1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:27,680 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome 2 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:31,479 Speaker 1: to the show, Ridiculous Historians. Thank you as always for 3 00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:36,800 Speaker 1: tuning in. Hi. I'm Ben, my baby's my name is Nolan, 4 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:40,040 Speaker 1: and we are joined as always in spirit with our 5 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:43,519 Speaker 1: super producer Casey Pegram. Today we'd like you to give 6 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:47,320 Speaker 1: it up for our guest super producer, are returning guest 7 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:52,040 Speaker 1: super producer j J. Pauseway, Hey, pauseway for the Causeway 8 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:56,640 Speaker 1: there we go. Uh no, no, you and I are. 9 00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:59,720 Speaker 1: You and I are going to be on the road 10 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:03,760 Speaker 1: a lot as we go towards this lovely Halloween season. 11 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:06,760 Speaker 1: I am super pumped. This is my most favorite time 12 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,759 Speaker 1: of the year. Uh you know in theory, the leaves 13 00:01:09,760 --> 00:01:14,920 Speaker 1: are falling, they're cool, strange winds blowing. It's very Ray Bradberry, 14 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:18,720 Speaker 1: something wicked. This way comes esque, except now it's ninety 15 00:01:18,800 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 1: degrees outside. Yeah, it's weird, right, Like, I feel like 16 00:01:21,520 --> 00:01:23,600 Speaker 1: we're in permost summer. Do you think it's gonna be 17 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:25,880 Speaker 1: like there's gonna be just rotting jack O lanterns out 18 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:29,240 Speaker 1: in the streets, just like crushed from the heat. Is 19 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:31,520 Speaker 1: this the New Normals? It might be the New Normal Band, 20 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:33,760 Speaker 1: which is about as scary as it gets, and it 21 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 1: makes me identify strongly with all of our Australian listeners 22 00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:42,440 Speaker 1: out there. Have you know what what temperature is it 23 00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:46,520 Speaker 1: usually around the holidays for you in Australia? Is it hot? 24 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 1: Is it unseasonably so? Like one time I was in 25 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 1: Florida during the Christmas season or the you know, Hanneka 26 00:01:52,440 --> 00:01:55,600 Speaker 1: holiday season, and I just couldn't get into it. Man, 27 00:01:55,640 --> 00:01:57,840 Speaker 1: it was just too hot. I I need some I 28 00:01:57,920 --> 00:02:02,600 Speaker 1: need some chill here. Anyway, despite the fact that the 29 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:05,880 Speaker 1: temperature doesn't agree with us or hasn't gotten the memo yet, 30 00:02:06,200 --> 00:02:09,280 Speaker 1: we are full on in the fall and I am 31 00:02:09,320 --> 00:02:13,600 Speaker 1: gonna embrace it. I'm gonna chase it. And I think 32 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 1: I might have a weird idea for a costume. What 33 00:02:17,560 --> 00:02:20,200 Speaker 1: do you think about a drummer boy? Yeah, would you 34 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 1: have like like the full on the whole nine, like 35 00:02:22,320 --> 00:02:27,239 Speaker 1: with the with the shoulder straps and the your rudiments, 36 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:31,079 Speaker 1: practice your rudiments, rudiments, I remember rudiments. I would also 37 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:35,640 Speaker 1: do some paradidals, paradis and rudiments. Yeah. So we're asking 38 00:02:35,680 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 1: this question for a reason because today's story takes us 39 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:43,560 Speaker 1: to the Civil War, takes us to the adventures of 40 00:02:43,639 --> 00:02:47,600 Speaker 1: someone known as the drummer Boy of Chickamauga. His name 41 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 1: is John Klem and he was a twelve year old 42 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:56,079 Speaker 1: who became a Civil War hero. There's a lot to 43 00:02:56,160 --> 00:02:59,000 Speaker 1: unpack in that sentence, right, that's right, Ben. He fought 44 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:03,600 Speaker 1: with a twenty second Michigan regiment. Horseshoe ridge. That's hard 45 00:03:03,639 --> 00:03:07,519 Speaker 1: to say, horseshoe horseshoe. That's really tough. I don't know 46 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:08,799 Speaker 1: why I'm having a hard time with that word, but 47 00:03:08,919 --> 00:03:10,359 Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna getrough it. I'm gonna say it 48 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 1: many more times in this episode. Um. But he had nothing, 49 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:17,040 Speaker 1: um to arm himself but his drum. It's very important 50 00:03:17,320 --> 00:03:20,000 Speaker 1: and a basically the equivalent of what you'd consider a 51 00:03:20,040 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 1: sawed off shotgun today, which is pretty baller if you 52 00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:27,400 Speaker 1: ask me, Yes, saw down must get so sacrificed some 53 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:31,239 Speaker 1: accuracy there close combat, though, right, one would imagine. So 54 00:03:31,400 --> 00:03:34,120 Speaker 1: this was a very, very bloody war, as we've pointed 55 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:37,440 Speaker 1: out previously. I'm always startled that we still call it 56 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:41,920 Speaker 1: the Civil War. It's not him things civil about it. 57 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:45,560 Speaker 1: Let's look at where Clem comes from. So he was 58 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 1: born in Ohio in August thirteen, eighteen fifty one. His 59 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:52,640 Speaker 1: parents named him John Joseph Clem, which is a cool name, 60 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 1: and they originally named him John Joseph Clem with a K, 61 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:58,880 Speaker 1: but he changed it so his last name was spelled 62 00:03:58,920 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 1: Clem with a C. He thought this sounded a little 63 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 1: more American. And nowadays everyone's change and sees twok's you know, 64 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:08,160 Speaker 1: up is down, Like everything's all mixed up, dogs and 65 00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:12,440 Speaker 1: cats sleeping together Pandemonium Industry sponkors. I had a friend 66 00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:15,360 Speaker 1: growing up whose name was Clem, and it wasn't short 67 00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:17,080 Speaker 1: for anything. It doesn't sound like a name that would 68 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:20,520 Speaker 1: be short for something like Clement Clemson or Clementine. Just 69 00:04:20,600 --> 00:04:24,400 Speaker 1: Clem or Clem Jeman, like Clem Jiman. No, it's true 70 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:28,159 Speaker 1: um so he uh would later Actually, he who's obviously 71 00:04:28,200 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 1: a huge fan of changing things about his name, because 72 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:33,159 Speaker 1: he would later add Lincoln Um to replace his Christian 73 00:04:33,240 --> 00:04:36,159 Speaker 1: given middle name. And they were vegetable farmers. That was 74 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:40,479 Speaker 1: their stock in trade, and John was the guy that 75 00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:44,920 Speaker 1: would kind of be their door to door salesman, going 76 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:46,880 Speaker 1: from home to home in the little burg where he 77 00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:51,560 Speaker 1: grew up, selling fresh produce. Yeah, and his younger siblings 78 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 1: would tag along with him. Unfortunately, their mother, Magdalene, was 79 00:04:57,680 --> 00:05:00,719 Speaker 1: hit by a train in eighteen sixty one and passed away. 80 00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:05,920 Speaker 1: John's father remarried. There's a guy named Roman Clem, and 81 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:09,480 Speaker 1: you know this wasn't some horrible fairy tale with an 82 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 1: evil stepmother. She was fine with the kids. But John 83 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:15,960 Speaker 1: soon struck out to make his own way at a 84 00:05:16,160 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 1: very young age. His childhood is essentially at this point 85 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: just a montage of him attempting to join the army. 86 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:28,599 Speaker 1: He wanted to be in military service ever since the 87 00:05:28,680 --> 00:05:32,839 Speaker 1: Confederate rebels fired on Fort Sumter, which officially started the 88 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 1: Civil War here in the US. He approached the third 89 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 1: Ohio Regiment of Volunteers when they were passing through Newark, 90 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:41,839 Speaker 1: and he asked the commanding officer to take him on. 91 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 1: He said, look, just let me be your drummer boy. 92 00:05:44,200 --> 00:05:48,599 Speaker 1: And according to Clem in uh from Nursery to Battlefield 93 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:52,120 Speaker 1: when he wrote himself, he when he asked the commanding 94 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:55,240 Speaker 1: officer to take him on, he said, he looked me over, 95 00:05:55,600 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 1: laughed and said he wasn't enlisting infants. A pretty definitive pass, right, 96 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 1: That's a pretty hard pass on the kid. But Clem 97 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:09,200 Speaker 1: did not give up, and he actually uh, he'd been 98 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:11,440 Speaker 1: thinking about this for a minute because he had asked 99 00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:14,760 Speaker 1: this of his father, Roman Um As as mentioned in 100 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:16,440 Speaker 1: that very same letter that you were talking about. Ben. 101 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:18,480 Speaker 1: He says, father, I'd like Matty Well to be a 102 00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:22,240 Speaker 1: drummer boy. Can I go to the Union Army? What nonsense? 103 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:26,400 Speaker 1: Boy replied father, you are not yet and y'alls old. Yeah, 104 00:06:26,480 --> 00:06:29,479 Speaker 1: And I love that little drummer boy. American drummer boy 105 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 1: has like a British schoolboy accent, but of course he does. 106 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:34,440 Speaker 1: I love that people are still saying touch. This is 107 00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:37,239 Speaker 1: back when Tutt was in play, is still in play 108 00:06:37,360 --> 00:06:40,440 Speaker 1: thanks to you. Ben. I don't know, man, I feel 109 00:06:40,440 --> 00:06:43,040 Speaker 1: like sometimes our friend groups. You know, I told you 110 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:46,160 Speaker 1: I got banned from using it with one friend who 111 00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 1: does that. Whooo bands you from using a very close 112 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:51,560 Speaker 1: friends who are doing their best, doing God's work. Well, 113 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:53,400 Speaker 1: I'm gonna start referring to you as a king Tutt 114 00:06:53,520 --> 00:06:57,440 Speaker 1: oh boy. So this is funny. I like this scene 115 00:06:57,480 --> 00:07:00,440 Speaker 1: you set here, Noel, because it's a dead her time 116 00:07:00,480 --> 00:07:05,360 Speaker 1: conversation right, as recalled by John's sister Elizabeth. His dad 117 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:07,799 Speaker 1: shuts him down when he's like you know, why can't 118 00:07:07,839 --> 00:07:10,040 Speaker 1: I go to the union, Nami? And I love that voice. 119 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:12,680 Speaker 1: By the way, Papa, Papa, I still have he mus 120 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 1: want to be a drummer boy. And so they finished 121 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:18,120 Speaker 1: eating and John says, I'm going to go out for 122 00:07:18,160 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 1: a swim, and what he means by that is I'm 123 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:25,880 Speaker 1: going to run away from home. That's great, that's like, 124 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:30,040 Speaker 1: that's like the dad thearettes. It's the drummer boy version 125 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:34,760 Speaker 1: of going for smokes. And this wasn't uncommon. You know. 126 00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 1: We we read a lot about the horrors of child 127 00:07:39,440 --> 00:07:42,239 Speaker 1: soldiers in the modern day, but we have to remember 128 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:45,440 Speaker 1: this occurred in earlier eras as well, and the Civil 129 00:07:45,480 --> 00:07:48,440 Speaker 1: War was no different. It was not uncommon for kids 130 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:53,000 Speaker 1: as young as fourteen to go and actually fight as soldiers. 131 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: And uh some sometimes it would be a family affair, 132 00:07:57,400 --> 00:07:59,920 Speaker 1: like a father grandfather would come with one of their 133 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 1: younger children and the army would accept both of them. 134 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:05,880 Speaker 1: Child soldier is sort of like a tale as old 135 00:08:05,880 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 1: as time, right, I mean, that's something that we've seen 136 00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 1: in sort of warlord type countries like in Africa, for example, 137 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 1: in more recent times, right exactly, and in previous empires, 138 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:20,120 Speaker 1: we've also seen child soldiers. So in his in that 139 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:24,120 Speaker 1: essay we mentioned earlier, from nursery to battlefield, Clym says 140 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:26,760 Speaker 1: he took a train to Cincinnati and that's where he 141 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 1: approached the Michigan Regiment, the twenty swon, and they rejected 142 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 1: him at first as well, but he just didn't give up. 143 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 1: He just kept following them around and they said, you're 144 00:08:38,760 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 1: not part of our crew, and he just kept walking 145 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 1: in their wake. Eventually they let him be their drummer boy, 146 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:48,080 Speaker 1: but they couldn't legally put him on the payroll because 147 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 1: he was too young. Presumably, when he's tagging along pulling 148 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:53,560 Speaker 1: at their coat, is he also beating his little drum? Yeah, 149 00:08:53,600 --> 00:08:55,720 Speaker 1: I guess he brought a drum with him. But it's 150 00:08:55,800 --> 00:08:59,880 Speaker 1: it's shady, it's really sketchy. Because the adults decided that 151 00:09:00,120 --> 00:09:03,440 Speaker 1: they would they since they couldn't legally pay a child soldier, 152 00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:07,240 Speaker 1: they decided that they would just dig into their pockets 153 00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:09,800 Speaker 1: and give them thirteen dollars a month out of their 154 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:12,760 Speaker 1: own cash a month. You say, do we even have 155 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:17,400 Speaker 1: any frame of reference to inflation calculators. Yeah, it's more 156 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:23,400 Speaker 1: than thirteen dollars. Now that's fair. Still pretty much a pittance, 157 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:27,520 Speaker 1: a sub pittance. He's not Yeah, he's not getting rich 158 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:30,560 Speaker 1: off this, but yeah, they they gave him his own 159 00:09:30,559 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 1: soldiers uniform and they had to, you know, cut it 160 00:09:33,920 --> 00:09:37,319 Speaker 1: down from a man's size uniform too, because there, you know, 161 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:39,840 Speaker 1: they didn't make they didn't didn't make child sized uniforms. 162 00:09:39,840 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 1: That'd be weird, that would be a very strange thing. 163 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:46,080 Speaker 1: So they did it at least this once. And uh, 164 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:50,760 Speaker 1: it's strange because John Clem became a private on May one, 165 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:55,160 Speaker 1: eighteen sixty three. He was eleven years old. How much 166 00:09:55,200 --> 00:09:58,000 Speaker 1: responsibility did you have when you were eleven? You have 167 00:09:58,000 --> 00:09:59,400 Speaker 1: to answer it. I don't wonder to feel put on 168 00:09:59,440 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 1: spot or you either j J or are you listening? 169 00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:04,680 Speaker 1: But I'm thinking like I was trash when I was eleven. 170 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:07,320 Speaker 1: I was in boy Scouts. I guess that's a what's 171 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:10,280 Speaker 1: what's a responsibility? Though? You know it's a responsibility to 172 00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 1: your pack, to your pack master? Is that what they 173 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 1: call it? Pack leader? Den leader? Den mother? Well? Sure, yeah, 174 00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:20,840 Speaker 1: and maybe I'm maybe I'm being unfair to myself, but 175 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:24,600 Speaker 1: I just may call it a different time I could 176 00:10:24,679 --> 00:10:26,319 Speaker 1: I could have dealt with boy Scouts, But I don't 177 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 1: know how I would have dealt with being a soldier 178 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:31,720 Speaker 1: at the age of eleven. You know, well, you would 179 00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:34,160 Speaker 1: have been more prepared than some with the skills that 180 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:37,440 Speaker 1: you learned from boy scouts. I'm gonna say you would 181 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:40,520 Speaker 1: have been able to navigate the woods and a panch 182 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: who needs a knot? Yeah, I got you. You would 183 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:45,320 Speaker 1: have at least been able to tie a knot in 184 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 1: order to mount your tiny drum on your slight frame 185 00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:52,320 Speaker 1: and follow around the soldiers. I would have been annoyed, 186 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:55,480 Speaker 1: wouldn't you. There's guys following you around beating a drama 187 00:10:55,600 --> 00:10:58,920 Speaker 1: like kid dispense with the drumming. I have to say, 188 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:01,760 Speaker 1: I guess it's for morale and it's for people to 189 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 1: have a sense of rhythm when they're marching. But I 190 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:08,520 Speaker 1: never I never got the the drummer boy thing and 191 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:16,720 Speaker 1: just didn't get it. But we know that he didn't 192 00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:20,320 Speaker 1: stay a drummer boy, right. He became he becomes a private, 193 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:23,520 Speaker 1: not a pirate, and then later he becomes a legend. 194 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 1: Is that true? It absolutely is true. So yeah, after 195 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:29,319 Speaker 1: the big the big boy Battle Gettysburg, that's the one 196 00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:33,319 Speaker 1: people remember. Um hey, chickamauguas up there too. Because it's 197 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:35,640 Speaker 1: it's fun to say. People likely remember it for that 198 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:38,959 Speaker 1: reason alone. But it was also a huge battle. It 199 00:11:39,040 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 1: was the second highest body count of any battle in 200 00:11:41,920 --> 00:11:43,839 Speaker 1: the Civil War. But Gettysburg is just so iconic. I 201 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:46,439 Speaker 1: think it's easy for number two to fall by the wayside. 202 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:49,319 Speaker 1: Any Civil War buffs out there are going to hand 203 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:51,400 Speaker 1: me my hat and then tell me that I'm absolutely 204 00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:53,760 Speaker 1: full full of it. But you know, not being a 205 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: Civil War buff um, I was not as aware of 206 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,240 Speaker 1: the events of Chickamaugua. Um. So here's the thing. On 207 00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:02,880 Speaker 1: September eighteenth, in eighteen sixty three, the Union and Confederate 208 00:12:02,920 --> 00:12:07,439 Speaker 1: forces absolutely shredded each other. Uh. And this was surrounding 209 00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:12,800 Speaker 1: the Chickamaugua Creek right here in Georgia. That's true North Georgia. Yeah. 210 00:12:13,160 --> 00:12:18,600 Speaker 1: The Confederate forces were there to stop the Union from 211 00:12:18,640 --> 00:12:26,079 Speaker 1: marching southward, and they succeeded, but at grizzly and profound costs. 212 00:12:26,760 --> 00:12:30,720 Speaker 1: At the end of the battle, thirty four thousand people 213 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 1: were dead. Thirty four thousand soldiers right and John Klem 214 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:39,240 Speaker 1: and his pals in the twenty two Michigan were part 215 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:43,320 Speaker 1: of the group that beat back the Union advance, and 216 00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:46,080 Speaker 1: he says, from his essay where a lot of our 217 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:49,040 Speaker 1: information is coming from. He says, at Chickamaugua, I carried 218 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:51,160 Speaker 1: a musket, the barrel of which had been sawed off 219 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:55,559 Speaker 1: to a length suitable to my side. That makes sense. Yeah, 220 00:12:55,640 --> 00:12:59,760 Speaker 1: he wasn't like terminator style, single handedly blasted fools. He 221 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:01,959 Speaker 1: probably still had to hold it too handed, and it 222 00:13:02,080 --> 00:13:03,680 Speaker 1: was probably a bit of a sight to behold with, 223 00:13:03,760 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 1: like his sort of weird baggy, oversized trimmed down uniform 224 00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:10,760 Speaker 1: and his little drum and his little tiny musket situation. 225 00:13:11,160 --> 00:13:14,880 Speaker 1: I mean, this kid had some stones my friends. Yeah, 226 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:18,480 Speaker 1: And there's a weird human moment here in the middle 227 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,560 Speaker 1: of this bloody battle. There's a Confederate colonel and he 228 00:13:21,760 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 1: sees this tiny boy in his Union uniform with his rifle, 229 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:31,120 Speaker 1: and the colonel apparently runs up to the boy and says, surrender, 230 00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:33,679 Speaker 1: you damned a little yankee. And then he says, I 231 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:35,600 Speaker 1: think the best thing it might have, a chap like 232 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:38,520 Speaker 1: you can do is drop that gun. And so what 233 00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:41,480 Speaker 1: does clim do. He shoots the colonel and then he 234 00:13:41,559 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 1: runs away and he becomes a legend. Yeah, shooting the colonel. 235 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:48,640 Speaker 1: That should also be a euphemism for something. I don't 236 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:51,360 Speaker 1: know what, right, right, you really shot the colonel on 237 00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:53,840 Speaker 1: that one. But that's a good one. So he gets 238 00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 1: promoted and now he's a sergeant. He's twelve years old, 239 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:00,960 Speaker 1: old sergeant. This is bonkers, oh the way he describes it. 240 00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:03,960 Speaker 1: Another one of his essays, Um, he says that this 241 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:06,679 Speaker 1: gentleman wrote up and and told him to he says, surrender, you, 242 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:09,720 Speaker 1: damn little yankee. He's like, no, one calls me a 243 00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:13,079 Speaker 1: damn little yankee, and then he blasts him. He didn't. 244 00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:15,679 Speaker 1: He didn't. He didn't drop his gun and give up 245 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:18,520 Speaker 1: and be taken. He actually shot this guy right up 246 00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:21,440 Speaker 1: his horse. And words spread about this pint size uh 247 00:14:21,640 --> 00:14:26,000 Speaker 1: new officer, um, and he kind of became almost like 248 00:14:26,040 --> 00:14:28,960 Speaker 1: a symbol. Yeah. Yeah. They started calling him the drummer 249 00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:33,360 Speaker 1: boy of Chickamaugua. Yeah. And this was great pr for 250 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:39,120 Speaker 1: the Union forces, which were relatively demoralized regarding the news 251 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:42,320 Speaker 1: of the Georgian Front. And he was a celebrity. He 252 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 1: was their version of a wartime celebrity. Some people in 253 00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:50,840 Speaker 1: Chicago got the kids measurements from his pals. In the 254 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 1: twenty two Michigan infantry, and they gave him a new 255 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:59,080 Speaker 1: handmade uniform. I guess they just wanted to help out 256 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:05,000 Speaker 1: the effort. However, all was not Rosie headlines and Union 257 00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:08,880 Speaker 1: praise for clim He soon fell into the very dark, 258 00:15:09,480 --> 00:15:13,040 Speaker 1: dangerous side of the Civil War. He was already inundated 259 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 1: in this violence, in this chaos. But in October of 260 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:19,680 Speaker 1: eighteen sixty three, he was actually captured by Confederate forces. 261 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:23,000 Speaker 1: It's true, it's true, Ben, But thankfully, Um, we don't 262 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 1: know too much about what happened. Well, maybe we do, 263 00:15:25,520 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 1: is it? Is it? In his essays He probably wrote 264 00:15:27,080 --> 00:15:29,080 Speaker 1: an essay about it. He seemed like a pretty pretty 265 00:15:29,080 --> 00:15:32,640 Speaker 1: mouthy little kid. Um. I mean, I mean he wrote 266 00:15:32,720 --> 00:15:36,240 Speaker 1: the essay later exactly Um. But he was eventually released 267 00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:38,920 Speaker 1: as as part of a prisoner exchange, like an exchange 268 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 1: of hostages basically um. And then he went on to 269 00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:46,560 Speaker 1: continue under General George H. Thomas's Army of the Cumberland, 270 00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:51,960 Speaker 1: and he himself sustained injuries several times during battle Um, 271 00:15:52,040 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 1: during the Battle of Kinna Saw and Murfreesboro. I love 272 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:58,160 Speaker 1: murfrees Borrow. You want to say Murphy's Borrow, but it's 273 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:02,880 Speaker 1: murfrees borrow. That's how they get you Tennessee, Perryville, and Atlanta, 274 00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:05,680 Speaker 1: right here in good old Atlanta, Georgia. UM. And then 275 00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:07,960 Speaker 1: he got out in eighteen sixty four, and he was 276 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 1: a teenager. Oh, we should say he didn't languish away 277 00:16:10,880 --> 00:16:12,920 Speaker 1: in the Confederate prison. He was only there for two 278 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 1: months and it was mainly used as propaganda. But you're 279 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:18,440 Speaker 1: right now, when he gets out, he's a teenager. He 280 00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 1: goes back to high school, he graduates in eighteen seventy, 281 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 1: and he probably has You know that thousand leagues stare 282 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:27,760 Speaker 1: so common to a lot of people who have been 283 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:30,840 Speaker 1: through traumatic events, one would imagine, one would imagine, Man, 284 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:32,960 Speaker 1: it's true, like you said, he went back to high school, 285 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:35,120 Speaker 1: he graduated, but he had a taste, he had the 286 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:38,120 Speaker 1: taste of the soldier's life at this point, Like he wasn't. 287 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know. I don't think you can 288 00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 1: go through something like that in such during such formative 289 00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:46,360 Speaker 1: years and not it's actually I let me rephrase that. 290 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:48,840 Speaker 1: I would think you would never want to do it ever, ever, 291 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:51,560 Speaker 1: ever again. But he obviously was suited for this life, 292 00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: and he decided to make it a life's goal for him, 293 00:16:54,720 --> 00:16:56,240 Speaker 1: or at least the next step in his in his 294 00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:59,640 Speaker 1: life to enter the U. S Military Academy. Yeah, he 295 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:03,480 Speaker 1: achieved the rank of commander captain of the Washington Rifles 296 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:07,919 Speaker 1: in eighteen seventy one, but you know, he he thought 297 00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:11,679 Speaker 1: that he would be able to enter the US Military 298 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 1: Academy as kind of a formality. However, there were there 299 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:19,280 Speaker 1: were some complications. His experience in a way worked against 300 00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 1: him because entry to places like West Point is based 301 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:26,600 Speaker 1: on academic achievement rather than combat experience, which is crazy. 302 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 1: Well it's not, I don't know, crazy, He's not the 303 00:17:28,080 --> 00:17:30,680 Speaker 1: right word. But it's like, if anyone should have been 304 00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:34,160 Speaker 1: admitted to a military academy, it was this kid, right, 305 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:37,040 Speaker 1: I mean, he had actual real world experience that you 306 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:40,080 Speaker 1: can't buy. You know, you can definitely run drills and 307 00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:42,320 Speaker 1: you know, march in the yard and everything, but this 308 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:44,879 Speaker 1: kid had actually seen it and tasted it like the 309 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:48,119 Speaker 1: actual hell that is war. And he had been in 310 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:52,480 Speaker 1: the field of battle since he was a child, right, 311 00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 1: as you said, it was a formative period. He left 312 00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:58,119 Speaker 1: school before he was ten years old. He failed the 313 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:01,640 Speaker 1: entrance exam to West Point because of course he did, 314 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 1: because he hadn't been to school years. Instead, he fought 315 00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:08,000 Speaker 1: for his country. You know, I mean, come on, give 316 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:10,000 Speaker 1: the kid a give the kid a hall pass on 317 00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:14,760 Speaker 1: this one, right And uh, Fortunately he still had his fame, 318 00:18:14,880 --> 00:18:16,760 Speaker 1: so it looked like his career might be over. He 319 00:18:16,840 --> 00:18:19,159 Speaker 1: might be a civil war, he wrote, retiring at the 320 00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:23,960 Speaker 1: ripe old age of twenty. But because he was such 321 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:27,919 Speaker 1: a prominent figure during wartime, he was able to secure 322 00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:31,400 Speaker 1: an audience with Ulysses S. Grant, who was then president, 323 00:18:31,960 --> 00:18:36,440 Speaker 1: and Clim was well known at the time, so Grant 324 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:40,840 Speaker 1: was definitely aware of who he was. And Clem makes 325 00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 1: some claims in his essays and in some of his 326 00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:49,360 Speaker 1: speeches regarding his interaction with Grant. Uh. He says, when 327 00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:53,200 Speaker 1: President Grant learned that he failed the entrance exam, Grant said, 328 00:18:53,560 --> 00:18:55,520 Speaker 1: you know, hero for ump if we can do better 329 00:18:55,560 --> 00:19:00,239 Speaker 1: than that, And he appointed Clem second lieutenant in the 330 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:04,000 Speaker 1: twenty four U. S. Infantry in December of eighteen seventy one. 331 00:19:04,280 --> 00:19:07,960 Speaker 1: So he said, they basically said, look, forget the schoolwork 332 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:11,280 Speaker 1: and the bureaucracy. Let's just get you back where you belong. 333 00:19:12,119 --> 00:19:15,560 Speaker 1: And this was the beginning of a very long career 334 00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:18,639 Speaker 1: in the military, a very long official career. That's right. 335 00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:21,320 Speaker 1: He started off as a first lieutenant, and then he 336 00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:24,119 Speaker 1: graduated from a different military school and artillery school at 337 00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:28,639 Speaker 1: Fort Monroe, and then he married Anita Rosetta French. By 338 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,359 Speaker 1: the way, that's all from a fantastic article in History 339 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:35,000 Speaker 1: collection dot com called the Incredible Story of a twelve 340 00:19:35,080 --> 00:19:38,280 Speaker 1: year old Civil War Hero. Um. He went on to 341 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:42,480 Speaker 1: continue getting promotions, and he eventually became a captain in 342 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 1: two and then he became a quartermaster, which is a 343 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 1: position that I wasn't super familiar with, but I believe 344 00:19:48,840 --> 00:19:52,240 Speaker 1: it has to do with maintaining like stocks of artillery. 345 00:19:52,280 --> 00:19:55,240 Speaker 1: Isn't that right? You have all the stuff? Yeah, Quartermasters 346 00:19:55,359 --> 00:19:59,639 Speaker 1: like a real, real powerful position. This is the person 347 00:19:59,720 --> 00:20:04,200 Speaker 1: in arg of quarters where you sleep, rations, the things 348 00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 1: we eat, clothing, other supplies including I would imagine at 349 00:20:08,040 --> 00:20:13,480 Speaker 1: this time armament. He did actually eventually attain the rank 350 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:16,880 Speaker 1: of major. She's a big deal. In eighteen nine five 351 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:20,840 Speaker 1: he received many commendations, serving with distinction in the American 352 00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:25,280 Speaker 1: Indian Wars against the Native Americans. He got a medal 353 00:20:25,359 --> 00:20:28,479 Speaker 1: called the Indian Campaign Medal. Um. He was also injured 354 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:33,240 Speaker 1: in that conflict. In eighteen ninety nine, yes, and his 355 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:42,919 Speaker 1: career continued. Eighteen ninety nine, his first wife dies. He 356 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:48,080 Speaker 1: eventually remarries daughter of a Confederate veteran, oddly enough, Bessie's Sullivan, 357 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 1: in nineteen oh three. He is active during this time 358 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:56,639 Speaker 1: in the Spanish American War eight. He is promoted to 359 00:20:56,680 --> 00:20:59,760 Speaker 1: lieutenant colonel in nineteen oh one. Two and a half 360 00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:02,680 Speaker 1: years later he's a colonel, and then he becomes the 361 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:07,120 Speaker 1: chief quartermaster at Fort sam Houston from nineteen oh six 362 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:11,639 Speaker 1: to nineteen eleven. He's retired in nineteen fifteen, but even 363 00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:14,560 Speaker 1: after he's retired, he's given the rank of brigadier general. 364 00:21:15,119 --> 00:21:17,960 Speaker 1: Apparently this sounds weird to us today, right, But apparently 365 00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:21,560 Speaker 1: during this time it was customary to promote Civil War 366 00:21:21,680 --> 00:21:24,159 Speaker 1: veterans this way. Once they reached the rink of colonel, 367 00:21:24,520 --> 00:21:29,080 Speaker 1: they retired, they get promoted to brigadier general. He was 368 00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:32,800 Speaker 1: the last American Civil War veterans still serving in the U. S. 369 00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:35,200 Speaker 1: Army when he retired, which makes sense because he started 370 00:21:35,240 --> 00:21:37,640 Speaker 1: when he was like ten. It absolutely makes sense. And 371 00:21:37,680 --> 00:21:40,879 Speaker 1: what's crazy to me is he didn't pass away until 372 00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:44,240 Speaker 1: May of nineteen thirty seven, which is actually the year 373 00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,879 Speaker 1: my father was born. Which is just for perspective here, right, 374 00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:50,600 Speaker 1: it's his reasons and my father was a little on 375 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:53,399 Speaker 1: the older side, but still crazy to think that their 376 00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:57,280 Speaker 1: paths somehow crossed historically speaking, you know, in terms of 377 00:21:57,359 --> 00:22:02,840 Speaker 1: occupying the same time base. Yeah, if only for a moment. 378 00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:05,399 Speaker 1: And today you can visit the memorial or the grave 379 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:09,919 Speaker 1: of John clym Over in Arlington National Cemetery. There's a 380 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:13,639 Speaker 1: six ft bronze statue of him standing close to the 381 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:16,960 Speaker 1: Buckingham Meeting House in his hometown of Newark as well, 382 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:20,160 Speaker 1: if you happen to pass through there. And we've talked 383 00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:24,680 Speaker 1: a lot about John's adventures, right, his close calls with danger, 384 00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:29,119 Speaker 1: his triumphs and his trials, but we haven't really looked 385 00:22:29,160 --> 00:22:33,679 Speaker 1: into his own perspective. And while he was glad to 386 00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:37,199 Speaker 1: serve his country and certainly considered himself a patriot, we 387 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:43,879 Speaker 1: also know that he understood the insidious, evil nature of war. 388 00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:47,160 Speaker 1: We have a line about it that he wrote himself 389 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:52,160 Speaker 1: where he says war is bald naked savagery as compared 390 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:55,240 Speaker 1: with the adult man. The boy is near to the savage. 391 00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:59,400 Speaker 1: But he had some views on child soldiers that might 392 00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:04,320 Speaker 1: surprise you a little bit problematic today. Yeah. Um. In 393 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:07,800 Speaker 1: that History Collection dot Com article, they cite a perspective 394 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:10,679 Speaker 1: of Clems that, yeah, as you say, Ben was was 395 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:15,760 Speaker 1: problematic at best. Um. He believe that boys in fact 396 00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:23,320 Speaker 1: made the best soldiers because they're so eager to please terrible. Yeah, 397 00:23:23,359 --> 00:23:26,159 Speaker 1: and and referred to this notion that they hadn't yet 398 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:32,720 Speaker 1: developed what he called the spirit of caution that adults, 399 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,879 Speaker 1: you know, self preservation. I'm sure he had things to 400 00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:40,640 Speaker 1: say about how they can fit in small spaces too. Yeah, 401 00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:44,600 Speaker 1: that's that's weird, though. I guess I can see where 402 00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:47,640 Speaker 1: he's coming from with it, because he's probably like, well, 403 00:23:47,640 --> 00:23:49,720 Speaker 1: I'm a child soldier and I turned out great. No, 404 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:52,520 Speaker 1: you're not a child soldier anymore. I'm you're an old man. 405 00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:56,080 Speaker 1: You're happy to survive exactly. So it's strange because it 406 00:23:56,119 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 1: gives us a look in a into a terrible, uh 407 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:02,680 Speaker 1: terrible aspect of that war, and as we said, a 408 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:06,119 Speaker 1: terrible aspect of many wars. The Civil War was called 409 00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:09,920 Speaker 1: the boy's War because of all the children that were 410 00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 1: enlisted in the armed forces. But you know, as we said, 411 00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:18,320 Speaker 1: it wasn't new, and some people in the country were 412 00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:22,280 Speaker 1: torn about it. President Lincoln was not a fan of 413 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 1: child soldiers, but he had a weird way of phrasing it. 414 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:27,640 Speaker 1: He wrote to the Secretary of the Navy at the time, 415 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:31,280 Speaker 1: Gideon Wells, and he said, the United States don't need 416 00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:34,440 Speaker 1: the service of boys who disobey their parents. His main 417 00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:36,600 Speaker 1: thing was, if your parents tell you not to run away, 418 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,760 Speaker 1: you should listen to your folks. Also, notice this is 419 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:44,640 Speaker 1: an interesting small thing. He used don't instead of doesn't. 420 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:48,919 Speaker 1: Like today, we refer to the United States as a 421 00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:52,679 Speaker 1: singular entity, but back then people referred to it just 422 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:56,240 Speaker 1: as a group of states. So instead of the United 423 00:24:56,280 --> 00:25:00,320 Speaker 1: States doesn't need this, it's the United States don't. So 424 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:02,560 Speaker 1: that really fascinated you. I know you're a big fan 425 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:07,040 Speaker 1: of grammar history. It's weird. It's a weird one, Yeah, 426 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 1: for sure. I like referring to them as these United States. Yeah, 427 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,040 Speaker 1: it just sounds it just sounds nice. It's a nice 428 00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:18,480 Speaker 1: fan of white feel to the United States. Yeah, I know, 429 00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,360 Speaker 1: it's very true. Um, And I always typically wear a 430 00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:24,159 Speaker 1: very slim, sparkly dress when I do something. You know, 431 00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:26,600 Speaker 1: HR might get onto me for this, but I think 432 00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:30,680 Speaker 1: it looks great on you. Fetching. You know, I would 433 00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:35,000 Speaker 1: you cut a good figure with thanks. You know, I 434 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:37,760 Speaker 1: appreciate it. So I've been doing a lot of pilates. 435 00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:42,960 Speaker 1: So this this is our This is where the tale 436 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:47,600 Speaker 1: of John Clem Civil War, he wrote, draws to a close. 437 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:53,159 Speaker 1: Little drummer boy uh sawed off, shotgun, baggy uniform wearing 438 00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:58,440 Speaker 1: child soldier, badass, slightly problematic, old man, old Johnny Shiloh 439 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:01,080 Speaker 1: as he was also called, Is that right? Yeah, Yeah, 440 00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:02,800 Speaker 1: that's a good one. There was a Disney film that 441 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:05,320 Speaker 1: used Johnny Shilo as the title is about him, and 442 00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 1: there's this rumor that he was in the Battle of 443 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 1: Shiloh and had a close call and trapnel went through 444 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:14,600 Speaker 1: his drum. Anyway, long story short, that's probably that's not true. 445 00:26:14,880 --> 00:26:17,879 Speaker 1: It's not even probably not true. It's he wasn't there, Okay, 446 00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:20,720 Speaker 1: but don't let that ruin a good name. Johnny Shilo. 447 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:24,640 Speaker 1: Johnny Shilo is pretty solid. It sounds like when Johnny 448 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:28,200 Speaker 1: Shilo comes to town. It sounds like he walks into 449 00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:32,600 Speaker 1: a restaurant and like the music stops and someone turns around. 450 00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:35,240 Speaker 1: Everyone turns around. Yeah, so what drops a glass and 451 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:37,400 Speaker 1: someone else is like, you got a lot of nerve 452 00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 1: show in your face. Around here, Johnny Shallow, Johnny Shadow. 453 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:42,520 Speaker 1: That's pretty good. It also makes me think of someone 454 00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:44,880 Speaker 1: that would be like in a mob crew or something 455 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:47,200 Speaker 1: like oh yeah, yeah, yeah, no doubt about it. He's 456 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:50,640 Speaker 1: like the one guy who's not Italian exactly, yeah, exactly. Um, 457 00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 1: he's the bagman. He's the bagman. You love and I 458 00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:57,919 Speaker 1: love a good Civil war story. And that's it for 459 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,760 Speaker 1: this one. But as you would say, not it for 460 00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:04,400 Speaker 1: our show? Yes, hopefully not as a whole. As a whole, 461 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:06,760 Speaker 1: it's it for this this edition of our show, unless 462 00:27:06,800 --> 00:27:10,480 Speaker 1: we get replaced by like hardcore nine to ten year 463 00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:14,720 Speaker 1: old podcasters who are also drummer boys. Wow, that's a 464 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:17,240 Speaker 1: pretty good idea. Actually, I mean it's you know, as 465 00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:19,439 Speaker 1: far as ways to go, it's not that bad. But 466 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:22,480 Speaker 1: the conversation continues. We want to hear from you. What 467 00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:26,520 Speaker 1: are some other little known stories of child soldiers. This 468 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:30,879 Speaker 1: one is interesting in that the nation as a whole 469 00:27:31,359 --> 00:27:34,760 Speaker 1: sort of got behind it and again supported this idea. 470 00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:38,000 Speaker 1: It's also interesting because it has a more or less 471 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:42,040 Speaker 1: happy ending. Right. Typically, stories of child soldiers involved like 472 00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:45,840 Speaker 1: indoctrinating you know, kids who have nowhere else to go 473 00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:50,480 Speaker 1: and forcing them to support a cause that is questionable 474 00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:52,480 Speaker 1: and not in their best interest a lot of the time. 475 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:55,480 Speaker 1: And then they you know, they there cannon fodder right 476 00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:59,760 Speaker 1: and there, or they're inducted into this army by having 477 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:02,400 Speaker 1: their family killed, you know what I mean, and they're 478 00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 1: giving the choice to fight or to die. It's it's 479 00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:08,560 Speaker 1: a terrible, terrible thing, and it is uh, it is 480 00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:11,880 Speaker 1: somewhat unique that this has a happy ending. We want 481 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,360 Speaker 1: to hear from you. You can find us on Facebook, 482 00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:16,159 Speaker 1: you can find us on Twitter, you can find us 483 00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:19,040 Speaker 1: on Instagram. Our favorite part of the show, or our 484 00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:22,800 Speaker 1: favorite part of the Facebook's at least, is our community page, 485 00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:26,119 Speaker 1: Ridiculous Historians. Yeah, admittedly we're a little bit biased, but 486 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:29,080 Speaker 1: it's a fun group, right and maybe it's ad come 487 00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 1: hang out. We hang out there. It's true. I mean, 488 00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:33,159 Speaker 1: we're not just saying that. Like, we definitely float around. 489 00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:36,600 Speaker 1: We absolutely read every post, and we occasionally get in 490 00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:38,160 Speaker 1: there and engage. So if you want to do that 491 00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:41,360 Speaker 1: going over to Facebook and search for Ridiculous Historians, and 492 00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:43,600 Speaker 1: I think you just have to say me or Ben's 493 00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:49,120 Speaker 1: name and walk around in a counterclockwise circles. So what 494 00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:52,240 Speaker 1: it is, Yes, it's true. Witter sians. I never get 495 00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:57,160 Speaker 1: to use that word. It's walking counterclockwise. Uh, it's a 496 00:28:57,160 --> 00:28:59,880 Speaker 1: way of walking. It's a really specific way of walking. 497 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:04,080 Speaker 1: Isn't the weird witterer ships, It's very weird. You can 498 00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:06,520 Speaker 1: also find us on our personal instagrams if you want 499 00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 1: to see our various, uh different adventures. As we said, 500 00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:13,400 Speaker 1: we are both going to be traveling a lot, separately 501 00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:16,760 Speaker 1: and together in the coming days. Uh So I am 502 00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,280 Speaker 1: at Ben Bolan and I am at how now Noel 503 00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:23,280 Speaker 1: Brown big thanks to our super guest producer j J. 504 00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:26,800 Speaker 1: Pause for the cause, pause way, cause for the pause, 505 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:29,640 Speaker 1: cause for the pause, cause for pause. He really he's 506 00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 1: the cause. He's the reason that he stopped dead in 507 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:33,800 Speaker 1: your tracks that you pause for the cause, pause for 508 00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: the cause, and and and remark upon his greatness. Um, 509 00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:39,400 Speaker 1: thanks to super buster Casey Pegram here in spirit. He's 510 00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:41,880 Speaker 1: here in the building, but he had something that pulled 511 00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:43,960 Speaker 1: him away. Yeah. He just keeps sending as these weird 512 00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:48,200 Speaker 1: snorky messages yet with some very problematic gifts. Yeah, alright, 513 00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:51,760 Speaker 1: le Bush. Thanks to Alex Williams who composed our track. 514 00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:55,200 Speaker 1: Thanks to our brain trust, I think we can start 515 00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:59,560 Speaker 1: calling them that. Christopher hascotis Eves jeff Coat, who recently 516 00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:03,239 Speaker 1: appeared on that fantastic Uncle Tom's Cabin episode. Thanks of 517 00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:06,160 Speaker 1: course to Gabe Louisier and uh, thanks to you know. 518 00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:08,560 Speaker 1: I'm glad that we did not grow up during the 519 00:30:08,600 --> 00:30:11,920 Speaker 1: Civil War joke. Man, it's a hard knock life. We'll 520 00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:18,440 Speaker 1: see you next time, folks. For more podcasts for my 521 00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,160 Speaker 1: Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 522 00:30:21,240 --> 00:30:23,360 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.