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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Greece.

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Speaker 2: Welcome everybody, Welcome to Crime Con number one.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for being here. You know what, isn't it

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Speaker 1: great to be with like minded spirits? You know?

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Speaker 2: And people think this is a big boondoggle. That's not true.

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Speaker 2: Everyone here, I believe, is seeking justice and whatever way

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Speaker 2: we can be in a podcast, putting up a missing flyer,

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Speaker 2: endlessly emailing, calling.

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Speaker 1: Writing, our congress people.

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Speaker 2: I don't know what they're doing in Washington, but I

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Speaker 2: can say this clearly, not much, because crime is going up.

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Speaker 2: It's not going down. That's what's supposed to be happening

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Speaker 2: with all our tax dollars. Ain't happening, but a one

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Speaker 2: man crime wave, Long Island serial killer.

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Speaker 1: And you were with me, Karen Stark was with me.

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Speaker 2: That's before I knew the rest of you awesome guests

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Speaker 2: at the very beginning, when we were out going to

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Speaker 2: Gilgo Beach looking at the scene. There is no way

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Speaker 2: in h E double l that all of these are

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Speaker 2: not connected. I mean, Joe Scott Morgan is joining me.

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Speaker 2: He is a renowned forensics expert, Professor Forensics, Jacksonville State University,

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Speaker 2: author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon and Star

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Speaker 2: of Body Bags with Joe Scott Morgan his wife and

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Speaker 2: I came up with that name. By the way, don't

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Speaker 2: even try to take credit for that, Joe Scott. There

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Speaker 2: is no way that a woman killed was in at

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Speaker 2: Davis Park and another jurisdiction, and so of her body

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Speaker 2: parts are found at Gilgo Beach.

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Speaker 1: There's no way she's not connected. And there's so many

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Speaker 1: more guys.

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Speaker 2: I firmly believe that there are going to be victims

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Speaker 2: in Vegas where he had a time share that he

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Speaker 2: visited without his family there. And that compound down in

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Speaker 2: South Carolina. His brother owns this huge compound. He also

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Speaker 2: has land there and they're trying to buy out the

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Speaker 2: neighbors for what There's no way these cases are not

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Speaker 2: connected except maybe maybe the first victim.

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Speaker 3: I think that the fact that there are so many

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Speaker 3: similarities relative to methodology, and also here's the key in

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Speaker 3: that area. It's so very specific geographically and isolated, and

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Speaker 3: the deposition of the bodies. When I think about, you

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Speaker 3: know what we class clinical.

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Speaker 1: Right to stop right there?

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Speaker 2: Did you say the deposition of the bodies? You mean

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Speaker 2: where they're dumped? I think is what he's trying to say,

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Speaker 2: is that what you're trying to say?

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Speaker 3: Bodies are left, yes, deposition and they were hidden.

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Speaker 2: Guys, tell him about the scrub out there, how thick

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Speaker 2: it is in.

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Speaker 1: Front of a body and not see.

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Speaker 3: Well, here's the thing. If if you're attempting to hide

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Speaker 3: a body, why not bury it? And but my thought

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Speaker 3: is is that you would have to have a conveyance

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Speaker 3: like a vehicle. You would have to understand.

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Speaker 4: You mean an avalanche, Well, yeah.

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Speaker 3: It is an avalanche. Yeah, that's the one that they have.

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Speaker 3: You have to be familiar with the area and you

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Speaker 3: have to be comfortable in that environment to drive in

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Speaker 3: that area and to know this is this is a

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Speaker 3: big thing when I'm looking at it. You have to

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Speaker 3: understand traffic patterns when it is the quietest, when it

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Speaker 3: is the darkest, and when it is essentially the most obscured,

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Speaker 3: because you don't want to get caught.

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Speaker 1: Guys, you're hearing what he's saying.

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Speaker 2: And I want to tell you that I interviewed a

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Speaker 2: sex worker who met up with the alleged Long Island

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Speaker 2: serial killer Rex Hureman. They went to dinner at a

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Speaker 2: prayer range location. He found her online, like all of

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Speaker 2: these other people.

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Speaker 1: Other women that are now dead.

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Speaker 2: She got such a creepy feeling from him, and he

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Speaker 2: kept insisting that she get in his car and go

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Speaker 2: with him back to Long Island for their date.

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Speaker 1: And she said, well, I'm going.

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Speaker 2: To take my car and he went no, no, don't

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Speaker 2: take your car. And he never mentioned to her how

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Speaker 2: she was going to get home. Now, this is a

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Speaker 2: woman that had had many, many dates, hundreds, maybe thousands,

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Speaker 2: I don't know, and she got so skewed out by

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Speaker 2: Rex Huerman she wouldn't go.

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Speaker 1: She didn't want the money. That bad. Okay, So what Joe.

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Speaker 2: Scott Morgan is saying is correct with me. Is Karen Stark,

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Speaker 2: renowned psychologist located in Manhattan, but really all over. You

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Speaker 2: can find her online at Karenstark dot com. And I

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Speaker 2: always say Karen with a C you will be able

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Speaker 2: to find her.

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Speaker 1: The familiarity.

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Speaker 2: And you know this Sanna Bremner, she's a high profile

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Speaker 2: lawyer out of Seattle joining us. The familiarity, Like.

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Speaker 1: Think about it, what if you had a dead body

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Speaker 1: in your trunk? What are you going to do? You

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Speaker 1: don't want to drive around with it and get caught.

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Speaker 1: That would be my look.

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Speaker 2: They still ask me for id at for a check

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Speaker 2: at the grocery store. So you got to get rid

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Speaker 2: of the body. Where would you go somewhere you're familiar, right, explain.

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Speaker 5: Within the same vicinity, because it's so important that you're comfortable.

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Speaker 5: Here's the thing, the main thing when it comes to

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Speaker 5: serial killers, they are very crafty. They don't want to

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Speaker 5: be caught, right, That's the thing. They need to be

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Speaker 5: very it's this is stealth. So they have to know

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Speaker 5: exactly where they are and how to do this. And

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Speaker 5: as Joe Scott said, you have to do it at

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Speaker 5: night and make sure think about that area. I've lived

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Speaker 5: in Long Island.

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Speaker 2: She just reminded me of something. And people say, why

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Speaker 2: do you interrupt? Well, because I will lose the thought

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Speaker 2: and it'll be gone forever. When the sex worker was

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Speaker 2: having her date with Rex Hureman, he said, how do

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Speaker 2: you think the Long Island serial killer did it?

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Speaker 1: So I need to shrink on that. I am to

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Speaker 1: answer that.

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Speaker 2: And he was saying, this is how I think he

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Speaker 2: did it. I think he dragged the body like in

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Speaker 2: Cameo or something, through those this really thick scrub and swamp,

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Speaker 2: kind of like marsh and he described her how he

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Speaker 2: thinks the killer would have done it. He was basking

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Speaker 2: and relaying the facts, and she told me to my face,

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Speaker 2: she said, it was like he was reliving it, Nancy.

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Speaker 2: It's not like he was just telling a story like

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Speaker 2: we are right now, like reliving it, killing the ladies,

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Speaker 2: dismembering some of them and hiding their.

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Speaker 5: Bodies, grandiosity. He's he's and this is one of those

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Speaker 5: things that another thing about serial killers that I want

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Speaker 5: to share with all of you, which is that they

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Speaker 5: have huge personalities. They are narcissists, and so as often

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Speaker 5: as he could and it's not just the one sex

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Speaker 5: worker that you spoke to, Nancy. He loved to talk

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Speaker 5: about the Go Go Beach killings and what did everybody

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Speaker 5: think about it? And he had that kind of an

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Speaker 5: ego where he really wanted to get the acclaimed for

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Speaker 5: being that person without identifying.

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Speaker 2: Himself with me is Crime Online dot Com investigative reporter

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Speaker 2: Nicole Parton, Nicole, isn't it true that when rex Huerman

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Speaker 2: was first booked, one of the first questions he said,

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Speaker 2: was the press talking about it?

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Speaker 1: Yes?

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Speaker 6: Absolutely, he wanted to know if it was in the

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Speaker 6: media yet how much which media coverage he was getting

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Speaker 6: was it making the headlines? He was very much interested

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Speaker 6: in knowing if he was becoming a star already.

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Speaker 1: And that even.

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Speaker 6: Goes back to his coworkers that he worked with. Now

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Speaker 6: that they're being interviewed, these people are saying the same

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Speaker 6: thing about him. He loved attention. There was a coworker

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Speaker 6: that he stalked and he showed up on a cruise

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Speaker 6: ship when she took her birthday vacation cruise.

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Speaker 2: Oh can you think of a cruise with Rex Hureman

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Speaker 2: on the show?

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Speaker 6: Yeah, exactly, not the birthday I'm hoping for it.

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Speaker 2: Not the birthday we want, Okay. So first thing when

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Speaker 2: it gets to the jail, the media covering me?

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Speaker 1: Really?

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Speaker 2: I mean I'd be wanting to go. Look, I got

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Speaker 2: to get home to my children. No, I gotta get

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Speaker 2: out of here.

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Speaker 1: But no, he wanted to know is the press covering this? Guys?

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Speaker 2: I still have two incredible guests and Jackie, let me

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Speaker 2: know what we can start taking questions. Oh, I haven't

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Speaker 2: even gotten to Vegas. There's five bodies there that we

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Speaker 2: know of, right, Scott and South Carolina listen to this.

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Speaker 2: The other day, Jackie and I were talking to a

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Speaker 2: very dear friend of a woman, also a sex worker,

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Speaker 2: who went missing. This was her friend and the friend

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Speaker 2: of the victim's daughter. That weekend, the daughter was graduating

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Speaker 2: high school and she was going to get her nails done.

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Speaker 1: Don't look at my nails awful.

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Speaker 2: A guy pulled up with her mother to the nail

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Speaker 2: salon in a truck she believes to be an avalanche.

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Speaker 1: She positively identifies.

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Speaker 2: Rex Huerman as that man, and she remembers him because

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Speaker 2: he was bragging that he had a place was the.

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Speaker 1: Beach of the lake he said he is was a lake.

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Speaker 2: Right, he had a lake, cows and he wanted her

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Speaker 2: and her friends to come over. Ew asleep over with

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Speaker 2: Rex Huerman in the next room, no, and bragging about

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Speaker 2: his money and his position to the daughter, and the

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Speaker 2: mom drives off. She's never seen alive again. So we've

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Speaker 2: got five victims that we're looking into in Vegas, same

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Speaker 2: mo and they look the same as the other victims,

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Speaker 2: amazing physical similarities. And I believe multiple South Carolina victims

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Speaker 2: with me. Also are two incredible guests. Number one my friend,

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Speaker 2: my longtime friend, Anne Bremner. She is a very high

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Speaker 2: profile trial lawyer out of the Seattle Jurisdiction. She is

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Speaker 2: a legal analyst and she is author of Justice in

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Speaker 2: the Age of Judgment. I mean, you have dealt with

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Speaker 2: so many homicide defendants, and I'm not asking you to

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Speaker 2: divulge any of their information, of their names, but.

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Speaker 4: What do you make of Hureman.

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Speaker 7: So I come from the serial killer capital.

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Speaker 8: I think of the United States and Washington State, and

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Speaker 8: we had Ted Bundy and the Green River Killer. My

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Speaker 8: ex husband, Sean Henry Brown represented Ted Bundy. So you know,

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Speaker 8: Heberman is just so creepy and he looks so kind

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Speaker 8: of Wall Street, normal, Empire State building. Right, he does,

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Speaker 8: in some ways look so normal, but then he's so creepy,

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Speaker 8: and that's kind of like Ted Bundy. I still see

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Speaker 8: my ex husband for dinner sometimes. He said that Ted

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Speaker 8: was not anybody that you would think was okay, which

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Speaker 8: I thought was interesting.

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Speaker 1: He's not anybody that you would think is.

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Speaker 8: Like as a woman sitting down with Ted Bundy, that

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Speaker 8: you would know.

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Speaker 7: He was a creeper.

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Speaker 8: You he was a creeper, which surprises me because so

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Speaker 8: many women went with him. Remember, he probably had over

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Speaker 8: one hundred victims all over the United States, Colorado, Washington, Florida, Utah,

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Speaker 8: everywhere and they all went with him. So that to

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Speaker 8: me is just so scary. And this guy looks creepy

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Speaker 8: but also normal in a way to me.

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Speaker 2: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, guys, I had the opportunity.

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Speaker 2: Oh I wish you could have met these ladies, and

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Speaker 2: you can meet them. I got to sit down.

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Speaker 1: With did we have two or three? We had three.

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Speaker 2: Victims right that lived, and I remember I remember speaking

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Speaker 2: to another victim with doctor Oz.

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Speaker 1: These ladies are so much like us.

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Speaker 2: I mean, they didn't see anything coming, they didn't know

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Speaker 2: anything was wrong. They wake up and somebody standing over

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Speaker 2: them that starts to.

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Speaker 1: Club them to death. It was horrible.

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Speaker 2: It changed their lives forever they lived. But I find

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Speaker 2: it really interesting. You sit down with Bundy and you

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Speaker 2: just know this guy in law school something is way off.

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Speaker 2: Guys with me and hey, everybody on the panel jump

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Speaker 2: in except.

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Speaker 1: You, Joe Scott, you just shut the hay up. You're

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Speaker 1: just here for your good looks with me.

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Speaker 2: Also a guy I don't know if you've met him

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Speaker 2: Net yet, Joseph Joe jackelone former NYPD sergeant, cold case investigator,

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Speaker 2: author of the Cold Case Handbook and the Criminal Investigative Function,

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Speaker 2: a guide for a new investigators. And you can find

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Speaker 2: him at Joseph Jackelone is crazy spelling dot com g

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Speaker 2: I A C A L O n E, but it's

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Speaker 2: pronounced jackaloone. This is your neck of the woods, gilg

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Speaker 2: Beach and beyond really Davis Park where the one other

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Speaker 2: woman was killed and then her body parts are found

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Speaker 2: on Gilger Beach. You have so much knowledge, just let

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Speaker 2: it out. I'm not gonna even limit you to a question.

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Speaker 3: Go yeah.

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Speaker 9: There's a number of cases that could be included in this.

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Speaker 9: There's a number of dismemberments. So we have Peaches from

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Speaker 9: Hempstead Lake State Park.

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Speaker 2: We have Vale a minute drinking from the higher fire hydrant.

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Speaker 1: Too much at once, slow it down?

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Speaker 4: What so we have.

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Speaker 9: We have Hempstead Lake State Park with Peaches. We have

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Speaker 9: Valerie Mac.

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Speaker 1: And Peaches is a victim, right.

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Speaker 9: Valerie Mac and Jessica Taylor are also found this membered

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Speaker 9: in a place called Manorville.

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Speaker 4: And then we have Fire Island Jane Dow.

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Speaker 2: How far away is Manerival from Gilgo Beach. There's dead

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Speaker 2: dismembered ladies at Manorval. That killer was called the Manival Butcher.

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Speaker 2: I believe the Manival Butcher is, in fact the Long

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Speaker 2: Island serial killer.

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Speaker 1: They're one and the same.

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Speaker 4: Well, it's about forty miles from Gilgo.

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Speaker 9: But when you do these, when you plot these cases out,

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Speaker 9: it's all in an oval and human's houses almost right

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Speaker 9: in the middle of it. So if anybody lived on

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Speaker 9: Long Island, I've been there almost my whole life, it's

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Speaker 9: pretty clear to see once you map them out. And

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Speaker 9: one thing, cops don't believe in his coincidences, and I

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Speaker 9: certainly don't believe in them. I've been a My theory

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Speaker 9: has been has been one person from the very beginning,

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Speaker 9: and it's a person that has changed his MO not

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Speaker 9: for any other reason other than the technology that became

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Speaker 9: available to him.

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Speaker 1: Okay, wait, let me just take that in.

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Speaker 2: He changed his m O because first the Mannibal Butcher

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Speaker 2: was dismembering all of his victims. Then the later victims,

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Speaker 2: the Gilgo Beach victims, were not all dismembered. That's the

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Speaker 2: change in them to which you are referring.

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Speaker 4: Is it not correct?

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Speaker 1: Okay?

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Speaker 9: And the reason is, and this is what you yelled

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Speaker 9: at me for last time. The but it's important to

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Speaker 9: understand the My theory has been that the girls who

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Speaker 9: were dismembered were street walkers.

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Speaker 1: Do you call them girls?

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Speaker 4: Ladies?

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Speaker 9: Women?

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Speaker 4: What do you like me better?

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Speaker 10: Is it he?

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Speaker 2: She? And when does it matter to you that they're

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Speaker 2: street walkers? Why is that your problem?

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Speaker 4: The street walkers is actually he.

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Speaker 1: Says street walkers, Well, he says street walkers.

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Speaker 9: There are different types of sex workers. There are street walkers,

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Speaker 9: there are escorts, there are women who run the hotels,

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Speaker 9: there are the online girls. They're all different categories. So

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Speaker 9: it's not used as a derogatory term. From an investigative standpoint,

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Speaker 9: it's used to determine.

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Speaker 2: You know, when somebody says, I don't mean this in

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Speaker 2: a bad way, but then they're going to say something

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Speaker 2: bad or no offense, but it's always offensive.

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Speaker 9: I've never been accused of having a filter. So it's

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Speaker 9: it is what it is.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 9: So, in the policing aspect of it, you look at

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Speaker 9: this and say, well, why were these girls dismembered and

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Speaker 9: the others not? Well, because he picked them off the street,

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Speaker 9: he ran the risk of being identified. Somebody could have

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Speaker 9: said I saw her get into the car or truck

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Speaker 9: with this guy. I mean and you think about Rex,

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Speaker 9: he definitely stands. I mean he was he like six

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Speaker 9: foot five, three hundred and something poundsies. He's not somebody

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Speaker 9: that just blends in. So I think the killer was

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Speaker 9: worried about that, so he decapitated them. He cut their

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Speaker 9: hands off. So their bodies were found in one location

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Speaker 9: and the rest of their remains were found in Gilgo.

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Speaker 9: So there's the connection between the two.

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Speaker 1: So the strong connection to.

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Speaker 9: The Manorville cases. Half in Gilgo and half in in Manerville.

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Speaker 9: And Peaches was was found in the barrel like a

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Speaker 9: bucket kind of thing, and her baby was found in Gilgo.

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Speaker 1: Okay, right, right, this is important.

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Speaker 2: Will you say that again? Where was Peaches found and

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Speaker 2: where was the baby?

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Speaker 9: Peaches is found in Hempstead Lake State Park, which is

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Speaker 9: in Nassau County, which is the county over from where

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Speaker 9: we're talking about, and her infant daughter was found in

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Speaker 9: Gilgo Beach.

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Speaker 2: Say that the location of the disbursement of the victims'

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Speaker 2: body parts, when in combination with the Gilgo Beach bodies,

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Speaker 2: they're clearly connect it. I mean, how can it be,

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Speaker 2: you know, Joe Scott Morgan jump in Karen Stark and Bremner,

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Speaker 2: Nicole Parton incredible experts and reporters. Please jump in, Nancy,

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Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, okay, listen to Joe's To Joe's point,

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Speaker 2: thank you, uh.

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Speaker 3: To Joe's point. Here, here's what's significant for me with

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Speaker 3: the with the dismemberment cases, those those that have been recovered.

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Speaker 3: You need privacy in order to facilitate this. This is

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Speaker 3: not something you're going to do in your front yard.

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Speaker 2: Please and regular people talk. If you're going to chop

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Speaker 2: up a body, where are you going to do it?

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Speaker 3: Not in your car and not in the front yard

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Speaker 3: or you know any you have to do it in

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Speaker 3: a motel, have privacy.

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Speaker 2: Would you even do it in a motel because that

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Speaker 2: would be afraid I would leave too much.

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Speaker 3: I suppose you could maybe in a bathtub. We've had

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Speaker 3: cases where that sort of thing has occurred over a

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Speaker 3: period of time. Here's the here's the key. You have

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Speaker 3: to have a kit with you in order to do this.

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Speaker 3: If you're doing dismemberment, you mean like Dexter. Be honest,

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Speaker 3: we have never watched a full episode.

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Speaker 1: Forgive me, hey got me through my pregnancy. Go ahead.

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Speaker 3: You have to have a kit. So you're going to

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Speaker 3: have to have tools, sharp instruments, particularly saws, in order

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Speaker 3: to facilitate it. And as you go along, as in

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Speaker 3: the universal sense, not you, but as they go along,

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Speaker 3: they acquire knowledge as they do this. And what's really

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Speaker 3: key here is that you go from actual dismemberment, which

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Speaker 3: is a form of a true form of desecration of

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Speaker 3: a human remain two where there are almost the bodies

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Speaker 3: are being memorialized in his own way, where they're being

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Speaker 3: wrapped at this point in time. So there's like a

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Speaker 3: progression and a change relative to how he's treating the bodies.

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Speaker 3: And that's something that you has to be taking a long,

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Speaker 3: long look at.

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Speaker 2: That's really interesting Joe Scott, you know, because he was

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Speaker 2: the first, I mean I knew it from an instinctive level,

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Speaker 2: instinctual level, but he first voiced it, verbalized it. And

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Speaker 2: the cult mom Laurie Valle case, the way the two

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Speaker 2: children were treated Tilely was based excuse me. Jj was

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Speaker 2: basically hermetically sealed and preserved.

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Speaker 1: Tilely, her sixteen.

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Speaker 2: Year old daughter was literally rendered like an animal at

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Speaker 2: a slaughterhouse. All that was left of her was a

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Speaker 2: bucket of human fat and tissue singed now I don't

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Speaker 2: know what that means because I'm not a shrink.

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Speaker 1: I'm just a lawyer.

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Speaker 2: But the way the bodies were treated differently that Joe

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Speaker 2: Scott just brought up is really important.

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Speaker 5: It's really important because again you're talking about a serial

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Speaker 5: killer and people are not real. They're objects to him. Absolutely,

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Speaker 5: So the whole idea of wrapping them in burlap like

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Speaker 5: you're giving a gift, or they're not, they're not living,

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Speaker 5: wrapping her.

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Speaker 1: Life as a gift. I think of that as something bad.

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Speaker 5: Well, think about Nancy. It's it's not a real person.

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Speaker 5: You're just like wrapping it up like a doll. Really,

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Speaker 5: like not not something that you see as alive. Because

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Speaker 5: they don't have feelings, they don't have empathy, so people

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Speaker 5: aren't real to them. It's easy to kill that way.

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Speaker 1: Am Bremner.

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Speaker 2: Ted speaking of the authorities or the experts that say, well,

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Speaker 2: it's not the same person because of the different MO.

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Speaker 2: That's technical legal term bs because Ted Bundy changed his MO.

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Speaker 2: I mean he started off in a VW bug going

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Speaker 2: hah and lost or some crap like that, and then

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Speaker 2: you get the girl close enough and it would be

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Speaker 2: just like that to grat she's in the car, or

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Speaker 2: he would lure her into the car and going, could

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Speaker 2: you help me get to someone? And so then there

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Speaker 2: was the fake broken arm. By the end of it,

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Speaker 2: he was just clubbing people, going into their place and

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Speaker 2: clubbing them.

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Speaker 1: Completely different. One victim of ted Bunnies was.

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Speaker 7: Like fourteen, yeah, and they e didn't think there was one. Yeah,

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Speaker 7: that young.

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Speaker 8: And Tacoma where he had a paper route and he

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Speaker 8: I mean sometimes he used like a crowbar. He had

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Speaker 8: a paper route in Tacoma where he grew up, that

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Speaker 8: where he went to law school. But he sometimes would

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Speaker 8: hit him with a crowbar, knock him out so fast,

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Speaker 8: like in between sororities and fraternities at the University of Washington,

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Speaker 8: Central Washington University. Like Samama, she had two victims, remember

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Speaker 8: Gianna saw It and Denise Nasland. He had a broken

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Speaker 8: arm and he wanted some help to put a boat

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Speaker 8: I think on his car, something on his car. Very

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Speaker 8: nice women went with him. Sometimes he would need help.

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Speaker 8: He would drop books and say can you pick those

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Speaker 8: up for me? Then he'd hit them with a crowbar

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Speaker 8: all through Seattle, Dacoma, even down to Oregon.

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Speaker 7: Then he went to Utah, went to law school in Utah.

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Speaker 7: Then he went to.

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Speaker 8: Colorado, remember, and then he went escaped twice, once through

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Speaker 8: a light fixture and once jumping, Yeah, jumping out a

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Speaker 8: window of the law library, a library at a courthouse, Yeah,

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Speaker 8: Kittom County.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: And then to Florida.

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Speaker 8: And my ex husband said he had a conversation with him,

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Speaker 8: and Ted said where would I most likely get the

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Speaker 8: death penalty? And John Henry said Florida and that's where

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Speaker 8: he went.

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Speaker 9: Wow, Nancy, there's something else that you want to talk

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Speaker 9: about in regards to the photos from the search warrant

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Speaker 9: where they showed the tub taken apart in the house. Yeah,

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Speaker 9: because they're looking to see if anything was cut up

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Speaker 9: in there and the anything might have seeped through the

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Speaker 9: coulking or the tile grout and that kind of thing.

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Speaker 9: I don't think anything happened inside of his house, does it?

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Speaker 8: Heay?

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Speaker 2: Wait?

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Speaker 1: I want to dissect what he just said.

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Speaker 4: Too many nosy neighbors of it there.

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Speaker 2: Joseph Jacklone, former NYPD author. So, I was thinking when

442
00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:48,560
Speaker 2: they were tearing apart rex Huerman's house, and do I

443
00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:51,679
Speaker 2: feel bad about his wife and children having to go

444
00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:53,600
Speaker 2: back in the house and it's all torn up, yes,

445
00:23:54,119 --> 00:23:56,720
Speaker 2: but I feel worse about all the dead people exactly.

446
00:23:57,160 --> 00:24:00,800
Speaker 2: I mean really, when they were taking the tub, I

447
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:02,960
Speaker 2: was thinking, but I did not want to criticize the

448
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:04,960
Speaker 2: play if I'm like, well, you know what, you're a

449
00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:08,040
Speaker 2: few years too late on taking that tub out, but

450
00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:10,200
Speaker 2: you're right, and they were right.

451
00:24:10,720 --> 00:24:14,240
Speaker 1: I was wrong because if any of their blood had

452
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:18,840
Speaker 1: seeped in, and it does, boy, fluids can do that,

453
00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:21,400
Speaker 1: it could still be in the tile to this day.

454
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:24,800
Speaker 9: You can never fully clean up a crime scene, even

455
00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:26,719
Speaker 9: if you set it on fire. So ladies, if you're

456
00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:28,879
Speaker 9: thinking about killing your husbands, you know, don't worry about it.

457
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:30,080
Speaker 9: You're not going to be able to get away with

458
00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:30,600
Speaker 9: it totally.

459
00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:31,399
Speaker 8: No.

460
00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 9: But the reason is is I always help people. If

461
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:36,560
Speaker 9: you made a milkshake one day and the cop came

462
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 9: off and the milkshake went everywhere, you know, six months later,

463
00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:40,440
Speaker 9: you pull the dish out and there's a a bout

464
00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:41,320
Speaker 9: of chocolate milk on.

465
00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:42,200
Speaker 4: It, you can't.

466
00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:44,479
Speaker 9: You always miss something. And the reason why they pull

467
00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:46,080
Speaker 9: that out is they're going to do their blood tests.

468
00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:48,119
Speaker 9: They're going to do the thing. I mean, listen, you

469
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:50,760
Speaker 9: might find you know, their blood, you know, the family

470
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:52,560
Speaker 9: because they live there. Of course, I mean, that's just what.

471
00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:55,080
Speaker 9: But here's the other thing that no one's really discussing.

472
00:24:55,440 --> 00:24:57,920
Speaker 9: They also called the medical examiner to the storage facility.

473
00:24:58,480 --> 00:24:59,960
Speaker 4: Now, oh yeah, we haven't heard.

474
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:02,080
Speaker 9: Yeah, there's only one reason to do that, right, So

475
00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:04,080
Speaker 9: they might have found something, whether it may be blood,

476
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,280
Speaker 9: you know, but you can answer that out right. Someone

477
00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:08,960
Speaker 9: might have cut themselves putting something away, but they found

478
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:10,480
Speaker 9: something that to say, let's get.

479
00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:13,240
Speaker 4: Them eat is to take on what it actually found there.

480
00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:17,480
Speaker 2: Nicole partners with US crimeonline dot Com investigate every porter

481
00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:18,200
Speaker 2: on Nicole.

482
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,960
Speaker 1: Let's talk about.

483
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:23,240
Speaker 2: A lot of us in the room already know the

484
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:26,160
Speaker 2: history of the case up to right now, I want

485
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 2: to look forward. What's happening now. I believe authorities are

486
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:35,200
Speaker 2: looking at Vegas, five different people, five different women.

487
00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:41,000
Speaker 1: Yes, and South Carolina. Bring everybody up to date with

488
00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:41,400
Speaker 1: your novel.

489
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:46,600
Speaker 6: They're investigating against South Carolina because Huerman purchased eighteen acres

490
00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 6: of property there in a very secluded area eighteen and

491
00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 6: on that property that he purchased, there are many bodies

492
00:25:55,000 --> 00:26:00,679
Speaker 6: of water, little lakes and ponds, very secluded rural area,

493
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:05,480
Speaker 6: and so obviously they're investigating there is that a place

494
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 6: where he took victims, and it goes back to the

495
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:11,639
Speaker 6: avalanche that you've spoken of so much. That avalanche was

496
00:26:11,680 --> 00:26:15,520
Speaker 6: also found on the property in South Carolina. So we

497
00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:19,119
Speaker 6: have the Las Vegas five victims, but we have a

498
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:23,400
Speaker 6: huge investigation now in South Carolina because of its property

499
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:25,760
Speaker 6: in addition to that avalanche.

500
00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:28,280
Speaker 2: And that was odd about well, everything you just said

501
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,879
Speaker 2: is odd. But did you hear say the Vegas five.

502
00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:35,719
Speaker 2: It sounds like the Gilgo five. Okay, go ahead.

503
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:40,480
Speaker 6: The search warrant for the South Carolina property lists things

504
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:42,440
Speaker 6: like pieces of a leather belt.

505
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:44,240
Speaker 4: And remember that was one.

506
00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:46,600
Speaker 6: Of the first pieces of evidence that was shown, that

507
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:49,840
Speaker 6: stamped leather belt with the initials on it.

508
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:52,520
Speaker 1: Still around or with one of the dead victims, yeap.

509
00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 6: So they're looking for pieces of a leather belt. They're

510
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:58,159
Speaker 6: also looking for the stamp that was part of the

511
00:26:58,200 --> 00:27:02,840
Speaker 6: search warrant for South Carolina, looking for things like condoms,

512
00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:07,000
Speaker 6: looking for things like weapons and more burner phones. All

513
00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:09,600
Speaker 6: of that was included in the search warrant for his

514
00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:11,560
Speaker 6: eighteen acres in South Carolina.

515
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,760
Speaker 2: Trying to just take in everything she's saying. The Chevy avalanche,

516
00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:21,040
Speaker 2: which as I recall was discontinued manufacturer in twenty thirteen.

517
00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:24,320
Speaker 2: So if there is a Chevy Avalanche somewhere, that means

518
00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:29,359
Speaker 2: it could beat the Chevy Avalanche that was used during

519
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,200
Speaker 2: some of the killings. That's the significance. That's why I

520
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:49,719
Speaker 2: keep talking about their manufacturer date crime stories with Nancy

521
00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:54,840
Speaker 2: Grace Long Island serial killer. I believe it's going to

522
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:58,399
Speaker 2: be the Vegas serial killer. I believe it's going to

523
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:01,320
Speaker 2: be the South Carolina seerial ki killer. And I believe

524
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:04,480
Speaker 2: he is one of the same as the Mannerable Butcher.

525
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,080
Speaker 9: And then it's going federal what And then it's going

526
00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:11,639
Speaker 9: federal federal. Yeah, it's going to be taken out of

527
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:13,879
Speaker 9: the hands of Suffolk County. It is gonna go federal.

528
00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:17,120
Speaker 2: No, I like the new people at Suffolk County, remember

529
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:18,320
Speaker 2: the old suffer County.

530
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:18,920
Speaker 1: Uh.

531
00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:22,600
Speaker 9: It's about leverage, though, Nancy, because once the Feds get in,

532
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:23,840
Speaker 9: the death penalties on the table.

533
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:24,360
Speaker 1: I agree.

534
00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:26,640
Speaker 2: But wait a minute, Wait a minute, who was it

535
00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:28,520
Speaker 2: that was having sex with hookers?

536
00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:31,840
Speaker 1: James Burke excuse me, sex workers?

537
00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:36,359
Speaker 4: What James Burke, Chief Burke.

538
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:38,960
Speaker 1: The Suffolk County Chief of Police.

539
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:41,440
Speaker 2: And I know he didn't want the FEDS in on this,

540
00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 2: you know why, because they would have found out he

541
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:47,760
Speaker 2: was having sex with sex workers and didn't want to

542
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:51,440
Speaker 2: blow up his empire. And it all came to light

543
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 2: when somebody stole a bag of sex toys out of

544
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:54,440
Speaker 2: the back of his car.

545
00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:55,720
Speaker 1: Isn't that how it went down?

546
00:28:56,120 --> 00:29:00,000
Speaker 2: I mean really, so you don't want him in charge

547
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:04,320
Speaker 2: of a murder investigation where all the victims are sex workers.

548
00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:08,320
Speaker 2: So he's out and now there's a new one in

549
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:10,200
Speaker 2: who I think is pretty good.

550
00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:14,400
Speaker 9: Rodney and I were sergeants together. Yeah, he's he's very good.

551
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 9: And then actually when he first came out, he took

552
00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:17,760
Speaker 9: a big chance. He said, this first day there, he

553
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:19,560
Speaker 9: went to Gilgo and said, we're going to solve this case,

554
00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:23,120
Speaker 9: this case, and he did.

555
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:28,000
Speaker 8: He asked me question, Yes, hi, my name is Karen.

556
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:30,560
Speaker 8: I'm actually from Suffolk County, and I was going to

557
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 8: ask about Jimmy Burke to Joe, does he have any

558
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:35,480
Speaker 8: connection to rex Hureman?

559
00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:39,000
Speaker 9: Is a lot of things, but he's I don't think

560
00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:41,840
Speaker 9: he's the killer involved in this. So there's no connection

561
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:44,440
Speaker 9: so far from what we've heard of to rex Hureman.

562
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:47,200
Speaker 9: The only thing that we know is that there was

563
00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:49,640
Speaker 9: lots of corruption going on that prevented a lot of

564
00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 9: this investigation from happening because they were more interested in

565
00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 9: saving their own behinds instead of Actually.

566
00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:57,479
Speaker 2: I don't think that's what he was interested in. I

567
00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,480
Speaker 2: think he was interested in continued sex with sex workers

568
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:02,920
Speaker 2: and not getting caught and getting paid by the government.

569
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:04,920
Speaker 1: We're talking about the former chief.

570
00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:05,640
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah.

571
00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:10,080
Speaker 9: Unfortunately, unfortunately for him beating the suspect cause first law,

572
00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:13,200
Speaker 9: because the federal investigation, which then the district attorney got

573
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:15,480
Speaker 9: involved with, and then was the cover up and the conspiracy,

574
00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:18,120
Speaker 9: and that was the real workings behind it.

575
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:20,480
Speaker 4: Now, remember Burke only came in.

576
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 9: A year after this case had already started, so he

577
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 9: you know, he's not the chief that was.

578
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 2: The chief of police, had anything to do with the murders.

579
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:30,960
Speaker 2: I think he had a lot to do with throwing

580
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:34,560
Speaker 2: off the investigation because he didn't want to be investigated

581
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:36,200
Speaker 2: for being with sex workers.

582
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:38,000
Speaker 1: Is that do you think that's right?

583
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:41,200
Speaker 9: Well, he he took the best investigators he had and

584
00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:43,280
Speaker 9: put them in places where they can find out if

585
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:45,400
Speaker 9: the Feds were talking about him, instead of putting them

586
00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:45,920
Speaker 9: on the case.

587
00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:49,320
Speaker 4: That's basically what happened in that whole thing. I mean,

588
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:49,640
Speaker 4: when you.

589
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:51,920
Speaker 9: Look at how they saw this case pretty pretty quickly

590
00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:54,440
Speaker 9: taken over the task for us they find I mean

591
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 9: the information was in the case folder for them, that made.

592
00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:02,920
Speaker 2: The Chevy Avalanche was parked in front of human's house forever. Okay,

593
00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:05,000
Speaker 2: where is my question?

594
00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:05,640
Speaker 1: Hello?

595
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:13,240
Speaker 11: Do you think uh Rex told anybody? I mean thirty

596
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:15,800
Speaker 11: five years. I couldn't keep a secret for five years.

597
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:18,320
Speaker 1: And do you think his brother?

598
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 11: We haven't heard anything about his brother, And I know

599
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:27,120
Speaker 11: it's early, but what are your thoughts on his brother?

600
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:31,280
Speaker 11: Haven't heard a lot about or or if he really

601
00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:31,880
Speaker 11: told anything.

602
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 1: My brother has not been arrested yet.

603
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:40,920
Speaker 2: Yet, which tells me would anybody agree or disagree? I

604
00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:43,920
Speaker 2: don't think the brother has been accused, of course, I'm

605
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:47,800
Speaker 2: sure they're looking at him as having anything to do

606
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:52,720
Speaker 2: with the murders. Now, should he have known if bodies

607
00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 2: were being buried on his property? I don't know, but

608
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:58,960
Speaker 2: I can tell you this much, that's an excellent defense.

609
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 2: I didn't know. So unless they can tie him directly

610
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 2: to a murder or the disposal of the body, he

611
00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:09,920
Speaker 2: is at this juncture without blame. Hey, jump in, you're

612
00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:12,640
Speaker 2: the high profile lawyer and Nicole part and remember you

613
00:32:12,640 --> 00:32:13,840
Speaker 2: have he did.

614
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:17,960
Speaker 6: He did sell the avalanche to the brother, So the

615
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,600
Speaker 6: brother did have possession of said avalanche.

616
00:32:21,880 --> 00:32:24,360
Speaker 1: L partner you think you said, hey, is that blood,

617
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:26,720
Speaker 1: because I don't. I don't think so.

618
00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:29,640
Speaker 6: But he but he it was on his property that

619
00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:33,400
Speaker 6: that avalanche was recovered, and he owns the adjoining property

620
00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:35,440
Speaker 6: there in South Carolina, the brother, and.

621
00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 4: They got to keep the leverage angle of this thing too.

622
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 4: They don't.

623
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:40,480
Speaker 9: They don't start locking everybody up because everybody gets a lawyer,

624
00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:42,520
Speaker 9: and then nobody could talk to anybody. So they keep

625
00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:45,520
Speaker 9: everybody at bay until they either figure out they're involved

626
00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:48,479
Speaker 9: or not. Then they say, okay, here's the deal. This

627
00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 9: is what happens. You either talk or you go to jail.

628
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:51,640
Speaker 9: And that's how these cases wait.

629
00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:52,080
Speaker 1: You may.

630
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 2: They don't arrest everybody and then let them go when

631
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:55,880
Speaker 2: they feel like it.

632
00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, no, we don't.

633
00:32:58,200 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 9: We don't really care for lawyers in this kind of things,

634
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:02,080
Speaker 9: So we want to make sure that we stay them

635
00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 9: as far away as possible. Because soon as you label

636
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:06,760
Speaker 9: somebody a suspect, that's it absolute right. The council attaches

637
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:08,080
Speaker 9: and good luck, Eva Dolbert.

638
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,960
Speaker 5: But I want to add that family members often have

639
00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:15,360
Speaker 5: no idea what's going on around them.

640
00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:16,760
Speaker 1: So perhaps, but.

641
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:20,360
Speaker 5: In most cases the family members are not involved well.

642
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:23,240
Speaker 8: And Gary Ridgeway was married three times in his last

643
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:26,080
Speaker 8: wife got the Green River Killer and the Green River

644
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:26,920
Speaker 8: Killer in Seattle.

645
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 7: I think he played guilty to forty eight deaths.

646
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,760
Speaker 8: But he had three wives, and his last wife said

647
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:32,840
Speaker 8: it was a perfect marriage.

648
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:35,280
Speaker 7: Perfect marriage to a serial.

649
00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:37,200
Speaker 1: Killer, A perfect marriage.

650
00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:38,320
Speaker 7: Yeah.

651
00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:40,440
Speaker 8: And then Ted Bundy of course had a long term

652
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:42,719
Speaker 8: girlfriend that never knew and she turned him in at

653
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:45,360
Speaker 8: the end, but many many years she had no idea and.

654
00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 1: B t K Okay, where's the question? Ah? Right there?

655
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 2: Hello, I was wondering how would they track someone's burner

656
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:53,960
Speaker 2: phones if.

657
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:54,959
Speaker 1: They throw them away?

658
00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 2: I love this part, the forensics of his burner phones.

659
00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:00,640
Speaker 1: You hit it, Jackline.

660
00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:02,800
Speaker 9: Yeah, this was a big blow for all those drug

661
00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 9: dealers out there, and that because they think that they've

662
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,640
Speaker 9: been anonymous for all this time. But the only thing

663
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:09,880
Speaker 9: I could definitely tell you is don't take a selfie

664
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:10,879
Speaker 9: with your burn a phone.

665
00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:12,040
Speaker 4: That's really not a good idea.

666
00:34:12,880 --> 00:34:14,680
Speaker 9: But this is what Rex did, right, He took several

667
00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:16,399
Speaker 9: cell You know, took several things, and then he also

668
00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:20,279
Speaker 9: went into the store and paid more for minutes, which then,

669
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,440
Speaker 9: as you know, and from what we believe, it was

670
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:24,440
Speaker 9: a credit card. So once again, now it's no more

671
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:26,640
Speaker 9: a Berna phone. So there's a lot of times it's

672
00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:28,839
Speaker 9: just mistakes. But now they have the technology, they can

673
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:31,560
Speaker 9: narrow these things down within a few feet and be

674
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:33,560
Speaker 9: able to tell you what cell tower it hit, what

675
00:34:33,640 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 9: time it hit, and it's it's been pretty amazing. I said,

676
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:37,839
Speaker 9: there's a lot that opened up a lot of eyes

677
00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:39,719
Speaker 9: in the underworld when they when they broke this thing

678
00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:41,600
Speaker 9: about the because he has seven of them, I believe.

679
00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:44,280
Speaker 2: And another thing, you can take the victim's cell phone

680
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:47,719
Speaker 2: data and see the burner phones calling in like when

681
00:34:47,760 --> 00:34:50,719
Speaker 2: you get an incoming call and then they start noticing

682
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:57,000
Speaker 2: the same number. And not only that, you can extrapolite

683
00:34:57,080 --> 00:35:00,759
Speaker 2: and figure out where a call is coming from. And

684
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:02,960
Speaker 2: some of the calls, for instance, the one that was

685
00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:06,879
Speaker 2: taunting the victim's family, he would call and say, Hey,

686
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:09,719
Speaker 2: where's your sister? I did X, Y and Z to

687
00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:14,120
Speaker 2: her before I murdered her. It was made right above

688
00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:18,800
Speaker 2: Penn Station in New York. You got Pen Station which

689
00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:22,640
Speaker 2: is Amtrak. You got Grand Central which is more local,

690
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:27,120
Speaker 2: but pen Station was what he would take to get home,

691
00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 2: all right.

692
00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:30,120
Speaker 1: Together.

693
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:32,319
Speaker 9: They gave them the box too when they got when

694
00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 9: he went back to Messapeaka with the phone, and the

695
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:37,040
Speaker 9: last ping was in Massapequa, so this was all they had.

696
00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:38,440
Speaker 1: This pretty amazing.

697
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:40,600
Speaker 9: So they had the ping, they had the towns, and

698
00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:42,799
Speaker 9: they had the description of him and the truck and

699
00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:44,080
Speaker 9: it took ten years to find it.

700
00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:46,840
Speaker 1: Hey, guys, look at Joscott Morgan.

701
00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:51,680
Speaker 2: What is going on in that head? Okay, you're sitting

702
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:53,240
Speaker 2: there having forensic thoughts.

703
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:54,080
Speaker 1: I think hit me.

704
00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:57,760
Speaker 3: Relative to the tracking, I think that it's essential because

705
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:01,399
Speaker 3: not only do you have the sequencing of him going

706
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:04,279
Speaker 3: out and buying a variety of different phones, but what

707
00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 3: what's fascinating to me is that when you utilize an

708
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:12,279
Speaker 3: item like this, these millstones that we carry in our

709
00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:15,919
Speaker 3: pockets everywhere we go, even if it is a burner phone,

710
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:21,000
Speaker 3: if you're reaching out to the sex workers and communicating

711
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:23,759
Speaker 3: with them visa these things, then you're going to have

712
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:28,400
Speaker 3: their data. And look, the police are not blind to this.

713
00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:31,239
Speaker 3: They're going to dig into if they can get a

714
00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:34,799
Speaker 3: victim identified, and that's the most important thing. You get

715
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 3: the victim identified, the decedent that you have, and you

716
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:40,520
Speaker 3: begin to track back through their history. You have a

717
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:43,720
Speaker 3: lot of these sex workers that are in the realm

718
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:47,880
Speaker 3: of the escort world, so they live and die by

719
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:51,000
Speaker 3: whatever device, whether it's a computer or whether it's a phone,

720
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:54,600
Speaker 3: whatever that and you're going to leave this digital footprint

721
00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:57,279
Speaker 3: along the way, and any kind of communication that they

722
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:00,480
Speaker 3: might have with this individual is going to When you

723
00:37:00,560 --> 00:37:03,640
Speaker 3: marry that up with the physical evidence that you actually

724
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:07,399
Speaker 3: find at the scene, this location data, it can be

725
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:09,320
Speaker 3: really hard for the defense to overcome.

726
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:12,120
Speaker 4: And sex workers don't change phones. It's their business.

727
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:15,760
Speaker 9: So that you get the constant phone number, the same number,

728
00:37:15,800 --> 00:37:18,040
Speaker 9: and when you start putting that pattern together, and that's

729
00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:19,720
Speaker 9: what backs you into these kind of things.

730
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:21,080
Speaker 4: But you have to be looking for it.

731
00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:24,160
Speaker 2: That's the only point you guys, how often have you

732
00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:27,760
Speaker 2: changed your phone number. I've had this phone number since

733
00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:32,359
Speaker 2: I started Court TV with Johnny cop from God Rest

734
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:36,040
Speaker 2: His Soul in nineteen ninety seven, the same phone number,

735
00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:39,239
Speaker 2: and if I change it, well, I'm not going to

736
00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:39,680
Speaker 2: change it.

737
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:42,080
Speaker 1: So that's a really good point, Jack Alone.

738
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:46,800
Speaker 12: Yes, Hi, my name is Brittan from Columbus, Ohio, And

739
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:49,680
Speaker 12: I actually have two questions. So, since Rex seems to

740
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:51,560
Speaker 12: like to brag and kind of talk about it, do

741
00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:54,319
Speaker 12: you think at any point he will end up confessing?

742
00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:56,480
Speaker 1: And your mind so much with my daughter, I don't

743
00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:57,480
Speaker 1: know what you're saying.

744
00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:02,560
Speaker 2: She talks so high that only dogs can hear what

745
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:03,320
Speaker 2: she's saying.

746
00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:07,560
Speaker 12: What you have to yeah, like all of us. Do

747
00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:10,320
Speaker 12: you think do you think Rex will end up confessing?

748
00:38:10,320 --> 00:38:11,960
Speaker 12: You're talking about it. Since he seems to like to

749
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:13,880
Speaker 12: brag about what he's done.

750
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:17,600
Speaker 9: Does Rex chance of confessing? I don't think so. Unless

751
00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:22,440
Speaker 9: the Feds Rex confessing to this. What are the chances?

752
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:24,719
Speaker 9: I think it's zero unless the Feds come in and

753
00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:26,440
Speaker 9: make the case, because the Feds can then hold the

754
00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:28,799
Speaker 9: death penalty over his head see New York State. Even

755
00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:30,440
Speaker 9: though you have the death penalty, you need the Feds

756
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:31,640
Speaker 9: now to step in and do it.

757
00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:35,000
Speaker 1: So if they or you got South Carolina in Vegas

758
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 1: right well, like.

759
00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:36,960
Speaker 4: I said, all they need is that want.

760
00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:38,920
Speaker 9: I mean technically, I think I can make a federal

761
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:41,040
Speaker 9: case out of it right now. Just because you had

762
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:44,000
Speaker 9: girls come from Philly and Jersey, so that transportation, I

763
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 9: think it's a hobs Act and then.

764
00:38:45,719 --> 00:38:49,040
Speaker 2: White a minute, and plus what about wire Oh yeah,

765
00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:51,320
Speaker 2: I don't know that it crossed Yeah, but the hobbsack

766
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:55,080
Speaker 2: or email or something, it crosses state lines that Feds

767
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:55,839
Speaker 2: can get you.

768
00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:58,800
Speaker 1: So i'thing something that's a great question.

769
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:03,440
Speaker 3: Something that we really haven't mentioned relative to Gilgo Beach

770
00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:08,000
Speaker 3: is you know there there are these four other victims

771
00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:10,759
Speaker 3: that they had mentioned out of Atlantic City at some

772
00:39:10,840 --> 00:39:14,560
Speaker 3: point in time, and my understanding is that they were

773
00:39:14,760 --> 00:39:19,040
Speaker 3: the deposition of the remains is that they were approximating

774
00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:21,680
Speaker 3: the same location and that they were laying in a

775
00:39:21,719 --> 00:39:26,920
Speaker 3: specific direction. There was directionality, and so they're all in

776
00:39:26,960 --> 00:39:28,720
Speaker 3: the same area. And I think there was an old

777
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:32,200
Speaker 3: hotel there or something. It's gone now, the Golden Key. Yeah,

778
00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:36,399
Speaker 3: the Golden Key a notel motel of that. Yeah.

779
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:42,400
Speaker 2: So its but she asked about a confession and you

780
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:43,000
Speaker 2: answered that.

781
00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:46,279
Speaker 1: Did he answer your question, lady.

782
00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 9: Yeah, there's no reason for him to confess unless they're

783
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:49,080
Speaker 9: going to hang a death penalty on.

784
00:39:49,160 --> 00:39:52,200
Speaker 1: Right there, Go ahead, sir, huh.

785
00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:54,360
Speaker 10: Hi, Nancy. My name is Dan. I'm retired law enforcement

786
00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:57,799
Speaker 10: from California, and several years ago I worked in Las

787
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:01,320
Speaker 10: Vegas as a ride share driver. So the Las Vegas

788
00:40:01,320 --> 00:40:06,680
Speaker 10: part of this case really interests me geographically. What area

789
00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:08,920
Speaker 10: was his residence in Las Vegas?

790
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:10,960
Speaker 1: And I may be able that's a really good question.

791
00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:15,200
Speaker 2: And isn't Jackie isn't didn't he have an email address?

792
00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:18,759
Speaker 2: It's a Springfield guy, and somebody goes missing in Springfield

793
00:40:19,160 --> 00:40:22,719
Speaker 2: as well, so I think we may actually have victims

794
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:26,279
Speaker 2: in Springfield area as well. Just throw that into the pot.

795
00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:28,040
Speaker 2: Were what was the area?

796
00:40:28,360 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 6: I don't know the exact area, but I know that

797
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:37,000
Speaker 6: his windhom properties were transferable and so they actually stayed

798
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 6: at about four different condos from one side to the other,

799
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:44,040
Speaker 6: so he was moving around when he would make these

800
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:45,400
Speaker 6: trips out to Vegas.

801
00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:47,239
Speaker 2: And I have been told and I need to go

802
00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:51,160
Speaker 2: to Vegas and look for myself that one of the

803
00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:54,840
Speaker 2: properties and Nicole Parton's talking about is not far from

804
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:58,600
Speaker 2: the strip where these women would have been. I mean, guys,

805
00:40:58,640 --> 00:40:59,720
Speaker 2: have you ever been to Vegas?

806
00:41:00,160 --> 00:41:00,719
Speaker 1: All on the.

807
00:41:00,719 --> 00:41:05,480
Speaker 2: Ground there are like flyers with ladies like practically need

808
00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:09,960
Speaker 2: on them call this number or this email. It's like

809
00:41:10,120 --> 00:41:12,239
Speaker 2: looking for a Niel in a haystack. But you're right

810
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:17,160
Speaker 2: geographically from what I've been told he's right on the scene.

811
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:17,920
Speaker 9: And they have his DNA.

812
00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:18,120
Speaker 3: Now.

813
00:41:18,120 --> 00:41:20,160
Speaker 9: They had to fight for it, so they have his

814
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 9: DNA to match it up the cases. But we have

815
00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:23,520
Speaker 9: that was about two months ago. They had to fight

816
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:25,799
Speaker 9: New York for it because New York is New York

817
00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:28,080
Speaker 9: and said you can't have it. So they had to

818
00:41:28,120 --> 00:41:29,440
Speaker 9: go through the courses and they get it.

819
00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:32,040
Speaker 2: They're trying to match up DNA right now and I

820
00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:33,759
Speaker 2: think there may be a match, but we don't know

821
00:41:33,800 --> 00:41:34,280
Speaker 2: that yet.

822
00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:35,360
Speaker 1: One more Good morning.

823
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:39,880
Speaker 13: I'm Kimberly and I'm from outside Buffalo, New York. My

824
00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:43,759
Speaker 13: question is they had all this evidence on Rex and

825
00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:47,560
Speaker 13: it took them ten years. Now is it due to

826
00:41:47,680 --> 00:41:51,520
Speaker 13: the fact of the occupation that these ladies had that

827
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:55,800
Speaker 13: they just quote unquote didn't care because cell phone records

828
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:57,960
Speaker 13: would have been the first thing that I would have

829
00:41:58,000 --> 00:41:58,480
Speaker 13: looked at.

830
00:41:58,600 --> 00:41:59,759
Speaker 1: It's because they didn't care.

831
00:42:00,120 --> 00:42:03,400
Speaker 2: Yes, they didn't care because they were sex workers and

832
00:42:03,440 --> 00:42:06,359
Speaker 2: they didn't care. Wait, they didn't care because they were

833
00:42:06,400 --> 00:42:08,799
Speaker 2: sex workers. And the chief of police didn't want the

834
00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:13,600
Speaker 2: investigation because he was sleeping with sex workers allegedly. Okay,

835
00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:16,080
Speaker 2: that's why it took so long. But I don't think

836
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:18,359
Speaker 2: we have that problem anymore. So I think it's full

837
00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:21,760
Speaker 2: steam ahead. Really good question, and you quickly quickly.

838
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:25,480
Speaker 14: Hi, I'm from Greenville, South Carolina, and I'm all up

839
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:29,080
Speaker 14: in my husband's business. So how is it that you

840
00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:32,480
Speaker 14: can have How can you live with someone for that long?

841
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:34,400
Speaker 1: And could be?

842
00:42:34,600 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 14: Is she a I don't want to blame her at all,

843
00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:38,000
Speaker 14: but I'm just saying.

844
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:39,440
Speaker 1: Is she How did the wife not know? Is that

845
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:42,480
Speaker 1: your question? Yes, ma'am. Okay, you're the strength.

846
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:46,799
Speaker 5: Think about BTK right, think about.

847
00:42:48,040 --> 00:42:48,080
Speaker 2: That.

848
00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:50,680
Speaker 5: I think it was a coed killer. But if you

849
00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:54,480
Speaker 5: look at serial killers, there are some that's the extraordinary

850
00:42:54,520 --> 00:42:57,719
Speaker 5: thing because we think they're monsters, but many of them

851
00:42:57,880 --> 00:43:02,840
Speaker 5: actually are in relationship ships married. As I said before,

852
00:43:02,920 --> 00:43:07,200
Speaker 5: families are unaware and they're able to keep that going well.

853
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:10,799
Speaker 5: Though they have no real emotions, they can on the

854
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:16,040
Speaker 5: surface come across as being engaged in a relationship having

855
00:43:16,120 --> 00:43:19,520
Speaker 5: a marriage. And I am not the least bit surprised

856
00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:21,319
Speaker 5: about that, not the least bit.

857
00:43:21,600 --> 00:43:26,040
Speaker 1: I agree with her what she said. I'm quoting the office. Okay,

858
00:43:26,680 --> 00:43:30,040
Speaker 1: lightning around that means lightning. Joe Scott.

859
00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:32,799
Speaker 3: Final thought, this is what I think I want to know.

860
00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:36,560
Speaker 3: Why was the Emmy at the storage facility. Was there

861
00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:39,360
Speaker 3: some kind of anatomical element there that were trying to

862
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:42,120
Speaker 3: identify as as some trophy? Is it something that he

863
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:45,120
Speaker 3: had just picked up along the way. And also have

864
00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:46,319
Speaker 3: they found.

865
00:43:46,040 --> 00:43:46,759
Speaker 1: A kill kit?

866
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:49,520
Speaker 3: Is there a murder kit that he had that included

867
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:53,520
Speaker 3: saws or knives or anything like this? Ligatures, That's what

868
00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:55,120
Speaker 3: I'm interested in trying to understand.

869
00:43:55,239 --> 00:43:56,360
Speaker 1: I'm on that note.

870
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 6: His wife spent her summers out of the country in Iceland,

871
00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:02,879
Speaker 6: and it's believed that a lot of these crimes took

872
00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:04,680
Speaker 6: place when she was out of the country.

873
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:06,800
Speaker 2: And I tell you this much. It beig col d

874
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:09,560
Speaker 2: aine Hl that David Lynch calls and said, I'm not

875
00:44:09,560 --> 00:44:10,279
Speaker 2: coming home tonight.

876
00:44:10,719 --> 00:44:13,279
Speaker 9: Yeah, well things happen, right. A lot of women don't

877
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:13,920
Speaker 9: know what's going on.

878
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:15,640
Speaker 4: Listen.

879
00:44:15,880 --> 00:44:17,279
Speaker 9: There's been a lot of times you call up the

880
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:18,880
Speaker 9: wife and say, listen, we lock your husband up for

881
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:20,839
Speaker 9: picking up a prostitute. And the first thing is, well,

882
00:44:20,840 --> 00:44:22,680
Speaker 9: he has a wife, And I'm like, well, that's your problem.

883
00:44:22,719 --> 00:44:24,400
Speaker 9: I don't know what to tell you. But there's a

884
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:26,359
Speaker 9: lot of stuff that goes around that people don't know.

885
00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:28,840
Speaker 8: I just think we're going to see a lot more victims,

886
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Speaker 8: and a lot more from all of these serial killers.

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Speaker 7: They confess to some and there's so much more. It's

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Speaker 7: just incredible.

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Speaker 1: Sure, thank you for being here.