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Speaker 1: Welcome back to She Pivots. I'm Crystal McCrary maguire.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to She Pivots, the podcast where we talk with

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Speaker 2: women who dared to pivot out of one career and

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Speaker 2: into something new and explore how their personal lives impacted

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Speaker 2: these decisions. I'm your host, Emily Tish Sussman. Welcome back Pivoters.

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Speaker 2: This week, I'm joined by the lovely Crystal McCrary. I

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Speaker 2: first met Crystal through my mom, the way I meet

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Speaker 2: most people in my life. But right away I could

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Speaker 2: tell this woman was impressive, which explains why Sex and

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Speaker 2: City and just like that, based a character off of her.

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Speaker 2: Her superpower is combining fine and fabulous energy with an

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Speaker 2: unparalleled drive and desire to tell stories that uplift and

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Speaker 2: power black culture and black women. Crystal is an accomplished producer, director, lawyer.

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Speaker 2: Growing up in Detroit, Cristal always knew she wanted to

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Speaker 2: do something bigger, and throughout her life she's always pivoted,

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Speaker 2: leveraging her circumstances to create new iterations for herself, from

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Speaker 2: being a two time New York Times bestselling author to

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Speaker 2: appearing on numerous television networks as a cultural legal and

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Speaker 2: political pundit and who can forget? She also co hosted

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Speaker 2: the view She's Really Done It All? On top of

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Speaker 2: it all, Kristal's life has revolved around basketball for decades now.

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Speaker 2: Her oldest son, Cole Anthony, now plays professionally for the

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Speaker 2: Orlando Magic, and her other two children, Ella and Leo,

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Speaker 2: also excelled in the sport, taking up nights and weekends

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Speaker 2: for as long as she can remember. After years in

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Speaker 2: the youth basketball scene, she's teamed up with her son

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Speaker 2: Cole to share their experience and connect young basketball players

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Speaker 2: with local basketball resources through.

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Speaker 3: Their new app up.

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Speaker 2: Crystal embodies someone who's always allowed herself to steadily explore

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Speaker 2: and pivot, leading with the personal hope you enjoy. Welcome

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Speaker 2: Crystal McCrary maguire. I am so excited to have you

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Speaker 2: on she pivots.

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Speaker 1: I'm really excited to be here. Emily, Thank you so

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Speaker 1: much for having me.

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Speaker 2: You have been a long inspiration in the pivoting for

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Speaker 2: me and just in general in the like you bring

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Speaker 2: the kind of energy that I aspire to bring into

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Speaker 2: the world.

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Speaker 3: Thank you, like with.

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Speaker 2: Generosity and with kindness and general boss ladiness.

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Speaker 3: But let's take it back. Let's go to the beginnings. Okay,

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Speaker 3: so you grew up in Detroit, Yes, I did. Did

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Speaker 3: you think you were going to stay in Detroit or

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Speaker 3: did you think you'd ever leave?

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Speaker 1: Well, I always knew I want it out. I mean, listen,

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Speaker 1: I love Detroit and it's had an incredible resurgence right now.

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Speaker 1: But I just was more so interested in the arts.

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Speaker 1: I was interested in creating and content creation. And I

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Speaker 1: didn't have anyone in my family who'd ever had a

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Speaker 1: quote unquote creative profession. I had a lot of lawyers,

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Speaker 1: few doctors, and I really didn't have that roadmap in

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Speaker 1: front of me. And I guess as a kid, whatever

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Speaker 1: it was that was incoming on my end, I was

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Speaker 1: informed that there's something in New York City that's pretty cool.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know what it was. I'd never been, but

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Speaker 1: I really did always want to move to New York City.

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Speaker 2: If you hadn't actually been, do you remember, like, was

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Speaker 2: it images?

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Speaker 4: Was it movies? Like what kind of drew you to

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Speaker 4: the city. Sure, I mean it was certainly images. You know,

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Speaker 4: I will say this not the most glamorous, but certainly gritty.

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Speaker 4: But I do remember as a child seeing the movie

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Speaker 4: Fame Ough.

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Speaker 1: With Irene Kara Debbie Allen.

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Speaker 2: Oh my god, that Times Square. I mean, well, first

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Speaker 2: of the dancing up on the taxi.

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Speaker 1: Of course, of course, in the in the school, the

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Speaker 1: liberal arts school, the just the diversity, you know, the music,

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Speaker 1: the excitement. There was just something that I saw in

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Speaker 1: that film and all of sort of the imagery and

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Speaker 1: messaging around New York City. And I think I had

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Speaker 1: a cousin that had moved to New York City, and

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Speaker 1: there was something sort of exotic and far off, and

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Speaker 1: you know, but I will say, you know, the part

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Speaker 1: of Detroit that I grew up in, you know, we

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Speaker 1: used to joke it was like a little mini United Nations.

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Speaker 1: And I grew up in the seventies in downtown Detroit,

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Speaker 1: and so I grew up really and I feel very

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Speaker 1: fortunate to have have grown up in a community that was,

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Speaker 1: you know, just multi cultural, ethnicity, gender, everything.

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Speaker 2: Despite living in downtown Detroit, Crystal started to travel out

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Speaker 2: to Gross Point to go to school, a wealthy and

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Speaker 2: largely white area just a few miles from downtown.

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Speaker 3: Yes I did. I was.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't like bussed in the traditional sense that I

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Speaker 1: now understand busting to mean, but in hindsight, there was

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Speaker 1: that feeling that I imagine a kid, you know, going

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Speaker 1: from a fairly urban community out to the suburbs, you

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Speaker 1: know where like the Fords of you know, their family

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Speaker 1: went to school an industrialist and you know, people whose

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Speaker 1: families were much more financially well off, so to speak,

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Speaker 1: than my family. And frankly, racism me being other was

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Speaker 1: made aware to me at the schools I went to

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Speaker 1: in gross Point in a way that they had never

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Speaker 1: been made aware to me going to school in downtown Detroit.

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Speaker 1: I became aware that, oh, you're a black girl. I

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Speaker 1: remember going to a party in middle school because I

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Speaker 1: went to the school called gross Point Academy and then

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Speaker 1: this University of Ligott. They they sound like they are, Yes,

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Speaker 1: I think I can picture it from the Point Academy

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Speaker 1: and I remember going to a party at a classmates

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Speaker 1: class and this is actually, can't make this up. As

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking about this, and I'm thinking about this young

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Speaker 1: lady's name you but we did. We had Muffy's, we

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Speaker 1: had Carrington's. No, we really did. I mean it was

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Speaker 1: remember like the preppy handbook, But I remember going to

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Speaker 1: a party and she lived in this mansion. You know,

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Speaker 1: I didn't know that people could live in houses like this, right,

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Speaker 1: And I remember a bunch of kids being outside and

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Speaker 1: I don't know what we were doing. I was the

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Speaker 1: only black girl. But then I saw this black boy

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Speaker 1: there that had never seen before.

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Speaker 3: He wasn't a classmate.

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Speaker 1: And my host said, oh, you'll like so and so

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Speaker 1: he's like you, and I.

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Speaker 3: Was like, whatnot?

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Speaker 1: And then and then I gathered that he was the

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Speaker 1: son of their Jamaican nanny, and they placed us together

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Speaker 1: based on, you know, our skin color. And again I

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Speaker 1: just I had no problem meeting him and talking tom

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Speaker 1: but the fact that I'm the only black girl. He's

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Speaker 1: not even there really as a guest. He's like just

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Speaker 1: there as the nanny's son. And I was made acutely

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Speaker 1: aware of I was different than the rest of the

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Speaker 1: kids at this party.

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Speaker 3: Things like that.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it wasn't you know, that wasn't like overtly

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Speaker 1: you know, rude. I don't know how to you know, like,

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Speaker 1: I know it wouldn't happen to my kids in the

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Speaker 1: same way growing up in New York City, but I was.

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Speaker 1: I was definitely made aware of my otherness and how

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Speaker 1: I was raised. You know, we actually we didn't really

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Speaker 1: talk about race, you know, we didn't talk about political

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Speaker 1: issues that that just was not what we talked about.

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Speaker 1: I mean I was raised, I mean I was actually

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Speaker 1: raised by my maternal grandparents. They raised me as my

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Speaker 1: mother and father because my mother, my biological mother, had

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Speaker 1: me in a very young agd. She basically left me at

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Speaker 1: their door step and there my parents, right. But they

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Speaker 1: were Depression era parents born in the Jim Crow South

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Speaker 1: who their families migrated north to Detroit for economic opportunity

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Speaker 1: during the you know, the Great Migration, as Isabella Wilkerson

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Speaker 1: writes about in the Warmth of other Sons.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it was very much that.

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Speaker 1: And so they came through the Depression, and they weren't

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Speaker 1: children of the sixties, so it was just a different

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Speaker 1: way of There wasn't like activism around civil rights in

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Speaker 1: our household. I mean, I really didn't start learning and

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Speaker 1: leaning into that part of who I am really until

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Speaker 1: I was in college.

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Speaker 2: Did they just not discuss civil rights or was there

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Speaker 2: did you get the sense that you really shouldn't be

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Speaker 2: talking about it?

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Speaker 3: They just didn't discuss it.

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Speaker 1: They didn't and you know, again it was this prop

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Speaker 1: you know, I'd say quote unquote properness. Right, my mom

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Speaker 1: she was born and she turns in ninety eight, but

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Speaker 1: she was born in nineteen twenty five.

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Speaker 3: She's still alive. It's incredible.

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Speaker 1: My dad was born in nineteen twenty three. He passed away.

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Speaker 1: And also just the age wise, I mean when I

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Speaker 1: was as my parents slash grandparents, they were older parents,

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Speaker 1: and look at this in the in the seventies, you know,

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Speaker 1: they were already married, had a family established. As you know,

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Speaker 1: my mom was a school teacher and then a principal,

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Speaker 1: public school teacher and principal. My dad was worked for

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Speaker 1: Ford Motor Company, and so it was the era of

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Speaker 1: where you didn't change jobs.

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Speaker 3: Right, there was no pivot, right, there was no pivot.

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Speaker 3: There was no pivot.

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Speaker 1: You know this that was not that same type of

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Speaker 1: optionality and even awareness of particularly as it relates particularly

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Speaker 1: as it relates to women in my mom. On one hand,

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Speaker 1: she was made money as a school teacher and then

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Speaker 1: a principal, but she wasn't going to do anything. There

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Speaker 1: was I'm going to stop being a teacher and go

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Speaker 1: and start a singing career or start a podcast or

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Speaker 1: there was.

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Speaker 3: None of that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it just wasn't the vibe for moving through the timeline.

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Speaker 2: So did you always think that you were going to

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Speaker 2: go to law school like so much of your family.

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Speaker 1: Well, I did really look up to the lawyers in

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Speaker 1: my family, you know, because they were sort of that

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Speaker 1: next generation of getting advanced degrees beyond the undergraduate degree,

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Speaker 1: and there was this upward mobility associated with one that

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Speaker 1: had a law degree. I can't say that I was

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Speaker 1: particularly interested in it other than it to me symbolized stability.

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Speaker 1: There was a certain status to it, you know, particularly

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Speaker 1: as I juxtaposed that to the people that I went

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Speaker 1: to school with. I just looked at that as, oh,

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Speaker 1: this is an opportunity to sort of excel. I wasn't

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Speaker 1: particularly interested in it. I was an English major in

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Speaker 1: undergrad and would have loved to have gone straight from

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Speaker 1: undergrad into a creative profession. I didn't know what that

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Speaker 1: could have been, what that looked like.

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Speaker 3: As I said, I.

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Speaker 1: Didn't have anybody in my family that was in the arts.

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Speaker 1: In my family, like so many families of my generation,

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Speaker 1: were what are you going to do with a quote

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Speaker 1: unquote creative profession? Are you going to get health insurance

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Speaker 1: with that? And so I sort of took that path

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Speaker 1: of least resistance, which is law school. Took that path

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Speaker 1: that had a level of familiarity and went to law school,

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Speaker 1: graduated from law school in nineteen ninety five, and went

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Speaker 1: to a farm in New York City called Paul Weiss.

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Speaker 1: And I did what many people who wanted to go

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Speaker 1: into the arts. I became a shadow artist as a lawyer,

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Speaker 1: what Julia Cameron writes about in the Artist way so eloquently.

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Speaker 1: And I was an entertainment lawyer. So I wasn't, you know,

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Speaker 1: earning a living as an artist, but I was representing artists.

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Speaker 1: But I got through. You know, I got through. I graduated,

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Speaker 1: I got a job. You've got a guide I got

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Speaker 1: I got a good.

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Speaker 3: I got a good job.

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Speaker 1: I passed the bar exam on the second time.

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Speaker 5: Well, all that matters is that we're barked out right

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Speaker 5: and started practicing law representing all of these really extraordinary entertainers, writers, playwrights, choreographers, authors,

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Speaker 5: visual artists, et cetera.

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Speaker 3: And really hated every minute of it. Wow, But my one.

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Speaker 1: Big butt in that is it showed me that they're

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Speaker 1: is a road map for one to have a creative profession.

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Speaker 1: And so from that perspective. It was instructive. That was

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Speaker 1: one of the great things that came out of it.

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Speaker 1: I did learn, you know, just the reasoning that one learns,

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Speaker 1: the writing that one must practice to be a lawyer.

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Speaker 1: And then I also met a lot of really fantastic people.

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Speaker 1: In fact, one of the men who was an associate

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Speaker 1: at Paul Weiss, a senior associate when I was a

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Speaker 1: young associate, a man by the name of Andrew Hurwitz,

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Speaker 1: left Paul Weiss also like I did, a little after me,

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Speaker 1: but he started this company called the Film Sales Company

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Speaker 1: flash forward many years he actually sold. I went to

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Speaker 1: him to sell my first film that I produced and

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Speaker 1: met him because of being you know, at Paul Weiss together.

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Speaker 3: So it wasn't totally for nothing.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely no. I do believe though that every saying so cliche,

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Speaker 1: everything does happen for a reason. Every coincidence is a

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Speaker 1: meaningful coincidence. I do believe in serendipity, and so I

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Speaker 1: can sort of sum up my whole legal journey as

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Speaker 1: being a part of that. That was a huge stepping

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Speaker 1: stone for me on the next path in my journey.

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Speaker 2: We talked so much on this show about how every

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Speaker 2: pivot is different and the time frame is differently. You know,

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Speaker 2: some happen in an instant, but some happen over time.

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Speaker 2: So what was that timeline for you of starting to write,

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Speaker 2: staying at the firm, and what was the thing that

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Speaker 2: made you feel like, Okay, it's time to leave the firm,

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Speaker 2: I'm ready to go into this full time.

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Speaker 1: I think I knew that my days were numbered at

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Speaker 1: the firm because I just had it was.

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Speaker 3: It was.

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Speaker 1: I was less than passionate. I was barely making it there,

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Speaker 1: just emotionally and mentally, and it's kind of making me

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Speaker 1: depressed is not the right, but just down. It was

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Speaker 1: every day. I just really did not look forward to

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Speaker 1: going to work, and I took enough time to kind

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Speaker 1: of save up some money. I did have a husband

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Speaker 1: that was making some money, but I didn't want to

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Speaker 1: have to rely on him.

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Speaker 2: Crystal was married to her first husband, Greg Anthony, an

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Speaker 2: NBA player for the New York Knicks at the time.

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Speaker 1: So I kind of got a plan in order that

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Speaker 1: I said, you know, let me finish working on this book.

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Speaker 1: And I think it was when Rita and I.

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Speaker 2: Rita Ewing, one of her best friends, who in fact

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Speaker 2: introduced Crystal to Greg and was writing the book with.

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Speaker 1: Her Rita, and I got a completed draft of the book,

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Speaker 1: found an agent, and I think it was right around

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Speaker 1: that time that I felt ready to make the leap

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Speaker 1: and leave the firm. And so that was sort of

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Speaker 1: like the first pivot. Didn't have a buyer yet, didn't

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Speaker 1: have a publishing house yet, but I felt pretty confident

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Speaker 1: about it. I felt like, I'm sure you've talked to

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Speaker 1: people who are passionate about a particular profession or a

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Speaker 1: dream or an idea or something, and they bulldoze ahead

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Speaker 1: with it and they don't necessarily have a plan B.

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Speaker 1: I guess my plan B was to stay at the firm.

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Speaker 1: But I knew that I had to cut those ties

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Speaker 1: if I was really going to ever give it a

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Speaker 1: go to have a creative profession.

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Speaker 2: So Crystal cut ties. She leaned into her book, eventually

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Speaker 2: publishing Home Court Advantage in nineteen ninety nine. The book

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Speaker 2: explored the flip side of the basketball scene, highlighting the

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Speaker 2: stories of the women who lived in the shadows of

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Speaker 2: quote great men. Though she never says it directly, the

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Speaker 2: book was almost certainly a reflection of Cristal's personal life

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Speaker 2: and the other accomplished women around her.

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Speaker 1: We would joke about it or talk about it all

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Speaker 1: the time, the wives and girlfriends of that New York

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Speaker 1: Nicks team and that era. Like, let me set the

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Speaker 1: stage for you, Like, so pat Riley was the coach,

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Speaker 1: and so you had Patrick Ewing at the time, his

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Speaker 1: wife Rita Ewing, who's a very good friend of mine.

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Speaker 1: She's a lawyer and she's also an entrepreneur. You had

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Speaker 1: herb Williams, his wife had a PhD. You had Lisa

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Speaker 1: Bonner at the time, She's a lawyer, entrepreneur, real estate developer.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I could just go on and on with

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Speaker 1: that list of really impressive women. Home court advantage was

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Speaker 1: derived out of something called the Morning Pages, which was

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Speaker 1: an exercise in that book The Artist Way, which was

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Speaker 1: written by Julia Cameron, which she recommends for people that

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Speaker 1: want to begin writing. She recommends this thing called the

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Speaker 1: morning Pages, which are you wake up every morning and

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Speaker 1: before you do anything else, write a minimum of three

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Speaker 1: pages in a brain drain style. Don't edit yourself.

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Speaker 3: Just do that.

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Speaker 1: Commit to that act of writing and the discipline of it.

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Speaker 1: Don't edit yourself, and just see what you get after

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Speaker 1: a few months of doing that and I did that.

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Speaker 1: You know, in hindsight, I'm proud that I actually had

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Speaker 1: the discipline to do it. But I got up every

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Speaker 1: morning like an hour before. This was while I was

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Speaker 1: actually still at Paul Weiss and did that. And that

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Speaker 1: was the beginnings of Home Court Advantage. And I said, Rita,

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Speaker 1: I was like, I've been doing this.

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Speaker 3: This came up.

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Speaker 1: It was originally actually called Seasonal Ties because it was

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Speaker 1: about the season ties, you know, And she said, because

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Speaker 1: you and I would laugh so much about the various

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Speaker 1: stories being these wives. And we talked about it and

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Speaker 1: thought it would be really fun to write it together.

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Speaker 1: And we did and it became Home Court Advantage, and

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Speaker 1: we were fortunate enough to, you know, get the first

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Speaker 1: book published and it was a New York Times bestseller,

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Speaker 1: and many efforts to.

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Speaker 3: Make it into a movie a series.

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Speaker 1: I think I was just telling somebody the other days

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Speaker 1: and I think I made more money from optioning that

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Speaker 1: book than I did for my actual advance.

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Speaker 2: Even after Crystal's divorced from Greg Anthony, basketball was ever

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Speaker 2: present in her life because of her children. When we

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Speaker 2: come back, Crystal talks about balancing the demands of her

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Speaker 2: own life with her kids, extremely active youth basketball career.

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Speaker 2: Now back to the show. You have three children who

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Speaker 2: are very involved in basketball. In particular, you are a

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Speaker 2: very present parent, and you've said that you started in

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Speaker 2: national championships with your oldest when he was as young

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Speaker 2: as fourth grade, and even younger once you got to

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Speaker 2: the third child.

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Speaker 3: Yes, but that takes time. That takes time, and that takes.

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Speaker 2: Brain power and bandwidth and time in your It takes

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Speaker 2: space in your life and in your thinking. How did

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Speaker 2: you navigate, Like I don't think there is such a

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Speaker 2: thing as work life balance, but how did you navigate it?

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Speaker 3: Being so present?

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Speaker 1: You know, it's been a real journey. I mean, what

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Speaker 1: is it you hear you can have everything, just not

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Speaker 1: at the same time. And then the great Jackie Oh

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Speaker 1: quote of I'm only as happy as my least happy child,

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Speaker 1: and so there's kind of like a mashup of those

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Speaker 1: that I think that every working mom tries to walk

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Speaker 1: in balance of that. And I have tried to be

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Speaker 1: as present as I could possibly be, but I know

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Speaker 1: that a lot of things have fallen through the cracks.

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Speaker 2: And your kids are approximately ten years apart, like the

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Speaker 2: two and then right.

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Speaker 1: The younger, right, right, So Yeah, Leo's eleven, and Ella

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Speaker 1: is twenty one and Cole is twenty three. So I

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Speaker 1: have like the ten year age difference between my youngest

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Speaker 1: and my middle and then the twelve year age difference

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Speaker 1: between my youngest and my eldest. So in any event, yes,

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Speaker 1: of course stuff falls through the cracks. You know. Of

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Speaker 1: course I have not always given the best advice, but

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Speaker 1: I guess what I have sort of gotten to the

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Speaker 1: point of, you can always be doing more, but you

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Speaker 1: can always be doing less.

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Speaker 3: Also, what do you mean by that?

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Speaker 1: I've struck a balance with myself and have decided to

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Speaker 1: be a little easier on me than these last several years.

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Speaker 1: I've decided to show myself some grace and do what

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Speaker 1: I can do, you know, because now I like, I

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Speaker 1: have three kids in three different states, at three very

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Speaker 1: different stages of their lives. You know, I have a

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Speaker 1: fifth grader who that's the hands on, taking to basketball practices,

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Speaker 1: taking to birthday parties, taking to mommy and me activities,

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Speaker 1: taking a Broadway. But then I have a college student

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Speaker 1: who's a junior in college, who there's parent weekends, there's

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Speaker 1: you know, she wants me to be there, ready to edit.

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Speaker 1: She writes for the Harvard Crimson. She wants me to

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Speaker 1: be there to edit something for her, her or you know,

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Speaker 1: there's a breakup or something to talk about that, you know,

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Speaker 1: just there to be present in in that way. But

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Speaker 1: there's never just enough time. Like there's parents weekend. I'm sorry,

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Speaker 1: I can't come up for the whole weekend. I can

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Speaker 1: come up for one night. Well, mom, that's not enough.

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Speaker 1: Why you know things like that, My you know, eldest

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Speaker 1: who's a professional basketball player in place with the Orlando Magic.

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Speaker 1: And you know, there's a part of me that, gosh,

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Speaker 1: I wish I wish I could live down in Orlando.

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Speaker 3: Well maybe not.

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Speaker 1: I wish I could be at every game home and away,

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Speaker 1: but I can't. And he has, you know, like he's

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Speaker 1: like other parents are down here, other parents, you know,

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Speaker 1: but other parents have packed up and moved. All my

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Speaker 1: teammates parents they packed up and moved to Florida, and

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Speaker 1: our neighbors with you know, like.

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Speaker 3: I have things to do here.

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Speaker 1: It's like, I love you, baby, but I have a job,

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Speaker 1: and you have a little brother who's here. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you know, so and I realized that this is a

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Speaker 1: very fortunate, blessed situation I am describing, But as you're

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Speaker 1: living and going through it as a parent, as a

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Speaker 1: working parent, you do feel that, well, at least I

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Speaker 1: feel that I'm not there for everything, and I may

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Speaker 1: have bouts of guilt about that from time to time,

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Speaker 1: but I do do a.

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Speaker 3: Lot, and she does.

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Speaker 2: Crystal continued to evolve her creative career, eventually moving into film.

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Speaker 2: But do you feel like it was a pivot into

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Speaker 2: documentary films? Was that another like big moment for you?

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Speaker 1: Before I did a documentary film, I actually produced a

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Speaker 1: scripted film that I was asked to come on board.

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Speaker 1: Its called Dirty Laundry. It was such a fun film

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Speaker 1: and it was like became a festival. Darling did it

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Speaker 1: independently with a group of folks. It was a gay

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Speaker 1: love story that had this incredible cast.

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Speaker 3: Gildon Davis seemed to have it all perfectly. Fate is

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Speaker 3: about to crash the party.

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Speaker 5: I'm looking for mister Davis.

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Speaker 3: I'm mister Davis. Who are you, Gabriel your son?

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Speaker 6: Oh?

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00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:13,360
Speaker 1: This is beautiful, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful.

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Speaker 3: It's Dirty Laundry.

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Speaker 1: And so that was my first foray actually into filmmaking.

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Speaker 2: Soon after producing Dirty Laundry, Crystal was asked to produce

429
00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 2: regularly Viacom while working on documentary style shows for BT

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Speaker 2: and MTV.

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Speaker 3: She fell in love with the format.

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Speaker 1: So there were a few shows I did there, Leading Women,

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Speaker 1: Leading Men, where we profiled men and women of color

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Speaker 1: who've impacted the country socially, politically, culturally, artistically. And so

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Speaker 1: I was doing that, which coincided with Cole playing this

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00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:52,360
Speaker 1: youth basketball as like a third grader, fourth grader, and

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Speaker 1: I was also the team mom. All the kids would

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Speaker 1: always come to our house. I was always you know, carpooling,

439
00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:03,880
Speaker 1: doing all that stuff, and really got to know these kids'

440
00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:09,600
Speaker 1: close teammates that were from an array of socioeconomic backgrounds

441
00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:13,159
Speaker 1: that otherwise Cole would have not gotten to know kids

442
00:25:13,200 --> 00:25:15,640
Speaker 1: like that, being you know, frankly being raised in Manhattan.

443
00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,399
Speaker 1: Again we call it a melting pot, but let's be honest,

444
00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:24,199
Speaker 1: Manhattan it's you know, economically prohibitive for many, and you

445
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:28,119
Speaker 1: don't get much diversity in that. And so I was

446
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:31,960
Speaker 1: struck by how different all of these young men, all

447
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 1: these boys, how their backgrounds were. But they were brothers,

448
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,199
Speaker 1: they were teammates, and I just felt like there was

449
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:42,560
Speaker 1: something there in their stories.

450
00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:46,760
Speaker 2: Leveraging her background in documentary style film, Crystal knew this

451
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:50,240
Speaker 2: was her moment to bring the personal and the professional together.

452
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:54,240
Speaker 1: And I said, I'd love to put a camera on

453
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:58,680
Speaker 1: these boys and really kind of highlight their friendship also

454
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 1: to show that black boys aren't to show their common

455
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:06,119
Speaker 1: goal of wanting to win a national championship, and that

456
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 1: became little Ballers. There were some kids that their families

457
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,439
Speaker 1: were immigrants from Jamaica. There was a boy on the

458
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:14,520
Speaker 1: team whose family was homeless. There was a boy on

459
00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:18,600
Speaker 1: the team whose family lived in Brownsville, Brooklyn, and the

460
00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:21,720
Speaker 1: mom had him playing so he could get away from

461
00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:24,600
Speaker 1: his community, which was really filled with a lot of

462
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:28,000
Speaker 1: gang violence. And I looked at this also as I'd

463
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:33,800
Speaker 1: love to make a documentary that shows the tells the

464
00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:39,359
Speaker 1: story of these boys before the dream has died, that

465
00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:41,679
Speaker 1: you're not actually going to go to the NBA, and

466
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:44,439
Speaker 1: that everybody has a dream and let's capture them in

467
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:46,080
Speaker 1: this last age of innocence.

468
00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:50,040
Speaker 6: When you think of AAU, I think of everybody on

469
00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 6: the team just having the same goal, and that's to

470
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:57,679
Speaker 6: get a college scholarship and then playing in the NBA.

471
00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:01,960
Speaker 6: You know that was everybody's dream. Everybody wanted to make it.

472
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 7: Everybody has dreams, everybody has a talent. If you're a

473
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 7: basketball player, it's nothing to be the best in New York.

474
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:11,960
Speaker 7: You want to be one of the best players in

475
00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:14,520
Speaker 7: the country. If you ain't trying to be the best player,

476
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:18,040
Speaker 7: that you possibly do something else. That's in anything. If

477
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:20,080
Speaker 7: there's a muscle seed, a doubt, you might as well quit.

478
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:23,040
Speaker 7: If you ain't trying to be the best, then what

479
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:23,760
Speaker 7: are you doing it for.

480
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:31,920
Speaker 8: How is it that basketball became this cultural cathedral in

481
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:37,400
Speaker 8: the African American community. It's almost like the African tribe

482
00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:42,119
Speaker 8: in that you can have individual expression within the context

483
00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:45,720
Speaker 8: of a try and the same thing with basketball. You're

484
00:27:45,800 --> 00:27:47,919
Speaker 8: part of a team, the past and all that, but

485
00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:52,520
Speaker 8: you could also create. You could also be individual as well.

486
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:57,280
Speaker 1: When that was my first time directing a documentary and

487
00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:01,080
Speaker 1: again did that independently, I call it real of filmmaking.

488
00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:06,240
Speaker 1: Forged ahead and ended up with my one of my

489
00:28:06,280 --> 00:28:09,879
Speaker 1: producing partners who was representing her name's Tammy Brooks. She

490
00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:12,480
Speaker 1: was representing Amri Stotdomeier at the time, who was playing

491
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 1: for the Knicks.

492
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 3: Brought him on.

493
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:16,560
Speaker 1: He loved the story, brought him on, he became an

494
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:19,960
Speaker 1: executive producer. He was in the film that was a pivot,

495
00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:24,119
Speaker 1: you know, when it was a pivot based on my life,

496
00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:25,440
Speaker 1: my kids' lives.

497
00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 2: Crystal is continuing to work at the intersection of the

498
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:31,680
Speaker 2: personal and professional with her latest venture with her son

499
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:35,120
Speaker 2: Cole for the app Game Up. So tell us about

500
00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:37,320
Speaker 2: this new venture and new relationship with your son, a

501
00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 2: business partnership.

502
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:41,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, so, you know, speaking of like going full circle

503
00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:44,800
Speaker 1: with your kid. You know, Cole likes me again after

504
00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:47,960
Speaker 1: high school. He's finally listening to me again. His favorite

505
00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:49,760
Speaker 1: thing that he said to me, you know, like his

506
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:52,320
Speaker 1: first two seasons in the NBA, when I tried to

507
00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:54,640
Speaker 1: give him some advices. You know, Mom, listen, I'm a

508
00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:55,440
Speaker 1: grown ass man.

509
00:28:57,560 --> 00:29:00,280
Speaker 3: I don't need you. I'm paying my own bills. You

510
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 3: tell me this, that and the other, you don't you know.

511
00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:06,800
Speaker 1: I finally realized I cannot give him any basketball advice

512
00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:09,400
Speaker 1: because he knows more and is one pinky than I

513
00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:13,320
Speaker 1: will ever know. But what has been happening for ten

514
00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 1: plus years is that I have been that basketball parent

515
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,719
Speaker 1: that people would come to and say, can you make

516
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:23,280
Speaker 1: a recommendation for a team for my kid? Can you

517
00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 1: make a recommendation for a developmental program, for a trainer,

518
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 1: for a tournament, for a camp, for this, that, and

519
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 1: that and the other. And I had been spending hours

520
00:29:31,800 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 1: and hours on calls, on emails, on text messages, sharing

521
00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:38,280
Speaker 1: knowledge with parents who really have just been trying to

522
00:29:38,400 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 1: navigate this youth's basketball landscape that's getting bigger and bigger,

523
00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:46,000
Speaker 1: that's getting more and more complicated, that's gotten more and

524
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 1: more expensive. And I really started aggregating all of this

525
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:55,920
Speaker 1: information in the youth basketball landscape and people would ask

526
00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 1: whole the same thing, but from a player perspective. And

527
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:01,760
Speaker 1: I started talking talking to him about this idea, and

528
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:04,160
Speaker 1: I said, why don't we make sort of a one

529
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:10,560
Speaker 1: stop shop platform where we can defragment this information, make

530
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 1: it sort of like the Angie's List for you know,

531
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:20,959
Speaker 1: youth basketball. And that began the beginning of making Game Up.

532
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 9: Navigating youth sports can be tough for parents. There's so

533
00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:26,760
Speaker 9: many options out there. But there's a new sports at

534
00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:30,360
Speaker 9: that's changing the basketball landscape. It's called Game Up. New

535
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:33,680
Speaker 9: York native and NBA point guard Cole Anthony's mom, Krystin

536
00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 9: McCrary maguire, teamed up to create a one stop shop

537
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,360
Speaker 9: to help parents out and connect their kid with the

538
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:42,719
Speaker 9: best basketball team and trainer based on their age, goals,

539
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:45,160
Speaker 9: and location. Join me now to speak more about Game

540
00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:48,240
Speaker 9: Up is co founder Krystal mccrairy McGuire. She's also a

541
00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:51,080
Speaker 9: New York Times bestselling author and producer, just to name

542
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:53,160
Speaker 9: a few. Good morning, Chrystal, thanks for joining us.

543
00:30:53,320 --> 00:30:55,000
Speaker 1: With the Wrens Frinds, I with the team Real in

544
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 1: Jersey and then high school FOPSA Cardinals I played with

545
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:00,480
Speaker 1: was that six to seven different AU programs levels of

546
00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:01,800
Speaker 1: youth basketball.

547
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 10: And went through all of these great programs that developed

548
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:06,080
Speaker 10: him at every stage.

549
00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:08,920
Speaker 11: And that is really what parents are looking for.

550
00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:11,160
Speaker 10: Most parents that are trying to find a program for

551
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 10: their kid, it's not like they enter into it saying,

552
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 10: I have this elite kid that's, you know, gonna go

553
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:17,920
Speaker 10: D one or go to the NBA.

554
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:19,520
Speaker 11: That may be the ultimate dream.

555
00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:22,080
Speaker 10: But they're really looking trying to figure out how to

556
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 10: navigate this system.

557
00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:25,560
Speaker 11: And Cole as a as my.

558
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 10: Son, as a resource and as somebody who truly lived

559
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 10: it as a player, was the perfect person.

560
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 11: Plus we get along pretty.

561
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 1: Well tolerator, and so we've been working on it together,

562
00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:41,280
Speaker 1: we hired you know, we seeded it ourselves again, just

563
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:45,640
Speaker 1: forging ahead, seated ourselves, that's right. Got a chief app

564
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:50,880
Speaker 1: designer and coders computer software engineers, got the graphics UXUI designers,

565
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 1: got the chief strategy officer, chief operating officer, and built

566
00:31:55,120 --> 00:32:00,080
Speaker 1: this and we launched in the Tri State area and

567
00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:04,120
Speaker 1: now in Q one, twenty twenty four, we are expanding

568
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:05,720
Speaker 1: across the US.

569
00:32:06,600 --> 00:32:10,280
Speaker 2: Is there something that holistically not just on little ballers,

570
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:13,240
Speaker 2: but is there something that at the time you feel

571
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:16,120
Speaker 2: like you felt like was a real low point negative,

572
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 2: like you weren't really sure you're gonna get out of it,

573
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:20,640
Speaker 2: and then now in retrospect, you see it as having

574
00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:22,400
Speaker 2: really launched the next step for you.

575
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:26,400
Speaker 1: I actually had an experience where it wasn't that it

576
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:29,160
Speaker 1: was what was rather male dominated, but I had an

577
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:33,960
Speaker 1: experience with somebody under the Viacom umbrella when I was

578
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:37,760
Speaker 1: working on the shows there that I was executive producing

579
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:43,360
Speaker 1: and creating. There was a very senior executive there that

580
00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 1: will I will never forget it, Like I think I

581
00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 1: was talking to him sort of like one of those

582
00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:50,680
Speaker 1: career advice kind of talks, and I will never forget again.

583
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:54,920
Speaker 1: You remember those things that light a fire under you.

584
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 1: But I remember he said to me, you know, Crystal,

585
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:02,040
Speaker 1: this was before I had done Little Ballers, and he said, listen,

586
00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 1: if you just keep reaching, you know, for that low

587
00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:09,080
Speaker 1: hanging fruit, he called it low hanging fruit. He said,

588
00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:11,760
Speaker 1: if you keep reaching for that low hanging fruit, there's

589
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:13,960
Speaker 1: something there for you in that. See where that gets you.

590
00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:20,239
Speaker 1: And I just remember being so offended low hanging fruit, Like,

591
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 1: what the heck does that mean?

592
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:22,800
Speaker 3: Yeah? What are you?

593
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 1: Are you trying to give me a ceiling where I'm

594
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:27,120
Speaker 1: just beginning.

595
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:32,120
Speaker 3: But it doesn't lights a fire. It lights a fire.

596
00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:35,880
Speaker 1: And you know, so that was that was a period

597
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:38,560
Speaker 1: that that did inspire me, and it was it was

598
00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:41,040
Speaker 1: you know, there were so many other parts of that,

599
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:42,440
Speaker 1: but there was certainly that.

600
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:50,120
Speaker 2: Oh I'm going to show you, you know, just you wait, okay,

601
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:53,640
Speaker 2: one last question. What everybody wants to know, what is

602
00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:55,560
Speaker 2: it like to have a sex and the city character

603
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:56,280
Speaker 2: based on you?

604
00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:01,520
Speaker 1: Well, listen, first of all, the fact that the character

605
00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 1: quote unquote inspired by me is played by the you know,

606
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:11,600
Speaker 1: pretty amazing Nicole Ari Parker. I'm like, okay, I'm just

607
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:17,919
Speaker 1: you've you've flattered me beyond you know, it's it's kind

608
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:19,080
Speaker 1: of you know, it's kind of cool.

609
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:21,239
Speaker 3: Totally, it's kind of cool.

610
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 1: I mean Susan fails Hill, who's a writer there and

611
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:25,200
Speaker 1: a very good friend of mine, you know.

612
00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:27,560
Speaker 3: She and then there was Kelly Goff who was there.

613
00:34:27,640 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 1: She's she's no longer with the show, but they somehow

614
00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:35,960
Speaker 1: were inspired by some aspect of my life. I think

615
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:40,600
Speaker 1: there are many inspirations for ltw's character, but I'm just,

616
00:34:40,840 --> 00:34:44,239
Speaker 1: you know, really flattered. Did you know did they tell

617
00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:45,560
Speaker 1: you or you just watched it in your thought, oh,

618
00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:49,520
Speaker 1: we seem similar. I started getting rumblings maybe four or

619
00:34:49,600 --> 00:34:53,840
Speaker 1: five months before the first season came out, and I

620
00:34:53,880 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 1: was like what. I was like, that was like that

621
00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:57,640
Speaker 1: just sounds crazy. I had that one girlfriend, you know,

622
00:34:57,640 --> 00:35:00,879
Speaker 1: who's like the gossip the town crier, and she was like, girl,

623
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:05,400
Speaker 1: there's a character Texas City three Kids documentary, Viille mak

624
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:07,239
Speaker 1: her husband's running for mayor because at the time, my

625
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:10,120
Speaker 1: husband Ray was running for mayor, and like, that certainly

626
00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:13,080
Speaker 1: sounds like you. And then it started picking up momentum,

627
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:14,560
Speaker 1: and you know, look, I've been in sort of the

628
00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,080
Speaker 1: writer room places and they're like this character is like

629
00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 1: so and so this is sort of think of, sort of,

630
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:21,640
Speaker 1: so I get how that can happen. I think that

631
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:23,920
Speaker 1: there again, I think that there are many people that

632
00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:26,480
Speaker 1: sort of you know, are part of the inspiration. But

633
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:28,960
Speaker 1: you know, if you want to say it's me, I'll

634
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:31,239
Speaker 1: take the good part of it for sure.

635
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:33,880
Speaker 3: Well, thank you so much, Krystal for coming to she Pivots.

636
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:36,160
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for having me. It was a

637
00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:37,520
Speaker 1: joy and an honor.

638
00:35:37,600 --> 00:35:44,000
Speaker 2: As always, thank you, You're the best. Crystal still lives

639
00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 2: in New York City. Her weekend's still filled with lots

640
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:50,480
Speaker 2: of basketball and now growing game up to be available

641
00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:53,799
Speaker 2: to youth basketball players across the country. To learn more

642
00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:57,799
Speaker 2: about Crystal, follow her on Instagram at Krystal McCrary Talk to.

643
00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:01,759
Speaker 3: You next week. Thanks for listening to this episode of

644
00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:02,560
Speaker 3: she Pivots.

645
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:05,280
Speaker 2: If you made it this far, you're a true pivot

646
00:36:05,560 --> 00:36:08,480
Speaker 2: So thanks for being part of this community. I hope

647
00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:10,960
Speaker 2: you enjoyed this episode, and if you did leave us

648
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:13,799
Speaker 2: a rating, please be nice and tell your friends about us.

649
00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:17,000
Speaker 2: To learn more about our guests, follow us on Instagram

650
00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:19,839
Speaker 2: at she Pivots the podcast, or sign up for our

651
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:22,800
Speaker 2: newsletter where you can get exclusive behind the scenes content

652
00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 2: or on our website, she Pivots the podcast Talk to

653
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:31,719
Speaker 2: You Next Week Special thanks to the she pivots team,

654
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 2: Executive producer Emily Edavlosk, Associate producer and social media connoisseur

655
00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:42,400
Speaker 2: Hannah Cousins, Research director Christine Dickinson, Events and Logistics coordinator

656
00:36:42,440 --> 00:36:47,040
Speaker 2: Madeline Sonovak, and audio editor and mixer Nina pollock I

657
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:49,360
Speaker 2: endorseh she Pivots