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Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the Bob Leftsets podcast. My

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Speaker 1: guest today is Kevin Cronin of Rio Speedwagon. Kevin, you're

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Speaker 1: in a hotel room. Where are you, Bob? I am

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Speaker 1: in the you know, here's what we do on show days,

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Speaker 1: when it's just a day room. We'll stay at the

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Speaker 1: you know, Hilton Townsend family in right and just for

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Speaker 1: a day room. And then on our days off we splurge.

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Speaker 1: So we are in the lovely Ritz Carlton and Georgetown today,

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Speaker 1: which is one of my favorite places. And why is

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Speaker 1: it so great?

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Speaker 2: Well, the area is great. You can from here, I can,

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Speaker 2: and I do this every time. I can't help myself.

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Speaker 2: I walk into d C. And actually the when we

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Speaker 2: stayed here in I think February of twenty twenty, like

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Speaker 2: soon after the you know, the June, the July, pardon me,

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Speaker 2: the January sixth insurrection. So I walked from here down

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Speaker 2: to the White House. And then I walked the path

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Speaker 2: that the that those people walked from the from the

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Speaker 2: reflection Pond, you know, down to the Capitol. And it's

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Speaker 2: it's a long walk. It's about a it's a good

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Speaker 2: half an hour. So what what it made me realize

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Speaker 2: is those people had plenty of time to go, wait

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Speaker 2: a minute, what am I doing here? I mean they

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Speaker 2: had half an hour to contemplate what they were about

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Speaker 2: to do. So but yeah, when we're here, I'll do

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Speaker 2: it again. You know, today I'll walk to the White House.

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Speaker 2: Else I'll you know, see the Washington Monument. I just

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Speaker 2: can't get enough of it. I I love seeing the

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Speaker 2: government buildings like the you know, the the Department of State,

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Speaker 2: you know, the Treasury Building. It's just I don't know,

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Speaker 2: I just I can't get enough of it. I just

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Speaker 2: feel uh patriotic, and I feel like, you know, with

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Speaker 2: all these symbols of America, you know, it's time to

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Speaker 2: get back to the America. That not getting back to

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Speaker 2: that other America, but just getting back to normalcy in America.

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Speaker 2: And I'm I'm I'm hopeful that that the steps that

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Speaker 2: are being taken now will uh will get us there

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Speaker 2: and get us back to where we can have a

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Speaker 2: healthy discourse between you know, the conservative point of view

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Speaker 2: and the liberal point of view. And because I like that,

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Speaker 2: you know, that's what America is all about. It's you know,

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Speaker 2: we we talk things over and we we listen to

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Speaker 2: the other side, and they listen to us and we

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Speaker 2: come to conclusions that are better than if we hadn't

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Speaker 2: listened to one another. So anyway, that's where I am.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So just to be clear, that's February of twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty one. But moving on, moving on. You know, you're

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Speaker 1: what they used to refer to as a Heartland rock act.

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Speaker 1: And one of the things that came with that is

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Speaker 1: you have an audience that today we would say is

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Speaker 1: both blue and red. Do you intentionally shy away from

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Speaker 1: making political statements that might appeal to one or the other?

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Speaker 1: Is that something that goes through your brain?

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Speaker 2: You know what? I You know, we have a song

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Speaker 2: that we put back in the set list after the pandemic.

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Speaker 2: It's a song called Building the Bridge, and it was

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Speaker 2: never a hit. It was on a record that we made,

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Speaker 2: the only record we made off of Epic Records, and

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Speaker 2: it was never really released, but it's it's one of

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Speaker 2: my one of the songs I'm the most proud of

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Speaker 2: that that we play and it it uh It says

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Speaker 2: we're building the bridge, one small stone at a time,

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Speaker 2: with a lot of love and some help from above,

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Speaker 2: from your heart to mine and there's another part. There's

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Speaker 2: another lyric where it says, uh, looking for the common

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Speaker 2: ground and every human heart. So it's all about, you know,

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Speaker 2: people coming together and people accepting one another, and people

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Speaker 2: kind of listening to one another. And it's it was

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Speaker 2: actually we actually sent the demo to somehow it miraculously

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Speaker 2: got into the White House and and Bill Clinton heard it,

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Speaker 2: and it became his re election campaign, building the bridge

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Speaker 2: to the twenty first century. And I ended up doing

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Speaker 2: some uh campaign events with him. But to answer your question,

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Speaker 2: which I didn't do, uh, I I don't. I don't.

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Speaker 2: I don't shy away from making statements. But I also

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Speaker 2: am cognizant of the fact that, uh, that this country

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Speaker 2: is so divided right now that I mean I I

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Speaker 2: made a statement a few years back when they uh,

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Speaker 2: when the whole when when the big trip was, you know, bathrooms,

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Speaker 2: who could use which bathrooms? You know, should trans people

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Speaker 2: use the bathroom of their birth gender or And you

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Speaker 2: know my thing was man if if a if a person,

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Speaker 2: you know, a male, a born male, walks into the

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Speaker 2: men's room and looks like a woman. To me, that's

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Speaker 2: that's more of a of a distraction than if that

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Speaker 2: person walked into the women's room, you know. So it's

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Speaker 2: like I think people can kind of have an idea

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Speaker 2: of which bathroom would be the most comfortable for them. Well,

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Speaker 2: you know, I reacted to the governor of North Carolina.

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Speaker 2: And what happened was Bruce Springsteen canceled his show in Greenville,

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Speaker 2: North Carolina, to protest the governor passing a law against

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Speaker 2: against trans people being able to use the bathroom of

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Speaker 2: their choice. And we had a show. We were on

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Speaker 2: tour with def Leppard at the time, and they chose

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Speaker 2: to play the gig. And so I was sitting there going, well,

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Speaker 2: wait a second. If you know, Bruce is in a

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Speaker 2: position to cancel his show in protest, so if if

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Speaker 2: we play our show, then that almost could be construed

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Speaker 2: it is tacit uh, you know, agreement. And so I

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Speaker 2: felt like I had to make a comment to to

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Speaker 2: to give Bruce props for for what he did and

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Speaker 2: also explain that everyone's not in that position that you know,

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Speaker 2: we're gonna we're gonna play the show. But I support

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Speaker 2: Bruce's position, you know, about the bathroom situation. And I

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Speaker 2: got hate mail. I mean, you know, you know, you

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Speaker 2: know how it is if you look at the comments

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Speaker 2: on your feed, and I'm sure you get them every

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Speaker 2: day because you're you're not one who shies away from

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Speaker 2: from expressing your opinions.

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Speaker 1: Okay, let's go back one chapter. You're on the road now,

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Speaker 1: it looks from the outside without studying it, you're on

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Speaker 1: the road every year.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, pretty much. We've since. You know, I joined the

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Speaker 2: band in seventy two, and other than the pandemic, we yeah,

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Speaker 2: I think we toured. We might have taken a year

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Speaker 2: off in uh in nineteen eighty three. That was just uh,

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Speaker 2: you know, we had to kind of recalibrate at that time.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, we're you know, the thing is, we've got

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Speaker 2: a touring family. You know, we've got our crew. Guys

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Speaker 2: have been with us forever, and you know, it's a

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Speaker 2: it's a large uh, it's a large organization. And you know,

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Speaker 2: in order to keep everybody working and keep everybody together,

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Speaker 2: you know, we you know, sometimes we'll go out and

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Speaker 2: do a tour, like just to pay the crew, you know,

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Speaker 2: I mean, just so so you know, we realized that

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Speaker 2: you know, the band gets all the gets all the glory,

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Speaker 2: but without a great crew that sets it up and

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Speaker 2: deals with everything every day. I mean, our crew is

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Speaker 2: an amazing group. So yeah, we we pretty much tour

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Speaker 2: every year.

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Speaker 1: And are you into it?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm I'm actually I'm actually more into it right

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Speaker 2: now than I have been in years. We you know,

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Speaker 2: our original keyboard player, Neil Dowdy, after fifty five years

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Speaker 2: on the road, decided that it was time for him

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Speaker 2: to start enjoying the fruits of his of his labor,

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Speaker 2: so he he retired back in back last December and

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Speaker 2: he's living comfortably up in Minneapolis. We love him, we

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Speaker 2: support him, we're happy for him, but we had to

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Speaker 2: replace him. So when you bring a new person into

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Speaker 2: a band, it it just well obviously you have to

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Speaker 2: work them into all the catalog songs, and so it

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Speaker 2: makes everyone take another look at what we've been you know,

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Speaker 2: what you've been playing for the past fifty years, you know,

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Speaker 2: And and you know I'm always tinkering with the arrangements

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Speaker 2: at sound check. I mean, I drive the guys crazy.

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Speaker 2: There's you know, I always want to My feeling is

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Speaker 2: that songs are never really completely written. You know, the

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Speaker 2: record comes out when you just wrote the song, so

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Speaker 2: you barely even know it yourself. So over the years,

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Speaker 2: you you have a chance to just you know, finish it,

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Speaker 2: and so I'm never satisfied, so I'm always working on

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Speaker 2: things like that. But I also started working with a

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Speaker 2: vocal coach during the pandemic and it has changed my life, Bob.

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Speaker 2: I enjoy performing so much better now because I actually,

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Speaker 2: for finally, after fifty years, kind of know what I'm

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Speaker 2: doing as a singer. So it's a so, you know,

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Speaker 2: between that and and the the infusion of new energy

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Speaker 2: from from Derek Hill and the keyboard player that joined

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Speaker 2: us just got everybody. We're working on our vocal arrangements more.

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Speaker 2: We're just really yeah, we're just improving as a band.

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Speaker 1: So what motivated you to get vocal help?

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Speaker 2: What did you.

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Speaker 1: Learn and was that done via zoom?

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Speaker 2: Well? Yes, as a matter of fact, my son Shane,

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Speaker 2: he and his twin brother Josh have a band called

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Speaker 2: Sir Please, and they were both just graduated from college

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Speaker 2: and Shane was a vocal music major and about during

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Speaker 2: his sophomore year he was like, Dad, you got to

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Speaker 2: work with my professor Jeffrey Allen. He'll change your life.

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Speaker 2: And I'm like, yeah, right, you know, I'm seven, I'm

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Speaker 2: sixty nine years old and he's going to change my life.

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Speaker 2: And every few months, you know, I would see Shaney like, Dad,

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Speaker 2: have you called Jeffrey? And I'm like, no, I haven't.

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Speaker 2: You know, I'm just thinking I can't drive all the

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Speaker 2: way into LA for a vocal lesson, you know, every week.

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Speaker 2: Then I saw Shane during the pandemic, singing into his

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Speaker 2: laptop and I'm like, all right, well there goes the

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Speaker 2: long commute excuse, you know. But here's what happened, Bob,

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Speaker 2: And this was I love telling this story because as

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Speaker 2: a parent, you are always telling your kids things that

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Speaker 2: they don't necessarily understand, that they don't necessarily agree with,

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Speaker 2: but you tell them I love you, I have your

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Speaker 2: best interests at heart, and even if you don't understand this,

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Speaker 2: at least give it a listen, give it a try.

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Speaker 2: And then here I am. Now my son is saying

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Speaker 2: that to me. So and it's my opportunity to show

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Speaker 2: him the same kind of respect as I was hoping

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Speaker 2: for him to show me. And he did a number

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Speaker 2: of times. And so I started working with Jeffrey via

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Speaker 2: zoom and I will tell you that it's been two

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Speaker 2: and a half years, and this past weekend, I had

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Speaker 2: a breakthrough and and all this for the past four

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Speaker 2: shows we've done have been the best vocal performances of

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Speaker 2: my career. And all of a sudden, you know, it's

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Speaker 2: like if you're taking golf lessons and you know, nothing

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Speaker 2: makes sense for a while, and then all of a sudden,

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Speaker 2: you smack a ball and you hear that pop off

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Speaker 2: the club. And so all these all these lessons, and

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Speaker 2: I've been taking at least two or three lessons a

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Speaker 2: week with Jeffrey, and it something just clicked, and I

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Speaker 2: just like, I can't wait for the next show, just

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Speaker 2: because I'm having so much fun. So you know, I

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Speaker 2: don't like being away from home, I'll be honest with you.

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Speaker 2: But for those you know, two hours that I'm on

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Speaker 2: stage I'm doing I'm having more fun than ever.

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Speaker 1: So you say, driving into LA, So where do you live?

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Speaker 1: I live in a thousand oaks, Okay, So for those

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Speaker 1: people don't know, LA is a morphous like a giant suburb.

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Speaker 1: So it's still kind of part of LA. But because

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Speaker 1: of the because of the traffic, et cetera, it would

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Speaker 1: take forever to get to where you might be going.

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Speaker 1: And since you mentioned your kids, how many times you've

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Speaker 1: been married, and how many kids do you have?

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Speaker 2: Well, I was married, I've been married twice. I have

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Speaker 2: a son, Paris from my first marriage and a step son,

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Speaker 2: Chris from that marriage. And then I met We got

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Speaker 2: divorced in eighty seven. And in eighty nine I met

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Speaker 2: a young music publisher from Geff and Music. Actually she

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Speaker 2: Our office was right upstairs from hers, and so, you know,

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Speaker 2: John Barrick and Tom Consolo were up there cranking cranking

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Speaker 2: out the latest composition by Tom Kelly and Billy Steinberg,

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Speaker 2: who were managed out of our office. And here comes

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Speaker 2: this pretty young music publisher upstairs saying, guys, I'm trying

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Speaker 2: to listen to demos downstairs. Can you turn the music

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Speaker 2: down a little bit? And one thing led to another,

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Speaker 2: and now she's my wife. And so I met Lisa

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Speaker 2: back in eighty nine. We got married in ninety two,

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Speaker 2: and we have three children, Holly and who is twenty six,

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Speaker 2: and the twins Josh and Shane, twenty three.

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Speaker 1: And being a working musician, how do you sustain a relationship.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you've been in the game a long time,

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Speaker 1: You've seen everything.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I have, you know, and it's it's it's a

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Speaker 2: challenge and and you know, at Lisa and I've been

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Speaker 2: together now for thirty four years, and you know, we've

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Speaker 2: we we figured it out and and it wasn't easy.

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Speaker 2: We we went through some rough patches and but you know,

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Speaker 2: love carried us through and uh and now we're we're

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Speaker 2: in a we're in a great place. And I'm I'm

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Speaker 2: so I feel so fortunate because a lot of marriages

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Speaker 2: do bite the dust because of because of touring. And

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Speaker 2: you know, there's just so much temptation on the road,

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Speaker 2: and you know, so much opportunity for uh, for bad behavior,

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Speaker 2: and you know, you just got to get to a

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Speaker 2: point where you can, uh, you know, exert self control

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Speaker 2: and uh discipline yourself and you know, yeah, so you know,

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Speaker 2: I'm i'm out here in the road that you know,

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Speaker 2: we also changed our touring modus operandi or whatever the

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Speaker 2: word is. You're an attorney, what wait, what is motus operandia?

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Speaker 1: That works? That works?

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Speaker 2: As that works? Okay? Good U. But uh so we

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Speaker 2: try not to be out on the road for you know,

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Speaker 2: we try to do a weekend, the weekend between the

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Speaker 2: middle weekend, the weekend between and the third weekend, so

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Speaker 2: we're it's a little less than three weeks, and then

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Speaker 2: we take a couple of weeks, at least a couple

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Speaker 2: of weeks off after that. Sometimes we just go out

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Speaker 2: for ten days. You know, we just don't go out

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Speaker 2: for you know, six months of touring, because that that

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Speaker 2: just you that's you can't sustain relationship if you're away

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Speaker 2: that long. It just doesn't work.

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Speaker 1: So, once again, since you've been on the road so

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Speaker 1: many times, to what degree did Temptation get to you?

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Speaker 1: Both in terms of sex, drugs, rock and roll?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, all of the above, you know, and uh, you know,

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Speaker 2: especially when you're coming up and you're you're you're playing

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Speaker 2: the bars and you're starting to get a little bit

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Speaker 2: of a you know, maybe your first or second record

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Speaker 2: comes out, you've got you know, uh, you know, a

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Speaker 2: local kind of following, and uh, you know, you're young

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Speaker 2: and you're single, and and uh you know it's uh

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Speaker 2: so that's so that's just kind of good, clean fun

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Speaker 2: and hopefully you get that out of your system. And uh,

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Speaker 2: but then you know, a band like us who started

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Speaker 2: out as a bar band and then suddenly just you know,

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Speaker 2: kind of hit the jackpot, and then you know, now

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Speaker 2: Temptation is really everywhere, and you know, uh, you know,

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Speaker 2: I'm uh, I don't regret necessarily. Well, I regret some

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Speaker 2: of the things I did, but mostly I uh, well

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Speaker 2: you know it cost me my first marriage, I'll put

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Speaker 2: it that way. So you know it's uh, I got

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Speaker 2: it out of my system, is all I can tell you.

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Speaker 2: And and I'm you know, I'm I'm, I'm a I'm

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Speaker 2: a true blue husband out here and and I'm happier

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Speaker 2: than ever.

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Speaker 1: Okay, just going a little bit deeper.

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Speaker 2: What's it? You know?

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Speaker 1: I say, tell the story all the time because it

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Speaker 1: really stuck with me. A friend of mine was the

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Speaker 1: agent for Oprah who was playing Arenas. This is after

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Speaker 1: she retired, and you will everyone would ask, well, why

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Speaker 1: does Oprah need to go on the road. She's got

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Speaker 1: all the money, as David Letterman needs to say, there's

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Speaker 1: nowhere else she can get that hit. You get on stage,

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Speaker 1: you get that love, et cetera. So what's it like

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Speaker 1: and you meet people in the audience, whether it be

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Speaker 1: friends want to be friends, whether it be women who

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Speaker 1: are interested in you. What's it like being on stage?

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Speaker 1: Do these people really want to know you? They just

301
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Speaker 1: want to touch fame? What's the experience.

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Speaker 2: Well, you know, I can tell you that that that

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Speaker 2: for me. Uh, you know, especially as a songwriter. You know,

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Speaker 2: I I remember every song I've written. I remember where

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Speaker 2: I was. I remember you know, that that holy moment

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Speaker 2: of inspiration where there was nothing and then all all

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Speaker 2: of a sudden, there was something and and uh and

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Speaker 2: so you know when I when I'm on stage and

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Speaker 2: I sing those songs, uh, it's it's it's just an

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Speaker 2: amazing experience, says because I know that song from when

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Speaker 2: it was nothing and now I walk out and I

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Speaker 2: play the opening chords and everybody stands up. You know,

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Speaker 2: I sing the song, everybody's singing it back to me.

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Speaker 2: It's a it's an amazing experience. It's uh, it's something

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Speaker 2: that's that unless you're standing there at that lead vocal

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Speaker 2: mic stage center. Uh, it's impossible to understand as far

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Speaker 2: as what the audience is expecting of me. I think

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Speaker 2: I think every audience member probably would answer that question differently. Uh.

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Speaker 2: You know, we do present uh you know, I mean

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Speaker 2: there are bands who you know, like Kiss or something

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Speaker 2: like that, who who totally present a character on stage

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Speaker 2: and that's their thing, and you know, no one does

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Speaker 2: it better than them. For for us, you know, we're

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Speaker 2: more the Midwest boys next door, and you know that's

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Speaker 2: kind of our image, but it's kind of who we

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Speaker 2: are too. So you know, when I'm up there on stage, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I'm an exaggerated version of myself, but there's a lot

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Speaker 2: of my real kind of self up there too, And

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Speaker 2: so I think people probably feel like they people in

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Speaker 2: the audience probably feel like they know me better than

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Speaker 2: they do because you know, uh, you know, I'm not

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Speaker 2: I'm not showing the necessarily the the the brutes and

333
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Speaker 2: not the bruises, but you know, uh uh, you know,

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Speaker 2: I'm presenting the best possible version of myself up there,

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Speaker 2: and and I want to. I want to. I want

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Speaker 2: to inspire other people in the crowd too to be

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Speaker 2: their best self. You know, we've all got our problems,

338
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Speaker 2: We've all got our faults, we've all got the issues

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Speaker 2: that we're working on in our relationships and in our

340
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Speaker 2: in our own personalities. But you know, so uh yeah,

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Speaker 2: so you know, I I go out there and yeah,

342
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Speaker 2: do I do? I do people think that that's who

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Speaker 2: I really am and that my wife is so lucky

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Speaker 2: to have me as her husban been. I think they do.

345
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Speaker 2: But you know, if you talk to Lisa, you know

346
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Speaker 2: she would tell you the other side of the story.

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Speaker 2: And uh, you know, my theory is that every every

348
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Speaker 2: good trait has the flip side of the coin, the

349
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Speaker 2: opposite of that good trait. And so it's all of

350
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Speaker 2: our jobs too, you know, to understand that that opposite trait.

351
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Speaker 2: And uh, you know, I call it the flip side

352
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Speaker 2: trait and uh, you know you gotta you gotta know

353
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Speaker 2: how to harness that and uh and uh, you know,

354
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Speaker 2: life is all about changing and uh and learning and

355
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Speaker 2: I'm I'm I'm still a work in progress.

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Speaker 1: Okay. Now, people were not on this side of the

357
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Speaker 1: footlights don't understand what a grind it is. A lot

358
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Speaker 1: of people have what are called find to five jobs.

359
00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:03,480
Speaker 1: They come home, maybe they get high, watch TV.

360
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Speaker 2: They do it again.

361
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Speaker 1: But there's an incredible adrenaline hit in performing and it

362
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Speaker 1: takes hours to come down, and certainly the longer the

363
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Speaker 1: day the sun comes up, it's hard. And therefore a

364
00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:20,720
Speaker 1: lot of people cope with drugs. Now people say, oh,

365
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,840
Speaker 1: it's about experimentation. A lot of times just coping. Did

366
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Speaker 1: you have that period in your road or you're more

367
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Speaker 1: of a Midwestern guy.

368
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Speaker 2: No, No, I definitely, I definitely had that period. I'm

369
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Speaker 2: I'm very fortunate Bob that that for whatever reason, you know,

370
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Speaker 2: the the drugs that I did, they never they never

371
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Speaker 2: got me. They never they never took control of me.

372
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Speaker 2: And you know, and I tell my kids that, you know,

373
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Speaker 2: you don't know, but by the time you know whether

374
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Speaker 2: drugs are going to get a hold of you, they've

375
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Speaker 2: got a hold of you. And now you've got an

376
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Speaker 2: addiction issue to deal with, you know. And somehow I

377
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Speaker 2: think that I always kind of had a fear. I've

378
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Speaker 2: always had a fear of addiction. So I've I've you know,

379
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Speaker 2: I've just managed to limit my intake. Uh. You know,

380
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Speaker 2: but uh, drugs were definitely a coping method. You know.

381
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Speaker 2: Meeting girls was a coping method. You know, it just

382
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Speaker 2: it just was a way to to to to cope

383
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Speaker 2: with the loneliness and uh and you know, the combination

384
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Speaker 2: of of of of willing girls and drugs was it

385
00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:44,199
Speaker 2: was just a way of life. Uh and and uh,

386
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Speaker 2: you know, I didn't even realize how weird it was

387
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:51,720
Speaker 2: until I kind of you know, I I actually, I

388
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Speaker 2: will tell you, and I'm not ashamed to say it.

389
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Speaker 2: I went to rehab and it wasn't for drugs, and

390
00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:02,240
Speaker 2: it wasn't for alcohol. It was for or just I

391
00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:05,160
Speaker 2: you know, I needed to to straighten out my head

392
00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:09,119
Speaker 2: and and uh and it really helped. I spent I

393
00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:13,080
Speaker 2: spent a month at Sierra Tucson, and it was it

394
00:26:13,119 --> 00:26:17,480
Speaker 2: was a life changer for me. It uh uh you know,

395
00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:21,320
Speaker 2: uh and and I would uh you know, I'm so

396
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:24,560
Speaker 2: happy that that it that that it ended up that

397
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 2: way because it really really helped me. And you know,

398
00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:31,760
Speaker 2: I'm not I'm not sober, you know. I I respect

399
00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 2: people that that are, but you know, I you know,

400
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:37,040
Speaker 2: I like to have you know, I like wine, and

401
00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:39,800
Speaker 2: I'll be honest with you and and uh you know,

402
00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:45,400
Speaker 2: and I like weed once in a while. So so yeah, yeah,

403
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,280
Speaker 2: the hardest part of being on the road is is

404
00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:54,760
Speaker 2: coping with the the time that you're alone. And and

405
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:58,679
Speaker 2: so I think that not being alone was was a

406
00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:03,040
Speaker 2: big part of of what are. Not being able to

407
00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:07,680
Speaker 2: be alone was what got me into a lot of situations,

408
00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:11,119
Speaker 2: you know. And uh, but I'm I'm okay being alone now.

409
00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:13,720
Speaker 2: I'm I'm writing a book. I've been writing a book

410
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:17,360
Speaker 2: for six and a half years. Now and and that

411
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,560
Speaker 2: kind of you know. So so I'm when when I'm alone,

412
00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:24,080
Speaker 2: I just you know, I've worked on the book. I

413
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:26,520
Speaker 2: tinker with it and uh you know, I've got a

414
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 2: little practice guitar with me, and uh you know, I'm

415
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:35,560
Speaker 2: I'm more okay with with with being alone than ever,

416
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:38,080
Speaker 2: So that helps.

417
00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:43,040
Speaker 1: Okay, going to rehab, most people are not eager to go,

418
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:45,480
Speaker 1: usually the environing people where I said, well maybe you

419
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,960
Speaker 1: should do this. How long ago did you go, what

420
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:52,040
Speaker 1: motivated you to go? And what was the experienced? Like

421
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:53,639
Speaker 1: you know, we said it was life changing? You know

422
00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:55,760
Speaker 1: what about it? What did you actually learn there?

423
00:27:56,880 --> 00:28:01,000
Speaker 2: Oh? Man? I I you know I used to to

424
00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:07,160
Speaker 2: cope by Uh well I learned at a young age too,

425
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:12,320
Speaker 2: you know, if what if I was misbehaving, Uh you know,

426
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,119
Speaker 2: my parents method of discipline was go up to your

427
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:19,080
Speaker 2: room and don't come back until you have a smile

428
00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:24,160
Speaker 2: on your face. So I learned that. Okay, so no

429
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:28,639
Speaker 2: matter what I'm feeling, I should come down with a

430
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:31,640
Speaker 2: smile on my face. And I took that into adulthood.

431
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:37,320
Speaker 2: Uh and so I just you know, Hey, the my

432
00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:42,960
Speaker 2: most famous song ever is called Can't Fight This Feeling? Uh,

433
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 2: and and uh. You know I always had just feelings

434
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:49,560
Speaker 2: that I would just stuff, and you know, you stuff

435
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:54,040
Speaker 2: the feelings down and and but but feelings are like water.

436
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:57,800
Speaker 2: They have to find their way out. It doesn't work.

437
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:01,680
Speaker 2: Anyone who thinks that if you just wait long enough,

438
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:09,120
Speaker 2: the feeling of you know, of anger, of unfulfillment of

439
00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 2: or whatever it happens to be, it's it doesn't go away.

440
00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:16,840
Speaker 2: It finds its way out in you know, passive aggressive

441
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:21,480
Speaker 2: behavior in code dependency. I mean, I didn't know what

442
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:26,240
Speaker 2: code dependency was. And the second day that I was

443
00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 2: at Sierra Tucson, they had they sent you you get

444
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:32,280
Speaker 2: a you get a schedule every morning, and that they

445
00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:37,080
Speaker 2: sent me to a codependence anonymous meeting. I'm like, what, what,

446
00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:40,000
Speaker 2: What's this? What am I doing? But I went there

447
00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:42,680
Speaker 2: and I walked into the room and there was about

448
00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:47,239
Speaker 2: twenty five people in in chairs around a circle. And

449
00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:51,240
Speaker 2: the group leader stood up and I guess this is

450
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:55,080
Speaker 2: what happens at the beginning of every meeting. She read

451
00:29:55,320 --> 00:30:00,840
Speaker 2: all she read like twenty five personality traits that are

452
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 2: indicative of codependency. Right, And I'm sitting there and not

453
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:07,800
Speaker 2: knowing what I'm doing. There I'm like, all of a sudden,

454
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:11,520
Speaker 2: I'm like check, check check. I mean, it was like

455
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 2: all it was, it was a description of me, you know,

456
00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:20,200
Speaker 2: and I always thought that that was just me and

457
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:23,040
Speaker 2: that I had this crazy part of me that I

458
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:26,280
Speaker 2: didn't understand that I was trying to hide. And suddenly

459
00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 2: I'm in a room of thirty people who all share

460
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:36,200
Speaker 2: that same whatever personality defect will fault to whatever you

461
00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 2: want to call it. And I just at that moment,

462
00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:44,760
Speaker 2: I had this feeling like, wow, I'm not alone. Other

463
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:50,560
Speaker 2: people feel these things, and that just that was It

464
00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:55,760
Speaker 2: just made me feel like this relief, like I could exhale.

465
00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 2: And then, you know, I spent the next month just

466
00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:03,200
Speaker 2: you know, get into it and seeing you know, some

467
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:10,040
Speaker 2: alternative coping methods and uh so, you know, and when

468
00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:13,360
Speaker 2: you're when you're in rehabits, it's just this weird thing

469
00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:18,560
Speaker 2: that first of all, everybody is nobody's any and no,

470
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:22,200
Speaker 2: there's no celebrities, you know, even though there were celebrities there,

471
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 2: but everybody's just on the same level and everyone's free

472
00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:31,680
Speaker 2: to talk and you can, uh you know, you don't

473
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,440
Speaker 2: have to hide things, you don't have to be you

474
00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:37,520
Speaker 2: don't have to be anything except who you are in

475
00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:41,680
Speaker 2: that moment, and uh, and it felt really good to me,

476
00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:44,640
Speaker 2: and so I kind of brought some of that.

477
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:45,280
Speaker 1: You know.

478
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:47,480
Speaker 2: The hard part is when you leave rehab that now

479
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 2: you've got to come in back into the real world

480
00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 2: and see if those same coping methods work. And uh,

481
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 2: but yeah, it was. It was a great experience. And

482
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,600
Speaker 2: you know, there were people there who were trying to

483
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 2: uh stop drinking, stop using drugs, uh, stop smoking. There

484
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:09,440
Speaker 2: was an eating disorder. A lot of people were in

485
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:13,520
Speaker 2: the eating disorder tract, and but all of us were

486
00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:17,040
Speaker 2: together in the you know, in the common areas, and

487
00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:21,040
Speaker 2: you just met people and people were free, and people

488
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:25,720
Speaker 2: were just talking about their their stuff, and uh, you know,

489
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 2: I I came out of there a lot more open

490
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:32,960
Speaker 2: I think as a as a person and and and

491
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 2: a lot less. I don't tolerate dishonesty in myself. I

492
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:42,960
Speaker 2: don't uh you know, I don't hold things in because

493
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:45,800
Speaker 2: I know what will happen if I do. And uh

494
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:51,720
Speaker 2: uh and uh and I understand the difference between uh

495
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 2: friendship and codependency. So I learned a lot of things

496
00:32:57,120 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 2: in there, and and uh, you know, I'm I'm I'm

497
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:04,959
Speaker 2: I'm really happy that I went. When I went in,

498
00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:07,320
Speaker 2: I was just like, what am I doing this for?

499
00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 2: I'm not you know, I'm not addicted to anything. But

500
00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:15,240
Speaker 2: sure enough, when I got there, I realized, Wow, codependency

501
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 2: who knew and changed my life?

502
00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:21,560
Speaker 1: In how long ago? And what was the motivation to

503
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:22,480
Speaker 1: actually go in?

504
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:27,520
Speaker 2: Uh? It was about ten years ago? And uh, you know,

505
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:32,720
Speaker 2: the motivation to go in was just that I had

506
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,160
Speaker 2: set myself up, you know, at a young age to

507
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:43,000
Speaker 2: think that if I could just become successful and my

508
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:45,200
Speaker 2: music to you know, if I could just have hit

509
00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:50,400
Speaker 2: songs and people would would be able to see, you know,

510
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:55,320
Speaker 2: my what I'm capable of doing, and and and I

511
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 2: could share these these songs with I just had it

512
00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:02,400
Speaker 2: set up that that would be that would solve all

513
00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:07,280
Speaker 2: my problems, you know, and and and that motivated me

514
00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 2: for years. And you know, then all of a sudden,

515
00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:14,480
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty one comes along and we've got the biggest

516
00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 2: album of the year, where the most popular band in

517
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:22,040
Speaker 2: the world. There was nobody more more successful in nineteen

518
00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:27,560
Speaker 2: eighty one than Ario Speedwagon. And guess what, Rather than

519
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:31,960
Speaker 2: solve my problems, it it magnified them. Began. It also

520
00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:36,359
Speaker 2: a new problem showed up, which is, oh, being successful

521
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:41,000
Speaker 2: isn't going to solve all my problems? So what is uh?

522
00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:46,160
Speaker 2: And so it finally got to the point in right

523
00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:50,960
Speaker 2: right around two thousand and twenty ten where I still

524
00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:56,799
Speaker 2: was just I just didn't feel right and and and

525
00:34:56,840 --> 00:35:01,280
Speaker 2: I and uh and and you know, success wasn't wasn't

526
00:35:01,320 --> 00:35:06,759
Speaker 2: filling the hole. And uh so, uh, you know, my

527
00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:09,440
Speaker 2: wife and I talked it over and and uh we

528
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 2: decided that, uh that I needed to to you know,

529
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:18,080
Speaker 2: go in there and get some help. And I think it,

530
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:22,160
Speaker 2: Uh it went a long way to uh to strengthen

531
00:35:22,800 --> 00:35:28,440
Speaker 2: my marriage for sure, my relationship with my children, uh,

532
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:31,279
Speaker 2: my all my relationships, you know, and you know some

533
00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 2: relationships uh uh you know kind of didn't work anymore

534
00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:41,640
Speaker 2: because they were based on on you know, codependency or whatever.

535
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:46,279
Speaker 2: You know. So yeah, so there you go.

536
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:49,239
Speaker 1: That's uh okay. So you talked about getting out. You're

537
00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: in this environment. Everybody's equal, You're surrounded by people. You

538
00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:56,000
Speaker 1: referenced loneliness earlier, and you talked and I give you

539
00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:59,160
Speaker 1: credit because most people have no idea how difficult it is.

540
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 1: You know, I read about people they went to rehab

541
00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:03,919
Speaker 1: for a week and then they go back on the road.

542
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:05,880
Speaker 1: That you know, I don't know how they can do that.

543
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:10,799
Speaker 1: So in terms of maintaining did you go to see

544
00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:13,360
Speaker 1: a therapist? Were you on your own? What's been happening

545
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:16,240
Speaker 1: in these last ten years to keep you steady?

546
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:20,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, you know, I was in therapy, you know,

547
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:24,040
Speaker 2: for on and off, you know, during the eighties and nineties,

548
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:27,480
Speaker 2: and uh, and I had some really I worked with

549
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:33,480
Speaker 2: some really good people and uh and after heire Tucson,

550
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:37,120
Speaker 2: I stayed in therapy for a while. I actually haven't

551
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:40,640
Speaker 2: been in therapy for for the for about I don't know,

552
00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:45,040
Speaker 2: three or four years now, which is kind of strange. Uh,

553
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:49,960
Speaker 2: it's uh, it's the that's the longest time since the

554
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:56,239
Speaker 2: eighties for me. But uh, you know, so yeah, so

555
00:36:57,239 --> 00:37:03,960
Speaker 2: uh I think that uh for some reason, I'm just

556
00:37:04,040 --> 00:37:07,759
Speaker 2: a little I'm just not quite as uncomfortable being by

557
00:37:07,800 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 2: myself as I used to be. And so uh, I mean,

558
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:15,319
Speaker 2: you know, that's the hardest part of of being on tour,

559
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 2: you know.

560
00:37:16,200 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 1: Uh.

561
00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:19,480
Speaker 2: Neil used to always say, you know, I do the

562
00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:23,520
Speaker 2: shows for free. I get paid to get there. Uh,

563
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:26,960
Speaker 2: and I think that's a pretty common uh thread, you know,

564
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 2: and uh you know, and and you know, the the

565
00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:33,520
Speaker 2: years of partying that that that was that was really

566
00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 2: a way of coping. And let's face it, if you're

567
00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:40,080
Speaker 2: in a rock band and you got hit records, it

568
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:44,879
Speaker 2: gives you a license to uh you know, for debauchery

569
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:48,000
Speaker 2: and and uh uh and it's a but it's a

570
00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:52,520
Speaker 2: fake license. And you know people people use sex and

571
00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:55,239
Speaker 2: drugs to get close to the band because they want

572
00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:57,839
Speaker 2: to be because they want to you know, people want

573
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:00,600
Speaker 2: to understand it. It's like, what's it like to being

574
00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:05,160
Speaker 2: a big time rock band? You know? And uh so yeah,

575
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:09,399
Speaker 2: you know these days, you know, our our audiences are

576
00:38:09,560 --> 00:38:14,360
Speaker 2: I mean, we played this Monday and Tuesday. Who who

577
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:16,480
Speaker 2: who goes to a rock show on a Monday or

578
00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 2: a Tuesday? When we had we had two sold out

579
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:24,160
Speaker 2: shows in Augusta, Georgia and Charleston, South Carolina. People were

580
00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:28,239
Speaker 2: on their feet, uh for the singing along, just having

581
00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 2: a great time. And you know, and that's enough for me.

582
00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:36,040
Speaker 2: That that that love is enough for me. You know,

583
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:40,200
Speaker 2: I'm I'm not looking for for extra curricular love. I

584
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 2: I got I got love at home. Uh, I got

585
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:47,839
Speaker 2: an honest relationship with my wife and my kids and

586
00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:50,440
Speaker 2: and not. I'll tell you one of the you know,

587
00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:52,080
Speaker 2: if you want to know, one of the one of

588
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:56,759
Speaker 2: the greatest things that that about rehab is is I

589
00:38:56,840 --> 00:39:00,400
Speaker 2: came out of there, Uh, like I said, with zero

590
00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 2: tolerance for bullshit and and the fact that I could,

591
00:39:05,200 --> 00:39:10,600
Speaker 2: uh that I could just since I'm not hiding anything,

592
00:39:10,680 --> 00:39:13,799
Speaker 2: since I'm not, you know, engaged in any behavior that

593
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:18,239
Speaker 2: I'm ashamed of. Uh, it's just it's like a it's

594
00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:21,279
Speaker 2: like a weight off my shoulders. It's like I can

595
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:25,800
Speaker 2: be totally honest all the time. I'm not hiding anything,

596
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:29,080
Speaker 2: you know, and it's just a it's a real freeing feeling.

597
00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:33,680
Speaker 2: And it's just made me closer to everyone in my life,

598
00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:36,400
Speaker 2: from my wife, to my friends, to my kids.

599
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:37,360
Speaker 1: Uh.

600
00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:41,440
Speaker 2: It just just feels good to be done with the

601
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:44,400
Speaker 2: what what I used to call the road guy home

602
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,800
Speaker 2: guy syndrome. You know, you can only be one guy,

603
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:51,440
Speaker 2: you know, if you're if you're being two guys, it's

604
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:54,080
Speaker 2: it doesn't work, you know, because you're always you're always

605
00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:58,600
Speaker 2: hiding guy too when when when your guy won? And uh,

606
00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:02,600
Speaker 2: it's a it's a it's a miserable way to live

607
00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:05,640
Speaker 2: I'll be honest with you. So now I'm it's it's

608
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:09,120
Speaker 2: all guy one and and I'm proud to say it,

609
00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:13,080
Speaker 2: and I'm at peace with it. Okay.

610
00:40:13,120 --> 00:40:18,400
Speaker 1: You talked about Augusta, Georgia and this rousing crowd. Generally speaking,

611
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 1: who comes to see Ario Speedwagon. Is it fans from

612
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:26,760
Speaker 1: the seventies and eighties? Is it people who are younger?

613
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:30,719
Speaker 1: Is it very young people? And with that, it's one

614
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:33,200
Speaker 1: thing when you're headlining. You talked about being out with

615
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:35,960
Speaker 1: def Leppard. You've been on a number of package tours.

616
00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:39,120
Speaker 1: What's it like when you play one of those gigs

617
00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:41,799
Speaker 1: where the people in the audience might not have bought

618
00:40:41,840 --> 00:40:45,200
Speaker 1: a ticket specifically to see you.

619
00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:51,360
Speaker 2: You know, I take that as a it's a challenge,

620
00:40:51,640 --> 00:40:55,400
Speaker 2: It's it's an adventure because it's a it's an opportunity

621
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:59,240
Speaker 2: to play for people, like you say, who didn't exactly

622
00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:02,200
Speaker 2: buy the ticket to see you, So you have an

623
00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:06,800
Speaker 2: opportunity to to spend you know, seventy five minutes with them,

624
00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:11,120
Speaker 2: playing you know, your best songs and and and putting

625
00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:13,879
Speaker 2: on you know, a seventy five minute show man. It's

626
00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:17,839
Speaker 2: just compact. It's just like powerful, It's it never lets

627
00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:22,319
Speaker 2: up and uh. And I think we've won over a

628
00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:26,759
Speaker 2: lot of fans through the package tours that we've done. Uh.

629
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:30,799
Speaker 2: But when you know, when you but these shows, like

630
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:34,280
Speaker 2: I say, in Augusta and Charleston, just for an example,

631
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:39,000
Speaker 2: they were I think, you know, maybe four thousand seeds

632
00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:43,760
Speaker 2: and I think Charleston was a little bit smaller. And

633
00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:47,400
Speaker 2: then you walk out on stage and it's like, wait,

634
00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:51,799
Speaker 2: everybody here bought a ticket to see us, you know,

635
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:56,960
Speaker 2: and uh and so it's like it's it's it's like

636
00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:02,720
Speaker 2: hanging out with old friends, you know. And uh So, Uh,

637
00:42:02,000 --> 00:42:05,319
Speaker 2: you know, Bob, I'll be honest with you, I like

638
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:09,719
Speaker 2: to play. I just like I just love doing it.

639
00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:13,719
Speaker 2: I mean I'm doing a gig in I did one

640
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:18,040
Speaker 2: uh in Vegas a couple of months ago. My friend

641
00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:21,319
Speaker 2: Kenny Aronoff, the great, the great drummer, Kenny r. They're

642
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:24,560
Speaker 2: one of the great drummers of all time. He he

643
00:42:24,560 --> 00:42:28,319
Speaker 2: he is involved in this uh, this band. It's a

644
00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:30,719
Speaker 2: long story. I won't go into it, but I ended up.

645
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:34,120
Speaker 2: Uh so I did this one show with them. They

646
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,600
Speaker 2: they've got a solid band and then they bring in

647
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:44,480
Speaker 2: uh this thing in Vegas, Billy Gibbons Vince Gill, Steven

648
00:42:44,560 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 2: Stills and myself and each of us do four or

649
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:49,799
Speaker 2: five of our songs with this great band. And it's

650
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:53,080
Speaker 2: Jim Orsay, the guy who owns the Indianapolis Colts, has

651
00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:57,399
Speaker 2: this amazing collection of memorabilia, and so he does these

652
00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:00,279
Speaker 2: free shows. So I'm doing another one in Boss And

653
00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:04,759
Speaker 2: in that show in Vegas, I got to sing a

654
00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:08,439
Speaker 2: duet and almost cut my hair. This was a few

655
00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:14,000
Speaker 2: weeks after David's passing. With Stephen Stills, who is I mean,

656
00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:18,200
Speaker 2: anybody who reads my book, if I ever finish it,

657
00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:25,160
Speaker 2: will will see my just my lifelong reverence and respect

658
00:43:25,200 --> 00:43:29,319
Speaker 2: and admiration for Stephen Stills. He's just He's my hero,

659
00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:31,880
Speaker 2: is all I can tell you. And so to be

660
00:43:31,920 --> 00:43:37,120
Speaker 2: able to just to sing almost cut my hair with

661
00:43:37,160 --> 00:43:41,080
Speaker 2: Stephen was just I was like I had to pinch myself.

662
00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:43,840
Speaker 2: I couldn't believe it was actually happening.

663
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:54,080
Speaker 1: Okay, so at this point in time, and of course

664
00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 1: everything's a little screwed up because of the pandemic, But

665
00:43:57,360 --> 00:44:01,480
Speaker 1: before then and after then, reo speed right yourself. How

666
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:02,840
Speaker 1: many dates a year do you work?

667
00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:09,800
Speaker 2: We do? You know? Uh, somewhere probably around eighty five

668
00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:14,000
Speaker 2: ish you know, if we're doing a big package tour,

669
00:44:14,120 --> 00:44:16,719
Speaker 2: sometimes you have to play a little more because the

670
00:44:17,200 --> 00:44:21,360
Speaker 2: you're carrying, you know, all the extra trucks and buses

671
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:24,520
Speaker 2: and you know, tech crew guys and everything. But uh

672
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:27,239
Speaker 2: but you know, I, you know, my wife and I

673
00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:30,839
Speaker 2: kind of made a deal that I wouldn't be on

674
00:44:30,880 --> 00:44:34,319
Speaker 2: the road more than I'm home. Uh and and uh

675
00:44:34,360 --> 00:44:37,320
Speaker 2: and so we try to keep it, you know. Uh,

676
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:41,320
Speaker 2: we try to keep that. We do. We've been consistent

677
00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:44,520
Speaker 2: with that for a long time now. So, but but

678
00:44:44,719 --> 00:44:47,279
Speaker 2: we also like to spread it out over the whole year,

679
00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:50,200
Speaker 2: so that so we keep the crew and and and

680
00:44:50,280 --> 00:44:53,319
Speaker 2: uh so we keep the organism. We kind of keep

681
00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:55,320
Speaker 2: the store opens as we say.

682
00:44:55,719 --> 00:44:55,799
Speaker 1: So.

683
00:44:56,760 --> 00:44:59,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, so so we can make it happen, you know,

684
00:44:59,080 --> 00:45:02,680
Speaker 2: with you know, a eighty five shows a year. Everybody

685
00:45:02,719 --> 00:45:05,959
Speaker 2: does great, you know, we can, we can pay the crew,

686
00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:12,040
Speaker 2: everybody's everybody's happy, and we're not away from home too

687
00:45:12,760 --> 00:45:17,040
Speaker 2: extremely much. So it's been working out well. Okay.

688
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:20,400
Speaker 1: In terms of transportation, in the sixties, bands went in

689
00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 1: station wagons. Then they win and win a bagos. Then

690
00:45:25,440 --> 00:45:28,960
Speaker 1: the real goal was to fly commercial, which got you

691
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:31,879
Speaker 1: there faster, but eats up a lot of time. Then

692
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 1: we have the era. Well I want to be big

693
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:37,080
Speaker 1: enough to have our own jet, and of course superstars

694
00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:39,759
Speaker 1: at this point. You know, what people don't realize is

695
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:43,120
Speaker 1: they'll base themselves in one location and they'll fly out

696
00:45:43,440 --> 00:45:47,080
Speaker 1: to different locations. But those are people who you know,

697
00:45:47,280 --> 00:45:50,640
Speaker 1: were you know, there's a very thin layer of the axe.

698
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:54,760
Speaker 1: And yet there are household names who were traveling by bus.

699
00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:58,880
Speaker 1: So there are a lot of people who don't understand

700
00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:01,239
Speaker 1: that the bus is the period because you get off

701
00:46:01,280 --> 00:46:03,520
Speaker 1: the road and there it is. You don't have to wait,

702
00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:06,680
Speaker 1: you don't have to go anywhere. So how do you

703
00:46:06,760 --> 00:46:09,520
Speaker 1: guys do it? And what's your experience been over history?

704
00:46:10,760 --> 00:46:14,279
Speaker 2: Oh man, Well, you know the Ario has a rich

705
00:46:14,440 --> 00:46:22,799
Speaker 2: history of aviation related high jinks and near missus and

706
00:46:23,040 --> 00:46:29,440
Speaker 2: uh uh it's it's uh we we we started chartering

707
00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:33,680
Speaker 2: a plane long before we could afford it. And uh

708
00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:36,920
Speaker 2: and our mutual friend, uh Irving as off of course

709
00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:40,960
Speaker 2: who was uh we were his first management client, as

710
00:46:41,000 --> 00:46:45,080
Speaker 2: you know, and uh and so so Irving made a

711
00:46:45,120 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 2: deal for for an airplane and and I remember thinking,

712
00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:51,920
Speaker 2: and I didn't ask. I'm like, I'm not going to

713
00:46:51,960 --> 00:46:54,279
Speaker 2: ask any questions, I don't know how we're affording this,

714
00:46:54,440 --> 00:46:57,400
Speaker 2: but uh but but hey, we're on an airplane, and

715
00:46:57,520 --> 00:47:05,680
Speaker 2: uh so, uh uh that ended up being that we'll

716
00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:10,240
Speaker 2: put it this way. The in about three years after

717
00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:15,640
Speaker 2: we uh left that airplane in an on an airstrip

718
00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:20,520
Speaker 2: in Arkansas, the plane had lost its brakes and and

719
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:23,319
Speaker 2: our and our pilot had a gun one of the

720
00:47:23,360 --> 00:47:27,040
Speaker 2: engines put the other engine in reverse and and put

721
00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:30,640
Speaker 2: it into a forced tailspin. And of course I always

722
00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:33,360
Speaker 2: used to like to sit in the rear portion of

723
00:47:33,400 --> 00:47:36,200
Speaker 2: the plane. And on that particular day, we had a

724
00:47:36,920 --> 00:47:40,640
Speaker 2: rolling stone reported by the name of John Swinson on

725
00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:43,319
Speaker 2: the plane with us, and John and I got the

726
00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:47,080
Speaker 2: right of our lights. The plane did did three full

727
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:52,520
Speaker 2: uh full spins on the in the in the grass.

728
00:47:52,560 --> 00:47:56,280
Speaker 2: But uh so. Years later, I'm in a hotel actually

729
00:47:56,320 --> 00:48:00,440
Speaker 2: here in Washington, d C. And some people knocked on

730
00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:02,239
Speaker 2: my door. I don't know how they found my room,

731
00:48:02,239 --> 00:48:04,440
Speaker 2: but there was a group outside. I looked at the people,

732
00:48:04,920 --> 00:48:10,280
Speaker 2: and someone's holding up the book looked like an Encyclopedia

733
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:17,239
Speaker 2: school yearbook size book, and it said Department of Our

734
00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:22,560
Speaker 2: Department of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms nineteen eighty two yearbook,

735
00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:26,600
Speaker 2: and so I'm like, what's this? So I opened the door.

736
00:48:26,960 --> 00:48:30,800
Speaker 2: They had opened to a page of a point of

737
00:48:30,880 --> 00:48:35,160
Speaker 2: view from behind a squad car with agent atf agent's

738
00:48:35,840 --> 00:48:41,480
Speaker 2: guns drawn aimed at in the distance, an airplane with

739
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:46,800
Speaker 2: the Areo speedwagon logo paines on the side. So, long

740
00:48:46,840 --> 00:48:51,839
Speaker 2: story a little shorter. On our days off on the road,

741
00:48:52,600 --> 00:48:57,759
Speaker 2: our plane was being used to do all kinds of

742
00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:00,279
Speaker 2: things that we were not aware of, and so we

743
00:49:00,640 --> 00:49:06,480
Speaker 2: we were the We were basically a cover for much

744
00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:11,239
Speaker 2: illegal activity. So that's how we afforded the plane. I

745
00:49:11,239 --> 00:49:15,480
Speaker 2: guess we didn't partake in any of the illegalities, but

746
00:49:15,719 --> 00:49:18,160
Speaker 2: are we were a cover for it? I guess.

747
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:21,279
Speaker 1: Okay, So at this point in time, you know, it's

748
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:22,759
Speaker 1: not like you go, as you said, go on the

749
00:49:22,840 --> 00:49:25,200
Speaker 1: road for sixty days straight, although sometimes you do a

750
00:49:25,239 --> 00:49:29,480
Speaker 1: package tour. So are you traveling by bus to these gigs?

751
00:49:29,480 --> 00:49:31,920
Speaker 1: Are you flying in and flying back to la? How

752
00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:32,479
Speaker 1: does it work?

753
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:36,200
Speaker 2: Now? We fly into a to a major hub that

754
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:41,719
Speaker 2: the tour buses meet us there and and honestly, you know,

755
00:49:43,840 --> 00:49:46,719
Speaker 2: you know, my friend Sammy Hagar's got a beautiful airplane

756
00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:49,879
Speaker 2: and he always and that's just his thing, and he's

757
00:49:49,920 --> 00:49:51,920
Speaker 2: in a position to be able to afford it, and

758
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:57,520
Speaker 2: and it's great, but the problem is you spend your

759
00:49:57,560 --> 00:50:01,200
Speaker 2: whole day driving to the airport getting on the airplane,

760
00:50:01,360 --> 00:50:04,960
Speaker 2: you know. So the beauty of tour buses, which is

761
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:08,799
Speaker 2: how we travel, is, you know, the gig's over, you

762
00:50:08,880 --> 00:50:11,480
Speaker 2: get on the bus, watch a little TV. You know,

763
00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:14,920
Speaker 2: there's cables, there's satellite TV and the bus. Then you

764
00:50:14,960 --> 00:50:17,600
Speaker 2: go into your bunk, you know, read a little bit,

765
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:22,200
Speaker 2: listen to a Bob Lefts it's podcast, and and uh

766
00:50:22,640 --> 00:50:25,240
Speaker 2: and uh and you uh and you get to sleep

767
00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 2: and then when you wake up, you're in the next

768
00:50:28,080 --> 00:50:31,880
Speaker 2: city and you can do things you can you know,

769
00:50:32,000 --> 00:50:33,840
Speaker 2: go to the gym, take a walk, you know. I

770
00:50:34,520 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 2: always like to walk around whatever city we're playing on

771
00:50:39,719 --> 00:50:42,440
Speaker 2: the afternoon before the show. I just kind of soak

772
00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:45,839
Speaker 2: up some of the vibe of what's going on in

773
00:50:45,880 --> 00:50:50,359
Speaker 2: that city. And uh. And then you know, I bring

774
00:50:50,440 --> 00:50:52,800
Speaker 2: that with me on stage and I just feel a

775
00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:55,160
Speaker 2: little bit closer to the audience that way. So I'm

776
00:50:55,480 --> 00:50:58,759
Speaker 2: I'm cool traveling by by tour bus. But I do

777
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:01,000
Speaker 2: like the nights that we get to sleep in a

778
00:51:01,040 --> 00:51:03,920
Speaker 2: real bed, So I will enjoy my evening tonight.

779
00:51:04,040 --> 00:51:06,920
Speaker 1: Okay, so we started that earlier. You talked about a

780
00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:09,040
Speaker 1: day room and then you talked about being in this

781
00:51:09,080 --> 00:51:13,799
Speaker 1: great hotel. Do you essentially get a hotel every day? Yeah,

782
00:51:13,800 --> 00:51:16,480
Speaker 1: we get a hotel every day. Some I mean sometimes

783
00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:19,319
Speaker 1: you know, you know, I'm I'm a.

784
00:51:19,320 --> 00:51:24,439
Speaker 2: Late sleeper, and so I by the time I get

785
00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:28,960
Speaker 2: off the bus, I'm in the room for maybe four

786
00:51:29,000 --> 00:51:32,040
Speaker 2: hours and then I got to you know, check out again.

787
00:51:32,160 --> 00:51:34,560
Speaker 2: So so that becomes a little bit of a burn

788
00:51:34,600 --> 00:51:36,239
Speaker 2: because you got to bring out, you know, you got

789
00:51:36,280 --> 00:51:38,000
Speaker 2: to open up all your luggage. I mean, it takes

790
00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:40,799
Speaker 2: me from the time I walk into my hotel room

791
00:51:41,200 --> 00:51:45,600
Speaker 2: until the time it's all set up to my specifications.

792
00:51:46,000 --> 00:51:49,560
Speaker 2: You know, it's a good half hour process. Just like

793
00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:53,319
Speaker 2: you know, put your suitcase here, you put your computers there,

794
00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:55,600
Speaker 2: your toiletries are in the bathroom. You know, I just

795
00:51:55,719 --> 00:52:02,960
Speaker 2: like to make make my environment feel somewhat familiar. But

796
00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:05,160
Speaker 2: on those day room days, yeah, well you know, they're

797
00:52:05,239 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 2: three or four hours and then we're off to the gig.

798
00:52:07,719 --> 00:52:10,160
Speaker 2: But then on the days off, you know, we get

799
00:52:10,200 --> 00:52:13,200
Speaker 2: to have a nice day and and uh, you know,

800
00:52:13,840 --> 00:52:17,359
Speaker 2: nice dinner in a restaurant somewhere or whatever. And so

801
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:19,719
Speaker 2: that that's what that's what today will be.

802
00:52:21,040 --> 00:52:25,399
Speaker 1: And to what degreed? Can you travel freely? Or you recognized?

803
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:27,120
Speaker 1: You know what?

804
00:52:27,520 --> 00:52:34,160
Speaker 2: Uh I'm I'm recognized on a pretty regular basis, but normally,

805
00:52:34,440 --> 00:52:38,239
Speaker 2: you know, if it's just on the street or you know,

806
00:52:38,239 --> 00:52:45,400
Speaker 2: there's hey, everybody's different, you know, every person has a different, uh,

807
00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:49,439
Speaker 2: you know, way of of approaching you know you and

808
00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:52,880
Speaker 2: and you know as a uh you know, I'm I'm

809
00:52:52,960 --> 00:52:58,920
Speaker 2: I'm so lucky that I that my music uh affects

810
00:52:58,960 --> 00:53:02,960
Speaker 2: people in such a way that they want to they

811
00:53:03,040 --> 00:53:06,600
Speaker 2: just want to. I don't quite understand it, but that's

812
00:53:06,640 --> 00:53:09,360
Speaker 2: how I felt about Steven Stills. I just I just

813
00:53:09,400 --> 00:53:11,640
Speaker 2: wanted to meet him because I love his music so

814
00:53:11,760 --> 00:53:16,040
Speaker 2: much that that I feel like that's a connection between

815
00:53:16,520 --> 00:53:19,760
Speaker 2: between him and me, even though you know, he didn't

816
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:21,440
Speaker 2: know who I was. You know, I was, I was

817
00:53:21,480 --> 00:53:26,280
Speaker 2: a kid and uh so, so I I understand that feeling,

818
00:53:26,480 --> 00:53:30,960
Speaker 2: and and so I try to be as as accommodating

819
00:53:31,000 --> 00:53:34,879
Speaker 2: as possible. The things that I don't tolerate is when

820
00:53:35,120 --> 00:53:39,040
Speaker 2: someone is drunk and they and they and now they

821
00:53:39,080 --> 00:53:42,839
Speaker 2: want to come up to me and it's just that

822
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:46,120
Speaker 2: doesn't work, you know. But if but if if people

823
00:53:46,239 --> 00:53:51,120
Speaker 2: are are and usually people are usually people are really cool,

824
00:53:51,280 --> 00:53:55,440
Speaker 2: just really respectful. Just want to say, you know what, man,

825
00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:57,920
Speaker 2: you know, your your music means a lot to me.

826
00:53:58,080 --> 00:54:00,680
Speaker 2: And and and we played your song at our wedding

827
00:54:01,000 --> 00:54:05,080
Speaker 2: and thanks, you know, and I'm like, you're welcome. That's awesome,

828
00:54:05,239 --> 00:54:07,560
Speaker 2: you know, I mean, who doesn't want to hear that?

829
00:54:07,960 --> 00:54:08,160
Speaker 2: You know?

830
00:54:09,640 --> 00:54:14,920
Speaker 1: Okay, So to what degree does Rio Speedwagon mean anything

831
00:54:15,000 --> 00:54:18,120
Speaker 1: outside the United States? And to what degree have you

832
00:54:18,280 --> 00:54:20,440
Speaker 1: toured outside the United States?

833
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:23,680
Speaker 2: Well, we you know, well I will tell you this.

834
00:54:23,960 --> 00:54:27,560
Speaker 2: We we did a really made a really dumb decision.

835
00:54:27,760 --> 00:54:33,640
Speaker 2: In nineteen eighty one, we were offered a huge European tour.

836
00:54:33,719 --> 00:54:36,879
Speaker 2: We had toured the States, you know, sold out stadiums.

837
00:54:37,360 --> 00:54:40,960
Speaker 2: We went to Japan, you know, did multiple nights at

838
00:54:41,000 --> 00:54:46,640
Speaker 2: Budu Khan and toured the country. And by late nineteen

839
00:54:46,680 --> 00:54:49,759
Speaker 2: eighty one, that was when the European leg of the

840
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:56,040
Speaker 2: tour was supposed to happen, and we just didn't do it.

841
00:54:56,840 --> 00:55:01,560
Speaker 2: And it was looking back that that was a dumb thing,

842
00:55:01,680 --> 00:55:06,239
Speaker 2: because you know what I've come to understand about uh,

843
00:55:06,680 --> 00:55:09,960
Speaker 2: European music fans an. You know, this is a generalization,

844
00:55:10,080 --> 00:55:14,400
Speaker 2: of course, but that if you if American bands come

845
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:19,560
Speaker 2: there when they're at their peak and tour, those bands

846
00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:24,760
Speaker 2: can come back to Europe forever and and people will.

847
00:55:25,080 --> 00:55:29,319
Speaker 2: People are loyal, the fans in your European fans are

848
00:55:29,560 --> 00:55:34,840
Speaker 2: just loyal. If you don't come there at your peak,

849
00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:37,879
Speaker 2: and now you're not at your peak anymore, and now

850
00:55:37,920 --> 00:55:40,640
Speaker 2: you want to go over to Europe and play, it's

851
00:55:40,719 --> 00:55:43,359
Speaker 2: a it's a it's a tougher hill to climb, I'll

852
00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:46,719
Speaker 2: tell you. But but but but we you know, we

853
00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:50,480
Speaker 2: you know, luckily, we we did go back there after

854
00:55:50,480 --> 00:55:54,480
Speaker 2: the wheels are turning tour. We toured Europe and so

855
00:55:54,640 --> 00:55:57,480
Speaker 2: you know, we go back there every few years. We've

856
00:55:57,840 --> 00:55:59,880
Speaker 2: you know, we've been to Japan a few times. We

857
00:56:00,480 --> 00:56:03,640
Speaker 2: did a little tour of New Zealand right before the

858
00:56:03,640 --> 00:56:08,120
Speaker 2: pandemic with Huey Lewis and Melissa Etheridge. We just played

859
00:56:08,520 --> 00:56:11,720
Speaker 2: a few festivals in New Zealand and it was awesome.

860
00:56:11,840 --> 00:56:16,560
Speaker 2: I mean it was just a great experience. And uh so, yeah,

861
00:56:16,719 --> 00:56:18,480
Speaker 2: you know, I like to see new places. You know,

862
00:56:18,560 --> 00:56:23,000
Speaker 2: we're we're we're tossing around an Australian tour, which we've

863
00:56:23,040 --> 00:56:29,000
Speaker 2: never done. So but there's also something nice about being

864
00:56:29,400 --> 00:56:32,520
Speaker 2: home too, you know, being not having to show a

865
00:56:32,600 --> 00:56:36,920
Speaker 2: passport and and just knowing that there's a little safety

866
00:56:37,040 --> 00:56:41,719
Speaker 2: and you know, I feel more connected to home, you know,

867
00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:46,360
Speaker 2: and and for me it's really important to feel connected

868
00:56:46,400 --> 00:56:51,720
Speaker 2: to home. Lisa bought me up a little a little

869
00:56:53,040 --> 00:56:57,279
Speaker 2: pendant right before I left, and and it's uh and

870
00:56:57,360 --> 00:57:00,600
Speaker 2: I love it. It's just a little shame. Well, I

871
00:57:00,600 --> 00:57:03,040
Speaker 2: guess people can't see it, but there's an anchor at

872
00:57:03,040 --> 00:57:06,600
Speaker 2: the end of it, and it's like, and I never

873
00:57:06,640 --> 00:57:11,200
Speaker 2: tell well, this is my New Zealand. The thing that

874
00:57:11,239 --> 00:57:14,960
Speaker 2: I wear constantly given to us by a maori u,

875
00:57:15,960 --> 00:57:19,480
Speaker 2: a spiritual guy. I don't know. I guess it was

876
00:57:19,480 --> 00:57:21,880
Speaker 2: a priest, a Maui priest. And then this little anchor,

877
00:57:22,200 --> 00:57:24,560
Speaker 2: and so it's like, that's my anchor. You know, home

878
00:57:24,680 --> 00:57:25,320
Speaker 2: is my anchor.

879
00:57:26,840 --> 00:57:31,320
Speaker 1: Okay, since you've been on the road for decades, what's

880
00:57:31,360 --> 00:57:34,200
Speaker 1: the best hotel you were ever at? What's not? If

881
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:35,920
Speaker 1: I said you we get to go to one, what

882
00:57:35,960 --> 00:57:36,520
Speaker 1: would that be?

883
00:57:37,320 --> 00:57:40,240
Speaker 2: Well, I'll tell you what. This one right here would

884
00:57:40,320 --> 00:57:44,800
Speaker 2: be high on my list for sure. The you know,

885
00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:48,560
Speaker 2: there's there's the Townsend in Birmingham, Michigan, outside of Detroit.

886
00:57:48,640 --> 00:57:51,480
Speaker 2: That's in a great spot. I'm trying to think of

887
00:57:51,880 --> 00:58:02,080
Speaker 2: like a someplace. Oh man, I can't there's there. I'm not.

888
00:58:02,520 --> 00:58:02,840
Speaker 1: I'm not.

889
00:58:02,880 --> 00:58:05,200
Speaker 2: I'm not thinking of like one. If you asked me

890
00:58:05,280 --> 00:58:08,360
Speaker 2: for a venue, you know, I would, you know, it's like.

891
00:58:08,920 --> 00:58:12,680
Speaker 1: Okay, agree, that's that's interesting to switch it to a venue.

892
00:58:13,120 --> 00:58:15,080
Speaker 1: If I if I say there are three venues you

893
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:16,160
Speaker 1: can play, what are those?

894
00:58:16,560 --> 00:58:20,960
Speaker 2: Well, the first one is Red Rocks without even without

895
00:58:20,960 --> 00:58:24,000
Speaker 2: even having to think twice, Red Rocks is just just

896
00:58:24,320 --> 00:58:27,680
Speaker 2: from uh well, first of all, I have a picture

897
00:58:28,200 --> 00:58:31,000
Speaker 2: of it. It's one of my first memories of life

898
00:58:31,240 --> 00:58:33,960
Speaker 2: of my mom and I. My dad took the picture

899
00:58:34,480 --> 00:58:37,160
Speaker 2: up at the top of the you know, with with

900
00:58:37,240 --> 00:58:40,600
Speaker 2: the Amphitheater of Red Rocks in the in the background,

901
00:58:40,640 --> 00:58:42,840
Speaker 2: when I was two and a half years old. And

902
00:58:43,040 --> 00:58:45,200
Speaker 2: you know who who would have thunk that that my

903
00:58:45,440 --> 00:58:48,400
Speaker 2: history with Red Rocks would be? I think we I

904
00:58:48,440 --> 00:58:52,320
Speaker 2: think we've played there seven times and and uh the

905
00:58:53,160 --> 00:58:56,320
Speaker 2: place has been sold out everyone. And what's great about

906
00:58:56,320 --> 00:59:00,240
Speaker 2: red Rocks is not only the natural amphitheater and the

907
00:59:00,280 --> 00:59:03,600
Speaker 2: beauty of the of the area that you're in, but

908
00:59:03,920 --> 00:59:08,040
Speaker 2: in the dressing room area, there's a they have a

909
00:59:08,200 --> 00:59:12,880
Speaker 2: mural of every everyone that's ever played there, starting in

910
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:16,320
Speaker 2: I think it opened in the early nineteen hundreds, and

911
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:19,520
Speaker 2: so you can look at this at this thing and

912
00:59:19,840 --> 00:59:24,120
Speaker 2: it's like a history of music, you know, from from classical,

913
00:59:24,280 --> 00:59:26,960
Speaker 2: you know, through the you know, the big band era

914
00:59:27,200 --> 00:59:30,160
Speaker 2: and the frank Sinatra area, and then all of a sudden,

915
00:59:30,640 --> 00:59:34,280
Speaker 2: the British invasion happens and you know could and yeah,

916
00:59:34,320 --> 00:59:37,360
Speaker 2: there was like a Beach Boys Frankie Valley in the

917
00:59:37,400 --> 00:59:41,560
Speaker 2: Four Seasons period. So you can really just document how

918
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:44,720
Speaker 2: music has changed over the years. It's really it's a

919
00:59:44,720 --> 00:59:51,240
Speaker 2: beautiful venue that that's my favorite. Everybody should at some

920
00:59:51,640 --> 00:59:54,840
Speaker 2: at some point in their life when when your favorite

921
00:59:54,840 --> 01:00:00,000
Speaker 2: band plays Red Rocks, fly to Denver and go see them,

922
01:00:00,480 --> 01:00:03,600
Speaker 2: because to see your favorite band at Red Rocks, that's

923
01:00:03,640 --> 01:00:05,800
Speaker 2: that's a that's a bucket list for everybody.

924
01:00:05,840 --> 01:00:09,040
Speaker 1: I would say, let's go back a chapter. You talk

925
01:00:09,160 --> 01:00:14,040
Speaker 1: about believing that if you had hit records, your life

926
01:00:14,080 --> 01:00:18,560
Speaker 1: would work, which raises the question to what degree were

927
01:00:18,600 --> 01:00:23,280
Speaker 1: you driven. What people don't understand is how impossibly hard

928
01:00:23,320 --> 01:00:27,640
Speaker 1: it is to make it. I mean it's just you know,

929
01:00:28,240 --> 01:00:30,520
Speaker 1: athletes you can kind of say, well they have this

930
01:00:30,680 --> 01:00:33,560
Speaker 1: skill or whatever, whereas in musicians it's not even like

931
01:00:33,600 --> 01:00:39,440
Speaker 1: there's a roadmap. How driven were you to be successful?

932
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:43,680
Speaker 2: And how successful, well, you know I was. I was

933
01:00:43,800 --> 01:00:48,080
Speaker 2: highly motivated, I would say. And then when I met

934
01:00:48,120 --> 01:00:52,520
Speaker 2: Gary Richrath, the late great Gary Richrath, who, by the way,

935
01:00:53,560 --> 01:00:55,800
Speaker 2: if I if I might, if I might, if I

936
01:00:55,880 --> 01:01:01,960
Speaker 2: made divert for a moment, Gary Richrath belongs in the

937
01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:07,520
Speaker 2: conversation of the great rock guitarists of all time, and

938
01:01:07,640 --> 01:01:12,760
Speaker 2: he's never mentioned in that conversation. And it's I feel

939
01:01:12,800 --> 01:01:18,520
Speaker 2: like it's a it's a uh, it's just not right. Gary. Uh.

940
01:01:18,720 --> 01:01:23,160
Speaker 2: Gary was a stone cold rock star. He the way

941
01:01:23,200 --> 01:01:26,400
Speaker 2: he played the guitar. I mean, I wouldn't call him

942
01:01:26,400 --> 01:01:30,120
Speaker 2: a virtuoso. I'm the guitar. There's no one Anario Speedwagon

943
01:01:30,160 --> 01:01:34,800
Speaker 2: who's a virtuoso. That's not what we do. I'll leave

944
01:01:34,840 --> 01:01:38,000
Speaker 2: that for for for Lucather, you know, and and and

945
01:01:38,920 --> 01:01:41,160
Speaker 2: you know Luke is just you know, one of my favorites.

946
01:01:41,200 --> 01:01:44,960
Speaker 2: But anyway, but Gary, man, if you think back the

947
01:01:45,000 --> 01:01:49,320
Speaker 2: way he held that those less Pauls. He just he

948
01:01:49,600 --> 01:01:53,920
Speaker 2: caressed them, he danced with them. He that he became

949
01:01:54,120 --> 01:01:58,320
Speaker 2: one with that instrument. Uh And and his stage presence

950
01:01:58,440 --> 01:02:03,080
Speaker 2: was so magnetic that he could literally stand on stage

951
01:02:03,720 --> 01:02:07,120
Speaker 2: and with he wasn't a singer, he didn't even have

952
01:02:07,160 --> 01:02:09,800
Speaker 2: a vocal mic. He just stood on stage. We all

953
01:02:09,840 --> 01:02:12,400
Speaker 2: went back to the dressing room and you know, had

954
01:02:12,400 --> 01:02:15,200
Speaker 2: a snack, and he stood out there in front of

955
01:02:15,400 --> 01:02:20,280
Speaker 2: twenty thousand and fifty thousand people and held them transfixed

956
01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:25,560
Speaker 2: for like a ten minute instrumental solo electric guitar with

957
01:02:26,400 --> 01:02:30,720
Speaker 2: a Les paul a coil cord plugged directly into a

958
01:02:30,760 --> 01:02:34,480
Speaker 2: Marshall stack and a wah wah pedal in between, and

959
01:02:34,520 --> 01:02:38,880
Speaker 2: that's it. And this guy, man, he was amazing. But

960
01:02:39,720 --> 01:02:44,360
Speaker 2: when I met him in nineteen seventy two, I found

961
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:50,280
Speaker 2: someone who was equally as driven as I was, which

962
01:02:50,360 --> 01:02:56,920
Speaker 2: I'd never experienced before. And you know, and together, I

963
01:02:56,960 --> 01:02:59,320
Speaker 2: mean we were you know, we were chalk and cheese

964
01:02:59,360 --> 01:03:04,880
Speaker 2: and so many but but together when you know, when

965
01:03:05,000 --> 01:03:09,400
Speaker 2: when we finally kind of figured it out and it

966
01:03:09,440 --> 01:03:12,680
Speaker 2: didn't last long, it was you know, it was two

967
01:03:12,840 --> 01:03:15,000
Speaker 2: you know, kind of two ships passing in the night

968
01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:20,200
Speaker 2: ish but for those few years between seventy eight and

969
01:03:20,840 --> 01:03:25,280
Speaker 2: you know, eighty two. Man, we were just firing on

970
01:03:25,320 --> 01:03:30,960
Speaker 2: all cylinders. It was just working. And and I'm I'm

971
01:03:31,000 --> 01:03:35,880
Speaker 2: so thankful, so grateful that my life that I just

972
01:03:36,080 --> 01:03:38,600
Speaker 2: it was so lucky. The way I met rich Rath

973
01:03:38,880 --> 01:03:43,960
Speaker 2: was it was just so lucky. It it it came

974
01:03:44,120 --> 01:03:47,760
Speaker 2: from my drive, I will say that. But still, you know,

975
01:03:47,800 --> 01:03:50,800
Speaker 2: having drive is important. You also got to get lucky.

976
01:03:50,960 --> 01:03:56,840
Speaker 2: And you know, I've had so many instances, and you know,

977
01:03:56,880 --> 01:03:59,840
Speaker 2: when you write a book, you kind of relive your

978
01:03:59,840 --> 01:04:02,880
Speaker 2: life life, and you know, you go, you know, when

979
01:04:03,000 --> 01:04:07,040
Speaker 2: something happens, you don't know the you know, the significance

980
01:04:07,160 --> 01:04:10,120
Speaker 2: that it might have. You know, when you're when you

981
01:04:10,200 --> 01:04:14,240
Speaker 2: look at your life in retrospect and I go, there's

982
01:04:14,360 --> 01:04:17,680
Speaker 2: just too many times where I just happen to be

983
01:04:18,080 --> 01:04:19,960
Speaker 2: in the talk about it, in the right place, at

984
01:04:20,000 --> 01:04:25,040
Speaker 2: the right time, and I'm just I'm just so thankful

985
01:04:25,120 --> 01:04:27,640
Speaker 2: for that. I'm just so so grateful for it. And

986
01:04:27,880 --> 01:04:29,480
Speaker 2: you know, then of course you got to be ready

987
01:04:29,480 --> 01:04:31,560
Speaker 2: for the luck when it hits, you know, And I

988
01:04:31,600 --> 01:04:34,880
Speaker 2: guess I got to take credit for that side of it,

989
01:04:34,920 --> 01:04:39,080
Speaker 2: because you know, I'm Bob, I there's a lot of

990
01:04:39,120 --> 01:04:42,600
Speaker 2: people who want to be in rock bands, a lot

991
01:04:42,680 --> 01:04:44,640
Speaker 2: of people who want to be famous, a lot of

992
01:04:44,640 --> 01:04:47,880
Speaker 2: people who you know, want to be a star. And

993
01:04:47,920 --> 01:04:53,040
Speaker 2: then there are those of us who need it. It's

994
01:04:53,080 --> 01:04:57,040
Speaker 2: like it's like survival. It's like, I don't know what

995
01:04:57,360 --> 01:05:01,760
Speaker 2: would have happened to me if, if, if, if, if

996
01:05:01,800 --> 01:05:04,360
Speaker 2: my life hadn't worked out the way it did. I I,

997
01:05:06,000 --> 01:05:09,160
Speaker 2: you know, I have nightmares about, you know, what would

998
01:05:09,160 --> 01:05:15,439
Speaker 2: have happened. And uh so I'm thankful every day every

999
01:05:15,480 --> 01:05:19,600
Speaker 2: time I walk out on stage. I I just have this,

1000
01:05:20,880 --> 01:05:24,360
Speaker 2: uh this feeling that I'm going to give this audience

1001
01:05:24,680 --> 01:05:28,960
Speaker 2: every freaking ounce of my energy tonight. And and because

1002
01:05:28,960 --> 01:05:33,600
Speaker 2: I'm so lucky that people are willing to spend their

1003
01:05:33,600 --> 01:05:37,120
Speaker 2: hard earned money to come and and and hear our

1004
01:05:37,160 --> 01:05:40,160
Speaker 2: songs and hear us perform them. You know, I never

1005
01:05:40,240 --> 01:05:41,200
Speaker 2: take that for granted.

1006
01:05:48,160 --> 01:05:50,920
Speaker 1: Rich Rath was in the band, he's unfortunately no longer

1007
01:05:50,920 --> 01:05:53,560
Speaker 1: with us, but then he was out of the band.

1008
01:05:53,960 --> 01:05:57,480
Speaker 1: What happened there, well, that's you know, that's a.

1009
01:05:59,160 --> 01:06:01,720
Speaker 2: Lot of what my book because about. Honestly, that about

1010
01:06:01,720 --> 01:06:04,920
Speaker 2: the relationship between Gary and I, because it was it

1011
01:06:04,960 --> 01:06:09,320
Speaker 2: was it was definitely Uh, you know, as Ash as

1012
01:06:09,440 --> 01:06:14,480
Speaker 2: Keith Richards famously said, a love hate relationship, Uh he

1013
01:06:14,560 --> 01:06:20,520
Speaker 2: loves me, I hate him. And you know, and Gary

1014
01:06:20,560 --> 01:06:23,880
Speaker 2: and I were we were you know, you hear the

1015
01:06:23,920 --> 01:06:28,240
Speaker 2: stories of the lead singer, lead guitar player things, you know,

1016
01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:31,800
Speaker 2: from from Tyler and Perry to Page and Plant. And

1017
01:06:31,840 --> 01:06:34,680
Speaker 2: not that I'm comparing Gary and I to either of

1018
01:06:34,720 --> 01:06:40,240
Speaker 2: those those amazing duos, but inasmuch as we were, we

1019
01:06:40,320 --> 01:06:43,640
Speaker 2: loved each other like brothers, and we fought like brothers,

1020
01:06:43,840 --> 01:06:48,200
Speaker 2: and we both wanted what was best for the band.

1021
01:06:48,680 --> 01:06:51,840
Speaker 2: We just didn't always agree on what that was. But

1022
01:06:52,440 --> 01:06:55,440
Speaker 2: like I say, for those for that for that period,

1023
01:06:55,480 --> 01:06:58,880
Speaker 2: there those few years where it was just really firing

1024
01:06:58,920 --> 01:07:03,680
Speaker 2: on all cylinders. Uh, that was that was something special.

1025
01:07:04,560 --> 01:07:09,440
Speaker 2: And I mean, how can I how can I how

1026
01:07:09,480 --> 01:07:12,760
Speaker 2: can I say? How can I answer your question in

1027
01:07:12,880 --> 01:07:16,520
Speaker 2: a with with without a book? I guess you know,

1028
01:07:16,680 --> 01:07:20,760
Speaker 2: if you look at at artists or as lead singer

1029
01:07:20,800 --> 01:07:26,800
Speaker 2: guitarist combos, as they're each a piece of sand paper

1030
01:07:27,320 --> 01:07:30,600
Speaker 2: and and and there. So there's the there's this friction

1031
01:07:30,800 --> 01:07:35,360
Speaker 2: that happens when when they come together, and those sparks

1032
01:07:35,680 --> 01:07:40,840
Speaker 2: are something that would not happen without each other, and

1033
01:07:40,840 --> 01:07:45,080
Speaker 2: and and uh, you know, my songs definitely needed a

1034
01:07:45,600 --> 01:07:48,920
Speaker 2: shot of Rich Rath rock and roll energy, and his

1035
01:07:49,120 --> 01:07:53,680
Speaker 2: songs needed a shot of my singer songwriter uh, you know,

1036
01:07:54,000 --> 01:07:58,960
Speaker 2: kind of folk singer energy. And at some point, uh,

1037
01:07:59,760 --> 01:08:04,120
Speaker 2: the s and paper wasn't the sparks weren't flying anymore,

1038
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:13,080
Speaker 2: and I and I saw it happen, and I I

1039
01:08:13,280 --> 01:08:18,960
Speaker 2: tried my best. I probably could have tried harder in retrospect,

1040
01:08:19,520 --> 01:08:27,040
Speaker 2: but I finally just got to the point where I

1041
01:08:27,080 --> 01:08:30,960
Speaker 2: had a conversation with Gary, who had been my musical

1042
01:08:31,000 --> 01:08:35,400
Speaker 2: partner for this was nineteen eighty nine, so since nineteen

1043
01:08:35,680 --> 01:08:39,600
Speaker 2: on and off since nineteen seventy two, and I just

1044
01:08:40,240 --> 01:08:47,320
Speaker 2: told him that I couldn't do it anymore. And and

1045
01:08:47,400 --> 01:08:49,519
Speaker 2: I couldn't you know that there was a there was

1046
01:08:49,520 --> 01:08:53,920
Speaker 2: an Rio album on the horizon, and I, you know,

1047
01:08:54,479 --> 01:08:57,000
Speaker 2: this is after I had met Stephen Stills and we'd

1048
01:08:57,040 --> 01:09:00,400
Speaker 2: written a song together, and I had this side project,

1049
01:09:00,960 --> 01:09:04,240
Speaker 2: you know, a ten piece band with horns and background singers,

1050
01:09:04,280 --> 01:09:07,720
Speaker 2: you know, called the Strolling Dudes, that that played out

1051
01:09:07,720 --> 01:09:12,200
Speaker 2: of trencas and played little bars around l A and

1052
01:09:12,200 --> 01:09:16,320
Speaker 2: and but with amazing musicians. I mean Graham Lear on drums,

1053
01:09:17,280 --> 01:09:21,760
Speaker 2: Ricky brown On on trumpet, Steve Grove on sacks, got

1054
01:09:21,840 --> 01:09:27,120
Speaker 2: guys that, uh, you know that were just just amazing musicians,

1055
01:09:27,680 --> 01:09:30,680
Speaker 2: including Bruce Hall, the bass player from Ario. He was

1056
01:09:30,720 --> 01:09:34,439
Speaker 2: a member of the Dudes too. Uh. And so then

1057
01:09:34,720 --> 01:09:37,840
Speaker 2: the thought I was having so much fun just being

1058
01:09:38,120 --> 01:09:43,439
Speaker 2: free and playing you know, different, I wrote different types

1059
01:09:43,479 --> 01:09:47,280
Speaker 2: of songs and and I just felt like, uh, and

1060
01:09:47,320 --> 01:09:50,519
Speaker 2: then the thought of going back in the studio for

1061
01:09:50,560 --> 01:09:55,639
Speaker 2: another Ario Speedwagon record just felt like, oh boy, okay,

1062
01:09:55,680 --> 01:09:58,759
Speaker 2: here we go. It just it just I wasn't excited

1063
01:09:58,800 --> 01:10:01,480
Speaker 2: about it. I wasn't in spa aired about it, and

1064
01:10:01,479 --> 01:10:05,640
Speaker 2: and and part of it was that, you know, the

1065
01:10:06,080 --> 01:10:10,800
Speaker 2: partnership between Gary and I just wasn't wasn't it wasn't

1066
01:10:10,840 --> 01:10:13,679
Speaker 2: firing on all cylinders, and it was it was actually

1067
01:10:13,840 --> 01:10:21,160
Speaker 2: a little bit of a drag. And so that's what happened. Honestly,

1068
01:10:22,840 --> 01:10:28,200
Speaker 2: I never thought that that Gary's hiatus Fromario Speedwagon would

1069
01:10:28,240 --> 01:10:31,200
Speaker 2: be permanent. I thought it would be like mine, you know,

1070
01:10:31,920 --> 01:10:34,120
Speaker 2: you know, I got kicked out of the band in

1071
01:10:34,680 --> 01:10:39,280
Speaker 2: nineteen seventy three. Took a couple of years to figure

1072
01:10:39,560 --> 01:10:42,960
Speaker 2: out some things that I needed to figure out about

1073
01:10:43,000 --> 01:10:47,439
Speaker 2: myself and when I got back in the band, it

1074
01:10:47,520 --> 01:10:50,400
Speaker 2: was better than ever. So that's kind of what I

1075
01:10:50,560 --> 01:10:54,920
Speaker 2: thought would happen with Gary, but it never did. And

1076
01:10:56,160 --> 01:11:02,320
Speaker 2: you know, God, you know, I uh, you know, I

1077
01:11:02,360 --> 01:11:04,800
Speaker 2: look back and I go, man, you know, could I

1078
01:11:04,800 --> 01:11:08,360
Speaker 2: have tried harder? Could I have What is there more

1079
01:11:08,400 --> 01:11:11,640
Speaker 2: that I that I could have done to help the situation?

1080
01:11:12,360 --> 01:11:18,160
Speaker 2: And you know, you always look at things that way

1081
01:11:18,240 --> 01:11:21,439
Speaker 2: in the rear view mirror. But at the time, Uh,

1082
01:11:22,439 --> 01:11:25,280
Speaker 2: I was just I was just out of gas, man,

1083
01:11:25,479 --> 01:11:27,799
Speaker 2: I just I just couldn't do it anymore.

1084
01:11:29,000 --> 01:11:32,360
Speaker 1: And to what degree was he resentful? And to what

1085
01:11:32,439 --> 01:11:35,599
Speaker 1: degree did you have any contact for the ensuing decades?

1086
01:11:35,680 --> 01:11:38,439
Speaker 1: Ultimately you played a couple of you know times on

1087
01:11:38,520 --> 01:11:42,720
Speaker 1: stage with you long after this incident, But was it

1088
01:11:42,840 --> 01:11:45,840
Speaker 1: pretty much final and you had no contact? And was

1089
01:11:45,880 --> 01:11:46,759
Speaker 1: he pissed off?

1090
01:11:48,280 --> 01:11:50,519
Speaker 2: You know, that's a good question, Bob. We we had,

1091
01:11:51,000 --> 01:11:56,320
Speaker 2: we had occasional contact, and uh, you know, Gary came

1092
01:11:56,360 --> 01:12:00,479
Speaker 2: out to some shows when we played the old Universal

1093
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:03,320
Speaker 2: Amphitheater in LA and just sat in on a couple

1094
01:12:03,320 --> 01:12:08,680
Speaker 2: of songs. And you know, the way Ario Speedwagon has

1095
01:12:08,720 --> 01:12:11,880
Speaker 2: always worked is that you know, there have been a

1096
01:12:11,960 --> 01:12:15,320
Speaker 2: number of people in the band. You know, I'm one

1097
01:12:15,360 --> 01:12:21,960
Speaker 2: of three lead singers, you know, and even crew guys,

1098
01:12:22,040 --> 01:12:24,759
Speaker 2: and anyone who's ever been in the band is always welcome.

1099
01:12:24,920 --> 01:12:27,280
Speaker 2: It's like, oh yeah, well yeah he was. He was

1100
01:12:27,320 --> 01:12:30,400
Speaker 2: my guitar tech and you know, nineteen seventy seven. Yeah,

1101
01:12:30,720 --> 01:12:32,479
Speaker 2: give him a pass, get him in here, you know.

1102
01:12:33,920 --> 01:12:39,000
Speaker 2: So so there was there was that Gary and I

1103
01:12:39,040 --> 01:12:44,720
Speaker 2: had a couple of soulful conversations over those years. Uh

1104
01:12:44,960 --> 01:12:48,840
Speaker 2: and and they always kind of ended in the same

1105
01:12:48,920 --> 01:12:54,120
Speaker 2: way where uh, you know, I would I would just

1106
01:12:54,280 --> 01:12:59,880
Speaker 2: try to motivate him and and and inspire him in

1107
01:13:00,160 --> 01:13:04,439
Speaker 2: some way. Uh and in it Uh, it just never

1108
01:13:04,880 --> 01:13:10,680
Speaker 2: never quite happened. But he was never he never expressed.

1109
01:13:11,800 --> 01:13:14,960
Speaker 2: I mean, the last time that I saw him was

1110
01:13:15,080 --> 01:13:18,439
Speaker 2: at a benefit show that we did in Illinois for

1111
01:13:18,439 --> 01:13:22,759
Speaker 2: for that horrible uh tornado that that came through Washington,

1112
01:13:22,800 --> 01:13:26,120
Speaker 2: Illinois and just decimated the town. It was right near

1113
01:13:26,160 --> 01:13:29,759
Speaker 2: where Gary grew up, and uh, and he had moved

1114
01:13:29,800 --> 01:13:32,160
Speaker 2: back there. He had moved back to Peoria, which I

1115
01:13:32,200 --> 01:13:34,439
Speaker 2: thought was gonna be great for him, you know, get

1116
01:13:34,439 --> 01:13:37,920
Speaker 2: out of la get out of the shadow of Ario speedwagon,

1117
01:13:38,040 --> 01:13:40,799
Speaker 2: you know, come back to the Midwest where everybody loves

1118
01:13:40,840 --> 01:13:45,960
Speaker 2: you and knows you. And so he came out to

1119
01:13:45,960 --> 01:13:49,559
Speaker 2: to to that show and and we were able to

1120
01:13:51,320 --> 01:13:56,439
Speaker 2: we just had a moment and and I didn't sense

1121
01:13:56,720 --> 01:14:01,640
Speaker 2: I didn't sense any anger. I sensed I sent some sadness.

1122
01:14:01,960 --> 01:14:06,080
Speaker 2: You know. We looked into each other's eyes right before

1123
01:14:06,120 --> 01:14:10,280
Speaker 2: we went on stage, and there was a there was

1124
01:14:10,360 --> 01:14:13,280
Speaker 2: definitely a certain sadness there. I felt it too, and

1125
01:14:13,680 --> 01:14:16,439
Speaker 2: I know he did. And uh, you know, the thing

1126
01:14:16,560 --> 01:14:20,760
Speaker 2: is that the band has had such a resurgence over

1127
01:14:20,800 --> 01:14:28,040
Speaker 2: the past I don't know, fifteen twenty years that and

1128
01:14:28,520 --> 01:14:30,760
Speaker 2: none of this would have happened without Gary. You know,

1129
01:14:30,840 --> 01:14:34,400
Speaker 2: he was he was the guy that got Ario Speedwagon signed.

1130
01:14:34,600 --> 01:14:39,599
Speaker 2: You know, Irving Irving saw Gary Richrath and and he

1131
01:14:39,720 --> 01:14:43,559
Speaker 2: was like he knew Irving knows a star when he

1132
01:14:43,600 --> 01:14:48,680
Speaker 2: sees one. And and and so you know, I just

1133
01:14:49,920 --> 01:14:54,759
Speaker 2: it's a bummer that Gary is not here, that hasn't

1134
01:14:54,760 --> 01:14:57,479
Speaker 2: been here for the past twenty years of the of

1135
01:14:57,520 --> 01:15:02,240
Speaker 2: this resurgence of the band. Now, maybe the band wouldn't

1136
01:15:02,280 --> 01:15:05,280
Speaker 2: have had a resurgence if Gary was there, But I

1137
01:15:05,320 --> 01:15:07,960
Speaker 2: always hoped that getting away from it for a while,

1138
01:15:08,040 --> 01:15:11,479
Speaker 2: maybe he'd you know, as I did when I was

1139
01:15:11,520 --> 01:15:15,559
Speaker 2: out of the band, bottom out and realized that, you know,

1140
01:15:16,120 --> 01:15:18,559
Speaker 2: you want your gig back, you know, That's what happened

1141
01:15:18,560 --> 01:15:21,120
Speaker 2: to me. I went and saw him. There was a

1142
01:15:21,160 --> 01:15:23,320
Speaker 2: show in West Palm Beach now just happened to be

1143
01:15:23,400 --> 01:15:25,439
Speaker 2: in town, and I showed up the dressing room, and

1144
01:15:26,040 --> 01:15:28,960
Speaker 2: you know, hadn't seen the guys in a couple of years,

1145
01:15:29,720 --> 01:15:33,720
Speaker 2: and it was like old times. And I watched the

1146
01:15:33,760 --> 01:15:38,280
Speaker 2: show from the stage right wing. And the guy who

1147
01:15:38,320 --> 01:15:44,639
Speaker 2: replaced me, Mike Murphy, champagne guy, extremely talented, like great

1148
01:15:46,040 --> 01:15:50,000
Speaker 2: blues and R and B singer played, played a good guitar,

1149
01:15:50,280 --> 01:15:54,479
Speaker 2: good piano. But I watched it, man, and I'm like,

1150
01:15:56,320 --> 01:15:58,960
Speaker 2: it didn't seem like a Reo speedwagon, you know, with

1151
01:15:59,479 --> 01:16:02,680
Speaker 2: Murphy's as good as he is, you know, it was

1152
01:16:02,840 --> 01:16:07,320
Speaker 2: just such a stylistic mismatch. And I was like, wait

1153
01:16:07,360 --> 01:16:10,920
Speaker 2: a minute, that was my gig and I let it

1154
01:16:10,960 --> 01:16:14,120
Speaker 2: slip away, and I want it back, and I'm gonna,

1155
01:16:14,240 --> 01:16:16,439
Speaker 2: I'm gonna. I don't know how it's gonna happen, but

1156
01:16:17,240 --> 01:16:20,840
Speaker 2: uh it did. And uh so that's what I thought

1157
01:16:20,840 --> 01:16:25,360
Speaker 2: would happened with Gary, and it just didn't happen.

1158
01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:29,080
Speaker 1: And yeah, okay, tell us a little bit more about

1159
01:16:29,120 --> 01:16:31,320
Speaker 1: how you got kicked out and how you got back in.

1160
01:16:32,680 --> 01:16:35,000
Speaker 2: I knew when I said kicked out that that you would.

1161
01:16:35,240 --> 01:16:37,479
Speaker 1: I never knew you were kicked out. I thought you left.

1162
01:16:37,520 --> 01:16:38,880
Speaker 1: But now since you brought it.

1163
01:16:38,920 --> 01:16:43,960
Speaker 2: Up, well, you know, yeah, I always kind of described

1164
01:16:44,000 --> 01:16:47,880
Speaker 2: it as, uh as that we had the creative differences

1165
01:16:47,920 --> 01:16:50,880
Speaker 2: arose during the during the recording of the Ride and

1166
01:16:50,920 --> 01:16:55,040
Speaker 2: the Starmut album, uh, which led to me leaving the band.

1167
01:16:56,320 --> 01:17:03,680
Speaker 2: That's not false, but uh, but really what happened was,

1168
01:17:03,880 --> 01:17:08,120
Speaker 2: you know, I you know, I had always played in

1169
01:17:08,160 --> 01:17:10,960
Speaker 2: the bands before Ario Speedwagon that I played in, you know,

1170
01:17:11,320 --> 01:17:14,160
Speaker 2: like my band in like high school and early college.

1171
01:17:14,400 --> 01:17:18,040
Speaker 2: We we had way more in common with Buffalo Springfield

1172
01:17:18,439 --> 01:17:21,439
Speaker 2: than we did with Deep Purple, you know. And so

1173
01:17:21,520 --> 01:17:24,000
Speaker 2: when I joined and I was never a lead singer.

1174
01:17:24,040 --> 01:17:26,960
Speaker 2: I was always just one of the I you know,

1175
01:17:27,000 --> 01:17:29,680
Speaker 2: I'd sing lead on some songs, but we all my

1176
01:17:29,760 --> 01:17:33,599
Speaker 2: band always had three singers with three part harmony, and

1177
01:17:33,880 --> 01:17:38,320
Speaker 2: so that's what I was used to. So when when, uh,

1178
01:17:38,520 --> 01:17:41,599
Speaker 2: when I went out and saw Ario Speedwagon after I

1179
01:17:41,640 --> 01:17:45,600
Speaker 2: met Gary, uh, I was like, wow, I got to

1180
01:17:45,640 --> 01:17:48,720
Speaker 2: sing every song? How's that going to And they were loud, man,

1181
01:17:48,800 --> 01:17:53,080
Speaker 2: these guys played loud. So I ended up having vocal

1182
01:17:53,120 --> 01:17:58,560
Speaker 2: problems and uh uh you know, I went to a

1183
01:17:58,800 --> 01:18:02,440
Speaker 2: doctor and Champagne kind of on the sly and he

1184
01:18:02,439 --> 01:18:06,640
Speaker 2: he diagnosed a nodule on my left vocal cord and

1185
01:18:06,720 --> 01:18:10,600
Speaker 2: said that the only way to cure it was to

1186
01:18:11,320 --> 01:18:16,519
Speaker 2: not uh not talk for three weeks and not sing

1187
01:18:16,640 --> 01:18:18,680
Speaker 2: for six weeks. And here I am, I've been in

1188
01:18:18,720 --> 01:18:21,600
Speaker 2: the band for a year that were headed out to

1189
01:18:21,600 --> 01:18:24,400
Speaker 2: California to make an album. How how's this going to work?

1190
01:18:25,040 --> 01:18:29,920
Speaker 2: And of course, my stupid coping mechanism was to stuff it,

1191
01:18:30,120 --> 01:18:32,920
Speaker 2: you know, not tell anybody, uh you know, keep it

1192
01:18:32,960 --> 01:18:38,200
Speaker 2: a secret. And and so I started not singing at rehearsals,

1193
01:18:38,640 --> 01:18:41,080
Speaker 2: you know, only you know, kind of isolating so I

1194
01:18:41,080 --> 01:18:43,600
Speaker 2: wouldn't have to talk. So everyone in the band just

1195
01:18:43,640 --> 01:18:46,519
Speaker 2: thought I was being a dick, but really I was

1196
01:18:46,560 --> 01:18:49,400
Speaker 2: just trying to save my voice. And but they had

1197
01:18:49,439 --> 01:18:51,719
Speaker 2: no idea that I was trying to save my voice

1198
01:18:51,760 --> 01:18:53,760
Speaker 2: because I was afraid if I told him that they

1199
01:18:53,880 --> 01:18:57,439
Speaker 2: kicked me out of the band. So you know, uh,

1200
01:18:57,760 --> 01:19:00,840
Speaker 2: you know that it caught up to me and uh

1201
01:19:00,960 --> 01:19:05,320
Speaker 2: and uh uh and so so Murphy came in and

1202
01:19:05,720 --> 01:19:08,439
Speaker 2: took over. But yeah, I you know, I can't say

1203
01:19:08,439 --> 01:19:11,800
Speaker 2: that it was a mutual decision, but I will say

1204
01:19:11,840 --> 01:19:15,559
Speaker 2: that I was in no position to argue the point.

1205
01:19:15,760 --> 01:19:18,880
Speaker 2: You know, I knew that I didn't write my best

1206
01:19:18,920 --> 01:19:22,160
Speaker 2: songs for the Ride in the Stormont album, and I

1207
01:19:22,600 --> 01:19:24,599
Speaker 2: couldn't sing. So how do you how do you keep

1208
01:19:24,640 --> 01:19:27,200
Speaker 2: a gig as a lead singer when your vocal cords

1209
01:19:27,200 --> 01:19:28,680
Speaker 2: are are compromised? You know?

1210
01:19:28,840 --> 01:19:33,479
Speaker 1: So yeah, so what did you do in the ensuing

1211
01:19:33,520 --> 01:19:35,800
Speaker 1: two years? And how did you literally get back in.

1212
01:19:36,840 --> 01:19:41,240
Speaker 2: Well, for for about for about a year. Yeah, I

1213
01:19:41,280 --> 01:19:44,240
Speaker 2: went to Colorado. I lived in up in Evergreen for

1214
01:19:44,280 --> 01:19:49,800
Speaker 2: a couple of months, didn't sing at all. And then

1215
01:19:49,840 --> 01:19:52,160
Speaker 2: it occurred to me, you know, up in the in

1216
01:19:52,200 --> 01:19:56,080
Speaker 2: the fresh air of Evergreen, Colorado, that I had gotten

1217
01:19:56,600 --> 01:20:01,360
Speaker 2: one opinion on my vocal cords, and and that caused

1218
01:20:01,400 --> 01:20:04,559
Speaker 2: me caused my life to change in a way that

1219
01:20:04,560 --> 01:20:08,240
Speaker 2: that was devastating. I'm like, well, maybe I should get

1220
01:20:08,280 --> 01:20:12,120
Speaker 2: another opinion, and so I went to went into Denver.

1221
01:20:12,520 --> 01:20:15,000
Speaker 2: I made a couple of appointments. When into Denver, saw

1222
01:20:15,080 --> 01:20:18,920
Speaker 2: two voice specialists and They're like, I don't know what

1223
01:20:18,960 --> 01:20:23,519
Speaker 2: you're talking about. There's you. There's no vocal nods nodules now,

1224
01:20:23,680 --> 01:20:27,800
Speaker 2: nor is there any evidence that there ever was. I'm like,

1225
01:20:28,360 --> 01:20:31,280
Speaker 2: then this is two different guys. I'm like, oh, great,

1226
01:20:31,680 --> 01:20:35,599
Speaker 2: now you tell me right. So, yeah, I went back

1227
01:20:35,640 --> 01:20:40,800
Speaker 2: to Chicago, tried to tried for a career as a

1228
01:20:40,800 --> 01:20:44,960
Speaker 2: solo artist. I was working with Bill Trout. Do you

1229
01:20:45,040 --> 01:20:48,120
Speaker 2: remember Bill Trout? He was the president of Wooden Nickel

1230
01:20:48,160 --> 01:20:51,720
Speaker 2: Records in Chicago. Yeah, you know, and Bill was he

1231
01:20:51,840 --> 01:20:53,840
Speaker 2: was a character. He was. He was part of the

1232
01:20:53,880 --> 01:20:57,879
Speaker 2: company that released the first Beatles album on VJA Records

1233
01:20:57,880 --> 01:21:01,200
Speaker 2: out of Chicago, and he parlayed into a deal with

1234
01:21:01,320 --> 01:21:03,600
Speaker 2: I think r c A what Wooden Nickel was a

1235
01:21:03,720 --> 01:21:09,800
Speaker 2: boutique label in RCA signed Sticks and and then so

1236
01:21:09,840 --> 01:21:12,760
Speaker 2: he acted as my attorney and uh, the late great

1237
01:21:12,800 --> 01:21:15,800
Speaker 2: Gary Luaiso from the from the American Breed, the other

1238
01:21:15,880 --> 01:21:19,000
Speaker 2: guy that sang Bend Me, Shape Me and produced a

1239
01:21:19,000 --> 01:21:23,000
Speaker 2: bunch of Sticks Records. I was his first production client

1240
01:21:23,120 --> 01:21:27,240
Speaker 2: in his garage in UH in Oaklhom, Illinois. And UH,

1241
01:21:27,320 --> 01:21:31,000
Speaker 2: and so we went about the UH tried to get

1242
01:21:31,040 --> 01:21:34,920
Speaker 2: me a solo deal and it just it didn't happen,

1243
01:21:35,920 --> 01:21:41,559
Speaker 2: and that was devastating because I thought, you know, when

1244
01:21:41,640 --> 01:21:44,680
Speaker 2: when I got away from Rio, I was like, this

1245
01:21:44,800 --> 01:21:46,679
Speaker 2: is the best thing that ever happened to me. I've

1246
01:21:47,200 --> 01:21:50,080
Speaker 2: I'm kind of well known. Now I had a couple

1247
01:21:50,120 --> 01:21:53,840
Speaker 2: of songs that did decent on the Rio. Well, now

1248
01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:55,439
Speaker 2: I'm going to be able to do what I really

1249
01:21:55,479 --> 01:21:58,639
Speaker 2: want to do, which is play you know, folk rock

1250
01:21:58,720 --> 01:22:01,880
Speaker 2: in harmony and you know, you know, more of a

1251
01:22:01,920 --> 01:22:05,680
Speaker 2: Stephen Stills type character. You know that that was my

1252
01:22:05,800 --> 01:22:10,680
Speaker 2: fantasy of myself and it just didn't work. Uh uh

1253
01:22:10,840 --> 01:22:14,080
Speaker 2: you know, you know I I uh so that was

1254
01:22:14,160 --> 01:22:20,240
Speaker 2: devastating and that sent me definitely into a funk. And

1255
01:22:20,360 --> 01:22:25,200
Speaker 2: uh and I spent almost a year just you know,

1256
01:22:25,280 --> 01:22:28,400
Speaker 2: going down to Bill Trout's office waiting for the phone

1257
01:22:28,439 --> 01:22:32,600
Speaker 2: to ring, uh you know, and uh you know, and

1258
01:22:32,640 --> 01:22:35,760
Speaker 2: then going back to my apartment up on the north

1259
01:22:35,840 --> 01:22:39,519
Speaker 2: side of I was living alone, and uh, you know,

1260
01:22:39,840 --> 01:22:45,479
Speaker 2: I started isolating and it was just not a good thing.

1261
01:22:46,160 --> 01:22:51,759
Speaker 2: And then I, uh I met my first wife and

1262
01:22:51,760 --> 01:22:55,759
Speaker 2: and she was she was a musician, and she really

1263
01:22:56,360 --> 01:23:01,320
Speaker 2: uh uh just kind of said you you got to

1264
01:23:01,360 --> 01:23:05,760
Speaker 2: start working again. You you know, you know that this

1265
01:23:05,920 --> 01:23:09,120
Speaker 2: is enough enough already of sitting around, you know, feeling

1266
01:23:09,160 --> 01:23:14,280
Speaker 2: sorry for yourself. And so I started singing, Uh, started

1267
01:23:14,320 --> 01:23:19,639
Speaker 2: playing solo acoustic gigs around Chicago and really working at it, man,

1268
01:23:20,200 --> 01:23:23,400
Speaker 2: And and I learned a lot. I you know, I

1269
01:23:23,479 --> 01:23:27,120
Speaker 2: opened for for some some really good The thing about

1270
01:23:27,200 --> 01:23:30,880
Speaker 2: being a playing folk clubs is you've got to learn

1271
01:23:30,960 --> 01:23:33,960
Speaker 2: how to talk to an audience. You know, it's you

1272
01:23:34,000 --> 01:23:38,280
Speaker 2: know it. Playing the songs is important, but getting a

1273
01:23:38,280 --> 01:23:42,679
Speaker 2: few laughs in between, and and kind of you know, uh,

1274
01:23:42,960 --> 01:23:47,280
Speaker 2: getting the audience, uh invested in a song that they

1275
01:23:47,280 --> 01:23:50,200
Speaker 2: have never heard before, so so that they're more willing

1276
01:23:50,280 --> 01:23:52,439
Speaker 2: to listen to it just by a little story or

1277
01:23:52,439 --> 01:23:55,320
Speaker 2: whatever of how the song was written or what the

1278
01:23:55,360 --> 01:23:59,360
Speaker 2: song's about. Uh. And I really learned a lot about that.

1279
01:24:00,120 --> 01:24:03,160
Speaker 2: I opened for a bit a man who you remember,

1280
01:24:03,439 --> 01:24:06,400
Speaker 2: maybe maybe not too many of your listeners would called

1281
01:24:06,479 --> 01:24:09,840
Speaker 2: Mason Prophet. Of course they had a song, yeah two

1282
01:24:09,880 --> 01:24:15,280
Speaker 2: hangman and Terry Talbot was a master of work in

1283
01:24:15,320 --> 01:24:17,599
Speaker 2: an audience. And I would just sit back and watch

1284
01:24:17,680 --> 01:24:20,280
Speaker 2: him do it, man, and just soak it up. And

1285
01:24:21,320 --> 01:24:25,800
Speaker 2: so that show in West Palm Beach that I talked

1286
01:24:25,840 --> 01:24:31,120
Speaker 2: about where I saw the band Neil Dowdy shared something

1287
01:24:31,120 --> 01:24:33,800
Speaker 2: with me in the dressing room. He's like, we just

1288
01:24:33,880 --> 01:24:38,680
Speaker 2: got a a what do you call that? When a

1289
01:24:38,720 --> 01:24:45,240
Speaker 2: petition that started out of Fort Wayne, Indiana. This is

1290
01:24:45,280 --> 01:24:49,200
Speaker 2: before the Internet or iPhones or anything like that. It

1291
01:24:49,280 --> 01:24:53,000
Speaker 2: was actually on paper and there was like I thought,

1292
01:24:53,160 --> 01:24:56,799
Speaker 2: I thought he said fifteen thousand names, but that sounds

1293
01:24:57,439 --> 01:25:00,120
Speaker 2: that's got to be too many. But it was a

1294
01:25:00,200 --> 01:25:04,000
Speaker 2: large number of names who signed a petition for Ario

1295
01:25:04,080 --> 01:25:08,000
Speaker 2: Speedwagon to get back to the Rio two lineup, which

1296
01:25:08,160 --> 01:25:11,439
Speaker 2: was that that was the album I made with the band.

1297
01:25:12,160 --> 01:25:15,600
Speaker 2: And uh So when he told me that, I was like,

1298
01:25:16,240 --> 01:25:18,600
Speaker 2: that's interesting. I wonder why he's sharing that with me.

1299
01:25:19,320 --> 01:25:22,320
Speaker 2: And uh, a few months later I got the phone

1300
01:25:22,360 --> 01:25:28,200
Speaker 2: call and uh and it was kind of perfect timing because, uh,

1301
01:25:28,520 --> 01:25:31,920
Speaker 2: you know, my ego was knocked down to size by

1302
01:25:32,040 --> 01:25:35,599
Speaker 2: not getting the solo deal, but I learned so much

1303
01:25:35,680 --> 01:25:38,640
Speaker 2: from playing as a solo artist, and I brought that

1304
01:25:39,000 --> 01:25:42,640
Speaker 2: energy back into the into the band. Uh. And there

1305
01:25:42,720 --> 01:25:46,080
Speaker 2: was a and and their egos came down a notch

1306
01:25:46,080 --> 01:25:49,120
Speaker 2: because they thought they were gonna be that it didn't

1307
01:25:49,160 --> 01:25:51,880
Speaker 2: matter who the singer was, you know, Uh, that they

1308
01:25:51,920 --> 01:25:56,000
Speaker 2: were gonna but but that two album did way better

1309
01:25:56,160 --> 01:25:59,560
Speaker 2: than the than the album's subsequent albums. That with with

1310
01:25:59,760 --> 01:26:02,920
Speaker 2: Murphy singing, it just didn't it as great of a

1311
01:26:03,439 --> 01:26:06,840
Speaker 2: musician as he is, It just didn't. It didn't sound

1312
01:26:07,000 --> 01:26:11,960
Speaker 2: like Ario Speedwagon at all. And uh so I was

1313
01:26:12,040 --> 01:26:15,519
Speaker 2: ready when when the call came, the guys were ready

1314
01:26:15,680 --> 01:26:17,760
Speaker 2: and there was a there was a new you know.

1315
01:26:17,960 --> 01:26:20,479
Speaker 2: Gary Neal used to joke that they, you know, they

1316
01:26:21,000 --> 01:26:22,519
Speaker 2: picked me up out of the gutter and made me

1317
01:26:22,560 --> 01:26:25,960
Speaker 2: a star, and there was some truth to it. But

1318
01:26:26,880 --> 01:26:28,920
Speaker 2: but when I came back to the band, I knew

1319
01:26:28,960 --> 01:26:30,800
Speaker 2: it had to be on equal terms. It had to

1320
01:26:30,880 --> 01:26:33,400
Speaker 2: be you know, there there There couldn't be you know,

1321
01:26:33,479 --> 01:26:35,360
Speaker 2: there was no more on the new guy. So I

1322
01:26:35,439 --> 01:26:38,479
Speaker 2: don't get a say in what happened. You know, I

1323
01:26:38,640 --> 01:26:41,760
Speaker 2: needed to be an equal member of the band, and

1324
01:26:42,040 --> 01:26:44,400
Speaker 2: uh and I was and and it worked.

1325
01:26:51,120 --> 01:26:57,760
Speaker 1: Okay. From the outside, Ario Speedwagon was around forever perceived

1326
01:26:57,840 --> 01:27:01,640
Speaker 1: as a regional thing, but on a majorly epic and

1327
01:27:01,840 --> 01:27:05,840
Speaker 1: then roll with the changes happened with the can't tuna piano?

1328
01:27:06,160 --> 01:27:08,160
Speaker 1: You can tune a piano, we can tuna fish. That

1329
01:27:08,400 --> 01:27:11,240
Speaker 1: seemed to be a line of demarcation from the outside,

1330
01:27:11,880 --> 01:27:13,559
Speaker 1: what was going on on the inside.

1331
01:27:14,800 --> 01:27:18,840
Speaker 2: Well, the the that was the the Tuna album was

1332
01:27:19,200 --> 01:27:23,519
Speaker 2: was the first album that was self produced. We we

1333
01:27:23,640 --> 01:27:29,760
Speaker 2: had had a number of uh successful well known I

1334
01:27:29,840 --> 01:27:34,960
Speaker 2: mean Bill Halverson, Bill Simsic, John Stronik. I mean those

1335
01:27:35,080 --> 01:27:38,679
Speaker 2: three producers right there probably are you know between Eagles

1336
01:27:38,760 --> 01:27:43,360
Speaker 2: Hotel California and Joe Walsh. So what uh you know

1337
01:27:43,479 --> 01:27:45,920
Speaker 2: the first two Crosby, Stills and Nash albums. I mean,

1338
01:27:45,960 --> 01:27:50,400
Speaker 2: these guys obviously know what they're doing, but somehow it

1339
01:27:50,479 --> 01:27:56,360
Speaker 2: didn't work for us, And so we had Uh I've

1340
01:27:56,400 --> 01:27:59,600
Speaker 2: been back in the band for about two years. I

1341
01:27:59,680 --> 01:28:02,960
Speaker 2: had written rolled the changes. Time for me to fly

1342
01:28:03,320 --> 01:28:07,880
Speaker 2: blazing your own trail again. Gary had sing to me,

1343
01:28:08,680 --> 01:28:10,880
Speaker 2: uh say you love me, you r say good night.

1344
01:28:10,960 --> 01:28:13,040
Speaker 2: We had we had some We had some pretty We

1345
01:28:13,120 --> 01:28:15,720
Speaker 2: had a pretty strong group of songs that we were

1346
01:28:15,760 --> 01:28:21,040
Speaker 2: ready to record. And our fear was that if Epic

1347
01:28:21,280 --> 01:28:26,719
Speaker 2: assigned a producer to us, that the that that those goods,

1348
01:28:26,840 --> 01:28:29,400
Speaker 2: that those songs would get spoiled, and we didn't want

1349
01:28:29,439 --> 01:28:33,320
Speaker 2: to take any chances. So so Gary and I march

1350
01:28:33,400 --> 01:28:36,240
Speaker 2: into Ronald Luxembourg's office. He was the president of Epic

1351
01:28:36,280 --> 01:28:39,160
Speaker 2: at the time and lay down the law that that

1352
01:28:39,360 --> 01:28:42,759
Speaker 2: either we produced the next studio album or we refused

1353
01:28:42,800 --> 01:28:46,120
Speaker 2: to record. We never even got that far. We were

1354
01:28:46,200 --> 01:28:49,559
Speaker 2: sitting in a meeting with Ronald Luxembourg and and John

1355
01:28:49,640 --> 01:28:53,639
Speaker 2: Boylan was in the in the meeting, and Aluxembourg is like, hey,

1356
01:28:54,120 --> 01:28:56,000
Speaker 2: I think it's a great idea for you two to

1357
01:28:56,680 --> 01:28:59,720
Speaker 2: produce this record, but I just want John to be

1358
01:29:00,040 --> 01:29:02,599
Speaker 2: in the room with you. And you know, John had

1359
01:29:02,680 --> 01:29:06,800
Speaker 2: just come off Boston's debut album. And uh so to me,

1360
01:29:07,200 --> 01:29:10,439
Speaker 2: I was like, this is perfect. We're we have the

1361
01:29:11,160 --> 01:29:14,160
Speaker 2: freedom to to produce the album how we want to,

1362
01:29:14,520 --> 01:29:17,840
Speaker 2: and if we have problems, we got John Boylen's in

1363
01:29:17,920 --> 01:29:20,679
Speaker 2: the room with us. So it was really an ideal

1364
01:29:20,840 --> 01:29:26,200
Speaker 2: situation in many ways. And uh but yeah, so, uh

1365
01:29:26,760 --> 01:29:30,040
Speaker 2: so we were co producing and and I think that

1366
01:29:30,320 --> 01:29:35,600
Speaker 2: was the beginning of of Ario Speedwagon changing from you know,

1367
01:29:35,720 --> 01:29:39,720
Speaker 2: before I joined the band, they were straight ahead rock band. Man,

1368
01:29:39,800 --> 01:29:43,200
Speaker 2: they were just a solid you know. Original singer Terry

1369
01:29:43,280 --> 01:29:46,000
Speaker 2: Latreuell was a you know, had the mic stand moves

1370
01:29:46,040 --> 01:29:48,200
Speaker 2: and the raspy voice and the and the whole thing,

1371
01:29:48,320 --> 01:29:52,360
Speaker 2: you know, and and uh but you know, I knew

1372
01:29:52,400 --> 01:29:54,519
Speaker 2: that if if the band was going to survive with

1373
01:29:54,680 --> 01:29:58,120
Speaker 2: me in it, it would take some it would be uh,

1374
01:29:58,720 --> 01:30:01,960
Speaker 2: some give and take on both. And I think role

1375
01:30:02,000 --> 01:30:06,760
Speaker 2: with the Changes was the first the first hint of

1376
01:30:07,360 --> 01:30:12,240
Speaker 2: what Ario Speedwagon could become if if there was equal

1377
01:30:12,360 --> 01:30:17,639
Speaker 2: parts Gary's guitar power and the power of that rhythm

1378
01:30:17,720 --> 01:30:21,760
Speaker 2: section and a respect for me as a songwriter and

1379
01:30:21,880 --> 01:30:25,960
Speaker 2: the more melodic uh you know, paying attention to the

1380
01:30:26,080 --> 01:30:29,640
Speaker 2: lyrics a little bit more side of things. And that

1381
01:30:29,880 --> 01:30:33,360
Speaker 2: was when we first kind of the balance first started

1382
01:30:33,479 --> 01:30:36,800
Speaker 2: being found and roll with the changes? Was it.

1383
01:30:38,360 --> 01:30:43,680
Speaker 1: Okay? So you have this unbelievable success with high end fidelity,

1384
01:30:43,760 --> 01:30:49,599
Speaker 1: which you also referenced earlier. Few questions to amplify the question, Hey,

1385
01:30:50,080 --> 01:30:52,400
Speaker 1: seems like you're driven. You want to get to a goal.

1386
01:30:52,520 --> 01:30:55,479
Speaker 1: From anybody in the outside that's ringing the bell, there's

1387
01:30:55,520 --> 01:30:59,439
Speaker 1: nowhere really higher you can go. How did it affect

1388
01:30:59,520 --> 01:31:01,839
Speaker 1: you going forward? You have the moment of success?

1389
01:31:02,960 --> 01:31:04,760
Speaker 2: Uh is it? Then? Well?

1390
01:31:04,800 --> 01:31:06,160
Speaker 1: How am I going to maintain this?

1391
01:31:06,920 --> 01:31:07,080
Speaker 2: You know?

1392
01:31:07,320 --> 01:31:09,640
Speaker 1: How does it affect your mentality going forward to have

1393
01:31:09,720 --> 01:31:11,360
Speaker 1: that unbelievable success?

1394
01:31:13,120 --> 01:31:15,839
Speaker 2: Well, it was, uh, you know, it was a shocker

1395
01:31:16,000 --> 01:31:19,040
Speaker 2: to me because, like I said, I thought that was

1396
01:31:19,080 --> 01:31:21,920
Speaker 2: going to be the magic wand that that suddenly that

1397
01:31:22,600 --> 01:31:27,120
Speaker 2: that all of my problems were a result of not

1398
01:31:27,840 --> 01:31:31,840
Speaker 2: being successful in music and not being recognized as an artist,

1399
01:31:31,960 --> 01:31:37,800
Speaker 2: all that, all that good stuff. Uh and what what really, well,

1400
01:31:38,000 --> 01:31:41,720
Speaker 2: I'll be honest with you, what really uh kind of

1401
01:31:41,760 --> 01:31:46,559
Speaker 2: did me in? Was we we thought sure that Heine

1402
01:31:46,560 --> 01:31:51,439
Speaker 2: Fidelity was a shoe in for at least the Best

1403
01:31:51,520 --> 01:31:56,240
Speaker 2: Album nomination, if not, if not, you know, a Grammy

1404
01:31:56,320 --> 01:31:59,120
Speaker 2: for Best Album or you know, keep on loving you

1405
01:32:00,040 --> 01:32:02,000
Speaker 2: long of the Year, you know. We we we had

1406
01:32:02,080 --> 01:32:06,280
Speaker 2: pretty high hopes. And when the Grammy nominations came out

1407
01:32:07,600 --> 01:32:14,479
Speaker 2: and we were nominated as for Best Rock Performance by

1408
01:32:14,560 --> 01:32:20,880
Speaker 2: a Duo or Group, and that was it. And that

1409
01:32:21,600 --> 01:32:26,920
Speaker 2: just sent me, uh into a bad place.

1410
01:32:27,680 --> 01:32:27,800
Speaker 1: Uh.

1411
01:32:28,000 --> 01:32:31,839
Speaker 2: And uh it was it was just like the ultimate

1412
01:32:32,680 --> 01:32:38,880
Speaker 2: you know that that that recognition, uh huh, that peer recognition,

1413
01:32:39,120 --> 01:32:43,760
Speaker 2: recognition that the Grammys represents was something that I had

1414
01:32:43,840 --> 01:32:46,360
Speaker 2: been craving since I was a little kid, you know,

1415
01:32:46,560 --> 01:32:51,360
Speaker 2: And so all the success in the world was, uh,

1416
01:32:52,160 --> 01:32:56,200
Speaker 2: it didn't make any difference because I just that the

1417
01:32:56,439 --> 01:33:00,760
Speaker 2: the Grammy snub just it just destroyed me. It was

1418
01:33:00,960 --> 01:33:05,960
Speaker 2: just so hard on me, and uh, and so so

1419
01:33:06,320 --> 01:33:09,560
Speaker 2: so when the when the band, when there was a

1420
01:33:09,640 --> 01:33:14,680
Speaker 2: band meeting in early nineteen eighty two, and uh and

1421
01:33:15,360 --> 01:33:19,680
Speaker 2: and everyone wanted to make a new record. I was like,

1422
01:33:20,000 --> 01:33:22,080
Speaker 2: make a new record? Are you kidding? First of all,

1423
01:33:22,160 --> 01:33:25,560
Speaker 2: High in Fidelity was still on the charts, and and

1424
01:33:25,880 --> 01:33:29,080
Speaker 2: and I didn't have I didn't you know, I like

1425
01:33:29,160 --> 01:33:31,600
Speaker 2: to have a bunch of songs written before before we

1426
01:33:31,680 --> 01:33:34,800
Speaker 2: win the studio. But there was this energy man that

1427
01:33:35,320 --> 01:33:38,480
Speaker 2: from you know, we had the high the high profile

1428
01:33:38,800 --> 01:33:43,719
Speaker 2: uh business managers. We hired Fleetwood Max business managers because

1429
01:33:43,880 --> 01:33:45,959
Speaker 2: we thought, well, you know, this is High in Fidelity

1430
01:33:46,040 --> 01:33:49,120
Speaker 2: had rumors like success, so let's let's go with their

1431
01:33:49,680 --> 01:33:54,960
Speaker 2: uh the business managers. We had the record label, you know,

1432
01:33:55,520 --> 01:34:00,720
Speaker 2: and and everyone else in the band honestly, you know,

1433
01:34:01,760 --> 01:34:05,280
Speaker 2: management everybody was like, okay, you know, this is what

1434
01:34:05,360 --> 01:34:08,240
Speaker 2: we do. We make a record every year. And I'm

1435
01:34:08,320 --> 01:34:12,240
Speaker 2: sitting there and I go, guys, are you out of

1436
01:34:12,280 --> 01:34:17,280
Speaker 2: your fricking minds? I don't have any songs. I'm still

1437
01:34:17,600 --> 01:34:22,719
Speaker 2: trying to find my balance, you know. After High in Fidelity,

1438
01:34:22,840 --> 01:34:26,040
Speaker 2: I just felt like, guys, let's just this is a

1439
01:34:26,200 --> 01:34:30,519
Speaker 2: once in a lifetime opportunity whatever, whatever, you do as

1440
01:34:30,600 --> 01:34:34,120
Speaker 2: the follow up to High Infidelity is going to be

1441
01:34:34,360 --> 01:34:39,080
Speaker 2: immediately played on the radio. It's going to be immediately accepted.

1442
01:34:40,680 --> 01:34:43,639
Speaker 2: Unless it doesn't live up to the promise of high

1443
01:34:43,680 --> 01:34:47,720
Speaker 2: in Fidelity, then it's going to be derided. And and

1444
01:34:47,840 --> 01:34:51,280
Speaker 2: I kind of had a sense of that, and but

1445
01:34:51,960 --> 01:34:57,000
Speaker 2: nobody wanted to pay attention that. Everyone was so you know,

1446
01:34:57,600 --> 01:35:01,559
Speaker 2: drunk on success that everybody, you know, let's just keep

1447
01:35:01,640 --> 01:35:05,120
Speaker 2: feeding the machine. And I'm like, wait, guys, you know,

1448
01:35:05,880 --> 01:35:08,680
Speaker 2: you know, uh, that's not how it works for me.

1449
01:35:09,800 --> 01:35:11,360
Speaker 1: But I folded.

1450
01:35:11,400 --> 01:35:14,559
Speaker 2: I ended up folding like a cheap suit and went

1451
01:35:14,600 --> 01:35:18,080
Speaker 2: into the studio and uh made the Good Trouble record

1452
01:35:18,320 --> 01:35:22,600
Speaker 2: and uh uh and uh, you know it was it

1453
01:35:22,880 --> 01:35:26,760
Speaker 2: wasn't that was the Good Trouble Tour was the the

1454
01:35:28,240 --> 01:35:32,920
Speaker 2: the peak of the Ario Speedwagon partying arc. It was,

1455
01:35:33,240 --> 01:35:36,080
Speaker 2: you know, it was just it was the first time

1456
01:35:36,360 --> 01:35:38,559
Speaker 2: that the you know what, We've always been a band

1457
01:35:38,600 --> 01:35:41,400
Speaker 2: that has a good time, but that tour was the

1458
01:35:41,520 --> 01:35:44,920
Speaker 2: first time where I saw that the after party was

1459
01:35:45,080 --> 01:35:48,639
Speaker 2: becoming the priority and the gig was just a way

1460
01:35:48,680 --> 01:35:50,640
Speaker 2: to get to the after party. And I was like,

1461
01:35:51,640 --> 01:35:54,560
Speaker 2: I don't like this, but I don't not like it

1462
01:35:54,880 --> 01:35:58,439
Speaker 2: enough to stop doing it and so, uh you know,

1463
01:35:58,800 --> 01:36:04,240
Speaker 2: so hey there you know are the Ario Speedwagon. Uh,

1464
01:36:04,840 --> 01:36:08,479
Speaker 2: career arc is not an arc at all. It's a

1465
01:36:08,720 --> 01:36:11,720
Speaker 2: it's a roller coaster, is what it is. And uh,

1466
01:36:11,920 --> 01:36:14,840
Speaker 2: that was that was that was a tough period for sure.

1467
01:36:15,840 --> 01:36:18,479
Speaker 1: Okay, the next album you come back with a monster song.

1468
01:36:18,600 --> 01:36:23,839
Speaker 1: Can't fight this feeling. Everybody, and I mean everybody reaches

1469
01:36:23,920 --> 01:36:27,360
Speaker 1: the point when they no longer have the peak of

1470
01:36:27,479 --> 01:36:31,640
Speaker 1: success they once have. Usually you're putting out records that

1471
01:36:31,880 --> 01:36:36,320
Speaker 1: don't for some reason get accepted. Then the sound sort

1472
01:36:36,360 --> 01:36:40,680
Speaker 1: of changes. How have you coped with that or how

1473
01:36:40,720 --> 01:36:42,560
Speaker 1: did you cope when you were experiencing it?

1474
01:36:43,920 --> 01:36:48,599
Speaker 2: Well? I mean uh, uh you see, I always feel

1475
01:36:48,680 --> 01:36:53,719
Speaker 2: like like the songs are the everything grows from the songs.

1476
01:36:53,880 --> 01:36:57,920
Speaker 2: And if you've uh you know, a good song is

1477
01:36:58,560 --> 01:37:03,160
Speaker 2: always a good song. You know, it doesn't ever get

1478
01:37:03,240 --> 01:37:07,120
Speaker 2: bad no matter how long it's around. So if you

1479
01:37:07,280 --> 01:37:12,080
Speaker 2: got if you got enough songs that that that people

1480
01:37:12,760 --> 01:37:19,120
Speaker 2: took into their DNA, uh, then uh you know, that's

1481
01:37:19,720 --> 01:37:22,719
Speaker 2: that's what sustains you, even if the records aren't selling

1482
01:37:22,960 --> 01:37:26,160
Speaker 2: like like they used to. You know, as long as

1483
01:37:26,240 --> 01:37:30,960
Speaker 2: you can continue to perform at a high level and

1484
01:37:31,280 --> 01:37:34,160
Speaker 2: and bring it every night, and and bring that energy

1485
01:37:34,200 --> 01:37:38,760
Speaker 2: every night. And you got those songs. Uh, then you know,

1486
01:37:39,000 --> 01:37:41,599
Speaker 2: I mean that's you know, there's no secret to success.

1487
01:37:41,920 --> 01:37:44,640
Speaker 2: That that's what it is and and that's that's what

1488
01:37:44,800 --> 01:37:49,600
Speaker 2: we do. And uh, that's enabled us to to continue

1489
01:37:49,640 --> 01:37:50,240
Speaker 2: all these years.

1490
01:37:51,760 --> 01:37:54,960
Speaker 1: Did you own your own songs? Then your own publishing,

1491
01:37:55,040 --> 01:37:56,040
Speaker 1: and do you own them now?

1492
01:37:57,280 --> 01:38:00,479
Speaker 2: I did own my publishing then, and it was Trout

1493
01:38:00,560 --> 01:38:06,559
Speaker 2: who told me never sell your publishing. And then right

1494
01:38:06,640 --> 01:38:13,800
Speaker 2: around nineteen ninety one when Kurt Cobain and his cohorts

1495
01:38:14,000 --> 01:38:18,680
Speaker 2: invaded from Seattle and took took over music, which, by

1496
01:38:18,720 --> 01:38:22,559
Speaker 2: the way, I thought was awesome because my kids had

1497
01:38:22,760 --> 01:38:25,360
Speaker 2: bon Jovi posters on their walls, you know, and I'm like,

1498
01:38:26,000 --> 01:38:30,000
Speaker 2: bon Jovi is not that different than Ario Speedwagon. It's

1499
01:38:30,080 --> 01:38:32,800
Speaker 2: the kind of the same thing, you know. And I'm like,

1500
01:38:33,200 --> 01:38:36,240
Speaker 2: so my kids don't have their own music, you know.

1501
01:38:36,479 --> 01:38:42,160
Speaker 2: And and then suddenly, you know, Nirvana came along, and

1502
01:38:42,439 --> 01:38:45,679
Speaker 2: boy John bon Jovi came off the wall and Kurt

1503
01:38:45,760 --> 01:38:49,200
Speaker 2: Cobain came up overnight, and so it was great for

1504
01:38:49,320 --> 01:38:52,040
Speaker 2: my kids. But but if you were a member of

1505
01:38:52,080 --> 01:38:55,600
Speaker 2: a classic rock band. It was. It was it was

1506
01:38:55,720 --> 01:38:58,320
Speaker 2: pretty bleak. I mean, a lot of bands just broke

1507
01:38:58,439 --> 01:39:03,839
Speaker 2: up or stopped to ring. You know. We we continued touring.

1508
01:39:04,000 --> 01:39:07,920
Speaker 2: But uh, but but my friend Tom Kelly, who's also

1509
01:39:08,000 --> 01:39:12,120
Speaker 2: another Champagne boy, another Irving as Off client or John

1510
01:39:12,200 --> 01:39:17,400
Speaker 2: Barrett client. He uh, it was his voice. He was

1511
01:39:17,439 --> 01:39:19,840
Speaker 2: a high voice on all the big Rio hits. He

1512
01:39:19,960 --> 01:39:22,519
Speaker 2: was a great singer. But then he became he also

1513
01:39:22,600 --> 01:39:25,760
Speaker 2: became a great songwrite, a great songwriting team with Billy Steinberg.

1514
01:39:26,439 --> 01:39:31,680
Speaker 2: Uh and Tom and Billy made a publishing deal. Uh

1515
01:39:32,080 --> 01:39:34,799
Speaker 2: right then in the early nineties. And the way publishing

1516
01:39:34,880 --> 01:39:40,160
Speaker 2: deals work is they the publishing company looks back three years.

1517
01:39:40,520 --> 01:39:44,200
Speaker 2: They take the past three years, and that becomes the

1518
01:39:44,439 --> 01:39:49,080
Speaker 2: value of your of your songs. And I was looking

1519
01:39:49,160 --> 01:39:51,800
Speaker 2: at it, and I'm going, well, wait a minute. Every

1520
01:39:52,160 --> 01:39:54,280
Speaker 2: you know, Couk, we thought it was all over and

1521
01:39:54,360 --> 01:39:57,080
Speaker 2: we we we we really thought that you know that,

1522
01:39:57,280 --> 01:40:00,920
Speaker 2: you know, it was a low point. And so I

1523
01:40:01,080 --> 01:40:04,200
Speaker 2: figured every year that I didn't make a publishing deal,

1524
01:40:04,479 --> 01:40:07,400
Speaker 2: that was one of the years that we sold a

1525
01:40:07,479 --> 01:40:09,600
Speaker 2: lot of records, that would wouldn't be one of the

1526
01:40:09,680 --> 01:40:12,120
Speaker 2: past three years. You know what I'm saying, so I

1527
01:40:14,040 --> 01:40:17,599
Speaker 2: made I got a great offer, and I sold my publishing.

1528
01:40:17,960 --> 01:40:20,559
Speaker 2: But the good news is that that was in nineteen

1529
01:40:20,640 --> 01:40:24,680
Speaker 2: ninety two. And I think Don Henley was the guy

1530
01:40:24,720 --> 01:40:32,960
Speaker 2: who really spearheaded the energy that has said that thirty

1531
01:40:33,040 --> 01:40:37,200
Speaker 2: five years after you sell your publishing, you get it back.

1532
01:40:37,560 --> 01:40:40,680
Speaker 2: So that means in a couple of years, I'll be

1533
01:40:40,760 --> 01:40:43,559
Speaker 2: getting it back. So that'll be uh, that'll be nice.

1534
01:40:46,400 --> 01:40:48,760
Speaker 2: And and of course, you know, there have been some

1535
01:40:49,160 --> 01:40:52,360
Speaker 2: pretty lucrative publishing deals made over the past few years.

1536
01:40:53,760 --> 01:40:57,439
Speaker 2: You know, had I kept my publishing, put it this way,

1537
01:40:57,720 --> 01:41:02,519
Speaker 2: the publishing company that bought my catalog made a great deal.

1538
01:41:03,320 --> 01:41:04,439
Speaker 2: I will leave it at that.

1539
01:41:05,280 --> 01:41:08,960
Speaker 1: Okay, just to be clear for the uninitiated, they're essentially

1540
01:41:09,080 --> 01:41:12,880
Speaker 1: two halves in the publishing dollar. There's the ownership of

1541
01:41:12,920 --> 01:41:15,640
Speaker 1: the song and the writer of the song. Did you

1542
01:41:15,920 --> 01:41:18,439
Speaker 1: sell one hundred percent or just fifty?

1543
01:41:18,920 --> 01:41:24,160
Speaker 2: I sold fifty percent. And they were a Nashville company

1544
01:41:24,240 --> 01:41:27,960
Speaker 2: with that that was an old school you know. Bob

1545
01:41:28,040 --> 01:41:30,400
Speaker 2: Beckham was the guy.

1546
01:41:30,280 --> 01:41:31,280
Speaker 1: Who he.

1547
01:41:33,000 --> 01:41:38,080
Speaker 2: Even just an iconic Nashville publisher and I just hit

1548
01:41:38,160 --> 01:41:42,240
Speaker 2: it off with him right away. And even though they

1549
01:41:42,320 --> 01:41:48,640
Speaker 2: didn't need my permission to exploit the songs. They respected

1550
01:41:48,800 --> 01:41:54,920
Speaker 2: me enough that they never that they never put the

1551
01:41:55,040 --> 01:41:58,320
Speaker 2: song in a movie that I didn't you know, you

1552
01:41:58,400 --> 01:41:59,800
Speaker 2: know that I thought it would be you. I mean

1553
01:42:00,200 --> 01:42:05,840
Speaker 2: they there was offers from cigarette companies. It's like, nope,

1554
01:42:06,160 --> 01:42:09,880
Speaker 2: you know, sorry, And so I've all I've been lucky

1555
01:42:10,000 --> 01:42:14,880
Speaker 2: that they've been respectful. And now my publishing is owned

1556
01:42:15,920 --> 01:42:22,160
Speaker 2: by Mark Freed and Mojo Music, who bought that my

1557
01:42:22,360 --> 01:42:24,880
Speaker 2: catalog from the original company. And Mark is just a

1558
01:42:26,200 --> 01:42:30,080
Speaker 2: wonderful He's a guy that's in it for the right

1559
01:42:30,200 --> 01:42:34,240
Speaker 2: reasons because he loves music and he loves songs. And hey,

1560
01:42:34,400 --> 01:42:37,879
Speaker 2: he got keep on Love with You in a Shaquille

1561
01:42:37,880 --> 01:42:40,080
Speaker 2: O'Neal commercial, So come on, that's it. You know, it

1562
01:42:40,120 --> 01:42:41,080
Speaker 2: didn't get any better than that.

1563
01:42:41,520 --> 01:42:45,519
Speaker 1: Okay, So needless to say, you've essentially gotten fifty percent

1564
01:42:45,720 --> 01:42:49,040
Speaker 1: of the revenue on your songs over these thirty years.

1565
01:42:50,439 --> 01:42:53,000
Speaker 1: If you never work, if you didn't tour, would that

1566
01:42:53,120 --> 01:42:55,240
Speaker 1: be enough money for you to pay your bills?

1567
01:42:56,680 --> 01:42:59,439
Speaker 2: Well, you know, I think that I think that touring

1568
01:43:00,120 --> 01:43:06,280
Speaker 2: is a way that that that leads to the value

1569
01:43:06,479 --> 01:43:10,200
Speaker 2: of the of the copyrights and the songs. Uh. I

1570
01:43:10,240 --> 01:43:11,880
Speaker 2: think I think I think they are two parts of

1571
01:43:12,200 --> 01:43:16,240
Speaker 2: the same machine. So, uh, you know, if we stop touring,

1572
01:43:18,200 --> 01:43:22,320
Speaker 2: it would be a I think a mistake to think

1573
01:43:22,479 --> 01:43:25,400
Speaker 2: that the that the that the income from the from

1574
01:43:25,439 --> 01:43:28,120
Speaker 2: the songs would would maintain at the same level. I

1575
01:43:28,200 --> 01:43:29,880
Speaker 2: think they kind of go hand in hand.

1576
01:43:30,760 --> 01:43:33,040
Speaker 1: Well, let me put it this way. Ed Sheeran goes

1577
01:43:33,120 --> 01:43:38,639
Speaker 1: out without a band and play stadiums. You know, there

1578
01:43:38,680 --> 01:43:42,479
Speaker 1: aren't twenty trucks, there aren't all these people, et cetera.

1579
01:43:42,720 --> 01:43:44,680
Speaker 1: It's like being a comedian. Comtian goes on the road

1580
01:43:44,680 --> 01:43:49,080
Speaker 1: with a microphone, maybe a road manager, and now comedians

1581
01:43:49,200 --> 01:43:55,080
Speaker 1: play arenas. Where's the band? There are multiple members? Okay,

1582
01:43:55,600 --> 01:44:00,519
Speaker 1: So in the heyday of Rio Speedwagon, the Steps in

1583
01:44:00,600 --> 01:44:04,040
Speaker 1: the eighties, was there enough money or were you just

1584
01:44:04,160 --> 01:44:06,800
Speaker 1: like a working guy, middle class guy and this is

1585
01:44:06,880 --> 01:44:07,320
Speaker 1: your gig?

1586
01:44:08,479 --> 01:44:15,000
Speaker 2: Well I will tell you that that. Uh when how

1587
01:44:15,080 --> 01:44:19,640
Speaker 2: can I how can I say the there was what?

1588
01:44:20,600 --> 01:44:25,280
Speaker 2: When you're a musician, you always you never turned down

1589
01:44:25,320 --> 01:44:28,519
Speaker 2: a gig because because you always think that if you

1590
01:44:28,640 --> 01:44:31,560
Speaker 2: turn down a gig, whoever it is that takes that

1591
01:44:31,720 --> 01:44:35,439
Speaker 2: gig might take the next gig too. It's just it comes.

1592
01:44:35,560 --> 01:44:37,559
Speaker 2: It goes back to being in a high school band.

1593
01:44:38,200 --> 01:44:41,600
Speaker 2: So it's uh, it's you know, whether you need the

1594
01:44:41,720 --> 01:44:46,280
Speaker 2: money or not, it's just it's just it's baked into

1595
01:44:46,400 --> 01:44:52,120
Speaker 2: my DNA that it's it's really hard to to think

1596
01:44:52,280 --> 01:44:55,280
Speaker 2: about turning down gigs, you know, and we do turn

1597
01:44:55,360 --> 01:44:57,519
Speaker 2: down gigs, but I'm talking about to the point that

1598
01:44:57,640 --> 01:45:00,519
Speaker 2: you stop touring for a certain amount of time. Just uh,

1599
01:45:01,360 --> 01:45:06,439
Speaker 2: it just seems it's it'll probably happen at some point

1600
01:45:06,560 --> 01:45:09,519
Speaker 2: in my life. But you know, as it is, man,

1601
01:45:09,800 --> 01:45:13,120
Speaker 2: I'm uh, you know, I can still move pretty well

1602
01:45:13,280 --> 01:45:16,679
Speaker 2: and uh and uh and you know, got my vocal coach,

1603
01:45:16,800 --> 01:45:19,680
Speaker 2: so uh, you know, so I'm having fun singing. The

1604
01:45:19,800 --> 01:45:23,080
Speaker 2: band is great. We've got a great crew. People are Hey,

1605
01:45:23,320 --> 01:45:27,120
Speaker 2: we had to sold out James Brown Arena in Augusta,

1606
01:45:27,160 --> 01:45:29,800
Speaker 2: Georgia on a Monday night. You know, go figure, you know,

1607
01:45:30,000 --> 01:45:32,719
Speaker 2: so it's kind of hard to walk away from something

1608
01:45:32,800 --> 01:45:32,960
Speaker 2: like that.

1609
01:45:33,600 --> 01:45:36,920
Speaker 1: Okay, going back to the old days, Barrick told me

1610
01:45:37,000 --> 01:45:41,600
Speaker 1: a great story that Irving came out here with Dan Voegelberg,

1611
01:45:42,800 --> 01:45:47,400
Speaker 1: was here for a year and call up Barreck. Barrick said, Barrick,

1612
01:45:48,000 --> 01:45:50,200
Speaker 1: come out, we can take this town.

1613
01:45:51,760 --> 01:45:55,559
Speaker 2: I was I thought the original quip because you told

1614
01:45:55,600 --> 01:45:58,479
Speaker 2: me that quote when I when I called your radio show,

1615
01:45:58,840 --> 01:46:01,720
Speaker 2: and I think what I think what what you said was,

1616
01:46:01,760 --> 01:46:03,800
Speaker 2: and it always stuck with me. It's actually in my

1617
01:46:03,920 --> 01:46:08,000
Speaker 2: book that that Irving called Barrick and said, grab the

1618
01:46:08,280 --> 01:46:10,720
Speaker 2: Rio boys and get out here as soon as you can.

1619
01:46:10,880 --> 01:46:14,760
Speaker 2: We're going to own this town. Now, that right, right?

1620
01:46:15,000 --> 01:46:18,320
Speaker 1: But let me ask you, was that palpable on your end?

1621
01:46:19,200 --> 01:46:22,719
Speaker 2: Well, I'm a Chicago boy. You know, I never pictured

1622
01:46:22,760 --> 01:46:26,960
Speaker 2: myself living anywhere by Chicago. But when I in the

1623
01:46:27,040 --> 01:46:29,360
Speaker 2: time that I was away with the band, from the band,

1624
01:46:29,479 --> 01:46:31,439
Speaker 2: they moved to La So if I was going to

1625
01:46:31,800 --> 01:46:33,880
Speaker 2: rejoin I was going to have to move to l

1626
01:46:33,960 --> 01:46:38,760
Speaker 2: A too. But uh, you know, I'm a Midwest boy

1627
01:46:38,920 --> 01:46:41,880
Speaker 2: by uh you know, and uh so I kind of

1628
01:46:41,920 --> 01:46:44,560
Speaker 2: got the best of both worlds. I got the Midwest

1629
01:46:44,760 --> 01:46:48,640
Speaker 2: upbringing and now and now the southern California lifestyle. So

1630
01:46:49,120 --> 01:46:52,000
Speaker 2: you know, I'll take it okay.

1631
01:46:53,160 --> 01:46:57,040
Speaker 1: For me, certainly, in the early seasons, Ozark was one

1632
01:46:57,040 --> 01:46:59,839
Speaker 1: of the best shows on TV really all the seasons.

1633
01:47:00,760 --> 01:47:05,000
Speaker 1: And I'm watching They're opening a riverboat casino and suddenly

1634
01:47:05,080 --> 01:47:08,400
Speaker 1: there is Ario Speedwagon. How does that come to be?

1635
01:47:09,800 --> 01:47:12,800
Speaker 2: Bob? That's that that's a that's a million dollar question.

1636
01:47:13,120 --> 01:47:17,200
Speaker 2: I uh, I don't know what came first, the chicken

1637
01:47:17,280 --> 01:47:21,360
Speaker 2: or the egg. I don't know if the idea this

1638
01:47:21,560 --> 01:47:23,680
Speaker 2: is this is what I think the you know, the

1639
01:47:23,800 --> 01:47:27,799
Speaker 2: show is supposedly based in the Lake of the Ozarks,

1640
01:47:27,840 --> 01:47:31,679
Speaker 2: which is in the heart of Missouri. The two biggest

1641
01:47:32,360 --> 01:47:35,880
Speaker 2: markets for Ario Speedwagon were Saint Louis and Kansas City.

1642
01:47:36,240 --> 01:47:41,000
Speaker 2: We would headline the baseball stadiums in Saint Louis and

1643
01:47:41,080 --> 01:47:43,320
Speaker 2: Kansas City and then go out and play the Roxy

1644
01:47:43,400 --> 01:47:47,360
Speaker 2: in Los Angeles for five hundred people. So the Ozarks

1645
01:47:47,640 --> 01:47:51,639
Speaker 2: were that's the heart of Ario Speedwagon country. So maybe

1646
01:47:51,720 --> 01:47:56,439
Speaker 2: the producers were going for authenticity, you know, and because

1647
01:47:56,560 --> 01:47:59,000
Speaker 2: because that kind of made sense that that we would

1648
01:47:59,040 --> 01:48:03,800
Speaker 2: be the band. But but the also, you know, that

1649
01:48:03,960 --> 01:48:06,280
Speaker 2: episode was kind of built around the song Time for

1650
01:48:06,400 --> 01:48:08,640
Speaker 2: Me to Fly, So I don't know if that had

1651
01:48:08,800 --> 01:48:10,840
Speaker 2: it was you know, like most things in life, it's

1652
01:48:11,000 --> 01:48:14,000
Speaker 2: it's not one thing that makes something happen. But I

1653
01:48:14,040 --> 01:48:16,280
Speaker 2: will tell you that that I was the only guy

1654
01:48:16,400 --> 01:48:20,400
Speaker 2: that had any lines. So when we were on location,

1655
01:48:21,160 --> 01:48:24,479
Speaker 2: the writer gave me a little print out of the

1656
01:48:24,600 --> 01:48:29,759
Speaker 2: scene and they were just like three mimiographed type pages

1657
01:48:30,280 --> 01:48:32,559
Speaker 2: and I had like one line and then I asked

1658
01:48:32,600 --> 01:48:35,800
Speaker 2: him to change another line, and they said, yeah, sure,

1659
01:48:35,880 --> 01:48:38,200
Speaker 2: sit say whatever you want. But at the top of

1660
01:48:38,280 --> 01:48:42,760
Speaker 2: each page of the script it says Kevin Cronin was here.

1661
01:48:42,840 --> 01:48:45,920
Speaker 2: And I'm like, wow, man, these people they just made us,

1662
01:48:46,360 --> 01:48:49,120
Speaker 2: they had already made us feel totally at home. Jason

1663
01:48:49,240 --> 01:48:51,439
Speaker 2: Bateman got up in the middle of his lunch to

1664
01:48:51,479 --> 01:48:55,160
Speaker 2: come over and hang with us, and and I thought, wow,

1665
01:48:55,280 --> 01:48:57,840
Speaker 2: that's really They're really they really know how to make

1666
01:48:57,920 --> 01:49:00,559
Speaker 2: you feel welcome, you know. So I had no idea.

1667
01:49:01,000 --> 01:49:04,960
Speaker 2: I'm sitting with my wife and kids, you know, watch it,

1668
01:49:05,280 --> 01:49:07,840
Speaker 2: getting ready for season three to drop and watch it.

1669
01:49:07,960 --> 01:49:10,320
Speaker 2: And when the third episode came on and I saw

1670
01:49:10,400 --> 01:49:13,519
Speaker 2: the title of the episode, I was like, I was

1671
01:49:13,680 --> 01:49:14,559
Speaker 2: I was blown away.

1672
01:49:14,600 --> 01:49:15,519
Speaker 1: I mean that was that was.

1673
01:49:15,880 --> 01:49:19,760
Speaker 2: Pretty freaking cool for I will say this for about

1674
01:49:21,040 --> 01:49:26,360
Speaker 2: five minutes, well maybe less than, you know, optimistically five minutes,

1675
01:49:26,520 --> 01:49:28,439
Speaker 2: my kids actually thought I was cool.

1676
01:49:28,800 --> 01:49:36,639
Speaker 1: So, okay, Ozark Gigantic Show. You have a prominent part

1677
01:49:36,720 --> 01:49:40,879
Speaker 1: in the episode. Do you feel any bump in business

1678
01:49:41,080 --> 01:49:44,760
Speaker 1: recognition anything or is it just so that was nice?

1679
01:49:45,680 --> 01:49:48,200
Speaker 2: No? No, that I mean Ozark as you said that

1680
01:49:48,439 --> 01:49:52,160
Speaker 2: was one of the biggest streaming shows ever. And and

1681
01:49:52,280 --> 01:49:54,840
Speaker 2: of course season three dropped right in the beginning of

1682
01:49:54,880 --> 01:49:58,400
Speaker 2: the pandemic when when everyone really got in the habit

1683
01:49:58,479 --> 01:50:03,400
Speaker 2: of streaming shows, Ozark was the top of the heap. So, uh,

1684
01:50:03,640 --> 01:50:05,320
Speaker 2: there was a big I mean Time for Me to Fly,

1685
01:50:06,080 --> 01:50:08,599
Speaker 2: which was the song that they featured in the episode,

1686
01:50:08,680 --> 01:50:15,600
Speaker 2: shows up as number one catalog song in Billboard from nowhere. Uh,

1687
01:50:15,800 --> 01:50:17,880
Speaker 2: there were actually there were actually a couple of weeks

1688
01:50:18,120 --> 01:50:23,120
Speaker 2: where I was Uh, I was the top producer of

1689
01:50:23,280 --> 01:50:27,599
Speaker 2: the week, the top songwriter of the week. It's like, wait,

1690
01:50:27,720 --> 01:50:30,200
Speaker 2: how do you know? So yeah, so we we definitely

1691
01:50:30,240 --> 01:50:33,680
Speaker 2: got a little bump and uh we actually you know,

1692
01:50:33,880 --> 01:50:37,400
Speaker 2: Dolly Parton had had recorded Time for Me to Fly

1693
01:50:37,560 --> 01:50:40,439
Speaker 2: on her White Limousine album turned it into a hoedown.

1694
01:50:40,600 --> 01:50:45,719
Speaker 2: It was an awesome record, and so our manager, Tommy Consola,

1695
01:50:45,800 --> 01:50:49,120
Speaker 2: got the idea to go back in the studio on

1696
01:50:49,560 --> 01:50:54,320
Speaker 2: the strength of the Ozark episode and re record uh,

1697
01:50:54,880 --> 01:50:56,519
Speaker 2: Time for Me to Fly. He said, just go in

1698
01:50:56,600 --> 01:50:58,639
Speaker 2: and you know, just just do it a different way,

1699
01:50:58,760 --> 01:51:01,679
Speaker 2: and so I did. I went in and then he's

1700
01:51:01,880 --> 01:51:05,840
Speaker 2: he's friendly with with Dolly's manager, so he sends the

1701
01:51:06,000 --> 01:51:10,240
Speaker 2: demo uh to or actually the it wasn't even a

1702
01:51:10,320 --> 01:51:14,280
Speaker 2: demo but a rough mix to to Dolly and and

1703
01:51:14,439 --> 01:51:17,599
Speaker 2: she hears it and she likes it, and she sings

1704
01:51:18,400 --> 01:51:22,160
Speaker 2: a part on the song and turns it into a duet.

1705
01:51:23,080 --> 01:51:25,920
Speaker 2: And I will tell you something. And you I'm sure

1706
01:51:25,920 --> 01:51:28,920
Speaker 2: you've talked to Dolly and met her. She is, I

1707
01:51:29,000 --> 01:51:32,880
Speaker 2: mean what there was no movie score, there was no

1708
01:51:33,520 --> 01:51:35,800
Speaker 2: there was nothing. There was no album, there was no

1709
01:51:36,000 --> 01:51:38,920
Speaker 2: nothing was just here's the song, you know, do you

1710
01:51:39,000 --> 01:51:41,080
Speaker 2: want to sing on it? And she goes in the

1711
01:51:41,160 --> 01:51:44,840
Speaker 2: studio and and sings the song with me, and it

1712
01:51:45,000 --> 01:51:46,760
Speaker 2: was we still haven't done anything with.

1713
01:51:46,840 --> 01:51:47,439
Speaker 1: It, you know.

1714
01:51:47,600 --> 01:51:51,360
Speaker 2: So so I talk about a person who does it

1715
01:51:51,439 --> 01:51:54,120
Speaker 2: for the right reasons. You know, there was no there

1716
01:51:54,200 --> 01:51:56,479
Speaker 2: was no other reason for Dolly to sing that song

1717
01:51:56,760 --> 01:52:00,080
Speaker 2: except that she liked it and and she had on

1718
01:52:00,200 --> 01:52:04,240
Speaker 2: it before, and you know, and of course that led to, uh,

1719
01:52:04,560 --> 01:52:08,639
Speaker 2: you know, to me being asked to participate in Dolly's

1720
01:52:09,080 --> 01:52:12,519
Speaker 2: rock album. And so Dolly and I do a d

1721
01:52:12,600 --> 01:52:14,600
Speaker 2: wet on that one and keep on loving you on

1722
01:52:15,080 --> 01:52:21,519
Speaker 2: her upcoming rock star album. So I just I there's

1723
01:52:21,600 --> 01:52:24,880
Speaker 2: not enough good words to say for me about Dolly,

1724
01:52:24,960 --> 01:52:27,080
Speaker 2: I just she's she's just the best.

1725
01:52:28,200 --> 01:52:33,439
Speaker 1: Okay. So, as you've referenced, Reo Speedwagon is a long

1726
01:52:34,240 --> 01:52:39,320
Speaker 1: storied history with members, never mind other elements being up

1727
01:52:39,360 --> 01:52:43,960
Speaker 1: and down. At this late date, you are the sole

1728
01:52:44,120 --> 01:52:50,680
Speaker 1: surviving member. So is it really your band? And if

1729
01:52:50,760 --> 01:52:54,000
Speaker 1: it is, how long has it been your band? And

1730
01:52:54,120 --> 01:52:56,880
Speaker 1: to really you make the ultimate decisions?

1731
01:52:58,640 --> 01:53:02,840
Speaker 2: Well, you know it's uh to call it my band.

1732
01:53:03,320 --> 01:53:06,559
Speaker 2: You know that I don't know that just that kind

1733
01:53:06,600 --> 01:53:09,679
Speaker 2: of rubs me in in not the right way because

1734
01:53:10,400 --> 01:53:13,439
Speaker 2: uh but but to say that that that I'm the

1735
01:53:13,560 --> 01:53:17,680
Speaker 2: leader of the band, yeah, you know, ever since ever

1736
01:53:17,760 --> 01:53:21,320
Speaker 2: since the split between Gary and I, uh and and

1737
01:53:21,560 --> 01:53:24,240
Speaker 2: and Alan had our original drummer had left the band

1738
01:53:24,280 --> 01:53:27,120
Speaker 2: by then, uh you know, I have been the leader

1739
01:53:27,160 --> 01:53:29,360
Speaker 2: of the band. And it it took a few years

1740
01:53:29,479 --> 01:53:33,560
Speaker 2: and and uh in I'm trying to think of what

1741
01:53:33,720 --> 01:53:36,320
Speaker 2: year it was. It was a couple of years after

1742
01:53:36,439 --> 01:53:39,200
Speaker 2: Gary left and it was obvious that he wasn't coming back,

1743
01:53:39,920 --> 01:53:43,759
Speaker 2: and I thought about, uh, you know, I was working

1744
01:53:43,800 --> 01:53:47,280
Speaker 2: on a solo album. Uh and and I thought that

1745
01:53:48,439 --> 01:53:51,720
Speaker 2: that Ario Speedwagon had just uh you know, it was

1746
01:53:51,840 --> 01:53:54,840
Speaker 2: just it was just over and and I'll never forget.

1747
01:53:54,920 --> 01:53:57,760
Speaker 2: I was at uh uh. I was at the ASCAP Awards,

1748
01:53:57,800 --> 01:54:01,600
Speaker 2: and after the ASCAP Awards, everyone goes to the the

1749
01:54:01,720 --> 01:54:06,000
Speaker 2: tiki bar and next door and and my wife introduced

1750
01:54:06,040 --> 01:54:09,559
Speaker 2: me to a guy that I never met, a producer

1751
01:54:09,640 --> 01:54:12,240
Speaker 2: named Rick Knowles, who Rick at You know, I didn't

1752
01:54:12,280 --> 01:54:16,040
Speaker 2: realize it at the time, but he was huge, hugely successful,

1753
01:54:16,760 --> 01:54:20,240
Speaker 2: mostly with female artists and so but we were just,

1754
01:54:20,439 --> 01:54:23,360
Speaker 2: you know, shooting the breeze and and and I kind

1755
01:54:23,400 --> 01:54:26,160
Speaker 2: of told him that, you know that my ties kind

1756
01:54:26,160 --> 01:54:27,880
Speaker 2: of loosened my lips a little bit, I guess. And

1757
01:54:27,960 --> 01:54:30,400
Speaker 2: I kind of told him I was working on a

1758
01:54:30,479 --> 01:54:33,600
Speaker 2: solo album and thinking about, you know, closing down the

1759
01:54:33,680 --> 01:54:37,839
Speaker 2: Ario Speedwagon. And he literally stopped me in my tracks,

1760
01:54:38,520 --> 01:54:41,440
Speaker 2: looked me right in the eye and said, dude, look

1761
01:54:41,480 --> 01:54:44,840
Speaker 2: around this room. There's not one person in this room

1762
01:54:44,920 --> 01:54:49,200
Speaker 2: who wouldn't kill to have a vehicle for their music

1763
01:54:50,400 --> 01:54:53,560
Speaker 2: like Ario Speedwagon. He's like, if you do that, you

1764
01:54:53,800 --> 01:54:57,280
Speaker 2: are out of your freaking mind. And I just met

1765
01:54:57,360 --> 01:55:00,800
Speaker 2: the guy, you know what I mean. But it kind

1766
01:55:00,840 --> 01:55:04,640
Speaker 2: of it kind of struck me that since Gary had left,

1767
01:55:05,720 --> 01:55:09,440
Speaker 2: I really hadn't given it my best shot. I was

1768
01:55:09,840 --> 01:55:11,680
Speaker 2: I think there was a part of me that was

1769
01:55:11,760 --> 01:55:15,320
Speaker 2: waiting for Gary to come back, and at that moment,

1770
01:55:15,400 --> 01:55:19,560
Speaker 2: I realized that he wasn't coming back, and I either

1771
01:55:19,640 --> 01:55:23,280
Speaker 2: had to do this, I had to be the sole

1772
01:55:23,440 --> 01:55:28,120
Speaker 2: leader of the band and the sole songwriter and et cetera,

1773
01:55:28,840 --> 01:55:31,600
Speaker 2: or else it was over and I wasn't about I

1774
01:55:31,760 --> 01:55:34,320
Speaker 2: just wasn't ready to let it go without a fight.

1775
01:55:35,080 --> 01:55:40,320
Speaker 2: And so at that point, yeah, I definitely took over

1776
01:55:40,400 --> 01:55:44,640
Speaker 2: the leadership of the band. And within a couple of years,

1777
01:55:44,840 --> 01:55:46,960
Speaker 2: you know, John Barrett came up with the idea of

1778
01:55:47,640 --> 01:55:54,800
Speaker 2: of of uh former arena headliners co headlining and having

1779
01:55:54,880 --> 01:55:59,320
Speaker 2: two headliners on the show, and and that was a

1780
01:55:59,400 --> 01:56:03,480
Speaker 2: way for or bands like ourselves to play the kind

1781
01:56:03,520 --> 01:56:06,040
Speaker 2: of buildings in front of the kind of crowds that

1782
01:56:06,480 --> 01:56:10,160
Speaker 2: we were used to playing. But you had to share

1783
01:56:10,200 --> 01:56:12,960
Speaker 2: the bill with another headliner, which meant you couldn't close

1784
01:56:13,040 --> 01:56:17,080
Speaker 2: every show. And that was a tough pill to swallow

1785
01:56:17,680 --> 01:56:22,240
Speaker 2: at first, but over the years it's become the paradigm

1786
01:56:22,320 --> 01:56:25,160
Speaker 2: and now it's like, oh, yeah, okay, so you guys

1787
01:56:25,240 --> 01:56:27,720
Speaker 2: close half the shows. You know, we're in the middle

1788
01:56:27,760 --> 01:56:31,200
Speaker 2: slot for half the shows. And at this point, Honestly,

1789
01:56:32,840 --> 01:56:35,480
Speaker 2: most of the bands that we work with would rather

1790
01:56:35,600 --> 01:56:41,600
Speaker 2: have the middle slot than the closing slot because because

1791
01:56:42,360 --> 01:56:45,680
Speaker 2: everyone's in their seats, because because you know, we always

1792
01:56:45,680 --> 01:56:48,520
Speaker 2: have a great opener, and no one's leaving early to

1793
01:56:49,800 --> 01:56:52,440
Speaker 2: beat traffic, So you're kind of in the sweet spot.

1794
01:56:52,600 --> 01:56:55,600
Speaker 2: You know. The good thing about the closing spot is

1795
01:56:55,680 --> 01:56:58,760
Speaker 2: that everyone thinks you're the headliner, but you know who cares?

1796
01:56:59,520 --> 01:57:01,840
Speaker 1: Okay, can you email me always reference that you're a

1797
01:57:01,920 --> 01:57:06,160
Speaker 1: bar band from the Midwest now, needless to say, especially

1798
01:57:06,200 --> 01:57:08,560
Speaker 1: when you look at it on paper or on a screen.

1799
01:57:09,040 --> 01:57:13,600
Speaker 1: You've had this unbelievable success with Rio Speedwagon, Yet you

1800
01:57:13,840 --> 01:57:17,240
Speaker 1: mentioned the Grammys where you thought you were dissed. At

1801
01:57:17,320 --> 01:57:20,760
Speaker 1: this point in time, do you still believe you and

1802
01:57:21,000 --> 01:57:25,920
Speaker 1: Rio having gotten the respect you deserve or do you

1803
01:57:26,160 --> 01:57:29,960
Speaker 1: feel comfortable? And then, of course there's a question of

1804
01:57:30,000 --> 01:57:32,600
Speaker 1: the rock and Roll Hall of thing, which is completely changed.

1805
01:57:32,960 --> 01:57:36,600
Speaker 1: Never mind, they're inducting acts that are not rock and roll,

1806
01:57:37,280 --> 01:57:41,960
Speaker 1: but acts that have petition to get their fans or

1807
01:57:41,960 --> 01:57:44,200
Speaker 1: their fans that petition to get the acts in it happened.

1808
01:57:44,560 --> 01:57:48,200
Speaker 1: So are you comfortable where Ario is in the landscape,

1809
01:57:48,840 --> 01:57:51,440
Speaker 1: and are you comfortable with the respect or you still

1810
01:57:51,560 --> 01:57:53,640
Speaker 1: want more recognition and respect.

1811
01:57:54,960 --> 01:57:58,760
Speaker 2: Well, I am comfortable. I'm very comfortable with where the

1812
01:57:58,840 --> 01:58:03,480
Speaker 2: band is at. And at the same time, I'm still driven.

1813
01:58:04,200 --> 01:58:09,280
Speaker 2: I'm not satisfied. So yes, of course, I always want

1814
01:58:09,360 --> 01:58:13,920
Speaker 2: to play a bigger gig or or uh you know,

1815
01:58:14,640 --> 01:58:17,720
Speaker 2: you know, just a couple of weeks ago, uh, American

1816
01:58:17,760 --> 01:58:20,080
Speaker 2: Idol called and wanted me to sing a song with

1817
01:58:20,200 --> 01:58:23,200
Speaker 2: one of their contestants, and I'm like, yeah, sure, that'll

1818
01:58:23,280 --> 01:58:25,160
Speaker 2: be fun. A lot of people, a lot of people

1819
01:58:25,360 --> 01:58:28,480
Speaker 2: will will see me. Who think who might think that

1820
01:58:28,600 --> 01:58:31,280
Speaker 2: I'm you know, long gone who knows, you know. But

1821
01:58:32,360 --> 01:58:36,120
Speaker 2: but but my uh, my goal is to be the

1822
01:58:36,520 --> 01:58:41,960
Speaker 2: Betty White of rock and roll, because Betty White hosted

1823
01:58:42,040 --> 01:58:45,160
Speaker 2: Saturday Night Live at the age of ninety and uh

1824
01:58:45,360 --> 01:58:48,560
Speaker 2: and did a great job. And so uh you know,

1825
01:58:48,680 --> 01:58:52,600
Speaker 2: Tommy Shaw and I laugh often about being being the

1826
01:58:52,960 --> 01:58:57,080
Speaker 2: the last two classic rockers standing and uh uh you know,

1827
01:58:57,280 --> 01:58:59,840
Speaker 2: I would be happy with that and and and and

1828
01:59:00,000 --> 01:59:01,520
Speaker 2: and that is a goal, man. I mean, I I

1829
01:59:02,320 --> 01:59:06,640
Speaker 2: still love to play. I I you know, I keep

1830
01:59:06,680 --> 01:59:11,320
Speaker 2: myself in decent shape and and I'm always always working

1831
01:59:11,400 --> 01:59:13,600
Speaker 2: to get better, always working to get better on the guitar,

1832
01:59:14,760 --> 01:59:17,000
Speaker 2: be a better singer, be a better front man. I

1833
01:59:17,160 --> 01:59:19,879
Speaker 2: I just always want to improve.

1834
01:59:20,240 --> 01:59:21,480
Speaker 1: And uh so.

1835
01:59:23,960 --> 01:59:28,160
Speaker 2: You know, yeah, I'm I'm satisfied, but I still would

1836
01:59:28,240 --> 01:59:29,200
Speaker 2: like a little more, you know.

1837
01:59:30,640 --> 01:59:32,800
Speaker 1: So you're still driven at the end of the day.

1838
01:59:33,080 --> 01:59:36,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I still am. I still am. I still

1839
01:59:36,440 --> 01:59:39,000
Speaker 2: love it and and you know, and in order to

1840
01:59:39,120 --> 01:59:41,480
Speaker 2: keep doing it at the level that we are, you

1841
01:59:42,320 --> 01:59:44,680
Speaker 2: got to keep getting yourself out there, you know, you

1842
01:59:44,800 --> 01:59:48,200
Speaker 2: got to do you know, for me to do American Idol,

1843
01:59:48,280 --> 01:59:51,520
Speaker 2: I literally had a walk off stage. We had a charter,

1844
01:59:51,680 --> 01:59:54,120
Speaker 2: a jet I had to get. I got on the

1845
01:59:54,200 --> 01:59:56,600
Speaker 2: plane at one in the morning, flew to l A.

1846
01:59:57,480 --> 02:00:01,400
Speaker 2: Uh you know, Uh they change my my call time

1847
02:00:01,440 --> 02:00:05,320
Speaker 2: from eleven am to eight thirty am, which oh I'm

1848
02:00:05,360 --> 02:00:08,560
Speaker 2: not thrilled about that at all. Uh. And you know

1849
02:00:08,600 --> 02:00:10,960
Speaker 2: I had to sit there all day, you know, do

1850
02:00:11,120 --> 02:00:13,680
Speaker 2: a bunch of rehearsals, and then and then do the

1851
02:00:13,760 --> 02:00:17,640
Speaker 2: live show and uh but that's you know, that's and

1852
02:00:17,800 --> 02:00:19,360
Speaker 2: and then I had to get back on the plane

1853
02:00:19,520 --> 02:00:22,080
Speaker 2: and get back on the tour and play a show.

1854
02:00:22,280 --> 02:00:27,880
Speaker 2: So uh, you know, it's it's not always as luxurious

1855
02:00:28,000 --> 02:00:30,480
Speaker 2: as as people think. But but that's what you got

1856
02:00:30,600 --> 02:00:33,560
Speaker 2: to do. You know, you you're you got to you

1857
02:00:33,680 --> 02:00:35,680
Speaker 2: gotta keep you got to keep at it, you know,

1858
02:00:36,200 --> 02:00:39,480
Speaker 2: otherwise if you're not getting One of the things my

1859
02:00:39,600 --> 02:00:41,440
Speaker 2: dad said to me when he was alive that that

1860
02:00:41,800 --> 02:00:44,240
Speaker 2: has always stuck with me is you know, if you're

1861
02:00:44,240 --> 02:00:46,200
Speaker 2: going to do it, do it right the first time.

1862
02:00:46,440 --> 02:00:49,440
Speaker 2: And and so you know, I've always got that's always

1863
02:00:49,440 --> 02:00:51,000
Speaker 2: stuck with me. If you if you're going to be

1864
02:00:51,120 --> 02:00:53,000
Speaker 2: doing something, do the best you can.

1865
02:00:54,280 --> 02:00:56,839
Speaker 1: And you've done great here, Kevin. This has been wonderful.

1866
02:00:57,320 --> 02:00:59,520
Speaker 1: You know, there's so many loose threads I could ask

1867
02:00:59,680 --> 02:01:02,839
Speaker 1: questions about, you know, you're growing up and other details

1868
02:01:02,880 --> 02:01:05,080
Speaker 1: we didn't get into, but I think we've you know,

1869
02:01:05,240 --> 02:01:07,120
Speaker 1: covered it for now. So I want to thank you

1870
02:01:07,680 --> 02:01:10,280
Speaker 1: so much for taking this time to speak with my audience.

1871
02:01:11,200 --> 02:01:15,120
Speaker 2: Bob. It's a it's a pleasure. It's uh. I love

1872
02:01:15,200 --> 02:01:18,480
Speaker 2: the way we met, which was literally just me driving

1873
02:01:18,600 --> 02:01:21,520
Speaker 2: down the street in my car and hearing you come

1874
02:01:21,600 --> 02:01:24,480
Speaker 2: on Serious Exam and I'm like, wait a minute, I've

1875
02:01:24,560 --> 02:01:27,800
Speaker 2: got the I got the hotline number to Roger Coletti.

1876
02:01:27,920 --> 02:01:30,160
Speaker 2: I could actually call in. I think the show. I

1877
02:01:30,200 --> 02:01:33,960
Speaker 2: think you were talking about opening acts right, and Ario

1878
02:01:34,040 --> 02:01:37,360
Speaker 2: Speedwagon was I think you mentioned us as being one

1879
02:01:37,440 --> 02:01:41,960
Speaker 2: of the quintessential seventies opening acts. And I'm like, wait

1880
02:01:42,000 --> 02:01:44,200
Speaker 2: a minute, I got the phone number. I'm gonna call

1881
02:01:44,280 --> 02:01:45,960
Speaker 2: in because I you know, I got a good vibe

1882
02:01:46,000 --> 02:01:49,520
Speaker 2: from you just just on the radio, and so it's

1883
02:01:49,640 --> 02:01:52,200
Speaker 2: really a pleasure to be here. And yeah, I could

1884
02:01:52,240 --> 02:01:54,040
Speaker 2: talk to you for hours, and I know I kind

1885
02:01:54,080 --> 02:01:57,200
Speaker 2: of strayed off your questions and that's a bad habit

1886
02:01:57,280 --> 02:01:59,880
Speaker 2: of mine. But hopefully you can forgive me for that,

1887
02:02:00,160 --> 02:02:03,560
Speaker 2: and you know, maybe when the book comes out we'll

1888
02:02:03,640 --> 02:02:04,160
Speaker 2: talk again.

1889
02:02:04,800 --> 02:02:06,800
Speaker 1: Well I believe, and I say this all the time.

1890
02:02:06,960 --> 02:02:10,600
Speaker 1: Digression is the spice of life. That's where that's where

1891
02:02:10,600 --> 02:02:12,520
Speaker 1: all the details are. And I have to give you

1892
02:02:12,680 --> 02:02:17,080
Speaker 1: credit almost always. You brought it back to the original anyway,

1893
02:02:17,120 --> 02:02:19,320
Speaker 1: which is how I do it. I remember, you know,

1894
02:02:19,360 --> 02:02:21,040
Speaker 1: I was in a bad space and I went to

1895
02:02:21,040 --> 02:02:23,920
Speaker 1: see the psychiatrist and he said, well, well, you know,

1896
02:02:24,080 --> 02:02:26,640
Speaker 1: I thought you had a problem tracking, which is something

1897
02:02:26,720 --> 02:02:28,640
Speaker 1: they do, he says, but you bring it back to

1898
02:02:28,720 --> 02:02:30,720
Speaker 1: the original point. I just realized you were on this

1899
02:02:30,880 --> 02:02:34,880
Speaker 1: long journey and too many people, you know, they just

1900
02:02:34,960 --> 02:02:38,520
Speaker 1: give yes and no answers. Where it's the flavor. I

1901
02:02:38,640 --> 02:02:41,160
Speaker 1: think people have really gotten an idea of what it's

1902
02:02:41,360 --> 02:02:45,080
Speaker 1: like to be you and be in these experiences. And

1903
02:02:45,240 --> 02:02:48,080
Speaker 1: I certainly thank you for being so honest and open.

1904
02:02:48,440 --> 02:02:51,880
Speaker 2: Not everybody is, well, well, thank you, Bob. You you

1905
02:02:52,120 --> 02:02:55,640
Speaker 2: definitely bring you know I do. I've done a lot

1906
02:02:55,680 --> 02:02:58,480
Speaker 2: of interviews and I still do, and some of them

1907
02:03:00,240 --> 02:03:02,920
Speaker 2: are more fun than others. And I will say that

1908
02:03:03,240 --> 02:03:05,360
Speaker 2: I really enjoyed this time with you, and I look

1909
02:03:05,400 --> 02:03:06,320
Speaker 2: forward to doing it again.

1910
02:03:07,200 --> 02:03:10,920
Speaker 1: I do too. You've been everything I wanted and more.

1911
02:03:11,120 --> 02:03:14,080
Speaker 1: You were totally open, You were fantastic. I literally could

1912
02:03:14,080 --> 02:03:15,280
Speaker 1: talk to her a few more hours. I got so

1913
02:03:15,320 --> 02:03:18,520
Speaker 1: many questions about growing up, what your father did, what

1914
02:03:18,640 --> 02:03:21,040
Speaker 1: your mother did, with the record you listened to, because

1915
02:03:21,360 --> 02:03:23,840
Speaker 1: the other thing. Of course, you're my contemporary. I'm a

1916
02:03:23,880 --> 02:03:27,160
Speaker 1: couple of years younger, but we are the generation who

1917
02:03:27,320 --> 02:03:31,560
Speaker 1: saw the Beatles on TV and everybody got a guitar

1918
02:03:31,840 --> 02:03:34,440
Speaker 1: and everything, as opposed to the people born in the forties.

1919
02:03:35,200 --> 02:03:38,400
Speaker 2: Right. I mean, I often say that I feel like

1920
02:03:38,560 --> 02:03:43,360
Speaker 2: I was born at the exact right moment to do

1921
02:03:44,280 --> 02:03:48,360
Speaker 2: what I've ended up doing because I was twelve years old.

1922
02:03:48,840 --> 02:03:52,640
Speaker 2: I'm playing guitar. For about two years, nobody played guitar.

1923
02:03:53,520 --> 02:03:56,240
Speaker 2: Playing guitar was for sissies, and I used to get

1924
02:03:56,320 --> 02:04:00,520
Speaker 2: chased through the streets by dudes. Just I was walking

1925
02:04:00,520 --> 02:04:03,840
Speaker 2: along with a guitar case. And when the Beatles came out,

1926
02:04:05,560 --> 02:04:07,720
Speaker 2: I didn't even know why I was taking guitar lessons,

1927
02:04:07,800 --> 02:04:10,400
Speaker 2: but I just did. And when I saw the Beatles,

1928
02:04:10,720 --> 02:04:19,080
Speaker 2: it was like it was everything changed, Everything changed for me,

1929
02:04:19,280 --> 02:04:22,120
Speaker 2: and all of a sudden, the same guys who had

1930
02:04:22,160 --> 02:04:24,360
Speaker 2: been chasing me through the streets wanted to kick my

1931
02:04:24,440 --> 02:04:27,120
Speaker 2: ass because I had a guitar. Now all the girls

1932
02:04:27,680 --> 02:04:30,360
Speaker 2: liked guitar players overnight, and they all wanted to be

1933
02:04:30,400 --> 02:04:32,560
Speaker 2: in a band with me. So I went from being

1934
02:04:32,640 --> 02:04:35,520
Speaker 2: the you know, the outcast of the neighborhood to suddenly

1935
02:04:35,680 --> 02:04:38,360
Speaker 2: the guy who everybody wanted to be in my band

1936
02:04:38,400 --> 02:04:39,840
Speaker 2: because I was the only one who knew how to

1937
02:04:39,880 --> 02:04:43,560
Speaker 2: play the guitar. So, you know, the Beatles, The Beatles

1938
02:04:43,600 --> 02:04:46,920
Speaker 2: were everything for me. And I was twelve years old

1939
02:04:47,240 --> 02:04:49,640
Speaker 2: when they hit right, that's right at the moment when

1940
02:04:49,680 --> 02:04:53,400
Speaker 2: you're looking for an identity, and I saw them, and

1941
02:04:53,560 --> 02:04:56,720
Speaker 2: I saw myself in them. I wanted to be I

1942
02:04:56,840 --> 02:04:59,600
Speaker 2: wanted to dress like them. I wanted to I wanted

1943
02:04:59,640 --> 02:05:01,480
Speaker 2: to be in a band like them. I wanted to

1944
02:05:01,560 --> 02:05:04,960
Speaker 2: have songs like them. And they were just they were

1945
02:05:05,040 --> 02:05:10,320
Speaker 2: just a huge inspiration. And man, you know, as you say,

1946
02:05:10,840 --> 02:05:14,200
Speaker 2: millions of people were tuned into that Ed Sullivan show

1947
02:05:14,280 --> 02:05:17,120
Speaker 2: that night. And you know, I'm just one of the

1948
02:05:17,720 --> 02:05:22,080
Speaker 2: lucky few who saw the Beatles and said that's what

1949
02:05:22,200 --> 02:05:26,160
Speaker 2: I want to do, and then we're lucky enough that

1950
02:05:26,240 --> 02:05:29,680
Speaker 2: it actually happened. I can tell you one last quick

1951
02:05:29,800 --> 02:05:33,280
Speaker 2: Beatles story. All right, So when the Beatles first came out,

1952
02:05:33,680 --> 02:05:37,520
Speaker 2: we talked about Bill Trout and VJ Records. So VJ

1953
02:05:37,720 --> 02:05:41,040
Speaker 2: Records is releasing Beatles songs. Then all of a sudden,

1954
02:05:41,160 --> 02:05:45,879
Speaker 2: Capitol realizes that they screwed up, so they start releasing

1955
02:05:45,920 --> 02:05:51,160
Speaker 2: Beatle records. Well, I'm in Chicago. WLS is the biggest

1956
02:05:51,360 --> 02:05:54,320
Speaker 2: radio station in the world. But I also am taking

1957
02:05:54,400 --> 02:05:58,880
Speaker 2: guitar lessons, and every lesson I would hang around and

1958
02:05:59,000 --> 02:06:02,120
Speaker 2: look at all the sheep muses, and I bought the

1959
02:06:02,200 --> 02:06:04,240
Speaker 2: sheep music for I Want to Hold Your Hand, which

1960
02:06:04,280 --> 02:06:07,320
Speaker 2: I still have framed above my desk, that exact piece

1961
02:06:07,360 --> 02:06:10,320
Speaker 2: of sheet music. But one day I saw a piece

1962
02:06:10,360 --> 02:06:13,280
Speaker 2: of sheet music, and you know, because it was such

1963
02:06:13,280 --> 02:06:17,000
Speaker 2: a such a feeding frenzy that sometimes the sheep music

1964
02:06:17,120 --> 02:06:19,880
Speaker 2: came in before the song was being played on the radio.

1965
02:06:20,400 --> 02:06:22,760
Speaker 2: So I got I saw the sheet music for this song.

1966
02:06:22,840 --> 02:06:25,400
Speaker 2: I said, please please me the Beatles, and I'm like,

1967
02:06:25,840 --> 02:06:29,240
Speaker 2: what's that. I've never heard this song. So I sneaked

1968
02:06:29,280 --> 02:06:32,160
Speaker 2: the sheet music back into one of the lesson rooms

1969
02:06:32,600 --> 02:06:35,920
Speaker 2: and I've got my little guitar and I opened the

1970
02:06:35,960 --> 02:06:38,760
Speaker 2: sheet music and I wasn't good enough to be able

1971
02:06:38,800 --> 02:06:42,720
Speaker 2: to play the song the there was. I knew some

1972
02:06:42,880 --> 02:06:46,000
Speaker 2: of the chords and the lyrics were there, so I

1973
02:06:46,240 --> 02:06:49,440
Speaker 2: just kind of faked it. And I so I had

1974
02:06:50,840 --> 02:06:53,400
Speaker 2: a version of please Please Me, which I thought I

1975
02:06:53,560 --> 02:06:56,200
Speaker 2: learned from the sheet music. Well, a couple of weeks later,

1976
02:06:56,640 --> 02:07:00,960
Speaker 2: the song comes on WLS and it bored no resemblance

1977
02:07:01,040 --> 02:07:06,920
Speaker 2: of all to my version. Right, And as blasphemous as

1978
02:07:07,000 --> 02:07:10,200
Speaker 2: this will sound, I kind of like my version better.

1979
02:07:10,720 --> 02:07:14,600
Speaker 2: And it gave me the thought, as a twelve or

1980
02:07:14,680 --> 02:07:17,400
Speaker 2: thirteen year old kid, that maybe I could write my

1981
02:07:17,480 --> 02:07:20,240
Speaker 2: own songs. So I even owe that to the Beatles.

1982
02:07:20,360 --> 02:07:22,640
Speaker 2: I mean, you know that I owe everything to them

1983
02:07:23,560 --> 02:07:27,080
Speaker 1: In any event, till next time, this is Bob left sets,