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Speaker 1: Hi, Brian, Hey Katie, Hi, everyone out there listening. Gosh,

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Speaker 1: I'd say the state of the Union is shaky still.

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Speaker 1: Just over a week after this election, I just got

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Speaker 1: finished interviewing Richard Cohen. Brian, remember we had him on.

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Speaker 1: He is head of the Southern Poverty Law Center, talking

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Speaker 1: about the rise and hate speech and incidents across the

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Speaker 1: country since election day. He said there had been three

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Speaker 1: hundred at this point, uh, anti gay, anti black, anti women,

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Speaker 1: anti Jew, anti Muslim incidents. We're definitely seeing a lot

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Speaker 1: of turmoil across the country. You know, on the left,

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Speaker 1: there have been mass protests in big blue cities like

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Speaker 1: New York, Chicago and l a um Online anonymous users

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Speaker 1: have risen on Twitter to sort of condemn both sides.

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Speaker 1: It's a it's a very angry time in the country.

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Speaker 1: That's something we really want to start with. As we

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Speaker 1: introduced today's guest, Larry Wilmore. Many people know Larry from

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Speaker 1: The Nightly Show. He replaced Stephen Colbert when Steven replaced

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Speaker 1: David Letterman. Oh, of course you probably remember him from

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Speaker 1: The Daily Show as well. But he's been behind the

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Speaker 1: scenes of a number of very iconic shows through the

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Speaker 1: years and We can't wait to hear about that as well.

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Speaker 1: Larry Wilmore, it's so nice to see you. Thank you

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Speaker 1: so much for coming my pleasure, Katie, thank you for

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Speaker 1: having me. First. Larry, we want to talk to you

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Speaker 1: about our good friend Gwen Eiffel. We got some terrible

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Speaker 1: news just really moments ago, and you were looking at

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Speaker 1: your phone and asking me about it when I walked

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Speaker 1: in to the building, and in fact, it was about

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Speaker 1: Gwen Eiffel passing away, which is so shocking. I had

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Speaker 1: known that she was sick and had been going through

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Speaker 1: treatment for cancer, but I did not obviously have any

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Speaker 1: idea that she was this ill. And UM, tell me

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Speaker 1: about your experience with when well, it's funny. UM, I

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Speaker 1: was always a big fan of hers. You know, I'm

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Speaker 1: one of those Uh, I'm one of the people who

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Speaker 1: is in your demo. I love news, you know, and

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Speaker 1: I've loved since I was a kid, and and I

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Speaker 1: love the fact that Amazon PBS and you know, and

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Speaker 1: she was one of the faces of PBS. She was

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Speaker 1: so gracious, so intelligent, you know, and the things that

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Speaker 1: she had to say. Um, so I'm just kind of

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Speaker 1: devastated right now. It just kind of hit me at

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Speaker 1: just all at once, you know she. Um. I've gotten

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Speaker 1: to know Gwen through the years, just covering various things,

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Speaker 1: and she was quite involved in the Aspen Ideas festivals

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Speaker 1: and was such an incredible presence. She was strong and

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Speaker 1: reasonable and fair minded and calm. Gwen has just been

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Speaker 1: such a steady force and an unbelievably kind, carrying, sweet person.

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Speaker 1: And uh, it's just crushing, Brian. Did you know Gwen

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Speaker 1: at all? I did. Actually, I first met her as

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Speaker 1: a nerdy politics geek at the Institute of Politics at Harvard,

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Speaker 1: where she was pretty involved. Um. I was obviously a

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Speaker 1: huge admirer of her work. We stayed in touch a

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Speaker 1: little over the years, and in fact I saw her

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Speaker 1: this summer at one of the conventions and she gave

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Speaker 1: me a big hug and said why did they allow

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Speaker 1: you in here? And was very sweet and teased me,

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Speaker 1: and um. She was also a great kind of utility

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Speaker 1: player in journalism. You know she was, if I remember correctly,

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Speaker 1: she was a writer for the New York Times before

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Speaker 1: she was before she went to television, and and excelled

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Speaker 1: at at both, which is a rare and hard thing

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Speaker 1: to do. Um. I think she was a universally respected

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Speaker 1: figure and a universally liked figure. Um, so it's this

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Speaker 1: is a really uh sad loss for journalism in the country. Yeah. Well, Um,

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Speaker 1: our thoughts and prayers are with her family and all

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Speaker 1: our colleagues at PBS, and uh, you know, I think

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Speaker 1: we can only feel grateful for the contributions that she made. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: let's move on to something more cheerful or not, Larry. Um,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's been a it's been a very um gosh,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, uh, strange and unsettling week in American life.

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Speaker 1: And I think the division is so raw and I

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Speaker 1: think more palpable than ever in the aftermath of this

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Speaker 1: campaign and in the election of Donald Trump is our

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Speaker 1: next president. Um, let's go back to election night. Were

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Speaker 1: you shocked? What did you think going into the evening? Well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: definitely was shocked. Um. You know, I kind of watched

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Speaker 1: election I kind of like a sporting event, you know. Um,

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Speaker 1: I'm looking at it as two sides going against each other,

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Speaker 1: because it's really there's really a third side. I Mean,

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Speaker 1: there was a chance of Ross Barrow doing something in

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Speaker 1: ninety two, but that was the last time anybody really

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Speaker 1: might do something interesting, you know, So I, like everyone

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Speaker 1: was interested to see how close Trump would make it.

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Speaker 1: That's how much I believe that, you know, it was

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Speaker 1: a faith to complete that Hillary would be the next president,

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Speaker 1: you know. Um And watching Florida, I was like very

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Speaker 1: fascinated by the returns in Florida. It's something that John

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Speaker 1: kings and In does well, is he really goes into

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Speaker 1: all the counties and how the ratings are coming through

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Speaker 1: the countings with his magic board. I always make fun

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Speaker 1: of that magic board because CNN always stays, you know,

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Speaker 1: cable entertainment news, you know, see end, That's what I

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Speaker 1: call it. But but I'm so happy he had that

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Speaker 1: magic wall because you really you can really in real

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Speaker 1: time understand what's going on. And in real time you

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Speaker 1: could see how those counties were overwhelmingly coming out, those

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Speaker 1: red counties for Trump. When that happened, I thought, Okay,

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Speaker 1: anything can happen tonight. Anything. So Florida was your big

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Speaker 1: key that all bets were off. Yes, And I was

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Speaker 1: going around all the networks and just watching reactions and

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Speaker 1: Fox News Funny, they started off really sad. It was

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Speaker 1: kind of interesting, and the other networks it was kind

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Speaker 1: of this it was almost a smugness, especially when you

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Speaker 1: look at it now. You know, to your point, Larry,

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Speaker 1: Florida really was the canary in the coal melt mine,

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Speaker 1: and it was a microcosm of how the election unfolded

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Speaker 1: in so many ways across the country. You had Hillary

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Speaker 1: doing what she was supposed to do in the democratic

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Speaker 1: parts of the state, maybe turnout was a little off

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Speaker 1: of where Obama was four years ago, but in more

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Speaker 1: rural parts of Florida, where she was expected to lose

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Speaker 1: by twenty points, she was losing by thirty and thirty

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Speaker 1: five points, and with enormous turnout among Trump supporters. And

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Speaker 1: so that was shocking for a lot of us who

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Speaker 1: just smuggly assumed, based on the data that she was

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Speaker 1: going to prevail. Yes, Hillary hadn't countant on white being

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Speaker 1: the new black. She had that, and that's what it

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Speaker 1: showed us. I mean, I remember Browerick County. They were

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Speaker 1: waiting on it, and you thought, this gush of you know,

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Speaker 1: black votes is it going to come in? And they're like, okay,

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Speaker 1: that's it, and I'm like, that's it. It's okay, alright, Florida, Well,

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Speaker 1: why you know, gosh, there's so much to unpack here. Um,

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Speaker 1: when was the moment that you all felt like party over,

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Speaker 1: game over, Mike drop, it's over. Pennsylvania was the one

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Speaker 1: for me because that's been untouchable for so long. You

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Speaker 1: know what about for you, Brian, when was that moment

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Speaker 1: you thought it's that it's over. Well, for me, it

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Speaker 1: was one it looked likely that she would lose Miss Chigan.

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Speaker 1: That was truly shocking because Michigan last went for a

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Speaker 1: Republican in when George H. W. Bush was running. And

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Speaker 1: is it true that Wisconsin had not voted Republican since

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Speaker 1: ur Yes, So that was a real shocker thirty two

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Speaker 1: years since Wisconsin supported a Republican for president. That was

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Speaker 1: during Ronald Reagan's forty nine state sweep. Let's talk about

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Speaker 1: sort of the white working class voters. You know, someone

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Speaker 1: was talking to me yesterday and saying, you know, you

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Speaker 1: don't realize how patronizing and superior it sounds to always

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Speaker 1: refer to this voting block as non college educated, blue

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Speaker 1: collar working class, etcetera. That that sort of in and

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Speaker 1: of itself sets up this US against them mentality of

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Speaker 1: the quote unquote more educated Americans, white collar workers, and

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Speaker 1: and pits these two groups against each other. What do

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Speaker 1: you guys think of that? I thought that was an

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Speaker 1: interesting observation. Yeah, it is interesting, I think that. I

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Speaker 1: think for me, I feel like the left has had

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Speaker 1: kind of the moral high ground on on the social issues,

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Speaker 1: but unfortunately it may have given them a smugness on

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Speaker 1: economic issues, you know, in kind of a false sense

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Speaker 1: of being right on all the issues, you know, and

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Speaker 1: so I think they forgot about what, you know, in

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Speaker 1: the nineties were called the Clintons. They were the Abubba

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Speaker 1: Democrats and the Bubba vote, you know, that were so

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Speaker 1: loyal to Bill Clinton. And I think a lot of

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Speaker 1: people forgot about those Republicans as well. I think had

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Speaker 1: forgotten about a lot of them because they were so

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Speaker 1: interested and on the religious side of the of the issues,

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Speaker 1: you know, especially with the borsho and some of those issues,

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Speaker 1: and so both sides were so interested in the cultural side.

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Speaker 1: It was Bernie Sanders and ironically Trump who talked about

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Speaker 1: these issues in ways that really connected with people. You know,

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Speaker 1: I had said to Briant through the course of this campaign,

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Speaker 1: why is in Hillary Clinton talking more about income inequality?

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Speaker 1: Why isn't she talking more about jobs, about the loss

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Speaker 1: of manufacturing jobs largely through automation. As we've reminded our

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Speaker 1: listeners here many times, it seems like like such a

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Speaker 1: duh captain obvious thing to say, why why didn't she

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Speaker 1: do that? In your view, I don't know, Brian, do

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Speaker 1: you have any views on that? Well? Bill Clinton was

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Speaker 1: sort of dismissed with a condescending pat on the head

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Speaker 1: and said, well, you know that that was then, this

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Speaker 1: is now. Yeah, the future of the Democratic Party is

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Speaker 1: this coalition of the ascendant young people, college educated whites,

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Speaker 1: uh and minorities. And in fact, depending on how you

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Speaker 1: calculated about of the electorate is still white working class people.

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Speaker 1: And it just seed that group and lose by thirty

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Speaker 1: or forty points in some places, makes it very very

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Speaker 1: hard to win for a Democrat. At a candidate, you

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Speaker 1: basically have to run the table everywhere else. Now, Clinton

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Speaker 1: strategists will tell you that the economic argument was sort

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Speaker 1: of at the core of her message, that in every

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Speaker 1: speech she said an economy that works for everyone, not

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Speaker 1: just those at the top um. But what but what

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Speaker 1: got media attention was just the conflict with with Donald Trump.

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Speaker 1: And so you have a lot of people outside the

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Speaker 1: campaign who said, you know, they should have done a

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Speaker 1: lot more. They should have they should have visited some

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Speaker 1: of these places. Hillary Clinton wasn't even in Wisconsin for

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Speaker 1: seven months before election day. And of course within the

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Speaker 1: Clinton campaign, their view was, you know, we reached them

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Speaker 1: through advertising, through other events, and the press didn't cover

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Speaker 1: her policy ideas and speeches. They just covered us when

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Speaker 1: we bashed Donald Trump. To me, that my biggest frustration

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Speaker 1: with Hillary Clinton, who I supported and voted for, was

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Speaker 1: was the empathy quotient. It didn't feel like she had

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Speaker 1: that empathy part of the equation, you know, whereas Trump,

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Speaker 1: if you look at his rallies, people were there excited

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Speaker 1: because they felt they were heard finally that somebody heard

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Speaker 1: them and someone was listening. And whether or not you

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Speaker 1: grew with the message, that connection is very powerful. And

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Speaker 1: if you just look at their message itself, just a

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Speaker 1: simple message, Trump, make America great again? Right, Very aspirational,

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Speaker 1: very inspirational for people that believe that it's an idea. Hillary,

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Speaker 1: I'm with her, are Stronger together. Yeah, it's more esoteric.

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Speaker 1: I'm just gonna ask you, Larry. You know, it's so

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Speaker 1: interesting to me as we kind of pick through these

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Speaker 1: exit polls because they're really kind of a reflection, uh

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Speaker 1: even a rough one of of where the American people are.

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Speaker 1: And they showed that a majority of voters approved of

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Speaker 1: President Obama's job performance, they opposed some of Donald Trump's

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Speaker 1: key policy ideas like the wall and mass deportations, and

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Speaker 1: and they viewed Hillary Clinton more favorably than Donald Trump.

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Speaker 1: So why do you think, um, even though he lost

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Speaker 1: the popular Trump was able to prevail on this election. UM.

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Speaker 1: I do feel that many times we get the president

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Speaker 1: we deserve, not the president we underneed. And I feel

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Speaker 1: a lot of the electorate is more superficial than people

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Speaker 1: give them credit for. And that's not always a bad thing.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes it works out well. But I think the toughest

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Speaker 1: hurdle the Clintons were always going to face is coming

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Speaker 1: back to the neighborhood. You know, they're already out of

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Speaker 1: the neighborhood. You're coming back. You wait, you're moving back

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Speaker 1: into this house. We know you already. There's nothing new.

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Speaker 1: America likes a new family, you know they as I mean,

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Speaker 1: President Obama said this in twelve He said, Americans like

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Speaker 1: that new car smell. That's what he when he was

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Speaker 1: worried about losing around. But He's right. People do like that.

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Speaker 1: They they they like getting to know the new family

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Speaker 1: in the White House. They already know about the Clintons.

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Speaker 1: One of the toughest hurdles that they had to overcome

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Speaker 1: was familiarity. Yes, we know that breeds contempt, you know.

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Speaker 1: So you know, if you just look at cult of personality,

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Speaker 1: we're also in a very narcissistic you know, reality show age.

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Speaker 1: And boy, there's no other better example of that than

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump. That's the world that we kind of live in.

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Speaker 1: And Trump wrote a lot of different waves into the

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Speaker 1: White House, not just one. And the thing about Obama,

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Speaker 1: I think more people approve of Obama than approve of

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Speaker 1: his record as president. I think there's a distinction there.

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Speaker 1: I think more people view him favorably as Barack Obama,

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Speaker 1: you know, singing al Green and you know, and being

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Speaker 1: he has an amazing personality, much like Reagan. But if

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Speaker 1: you look at his job performance, I think those numbers

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Speaker 1: are lower in terms of people being satisfied with with

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Speaker 1: the actual job that's happened over the past seage. Also,

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Speaker 1: I think if you look at right track, run track,

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Speaker 1: Brian and I talked about that and he said these

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Speaker 1: numbers really don't facilate that much. Having said that, I

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Speaker 1: think if you just look at some of the things

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Speaker 1: that are barometers of how people are doing. You look

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Speaker 1: at heroin addiction, you look at suicide, you look at unemployment,

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Speaker 1: and all those things are disproportionately affecting white men fifty

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Speaker 1: and over. And I think the chickens came home to

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Speaker 1: roost in this election where suddenly they said, this is

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Speaker 1: someone who listens to us and cares about our issues

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Speaker 1: in a way that no other candidate really seemed to.

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Speaker 1: And so you can understand why they said, we're going

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Speaker 1: to make our situations and known and our presence felt

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Speaker 1: in this campaign. Yeah, and it is significant that he

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Speaker 1: didn't just beat Hillary Clinton, he beat the Republican establishment

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Speaker 1: as well. I mean Trump did beat both sides. You know,

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Speaker 1: he was more of an independent candidate running as a Republican.

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Speaker 1: Why do you think that black and Latino voters didn't

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Speaker 1: weren't more enthusiastic about Hillary Clinton. I always predicted there

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Speaker 1: was going to be this enthusiasm gap. You just have

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Speaker 1: to look at the rallies. Right. Well, I believe it's

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Speaker 1: a false comparison. I think, um, you can't compare Hillary

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Speaker 1: Clinton to Barack Obama, who is an historical candidate. You know,

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Speaker 1: we've never had a candidate like that. So there were

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Speaker 1: those numbers for Obama You're not going to see for

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Speaker 1: anyone else. I guess I was saying an enthusiasm gap

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Speaker 1: between Donald Trump's supporters and Hillary clinton supporters. But yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: well yeah, So that to me is about her messaging.

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Speaker 1: I think it's very clinical, it's very antiseptic. There's nothing

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Speaker 1: inspiring for certain groups to come out and vote for something.

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Speaker 1: They were being more choral to vote against something, and

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Speaker 1: cynical campaigns. To me, I call that a cynical campaign

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Speaker 1: when you're voting against something, UM, to me, are always

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Speaker 1: harder to win them positive campaigns, you know, I also

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Speaker 1: think that. I mean again, I'm not a campaign expert

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Speaker 1: or a political strategist by any stretch, but I've covered

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Speaker 1: enough elections to know that her campaign to me, seemed

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Speaker 1: exceedingly cautious, careful and controlled. Um. She didn't get out

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Speaker 1: in front of the pressure. You know, she is actually

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Speaker 1: a very engaging, warm, funny person because I've covered her

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Speaker 1: since the early nineties when she was first Lady. But

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Speaker 1: I think there was such a fear of getting her

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Speaker 1: out there, and I think as a result, Donald Trump

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Speaker 1: sucked all the oxygen out of the room. And you

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Speaker 1: never actually felt like you knew her as a person.

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Speaker 1: She seemed, as you said, an aseptic. And the fact

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Speaker 1: of the matter is anyone who's spent any time with her,

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Speaker 1: or knows her a little bit, or has had a

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Speaker 1: conversation with her, or seeing her in an unguarded moment,

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Speaker 1: she really isn't like that. You look at her two

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Speaker 1: most effective times as candidate, once in two thousand and eight,

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Speaker 1: when she cried in New Hampshire or whatever that was

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Speaker 1: she let to her guards, I'll call it, and her

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Speaker 1: concession speech. For this, to me, she was she was

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Speaker 1: more revealed as a person rather than presented as a candidate.

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Speaker 1: And it's well said, yes, And the thing that Hillary

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Speaker 1: did not do enough of, in my mind, was revealed

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Speaker 1: herself as a person, because there were so many things

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Speaker 1: that were said about her, and you know how how

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Speaker 1: the media can make up who we think someone is.

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Speaker 1: You know, all I could think of was they were

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Speaker 1: so concerned about a misstep and that getting focused on

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Speaker 1: and blown out of proportion that they didn't allow her

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Speaker 1: to be herself. Well, we're going to take a quick break.

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Speaker 1: Here some messages from our sponsors and from you all,

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Speaker 1: and we're going to have more with Larry Wilmore, the Man,

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Speaker 1: the Legend. Right after this last week we asked you

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Speaker 1: all for your greatest hopes and fears for a Trump presidency.

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Speaker 1: You left us so many great voicemails, and here's the sampling. Hi, Katie,

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Speaker 1: my name is Ellie. I'm calling from Brooklyn, New York.

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Speaker 1: I just wanted to respond said, what is your biggest

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Speaker 1: hope or biggest share a boy tru president? But one

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Speaker 1: of my biggest hopes is that he'll turn me that

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Speaker 1: he will turn the kind year round and we'll see

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Speaker 1: more jobs coming back to America. We'll see more economic growth,

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Speaker 1: and we will see general prosperity. One of my biggest fears. Um, well,

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Speaker 1: I have to tell you I have a lot of

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Speaker 1: friends in the LGBT community and I'm afraid that him,

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Speaker 1: our Governor Pence, might roll back the lgbt Q right

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Speaker 1: and I really really don't want to do that. If

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Speaker 1: they don't have a lot of times are going to

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Speaker 1: be affected by that. Have a going thinks. Hi, this

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Speaker 1: is Peggy, my hope for the Trump presidency is that

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Speaker 1: he will prove to be a moderate someone who will

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Speaker 1: focus on infrastructure and improvements like that. My greatest fear

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Speaker 1: is that he will be an insane autocrat. Thanks Hi Brian, Hi,

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Speaker 1: Katie Um. My biggest hope for the Trump presidency is

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Speaker 1: that he's able to comprehend the awesome responsibility he has

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Speaker 1: been handed and that he is somehow able to transform

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Speaker 1: himself into a person that can now inspire in the country.

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Speaker 1: I'm willing, like a lot of people, I think, to

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Speaker 1: give him a chance. So my biggest fear is that

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Speaker 1: he will continue to be petty and vindictive and dragging

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Speaker 1: us all into a world of conspiracies and corruption, sort

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Speaker 1: of like the House of Cards. Uh. Hi Katie, Hi,

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Speaker 1: Brian Um. My name is Kate. I am in Michigan.

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Speaker 1: I think my biggest hope is that people don't forget

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Speaker 1: the feelings they feel right now following the election, but

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Speaker 1: they stay hungry, they stay motivated, um, and they stay involved.

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Speaker 1: My biggest fear is that young people like my generation

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Speaker 1: will stop being involved, that they'll feel like they don't

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Speaker 1: have a role or a voice. Thanks guys for our

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Speaker 1: next listener question. We'd love to hear from some of

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Speaker 1: our Republican listeners. We know you're out there. What do

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Speaker 1: you think is the future of the GOP. We want

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Speaker 1: to hear your thoughts about Donald Trump, about the party itself,

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Speaker 1: about the establishment wing of the party, about this new

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Speaker 1: kind of GOP ushered in by this era of Donald Trump.

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Speaker 1: So leave us a message at nine to nine, two

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Speaker 1: to four, four, six, three seven, Brian will be there

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Speaker 1: to answer all of your calls. How are you sleeping

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Speaker 1: these days, Gianna, Oh, you know it's been hard. Well,

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Speaker 1: I think I have the answer for you. Casper is

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Speaker 1: to consumers, eliminating commission driven inflated prices. How does that sound, Gianna?

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Speaker 1: Not too bad honestly, and buying a Casper mattress is

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Speaker 1: with a one hundred night at home trial. So Gianna you.

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Speaker 1: You really have nothing to lose. It sounds like I

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Speaker 1: could just return it, but I would, And if you

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Speaker 1: don't love it for whatever reason, they'll pick it up

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Speaker 1: and refund you everything. Um, but what else should I know?

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Speaker 1: Do we have any kind of deal for our listeners?

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Speaker 1: and conditions apply. Gianna, I want to tell you about

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Speaker 1: a new and fascinating true crime podcast from Erewolf. It's

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Speaker 1: called Stranglers. Have you ever heard of the Boston Strangler? Yes,

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00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:44,640
Speaker 1: but I don't actually know that much. It happened before

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Speaker 1: I was born. I think, well, thirteen gruesome murders happened

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Speaker 1: between two and sixty four. The city was terrified, thousands

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Speaker 1: of suspects were questioned, no one was ever convicted. And

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Speaker 1: in this podcast, you hear from the victim and detectives.

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Speaker 1: How do you hear from the victims if they're dead? Anyway,

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Speaker 1: you hear from people close to the case, and the

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Speaker 1: investigator is still on the job. You'll even hear the

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Speaker 1: voice of an alleged killer whose confession raised more questions

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Speaker 1: than it answered. That's a pretty good tease. You can

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Speaker 1: subscribe to Stranglers in iTunes, Stitcher, or Google Play and

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Speaker 1: stay tuned at the end of this episode to hear

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00:23:23,880 --> 00:23:31,960
Speaker 1: a special sneak preview. Oh I will We're back with

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Speaker 1: Larry Wilmore. Gosh, you know enough about Hillary Clinton and

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump. Let's talk about you, Larry. So you you're You're.

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Speaker 1: You became very well known on the Daily Show, and

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Speaker 1: then you started hosting your own show on Comedy Central.

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Speaker 1: How did you get into comedy, Larry? How do you

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Speaker 1: get into comedy? I always tell people I'm one of

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Speaker 1: those people. I didn't really get into comedy. I kind

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Speaker 1: of went into show biz. I could get comedy out

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Speaker 1: of me, you know. Yeah, I was lucky. There's a

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Speaker 1: thing called showbiz, right, do that? I mean, if I

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Speaker 1: worked at a bank, I'd still be telling jokes. I

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Speaker 1: just wouldn't be getting paid for it and probably wouldn't

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Speaker 1: last that long, you know. So I've always looked at

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Speaker 1: showbiz as a way to comedy is kind of my expression.

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Speaker 1: So whether I'm writing or producing or performing, you know,

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Speaker 1: or whatever it is, I'm getting that comic expression out.

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Speaker 1: So you But so you worked on all these shows.

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Speaker 1: I know you worked on the Fresh principle there. Did

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Speaker 1: you know my friend Andy Borrowitz? You know, I have

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Speaker 1: funny story about Andy Boris. I love Andy Borrowitz, great guy.

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Speaker 1: Here's this very interesting and Andy so my very first gig,

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Speaker 1: as you will, one of my first gigs. This is

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Speaker 1: in the early eighties. I was on the Facts of

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Speaker 1: Life and I was a cop for a couple of episodes.

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Speaker 1: It's like, you know, it's so bizarre. Uh. And my

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Speaker 1: name was Officer Zakus. Okay, so you were a Greek Greek.

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Speaker 1: You know, there's a lot of brothers the acus Is

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Speaker 1: out there that people don't give enough credit for. So

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Speaker 1: the person who wrote that episode was Andy Borrowitz. I

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Speaker 1: didn't know this. Years later, I was serving on the

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Speaker 1: Border Directors I think of the Writer's Guild at the time,

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Speaker 1: and somebody mentioned Zakus. I think, I go Zakus. That

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Speaker 1: was the name of a character. So really, that's a

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Speaker 1: friend of mine, a friend of yours, and this star

426
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,000
Speaker 1: all started on raveling that this was a friend of

427
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:21,639
Speaker 1: Andy Borrowitz, who somehow like he knew Andy bros. And

428
00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:23,480
Speaker 1: somehow we got him on the phone and I talked

429
00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:25,119
Speaker 1: to Zakus or something like that, and it was this

430
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:27,480
Speaker 1: weird connection that was made. And I got to meet

431
00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:30,160
Speaker 1: Andy after that and we talked about it. But when

432
00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:31,960
Speaker 1: I worked on Fresh Prints, he was already gone. He

433
00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 1: was gone because he create. Didn't he create the Fresh Prince?

434
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 1: He and Susan created a Fresh Prince along with that.

435
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:38,720
Speaker 1: Think Benny Medina who I think it was based on

436
00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:42,560
Speaker 1: something like that. And you also worked on Living Color?

437
00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:46,720
Speaker 1: Is it in Living Color? And Color is the band? Yeah? Yeah,

438
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:50,320
Speaker 1: it was in Living Color, which is another show I loved.

439
00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:52,879
Speaker 1: I have such a crush on the way and brothers.

440
00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:58,879
Speaker 1: They're still around about I like, I think it's um Damon.

441
00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:01,399
Speaker 1: Damon is know he's on leath the weapon right now.

442
00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:04,159
Speaker 1: I think that's the one. They're all kind of the

443
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 1: tall skinning. So the Wayne's family, they're the first ones

444
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:10,600
Speaker 1: to experiment with cloning. They're the first ones to do

445
00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:14,399
Speaker 1: it successfully actually, and they just put different names on its,

446
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:19,560
Speaker 1: same body, same jokes, you know, so did it? No?

447
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:21,960
Speaker 1: Well no, I did a couple of guest spots, but

448
00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:23,840
Speaker 1: I was a stand up in an actor before that

449
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:26,040
Speaker 1: point and I realized that I wanted to get into

450
00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 1: writing and producing the kind of guide my own career,

451
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:30,879
Speaker 1: because you know, I just couldn't get the type of

452
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 1: auditions that I went so. I had done like years

453
00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:34,600
Speaker 1: of standard before that, and in Living Color was my

454
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:37,399
Speaker 1: first break as a writer. And it was such an

455
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:39,480
Speaker 1: amazing show. I mean, jim Carrey came out of there.

456
00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:44,080
Speaker 1: Jimmy Fox won an oscar you know, j lost. She

457
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:47,800
Speaker 1: was a fly girl on that show. We're dating ourselves, Larry,

458
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:53,360
Speaker 1: I'm never dated any of the Flag girls, unfortunately, much

459
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,119
Speaker 1: to your dismaying so that that must have been so

460
00:26:56,320 --> 00:26:58,400
Speaker 1: much fun to work on that show. Well, it was fun,

461
00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:00,200
Speaker 1: but it was really tough too. I tell people it

462
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:01,680
Speaker 1: was the worst of times. It was the worst of

463
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 1: times as a writer because you had to work till

464
00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:07,200
Speaker 1: like five six in the morning. You're exhausted all the time.

465
00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:09,919
Speaker 1: But you learned everything you wanted to learn about comedy

466
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:11,680
Speaker 1: writing on that job. And then you worked for the

467
00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 1: Bernie mac Show. Well, I created the Burn, actually created it.

468
00:27:15,440 --> 00:27:19,720
Speaker 1: A writer's distinction there. Well, the first show I created

469
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:22,040
Speaker 1: was called The Pj's. It was a show with Eddie Murphy,

470
00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:24,320
Speaker 1: was an animated show. And then after that I did

471
00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:26,640
Speaker 1: the Bernie mac Show, and Bernie Maxwell kind of put

472
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:29,200
Speaker 1: me on the map as a as a creator of

473
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:31,879
Speaker 1: shows and that type of thing, and you know, we

474
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 1: want a lot of awards. I want a Peabody Actually,

475
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:38,840
Speaker 1: m m, I know it's double mozzle on that. Then

476
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:42,359
Speaker 1: you ended up working on the Jon Stewart obviously on

477
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:45,240
Speaker 1: The Daily before that, now before that, actually tell me more.

478
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,359
Speaker 1: Actually ran Whoopi Goldberg Show in New York and you

479
00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:51,400
Speaker 1: actually came by the set once and we actually were like, oh,

480
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:57,040
Speaker 1: my goodness, is Katie Kurt's coming by? Remember it was

481
00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:00,480
Speaker 1: Whoopi Goldberg had a show for NBC back in two

482
00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:03,880
Speaker 1: thousand three, So did you create that show? A friend

483
00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:05,560
Speaker 1: of mine it, but I went in to run it.

484
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 1: Um after that, I went to the office and helped

485
00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:11,520
Speaker 1: launch that with Greg Daniels, and I was there for

486
00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:13,200
Speaker 1: the first couple of seasons and I played a part

487
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,320
Speaker 1: called Mr. Brown. It was the Diversity Day episode. It

488
00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:19,639
Speaker 1: was really funny. Steve Carroll's hilarious in there, and it's funny.

489
00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:21,320
Speaker 1: Then I thought, well, now is the time to get

490
00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:23,760
Speaker 1: back into performing. And it was then that the Daily

491
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 1: Show came about and I went to do that, and

492
00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:28,560
Speaker 1: you know, and the rest of history as they say,

493
00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:30,640
Speaker 1: how much fun was it working on the Daily Show?

494
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:33,399
Speaker 1: It was so much fun. When I started, John Oliver

495
00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 1: had just started Assume Mombi, John Hodgeman, there was a

496
00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:41,960
Speaker 1: whole mess of us who were just coming in and

497
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:44,720
Speaker 1: U It was fun because we were trying to figure

498
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 1: out who we are and all that kind of stuff.

499
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:48,520
Speaker 1: I know, I was, you know, and it was it

500
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:50,719
Speaker 1: was really really a lot of fun. And how were

501
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 1: they able to make it such a fun place to work? Well,

502
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:57,080
Speaker 1: here's the thing. It's funny. There's a book that's coming

503
00:28:57,080 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 1: out right now about the Daily Show in the early days,

504
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:03,760
Speaker 1: and it wasn't always like happy, happy family. John John

505
00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 1: had He took a few years to really make that

506
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:08,200
Speaker 1: show his own. It was a different show before he

507
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:11,600
Speaker 1: came around, and and John really saw the way that

508
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:14,120
Speaker 1: he wanted to make it, and the people who were there, like,

509
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:16,360
Speaker 1: I don't think so we kind of do it like that.

510
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 1: So there's a lot of tension for a few years there,

511
00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:22,480
Speaker 1: and as the personnel shifted and the show shifted, it

512
00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,200
Speaker 1: kind of turned into what we know it is now.

513
00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 1: But that was kind of a birthing process that wasn't

514
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:32,040
Speaker 1: always fun for everyone. I guess, yeah. But but but

515
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:34,480
Speaker 1: towards the end, I mean, I guess or through the years.

516
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:36,480
Speaker 1: How long was the Daily Show even on? I should

517
00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:38,600
Speaker 1: know this. I think was created in ninety I think

518
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:42,000
Speaker 1: it's been twenty one years. Craig Kilburne was on at

519
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:45,120
Speaker 1: the outset, and he was replaced by John Stewart, if

520
00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 1: I remember correctly, So the Daily Show started at around

521
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:51,400
Speaker 1: the time of Fox Names in MSNBC. Ironically, when I

522
00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,080
Speaker 1: meant to ask you, how do you think, if how

523
00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:56,080
Speaker 1: do you think, if at all, this campaign would have

524
00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 1: been different had John Stewart still been in that chair.

525
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 1: People love to think that that we actually can make

526
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:09,040
Speaker 1: a difference at the ballot box. I don't know if

527
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:11,480
Speaker 1: that's true. I think John would probably would disagree with

528
00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:14,280
Speaker 1: you vehemently that he would have made any difference at

529
00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:17,880
Speaker 1: the ballot box, because if that were the case, you know,

530
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:21,080
Speaker 1: then all those mid terms would have turned out differently.

531
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:23,720
Speaker 1: Let me ask you about the nightly show, you know,

532
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,920
Speaker 1: tell me what that experience was like for you, Um,

533
00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:29,280
Speaker 1: some of the pressures you felt. I did a daily

534
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:32,480
Speaker 1: syndicated talk show, so in some ways. I think I'm

535
00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:35,040
Speaker 1: going to feel your pain, Larry, because we can only

536
00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:39,640
Speaker 1: relate to each other. And it's really really hard, I think,

537
00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:44,400
Speaker 1: to do uh super high quality daily show. And um,

538
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 1: I'm just curious. What were some of the challenges you found. Well,

539
00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:49,880
Speaker 1: it was there was a lot of pressure from a

540
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:53,440
Speaker 1: lot of different way areas, which I really don't mind.

541
00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 1: I've worked under pressure for a long time and I

542
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:57,800
Speaker 1: feel like sometimes I do my best work under there,

543
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,560
Speaker 1: but it is very difficult. And I had the pressure

544
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:02,880
Speaker 1: of following Stephen Colbert, who was very beloved in the

545
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:05,760
Speaker 1: time slot side time slot pressure, I had pressure of

546
00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:11,240
Speaker 1: making a show that works, you know, which I don't care. Yes,

547
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:13,600
Speaker 1: I don't care where you're at. That's pressure, right, And

548
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:16,160
Speaker 1: also the what was interesting about our show there were

549
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:19,160
Speaker 1: two components to it. There was a discussion component that

550
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:21,200
Speaker 1: takes a certain amount of preparation and in the beginning

551
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 1: we have four guests on every night, which is crazy,

552
00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 1: and that takes preparation for that discussion, oh my gosh.

553
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:30,200
Speaker 1: But before that, there was an edit comic editorial that

554
00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:32,840
Speaker 1: also takes brain power every day. How are you going

555
00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 1: to distill your thoughts about what just happened every single day,

556
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 1: having to write a funny column every day and study

557
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:44,440
Speaker 1: and know how you're going to relate and interact with

558
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:46,680
Speaker 1: all your guests. That's exactly right. So it's a lot

559
00:31:46,720 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 1: of work, Lary, What the hell do you want to

560
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 1: do that? I didn't know what it was. My head

561
00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 1: was ready to explode in the first three months. I

562
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 1: really didn't know how it was going to continue. That

563
00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:58,800
Speaker 1: it was just too much. And we had to pair

564
00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:00,960
Speaker 1: the show down a bit where we would have a

565
00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:04,479
Speaker 1: couple of our regulars and one guest and simplified a bit,

566
00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:08,600
Speaker 1: and we we we had the show became more about

567
00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:11,480
Speaker 1: the comedy and the that part of it unless about

568
00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:14,160
Speaker 1: the discussion. But that happens more in the in the

569
00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:16,720
Speaker 1: development of a show, you know. But I did enjoy

570
00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:19,080
Speaker 1: doing both parts of those shows. I really enjoyed it.

571
00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:21,880
Speaker 1: You wish you could have done it weekly, And you know,

572
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:25,320
Speaker 1: like you look at John Oliver and you know he

573
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: did a brilliant show. I give him ship all the time.

574
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:33,280
Speaker 1: Are you I worked so hard to do and now

575
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:39,160
Speaker 1: I'm up to But I bet if you had had

576
00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 1: that kind of pace for your show, um, you could

577
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:46,680
Speaker 1: have really probably taken these big issues. Had had a

578
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,440
Speaker 1: lot of fun with your comedy because the daily grind

579
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 1: must have been the pits. It is tough, although I

580
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: will say, you do get to comment on a lot

581
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:58,000
Speaker 1: of things you probably wouldn't be able to comment on otherwise.

582
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,520
Speaker 1: So they have a frustration that they don't get to

583
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:03,840
Speaker 1: comment on everything because once again now they're reduced to

584
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:07,400
Speaker 1: that twenty three minutes weekly, right, and they usually do

585
00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:09,880
Speaker 1: a single topic exactly. So if you think about in

586
00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:12,520
Speaker 1: a month, they've only weighed in on four separate things,

587
00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:15,400
Speaker 1: whereas in a month I've done twenty shows, you know,

588
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 1: or how long that month happens to be. So you know,

589
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 1: you do get to weigh in on more things, you

590
00:33:21,480 --> 00:33:23,280
Speaker 1: get to have more targets you can throw it, but

591
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 1: then you still have to produce that too. So they're

592
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,280
Speaker 1: pros and co and I think also, you know, for

593
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:30,600
Speaker 1: people who watch regularly, they like sort of seeing you

594
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,600
Speaker 1: every night. People do it becomes a habit. I still

595
00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 1: get on Twitter people are still like, Larry, we miss

596
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:37,520
Speaker 1: you so much, And what they really miss is that

597
00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:40,200
Speaker 1: they were watching us every night, right, you were habit

598
00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:42,719
Speaker 1: for me, That's right there you go. I'm like, I'm

599
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:47,120
Speaker 1: like crack, Were you sorry? Were you sorry? It came

600
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:50,800
Speaker 1: to an end absolutely, of course, especially for everyone that

601
00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:53,920
Speaker 1: worked there. But I'm a move on type of person

602
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:56,120
Speaker 1: in show biz because I have to, you know, and

603
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:58,520
Speaker 1: I've always I always get different ideas, you know, and

604
00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:00,720
Speaker 1: I'm always working on different project. I have a project

605
00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:03,200
Speaker 1: at HV right now. You know. Let's talk about your projects,

606
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:06,560
Speaker 1: because I mean, you're doing such cool things. And first

607
00:34:06,600 --> 00:34:09,719
Speaker 1: of all, I love is Array. Oh she's so great.

608
00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:13,440
Speaker 1: She was on my my talk show. She was kind

609
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:19,839
Speaker 1: of a a online presence, really funny and so yes, um,

610
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:22,879
Speaker 1: I kind of introduced her to the country. That's great,

611
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:30,279
Speaker 1: Thank you, residual check. I'm kiddy. But she's got a

612
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:33,000
Speaker 1: show on HBO called Insecure, and and are you the

613
00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:35,719
Speaker 1: executive producer? Well, I co created it with her. I

614
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:39,400
Speaker 1: was in a transition period, just trying to figure things out. Uh,

615
00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:41,920
Speaker 1: this is three years ago, and my managers asked me

616
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:44,239
Speaker 1: if I wanted to meet her. She had just tried

617
00:34:44,320 --> 00:34:46,560
Speaker 1: to do something at ABC with Shonda and it didn't

618
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:49,439
Speaker 1: quite work out. But Issa had already done I called.

619
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:53,640
Speaker 1: I called, I'm sorry Issa. Yeah, so, but she had

620
00:34:53,680 --> 00:34:56,879
Speaker 1: done Misadventures of an awkward black girl. She probably talked

621
00:34:56,880 --> 00:34:59,239
Speaker 1: to you about, right, That's what she was. Yes, it

622
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:01,799
Speaker 1: was hilarious and I saw that and I thought, oh

623
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:04,760
Speaker 1: my god, who is this person? I thought, this is fantastic.

624
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:06,560
Speaker 1: I love the point of view, I love the style

625
00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:08,880
Speaker 1: of it. And her acting though, was a revelation to

626
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:11,840
Speaker 1: me as someone who's produced for years. I thought the

627
00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 1: camera was really discovering her, you know, in a way

628
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:17,800
Speaker 1: that was revelatory. I love that about her, you know.

629
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:19,880
Speaker 1: And so I wanted to collaborate with her, and I

630
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:22,080
Speaker 1: was They asked if I wanted to supervise if I said, so,

631
00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:23,600
Speaker 1: you want to just write together? She was like, yeah,

632
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:26,120
Speaker 1: let's do it. And so so the two of you,

633
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:28,720
Speaker 1: do you write it together or yeah, you write it together.

634
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 1: We don't write the series together. We we created the

635
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 1: pilot together. So we created that together, and then the

636
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:37,320
Speaker 1: HBO process is kind of long, so there were several

637
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:39,680
Speaker 1: rewrites and they were kind of in a holding pattern,

638
00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:42,560
Speaker 1: and I decided to go help launch Blackish at the

639
00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:45,360
Speaker 1: time an ABC. So I worked with Kenya Bears and

640
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:47,719
Speaker 1: helped to launch that show, working on the pilot with him.

641
00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 1: You like Mr Starmaker, Lary, it seems like now, but

642
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:58,239
Speaker 1: it didn't work for me, you know. I mean, is

643
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:00,680
Speaker 1: there something which do you prefer or being in front

644
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:03,120
Speaker 1: of the camera, behind the camera, a little boat, a

645
00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:08,200
Speaker 1: little bit of both. Um. I really enjoy the creative process,

646
00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 1: you know, and figuring it out, making it work. I

647
00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:15,120
Speaker 1: love introducing, like the world to something is how I

648
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:17,160
Speaker 1: do it, and like introducing the world to Issa. I

649
00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:19,879
Speaker 1: was so excited about that, you know. Or even when

650
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:21,480
Speaker 1: I did the Bernie actually I said, I can't wait

651
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:23,640
Speaker 1: for people to see Bernie and see him do this stuff.

652
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:25,959
Speaker 1: I was so excited about it. I'm always a little

653
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:27,799
Speaker 1: more shy about myself. I think I'm a little more

654
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:30,719
Speaker 1: gunshy about me kind of being out there, so I'm

655
00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:34,000
Speaker 1: less interested in I call it hoggy, being hoggy, you know,

656
00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:35,600
Speaker 1: me being in front of the camera and all that.

657
00:36:36,080 --> 00:36:38,279
Speaker 1: I feel like I do it if it's what I

658
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:40,000
Speaker 1: need to do, but it's not the first thing that

659
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:41,960
Speaker 1: I feel like I need to do or have to do.

660
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:44,279
Speaker 1: But you're having fun right now. It sounds I'm having

661
00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: a lot of Are you doing stand up? Because you

662
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:48,160
Speaker 1: did some standard I did. I did it for years

663
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:51,040
Speaker 1: and years, you know, and uh, I did a couple

664
00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:53,480
Speaker 1: of election specials in two thousand and twelve for Showtime

665
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,840
Speaker 1: called Larry. One was Racial Religion and Sex in Utah

666
00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:59,200
Speaker 1: was the first one, and then Racial Religion Sex in Florida.

667
00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:00,800
Speaker 1: And it was kind of a town hall in different

668
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:02,960
Speaker 1: parts of the country and I really enjoy doing that.

669
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:04,719
Speaker 1: And the first part was a little stand up eat

670
00:37:04,719 --> 00:37:07,520
Speaker 1: and then discussion and that kind of thing. So well,

671
00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:10,200
Speaker 1: that's a good segue to coming back to where we

672
00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:13,600
Speaker 1: are as a country. Very um, I think we need

673
00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:16,839
Speaker 1: one of those specials just about now. Well I may

674
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:19,680
Speaker 1: be doing some of that. Yeah, some of that again,

675
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:23,200
Speaker 1: So well, do you want in New York? Would you

676
00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:26,279
Speaker 1: be on it? If I didn't know, I want to

677
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:28,200
Speaker 1: be on it. I just want to be in the audience.

678
00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:35,839
Speaker 1: I'm not You don't understand. America has never fallen out

679
00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:38,279
Speaker 1: of love with you. They still love you. What are

680
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:40,840
Speaker 1: you talking about? Shy? You're doing? You? Look at what

681
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,320
Speaker 1: is all these shy people? I don't know. I just

682
00:37:43,560 --> 00:37:47,160
Speaker 1: I don't know. America will never be I'm saying it

683
00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:49,600
Speaker 1: right now. Well, I don't know. Call my agent learning

684
00:37:49,680 --> 00:37:51,640
Speaker 1: we'll discuss it. But anyway, but but what are we

685
00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 1: going to do as a country. You know, here we've

686
00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:57,080
Speaker 1: got Steve Bannon, who from bright Bart News as the

687
00:37:57,160 --> 00:38:00,640
Speaker 1: chief strategist, and that's really upsetting to a lot of

688
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:04,120
Speaker 1: people because of the whole rise of the alt right

689
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:08,400
Speaker 1: and some of the incredibly inflammatory stuff that's been on

690
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:15,279
Speaker 1: bright Bart News. Um, you know, cheez how I don't

691
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 1: even know. I don't even know where to begin. What

692
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:21,640
Speaker 1: is it about this election? I can't stop talking about

693
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:25,200
Speaker 1: it thinking about it. At some point? Am I going

694
00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:28,200
Speaker 1: to move on? M not for a while? I don't

695
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:31,239
Speaker 1: think so. I don't think so. This is a big one.

696
00:38:31,600 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 1: How can we I don't know, just sort of tamped

697
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 1: down the anger and hate on both sides? I know

698
00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:42,880
Speaker 1: I sound like Rodney King. Can't we all just get along?

699
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:47,400
Speaker 1: But I mean, I'm just I'm I'm worried about the country. Um,

700
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:51,320
Speaker 1: I'm not as worried. But I also, once again my

701
00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:56,799
Speaker 1: contrary nature, I'm not as concerned about people expressing their emotions.

702
00:38:57,120 --> 00:38:59,719
Speaker 1: Maybe I'm just sort of a woos and I just

703
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:03,279
Speaker 1: start getting upset about it. I find it's okay to

704
00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:06,279
Speaker 1: be upset, you know, and I think it's necessary for

705
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:11,359
Speaker 1: us to express those feelings. It's okay. But I think

706
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:14,640
Speaker 1: through our through people's outrage sometimes and look, the the

707
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:18,560
Speaker 1: people on the right who voted for Trump expressed their

708
00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:20,920
Speaker 1: outrage in a certain way, and people have heard it,

709
00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:23,760
Speaker 1: and now it must be dealt with. And so people

710
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:26,000
Speaker 1: need to express how they feel about something so it

711
00:39:26,080 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 1: can be dealt with so we can do something about it.

712
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:31,080
Speaker 1: A move hunt and Larry, how much do you see

713
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:34,920
Speaker 1: those divisions breaking down along racial lines? I mean, I

714
00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:37,840
Speaker 1: was really struck when Skip Gates, who's a you know,

715
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:43,920
Speaker 1: noted African American professor, said Trump represents a backlash against

716
00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:47,360
Speaker 1: the progress black people have made since nineteen which of

717
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:50,200
Speaker 1: course was the year the Voting Rights Act. Van Jones

718
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:53,840
Speaker 1: on CNN said that Trump represents a white lash, a

719
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:58,279
Speaker 1: reaction against Obama and changing demographics by white people. Do

720
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:01,879
Speaker 1: you see it in that kind of star complain? I mean, look,

721
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:04,640
Speaker 1: in August of two thousand fifteen, I predicted that Trump

722
00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:06,520
Speaker 1: would win to my staff and they all laughed at me,

723
00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:11,960
Speaker 1: and we called our coverage of the blacklash beyond blackening

724
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:15,080
Speaker 1: was how we said it. You know that that there's

725
00:40:15,080 --> 00:40:17,839
Speaker 1: an unblackening that's happening. And to me, I just wrote

726
00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:19,839
Speaker 1: an article for the New Yorker about this, which people

727
00:40:19,880 --> 00:40:22,319
Speaker 1: can be right now where I I called Trump um

728
00:40:22,719 --> 00:40:26,160
Speaker 1: the birth of a nation, and uh, that was clever,

729
00:40:26,640 --> 00:40:30,040
Speaker 1: thank you, thank you very much. But I linked a lot,

730
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 1: a lot of his um de legitimization of the president

731
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:36,160
Speaker 1: back to that film and the fact that that film

732
00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:39,480
Speaker 1: was legitimately screened in the White House like just a

733
00:40:40,680 --> 00:40:43,239
Speaker 1: correct and said history was just written with lightning, you know.

734
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:46,719
Speaker 1: And and he he, the president of the United States,

735
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:51,120
Speaker 1: legitimized the de legitimization of the black male that happened

736
00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:55,200
Speaker 1: in the White House. Trump trying to unamericanize Barack Obama

737
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:58,640
Speaker 1: to me is that same thing, you know, trying to

738
00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:01,600
Speaker 1: make him de legitimate. And that's why Obama was very

739
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:03,879
Speaker 1: upset about it himself. You can see on his face

740
00:41:04,280 --> 00:41:07,080
Speaker 1: when that stuff was happening. And he enjoyed the takedown

741
00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 1: of Trump at that White House Correspondence Center. You can

742
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:11,239
Speaker 1: see how much he enjoyed that, you know. And I

743
00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:13,600
Speaker 1: think he enjoyed it a little too much, because I

744
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:17,920
Speaker 1: you know, you look at that video in two thousand eleven,

745
00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:22,479
Speaker 1: and you think was that the moment Donald Trump said yeah,

746
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:26,640
Speaker 1: well just you wait, and and a lot of people

747
00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:29,840
Speaker 1: who know him and We discussed this on our last podcast.

748
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:34,359
Speaker 1: Thought that that speech really catalyzed this sense for him

749
00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:37,120
Speaker 1: that he had to show not just Obama, but the

750
00:41:37,200 --> 00:41:40,279
Speaker 1: whole establishment that mocked him. Well, the one thing, you know,

751
00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:43,440
Speaker 1: you talked earlier in our conversation about messaging, and I

752
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:49,160
Speaker 1: think Donald Trump was incredibly effective at messaging, staying on message,

753
00:41:49,200 --> 00:41:53,960
Speaker 1: being very discipline. It almost became a mantra, you know,

754
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:56,839
Speaker 1: whether it was locker up, Crooked Hillary. I think there's

755
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,320
Speaker 1: a reason he had those hashtags, you know what it

756
00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:02,440
Speaker 1: little more Marco and you know what did he say

757
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:06,319
Speaker 1: about Jeb Bush? You know, you know, and these things

758
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:09,680
Speaker 1: that he repeated again and again and again. Do you

759
00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:14,560
Speaker 1: think sometimes it's because he is, you know, reflecting his

760
00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:19,080
Speaker 1: own vulnerabilities, you know oftentimes I don't know if you're

761
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:21,600
Speaker 1: getting very shrinky here. No, but I'll tell you why

762
00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:25,320
Speaker 1: I disagree with with that assessment, because he's right, you know,

763
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:28,239
Speaker 1: so it's not his thing. He was right about Jeb Bush.

764
00:42:28,280 --> 00:42:30,840
Speaker 1: That's why Jeb was so upset about it. Little Marco

765
00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:34,800
Speaker 1: did upset Marco Rubio. It did make him mad, you know,

766
00:42:34,960 --> 00:42:38,960
Speaker 1: lying Ted did upset Ted Cruz. He really knew and

767
00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:42,799
Speaker 1: knows how to get people under under. People's exactly right.

768
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:45,680
Speaker 1: And the one thing that buried Hillary more than anything

769
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:48,560
Speaker 1: else was cricket Hillary. And right before the election, FBI

770
00:42:48,680 --> 00:42:51,000
Speaker 1: comes down and says, well, we're still looking into this up.

771
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:54,760
Speaker 1: He's right, cricket Hillary, and not because necessarily these labels

772
00:42:54,800 --> 00:42:57,200
Speaker 1: are accurate. I mean, I have a friend who was

773
00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:01,120
Speaker 1: very question that little actually is well, had a friend

774
00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:04,840
Speaker 1: who worked for Jeb Bush. If Trump had Jeb Bush's

775
00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:07,840
Speaker 1: schedule for a week, he'd be in the hospital. What

776
00:43:08,040 --> 00:43:11,759
Speaker 1: he meant by low energy was not willing to say

777
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:15,640
Speaker 1: the kind of incendiary stuff, not willing to kind of

778
00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:19,520
Speaker 1: cross the lines that Trump was able to cross. And

779
00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:22,560
Speaker 1: I think he meant boring. Brian, I disagree. I think

780
00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:24,680
Speaker 1: he just meant he was well, maybe the we're seeing

781
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:27,920
Speaker 1: the same things that he was. He was just boring

782
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:30,480
Speaker 1: because he wasn't. I think we're actually agreeing because he

783
00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:34,440
Speaker 1: wasn't able to say the exciting stuff that Jeb just

784
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 1: didn't believe in our thought was offensive. So in closing, Larry,

785
00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:42,120
Speaker 1: I could talk to you all day. So this has

786
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:44,160
Speaker 1: been really fun. Thank you so much for doing this.

787
00:43:44,840 --> 00:43:49,080
Speaker 1: What are your greatest hopes and fears for a Trump presidency.

788
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:52,439
Speaker 1: That's the same question we've asked our listeners. So, wow,

789
00:43:52,600 --> 00:44:00,360
Speaker 1: you give me the oxymorons of oxymorons. Um. Well, you know,

790
00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:05,120
Speaker 1: it's a really tough one because the things that he

791
00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:08,680
Speaker 1: wants to accomplish I don't want him to accomplish. You know. Um,

792
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:11,279
Speaker 1: I don't think we need to build a wall or

793
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:15,239
Speaker 1: band Muslims or those types of things. And you know,

794
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:18,480
Speaker 1: the opposition is not in power right now. You know,

795
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:21,239
Speaker 1: they have a firm grasp on all the levers of

796
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:24,680
Speaker 1: government right now. So I'm just hoping that someone with

797
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:27,880
Speaker 1: some sense in there, and and with the more of

798
00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 1: an eye on, you know, on the country. I guess

799
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:36,880
Speaker 1: UH can talk some sense in the Trump I'm concerned

800
00:44:36,920 --> 00:44:39,960
Speaker 1: that he hired Steve Bannon as the person in his ear.

801
00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:42,720
Speaker 1: That really concerns me. You know. I think Ryan's previous,

802
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:45,319
Speaker 1: as we said, is very reasonably. I'd rather have Kelly

803
00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:49,600
Speaker 1: on Conney. I think she was great her her really

804
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:53,400
Speaker 1: crowning Trump, which I think it was. She was indispensable

805
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:56,480
Speaker 1: in that campaign. She's very talented. When they hired Kelly Anne,

806
00:44:56,640 --> 00:44:59,200
Speaker 1: I thought, wow, that that's a really smart I thought

807
00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:01,080
Speaker 1: it was smart to Yeah, I thought it was really

808
00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:03,680
Speaker 1: so smartest thing they probably ever did. What do you

809
00:45:03,719 --> 00:45:05,640
Speaker 1: think she's going to do that? They talked about a job.

810
00:45:05,800 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 1: She said that she has been offered a job in

811
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:12,000
Speaker 1: the White House, although she won't say what what it is.

812
00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:13,800
Speaker 1: Maybe by the time the show comes out will know

813
00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:15,800
Speaker 1: how big of a Fox News star would she be

814
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:20,160
Speaker 1: right now? Yeah, although Fox is having its own identity,

815
00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:23,640
Speaker 1: that's a whole different discussion. Yeah, yeah, Brian, what are

816
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:28,880
Speaker 1: your biggest hopes and fears for Trump presidency? Uh? My

817
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:33,879
Speaker 1: biggest hope is that he can shape up an inefficient,

818
00:45:34,320 --> 00:45:39,360
Speaker 1: bureaucratic federal government and maybe deliver better customer service for

819
00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:43,440
Speaker 1: the American people. Um. My greatest fear is that he's

820
00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:47,840
Speaker 1: as divisive in office as he was during the campaign,

821
00:45:48,600 --> 00:45:54,400
Speaker 1: and half of the American people feel not just alienated

822
00:45:54,480 --> 00:45:59,200
Speaker 1: from the president, but actively scorned and disrespected by the President.

823
00:45:59,239 --> 00:46:01,640
Speaker 1: And I think that would a profoundly unhealthy thing for

824
00:46:01,719 --> 00:46:05,520
Speaker 1: the country. Maybe he can come up with some compromises

825
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:08,800
Speaker 1: that will that will address some of the issues that

826
00:46:08,920 --> 00:46:12,200
Speaker 1: we're so motivating for people at the polls, but do

827
00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:16,399
Speaker 1: so in a more incrementalist way or in a way

828
00:46:16,719 --> 00:46:20,880
Speaker 1: that isn't sort of you know, maybe he can use

829
00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:24,440
Speaker 1: what's the expression set of a meat cleaver? He can

830
00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:27,400
Speaker 1: use Uh, I don't know. What would you say, you guys,

831
00:46:27,480 --> 00:46:32,520
Speaker 1: a scalpel instead and be and perform the surgery that

832
00:46:32,680 --> 00:46:36,920
Speaker 1: I think most people agree needs to be done with

833
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:41,200
Speaker 1: with a little more care and a little more compassion.

834
00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:43,600
Speaker 1: You're talking about a man who puts his name on

835
00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:47,920
Speaker 1: places in large gold letters to do something subtly and precisely.

836
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:54,200
Speaker 1: A girl can dream, can't she? Larry, thank you so

837
00:46:54,360 --> 00:46:56,719
Speaker 1: much for coming out. Was really fun to talk to you,

838
00:46:57,040 --> 00:47:01,320
Speaker 1: and congratulations on all your success and continue. You're welcome.

839
00:47:04,200 --> 00:47:07,880
Speaker 1: Thanks Brian, thank you so much for coming on. And

840
00:47:07,960 --> 00:47:11,120
Speaker 1: as Katie mentioned, for our next listener question, we would

841
00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:14,600
Speaker 1: love to hear from our conservative listeners, what do you

842
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:18,000
Speaker 1: think the future of the Republican Party is. We're curious

843
00:47:18,040 --> 00:47:21,360
Speaker 1: to hear your thoughts about the party itself, the division

844
00:47:21,440 --> 00:47:24,880
Speaker 1: between the alt right and the establishment wing, how can

845
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:27,759
Speaker 1: the party appeal to Latinos and African Americans? Where does

846
00:47:27,760 --> 00:47:30,200
Speaker 1: it go from here? So leave us a message at

847
00:47:30,320 --> 00:47:34,400
Speaker 1: nine to nine, two to four, four, six, three seven.

848
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:39,640
Speaker 1: Thanks as always to Gianna Palmer for producing the show

849
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Speaker 1: and Jared O'Connell for engineering and mixing it. Thanks to

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Speaker 1: Sam for engineering from l A. Thanks to Mark Phillips

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Speaker 1: for our fantastic theme music. And remember you can always

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Speaker 1: email us at comments at current podcast dot com. You

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Speaker 1: can find Katie and me on social media. I'm at

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Speaker 1: goldsmith B on Twitter, Katie's at Katie Kurrik on Twitter

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Speaker 1: and Instagram, and Katie dot Kirk on Snapchat. Best of all,

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Speaker 1: you can rate and review us on iTunes. We'd really

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Speaker 1: appreciate it if you would let us know what you

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Speaker 1: think of the show. Don't forget to subscribe to will

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Speaker 1: talk to you next time you take the goods to

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Speaker 1: take the bad? Did it? Did it? Did it? The

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Speaker 1: facts of life? That's amazing that you know I could do.

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Speaker 1: This is Garrett, Oh, this is this is Carrott. Go

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Speaker 1: sound like it