WEBVTT - Kevin Cronin 0:00:08.600 --> 0:00:12.960 Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the Bob Leftsets podcast. My 0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:19.599 guest today is Kevin Cronin of Rio Speedwagon. Kevin, you're 0:00:19.600 --> 0:00:23.040 in a hotel room. Where are you, Bob? I am 0:00:23.280 --> 0:00:27.720 in the you know, here's what we do on show days, 0:00:27.760 --> 0:00:30.440 when it's just a day room. We'll stay at the 0:00:30.840 --> 0:00:35.720 you know, Hilton Townsend family in right and just for 0:00:35.760 --> 0:00:39.760 a day room. And then on our days off we splurge. 0:00:39.800 --> 0:00:44.040 So we are in the lovely Ritz Carlton and Georgetown today, 0:00:44.080 --> 0:00:46.880 which is one of my favorite places. And why is 0:00:46.920 --> 0:00:48.000 it so great? 0:00:48.720 --> 0:00:53.840 Well, the area is great. You can from here, I can, 0:00:54.200 --> 0:00:57.240 and I do this every time. I can't help myself. 0:00:57.360 --> 0:01:04.600 I walk into d C. And actually the when we 0:01:05.120 --> 0:01:12.720 stayed here in I think February of twenty twenty, like 0:01:12.920 --> 0:01:18.120 soon after the you know, the June, the July, pardon me, 0:01:18.160 --> 0:01:22.839 the January sixth insurrection. So I walked from here down 0:01:22.880 --> 0:01:27.919 to the White House. And then I walked the path 0:01:28.120 --> 0:01:31.480 that the that those people walked from the from the 0:01:31.520 --> 0:01:35.919 reflection Pond, you know, down to the Capitol. And it's 0:01:36.160 --> 0:01:38.759 it's a long walk. It's about a it's a good 0:01:38.800 --> 0:01:42.360 half an hour. So what what it made me realize 0:01:42.480 --> 0:01:46.240 is those people had plenty of time to go, wait 0:01:46.280 --> 0:01:49.920 a minute, what am I doing here? I mean they 0:01:49.960 --> 0:01:53.320 had half an hour to contemplate what they were about 0:01:53.360 --> 0:01:56.880 to do. So but yeah, when we're here, I'll do 0:01:56.960 --> 0:02:00.000 it again. You know, today I'll walk to the White House. 0:02:00.080 --> 0:02:03.120 Else I'll you know, see the Washington Monument. I just 0:02:03.160 --> 0:02:05.520 can't get enough of it. I I love seeing the 0:02:05.560 --> 0:02:09.799 government buildings like the you know, the the Department of State, 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:13.680 you know, the Treasury Building. It's just I don't know, 0:02:13.760 --> 0:02:15.720 I just I can't get enough of it. I just 0:02:15.840 --> 0:02:20.960 feel uh patriotic, and I feel like, you know, with 0:02:21.120 --> 0:02:25.440 all these symbols of America, you know, it's time to 0:02:25.760 --> 0:02:30.960 get back to the America. That not getting back to 0:02:31.880 --> 0:02:35.480 that other America, but just getting back to normalcy in America. 0:02:35.520 --> 0:02:38.720 And I'm I'm I'm hopeful that that the steps that 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:42.639 are being taken now will uh will get us there 0:02:42.680 --> 0:02:45.160 and get us back to where we can have a 0:02:45.200 --> 0:02:50.440 healthy discourse between you know, the conservative point of view 0:02:50.520 --> 0:02:54.000 and the liberal point of view. And because I like that, 0:02:54.600 --> 0:02:56.880 you know, that's what America is all about. It's you know, 0:02:56.960 --> 0:03:00.400 we we talk things over and we we listen to 0:03:00.400 --> 0:03:02.360 the other side, and they listen to us and we 0:03:02.840 --> 0:03:07.600 come to conclusions that are better than if we hadn't 0:03:07.760 --> 0:03:11.320 listened to one another. So anyway, that's where I am. 0:03:11.560 --> 0:03:14.000 Okay, So just to be clear, that's February of twenty 0:03:14.080 --> 0:03:18.160 twenty one. But moving on, moving on. You know, you're 0:03:18.960 --> 0:03:22.480 what they used to refer to as a Heartland rock act. 0:03:23.280 --> 0:03:25.440 And one of the things that came with that is 0:03:25.480 --> 0:03:27.840 you have an audience that today we would say is 0:03:27.880 --> 0:03:33.679 both blue and red. Do you intentionally shy away from 0:03:33.680 --> 0:03:37.160 making political statements that might appeal to one or the other? 0:03:37.280 --> 0:03:38.760 Is that something that goes through your brain? 0:03:40.560 --> 0:03:44.440 You know what? I You know, we have a song 0:03:45.200 --> 0:03:49.240 that we put back in the set list after the pandemic. 0:03:49.280 --> 0:03:52.040 It's a song called Building the Bridge, and it was 0:03:52.160 --> 0:03:55.360 never a hit. It was on a record that we made, 0:03:56.520 --> 0:03:59.880 the only record we made off of Epic Records, and 0:04:00.960 --> 0:04:05.120 it was never really released, but it's it's one of 0:04:05.160 --> 0:04:08.200 my one of the songs I'm the most proud of 0:04:08.280 --> 0:04:11.960 that that we play and it it uh It says 0:04:15.080 --> 0:04:17.960 we're building the bridge, one small stone at a time, 0:04:18.400 --> 0:04:20.440 with a lot of love and some help from above, 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:23.840 from your heart to mine and there's another part. There's 0:04:23.800 --> 0:04:27.520 another lyric where it says, uh, looking for the common 0:04:27.560 --> 0:04:31.599 ground and every human heart. So it's all about, you know, 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:36.640 people coming together and people accepting one another, and people 0:04:37.040 --> 0:04:41.240 kind of listening to one another. And it's it was 0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:46.119 actually we actually sent the demo to somehow it miraculously 0:04:46.160 --> 0:04:50.359 got into the White House and and Bill Clinton heard it, 0:04:50.960 --> 0:04:55.520 and it became his re election campaign, building the bridge 0:04:55.520 --> 0:04:59.279 to the twenty first century. And I ended up doing 0:04:59.320 --> 0:05:04.679 some uh campaign events with him. But to answer your question, 0:05:04.760 --> 0:05:10.120 which I didn't do, uh, I I don't. I don't. 0:05:11.520 --> 0:05:15.200 I don't shy away from making statements. But I also 0:05:15.320 --> 0:05:19.039 am cognizant of the fact that, uh, that this country 0:05:19.120 --> 0:05:22.719 is so divided right now that I mean I I 0:05:22.839 --> 0:05:27.680 made a statement a few years back when they uh, 0:05:27.760 --> 0:05:32.880 when the whole when when the big trip was, you know, bathrooms, 0:05:32.920 --> 0:05:36.480 who could use which bathrooms? You know, should trans people 0:05:37.240 --> 0:05:42.040 use the bathroom of their birth gender or And you 0:05:42.040 --> 0:05:46.600 know my thing was man if if a if a person, 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:51.360 you know, a male, a born male, walks into the 0:05:51.400 --> 0:05:56.200 men's room and looks like a woman. To me, that's 0:05:56.960 --> 0:06:00.880 that's more of a of a distraction than if that 0:06:01.000 --> 0:06:03.880 person walked into the women's room, you know. So it's 0:06:03.920 --> 0:06:07.920 like I think people can kind of have an idea 0:06:08.000 --> 0:06:12.280 of which bathroom would be the most comfortable for them. Well, 0:06:12.839 --> 0:06:17.760 you know, I reacted to the governor of North Carolina. 0:06:18.520 --> 0:06:23.920 And what happened was Bruce Springsteen canceled his show in Greenville, 0:06:23.920 --> 0:06:29.200 North Carolina, to protest the governor passing a law against 0:06:30.440 --> 0:06:33.560 against trans people being able to use the bathroom of 0:06:33.600 --> 0:06:38.440 their choice. And we had a show. We were on 0:06:38.520 --> 0:06:42.880 tour with def Leppard at the time, and they chose 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:46.960 to play the gig. And so I was sitting there going, well, 0:06:46.960 --> 0:06:50.400 wait a second. If you know, Bruce is in a 0:06:50.440 --> 0:06:55.520 position to cancel his show in protest, so if if 0:06:55.560 --> 0:06:59.960 we play our show, then that almost could be construed 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:04.479 it is tacit uh, you know, agreement. And so I 0:07:04.520 --> 0:07:07.960 felt like I had to make a comment to to 0:07:07.960 --> 0:07:11.760 to give Bruce props for for what he did and 0:07:11.840 --> 0:07:17.000 also explain that everyone's not in that position that you know, 0:07:17.040 --> 0:07:20.640 we're gonna we're gonna play the show. But I support 0:07:20.720 --> 0:07:27.800 Bruce's position, you know, about the bathroom situation. And I 0:07:27.920 --> 0:07:30.440 got hate mail. I mean, you know, you know, you 0:07:30.520 --> 0:07:32.600 know how it is if you look at the comments 0:07:32.680 --> 0:07:36.320 on your feed, and I'm sure you get them every 0:07:36.360 --> 0:07:40.120 day because you're you're not one who shies away from 0:07:40.400 --> 0:07:42.040 from expressing your opinions. 0:07:43.640 --> 0:07:47.640 Okay, let's go back one chapter. You're on the road now, 0:07:48.200 --> 0:07:51.360 it looks from the outside without studying it, you're on 0:07:51.400 --> 0:07:52.320 the road every year. 0:07:53.800 --> 0:07:56.760 Yeah, pretty much. We've since. You know, I joined the 0:07:56.760 --> 0:08:03.440 band in seventy two, and other than the pandemic, we yeah, 0:08:03.440 --> 0:08:06.600 I think we toured. We might have taken a year 0:08:06.680 --> 0:08:11.400 off in uh in nineteen eighty three. That was just uh, 0:08:11.600 --> 0:08:15.040 you know, we had to kind of recalibrate at that time. 0:08:15.120 --> 0:08:17.440 But yeah, we're you know, the thing is, we've got 0:08:17.440 --> 0:08:20.880 a touring family. You know, we've got our crew. Guys 0:08:20.880 --> 0:08:23.360 have been with us forever, and you know, it's a 0:08:23.480 --> 0:08:28.640 it's a large uh, it's a large organization. And you know, 0:08:28.760 --> 0:08:32.520 in order to keep everybody working and keep everybody together, 0:08:33.120 --> 0:08:35.840 you know, we you know, sometimes we'll go out and 0:08:36.080 --> 0:08:38.800 do a tour, like just to pay the crew, you know, 0:08:38.880 --> 0:08:42.720 I mean, just so so you know, we realized that 0:08:43.880 --> 0:08:47.480 you know, the band gets all the gets all the glory, 0:08:47.600 --> 0:08:52.240 but without a great crew that sets it up and 0:08:52.400 --> 0:08:56.280 deals with everything every day. I mean, our crew is 0:08:56.280 --> 0:08:59.600 an amazing group. So yeah, we we pretty much tour 0:08:59.640 --> 0:09:00.000 every year. 0:09:00.640 --> 0:09:02.600 And are you into it? 0:09:03.760 --> 0:09:08.360 Yeah, I'm I'm actually I'm actually more into it right 0:09:08.400 --> 0:09:11.680 now than I have been in years. We you know, 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:17.000 our original keyboard player, Neil Dowdy, after fifty five years 0:09:17.040 --> 0:09:20.000 on the road, decided that it was time for him 0:09:20.080 --> 0:09:24.800 to start enjoying the fruits of his of his labor, 0:09:24.880 --> 0:09:31.560 so he he retired back in back last December and 0:09:31.720 --> 0:09:35.400 he's living comfortably up in Minneapolis. We love him, we 0:09:35.440 --> 0:09:39.280 support him, we're happy for him, but we had to 0:09:39.320 --> 0:09:43.880 replace him. So when you bring a new person into 0:09:44.000 --> 0:09:47.880 a band, it it just well obviously you have to 0:09:48.120 --> 0:09:51.679 work them into all the catalog songs, and so it 0:09:52.440 --> 0:09:56.480 makes everyone take another look at what we've been you know, 0:09:56.520 --> 0:09:59.440 what you've been playing for the past fifty years, you know, 0:09:59.559 --> 0:10:03.559 And and you know I'm always tinkering with the arrangements 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:05.600 at sound check. I mean, I drive the guys crazy. 0:10:05.640 --> 0:10:09.680 There's you know, I always want to My feeling is 0:10:09.679 --> 0:10:14.720 that songs are never really completely written. You know, the 0:10:14.800 --> 0:10:18.080 record comes out when you just wrote the song, so 0:10:18.120 --> 0:10:22.200 you barely even know it yourself. So over the years, 0:10:22.240 --> 0:10:26.120 you you have a chance to just you know, finish it, 0:10:26.280 --> 0:10:30.080 and so I'm never satisfied, so I'm always working on 0:10:30.160 --> 0:10:34.400 things like that. But I also started working with a 0:10:34.440 --> 0:10:40.280 vocal coach during the pandemic and it has changed my life, Bob. 0:10:40.840 --> 0:10:45.640 I enjoy performing so much better now because I actually, 0:10:46.320 --> 0:10:49.680 for finally, after fifty years, kind of know what I'm 0:10:49.679 --> 0:10:52.600 doing as a singer. So it's a so, you know, 0:10:53.120 --> 0:10:57.200 between that and and the the infusion of new energy 0:10:57.320 --> 0:11:03.040 from from Derek Hill and the keyboard player that joined 0:11:03.120 --> 0:11:08.200 us just got everybody. We're working on our vocal arrangements more. 0:11:08.320 --> 0:11:12.280 We're just really yeah, we're just improving as a band. 0:11:12.840 --> 0:11:15.800 So what motivated you to get vocal help? 0:11:16.160 --> 0:11:16.719 What did you. 0:11:16.800 --> 0:11:19.320 Learn and was that done via zoom? 0:11:20.000 --> 0:11:22.720 Well? Yes, as a matter of fact, my son Shane, 0:11:24.280 --> 0:11:27.640 he and his twin brother Josh have a band called 0:11:27.720 --> 0:11:33.320 Sir Please, and they were both just graduated from college 0:11:33.480 --> 0:11:41.240 and Shane was a vocal music major and about during 0:11:41.280 --> 0:11:46.720 his sophomore year he was like, Dad, you got to 0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:51.240 work with my professor Jeffrey Allen. He'll change your life. 0:11:51.320 --> 0:11:54.200 And I'm like, yeah, right, you know, I'm seven, I'm 0:11:54.240 --> 0:11:56.920 sixty nine years old and he's going to change my life. 0:11:57.240 --> 0:12:00.679 And every few months, you know, I would see Shaney like, Dad, 0:12:01.000 --> 0:12:03.400 have you called Jeffrey? And I'm like, no, I haven't. 0:12:04.080 --> 0:12:05.880 You know, I'm just thinking I can't drive all the 0:12:05.880 --> 0:12:08.960 way into LA for a vocal lesson, you know, every week. 0:12:09.440 --> 0:12:12.400 Then I saw Shane during the pandemic, singing into his 0:12:12.520 --> 0:12:15.240 laptop and I'm like, all right, well there goes the 0:12:15.559 --> 0:12:19.320 long commute excuse, you know. But here's what happened, Bob, 0:12:19.360 --> 0:12:23.320 And this was I love telling this story because as 0:12:23.320 --> 0:12:29.040 a parent, you are always telling your kids things that 0:12:29.440 --> 0:12:33.319 they don't necessarily understand, that they don't necessarily agree with, 0:12:34.000 --> 0:12:38.160 but you tell them I love you, I have your 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:42.320 best interests at heart, and even if you don't understand this, 0:12:42.520 --> 0:12:45.280 at least give it a listen, give it a try. 0:12:45.480 --> 0:12:50.320 And then here I am. Now my son is saying 0:12:50.400 --> 0:12:53.760 that to me. So and it's my opportunity to show 0:12:53.840 --> 0:12:56.840 him the same kind of respect as I was hoping 0:12:56.920 --> 0:12:59.600 for him to show me. And he did a number 0:12:59.640 --> 0:13:03.959 of times. And so I started working with Jeffrey via 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:09.360 zoom and I will tell you that it's been two 0:13:09.440 --> 0:13:14.480 and a half years, and this past weekend, I had 0:13:14.520 --> 0:13:19.240 a breakthrough and and all this for the past four 0:13:19.280 --> 0:13:25.520 shows we've done have been the best vocal performances of 0:13:26.720 --> 0:13:29.760 my career. And all of a sudden, you know, it's 0:13:29.800 --> 0:13:32.880 like if you're taking golf lessons and you know, nothing 0:13:32.960 --> 0:13:35.120 makes sense for a while, and then all of a sudden, 0:13:35.600 --> 0:13:38.680 you smack a ball and you hear that pop off 0:13:38.720 --> 0:13:44.520 the club. And so all these all these lessons, and 0:13:44.720 --> 0:13:47.480 I've been taking at least two or three lessons a 0:13:47.480 --> 0:13:51.920 week with Jeffrey, and it something just clicked, and I 0:13:52.120 --> 0:13:54.920 just like, I can't wait for the next show, just 0:13:54.960 --> 0:13:59.360 because I'm having so much fun. So you know, I 0:13:59.360 --> 0:14:01.640 don't like being away from home, I'll be honest with you. 0:14:01.800 --> 0:14:05.400 But for those you know, two hours that I'm on 0:14:05.480 --> 0:14:09.200 stage I'm doing I'm having more fun than ever. 0:14:10.080 --> 0:14:12.680 So you say, driving into LA, So where do you live? 0:14:13.720 --> 0:14:18.360 I live in a thousand oaks, Okay, So for those 0:14:18.400 --> 0:14:21.960 people don't know, LA is a morphous like a giant suburb. 0:14:22.000 --> 0:14:24.040 So it's still kind of part of LA. But because 0:14:24.080 --> 0:14:27.040 of the because of the traffic, et cetera, it would 0:14:27.120 --> 0:14:29.240 take forever to get to where you might be going. 0:14:29.640 --> 0:14:32.200 And since you mentioned your kids, how many times you've 0:14:32.200 --> 0:14:33.680 been married, and how many kids do you have? 0:14:34.720 --> 0:14:40.000 Well, I was married, I've been married twice. I have 0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:46.000 a son, Paris from my first marriage and a step son, 0:14:46.240 --> 0:14:52.280 Chris from that marriage. And then I met We got 0:14:52.280 --> 0:14:58.560 divorced in eighty seven. And in eighty nine I met 0:14:58.600 --> 0:15:03.440 a young music publisher from Geff and Music. Actually she 0:15:04.440 --> 0:15:08.600 Our office was right upstairs from hers, and so, you know, 0:15:09.960 --> 0:15:13.600 John Barrick and Tom Consolo were up there cranking cranking 0:15:13.680 --> 0:15:18.880 out the latest composition by Tom Kelly and Billy Steinberg, 0:15:18.920 --> 0:15:22.560 who were managed out of our office. And here comes 0:15:22.560 --> 0:15:26.560 this pretty young music publisher upstairs saying, guys, I'm trying 0:15:26.560 --> 0:15:28.960 to listen to demos downstairs. Can you turn the music 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:31.920 down a little bit? And one thing led to another, 0:15:32.160 --> 0:15:36.960 and now she's my wife. And so I met Lisa 0:15:37.040 --> 0:15:40.280 back in eighty nine. We got married in ninety two, 0:15:40.920 --> 0:15:46.040 and we have three children, Holly and who is twenty six, 0:15:46.120 --> 0:15:48.680 and the twins Josh and Shane, twenty three. 0:15:49.960 --> 0:15:54.160 And being a working musician, how do you sustain a relationship. 0:15:54.200 --> 0:15:55.520 I mean, you've been in the game a long time, 0:15:55.600 --> 0:15:56.920 You've seen everything. 0:15:57.360 --> 0:16:00.840 Yeah, I have, you know, and it's it's it's a 0:16:00.960 --> 0:16:03.720 challenge and and you know, at Lisa and I've been 0:16:03.720 --> 0:16:09.560 together now for thirty four years, and you know, we've 0:16:09.720 --> 0:16:13.200 we we figured it out and and it wasn't easy. 0:16:13.240 --> 0:16:17.680 We we went through some rough patches and but you know, 0:16:17.840 --> 0:16:23.880 love carried us through and uh and now we're we're 0:16:23.880 --> 0:16:26.680 in a we're in a great place. And I'm I'm 0:16:26.800 --> 0:16:30.840 so I feel so fortunate because a lot of marriages 0:16:30.880 --> 0:16:33.800 do bite the dust because of because of touring. And 0:16:34.200 --> 0:16:37.600 you know, there's just so much temptation on the road, 0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:42.320 and you know, so much opportunity for uh, for bad behavior, 0:16:42.920 --> 0:16:45.840 and you know, you just got to get to a 0:16:45.920 --> 0:16:50.479 point where you can, uh, you know, exert self control 0:16:50.800 --> 0:16:58.000 and uh discipline yourself and you know, yeah, so you know, 0:16:58.120 --> 0:16:59.920 I'm i'm out here in the road that you know, 0:17:00.800 --> 0:17:07.879 we also changed our touring modus operandi or whatever the 0:17:07.920 --> 0:17:10.320 word is. You're an attorney, what wait, what is motus operandia? 0:17:10.400 --> 0:17:11.399 That works? That works? 0:17:11.560 --> 0:17:14.879 As that works? Okay? Good U. But uh so we 0:17:15.040 --> 0:17:18.320 try not to be out on the road for you know, 0:17:18.359 --> 0:17:21.639 we try to do a weekend, the weekend between the 0:17:21.680 --> 0:17:24.520 middle weekend, the weekend between and the third weekend, so 0:17:24.600 --> 0:17:27.600 we're it's a little less than three weeks, and then 0:17:27.640 --> 0:17:29.320 we take a couple of weeks, at least a couple 0:17:29.359 --> 0:17:31.880 of weeks off after that. Sometimes we just go out 0:17:31.880 --> 0:17:33.880 for ten days. You know, we just don't go out 0:17:33.960 --> 0:17:37.879 for you know, six months of touring, because that that 0:17:38.240 --> 0:17:43.359 just you that's you can't sustain relationship if you're away 0:17:43.359 --> 0:17:44.879 that long. It just doesn't work. 0:17:45.520 --> 0:17:47.879 So, once again, since you've been on the road so 0:17:47.920 --> 0:17:50.920 many times, to what degree did Temptation get to you? 0:17:51.480 --> 0:17:56.119 Both in terms of sex, drugs, rock and roll? 0:17:56.359 --> 0:18:01.760 Yeah, all of the above, you know, and uh, you know, 0:18:03.880 --> 0:18:06.800 especially when you're coming up and you're you're you're playing 0:18:06.840 --> 0:18:09.720 the bars and you're starting to get a little bit 0:18:09.720 --> 0:18:12.159 of a you know, maybe your first or second record 0:18:12.240 --> 0:18:15.159 comes out, you've got you know, uh, you know, a 0:18:15.240 --> 0:18:19.080 local kind of following, and uh, you know, you're young 0:18:19.200 --> 0:18:23.359 and you're single, and and uh you know it's uh 0:18:23.680 --> 0:18:26.200 so that's so that's just kind of good, clean fun 0:18:26.280 --> 0:18:30.480 and hopefully you get that out of your system. And uh, 0:18:30.680 --> 0:18:34.479 but then you know, a band like us who started 0:18:34.520 --> 0:18:38.119 out as a bar band and then suddenly just you know, 0:18:38.359 --> 0:18:42.800 kind of hit the jackpot, and then you know, now 0:18:43.480 --> 0:18:48.679 Temptation is really everywhere, and you know, uh, you know, 0:18:48.720 --> 0:18:53.840 I'm uh, I don't regret necessarily. Well, I regret some 0:18:53.880 --> 0:18:57.840 of the things I did, but mostly I uh, well 0:18:57.920 --> 0:18:59.880 you know it cost me my first marriage, I'll put 0:18:59.880 --> 0:19:07.160 it that way. So you know it's uh, I got 0:19:07.160 --> 0:19:08.800 it out of my system, is all I can tell you. 0:19:09.000 --> 0:19:12.800 And and I'm you know, I'm I'm, I'm a I'm 0:19:12.840 --> 0:19:18.560 a true blue husband out here and and I'm happier 0:19:18.600 --> 0:19:18.960 than ever. 0:19:19.440 --> 0:19:21.720 Okay, just going a little bit deeper. 0:19:22.240 --> 0:19:23.359 What's it? You know? 0:19:24.680 --> 0:19:26.439 I say, tell the story all the time because it 0:19:26.480 --> 0:19:28.399 really stuck with me. A friend of mine was the 0:19:28.440 --> 0:19:31.280 agent for Oprah who was playing Arenas. This is after 0:19:31.320 --> 0:19:35.640 she retired, and you will everyone would ask, well, why 0:19:35.720 --> 0:19:37.959 does Oprah need to go on the road. She's got 0:19:38.000 --> 0:19:41.480 all the money, as David Letterman needs to say, there's 0:19:41.520 --> 0:19:44.920 nowhere else she can get that hit. You get on stage, 0:19:45.000 --> 0:19:50.359 you get that love, et cetera. So what's it like 0:19:50.960 --> 0:19:54.800 and you meet people in the audience, whether it be 0:19:55.400 --> 0:19:58.200 friends want to be friends, whether it be women who 0:19:58.200 --> 0:20:01.680 are interested in you. What's it like being on stage? 0:20:01.800 --> 0:20:03.840 Do these people really want to know you? They just 0:20:03.920 --> 0:20:06.000 want to touch fame? What's the experience. 0:20:07.720 --> 0:20:11.600 Well, you know, I can tell you that that that 0:20:11.880 --> 0:20:15.960 for me. Uh, you know, especially as a songwriter. You know, 0:20:16.160 --> 0:20:21.320 I I remember every song I've written. I remember where 0:20:21.359 --> 0:20:25.080 I was. I remember you know, that that holy moment 0:20:25.160 --> 0:20:29.439 of inspiration where there was nothing and then all all 0:20:29.480 --> 0:20:33.040 of a sudden, there was something and and uh and 0:20:33.119 --> 0:20:38.240 so you know when I when I'm on stage and 0:20:38.560 --> 0:20:42.919 I sing those songs, uh, it's it's it's just an 0:20:42.960 --> 0:20:46.480 amazing experience, says because I know that song from when 0:20:46.520 --> 0:20:49.600 it was nothing and now I walk out and I 0:20:49.720 --> 0:20:53.760 play the opening chords and everybody stands up. You know, 0:20:53.800 --> 0:20:56.159 I sing the song, everybody's singing it back to me. 0:20:57.280 --> 0:21:01.720 It's a it's an amazing experience. It's uh, it's something 0:21:01.760 --> 0:21:06.000 that's that unless you're standing there at that lead vocal 0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:12.680 mic stage center. Uh, it's impossible to understand as far 0:21:12.720 --> 0:21:17.160 as what the audience is expecting of me. I think 0:21:17.240 --> 0:21:23.840 I think every audience member probably would answer that question differently. Uh. 0:21:23.920 --> 0:21:29.119 You know, we do present uh you know, I mean 0:21:29.119 --> 0:21:32.159 there are bands who you know, like Kiss or something 0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:35.520 like that, who who totally present a character on stage 0:21:35.560 --> 0:21:38.320 and that's their thing, and you know, no one does 0:21:38.320 --> 0:21:41.000 it better than them. For for us, you know, we're 0:21:41.000 --> 0:21:44.960 more the Midwest boys next door, and you know that's 0:21:45.040 --> 0:21:47.919 kind of our image, but it's kind of who we 0:21:48.000 --> 0:21:50.880 are too. So you know, when I'm up there on stage, yeah, 0:21:50.960 --> 0:21:55.880 I'm an exaggerated version of myself, but there's a lot 0:21:55.920 --> 0:21:59.520 of my real kind of self up there too, And 0:21:59.600 --> 0:22:04.560 so I think people probably feel like they people in 0:22:04.600 --> 0:22:08.760 the audience probably feel like they know me better than 0:22:09.000 --> 0:22:13.280 they do because you know, uh, you know, I'm not 0:22:13.760 --> 0:22:19.760 I'm not showing the necessarily the the the brutes and 0:22:19.880 --> 0:22:22.399 not the bruises, but you know, uh uh, you know, 0:22:22.480 --> 0:22:26.520 I'm presenting the best possible version of myself up there, 0:22:26.560 --> 0:22:29.240 and and I want to. I want to. I want 0:22:29.280 --> 0:22:33.480 to inspire other people in the crowd too to be 0:22:33.680 --> 0:22:37.200 their best self. You know, we've all got our problems, 0:22:37.240 --> 0:22:39.960 We've all got our faults, we've all got the issues 0:22:40.000 --> 0:22:42.720 that we're working on in our relationships and in our 0:22:42.960 --> 0:22:48.440 in our own personalities. But you know, so uh yeah, 0:22:48.480 --> 0:22:50.800 so you know, I I go out there and yeah, 0:22:50.880 --> 0:22:55.080 do I do? I do people think that that's who 0:22:55.160 --> 0:22:58.199 I really am and that my wife is so lucky 0:22:58.320 --> 0:23:02.560 to have me as her husban been. I think they do. 0:23:03.160 --> 0:23:06.040 But you know, if you talk to Lisa, you know 0:23:07.920 --> 0:23:10.679 she would tell you the other side of the story. 0:23:10.760 --> 0:23:13.679 And uh, you know, my theory is that every every 0:23:13.800 --> 0:23:17.800 good trait has the flip side of the coin, the 0:23:17.960 --> 0:23:20.480 opposite of that good trait. And so it's all of 0:23:20.520 --> 0:23:26.480 our jobs too, you know, to understand that that opposite trait. 0:23:26.640 --> 0:23:29.000 And uh, you know, I call it the flip side 0:23:29.040 --> 0:23:31.840 trait and uh, you know you gotta you gotta know 0:23:31.880 --> 0:23:35.199 how to harness that and uh and uh, you know, 0:23:35.560 --> 0:23:38.800 life is all about changing and uh and learning and 0:23:39.560 --> 0:23:41.879 I'm I'm I'm still a work in progress. 0:23:48.920 --> 0:23:53.000 Okay. Now, people were not on this side of the 0:23:53.160 --> 0:23:58.280 footlights don't understand what a grind it is. A lot 0:23:58.280 --> 0:24:01.159 of people have what are called find to five jobs. 0:24:01.200 --> 0:24:03.480 They come home, maybe they get high, watch TV. 0:24:03.640 --> 0:24:04.399 They do it again. 0:24:04.800 --> 0:24:09.960 But there's an incredible adrenaline hit in performing and it 0:24:10.119 --> 0:24:14.240 takes hours to come down, and certainly the longer the 0:24:14.320 --> 0:24:17.639 day the sun comes up, it's hard. And therefore a 0:24:17.680 --> 0:24:20.720 lot of people cope with drugs. Now people say, oh, 0:24:20.800 --> 0:24:23.840 it's about experimentation. A lot of times just coping. Did 0:24:23.920 --> 0:24:26.880 you have that period in your road or you're more 0:24:26.920 --> 0:24:28.200 of a Midwestern guy. 0:24:29.040 --> 0:24:32.080 No, No, I definitely, I definitely had that period. I'm 0:24:32.560 --> 0:24:37.800 I'm very fortunate Bob that that for whatever reason, you know, 0:24:37.920 --> 0:24:43.880 the the drugs that I did, they never they never 0:24:44.040 --> 0:24:47.320 got me. They never they never took control of me. 0:24:47.560 --> 0:24:51.080 And you know, and I tell my kids that, you know, 0:24:51.560 --> 0:24:55.480 you don't know, but by the time you know whether 0:24:55.600 --> 0:24:57.880 drugs are going to get a hold of you, they've 0:24:57.920 --> 0:25:00.280 got a hold of you. And now you've got an 0:25:00.280 --> 0:25:04.879 addiction issue to deal with, you know. And somehow I 0:25:04.960 --> 0:25:08.560 think that I always kind of had a fear. I've 0:25:08.600 --> 0:25:12.199 always had a fear of addiction. So I've I've you know, 0:25:12.880 --> 0:25:17.600 I've just managed to limit my intake. Uh. You know, 0:25:17.760 --> 0:25:23.639 but uh, drugs were definitely a coping method. You know. 0:25:24.480 --> 0:25:27.280 Meeting girls was a coping method. You know, it just 0:25:27.520 --> 0:25:30.560 it just was a way to to to to cope 0:25:30.560 --> 0:25:34.080 with the loneliness and uh and you know, the combination 0:25:34.520 --> 0:25:39.880 of of of of willing girls and drugs was it 0:25:39.960 --> 0:25:44.199 was just a way of life. Uh and and uh, 0:25:44.320 --> 0:25:48.399 you know, I didn't even realize how weird it was 0:25:48.600 --> 0:25:51.720 until I kind of you know, I I actually, I 0:25:51.760 --> 0:25:54.600 will tell you, and I'm not ashamed to say it. 0:25:54.640 --> 0:25:57.480 I went to rehab and it wasn't for drugs, and 0:25:57.520 --> 0:26:02.240 it wasn't for alcohol. It was for or just I 0:26:02.320 --> 0:26:05.160 you know, I needed to to straighten out my head 0:26:05.359 --> 0:26:09.119 and and uh and it really helped. I spent I 0:26:09.160 --> 0:26:13.080 spent a month at Sierra Tucson, and it was it 0:26:13.119 --> 0:26:17.480 was a life changer for me. It uh uh you know, 0:26:17.680 --> 0:26:21.320 uh and and I would uh you know, I'm so 0:26:21.600 --> 0:26:24.560 happy that that it that that it ended up that 0:26:24.640 --> 0:26:27.359 way because it really really helped me. And you know, 0:26:27.440 --> 0:26:31.760 I'm not I'm not sober, you know. I I respect 0:26:31.840 --> 0:26:34.840 people that that are, but you know, I you know, 0:26:34.880 --> 0:26:37.040 I like to have you know, I like wine, and 0:26:37.200 --> 0:26:39.800 I'll be honest with you and and uh you know, 0:26:40.000 --> 0:26:45.400 and I like weed once in a while. So so yeah, yeah, 0:26:45.440 --> 0:26:48.280 the hardest part of being on the road is is 0:26:48.520 --> 0:26:54.760 coping with the the time that you're alone. And and 0:26:54.800 --> 0:26:58.679 so I think that not being alone was was a 0:26:58.720 --> 0:27:03.040 big part of of what are. Not being able to 0:27:03.119 --> 0:27:07.680 be alone was what got me into a lot of situations, 0:27:07.720 --> 0:27:11.119 you know. And uh, but I'm I'm okay being alone now. 0:27:11.119 --> 0:27:13.720 I'm I'm writing a book. I've been writing a book 0:27:13.800 --> 0:27:17.360 for six and a half years. Now and and that 0:27:17.440 --> 0:27:20.560 kind of you know. So so I'm when when I'm alone, 0:27:20.920 --> 0:27:24.080 I just you know, I've worked on the book. I 0:27:24.119 --> 0:27:26.520 tinker with it and uh you know, I've got a 0:27:26.520 --> 0:27:29.960 little practice guitar with me, and uh you know, I'm 0:27:31.400 --> 0:27:35.560 I'm more okay with with with being alone than ever, 0:27:35.720 --> 0:27:38.080 So that helps. 0:27:38.280 --> 0:27:43.040 Okay, going to rehab, most people are not eager to go, 0:27:43.600 --> 0:27:45.480 usually the environing people where I said, well maybe you 0:27:45.480 --> 0:27:48.960 should do this. How long ago did you go, what 0:27:49.000 --> 0:27:52.040 motivated you to go? And what was the experienced? Like 0:27:52.080 --> 0:27:53.639 you know, we said it was life changing? You know 0:27:53.680 --> 0:27:55.760 what about it? What did you actually learn there? 0:27:56.880 --> 0:28:01.000 Oh? Man? I I you know I used to to 0:28:01.280 --> 0:28:07.160 cope by Uh well I learned at a young age too, 0:28:07.920 --> 0:28:12.320 you know, if what if I was misbehaving, Uh you know, 0:28:12.960 --> 0:28:16.119 my parents method of discipline was go up to your 0:28:16.160 --> 0:28:19.080 room and don't come back until you have a smile 0:28:19.119 --> 0:28:24.160 on your face. So I learned that. Okay, so no 0:28:24.160 --> 0:28:28.639 matter what I'm feeling, I should come down with a 0:28:28.680 --> 0:28:31.640 smile on my face. And I took that into adulthood. 0:28:32.240 --> 0:28:37.320 Uh and so I just you know, Hey, the my 0:28:37.400 --> 0:28:42.960 most famous song ever is called Can't Fight This Feeling? Uh, 0:28:43.160 --> 0:28:47.600 and and uh. You know I always had just feelings 0:28:47.640 --> 0:28:49.560 that I would just stuff, and you know, you stuff 0:28:49.640 --> 0:28:54.040 the feelings down and and but but feelings are like water. 0:28:54.240 --> 0:28:57.800 They have to find their way out. It doesn't work. 0:28:57.880 --> 0:29:01.680 Anyone who thinks that if you just wait long enough, 0:29:01.840 --> 0:29:09.120 the feeling of you know, of anger, of unfulfillment of 0:29:09.640 --> 0:29:12.840 or whatever it happens to be, it's it doesn't go away. 0:29:13.320 --> 0:29:16.840 It finds its way out in you know, passive aggressive 0:29:16.960 --> 0:29:21.480 behavior in code dependency. I mean, I didn't know what 0:29:21.560 --> 0:29:26.240 code dependency was. And the second day that I was 0:29:26.360 --> 0:29:30.200 at Sierra Tucson, they had they sent you you get 0:29:30.200 --> 0:29:32.280 a you get a schedule every morning, and that they 0:29:32.320 --> 0:29:37.080 sent me to a codependence anonymous meeting. I'm like, what, what, 0:29:37.080 --> 0:29:40.000 What's this? What am I doing? But I went there 0:29:40.840 --> 0:29:42.680 and I walked into the room and there was about 0:29:43.440 --> 0:29:47.239 twenty five people in in chairs around a circle. And 0:29:47.320 --> 0:29:51.240 the group leader stood up and I guess this is 0:29:51.600 --> 0:29:55.080 what happens at the beginning of every meeting. She read 0:29:55.320 --> 0:30:00.840 all she read like twenty five personality traits that are 0:30:01.360 --> 0:30:05.800 indicative of codependency. Right, And I'm sitting there and not 0:30:05.880 --> 0:30:07.800 knowing what I'm doing. There I'm like, all of a sudden, 0:30:07.800 --> 0:30:11.520 I'm like check, check check. I mean, it was like 0:30:12.200 --> 0:30:15.760 all it was, it was a description of me, you know, 0:30:15.960 --> 0:30:20.200 and I always thought that that was just me and 0:30:20.240 --> 0:30:23.040 that I had this crazy part of me that I 0:30:23.080 --> 0:30:26.280 didn't understand that I was trying to hide. And suddenly 0:30:26.360 --> 0:30:30.600 I'm in a room of thirty people who all share 0:30:30.800 --> 0:30:36.200 that same whatever personality defect will fault to whatever you 0:30:36.280 --> 0:30:39.600 want to call it. And I just at that moment, 0:30:39.640 --> 0:30:44.760 I had this feeling like, wow, I'm not alone. Other 0:30:44.880 --> 0:30:50.560 people feel these things, and that just that was It 0:30:50.760 --> 0:30:55.760 just made me feel like this relief, like I could exhale. 0:30:55.800 --> 0:30:59.200 And then, you know, I spent the next month just 0:30:59.440 --> 0:31:03.200 you know, get into it and seeing you know, some 0:31:03.960 --> 0:31:10.040 alternative coping methods and uh so, you know, and when 0:31:10.120 --> 0:31:13.360 you're when you're in rehabits, it's just this weird thing 0:31:13.400 --> 0:31:18.560 that first of all, everybody is nobody's any and no, 0:31:18.600 --> 0:31:22.200 there's no celebrities, you know, even though there were celebrities there, 0:31:22.480 --> 0:31:27.720 but everybody's just on the same level and everyone's free 0:31:27.760 --> 0:31:31.680 to talk and you can, uh you know, you don't 0:31:31.720 --> 0:31:34.440 have to hide things, you don't have to be you 0:31:34.440 --> 0:31:37.520 don't have to be anything except who you are in 0:31:37.640 --> 0:31:41.680 that moment, and uh, and it felt really good to me, 0:31:42.400 --> 0:31:44.640 and so I kind of brought some of that. 0:31:45.080 --> 0:31:45.280 You know. 0:31:45.320 --> 0:31:47.480 The hard part is when you leave rehab that now 0:31:47.520 --> 0:31:50.120 you've got to come in back into the real world 0:31:50.320 --> 0:31:54.120 and see if those same coping methods work. And uh, 0:31:54.960 --> 0:31:59.080 but yeah, it was. It was a great experience. And 0:31:59.400 --> 0:32:01.600 you know, there were people there who were trying to 0:32:02.240 --> 0:32:06.840 uh stop drinking, stop using drugs, uh, stop smoking. There 0:32:06.880 --> 0:32:09.440 was an eating disorder. A lot of people were in 0:32:09.480 --> 0:32:13.520 the eating disorder tract, and but all of us were 0:32:13.560 --> 0:32:17.040 together in the you know, in the common areas, and 0:32:17.080 --> 0:32:21.040 you just met people and people were free, and people 0:32:21.080 --> 0:32:25.720 were just talking about their their stuff, and uh, you know, 0:32:25.840 --> 0:32:29.080 I I came out of there a lot more open 0:32:29.480 --> 0:32:32.960 I think as a as a person and and and 0:32:33.560 --> 0:32:38.560 a lot less. I don't tolerate dishonesty in myself. I 0:32:38.640 --> 0:32:42.960 don't uh you know, I don't hold things in because 0:32:43.000 --> 0:32:45.800 I know what will happen if I do. And uh 0:32:46.400 --> 0:32:51.720 uh and uh and I understand the difference between uh 0:32:51.840 --> 0:32:57.120 friendship and codependency. So I learned a lot of things 0:32:57.120 --> 0:33:01.080 in there, and and uh, you know, I'm I'm I'm 0:33:01.480 --> 0:33:04.959 I'm really happy that I went. When I went in, 0:33:05.080 --> 0:33:07.320 I was just like, what am I doing this for? 0:33:07.680 --> 0:33:10.960 I'm not you know, I'm not addicted to anything. But 0:33:11.840 --> 0:33:15.240 sure enough, when I got there, I realized, Wow, codependency 0:33:15.280 --> 0:33:17.720 who knew and changed my life? 0:33:18.400 --> 0:33:21.560 In how long ago? And what was the motivation to 0:33:21.640 --> 0:33:22.480 actually go in? 0:33:23.280 --> 0:33:27.520 Uh? It was about ten years ago? And uh, you know, 0:33:27.640 --> 0:33:32.720 the motivation to go in was just that I had 0:33:32.960 --> 0:33:36.160 set myself up, you know, at a young age to 0:33:36.360 --> 0:33:43.000 think that if I could just become successful and my 0:33:43.240 --> 0:33:45.200 music to you know, if I could just have hit 0:33:45.360 --> 0:33:50.400 songs and people would would be able to see, you know, 0:33:51.080 --> 0:33:55.320 my what I'm capable of doing, and and and I 0:33:55.320 --> 0:33:58.760 could share these these songs with I just had it 0:33:58.840 --> 0:34:02.400 set up that that would be that would solve all 0:34:02.480 --> 0:34:07.280 my problems, you know, and and and that motivated me 0:34:07.360 --> 0:34:10.160 for years. And you know, then all of a sudden, 0:34:11.120 --> 0:34:14.480 nineteen eighty one comes along and we've got the biggest 0:34:14.480 --> 0:34:16.680 album of the year, where the most popular band in 0:34:16.719 --> 0:34:22.040 the world. There was nobody more more successful in nineteen 0:34:22.080 --> 0:34:27.560 eighty one than Ario Speedwagon. And guess what, Rather than 0:34:27.800 --> 0:34:31.960 solve my problems, it it magnified them. Began. It also 0:34:32.719 --> 0:34:36.359 a new problem showed up, which is, oh, being successful 0:34:36.560 --> 0:34:41.000 isn't going to solve all my problems? So what is uh? 0:34:41.040 --> 0:34:46.160 And so it finally got to the point in right 0:34:46.239 --> 0:34:50.960 right around two thousand and twenty ten where I still 0:34:51.080 --> 0:34:56.799 was just I just didn't feel right and and and 0:34:56.840 --> 0:35:01.280 I and uh and and you know, success wasn't wasn't 0:35:01.320 --> 0:35:06.759 filling the hole. And uh so, uh, you know, my 0:35:06.800 --> 0:35:09.440 wife and I talked it over and and uh we 0:35:09.520 --> 0:35:14.960 decided that, uh that I needed to to you know, 0:35:15.080 --> 0:35:18.080 go in there and get some help. And I think it, 0:35:18.320 --> 0:35:22.160 Uh it went a long way to uh to strengthen 0:35:22.800 --> 0:35:28.440 my marriage for sure, my relationship with my children, uh, 0:35:28.640 --> 0:35:31.279 my all my relationships, you know, and you know some 0:35:31.440 --> 0:35:36.600 relationships uh uh you know kind of didn't work anymore 0:35:36.719 --> 0:35:41.640 because they were based on on you know, codependency or whatever. 0:35:41.760 --> 0:35:46.279 You know. So yeah, so there you go. 0:35:46.400 --> 0:35:49.239 That's uh okay. So you talked about getting out. You're 0:35:49.280 --> 0:35:52.600 in this environment. Everybody's equal, You're surrounded by people. You 0:35:52.680 --> 0:35:56.000 referenced loneliness earlier, and you talked and I give you 0:35:56.040 --> 0:35:59.160 credit because most people have no idea how difficult it is. 0:35:59.440 --> 0:36:02.000 You know, I read about people they went to rehab 0:36:02.239 --> 0:36:03.919 for a week and then they go back on the road. 0:36:04.280 --> 0:36:05.880 That you know, I don't know how they can do that. 0:36:06.480 --> 0:36:10.799 So in terms of maintaining did you go to see 0:36:10.840 --> 0:36:13.360 a therapist? Were you on your own? What's been happening 0:36:13.360 --> 0:36:16.240 in these last ten years to keep you steady? 0:36:16.800 --> 0:36:20.560 Yeah, Well, you know, I was in therapy, you know, 0:36:20.760 --> 0:36:24.040 for on and off, you know, during the eighties and nineties, 0:36:24.200 --> 0:36:27.480 and uh, and I had some really I worked with 0:36:27.520 --> 0:36:33.480 some really good people and uh and after heire Tucson, 0:36:33.600 --> 0:36:37.120 I stayed in therapy for a while. I actually haven't 0:36:37.160 --> 0:36:40.640 been in therapy for for the for about I don't know, 0:36:40.719 --> 0:36:45.040 three or four years now, which is kind of strange. Uh, 0:36:45.280 --> 0:36:49.960 it's uh, it's the that's the longest time since the 0:36:50.120 --> 0:36:56.239 eighties for me. But uh, you know, so yeah, so 0:36:57.239 --> 0:37:03.960 uh I think that uh for some reason, I'm just 0:37:04.040 --> 0:37:07.759 a little I'm just not quite as uncomfortable being by 0:37:07.800 --> 0:37:11.560 myself as I used to be. And so uh, I mean, 0:37:11.760 --> 0:37:15.319 you know, that's the hardest part of of being on tour, 0:37:15.760 --> 0:37:15.960 you know. 0:37:16.200 --> 0:37:16.520 Uh. 0:37:16.800 --> 0:37:19.480 Neil used to always say, you know, I do the 0:37:19.520 --> 0:37:23.520 shows for free. I get paid to get there. Uh, 0:37:23.560 --> 0:37:26.960 and I think that's a pretty common uh thread, you know, 0:37:27.120 --> 0:37:30.239 and uh you know, and and you know, the the 0:37:30.600 --> 0:37:33.520 years of partying that that that was that was really 0:37:33.600 --> 0:37:37.080 a way of coping. And let's face it, if you're 0:37:37.480 --> 0:37:40.080 in a rock band and you got hit records, it 0:37:40.280 --> 0:37:44.879 gives you a license to uh you know, for debauchery 0:37:44.960 --> 0:37:48.000 and and uh uh and it's a but it's a 0:37:48.040 --> 0:37:52.520 fake license. And you know people people use sex and 0:37:52.600 --> 0:37:55.239 drugs to get close to the band because they want 0:37:55.239 --> 0:37:57.839 to be because they want to you know, people want 0:37:57.840 --> 0:38:00.600 to understand it. It's like, what's it like to being 0:38:00.680 --> 0:38:05.160 a big time rock band? You know? And uh so yeah, 0:38:05.560 --> 0:38:09.399 you know these days, you know, our our audiences are 0:38:09.560 --> 0:38:14.360 I mean, we played this Monday and Tuesday. Who who 0:38:14.400 --> 0:38:16.480 who goes to a rock show on a Monday or 0:38:16.480 --> 0:38:19.000 a Tuesday? When we had we had two sold out 0:38:19.040 --> 0:38:24.160 shows in Augusta, Georgia and Charleston, South Carolina. People were 0:38:24.760 --> 0:38:28.239 on their feet, uh for the singing along, just having 0:38:28.280 --> 0:38:32.520 a great time. And you know, and that's enough for me. 0:38:32.719 --> 0:38:36.040 That that that love is enough for me. You know, 0:38:36.200 --> 0:38:40.200 I'm I'm not looking for for extra curricular love. I 0:38:40.200 --> 0:38:43.040 I got I got love at home. Uh, I got 0:38:43.120 --> 0:38:47.839 an honest relationship with my wife and my kids and 0:38:47.840 --> 0:38:50.440 and not. I'll tell you one of the you know, 0:38:50.560 --> 0:38:52.080 if you want to know, one of the one of 0:38:52.080 --> 0:38:56.759 the greatest things that that about rehab is is I 0:38:56.840 --> 0:39:00.400 came out of there, Uh, like I said, with zero 0:39:00.520 --> 0:39:04.160 tolerance for bullshit and and the fact that I could, 0:39:05.200 --> 0:39:10.600 uh that I could just since I'm not hiding anything, 0:39:10.680 --> 0:39:13.799 since I'm not, you know, engaged in any behavior that 0:39:13.800 --> 0:39:18.239 I'm ashamed of. Uh, it's just it's like a it's 0:39:18.239 --> 0:39:21.279 like a weight off my shoulders. It's like I can 0:39:21.360 --> 0:39:25.800 be totally honest all the time. I'm not hiding anything, 0:39:25.920 --> 0:39:29.080 you know, and it's just a it's a real freeing feeling. 0:39:29.160 --> 0:39:33.680 And it's just made me closer to everyone in my life, 0:39:34.040 --> 0:39:36.400 from my wife, to my friends, to my kids. 0:39:37.000 --> 0:39:37.360 Uh. 0:39:37.440 --> 0:39:41.440 It just just feels good to be done with the 0:39:41.600 --> 0:39:44.400 what what I used to call the road guy home 0:39:44.480 --> 0:39:47.800 guy syndrome. You know, you can only be one guy, 0:39:48.040 --> 0:39:51.440 you know, if you're if you're being two guys, it's 0:39:51.480 --> 0:39:54.080 it doesn't work, you know, because you're always you're always 0:39:54.120 --> 0:39:58.600 hiding guy too when when when your guy won? And uh, 0:39:58.800 --> 0:40:02.600 it's a it's a it's a miserable way to live 0:40:02.640 --> 0:40:05.640 I'll be honest with you. So now I'm it's it's 0:40:05.680 --> 0:40:09.120 all guy one and and I'm proud to say it, 0:40:09.160 --> 0:40:13.080 and I'm at peace with it. Okay. 0:40:13.120 --> 0:40:18.400 You talked about Augusta, Georgia and this rousing crowd. Generally speaking, 0:40:18.760 --> 0:40:23.000 who comes to see Ario Speedwagon. Is it fans from 0:40:23.080 --> 0:40:26.760 the seventies and eighties? Is it people who are younger? 0:40:26.920 --> 0:40:30.719 Is it very young people? And with that, it's one 0:40:30.760 --> 0:40:33.200 thing when you're headlining. You talked about being out with 0:40:33.280 --> 0:40:35.960 def Leppard. You've been on a number of package tours. 0:40:36.400 --> 0:40:39.120 What's it like when you play one of those gigs 0:40:39.320 --> 0:40:41.799 where the people in the audience might not have bought 0:40:41.840 --> 0:40:45.200 a ticket specifically to see you. 0:40:45.200 --> 0:40:51.360 You know, I take that as a it's a challenge, 0:40:51.640 --> 0:40:55.400 It's it's an adventure because it's a it's an opportunity 0:40:55.600 --> 0:40:59.240 to play for people, like you say, who didn't exactly 0:40:59.239 --> 0:41:02.200 buy the ticket to see you, So you have an 0:41:02.239 --> 0:41:06.800 opportunity to to spend you know, seventy five minutes with them, 0:41:06.840 --> 0:41:11.120 playing you know, your best songs and and and putting 0:41:11.160 --> 0:41:13.879 on you know, a seventy five minute show man. It's 0:41:13.960 --> 0:41:17.839 just compact. It's just like powerful, It's it never lets 0:41:17.920 --> 0:41:22.319 up and uh. And I think we've won over a 0:41:22.320 --> 0:41:26.759 lot of fans through the package tours that we've done. Uh. 0:41:27.760 --> 0:41:30.799 But when you know, when you but these shows, like 0:41:30.840 --> 0:41:34.280 I say, in Augusta and Charleston, just for an example, 0:41:34.360 --> 0:41:39.000 they were I think, you know, maybe four thousand seeds 0:41:39.040 --> 0:41:43.760 and I think Charleston was a little bit smaller. And 0:41:43.800 --> 0:41:47.400 then you walk out on stage and it's like, wait, 0:41:47.719 --> 0:41:51.799 everybody here bought a ticket to see us, you know, 0:41:52.480 --> 0:41:56.960 and uh and so it's like it's it's it's like 0:41:57.400 --> 0:42:02.720 hanging out with old friends, you know. And uh So, Uh, 0:42:02.000 --> 0:42:05.319 you know, Bob, I'll be honest with you, I like 0:42:05.920 --> 0:42:09.719 to play. I just like I just love doing it. 0:42:09.760 --> 0:42:13.719 I mean I'm doing a gig in I did one 0:42:14.239 --> 0:42:18.040 uh in Vegas a couple of months ago. My friend 0:42:18.160 --> 0:42:21.319 Kenny Aronoff, the great, the great drummer, Kenny r. They're 0:42:21.320 --> 0:42:24.560 one of the great drummers of all time. He he 0:42:24.560 --> 0:42:28.319 he is involved in this uh, this band. It's a 0:42:28.320 --> 0:42:30.719 long story. I won't go into it, but I ended up. 0:42:31.239 --> 0:42:34.120 Uh so I did this one show with them. They 0:42:34.200 --> 0:42:37.600 they've got a solid band and then they bring in 0:42:38.120 --> 0:42:44.480 uh this thing in Vegas, Billy Gibbons Vince Gill, Steven 0:42:44.560 --> 0:42:47.000 Stills and myself and each of us do four or 0:42:47.040 --> 0:42:49.799 five of our songs with this great band. And it's 0:42:49.880 --> 0:42:53.080 Jim Orsay, the guy who owns the Indianapolis Colts, has 0:42:53.120 --> 0:42:57.399 this amazing collection of memorabilia, and so he does these 0:42:57.440 --> 0:43:00.279 free shows. So I'm doing another one in Boss And 0:43:01.800 --> 0:43:04.759 in that show in Vegas, I got to sing a 0:43:04.880 --> 0:43:08.439 duet and almost cut my hair. This was a few 0:43:08.480 --> 0:43:14.000 weeks after David's passing. With Stephen Stills, who is I mean, 0:43:14.480 --> 0:43:18.200 anybody who reads my book, if I ever finish it, 0:43:18.239 --> 0:43:25.160 will will see my just my lifelong reverence and respect 0:43:25.200 --> 0:43:29.319 and admiration for Stephen Stills. He's just He's my hero, 0:43:29.560 --> 0:43:31.880 is all I can tell you. And so to be 0:43:31.920 --> 0:43:37.120 able to just to sing almost cut my hair with 0:43:37.160 --> 0:43:41.080 Stephen was just I was like I had to pinch myself. 0:43:41.120 --> 0:43:43.840 I couldn't believe it was actually happening. 0:43:51.480 --> 0:43:54.080 Okay, so at this point in time, and of course 0:43:54.080 --> 0:43:57.040 everything's a little screwed up because of the pandemic, But 0:43:57.360 --> 0:44:01.480 before then and after then, reo speed right yourself. How 0:44:01.480 --> 0:44:02.840 many dates a year do you work? 0:44:04.560 --> 0:44:09.800 We do? You know? Uh, somewhere probably around eighty five 0:44:10.120 --> 0:44:14.000 ish you know, if we're doing a big package tour, 0:44:14.120 --> 0:44:16.719 sometimes you have to play a little more because the 0:44:17.200 --> 0:44:21.360 you're carrying, you know, all the extra trucks and buses 0:44:21.400 --> 0:44:24.520 and you know, tech crew guys and everything. But uh 0:44:24.560 --> 0:44:27.239 but you know, I, you know, my wife and I 0:44:27.320 --> 0:44:30.839 kind of made a deal that I wouldn't be on 0:44:30.880 --> 0:44:34.319 the road more than I'm home. Uh and and uh 0:44:34.360 --> 0:44:37.320 and so we try to keep it, you know. Uh, 0:44:37.680 --> 0:44:41.320 we try to keep that. We do. We've been consistent 0:44:41.360 --> 0:44:44.520 with that for a long time now. So, but but 0:44:44.719 --> 0:44:47.279 we also like to spread it out over the whole year, 0:44:47.400 --> 0:44:50.200 so that so we keep the crew and and and 0:44:50.280 --> 0:44:53.319 uh so we keep the organism. We kind of keep 0:44:53.320 --> 0:44:55.320 the store opens as we say. 0:44:55.719 --> 0:44:55.799 So. 0:44:56.760 --> 0:44:59.040 Yeah, so so we can make it happen, you know, 0:44:59.080 --> 0:45:02.680 with you know, a eighty five shows a year. Everybody 0:45:02.719 --> 0:45:05.959 does great, you know, we can, we can pay the crew, 0:45:06.120 --> 0:45:12.040 everybody's everybody's happy, and we're not away from home too 0:45:12.760 --> 0:45:17.040 extremely much. So it's been working out well. Okay. 0:45:17.280 --> 0:45:20.400 In terms of transportation, in the sixties, bands went in 0:45:20.480 --> 0:45:25.200 station wagons. Then they win and win a bagos. Then 0:45:25.440 --> 0:45:28.960 the real goal was to fly commercial, which got you 0:45:29.080 --> 0:45:31.879 there faster, but eats up a lot of time. Then 0:45:31.960 --> 0:45:33.600 we have the era. Well I want to be big 0:45:33.719 --> 0:45:37.080 enough to have our own jet, and of course superstars 0:45:37.080 --> 0:45:39.759 at this point. You know, what people don't realize is 0:45:39.760 --> 0:45:43.120 they'll base themselves in one location and they'll fly out 0:45:43.440 --> 0:45:47.080 to different locations. But those are people who you know, 0:45:47.280 --> 0:45:50.640 were you know, there's a very thin layer of the axe. 0:45:50.680 --> 0:45:54.760 And yet there are household names who were traveling by bus. 0:45:55.719 --> 0:45:58.880 So there are a lot of people who don't understand 0:45:59.000 --> 0:46:01.239 that the bus is the period because you get off 0:46:01.280 --> 0:46:03.520 the road and there it is. You don't have to wait, 0:46:03.600 --> 0:46:06.680 you don't have to go anywhere. So how do you 0:46:06.760 --> 0:46:09.520 guys do it? And what's your experience been over history? 0:46:10.760 --> 0:46:14.279 Oh man, Well, you know the Ario has a rich 0:46:14.440 --> 0:46:22.799 history of aviation related high jinks and near missus and 0:46:23.040 --> 0:46:29.440 uh uh it's it's uh we we we started chartering 0:46:29.560 --> 0:46:33.680 a plane long before we could afford it. And uh 0:46:33.760 --> 0:46:36.920 and our mutual friend, uh Irving as off of course 0:46:36.920 --> 0:46:40.960 who was uh we were his first management client, as 0:46:41.000 --> 0:46:45.080 you know, and uh and so so Irving made a 0:46:45.120 --> 0:46:49.600 deal for for an airplane and and I remember thinking, 0:46:50.280 --> 0:46:51.920 and I didn't ask. I'm like, I'm not going to 0:46:51.960 --> 0:46:54.279 ask any questions, I don't know how we're affording this, 0:46:54.440 --> 0:46:57.400 but uh but but hey, we're on an airplane, and 0:46:57.520 --> 0:47:05.680 uh so, uh uh that ended up being that we'll 0:47:05.760 --> 0:47:10.240 put it this way. The in about three years after 0:47:10.320 --> 0:47:15.640 we uh left that airplane in an on an airstrip 0:47:15.840 --> 0:47:20.520 in Arkansas, the plane had lost its brakes and and 0:47:20.600 --> 0:47:23.319 our and our pilot had a gun one of the 0:47:23.360 --> 0:47:27.040 engines put the other engine in reverse and and put 0:47:27.080 --> 0:47:30.640 it into a forced tailspin. And of course I always 0:47:30.680 --> 0:47:33.360 used to like to sit in the rear portion of 0:47:33.400 --> 0:47:36.200 the plane. And on that particular day, we had a 0:47:36.920 --> 0:47:40.640 rolling stone reported by the name of John Swinson on 0:47:40.680 --> 0:47:43.319 the plane with us, and John and I got the 0:47:43.440 --> 0:47:47.080 right of our lights. The plane did did three full 0:47:47.760 --> 0:47:52.520 uh full spins on the in the in the grass. 0:47:52.560 --> 0:47:56.280 But uh so. Years later, I'm in a hotel actually 0:47:56.320 --> 0:48:00.440 here in Washington, d C. And some people knocked on 0:48:00.520 --> 0:48:02.239 my door. I don't know how they found my room, 0:48:02.239 --> 0:48:04.440 but there was a group outside. I looked at the people, 0:48:04.920 --> 0:48:10.280 and someone's holding up the book looked like an Encyclopedia 0:48:13.000 --> 0:48:17.239 school yearbook size book, and it said Department of Our 0:48:17.840 --> 0:48:22.560 Department of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms nineteen eighty two yearbook, 0:48:23.200 --> 0:48:26.600 and so I'm like, what's this? So I opened the door. 0:48:26.960 --> 0:48:30.800 They had opened to a page of a point of 0:48:30.880 --> 0:48:35.160 view from behind a squad car with agent atf agent's 0:48:35.840 --> 0:48:41.480 guns drawn aimed at in the distance, an airplane with 0:48:41.760 --> 0:48:46.800 the Areo speedwagon logo paines on the side. So, long 0:48:46.840 --> 0:48:51.839 story a little shorter. On our days off on the road, 0:48:52.600 --> 0:48:57.759 our plane was being used to do all kinds of 0:48:57.800 --> 0:49:00.279 things that we were not aware of, and so we 0:49:00.640 --> 0:49:06.480 we were the We were basically a cover for much 0:49:06.640 --> 0:49:11.239 illegal activity. So that's how we afforded the plane. I 0:49:11.239 --> 0:49:15.480 guess we didn't partake in any of the illegalities, but 0:49:15.719 --> 0:49:18.160 are we were a cover for it? I guess. 0:49:18.640 --> 0:49:21.279 Okay, So at this point in time, you know, it's 0:49:21.280 --> 0:49:22.759 not like you go, as you said, go on the 0:49:22.840 --> 0:49:25.200 road for sixty days straight, although sometimes you do a 0:49:25.239 --> 0:49:29.480 package tour. So are you traveling by bus to these gigs? 0:49:29.480 --> 0:49:31.920 Are you flying in and flying back to la? How 0:49:31.960 --> 0:49:32.479 does it work? 0:49:32.960 --> 0:49:36.200 Now? We fly into a to a major hub that 0:49:36.320 --> 0:49:41.719 the tour buses meet us there and and honestly, you know, 0:49:43.840 --> 0:49:46.719 you know, my friend Sammy Hagar's got a beautiful airplane 0:49:46.800 --> 0:49:49.879 and he always and that's just his thing, and he's 0:49:49.920 --> 0:49:51.920 in a position to be able to afford it, and 0:49:52.120 --> 0:49:57.520 and it's great, but the problem is you spend your 0:49:57.560 --> 0:50:01.200 whole day driving to the airport getting on the airplane, 0:50:01.360 --> 0:50:04.960 you know. So the beauty of tour buses, which is 0:50:05.000 --> 0:50:08.799 how we travel, is, you know, the gig's over, you 0:50:08.880 --> 0:50:11.480 get on the bus, watch a little TV. You know, 0:50:11.480 --> 0:50:14.920 there's cables, there's satellite TV and the bus. Then you 0:50:14.960 --> 0:50:17.600 go into your bunk, you know, read a little bit, 0:50:17.760 --> 0:50:22.200 listen to a Bob Lefts it's podcast, and and uh 0:50:22.640 --> 0:50:25.240 and uh and you uh and you get to sleep 0:50:25.520 --> 0:50:28.040 and then when you wake up, you're in the next 0:50:28.080 --> 0:50:31.880 city and you can do things you can you know, 0:50:32.000 --> 0:50:33.840 go to the gym, take a walk, you know. I 0:50:34.520 --> 0:50:39.640 always like to walk around whatever city we're playing on 0:50:39.719 --> 0:50:42.440 the afternoon before the show. I just kind of soak 0:50:42.560 --> 0:50:45.839 up some of the vibe of what's going on in 0:50:45.880 --> 0:50:50.359 that city. And uh. And then you know, I bring 0:50:50.440 --> 0:50:52.800 that with me on stage and I just feel a 0:50:52.840 --> 0:50:55.160 little bit closer to the audience that way. So I'm 0:50:55.480 --> 0:50:58.759 I'm cool traveling by by tour bus. But I do 0:50:58.920 --> 0:51:01.000 like the nights that we get to sleep in a 0:51:01.040 --> 0:51:03.920 real bed, So I will enjoy my evening tonight. 0:51:04.040 --> 0:51:06.920 Okay, so we started that earlier. You talked about a 0:51:07.040 --> 0:51:09.040 day room and then you talked about being in this 0:51:09.080 --> 0:51:13.799 great hotel. Do you essentially get a hotel every day? Yeah, 0:51:13.800 --> 0:51:16.480 we get a hotel every day. Some I mean sometimes 0:51:16.760 --> 0:51:19.319 you know, you know, I'm I'm a. 0:51:19.320 --> 0:51:24.439 Late sleeper, and so I by the time I get 0:51:24.440 --> 0:51:28.960 off the bus, I'm in the room for maybe four 0:51:29.000 --> 0:51:32.040 hours and then I got to you know, check out again. 0:51:32.160 --> 0:51:34.560 So so that becomes a little bit of a burn 0:51:34.600 --> 0:51:36.239 because you got to bring out, you know, you got 0:51:36.280 --> 0:51:38.000 to open up all your luggage. I mean, it takes 0:51:38.040 --> 0:51:40.799 me from the time I walk into my hotel room 0:51:41.200 --> 0:51:45.600 until the time it's all set up to my specifications. 0:51:46.000 --> 0:51:49.560 You know, it's a good half hour process. Just like 0:51:50.080 --> 0:51:53.319 you know, put your suitcase here, you put your computers there, 0:51:53.480 --> 0:51:55.600 your toiletries are in the bathroom. You know, I just 0:51:55.719 --> 0:52:02.960 like to make make my environment feel somewhat familiar. But 0:52:03.080 --> 0:52:05.160 on those day room days, yeah, well you know, they're 0:52:05.239 --> 0:52:07.600 three or four hours and then we're off to the gig. 0:52:07.719 --> 0:52:10.160 But then on the days off, you know, we get 0:52:10.200 --> 0:52:13.200 to have a nice day and and uh, you know, 0:52:13.840 --> 0:52:17.359 nice dinner in a restaurant somewhere or whatever. And so 0:52:17.440 --> 0:52:19.719 that that's what that's what today will be. 0:52:21.040 --> 0:52:25.399 And to what degreed? Can you travel freely? Or you recognized? 0:52:26.800 --> 0:52:27.120 You know what? 0:52:27.520 --> 0:52:34.160 Uh I'm I'm recognized on a pretty regular basis, but normally, 0:52:34.440 --> 0:52:38.239 you know, if it's just on the street or you know, 0:52:38.239 --> 0:52:45.400 there's hey, everybody's different, you know, every person has a different, uh, 0:52:45.560 --> 0:52:49.439 you know, way of of approaching you know you and 0:52:49.440 --> 0:52:52.880 and you know as a uh you know, I'm I'm 0:52:52.960 --> 0:52:58.920 I'm so lucky that I that my music uh affects 0:52:58.960 --> 0:53:02.960 people in such a way that they want to they 0:53:03.040 --> 0:53:06.600 just want to. I don't quite understand it, but that's 0:53:06.640 --> 0:53:09.360 how I felt about Steven Stills. I just I just 0:53:09.400 --> 0:53:11.640 wanted to meet him because I love his music so 0:53:11.760 --> 0:53:16.040 much that that I feel like that's a connection between 0:53:16.520 --> 0:53:19.760 between him and me, even though you know, he didn't 0:53:19.760 --> 0:53:21.440 know who I was. You know, I was, I was 0:53:21.480 --> 0:53:26.280 a kid and uh so, so I I understand that feeling, 0:53:26.480 --> 0:53:30.960 and and so I try to be as as accommodating 0:53:31.000 --> 0:53:34.879 as possible. The things that I don't tolerate is when 0:53:35.120 --> 0:53:39.040 someone is drunk and they and they and now they 0:53:39.080 --> 0:53:42.839 want to come up to me and it's just that 0:53:42.880 --> 0:53:46.120 doesn't work, you know. But if but if if people 0:53:46.239 --> 0:53:51.120 are are and usually people are usually people are really cool, 0:53:51.280 --> 0:53:55.440 just really respectful. Just want to say, you know what, man, 0:53:55.600 --> 0:53:57.920 you know, your your music means a lot to me. 0:53:58.080 --> 0:54:00.680 And and and we played your song at our wedding 0:54:01.000 --> 0:54:05.080 and thanks, you know, and I'm like, you're welcome. That's awesome, 0:54:05.239 --> 0:54:07.560 you know, I mean, who doesn't want to hear that? 0:54:07.960 --> 0:54:08.160 You know? 0:54:09.640 --> 0:54:14.920 Okay, So to what degree does Rio Speedwagon mean anything 0:54:15.000 --> 0:54:18.120 outside the United States? And to what degree have you 0:54:18.280 --> 0:54:20.440 toured outside the United States? 0:54:20.840 --> 0:54:23.680 Well, we you know, well I will tell you this. 0:54:23.960 --> 0:54:27.560 We we did a really made a really dumb decision. 0:54:27.760 --> 0:54:33.640 In nineteen eighty one, we were offered a huge European tour. 0:54:33.719 --> 0:54:36.879 We had toured the States, you know, sold out stadiums. 0:54:37.360 --> 0:54:40.960 We went to Japan, you know, did multiple nights at 0:54:41.000 --> 0:54:46.640 Budu Khan and toured the country. And by late nineteen 0:54:46.680 --> 0:54:49.759 eighty one, that was when the European leg of the 0:54:49.800 --> 0:54:56.040 tour was supposed to happen, and we just didn't do it. 0:54:56.840 --> 0:55:01.560 And it was looking back that that was a dumb thing, 0:55:01.680 --> 0:55:06.239 because you know what I've come to understand about uh, 0:55:06.680 --> 0:55:09.960 European music fans an. You know, this is a generalization, 0:55:10.080 --> 0:55:14.400 of course, but that if you if American bands come 0:55:14.480 --> 0:55:19.560 there when they're at their peak and tour, those bands 0:55:19.600 --> 0:55:24.760 can come back to Europe forever and and people will. 0:55:25.080 --> 0:55:29.319 People are loyal, the fans in your European fans are 0:55:29.560 --> 0:55:34.840 just loyal. If you don't come there at your peak, 0:55:35.040 --> 0:55:37.879 and now you're not at your peak anymore, and now 0:55:37.920 --> 0:55:40.640 you want to go over to Europe and play, it's 0:55:40.719 --> 0:55:43.359 a it's a it's a tougher hill to climb, I'll 0:55:43.400 --> 0:55:46.719 tell you. But but but but we you know, we 0:55:47.080 --> 0:55:50.480 you know, luckily, we we did go back there after 0:55:50.480 --> 0:55:54.480 the wheels are turning tour. We toured Europe and so 0:55:54.640 --> 0:55:57.480 you know, we go back there every few years. We've 0:55:57.840 --> 0:55:59.880 you know, we've been to Japan a few times. We 0:56:00.480 --> 0:56:03.640 did a little tour of New Zealand right before the 0:56:03.640 --> 0:56:08.120 pandemic with Huey Lewis and Melissa Etheridge. We just played 0:56:08.520 --> 0:56:11.720 a few festivals in New Zealand and it was awesome. 0:56:11.840 --> 0:56:16.560 I mean it was just a great experience. And uh so, yeah, 0:56:16.719 --> 0:56:18.480 you know, I like to see new places. You know, 0:56:18.560 --> 0:56:23.000 we're we're we're tossing around an Australian tour, which we've 0:56:23.040 --> 0:56:29.000 never done. So but there's also something nice about being 0:56:29.400 --> 0:56:32.520 home too, you know, being not having to show a 0:56:32.600 --> 0:56:36.920 passport and and just knowing that there's a little safety 0:56:37.040 --> 0:56:41.719 and you know, I feel more connected to home, you know, 0:56:41.800 --> 0:56:46.360 and and for me it's really important to feel connected 0:56:46.400 --> 0:56:51.720 to home. Lisa bought me up a little a little 0:56:53.040 --> 0:56:57.279 pendant right before I left, and and it's uh and 0:56:57.360 --> 0:57:00.600 I love it. It's just a little shame. Well, I 0:57:00.600 --> 0:57:03.040 guess people can't see it, but there's an anchor at 0:57:03.040 --> 0:57:06.600 the end of it, and it's like, and I never 0:57:06.640 --> 0:57:11.200 tell well, this is my New Zealand. The thing that 0:57:11.239 --> 0:57:14.960 I wear constantly given to us by a maori u, 0:57:15.960 --> 0:57:19.480 a spiritual guy. I don't know. I guess it was 0:57:19.480 --> 0:57:21.880 a priest, a Maui priest. And then this little anchor, 0:57:22.200 --> 0:57:24.560 and so it's like, that's my anchor. You know, home 0:57:24.680 --> 0:57:25.320 is my anchor. 0:57:26.840 --> 0:57:31.320 Okay, since you've been on the road for decades, what's 0:57:31.360 --> 0:57:34.200 the best hotel you were ever at? What's not? If 0:57:34.240 --> 0:57:35.920 I said you we get to go to one, what 0:57:35.960 --> 0:57:36.520 would that be? 0:57:37.320 --> 0:57:40.240 Well, I'll tell you what. This one right here would 0:57:40.320 --> 0:57:44.800 be high on my list for sure. The you know, 0:57:44.880 --> 0:57:48.560 there's there's the Townsend in Birmingham, Michigan, outside of Detroit. 0:57:48.640 --> 0:57:51.480 That's in a great spot. I'm trying to think of 0:57:51.880 --> 0:58:02.080 like a someplace. Oh man, I can't there's there. I'm not. 0:58:02.520 --> 0:58:02.840 I'm not. 0:58:02.880 --> 0:58:05.200 I'm not thinking of like one. If you asked me 0:58:05.280 --> 0:58:08.360 for a venue, you know, I would, you know, it's like. 0:58:08.920 --> 0:58:12.680 Okay, agree, that's that's interesting to switch it to a venue. 0:58:13.120 --> 0:58:15.080 If I if I say there are three venues you 0:58:15.080 --> 0:58:16.160 can play, what are those? 0:58:16.560 --> 0:58:20.960 Well, the first one is Red Rocks without even without 0:58:20.960 --> 0:58:24.000 even having to think twice, Red Rocks is just just 0:58:24.320 --> 0:58:27.680 from uh well, first of all, I have a picture 0:58:28.200 --> 0:58:31.000 of it. It's one of my first memories of life 0:58:31.240 --> 0:58:33.960 of my mom and I. My dad took the picture 0:58:34.480 --> 0:58:37.160 up at the top of the you know, with with 0:58:37.240 --> 0:58:40.600 the Amphitheater of Red Rocks in the in the background, 0:58:40.640 --> 0:58:42.840 when I was two and a half years old. And 0:58:43.040 --> 0:58:45.200 you know who who would have thunk that that my 0:58:45.440 --> 0:58:48.400 history with Red Rocks would be? I think we I 0:58:48.440 --> 0:58:52.320 think we've played there seven times and and uh the 0:58:53.160 --> 0:58:56.320 place has been sold out everyone. And what's great about 0:58:56.320 --> 0:59:00.240 red Rocks is not only the natural amphitheater and the 0:59:00.280 --> 0:59:03.600 beauty of the of the area that you're in, but 0:59:03.920 --> 0:59:08.040 in the dressing room area, there's a they have a 0:59:08.200 --> 0:59:12.880 mural of every everyone that's ever played there, starting in 0:59:13.000 --> 0:59:16.320 I think it opened in the early nineteen hundreds, and 0:59:16.800 --> 0:59:19.520 so you can look at this at this thing and 0:59:19.840 --> 0:59:24.120 it's like a history of music, you know, from from classical, 0:59:24.280 --> 0:59:26.960 you know, through the you know, the big band era 0:59:27.200 --> 0:59:30.160 and the frank Sinatra area, and then all of a sudden, 0:59:30.640 --> 0:59:34.280 the British invasion happens and you know could and yeah, 0:59:34.320 --> 0:59:37.360 there was like a Beach Boys Frankie Valley in the 0:59:37.400 --> 0:59:41.560 Four Seasons period. So you can really just document how 0:59:41.680 --> 0:59:44.720 music has changed over the years. It's really it's a 0:59:44.720 --> 0:59:51.240 beautiful venue that that's my favorite. Everybody should at some 0:59:51.640 --> 0:59:54.840 at some point in their life when when your favorite 0:59:54.840 --> 1:00:00.000 band plays Red Rocks, fly to Denver and go see them, 1:00:00.480 --> 1:00:03.600 because to see your favorite band at Red Rocks, that's 1:00:03.640 --> 1:00:05.800 that's a that's a bucket list for everybody. 1:00:05.840 --> 1:00:09.040 I would say, let's go back a chapter. You talk 1:00:09.160 --> 1:00:14.040 about believing that if you had hit records, your life 1:00:14.080 --> 1:00:18.560 would work, which raises the question to what degree were 1:00:18.600 --> 1:00:23.280 you driven. What people don't understand is how impossibly hard 1:00:23.320 --> 1:00:27.640 it is to make it. I mean it's just you know, 1:00:28.240 --> 1:00:30.520 athletes you can kind of say, well they have this 1:00:30.680 --> 1:00:33.560 skill or whatever, whereas in musicians it's not even like 1:00:33.600 --> 1:00:39.440 there's a roadmap. How driven were you to be successful? 1:00:39.480 --> 1:00:43.680 And how successful, well, you know I was. I was 1:00:43.800 --> 1:00:48.080 highly motivated, I would say. And then when I met 1:00:48.120 --> 1:00:52.520 Gary Richrath, the late great Gary Richrath, who, by the way, 1:00:53.560 --> 1:00:55.800 if I if I might, if I might, if I 1:00:55.880 --> 1:01:01.960 made divert for a moment, Gary Richrath belongs in the 1:01:02.000 --> 1:01:07.520 conversation of the great rock guitarists of all time, and 1:01:07.640 --> 1:01:12.760 he's never mentioned in that conversation. And it's I feel 1:01:12.800 --> 1:01:18.520 like it's a it's a uh, it's just not right. Gary. Uh. 1:01:18.720 --> 1:01:23.160 Gary was a stone cold rock star. He the way 1:01:23.200 --> 1:01:26.400 he played the guitar. I mean, I wouldn't call him 1:01:26.400 --> 1:01:30.120 a virtuoso. I'm the guitar. There's no one Anario Speedwagon 1:01:30.160 --> 1:01:34.800 who's a virtuoso. That's not what we do. I'll leave 1:01:34.840 --> 1:01:38.000 that for for for Lucather, you know, and and and 1:01:38.920 --> 1:01:41.160 you know Luke is just you know, one of my favorites. 1:01:41.200 --> 1:01:44.960 But anyway, but Gary, man, if you think back the 1:01:45.000 --> 1:01:49.320 way he held that those less Pauls. He just he 1:01:49.600 --> 1:01:53.920 caressed them, he danced with them. He that he became 1:01:54.120 --> 1:01:58.320 one with that instrument. Uh And and his stage presence 1:01:58.440 --> 1:02:03.080 was so magnetic that he could literally stand on stage 1:02:03.720 --> 1:02:07.120 and with he wasn't a singer, he didn't even have 1:02:07.160 --> 1:02:09.800 a vocal mic. He just stood on stage. We all 1:02:09.840 --> 1:02:12.400 went back to the dressing room and you know, had 1:02:12.400 --> 1:02:15.200 a snack, and he stood out there in front of 1:02:15.400 --> 1:02:20.280 twenty thousand and fifty thousand people and held them transfixed 1:02:20.400 --> 1:02:25.560 for like a ten minute instrumental solo electric guitar with 1:02:26.400 --> 1:02:30.720 a Les paul a coil cord plugged directly into a 1:02:30.760 --> 1:02:34.480 Marshall stack and a wah wah pedal in between, and 1:02:34.520 --> 1:02:38.880 that's it. And this guy, man, he was amazing. But 1:02:39.720 --> 1:02:44.360 when I met him in nineteen seventy two, I found 1:02:45.480 --> 1:02:50.280 someone who was equally as driven as I was, which 1:02:50.360 --> 1:02:56.920 I'd never experienced before. And you know, and together, I 1:02:56.960 --> 1:02:59.320 mean we were you know, we were chalk and cheese 1:02:59.360 --> 1:03:04.880 and so many but but together when you know, when 1:03:05.000 --> 1:03:09.400 when we finally kind of figured it out and it 1:03:09.440 --> 1:03:12.680 didn't last long, it was you know, it was two 1:03:12.840 --> 1:03:15.000 you know, kind of two ships passing in the night 1:03:15.280 --> 1:03:20.200 ish but for those few years between seventy eight and 1:03:20.840 --> 1:03:25.280 you know, eighty two. Man, we were just firing on 1:03:25.320 --> 1:03:30.960 all cylinders. It was just working. And and I'm I'm 1:03:31.000 --> 1:03:35.880 so thankful, so grateful that my life that I just 1:03:36.080 --> 1:03:38.600 it was so lucky. The way I met rich Rath 1:03:38.880 --> 1:03:43.960 was it was just so lucky. It it it came 1:03:44.120 --> 1:03:47.760 from my drive, I will say that. But still, you know, 1:03:47.800 --> 1:03:50.800 having drive is important. You also got to get lucky. 1:03:50.960 --> 1:03:56.840 And you know, I've had so many instances, and you know, 1:03:56.880 --> 1:03:59.840 when you write a book, you kind of relive your 1:03:59.840 --> 1:04:02.880 life life, and you know, you go, you know, when 1:04:03.000 --> 1:04:07.040 something happens, you don't know the you know, the significance 1:04:07.160 --> 1:04:10.120 that it might have. You know, when you're when you 1:04:10.200 --> 1:04:14.240 look at your life in retrospect and I go, there's 1:04:14.360 --> 1:04:17.680 just too many times where I just happen to be 1:04:18.080 --> 1:04:19.960 in the talk about it, in the right place, at 1:04:20.000 --> 1:04:25.040 the right time, and I'm just I'm just so thankful 1:04:25.120 --> 1:04:27.640 for that. I'm just so so grateful for it. And 1:04:27.880 --> 1:04:29.480 you know, then of course you got to be ready 1:04:29.480 --> 1:04:31.560 for the luck when it hits, you know, And I 1:04:31.600 --> 1:04:34.880 guess I got to take credit for that side of it, 1:04:34.920 --> 1:04:39.080 because you know, I'm Bob, I there's a lot of 1:04:39.120 --> 1:04:42.600 people who want to be in rock bands, a lot 1:04:42.680 --> 1:04:44.640 of people who want to be famous, a lot of 1:04:44.640 --> 1:04:47.880 people who you know, want to be a star. And 1:04:47.920 --> 1:04:53.040 then there are those of us who need it. It's 1:04:53.080 --> 1:04:57.040 like it's like survival. It's like, I don't know what 1:04:57.360 --> 1:05:01.760 would have happened to me if, if, if, if, if 1:05:01.800 --> 1:05:04.360 my life hadn't worked out the way it did. I I, 1:05:06.000 --> 1:05:09.160 you know, I have nightmares about, you know, what would 1:05:09.160 --> 1:05:15.439 have happened. And uh so I'm thankful every day every 1:05:15.480 --> 1:05:19.600 time I walk out on stage. I I just have this, 1:05:20.880 --> 1:05:24.360 uh this feeling that I'm going to give this audience 1:05:24.680 --> 1:05:28.960 every freaking ounce of my energy tonight. And and because 1:05:28.960 --> 1:05:33.600 I'm so lucky that people are willing to spend their 1:05:33.600 --> 1:05:37.120 hard earned money to come and and and hear our 1:05:37.160 --> 1:05:40.160 songs and hear us perform them. You know, I never 1:05:40.240 --> 1:05:41.200 take that for granted. 1:05:48.160 --> 1:05:50.920 Rich Rath was in the band, he's unfortunately no longer 1:05:50.920 --> 1:05:53.560 with us, but then he was out of the band. 1:05:53.960 --> 1:05:57.480 What happened there, well, that's you know, that's a. 1:05:59.160 --> 1:06:01.720 Lot of what my book because about. Honestly, that about 1:06:01.720 --> 1:06:04.920 the relationship between Gary and I, because it was it 1:06:04.960 --> 1:06:09.320 was it was definitely Uh, you know, as Ash as 1:06:09.440 --> 1:06:14.480 Keith Richards famously said, a love hate relationship, Uh he 1:06:14.560 --> 1:06:20.520 loves me, I hate him. And you know, and Gary 1:06:20.560 --> 1:06:23.880 and I were we were you know, you hear the 1:06:23.920 --> 1:06:28.240 stories of the lead singer, lead guitar player things, you know, 1:06:28.400 --> 1:06:31.800 from from Tyler and Perry to Page and Plant. And 1:06:31.840 --> 1:06:34.680 not that I'm comparing Gary and I to either of 1:06:34.720 --> 1:06:40.240 those those amazing duos, but inasmuch as we were, we 1:06:40.320 --> 1:06:43.640 loved each other like brothers, and we fought like brothers, 1:06:43.840 --> 1:06:48.200 and we both wanted what was best for the band. 1:06:48.680 --> 1:06:51.840 We just didn't always agree on what that was. But 1:06:52.440 --> 1:06:55.440 like I say, for those for that for that period, 1:06:55.480 --> 1:06:58.880 there those few years where it was just really firing 1:06:58.920 --> 1:07:03.680 on all cylinders. Uh, that was that was something special. 1:07:04.560 --> 1:07:09.440 And I mean, how can I how can I how 1:07:09.480 --> 1:07:12.760 can I say? How can I answer your question in 1:07:12.880 --> 1:07:16.520 a with with without a book? I guess you know, 1:07:16.680 --> 1:07:20.760 if you look at at artists or as lead singer 1:07:20.800 --> 1:07:26.800 guitarist combos, as they're each a piece of sand paper 1:07:27.320 --> 1:07:30.600 and and and there. So there's the there's this friction 1:07:30.800 --> 1:07:35.360 that happens when when they come together, and those sparks 1:07:35.680 --> 1:07:40.840 are something that would not happen without each other, and 1:07:40.840 --> 1:07:45.080 and and uh, you know, my songs definitely needed a 1:07:45.600 --> 1:07:48.920 shot of Rich Rath rock and roll energy, and his 1:07:49.120 --> 1:07:53.680 songs needed a shot of my singer songwriter uh, you know, 1:07:54.000 --> 1:07:58.960 kind of folk singer energy. And at some point, uh, 1:07:59.760 --> 1:08:04.120 the s and paper wasn't the sparks weren't flying anymore, 1:08:05.280 --> 1:08:13.080 and I and I saw it happen, and I I 1:08:13.280 --> 1:08:18.960 tried my best. I probably could have tried harder in retrospect, 1:08:19.520 --> 1:08:27.040 but I finally just got to the point where I 1:08:27.080 --> 1:08:30.960 had a conversation with Gary, who had been my musical 1:08:31.000 --> 1:08:35.400 partner for this was nineteen eighty nine, so since nineteen 1:08:35.680 --> 1:08:39.600 on and off since nineteen seventy two, and I just 1:08:40.240 --> 1:08:47.320 told him that I couldn't do it anymore. And and 1:08:47.400 --> 1:08:49.519 I couldn't you know that there was a there was 1:08:49.520 --> 1:08:53.920 an Rio album on the horizon, and I, you know, 1:08:54.479 --> 1:08:57.000 this is after I had met Stephen Stills and we'd 1:08:57.040 --> 1:09:00.400 written a song together, and I had this side project, 1:09:00.960 --> 1:09:04.240 you know, a ten piece band with horns and background singers, 1:09:04.280 --> 1:09:07.720 you know, called the Strolling Dudes, that that played out 1:09:07.720 --> 1:09:12.200 of trencas and played little bars around l A and 1:09:12.200 --> 1:09:16.320 and but with amazing musicians. I mean Graham Lear on drums, 1:09:17.280 --> 1:09:21.760 Ricky brown On on trumpet, Steve Grove on sacks, got 1:09:21.840 --> 1:09:27.120 guys that, uh, you know that were just just amazing musicians, 1:09:27.680 --> 1:09:30.680 including Bruce Hall, the bass player from Ario. He was 1:09:30.720 --> 1:09:34.439 a member of the Dudes too. Uh. And so then 1:09:34.720 --> 1:09:37.840 the thought I was having so much fun just being 1:09:38.120 --> 1:09:43.439 free and playing you know, different, I wrote different types 1:09:43.479 --> 1:09:47.280 of songs and and I just felt like, uh, and 1:09:47.320 --> 1:09:50.519 then the thought of going back in the studio for 1:09:50.560 --> 1:09:55.639 another Ario Speedwagon record just felt like, oh boy, okay, 1:09:55.680 --> 1:09:58.759 here we go. It just it just I wasn't excited 1:09:58.800 --> 1:10:01.480 about it. I wasn't in spa aired about it, and 1:10:01.479 --> 1:10:05.640 and and part of it was that, you know, the 1:10:06.080 --> 1:10:10.800 partnership between Gary and I just wasn't wasn't it wasn't 1:10:10.840 --> 1:10:13.679 firing on all cylinders, and it was it was actually 1:10:13.840 --> 1:10:21.160 a little bit of a drag. And so that's what happened. Honestly, 1:10:22.840 --> 1:10:28.200 I never thought that that Gary's hiatus Fromario Speedwagon would 1:10:28.240 --> 1:10:31.200 be permanent. I thought it would be like mine, you know, 1:10:31.920 --> 1:10:34.120 you know, I got kicked out of the band in 1:10:34.680 --> 1:10:39.280 nineteen seventy three. Took a couple of years to figure 1:10:39.560 --> 1:10:42.960 out some things that I needed to figure out about 1:10:43.000 --> 1:10:47.439 myself and when I got back in the band, it 1:10:47.520 --> 1:10:50.400 was better than ever. So that's kind of what I 1:10:50.560 --> 1:10:54.920 thought would happen with Gary, but it never did. And 1:10:56.160 --> 1:11:02.320 you know, God, you know, I uh, you know, I 1:11:02.360 --> 1:11:04.800 look back and I go, man, you know, could I 1:11:04.800 --> 1:11:08.360 have tried harder? Could I have What is there more 1:11:08.400 --> 1:11:11.640 that I that I could have done to help the situation? 1:11:12.360 --> 1:11:18.160 And you know, you always look at things that way 1:11:18.240 --> 1:11:21.439 in the rear view mirror. But at the time, Uh, 1:11:22.439 --> 1:11:25.280 I was just I was just out of gas, man, 1:11:25.479 --> 1:11:27.799 I just I just couldn't do it anymore. 1:11:29.000 --> 1:11:32.360 And to what degree was he resentful? And to what 1:11:32.439 --> 1:11:35.599 degree did you have any contact for the ensuing decades? 1:11:35.680 --> 1:11:38.439 Ultimately you played a couple of you know times on 1:11:38.520 --> 1:11:42.720 stage with you long after this incident, But was it 1:11:42.840 --> 1:11:45.840 pretty much final and you had no contact? And was 1:11:45.880 --> 1:11:46.759 he pissed off? 1:11:48.280 --> 1:11:50.519 You know, that's a good question, Bob. We we had, 1:11:51.000 --> 1:11:56.320 we had occasional contact, and uh, you know, Gary came 1:11:56.360 --> 1:12:00.479 out to some shows when we played the old Universal 1:12:00.479 --> 1:12:03.320 Amphitheater in LA and just sat in on a couple 1:12:03.320 --> 1:12:08.680 of songs. And you know, the way Ario Speedwagon has 1:12:08.720 --> 1:12:11.880 always worked is that you know, there have been a 1:12:11.960 --> 1:12:15.320 number of people in the band. You know, I'm one 1:12:15.360 --> 1:12:21.960 of three lead singers, you know, and even crew guys, 1:12:22.040 --> 1:12:24.759 and anyone who's ever been in the band is always welcome. 1:12:24.920 --> 1:12:27.280 It's like, oh yeah, well yeah he was. He was 1:12:27.320 --> 1:12:30.400 my guitar tech and you know, nineteen seventy seven. Yeah, 1:12:30.720 --> 1:12:32.479 give him a pass, get him in here, you know. 1:12:33.920 --> 1:12:39.000 So so there was there was that Gary and I 1:12:39.040 --> 1:12:44.720 had a couple of soulful conversations over those years. Uh 1:12:44.960 --> 1:12:48.840 and and they always kind of ended in the same 1:12:48.920 --> 1:12:54.120 way where uh, you know, I would I would just 1:12:54.280 --> 1:12:59.880 try to motivate him and and and inspire him in 1:13:00.160 --> 1:13:04.439 some way. Uh and in it Uh, it just never 1:13:04.880 --> 1:13:10.680 never quite happened. But he was never he never expressed. 1:13:11.800 --> 1:13:14.960 I mean, the last time that I saw him was 1:13:15.080 --> 1:13:18.439 at a benefit show that we did in Illinois for 1:13:18.439 --> 1:13:22.759 for that horrible uh tornado that that came through Washington, 1:13:22.800 --> 1:13:26.120 Illinois and just decimated the town. It was right near 1:13:26.160 --> 1:13:29.759 where Gary grew up, and uh, and he had moved 1:13:29.800 --> 1:13:32.160 back there. He had moved back to Peoria, which I 1:13:32.200 --> 1:13:34.439 thought was gonna be great for him, you know, get 1:13:34.439 --> 1:13:37.920 out of la get out of the shadow of Ario speedwagon, 1:13:38.040 --> 1:13:40.799 you know, come back to the Midwest where everybody loves 1:13:40.840 --> 1:13:45.960 you and knows you. And so he came out to 1:13:45.960 --> 1:13:49.559 to to that show and and we were able to 1:13:51.320 --> 1:13:56.439 we just had a moment and and I didn't sense 1:13:56.720 --> 1:14:01.640 I didn't sense any anger. I sensed I sent some sadness. 1:14:01.960 --> 1:14:06.080 You know. We looked into each other's eyes right before 1:14:06.120 --> 1:14:10.280 we went on stage, and there was a there was 1:14:10.360 --> 1:14:13.280 definitely a certain sadness there. I felt it too, and 1:14:13.680 --> 1:14:16.439 I know he did. And uh, you know, the thing 1:14:16.560 --> 1:14:20.760 is that the band has had such a resurgence over 1:14:20.800 --> 1:14:28.040 the past I don't know, fifteen twenty years that and 1:14:28.520 --> 1:14:30.760 none of this would have happened without Gary. You know, 1:14:30.840 --> 1:14:34.400 he was he was the guy that got Ario Speedwagon signed. 1:14:34.600 --> 1:14:39.599 You know, Irving Irving saw Gary Richrath and and he 1:14:39.720 --> 1:14:43.559 was like he knew Irving knows a star when he 1:14:43.600 --> 1:14:48.680 sees one. And and and so you know, I just 1:14:49.920 --> 1:14:54.759 it's a bummer that Gary is not here, that hasn't 1:14:54.760 --> 1:14:57.479 been here for the past twenty years of the of 1:14:57.520 --> 1:15:02.240 this resurgence of the band. Now, maybe the band wouldn't 1:15:02.280 --> 1:15:05.280 have had a resurgence if Gary was there, But I 1:15:05.320 --> 1:15:07.960 always hoped that getting away from it for a while, 1:15:08.040 --> 1:15:11.479 maybe he'd you know, as I did when I was 1:15:11.520 --> 1:15:15.559 out of the band, bottom out and realized that, you know, 1:15:16.120 --> 1:15:18.559 you want your gig back, you know, That's what happened 1:15:18.560 --> 1:15:21.120 to me. I went and saw him. There was a 1:15:21.160 --> 1:15:23.320 show in West Palm Beach now just happened to be 1:15:23.400 --> 1:15:25.439 in town, and I showed up the dressing room, and 1:15:26.040 --> 1:15:28.960 you know, hadn't seen the guys in a couple of years, 1:15:29.720 --> 1:15:33.720 and it was like old times. And I watched the 1:15:33.760 --> 1:15:38.280 show from the stage right wing. And the guy who 1:15:38.320 --> 1:15:44.639 replaced me, Mike Murphy, champagne guy, extremely talented, like great 1:15:46.040 --> 1:15:50.000 blues and R and B singer played, played a good guitar, 1:15:50.280 --> 1:15:54.479 good piano. But I watched it, man, and I'm like, 1:15:56.320 --> 1:15:58.960 it didn't seem like a Reo speedwagon, you know, with 1:15:59.479 --> 1:16:02.680 Murphy's as good as he is, you know, it was 1:16:02.840 --> 1:16:07.320 just such a stylistic mismatch. And I was like, wait 1:16:07.360 --> 1:16:10.920 a minute, that was my gig and I let it 1:16:10.960 --> 1:16:14.120 slip away, and I want it back, and I'm gonna, 1:16:14.240 --> 1:16:16.439 I'm gonna. I don't know how it's gonna happen, but 1:16:17.240 --> 1:16:20.840 uh it did. And uh so that's what I thought 1:16:20.840 --> 1:16:25.360 would happened with Gary, and it just didn't happen. 1:16:25.520 --> 1:16:29.080 And yeah, okay, tell us a little bit more about 1:16:29.120 --> 1:16:31.320 how you got kicked out and how you got back in. 1:16:32.680 --> 1:16:35.000 I knew when I said kicked out that that you would. 1:16:35.240 --> 1:16:37.479 I never knew you were kicked out. I thought you left. 1:16:37.520 --> 1:16:38.880 But now since you brought it. 1:16:38.920 --> 1:16:43.960 Up, well, you know, yeah, I always kind of described 1:16:44.000 --> 1:16:47.880 it as, uh as that we had the creative differences 1:16:47.920 --> 1:16:50.880 arose during the during the recording of the Ride and 1:16:50.920 --> 1:16:55.040 the Starmut album, uh, which led to me leaving the band. 1:16:56.320 --> 1:17:03.680 That's not false, but uh, but really what happened was, 1:17:03.880 --> 1:17:08.120 you know, I you know, I had always played in 1:17:08.160 --> 1:17:10.960 the bands before Ario Speedwagon that I played in, you know, 1:17:11.320 --> 1:17:14.160 like my band in like high school and early college. 1:17:14.400 --> 1:17:18.040 We we had way more in common with Buffalo Springfield 1:17:18.439 --> 1:17:21.439 than we did with Deep Purple, you know. And so 1:17:21.520 --> 1:17:24.000 when I joined and I was never a lead singer. 1:17:24.040 --> 1:17:26.960 I was always just one of the I you know, 1:17:27.000 --> 1:17:29.680 I'd sing lead on some songs, but we all my 1:17:29.760 --> 1:17:33.599 band always had three singers with three part harmony, and 1:17:33.880 --> 1:17:38.320 so that's what I was used to. So when when, uh, 1:17:38.520 --> 1:17:41.599 when I went out and saw Ario Speedwagon after I 1:17:41.640 --> 1:17:45.600 met Gary, uh, I was like, wow, I got to 1:17:45.640 --> 1:17:48.720 sing every song? How's that going to And they were loud, man, 1:17:48.800 --> 1:17:53.080 these guys played loud. So I ended up having vocal 1:17:53.120 --> 1:17:58.560 problems and uh uh you know, I went to a 1:17:58.800 --> 1:18:02.440 doctor and Champagne kind of on the sly and he 1:18:02.439 --> 1:18:06.640 he diagnosed a nodule on my left vocal cord and 1:18:06.720 --> 1:18:10.600 said that the only way to cure it was to 1:18:11.320 --> 1:18:16.519 not uh not talk for three weeks and not sing 1:18:16.640 --> 1:18:18.680 for six weeks. And here I am, I've been in 1:18:18.720 --> 1:18:21.600 the band for a year that were headed out to 1:18:21.600 --> 1:18:24.400 California to make an album. How how's this going to work? 1:18:25.040 --> 1:18:29.920 And of course, my stupid coping mechanism was to stuff it, 1:18:30.120 --> 1:18:32.920 you know, not tell anybody, uh you know, keep it 1:18:32.960 --> 1:18:38.200 a secret. And and so I started not singing at rehearsals, 1:18:38.640 --> 1:18:41.080 you know, only you know, kind of isolating so I 1:18:41.080 --> 1:18:43.600 wouldn't have to talk. So everyone in the band just 1:18:43.640 --> 1:18:46.519 thought I was being a dick, but really I was 1:18:46.560 --> 1:18:49.400 just trying to save my voice. And but they had 1:18:49.439 --> 1:18:51.719 no idea that I was trying to save my voice 1:18:51.760 --> 1:18:53.760 because I was afraid if I told him that they 1:18:53.880 --> 1:18:57.439 kicked me out of the band. So you know, uh, 1:18:57.760 --> 1:19:00.840 you know that it caught up to me and uh 1:19:00.960 --> 1:19:05.320 and uh uh and so so Murphy came in and 1:19:05.720 --> 1:19:08.439 took over. But yeah, I you know, I can't say 1:19:08.439 --> 1:19:11.800 that it was a mutual decision, but I will say 1:19:11.840 --> 1:19:15.559 that I was in no position to argue the point. 1:19:15.760 --> 1:19:18.880 You know, I knew that I didn't write my best 1:19:18.920 --> 1:19:22.160 songs for the Ride in the Stormont album, and I 1:19:22.600 --> 1:19:24.599 couldn't sing. So how do you how do you keep 1:19:24.640 --> 1:19:27.200 a gig as a lead singer when your vocal cords 1:19:27.200 --> 1:19:28.680 are are compromised? You know? 1:19:28.840 --> 1:19:33.479 So yeah, so what did you do in the ensuing 1:19:33.520 --> 1:19:35.800 two years? And how did you literally get back in. 1:19:36.840 --> 1:19:41.240 Well, for for about for about a year. Yeah, I 1:19:41.280 --> 1:19:44.240 went to Colorado. I lived in up in Evergreen for 1:19:44.280 --> 1:19:49.800 a couple of months, didn't sing at all. And then 1:19:49.840 --> 1:19:52.160 it occurred to me, you know, up in the in 1:19:52.200 --> 1:19:56.080 the fresh air of Evergreen, Colorado, that I had gotten 1:19:56.600 --> 1:20:01.360 one opinion on my vocal cords, and and that caused 1:20:01.400 --> 1:20:04.559 me caused my life to change in a way that 1:20:04.560 --> 1:20:08.240 that was devastating. I'm like, well, maybe I should get 1:20:08.280 --> 1:20:12.120 another opinion, and so I went to went into Denver. 1:20:12.520 --> 1:20:15.000 I made a couple of appointments. When into Denver, saw 1:20:15.080 --> 1:20:18.920 two voice specialists and They're like, I don't know what 1:20:18.960 --> 1:20:23.519 you're talking about. There's you. There's no vocal nods nodules now, 1:20:23.680 --> 1:20:27.800 nor is there any evidence that there ever was. I'm like, 1:20:28.360 --> 1:20:31.280 then this is two different guys. I'm like, oh, great, 1:20:31.680 --> 1:20:35.599 now you tell me right. So, yeah, I went back 1:20:35.640 --> 1:20:40.800 to Chicago, tried to tried for a career as a 1:20:40.800 --> 1:20:44.960 solo artist. I was working with Bill Trout. Do you 1:20:45.040 --> 1:20:48.120 remember Bill Trout? He was the president of Wooden Nickel 1:20:48.160 --> 1:20:51.720 Records in Chicago. Yeah, you know, and Bill was he 1:20:51.840 --> 1:20:53.840 was a character. He was. He was part of the 1:20:53.880 --> 1:20:57.879 company that released the first Beatles album on VJA Records 1:20:57.880 --> 1:21:01.200 out of Chicago, and he parlayed into a deal with 1:21:01.320 --> 1:21:03.600 I think r c A what Wooden Nickel was a 1:21:03.720 --> 1:21:09.800 boutique label in RCA signed Sticks and and then so 1:21:09.840 --> 1:21:12.760 he acted as my attorney and uh, the late great 1:21:12.800 --> 1:21:15.800 Gary Luaiso from the from the American Breed, the other 1:21:15.880 --> 1:21:19.000 guy that sang Bend Me, Shape Me and produced a 1:21:19.000 --> 1:21:23.000 bunch of Sticks Records. I was his first production client 1:21:23.120 --> 1:21:27.240 in his garage in UH in Oaklhom, Illinois. And UH, 1:21:27.320 --> 1:21:31.000 and so we went about the UH tried to get 1:21:31.040 --> 1:21:34.920 me a solo deal and it just it didn't happen, 1:21:35.920 --> 1:21:41.559 and that was devastating because I thought, you know, when 1:21:41.640 --> 1:21:44.680 when I got away from Rio, I was like, this 1:21:44.800 --> 1:21:46.679 is the best thing that ever happened to me. I've 1:21:47.200 --> 1:21:50.080 I'm kind of well known. Now I had a couple 1:21:50.120 --> 1:21:53.840 of songs that did decent on the Rio. Well, now 1:21:53.880 --> 1:21:55.439 I'm going to be able to do what I really 1:21:55.479 --> 1:21:58.639 want to do, which is play you know, folk rock 1:21:58.720 --> 1:22:01.880 in harmony and you know, you know, more of a 1:22:01.920 --> 1:22:05.680 Stephen Stills type character. You know that that was my 1:22:05.800 --> 1:22:10.680 fantasy of myself and it just didn't work. Uh uh 1:22:10.840 --> 1:22:14.080 you know, you know I I uh so that was 1:22:14.160 --> 1:22:20.240 devastating and that sent me definitely into a funk. And 1:22:20.360 --> 1:22:25.200 uh and I spent almost a year just you know, 1:22:25.280 --> 1:22:28.400 going down to Bill Trout's office waiting for the phone 1:22:28.439 --> 1:22:32.600 to ring, uh you know, and uh you know, and 1:22:32.640 --> 1:22:35.760 then going back to my apartment up on the north 1:22:35.840 --> 1:22:39.519 side of I was living alone, and uh, you know, 1:22:39.840 --> 1:22:45.479 I started isolating and it was just not a good thing. 1:22:46.160 --> 1:22:51.759 And then I, uh I met my first wife and 1:22:51.760 --> 1:22:55.759 and she was she was a musician, and she really 1:22:56.360 --> 1:23:01.320 uh uh just kind of said you you got to 1:23:01.360 --> 1:23:05.760 start working again. You you know, you know that this 1:23:05.920 --> 1:23:09.120 is enough enough already of sitting around, you know, feeling 1:23:09.160 --> 1:23:14.280 sorry for yourself. And so I started singing, Uh, started 1:23:14.320 --> 1:23:19.639 playing solo acoustic gigs around Chicago and really working at it, man, 1:23:20.200 --> 1:23:23.400 And and I learned a lot. I you know, I 1:23:23.479 --> 1:23:27.120 opened for for some some really good The thing about 1:23:27.200 --> 1:23:30.880 being a playing folk clubs is you've got to learn 1:23:30.960 --> 1:23:33.960 how to talk to an audience. You know, it's you 1:23:34.000 --> 1:23:38.280 know it. Playing the songs is important, but getting a 1:23:38.280 --> 1:23:42.679 few laughs in between, and and kind of you know, uh, 1:23:42.960 --> 1:23:47.280 getting the audience, uh invested in a song that they 1:23:47.280 --> 1:23:50.200 have never heard before, so so that they're more willing 1:23:50.280 --> 1:23:52.439 to listen to it just by a little story or 1:23:52.439 --> 1:23:55.320 whatever of how the song was written or what the 1:23:55.360 --> 1:23:59.360 song's about. Uh. And I really learned a lot about that. 1:24:00.120 --> 1:24:03.160 I opened for a bit a man who you remember, 1:24:03.439 --> 1:24:06.400 maybe maybe not too many of your listeners would called 1:24:06.479 --> 1:24:09.840 Mason Prophet. Of course they had a song, yeah two 1:24:09.880 --> 1:24:15.280 hangman and Terry Talbot was a master of work in 1:24:15.320 --> 1:24:17.599 an audience. And I would just sit back and watch 1:24:17.680 --> 1:24:20.280 him do it, man, and just soak it up. And 1:24:21.320 --> 1:24:25.800 so that show in West Palm Beach that I talked 1:24:25.840 --> 1:24:31.120 about where I saw the band Neil Dowdy shared something 1:24:31.120 --> 1:24:33.800 with me in the dressing room. He's like, we just 1:24:33.880 --> 1:24:38.680 got a a what do you call that? When a 1:24:38.720 --> 1:24:45.240 petition that started out of Fort Wayne, Indiana. This is 1:24:45.280 --> 1:24:49.200 before the Internet or iPhones or anything like that. It 1:24:49.280 --> 1:24:53.000 was actually on paper and there was like I thought, 1:24:53.160 --> 1:24:56.799 I thought he said fifteen thousand names, but that sounds 1:24:57.439 --> 1:25:00.120 that's got to be too many. But it was a 1:25:00.200 --> 1:25:04.000 large number of names who signed a petition for Ario 1:25:04.080 --> 1:25:08.000 Speedwagon to get back to the Rio two lineup, which 1:25:08.160 --> 1:25:11.439 was that that was the album I made with the band. 1:25:12.160 --> 1:25:15.600 And uh So when he told me that, I was like, 1:25:16.240 --> 1:25:18.600 that's interesting. I wonder why he's sharing that with me. 1:25:19.320 --> 1:25:22.320 And uh, a few months later I got the phone 1:25:22.360 --> 1:25:28.200 call and uh and it was kind of perfect timing because, uh, 1:25:28.520 --> 1:25:31.920 you know, my ego was knocked down to size by 1:25:32.040 --> 1:25:35.599 not getting the solo deal, but I learned so much 1:25:35.680 --> 1:25:38.640 from playing as a solo artist, and I brought that 1:25:39.000 --> 1:25:42.640 energy back into the into the band. Uh. And there 1:25:42.720 --> 1:25:46.080 was a and and their egos came down a notch 1:25:46.080 --> 1:25:49.120 because they thought they were gonna be that it didn't 1:25:49.160 --> 1:25:51.880 matter who the singer was, you know, Uh, that they 1:25:51.920 --> 1:25:56.000 were gonna but but that two album did way better 1:25:56.160 --> 1:25:59.560 than the than the album's subsequent albums. That with with 1:25:59.760 --> 1:26:02.920 Murphy singing, it just didn't it as great of a 1:26:03.439 --> 1:26:06.840 musician as he is, It just didn't. It didn't sound 1:26:07.000 --> 1:26:11.960 like Ario Speedwagon at all. And uh so I was 1:26:12.040 --> 1:26:15.519 ready when when the call came, the guys were ready 1:26:15.680 --> 1:26:17.760 and there was a there was a new you know. 1:26:17.960 --> 1:26:20.479 Gary Neal used to joke that they, you know, they 1:26:21.000 --> 1:26:22.519 picked me up out of the gutter and made me 1:26:22.560 --> 1:26:25.960 a star, and there was some truth to it. But 1:26:26.880 --> 1:26:28.920 but when I came back to the band, I knew 1:26:28.960 --> 1:26:30.800 it had to be on equal terms. It had to 1:26:30.880 --> 1:26:33.400 be you know, there there There couldn't be you know, 1:26:33.479 --> 1:26:35.360 there was no more on the new guy. So I 1:26:35.439 --> 1:26:38.479 don't get a say in what happened. You know, I 1:26:38.640 --> 1:26:41.760 needed to be an equal member of the band, and 1:26:42.040 --> 1:26:44.400 uh and I was and and it worked. 1:26:51.120 --> 1:26:57.760 Okay. From the outside, Ario Speedwagon was around forever perceived 1:26:57.840 --> 1:27:01.640 as a regional thing, but on a majorly epic and 1:27:01.840 --> 1:27:05.840 then roll with the changes happened with the can't tuna piano? 1:27:06.160 --> 1:27:08.160 You can tune a piano, we can tuna fish. That 1:27:08.400 --> 1:27:11.240 seemed to be a line of demarcation from the outside, 1:27:11.880 --> 1:27:13.559 what was going on on the inside. 1:27:14.800 --> 1:27:18.840 Well, the the that was the the Tuna album was 1:27:19.200 --> 1:27:23.519 was the first album that was self produced. We we 1:27:23.640 --> 1:27:29.760 had had a number of uh successful well known I 1:27:29.840 --> 1:27:34.960 mean Bill Halverson, Bill Simsic, John Stronik. I mean those 1:27:35.080 --> 1:27:38.679 three producers right there probably are you know between Eagles 1:27:38.760 --> 1:27:43.360 Hotel California and Joe Walsh. So what uh you know 1:27:43.479 --> 1:27:45.920 the first two Crosby, Stills and Nash albums. I mean, 1:27:45.960 --> 1:27:50.400 these guys obviously know what they're doing, but somehow it 1:27:50.479 --> 1:27:56.360 didn't work for us, And so we had Uh I've 1:27:56.400 --> 1:27:59.600 been back in the band for about two years. I 1:27:59.680 --> 1:28:02.960 had written rolled the changes. Time for me to fly 1:28:03.320 --> 1:28:07.880 blazing your own trail again. Gary had sing to me, 1:28:08.680 --> 1:28:10.880 uh say you love me, you r say good night. 1:28:10.960 --> 1:28:13.040 We had we had some We had some pretty We 1:28:13.120 --> 1:28:15.720 had a pretty strong group of songs that we were 1:28:15.760 --> 1:28:21.040 ready to record. And our fear was that if Epic 1:28:21.280 --> 1:28:26.719 assigned a producer to us, that the that that those goods, 1:28:26.840 --> 1:28:29.400 that those songs would get spoiled, and we didn't want 1:28:29.439 --> 1:28:33.320 to take any chances. So so Gary and I march 1:28:33.400 --> 1:28:36.240 into Ronald Luxembourg's office. He was the president of Epic 1:28:36.280 --> 1:28:39.160 at the time and lay down the law that that 1:28:39.360 --> 1:28:42.759 either we produced the next studio album or we refused 1:28:42.800 --> 1:28:46.120 to record. We never even got that far. We were 1:28:46.200 --> 1:28:49.559 sitting in a meeting with Ronald Luxembourg and and John 1:28:49.640 --> 1:28:53.639 Boylan was in the in the meeting, and Aluxembourg is like, hey, 1:28:54.120 --> 1:28:56.000 I think it's a great idea for you two to 1:28:56.680 --> 1:28:59.720 produce this record, but I just want John to be 1:29:00.040 --> 1:29:02.599 in the room with you. And you know, John had 1:29:02.680 --> 1:29:06.800 just come off Boston's debut album. And uh so to me, 1:29:07.200 --> 1:29:10.439 I was like, this is perfect. We're we have the 1:29:11.160 --> 1:29:14.160 freedom to to produce the album how we want to, 1:29:14.520 --> 1:29:17.840 and if we have problems, we got John Boylen's in 1:29:17.920 --> 1:29:20.679 the room with us. So it was really an ideal 1:29:20.840 --> 1:29:26.200 situation in many ways. And uh but yeah, so, uh 1:29:26.760 --> 1:29:30.040 so we were co producing and and I think that 1:29:30.320 --> 1:29:35.600 was the beginning of of Ario Speedwagon changing from you know, 1:29:35.720 --> 1:29:39.720 before I joined the band, they were straight ahead rock band. Man, 1:29:39.800 --> 1:29:43.200 they were just a solid you know. Original singer Terry 1:29:43.280 --> 1:29:46.000 Latreuell was a you know, had the mic stand moves 1:29:46.040 --> 1:29:48.200 and the raspy voice and the and the whole thing, 1:29:48.320 --> 1:29:52.360 you know, and and uh but you know, I knew 1:29:52.400 --> 1:29:54.519 that if if the band was going to survive with 1:29:54.680 --> 1:29:58.120 me in it, it would take some it would be uh, 1:29:58.720 --> 1:30:01.960 some give and take on both. And I think role 1:30:02.000 --> 1:30:06.760 with the Changes was the first the first hint of 1:30:07.360 --> 1:30:12.240 what Ario Speedwagon could become if if there was equal 1:30:12.360 --> 1:30:17.639 parts Gary's guitar power and the power of that rhythm 1:30:17.720 --> 1:30:21.760 section and a respect for me as a songwriter and 1:30:21.880 --> 1:30:25.960 the more melodic uh you know, paying attention to the 1:30:26.080 --> 1:30:29.640 lyrics a little bit more side of things. And that 1:30:29.880 --> 1:30:33.360 was when we first kind of the balance first started 1:30:33.479 --> 1:30:36.800 being found and roll with the changes? Was it. 1:30:38.360 --> 1:30:43.680 Okay? So you have this unbelievable success with high end fidelity, 1:30:43.760 --> 1:30:49.599 which you also referenced earlier. Few questions to amplify the question, Hey, 1:30:50.080 --> 1:30:52.400 seems like you're driven. You want to get to a goal. 1:30:52.520 --> 1:30:55.479 From anybody in the outside that's ringing the bell, there's 1:30:55.520 --> 1:30:59.439 nowhere really higher you can go. How did it affect 1:30:59.520 --> 1:31:01.839 you going forward? You have the moment of success? 1:31:02.960 --> 1:31:04.760 Uh is it? Then? Well? 1:31:04.800 --> 1:31:06.160 How am I going to maintain this? 1:31:06.920 --> 1:31:07.080 You know? 1:31:07.320 --> 1:31:09.640 How does it affect your mentality going forward to have 1:31:09.720 --> 1:31:11.360 that unbelievable success? 1:31:13.120 --> 1:31:15.839 Well, it was, uh, you know, it was a shocker 1:31:16.000 --> 1:31:19.040 to me because, like I said, I thought that was 1:31:19.080 --> 1:31:21.920 going to be the magic wand that that suddenly that 1:31:22.600 --> 1:31:27.120 that all of my problems were a result of not 1:31:27.840 --> 1:31:31.840 being successful in music and not being recognized as an artist, 1:31:31.960 --> 1:31:37.800 all that, all that good stuff. Uh and what what really, well, 1:31:38.000 --> 1:31:41.720 I'll be honest with you, what really uh kind of 1:31:41.760 --> 1:31:46.559 did me in? Was we we thought sure that Heine 1:31:46.560 --> 1:31:51.439 Fidelity was a shoe in for at least the Best 1:31:51.520 --> 1:31:56.240 Album nomination, if not, if not, you know, a Grammy 1:31:56.320 --> 1:31:59.120 for Best Album or you know, keep on loving you 1:32:00.040 --> 1:32:02.000 long of the Year, you know. We we we had 1:32:02.080 --> 1:32:06.280 pretty high hopes. And when the Grammy nominations came out 1:32:07.600 --> 1:32:14.479 and we were nominated as for Best Rock Performance by 1:32:14.560 --> 1:32:20.880 a Duo or Group, and that was it. And that 1:32:21.600 --> 1:32:26.920 just sent me, uh into a bad place. 1:32:27.680 --> 1:32:27.800 Uh. 1:32:28.000 --> 1:32:31.839 And uh it was it was just like the ultimate 1:32:32.680 --> 1:32:38.880 you know that that that recognition, uh huh, that peer recognition, 1:32:39.120 --> 1:32:43.760 recognition that the Grammys represents was something that I had 1:32:43.840 --> 1:32:46.360 been craving since I was a little kid, you know, 1:32:46.560 --> 1:32:51.360 And so all the success in the world was, uh, 1:32:52.160 --> 1:32:56.200 it didn't make any difference because I just that the 1:32:56.439 --> 1:33:00.760 the Grammy snub just it just destroyed me. It was 1:33:00.960 --> 1:33:05.960 just so hard on me, and uh, and so so 1:33:06.320 --> 1:33:09.560 so when the when the band, when there was a 1:33:09.640 --> 1:33:14.680 band meeting in early nineteen eighty two, and uh and 1:33:15.360 --> 1:33:19.680 and everyone wanted to make a new record. I was like, 1:33:20.000 --> 1:33:22.080 make a new record? Are you kidding? First of all, 1:33:22.160 --> 1:33:25.560 High in Fidelity was still on the charts, and and 1:33:25.880 --> 1:33:29.080 and I didn't have I didn't you know, I like 1:33:29.160 --> 1:33:31.600 to have a bunch of songs written before before we 1:33:31.680 --> 1:33:34.800 win the studio. But there was this energy man that 1:33:35.320 --> 1:33:38.480 from you know, we had the high the high profile 1:33:38.800 --> 1:33:43.719 uh business managers. We hired Fleetwood Max business managers because 1:33:43.880 --> 1:33:45.959 we thought, well, you know, this is High in Fidelity 1:33:46.040 --> 1:33:49.120 had rumors like success, so let's let's go with their 1:33:49.680 --> 1:33:54.960 uh the business managers. We had the record label, you know, 1:33:55.520 --> 1:34:00.720 and and everyone else in the band honestly, you know, 1:34:01.760 --> 1:34:05.280 management everybody was like, okay, you know, this is what 1:34:05.360 --> 1:34:08.240 we do. We make a record every year. And I'm 1:34:08.320 --> 1:34:12.240 sitting there and I go, guys, are you out of 1:34:12.280 --> 1:34:17.280 your fricking minds? I don't have any songs. I'm still 1:34:17.600 --> 1:34:22.719 trying to find my balance, you know. After High in Fidelity, 1:34:22.840 --> 1:34:26.040 I just felt like, guys, let's just this is a 1:34:26.200 --> 1:34:30.519 once in a lifetime opportunity whatever, whatever, you do as 1:34:30.600 --> 1:34:34.120 the follow up to High Infidelity is going to be 1:34:34.360 --> 1:34:39.080 immediately played on the radio. It's going to be immediately accepted. 1:34:40.680 --> 1:34:43.639 Unless it doesn't live up to the promise of high 1:34:43.680 --> 1:34:47.720 in Fidelity, then it's going to be derided. And and 1:34:47.840 --> 1:34:51.280 I kind of had a sense of that, and but 1:34:51.960 --> 1:34:57.000 nobody wanted to pay attention that. Everyone was so you know, 1:34:57.600 --> 1:35:01.559 drunk on success that everybody, you know, let's just keep 1:35:01.640 --> 1:35:05.120 feeding the machine. And I'm like, wait, guys, you know, 1:35:05.880 --> 1:35:08.680 you know, uh, that's not how it works for me. 1:35:09.800 --> 1:35:11.360 But I folded. 1:35:11.400 --> 1:35:14.559 I ended up folding like a cheap suit and went 1:35:14.600 --> 1:35:18.080 into the studio and uh made the Good Trouble record 1:35:18.320 --> 1:35:22.600 and uh uh and uh, you know it was it 1:35:22.880 --> 1:35:26.760 wasn't that was the Good Trouble Tour was the the 1:35:28.240 --> 1:35:32.920 the peak of the Ario Speedwagon partying arc. It was, 1:35:33.240 --> 1:35:36.080 you know, it was just it was the first time 1:35:36.360 --> 1:35:38.559 that the you know what, We've always been a band 1:35:38.600 --> 1:35:41.400 that has a good time, but that tour was the 1:35:41.520 --> 1:35:44.920 first time where I saw that the after party was 1:35:45.080 --> 1:35:48.639 becoming the priority and the gig was just a way 1:35:48.680 --> 1:35:50.640 to get to the after party. And I was like, 1:35:51.640 --> 1:35:54.560 I don't like this, but I don't not like it 1:35:54.880 --> 1:35:58.439 enough to stop doing it and so, uh you know, 1:35:58.800 --> 1:36:04.240 so hey there you know are the Ario Speedwagon. Uh, 1:36:04.840 --> 1:36:08.479 career arc is not an arc at all. It's a 1:36:08.720 --> 1:36:11.720 it's a roller coaster, is what it is. And uh, 1:36:11.920 --> 1:36:14.840 that was that was that was a tough period for sure. 1:36:15.840 --> 1:36:18.479 Okay, the next album you come back with a monster song. 1:36:18.600 --> 1:36:23.839 Can't fight this feeling. Everybody, and I mean everybody reaches 1:36:23.920 --> 1:36:27.360 the point when they no longer have the peak of 1:36:27.479 --> 1:36:31.640 success they once have. Usually you're putting out records that 1:36:31.880 --> 1:36:36.320 don't for some reason get accepted. Then the sound sort 1:36:36.360 --> 1:36:40.680 of changes. How have you coped with that or how 1:36:40.720 --> 1:36:42.560 did you cope when you were experiencing it? 1:36:43.920 --> 1:36:48.599 Well? I mean uh, uh you see, I always feel 1:36:48.680 --> 1:36:53.719 like like the songs are the everything grows from the songs. 1:36:53.880 --> 1:36:57.920 And if you've uh you know, a good song is 1:36:58.560 --> 1:37:03.160 always a good song. You know, it doesn't ever get 1:37:03.240 --> 1:37:07.120 bad no matter how long it's around. So if you 1:37:07.280 --> 1:37:12.080 got if you got enough songs that that that people 1:37:12.760 --> 1:37:19.120 took into their DNA, uh, then uh you know, that's 1:37:19.720 --> 1:37:22.719 that's what sustains you, even if the records aren't selling 1:37:22.960 --> 1:37:26.160 like like they used to. You know, as long as 1:37:26.240 --> 1:37:30.960 you can continue to perform at a high level and 1:37:31.280 --> 1:37:34.160 and bring it every night, and and bring that energy 1:37:34.200 --> 1:37:38.760 every night. And you got those songs. Uh, then you know, 1:37:39.000 --> 1:37:41.599 I mean that's you know, there's no secret to success. 1:37:41.920 --> 1:37:44.640 That that's what it is and and that's that's what 1:37:44.800 --> 1:37:49.600 we do. And uh, that's enabled us to to continue 1:37:49.640 --> 1:37:50.240 all these years. 1:37:51.760 --> 1:37:54.960 Did you own your own songs? Then your own publishing, 1:37:55.040 --> 1:37:56.040 and do you own them now? 1:37:57.280 --> 1:38:00.479 I did own my publishing then, and it was Trout 1:38:00.560 --> 1:38:06.559 who told me never sell your publishing. And then right 1:38:06.640 --> 1:38:13.800 around nineteen ninety one when Kurt Cobain and his cohorts 1:38:14.000 --> 1:38:18.680 invaded from Seattle and took took over music, which, by 1:38:18.720 --> 1:38:22.559 the way, I thought was awesome because my kids had 1:38:22.760 --> 1:38:25.360 bon Jovi posters on their walls, you know, and I'm like, 1:38:26.000 --> 1:38:30.000 bon Jovi is not that different than Ario Speedwagon. It's 1:38:30.080 --> 1:38:32.800 the kind of the same thing, you know. And I'm like, 1:38:33.200 --> 1:38:36.240 so my kids don't have their own music, you know. 1:38:36.479 --> 1:38:42.160 And and then suddenly, you know, Nirvana came along, and 1:38:42.439 --> 1:38:45.679 boy John bon Jovi came off the wall and Kurt 1:38:45.760 --> 1:38:49.200 Cobain came up overnight, and so it was great for 1:38:49.320 --> 1:38:52.040 my kids. But but if you were a member of 1:38:52.080 --> 1:38:55.600 a classic rock band. It was. It was it was 1:38:55.720 --> 1:38:58.320 pretty bleak. I mean, a lot of bands just broke 1:38:58.439 --> 1:39:03.839 up or stopped to ring. You know. We we continued touring. 1:39:04.000 --> 1:39:07.920 But uh, but but my friend Tom Kelly, who's also 1:39:08.000 --> 1:39:12.120 another Champagne boy, another Irving as Off client or John 1:39:12.200 --> 1:39:17.400 Barrett client. He uh, it was his voice. He was 1:39:17.439 --> 1:39:19.840 a high voice on all the big Rio hits. He 1:39:19.960 --> 1:39:22.519 was a great singer. But then he became he also 1:39:22.600 --> 1:39:25.760 became a great songwrite, a great songwriting team with Billy Steinberg. 1:39:26.439 --> 1:39:31.680 Uh and Tom and Billy made a publishing deal. Uh 1:39:32.080 --> 1:39:34.799 right then in the early nineties. And the way publishing 1:39:34.880 --> 1:39:40.160 deals work is they the publishing company looks back three years. 1:39:40.520 --> 1:39:44.200 They take the past three years, and that becomes the 1:39:44.439 --> 1:39:49.080 value of your of your songs. And I was looking 1:39:49.160 --> 1:39:51.800 at it, and I'm going, well, wait a minute. Every 1:39:52.160 --> 1:39:54.280 you know, Couk, we thought it was all over and 1:39:54.360 --> 1:39:57.080 we we we we really thought that you know that, 1:39:57.280 --> 1:40:00.920 you know, it was a low point. And so I 1:40:01.080 --> 1:40:04.200 figured every year that I didn't make a publishing deal, 1:40:04.479 --> 1:40:07.400 that was one of the years that we sold a 1:40:07.479 --> 1:40:09.600 lot of records, that would wouldn't be one of the 1:40:09.680 --> 1:40:12.120 past three years. You know what I'm saying, so I 1:40:14.040 --> 1:40:17.599 made I got a great offer, and I sold my publishing. 1:40:17.960 --> 1:40:20.559 But the good news is that that was in nineteen 1:40:20.640 --> 1:40:24.680 ninety two. And I think Don Henley was the guy 1:40:24.720 --> 1:40:32.960 who really spearheaded the energy that has said that thirty 1:40:33.040 --> 1:40:37.200 five years after you sell your publishing, you get it back. 1:40:37.560 --> 1:40:40.680 So that means in a couple of years, I'll be 1:40:40.760 --> 1:40:43.559 getting it back. So that'll be uh, that'll be nice. 1:40:46.400 --> 1:40:48.760 And and of course, you know, there have been some 1:40:49.160 --> 1:40:52.360 pretty lucrative publishing deals made over the past few years. 1:40:53.760 --> 1:40:57.439 You know, had I kept my publishing, put it this way, 1:40:57.720 --> 1:41:02.519 the publishing company that bought my catalog made a great deal. 1:41:03.320 --> 1:41:04.439 I will leave it at that. 1:41:05.280 --> 1:41:08.960 Okay, just to be clear for the uninitiated, they're essentially 1:41:09.080 --> 1:41:12.880 two halves in the publishing dollar. There's the ownership of 1:41:12.920 --> 1:41:15.640 the song and the writer of the song. Did you 1:41:15.920 --> 1:41:18.439 sell one hundred percent or just fifty? 1:41:18.920 --> 1:41:24.160 I sold fifty percent. And they were a Nashville company 1:41:24.240 --> 1:41:27.960 with that that was an old school you know. Bob 1:41:28.040 --> 1:41:30.400 Beckham was the guy. 1:41:30.280 --> 1:41:31.280 Who he. 1:41:33.000 --> 1:41:38.080 Even just an iconic Nashville publisher and I just hit 1:41:38.160 --> 1:41:42.240 it off with him right away. And even though they 1:41:42.320 --> 1:41:48.640 didn't need my permission to exploit the songs. They respected 1:41:48.800 --> 1:41:54.920 me enough that they never that they never put the 1:41:55.040 --> 1:41:58.320 song in a movie that I didn't you know, you 1:41:58.400 --> 1:41:59.800 know that I thought it would be you. I mean 1:42:00.200 --> 1:42:05.840 they there was offers from cigarette companies. It's like, nope, 1:42:06.160 --> 1:42:09.880 you know, sorry, And so I've all I've been lucky 1:42:10.000 --> 1:42:14.880 that they've been respectful. And now my publishing is owned 1:42:15.920 --> 1:42:22.160 by Mark Freed and Mojo Music, who bought that my 1:42:22.360 --> 1:42:24.880 catalog from the original company. And Mark is just a 1:42:26.200 --> 1:42:30.080 wonderful He's a guy that's in it for the right 1:42:30.200 --> 1:42:34.240 reasons because he loves music and he loves songs. And hey, 1:42:34.400 --> 1:42:37.879 he got keep on Love with You in a Shaquille 1:42:37.880 --> 1:42:40.080 O'Neal commercial, So come on, that's it. You know, it 1:42:40.120 --> 1:42:41.080 didn't get any better than that. 1:42:41.520 --> 1:42:45.519 Okay, So needless to say, you've essentially gotten fifty percent 1:42:45.720 --> 1:42:49.040 of the revenue on your songs over these thirty years. 1:42:50.439 --> 1:42:53.000 If you never work, if you didn't tour, would that 1:42:53.120 --> 1:42:55.240 be enough money for you to pay your bills? 1:42:56.680 --> 1:42:59.439 Well, you know, I think that I think that touring 1:43:00.120 --> 1:43:06.280 is a way that that that leads to the value 1:43:06.479 --> 1:43:10.200 of the of the copyrights and the songs. Uh. I 1:43:10.240 --> 1:43:11.880 think I think I think they are two parts of 1:43:12.200 --> 1:43:16.240 the same machine. So, uh, you know, if we stop touring, 1:43:18.200 --> 1:43:22.320 it would be a I think a mistake to think 1:43:22.479 --> 1:43:25.400 that the that the that the income from the from 1:43:25.439 --> 1:43:28.120 the songs would would maintain at the same level. I 1:43:28.200 --> 1:43:29.880 think they kind of go hand in hand. 1:43:30.760 --> 1:43:33.040 Well, let me put it this way. Ed Sheeran goes 1:43:33.120 --> 1:43:38.639 out without a band and play stadiums. You know, there 1:43:38.680 --> 1:43:42.479 aren't twenty trucks, there aren't all these people, et cetera. 1:43:42.720 --> 1:43:44.680 It's like being a comedian. Comtian goes on the road 1:43:44.680 --> 1:43:49.080 with a microphone, maybe a road manager, and now comedians 1:43:49.200 --> 1:43:55.080 play arenas. Where's the band? There are multiple members? Okay, 1:43:55.600 --> 1:44:00.519 So in the heyday of Rio Speedwagon, the Steps in 1:44:00.600 --> 1:44:04.040 the eighties, was there enough money or were you just 1:44:04.160 --> 1:44:06.800 like a working guy, middle class guy and this is 1:44:06.880 --> 1:44:07.320 your gig? 1:44:08.479 --> 1:44:15.000 Well I will tell you that that. Uh when how 1:44:15.080 --> 1:44:19.640 can I how can I say the there was what? 1:44:20.600 --> 1:44:25.280 When you're a musician, you always you never turned down 1:44:25.320 --> 1:44:28.519 a gig because because you always think that if you 1:44:28.640 --> 1:44:31.560 turn down a gig, whoever it is that takes that 1:44:31.720 --> 1:44:35.439 gig might take the next gig too. It's just it comes. 1:44:35.560 --> 1:44:37.559 It goes back to being in a high school band. 1:44:38.200 --> 1:44:41.600 So it's uh, it's you know, whether you need the 1:44:41.720 --> 1:44:46.280 money or not, it's just it's just it's baked into 1:44:46.400 --> 1:44:52.120 my DNA that it's it's really hard to to think 1:44:52.280 --> 1:44:55.280 about turning down gigs, you know, and we do turn 1:44:55.360 --> 1:44:57.519 down gigs, but I'm talking about to the point that 1:44:57.640 --> 1:45:00.519 you stop touring for a certain amount of time. Just uh, 1:45:01.360 --> 1:45:06.439 it just seems it's it'll probably happen at some point 1:45:06.560 --> 1:45:09.519 in my life. But you know, as it is, man, 1:45:09.800 --> 1:45:13.120 I'm uh, you know, I can still move pretty well 1:45:13.280 --> 1:45:16.679 and uh and uh and you know, got my vocal coach, 1:45:16.800 --> 1:45:19.680 so uh, you know, so I'm having fun singing. The 1:45:19.800 --> 1:45:23.080 band is great. We've got a great crew. People are Hey, 1:45:23.320 --> 1:45:27.120 we had to sold out James Brown Arena in Augusta, 1:45:27.160 --> 1:45:29.800 Georgia on a Monday night. You know, go figure, you know, 1:45:30.000 --> 1:45:32.719 so it's kind of hard to walk away from something 1:45:32.800 --> 1:45:32.960 like that. 1:45:33.600 --> 1:45:36.920 Okay, going back to the old days, Barrick told me 1:45:37.000 --> 1:45:41.600 a great story that Irving came out here with Dan Voegelberg, 1:45:42.800 --> 1:45:47.400 was here for a year and call up Barreck. Barrick said, Barrick, 1:45:48.000 --> 1:45:50.200 come out, we can take this town. 1:45:51.760 --> 1:45:55.559 I was I thought the original quip because you told 1:45:55.600 --> 1:45:58.479 me that quote when I when I called your radio show, 1:45:58.840 --> 1:46:01.720 and I think what I think what what you said was, 1:46:01.760 --> 1:46:03.800 and it always stuck with me. It's actually in my 1:46:03.920 --> 1:46:08.000 book that that Irving called Barrick and said, grab the 1:46:08.280 --> 1:46:10.720 Rio boys and get out here as soon as you can. 1:46:10.880 --> 1:46:14.760 We're going to own this town. Now, that right, right? 1:46:15.000 --> 1:46:18.320 But let me ask you, was that palpable on your end? 1:46:19.200 --> 1:46:22.719 Well, I'm a Chicago boy. You know, I never pictured 1:46:22.760 --> 1:46:26.960 myself living anywhere by Chicago. But when I in the 1:46:27.040 --> 1:46:29.360 time that I was away with the band, from the band, 1:46:29.479 --> 1:46:31.439 they moved to La So if I was going to 1:46:31.800 --> 1:46:33.880 rejoin I was going to have to move to l 1:46:33.960 --> 1:46:38.760 A too. But uh, you know, I'm a Midwest boy 1:46:38.920 --> 1:46:41.880 by uh you know, and uh so I kind of 1:46:41.920 --> 1:46:44.560 got the best of both worlds. I got the Midwest 1:46:44.760 --> 1:46:48.640 upbringing and now and now the southern California lifestyle. So 1:46:49.120 --> 1:46:52.000 you know, I'll take it okay. 1:46:53.160 --> 1:46:57.040 For me, certainly, in the early seasons, Ozark was one 1:46:57.040 --> 1:46:59.839 of the best shows on TV really all the seasons. 1:47:00.760 --> 1:47:05.000 And I'm watching They're opening a riverboat casino and suddenly 1:47:05.080 --> 1:47:08.400 there is Ario Speedwagon. How does that come to be? 1:47:09.800 --> 1:47:12.800 Bob? That's that that's a that's a million dollar question. 1:47:13.120 --> 1:47:17.200 I uh, I don't know what came first, the chicken 1:47:17.280 --> 1:47:21.360 or the egg. I don't know if the idea this 1:47:21.560 --> 1:47:23.680 is this is what I think the you know, the 1:47:23.800 --> 1:47:27.799 show is supposedly based in the Lake of the Ozarks, 1:47:27.840 --> 1:47:31.679 which is in the heart of Missouri. The two biggest 1:47:32.360 --> 1:47:35.880 markets for Ario Speedwagon were Saint Louis and Kansas City. 1:47:36.240 --> 1:47:41.000 We would headline the baseball stadiums in Saint Louis and 1:47:41.080 --> 1:47:43.320 Kansas City and then go out and play the Roxy 1:47:43.400 --> 1:47:47.360 in Los Angeles for five hundred people. So the Ozarks 1:47:47.640 --> 1:47:51.639 were that's the heart of Ario Speedwagon country. So maybe 1:47:51.720 --> 1:47:56.439 the producers were going for authenticity, you know, and because 1:47:56.560 --> 1:47:59.000 because that kind of made sense that that we would 1:47:59.040 --> 1:48:03.800 be the band. But but the also, you know, that 1:48:03.960 --> 1:48:06.280 episode was kind of built around the song Time for 1:48:06.400 --> 1:48:08.640 Me to Fly, So I don't know if that had 1:48:08.800 --> 1:48:10.840 it was you know, like most things in life, it's 1:48:11.000 --> 1:48:14.000 it's not one thing that makes something happen. But I 1:48:14.040 --> 1:48:16.280 will tell you that that I was the only guy 1:48:16.400 --> 1:48:20.400 that had any lines. So when we were on location, 1:48:21.160 --> 1:48:24.479 the writer gave me a little print out of the 1:48:24.600 --> 1:48:29.759 scene and they were just like three mimiographed type pages 1:48:30.280 --> 1:48:32.559 and I had like one line and then I asked 1:48:32.600 --> 1:48:35.800 him to change another line, and they said, yeah, sure, 1:48:35.880 --> 1:48:38.200 sit say whatever you want. But at the top of 1:48:38.280 --> 1:48:42.760 each page of the script it says Kevin Cronin was here. 1:48:42.840 --> 1:48:45.920 And I'm like, wow, man, these people they just made us, 1:48:46.360 --> 1:48:49.120 they had already made us feel totally at home. Jason 1:48:49.240 --> 1:48:51.439 Bateman got up in the middle of his lunch to 1:48:51.479 --> 1:48:55.160 come over and hang with us, and and I thought, wow, 1:48:55.280 --> 1:48:57.840 that's really They're really they really know how to make 1:48:57.920 --> 1:49:00.559 you feel welcome, you know. So I had no idea. 1:49:01.000 --> 1:49:04.960 I'm sitting with my wife and kids, you know, watch it, 1:49:05.280 --> 1:49:07.840 getting ready for season three to drop and watch it. 1:49:07.960 --> 1:49:10.320 And when the third episode came on and I saw 1:49:10.400 --> 1:49:13.519 the title of the episode, I was like, I was 1:49:13.680 --> 1:49:14.559 I was blown away. 1:49:14.600 --> 1:49:15.519 I mean that was that was. 1:49:15.880 --> 1:49:19.760 Pretty freaking cool for I will say this for about 1:49:21.040 --> 1:49:26.360 five minutes, well maybe less than, you know, optimistically five minutes, 1:49:26.520 --> 1:49:28.439 my kids actually thought I was cool. 1:49:28.800 --> 1:49:36.639 So, okay, Ozark Gigantic Show. You have a prominent part 1:49:36.720 --> 1:49:40.879 in the episode. Do you feel any bump in business 1:49:41.080 --> 1:49:44.760 recognition anything or is it just so that was nice? 1:49:45.680 --> 1:49:48.200 No? No, that I mean Ozark as you said that 1:49:48.439 --> 1:49:52.160 was one of the biggest streaming shows ever. And and 1:49:52.280 --> 1:49:54.840 of course season three dropped right in the beginning of 1:49:54.880 --> 1:49:58.400 the pandemic when when everyone really got in the habit 1:49:58.479 --> 1:50:03.400 of streaming shows, Ozark was the top of the heap. So, uh, 1:50:03.640 --> 1:50:05.320 there was a big I mean Time for Me to Fly, 1:50:06.080 --> 1:50:08.599 which was the song that they featured in the episode, 1:50:08.680 --> 1:50:15.600 shows up as number one catalog song in Billboard from nowhere. Uh, 1:50:15.800 --> 1:50:17.880 there were actually there were actually a couple of weeks 1:50:18.120 --> 1:50:23.120 where I was Uh, I was the top producer of 1:50:23.280 --> 1:50:27.599 the week, the top songwriter of the week. It's like, wait, 1:50:27.720 --> 1:50:30.200 how do you know? So yeah, so we we definitely 1:50:30.240 --> 1:50:33.680 got a little bump and uh we actually you know, 1:50:33.880 --> 1:50:37.400 Dolly Parton had had recorded Time for Me to Fly 1:50:37.560 --> 1:50:40.439 on her White Limousine album turned it into a hoedown. 1:50:40.600 --> 1:50:45.719 It was an awesome record, and so our manager, Tommy Consola, 1:50:45.800 --> 1:50:49.120 got the idea to go back in the studio on 1:50:49.560 --> 1:50:54.320 the strength of the Ozark episode and re record uh, 1:50:54.880 --> 1:50:56.519 Time for Me to Fly. He said, just go in 1:50:56.600 --> 1:50:58.639 and you know, just just do it a different way, 1:50:58.760 --> 1:51:01.679 and so I did. I went in and then he's 1:51:01.880 --> 1:51:05.840 he's friendly with with Dolly's manager, so he sends the 1:51:06.000 --> 1:51:10.240 demo uh to or actually the it wasn't even a 1:51:10.320 --> 1:51:14.280 demo but a rough mix to to Dolly and and 1:51:14.439 --> 1:51:17.599 she hears it and she likes it, and she sings 1:51:18.400 --> 1:51:22.160 a part on the song and turns it into a duet. 1:51:23.080 --> 1:51:25.920 And I will tell you something. And you I'm sure 1:51:25.920 --> 1:51:28.920 you've talked to Dolly and met her. She is, I 1:51:29.000 --> 1:51:32.880 mean what there was no movie score, there was no 1:51:33.520 --> 1:51:35.800 there was nothing. There was no album, there was no 1:51:36.000 --> 1:51:38.920 nothing was just here's the song, you know, do you 1:51:39.000 --> 1:51:41.080 want to sing on it? And she goes in the 1:51:41.160 --> 1:51:44.840 studio and and sings the song with me, and it 1:51:45.000 --> 1:51:46.760 was we still haven't done anything with. 1:51:46.840 --> 1:51:47.439 It, you know. 1:51:47.600 --> 1:51:51.360 So so I talk about a person who does it 1:51:51.439 --> 1:51:54.120 for the right reasons. You know, there was no there 1:51:54.200 --> 1:51:56.479 was no other reason for Dolly to sing that song 1:51:56.760 --> 1:52:00.080 except that she liked it and and she had on 1:52:00.200 --> 1:52:04.240 it before, and you know, and of course that led to, uh, 1:52:04.560 --> 1:52:08.639 you know, to me being asked to participate in Dolly's 1:52:09.080 --> 1:52:12.519 rock album. And so Dolly and I do a d 1:52:12.600 --> 1:52:14.600 wet on that one and keep on loving you on 1:52:15.080 --> 1:52:21.519 her upcoming rock star album. So I just I there's 1:52:21.600 --> 1:52:24.880 not enough good words to say for me about Dolly, 1:52:24.960 --> 1:52:27.080 I just she's she's just the best. 1:52:28.200 --> 1:52:33.439 Okay. So, as you've referenced, Reo Speedwagon is a long 1:52:34.240 --> 1:52:39.320 storied history with members, never mind other elements being up 1:52:39.360 --> 1:52:43.960 and down. At this late date, you are the sole 1:52:44.120 --> 1:52:50.680 surviving member. So is it really your band? And if 1:52:50.760 --> 1:52:54.000 it is, how long has it been your band? And 1:52:54.120 --> 1:52:56.880 to really you make the ultimate decisions? 1:52:58.640 --> 1:53:02.840 Well, you know it's uh to call it my band. 1:53:03.320 --> 1:53:06.559 You know that I don't know that just that kind 1:53:06.600 --> 1:53:09.679 of rubs me in in not the right way because 1:53:10.400 --> 1:53:13.439 uh but but to say that that that I'm the 1:53:13.560 --> 1:53:17.680 leader of the band, yeah, you know, ever since ever 1:53:17.760 --> 1:53:21.320 since the split between Gary and I, uh and and 1:53:21.560 --> 1:53:24.240 and Alan had our original drummer had left the band 1:53:24.280 --> 1:53:27.120 by then, uh you know, I have been the leader 1:53:27.160 --> 1:53:29.360 of the band. And it it took a few years 1:53:29.479 --> 1:53:33.560 and and uh in I'm trying to think of what 1:53:33.720 --> 1:53:36.320 year it was. It was a couple of years after 1:53:36.439 --> 1:53:39.200 Gary left and it was obvious that he wasn't coming back, 1:53:39.920 --> 1:53:43.759 and I thought about, uh, you know, I was working 1:53:43.800 --> 1:53:47.280 on a solo album. Uh and and I thought that 1:53:48.439 --> 1:53:51.720 that Ario Speedwagon had just uh you know, it was 1:53:51.840 --> 1:53:54.840 just it was just over and and I'll never forget. 1:53:54.920 --> 1:53:57.760 I was at uh uh. I was at the ASCAP Awards, 1:53:57.800 --> 1:54:01.600 and after the ASCAP Awards, everyone goes to the the 1:54:01.720 --> 1:54:06.000 tiki bar and next door and and my wife introduced 1:54:06.040 --> 1:54:09.559 me to a guy that I never met, a producer 1:54:09.640 --> 1:54:12.240 named Rick Knowles, who Rick at You know, I didn't 1:54:12.280 --> 1:54:16.040 realize it at the time, but he was huge, hugely successful, 1:54:16.760 --> 1:54:20.240 mostly with female artists and so but we were just, 1:54:20.439 --> 1:54:23.360 you know, shooting the breeze and and and I kind 1:54:23.400 --> 1:54:26.160 of told him that, you know that my ties kind 1:54:26.160 --> 1:54:27.880 of loosened my lips a little bit, I guess. And 1:54:27.960 --> 1:54:30.400 I kind of told him I was working on a 1:54:30.479 --> 1:54:33.600 solo album and thinking about, you know, closing down the 1:54:33.680 --> 1:54:37.839 Ario Speedwagon. And he literally stopped me in my tracks, 1:54:38.520 --> 1:54:41.440 looked me right in the eye and said, dude, look 1:54:41.480 --> 1:54:44.840 around this room. There's not one person in this room 1:54:44.920 --> 1:54:49.200 who wouldn't kill to have a vehicle for their music 1:54:50.400 --> 1:54:53.560 like Ario Speedwagon. He's like, if you do that, you 1:54:53.800 --> 1:54:57.280 are out of your freaking mind. And I just met 1:54:57.360 --> 1:55:00.800 the guy, you know what I mean. But it kind 1:55:00.840 --> 1:55:04.640 of it kind of struck me that since Gary had left, 1:55:05.720 --> 1:55:09.440 I really hadn't given it my best shot. I was 1:55:09.840 --> 1:55:11.680 I think there was a part of me that was 1:55:11.760 --> 1:55:15.320 waiting for Gary to come back, and at that moment, 1:55:15.400 --> 1:55:19.560 I realized that he wasn't coming back, and I either 1:55:19.640 --> 1:55:23.280 had to do this, I had to be the sole 1:55:23.440 --> 1:55:28.120 leader of the band and the sole songwriter and et cetera, 1:55:28.840 --> 1:55:31.600 or else it was over and I wasn't about I 1:55:31.760 --> 1:55:34.320 just wasn't ready to let it go without a fight. 1:55:35.080 --> 1:55:40.320 And so at that point, yeah, I definitely took over 1:55:40.400 --> 1:55:44.640 the leadership of the band. And within a couple of years, 1:55:44.840 --> 1:55:46.960 you know, John Barrett came up with the idea of 1:55:47.640 --> 1:55:54.800 of of uh former arena headliners co headlining and having 1:55:54.880 --> 1:55:59.320 two headliners on the show, and and that was a 1:55:59.400 --> 1:56:03.480 way for or bands like ourselves to play the kind 1:56:03.520 --> 1:56:06.040 of buildings in front of the kind of crowds that 1:56:06.480 --> 1:56:10.160 we were used to playing. But you had to share 1:56:10.200 --> 1:56:12.960 the bill with another headliner, which meant you couldn't close 1:56:13.040 --> 1:56:17.080 every show. And that was a tough pill to swallow 1:56:17.680 --> 1:56:22.240 at first, but over the years it's become the paradigm 1:56:22.320 --> 1:56:25.160 and now it's like, oh, yeah, okay, so you guys 1:56:25.240 --> 1:56:27.720 close half the shows. You know, we're in the middle 1:56:27.760 --> 1:56:31.200 slot for half the shows. And at this point, Honestly, 1:56:32.840 --> 1:56:35.480 most of the bands that we work with would rather 1:56:35.600 --> 1:56:41.600 have the middle slot than the closing slot because because 1:56:42.360 --> 1:56:45.680 everyone's in their seats, because because you know, we always 1:56:45.680 --> 1:56:48.520 have a great opener, and no one's leaving early to 1:56:49.800 --> 1:56:52.440 beat traffic, So you're kind of in the sweet spot. 1:56:52.600 --> 1:56:55.600 You know. The good thing about the closing spot is 1:56:55.680 --> 1:56:58.760 that everyone thinks you're the headliner, but you know who cares? 1:56:59.520 --> 1:57:01.840 Okay, can you email me always reference that you're a 1:57:01.920 --> 1:57:06.160 bar band from the Midwest now, needless to say, especially 1:57:06.200 --> 1:57:08.560 when you look at it on paper or on a screen. 1:57:09.040 --> 1:57:13.600 You've had this unbelievable success with Rio Speedwagon, Yet you 1:57:13.840 --> 1:57:17.240 mentioned the Grammys where you thought you were dissed. At 1:57:17.320 --> 1:57:20.760 this point in time, do you still believe you and 1:57:21.000 --> 1:57:25.920 Rio having gotten the respect you deserve or do you 1:57:26.160 --> 1:57:29.960 feel comfortable? And then, of course there's a question of 1:57:30.000 --> 1:57:32.600 the rock and Roll Hall of thing, which is completely changed. 1:57:32.960 --> 1:57:36.600 Never mind, they're inducting acts that are not rock and roll, 1:57:37.280 --> 1:57:41.960 but acts that have petition to get their fans or 1:57:41.960 --> 1:57:44.200 their fans that petition to get the acts in it happened. 1:57:44.560 --> 1:57:48.200 So are you comfortable where Ario is in the landscape, 1:57:48.840 --> 1:57:51.440 and are you comfortable with the respect or you still 1:57:51.560 --> 1:57:53.640 want more recognition and respect. 1:57:54.960 --> 1:57:58.760 Well, I am comfortable. I'm very comfortable with where the 1:57:58.840 --> 1:58:03.480 band is at. And at the same time, I'm still driven. 1:58:04.200 --> 1:58:09.280 I'm not satisfied. So yes, of course, I always want 1:58:09.360 --> 1:58:13.920 to play a bigger gig or or uh you know, 1:58:14.640 --> 1:58:17.720 you know, just a couple of weeks ago, uh, American 1:58:17.760 --> 1:58:20.080 Idol called and wanted me to sing a song with 1:58:20.200 --> 1:58:23.200 one of their contestants, and I'm like, yeah, sure, that'll 1:58:23.280 --> 1:58:25.160 be fun. A lot of people, a lot of people 1:58:25.360 --> 1:58:28.480 will will see me. Who think who might think that 1:58:28.600 --> 1:58:31.280 I'm you know, long gone who knows, you know. But 1:58:32.360 --> 1:58:36.120 but but my uh, my goal is to be the 1:58:36.520 --> 1:58:41.960 Betty White of rock and roll, because Betty White hosted 1:58:42.040 --> 1:58:45.160 Saturday Night Live at the age of ninety and uh 1:58:45.360 --> 1:58:48.560 and did a great job. And so uh you know, 1:58:48.680 --> 1:58:52.600 Tommy Shaw and I laugh often about being being the 1:58:52.960 --> 1:58:57.080 the last two classic rockers standing and uh uh you know, 1:58:57.280 --> 1:58:59.840 I would be happy with that and and and and 1:59:00.000 --> 1:59:01.520 and that is a goal, man. I mean, I I 1:59:02.320 --> 1:59:06.640 still love to play. I I you know, I keep 1:59:06.680 --> 1:59:11.320 myself in decent shape and and I'm always always working 1:59:11.400 --> 1:59:13.600 to get better, always working to get better on the guitar, 1:59:14.760 --> 1:59:17.000 be a better singer, be a better front man. I 1:59:17.160 --> 1:59:19.879 I just always want to improve. 1:59:20.240 --> 1:59:21.480 And uh so. 1:59:23.960 --> 1:59:28.160 You know, yeah, I'm I'm satisfied, but I still would 1:59:28.240 --> 1:59:29.200 like a little more, you know. 1:59:30.640 --> 1:59:32.800 So you're still driven at the end of the day. 1:59:33.080 --> 1:59:36.400 Yeah, yeah, I still am. I still am. I still 1:59:36.440 --> 1:59:39.000 love it and and you know, and in order to 1:59:39.120 --> 1:59:41.480 keep doing it at the level that we are, you 1:59:42.320 --> 1:59:44.680 got to keep getting yourself out there, you know, you 1:59:44.800 --> 1:59:48.200 got to do you know, for me to do American Idol, 1:59:48.280 --> 1:59:51.520 I literally had a walk off stage. We had a charter, 1:59:51.680 --> 1:59:54.120 a jet I had to get. I got on the 1:59:54.200 --> 1:59:56.600 plane at one in the morning, flew to l A. 1:59:57.480 --> 2:00:01.400 Uh you know, Uh they change my my call time 2:00:01.440 --> 2:00:05.320 from eleven am to eight thirty am, which oh I'm 2:00:05.360 --> 2:00:08.560 not thrilled about that at all. Uh. And you know 2:00:08.600 --> 2:00:10.960 I had to sit there all day, you know, do 2:00:11.120 --> 2:00:13.680 a bunch of rehearsals, and then and then do the 2:00:13.760 --> 2:00:17.640 live show and uh but that's you know, that's and 2:00:17.800 --> 2:00:19.360 and then I had to get back on the plane 2:00:19.520 --> 2:00:22.080 and get back on the tour and play a show. 2:00:22.280 --> 2:00:27.880 So uh, you know, it's it's not always as luxurious 2:00:28.000 --> 2:00:30.480 as as people think. But but that's what you got 2:00:30.600 --> 2:00:33.560 to do. You know, you you're you got to you 2:00:33.680 --> 2:00:35.680 gotta keep you got to keep at it, you know, 2:00:36.200 --> 2:00:39.480 otherwise if you're not getting One of the things my 2:00:39.600 --> 2:00:41.440 dad said to me when he was alive that that 2:00:41.800 --> 2:00:44.240 has always stuck with me is you know, if you're 2:00:44.240 --> 2:00:46.200 going to do it, do it right the first time. 2:00:46.440 --> 2:00:49.440 And and so you know, I've always got that's always 2:00:49.440 --> 2:00:51.000 stuck with me. If you if you're going to be 2:00:51.120 --> 2:00:53.000 doing something, do the best you can. 2:00:54.280 --> 2:00:56.839 And you've done great here, Kevin. This has been wonderful. 2:00:57.320 --> 2:00:59.520 You know, there's so many loose threads I could ask 2:00:59.680 --> 2:01:02.839 questions about, you know, you're growing up and other details 2:01:02.880 --> 2:01:05.080 we didn't get into, but I think we've you know, 2:01:05.240 --> 2:01:07.120 covered it for now. So I want to thank you 2:01:07.680 --> 2:01:10.280 so much for taking this time to speak with my audience. 2:01:11.200 --> 2:01:15.120 Bob. It's a it's a pleasure. It's uh. I love 2:01:15.200 --> 2:01:18.480 the way we met, which was literally just me driving 2:01:18.600 --> 2:01:21.520 down the street in my car and hearing you come 2:01:21.600 --> 2:01:24.480 on Serious Exam and I'm like, wait a minute, I've 2:01:24.560 --> 2:01:27.800 got the I got the hotline number to Roger Coletti. 2:01:27.920 --> 2:01:30.160 I could actually call in. I think the show. I 2:01:30.200 --> 2:01:33.960 think you were talking about opening acts right, and Ario 2:01:34.040 --> 2:01:37.360 Speedwagon was I think you mentioned us as being one 2:01:37.440 --> 2:01:41.960 of the quintessential seventies opening acts. And I'm like, wait 2:01:42.000 --> 2:01:44.200 a minute, I got the phone number. I'm gonna call 2:01:44.280 --> 2:01:45.960 in because I you know, I got a good vibe 2:01:46.000 --> 2:01:49.520 from you just just on the radio, and so it's 2:01:49.640 --> 2:01:52.200 really a pleasure to be here. And yeah, I could 2:01:52.240 --> 2:01:54.040 talk to you for hours, and I know I kind 2:01:54.080 --> 2:01:57.200 of strayed off your questions and that's a bad habit 2:01:57.280 --> 2:01:59.880 of mine. But hopefully you can forgive me for that, 2:02:00.160 --> 2:02:03.560 and you know, maybe when the book comes out we'll 2:02:03.640 --> 2:02:04.160 talk again. 2:02:04.800 --> 2:02:06.800 Well I believe, and I say this all the time. 2:02:06.960 --> 2:02:10.600 Digression is the spice of life. That's where that's where 2:02:10.600 --> 2:02:12.520 all the details are. And I have to give you 2:02:12.680 --> 2:02:17.080 credit almost always. You brought it back to the original anyway, 2:02:17.120 --> 2:02:19.320 which is how I do it. I remember, you know, 2:02:19.360 --> 2:02:21.040 I was in a bad space and I went to 2:02:21.040 --> 2:02:23.920 see the psychiatrist and he said, well, well, you know, 2:02:24.080 --> 2:02:26.640 I thought you had a problem tracking, which is something 2:02:26.720 --> 2:02:28.640 they do, he says, but you bring it back to 2:02:28.720 --> 2:02:30.720 the original point. I just realized you were on this 2:02:30.880 --> 2:02:34.880 long journey and too many people, you know, they just 2:02:34.960 --> 2:02:38.520 give yes and no answers. Where it's the flavor. I 2:02:38.640 --> 2:02:41.160 think people have really gotten an idea of what it's 2:02:41.360 --> 2:02:45.080 like to be you and be in these experiences. And 2:02:45.240 --> 2:02:48.080 I certainly thank you for being so honest and open. 2:02:48.440 --> 2:02:51.880 Not everybody is, well, well, thank you, Bob. You you 2:02:52.120 --> 2:02:55.640 definitely bring you know I do. I've done a lot 2:02:55.680 --> 2:02:58.480 of interviews and I still do, and some of them 2:03:00.240 --> 2:03:02.920 are more fun than others. And I will say that 2:03:03.240 --> 2:03:05.360 I really enjoyed this time with you, and I look 2:03:05.400 --> 2:03:06.320 forward to doing it again. 2:03:07.200 --> 2:03:10.920 I do too. You've been everything I wanted and more. 2:03:11.120 --> 2:03:14.080 You were totally open, You were fantastic. I literally could 2:03:14.080 --> 2:03:15.280 talk to her a few more hours. I got so 2:03:15.320 --> 2:03:18.520 many questions about growing up, what your father did, what 2:03:18.640 --> 2:03:21.040 your mother did, with the record you listened to, because 2:03:21.360 --> 2:03:23.840 the other thing. Of course, you're my contemporary. I'm a 2:03:23.880 --> 2:03:27.160 couple of years younger, but we are the generation who 2:03:27.320 --> 2:03:31.560 saw the Beatles on TV and everybody got a guitar 2:03:31.840 --> 2:03:34.440 and everything, as opposed to the people born in the forties. 2:03:35.200 --> 2:03:38.400 Right. I mean, I often say that I feel like 2:03:38.560 --> 2:03:43.360 I was born at the exact right moment to do 2:03:44.280 --> 2:03:48.360 what I've ended up doing because I was twelve years old. 2:03:48.840 --> 2:03:52.640 I'm playing guitar. For about two years, nobody played guitar. 2:03:53.520 --> 2:03:56.240 Playing guitar was for sissies, and I used to get 2:03:56.320 --> 2:04:00.520 chased through the streets by dudes. Just I was walking 2:04:00.520 --> 2:04:03.840 along with a guitar case. And when the Beatles came out, 2:04:05.560 --> 2:04:07.720 I didn't even know why I was taking guitar lessons, 2:04:07.800 --> 2:04:10.400 but I just did. And when I saw the Beatles, 2:04:10.720 --> 2:04:19.080 it was like it was everything changed, Everything changed for me, 2:04:19.280 --> 2:04:22.120 and all of a sudden, the same guys who had 2:04:22.160 --> 2:04:24.360 been chasing me through the streets wanted to kick my 2:04:24.440 --> 2:04:27.120 ass because I had a guitar. Now all the girls 2:04:27.680 --> 2:04:30.360 liked guitar players overnight, and they all wanted to be 2:04:30.400 --> 2:04:32.560 in a band with me. So I went from being 2:04:32.640 --> 2:04:35.520 the you know, the outcast of the neighborhood to suddenly 2:04:35.680 --> 2:04:38.360 the guy who everybody wanted to be in my band 2:04:38.400 --> 2:04:39.840 because I was the only one who knew how to 2:04:39.880 --> 2:04:43.560 play the guitar. So, you know, the Beatles, The Beatles 2:04:43.600 --> 2:04:46.920 were everything for me. And I was twelve years old 2:04:47.240 --> 2:04:49.640 when they hit right, that's right at the moment when 2:04:49.680 --> 2:04:53.400 you're looking for an identity, and I saw them, and 2:04:53.560 --> 2:04:56.720 I saw myself in them. I wanted to be I 2:04:56.840 --> 2:04:59.600 wanted to dress like them. I wanted to I wanted 2:04:59.640 --> 2:05:01.480 to be in a band like them. I wanted to 2:05:01.560 --> 2:05:04.960 have songs like them. And they were just they were 2:05:05.040 --> 2:05:10.320 just a huge inspiration. And man, you know, as you say, 2:05:10.840 --> 2:05:14.200 millions of people were tuned into that Ed Sullivan show 2:05:14.280 --> 2:05:17.120 that night. And you know, I'm just one of the 2:05:17.720 --> 2:05:22.080 lucky few who saw the Beatles and said that's what 2:05:22.200 --> 2:05:26.160 I want to do, and then we're lucky enough that 2:05:26.240 --> 2:05:29.680 it actually happened. I can tell you one last quick 2:05:29.800 --> 2:05:33.280 Beatles story. All right, So when the Beatles first came out, 2:05:33.680 --> 2:05:37.520 we talked about Bill Trout and VJ Records. So VJ 2:05:37.720 --> 2:05:41.040 Records is releasing Beatles songs. Then all of a sudden, 2:05:41.160 --> 2:05:45.879 Capitol realizes that they screwed up, so they start releasing 2:05:45.920 --> 2:05:51.160 Beatle records. Well, I'm in Chicago. WLS is the biggest 2:05:51.360 --> 2:05:54.320 radio station in the world. But I also am taking 2:05:54.400 --> 2:05:58.880 guitar lessons, and every lesson I would hang around and 2:05:59.000 --> 2:06:02.120 look at all the sheep muses, and I bought the 2:06:02.200 --> 2:06:04.240 sheep music for I Want to Hold Your Hand, which 2:06:04.280 --> 2:06:07.320 I still have framed above my desk, that exact piece 2:06:07.360 --> 2:06:10.320 of sheet music. But one day I saw a piece 2:06:10.360 --> 2:06:13.280 of sheet music, and you know, because it was such 2:06:13.280 --> 2:06:17.000 a such a feeding frenzy that sometimes the sheep music 2:06:17.120 --> 2:06:19.880 came in before the song was being played on the radio. 2:06:20.400 --> 2:06:22.760 So I got I saw the sheet music for this song. 2:06:22.840 --> 2:06:25.400 I said, please please me the Beatles, and I'm like, 2:06:25.840 --> 2:06:29.240 what's that. I've never heard this song. So I sneaked 2:06:29.280 --> 2:06:32.160 the sheet music back into one of the lesson rooms 2:06:32.600 --> 2:06:35.920 and I've got my little guitar and I opened the 2:06:35.960 --> 2:06:38.760 sheet music and I wasn't good enough to be able 2:06:38.800 --> 2:06:42.720 to play the song the there was. I knew some 2:06:42.880 --> 2:06:46.000 of the chords and the lyrics were there, so I 2:06:46.240 --> 2:06:49.440 just kind of faked it. And I so I had 2:06:50.840 --> 2:06:53.400 a version of please Please Me, which I thought I 2:06:53.560 --> 2:06:56.200 learned from the sheet music. Well, a couple of weeks later, 2:06:56.640 --> 2:07:00.960 the song comes on WLS and it bored no resemblance 2:07:01.040 --> 2:07:06.920 of all to my version. Right, And as blasphemous as 2:07:07.000 --> 2:07:10.200 this will sound, I kind of like my version better. 2:07:10.720 --> 2:07:14.600 And it gave me the thought, as a twelve or 2:07:14.680 --> 2:07:17.400 thirteen year old kid, that maybe I could write my 2:07:17.480 --> 2:07:20.240 own songs. So I even owe that to the Beatles. 2:07:20.360 --> 2:07:22.640 I mean, you know that I owe everything to them 2:07:23.560 --> 2:07:27.080 In any event, till next time, this is Bob left sets,