohmishly just gold and all

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Speaker 1: that stuff. You pronounced it right this time, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: but this is this box was one of twelve, which

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Speaker 1: would mean about six billion dollars. Again, as you ask

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Speaker 1: where did you get it? Well, it could have been

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Speaker 1: from ships, I mean because my ron of course was

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Speaker 1: looking for yamash she is gold. And uh if what

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Speaker 1: he said about those twelve boxes of cash, it's true

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Speaker 1: that it sounds like he found part of it. Because

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Speaker 1: as they all know, the Japanese and World War two

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Speaker 1: and before World War two were looting East Asia of everything.

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Speaker 1: They would go to the banks and I'm sure carry

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Speaker 1: away all the bank notes. They all everybody's jewelry, their

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Speaker 1: silver candelabra and you know, their rings and gold coins,

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Speaker 1: silver coins, everything, jewels, And that was Yamashita's gold and

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Speaker 1: supposedly just about all of it wound up in the Philippines.

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Speaker 1: And we've actually covered that story, talked about this story,

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Speaker 1: yeah years ago, actually was it was a couple of

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Speaker 1: years ago. Yeah. Uh. And of course, as if you

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Speaker 1: listen to that episodes, you know, towards the end of

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Speaker 1: the war, there was some efforts to transport all that

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Speaker 1: stuff back to Japan because it did look like the

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Speaker 1: Philippines were going to fall to the to the Allies,

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Speaker 1: and so, uh, it had to be transported back to Japan.

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Speaker 1: So what to set it on? Walships and submarines of course,

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Speaker 1: and they're apparently around Menta now there are a lot

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Speaker 1: of sunken ships and submarines, so it's kind of uh

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Speaker 1: worth taking a look at them, I suppose. So that

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Speaker 1: might be where I found it. If they if they

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Speaker 1: got a ship or something that's got these crates of cash,

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Speaker 1: and he's found this thing and salvage these crates. Okay,

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00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:10,760
Speaker 1: that could be one potential source of it, or maybe

340
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Speaker 1: he was just b sing. I don't know, it could

341
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Speaker 1: be that too. In fact, I'm kind of betting on that.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, that would be sealed really well, to have

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Speaker 1: survived underwater, not necessarily. My understanding about the way things

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Speaker 1: work is underwater is that you can leave it down

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Speaker 1: there as long as you want. It's the process when

346
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Speaker 1: you bring it back to the surface. You've got to

347
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Speaker 1: manage that process kind of carefully. Sinization and separation and

348
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Speaker 1: drying is time consumer expensive. Otherwise it just it turns

349
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Speaker 1: to dust. Yeah, and so that's why I'm that's why

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Speaker 1: I'm curious about that part. But well, it might have

351
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Speaker 1: been something else too. I mean, there's not just on ships.

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Speaker 1: It could have been buried in a a cave somewhere. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: It also could have explained why maybe you know, maybe

354
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Speaker 1: he knew where it was. He had you know, a

355
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Speaker 1: friend who was guarding it, lived on a boat above

356
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Speaker 1: it or something like that. He brought you know, one

357
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Speaker 1: box up at a time. Yeah, and it was a

358
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Speaker 1: very slow process. It would explain why he was staying

359
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Speaker 1: at kind of a crappy hotel. Actually have the money yet,

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00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:16,919
Speaker 1: you know, Okay, I can behind that. Yeah, maybe that's it.

361
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Speaker 1: I don't know, um, but that's our that's so far

362
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Speaker 1: that the only treasure we know for sure that he

363
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Speaker 1: found it. We're pretty sure he didn't actually find that

364
00:18:26,920 --> 00:18:29,159
Speaker 1: he also had supposed to supposedly partnered up with the

365
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Speaker 1: Manila based group of people. That's you see a lot

366
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Speaker 1: of this in a story. There's this shadowy group of

367
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Speaker 1: people who aren't exactly named, and you don't exactly find out.

368
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Speaker 1: But these are the ones that I said had links

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Speaker 1: to this white supremacist group back in the US and

370
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Speaker 1: also to the neo Nazi Party of the United States.

371
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Speaker 1: And I'm not sure why he joined up with these people.

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Speaker 1: Um it might be needed capital, or maybe they just

373
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Speaker 1: had information that they needed, or maybe they just were

374
00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:53,400
Speaker 1: like the mob and they just muscled in on the operation.

375
00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:54,919
Speaker 1: Maybe they were the only ones who know how to

376
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Speaker 1: desalinate money. They could be that too. They might have

377
00:18:57,280 --> 00:18:59,680
Speaker 1: had some skills that didn't get a lot of experience. Well,

378
00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:01,800
Speaker 1: there was you know, another thing, there was some some

379
00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:06,960
Speaker 1: some messages between him and his demolition experts where the

380
00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:09,880
Speaker 1: demolition experts was talking about him the handling this situation.

381
00:19:09,920 --> 00:19:12,439
Speaker 1: He described what sounds to me like the guy was

382
00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:16,679
Speaker 1: talking about maybe unexploded dealing with unexploded ordinance, which if

383
00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:19,919
Speaker 1: you're salvaging a warship that's sunken, there's probably gonna be

384
00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:22,040
Speaker 1: some bombs in our chillery shows and stuff like that

385
00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:24,160
Speaker 1: on board of that ship. Hell, to this day, they're

386
00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:31,160
Speaker 1: still finding minds in Britain in backyards. But yeah, but

387
00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:33,840
Speaker 1: unexploded bombs, Oh yeah, they find them all the time,

388
00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:36,639
Speaker 1: I mean still and uh, and so you've gotta be

389
00:19:36,680 --> 00:19:39,720
Speaker 1: real careful with that stuff, obviously. According to the same

390
00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:42,240
Speaker 1: guy I mentioned, David Hawthorne before it was a friend

391
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Speaker 1: of my Rings. My Ring was afraid of his new partners,

392
00:19:45,280 --> 00:19:48,919
Speaker 1: these shadowy Minila based people. He said to Hawthorne that

393
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Speaker 1: his life was in danger, and that's my Ring's life,

394
00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:53,600
Speaker 1: and that it had something to do with the treasure.

395
00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:56,399
Speaker 1: That kind of vague stuff. But so the question, of

396
00:19:56,400 --> 00:19:59,400
Speaker 1: course is why didn't he leave the country. Well, apparently

397
00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:01,600
Speaker 1: wanted you get a stranger before he left the country.

398
00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:04,600
Speaker 1: Maybe too, I don't know, Yeah, me too. Yeah, I

399
00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:06,480
Speaker 1: suppose i'd risk my life for that kind of cash

400
00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:10,640
Speaker 1: and why not. Yeah I probably would, or at risk

401
00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:14,120
Speaker 1: somebody's life. Yeah, yeah, definitely definitely your life, for sure,

402
00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:18,160
Speaker 1: I know you would. That's that's okay, I don't mind.

403
00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:21,760
Speaker 1: But it doesn't make sense though, what's that this this

404
00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:24,840
Speaker 1: whole he's recovering all of this treasure, because why he

405
00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:27,680
Speaker 1: was he giving it away? Well, that's it. I mean,

406
00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:30,119
Speaker 1: why would you if you've only recovered one crate of

407
00:20:30,240 --> 00:20:33,040
Speaker 1: cash and turn around and you give it to Nelson Mandela.

408
00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:35,640
Speaker 1: I'm sorry that it was a great guy, by the way,

409
00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:40,600
Speaker 1: deserved it. But if it's all your money, you're operating capital,

410
00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:42,359
Speaker 1: that's a problem. Does not make a lot of sense

411
00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:45,119
Speaker 1: to me either. I'm sorry. I'm a selfish guy. I

412
00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:47,399
Speaker 1: would keep it for me. Of course, maybe it was

413
00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:49,720
Speaker 1: a bad batch. You know, we brought this up wrong

414
00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:51,520
Speaker 1: and it's it's all turned to crap. So I'm gonna

415
00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:55,120
Speaker 1: generously give it to some of the else maybe look

416
00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:58,640
Speaker 1: at all this. Yeah, yeah, so that's when he's supposedly doing.

417
00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:01,359
Speaker 1: He's looking for treasure and came back, like I said

418
00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:05,520
Speaker 1: to Dabo in mid December two thousand one, and uh,

419
00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:07,360
Speaker 1: as I said before, he always did. At the ever

420
00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:09,520
Speaker 1: Being hotel. When he showed up the last time I

421
00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:12,280
Speaker 1: checked in, he brought these two large metal boxes with him.

422
00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:15,800
Speaker 1: When we're talking large, I don't know how large. Bigger

423
00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:18,280
Speaker 1: than a bread box, a little bigger than a bread box,

424
00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:21,160
Speaker 1: I think, but still smaller than a refrigerator. Still big

425
00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:23,920
Speaker 1: enough or small enough that somebody could carry it. Yeah,

426
00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:26,080
Speaker 1: I think so, Yeah, they were. I got the impression

427
00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:28,320
Speaker 1: that he kept files in there, like like information on

428
00:21:28,320 --> 00:21:33,000
Speaker 1: it was like bankers boxes. I'm thinking about that size,

429
00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:34,960
Speaker 1: but I've never seen a picture of them, so I

430
00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:37,560
Speaker 1: can't tell you. Actually, they kind of got blown up anyway.

431
00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:41,119
Speaker 1: So yeah, but these were padlocked, and they were He

432
00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:44,080
Speaker 1: told three different hotel employees that the boxes should not

433
00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:46,960
Speaker 1: be touched, not at all. These must have been the

434
00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:49,560
Speaker 1: room cleaners, and apparently he said that to them repeatedly,

435
00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:52,520
Speaker 1: said hey, whatever you do, don't touch those boxes. Don't

436
00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:55,399
Speaker 1: even touch them. And and actually I think that this

437
00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:57,480
Speaker 1: is not a rumor because these three people actually signed

438
00:21:57,480 --> 00:21:59,960
Speaker 1: AFFI David stating this. So and that's probably one of

439
00:21:59,960 --> 00:22:02,120
Speaker 1: the few solid pieces of information we've got to work

440
00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:05,200
Speaker 1: with here. So there's something about them boxes that was important.

441
00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:07,199
Speaker 1: Other than that, we don't know much about what he

442
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:10,280
Speaker 1: was doing. My Ring was busted about a week before

443
00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:13,199
Speaker 1: the bomb went off for passing counterfeit US cash and

444
00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:15,359
Speaker 1: as a result of this, his hotel room was searched

445
00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:18,399
Speaker 1: by police, and in another telling the story, Philippine intelligence

446
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:21,359
Speaker 1: had an eyem because they were suspicious because he kept

447
00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:24,719
Speaker 1: bringing in these metal boxes into his hotel, so so

448
00:22:24,760 --> 00:22:26,760
Speaker 1: there were a lot more. I don't know if he

449
00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:29,119
Speaker 1: was bringing them and then taking him out and bringing

450
00:22:29,160 --> 00:22:31,600
Speaker 1: them back or what they were, like the equivalent of

451
00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:34,040
Speaker 1: his briefcases. Yeah, he didn't have enough. I don't think

452
00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:35,560
Speaker 1: more than two at a time, and they were probably

453
00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:38,240
Speaker 1: the same ones. But maybe he was swapping him. But

454
00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:41,000
Speaker 1: but again, we don't know that this is true either

455
00:22:41,040 --> 00:22:43,760
Speaker 1: that either the part about his arrest or them, well,

456
00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:46,720
Speaker 1: part about him getting caught with the counterfeits and the

457
00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:50,119
Speaker 1: police coming by and looking over his place apparently is true.

458
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:52,040
Speaker 1: That seems to be documented, but I'm not a hundred

459
00:22:52,040 --> 00:22:54,720
Speaker 1: percent even sure about even that. And then I said

460
00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:58,639
Speaker 1: Doty did complain about the search because apparently Michael Myering

461
00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,440
Speaker 1: was not totally operative when the police showed up the

462
00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:05,320
Speaker 1: searches room. Most people aren't, though, yeah, I wouldn't be. Well, yeah, well,

463
00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 1: they searches room. Apparently they didn't find the steel boxes,

464
00:23:08,400 --> 00:23:10,680
Speaker 1: so he must have booed them. He might have moved

465
00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:13,159
Speaker 1: into the bathroom because apparently he wouldn't let the police

466
00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:16,119
Speaker 1: search the bathroom when the police expressed an interest in

467
00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:17,920
Speaker 1: the bathroom he said, no, you can't go in there.

468
00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:19,880
Speaker 1: It's out of order. I've got a red north Face

469
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:23,160
Speaker 1: bag in there. Yeah. Well the corps said it, and

470
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:25,480
Speaker 1: you can't go in Yeah. I love I love it

471
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:27,720
Speaker 1: chili last night. You don't want to go in there.

472
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 1: It's out of order. Yeah, I know whatever. Whatever. Apparently

473
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:33,119
Speaker 1: that maybe he slipped in somebody. I don't know, but

474
00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:35,080
Speaker 1: I do know where I'm keeping my murder weapons and

475
00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:38,040
Speaker 1: all my contraband. I'm keeping it in my bathroom. Yeah,

476
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,000
Speaker 1: of course, at least if I'm living in the Philippines.

477
00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:42,159
Speaker 1: And as we all know, about a week after that,

478
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:45,720
Speaker 1: he was nearly killed in that explosion in his room. Uh.

479
00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:47,560
Speaker 1: Some of the things they found in the wreckage, besides

480
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 1: bits and pieces of the bomb, uh, they also found

481
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:52,679
Speaker 1: some pieces of old U s currency, kind of like

482
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:56,360
Speaker 1: those old banknotes we were talking about. Was there all?

483
00:23:56,520 --> 00:23:57,920
Speaker 1: This is? This is where I want to ask a

484
00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:01,719
Speaker 1: question about counterfeit money, because I thought that counterfeit cash

485
00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:04,960
Speaker 1: or remnants of counterfeit cash had also been found in

486
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:08,280
Speaker 1: the room post explosion. Am I correcting that? Or am

487
00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:11,080
Speaker 1: I there's some accounts about that it was red remnants

488
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:13,639
Speaker 1: of account Okay, again, the reporting on this one is

489
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:18,720
Speaker 1: just so slapdash. Uh. They also found an ID card

490
00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:22,040
Speaker 1: from the Moral National Liberation Front AC. Sure you've heard

491
00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:24,880
Speaker 1: of those guys, If we haven't, well, if you haven't, well,

492
00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:27,000
Speaker 1: the MML office a group that's they're part of the

493
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 1: Muslim separatist movement in the Philippines. Okay, Yeah, so they're

494
00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:33,439
Speaker 1: as a group that's part of the Muslim separatist movement

495
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,720
Speaker 1: in the Philippines. This ID card had Michael Mariray's name

496
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:39,840
Speaker 1: and photograph on it, along with the birthday September seven, teenth,

497
00:24:40,080 --> 00:24:43,199
Speaker 1: nine five, which would make him about sixty six when

498
00:24:43,240 --> 00:24:45,399
Speaker 1: he got blown up. And what was he doing with

499
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:47,320
Speaker 1: that card? Do you ask? Well, I don't know. Well,

500
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 1: my question is why do they even make ID cards

501
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:53,680
Speaker 1: that I don't know either. That's a good question, isn't it.

502
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:55,639
Speaker 1: Isn't it kind of like a class fed as a

503
00:24:55,720 --> 00:25:01,480
Speaker 1: terrorist organization? Well, they're not. They weren't. They weren't covert. Yeah,

504
00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:04,000
Speaker 1: they weren't as extreme as some of the other organizations.

505
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:07,959
Speaker 1: Like there's a few others like another ABUSA is another

506
00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:10,920
Speaker 1: group that's sort of advocating for a separate Muslim state

507
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,760
Speaker 1: in the Philippines and they are classified as a terrorist

508
00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:15,800
Speaker 1: organization because well, they use a lot of violence for

509
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:18,680
Speaker 1: one thing, and they're advocating actual separatism, and that's true

510
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,320
Speaker 1: re estate and everything. There's a lot of a lot

511
00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:26,000
Speaker 1: of acronyms things in this story. So sorry, I didn't

512
00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:29,760
Speaker 1: mean to say that they were terrorists, but but I

513
00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:32,720
Speaker 1: I still don't understand necessarily why. Yeah. They Well, actually

514
00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:36,840
Speaker 1: the government signed a peace agreement with the separatists, and

515
00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:40,280
Speaker 1: I think and they establish essentially established gave them some

516
00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:44,080
Speaker 1: limited regional autonomy. I see, and uh, and so they

517
00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:46,720
Speaker 1: were more or less it was probably the equivalent of,

518
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:49,200
Speaker 1: you know, kind of like a passport to get into

519
00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:51,960
Speaker 1: their territory. Well it might it might have been a

520
00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:55,640
Speaker 1: way to, yeah, to be in the territory at least unmolested,

521
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:58,679
Speaker 1: you know, travel. You know, this certifies that, you know,

522
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:00,960
Speaker 1: the local government knows you're there and it's okay. Yeah,

523
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:02,720
Speaker 1: they're equivalent of the t s A has said, this

524
00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:04,560
Speaker 1: guy's fine, he's good, let him in and out and

525
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 1: as he pleases. That could be what it was, And

526
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:08,640
Speaker 1: I'm not really sure he could have just gone out

527
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:10,639
Speaker 1: of the local quickie. Martin got himself a fake I

528
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:15,600
Speaker 1: d I don't know. But but but also besides this,

529
00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 1: this did raise a few eyebrows, of course, but apparently

530
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:19,920
Speaker 1: this came out in the press. Apparently my Ring had

531
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:23,320
Speaker 1: some shitty connections to some other groups as well. According

532
00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:26,040
Speaker 1: to the Middle of Times, he had ties with of course,

533
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:29,080
Speaker 1: all sorts of government officials in Minda now, which is

534
00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:32,400
Speaker 1: where Davo is of course, and also the Philippine National Police.

535
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:35,320
Speaker 1: It was a kind of like their FBI, I guess, uh.

536
00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:37,120
Speaker 1: And of course the MNL, as I said, but also

537
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:40,320
Speaker 1: the MILF, the m I l L, the m I

538
00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:43,679
Speaker 1: l F, which is the Moral Islamic Liberation Front. They

539
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:48,040
Speaker 1: like the MLF, but they're they're actually more religious versus secular.

540
00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 1: And of course obviously I have as I said, we

541
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:54,359
Speaker 1: are hardcore. These guys are affiliated with ISIS considered the

542
00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:57,879
Speaker 1: Filipino chapter of ISIS uh. And of course also the

543
00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:02,000
Speaker 1: New People's Arming, which is the communist guy that the

544
00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:06,280
Speaker 1: communist insurgency in the Philippines. So all these different things,

545
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:09,439
Speaker 1: it's like alphabet soup. And I would have never guessed

546
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,520
Speaker 1: that the Philippines was such a hotbed of activity with

547
00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 1: all these different organizations fighting for control. Yeah, it kind

548
00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:20,920
Speaker 1: of is, and it feels very nineteen fifties nineteen sixties

549
00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:23,199
Speaker 1: to me with all of this, all of these groups

550
00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:27,280
Speaker 1: battling for control. Aren't the Philippines pretty strategic? They're like

551
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:29,679
Speaker 1: a pretty good spot to be if you want to

552
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:31,840
Speaker 1: do anything in the world, Right, Yeah, they're kind of are.

553
00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:33,760
Speaker 1: They're down there close to all the shipping lanes and

554
00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:36,000
Speaker 1: you know, so in East Asia and all these things.

555
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,760
Speaker 1: That's why we have this relationship with us and with them.

556
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:41,159
Speaker 1: I mean, it's because you know, they're they're valuable allies

557
00:27:41,160 --> 00:27:43,160
Speaker 1: in other ways, but also they're just a great land

558
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:45,960
Speaker 1: based to base our fighters and our ships and everything else.

559
00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: So yeah, it's kind of a key strategic area. So yeah,

560
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:50,679
Speaker 1: and this is one of the reasons I kind of

561
00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:53,720
Speaker 1: questioned the false flag operation because it's like, you know, okay,

562
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:55,320
Speaker 1: so US we're gonna go in there, We're gonna plant

563
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:58,440
Speaker 1: some bombs, We're gonna just stir up this hornet's nest

564
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:00,639
Speaker 1: even more. Now, is that really a good idea in

565
00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:03,160
Speaker 1: a place like this place where you want to have

566
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:05,680
Speaker 1: a foothold a place where you know, do you really

567
00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:09,119
Speaker 1: want to stir that hornet's nest anymore? But maybe I

568
00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:10,880
Speaker 1: will talk about that a little bit more to the theories.

569
00:28:11,359 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 1: But as it's pretty obvious so and not all these

570
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:15,879
Speaker 1: groups that he's supposedly had all these shadowy ties to

571
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:20,120
Speaker 1: are necessarily compatible. Uh. And also none of these connections

572
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,360
Speaker 1: was really well documented. They're just basically hearsay, loose talk

573
00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:25,680
Speaker 1: that's printed in the paper. So I have no idea.

574
00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:28,159
Speaker 1: If it's true he was really seriously connected to all

575
00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:31,800
Speaker 1: these groups, then this mystery may be significant, especially when

576
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 1: you consider the potential possible involvement of the U. S. Government.

577
00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:36,199
Speaker 1: The question is is we don't know if any of

578
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:38,440
Speaker 1: this stuff is really true. You have to be kind

579
00:28:38,440 --> 00:28:41,840
Speaker 1: of a mastermind level negotiator to have INDs and friendships

580
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:44,280
Speaker 1: with all of these groups and not have them all

581
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:46,920
Speaker 1: mad at him for being associated with the others, you

582
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:49,040
Speaker 1: know what I mean? Uh? Well, I mean, and it

583
00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 1: could have been something that's obviously maybe he had contacts

584
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:53,600
Speaker 1: with them in order. Well, I'm going to be like,

585
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:55,720
Speaker 1: this is territory that you guys kind of considered to

586
00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: be your territory, So I'm going to be looking for

587
00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:02,320
Speaker 1: sucking treasure kind of a very think is yours. So

588
00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 1: I just want to know who to bribe, making sure

589
00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:08,320
Speaker 1: he's not trespassing, Yeah, making sure just sort of want

590
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:09,760
Speaker 1: to clear out with the locals. It could have been

591
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 1: as simple as that, And maybe he did have some

592
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 1: sort of contacts along those those lines, maybe because I'm

593
00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 1: sure in some of these countries, I'm sure we would

594
00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 1: look at it as well. I want to look for

595
00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 1: sucking treasure out the U. S. Coast. I'll talk to

596
00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:23,320
Speaker 1: the U. S. Government about it, and that's that. Well,

597
00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:24,560
Speaker 1: it doesn't work that way in the rest of the

598
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: world when there's seven organizations claiming the same hunker ground. Yeah,

599
00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: it turns out even in America, it doesn't always work

600
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:32,400
Speaker 1: that way, you know, they really doesn't. Actually, just in

601
00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:34,480
Speaker 1: the federal government itself, you'll probably have to negotiate with

602
00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:36,760
Speaker 1: seventeen other organisms and then you probably you know, state

603
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 1: in local governments as well, and then some other things too,

604
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:43,360
Speaker 1: and probably you and probably any probably some local Indian

605
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 1: tribes and you know who knows. But yeah, So what

606
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 1: exactly was my Michael Myering up to? That is why

607
00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 1: we call this is a Michael Myering mystery. That's what

608
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:53,960
Speaker 1: it's called. In the Philippines. As I said, was he

609
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:57,280
Speaker 1: just looking for Yamashita's gold or was he really working

610
00:29:57,280 --> 00:30:01,360
Speaker 1: for the CIA or with some terror risk groups or

611
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:04,280
Speaker 1: was he a master bombmaker or was he just a

612
00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 1: mule or maybe a handler for covert sources and what

613
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,280
Speaker 1: was he doing there? That's our story. Now it's time

614
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 1: for some theories, all right. Theory number one, Michael Myrin

615
00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:18,400
Speaker 1: was a CIA agent part of a false flag operation,

616
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,040
Speaker 1: as do tear Take claims. I think we kind of

617
00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 1: covered this a little bit, well a little bit, yeah,

618
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:25,200
Speaker 1: of course, you know was as we know, the Abbi

619
00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:28,400
Speaker 1: morxteriously showed up. They flew him out of Davo three

620
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,560
Speaker 1: days after the explosion, and later on you get him

621
00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:33,200
Speaker 1: out of the country and they allowed him to live.

622
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 1: I'm molested in the United States for years afterwards. Right,

623
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:41,000
Speaker 1: as a citizen, even a naturalized citizen, is still a citizen.

624
00:30:41,080 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 1: He's still a citizen. I still got rights. And so yeah,

625
00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:46,480
Speaker 1: they didn't raise a finger to do anything about him

626
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:48,760
Speaker 1: or send him back to the Philippines to face justice.

627
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:50,680
Speaker 1: It might have been a good reason for well, yeah,

628
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:53,040
Speaker 1: I was gonna say that the Philippines justice maybe is

629
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:56,200
Speaker 1: not percent in line with what like you would think

630
00:30:56,240 --> 00:31:01,200
Speaker 1: American justice, maybe especially in these days human rights violations. Yeah, well,

631
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:03,920
Speaker 1: especially these days, you know, with all the death squads

632
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:06,320
Speaker 1: you keep hearing about, you know, and uh. But of course,

633
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,040
Speaker 1: on the other hand, myring was a US citizen who've

634
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:11,200
Speaker 1: been injured in something that looked like a terrorist bombing.

635
00:31:11,240 --> 00:31:14,840
Speaker 1: And you forget this is only months after Night eleven, right, Yeah, So,

636
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 1: like I said, I would assume that my government would

637
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 1: come get me. You would assume that they would at

638
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:22,080
Speaker 1: least come in and ask a few questions. Right, yeah,

639
00:31:22,080 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 1: that's so that's why the FBI showed up and uh,

640
00:31:24,480 --> 00:31:26,720
Speaker 1: and and showing up at the hospital too, doesn't seem

641
00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:29,280
Speaker 1: too outrageous to me. And as far as moving him

642
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 1: to the hospital Manila, well, one of the reasons apparently

643
00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 1: is a hospital and Dabo was not an approved provider

644
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:37,320
Speaker 1: under under Miring's insurance. Oh yeah, you don't want to

645
00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:40,240
Speaker 1: be out of network when you've got a catastrophic injuries

646
00:31:41,360 --> 00:31:43,440
Speaker 1: that I would imagine like that that you know, spending

647
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:46,800
Speaker 1: a bunch of time in the burning, it's probably very spending. Yeah. Yeah.

648
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 1: It could also be that Manila hospital maybe had a

649
00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 1: better burning. It might be that the hospital back in

650
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:55,360
Speaker 1: San Diego had an even better burn unite. Likely yeah, yeah,

651
00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:58,240
Speaker 1: But according to the US ambassador who gave an interview,

652
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:00,920
Speaker 1: I think in two thousand five or some time, the

653
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 1: movie was made on the advice of his doctors and Dabo.

654
00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:05,600
Speaker 1: The master also said the local police at that time

655
00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:07,760
Speaker 1: it actually showed no interest in Miiring. No matter what

656
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 1: do Terrte is actually saying. All that stuff really showed

657
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:13,400
Speaker 1: up in the press later. This is again according to

658
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 1: the ambassador, it wasn't happening at the time. This just

659
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:18,440
Speaker 1: showed up in the press later. It's kind of a snowball.

660
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 1: Longer the story goes on, the bigger it gets. Yeah,

661
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 1: of course, what a big a big name like de Tarty,

662
00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:25,360
Speaker 1: it gets involved in it. Then it gets bigger still

663
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:27,400
Speaker 1: because that's a that's a news story in and of itself,

664
00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:30,080
Speaker 1: and all that stuff gets recycled again through the news cycle.

665
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 1: And there might have been an ulterior motive too. Maybe

666
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:36,000
Speaker 1: the embassy felt that if he was suspected of wrongdoing

667
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:38,000
Speaker 1: or lawbreaking, that it would be best to get him

668
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:41,160
Speaker 1: out of Dabo and away from du Terte, because, let's

669
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:44,480
Speaker 1: face it, his his due process. His consideration for the

670
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 1: idea of due process is not very strong. I was

671
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:50,600
Speaker 1: going to say, his burden of proof seems way it does,

672
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:53,400
Speaker 1: and so maybe that's what it was. And they felt

673
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 1: that he'd get better do process somewhere else in the Philippines.

674
00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 1: And of course they couldn't publicly say that, and that's

675
00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:01,880
Speaker 1: not his athlete that kind of thing. It's not diplomatic

676
00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:04,680
Speaker 1: to say that sort of really, but as far as also,

677
00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:06,239
Speaker 1: but then there's that whole thing about getting him out

678
00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:07,760
Speaker 1: of the country. And again I saw this in an

679
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,000
Speaker 1: interview with the U. S Ambassador's name is France's uh

680
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:16,600
Speaker 1: Rickie alone, you're the Italian here, Devon, what do you think? Okay,

681
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:18,720
Speaker 1: that was in the minda news. I guess that's shut

682
00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:23,240
Speaker 1: from Minta. Now. The ambassador said that my Ring actually

683
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 1: left the Philippines in a bow board way. He was

684
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:27,920
Speaker 1: stamped out by the Bureau of Immigration. Those are the

685
00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 1: guys at the airport. I don't know if you've been

686
00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:30,960
Speaker 1: to the countries where you have to be stamped out.

687
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:34,280
Speaker 1: Some of them you have to be stamped out and

688
00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:37,800
Speaker 1: they stamp you in and out. They do, and they're

689
00:33:37,840 --> 00:33:40,440
Speaker 1: the guys that they checked. They check the list to

690
00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 1: make sure that you're on the do not let them

691
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,040
Speaker 1: leave lists. You know you're not on that list, And yeah,

692
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 1: they check to make sure you're not on that list.

693
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:51,160
Speaker 1: And according to the ambassador, the authorities stamped them out

694
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:53,480
Speaker 1: and had no issue with him leaving the country. I

695
00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:56,880
Speaker 1: can't imagine, right, You've got a guy on a stretcher

696
00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:01,000
Speaker 1: or something. He's got no legs, bandaged that from recent amputation.

697
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:03,880
Speaker 1: His body is totally wrapped up because he's got third

698
00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:07,000
Speaker 1: degree burns everywhere, he's you know, drugged up, and you're like,

699
00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 1: we need to do an interview with this guy for

700
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:14,640
Speaker 1: business or pleasure. Yeah, yeah, I think you're going to

701
00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:17,279
Speaker 1: stamp him out probably probably you know, let him be

702
00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:22,799
Speaker 1: somebody else's you know, doctor expenses. Yeah, totally. Yeah. But yeah,

703
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:25,600
Speaker 1: So apparently the charges weren't filed until after he had left,

704
00:34:25,680 --> 00:34:27,520
Speaker 1: or if they were filed before he had left, apparently,

705
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 1: and this happens a lot in the government. I don't

706
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:30,839
Speaker 1: know what's like in the Philippines. Often one hand doesn't

707
00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:33,000
Speaker 1: know what the other hand is doing. May well be

708
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:35,080
Speaker 1: that they just hadn't quite got a run and notifying

709
00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:36,880
Speaker 1: the guys at the airport that this guy was not

710
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:40,320
Speaker 1: supposed to leave the country, or maybe somebody just got bribed.

711
00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:43,320
Speaker 1: I don't know. Apparently, the Philippine government didn't actually officially

712
00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:47,800
Speaker 1: notify the US government of these charges against Michael Myering

713
00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,880
Speaker 1: until January two thousand five. Wait, wait when did the

714
00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:55,319
Speaker 1: explosion take place? And May two thousand two, almost three

715
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:58,480
Speaker 1: years later, they they finally notified because there was a

716
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:00,640
Speaker 1: lot of stuff in the papers. It was a big controversy.

717
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:01,880
Speaker 1: But as far as I guess, as far as the

718
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 1: government goes, they can't just say, hey, you know, the

719
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:06,800
Speaker 1: US citizen, we're reading some bad stuff about you in

720
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:08,600
Speaker 1: the papers in the Philippines, so we're gonna put you

721
00:35:08,640 --> 00:35:10,440
Speaker 1: on the next plane, and you've got you better go

722
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 1: back there and sort that stuff out. That's not the

723
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:15,399
Speaker 1: way it works, really. Yeah, And it's hard to tell,

724
00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:18,319
Speaker 1: you know, I don't. I couldn't tell, but maybe you

725
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:21,000
Speaker 1: guys could. What the status of his health was for

726
00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:24,960
Speaker 1: the remainder of his life and injuries like that, sometimes

727
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:27,080
Speaker 1: you can just be in bad health until the end.

728
00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:29,840
Speaker 1: I mean, he didn't live too terribly. I mean it

729
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:33,759
Speaker 1: was ten years longer or something like that. I have heard.

730
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:36,680
Speaker 1: Also alternatively he died in two thousand six and two

731
00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:39,200
Speaker 1: thousand tens yeah, he could have died, so he essentially

732
00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:42,440
Speaker 1: fell off the radar. And so I can imagine, you know,

733
00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:45,440
Speaker 1: also that like, you know, unless you can really prove

734
00:35:45,920 --> 00:35:49,640
Speaker 1: that this citizen of the United States is really guilty

735
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:51,880
Speaker 1: of something, we're not gonna send him. You know, I'm

736
00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:53,239
Speaker 1: not going to get him on a plane for all

737
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:57,319
Speaker 1: this emotional stress. That's ridiculous. Yeah and so so, and

738
00:35:57,320 --> 00:36:01,319
Speaker 1: it's gonna have a physical toll on him. Oh yeah, definitely,

739
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:04,680
Speaker 1: flying flying from the US clear that side of the world,

740
00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:06,800
Speaker 1: it does take a toll on even if you're healthy,

741
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:11,080
Speaker 1: that long plane flight. Oh my god. Yeah. So that's

742
00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:12,800
Speaker 1: These are some of the reasons I'm a little skeptical

743
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:16,680
Speaker 1: about this whole CIA shadowy US government involvement sort of thing.

744
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 1: Another problem I have with this idea is just the

745
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:21,040
Speaker 1: way admiring what about things. I mean, he kept a

746
00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:23,520
Speaker 1: bomb in his frigging hotel room. It does not make

747
00:36:23,560 --> 00:36:26,280
Speaker 1: a lot of sense because I saw not only in safe,

748
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:29,719
Speaker 1: but it's not good operational security. For one thing, it's

749
00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:33,600
Speaker 1: very damning evidence. If you get caught has been all

750
00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:35,840
Speaker 1: these bombings and suddenly you're caught with a bomb that

751
00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:38,759
Speaker 1: doesn't look good. Yeah, and so I can't believe that

752
00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:43,040
Speaker 1: somebody who's with the CIA would do something that ridiculous. Also,

753
00:36:43,600 --> 00:36:46,279
Speaker 1: you know, it's unclear what would have set it off

754
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 1: if it were just so unstable. But that's another good

755
00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:50,759
Speaker 1: reason to not keep a bomb in your room, is

756
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:53,840
Speaker 1: that it might go off and you might lose your legs.

757
00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 1: That's a good reason. And well, the other thing is

758
00:36:56,040 --> 00:37:00,000
Speaker 1: that age CIA agents, if he was, don't go around

759
00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:04,719
Speaker 1: telling people their CIA agents, which he did. Was he

760
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:07,680
Speaker 1: said it was they were Christians and christ in Action

761
00:37:07,800 --> 00:37:14,440
Speaker 1: or something what it stood for. No, no, no salt

762
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:16,879
Speaker 1: would do you know what? That's just like those guys

763
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:21,200
Speaker 1: who are the FBI shirts the female body inspector, the

764
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:23,760
Speaker 1: same thing, and they're like, oh yeah, I'm in the FBI,

765
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:26,319
Speaker 1: Like Chris, Yeah, it's the same. I need to get

766
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:30,759
Speaker 1: me one of them. No, well, actually, joke you like

767
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:35,080
Speaker 1: to get punched in the face because that might happen. Yeah.

768
00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:37,799
Speaker 1: And the other thing I really kind of questioned about this.

769
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:40,879
Speaker 1: If he was a super secret agent with bomb bomb

770
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:43,360
Speaker 1: making materials in his room, he went out of his

771
00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 1: way to call attention to those boxes to at least

772
00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:49,320
Speaker 1: three hotel employees, which also doesn't seem like a breadcast.

773
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:51,959
Speaker 1: What you're really doing is you're really letting those guys

774
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:54,319
Speaker 1: know that there's either something dangerous or something really really

775
00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:57,640
Speaker 1: valuable inside those boxes, which guys kind of increases the

776
00:37:57,719 --> 00:38:01,200
Speaker 1: likelihood they're gonna get stolen. You to distract people or

777
00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:06,320
Speaker 1: divert people from your thing of important not pointed out. Yeah,

778
00:38:06,440 --> 00:38:08,279
Speaker 1: so that that kind of flies in the face of

779
00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:10,360
Speaker 1: reason to keep secret stuff in your room to begin with,

780
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:12,520
Speaker 1: but then also to call so much attention to it

781
00:38:12,520 --> 00:38:14,360
Speaker 1: just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. And

782
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:16,000
Speaker 1: then and then last of all, of course, what was

783
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:17,960
Speaker 1: the purpose? As I already said, you know, the purpose

784
00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:23,160
Speaker 1: was to genna public antagonism towards certain groups. Well maybe,

785
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:25,799
Speaker 1: but it doesn't make any sense though. Well, yeah, like

786
00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:27,839
Speaker 1: we said, if if the US wants to be there,

787
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:31,839
Speaker 1: doesn't make any sense to just get everybody hot under

788
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:36,239
Speaker 1: the collar and and try and tip over whatever regimes

789
00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:40,720
Speaker 1: are in place. Because I disagree with that. Yeah, yeah,

790
00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:43,960
Speaker 1: I feel like a really great way to destabilize an

791
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 1: area is to really bring the heat on a bunch

792
00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:49,239
Speaker 1: of you know, get a bunch of organizations really really

793
00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:51,759
Speaker 1: mad at each other, and then somehow come in and

794
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:55,879
Speaker 1: say like, whoa, well, we're peacekeepers. Let's let's talk about

795
00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:59,520
Speaker 1: this and bring it back down. Get that going. That's

796
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:01,400
Speaker 1: a great it's a great theory and great I like

797
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 1: that idea, except I don't think we would be accepted

798
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:06,440
Speaker 1: as an honest broker in the Philips from Oh No,

799
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:08,399
Speaker 1: I absolutely agree with that. I'm just saying as a

800
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 1: general theory of coming into a place like we've done

801
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:15,120
Speaker 1: that other places. I know we've done that a lot,

802
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:17,680
Speaker 1: But what I'm saying is that it doesn't appear that

803
00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:21,839
Speaker 1: we would get any benefit from doing that. Yeah, it's

804
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:24,120
Speaker 1: it's well, it's one of those things in this particular location,

805
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:25,799
Speaker 1: it's one of the well, it's one of those things too,

806
00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:29,840
Speaker 1: where unforeseen consequences and all that. You go, you go

807
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:32,359
Speaker 1: stare on the pot like that things might turn out

808
00:39:32,360 --> 00:39:33,800
Speaker 1: the way you want to, but there's a lot of

809
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:36,560
Speaker 1: variables and things might turn out way way worse than

810
00:39:36,560 --> 00:39:39,319
Speaker 1: you want them to be, so you know, probably best

811
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:43,000
Speaker 1: to keep your hands off. So again, I'm not saying

812
00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:45,160
Speaker 1: this is impossible, but I really have a hard time

813
00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:49,279
Speaker 1: buying this theory. I would be wholeheartedly being this. Okay, see,

814
00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:51,960
Speaker 1: I see, I operated we're gonna rule that out. Okay,

815
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:54,880
Speaker 1: what else? Uh? Next theory number two, he was a

816
00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:57,520
Speaker 1: freelance terrorist doing it for his own reason, or maybe

817
00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:00,879
Speaker 1: he was under the pay of some terrorist group which

818
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:04,040
Speaker 1: would name some of these things. I really don't see

819
00:40:04,040 --> 00:40:06,359
Speaker 1: a motive except for maybe sheer union bomb er fun.

820
00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:08,879
Speaker 1: Maybe just maybe he liked to do this kind of thing,

821
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:11,160
Speaker 1: although it seems like got to be smart to carry

822
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:13,200
Speaker 1: out a bombing campaign like in your own home country

823
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:15,400
Speaker 1: where you blend in a lot better, you know, I

824
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:19,319
Speaker 1: mean it does you know, unless Michael Myron really hated

825
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:21,040
Speaker 1: Filipinos and he really wanted to blow a lot of

826
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:23,600
Speaker 1: Filipinos up. Maybe that was saying it's kind of a

827
00:40:23,680 --> 00:40:27,319
Speaker 1: racist action. Could be that it's part Yeah, maybe maybe

828
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: some Filipino was, you know, like like beat up his

829
00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:31,160
Speaker 1: dad when he was a kid and he's hated him

830
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:33,360
Speaker 1: ever since. I don't know. Yeah, I don't know either. Yeah,

831
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 1: that's that's stretching. Well it is. And also there's lots

832
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:38,560
Speaker 1: of if you want to stay in the US, there's

833
00:40:38,560 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 1: lots of Filipinos living here, so there wouldn't mean a

834
00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:43,239
Speaker 1: shortage of targets really. So as far as him doing

835
00:40:43,239 --> 00:40:45,120
Speaker 1: it for his own reasons. I can't really see that

836
00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:47,880
Speaker 1: working for some shadowy group. There was a lot of

837
00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:51,400
Speaker 1: shadowy groups there, but really, why would they hire him.

838
00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:53,279
Speaker 1: I mean, he didn't have any special skills as far

839
00:40:53,320 --> 00:40:56,719
Speaker 1: as I know, unless it wasn't a retired spy now

840
00:40:56,840 --> 00:40:59,080
Speaker 1: and he didn't have judgment. What I see it is

841
00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:02,160
Speaker 1: his bomb making skills were not that fat. Well he

842
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:06,120
Speaker 1: blew himself up. Yeah, yeah, And so the only thing,

843
00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:08,000
Speaker 1: the only thing I could see where he would be

844
00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:12,160
Speaker 1: useful to them would be as a useful idiot. And

845
00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:14,640
Speaker 1: there are such people out there. Maybe he was the

846
00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:17,560
Speaker 1: useful idiots. Guys are really into your cause. What could

847
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:19,799
Speaker 1: I do and say, dude, yeah that's okay, that make

848
00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:22,359
Speaker 1: some bombs and blow blow some people here, here, here,

849
00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 1: and here. Maybe that's possible. He could have been a

850
00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:27,759
Speaker 1: useful idiot. Well, and that ends up kind of being

851
00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:29,960
Speaker 1: its own false flag thing, right, because you've got this

852
00:41:30,080 --> 00:41:33,120
Speaker 1: like dumb American, he's making bombs, and then you can

853
00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:35,080
Speaker 1: come in and say, look at what the Americans are doing.

854
00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:37,160
Speaker 1: It could have been that got to get him out.

855
00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:38,839
Speaker 1: That would be That would be the best part about

856
00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 1: it is if you are one of these shadowy groups

857
00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, and you want to you know,

858
00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:44,560
Speaker 1: have you know, have a cut out. He'd be the

859
00:41:44,560 --> 00:41:46,440
Speaker 1: perfect cutout because you could just say, like you said, oh,

860
00:41:46,440 --> 00:41:49,160
Speaker 1: he's an American obviously, C I A and the CIA

861
00:41:49,280 --> 00:41:51,200
Speaker 1: is like, you know, they're don't get me started on

862
00:41:51,239 --> 00:41:54,480
Speaker 1: these guys, because I've got my own differences with these guys,

863
00:41:54,520 --> 00:41:56,799
Speaker 1: because I'm sure we all do. But they are sort

864
00:41:56,840 --> 00:42:00,520
Speaker 1: of the handy, the handy, just all around bad guy.

865
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:02,960
Speaker 1: You know, they're kind of like in the movies. It's like, well,

866
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,319
Speaker 1: C oil companies to farmer companies to C I A.

867
00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:08,440
Speaker 1: You know, it's always you know, it always is you know,

868
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:12,120
Speaker 1: it's it's it's kind of almost insulting to your intelligence. Yeah,

869
00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:14,200
Speaker 1: I can't really see him being involved with these people

870
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:16,719
Speaker 1: because I don't know why they would want him, why

871
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:19,080
Speaker 1: they would need him. I mean, these are these again,

872
00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:21,520
Speaker 1: these are people who are perfectly capable of making their

873
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:24,880
Speaker 1: own bombs. So I don't really get it. And as

874
00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:28,200
Speaker 1: far as the m L M MLF card that he had, again,

875
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:29,680
Speaker 1: as I said earlier, that could have just been a

876
00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:32,160
Speaker 1: fake idea that he got somewhere or or had a

877
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:36,480
Speaker 1: very very standard reason for having it. Sure might have

878
00:42:36,520 --> 00:42:38,760
Speaker 1: made travel in that part of the country more easier.

879
00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:41,160
Speaker 1: I don't know. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna

880
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:42,680
Speaker 1: kick that one of the curb and say that there

881
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:46,040
Speaker 1: is no good either. Let's go to another one here. Okay,

882
00:42:46,040 --> 00:42:49,200
Speaker 1: theory number three. Uh, he was a treasure hunter, but

883
00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:52,439
Speaker 1: uh and he actually did have something valuable, like say,

884
00:42:52,440 --> 00:42:55,680
Speaker 1: treasure maps or something in those boxes, but he booby

885
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:58,799
Speaker 1: trapped them and accudentally boot flew himself up, you know.

886
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:04,839
Speaker 1: And are they possible? Yeah? Why why why would you

887
00:43:05,440 --> 00:43:10,680
Speaker 1: booby trap something like that instead of hiding it somewhere,

888
00:43:11,560 --> 00:43:14,239
Speaker 1: you know, rather than carrying a booby trapped thing that

889
00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:17,840
Speaker 1: could go off on you at any time. Why wouldn't

890
00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:21,000
Speaker 1: you just dig a secret hole under the third tree

891
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:24,480
Speaker 1: to the right, and there's that I uh, well, you know,

892
00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:26,719
Speaker 1: and that's that makes more sense to me. Why I

893
00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:29,120
Speaker 1: keep that stuff like in a safe deposit box at

894
00:43:29,120 --> 00:43:31,920
Speaker 1: the bank, you know, although maybe that's what he was doing,

895
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:34,600
Speaker 1: you know, I mean maybe, and this could be why

896
00:43:34,640 --> 00:43:38,040
Speaker 1: he kept calling attention to those boxes that had patent

897
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:40,239
Speaker 1: bocks and everything, you know, because and like you say,

898
00:43:40,320 --> 00:43:42,719
Speaker 1: to what the other things about about having that is,

899
00:43:42,760 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 1: you know, if it does work, then you come on

900
00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:46,279
Speaker 1: one day and somebody's trying to break into your box

901
00:43:46,280 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 1: and there's this huge, bloody mess in your room. Yeah,

902
00:43:49,200 --> 00:43:51,319
Speaker 1: you gotta clean that up. Oh yeah, and plus the

903
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:54,040
Speaker 1: police might show up too, and then the whole thing

904
00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:58,760
Speaker 1: is literally no pun intended, blown. Yeah, but yeah, really serious.

905
00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:02,000
Speaker 1: But maybe he kept he actually did keep his secret

906
00:44:02,040 --> 00:44:05,640
Speaker 1: documents and whatever somewhere else, and the boxes were just

907
00:44:05,719 --> 00:44:08,000
Speaker 1: a decoy and you thought, well, I'll just put a

908
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:09,920
Speaker 1: bomb in there because and think, if you think about it,

909
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 1: nobody's gonna come in there and cut the locks off

910
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:16,160
Speaker 1: the boxes and open the boxes in the room. Not likely.

911
00:44:16,280 --> 00:44:18,399
Speaker 1: Probably they got to steal the boxes, take them back

912
00:44:18,400 --> 00:44:20,520
Speaker 1: to their place, and then cut the locks off, and

913
00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:23,080
Speaker 1: then in that case they blow themselves up. So maybe

914
00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:24,759
Speaker 1: that was kind of it. Maybe he just saw ha

915
00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:28,680
Speaker 1: ha ha. Yeah, it's it's somebody that somebody get blown up,

916
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:31,680
Speaker 1: you know, by my bomb, by stealing my stuff. I mean,

917
00:44:31,680 --> 00:44:34,960
Speaker 1: that's that That would that would make more sense. Although

918
00:44:35,160 --> 00:44:37,680
Speaker 1: you know, even then, of course, you still have a problem,

919
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:40,040
Speaker 1: which is that if you've got a bomb, and especially

920
00:44:40,040 --> 00:44:42,040
Speaker 1: if your bomb making skills are not at the highest

921
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:46,320
Speaker 1: order and maybe made yourself an ammonium nitrate fuel oil bomb,

922
00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:50,080
Speaker 1: and you're thinking that the explosive in there is more

923
00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:52,759
Speaker 1: stable than it actually is, you know, and then one day,

924
00:44:52,920 --> 00:44:55,200
Speaker 1: you know, just accidentally, you want your box and co

925
00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:58,239
Speaker 1: bluely off it goes correct me if I'm wrong, but

926
00:44:58,360 --> 00:45:01,640
Speaker 1: if not made well, it's a rather volatile mix and

927
00:45:02,280 --> 00:45:08,080
Speaker 1: temperature and humidity and static electricity apparently can even or shock,

928
00:45:08,360 --> 00:45:10,400
Speaker 1: you know. And that's actually one of the theories that

929
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:12,400
Speaker 1: the police had is that is that the two boxes

930
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:14,759
Speaker 1: were side by side and he might have flipped open

931
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:17,280
Speaker 1: the cover on the middle cover on the one box

932
00:45:17,320 --> 00:45:19,400
Speaker 1: and it banged down on the cover on the other

933
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:21,680
Speaker 1: box and had the bomb in it, and that was

934
00:45:21,840 --> 00:45:24,400
Speaker 1: enough to set it off. Yeah, so you know, it

935
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:26,600
Speaker 1: could be that he had a bomb in there and

936
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:28,960
Speaker 1: it just was a little more unstable than he realized.

937
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:30,960
Speaker 1: And so let's see. So I'm kind of like in

938
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:33,279
Speaker 1: that theory a little better than the first two. Um,

939
00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:37,480
Speaker 1: still it's got some issues. Yeah, or another one another

940
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:41,000
Speaker 1: possibility is a theory number four is he was a

941
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:43,480
Speaker 1: treasure hunter, but he blew himself up opening a treasure

942
00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:45,840
Speaker 1: box that he had found that had been booby trapped

943
00:45:45,880 --> 00:45:50,720
Speaker 1: by somebody else badly attempted, poor, poor attempt to diffuse. Yeah,

944
00:45:51,440 --> 00:45:53,959
Speaker 1: so this is possible if he truly was a treasure hunter.

945
00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:56,000
Speaker 1: That the only issues I have with this I think,

946
00:45:56,000 --> 00:45:58,560
Speaker 1: as I mentioned, he had already had some talk about

947
00:45:58,600 --> 00:46:01,640
Speaker 1: hiring some demos and experts to help him with issues

948
00:46:01,680 --> 00:46:03,719
Speaker 1: like this. Yeah, so I'm kind of questioning why he

949
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:06,359
Speaker 1: would bring a box back to his hotel room. Well,

950
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:08,200
Speaker 1: just by the way, this is a legitimate theory that's

951
00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:10,440
Speaker 1: been been put forth by people like in the press,

952
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:13,600
Speaker 1: So I'm not just making this up. I was just

953
00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:15,839
Speaker 1: gonna say, I don't think I see it in here.

954
00:46:15,920 --> 00:46:19,279
Speaker 1: Is there there's not the theory that the boxes were

955
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:22,279
Speaker 1: indeed bombs, but that he was trying he was like

956
00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:24,880
Speaker 1: keeping them to go use them on a cave or

957
00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:27,279
Speaker 1: something like that. And he had taken the boxes, you know,

958
00:46:27,520 --> 00:46:29,480
Speaker 1: to his demolition expert and said, Okay, rig me a

959
00:46:29,520 --> 00:46:32,080
Speaker 1: bomb and then I'll take it to the cave and

960
00:46:32,120 --> 00:46:33,719
Speaker 1: then I'll blow it because I don't want anybody to

961
00:46:33,719 --> 00:46:36,400
Speaker 1: know where my cave is, right, so I'm gonna go

962
00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:38,399
Speaker 1: by myself. So I'll take these, I'll take him back

963
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:41,080
Speaker 1: to my room. Then i'll take them and then he

964
00:46:41,360 --> 00:46:45,239
Speaker 1: I don't know, accidentally blew himself up somehow. That is

965
00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:48,600
Speaker 1: a possibility to Yeah, but that you know, he didn't

966
00:46:48,600 --> 00:46:50,560
Speaker 1: make the bomb, he didn't really know how unstable it was.

967
00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:52,520
Speaker 1: He went to fuss with it, but he was going

968
00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:56,200
Speaker 1: to use it for a legitimate demolition purpose. Yeah, possible. Um.

969
00:46:56,480 --> 00:46:58,760
Speaker 1: I still if it were me, I would go rent

970
00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:01,160
Speaker 1: a storage unity. If it were me, I would too,

971
00:47:01,239 --> 00:47:03,040
Speaker 1: But that's what I would do. You know, I'm not

972
00:47:03,120 --> 00:47:05,960
Speaker 1: a dummy if he was going to use it too.

973
00:47:06,080 --> 00:47:09,239
Speaker 1: Is you're saying devon do demolition on a site to

974
00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:12,160
Speaker 1: recover something. I would think that it would be much

975
00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:16,920
Speaker 1: simpler to just go acquired dynamite rather than some kind

976
00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:20,960
Speaker 1: of what appears to be a home assembled bomb. I

977
00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:24,840
Speaker 1: don't know what this guy was doing, or I'm just

978
00:47:24,840 --> 00:47:29,120
Speaker 1: saying it out there as a thing in an illogical theory. Yeah,

979
00:47:29,160 --> 00:47:31,680
Speaker 1: none of this is really logical though. I mean, there's

980
00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 1: no real good reason for this to have happened, so

981
00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 1: just adding another one to the pile. Yeah, it's kind

982
00:47:36,719 --> 00:47:39,200
Speaker 1: of hard to really make total sense of this story,

983
00:47:39,520 --> 00:47:42,560
Speaker 1: honest with you. The but your theory is it works

984
00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:45,279
Speaker 1: except for me, it doesn't really make sense to me

985
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:48,240
Speaker 1: that somebody would make a bomb and arm the bomb

986
00:47:49,120 --> 00:47:51,120
Speaker 1: and then stash it away into their bed or something.

987
00:47:51,200 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 1: That doesn't make sense. But again, maybe this guy was

988
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:55,879
Speaker 1: complete well, he might not have really known. I mean,

989
00:47:56,440 --> 00:47:59,120
Speaker 1: you know, I guess in my in my mind it's

990
00:47:59,200 --> 00:48:02,320
Speaker 1: you know, he gets the bomb from the demolitions expert

991
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:03,560
Speaker 1: and he said, you know, how do I arm it?

992
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:05,160
Speaker 1: And he says, oh, yeah, you do it like this,

993
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:07,200
Speaker 1: and he was okay, cool, and then he's sitting in

994
00:48:07,200 --> 00:48:10,480
Speaker 1: his room and he's like, I don't I think I'm

995
00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:12,880
Speaker 1: gonna just try it, and maybe he's maybe it's like,

996
00:48:12,880 --> 00:48:14,839
Speaker 1: you know, if I wait until I'm actually out there

997
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:17,239
Speaker 1: to arm it, I will have forgotten. So I'm going

998
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:20,799
Speaker 1: to do one of them, yeah, or like okay, I

999
00:48:20,840 --> 00:48:23,279
Speaker 1: think it's this and then accidentally did it and was

1000
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:25,839
Speaker 1: like oh lips. And then there's that's why if you're

1001
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:28,040
Speaker 1: not the explosives expert, you hire the guy and you

1002
00:48:28,120 --> 00:48:30,000
Speaker 1: bring him along in your little and then you pay

1003
00:48:30,080 --> 00:48:33,120
Speaker 1: him really well, and it's well yeah, yeah, and so

1004
00:48:33,200 --> 00:48:35,279
Speaker 1: that's but that is a possibility yet that he had

1005
00:48:35,320 --> 00:48:37,560
Speaker 1: some legitimate purpose for them, but he was just a

1006
00:48:37,640 --> 00:48:39,399
Speaker 1: screw up in the hand I don't know that there's

1007
00:48:39,520 --> 00:48:43,160
Speaker 1: like a legitimate purpose for a bomb like this. Sometimes

1008
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:47,040
Speaker 1: there are certain certain civilian to have a bomb like this. Well,

1009
00:48:47,080 --> 00:48:48,560
Speaker 1: that might have been one reason he needed to like,

1010
00:48:48,640 --> 00:48:51,920
Speaker 1: you know, do it on the on the d L. Yeah. Yeah,

1011
00:48:52,080 --> 00:48:53,640
Speaker 1: But back to the theory that he was opening up

1012
00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:57,040
Speaker 1: a treasure chest, that's fine. This gets back again to

1013
00:48:57,120 --> 00:49:00,480
Speaker 1: our demolition experts. He was he was talking about tracting

1014
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:04,320
Speaker 1: with these guys to have them handle these delicate operations.

1015
00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 1: What's you know, having to do with ordnance, And you

1016
00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:08,719
Speaker 1: would think that those would be the guys that you

1017
00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:12,120
Speaker 1: would task with opening up these boxes that potentially have

1018
00:49:12,239 --> 00:49:15,720
Speaker 1: been booby trapped, because, let's let's face it, that wouldn't

1019
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:19,439
Speaker 1: be a shock. You know that Japanese had had left

1020
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:22,040
Speaker 1: these crates in a cave somewhere. You would expect them

1021
00:49:22,040 --> 00:49:24,839
Speaker 1: to be booby trapped, wouldn't you. Yeah? I sure would so,

1022
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:26,480
Speaker 1: and I but still, why do you take it back

1023
00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:29,960
Speaker 1: to your hotel and probably the box open there a

1024
00:49:30,040 --> 00:49:34,040
Speaker 1: little continental breakfast, the mooby trapped bob. It sounds like

1025
00:49:34,040 --> 00:49:37,200
Speaker 1: a normal morning to me. I mean, you know, I

1026
00:49:37,239 --> 00:49:40,680
Speaker 1: guess part of this could be, but um, he thought

1027
00:49:40,760 --> 00:49:44,200
Speaker 1: they were diffused or maybe or maybe he actually had

1028
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:46,080
Speaker 1: watched them do it enough he thought, hey, I can

1029
00:49:46,120 --> 00:49:49,040
Speaker 1: do this piece of cake. Yeah. Still, if that's the case,

1030
00:49:49,560 --> 00:49:52,160
Speaker 1: grossly irresponsible to take it back to your hotel to

1031
00:49:52,280 --> 00:49:54,040
Speaker 1: do it, and you want to do it somewhere a

1032
00:49:54,080 --> 00:49:57,360
Speaker 1: little more isolated than that, I would. Yeah, although you know,

1033
00:49:57,480 --> 00:49:59,879
Speaker 1: well he's going to blow himself up either way, right right,

1034
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:02,280
Speaker 1: pretty much, Actually it works out better for him because

1035
00:50:02,320 --> 00:50:04,480
Speaker 1: if it's somewhere more isolated, he probably just bleeds to

1036
00:50:04,520 --> 00:50:06,799
Speaker 1: death before the paramedics show up. So you know, then

1037
00:50:07,200 --> 00:50:11,440
Speaker 1: maybe that's why he did maybe Yeah, but yeah, I'm

1038
00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:13,759
Speaker 1: an hard time believing that he would actually be dumb

1039
00:50:13,840 --> 00:50:17,280
Speaker 1: enough I mean that to do this. Again, I didn't

1040
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:19,200
Speaker 1: really know the guy. Maybe he was just that time.

1041
00:50:19,280 --> 00:50:21,719
Speaker 1: But the guy was an oncologist. This is not a

1042
00:50:21,719 --> 00:50:25,320
Speaker 1: low i Q person. Although there are there's book smarts

1043
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:29,000
Speaker 1: in their street smarts. There's all between the two. Well,

1044
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:31,120
Speaker 1: I know, I know there are definitely people out there

1045
00:50:31,239 --> 00:50:33,840
Speaker 1: higher high high i Q with not a lick of sense.

1046
00:50:34,320 --> 00:50:38,239
Speaker 1: You know, it's really really true. Uh So that's yet

1047
00:50:38,280 --> 00:50:41,520
Speaker 1: another theory down. Let's go to another theory here, which

1048
00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:44,400
Speaker 1: is that he was indeed a treasure hunter. But as

1049
00:50:44,400 --> 00:50:46,360
Speaker 1: we all know, he kind of fell in with that crowd,

1050
00:50:46,440 --> 00:50:50,960
Speaker 1: the shadow Evenola group. Whichever one of the seven there are,

1051
00:50:51,080 --> 00:50:53,800
Speaker 1: whichever one of these what these people they were, I mean, again,

1052
00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:58,960
Speaker 1: this is more potentially BS, I don't know, But this

1053
00:50:59,000 --> 00:51:01,680
Speaker 1: is the thing about this about this story is that

1054
00:51:01,960 --> 00:51:05,320
Speaker 1: it's about the treasure. And as you all know, whenever

1055
00:51:05,360 --> 00:51:08,680
Speaker 1: the word treasure comes up, immediately clouds of BS immediately

1056
00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:11,440
Speaker 1: rise up out of the round to surround the entire story. Right,

1057
00:51:11,680 --> 00:51:13,280
Speaker 1: That's one of the things that makes them so fun,

1058
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:15,720
Speaker 1: I mean, because you hear these really fun, cool theories

1059
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:18,359
Speaker 1: about it. But so later on sorting out the weeks

1060
00:51:18,360 --> 00:51:20,919
Speaker 1: from the chap makes it really really hard. But this

1061
00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:25,080
Speaker 1: this group of people, for reasons unbeknownst, decided that they

1062
00:51:25,080 --> 00:51:28,279
Speaker 1: would just you know, double across him and plant Obama's room.

1063
00:51:28,360 --> 00:51:31,120
Speaker 1: So maybe that's maybe that's what happened. Again, and you know,

1064
00:51:31,200 --> 00:51:33,880
Speaker 1: the absence of any evidence, and we don't even know

1065
00:51:33,920 --> 00:51:36,120
Speaker 1: who these people were, if they even exist, it's kind

1066
00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:38,040
Speaker 1: of hard to credit this theory. I mean, you know,

1067
00:51:38,080 --> 00:51:41,400
Speaker 1: if he had a shadow organization partner, they figure, all right,

1068
00:51:41,440 --> 00:51:45,520
Speaker 1: he's the treasure hunter. He can find the treasure. And finally,

1069
00:51:45,800 --> 00:51:49,719
Speaker 1: you know, on this day he finds a treasure and

1070
00:51:48,560 --> 00:51:52,239
Speaker 1: they say, okay, well you take these two boxes as

1071
00:51:52,239 --> 00:51:55,960
Speaker 1: your finder's fee. Right there. You know, they all look

1072
00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:59,440
Speaker 1: the same, right He opens one and it's got millions

1073
00:51:59,480 --> 00:52:01,480
Speaker 1: of dollars, and he says, okay, I'll take two boxes

1074
00:52:01,520 --> 00:52:04,399
Speaker 1: in my finder's fee, no problem, And they hand him

1075
00:52:04,440 --> 00:52:06,480
Speaker 1: one that's a bomb, so that he can't ever, so

1076
00:52:06,560 --> 00:52:08,400
Speaker 1: they can double cross him. Yeah, I mean, you know,

1077
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:12,319
Speaker 1: so that they know ostensibly get rid of him, get

1078
00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:16,000
Speaker 1: rid of any evidence, and also they are free to

1079
00:52:16,080 --> 00:52:18,520
Speaker 1: just do whatever they want with the money, and there's

1080
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:21,120
Speaker 1: no one who's not part of the organization who knows

1081
00:52:21,160 --> 00:52:23,319
Speaker 1: about it or where it was or anything like that.

1082
00:52:23,960 --> 00:52:26,480
Speaker 1: And then he you know, sitting in his hotel room

1083
00:52:26,480 --> 00:52:28,360
Speaker 1: thinking oh yeah, I have this money, and go to

1084
00:52:28,440 --> 00:52:30,120
Speaker 1: open this box that opens it into the bomb and

1085
00:52:30,200 --> 00:52:32,799
Speaker 1: blows him up but doesn't actually quite do his job,

1086
00:52:32,880 --> 00:52:36,040
Speaker 1: doesn't quite kill him that but at least in that

1087
00:52:36,080 --> 00:52:38,200
Speaker 1: case of with the fear of God, and because he

1088
00:52:38,239 --> 00:52:41,360
Speaker 1: didn't squeal on anybody, not that we know of, you

1089
00:52:41,560 --> 00:52:43,600
Speaker 1: think could have a motive, because i mean, obviously this

1090
00:52:43,719 --> 00:52:46,000
Speaker 1: cost him pretty dearly. Although you know, it is. It

1091
00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:49,360
Speaker 1: is entirely possible that let's just presume for a second

1092
00:52:49,360 --> 00:52:52,480
Speaker 1: that the scenario that Devon just ran through is what happened.

1093
00:52:52,920 --> 00:52:56,319
Speaker 1: It's entirely possible that he squealed, but he did it

1094
00:52:56,360 --> 00:53:02,480
Speaker 1: to the US government and they used that information in

1095
00:53:02,560 --> 00:53:06,439
Speaker 1: some manner for the manner you know, then we don't

1096
00:53:06,480 --> 00:53:08,600
Speaker 1: you know, we're like, oh, he obviously didn't squeal because

1097
00:53:08,640 --> 00:53:12,239
Speaker 1: nothing happened. Maybe stuff did happen, Yeah, and it's just

1098
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:15,400
Speaker 1: it's never been informed about. It's clever enough that we

1099
00:53:15,480 --> 00:53:18,399
Speaker 1: never knew. Yeah, it's entirely possible. It might be that

1100
00:53:19,200 --> 00:53:21,600
Speaker 1: they were actually able to sus out a connection between

1101
00:53:21,600 --> 00:53:25,520
Speaker 1: the previous bombings in the Philippines and the bomb makings

1102
00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:28,040
Speaker 1: that were found, the fragments that were left found. Maybe

1103
00:53:28,480 --> 00:53:30,759
Speaker 1: and maybe the Philippines and the US government just sort

1104
00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:32,880
Speaker 1: of quietly worked it up behind the scenes and everybody

1105
00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:35,600
Speaker 1: was satisfied, and they just didn't tell the president. Well,

1106
00:53:37,520 --> 00:53:39,480
Speaker 1: he wasn't the president at that time, you know that,

1107
00:53:40,040 --> 00:53:42,600
Speaker 1: it wasn't. It wasn't until fairly recently he became president.

1108
00:53:42,760 --> 00:53:46,280
Speaker 1: It's true. Yeah, and so, and I got a feeling

1109
00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:48,560
Speaker 1: that he's got a kind of a big ego, and

1110
00:53:48,640 --> 00:53:51,200
Speaker 1: that part of it is his outrage was just his

1111
00:53:51,280 --> 00:53:53,560
Speaker 1: feeling that he'd been left out of the loop. I'm

1112
00:53:53,560 --> 00:53:55,400
Speaker 1: not going to say, but all I canna say is

1113
00:53:55,440 --> 00:53:58,399
Speaker 1: that he's duly elected at the Filipino people want him,

1114
00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:01,319
Speaker 1: then more power to him. So let's come down to

1115
00:54:01,320 --> 00:54:04,279
Speaker 1: our bottom line here on this story. Whatever it is

1116
00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:06,520
Speaker 1: about this bomb, wherever it came from, I think he

1117
00:54:06,560 --> 00:54:09,160
Speaker 1: had some guilty knowledge of it, because you were, as

1118
00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:11,799
Speaker 1: you were recalled, he did reportedly at least tell the

1119
00:54:11,840 --> 00:54:14,759
Speaker 1: police while he was still bleeding and being taken from

1120
00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:17,839
Speaker 1: the room, say, oh, somebody through a grenade in here?

1121
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:20,520
Speaker 1: Is there any chance that there could have been a

1122
00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:25,000
Speaker 1: grenade that set off a bomb? Yeah? Good question. But

1123
00:54:25,080 --> 00:54:27,760
Speaker 1: I tend to think that these guys, I mean, these

1124
00:54:27,960 --> 00:54:31,360
Speaker 1: these demolitions experts, these guys are kind of like cs

1125
00:54:31,440 --> 00:54:33,760
Speaker 1: I for bomb scenes. And there's a lot of bombs

1126
00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:36,000
Speaker 1: that go off in the Philippines, so you guys probably

1127
00:54:36,000 --> 00:54:38,120
Speaker 1: know their stuff. I just wonder if there was a

1128
00:54:38,120 --> 00:54:39,759
Speaker 1: bomb in his room, and I see what you're saying,

1129
00:54:39,760 --> 00:54:42,440
Speaker 1: that somebody lobbed a grenade in there. I don't know,

1130
00:54:42,520 --> 00:54:44,680
Speaker 1: if I don't know if the bigger bomb would cover

1131
00:54:44,760 --> 00:54:47,399
Speaker 1: up all evidence that a grenade even was in there

1132
00:54:47,520 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 1: or what. I don't know. Sec Yeah, I see what

1133
00:54:50,600 --> 00:54:54,960
Speaker 1: you're saying. But grenades, like they create their own special

1134
00:54:55,000 --> 00:54:57,839
Speaker 1: kind of shrapnel, you know, And so I would think

1135
00:54:57,840 --> 00:54:59,840
Speaker 1: they would have been finding all these pieces of shrapnel

1136
00:55:00,200 --> 00:55:03,239
Speaker 1: in his body and around the room and stuff. That

1137
00:55:03,239 --> 00:55:06,160
Speaker 1: would be different. Was that what floor was here? I

1138
00:55:06,160 --> 00:55:08,279
Speaker 1: assume the third floor, room three oh five, but I

1139
00:55:08,320 --> 00:55:10,400
Speaker 1: don't know. Maybe and maybe in the Philippines, and I

1140
00:55:10,440 --> 00:55:12,480
Speaker 1: mean some places I hear they number them from the

1141
00:55:12,520 --> 00:55:15,520
Speaker 1: top floor down. So well, I mean I'm just thinking, Okay, well,

1142
00:55:15,560 --> 00:55:17,120
Speaker 1: that's why I was asking. I'm like, if he's on

1143
00:55:17,160 --> 00:55:19,359
Speaker 1: the third floor, you got a hell of an arm

1144
00:55:20,160 --> 00:55:22,520
Speaker 1: to throw. Unless somebody opened up the door to his

1145
00:55:22,640 --> 00:55:25,239
Speaker 1: room and chucked it in from the hallway, I I

1146
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:27,920
Speaker 1: automatically assumed they threw it through the window. Yeah, it

1147
00:55:27,960 --> 00:55:29,200
Speaker 1: could have been that. It could have been you know,

1148
00:55:29,239 --> 00:55:31,360
Speaker 1: you get the room next door and you just like

1149
00:55:31,400 --> 00:55:33,560
Speaker 1: sort of lean way out the window and fling it

1150
00:55:33,560 --> 00:55:36,640
Speaker 1: in the window next door. Now, I you know, I

1151
00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:38,279
Speaker 1: don't know, I know how I would do it. I

1152
00:55:38,280 --> 00:55:40,840
Speaker 1: would get the room next door. The subtle guy that

1153
00:55:40,880 --> 00:55:42,239
Speaker 1: I am, and I get a saws all and I

1154
00:55:42,239 --> 00:55:44,839
Speaker 1: would saw it. I would sade grenade sized hole through

1155
00:55:45,320 --> 00:55:48,279
Speaker 1: that connecting door and then just push a grenade or

1156
00:55:48,320 --> 00:55:50,880
Speaker 1: two through there, you know, And yeah, it would totally

1157
00:55:50,880 --> 00:55:53,480
Speaker 1: catch them off guard. They'd just be going, what's that?

1158
00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:59,240
Speaker 1: And then then hear this, they said, oh my god, grandad.

1159
00:56:00,440 --> 00:56:06,120
Speaker 1: Now just kidding anyway, they probably Honestly, I don't. I

1160
00:56:06,120 --> 00:56:08,240
Speaker 1: don't think that was a great and I think that

1161
00:56:08,760 --> 00:56:11,000
Speaker 1: I think that he was trying to mislead the police,

1162
00:56:11,040 --> 00:56:14,760
Speaker 1: which indicates to me that that he probably was blown

1163
00:56:14,800 --> 00:56:17,600
Speaker 1: up by his own bomb. But I don't think he

1164
00:56:17,640 --> 00:56:20,120
Speaker 1: was doing it for the CIA or some local terrorist group.

1165
00:56:21,000 --> 00:56:23,000
Speaker 1: And I don't think he was a master bomb maker,

1166
00:56:23,680 --> 00:56:26,359
Speaker 1: So maybe he was just playing with bombs for his

1167
00:56:26,360 --> 00:56:28,000
Speaker 1: own ends. I mean, there are people who do that.

1168
00:56:28,040 --> 00:56:29,480
Speaker 1: I mean, I knew a kid in high school who

1169
00:56:29,520 --> 00:56:31,520
Speaker 1: blew himself up making a bomb. Yeah, I knew a

1170
00:56:31,600 --> 00:56:34,000
Speaker 1: kid who all the serious damage to his hand. All

1171
00:56:34,040 --> 00:56:36,480
Speaker 1: of us knew somebody in high school to blew himself up,

1172
00:56:36,480 --> 00:56:38,719
Speaker 1: don't we. I mean, maybe you don't know. Maybe it's

1173
00:56:38,760 --> 00:56:41,440
Speaker 1: more of an older generation thing and kids today aren't

1174
00:56:41,440 --> 00:56:43,680
Speaker 1: so much into that stuff. But when I was a kid.

1175
00:56:43,680 --> 00:56:46,080
Speaker 1: It just seemed like every class had had a dead

1176
00:56:46,160 --> 00:56:49,440
Speaker 1: kid from a bomb. Yeah, he did kids from other stuff. Yeah. No,

1177
00:56:49,520 --> 00:56:50,960
Speaker 1: I was gonna say the one I knew didn't die,

1178
00:56:51,000 --> 00:56:55,360
Speaker 1: but he end up pretty good. Yeah, that's why I

1179
00:56:55,360 --> 00:56:58,440
Speaker 1: stay away from that stuff. Good idea, and all our listeners,

1180
00:56:58,480 --> 00:57:00,880
Speaker 1: you guys should do that too, So stay away from

1181
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:04,000
Speaker 1: the bombs. Uh. So. Yeah, I think that he knew

1182
00:57:04,000 --> 00:57:06,640
Speaker 1: something about that bomb, But beyond that, I just can't say.

1183
00:57:06,640 --> 00:57:09,279
Speaker 1: I don't think he was a super secret spy. I

1184
00:57:09,960 --> 00:57:12,120
Speaker 1: yea mystery to me, but yeah, so I think we

1185
00:57:12,120 --> 00:57:13,520
Speaker 1: can put that part of it to rest. He was

1186
00:57:13,640 --> 00:57:17,400
Speaker 1: not with the CIA. I don't know what the heck

1187
00:57:17,440 --> 00:57:21,160
Speaker 1: he was doing. I mean, there's just the reporting on

1188
00:57:21,200 --> 00:57:24,600
Speaker 1: this just makes it so tough. The Philippine reporting gets

1189
00:57:24,640 --> 00:57:28,800
Speaker 1: more and more inflammatory, to the point that I can't

1190
00:57:28,800 --> 00:57:33,040
Speaker 1: help but question every single statement that's made. Yeah, I know, so,

1191
00:57:33,160 --> 00:57:35,840
Speaker 1: I I really I don't know where I stand on

1192
00:57:35,920 --> 00:57:37,680
Speaker 1: this other than I feel bad that the guy was

1193
00:57:37,720 --> 00:57:41,280
Speaker 1: in the middle of an explosion. Yeah, yeah, I mean

1194
00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:43,320
Speaker 1: the but like you said, the reporting on it is

1195
00:57:43,400 --> 00:57:45,800
Speaker 1: such and I'm not saying that Filipino reporters are any

1196
00:57:45,800 --> 00:57:48,479
Speaker 1: worse than American, but they just went out and found

1197
00:57:48,520 --> 00:57:51,000
Speaker 1: some people who claimed to know this guy and just

1198
00:57:51,200 --> 00:57:53,880
Speaker 1: basically printed whatever bs these guys told him. And of course,

1199
00:57:53,960 --> 00:57:58,000
Speaker 1: Meiring himself might have been probably was a total BS

1200
00:57:58,120 --> 00:58:01,040
Speaker 1: artist himself, if he they did say all the things

1201
00:58:01,040 --> 00:58:02,959
Speaker 1: that he said, these things that he said to people,

1202
00:58:03,080 --> 00:58:07,960
Speaker 1: I mean, I think he was kind of yeah, and

1203
00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:09,800
Speaker 1: so it's kind of amazing this guy was telling these

1204
00:58:09,840 --> 00:58:12,520
Speaker 1: tall tales and then it turns into this international incident.

1205
00:58:12,640 --> 00:58:16,120
Speaker 1: Now our relationship with the Philippines is seriously kind of

1206
00:58:16,160 --> 00:58:21,160
Speaker 1: in question. It's like really, uh So, anyway, hopefully Rodrigo

1207
00:58:21,200 --> 00:58:23,920
Speaker 1: do Teritory, if you are listening to this episode, first

1208
00:58:23,920 --> 00:58:26,840
Speaker 1: of all, sponsor us on Patreon. Uh. Second of all,

1209
00:58:26,840 --> 00:58:28,880
Speaker 1: subscribe to leave us a rating. And third of all,

1210
00:58:29,040 --> 00:58:32,120
Speaker 1: you know, take take this all to heart. All right,

1211
00:58:32,160 --> 00:58:35,480
Speaker 1: that's about it. Um any any more theories on your

1212
00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:39,240
Speaker 1: guys part? Okay, UM, so you probably want to know

1213
00:58:39,320 --> 00:58:41,919
Speaker 1: you probably if you are do Territy or anybody else.

1214
00:58:41,960 --> 00:58:44,000
Speaker 1: You want to know our email address, Well, it is

1215
00:58:44,040 --> 00:58:48,080
Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways podcast at gmail dot com. It's by all

1216
00:58:48,120 --> 00:58:50,600
Speaker 1: means sent us your thoughts. Um. Also, you want to

1217
00:58:50,600 --> 00:58:52,640
Speaker 1: know where to find us because obviously you haven't found

1218
00:58:52,680 --> 00:58:54,800
Speaker 1: us yet because you're not listening to us, so end

1219
00:58:54,920 --> 00:58:59,280
Speaker 1: us on iTunes. Also, if you find us there, give

1220
00:58:59,320 --> 00:59:02,080
Speaker 1: us a rating and review. We love those five star ratings,

1221
00:59:02,080 --> 00:59:04,720
Speaker 1: please um. And also remember to down about the bad

1222
00:59:04,840 --> 00:59:07,360
Speaker 1: the bad reviews. Down about those guys please. Uh. You

1223
00:59:07,400 --> 00:59:10,040
Speaker 1: can also find us on streaming services like Stitcher that's

1224
00:59:10,040 --> 00:59:12,280
Speaker 1: a big one, uh, and a bunch of other ones.

1225
00:59:12,480 --> 00:59:16,200
Speaker 1: We have a website Thinking Sideways podcast dot com where

1226
00:59:16,240 --> 00:59:18,760
Speaker 1: you can also find our episodes, and there's also merch

1227
00:59:19,360 --> 00:59:21,000
Speaker 1: link over there on the right. You can buy mugs

1228
00:59:21,000 --> 00:59:23,920
Speaker 1: and t shirts and something else. I don't care. What

1229
00:59:24,040 --> 00:59:26,720
Speaker 1: else can you buy over there? Other things? Yeah, other

1230
00:59:26,800 --> 00:59:32,520
Speaker 1: things like cheaper, cheaper copro nightlights. Do we still sell those? Okay? Yeah? Uh?

1231
00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:36,880
Speaker 1: What else? We are on social media Facebook. You can

1232
00:59:36,920 --> 00:59:39,520
Speaker 1: find us out there thinking Sideways Podcast. We have a

1233
00:59:39,560 --> 00:59:42,640
Speaker 1: group and page. So like the page, but join the

1234
00:59:42,680 --> 00:59:45,280
Speaker 1: group and answer the questions. So you gotta answer the questions.

1235
00:59:45,280 --> 00:59:48,080
Speaker 1: Don't forget that. But yeah, lots of fun stuff going

1236
00:59:48,120 --> 00:59:50,520
Speaker 1: on in the group. We are on Twitter where we

1237
00:59:50,560 --> 00:59:55,120
Speaker 1: are thinking Sideways. What's going on on Twitter? Devn nothing? Okay? Perfect?

1238
00:59:55,160 --> 00:59:56,520
Speaker 1: That's why you want to be on Twitter with us.

1239
00:59:57,480 --> 01:00:00,280
Speaker 1: We are on Reddit, where we are again thinking side ways,

1240
01:00:00,560 --> 01:00:02,040
Speaker 1: and of course this is kind of a new thing.

1241
01:00:02,040 --> 01:00:05,840
Speaker 1: We're on Instagram, yeah, and our handle there is not

1242
01:00:06,120 --> 01:00:10,120
Speaker 1: thinking sideways. Our handle is thinking Sideways podcast again. It's

1243
01:00:10,160 --> 01:00:13,680
Speaker 1: thinking Sideways podcast everywhere but Twitter, yeah very much. Yeah

1244
01:00:13,720 --> 01:00:16,480
Speaker 1: so but yeah, there's somebody else called thinking sideways on Instagram.

1245
01:00:16,560 --> 01:00:19,200
Speaker 1: Ignore those guys. So that's about it for this week

1246
01:00:20,000 --> 01:00:23,600
Speaker 1: until next week whatever they still in say in the Philippines.

1247
01:00:23,720 --> 01:00:27,480
Speaker 1: This one was a blast. Bye, guys, dudes,