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Speaker 1: The volume, all right, Jason timf and I all things

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Speaker 1: basketball for about the next thirty thirty five minutes. And

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Speaker 1: I was thinking about this today. So basketball has a

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Speaker 1: very unique place in our sports consumption. We wear a

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Speaker 1: lot of people wear their favorite basketball player because of

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Speaker 1: shoes and apparent We don't wear our favorite hockey player

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Speaker 1: unless you buy a stick or something. We don't wear

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Speaker 1: our favorite baseball player, our favorite football player. We're not

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Speaker 1: around wearing cleats to work, or at least shouldn't be.

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Speaker 1: But in basketball, it's different. There's a loyalty to your

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Speaker 1: favorite basketball player because it's part of your beam. And

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Speaker 1: because of that, I think people are it's just hard

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Speaker 1: to let go. If you're a nick fan with all

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Speaker 1: his flaws, it's hard to let go of Carmelo. He's

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Speaker 1: your guy. It's not about like a baseball card. It's

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Speaker 1: like I got his shoes, you know, I've got his apparel.

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Speaker 1: And so I've always thought like basketball fans are more

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Speaker 1: loyal to their stars. I'm not talking teams. Fans are

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Speaker 1: all loyal to their teams, They're more loyal to their stars.

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Speaker 1: And I do wonder because as much as you love

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Speaker 1: the NBA, when somebody's on your team, you see all

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Speaker 1: the worts and the flaws that you don't see on

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Speaker 1: the highlights or YouTube or when they play your team.

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Speaker 1: And now we're a year into Luca and he's got

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Speaker 1: more technicals that he does defensive stops. I think he's

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Speaker 1: at thirteen. I think he's at thirteen. And I was

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Speaker 1: saying this today on the show at FS one is

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Speaker 1: that of the twenty two Laker losses, nineteen or blowouts

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Speaker 1: and the team doesn't have a ton of resilience when

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Speaker 1: the going gets tough. Sometimes they just foold. And I said,

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Speaker 1: I'm not blaming Luca for everything, because he's a gifted

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Speaker 1: offensive player, but you do kind of follow the lead

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Speaker 1: of your guy. And even if Lebron had a bad night,

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Speaker 1: he played his ass off. I mean now is different.

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Speaker 1: For fifteen years Kobe MJ bad bad shooting Knights, they

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Speaker 1: didn't have bad effort nights, or bad commitment nights or

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Speaker 1: bad focus nights. And when you watch Luke on a

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Speaker 1: nightly basis, do you think sometimes when he kind of

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Speaker 1: mails it into the wrong word, he becomes a little dispassionate.

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Speaker 1: They're down eleven, he gets a bad call, he's barking

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Speaker 1: at the ref the Celtics are racing down to the

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Speaker 1: other end of the floor. Do you think part of

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Speaker 1: that makes it hard for him to be a true

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Speaker 1: emotional leader, not talent an emotional bedrock player like a

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Speaker 1: Duncan or an MJ for a franchise or a d

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Speaker 1: Wade Well.

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Speaker 2: To put it very simply, I think if you talk

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Speaker 2: to anybody who covers the Lakers roots for them, are

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Speaker 2: watches them very closely. Luca's not the emotional leader of

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Speaker 2: the team. It's never been really something that he's particularly

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Speaker 2: gifted at. He's very much a I lead by snatching

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Speaker 2: the other team's heart and hopefully everyone just gets in

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Speaker 2: line behind me kind of thing. And you know, it's

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Speaker 2: funny you mentioned the dynamic when you're rooting for somebody,

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Speaker 2: because I've experienced this directly. I mean, I covered the

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Speaker 2: league at large. I watched tons and tons of Luca

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Speaker 2: over the course of previous years. I'd almost deified him

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Speaker 2: in my head after those playoff performances in twenty twenty

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Speaker 2: four and in twenty twenty two, and then when he

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Speaker 2: came to the Lakers. It's not just watching him every day,

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Speaker 2: but also seeing as He's headed into this phase of

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Speaker 2: his career where he's declined a little bit physically, which

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Speaker 2: has kind of accentuated some of these awards. Doesn't have

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Speaker 2: as much burst going to the basket as he as

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Speaker 2: he used to. It's crazy you look back with Luca

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Speaker 2: towards his early career. He used to get a dunk

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Speaker 2: every couple weeks. Like now it's like he might get

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Speaker 2: one a season, you know what I mean, Like there's

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Speaker 2: a difference in the level of explosive and.

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Speaker 1: He's twenty seven. He's twenty seven, isn't he.

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Speaker 2: I know, this should theoretically be the time when he's

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Speaker 2: peaking athletically, This should be when it's all kind of

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Speaker 2: coming together for him, and he has made some improvements

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Speaker 2: over last season when he was downright completely out of

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Speaker 2: shape for most of the season. But you know, the

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Speaker 2: big thing that stood out to me after covering him

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Speaker 2: very very closely over the last couple of seasons is

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Speaker 2: how different his floor is compared to the other stars

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Speaker 2: around the league. I would actually argue Luca's ceiling is

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Speaker 2: the highest in the NBA, specifically because he's got that

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Speaker 2: step back three at his size, which is basically unguardable,

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Speaker 2: and so you know, Nikole Jokic, there's a certain like,

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Speaker 2: you know, he's not a guy that's gonna break you

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Speaker 2: down off the dribble a ton. You know, He's a

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Speaker 2: guy that runs a lot of two man game and

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Speaker 2: works out of the post for the most part, shake

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Speaker 2: kills as Alexander doesn't take a ton of threes, and

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Speaker 2: so those two guys are much more reliable night tonight.

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Speaker 2: But Luca has this like, oh, but what if he

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Speaker 2: goes eight for twelve on step back threes kind of

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Speaker 2: thing going on where he just becomes borderline impossible to

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Speaker 2: guard because it's got the of Steph Curry with the

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Speaker 2: unguardable step back three that Luca has. Plus he's the

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Speaker 2: short range shot maker that Shaye and Nikola Jokic are,

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Speaker 2: and he's this unbelievable playmaker. But when the step back

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Speaker 2: three is not going in for him, it just becomes

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Speaker 2: a lot more dicey, and like to put it very frank,

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Speaker 2: the difference between him and Shae and him and Jokic

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Speaker 2: at this point is Luca is way more prone to

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Speaker 2: bad games. And when he has a bad game like

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Speaker 2: last night, and last night he was actually four for

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Speaker 2: seven from three, but on twos that were away from

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Speaker 2: the rim but inside the three point line, so the

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Speaker 2: mid range stuff. He was one for eleven, which he's

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Speaker 2: typically very good at, but wasn't going in last night.

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Speaker 2: He doesn't have like an alternative method to impact the game,

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Speaker 2: and that makes it really tough. Like Shae has this

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Speaker 2: rim pressure element. He's so good at beating people off

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Speaker 2: the dribble that raises his floor on a night to

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Speaker 2: night basis. Nicola Jokic, he operates within seven or eight

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Speaker 2: feet from the basket, so he just doesn't deal with

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Speaker 2: the jump shooting variants that a guy like Nikola Jokic

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Speaker 2: does or that Luka Dancic does. And then among all

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Speaker 2: of the stars at the top of the league, you

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Speaker 2: can throw Ant in there, you can throw Wemby in there, Jannis, Luka,

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Speaker 2: Shay Jokic. He's by far the worst defensive player in

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Speaker 2: that group, and so he's so dependent on his ceiling,

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Speaker 2: and his ceiling has such a high variance element to

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Speaker 2: it that it just makes him prone to bad nights.

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Speaker 2: And you know, I've been asked us a bunch like

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Speaker 2: why is Luca Luca? There was the big straw pole

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Speaker 2: that came out with ESPN where they go around and

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Speaker 2: they ask all the people have votes. Yeah, and he

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Speaker 2: came back fifth and MVP voting. And so, to put

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Speaker 2: it very simply, this is gonna be like the fourth

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Speaker 2: consecutive year where we went into training camp and we're like,

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Speaker 2: Luca's gonna get MVP. This is the year, and it's like, actually,

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Speaker 2: no shot, like literally no shot. And until he fixes

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Speaker 2: his floor, until he becomes a player that does enough

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Speaker 2: things consistently well night tonight that he doesn't have those

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Speaker 2: kinds of bad games, he's never gonna be able to

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Speaker 2: compete with the guys at the very top of the league.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the Yeah, it's just I like him and I

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Speaker 1: think he's a remarkable player. But I do think the

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Speaker 1: first thing you said is he is now a more

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Speaker 1: academic player than athletic player, and he is twenty seven.

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Speaker 1: Lebron slowed down at thirty nine and a half. I mean, honestly,

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Speaker 1: Brady could have still played last year. Like at twenty seven,

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Speaker 1: he's starting to break down. And that goes to my

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Speaker 1: mellow comp which is Carmelo's last all NBA season was

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Speaker 1: twenty eight. That's like, that's it. See that's it. And

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Speaker 1: that's why I always said, like Dwayne Wade doesn't have

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Speaker 1: nearly the offensive elegance or ceiling of Luca, but man

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Speaker 1: did he squeezed every ounceide of that. He looked like

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Speaker 1: a running back. Like he just there was like they

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Speaker 1: always say, like alcohol ages you. And in the NBA

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Speaker 1: getting in the weight room, grinding, exten extendion. Jordan was

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Speaker 1: great every morning. I mean, Lebron James to this day

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Speaker 1: is a weight room warrior. I covered Rashid Wallace. They

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Speaker 1: he would pay the fine before the season, like I'm

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Speaker 1: not gonna go to the weight room. Rashid was great,

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Speaker 1: good over. And so you know, I was watching Oklahoma

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Speaker 1: City yesterday. They were missing four starters, four really high

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Speaker 1: end players, and they still beat Cleveland, a top seed

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Speaker 1: in the East. And I say this about the Lakers,

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Speaker 1: and I don't want to go all Lakers here, but

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Speaker 1: regular season football and postseason football is largely the same.

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Speaker 1: The weather gets worse, but you have to be able

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Speaker 1: to run the football. You have to be a fishing

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Speaker 1: in the red zone, win the turnover battle. Coaching matters

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Speaker 1: postseason baseball. Regular season baseball need good starting pitching. One

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Speaker 1: good clothes, situational hitting, can't be bad. Defensively, don't have

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Speaker 1: to be great, can't be bad. NBA is different the NBA.

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Speaker 1: The regular season is not the postseason. First of all,

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Speaker 1: the postseason becomes much more situational and getting baskets and

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Speaker 1: buckets matters more than the high volume of threes. Right

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Speaker 1: Like in the regular season, the math is shoot threes, defend,

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Speaker 1: You're gonna win a lot of games. And so I

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Speaker 1: think the Lakers are a little bit of fools gold.

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Speaker 1: I think they're built for the regular season. I think

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Speaker 1: if they walk into town, you're not rested. Austin, Lebron,

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Speaker 1: Luca can really be a handful, especially if like Austin's hitting.

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Speaker 1: It's like, oh shit, okay, now we have our hands full.

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Speaker 1: But if I can play you five times, we're equally arrested,

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Speaker 1: and I can hunt Luca or Harden or Austin. It's

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Speaker 1: a different it's a different team. Last year Minnesota did this.

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Speaker 1: Remember we went into that series thinking it's gonna be

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Speaker 1: a six game series, and you watch it and you're like, well,

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Speaker 1: this is a mismatch. Do you see this where this

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Speaker 1: Laker team it can be elegant and beautiful. The spacing's good.

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Speaker 1: I think Reddick's a really good offensive coach in close games.

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Speaker 1: The clutch numbers, I think are still remain very good.

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Speaker 1: But they are not built for the playoffs. They are

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Speaker 1: they have no bench. I mean not that bench is everything.

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Speaker 1: They don't have a great bench. They don't protect the rim,

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Speaker 1: they don't have This as well documented athletic Wings is

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Speaker 1: that we're people in Los Angeles. They're gonna get a

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Speaker 1: They're gonna be a four seed in the West, but

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Speaker 1: they're not really a true four seed. They're like the

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Speaker 1: Miami Dolphins when they made the playoffs with TUA. Nobody

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Speaker 1: thought they're gonna go up north in the cold and

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Speaker 1: win a playoff game. It's like they have no chance

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Speaker 1: to do that. The Lakers really have no chance for

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Speaker 1: the depth of OKC, the defense of Oklahoma City facing Jokics,

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Speaker 1: they really have no chance against those teams in a

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Speaker 1: long series or am I totally off?

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Speaker 2: No, you're I mean did you're You're in line with

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Speaker 2: the consensus there. I think like the the metrics that

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Speaker 2: come out from this Lakers team make them stick out

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Speaker 2: like a sore thumb among the other good teams in

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Speaker 2: the league, and it really comes down to that dynamic

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Speaker 2: you're talking about. The Lakers are great at one thing,

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Speaker 2: half court offense. They're the third best in the league,

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Speaker 2: behind Denver and Oklahoma City, and it's because they have

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Speaker 2: these unbelievable shot creators that can go nuclear in any

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Speaker 2: given night. But that is a large sample size trend.

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Speaker 2: It is an issue like the offense did not look

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Speaker 2: good last night against Boston, And really the problem when

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Speaker 2: you look at this Lakers team is they have chewed

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Speaker 2: up and spit out every bad team in the league

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Speaker 2: and that has carried their record. So here are some

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Speaker 2: crazy stats for you con the Lakers this season. When

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Speaker 2: they play teams in the bottom ten in point differential,

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Speaker 2: they're eighteen and two, which is tied with Oklahoma City

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Speaker 2: for the best in the entire NBA. That means they're

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Speaker 2: sixteen and twenty against the rest of the league, So

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Speaker 2: they are below five hundred against anybody that's not in

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Speaker 2: the bottom third of the NBA. Even as you zoom

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Speaker 2: individually in on it, just against the top ten teams

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Speaker 2: in point differential, they are getting outscored by thirteen points

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Speaker 2: per game, which ranks twenty eighth in the NBA. Only

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Speaker 2: the Wizards and that Brooklyn Nets team have been worse

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Speaker 2: when they're playing the good teams. It's funny if you

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Speaker 2: look at all the teams just in their games against

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Speaker 2: the top ten teams in the league. So just erase

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Speaker 2: all the filler games in the schedule and just look

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Speaker 2: at the benchmarks, test just the measuring sticks. The top

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Speaker 2: nine teams are all the teams you'd expect to see

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Speaker 2: among contenders. Detroit's number one, Minnesota's number two, they're always

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Speaker 2: They've been my sneaky championship contender this season. I love them.

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Speaker 2: Oklahoma City, Houston, San Antonio, Boston, Cleveland, New York, and Denver.

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Speaker 2: That's the top nine. That's what you would expect to see.

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Speaker 2: And then it's all the way down to number twenty

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Speaker 2: eight is the Lakers. Like that's literally what you're talking

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Speaker 2: about with this team. They have been consistently outclassed in

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Speaker 2: these matchups. And the reason why is there is a

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Speaker 2: clear game plan how to beat the Lakers, and all

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Speaker 2: of the good teams understand this game plan and they

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Speaker 2: execute it well. Number One, ball pressure. If you pick

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Speaker 2: the Lakers up full court, you'll wear them down. Boston

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Speaker 2: did this all night last night, even on every possession

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Speaker 2: they didn't pick up Luca. You see Missoula yelling and

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Speaker 2: screaming and pointing like pick them up, pick them up,

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Speaker 2: like they just they want to pick up full court

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Speaker 2: the entire game. Why the Lakers allowed nineteen points off

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Speaker 2: of turnovers per game. That's the seventh most in the

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Speaker 2: entire NBA. If you pick them up full court, you'll

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Speaker 2: turn them over, you'll get out in transition two deep

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Speaker 2: drop coverage. Boston did this last night. Just have Vucevic,

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Speaker 2: Animi Kata sit way back at the basket, chase Luca

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Speaker 2: and Austin off the three point line, and funnel them

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Speaker 2: into the rim. It allows you to stay home off

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Speaker 2: the ball and force them to take all of those

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Speaker 2: tough contested twos. That's where Luca is always trying to

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Speaker 2: draw foulsand stuff. Their offense can fall apart in that sense.

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Speaker 2: That's a big part of why the Lakers can't get

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Speaker 2: quality three point shots up that specific defensive look and

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Speaker 2: then lastly run on them like crazy cleaning the glass.

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Speaker 2: Has this catch all metric they use for transition defense.

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Speaker 2: They call it transition points added per one hundred possessions.

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Speaker 2: The Lakers literally rank dead last in that stat against

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Speaker 2: the top against teams in the top ten and point differential.

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Speaker 2: So pick them up full court, run on them all day,

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Speaker 2: run that deep drop coverage. You're not just gonna beat

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Speaker 2: the Lakers, You're gonna make them quit and blow them

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Speaker 2: out by twenty. It is a consistent game plan that

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Speaker 2: we have seen all season long from the good teams

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Speaker 2: against the Lakers, and they just fall apart in that

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Speaker 2: play style. And so honestly, like when you see something

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Speaker 2: over and over and over and over again, and like

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Speaker 2: last night was another chance they could have beat Boston

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Speaker 2: and changed the narrative a little bit. Nope, the exact

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Speaker 2: same damn thing happened again, and that just keeps happening

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Speaker 2: all season. And when you're that bad against the good teams,

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Speaker 2: when all of the other good teams are good against

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Speaker 2: the good teams, that's a giant red flag for your hopes.

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Speaker 2: In this case.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's interesting. I'm watching the Celtics, and when

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Speaker 1: you watch the celt I mean they got three guys

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Speaker 1: that ninety percent of the league. You know, they got

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Speaker 1: some Sam hawsers now playing big minutes. They got three

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Speaker 1: guys that like don't have NBA resumes that anybody outside

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Speaker 1: of Boston knows. But I will tell you that I

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Speaker 1: thought they'd be fine without Jason Tatum. I did not

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Speaker 1: think they'd be this good defensively without him, and they're

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Speaker 1: not quite as good offensively without him, which makes sense.

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Speaker 1: But when I said I don't think he's face of

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Speaker 1: the league, it was mostly an aura thing. It wasn't

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Speaker 1: a game thing. I think it's games good and he's

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Speaker 1: a really, really high end player. Are you surprised, though,

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Speaker 1: They're eight and two in their last ten. Their defensive

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Speaker 1: metrics are excellent. I mean, basically, Chris Brusarge said at

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Speaker 1: the My Show, they have two rules, shoot threes and

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Speaker 1: player ass off defensively. Like that's it. It's very simple,

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Speaker 1: like play hard on the defensive end and shoot threes.

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Speaker 1: Are you surprised they are still a I think Detroit

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Speaker 1: probably wins the East, but they're still viable. They're playing well.

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Speaker 1: They haven't dropped off a ton offensively. I mean Porzingis

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Speaker 1: has gone to trade, Drew Holliday's gone, Tatum's out, and

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Speaker 1: you're like, no, they're okay, They're fine. It's the same

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Speaker 1: kind of team, not quite as athletic. Are you surprised?

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Speaker 2: I think everyone's surprised that they're as good as they

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Speaker 2: have been. I think that I think most of us

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Speaker 2: expected them to be just kind of a middle team

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Speaker 2: in the East, like in that five to eight range,

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Speaker 2: like win more games than you'd think. But like, I

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Speaker 2: think both Indiana and Boston have been shocking in opposite directions.

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Speaker 2: Like we all thought Boston and Indiana would be kind

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Speaker 2: of in the middle. Indiana went completely into the tank

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Speaker 2: and Boston is still competing for a championship, and honestly,

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Speaker 2: if it wasn't for JB. Bickerstaff have a really clear

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Speaker 2: Coach of the Year case just because of how good

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Speaker 2: the Pistons would have been. Joe Miszula is an awesome

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Speaker 2: Coach of the Year candidate because I think this season

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Speaker 2: has been a testament to the basketball culture that he's built. Again,

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Speaker 2: you're in the mid second quarter, you're beating up on

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Speaker 2: the Lakers like you're dominating the game. You've been doing

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Speaker 2: your job all night long, and one time someone didn't

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Speaker 2: pick up Lucas he's dribbling in front of the Celtics

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Speaker 2: beench and you could see Joe demonstratively like yelling at

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Speaker 2: his guys to get over there and pick him up.

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Speaker 2: There is an accountability that he has established with his crew. Yes,

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Speaker 2: where this is the expectation. If you're going to play

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Speaker 2: for me, this is what you've got to do. And

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Speaker 2: it goes even deeper than the ball pressure, like they

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Speaker 2: crash out of the corners so well, this is a

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Speaker 2: team that you would have thought would have tanked as

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Speaker 2: a rebounding team because you lose hatum and you lose

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Speaker 2: your entire center rotation. No, they win the rebound battle.

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Speaker 2: They win the second chance points battle every night because

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Speaker 2: their guards are so scrappy coming out of the corners

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Speaker 2: getting offensive rebounds. And then the last thing that I

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Speaker 2: think is super impressive with Boston Collin. They lost Drew Hall,

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Speaker 2: Jason Tatum, Al Horford, and Christops Porzingis, and they have

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Speaker 2: a one to twenty offensive rating, their second best offense

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Speaker 2: in the NBA. And I think that's where, like, honestly,

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Speaker 2: for all to talk about Joe Mizzoula's offense, and then

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Speaker 2: like hunting threes, Joe Mizzoula never said take bad threes.

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Speaker 1: You want to do on.

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Speaker 2: Quality offense for good looks from three. And what's happening

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Speaker 2: is over the years they've gotten better and better at

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Speaker 2: running his system. And even though those guys are all

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Speaker 2: out of the lineup, Howserd's been there a long time,

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Speaker 2: Prichard's been there a long time, Derek White's been there

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Speaker 2: a long time, Jalen Brown's been there a long time.

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Speaker 2: Even kid has been there for a few years now,

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Speaker 2: and so there's some continuity in this system. They know

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Speaker 2: how they want to play, and so honestly, like if

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Speaker 2: you look at the strongest basketball cultures in the NBA.

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Speaker 2: Boston has clearly demonstrated this year that they are one

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Speaker 2: of those teams, and as far as their chances this

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Speaker 2: year goes, I viewed Detroit, New York, Boston, and Cleveland

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Speaker 2: all kind of in the same tier. I lean very

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Speaker 2: slightly Cleveland because I just think they're very complete team

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Speaker 2: after the trades they made, not just Harden, but the

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Speaker 2: other deals they made at the deadline. But Boston absolutely

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Speaker 2: has a shot to come out of the East. And

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Speaker 2: I mean it really just comes down how good Tatum

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Speaker 2: is when he comes back. If he comes back and

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Speaker 2: he's all NBA Tatum, they have a big experience advantage.

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Speaker 2: They have a big continuity advantage. Those guys have been

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Speaker 2: in so many big games.

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Speaker 1: Don't we know exactly when he's coming back? Do we

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Speaker 1: know for sure?

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Speaker 2: The rumor is like early March, so I would assume,

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Speaker 2: like I mean, I'm I mean, he was photographed practicing

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Speaker 2: with the team literally just a couple of days ago.

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Speaker 2: He's already been doing five on five for I think

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Speaker 2: a couple of weeks now, so I think we're like

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Speaker 2: a week or two out from him coming back. And

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Speaker 2: like he addresses a very specific need because the one

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Speaker 2: thing they don't really have is a big forward because

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Speaker 2: Jalen Brown is very much a three. And then they

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Speaker 2: have these like role player forwards, you know, guys like

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Speaker 2: Jordan Walsh that can play a little bit, but it's

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Speaker 2: like they don't have like a big, strong forward that's

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Speaker 2: really switchy and can defensive, rebound and stuff. Like if

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Speaker 2: you remember when Boston won the title, the way they

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Speaker 2: won the title is Tatum guarded the other team enter

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Speaker 2: every single game. They don't really have that right now.

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Speaker 2: If Tatum can come back and provide all of those

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Speaker 2: elements and really just the big thing I'd worry about

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Speaker 2: is him janking up the offense just because it's a

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Speaker 2: weird rhythm thing to add a new player like that.

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Speaker 1: He and Jalen Brown had a rhythm issue in the past. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I think that's just kind of always going

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Speaker 1: to be an issue because I think Jalen's a more

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Speaker 1: aggressive athlete. Tatum's a little more passive. Tatum's probably more talented.

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Speaker 1: I agree, when Tatum comes back, it will look weird.

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Speaker 1: It will take a first absolutely, you know, it's interesting.

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Speaker 1: Detroit is a physical, tough team. The Knicks are we

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Speaker 1: know this. Brunson's a poor defender. Cat's kind of a flaky, talented,

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Speaker 1: bit inconsistent, kind of a finesse player, although he has moments.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he'll have moments when when he's inspired or

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Speaker 1: when he's prodded. But two times I've watched the Knicks

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Speaker 1: play the Pistons this year, and I go watch it,

426
00:22:06,040 --> 00:22:10,160
Speaker 1: it's very clear that Detroit has unbelievable confidence against New York.

427
00:22:10,200 --> 00:22:12,439
Speaker 1: They think they can push him around. They don't respect

428
00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:16,359
Speaker 1: him defensively. And I look at the Knicks and even

429
00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,840
Speaker 1: though Jannis you'd have to give up a ton for him,

430
00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:22,840
Speaker 1: I kind of do believe if you move off TIBs,

431
00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:26,679
Speaker 1: which they did, you're kind of spinning your wheels with

432
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:30,239
Speaker 1: this group, right like they're always going to have I mean,

433
00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:33,560
Speaker 1: when you let go of Hart and Steam, they couldn't

434
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:36,560
Speaker 1: afford him. All Right, Well, we lose somebody that crashes

435
00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:41,119
Speaker 1: the boards, somebody that plays defense limited offensively, we lose size. Well,

436
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:44,560
Speaker 1: Carl Anthony Towns, he's a little like a D. He'd

437
00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:47,520
Speaker 1: rather just be a four and score like. He likes

438
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:50,520
Speaker 1: the fun of basketball. He's highly skilled. I do I

439
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:52,000
Speaker 1: think I think I look at the Knicks, and I

440
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:54,840
Speaker 1: think I think they're a worst version of last year.

441
00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:58,639
Speaker 1: And I think I think the jury's out and I

442
00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:01,080
Speaker 1: think TIBs squeezed the most out of them defensively, And

443
00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:03,159
Speaker 1: I could be wrong, but I feel like when the

444
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:07,680
Speaker 1: season's over, if Detroit matches up or Boston with Tatum,

445
00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:11,200
Speaker 1: they're gonna beat the Knicks, and it's gonna be quicker

446
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:13,959
Speaker 1: than you think, and the Yanna stuff will heat back up.

447
00:23:14,080 --> 00:23:16,919
Speaker 1: I mean, I just feel like the Knicks are a

448
00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:21,680
Speaker 1: worse version last year. People knocked Tims because offensively he's

449
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:26,320
Speaker 1: not a creative guy, but they were a better defensive

450
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:29,520
Speaker 1: team and they had a certain stylistically, a certain feel

451
00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:32,840
Speaker 1: to him. I don't really feel like they do this year.

452
00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:35,080
Speaker 1: I don't think it's they lack dog. I just think

453
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:37,320
Speaker 1: their roster is what it is and there's defensive holes.

454
00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:41,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is what it is. And the main thing

455
00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:44,320
Speaker 2: is is there is a clearly defined ceiling with this

456
00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:47,399
Speaker 2: group that has repeatedly manifested itself over the course of

457
00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:50,240
Speaker 2: the last few years. And it's just simply that they

458
00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:54,080
Speaker 2: have this incredibly mistake prone big in Karl Anthony Towns.

459
00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:56,400
Speaker 2: He's again I talked about this a lot on my show.

460
00:23:56,440 --> 00:24:00,919
Speaker 2: But like, you can be a physically limited defender, but

461
00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:04,280
Speaker 2: if you do your job, a coach can game plan

462
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:06,920
Speaker 2: for you. Like every team has a bat. Like if

463
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:09,280
Speaker 2: you go back through NBA history, like you don't think

464
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,440
Speaker 2: teams attack Shake Gildess Alexander as the weakest defender on

465
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:14,720
Speaker 2: the Thunder. You don't think teams attack jokicch or Jamal

466
00:24:14,800 --> 00:24:16,760
Speaker 2: Murray when they won the title in twenty twenty three.

467
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:19,360
Speaker 2: Teams have been attacking Steph Curry for years. He's got

468
00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:23,439
Speaker 2: four titles. Like, a physically limited defender is just a

469
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:26,720
Speaker 2: part of an NBA team. You if that guy can

470
00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:29,880
Speaker 2: do his job, then as a coach, I can draw

471
00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:32,879
Speaker 2: up a scheme to plan for what this guy of

472
00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:35,680
Speaker 2: what his limitations are. But if you have a mistake

473
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:38,239
Speaker 2: prone defender, there's nothing I can do because I can

474
00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:39,639
Speaker 2: go over there and I'll be like, all right, Kat,

475
00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:41,280
Speaker 2: here's what I need you to do. And if he

476
00:24:41,320 --> 00:24:44,040
Speaker 2: goes out there and does something else, it doesn't really matter.

477
00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 2: And so Kat is extremely mistake prone and that is

478
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:51,000
Speaker 2: his biggest issue that undercuts this defense. Jalen's just physically limited.

479
00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:53,639
Speaker 2: That's his issue. You put the two of them together

480
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,800
Speaker 2: on the floor there. It just puts so much pressure

481
00:24:56,840 --> 00:24:59,840
Speaker 2: on those other three guys to fly around and cover

482
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:02,080
Speaker 2: for them defensively, which is just really hard to do.

483
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 2: And I talked with you a little bit about this

484
00:25:04,640 --> 00:25:07,840
Speaker 2: on the Herd last week. But like most of my

485
00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 2: pessimism surrounding the Knicks centers around just how good everyone

486
00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:13,360
Speaker 2: else is. It's like, I know what the Knicks are.

487
00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:15,320
Speaker 2: I know that they can beat teams in the playoffs,

488
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:17,520
Speaker 2: like they just made the conference finals last year, Like

489
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:20,160
Speaker 2: they beat that Celtics team even before the Tatum Achilles

490
00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:22,280
Speaker 2: that series was over, the Knicks were gonna win, Like

491
00:25:22,520 --> 00:25:25,320
Speaker 2: to their credit, I know what they are. But they

492
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:27,920
Speaker 2: just inevitably run into a team that's got a higher

493
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:30,879
Speaker 2: ceiling than them and at some point in a later round.

494
00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:32,960
Speaker 2: And so to your point, I think it's almost a

495
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,320
Speaker 2: certainty that if they end up losing in the second

496
00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:37,600
Speaker 2: round or something like that this year, I am. I

497
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:39,480
Speaker 2: think it's almost a certainty that they end up breaking

498
00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:41,840
Speaker 2: the team up because there's just a clearly defined ceiling

499
00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:42,480
Speaker 2: with this group.

500
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:45,560
Speaker 1: Yeah no, And I think Giannis is just sitting out

501
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:49,000
Speaker 1: there and you know what, you know, they gave up

502
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:51,600
Speaker 1: a lot of picks. Was at five to get McHale Bridges,

503
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:54,520
Speaker 1: so they don't have as much the same Yeah, I

504
00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:58,960
Speaker 1: mean at the time, you're like, well, bruntson and cat

505
00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 1: have weaknesses. Okay, McHale's a mid rate. He can hit threes.

506
00:26:03,080 --> 00:26:04,840
Speaker 1: He can. At the time, I didn't think it was

507
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,840
Speaker 1: a terrible move, but the league now Sam Presty was

508
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:11,199
Speaker 1: about two years ahead of everybody. Is that Like he

509
00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:14,119
Speaker 1: was building his team based on what was going to

510
00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:18,440
Speaker 1: happen to the CBA, and now he's got like cost certainty,

511
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:23,920
Speaker 1: draft picks everywhere, the kind of depth where they can

512
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:26,920
Speaker 1: have four guys out last night and still fump Cleveland.

513
00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:32,040
Speaker 1: It's like you can see, you know, I will defend

514
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:36,000
Speaker 1: Adam Silver on this. David Stern took over a league

515
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:39,600
Speaker 1: that was uninteresting and so he didn't care if it

516
00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:43,480
Speaker 1: became dynastic, if New York and Ellen Boston and Philadelphia dominated,

517
00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,159
Speaker 1: Like that's how you solve that Rubik's cube. It's like,

518
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 1: we're not an interesting league. We got to I mean,

519
00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:50,120
Speaker 1: are rumors of a cocaine problem. They had a bad

520
00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:53,200
Speaker 1: TV deal, you know, the big advertisers didn't care about

521
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:55,800
Speaker 1: the players. Like that's the league David Stern took over,

522
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 1: so we lean into it. Well. Adam Silver took over

523
00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:02,840
Speaker 1: a very financially stable league that was really popular, and

524
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:06,160
Speaker 1: the owners were all bitching that the power was in

525
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 1: like six four teams, and so Adam's like, okay, I'm

526
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:15,879
Speaker 1: gonna spread this out. And it's like, I get what

527
00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:20,080
Speaker 1: Adam was doing. And in the big picture, it's a

528
00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:24,280
Speaker 1: more reasonable fair way to make a larger percentage of

529
00:27:24,320 --> 00:27:28,399
Speaker 1: the owner satisfied. But I'll throw this out to you

530
00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:34,879
Speaker 1: this phone. Were more distracted than ever. And baseball's like

531
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 1: the hell with parody. The Yankees, the Mets, the Phillies,

532
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:41,240
Speaker 1: the Cubs, the Dodgers, the Astros are good, go for

533
00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 1: it fellas. You don't have to worry about the bottom

534
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:46,080
Speaker 1: teams that are all making money. The NBA is like

535
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:50,640
Speaker 1: no dynasties. And I do wonder, Jason that in this

536
00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 1: world that's got so many options, tiktoks, more platforms streaming

537
00:27:56,520 --> 00:28:02,240
Speaker 1: these hockey, Baseball, Basketball, Monday New Friday volume game sports.

538
00:28:03,200 --> 00:28:09,240
Speaker 1: Dynasties attract attention. The baseball has a bad guy, They've

539
00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 1: got a villain. And I do think that Oklahoma City

540
00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:15,000
Speaker 1: is one of the great defensive teams ever, but I'm

541
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:18,600
Speaker 1: not sure they're captivating. I'm not sure when your GM

542
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:22,320
Speaker 1: is the north Star is the second most important person

543
00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 1: to SG and you'r franchise, I'm not sure it's great

544
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:27,640
Speaker 1: for the league right.

545
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:32,359
Speaker 2: Yet, the way that the new CBA is structured makes

546
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:37,000
Speaker 2: contending windows like way too cyclical, and it just simply

547
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,840
Speaker 2: it's simply a product of the fact that it's borderline

548
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:43,000
Speaker 2: impossible to sustain large amounts of talent because of the

549
00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:44,960
Speaker 2: way that you have to pay everybody in the constraints

550
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:47,160
Speaker 2: that can take place. And so what ends up happening

551
00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:49,520
Speaker 2: is you have these teams that have these two or

552
00:28:49,560 --> 00:28:52,440
Speaker 2: three year windows and then suddenly they're completely deprived of

553
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 2: assets and they really have no choice but to blow

554
00:28:54,880 --> 00:28:57,080
Speaker 2: up at that point. I mean, even Oklahoma City, as

555
00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:59,920
Speaker 2: good as they are, Like, what's gonna end up happening?

556
00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:03,720
Speaker 2: Is like, Okay, if aj Mitchell is this two way

557
00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:06,320
Speaker 2: guard that can beat people off the dribble and create shots,

558
00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:09,080
Speaker 2: he's all of a suddenly he's a twenty million dollar player.

559
00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 2: And it's like Alex Cruzo is a twenty million dollar player,

560
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,640
Speaker 2: Isaiah Hartenstein's almost a thirty million dollar player. J Dub's

561
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 2: a fifty million dollar player, Shay's a sixty million dollar player,

562
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,400
Speaker 2: Chets a sixty million dollar player, Like at a certain

563
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:23,840
Speaker 2: point that like Oklahoma City's gonna start hemorrhaging players here

564
00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 2: pretty soon, and then guess what san Antonio is gonna

565
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:28,360
Speaker 2: look like? A way more talented team. And then san

566
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:30,520
Speaker 2: Antonio is gonna run into the same damn problem two

567
00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 2: years after that, and like it's so cyclical, and it's

568
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:39,080
Speaker 2: become more difficult than ever to actually maintain your consistency

569
00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 2: and your roster year over year. And I think that

570
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:43,600
Speaker 2: that actually has a deeper problem that goes further than

571
00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:45,880
Speaker 2: just like the dynasty point that you're making. I think

572
00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:50,440
Speaker 2: it's also leads to lots of roster turnover, which makes

573
00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:53,200
Speaker 2: it harder for teams to resonate with local fan bases.

574
00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 2: Like it should be. Every team should be heavily incentivized

575
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 2: to keep their own players. And the only way you

576
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:00,560
Speaker 2: can do that is if you have assistan in which

577
00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:03,480
Speaker 2: your draft picks, not draft picks you've traded for, but

578
00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:06,680
Speaker 2: if your draft picks should have some sort of exception

579
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:09,160
Speaker 2: with the cap to where if you have a team

580
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 2: that drafts well and you obtain these players. If you

581
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:16,520
Speaker 2: had more ability to maintain your roster control year over year,

582
00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:18,920
Speaker 2: you'd resonate with your local fans. Like that's a big

583
00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:20,400
Speaker 2: thing that I think makes a big difference, Like what

584
00:30:20,440 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 2: are the most popular teams over the course of the

585
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,560
Speaker 2: last fifteen to twenty years In the NBA, It's like

586
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:28,920
Speaker 2: Golden State, same core year after year after year. Denver

587
00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 2: is one of our biggest fan bases over at hoops tonight.

588
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 2: A big part of that is they've had Jamal Murray,

589
00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:36,120
Speaker 2: Aaron Gordon, and Nicole Jokic forever. Jokic and Murray have

590
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:38,200
Speaker 2: been running two man game for ten years now. It's

591
00:30:38,240 --> 00:30:41,440
Speaker 2: like there is a consistency in the roster that I

592
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:43,000
Speaker 2: think is a big part of this. And when you

593
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 2: have the turnover that all these teams have, it just

594
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:48,720
Speaker 2: makes it really difficult for the landscape of the league

595
00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:51,719
Speaker 2: to stay in one area long enough to resonate with fans.

596
00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:55,280
Speaker 2: I think in general, the new CBA it was intended

597
00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 2: to make things easier for the teams at the bottom,

598
00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:01,000
Speaker 2: but all it's really done is kind of remove a

599
00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:04,680
Speaker 2: lot of the intrigue that comes along with the rivalries

600
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 2: of like having you know, like the NBA Finals ratings

601
00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:10,280
Speaker 2: when it was calvs. Versus Warriors every year were great.

602
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:12,600
Speaker 2: They were great ratings every year. Like you, when you

603
00:31:12,680 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 2: have that sort of continuity, it resonates with fans more.

604
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:20,560
Speaker 2: It builds rivalry, It builds intrigue and urgency around the games.

605
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:24,520
Speaker 1: Remember when Oklahoma City had Durant and Kyrie Irving and

606
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 1: James Harden, they were the lowest rated local broadcast in

607
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 1: the league. With it should be noted they kept winning

608
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:34,600
Speaker 1: on an annual basis the best local broadcast, So it

609
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:37,880
Speaker 1: wasn't quality of broadcasts. And you bring it all these stars,

610
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:40,120
Speaker 1: it was like, we don't know them. They're not us.

611
00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:44,840
Speaker 1: They're interlopers. Like people want, they want their guys, and

612
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 1: I think Adam Silver believes in that. But you know,

613
00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:54,920
Speaker 1: I want to end with this topic. So you know,

614
00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 1: if you ask people the top seven or eight players,

615
00:31:57,120 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I do think there's some exceptional. Year's draft

616
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,800
Speaker 1: class was really good. I mean like it could go

617
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,960
Speaker 1: down as the best in ten to twelve years. And

618
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 1: we all know the headliners. The top players in the

619
00:32:09,640 --> 00:32:14,240
Speaker 1: league are largely international players. If I had if I

620
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 1: ask you to name a starting five in the NBA.

621
00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:24,920
Speaker 1: It's the great but not household name starting five. The

622
00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:27,280
Speaker 1: best player on that to me would be Stefan Castle.

623
00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:30,800
Speaker 1: You know him, Spurs fan know him, people that listen

624
00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:33,800
Speaker 1: to this podcast know him, but the average fan has

625
00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:37,480
Speaker 1: no idea who this Yukon kid is. And literally, if

626
00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:41,520
Speaker 1: you watch the Spurs play, he jumps through the television.

627
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:44,320
Speaker 1: That was always been one of my rules. He just

628
00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:48,320
Speaker 1: your eyes go to Stefan Castle. He is a complete dog. Defensively,

629
00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:51,440
Speaker 1: he can be a killer. Offensively, I think he's like

630
00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:53,960
Speaker 1: a more talented in a weird way Jalen Brown, like

631
00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:59,920
Speaker 1: almost sometimes like intimidatingly aggressive. So your thoughts on staff

632
00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:02,560
Speaker 1: Castle and give me four or five guys in the

633
00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:06,360
Speaker 1: league that are not household names but you view I

634
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:08,880
Speaker 1: mean Cooper Flagg because of going to do is one

635
00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:12,080
Speaker 1: of them. He is an ascending star. Give me guys

636
00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:14,520
Speaker 1: in the league that you love that we don't talk about.

637
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 2: Okay, So Steph Castle is Steph Castle is one of

638
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 2: my favorites. I actually had a debate earlier in the

639
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:21,800
Speaker 2: year about whether or not I liked him or a

640
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 2: Men Thompson more for the future, and I voted Steph

641
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:26,800
Speaker 2: even though I'm really high on a men Thompson, but

642
00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:30,600
Speaker 2: Steph to me is a super unique prospect in that,

643
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:32,840
Speaker 2: you know, who he actually reminds me of is like

644
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:36,480
Speaker 2: a mix between like more of a point guard naturally

645
00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 2: in Jimmy Butler. And the reason why I draw towards

646
00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:43,080
Speaker 2: Jimmy Butler is there is a physical size with Steph.

647
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 2: He's huge, like he's built like a truck and he's

648
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 2: six foot six. He can really he can really bully players.

649
00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:50,920
Speaker 1: Oh he's intimidating. You can see he's intimidating.

650
00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:55,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, And he plays off of two feet extremely well.

651
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:57,000
Speaker 2: This is his strength and this is what Jimmy Butler

652
00:33:57,040 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 2: did so well forever and what made him such a

653
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 2: gifted player around on the basket. For more of a

654
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:04,520
Speaker 2: perimeter oriented player, Steph constantly plays off two feet. And

655
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 2: why this matters is when you play off of like

656
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:09,239
Speaker 2: straight line drives and off of one foot, it's very

657
00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:11,560
Speaker 2: easy to knock you off balance one way or the other.

658
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:15,520
Speaker 2: But Steph kind of controls this radius around him because

659
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 2: he's so strong and he always plays off of two

660
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:20,440
Speaker 2: feet that he can get to his spots wherever he

661
00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:22,160
Speaker 2: wants to on the floor. He's one of those guys

662
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:25,280
Speaker 2: that for not having like a lightning quick speed element

663
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:27,600
Speaker 2: to his game, he gets to the basket a ton

664
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:30,560
Speaker 2: and people just can't guard him there. The second piece

665
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 2: of it is he is an extremely gifted passer, his

666
00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:37,799
Speaker 2: natural feel alongside Victor wembin Yama, he is connected on

667
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:40,239
Speaker 2: so many lobs with him this year, he's a very

668
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:42,680
Speaker 2: natural two man game partner with him. And then the

669
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:44,879
Speaker 2: last piece of it, like you said, I've seen him

670
00:34:44,920 --> 00:34:48,400
Speaker 2: put together stretches of like top tier perimeter defense this

671
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:51,320
Speaker 2: year where he's guarding an opposing star and getting physical

672
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,520
Speaker 2: underneath him and using his size and quickness to beat

673
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 2: him to spots. I think he's the kind of guy that,

674
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:58,359
Speaker 2: like you just look like you look at as a

675
00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:01,080
Speaker 2: bona fide number two next two Wombenyama. Like when you're

676
00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:03,560
Speaker 2: looking at the Spurs as a team, you can talk

677
00:35:03,640 --> 00:35:06,640
Speaker 2: about this particular window of time where you've got Darren

678
00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:08,759
Speaker 2: Fox who's kind of old, and like Dylan Harper who's

679
00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:10,880
Speaker 2: kind of young, and some of these other flawed young players.

680
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:13,360
Speaker 2: But it's like, I know it's gonna be Steph Castle

681
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:16,880
Speaker 2: and Victor wembin Yama for a very long time moving forward.

682
00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:22,080
Speaker 2: This is this is these are really good. This is

683
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:25,920
Speaker 2: a really good question. Keyante George in Utah is a

684
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:29,000
Speaker 2: little guard that I really really like this year. You

685
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:31,239
Speaker 2: want to know why the Jazz went all in at

686
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:33,839
Speaker 2: the deadline and traded for Jaron Jackson instead of going

687
00:35:33,880 --> 00:35:37,319
Speaker 2: the opposite way and trading Lauri Markinen. It's because they've

688
00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:40,320
Speaker 2: been kind of sneaky feisty this year, and Keyante George,

689
00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:42,759
Speaker 2: their guard, took a massive leap into a guy who's

690
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:45,840
Speaker 2: in that mid twenties in points per game and super

691
00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:49,040
Speaker 2: efficient in terms of his shot making and a high

692
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,919
Speaker 2: level playmaking talent. They're betting on him. Lauri marketing, Jaren

693
00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:56,000
Speaker 2: Jackson and this Walker Kessler guy who had the lebrum

694
00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 2: injury to come back next year, and they want to

695
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:00,960
Speaker 2: be like a serious playoff team next year. Keiante George

696
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:05,560
Speaker 2: really really good. Let's see as I go down. Jalen

697
00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:07,640
Speaker 2: Johnson in Atlanta. He's kind of a guy who's coming

698
00:36:07,680 --> 00:36:10,799
Speaker 2: onto the scene as like a kind of like a

699
00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:13,399
Speaker 2: big four to attacks the room. A lot of playmaking talent.

700
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:15,879
Speaker 2: He's a guy flirts with triple doubles every single night.

701
00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:18,840
Speaker 2: Dylan Brooks went over to Phoenix and became like a

702
00:36:18,840 --> 00:36:21,799
Speaker 2: borderline star. Yeah, and there's like a whole conversation to

703
00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 2: have around the Sun's colin because they, first of all,

704
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:29,319
Speaker 2: to your point about interlopers, Suns fans hated the last

705
00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:32,720
Speaker 2: couple of years. They love this team. They love this team,

706
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:35,840
Speaker 2: and it's because it's it feels like they're building a culture.

707
00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:38,920
Speaker 2: Dylan Brooks has come in and brought like a defensive intensity.

708
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:41,399
Speaker 2: And also Dylan has become one of the better pull

709
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 2: up jump shooters in the league, which came out of

710
00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:45,080
Speaker 2: nowhere because he got such an ugly shot, but it

711
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:47,440
Speaker 2: just goes in and he's averaging over twenty points a

712
00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:50,440
Speaker 2: game this season. Mark Williams the guy that was traded

713
00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 2: for by the Lakers that they backed out.

714
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:53,760
Speaker 1: And couldn't stay healthy.

715
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:56,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, couldn't stay healthy, and he had a reputation in

716
00:36:56,520 --> 00:37:00,239
Speaker 2: Charlotte of being an awful defensive player. He is turned

717
00:37:00,320 --> 00:37:03,040
Speaker 2: into a defensive anchor for Phoenix. They've turned him into

718
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:04,880
Speaker 2: a very good defensive player. All of a sudden, Phoenix

719
00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:07,160
Speaker 2: looks really, really good. Let's see, I'll try to come

720
00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:12,879
Speaker 2: up with one more. I'll go with aj Mitchell from

721
00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:18,880
Speaker 2: the Thunder so aj Mitchell represents a type of player

722
00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:23,440
Speaker 2: that Oklahoma City desperately needs because Jalen Williams is a

723
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:26,760
Speaker 2: little bit slow on his first step and so guys

724
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:28,799
Speaker 2: can beat him the spot sometimes if he's not in

725
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:30,560
Speaker 2: the open floor, and it can turn him into an

726
00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:33,040
Speaker 2: over the top jump shooter, which can cause things to

727
00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:34,640
Speaker 2: get a little stagnant for him. And Ja Dub has

728
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:36,080
Speaker 2: been a little bit of an up and down player

729
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:38,879
Speaker 2: for the Thunder in recent years. Shay is the guy

730
00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:41,319
Speaker 2: that is the driver of their engine on offense because

731
00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:43,240
Speaker 2: he can get wherever he wants to on the floor.

732
00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 2: AJ Mitchell is lightning fast, can make all the passing reads,

733
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:50,840
Speaker 2: is an excellent defensive player. He is a guy that

734
00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:52,880
Speaker 2: has come onto the scene. Is on many nights as

735
00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,080
Speaker 2: their second best offensive player. Is dealing with an injury

736
00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:57,000
Speaker 2: right now that has him out of the lineup. But

737
00:37:57,040 --> 00:37:58,719
Speaker 2: he's a guy that I think has really come onto

738
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,440
Speaker 2: the scene as a ceiling razor Oklahoma City. There's a

739
00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:04,080
Speaker 2: lot of talented young players coming up around the league. Colin,

740
00:38:04,120 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 2: and I mean this draft next year, Colin. I'm telling

741
00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:10,120
Speaker 2: you I dove into it for the first time last year.

742
00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:12,400
Speaker 2: I usually wait till the finals to do the draft,

743
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:15,000
Speaker 2: but we're doing it a little bit earlier this year,

744
00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:20,080
Speaker 2: and aj debonsa unbelievable I was watching in the other

745
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:23,239
Speaker 2: night with my buddy against Iowa State. He goes for

746
00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 2: twenty nine, ten and nine, and I was digging into

747
00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:28,640
Speaker 2: some of his numbers and he's getting to the rim

748
00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:31,480
Speaker 2: at an insane percentage. And he just has this feisty,

749
00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 2: aggressive motor, plays super hard all the time, seems wired

750
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:37,919
Speaker 2: the right way. And then you go down the list

751
00:38:37,920 --> 00:38:40,600
Speaker 2: and it's like Darren Peterson looks like he's awesome. Cam

752
00:38:40,640 --> 00:38:43,400
Speaker 2: Boozer looks like he's awesome. This guard a cuff, just

753
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 2: going for forty eight points the other night. Like there

754
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:48,080
Speaker 2: is a huge influx of young talent coming in around

755
00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 2: the league.

756
00:38:48,719 --> 00:38:51,000
Speaker 1: You know, Boozer is interesting. I said this today. He's

757
00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:53,360
Speaker 1: not Chris Weber. He's not that good, he's not that athletic.

758
00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:56,920
Speaker 1: But when I watch Boozer play for a big he

759
00:38:56,960 --> 00:39:01,239
Speaker 1: has great hands and great feet. He is really you know,

760
00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 1: Dad spent you know that you got twins. Dad spent

761
00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:10,040
Speaker 1: some time with those with his sons. Because maybe it's

762
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 1: just basketball in general, players are more developed more quickly

763
00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:16,080
Speaker 1: the coaching's better. It's like quarterbacks now, the seven on

764
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:18,319
Speaker 1: seven camps. I mean they're twenty four years old and

765
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:20,960
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, these guys, they've had ten thousand snaps.

766
00:39:21,640 --> 00:39:24,239
Speaker 1: Boozer is one of those guys that's not flashy. But

767
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:26,760
Speaker 1: I was watching him this weekend and I'm like, Oh, yeah,

768
00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:29,279
Speaker 1: that game that's gonna work in the NBA first year.

769
00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:32,160
Speaker 1: He's just got good hands, good feed, he's mobile. He's

770
00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:35,719
Speaker 1: not one of those guys that's onspiring athletically, but it's

771
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:40,720
Speaker 1: just really smart around the basket, very resourceful with his moves.

772
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:42,960
Speaker 1: And you're more of a scout on this than I am.

773
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:45,600
Speaker 1: But I'm like, he's not going to wow people, especially

774
00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:48,480
Speaker 1: when you got you know, Peterson at Kansas who looked

775
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:50,480
Speaker 1: it plays like a little bit like Kobe and he's

776
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:52,719
Speaker 1: got some injury stuff, but it's not gonna hurt him

777
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:55,360
Speaker 1: because he's just too damn talented. But I have Boozer

778
00:39:55,440 --> 00:39:58,400
Speaker 1: is one of those guys that, again feels like a

779
00:39:58,400 --> 00:40:01,960
Speaker 1: guy that's going to have a thirteen year minimum productive

780
00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:04,280
Speaker 1: career and it's gonna be really good year one.

781
00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:08,360
Speaker 2: No, I totally agree, like he doesn't have the unbelievable

782
00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:11,759
Speaker 2: raw talent that Darren Peterson and aj Debons have. But

783
00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:13,879
Speaker 2: what he does have is like this game that's kind

784
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:15,960
Speaker 2: of built for the modern NBA. We've seen a lot

785
00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:18,840
Speaker 2: of this type of success in recent years. Jokich is

786
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:21,239
Speaker 2: the biggest example, but I put Shangun in this group.

787
00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:23,719
Speaker 2: I think Derek Queen coming in last year, coming in

788
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:25,600
Speaker 2: last year's draft and having a lot of success this

789
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:29,960
Speaker 2: year meets this criteria. But these big forwards that are

790
00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:33,879
Speaker 2: good at attacking matchups and that can pass is the key,

791
00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:36,600
Speaker 2: because what ends up happening is a lot of NBA

792
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:39,600
Speaker 2: teams switch and there's always these smaller guys on the

793
00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:41,279
Speaker 2: floor that you can attack. So when you have a

794
00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:44,200
Speaker 2: dude that can back him down and hit little short shots,

795
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:47,000
Speaker 2: but that can read the double teams really well, Cam,

796
00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:50,279
Speaker 2: of all those dudes in that top tier, Cam has

797
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:53,719
Speaker 2: by far the best like passing feel of any guy

798
00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:56,400
Speaker 2: in that group. He's very much like power forward Yo

799
00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:58,879
Speaker 2: Kitchen in that sense. He just sees things before they

800
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:02,319
Speaker 2: happen in Tis paints the reads, gets the pass out

801
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:04,640
Speaker 2: on time, on target. He's that kind of guy that

802
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:07,479
Speaker 2: like everyone's gonna love playing with him. He's just gonna

803
00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 2: be the wheels.

804
00:41:09,520 --> 00:41:13,080
Speaker 1: You can tell his dad has told him like the

805
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:16,120
Speaker 1: right things. Yes, like he when you watch his game,

806
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:19,000
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, that's gonna work. People are gonna want

807
00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:22,200
Speaker 1: to play with him. Like Joe Morant, people just don't

808
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:24,799
Speaker 1: want to play with John. You get guys like that

809
00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:27,040
Speaker 1: where it's I just don't want to play with him.

810
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:30,439
Speaker 1: You watch Boozer and it's like, oh, yeah, that guy could.

811
00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:33,600
Speaker 1: You know, as good as talent is a lot of players.

812
00:41:33,600 --> 00:41:36,160
Speaker 1: I always said this about Klay Thompson. Catch and shoot

813
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 1: guys worked every Peyton Pritchard, Klay Thompson in his prime, everybody,

814
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:42,799
Speaker 1: Kevin Durant, he could be forty four years old, like,

815
00:41:42,840 --> 00:41:45,120
Speaker 1: get him the ball late in the clock. There are

816
00:41:45,239 --> 00:41:49,880
Speaker 1: guys that just you want to play with. And that's

817
00:41:50,239 --> 00:41:54,160
Speaker 1: that's an underdiscussed, underrated part. You know, the AAU culture,

818
00:41:54,520 --> 00:41:57,240
Speaker 1: you know a lot of it's a million games, losing

819
00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:01,400
Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily matter, not enough practic, too many games, whereas

820
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:03,160
Speaker 1: the you know, we know this, it's well documented. The

821
00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:06,879
Speaker 1: European culture is more practice, fewer games, the games matter more.

822
00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:10,040
Speaker 1: But I do think sometimes our culture develops players that

823
00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:14,360
Speaker 1: they're not necessarily fun to play with. They're just super talented.

824
00:42:14,360 --> 00:42:17,279
Speaker 1: They're long, they're talented, and I guess you know, I

825
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:19,399
Speaker 1: haven't watched enough Boozer. I' probably seen him play five

826
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:21,520
Speaker 1: times this year, but when I watch them against Michigan,

827
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 1: I'm like, that's an NBA game. He's he's just a

828
00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:27,359
Speaker 1: year away from it, but it's like it almost has

829
00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:31,000
Speaker 1: a slight European feel. Cooper flags got this where you're like,

830
00:42:31,160 --> 00:42:34,719
Speaker 1: he's got a left hand, he's got a floater. It's

831
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:38,200
Speaker 1: like that's a really developed game at nineteen, and I

832
00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:40,680
Speaker 1: think Boozer is not nearly as talented, but I think

833
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:41,719
Speaker 1: Boozer has that.

834
00:42:42,239 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, Cooper. That's the big difference between Cooper and Debonsa

835
00:42:45,640 --> 00:42:47,560
Speaker 2: and Peterson because those are the three guys that kind

836
00:42:47,560 --> 00:42:49,600
Speaker 2: of get lumped together from these last two drafts as

837
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:54,480
Speaker 2: like real like superstar level prospects, right, and Cooper just

838
00:42:54,520 --> 00:42:58,360
Speaker 2: had this unbelievable natural passing feel that stood out immediately

839
00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:00,880
Speaker 2: at Duke, and stood out immediately at Summer League, and

840
00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:03,000
Speaker 2: stood out immediately when he started playing in the NBA.

841
00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:05,960
Speaker 2: I mean, for example, like Darren Peterson has more turnovers

842
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:08,439
Speaker 2: than assists for this year, Like that's a huge red

843
00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:10,400
Speaker 2: flag for me in terms of passing field when a

844
00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:14,000
Speaker 2: player has more turnovers than assists. Cooper already as a

845
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:15,960
Speaker 2: rookie this year is like at a two to one

846
00:43:16,000 --> 00:43:18,520
Speaker 2: assist a turnover ratio, which is a really strong number

847
00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:21,520
Speaker 2: for him. Like there's a that passing feel is so important, Colin,

848
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:26,560
Speaker 2: because like there is such a sophisticated element to defense. Now,

849
00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:29,120
Speaker 2: the defenses are good at getting the ball out of

850
00:43:29,120 --> 00:43:30,960
Speaker 2: the hands of the good players they are, and so

851
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:34,319
Speaker 2: it's like, look at Cam Thomas. So when you have

852
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:36,440
Speaker 2: a guard who's like the one thing he's good at

853
00:43:36,520 --> 00:43:38,360
Speaker 2: is putting the ball in the basket, you're gonna have

854
00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:40,440
Speaker 2: a hard time finding a home in the NBA because

855
00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:43,080
Speaker 2: so much of this is about Reid and React playing

856
00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:46,520
Speaker 2: with the advantage quick decision making. You watch Boston, you

857
00:43:46,560 --> 00:43:48,799
Speaker 2: watch Okay, See, you watch Indiana, you watch these good

858
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:52,200
Speaker 2: teams around the league. They're driven by quick decision making

859
00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:54,399
Speaker 2: in the ball popping around, it's just harder to guard.

860
00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:57,000
Speaker 2: The simplest way I can put it is if you

861
00:43:57,080 --> 00:43:59,600
Speaker 2: drive up the floor like Luca, and this guy stands

862
00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:01,760
Speaker 2: in the left, that guy stands in the right corner

863
00:44:01,760 --> 00:44:04,319
Speaker 2: opposite wing. Here, let's run a pick and roll. I

864
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:06,719
Speaker 2: have to guard one action. If I defend that pick

865
00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:09,440
Speaker 2: and roll, well, I win the possession. We're going out

866
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:11,520
Speaker 2: the other way. If we go up the floor and

867
00:44:11,560 --> 00:44:15,040
Speaker 2: it's four or five actions in the same possession, you're

868
00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 2: gonna make a mistake somewhere in there, and someone's gonna

869
00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:21,360
Speaker 2: get open. And that's the thing like playing quick, quick decisions,

870
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:24,640
Speaker 2: getting the ball moving. It makes everyone have more fun

871
00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:27,160
Speaker 2: when they're out there. It keeps everyone in rhythm, and

872
00:44:27,200 --> 00:44:30,560
Speaker 2: it generates more mistakes. It generates the open shots that

873
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:33,480
Speaker 2: you need in order to have sustainably good offense. And

874
00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:35,800
Speaker 2: I just think I just think Cooper in particular, and

875
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:38,040
Speaker 2: I think Cam Booser falls into that group. That passing

876
00:44:38,080 --> 00:44:41,000
Speaker 2: feel is such an important part of a young prospect.

877
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 1: Jason timp could talk anybody good to.

878
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879
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