WEBVTT - Selects: The Tylenol Murders, Part I 0:00:00.600 --> 0:00:03.360 Hey, everybody, it's me Josh, and for this week's select, 0:00:03.400 --> 0:00:07.119 I've chosen a two parter one of the most baffling 0:00:07.440 --> 0:00:12.480 true crime mysteries ever to hit America, the Thailand All Murders. Uh. 0:00:12.480 --> 0:00:15.080 In part one, which you're about to hear now, we 0:00:15.160 --> 0:00:19.560 introduced the murders, the senseless deaths, and the panic that 0:00:19.600 --> 0:00:22.560 gripped America. And then you'll hear from me again for 0:00:22.720 --> 0:00:25.840 part two. So in the meantime, enjoy part one and 0:00:25.880 --> 0:00:33.599 I'll see you soon. Welcome to Stuff you should Know, 0:00:33.920 --> 0:00:42.600 a production of I Heart Radio. Hey, and welcome to 0:00:42.640 --> 0:00:48.320 the podcast. I'm Josh. There's Chuck. There's Josh, not me, Chuck. 0:00:48.880 --> 0:00:51.800 Guest producer Josh is back in the house. Yeah, and 0:00:51.800 --> 0:00:55.040 there's a little Chuck in your pockets, Remember little Elvis. 0:00:55.160 --> 0:00:57.760 I was just about to say that you got that right, 0:00:57.800 --> 0:01:01.000 Tony Oh Man, what a great sketch it really was. 0:01:01.080 --> 0:01:03.680 That was Nicholas Kane, wasn't it. Yeah? Man, did you 0:01:03.680 --> 0:01:06.600 ever see Mandy? Yes? It was terrible. I don't care 0:01:06.640 --> 0:01:11.039 what anybody else says. You hate it. Terrible, terrible movie. Yeah, 0:01:11.240 --> 0:01:13.480 Nolan I talked about it on movie Crush. He's seen 0:01:13.480 --> 0:01:16.280 it like four times thinks it's the best thing ever. 0:01:17.080 --> 0:01:18.880 And he was like, people the love it, I hate it. 0:01:18.880 --> 0:01:20.120 And I was like, actually, I was kind of in 0:01:20.120 --> 0:01:22.360 the middle. Were you really Yeah? I mean I told 0:01:22.400 --> 0:01:25.320 him young Chuck, like twenty two year old college Chuck 0:01:25.640 --> 0:01:28.760 would have probably liked it a lot more. But today 0:01:28.880 --> 0:01:32.520 Chuck was kind of like, I get it. Like, sure, 0:01:32.720 --> 0:01:38.240 parts of it, we're fine. Sure to me. Spending an 0:01:38.319 --> 0:01:44.240 hour doing character development but not successfully making you care 0:01:44.240 --> 0:01:47.840 about the characters, it just really irked me. Wow, you 0:01:47.880 --> 0:01:51.080 had structural issues. Yeah, that was really the big thing. 0:01:51.200 --> 0:01:54.080 I also thought Lenis Roach was very very odd for casting. 0:01:54.160 --> 0:01:57.600 But which one was the main bad guy? That that 0:01:57.720 --> 0:02:00.480 was weird, very weird. I don't even know him, but 0:02:00.640 --> 0:02:03.760 it's from Law and Order and like some other stuff, 0:02:04.240 --> 0:02:06.680 you gotta get into law. See how much you're missing 0:02:06.680 --> 0:02:10.960 out on that's becoming a bit. So did we start 0:02:11.000 --> 0:02:13.480 recording yet? I think so? Oh, I already welcomed everybody 0:02:13.520 --> 0:02:18.280 the podcast. Um so, Chuck, we are this is some 0:02:18.320 --> 0:02:21.320 true crime stuff. For getting into here, that's right, But 0:02:21.480 --> 0:02:23.680 I feel like we need to set the tone right 0:02:23.720 --> 0:02:26.600 because this isn't just didn't happened just yesterday. This happened 0:02:26.600 --> 0:02:31.160 way back in two in Chicago, Illinois. And I remember 0:02:31.240 --> 0:02:33.679 this and I was like six at the time. It 0:02:33.760 --> 0:02:38.080 was one of my favorite years because of this, the 0:02:38.120 --> 0:02:41.079 opposite of that, right, mainly because of movies that was 0:02:41.120 --> 0:02:44.560 so great about two look it up? Man, Well, I 0:02:44.600 --> 0:02:48.720 was kind of hoping, Oh yeah, okay, yeah, that was 0:02:49.880 --> 0:02:52.480 Do you know I didn't see Blade Runner until I 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:59.440 was forty That's not true. Yes, the original, the original 0:02:59.440 --> 0:03:02.240 Blade Runner. Did you like it? It was good. I 0:03:02.280 --> 0:03:04.120 like the second one too, You're like, but they spent 0:03:04.160 --> 0:03:09.600 way too much time on characters. Um. Yeah. And I 0:03:09.680 --> 0:03:12.160 just did a little poking around about two and it 0:03:12.200 --> 0:03:15.760 was It was a good year for an eleven year old, 0:03:15.760 --> 0:03:19.400 but it was an uneasy time in America. Uh well 0:03:19.520 --> 0:03:22.239 for a bunch of awful things happened that year. Uh 0:03:22.280 --> 0:03:23.480 And I don't know if it was any more or 0:03:23.600 --> 0:03:27.040 less than other years, but uh, air Flight nine D 0:03:27.160 --> 0:03:31.440 crashed into into the Potomac River, remember that in Washington, 0:03:31.520 --> 0:03:33.680 d C. The plane crash in the river. Didn't hit 0:03:33.720 --> 0:03:37.240 a bridge, maybe, but there was there was like a 0:03:37.360 --> 0:03:41.839 daring icy river rescue. Yeah. Seventy eight people died though. 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:46.000 That same day, a metro train in d c derailed 0:03:46.120 --> 0:03:51.000 killed three people. Uh. February was when Wayne Williams was convicted, 0:03:51.720 --> 0:03:54.320 and that was just the end of a lot of honeys, 0:03:54.720 --> 0:03:59.200 you know, for years. Uh, Klaus Vambu Law was found 0:03:59.240 --> 0:04:03.120 guilty of attempted murder of his wife in March. I 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:05.440 didn't make it to the end of reversal of fortune, 0:04:05.440 --> 0:04:09.600 so I honestly didn't know what happened to class guilty. Uh. 0:04:09.640 --> 0:04:12.720 In June was the murder of Vincent Chen, who was 0:04:12.800 --> 0:04:18.160 a Chinese American who was beaten to death by two 0:04:18.880 --> 0:04:21.400 men in Michigan thinking he was a Japanese and they 0:04:21.400 --> 0:04:26.400 were like stealing his their auto work. I know, right, Uh. 0:04:26.440 --> 0:04:30.640 And then July nine, pan Am flight seven nine goes 0:04:30.680 --> 0:04:34.559 down in Louisiana, Louisiana kills all one forty six people 0:04:34.560 --> 0:04:37.400 on board, plus eight more on the ground. And then 0:04:37.400 --> 0:04:41.240 in September, early September was when I know, man, remember 0:04:41.240 --> 0:04:44.039 planes used to just crash a lot. Yeah that never 0:04:44.080 --> 0:04:47.839 happens now, Uh, not as much. But yeah, weird that 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:50.600 we're recording this in the midst of more plane gradges. 0:04:50.960 --> 0:04:55.280 And then early September was when that paper boy in Iowa, 0:04:55.360 --> 0:04:59.480 Iowa was kidnapped and never seen again. Johnny Gosh, I 0:04:59.480 --> 0:05:01.640 don't know that that was a big deal too, because 0:05:01.640 --> 0:05:04.360 it was you know, the paper boy, and there was 0:05:04.400 --> 0:05:09.040 this false story about a pedophile ring from politicians and 0:05:09.040 --> 0:05:10.719 that turned out not to be true, but he was 0:05:10.760 --> 0:05:13.719 never found again. So basically everything that's going on today 0:05:13.800 --> 0:05:16.720 is just a rehash of two It sounds like I 0:05:16.760 --> 0:05:19.719 just remember being about that age, and they're just the 0:05:19.800 --> 0:05:22.600 nightly news sort of just being a horror show and 0:05:22.680 --> 0:05:28.640 not politically speaking, you know, like real bad incidents is occurring. Well, yeah, 0:05:28.680 --> 0:05:32.200 plane crash like just about at any age, like that'll 0:05:32.360 --> 0:05:34.560 that'll bring you down if you see that on the 0:05:34.560 --> 0:05:37.800 news for sure. Yeah, um, because you know when you 0:05:37.839 --> 0:05:40.320 get on a plane, you think maybe this plane will 0:05:40.360 --> 0:05:42.400 go down while I'm want it and that would be terrible. 0:05:42.640 --> 0:05:45.680 Although I wasn't flying at eleven. So all of those 0:05:45.720 --> 0:05:49.360 things you just mentioned sweep them totally off the table, 0:05:50.080 --> 0:05:54.800 because come the end of September of that year, nothing 0:05:54.800 --> 0:05:57.719 else mattered but what we're about to talk about now, 0:05:58.400 --> 0:06:03.800 that's right, nothing nothing came close to taking the over 0:06:04.240 --> 0:06:11.359 the national psyche like the deaths of seven people beginning 0:06:11.400 --> 0:06:15.760 on September two in Chicago, Illinois. Yeah. And one of 0:06:15.800 --> 0:06:17.960 the articles I read about this, I mean, are we 0:06:18.000 --> 0:06:20.440 trying to keep it a secret? It's a show title, 0:06:20.560 --> 0:06:23.240 right yeah, yeah yeah, I think they're gonna have to 0:06:23.240 --> 0:06:26.440 figure it out. So yeah, go ahead, the thailan All murders. Yeah, okay, 0:06:26.920 --> 0:06:30.160 you're like, oh no, no, but that's that comes up 0:06:30.160 --> 0:06:32.679 in part two. Oh yeah, this is a two parter 0:06:32.880 --> 0:06:36.440 ye as well, so Buckle and everybody. Uh So. I 0:06:36.480 --> 0:06:38.800 was doing some research though, and I saw one article 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:42.360 that said something about, you know, the first domestic terror 0:06:42.360 --> 0:06:46.159 incident United States that nobody has ever heard of. It's like, what, 0:06:46.480 --> 0:06:50.000 who hasn't heard of this? A millennial wrote that headline. Well, 0:06:50.120 --> 0:06:52.120 I have to say Josh on the way in here, yeah, 0:06:52.200 --> 0:06:54.720 I told him Tailttle murders and huh he goes, what's 0:06:54.760 --> 0:07:00.320 the title? And all you old kadr, we should say 0:07:00.320 --> 0:07:03.039 what Thailand all is? Huh Okay, yeah, I guess just 0:07:03.080 --> 0:07:04.839 in case you are a MILLENNI only you've never heard 0:07:04.839 --> 0:07:08.200 of Thailand all, but Thailand all was and still is 0:07:08.279 --> 0:07:11.440 and over the counter pain reliever. It's like you have 0:07:11.560 --> 0:07:15.320 eggs and pains and apparently, what's crazy? People would take 0:07:15.320 --> 0:07:18.680 thaile and all whatever was wrong with them, because now 0:07:18.800 --> 0:07:23.080 you can go get like you know, aspirin and um 0:07:23.640 --> 0:07:27.000 aadville and and a leave. There was no leave back then. 0:07:27.120 --> 0:07:29.600 That was the nineties drug There's way more over the 0:07:29.600 --> 0:07:32.040 counter pain relievers now than they we're back then. Back then, 0:07:32.120 --> 0:07:37.240 Thailand All was basically it. Yeah, it's a set of menafin, 0:07:37.440 --> 0:07:39.440 which is different than aspirin, and I think a lot 0:07:39.440 --> 0:07:43.040 of people just think those are interchangeable. Right. The reason 0:07:43.160 --> 0:07:47.080 I believe Thailand All became so big is because aspirin 0:07:47.200 --> 0:07:51.000 upsets a lot of people's stomachs. Thailand All does not, 0:07:51.560 --> 0:07:54.920 or it's not supposed to, and that's why it came 0:07:54.920 --> 0:07:57.880 out of nowhere and just took over the aspirin market. 0:07:58.040 --> 0:08:01.280 I think by two thailand All had thirty seven of 0:08:01.320 --> 0:08:04.800 the market. It's pretty good cornered. Yeah, yeah, almost half, 0:08:05.080 --> 0:08:08.280 especially since like some of the other like aspirants have 0:08:08.320 --> 0:08:11.560 been around since you know, nineteenth century, right, So it 0:08:11.640 --> 0:08:16.120 makes sense then that when a little girl named Mary 0:08:16.120 --> 0:08:19.520 Anne kellerman Uh complained that she had a sore throat 0:08:19.560 --> 0:08:24.240 and wasn't feeling too good at like seven am on Wednesday, September, 0:08:25.840 --> 0:08:28.320 her parents said, just take an extra strength title and 0:08:28.400 --> 0:08:31.320 all and go back to bed man for sore throat. 0:08:31.560 --> 0:08:35.040 You imagine the guilt. Oh no, these parents feel well, 0:08:35.040 --> 0:08:37.199 don't blow it. We haven't said what happens to Marianne 0:08:37.240 --> 0:08:40.920 Kellerman yet. I think everybody knows. Uh. Yeah, she got up, 0:08:41.280 --> 0:08:44.600 said I'm sick. He said, take this. The father said 0:08:44.640 --> 0:08:47.360 he heard her go into the bathroom and close the door, 0:08:47.960 --> 0:08:50.800 then heard something drop and went to the door, saying, 0:08:50.800 --> 0:08:54.080 are you okay, you're okay? Uh? No answer, opened the 0:08:54.120 --> 0:08:58.280 door and there she is on the floor. Um. Taken 0:08:58.320 --> 0:09:01.480 to the hospital, but died very quickly. Yeah, probably was 0:09:01.520 --> 0:09:04.240 dead when she went to the hospital. Was pronounced there 0:09:04.920 --> 0:09:07.800 um and she they suspected this is just a little 0:09:07.800 --> 0:09:10.600 twelve year old girl of middle school, girl into Jane 0:09:10.640 --> 0:09:14.480 Adams Middle School. Um. She they think she died of 0:09:14.480 --> 0:09:17.480 a stroke. That's what they thought happened to her. They 0:09:17.480 --> 0:09:19.680 were just so baffled that they're like, it had to 0:09:19.679 --> 0:09:21.240 have been a stroke. That's the only thing that can 0:09:21.280 --> 0:09:24.680 come on like this. Yeah. So that's seven am. Just 0:09:24.920 --> 0:09:29.200 the day is just beginning, and one atrocity has already happened. Yeah, 0:09:29.240 --> 0:09:32.560 this is a this is a very bad day in 0:09:32.720 --> 0:09:37.360 the history of Chicago. September. Yeah, absolutely, and it started 0:09:37.360 --> 0:09:42.200 early Adam Janice, who uh will detail his story, but 0:09:42.400 --> 0:09:44.800 put a pin in this one too, because he figures 0:09:44.800 --> 0:09:48.280 in even more prominently in a minute. But a little 0:09:48.320 --> 0:09:51.640 bit later that same morning, Uh, this gentleman, Adam Janese's 0:09:51.640 --> 0:09:55.240 twenty seven years old and lived in Arlington Heights, another 0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:59.640 Chicago suburb, and he died. Uh, and they think that 0:09:59.760 --> 0:10:02.720 this is a heart attack. Uh. He complained of chess 0:10:02.720 --> 0:10:06.240 pains after he had driven his daughter's neighbor home from school. 0:10:06.880 --> 0:10:09.760 Uh said, I'm gonna take the day off, comes home, 0:10:09.960 --> 0:10:12.439 eats a little lunch, takes two extra strength tile and 0:10:12.520 --> 0:10:16.240 all that he bought from a local drug store, collapses 0:10:16.280 --> 0:10:19.320 in front of his wife, and by you know, a 0:10:19.360 --> 0:10:23.040 few minutes later, when the paramedics arrived, he was dead right. 0:10:23.120 --> 0:10:25.480 And again, like you said, they said heart attack because 0:10:25.480 --> 0:10:27.520 he's been complaining of chess pains, which had nothing to 0:10:27.559 --> 0:10:30.200 do with it. But just like Marianne Kellerman took an 0:10:30.200 --> 0:10:32.120 extra strength tile and all for a sore throat, he 0:10:32.200 --> 0:10:34.319 took some extra strength tile and all for some chest pains. 0:10:34.360 --> 0:10:36.240 This is just what people did back then. Yeah, and 0:10:36.240 --> 0:10:39.600 that's what complicated it a little bit. At first, Um 0:10:39.840 --> 0:10:41.599 was that you know, if you take the tile and 0:10:41.679 --> 0:10:45.280 all it means you felt bad already, So obviously you 0:10:45.280 --> 0:10:46.839 know they're gonna be saying like, wait a minute, chess 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:49.520 pains or some throat like, how does that figure in? Yeah, 0:10:49.559 --> 0:10:52.600 and it didn't. Plus, Also, what made this even more 0:10:52.640 --> 0:10:55.880 baffling is that Marianne Kellerman was twelve and healthy. Adam 0:10:56.000 --> 0:10:58.640 Janis was twenty seven and healthy, and all of a 0:10:58.679 --> 0:11:01.080 sudden they just dropped up. People just dropped dead. No 0:11:01.080 --> 0:11:03.080 matter what you see on TV or in the movies 0:11:03.160 --> 0:11:08.200 or whatever, dropping dead inexplicably is a really bizarre thing. 0:11:08.240 --> 0:11:11.680 When you're a healthy person, that just doesn't happen. Uh. 0:11:11.800 --> 0:11:16.000 Next we have Mary Reiner, same day, same day. This 0:11:16.080 --> 0:11:18.680 is still all on the same day. Um, she's twenty 0:11:18.679 --> 0:11:22.040 seven years old. She's feeling a little dizzy. She had 0:11:22.080 --> 0:11:26.360 just come home from the hospital, uh, after having given 0:11:26.400 --> 0:11:28.439 birth to her fourth kid a couple of days before. 0:11:29.640 --> 0:11:33.120 Super super sad. All of these are, obviously, but being 0:11:33.160 --> 0:11:35.240 a just a brand new mom for the fourth time, 0:11:35.440 --> 0:11:39.160 it's just so tragic. Uh. And then by three five 0:11:39.800 --> 0:11:41.840 she was so ill she was rushed back to the 0:11:41.840 --> 0:11:45.480 hospital and again died, very very quickly. Yeah, and like 0:11:45.600 --> 0:11:48.480 Adam Janis collapsed in front of his wife, she collapsed 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:50.880 in front of her young eight year old daughter. One 0:11:50.880 --> 0:11:54.120 of her children sare um and yeah. When she was 0:11:54.160 --> 0:11:57.080 taking the hospital, they pronounced her dead as well. This 0:11:57.160 --> 0:12:02.400 is mid afternoon. Mary mcfar Marland was up next. She 0:12:02.600 --> 0:12:07.440 was over in um the suburb of Lombard, and she 0:12:07.480 --> 0:12:10.360 worked at the Illinois Bell Phone Center where you remember, 0:12:10.400 --> 0:12:13.560 like you go get your phone, like the rotary phone, 0:12:13.760 --> 0:12:17.400 you know, you would actually lease your phone. I wasn't 0:12:17.400 --> 0:12:20.800 involved in that process, but we had them in our home, okay, 0:12:20.920 --> 0:12:25.040 well your parents that stuff. No, there was like a 0:12:25.080 --> 0:12:27.719 store where you would go it's like the phone company's 0:12:28.160 --> 0:12:31.160 retail store, and you would go and be like that 0:12:31.240 --> 0:12:34.640 pink one. It's like smartphones today, kind of same model. 0:12:34.800 --> 0:12:37.720 Kind of Um, yeah, I guess so. But this was 0:12:37.760 --> 0:12:39.959 with a big, clunky rotary phone and you had to 0:12:40.000 --> 0:12:43.520 pay extra for the extra long court. Well. Mary McFarlane 0:12:43.559 --> 0:12:45.439 worked in one of these stores, and at about four 0:12:45.480 --> 0:12:48.680 o'clock UM at the Illinois Bell Phone Center, she was 0:12:48.840 --> 0:12:51.080 she had a massive headache that just came on out 0:12:51.080 --> 0:12:54.199 of nowhere, and she went back and got some extra 0:12:54.200 --> 0:12:57.000 strength tilent all out of her purse, took a couple 0:12:57.040 --> 0:13:00.840 of them, and within minutes collapsed in the door. Yeah 0:13:00.880 --> 0:13:02.960 she was young as well. She was thirty one years old, 0:13:04.000 --> 0:13:07.440 mother of two. And then remember I was talking about 0:13:07.480 --> 0:13:11.400 Adam Janice a few minutes ago. Um, his family goes 0:13:11.400 --> 0:13:15.760 to the hospital. Obviously, everyone converges there, he passes away, 0:13:15.840 --> 0:13:19.240 and so the family makes their way home UM to 0:13:19.360 --> 0:13:22.160 begin morning and just sort of trying to reconcile what 0:13:22.200 --> 0:13:25.600 had just happened. His brother, Stanley, he was only twenty, 0:13:26.000 --> 0:13:29.680 and then his wife Teresa, who was only nineteen, are 0:13:29.720 --> 0:13:33.280 both just overcome and worn out and have headaches. So 0:13:33.440 --> 0:13:36.640 they're at Adam's house. They got his medicine cabinet, get 0:13:36.640 --> 0:13:40.240 out the tile on all that he took completely unknowingly obviously, 0:13:41.000 --> 0:13:46.440 and uh, Stanley hits the ground. Foam comes from his mouth, 0:13:46.960 --> 0:13:50.240 his eyes rolled back in his head. Everyone's freaking out, 0:13:50.600 --> 0:13:54.839 and a few minutes later, his wife collapses and they 0:13:54.880 --> 0:13:57.520 called the ambulance. By the time and the ambulances get there, 0:13:58.240 --> 0:14:01.920 I think Stanley died that day and Teresa somehow managed 0:14:01.920 --> 0:14:03.880 to live a couple of days. Yeah, she hung on. 0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:06.800 And I don't know if like her dose is lesser 0:14:07.000 --> 0:14:09.600 or what. But but she she survived for a couple 0:14:09.600 --> 0:14:13.280 of days after that. Yeah, I mean my guess is that, uh, 0:14:13.440 --> 0:14:16.280 there just wasn't as much cyanide and the capsule she took. 0:14:17.080 --> 0:14:20.320 Did I just give something else away? But the so 0:14:20.680 --> 0:14:23.840 Stanley took his tail in all first, and then Teresa's occurs, 0:14:24.080 --> 0:14:27.320 and one of the paramedics noted, like Teresa was the 0:14:27.360 --> 0:14:30.360 one that called the ambulance out to come out for Stanley. 0:14:30.360 --> 0:14:32.920 And when you get there, they're they're both like on 0:14:33.000 --> 0:14:34.720 the ground and they're like, what's going on? And one 0:14:34.720 --> 0:14:36.680 of the paramedics said, everything that was happening to the 0:14:36.720 --> 0:14:39.320 guy happened to the woman like a couple of minutes later, 0:14:39.720 --> 0:14:42.320 like she was just following him through this process of 0:14:42.800 --> 0:14:46.960 like basically systemic organ failure. And this is the same 0:14:47.040 --> 0:14:49.960 day that his brother had passed away. Yep. This is 0:14:50.000 --> 0:14:54.920 about five six hours, six hours after Adam Janis had died. 0:14:55.520 --> 0:14:59.520 Then finally, I know this is all tough to go through. Everyone. 0:15:00.400 --> 0:15:02.680 We almost selected this as our next live show. I'm 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:05.760 really glad we did, because, I mean, can you imagine 0:15:05.800 --> 0:15:08.640 trying to liven this up with some jokes? I saw it. 0:15:08.880 --> 0:15:10.640 The whole time I was like, no, we can do that. 0:15:10.720 --> 0:15:12.600 But yeah, the more I got into it, I was like, yeah, 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:15.520 it's probably not good live material. We should have a 0:15:15.600 --> 0:15:17.720 rule of thumb that any story that begins with the 0:15:17.760 --> 0:15:20.400 death of a twelve year old girl probably not live 0:15:20.440 --> 0:15:23.440 show material. I think you're right. So finally we have 0:15:23.600 --> 0:15:26.760 Paula Prince. Paula Jeene Prince. This is a couple of 0:15:26.840 --> 0:15:29.360 days later. This is not the same day. This is 0:15:29.360 --> 0:15:31.840 on Friday evening. She was a thirty five year old 0:15:31.880 --> 0:15:35.520 flight attendant and she was found dead in her apartment 0:15:36.080 --> 0:15:40.080 after police responded for a welfare check that her sister 0:15:40.160 --> 0:15:42.840 called in saying, hey, you know, I know she's a 0:15:42.840 --> 0:15:44.720 flight attendant and all, but no one knows where she is. 0:15:44.720 --> 0:15:47.040 Can you go check on her welfare check up? And 0:15:47.080 --> 0:15:51.920 they finally found her and she was gone, very very sad. 0:15:52.040 --> 0:15:54.640 She was found in her bathroom with a bottle of 0:15:54.680 --> 0:15:57.520 extra strength Title and all still open on the counter 0:15:58.280 --> 0:16:04.320 and she uh They look into um her receipts and 0:16:04.360 --> 0:16:08.240 found that she had purchased it on Wednesday, September that's right. 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:10.600 Uh So, at the end of this very short span 0:16:10.640 --> 0:16:14.080 of time in the Chicago area. We have seven people dead, 0:16:14.840 --> 0:16:17.720 and I feel like that's a good time to take 0:16:17.720 --> 0:16:43.560 a message break. Yeah, yeah, all right, stop you know, stop, okay, Chuck, 0:16:44.400 --> 0:16:47.680 So you said cyanide. How did you know that? Because 0:16:47.680 --> 0:16:50.800 I was eleven years old and I watch the nightly 0:16:50.840 --> 0:16:53.480 news like all eleven year old stad just called it 0:16:53.560 --> 0:16:58.520 just me and broke aw Dan Rather, yeah, Copple, who else? 0:16:58.680 --> 0:17:01.400 That was it? Peter Jennings He came a little later, 0:17:01.440 --> 0:17:06.280 but sure, yeah, yeah, he came after somebody. Well, I 0:17:06.280 --> 0:17:08.199 mean Cronkite wasn't still around, was he? Or was he? 0:17:09.720 --> 0:17:13.040 I don't know. I don't think so. I was I 0:17:13.119 --> 0:17:14.359 was going to be into the news as a kid 0:17:14.400 --> 0:17:16.320 a little bit. Well, yeah, I mean that was that 0:17:16.400 --> 0:17:18.280 was where you got your news back then. Yeah, you 0:17:18.320 --> 0:17:20.760 would watch the evening news. It's very strange to think 0:17:20.760 --> 0:17:23.480 about now, with the with the up to the minute 0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:26.640 news cycle. So oh yeah, I know how much more 0:17:26.680 --> 0:17:30.520 innocent things were back then. Um, So remove yourself from 0:17:30.560 --> 0:17:33.840 the benefit of hindsight or the benefit of Dan Rather's insight, 0:17:34.960 --> 0:17:39.000 and put yourself in the shoes of the people in Chicago. Right, 0:17:39.680 --> 0:17:43.760 these are five These are seven different deaths. Um, I 0:17:43.800 --> 0:17:47.919 think from five different townships in the greater Chicago area, 0:17:48.160 --> 0:17:53.280 including Chicago. Paula Prince, the last person to die, lived 0:17:53.280 --> 0:17:56.520 in Chicago. These people aren't talking. These people have no 0:17:56.560 --> 0:17:58.720 idea what's going on. It's just that there were five 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:04.560 seven separate baffling deaths. If you want to if you 0:18:04.640 --> 0:18:06.600 were people to be dead, yeah I do. That's good. 0:18:06.760 --> 0:18:11.360 My voices aren't working though. Um. It just so happens 0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:15.359 that the ambulance paramedics that showed up to attend to 0:18:15.600 --> 0:18:19.639 marry Mary Anne Kellerman, the first girl to die. Um, 0:18:20.119 --> 0:18:23.280 they were just logging everything because it was such a 0:18:23.280 --> 0:18:26.080 baffling thing, and they logged her tile and all, yeah 0:18:26.200 --> 0:18:29.399 logged isn't collected, right, Yeah, took it as evidence to 0:18:29.400 --> 0:18:32.200 maybe look into who knows, But they took the extra 0:18:32.240 --> 0:18:34.240 strength tile and all that she had taken, not thinking 0:18:34.280 --> 0:18:37.280 anything of it, but just basically throwing anything at the 0:18:37.280 --> 0:18:39.240 wall to see what stopped. Yeah, I'm sure the dad 0:18:39.280 --> 0:18:41.000 was like, you know, she went in, took some tile 0:18:41.040 --> 0:18:43.480 and on and dropped dead. So it probably made sense, 0:18:43.520 --> 0:18:45.520 even though it's just Thailand all to say like, well, hey, 0:18:45.920 --> 0:18:48.720 let's at least take this in yes, and that title 0:18:48.720 --> 0:18:51.359 and all that, right, you know, because that bottle of 0:18:51.440 --> 0:18:54.800 tile and All made its way into the hands of 0:18:55.040 --> 0:19:00.280 a medical examiner um whose name was Michael Schaefer, and 0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:03.600 Michael Schafer tested the tile in All it was rather 0:19:03.640 --> 0:19:06.800 surprised to find that some of the capsules had not 0:19:06.920 --> 0:19:10.199 tile in all in it, but sixty five milligrams of 0:19:10.280 --> 0:19:14.560 potassium cyanide. And it takes about fifty milligrams to kill 0:19:14.600 --> 0:19:17.919 a healthy adult. Yeah, I mean some of them. I 0:19:17.920 --> 0:19:19.840 don't think they were all exactly the same, but some 0:19:19.920 --> 0:19:24.760 of them had been completely emptied of any staminafin and 0:19:24.840 --> 0:19:28.160 completely filled with cyanide. With cyanide right, yeah, I mean 0:19:28.200 --> 0:19:32.200 it was it was someone intent on for sure killing people. Yes, 0:19:32.560 --> 0:19:36.000 because cyanide is no joke. It's a it's a really 0:19:36.040 --> 0:19:41.320 really small molecule um and it normally attaches to metals 0:19:41.359 --> 0:19:44.159 outside of the body, which is why you have or 0:19:44.240 --> 0:19:47.840 minerals I guess, which why you have potassium cyanide um 0:19:47.880 --> 0:19:50.560 when it goes into the body when you ingested, however 0:19:50.640 --> 0:19:53.160 you ingested, whether it's from a tile in all capsule 0:19:53.280 --> 0:19:56.119 or breathing cyanide gas like they used to use to 0:19:56.200 --> 0:19:59.879 execute people with. Like they stopped using it for execution 0:20:00.119 --> 0:20:02.399 because it was such a brutal death. Yeah, it's very cruel, 0:20:02.560 --> 0:20:06.280 painful way to die. Um in the body. It detaches 0:20:06.359 --> 0:20:09.720 from its its mineral or metal, and it attaches to 0:20:09.800 --> 0:20:14.960 a protein in the body called UM cytochrome c oxidase, 0:20:15.600 --> 0:20:17.439 which doesn't sound like could be a big problem, but 0:20:17.480 --> 0:20:20.800 it turns out that that's about the worst protein that 0:20:20.920 --> 0:20:24.520 cyanide could attach itself too, because we really need cytochrome 0:20:24.560 --> 0:20:29.199 c oxidase to breathe. Yeah, basically it I mean, this 0:20:29.240 --> 0:20:33.000 sounds like such a cruel thing because it's just rapid 0:20:33.040 --> 0:20:36.760 cell death and it's not like your throat closes up 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:41.240 and you can't breathe, like you're inhaling oxygen and you 0:20:41.240 --> 0:20:44.919 you are technically taking breaths, but the oxygen is not 0:20:45.440 --> 0:20:48.159 getting in the cells. No, it's not because that c 0:20:48.840 --> 0:20:53.639 or that cytochrome c oxidase is what helps transport the 0:20:53.680 --> 0:20:56.720 oxygen and get and allows the oxygen to be used 0:20:56.720 --> 0:21:00.639 for energy. So if the potassium is clinging to it, 0:21:00.880 --> 0:21:03.919 the oxygen can't. It just stays in the bloodstream and 0:21:03.960 --> 0:21:05.959 it doesn't get used by the cells. And since your 0:21:06.000 --> 0:21:09.199 central nervous system is the most oxygen hungry system in 0:21:09.240 --> 0:21:12.520 your entire body. It starts to shut down first, and 0:21:12.560 --> 0:21:15.600 when your brain and your spinal cords starts shutting down, 0:21:15.920 --> 0:21:19.320 all sorts of things happen. Your long start shutting down. 0:21:19.800 --> 0:21:24.080 Your heart, God bless it keeps beating for minutes after 0:21:24.119 --> 0:21:26.000 the rest of your body is shut down. Can So 0:21:26.119 --> 0:21:29.640 you're not technically dead. And they're not sure exactly how 0:21:30.119 --> 0:21:34.639 long the pain and excruciation of dying from cyanide lasts, 0:21:34.720 --> 0:21:37.600 but they think you're probably conscious in a way and 0:21:37.720 --> 0:21:40.600 freaked out for about a minute at least, and your 0:21:40.600 --> 0:21:43.440 heart may continue beating for three or four minutes after that. 0:21:43.640 --> 0:21:46.840 So it's not a pleasant death at all. No. I mean, 0:21:46.880 --> 0:21:50.760 you're you're gasping for air, You're breathing in air. Nothing's happening, 0:21:51.359 --> 0:21:55.760 Like I said, um Stanley Janice. He was foaming at 0:21:55.760 --> 0:21:57.760 the mouth and his eyes rolled back in his head 0:21:57.760 --> 0:22:00.479 in front of his family. It's just like it's awful, 0:22:00.520 --> 0:22:04.480 like writhing on the floor, gasping for air. You're breathing, 0:22:04.480 --> 0:22:06.960 but it's not doing anything. It's just I can't imagine 0:22:06.960 --> 0:22:09.639 anything more horrifying, right, because your central nervous system has 0:22:09.720 --> 0:22:12.200 kind of falling out of its um, out of controller 0:22:12.320 --> 0:22:16.679 rhythm convulsions are usually a hallmark of cyanide poisoning. And 0:22:16.680 --> 0:22:19.120 then you turn bright red at the end of it. Yeah, 0:22:19.520 --> 0:22:22.960 sin a chair, you read, they said, Because when your 0:22:23.000 --> 0:22:26.240 body has gotten rid of oxygen to your cells and 0:22:26.359 --> 0:22:30.679 the oxygen becomes depleted, um, your your skin kind of 0:22:30.680 --> 0:22:34.360 turns like a rusty brownish red. But because it can 0:22:34.480 --> 0:22:38.240 unload that oxygen when you're dead, it stays a bright red. 0:22:38.359 --> 0:22:40.760 And your skin turns bright red. And then the other 0:22:40.920 --> 0:22:43.960 real telltale sign is your breath will smell a bit 0:22:44.040 --> 0:22:47.000 like almonds. Yeah, I mean not a bit. I mean 0:22:47.040 --> 0:22:50.600 these bottles supposedly were really pungent with bitter almond, And 0:22:51.359 --> 0:22:55.600 unless you know what that means, then you're probably not 0:22:56.240 --> 0:22:59.080 clued in, you know, Like I wouldn't I wouldn't have known. 0:22:59.880 --> 0:23:01.480 I open the bottle of Thailand on it smelled like 0:23:01.520 --> 0:23:03.920 better almen would probably be like, h right, it's a 0:23:04.000 --> 0:23:06.520 nice smell. Actually, yeah, I like this tail and all. Yeah, 0:23:06.640 --> 0:23:10.040 I guess they have a new almond flavor. Awful. So 0:23:10.240 --> 0:23:14.480 Michael Schaefer, that medical examiner has just realized that this 0:23:14.480 --> 0:23:17.360