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Speaker 1: How d everybody. This is Chuck here on the Ranch

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Speaker 1: and How Stuff Work Studios and welcome to Saturday selects

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Speaker 1: April nine, two nine. We're going way back into the

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Speaker 1: archive for this one, how a Pons Schemes Will Work.

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Speaker 1: And honestly, I picked this one because I believe, I

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Speaker 1: believe this is the very first instance of me doing

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Speaker 1: my bad Italian accent. I think it started with this episode,

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Speaker 1: if I'm not mistaken, and it has since become such

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Speaker 1: a part of the show, and uh, I thought I

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Speaker 1: might as well repost this select episode from where it

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Speaker 1: all began. And not only that, but it's a really

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Speaker 1: interesting you know, it's a really interesting I'm falling into

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Speaker 1: it right now. Pons schemes, very very interesting topic and

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Speaker 1: um we we we get into it here we men.

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Speaker 1: Let you know how to be aware of him and

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Speaker 1: in the history behind it, there was a real Pons

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Speaker 1: you know that, all right? Learn all about it right now, everyone,

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Speaker 1: How Pons schemes work. Welcome to Stuff you should know

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Speaker 1: from How Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome to

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Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Josh Clark Chuck say Hi, Hi, welcome people.

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Speaker 1: This is stuff you should know. Indeed, Chuck's got his

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Speaker 1: um little jug of vodka. I got my Fresca and

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Speaker 1: we were ready to go. All right, Chuck, No, I

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Speaker 1: don't drink vodka wire Chuck, Chuck. Do you know how

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Speaker 1: we have these web blogs? Now? There's like a stuff

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Speaker 1: you should know, web blog, a k A blog. Yeah, sure, yeah,

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Speaker 1: if you want to be all hit or whatever. I

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Speaker 1: do know how we have that because I write on

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Speaker 1: it every day. I know. I was just starting a conversation,

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Speaker 1: Chuck layoff. Well, yes, sorry, Um remember that post I

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Speaker 1: put up yesterday that you said like you read three

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Speaker 1: times and still couldn't make heads or tails of Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I didn't get it. Well, there's a there's a part

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Speaker 1: of it, uh, kind of the crux of the whole thing.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if that's the case or not, but anyway,

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Speaker 1: there's an aspect of it. And it was about these um,

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Speaker 1: these two artists and um, well one of them just

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Speaker 1: goes by the name Arakawa, right, and his partner, and

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Speaker 1: I don't think just artistic partner. I think I think

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Speaker 1: that their life partners. Maybe her name is Madeline Gins, right,

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Speaker 1: and they have been quite successful at creating this architecture. Um,

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Speaker 1: that's intended to achieve immortality, right, how so well, the

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Speaker 1: way these two have done it is um by through surprising,

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Speaker 1: disturbing architectural choices. Right. Basically, their theory is that if

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Speaker 1: you create or if you live in an uncomfortable dwelling,

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Speaker 1: um discomfort or comfort leavest the laziness and sedentariness, and

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Speaker 1: then that's ultimately what kills you. Holly unproven, but they

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Speaker 1: designed their architecture based on that theory, so they keep

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Speaker 1: you uncomfortable, and uh, it's unfamil Earlier, I think I

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Speaker 1: know this. I think we actually have an article on this,

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Speaker 1: Like the floors are undulating, undulating floors and uh yeah,

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Speaker 1: I've heard of that. They also like um kind of

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Speaker 1: moonscape floors, um angled like ceilings. That just it doesn't

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Speaker 1: sound like a very pleasant place to live. Pretty interesting

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Speaker 1: that this one guy and these things go for there

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Speaker 1: there just to build them, they cost millions of dollars,

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Speaker 1: but they have built several. Most of them are lofts

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Speaker 1: in in Tokyo. And this one guy who lives in

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Speaker 1: one with his family said that he's lost like twenty

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Speaker 1: pounds and doesn't have hay fever any longer since he

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Speaker 1: moved in there. Yeah. Um, but there their their whole

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Speaker 1: firm is basically in jeopardy because they were heavily invested

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Speaker 1: with one Bernard made Off, who you may may have heard.

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Speaker 1: This guy's reach extends everywhere. We're talking Kevin Bacon, right,

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Speaker 1: and there's a six degrees joke in there somewhere. Um,

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Speaker 1: I imagine Kiras Sedgewick, since Kevin Bacon is in there,

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Speaker 1: Jaja Gabor, Spielberg, Spielberg, and that's just like the tip

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Speaker 1: of the iceberg, right, I mean, thousands and thousands of

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Speaker 1: people were invested with this guy and it turned out

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Speaker 1: he was a Ponzi schemer. That's right, it's a Ponzi scheme. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Chuck likes to say it like that in a tribute

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Speaker 1: to the Italian immigrant Mr Charles Ponzi, who was running

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Speaker 1: around in the twenties. And actually, yeah, you want to

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Speaker 1: talk a little bit about Mr Ponzi. Yeah, I didn't

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Speaker 1: know this until I read the article. Is pretty interesting,

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Speaker 1: and you know, Ponce's all over the news, so it's

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Speaker 1: kind of cool to get some background. Yeah. Oh, and

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Speaker 1: also we should probably say thanks to all the people

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Speaker 1: who wrote in and requested that we do this podcast, right,

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Speaker 1: this one's for you, right. Bernie Madoff made off excuse

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Speaker 1: me himself wrote in yeah he did. He's like, hey,

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Speaker 1: can you tell everybody what I did? So, yeah, in

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Speaker 1: the nineties, Charles Ponse. What he did was at the

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Speaker 1: time there was if you want to send mail overseas,

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Speaker 1: you would include what was called an international reply cupon

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Speaker 1: well if you wanted to reply, right. But it's basically

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Speaker 1: sort of like, uh, when you get something from you know,

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Speaker 1: mag magazine and the postage is prepaid to return the card,

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Speaker 1: you know, right, it's it's prepaid so that you get

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Speaker 1: that back to say, hey, these people got that exactly right,

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Speaker 1: So this is what you did back then. Uh. He

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Speaker 1: had an idea. He said, hey, if I go over

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Speaker 1: and buy these in a different country where they're cheaper,

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Speaker 1: I can come back and sell them in the United States, right,

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Speaker 1: And he could do this because these things were internationally recognized.

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Speaker 1: There were same in any country, but apparently they went

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Speaker 1: for different prices in different countries. Right, So it's not

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Speaker 1: a bad business model, right, right, I would say so right. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And things went pretty well at first. He got a

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Speaker 1: lot of investors and made some pretty good money, but

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Speaker 1: the return that he promised, which what was it again,

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Speaker 1: It was a ridiculous promise. It was I think return

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Speaker 1: in forty to ninety days. So yeah, that should have

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Speaker 1: been a red flag right then. We'll talk about that later.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, that didn't go as well as he thought. Um,

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Speaker 1: but he kept getting investors and he just kind of

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Speaker 1: kept this all quiet. So what he would do is

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Speaker 1: he would payback some to the initial investors based on

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Speaker 1: the money that the current investors were giving him, and

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Speaker 1: just kind of kept going in a cyclical way until

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Speaker 1: he had a lot of He started you know, taking

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Speaker 1: a little money for himself too, and uh ended up

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Speaker 1: having you know, millions of bucks off this in the

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Speaker 1: nineteen twenties before it finally crumbled. Um as a big scam. Well,

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Speaker 1: the reason he was found out was because somebody apparently

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Speaker 1: calculated that, um, there would have had to have been

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Speaker 1: about a hundred and sixty million of these things extant

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Speaker 1: for him to be making the money he was making,

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Speaker 1: and the problem is that there was only twenty seven

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Speaker 1: thousand exactly. That's that's kind of what found him out.

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Speaker 1: But what I got from this, what I got from

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Speaker 1: reading about Ponzi schemes, is that, Um, Charles Ponzi didn't

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Speaker 1: appear to be a huckster from the outset, like this

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Speaker 1: is actually a legitimate business that he was trying to run. Sure,

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Speaker 1: I think it was an act of desperation. Um, And well,

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Speaker 1: we should probably talk about exactly how Ponzi schemes work. Right,

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Speaker 1: they're pretty straightforward and simple. But I can't imagine that

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Speaker 1: as they just get bigger and bigger, you start to

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Speaker 1: eat a lot of role aids. Right. I bet that

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Speaker 1: that was the original Ponzi scheme, and I'm sure he

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Speaker 1: was nervous as it was going. What kind of scheme?

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Speaker 1: Pons a scheme? Very nice, Chuck, So do you want

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Speaker 1: to give some detailed explanation on how Ponzi schemes work? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's actually pretty simple. What you do is you, um,

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Speaker 1: you come up with a investment a shell sort of,

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Speaker 1: and you get people to invest in your in whatever

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Speaker 1: you're saying you're gonna invest in. In this case, and

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Speaker 1: in the original Ponti scheme, it was these reply coupons,

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Speaker 1: but nowadays it's usually like a stock thing. So you

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Speaker 1: get these folks to invest and you take their money

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Speaker 1: and essentially, UH use that first rung of people to

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Speaker 1: attract other people to invest. And once you start getting

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Speaker 1: other investors, you can pay back those initial folks and

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Speaker 1: they can go on record and say, oh, yeah, you know,

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Speaker 1: I made a great return. That's exactly right. And then

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Speaker 1: that even more investors right, and more wrongs, and you

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Speaker 1: just kind of it's sort of like robbing Peter to

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Speaker 1: pay Paul the entire time, right, but you're pocketing like

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Speaker 1: Ponzi did some for himself. Right. At a certain point

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Speaker 1: you can start skimming off the top, right, And but

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Speaker 1: it's not like it take the money and run proposition.

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Speaker 1: It's the take of the money, stick around and pay

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Speaker 1: people off as much as you can. The problem is

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Speaker 1: is to like, people don't divest very easily. When they

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Speaker 1: get a better and unbelievable return on something, they want

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Speaker 1: to keep investing. Sure, So if you're like, no, no,

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Speaker 1: you can't invest anymore, the people are going to start

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Speaker 1: to get suspicious. So you've got your first wrong, you've

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Speaker 1: got your second wrong, and then so on and so

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Speaker 1: on and so on. But to sustain it, you have

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Speaker 1: to keep adding more and more wrongs. But the more

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Speaker 1: wrongs you add, more difficult it is to pay everybody back,

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Speaker 1: so it's inevitable that collapses. But as some people will

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Speaker 1: know they're investing in a Ponzi scheme, some of those

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Speaker 1: first wrong people. Yeah and yeah, from what I understand,

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Speaker 1: people can actually make money off Ponzi schemes. You get

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Speaker 1: in early enough, and you're smart enough to get out

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Speaker 1: while it getting is good because those are the people

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Speaker 1: are gonna get paid first, so they can vouch and

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Speaker 1: say this is a really great deal, right exactly? So yeah, sure, yeah,

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Speaker 1: So the whole that's that's pretty much a Ponzi scheme.

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Speaker 1: And if it sounds a lot like a pyramid scheme

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Speaker 1: to you, you would be right. Uh, it's virtually the

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Speaker 1: same structure. The one big difference is is that in

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Speaker 1: a Ponzi scheme, you're not asked to do anything. You're

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Speaker 1: just an investor. They just want your money. Uh. In

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Speaker 1: a pyramid scheme, generally you have to do something like

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Speaker 1: you are buying in uh to sell something? Sorry? Well no, actually, UM.

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Speaker 1: On Amway site they have uh like on the f

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Speaker 1: a Q section it's like, is am Way a pyramid scheme?

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Speaker 1: And they're like where a pyramid model schemes? The wrong

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Speaker 1: word to use and Actually, the pyramid model has worked

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Speaker 1: for legitimate businesses Am Wai, Mary kay Um paper Chef,

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Speaker 1: pamper Chef. That's another one. So yeah, So I mean

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Speaker 1: it can work and it doesn't necessarily have to be illegal.

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Speaker 1: That that that's the other distinction between Ponzi schemes and

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Speaker 1: um pyramids models is that ponzi schemes are always fraud

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Speaker 1: completely false because it's an investment, but the money's never invested.

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Speaker 1: So it's so simple. When I read this, I was

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Speaker 1: just like, it's the beauty is in its simplicity, Just like,

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Speaker 1: give me a bunch of money and I will keep

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Speaker 1: it and get more people to give me money. I'll

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Speaker 1: give you a little bit, and it's just amazing how

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Speaker 1: that works. Can you imagine being such an edgy, savvy

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Speaker 1: investor that you actually knowingly invest in ponzi schemes? Who

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Speaker 1: does that? I don't know. I bet there's some names

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Speaker 1: on the on the Made Off List. Yeah, I'm bet

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Speaker 1: I'll bet um. But no, he did everything alone. We'll

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Speaker 1: get to him in a minute. Allegedly still more, he confessed, buddy, Well,

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Speaker 1: we're certain things are still alleged at this point. All right, Well,

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Speaker 1: we'll just go with it. You're such a c O

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Speaker 1: A dude. But I appreciate the oh because that includes me. UM.

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Speaker 1: So Ponzi wasn't the guy who came up with a scheme.

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Speaker 1: He he did it so well that they named it

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Speaker 1: after him. But the earliest one we know about goes

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Speaker 1: back to, UH eighteen eighty early eighteen eighties in Boston

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Speaker 1: with a woman named Sarah Howe. I don't think I

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Speaker 1: know about this one, okay, So she actually actively and

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Speaker 1: purposefully built a Ponzi scheme, although you know what, with

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Speaker 1: it being forty years before Charles Ponzi showed up, she

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Speaker 1: probably didn't call it that to herself. What was her name?

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Speaker 1: How Sarah how the how scheme? Yes, if she were,

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Speaker 1: if she did have enough foresight to know that it

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Speaker 1: would eventually be called a Ponzi scheme, how would it

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Speaker 1: sound in her head when she said, this is the

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Speaker 1: kind of scheme that I'm carrying out. It's a scheme? UM? Anyway,

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Speaker 1: Miss Howe basically put together a UM, a group of

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Speaker 1: thousands of women investors and UH invested in women's UM

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Speaker 1: Women's Liberty bonds, I think is what they were called. UH.

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Speaker 1: That's supposedly what the investment was for. But no, it wasn't.

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Speaker 1: She just basically carried out a Ponzi scheme um and

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Speaker 1: she managed to rake in about half a million bucks

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Speaker 1: before she was caught. Uh. And then another guy shortly after,

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Speaker 1: about the turn of the century. His name was William

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Speaker 1: Franklin Miller, and he also builked investors for about another

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Speaker 1: half a million. And this is, you know, substantial enough

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Speaker 1: to be remembered a hundred years plus later. But Ponzi

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Speaker 1: was the first one, right, Ponsi was the first big one,

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Speaker 1: I should say. Uh. And then you don't really hear

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Speaker 1: about anybody in in the world of Ponzi schemes. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I'm sure you can, but nobody huge doing it right now,

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Speaker 1: well until Lou Pearlman. Is that where you're going? I

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Speaker 1: was going to go to the Balkans first blist to

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Speaker 1: Mr Pearlman. Okay, Yeah, this is one of my favorites,

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Speaker 1: just because his associations are kind of funny. H Lou Pearlman,

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Speaker 1: who I think you have to say his name like

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Speaker 1: Lou Pearlman. That's how I got that impression as well.

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Speaker 1: And he kind of looks like that kind of guy too. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he was. Uh, he kind of funded the boy band

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Speaker 1: craze in the nineties. I know, you remember the Backstreet

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Speaker 1: Boys because of the tattoo you have on your neck,

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Speaker 1: and uh, in Sync was the other one. I don't

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Speaker 1: know if you have a tattoo of instinctly, okay, I

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Speaker 1: was covering all my bases. Uh. So he funded these bands. Uh,

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Speaker 1: And it turned out in two thousand and six that

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Speaker 1: he was running a big Poncey scheme. He had been

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Speaker 1: for like twenty years, right, and a lot you know,

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Speaker 1: in Sync and the Backstreet Boys were kind of funded

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Speaker 1: on this Poncey schemes. I don't think funded kind of

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Speaker 1: at all. I think they were fully fully funded, right, Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And this this guy created the Backstreet Boys and in

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Speaker 1: Sync and funded him with illegal money. So those yahoo's

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Speaker 1: kind of oh ponce with their careers, yes they do. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well their careers past tense, right sure? Um, timber Lakes

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Speaker 1: done well for himself. Was he in one of those

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Speaker 1: who j T I don't know who that is? Shut up? Um?

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Speaker 1: All right, Back to Albania. Yes, Albania. Basically a whole

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Speaker 1: bunch of people were working this big Ponzi scheme, which

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Speaker 1: from what I understand also, UH can extend the life

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Speaker 1: of a ponzi scheme, h. Lou Perlman is an unusual animal, uh,

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Speaker 1: and that he could carry it out single handedly for

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Speaker 1: twenty years. Um. But in Albania, for a while a

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Speaker 1: group of ponzi schemers UM had one set up that

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Speaker 1: builked these investors out of two billion dollars before it collapsed,

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Speaker 1: which is in Albania, that is thirty of their gross

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Speaker 1: domestic product. That's huge, Like how to cripple a country?

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, and yeah, so yeah, I think Albania is

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Speaker 1: probably second world. Um. So, I think a hit like

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Speaker 1: that is just ginormous. And that was a big problem

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Speaker 1: when it happened. It was because when people found out,

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Speaker 1: they started riding in the streets and fires broke out

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Speaker 1: and people died. Yeah. Yeah, so that's the Albania, the

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Speaker 1: old Albania ponzi scheme. And we should note that Lou

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Speaker 1: Parliaman he went to jail or received a sentence of

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Speaker 1: twenty five years for conning three hundred million dollars, and

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Speaker 1: apparently every million he paid back they cut a month

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Speaker 1: off the sentence, which seems really fair, I think so.

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Speaker 1: But Pearlman three million dollars sounds like a lot, it

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Speaker 1: ain't it was. And then two thousand and eight came

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Speaker 1: along the big daddy dude, this guy Bernard made Off,

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Speaker 1: one of the founders of Nasdak. Yeah, which is one

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Speaker 1: reason why it works so well, because he was beyond

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Speaker 1: legit He was beyond legit um. Although he his One

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Speaker 1: of the other reasons he was so successful was that

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Speaker 1: he was smart. First of all, like Sarah, how he

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Speaker 1: used affinity fraud. An affinity fraud is where you are bilking.

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Speaker 1: You're you're using the inclusiveness of a of a group

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Speaker 1: to um against themselves, right, So he uh used his

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Speaker 1: membership in a a uber wealthy, very exclusive Jewish country

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Speaker 1: club down in Florida to prey on investors at for um.

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Speaker 1: And you know, the affinity fraud happens a lot like

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Speaker 1: and usually it happens with religious groups. Somebody comes in,

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Speaker 1: it's like, hey, I'm a Lutheran two and I've got

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Speaker 1: this great investment. Since he's a Lutheran, you know, he

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Speaker 1: seems upstanding, you trust him, and then that's that. But

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Speaker 1: made Off very much used affinity fraud, at least at first,

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Speaker 1: and then news of his amazing returns got out. But

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Speaker 1: as I was saying, the reason he was so successful

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Speaker 1: is he didn't pull a Ponzi and say I'll get

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Speaker 1: you fifty percent return in forty five days. You know, Uh,

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Speaker 1: he offered reasonable I think eleven percent was the average

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Speaker 1: returns over the long haul, right, That was the key.

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Speaker 1: It was very believable. Well to an extent. Have you

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Speaker 1: ever looked at our prospectus, the t row price prospectus

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Speaker 1: or prospectus? Yeah, have you ever noticed, like if you

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Speaker 1: look at it's like one year, three years, five years,

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Speaker 1: ten years, and it'll be up at one year down,

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Speaker 1: three years down, five years up. He was offering like

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Speaker 1: a straight even kill eleven percent return. You couldn't lose, right,

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Speaker 1: So that actually should have been a red flag, but

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Speaker 1: it wasn't. Right um. And in two thousand one, Barons,

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Speaker 1: the Financial rag they published a an article on him

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Speaker 1: specifically was saying made Off can't be offering these returns

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Speaker 1: mathematically speaking, this isn't possible. And no one listened. But

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Speaker 1: chief among the people who weren't listening was the SEC. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and they've been under a lot of fire lately because

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Speaker 1: they did not listen. They did not investigate, even when

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Speaker 1: it was kind of handed to them, like hey, several times,

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Speaker 1: actually they were like two or three formal complaints to

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Speaker 1: them and they never followed up. Well. One reason why,

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Speaker 1: and this is even another reason why he was successful,

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Speaker 1: is he was also running a legit business alongside it,

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Speaker 1: so he could sort of defer, you know, when he

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Speaker 1: needed to pay people back and things were getting tight,

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Speaker 1: he could pull a little money out of his legit

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Speaker 1: business and do that, and apparently did so promptly if

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Speaker 1: somebody wanted to um withdrawal. Yeah, they got to check

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Speaker 1: like that. Questions asked, Like when Kevin Bacon was like,

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Speaker 1: we're heading to Barbados and I need a million dollars

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Speaker 1: because I'm gonna buy a hut on the beach, right,

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to hide my wife from her shame for

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Speaker 1: being in the closer right Yeah. Um so yeah, made

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Speaker 1: off was very, very successful, to the tune of fifty

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Speaker 1: billion dollars he made off with. I know he's got

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Speaker 1: the perfect name for him. I should have been like, wait,

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Speaker 1: what's your last name? No, I'm not investing. Every headline

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Speaker 1: has already used that, so that's probably stale by now. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: thanks for that. Chuck. So what can you do, Chuck?

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Speaker 1: How do you stay out of a Ponzi scheme unless

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Speaker 1: you're a very savvy investor who's totally unconscionable. Well, uh,

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Speaker 1: there's a few things you can look for, um, And

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Speaker 1: and it also should be noted that a Ponzi scheme

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Speaker 1: is pretty much a one way street to collapse. There's

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Speaker 1: really no way to pull it off in the long

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Speaker 1: run sustainable unless I think a lot of people might

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Speaker 1: start these and think, well, I can get out at

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Speaker 1: a certain point, pay everyone back and make a lot

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Speaker 1: of money. Um. But yeah, it's it's not a good

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Speaker 1: working model in the end. Well, apparently the point to

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Speaker 1: a ponzi schemers to keep it going until they die, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: which is considered a big success because you live like

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Speaker 1: a billionaire and then uh, at the end, you know,

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Speaker 1: you die or you know, you off yourself. Speaking of that,

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Speaker 1: did you know that um, after he was found out

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Speaker 1: made Off was spending a hundred and sixty grand a

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Speaker 1: month on personal security at its penthouse. Yeah. Do you

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Speaker 1: know how many in Manhattan? Do you know how many bodyguards?

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Speaker 1: That buys you? That's like Delta Force money? Yeah? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: uh so yeah, some things you can look for. Um.

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Speaker 1: The obvious of course is if it sounds too good

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Speaker 1: to be true, it is. That's the oldest edge in

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Speaker 1: the book, and it's true across the board. Uh So

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Speaker 1: someone's making you promises on big returns, then you should

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Speaker 1: probably turn around and walk away. Don't let anyone pressure

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Speaker 1: you into doing well. Pressure. That's another point too, is

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's usually going to be a high pressure pitch,

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Speaker 1: like you have a very limited time window, maybe for

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Speaker 1: as long as the person standing there, um, and you're

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Speaker 1: made to feel like a jackass if you don't take

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Speaker 1: them up on it. Um. But yeah, yeah, pressure is

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Speaker 1: definitely one one of the factors. And even one like

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Speaker 1: you said that uh like made off scam where he

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Speaker 1: would not promise huge returns, that might make it a

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Speaker 1: little more believable. But everything, like you said, fluctuates, So

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Speaker 1: if it's a consistent even if it's a consistent like

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Speaker 1: five growth for years, then that should be a red

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Speaker 1: flag right there. And also you should um ask questions

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Speaker 1: and and demand answers as well, because I mean, if

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Speaker 1: you're just if you have a friend who has a

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Speaker 1: friend that has this great investment and you cut him

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Speaker 1: a check and it turns out to be a Ponzi scheme, Well,

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Speaker 1: t s for you. That was a stupid thing to do.

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Speaker 1: You should know what your money is being invested in.

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Speaker 1: You should know who's investing it. You should and even

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Speaker 1: if it's legitimate, you should be asking these questions if

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Speaker 1: it's through any of the major brokerages, but not how

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Speaker 1: many fees there are. Just just that's a good habit

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Speaker 1: no matter what. Uh. And the other thing is um

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Speaker 1: even if you're involved in a Ponzi scheme, even if

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Speaker 1: you get sucked in, you should never it should never

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Speaker 1: break you and leave you bankrupt. Excellent point, Chuck, because

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Speaker 1: this is probably the most important important point. Well. And

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Speaker 1: they always say diversification is a key to a good portfolio,

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Speaker 1: and this is definitely true here. You should not invest

395
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Speaker 1: all your money in one thing. You're just setting yourself

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Speaker 1: up for for bankruptcy. And whether it's a Ponzi scheme

397
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Speaker 1: or not. Because you do all real estate and you're

398
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Speaker 1: just totally invested in real estate in two thousand and seven,

399
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Speaker 1: you're in big trouble. I mean, even Donald Trump uh

400
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Speaker 1: hit the lowest of the lows. At one point. We

401
00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:56,879
Speaker 1: all forget I think he's lost a lot of his

402
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Speaker 1: old edge that he used to have. He's made some

403
00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:03,200
Speaker 1: had decisions like the TV show. Sure, no one needs

404
00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:05,560
Speaker 1: to see that, you know. And if you if you

405
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Speaker 1: do find yourself in a Ponzi scheme and you're not

406
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Speaker 1: the type to take the law into your own hands

407
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Speaker 1: with like a tire iron or anything like that, you

408
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Speaker 1: could always contact the SEC. I don't know that they'll

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Speaker 1: do anything, and they probably won't, but it's worth a

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Speaker 1: shot anyway, right right, Oh, when we should Just as

411
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Speaker 1: a sidebar here, I know that made Off did confess,

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Speaker 1: but they are there's a SEC is still coming under

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Speaker 1: fire because he's claiming that he acted alone and didn't

414
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Speaker 1: have any help with this is which is really really

415
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Speaker 1: hard to believe just because paperwork alone. First scheme this

416
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Speaker 1: size would be huge, and uh, some people think out

417
00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:43,400
Speaker 1: there that he probably had his family involved and then

418
00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:45,320
Speaker 1: did everything he could to cover for them and take

419
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Speaker 1: the hits but yet to come out well as even

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Speaker 1: if they weren't involved, their salary came directly from the

421
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Speaker 1: bilking of other people, even if they somehow we're just

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Speaker 1: totally unaware of it, you know, it makes it kind

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00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:59,040
Speaker 1: of I don't know it puts it puts their own

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00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:02,560
Speaker 1: wealth in question, right. So yeah, so that's the Ponsi schemes.

425
00:23:02,680 --> 00:23:04,600
Speaker 1: That was very good, Chuck. Thank you, Chuck. The last

426
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:06,600
Speaker 1: time I'll say that, are we Are we going to

427
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:10,160
Speaker 1: talk about our spoken word album? Yes? Yeah, and then

428
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:13,160
Speaker 1: maybe we'll talk about blogs and then listener mail stick

429
00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:16,199
Speaker 1: around first, all right, So we do have a spoken

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00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:19,119
Speaker 1: word album, our first one, and it is about the

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00:23:19,119 --> 00:23:23,359
Speaker 1: economy and economics. Everyone knows that we are in the

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00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:28,320
Speaker 1: second Great Depression, and um, we just kind of decided

433
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:32,560
Speaker 1: to make a spoken word album about that. That's that's

434
00:23:32,600 --> 00:23:38,280
Speaker 1: such a an off a slightly off kilter description. It's

435
00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:42,200
Speaker 1: more like a guide, right, right, possibly a guide to

436
00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,320
Speaker 1: the economy, that's what it's called. But it's very big, right,

437
00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:47,920
Speaker 1: Like there's a lot of stuff in it, right, Yes,

438
00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:50,160
Speaker 1: it's called the Stuff you should know, super Stuffed got

439
00:23:50,200 --> 00:23:53,760
Speaker 1: to the economy, and it's got expert interviews. Josh and

440
00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:55,560
Speaker 1: I get out of the studio, we go in uh

441
00:23:56,080 --> 00:24:00,080
Speaker 1: around the working Farm, chicken farm, don't spoil it. And

442
00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:03,879
Speaker 1: Jerry are awesome producer. She did excellent sound design and

443
00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:06,520
Speaker 1: it's got more bells and whistles and it's it's definitely

444
00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:09,879
Speaker 1: a cut above the silliness we do here each week. Yeah. Yeah,

445
00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:13,639
Speaker 1: And you can find it by typing a super stuffed

446
00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:18,080
Speaker 1: in the search bar at iTunes. It's three frankly chuck,

447
00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 1: and I think it's worth it. I think so. So

448
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:22,080
Speaker 1: if you want to get it, knock yourself out, get

449
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 1: it a couple of times if you like support us, Yeah,

450
00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:27,520
Speaker 1: because it blows up your computer after forty eight hours,

451
00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:30,720
Speaker 1: so unless you keep downloading it fresh each time, and

452
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:32,640
Speaker 1: I'm paying for it over and over again, not sure

453
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:35,000
Speaker 1: at all. All right, So there was that plug that

454
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:37,480
Speaker 1: was plug the blog. Yes, we've been plugging the blog now.

455
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:39,240
Speaker 1: I hope you guys aren't sick of it yet. Um,

456
00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:41,800
Speaker 1: but Josh and I blog a couple of times a day.

457
00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:45,040
Speaker 1: He post once, I post once, and it's called stuff

458
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,240
Speaker 1: you should know. You can find it on the right

459
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:50,160
Speaker 1: hand side of our homepage at House of Works dot com.

460
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,640
Speaker 1: And we just cherry pick interesting news items and kind

461
00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 1: of like what we do here, except it may not

462
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:58,000
Speaker 1: be enough to flesh out a full show. So yeah,

463
00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:00,480
Speaker 1: and a couple of times we've we've post sit on

464
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,800
Speaker 1: listeners suggestions like why don't you guys do this absolutely. Um,

465
00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:07,240
Speaker 1: So yeah, keep keep the ideas coming. We love them.

466
00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:09,120
Speaker 1: We do it keeps us from having to do any

467
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 1: real research, is true, and you know what, that leads

468
00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:17,880
Speaker 1: us to listener mail time. That's right, Okay, Josh, this

469
00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:21,040
Speaker 1: is an installment of stuff we should know, stuff we

470
00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:25,679
Speaker 1: should have known. No, it's not, because sometimes it's additional things.

471
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:29,479
Speaker 1: Quit saying that. This one is from Sarah, and Sarah

472
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:35,520
Speaker 1: wrote in UM about the word theory versus hypotheses. Sarah

473
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:39,200
Speaker 1: is a teacher, and we say all the time, someone's theory,

474
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:42,960
Speaker 1: someone's theory, and she says, we've been misusing it. She says,

475
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:46,600
Speaker 1: in the thinking Cap podcast you repleted, you repeatedly referenced

476
00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:52,520
Speaker 1: theories about savantis um and left hemisphere damage, and scientifically speaking,

477
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:55,680
Speaker 1: these are not theories, their hypotheses. So her basic point

478
00:25:55,800 --> 00:25:58,160
Speaker 1: is that a theory is not just an educated guess.

479
00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:02,240
Speaker 1: It's uh something that a lot of detail and research

480
00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:03,840
Speaker 1: has gone into to get to the point where you

481
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,320
Speaker 1: can call it a theory, like the theory of evolution,

482
00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:09,080
Speaker 1: which is often dismissed as oh, it's just a theory,

483
00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:11,760
Speaker 1: but a theory has actually got a lot to it.

484
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:14,960
Speaker 1: So Sarah wanted us to set the record straight, so

485
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:19,640
Speaker 1: we did that. Another little minor correction here. Josh said

486
00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:22,240
Speaker 1: at one point we were the only country that uses

487
00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,479
Speaker 1: UH the imperial system. I thought we got this out

488
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:28,359
Speaker 1: of the way with the bodies on Everest Podast. We

489
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:33,680
Speaker 1: did not officially U s Burma, Liberia and Myanmar. Myanmar

490
00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:36,280
Speaker 1: and Burma are the same place. Okay, well do you

491
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:38,320
Speaker 1: have it ever since the junta? It's now me and

492
00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:43,399
Speaker 1: mar look at you. So rich from Omaha, Joshua from you,

493
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 1: Claire Wisconsin, Stephen from Newark, Delaware, and Jeanne or Gene Gene.

494
00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:52,399
Speaker 1: They all wrote in and told us that, and I

495
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:54,600
Speaker 1: have one more and I like this one. Stephanie wrote

496
00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:57,240
Speaker 1: in and told us that on our afrodsix podcast, we're

497
00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,719
Speaker 1: talking about UH phallic symbol and fallacies, and we were

498
00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 1: talking about an oyster. Apparently there is a word for

499
00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:07,399
Speaker 1: something that resembles the female geniti. Yeah. I was interested

500
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:09,440
Speaker 1: to hear this because we kept saying female genitalia. And

501
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:11,919
Speaker 1: I wish that she had written in before then. And

502
00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:15,040
Speaker 1: we knew that phallus only represented the male genitalia, but

503
00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:18,680
Speaker 1: I did not realize there was one for female Yannick

504
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 1: y o n I see And she said, Yannick or

505
00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:25,640
Speaker 1: Yanni is Sanskrit for the word womb vulva in place

506
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:28,239
Speaker 1: of origin. And she said she just want to tell

507
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 1: us this because for one of the first times in

508
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:32,240
Speaker 1: her life she actually knew something Yonick. So thank you

509
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:35,520
Speaker 1: Stephanie for the Yeah, thanks Stephanie, Nick, I'm getting it.

510
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:37,879
Speaker 1: I'm processing it right now. So, Yanni, can I remember

511
00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:41,320
Speaker 1: the famous tennis player, Yeah, I knew was actually a

512
00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:44,399
Speaker 1: reference to female genitalia. I wonder if he knows that.

513
00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:47,239
Speaker 1: I'm sure it's her time, truly. But now, so, if

514
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: you want to point out that there are other words

515
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:53,359
Speaker 1: Chuck and I are unfamiliar with, basically, let me know

516
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:57,480
Speaker 1: that I shouldn't call my crackpot theories theories, but hypotheses instead,

517
00:27:58,119 --> 00:28:00,679
Speaker 1: or just say hi. You can send us an email

518
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:07,919
Speaker 1: to Stuff podcast at how stuff works dot com. For

519
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:11,120
Speaker 1: moralness and thousands of other topics, visit how stuff works

520
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,120
Speaker 1: dot com. M hmm,