1 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:07,360 Speaker 1: Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show. On iHeartRadio, 2 00:00:07,760 --> 00:00:11,240 Speaker 1: last episode, I talked about men cheating on their wives, 3 00:00:11,320 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: throwing away their family, and how susceptible rich men are 4 00:00:15,720 --> 00:00:17,520 Speaker 1: to the idea that they could get away with it. 5 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:20,760 Speaker 1: On this episode, I want to talk about divorce ideation 6 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:23,960 Speaker 1: I see from women. There was a story in New 7 00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:27,960 Speaker 1: York Magazine by Emily Gould on how she had considered 8 00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:31,840 Speaker 1: divorcing her husband. I mean she was also in the 9 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:34,320 Speaker 1: throes of a manic episode and ended up in a 10 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:37,120 Speaker 1: mental hospital. But the crux of the piece was that 11 00:00:37,159 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 1: she became obsessed with divorce. The piece is called Should. 12 00:00:40,840 --> 00:00:42,919 Speaker 2: I Leave My Husband? The Lore of Divorce. 13 00:00:43,280 --> 00:00:45,559 Speaker 1: She writes that she read a bunch of books by 14 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:49,639 Speaker 1: divorced women. Here's a quote in Nora Efren's Heartburn. As 15 00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:53,159 Speaker 1: an aftermath, I found an airtight case for divorce. The 16 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:56,040 Speaker 1: husband was the villain and the wife the wrongs party, 17 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:58,800 Speaker 1: and the inevitable result was splitting up. I felt an 18 00:00:58,840 --> 00:01:01,360 Speaker 1: echo of this later on when I read Liz Len's 19 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 1: polemic The American ex Wife out this month, marketed as 20 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:08,920 Speaker 1: a deeply validating manifesto on the gender politics of marriage. 21 00:01:09,080 --> 00:01:12,759 Speaker 1: Bad and divorce actually pretty good. The book begins by 22 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:16,679 Speaker 1: detailing how Lens's husband rarely did household chores and hid 23 00:01:16,720 --> 00:01:19,480 Speaker 1: belongings of hers that he didn't like, for example, a 24 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:22,199 Speaker 1: mug that said right like a motherfucker in a box 25 00:01:22,240 --> 00:01:24,520 Speaker 1: in the basement. I didn't want to waste my one 26 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 1: wild and precious life telling a grown man where to 27 00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,560 Speaker 1: find the ketchup. Lens rights. What was compelling about my 28 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:34,440 Speaker 1: marriage wasn't its evils or its villains, but its commonplace 29 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:38,319 Speaker 1: horror end quote. I see this a lot, especially in 30 00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 1: the writing world, divorce as this amazing thing that women 31 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,880 Speaker 1: simply must do. I mean, how could you waste your 32 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:48,120 Speaker 1: one wild and precious life with a man? 33 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 2: Right? 34 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:51,760 Speaker 1: I mean, look, divorce happens, people fall out of love, 35 00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:55,400 Speaker 1: people find they'd rather live alone. But this idea that 36 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:59,320 Speaker 1: divorce is exciting or divorce is freeing or whatever is 37 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:03,040 Speaker 1: a lie. And it's a lie aimed. I think more 38 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 1: women than it meant. Gould writes, quote, I read more 39 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:10,079 Speaker 1: books about divorce. I received an early copy of Sarah 40 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:14,200 Speaker 1: Manguso's Liars, marketed as a searing novel about being a wife, 41 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:17,560 Speaker 1: a mother, and an artist and how marriage makes liars 42 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:17,840 Speaker 1: of us. 43 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:18,839 Speaker 2: All in it. 44 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:22,520 Speaker 1: John, a creative dilettante, and Jane, a writer, meet and 45 00:02:22,600 --> 00:02:26,720 Speaker 1: soon decide to marry. Liars describes their marriage from beginning 46 00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:29,960 Speaker 1: to end, a span of almost fifteen years, and is 47 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:33,679 Speaker 1: narrated by Jane. The beginning of their relationship is delirious. 48 00:02:34,200 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 1: This is a quote inside the quote. I tried to 49 00:02:36,440 --> 00:02:40,520 Speaker 1: explain that ferocious hunger and couldn't it came from somewhere 50 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:43,640 Speaker 1: beyond reasoned end quote. But the opening of that book 51 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 1: also contains a warning. Then I married a man, as 52 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:50,840 Speaker 1: women do. My life became archtypical, a drag show of 53 00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:53,960 Speaker 1: nuclear familyhood. I got en mesh to a story that 54 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 1: had already been told ten billion times. I felt, perversely 55 00:02:57,600 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 1: reassured that I was merely adding another story to the 56 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:02,840 Speaker 1: ten billion. It made it seem like it was less 57 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:06,880 Speaker 1: my fault. End quote. Marriage makes liars of us. I 58 00:03:06,880 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 1: don't know about that. Marriage feels very truthful to me, 59 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:14,280 Speaker 1: like I get to be really, really myself. And look, 60 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:16,520 Speaker 1: if you're in a marriage where you feel like it's 61 00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:19,320 Speaker 1: a lie, I'm not saying stay in it and that's 62 00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 1: it and just suffer. But I should note at the 63 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:26,000 Speaker 1: end of that Emily Gold piece. She realizes that she 64 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:28,399 Speaker 1: had been in a crazy place, and she does stay 65 00:03:28,440 --> 00:03:31,280 Speaker 1: in her marriage. Maybe if you're feeling like you're living 66 00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:34,480 Speaker 1: a lie, it's not the marriage that's necessarily the problem. 67 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 1: Last episode, I talked about men making mistakes, cheating on 68 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:42,080 Speaker 1: their wives, leaving their families during time of change. I 69 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 1: think for women, it's in times of extreme routine where 70 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:48,720 Speaker 1: nothing has changed for a long time, or maybe nothing 71 00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:51,600 Speaker 1: exciting is going on, that they start to daydream of 72 00:03:51,640 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 1: a single future where they're finally live their truth. My 73 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:59,720 Speaker 1: advice would be start now, start living truthfully now, and 74 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 1: you'll find that marriage was not the problem. Coming up 75 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 1: next and interview with Glenn Reynolds. Join us after the break. Hi, 76 00:04:09,880 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 1: and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show on iHeartRadio. 77 00:04:13,760 --> 00:04:18,040 Speaker 1: Guest today is Glenn Reynolds, Law professor, Instapundit, founder, fellow 78 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:21,760 Speaker 1: New York Post columnist and writer at instapundit dot subdeck 79 00:04:21,839 --> 00:04:24,040 Speaker 1: dot com. Hi Glenn, so nice to talk to you. 80 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 3: Hi, great to be here, Great to see you. 81 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:28,840 Speaker 1: I mean, just talking to the blog father is very 82 00:04:28,839 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 1: exciting for me. You know, you had a huge influence 83 00:04:32,360 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 1: in me becoming a writer. 84 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:39,880 Speaker 3: And just your alarming news blog years ago or something. 85 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:40,400 Speaker 2: Yeah. 86 00:04:40,520 --> 00:04:43,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, I started it in two thousand and two. I 87 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:47,120 Speaker 1: think you when did you start instapundit. 88 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:50,240 Speaker 3: Two thousand and one, right, I a month before nine 89 00:04:50,240 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 3: to eleven. 90 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:54,080 Speaker 1: Right, so I followed nine to eleven on your blog. 91 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 1: I didn't have a TV. I mean, I just I 92 00:04:57,320 --> 00:04:59,720 Speaker 1: didn't even have a desk. I was, you know, a 93 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:04,360 Speaker 1: to graduate school eventually, but I was just living a 94 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:07,960 Speaker 1: very meager existence. And I remember sitting on the floor 95 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 1: of my apartment in New York and refreshing instapundit and 96 00:05:12,880 --> 00:05:15,120 Speaker 1: you know, just getting all the news that way. 97 00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:18,480 Speaker 2: Do you miss those blog days? 98 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 3: I mean, certainly not nine to eleven. 99 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:21,840 Speaker 2: No, No. 100 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 3: I just wrote a history. Actually, Michael Walsh has got 101 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:27,800 Speaker 3: a media book coming out, and I wrote a chapter 102 00:05:27,920 --> 00:05:29,839 Speaker 3: on the early days of the blog is here for It? 103 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:32,800 Speaker 3: Which was fun because I really did sort of go 104 00:05:32,839 --> 00:05:34,880 Speaker 3: back and revisit that and go back and read through 105 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:37,240 Speaker 3: my archives and read some of the articles people wrote 106 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:39,920 Speaker 3: about it back then. And you know, the first couple 107 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:45,280 Speaker 3: of years, from basically two thousand and one before nine 108 00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:48,120 Speaker 3: eleven to around the summer at two thousand and three, 109 00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 3: it was a real innocent and pleasant time in the 110 00:05:51,200 --> 00:05:56,159 Speaker 3: blogger sphere. It was so new and that was exciting, 111 00:05:56,320 --> 00:05:59,600 Speaker 3: and there was a camaraderie that I mean, it's hard 112 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:02,800 Speaker 3: to image and now in these polarized times, but between 113 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:05,840 Speaker 3: the left and the right, bloggers like it was more 114 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 3: important that we were all doing this cool new thing 115 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:12,120 Speaker 3: than that we disagreed about politics. And the remnants of 116 00:06:12,200 --> 00:06:15,000 Speaker 3: nineties connecticuet were still around. So I remember Dave Copple 117 00:06:15,080 --> 00:06:18,159 Speaker 3: and I actually were in the comments at the Daily 118 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:21,799 Speaker 3: Coast having a civil and intelligent discussion of assault weapons 119 00:06:21,839 --> 00:06:25,039 Speaker 3: bands with Daily Coast readers, which you know, within a 120 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:28,200 Speaker 3: couple of years was unimaginable but was still a thing. 121 00:06:28,279 --> 00:06:31,760 Speaker 1: Then I remember the moment that I was like, Okay, 122 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:34,320 Speaker 1: this is all over, this camaraderie and all of that. 123 00:06:34,240 --> 00:06:35,040 Speaker 2: Because it was the same. 124 00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:37,719 Speaker 1: I mean in New York we'd have like blogger parties 125 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:41,200 Speaker 1: and it would be like cooking bloggers and travel bloggers 126 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:43,919 Speaker 1: and obviously all the political bloggers and whatever. But it 127 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:47,200 Speaker 1: was all like we were doing something together. But I 128 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:49,719 Speaker 1: remember that feminist site, Feminist Like. 129 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:50,320 Speaker 2: I used to. 130 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:55,560 Speaker 1: Comment there barely regularly, and then one time I commented 131 00:06:55,720 --> 00:06:58,919 Speaker 1: that trans people should have to disclose at their trends, 132 00:06:58,920 --> 00:07:01,360 Speaker 1: like they shouldn't trick you, and you know, kind of 133 00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:04,560 Speaker 1: not just just be open about it. I thought it 134 00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:07,159 Speaker 1: was barely pro trends, and I thought that that was 135 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:10,280 Speaker 1: a normal comment. I got blocked, and I was like, WHOA, 136 00:07:10,360 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 1: something has changed here, Like, you know, I used to 137 00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:16,080 Speaker 1: be like, you know, the quirky conservative in their comments section. 138 00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:20,360 Speaker 1: That quickly became unacceptable. And I think that that's you know, 139 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:23,240 Speaker 1: has translated to so many other spaces in our world. 140 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:25,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, you really saw it. I mean, if I were 141 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 3: going to pick a single dividing line for the blogsphere 142 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:32,559 Speaker 3: as a whole, it would probably be and again, summer 143 00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:35,360 Speaker 3: of two thousand and three, about the time that Andrew 144 00:07:35,400 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 3: Sullivan sort of took a few weeks off and then 145 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:43,160 Speaker 3: came back as a pro carry blogger. Careful not to 146 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:45,160 Speaker 3: just make a big deal about that until after he 147 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:50,080 Speaker 3: did his last big fundraising drive, but you know, I 148 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:53,840 Speaker 3: felt like that everybody suddenly was like, Okay, it's two 149 00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 3: thousand and three. We pretended to be patriotic for a 150 00:07:57,960 --> 00:07:59,400 Speaker 3: couple of years, but we got a gear up for 151 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:02,280 Speaker 3: the election. The gloves have to come on, which didn't 152 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 3: even work out for him, as it turned out, but 153 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:08,840 Speaker 3: it definitely changed the tone of everything, and it's only 154 00:08:08,880 --> 00:08:11,560 Speaker 3: gotten worse for the I mean, actually it's gotten better 155 00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:13,440 Speaker 3: in a way. I mean, you know, blogs are now 156 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:17,160 Speaker 3: so old, they're like five or six media generations of 157 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:20,360 Speaker 3: revolution behind. So uh, you know, I'm kind of like 158 00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:23,120 Speaker 3: this quirky museum piece. Now I can do and what 159 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:25,440 Speaker 3: I want. The notion that anybody's going to get mad 160 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 3: and go after a blogger, now I guess it could happen, 161 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:30,640 Speaker 3: but it just it's not like it was. 162 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:33,319 Speaker 2: Yeah, how did you escape being canceled? 163 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:36,679 Speaker 3: I feel like people tried on a number of occasions, 164 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 3: but uh, you know, I'm pretty hard to cancel. I mean, 165 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:42,920 Speaker 3: I control my own platform, which is the most important thing, 166 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:46,200 Speaker 3: and I have a tenured job at a state school 167 00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:47,840 Speaker 3: in a red state where I have a lot of 168 00:08:47,840 --> 00:08:50,480 Speaker 3: friends on the legislature, so it's you know, I'm just 169 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 3: pretty safe. But people have certainly tried on a number 170 00:08:54,800 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 3: of occasions, and it generally hasn't worked out well for them. 171 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:01,839 Speaker 3: But uh, you know, know they there's just a class 172 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:04,760 Speaker 3: of people who just are offended by the idea that 173 00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:07,160 Speaker 3: somebody's even allowed to say stuff they don't. 174 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:11,680 Speaker 2: How dare you? Yeah, so you don't use Twitter, which 175 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:12,439 Speaker 2: is interesting. 176 00:09:12,880 --> 00:09:15,680 Speaker 3: No, I mean I'm not. I have a Twitter account. 177 00:09:15,720 --> 00:09:18,400 Speaker 3: I actually have a couple of them. I have a 178 00:09:18,400 --> 00:09:21,439 Speaker 3: personal account I started once in the very earliest days 179 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 3: of Twitter because I was doing some media panel and 180 00:09:23,760 --> 00:09:25,920 Speaker 3: I needed to tweet from it as part of the setup. 181 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:29,040 Speaker 3: And it still exists, and then I have the instantpund 182 00:09:29,080 --> 00:09:33,400 Speaker 3: the account. I actually deleted it. I really just you know, 183 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 3: it was just I was writing this book on social media, 184 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:39,040 Speaker 3: the social media upheaval, and I was just researching all 185 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:43,200 Speaker 3: the nasty stuff that Twitter does. Your mind, Yeah, and 186 00:09:43,240 --> 00:09:46,360 Speaker 3: so I just honestly, they pissed me off about something 187 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:49,680 Speaker 3: and I just said, screw it, I'm out of here, 188 00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:52,560 Speaker 3: and deleted it. And then I forget who it was. 189 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:55,880 Speaker 3: Somebody maybe it's Charles Glasser. Somebody said you really shouldn't 190 00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:59,680 Speaker 3: delete your account. You really should just reopen it and 191 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:01,679 Speaker 3: not is it so nobody can pretend to be you? 192 00:10:02,360 --> 00:10:04,840 Speaker 3: That makes sense? So I have it. I think I 193 00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:06,800 Speaker 3: may have tweeted three or four times in the last 194 00:10:06,840 --> 00:10:08,200 Speaker 3: several years, but you. 195 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 2: Just don't like it, or what's that. 196 00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 3: I was a late adopter of Twitter ideal set up 197 00:10:14,160 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 3: for me was when somebody and I didn't know who 198 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:19,120 Speaker 3: it was, had set up an Incipendent Twitter account that 199 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:22,360 Speaker 3: did nothing but tweet stuff from the RSS feed on 200 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:25,080 Speaker 3: my blog and that was great. I was happy with that, 201 00:10:25,120 --> 00:10:27,079 Speaker 3: and somebody's like, shouldn't you, you know, have it taken down? 202 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 3: And I was like, no, I love this, And then 203 00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 3: it quit working. I just broke I don't know why. 204 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:36,680 Speaker 3: And I had to actually get lawyers to get the 205 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:38,960 Speaker 3: handle turned over to me since I had the trademark 206 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:42,520 Speaker 3: for Incipendent. And then once I got that, I started tweeting, 207 00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 3: which was a big mistake because it's just, I mean, 208 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:48,680 Speaker 3: it has its satisfaction. It's always fun to really administer 209 00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:52,360 Speaker 3: a sick burden to somebody, but you can waste a 210 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:58,079 Speaker 3: lot of time administer burns. And it's the crystal math 211 00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:00,680 Speaker 3: of social media and that it's the most addictive but 212 00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:04,520 Speaker 3: the least satisfying, you know. And I was spending a 213 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:06,240 Speaker 3: lot of time on it. I was in a bad 214 00:11:06,320 --> 00:11:10,680 Speaker 3: mood a lot, and ultimately, you know, uh, after I quit, 215 00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:12,880 Speaker 3: everybody's like, you'll be back in a few months, and 216 00:11:12,920 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 3: I could be who knows, you know, but I I've 217 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:18,560 Speaker 3: never missed it once. They didn't drive any traffic to 218 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:19,800 Speaker 3: my site to speak of here. 219 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:23,679 Speaker 1: That's a big part of like, it's a big negative 220 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:25,440 Speaker 1: for the site. I think people think that it's a 221 00:11:25,559 --> 00:11:28,040 Speaker 1: driver of traffic, and it's just just not. I would 222 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:31,200 Speaker 1: rather go viral on Facebook any day of the week, 223 00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 1: like one of my columns, than on Twitter, because you know, 224 00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:35,560 Speaker 1: I just don't I. 225 00:11:35,559 --> 00:11:39,559 Speaker 3: Don't know why Facebook drives traffic. I think it drives 226 00:11:39,559 --> 00:11:42,280 Speaker 3: a lot less that it used to. Yeah, Facebook drive 227 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:45,880 Speaker 3: has always driven more traffic than Twitter, and everybody knows that, 228 00:11:45,920 --> 00:11:48,679 Speaker 3: but I've never heard anybody explain why. My theory is 229 00:11:48,720 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 3: just that people on Twitter are at such a superficial 230 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:55,520 Speaker 3: level they just don't ever click on a link, so right, Yeah. 231 00:11:55,320 --> 00:11:57,800 Speaker 1: They see the headline and that's it, Whereas on Facebook, 232 00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:00,560 Speaker 1: I think, like, you know, your grandma share it with 233 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:03,480 Speaker 1: her friend, and like they're they're actually reading it and 234 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:07,360 Speaker 1: clicking it and sharing it and talking about it, which 235 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:10,160 Speaker 1: is you're right, it's not the same kind of reach 236 00:12:10,240 --> 00:12:12,520 Speaker 1: on Facebook that it used to be. But I always 237 00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:16,400 Speaker 1: just preferred sort of the real people on Facebook versus 238 00:12:16,440 --> 00:12:19,080 Speaker 1: the media people on Twitter to like my stuff. 239 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 2: It just meant so much more to me. 240 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 3: So yeah, the appeal of Twitter is it was very 241 00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:29,000 Speaker 3: useful for journalists who had time to kill, you know. 242 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:32,959 Speaker 3: I mean I remember somebody saying Twitter exists because people 243 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:36,640 Speaker 3: like me being or waiting in line for congressional hearings have 244 00:12:36,760 --> 00:12:38,520 Speaker 3: nothing to do but play with our phone for five 245 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:40,600 Speaker 3: or ten minutes, you know. And I think there's something 246 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 3: to that, but that doesn't waiting on any line really. 247 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 1: But I also agree with you completely that it's the 248 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 1: crystal meth. It's the one that I am absolutely most 249 00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 1: addicted to. It's the one that I take breaks from. 250 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:54,440 Speaker 1: It's the one that I like, I feel like I 251 00:12:54,480 --> 00:12:56,280 Speaker 1: need to get clean from occasionally. 252 00:12:56,600 --> 00:12:58,040 Speaker 2: I don't feel like that about Instagram. 253 00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:01,000 Speaker 1: Like Instagram, I see like home to core tips and 254 00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:04,480 Speaker 1: like fashion and like some Taylor Swift news, I don't 255 00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:07,439 Speaker 1: feel like I'm getting you know, the negative side of 256 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:08,240 Speaker 1: the world on. 257 00:13:08,160 --> 00:13:11,439 Speaker 3: Instagram Instagram is how I keep up with Taylor too. 258 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:15,600 Speaker 1: That's my Tay sorts among us, you know. 259 00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:19,080 Speaker 3: Right well, it is funny. And I don't do TikTok. 260 00:13:19,200 --> 00:13:24,560 Speaker 3: I actually I have. I have a former student that 261 00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 3: I call my contributing TikTok editor. Because she sends me 262 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:29,800 Speaker 3: tiktoks and I post on the blog from time to time. 263 00:13:30,400 --> 00:13:32,240 Speaker 3: But I don't want the app on my phone because 264 00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:34,719 Speaker 3: I know what it's doing to me, right, and I 265 00:13:34,880 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 3: really don't want to spend any more time on the 266 00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:39,720 Speaker 3: Internet or on any screen. I'm kind of trying to. 267 00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:43,120 Speaker 3: I mean, for me to talk about reducing my Internet exposure. 268 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 1: It's kind of a joke, but I hear that, you 269 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:49,520 Speaker 1: know the whole what is it called the new Apple glasses, 270 00:13:49,960 --> 00:13:50,600 Speaker 1: the Provision? 271 00:13:50,679 --> 00:13:53,000 Speaker 2: Yet no, like that looks like a nightmare to me. 272 00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:53,960 Speaker 2: Why would I want that? 273 00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:57,560 Speaker 1: And it's you know, and the thinking that people are like, 274 00:13:57,559 --> 00:13:59,360 Speaker 1: oh when I say that, like, oh, you know, in 275 00:13:59,400 --> 00:14:01,400 Speaker 1: a few years, you'll see you're going to want that. 276 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:03,080 Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm never going to want that. 277 00:14:03,360 --> 00:14:07,240 Speaker 3: I was. It was the Foresight Vision conference. It was 278 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 3: in the nineties. It was probably like ninety seven ninety eight. 279 00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 3: Jarre Lanier, who was with the original VR pioneers, had 280 00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:17,800 Speaker 3: had his display with the same kind of goggles and 281 00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 3: you can look at it and the shark would swim 282 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:22,200 Speaker 3: by you and stuff, and everybody was like, this is 283 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 3: going to be the next big thing in two or 284 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:25,320 Speaker 3: three years, and I was on it and I was like, 285 00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:28,440 Speaker 3: you know, this just seems really lame to me. I mean, 286 00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:30,480 Speaker 3: you know, I know they have those three D movies 287 00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:32,800 Speaker 3: in the fifties where you wore the glasses, and that's 288 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 3: kind of what it seems like to me. It's like 289 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:37,840 Speaker 3: a gimmick that. Yeah, I can see how for some 290 00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:41,720 Speaker 3: stuff a truly immersive experience would really be worth it, 291 00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:46,200 Speaker 3: but not that much. And I'm not going to be 292 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:48,280 Speaker 3: the first one to adopt it because I'm honestly, I 293 00:14:48,280 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 3: am trying to spend more time outdoors, Yeah, and actually 294 00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:53,960 Speaker 3: looking at the real world, not outdoors wearing goggles. 295 00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 2: Right, I think that's the way to go. 296 00:14:56,400 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 1: Really, we're going to take a quick break and be 297 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:05,120 Speaker 1: right back on the car Marco Witch Show. So you're, 298 00:15:06,120 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 1: you know, a very well known law professor. You're the 299 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:14,560 Speaker 1: father of many, many writer children on the internet, the 300 00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:15,240 Speaker 1: blog father. 301 00:15:15,880 --> 00:15:18,800 Speaker 3: That's my favorite thing is that I have all these 302 00:15:18,920 --> 00:15:20,040 Speaker 3: blog children out there. 303 00:15:20,080 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 2: You do, they're like scattered through the world. Do you 304 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:24,280 Speaker 2: feel like you've made it? 305 00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:29,160 Speaker 3: Made it? You know? My ambitions were ever super huge? 306 00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:32,120 Speaker 2: So yeah, just so, and you have a beautiful wife. 307 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 1: I have to also say, Helen is like every time 308 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 1: you post a picture of her, I'm like, I don't know, 309 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:39,560 Speaker 1: she's brilliant too, but she is stunning, Like she is 310 00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:42,040 Speaker 1: literally one of the most beautiful women I've ever seen. 311 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:44,520 Speaker 3: She's very beautiful. And that we have a lovely daughter 312 00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:47,040 Speaker 3: who is now married. We have a lovely, delightful son 313 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:49,280 Speaker 3: in law who's a great guy. So yeah, in that's sense, 314 00:15:49,320 --> 00:15:52,160 Speaker 3: I've definitely made it. And career wise, you know, I'm 315 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 3: my law professor's standards. I'm successful, and that's all I 316 00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:59,680 Speaker 3: really ever aim for. So I mean, I it's not 317 00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:01,560 Speaker 3: quite When I was in college, I wanted to be 318 00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 3: a pundit and write newspaper columns, and I do that. 319 00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 3: So yeah, that's. 320 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:10,680 Speaker 2: What you wanted to do. Well, But what's the like 321 00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:12,240 Speaker 2: if that wasn't your career? 322 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:14,040 Speaker 1: If this, if you weren't a law professor and you 323 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:16,280 Speaker 1: weren't a pundit, what would be plan B. 324 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 3: I'd probably be a lawyer. I like practicing law fine. 325 00:16:23,440 --> 00:16:29,000 Speaker 3: I don't miss it except on payday. But honestly, I 326 00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:31,240 Speaker 3: didn't mind practicing law at all. I like what I 327 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:33,640 Speaker 3: do now a lot better. Which are there some people 328 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 3: who become law professors because they hate practicing law. I didn't. 329 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:40,280 Speaker 3: It was interesting. I liked my clients for the most part. 330 00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:42,760 Speaker 2: What kind of law did you practice? 331 00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:45,920 Speaker 3: So I was in DC and we had what was 332 00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:49,560 Speaker 3: called a Washington policy practice, which basically means lobbying and 333 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:55,200 Speaker 3: administrative law. And I did work telecommunications in aerospace, mostly 334 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:59,400 Speaker 3: a little bit of food and drugs. Sometimes represented McDonald's 335 00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:02,440 Speaker 3: on a few things. Wow, So you know it was 336 00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 3: it was fine. I liked it fine, And you know, 337 00:17:08,080 --> 00:17:10,440 Speaker 3: I could have stayed and done that. And the nice 338 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:13,240 Speaker 3: thing about the firm I work at is the DC 339 00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:16,159 Speaker 3: Office had a big international trade practice. They had economists 340 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:18,480 Speaker 3: on staff. They actually encourage people to write and publish, 341 00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:21,199 Speaker 3: and that's kind of how I started writing lot of 342 00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 3: ther articles and books even before I became the law professor. 343 00:17:25,320 --> 00:17:29,000 Speaker 3: How long have you been in Tennessee thirty plus years? Now? 344 00:17:29,280 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 2: Oh wow? 345 00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:33,359 Speaker 1: How the last few years of all the new people 346 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:36,800 Speaker 1: moving in, how has that been mostly great? 347 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:40,919 Speaker 3: I was really concerned that it was going to be 348 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:43,920 Speaker 3: like Colorado or something and bringing a bunch of people 349 00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:46,800 Speaker 3: who turned the state blue, and the local Democrats still 350 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:51,040 Speaker 3: hope for that. But everybody we meet who's moving here 351 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:55,320 Speaker 3: is in some ways I think more conservative than people 352 00:17:55,400 --> 00:17:57,439 Speaker 3: here are, or at least more aware they've been in 353 00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:00,439 Speaker 3: a state that went down, whereas people here, I think 354 00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:04,320 Speaker 3: are kind of complacent. So I've noticed that some of 355 00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:07,560 Speaker 3: them are becoming more politically active than most of the locals. 356 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:08,400 Speaker 2: Interesting. 357 00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:10,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that the last few years that this 358 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:16,320 Speaker 1: recent migration has been, you know, people with a purpose moving. 359 00:18:16,359 --> 00:18:20,280 Speaker 1: It's like nobody's moving to Florida now for the low 360 00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:22,440 Speaker 1: taxes or the weather. I mean, look, those are all 361 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:25,280 Speaker 1: side benefits obviously, but it's. 362 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:26,119 Speaker 2: For a reason. 363 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:29,240 Speaker 1: You're you're wanting something different, You're wanting something better, and 364 00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:32,840 Speaker 1: I think Tennessee and Florida and Texas are obviously at 365 00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:34,720 Speaker 1: the forefront of that. I don't I don't I see 366 00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:37,480 Speaker 1: the same thing. I don't think that this is a 367 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:38,240 Speaker 1: blue migration. 368 00:18:38,359 --> 00:18:38,680 Speaker 2: Of course. 369 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:42,399 Speaker 1: The concern is that once this wave of people comes 370 00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:44,720 Speaker 1: in and kind of settles down, that the next wave 371 00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:46,879 Speaker 1: will be like, wait, they've built something really good there, 372 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:48,200 Speaker 1: let's go there and change it. 373 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:51,240 Speaker 2: And yeah, well we'll see how that goes. 374 00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:55,240 Speaker 3: But when I think somebody said, which is a good observation, 375 00:18:55,480 --> 00:18:58,520 Speaker 3: is the people who move from a blue state to 376 00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:01,439 Speaker 3: a red state because they were employed warrior moves typically 377 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:04,480 Speaker 3: bring their blue state attitudes with them. The people who 378 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:09,120 Speaker 3: pick up stakes and do it themselves typically don't. And 379 00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:11,199 Speaker 3: so I think that's right. The one thing I do 380 00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 3: think sort of funny is, you know, and it's kind 381 00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:16,440 Speaker 3: of like everybody who moves here immediately like learns to 382 00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:17,760 Speaker 3: shoot if they don't already know how. 383 00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:21,600 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's definitely true. For us, we you know, 384 00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:24,160 Speaker 1: had never shot a gun or even touched a gun 385 00:19:24,240 --> 00:19:27,800 Speaker 1: or anything, and now we enjoy the shooting very very much. 386 00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:29,640 Speaker 2: It's benefit. 387 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:31,959 Speaker 1: It's like, why wouldn't you take advantage of your rights 388 00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 1: and why wouldn't you learn how to do something like 389 00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:35,000 Speaker 1: that when you can? 390 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 3: I love it. Now. Do you know Hadas Levy who's 391 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:41,479 Speaker 3: down there in your neck of the woods. She does 392 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:43,119 Speaker 3: a lot of tactical training for women. 393 00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:44,400 Speaker 2: I know the name. 394 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:47,040 Speaker 1: I feel like somebody might have mentioned her to me 395 00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:49,440 Speaker 1: and maybe I'll look her up after this, but. 396 00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:51,959 Speaker 3: Yeah, maybe interview her. I'll bet she'd be a good interview. 397 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean, I'll have her on. 398 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 1: So one of the things we've talked about on this 399 00:19:57,080 --> 00:20:01,200 Speaker 1: show is, you know, cultural problems and society problems. 400 00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:04,000 Speaker 2: And so's the what's your take. 401 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:07,160 Speaker 1: On what our biggest cultural problem is and whether it's solvable. 402 00:20:08,040 --> 00:20:12,240 Speaker 3: The biggest cultural problem we face is that the people 403 00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:14,600 Speaker 3: running our society, the ruling class, if you want to 404 00:20:14,640 --> 00:20:17,399 Speaker 3: call them that, don't like the society or the people 405 00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:21,119 Speaker 3: they rule very much. And that's true throughout most of 406 00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:24,639 Speaker 3: the West. It's certainly true in the United States and 407 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:30,840 Speaker 3: Canada and the UK, and in most of Europe especially, 408 00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:33,520 Speaker 3: but not exclusively, in the anglophone countries, which seem to 409 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:37,440 Speaker 3: have the worst dose of it for some reason. And 410 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:39,440 Speaker 3: you know, you can't be a very good ruling class 411 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:43,240 Speaker 3: of a country you don't like. And it's much more divisive. 412 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:47,160 Speaker 3: I mean, if you look at things like the collapse 413 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 3: in military recruitment. Now, the collapse of military recruitment comes 414 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:54,040 Speaker 3: because the pool of potential recruits looks at the people 415 00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:56,959 Speaker 3: running things and says, I can't trust these people. You know, 416 00:20:57,240 --> 00:20:59,600 Speaker 3: they'd screw me over in a heartbeat, not even for 417 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:02,119 Speaker 3: their little gain, just to look good for their friends 418 00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:04,639 Speaker 3: for fifteen minutes. And why should I go and take 419 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:07,080 Speaker 3: a bullet for that? And I don't believe him. I mean, 420 00:21:07,200 --> 00:21:08,840 Speaker 3: I've got a nephew who's in the army now and 421 00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:11,439 Speaker 3: it's been good for him, but you know, he'll be 422 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:13,480 Speaker 3: out in the year and he has no intention to stay. 423 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:16,800 Speaker 3: And honestly, it's been good for him in a lot 424 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 3: of ways, but not because they've treated him especially well, 425 00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:21,600 Speaker 3: if that makes sense. There's all these stories of you know, 426 00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:23,639 Speaker 3: you go to a base and there's no food and 427 00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:27,160 Speaker 3: no toilet paper, and I mean, yeah, you know, it's 428 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:29,639 Speaker 3: just like they're they're not spending all that money on 429 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:32,480 Speaker 3: taking care of their people, right, So. 430 00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:35,719 Speaker 2: How do we solve that? What's the I don't know. 431 00:21:35,880 --> 00:21:37,360 Speaker 3: I mean, you know, you. 432 00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:38,760 Speaker 2: Have to know you're the blog father. 433 00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:40,919 Speaker 3: Well, I don't know. Sometimes to get angry, I'm just like, 434 00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:45,640 Speaker 3: let the purges begin. But you know, you really, sweeping 435 00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:47,800 Speaker 3: out your ruling class and sweeping in a new one 436 00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:51,160 Speaker 3: is something that never works very well and usually is worse. 437 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:54,719 Speaker 3: The good news about our ruling class, honestly, is because 438 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:57,959 Speaker 3: they're very shallow and driven by fads. If you just 439 00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:01,640 Speaker 3: get a fad that involved them being patriotic and trying 440 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 3: to do the job, they do it. So I think 441 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:05,000 Speaker 3: that's got to be where we go. 442 00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:08,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's wild to me that like American flags have 443 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:13,240 Speaker 1: become right wing. I just I try to imagine the opposite, like, oh, 444 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,440 Speaker 1: the left wing has now decided that every house that 445 00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:19,200 Speaker 1: is a left wing person, they would put an American 446 00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 1: flag outside. And would I be like, oh, well that 447 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:24,359 Speaker 1: I'm not putting the American flag outside because that's a 448 00:22:24,440 --> 00:22:26,800 Speaker 1: left wing thing. I would never surrender it. I would 449 00:22:26,800 --> 00:22:29,560 Speaker 1: never let them just have it. And the idea of 450 00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:33,760 Speaker 1: that that patriotism has become something only one side of 451 00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:37,080 Speaker 1: the political aisle is into is it's just really crazy 452 00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:40,119 Speaker 1: to me, especially again looking back at those early blog days. 453 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,400 Speaker 2: It was sort of everybody realized. 454 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:45,199 Speaker 1: That America was worth fighting for and worth salvaging, and 455 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:48,520 Speaker 1: those post nine to eleven days were really something. 456 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:53,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, you saw American flags everywhere there for a while, Yeah, 457 00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:56,760 Speaker 3: and then and then not yeah, I mean I mean 458 00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:01,800 Speaker 3: going to fans again, Rainbow flags everywhere. Now. I was 459 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:06,040 Speaker 3: just I was at a political lunch and and we're 460 00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:09,160 Speaker 3: coming out in sort of a hipster area of Nxville, 461 00:23:09,200 --> 00:23:12,880 Speaker 3: and that, you know, some flower shop with a huge 462 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:16,480 Speaker 3: rainbow flag that said, hey, does not abide here. And 463 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:18,400 Speaker 3: my wife was like, I bet if I would ever 464 00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:20,760 Speaker 3: mentioned Donald Trump or something, there'd be plenty of hate 465 00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:24,120 Speaker 3: that would abide there, so, you know, but that's a fad. Yeah, 466 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:27,399 Speaker 3: and you know we've seen those in this house signs 467 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:31,320 Speaker 3: in people's yards and stuff and so, but it literally 468 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:35,359 Speaker 3: is a fad, mostly shallowly held by shallow people. So 469 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:39,199 Speaker 3: the good news for us is it's not like you 470 00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:41,520 Speaker 3: have to change the mind of the vaffen s s 471 00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:44,800 Speaker 3: or something like that. Mostly people don't even know why 472 00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:46,679 Speaker 3: they believe what they believe half the time. It's just 473 00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:50,639 Speaker 3: because that's what has status in their community at the moment, right. 474 00:23:50,800 --> 00:23:52,919 Speaker 1: So that just concerns me that if we do have 475 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:56,080 Speaker 1: another tragedy, if we do have something bad happen, I 476 00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:59,000 Speaker 1: just I can't see us uniting in quite the same ways. 477 00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:02,000 Speaker 1: It's it was sort of the great example of that 478 00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:04,960 Speaker 1: we completely did not unite. You know, my neighbors tell 479 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:07,120 Speaker 1: each other in for having too many people over. 480 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:10,600 Speaker 3: COVID was a good example of how bad our ruling 481 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:13,560 Speaker 3: class is and how much of what went on during 482 00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:15,879 Speaker 3: COVID seemed to be mostly just sort of kicking around 483 00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:18,440 Speaker 3: the public because you could, you know, from the privilege 484 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,359 Speaker 3: of feeling like a powerful big shop. And of course 485 00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:24,359 Speaker 3: the emails and stuff that have come out since the 486 00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 3: show that the people who are telling us to follow 487 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:31,640 Speaker 3: the science, even the scientists didn't believe it themselves, indicate 488 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:34,199 Speaker 3: that it was just a shocking breach of faith with 489 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:39,040 Speaker 3: the public. And you can't have a cohesive, united, patriotic 490 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:44,280 Speaker 3: country where the leading leadership has broken faith with the 491 00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 3: public and the public knows it. And that's definitely where 492 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:50,160 Speaker 3: we are right now. Yeah, how's that for cheerful. 493 00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:53,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's not very optimistic, Glenn. I you know, I 494 00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:54,719 Speaker 2: was hoping for more. Uh. 495 00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:00,520 Speaker 3: I mean honestly, you know, there's a school of thought 496 00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:02,359 Speaker 3: of which you say, everything's really terrible now and the 497 00:25:02,359 --> 00:25:05,600 Speaker 3: government is much more illegitimate and dishonest. If you actually 498 00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:07,720 Speaker 3: look at the history of say the fifties and the sixties, 499 00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:10,399 Speaker 3: it's not at all clear that's true. But the difference 500 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:13,680 Speaker 3: is the public didn't know it, so the country felt 501 00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:16,320 Speaker 3: more united and more patriotic because people just didn't know 502 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:18,439 Speaker 3: what was being done to them in a lot of ways. 503 00:25:18,920 --> 00:25:20,919 Speaker 3: Now they do, And you know, I'm in favor of that. 504 00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:24,199 Speaker 3: I like transparency. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe it's better off 505 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:28,280 Speaker 3: of everybody's but whatever word has gotten out, and all 506 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:30,880 Speaker 3: the efforts to censor things and keep it in only 507 00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:34,080 Speaker 3: make it look worse. I think people are just gonna 508 00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:36,240 Speaker 3: have to do it. I mean, I hate to just say, 509 00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:38,080 Speaker 3: you know, the solution is for the people running things 510 00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:40,800 Speaker 3: to do a better job. But we do actually really 511 00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 3: need that. 512 00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:47,240 Speaker 1: Right, So societally we might be in trouble. But a 513 00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:49,560 Speaker 1: question that I ask all of my guests is end 514 00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:52,880 Speaker 1: here with your best tip for my listeners on how 515 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:55,640 Speaker 1: they can improve their individual lives. 516 00:25:56,440 --> 00:26:01,920 Speaker 3: Oh, well, that's actually easier. It's a amazing Actually, there's 517 00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:06,040 Speaker 3: a very funny little video that's bouncing around on social 518 00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 3: media and some of you may have seen it where 519 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:11,040 Speaker 3: this woman is saying I just feel sort of down now. 520 00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:13,600 Speaker 3: I really don't know why, and her friend says, well, 521 00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:16,560 Speaker 3: you're getting enough sleep? No, have you exercised? No? Have 522 00:26:16,640 --> 00:26:20,240 Speaker 3: you been outside? No? You know, it's just like, honestly, 523 00:26:20,320 --> 00:26:22,960 Speaker 3: do all that stuff and you'll feel a lot better. Exercise, 524 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:26,439 Speaker 3: get outside, stay away from the computer and the news, 525 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:28,560 Speaker 3: and drink. 526 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:33,199 Speaker 1: Yeah, eat and drink. The part of her thing was like, 527 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:34,920 Speaker 1: did you eat today? Did you drink enough water? 528 00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:35,560 Speaker 2: Yeah? 529 00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,600 Speaker 3: Exactly? Yeah. I mean all of that honestly makes an 530 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:40,960 Speaker 3: amazing difference to me. People talk about how I seem 531 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:44,320 Speaker 3: pretty cheerful, and I mean, you do, but I do it. 532 00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:46,600 Speaker 3: And part of the reason is I, you know, I 533 00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:48,760 Speaker 3: left weights, and I do yoga several times a week, 534 00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:51,800 Speaker 3: and I eat a reasonably healthy diet, and I get 535 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:54,359 Speaker 3: out and move around, and you know, I read a 536 00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:57,280 Speaker 3: novel or two every week, and that keeps me pretty cheerful. 537 00:26:57,280 --> 00:27:01,560 Speaker 3: Although I'm reading Kurg Schlickter's new novel The Attack, which 538 00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:05,800 Speaker 3: is basically like the October seventh attacks, if they happened 539 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:08,080 Speaker 3: on a big scale in the United States. That sounds 540 00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:08,880 Speaker 3: super cheerful. 541 00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,080 Speaker 1: I'm planning to read that next. It's on my list. 542 00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:17,359 Speaker 3: It's depressingly realistic and believable. And in fact, I was 543 00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:19,359 Speaker 3: at this political luncheon and the Speaker of the House 544 00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:22,120 Speaker 3: was there and there was just a lot of security 545 00:27:22,119 --> 00:27:23,520 Speaker 3: around it, and I was really good. 546 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:27,359 Speaker 2: Well, thank you so much for coming on, Glenn. This 547 00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:30,200 Speaker 2: has been great. Really love talking to you. I love 548 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,240 Speaker 2: reliving the blogger days. 549 00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:35,480 Speaker 1: Thanks so much for joining us on the Carol Markowitz Show. 550 00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:37,640 Speaker 1: Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.