WEBVTT - 112523 Rethinking the Carceral System (Part 2)

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<v Speaker 1>If you're just tuning in to civic Cipher, I am

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<v Speaker 1>your host, Rams' Ja.

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<v Speaker 2>He is Ramsey's Jah. I am Q Gordon. As he mentioned,

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<v Speaker 2>you are tuned into civic Cipher.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, indeed, and keep writing with us as we continue

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<v Speaker 1>to broadcast the balance and defend the discourse from these

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<v Speaker 1>hip hop weekly studios. Stick around because we have a

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<v Speaker 1>lot more to talk about, including a rethink of the

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<v Speaker 1>car sool system here in these United States of America,

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<v Speaker 1>long overdue. It sounds like, yeah, yeah, and you know what,

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<v Speaker 1>To be honest with you, I have known people who

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<v Speaker 1>are somewhere on the spectrum going from prisons are absolutely

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<v Speaker 1>necessary for the rehabilitation of criminal behavior, to abolish prisons outright.

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<v Speaker 1>And it wasn't until I had this rethink that we're

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<v Speaker 1>going to get into a little bit later in the

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<v Speaker 1>show that I started to really understand just how much

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<v Speaker 1>our current way of thinking holds us back. So stay tuned.

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<v Speaker 1>First and foremost, though, we are going to discuss BA

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<v Speaker 1>BA becoming a Better ally ab BA. Today's BABA sponsored

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<v Speaker 1>by Friends of the Movie. You can sign up for

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<v Speaker 1>the free voter wallet from Fotmglobal dot com to support

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<v Speaker 1>impact with your spending. Again, that's Fotmglobal dot Com and

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<v Speaker 1>today's baba. This is an ally in the truest sense.

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<v Speaker 1>This behavior is worthy of applause. This comes from NPR.

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<v Speaker 1>Pink is joining the fight against book banning. Thank you Pink.

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<v Speaker 1>In collaboration with PEN America and Florida Best Sorry, Florida Bookseller,

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<v Speaker 1>Books and Books, the Grammy winning pop musician is giving

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<v Speaker 1>away two thousand challenged books at our concerts in Miami

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<v Speaker 1>and Sunrise, Florida. The books which have appeared in pen

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<v Speaker 1>America's index of banned books include Beloved by Tony Morrison,

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<v Speaker 1>Amanda Gorman's The Hill We Climb, Gross Who Code by

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<v Speaker 1>Regma Sojani, and Todd Parr's The Family Book. It's confusing,

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<v Speaker 1>it's infuriating, its censorship, Pink said in an Instagram video

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<v Speaker 1>announcing her action. The video, which also featured PEN America's

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<v Speaker 1>president Suzanne Nozel, has been linked to more than has

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<v Speaker 1>been linked more than thirty three thousand times liked sorry,

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<v Speaker 1>don't have my glasses on all right quote. Books have

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<v Speaker 1>held a special joy for me from the time I

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<v Speaker 1>was a child and That's why I am unwilling to

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<v Speaker 1>stand by and watch while books are banned by schools,

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<v Speaker 1>Pink said in a PEN statement about the giveaway. She

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<v Speaker 1>goes on to say, it's especially hateful to see authorities

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<v Speaker 1>take aim at books about race and racism against LGBTQ

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<v Speaker 1>authors and those of color. We have made so many

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<v Speaker 1>strides toward equality in this country, and no one should

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<v Speaker 1>want to see this progress reversed. This is why I

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<v Speaker 1>am supporting PEN America in its work and why I

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<v Speaker 1>agree with them no more banned books. And we always

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<v Speaker 1>do our best to applaud folks who are becoming better

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<v Speaker 1>allies by using their platforms and really taking on uncomfortablet answers,

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<v Speaker 1>and I'd imagine that's true with Pink. Okay, so we're

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<v Speaker 1>going to talk about the car s rules system, and

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<v Speaker 1>this is one piece of the entire criminal justice system.

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<v Speaker 1>We spent the first half of the show talking about police,

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<v Speaker 1>law enforcement, law enforcement. Yeah, and you know, we we

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<v Speaker 1>have problems there with police. We have problems with sentencing,

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<v Speaker 1>and we have problems with how we think about the

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<v Speaker 1>car rules system. And it's always interesting to do these

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<v Speaker 1>readings that we do because we learn so much from

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<v Speaker 1>these great thinkers who allow us to step outside of

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<v Speaker 1>our own way of thinking, our own framework, mental framework,

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<v Speaker 1>to re examine critically what holds our society. Yet, well,

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<v Speaker 1>this happens because it's always happened that way, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>too difficult to undo it. And these brilliant minds cause

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<v Speaker 1>us to rethink even that position because the fact of

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<v Speaker 1>the matter is that these rethinks aren't tall orders. It

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<v Speaker 1>doesn't require any people being any different, And in this instance,

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<v Speaker 1>it was very easy for me. I've shared this on

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<v Speaker 1>the show before and I'll share it again. I have

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<v Speaker 1>an older brother who went to prison for a very

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<v Speaker 1>very very long time. Not quite football numbers, but a

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<v Speaker 1>long time.

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<v Speaker 2>You know.

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<v Speaker 1>It might have been somewhere in the neighborhood of maybe

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<v Speaker 1>fifteen years. And you would think that my brother did

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<v Speaker 1>something wild. And I mean, I suppose it depends on

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<v Speaker 1>who you ask, but I don't think it was wild.

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<v Speaker 1>My brother got a brand new Cadillac Escalade and my

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<v Speaker 1>family's from California. I'm from California. California is a place

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<v Speaker 1>where people will jack you for your car. Carjackings take

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<v Speaker 1>place in California. So my brother decided to protect himself

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<v Speaker 1>by owning a firearm. One day because he had this

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<v Speaker 1>in his vehicle to protect himself. There was some people

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<v Speaker 1>that were messing with his girlfriend now wife. They were

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<v Speaker 1>being they were harassing her, and my brother was outnumbered.

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<v Speaker 1>But he knew that, hey, if I get this gun

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<v Speaker 1>fire in the air, might scare these guys off and

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<v Speaker 1>then we can get out of here. It's exactly what

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<v Speaker 1>he did. Now we thought everything was going to be okay.

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<v Speaker 1>We his family because fortunately where he was, it was

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<v Speaker 1>on video. It's clearly shooting in the air. Guys run away,

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<v Speaker 1>they get out of there. Everything's fine. My brother went

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<v Speaker 1>to jail prison for attempted murder fifteen years. They took

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<v Speaker 1>my brother from me, and it's on video. He wasn't

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<v Speaker 1>trying to murder anyone. Story checks out, you know, he's

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<v Speaker 1>obviously his now wife was there. Tell our version of

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<v Speaker 1>the story. And this is the car soule system in

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<v Speaker 1>the United States of America. This is my brother. This

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<v Speaker 1>is not like the homie. This is my father's son

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<v Speaker 1>that I'm talking about. So when I came across this,

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<v Speaker 1>which I want to shout out, we are pushblack on Instagram.

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<v Speaker 1>Give them a once sober and give them a follow

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<v Speaker 1>if you're into this type of content, I believe that

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<v Speaker 1>this is really some profound content for thought experiments and

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<v Speaker 1>rethinking just the world looks and feels to you if

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<v Speaker 1>you're black, if you are not black. You know, it's

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<v Speaker 1>just important that we share this information and we understand

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<v Speaker 1>a little bit more about each other's walks. But this

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<v Speaker 1>comes or this starts off three ways. Garceral logic limits

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<v Speaker 1>our imaginations and restricts our futures. Okay, so I'll read

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<v Speaker 1>a bit. Carcerol logic is the way of thinking that

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<v Speaker 1>made prisons and policing or carceral systems possible. Because we've

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<v Speaker 1>normalized those systems, we still use this logic even outside

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<v Speaker 1>context of incarceration. Here's three examples. So this is a

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<v Speaker 1>very easy thought experiment to follow. We're going to go

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<v Speaker 1>through these examples one by one. Okay, Number one, are

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<v Speaker 1>you innocent or are you guilty? Now you're just listening

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<v Speaker 1>to me ask That sounds simple enough, right. Turns out, realistically,

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<v Speaker 1>most real people and real conflicts are more complex than that. Carciologic, however,

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<v Speaker 1>tells us there's a terrible few the guilty people who

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<v Speaker 1>do the wrong things because they have something wrong with them,

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<v Speaker 1>But that establishes a dangerous inaccurate binary, especially for marginalized people.

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<v Speaker 1>And funnily enough, on this show, and I want you

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<v Speaker 1>to jump in here, Q, because I know that this

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<v Speaker 1>has been one of the things that you've been certainly

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<v Speaker 1>even more passionate about than me. But for folks who

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<v Speaker 1>have a traditional mindset, innocent, guilty, do the crime, do

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<v Speaker 1>the time. That's sort of thinking that when it lacks humanity,

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<v Speaker 1>when it lacks empathy, when it lacks context, overlooks people's circumstances.

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<v Speaker 1>And if we agree that human beings deserve how about

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<v Speaker 1>if there's a stray dog, it looks very thin, and

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<v Speaker 1>it's outside of your house, and say you live on

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<v Speaker 1>a house and the dog knocks over your trash can

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<v Speaker 1>and takes some food and runs off, that would make sense, Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>the dog is trying to survive. Indeed, if it was

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<v Speaker 1>a dog, most people might actually say, Wow, that dog

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<v Speaker 1>is hungry, Let me feed the dog. Okay. If that

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<v Speaker 1>is a person, not a dog, and the person is black, people,

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<v Speaker 1>funnily enough, treat that human being worse in many instances,

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<v Speaker 1>because we've seen many videos of police kicking black men

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<v Speaker 1>and They're like, Yo, what did I do? I was

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<v Speaker 1>just walking down wooded what's going on? The police are kicking, no,

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<v Speaker 1>stop resisting all that sort of stuff, and people are like, yeah, well,

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<v Speaker 1>clearly he did something. And then the thought experiment that

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<v Speaker 1>we have often is excuse me, swap out that black

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<v Speaker 1>man for a dog. Do you still feel the same way?

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<v Speaker 1>And then most people are like, of course not. And

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<v Speaker 1>so this is where I want you to dear been

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<v Speaker 1>guilty or innocent. If I'm poor, I come from impoverished

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<v Speaker 1>circumstances and I need to eat, or I need to

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<v Speaker 1>figure out a way to get some money together so

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<v Speaker 1>that I can pay for where I live or whatever,

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<v Speaker 1>does that make me a bad person or does that

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<v Speaker 1>make me a poor person? And I get that there's

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of nuance here, but it's a good question

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<v Speaker 1>to ask, because I could show you bad people who

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<v Speaker 1>are wealthy people and then they do bad things to

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<v Speaker 1>gain more wealth. But it's very hard for me with

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<v Speaker 1>proper contact to look at poor people and feel that

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<v Speaker 1>they should be held to the same standard, or indeed

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<v Speaker 1>a worse or a more harsh standard than people who

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<v Speaker 1>are just greedy for the sake of being greedy. All right,

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<v Speaker 1>go ahead.

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<v Speaker 2>Nuance it's one of my favorite words. And this spoke

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<v Speaker 2>about the idea of us having a cutro logic, even

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<v Speaker 2>outside the idea of incarceration.

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<v Speaker 1>Right.

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<v Speaker 2>Two, you know examples that I want to point out.

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<v Speaker 2>The first and most obvious is in the way that

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<v Speaker 2>you just described. Right, in this capitalist society, there has

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<v Speaker 2>to be a good guy and a bad guy, and

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of that is in order to upheil uphold

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sorry the society.

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<v Speaker 1>Right.

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<v Speaker 2>The interjection of nuance and context and complexity makes it

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<v Speaker 2>far too difficult to enforce this law and this system

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<v Speaker 2>the way that we want to right. Bad people do

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<v Speaker 2>bad things, sending to jail. It's way easier than asking

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<v Speaker 2>all the questions why and what circumstances led to etcetera, etcetera.

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<v Speaker 2>Then far more simple examples like relationships, Right, a romantic

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<v Speaker 2>relationship comes to an end, someone there had to be

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<v Speaker 2>the bad guy. There is no space for nuances and

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<v Speaker 2>decisions being made for reasons outside of that person's just bad.

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<v Speaker 1>I know that story. That's why I brought it. We

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<v Speaker 1>all do it.

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<v Speaker 2>I got to be painted as the bad guy in

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<v Speaker 2>a very very public way. Once upon a time to

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<v Speaker 2>hundreds and thousands of strangers who got to then have

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<v Speaker 2>a full, fleshed out opinion of me with very very

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<v Speaker 2>little little data, very very little context, with very very

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<v Speaker 2>little in the way of complexity and nuance. Right, this

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<v Speaker 2>pretty person said I was bad, so I must be.

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<v Speaker 2>It was easy to view me and other people male

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<v Speaker 2>and female, on the wake of a relationship gone south,

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<v Speaker 2>a romantic relationship.

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<v Speaker 1>Right.

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<v Speaker 2>Probably our most flimsy relationship are those of romance and passion.

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<v Speaker 2>When they fall apart and go south, someone has to

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<v Speaker 2>be the bad guy, and there has to be a

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<v Speaker 2>punishment assigned to the bad person. It's never that straight. Look,

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<v Speaker 2>that's not fair. Sometimes it is. There is a such

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<v Speaker 2>thing as bad people like we don't want to pretend

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<v Speaker 2>to let's not pretend, right, But in often cases, bad

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<v Speaker 2>as a label that gets placed on somebody because of

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<v Speaker 2>a decision made because of circumstance. And we'd rather not

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<v Speaker 2>have those complex conversations about circumstances because it makes upholding

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<v Speaker 2>a specific system and making very black and white linear.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, in some cases bad logic decisions hard to

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<v Speaker 2>make if you interject these complexities and nuance and context

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<v Speaker 2>and color.

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<v Speaker 1>What we'd rather it just be black and white, you know.

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<v Speaker 1>And and there's something funny here too, specifically because I've

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<v Speaker 1>said this on a recent episode two that a bar

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<v Speaker 1>from Tupac it's not I wonder if Heaven got a ghetto.

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<v Speaker 1>It's probably the song will come to me. But he says,

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<v Speaker 1>instead of a war on poverty, they got a war

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<v Speaker 1>on drugs, so the police can bother me. And I

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<v Speaker 1>think that that really shows that's just the way it is.

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<v Speaker 1>That's just the way. Thank you, thank you. I don't

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<v Speaker 1>know I'm a DJ. I don't know how I forgot

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<v Speaker 1>that one. You're a DJ, though, thank you for remembering

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<v Speaker 1>profile messages. But I know it came from the same

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<v Speaker 1>album or same time brain, you know. But anyway, that statement,

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<v Speaker 1>I think kind of really encompasses the way that the

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<v Speaker 1>government or the powers that be, or the societal framework

0:14:55.760 --> 0:15:02.240
<v Speaker 1>under which we live is just comfortab with things being

0:15:02.280 --> 0:15:07.000
<v Speaker 1>the way that they are. It overwhelmingly upholds people who

0:15:07.120 --> 0:15:10.720
<v Speaker 1>have privileged that could be wealth, that could be their

0:15:10.800 --> 0:15:13.880
<v Speaker 1>racial composition, that could be opportunities, that could be, you know,

0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:16.080
<v Speaker 1>where their dad went to school or who their mom

0:15:16.160 --> 0:15:23.560
<v Speaker 1>knew or whatever, and it disproportionately negatively affects people like us,

0:15:23.720 --> 0:15:27.040
<v Speaker 1>especially if when you're looking at a carceral system that

0:15:27.400 --> 0:15:35.560
<v Speaker 1>disproportionately sentences black people to sorry sentences, black people to

0:15:35.720 --> 0:15:38.560
<v Speaker 1>disproportionately long sentences. I think that's what I'm trying to say.

0:15:39.560 --> 0:15:47.560
<v Speaker 1>You start to realize that the data shows that it's

0:15:47.600 --> 0:15:53.400
<v Speaker 1>a much tougher go for us based on this binary

0:15:53.440 --> 0:15:55.880
<v Speaker 1>system where there's no room for nuance. And this this

0:15:55.960 --> 0:15:57.520
<v Speaker 1>is true. I've been I've been to court before and

0:15:57.520 --> 0:15:59.240
<v Speaker 1>they have, you know, a judge. You'd be like, I

0:15:59.240 --> 0:16:00.840
<v Speaker 1>got a ticket once, How about this, I got a

0:16:00.840 --> 0:16:04.640
<v Speaker 1>ticket once. Judge is like, well, the ticket was for

0:16:04.720 --> 0:16:06.680
<v Speaker 1>like tag. I had a paper tag. I bought a

0:16:06.680 --> 0:16:11.640
<v Speaker 1>new car, right, and the paper tag expired. But the

0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:15.160
<v Speaker 1>dealership was supposed to send me the new tag. You know,

0:16:15.160 --> 0:16:16.480
<v Speaker 1>that's what you paid for when you get the car,

0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:20.080
<v Speaker 1>and the dealership never sent it to me. So I'm driving,

0:16:20.360 --> 0:16:24.120
<v Speaker 1>get pulled over, I get a ticket, right, and then

0:16:24.160 --> 0:16:26.320
<v Speaker 1>I go to court for this ticket, and I was

0:16:26.440 --> 0:16:29.160
<v Speaker 1>trying to let them know, hey, I've done everything that

0:16:29.200 --> 0:16:34.000
<v Speaker 1>I could possibly do. This is not my crime. This

0:16:34.040 --> 0:16:36.680
<v Speaker 1>is indeed the crime of the dealership because had I

0:16:36.720 --> 0:16:39.080
<v Speaker 1>received everything, it would have been there I still have

0:16:39.120 --> 0:16:40.240
<v Speaker 1>to go to work. This is my only car. I

0:16:40.240 --> 0:16:41.720
<v Speaker 1>bought it. You know, this is what I was thinking.

0:16:41.880 --> 0:16:44.480
<v Speaker 1>There's all the nuance for you. The judge wasn't trying

0:16:44.480 --> 0:16:46.200
<v Speaker 1>to hear a nuance. The judge was like, were you

0:16:46.280 --> 0:16:50.960
<v Speaker 1>driving with a expired paper tag? Yes? Or no? And

0:16:51.080 --> 0:16:54.360
<v Speaker 1>under those circumstances, I have to say yes. And I

0:16:54.400 --> 0:16:55.960
<v Speaker 1>don't have any money if I at the time, I

0:16:56.000 --> 0:16:58.280
<v Speaker 1>was going to school and I had to pay for

0:16:58.320 --> 0:17:00.360
<v Speaker 1>my own school, you know what I mean, So certainly

0:17:00.400 --> 0:17:03.160
<v Speaker 1>didn't have money to fight a ticket. And now you

0:17:03.200 --> 0:17:06.439
<v Speaker 1>see how it goes. So anyway, the point here is

0:17:06.440 --> 0:17:10.840
<v Speaker 1>that nuance helps where currently we have a binary system.

0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:15.360
<v Speaker 1>Let's go to step two. Defining punishment is complex too.

0:17:15.720 --> 0:17:19.439
<v Speaker 1>You might consider blocking someone's number, punching someone, or killing

0:17:19.480 --> 0:17:22.760
<v Speaker 1>someone who hurt you. Hurt also exists on a spectrum.

0:17:23.200 --> 0:17:27.080
<v Speaker 1>In other words, there are mandatory minimums, there are three

0:17:27.119 --> 0:17:29.720
<v Speaker 1>strikes laws. There are things like this, where how about

0:17:29.720 --> 0:17:32.600
<v Speaker 1>three strikes? Brian Stevenson, who we're a big fan of

0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:36.440
<v Speaker 1>on this show. He is the founder of the Equal

0:17:36.560 --> 0:17:38.960
<v Speaker 1>Justice Initiative. Please look him up to He's a very

0:17:38.960 --> 0:17:43.679
<v Speaker 1>profound speaker in a brilliant mind. Brian Stevenson said on

0:17:43.720 --> 0:17:46.320
<v Speaker 1>a Ted Talk Once upon a Time. He says, you know,

0:17:46.359 --> 0:17:50.520
<v Speaker 1>the three strikes laws in California have people who've lived

0:17:50.600 --> 0:17:53.280
<v Speaker 1>rough lives. Just how no one wakes up in the

0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:54.960
<v Speaker 1>morning's like, oh my gosh, you can't wait to do crime.

0:17:55.240 --> 0:17:57.040
<v Speaker 1>People are like, I need to get the opportunity wherever

0:17:57.080 --> 0:18:01.160
<v Speaker 1>I can. Some people, I'll interject again, some people people exist. Yeah, right,

0:18:01.160 --> 0:18:04.320
<v Speaker 1>But the people that we know that end up in

0:18:04.359 --> 0:18:06.399
<v Speaker 1>these stories that we end up coming across lots of

0:18:07.320 --> 0:18:09.960
<v Speaker 1>these stories, that's not the It's hard to imagine that

0:18:10.440 --> 0:18:13.080
<v Speaker 1>way like that because Rams just pointed out earlier and

0:18:13.560 --> 0:18:16.360
<v Speaker 1>in our covers today that there are people who are

0:18:16.359 --> 0:18:19.320
<v Speaker 1>well off that still wake up. That's exactly what he

0:18:19.480 --> 0:18:22.040
<v Speaker 1>thank you for. Thank you for making sure that I'm

0:18:22.080 --> 0:18:24.800
<v Speaker 1>all the way right. But what you have is people

0:18:24.800 --> 0:18:30.800
<v Speaker 1>that have lived rough lives that you know, maybe they're

0:18:31.520 --> 0:18:34.520
<v Speaker 1>they see a bicycle, they think there, that's the bike

0:18:34.600 --> 0:18:36.880
<v Speaker 1>that was taken from them, so they take it back

0:18:37.760 --> 0:18:40.440
<v Speaker 1>and now they have to go to prison forever. Right.

0:18:40.640 --> 0:18:44.000
<v Speaker 1>So again, rethinking punishment is another part of this, and

0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:45.600
<v Speaker 1>I want to make sure we get this. This last

0:18:45.600 --> 0:18:49.240
<v Speaker 1>one here is number three. Punishment in this context, along

0:18:49.280 --> 0:18:52.280
<v Speaker 1>with surveillance and violating human rights, is more so an

0:18:52.280 --> 0:18:57.600
<v Speaker 1>abusive power. Yes, prisons, but also actions like parents beating children.

0:18:57.960 --> 0:19:01.000
<v Speaker 1>State enforced carco logic leaves us little room to question

0:19:01.080 --> 0:19:04.560
<v Speaker 1>punishments or approach individual harms as part of a collective,

0:19:05.040 --> 0:19:09.160
<v Speaker 1>like eliminating the actual causes of systemic sexual or racial violence.

0:19:09.720 --> 0:19:11.760
<v Speaker 1>We're expected to trade our agency for how the state

0:19:11.800 --> 0:19:15.760
<v Speaker 1>response to our conflicts, leaving many violent survivors dissatisfied or

0:19:15.760 --> 0:19:20.320
<v Speaker 1>criminalized themselves. Carcologic is ingrained in our world, but it's

0:19:20.320 --> 0:19:22.840
<v Speaker 1>still a system of opinions. We can choose to believe

0:19:22.840 --> 0:19:27.160
<v Speaker 1>something else. We can imagine and create more empowering logics

0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:30.400
<v Speaker 1>and a safer world. Now, I don't want to leave

0:19:30.680 --> 0:19:34.639
<v Speaker 1>us right there, so I'm going to share some good news,

0:19:35.280 --> 0:19:38.120
<v Speaker 1>which is rare on this show. But I came across

0:19:38.119 --> 0:19:42.000
<v Speaker 1>the statistic, and funnily enough, it was Ben Crump that

0:19:42.600 --> 0:19:44.639
<v Speaker 1>first posted it, and then I went and researched it

0:19:44.680 --> 0:19:46.320
<v Speaker 1>to make sure that it was true. But as it

0:19:46.359 --> 0:19:51.200
<v Speaker 1>turns out, the imprisonment rates for black women are in decline.

0:19:53.000 --> 0:19:58.040
<v Speaker 1>They've declined seventy percent from two thousand to twenty twenty one.

0:19:58.160 --> 0:20:02.160
<v Speaker 1>She's going. And then for black males rates declined forty

0:20:02.200 --> 0:20:05.560
<v Speaker 1>eight percent during the same time frame, and obviously this

0:20:05.640 --> 0:20:08.560
<v Speaker 1>is a major step forward. Still disproportionately affects us. We

0:20:08.600 --> 0:20:11.800
<v Speaker 1>still get the disproportionate sentences, but over the you know,

0:20:11.880 --> 0:20:16.359
<v Speaker 1>two decade plus, you know time frame, you can see

0:20:16.400 --> 0:20:22.600
<v Speaker 1>that you know, either we are you know, figuring a

0:20:22.600 --> 0:20:26.639
<v Speaker 1>way to avoid this or something is working. I would

0:20:27.080 --> 0:20:28.840
<v Speaker 1>I think that I probably should do some more research

0:20:28.880 --> 0:20:34.520
<v Speaker 1>into what might be causing these these rates. But this

0:20:34.640 --> 0:20:37.040
<v Speaker 1>is very special. The truth of the matter is that

0:20:39.000 --> 0:20:42.840
<v Speaker 1>one in five black mails born in two thousand and

0:20:42.880 --> 0:20:47.720
<v Speaker 1>one it is likely to experience imprisonment in their lifetimes.

0:20:48.320 --> 0:20:50.760
<v Speaker 1>It sounds like a lot, and it is. But that's

0:20:50.880 --> 0:20:54.520
<v Speaker 1>down from one in three black males born when we

0:20:54.520 --> 0:20:58.040
<v Speaker 1>were born, born in nineteen eighty one. And you're free

0:20:58.080 --> 0:21:03.040
<v Speaker 1>to verify this. Go to Entensingproject dot org and check

0:21:03.119 --> 0:21:06.040
<v Speaker 1>that out. But yeah, as it turns out, incarceration rates

0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:09.440
<v Speaker 1>for black people are dropping, and I'd imagine that's why

0:21:09.480 --> 0:21:11.600
<v Speaker 1>in the past couple of years there's been this big

0:21:11.640 --> 0:21:15.720
<v Speaker 1>push to make us at for the stakeholders of the

0:21:15.760 --> 0:21:18.000
<v Speaker 1>prisons in their country to try to keep them filled

0:21:18.040 --> 0:21:22.080
<v Speaker 1>and they've renegotiated their deals with different cities and criminal

0:21:22.200 --> 0:21:27.240
<v Speaker 1>justice you know, uh departments and so forth. But but yeah,

0:21:27.280 --> 0:21:31.359
<v Speaker 1>rethinking that system in its entirety is something that we

0:21:31.400 --> 0:21:34.040
<v Speaker 1>want you to do. Obviously, if you're an elected official,

0:21:34.400 --> 0:21:36.960
<v Speaker 1>shoot put that on your platform. But if you're just

0:21:37.000 --> 0:21:39.400
<v Speaker 1>a person who is like us, and.

0:21:39.400 --> 0:21:43.760
<v Speaker 2>We imagine not just with regards to incarceration in prison,

0:21:43.840 --> 0:21:47.000
<v Speaker 2>but like this, like the reading says, with our relationships

0:21:47.000 --> 0:21:47.919
<v Speaker 2>with our children everything.

0:21:48.000 --> 0:21:51.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, absolutely that that binary is very dangerous and it

0:21:52.119 --> 0:21:55.560
<v Speaker 1>and it causes us to miss out on really the

0:21:56.280 --> 0:21:58.120
<v Speaker 1>bulk of what it is we're supposed to learn from

0:21:58.119 --> 0:22:01.640
<v Speaker 1>our stories. So with that in mind, I guess we'll

0:22:01.680 --> 0:22:03.320
<v Speaker 1>leave that one right there. I'd like to thank you

0:22:03.359 --> 0:22:06.960
<v Speaker 1>all once again for tuning into this installment of Civic Cipher.

0:22:07.000 --> 0:22:08.560
<v Speaker 1>I have been your host Ramsy's.

0:22:08.240 --> 0:22:12.960
<v Speaker 2>Ja He has been Ramsey's jaw. I still am you know,

0:22:12.960 --> 0:22:16.680
<v Speaker 2>I like that word, and you know, engage with us

0:22:16.880 --> 0:22:20.800
<v Speaker 2>civic cipher dot com and civic Cipher at Civic Cipher

0:22:20.840 --> 0:22:27.080
<v Speaker 2>on all social media you know, like love, share, comment, subscribe,

0:22:27.240 --> 0:22:29.480
<v Speaker 2>follow all of that.

0:22:29.720 --> 0:22:32.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Yeah, and we want to give a big shout

0:22:32.480 --> 0:22:35.040
<v Speaker 1>out to the Black Information Network If you're listening to

0:22:35.080 --> 0:22:37.919
<v Speaker 1>us on a bi in station, we appreciate you. Want

0:22:37.960 --> 0:22:40.280
<v Speaker 1>to let you know that you welcome to Cipher. Indeed,

0:22:40.960 --> 0:22:43.720
<v Speaker 1>let you know that you can get the full show

0:22:43.800 --> 0:22:47.320
<v Speaker 1>at civic cipher dot com in case you missed any

0:22:47.320 --> 0:22:50.240
<v Speaker 1>part of it. And as Q mentioned, please tap in

0:22:50.280 --> 0:22:53.000
<v Speaker 1>with us on social media at Civic Cipher on all platforms.

0:22:53.240 --> 0:22:56.400
<v Speaker 1>We need that support because we attract a lot of trolls.

0:22:56.440 --> 0:22:59.000
<v Speaker 1>And until next week, y'all, peace, peace,