WEBVTT - Google's Antitrust Case, Trump's Frustration with Powell 0:00:02.520 --> 0:00:07.000 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. 0:00:08.920 --> 0:00:13.240 This is Bloomberg business Week Daily reporting from the magazine 0:00:13.240 --> 0:00:17.840 that helps global leaders stay ahead with insight on the people, companies, 0:00:17.880 --> 0:00:22.760 and trends shaping today's complex economy. Plus global business finance 0:00:22.800 --> 0:00:26.520 and tech news as it happens. The Bloomberg Business Weekdaily 0:00:26.640 --> 0:00:31.720 Podcast with Carol Masser and Tim Steneveek on Bloomberg Radio. 0:00:32.240 --> 0:00:34.199 A couple legal actions we want to get to you 0:00:34.280 --> 0:00:34.640 right now. 0:00:34.680 --> 0:00:38.640 First of all, earlier today Google partially losing a US 0:00:38.840 --> 0:00:42.760 advertising tech antitrust case, and just moments ago, the US 0:00:42.800 --> 0:00:45.680 Supreme Court saying we'll hear arguments on President Trump's bid 0:00:45.720 --> 0:00:49.600 to start enforcing an executive order that would restrict automatic 0:00:49.640 --> 0:00:53.760 birthright citizenship and upend a longstanding constitutional right. 0:00:53.800 --> 0:00:55.360 The Court saying today. 0:00:55.120 --> 0:00:57.440 Will keep his restrictions on hold in advance of that 0:00:57.480 --> 0:00:58.520 May fifteenth argument. 0:00:58.640 --> 0:01:00.920 I want to bring in Bloomberg News team leader Sarah 0:01:01.000 --> 0:01:03.600 Ford and Sarah joins us from our Washington DC bureau. 0:01:03.600 --> 0:01:05.800 I want to start with the Supreme Court setting to 0:01:05.800 --> 0:01:09.760 hear arguments in the birthright sistemship case. How does this work? 0:01:10.040 --> 0:01:12.680 Give us the sort of schoolhouse rock version of how 0:01:12.720 --> 0:01:15.600 the Supreme Court could change what is written in the 0:01:15.680 --> 0:01:16.479 US Constitution. 0:01:17.520 --> 0:01:19.280 Well, I mean this has been, as you said, a 0:01:19.319 --> 0:01:24.480 longstanding belief of constitutional scholars and others that the right 0:01:24.520 --> 0:01:27.720 to birthright citizenship is sacrosanct. So the fact that they 0:01:27.760 --> 0:01:30.080 are willing to take this up and to start to 0:01:30.080 --> 0:01:34.440 parse it and consider the restrictions that are being proposed 0:01:34.440 --> 0:01:39.160 by the Trump administration means that this right could potentially 0:01:39.200 --> 0:01:40.640 be in play going forward. 0:01:41.319 --> 0:01:43.200 So what's next May fifteenth? 0:01:43.640 --> 0:01:46.600 Is that what we focus So, as you said, the 0:01:46.640 --> 0:01:49.240 restrictions are on hold for now, but May fifteenth will 0:01:49.240 --> 0:01:53.960 be a closely closely followed arguments. This usually takes several 0:01:54.040 --> 0:01:57.280 hours where we listen attentively to what each of the 0:01:57.360 --> 0:01:59.760 justices the questions that they're asking and how that might 0:02:00.080 --> 0:02:01.240 indicate what they're thinking. 0:02:01.360 --> 0:02:01.960 Is I mean, this. 0:02:01.960 --> 0:02:04.720 Would be a significant change in a policy that's been standing. 0:02:05.680 --> 0:02:08.359 Yeah, I mean this has been sacri saying that the 0:02:08.480 --> 0:02:11.360 children of people who are non citizens who are born 0:02:11.400 --> 0:02:14.560 in this country have the right to American citizenship. So 0:02:14.600 --> 0:02:19.040 this will go to hospitals across the country when babies 0:02:19.080 --> 0:02:20.960 are born. Are they going to give those babies a 0:02:21.000 --> 0:02:24.600 Social Security number or not? And so this could start 0:02:24.600 --> 0:02:27.080 to roll back that, and it's part of the Trump 0:02:27.120 --> 0:02:32.320 administration's larger, very aggressive crackdown on immigration to this country 0:02:32.600 --> 0:02:33.680 over multiple What. 0:02:33.639 --> 0:02:36.520 Is the legal case here, because in the Section one 0:02:36.560 --> 0:02:39.320 of the fourteenth Amendment of the Constitution, it does go 0:02:39.400 --> 0:02:41.760 into the fact that all persons born or naturalized in 0:02:41.760 --> 0:02:44.600 the US are subject and subject to the jurisdiction thereof 0:02:44.600 --> 0:02:47.840 are citizens of the US and the state wherein they reside. 0:02:48.400 --> 0:02:53.600 Is the Supreme Court challenging the meaning of that. 0:02:53.600 --> 0:02:56.799 That clause subject to the jurisdiction thereof is the one 0:02:56.840 --> 0:02:59.640 that is being put into question, and the questions whether 0:03:00.120 --> 0:03:03.280 these non citizens who are here are really subject to 0:03:03.320 --> 0:03:05.239 the jurisdiction. And so that is what they're going to 0:03:05.520 --> 0:03:08.240 tease out in part during these arguments. 0:03:08.919 --> 0:03:13.960 So I am curious, what did you just happen? Oh, 0:03:14.000 --> 0:03:15.880 I'm sorry, there's a lot of stuff happening. 0:03:15.960 --> 0:03:18.760 Yeah, producers are talking to Carol, So I'm jumping in 0:03:18.760 --> 0:03:21.040 a little bit. I was asking specifically about Section one 0:03:21.040 --> 0:03:23.200 of the fourteenth Defendment, okay, and how that is open 0:03:23.240 --> 0:03:24.880 to interpretation with this legal case. 0:03:24.919 --> 0:03:26.680 Sorry, it's one of those kind of days and kind 0:03:26.680 --> 0:03:28.240 of these weeks in one of these kind of years. 0:03:28.560 --> 0:03:30.760 I want to flip to Google and the case there 0:03:30.880 --> 0:03:35.440 of Google partially losing a US advertising tech anti trust case. 0:03:35.520 --> 0:03:39.000 This was a federal judge finding Google to have legally 0:03:39.200 --> 0:03:44.480 illegally monopolize some online ad technology markets in a blow 0:03:44.640 --> 0:03:47.440 to what is a really key part of Google's business. 0:03:47.800 --> 0:03:49.040 Walk us through this one. 0:03:49.960 --> 0:03:54.520 Yeah, absolutely. This is the second major ruling against Google 0:03:54.640 --> 0:03:57.520 in a tech anti trust case. And this case has 0:03:57.600 --> 0:04:01.560 to do with the pipeline that Underpins's advertising business. So 0:04:01.600 --> 0:04:05.120 they control the technology soup to nuts, from the ad 0:04:05.200 --> 0:04:10.360 servers to the putting these ads on websites. And this 0:04:10.480 --> 0:04:14.080 judge found that Google monopolizes the part that has to 0:04:14.120 --> 0:04:16.080 do with the ad server tools. And I know this 0:04:16.240 --> 0:04:18.720 is all very wonky, but it goes back to their 0:04:18.760 --> 0:04:21.400 acquisition of a company called double Click in two thousand. 0:04:21.480 --> 0:04:24.160 That was so long ago, long ago. 0:04:24.279 --> 0:04:28.000 So the DOJ actually is in the remedy portion of 0:04:28.000 --> 0:04:31.520 this case, which will follow today's decision, is DJ is 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:34.240 asking for the judge to order Google to sell off 0:04:34.279 --> 0:04:37.560 that double Click unit. But of course, over the years 0:04:37.800 --> 0:04:40.280 it has been integrated into their business, and so it's 0:04:40.360 --> 0:04:42.680 kind of like trying to unscramble the omelet. 0:04:42.440 --> 0:04:45.200 So is there an appeal coming to we assume so Kenny. 0:04:45.400 --> 0:04:49.400 Google has already said they will appeal this part of 0:04:49.400 --> 0:04:51.760 the case. They did win the part of the case 0:04:51.760 --> 0:04:54.640 that has to do with display ads, so so they're 0:04:54.960 --> 0:04:58.080 safe on that count. But all of this marks a 0:04:58.120 --> 0:05:02.240 bigger reckoning for the tech companies that have gotten so powerful, 0:05:02.600 --> 0:05:06.000 and it shows that we have a rare little spot 0:05:06.240 --> 0:05:10.640 of bipartisan consensus on antitrust and limiting the power of 0:05:10.640 --> 0:05:17.120 big tech because these cases have been taken forward both 0:05:17.160 --> 0:05:21.080 by the first Trump administration who filed the first Google 0:05:21.120 --> 0:05:24.839 case which was about search, and the metacase, which is 0:05:24.920 --> 0:05:29.720 currently playing out in another DC courtroom, and they were 0:05:29.720 --> 0:05:32.839 carried forward by the Biden administration. So we're not seeing 0:05:32.880 --> 0:05:37.080 a lot of light between conservatives and liberals on these cases. 0:05:37.120 --> 0:05:39.359 Just real quickly, just about twenty seconds here, sour. So 0:05:39.400 --> 0:05:40.640 that's what I was going to ask, because we know 0:05:40.680 --> 0:05:43.800 this was a kind of second major blow to Google 0:05:43.920 --> 0:05:47.080 that was already found to have monopolized the online search 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:48.120 market in a separate case. 0:05:48.400 --> 0:05:49.560 Is this all Google. 0:05:49.279 --> 0:05:51.960 Specific or I kind of get the feeling it's a 0:05:52.040 --> 0:05:53.880 larger message here for some of those big tech guys. 0:05:53.920 --> 0:05:54.440 Just quickly. 0:05:55.040 --> 0:05:57.440 This is a larger message and we have cases running 0:05:57.440 --> 0:06:02.360 now against Amazon, Meta, Apple, and Google. So yes, it's 0:06:02.440 --> 0:06:03.480 broad all right. 0:06:03.520 --> 0:06:05.560 Just thinking, I'm just thinking of those CEOs of those 0:06:05.600 --> 0:06:09.880 companies were all at the inauguration. I think they were. 0:06:09.960 --> 0:06:11.560 I believe they were just making sure. 0:06:11.640 --> 0:06:13.240 Yeah, it's working out well, cool, all right. 0:06:13.279 --> 0:06:16.960 Bloomberg News Legal team leader Sarah Fordon, thank you so much. 0:06:17.000 --> 0:06:19.279 We really appreciate you joining us. 0:06:19.800 --> 0:06:23.160 You are listening to the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Catch 0:06:23.240 --> 0:06:26.479 us live weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern. 0:06:26.600 --> 0:06:29.680 Listen on Apple CarPlay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg 0:06:29.720 --> 0:06:32.440 Business app, or watch us live on YouTube. 0:06:33.800 --> 0:06:37.599 We want to stay with the future of j. Powell. 0:06:37.640 --> 0:06:40.599 Of course, the fed share things have just come out 0:06:40.839 --> 0:06:44.280 of this press conference that is ongoing here in the 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:46.920 White House again the President making another comment he should 0:06:46.920 --> 0:06:49.599 do the right cuts. So we want to kind of 0:06:49.600 --> 0:06:51.360 get into this, and we have a great voice we do. 0:06:51.520 --> 0:06:54.520 Let's bring in Katerina Sariva. She joins us from Houston, 0:06:54.520 --> 0:06:57.360 also with us as Michael McKee's Bloomberg News International Economics 0:06:57.360 --> 0:06:59.640 and Policy correspondent. He joins us here in the studio. 0:07:00.160 --> 0:07:01.719 I do want to start with you, because you have 0:07:01.839 --> 0:07:05.280 been monitoring these Powell or these Trump comments. I should say, 0:07:05.520 --> 0:07:08.160 in the context of what we heard from j. Powell yesterday, 0:07:08.160 --> 0:07:11.600 you were there in Chicago, just give me your impression 0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:13.800 of what we're hearing from the President right now and 0:07:13.840 --> 0:07:16.800 what the message is that he has for the Federal Reserve. 0:07:17.800 --> 0:07:20.600 At the moment, I'm still seeing this as saber rattling, 0:07:21.200 --> 0:07:25.440 trying to influence the FED. The President said this morning 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:29.080 he is a word termination. Other White House officials have 0:07:29.120 --> 0:07:32.040 told other networks that he didn't mean firing him, And 0:07:32.040 --> 0:07:34.800 then today in the Oval office, they said, are you 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:36.840 trying to get rid of him? And he said, yeah, yeah, 0:07:37.000 --> 0:07:40.080 But what does that really mean. We know he doesn't 0:07:40.200 --> 0:07:44.160 like Powell, and we know he doesn't like the fact 0:07:44.200 --> 0:07:47.040 that the FED is not cutting interest rates as the 0:07:47.080 --> 0:07:51.480 president would like, but there isn't There's a real debate 0:07:51.520 --> 0:07:53.920 about whether the President has any power to get rid 0:07:53.960 --> 0:07:55.840 of the FED chair, which we can go into later. 0:07:55.880 --> 0:08:01.040 But I don't think that we're necessarily any closer to 0:08:01.160 --> 0:08:04.320 Powell being ousted or an attempt to oust him by 0:08:04.320 --> 0:08:07.400 the President. But I think that because Powell spoke yesterday 0:08:07.840 --> 0:08:10.000 and gave the impression they're not going to cut rates soon, 0:08:10.320 --> 0:08:13.080 that he's just venting again on the FED chair. 0:08:13.120 --> 0:08:14.760 I mean, you can't fire a FED chair just because 0:08:14.800 --> 0:08:16.120 you don't like their policy, can you. 0:08:16.640 --> 0:08:20.000 Well, is that I don't. 0:08:19.800 --> 0:08:20.280 Know, is that? 0:08:20.320 --> 0:08:20.600 Cause? 0:08:21.960 --> 0:08:24.000 Like I said, we can go into the whole background. 0:08:24.040 --> 0:08:28.560 But in theory, legal experts say that's not cause, causes 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:33.040 malfeasance or illegality or something like that. The question is 0:08:33.040 --> 0:08:35.760 not so much cause. It's this whole Article two issue 0:08:35.760 --> 0:08:41.239 about whether the president has unfettered ability to run everything 0:08:41.720 --> 0:08:44.440 in the executive branch, including what are supposed to be 0:08:44.480 --> 0:08:45.559 independent agencies. 0:08:45.640 --> 0:08:47.400 Well, and to that, there are some legal actions that 0:08:47.440 --> 0:08:49.360 are out there that are testing the limits of presidential 0:08:49.360 --> 0:08:52.560 authority to remove agency officials without cause. I want to 0:08:52.600 --> 0:08:56.280 just bring in Bloomberg News Federal Reserve reporter Katerina Sariva, 0:08:56.320 --> 0:08:59.679 who's with us from Houston. Katerina, what do we know 0:08:59.760 --> 0:09:02.800 about these cases and what it could possibly potentially I 0:09:02.840 --> 0:09:05.160 want to be careful here, but what it could mean 0:09:05.720 --> 0:09:08.280 in terms of the presidential authority to possibly get rid 0:09:08.280 --> 0:09:08.920 of the FED chair. 0:09:10.520 --> 0:09:14.320 Yeah, I mean that's you know, as Mike was just saying, 0:09:14.320 --> 0:09:17.760 the big question. So we have a couple cases that 0:09:17.880 --> 0:09:21.679 have kind of filtered their way through the federal court 0:09:21.720 --> 0:09:25.600 system and will are expected to be taken up by 0:09:25.600 --> 0:09:30.440 the Supreme Court soon. So these are kind of They 0:09:30.440 --> 0:09:34.560 both have to do with what's called Humphries Executor, which 0:09:34.640 --> 0:09:38.400 is a provision from nineteen thirty five, a Supreme Court 0:09:38.480 --> 0:09:45.480 ruling that found that the president could not unilaterally fire 0:09:47.480 --> 0:09:50.880 members of boards. Now the Supreme Court has already chipped 0:09:50.880 --> 0:09:52.920 away at that a little bit. There was a twenty 0:09:52.960 --> 0:09:56.400 twenty decision about the CFPB that said, when it's a 0:09:56.440 --> 0:10:00.160 single directory, the President does have that authority to to 0:10:00.200 --> 0:10:03.760 fire that person. But the open question is kind of 0:10:03.800 --> 0:10:08.760 how it applies still to multi member boards. So the 0:10:08.840 --> 0:10:11.840 decisions going up to the Supreme the cases going up 0:10:11.840 --> 0:10:15.880 to the Supreme Court now are not specifically about the 0:10:15.880 --> 0:10:20.000 Federal Reserve. It's other government agencies, but it's a similar 0:10:20.040 --> 0:10:22.839 structure where they have multiple people on the board. 0:10:23.640 --> 0:10:26.160 You know, Katerina, we're monitoring what's going on in the 0:10:26.200 --> 0:10:28.880 Oval Office right now. The President is with Georgia Maloney, 0:10:28.880 --> 0:10:31.400 the Prime Minister of Italy. He's still making more comments. 0:10:31.440 --> 0:10:34.000 Just as you were speaking about the Federal Reserve, he said, 0:10:34.280 --> 0:10:36.680 interest rates are pretty flat. They should be better. Costs 0:10:36.679 --> 0:10:39.360 are down, very little inflation. The Fed owes it to 0:10:39.400 --> 0:10:41.800 Americans to get interest rates down. Powell will have a 0:10:41.800 --> 0:10:44.439 lot of political pressure and the only thing Powell is 0:10:44.480 --> 0:10:46.840 good for is lowering rates. I want to go back 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:50.080 to Mike McKee, International Economics and Policy correspondent. He's here 0:10:50.120 --> 0:10:52.080 in our studio too. He's looking at these comments as well. 0:10:53.240 --> 0:10:56.160 Just fact check us a little bit with where inflation is, 0:10:56.840 --> 0:11:00.320 where costs are, and how you view the comment that 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:03.000 the President said the only thing Paul is good for 0:11:03.040 --> 0:11:03.840 is lowering rates. 0:11:03.920 --> 0:11:05.920 Well, it depends on which measure you want to use. 0:11:05.960 --> 0:11:09.800 As always, we say with the inflation numbers, but basically 0:11:09.800 --> 0:11:13.640 they're getting very close to the Fed's target, the CPI down, 0:11:13.720 --> 0:11:16.960 and now we're here after we've had the other numbers 0:11:16.960 --> 0:11:20.200 and people plugged in the data. The Fed's target is 0:11:20.240 --> 0:11:23.240 the PCE index, and that's now forecast to come in 0:11:23.280 --> 0:11:26.839 about two point three percent. So inflation has come down. 0:11:27.480 --> 0:11:30.360 The issue is not that inflation is coming down, because 0:11:30.400 --> 0:11:35.319 if this were an ordinary time, the Fed would be 0:11:35.360 --> 0:11:38.240 probably lining up to cut rates again. I think pretty 0:11:38.320 --> 0:11:42.200 much all of them want to, but they can't because 0:11:42.240 --> 0:11:44.840 they don't know what is going to happen, and this 0:11:45.000 --> 0:11:49.200 may be what set the president off. Powell yesterday saying 0:11:49.240 --> 0:11:52.640 that the tariffs as announced were bigger than people thought, 0:11:52.880 --> 0:11:55.199 and they will have a bigger impact than people thought. 0:11:55.360 --> 0:11:58.720 Inflation will probably go higher than we estimated. And in 0:11:58.760 --> 0:12:03.240 that case, because that's a possibility if Ed doesn't want 0:12:03.240 --> 0:12:05.240 to move right now, and that makes sense. 0:12:05.640 --> 0:12:08.040 So he also said the president, if Europe has cut rates, 0:12:08.040 --> 0:12:09.960 that puts a set in a disadvantage. 0:12:10.160 --> 0:12:16.480 They're not comparable. The European economy is growing barely one percent. 0:12:17.320 --> 0:12:19.920 We've been growing two and a half or better. First 0:12:20.000 --> 0:12:22.560 quarter may not be great, but there may be some 0:12:22.600 --> 0:12:28.920 statistical anomalies there. Their unemployment rate is much higher than ours, 0:12:29.800 --> 0:12:34.640 and their interest rates are lower than ours. So at 0:12:34.640 --> 0:12:38.480 this point you can't really say that it's a comparable situation. 0:12:38.760 --> 0:12:40.959 And we should point out that the remarks and the 0:12:41.080 --> 0:12:43.520 press event in the Oval Office has ended, so that 0:12:43.520 --> 0:12:45.679 should be the end of those headlines. Katherine, I want 0:12:45.679 --> 0:12:48.720 to go back to you for one more thought. I 0:12:48.760 --> 0:12:53.959 mean so legally, I mean how easy would it be 0:12:54.040 --> 0:12:57.040 potentially and I guess, depending on how all these rulings go, 0:12:58.240 --> 0:13:01.640 could it be for the President to maybe remove Fetcher 0:13:01.720 --> 0:13:02.319 J Powell. 0:13:03.600 --> 0:13:06.600 Yeah, I mean if the rulings are broad and not 0:13:07.480 --> 0:13:10.040 very narrow, right, if they if they are seen to 0:13:10.120 --> 0:13:15.000 apply to basically any multi member agency, then yeah, that 0:13:15.080 --> 0:13:17.760 leaves the door wide open for the President to fire 0:13:18.200 --> 0:13:21.640 the fet Share. There are some legal scholars and some folks, 0:13:21.679 --> 0:13:24.880 and we heard it from Chair Powell yesterday as well, 0:13:24.920 --> 0:13:27.720 that think that there is likely to be a carve 0:13:27.760 --> 0:13:32.120 out specifically for the FED. We have heard, we had, 0:13:32.920 --> 0:13:35.760 we've been in a decision a few years ago. Justice 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:38.720 Alito kind of eluded, you know, talked a little bit 0:13:38.760 --> 0:13:42.520 about how the Federal Reserve is a unique entity. So 0:13:43.040 --> 0:13:46.679 there there might be appetite for that at the Supreme 0:13:46.720 --> 0:13:49.559 Court to kind of carve out the FED. But it 0:13:49.600 --> 0:13:50.600 remains to be seen. 0:13:50.720 --> 0:13:51.000 Now. 0:13:51.360 --> 0:13:54.480 I think one of the important factors for Trump, even 0:13:54.520 --> 0:13:56.840 if he has the permission to do so, is the 0:13:56.880 --> 0:14:00.520 reality of how the markets would react, right, because it 0:14:00.559 --> 0:14:03.720 would be quite a reaction in markets, and that may 0:14:04.240 --> 0:14:06.040 prevent them from ultimately acting. 0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:09.000 All right, really appreciate you, wangan, Katerina. We're going to 0:14:09.080 --> 0:14:10.320 let you go. Thank you so much. 0:14:10.360 --> 0:14:13.559 So, Katerina Saravas, she is Bloomberg News Federal Reserve reporter. 0:14:13.600 --> 0:14:15.679 We're going to continue that a little bit more with 0:14:15.760 --> 0:14:19.240 Mike in terms of Fetcher J. Powell and his tenure. 0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:22.000 Yeah, so, Mike, I do want to bring you back 0:14:22.000 --> 0:14:23.560 in here because and we're going to get to trade 0:14:23.560 --> 0:14:25.680 in just a minute, because there were some headlines on 0:14:25.720 --> 0:14:29.120 the trade side of things coming from that Oval Office meeting. 0:14:29.680 --> 0:14:31.520 But if we think about this in the context of 0:14:31.520 --> 0:14:35.240 what we heard from the president in his first term, 0:14:35.520 --> 0:14:39.320 he would tweet at the time about the FED lowering 0:14:39.360 --> 0:14:43.800 interest rates. The FED chair has in the past addressed 0:14:44.320 --> 0:14:48.400 questions about pressure and political pressure. He's talked about maintaining independence. 0:14:48.960 --> 0:14:50.640 As of now, though, given what we heard from the 0:14:50.640 --> 0:14:54.000 President today, are there any more questions about the pressure 0:14:54.000 --> 0:14:56.320 that he must be feeling or he may be feeling. 0:14:56.200 --> 0:14:59.160 Well, he may be feeling pressure, But he is giving 0:14:59.240 --> 0:15:02.320 the same answer it was asked yesterday and again he said, 0:15:02.640 --> 0:15:05.680 we will do what we do without any regard to 0:15:05.680 --> 0:15:09.400 political pressure. Our job is the mandate that Congress gave 0:15:09.480 --> 0:15:13.280 us maximum employment and stable prices, and that's what we're 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:16.440 going to do. We'll make our decisions based on what 0:15:16.560 --> 0:15:17.920 gets us to those mandates. 0:15:18.680 --> 0:15:19.160 Fetcher J. 0:15:19.320 --> 0:15:22.280 Powell also said yesterday our independence is a matter of law. 0:15:22.400 --> 0:15:25.440 Congress has it in our statute. We're not removable except 0:15:25.440 --> 0:15:29.000 for cause we serve very long terms, seemingly endless terms, 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:32.800 he said, So we're protected in the law. So you know, 0:15:32.840 --> 0:15:34.800 Congress could change that law, but there's I don't think 0:15:34.800 --> 0:15:37.080 there's any danger of that. That independence has pretty broad 0:15:37.120 --> 0:15:40.920 support across both political parties. I'm going to ask the obvious. 0:15:41.000 --> 0:15:42.880 I know the answer, but we've got to ask it. 0:15:43.320 --> 0:15:45.040 Maybe for those who are like, well, couldn't you just 0:15:45.040 --> 0:15:48.320 get rid of the FED? I mean, if President Trump 0:15:48.400 --> 0:15:51.120 just got rid of feedcher J. Powell just kind of 0:15:51.120 --> 0:15:53.840 because he wanted to, and there was no real cause, 0:15:54.640 --> 0:15:58.560 what would that say potentially to the independence of the Fed? 0:15:59.120 --> 0:16:02.560 And again, just why having an independent fact is crucial 0:16:02.920 --> 0:16:05.560 and when it doesn't happen, we see what happens two countries. 0:16:05.680 --> 0:16:07.640 That part is easy because there have been many, many 0:16:07.680 --> 0:16:11.400 studies that show countries with independent central banks have much 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:16.320 lower interest rates, much lower inflation rates, and it's just 0:16:16.480 --> 0:16:20.520 overall better for the economy. And there's no debate among 0:16:20.720 --> 0:16:26.240 economists or I think investors, Wall Street Global, Wall Street 0:16:26.320 --> 0:16:31.080 kind of people about that. Now if the President tried 0:16:31.200 --> 0:16:36.200 to fire Powell, I think there would be a rebellion 0:16:36.480 --> 0:16:41.360 on Wall Street. Krishnaghoo, is I ever core said today 0:16:41.680 --> 0:16:44.800 if you like the reaction to the tariff announcement, just 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:47.440 wait till you get Trump has fired at US. 0:16:47.480 --> 0:16:49.120 You're saying the bond market could get yippie. 0:16:49.200 --> 0:16:52.880 Yeah, they could get so it's kind of a technical. 0:16:52.560 --> 0:16:55.520 Term, but yeah, okay, that's good to know, Mike. One 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:57.760 last question to you, this one on trade, because we 0:16:57.840 --> 0:17:00.520 did hear the President and Prime Minister the Resident just 0:17:00.600 --> 0:17:04.399 now saying that they discussed trade other things and that 0:17:04.480 --> 0:17:08.640 Italy will have to increase their imports of LNG. Remind 0:17:08.760 --> 0:17:12.960 us because the European Union is this block. Remind us 0:17:13.440 --> 0:17:16.800 if individual countries can actually go and negotiate their own 0:17:16.840 --> 0:17:18.879 trade deals with the US or do they have to 0:17:18.880 --> 0:17:19.720 do it as the EU. 0:17:19.920 --> 0:17:22.520 Well, they have to do it as an as the 0:17:22.560 --> 0:17:27.080 EU as a block to negotiate a trade agreement. Now, 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:30.720 there's no reason that Italy couldn't buy more of one product. 0:17:30.720 --> 0:17:33.280 They could say we want more LNG. We saw that 0:17:33.720 --> 0:17:40.200 during the initial phase of the Ukrainian War, countries that 0:17:40.400 --> 0:17:43.840 needed natural gas buying more from the United States and 0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:48.359 other places. But the idea of an overall trade deal 0:17:48.440 --> 0:17:52.760 that would exempt them from tariffs probably has to go 0:17:52.840 --> 0:17:56.440 through Brussels. I mean, that's the structure they have set up. 0:17:56.800 --> 0:17:59.280 All right, We're gonna leave it there. Great timing. Thanks 0:17:59.280 --> 0:18:03.200 for dropping by. 0:18:01.880 --> 0:18:03.840 And it knows when I'm here to make. 0:18:03.800 --> 0:18:06.800 It a coordinate schedules, right, five o'clock, Balance of power, 0:18:07.040 --> 0:18:10.840 five o'clock, talk about it again. To see you next. 0:18:10.960 --> 0:18:14.199 Michael McKee, International Economics and Policy Correspondent, Bloomberg News. 0:18:15.760 --> 0:18:19.520 This is the Bloomberg Business Week podcast. Listen live each 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:22.560 weekday starting at two pm Eastern on Apple car Play 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:25.280 and the Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. You 0:18:25.320 --> 0:18:28.520 can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship 0:18:28.560 --> 0:18:32.359 New York station, Just Say Alexa played Bloomberg eleven thirty. 0:18:33.000 --> 0:18:33.160 Well. 0:18:33.200 --> 0:18:35.640 President Donald Trump said during a meeting with Italian Prime 0:18:35.640 --> 0:18:38.600 Minister Georgia Maloney that he expects to reach a trade 0:18:38.640 --> 0:18:41.239 deal with the EU, but he indicated he's in no 0:18:41.359 --> 0:18:43.800 hurry to finalize tariff agreements. 0:18:44.280 --> 0:18:47.960 We're doing very well with negotiations, I think with all countries, 0:18:48.760 --> 0:18:52.399 and Scott could tell you a little bit, but we 0:18:52.480 --> 0:18:55.120 are doing very well. We have a lot of countries 0:18:55.160 --> 0:18:57.280 that want to make a deal. Frankly, they want to 0:18:57.280 --> 0:19:00.320 make deals more than I do. Tariffs are making those rich. 0:19:00.960 --> 0:19:01.120 Well. 0:19:01.119 --> 0:19:04.040 That was President Trump from the Oval Office, alongside Italian 0:19:04.040 --> 0:19:06.639 Prime Minister Georgia Maloney. The Scott by the way, he 0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:09.239 referred to with Scott Bess and the Treasury Secretary of 0:19:09.320 --> 0:19:12.160 the US separately, well not separately, but also I should say, 0:19:12.200 --> 0:19:14.719 the EU carol is working on a proposal to introduce 0:19:14.760 --> 0:19:17.199 restrictions on some exports to the US as a possible 0:19:17.280 --> 0:19:20.480 retaliatory tactic in that expense of trade war that the 0:19:20.520 --> 0:19:22.280 President initiated last month. 0:19:22.320 --> 0:19:24.919 All right, for the latest, let's head to Stephanie law. 0:19:24.960 --> 0:19:27.320 She's Bloomberg News White House correspondent. She is out there 0:19:27.320 --> 0:19:30.040 in our DC bureau. Hey, Stephanie, So, I just want 0:19:30.080 --> 0:19:32.920 to cut to the chase. Are things moving forward when 0:19:32.920 --> 0:19:36.720 it comes to trade negotiations and should we assume sooner 0:19:36.840 --> 0:19:39.240 rather than later that there could be some kind of deals, 0:19:39.280 --> 0:19:42.840 better deals maybe perhaps announced that maybe kind of cool 0:19:42.880 --> 0:19:45.000 the heat that we've seen and what feels like a 0:19:45.040 --> 0:19:45.560 trade war. 0:19:46.640 --> 0:19:48.159 Yeah, I mean, I think that's what we've all been 0:19:48.200 --> 0:19:52.000 waiting for. But it remains unseen when a deal will 0:19:52.040 --> 0:19:54.600 come together. You know, they've mentioned for a couple I 0:19:54.600 --> 0:19:57.280 guess about a week now that they have about fifteen 0:19:57.359 --> 0:19:59.399 or so offerers and that there are people coming to 0:19:59.400 --> 0:20:00.639 the White House make deals. 0:20:00.920 --> 0:20:01.119 You know. 0:20:01.240 --> 0:20:04.080 Notably, nothing really came out of the Japan talks yesterday. 0:20:04.400 --> 0:20:07.640 Now it was a preliminary meeting, sure, but the President 0:20:07.720 --> 0:20:10.960 still did attend. And so everything we've been hearing from 0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:13.040 our sources, from just what's coming out of the White 0:20:13.040 --> 0:20:15.159 House is that deals are being made, that they're not 0:20:15.200 --> 0:20:17.679 really in a rush. And Trump himself is saying, you know, 0:20:17.760 --> 0:20:20.600 repeatedly in the last week that he really doesn't mind 0:20:20.640 --> 0:20:24.080 waiting because we're bringing in a bunch of revenue and 0:20:24.119 --> 0:20:27.800 money from these exports or the imports that were putting 0:20:27.800 --> 0:20:29.720 tariffs on and so he doesn't seem to be in 0:20:29.760 --> 0:20:31.840 a rush. It seems like his team is very focused 0:20:31.880 --> 0:20:35.240 on making good deals. But you know, one thing that 0:20:35.280 --> 0:20:39.320 the Secretary Treasury Secretary Besent mentioned at this Oval meeting 0:20:39.720 --> 0:20:42.280 was that South Korea is expected to come next week. 0:20:42.359 --> 0:20:46.440 So we're still seeing some trade partners come in. Discussions 0:20:46.440 --> 0:20:48.520 are still happening, but in terms of the timing, it 0:20:48.520 --> 0:20:50.680 doesn't quite seem like an immediate remedy. 0:20:50.840 --> 0:20:54.960 Okay, South Korea, Japan, something's missing, Yeah, I was gonna say, 0:20:55.080 --> 0:20:57.160 and then Italy, of course, what about the big one? 0:20:57.200 --> 0:20:59.000