1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:25,280 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio, Welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:28,480 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Nol. They called 6 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:31,480 Speaker 1: me Ben. We're joined as always with our super producer 7 00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:35,680 Speaker 1: Paul Mission controlled decade. Most importantly, you are you, You 8 00:00:35,720 --> 00:00:38,960 Speaker 1: are here, and that makes this stuff they don't want 9 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 1: you to know. At the very top, we need to 10 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:44,839 Speaker 1: say that today's episode may contain information that is not 11 00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:50,200 Speaker 1: suitable for all members of the audience, and candidly, the 12 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:54,360 Speaker 1: subject of today's episode got to me, which very rarely happens. 13 00:00:55,080 --> 00:00:58,440 Speaker 1: It's a tale of quiet desperation. It's a tale of 14 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:03,040 Speaker 1: a real global cabal and the looming existential threat of 15 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:08,959 Speaker 1: nuclear annihilation, all occurring just under the glitzy surface of 16 00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:14,080 Speaker 1: unprecedented American prosperity. I mean, what do you guys think 17 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:17,720 Speaker 1: of when you think of the nineteen fifties, postwar America. 18 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 1: Everybody has a home. Everybody has a bunch of cool 19 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:24,000 Speaker 1: gadgets that are filling up that home, that are making 20 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:29,160 Speaker 1: life easier for everybody. The future. Uh is what that 21 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:32,040 Speaker 1: felt like. But you know the past, I don't know, 22 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:37,120 Speaker 1: I don't know. Yeah, exactly, that's exactly right, That's exactly 23 00:01:37,120 --> 00:01:39,039 Speaker 1: what I was kidding at. You said it much better, 24 00:01:39,120 --> 00:01:42,440 Speaker 1: ben Um, but no, it's true. It's that's that kind 25 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:46,400 Speaker 1: of like idyllic you know, clip art kind of American 26 00:01:46,520 --> 00:01:52,600 Speaker 1: dream sense with also this like you know, absolutely terrifying 27 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:56,880 Speaker 1: underbelly just beneath the surface, kind of ready to you know, 28 00:01:57,240 --> 00:02:01,920 Speaker 1: devour everyone whole well said. In some ways, this is 29 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 1: a study of two very different worlds existing concurrently. On 30 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:10,639 Speaker 1: one world, we have a shiny universe of brand new 31 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:15,480 Speaker 1: homes and automobiles, solid jobs, two point five happy kids 32 00:02:15,520 --> 00:02:20,120 Speaker 1: in suburbs across the country. The other world is a 33 00:02:20,160 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 1: world of vast and true conspiracy, a violation that we 34 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:27,280 Speaker 1: still don't fully understand the extent of It's a profound 35 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 1: crime nearly a century old, and the consequences of it 36 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:34,680 Speaker 1: remain with us in the modern day. This is a 37 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:38,600 Speaker 1: horror story, folks, But let's talk about the fun part first. 38 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:43,639 Speaker 1: Here are the facts, so that for the world, not 39 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:47,079 Speaker 1: just the US, it's the post World War two time, 40 00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:50,919 Speaker 1: which for a lot of intens and purposes was great 41 00:02:51,080 --> 00:02:55,120 Speaker 1: because there was such a devastating period that had occurred 42 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:59,160 Speaker 1: just before the nineteen fifties, and there's a feeling of 43 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:03,079 Speaker 1: rebirth that's coming out of that stuff. Um and in 44 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:06,200 Speaker 1: particular in the United States, as who you know, we're seeing, 45 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:08,880 Speaker 1: at least according to our news and all the history 46 00:03:08,919 --> 00:03:12,040 Speaker 1: I've ever learned, were seen as the victors, were seen 47 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 1: as the ones who really brought victory home for the world. Yeah, 48 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 1: I would say that, you know, the nineteen fifties were 49 00:03:20,760 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 1: a particularly great time for a big segment of the 50 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:27,840 Speaker 1: US population. Uh, And they were an exception to the rule, 51 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:32,400 Speaker 1: because the nineteen fifties were horrible for a lot of 52 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:36,840 Speaker 1: the rest of the world due to that enormous devastation 53 00:03:37,040 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 1: that we're alluding to a World War two, the US 54 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:42,360 Speaker 1: was very much in what is called the catbird seat, 55 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:46,680 Speaker 1: a little idiom that I love but still don't completely understand. 56 00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:49,840 Speaker 1: Please explain it somewhat well. Well, the fighting didn't happen 57 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 1: on American soil, right, The our cities were not destroyed 58 00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:58,880 Speaker 1: the way much of Europe was, right, right, exactly, So 59 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 1: they're too big actors here. First, the Americans are the 60 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:07,120 Speaker 1: inventors of nuclear technology. Also the first country to deploy 61 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 1: this disastrous weapon in the field. So the US emerges 62 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: as one of the world's most deadly military forces, in fact, 63 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:20,479 Speaker 1: the most deadly military force on Earth. And that's that's 64 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:25,400 Speaker 1: something that continues today. And also geography played a huge role. 65 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 1: The US was isolated by two enormous oceans. It was 66 00:04:30,080 --> 00:04:34,320 Speaker 1: really expensive to get over there, right, and because of that, 67 00:04:34,640 --> 00:04:38,960 Speaker 1: they avoided that destruction. They still had a manufacturing base 68 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:43,480 Speaker 1: that had been accelerated through, you know, the war effort. 69 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 1: So we're making more stuff than ever before. We're the 70 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:51,400 Speaker 1: we're like, if the world is a suburb, we're the 71 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:54,560 Speaker 1: only house that didn't get hit by the tornado, kind 72 00:04:54,600 --> 00:04:59,120 Speaker 1: of end. And people were worried about this. The world 73 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 1: is full pessimists, of course, right, And there were numerous 74 00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:06,680 Speaker 1: experts who were arguing back and forth about the uncertain 75 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 1: future because everybody knew unemployment rates had fluctuated widely over 76 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:17,000 Speaker 1: just the past few decades. In the nineteen thirties, around 77 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:20,440 Speaker 1: one out of four people were out of work due 78 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:24,480 Speaker 1: to the Great Depression. Still a terrible day. It wasn't 79 00:05:24,520 --> 00:05:27,479 Speaker 1: a particularly great depression. It was a terrible depression, but 80 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:29,640 Speaker 1: it was you know, the big one. Um. But yeah, 81 00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:34,440 Speaker 1: the war effort um caused industrialization because you know, all 82 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:36,839 Speaker 1: of that stuff was needed to aid the war effort, 83 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 1: with infrastructure and machinery of weapons of war, etcetera. By 84 00:05:41,920 --> 00:05:47,120 Speaker 1: nineteen forty four, unemployment had precipitously dropped to one point 85 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:50,280 Speaker 1: two percent. Uh. And this even to this day is 86 00:05:50,320 --> 00:05:57,440 Speaker 1: a record low. And everyone and you know, their mother, sister, dog, brother, 87 00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:02,480 Speaker 1: everyone was working. UMA yimists were concerned that this was 88 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:05,320 Speaker 1: like a bubble that was going to pop. This was 89 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:09,320 Speaker 1: not sustainable. Had the United States become addicted to war 90 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 1: where we're going to have to face it that we 91 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 1: were addicted to war, It's possible. Was global conflict now 92 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 1: just an absolute necessity? Was this something that we were 93 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:22,760 Speaker 1: going to have to continue to almost you know, lean 94 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:26,160 Speaker 1: into in order to save our economy? Uh? It certainly 95 00:06:26,160 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: feels like it sometimes even today. UM, Folks like Senator 96 00:06:29,480 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 1: James Mead believe that the US would never be able 97 00:06:32,920 --> 00:06:37,080 Speaker 1: to successfully convert from our military economy to a civilian one. 98 00:06:37,279 --> 00:06:40,599 Speaker 1: And and this becomes sort of like this boogeyman of 99 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 1: these these visions of things that were only just recently 100 00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:47,440 Speaker 1: you know, out of people's you know, daily lives, things 101 00:06:47,480 --> 00:06:53,800 Speaker 1: like these decaying factories. Uh and those huge, horrible unemployment numbers. Um. 102 00:06:54,080 --> 00:06:56,159 Speaker 1: So people were spooked and they were gonna do whatever 103 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:57,840 Speaker 1: it took to kind of keep things on the up 104 00:06:57,880 --> 00:07:02,279 Speaker 1: and up right. Yeah exactly. I mean part of being 105 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:09,000 Speaker 1: an economic expert or politician like Senator Mead is a 106 00:07:09,040 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 1: big part of that is being the person who goes 107 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 1: into a good situation and starts naming all the reasons 108 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:19,280 Speaker 1: it will be terrible. Shortly you're you're paid to ruin 109 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:24,400 Speaker 1: the party. Luckily, Mead and the other experts were proven 110 00:07:24,480 --> 00:07:29,360 Speaker 1: incorrect in their predictions. Those unique advantages we mentioned for 111 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:34,119 Speaker 1: the US paved the way for the post war economic boom. Paul, 112 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:38,880 Speaker 1: can we get some music? Okay? Perfect? Yeah, exactly that. 113 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 1: So the study of the US and the nineteen fifties is, 114 00:07:43,840 --> 00:07:47,080 Speaker 1: I would argue, best understood as a study in paradox 115 00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:50,920 Speaker 1: like life was great. Life was aces for a lot 116 00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:54,480 Speaker 1: of white people who towed the correct ideological lines, but 117 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:59,560 Speaker 1: the horror of racism remained. The civil rights movement was 118 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 1: in its nascent stages. The red scare of communism costs 119 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:09,200 Speaker 1: people their livelihoods. There was terror behind America's shiny new smile. 120 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:13,400 Speaker 1: But on the bright side, we'll bring back the happy music. 121 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:17,560 Speaker 1: Business was booming. Everything was That's why we call that 122 00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:20,880 Speaker 1: generation the baby boomers. Think of it like, after years 123 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:26,000 Speaker 1: of rations and shortages and insane propaganda, people are kind 124 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 1: of like um, the folks and countries that were able 125 00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:32,839 Speaker 1: to end the pandemic. You know, they're desperate to get outside, 126 00:08:33,160 --> 00:08:36,360 Speaker 1: get some action, enjoy the good life. And man, they 127 00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 1: loved spending money. It was a veritable shopping spree going 128 00:08:40,920 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: on in the US. And like we said before, homes 129 00:08:45,880 --> 00:08:48,360 Speaker 1: were one of the biggest things that people were buying 130 00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:50,160 Speaker 1: and moving into. And of course there are bills that 131 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 1: we've mentioned before on this show that we're available to 132 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:55,079 Speaker 1: help people who needed homes, who needed to be able 133 00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 1: to afford one. Cars were huge. I mean, you're just 134 00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 1: gonna you had to have a car, and you had 135 00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:05,199 Speaker 1: to be able to drive fairly long distances a lot 136 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:07,400 Speaker 1: of times. You know, again, there's a lot of parts 137 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:09,559 Speaker 1: of the economy. We're just required a ton of travel. 138 00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:12,480 Speaker 1: And because you have homes, because you have nice cars, 139 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:15,080 Speaker 1: you fill them up with things because there's space in there, 140 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:18,360 Speaker 1: and they're all these companies that are manufacturing things that 141 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 1: are specifically designed for all of these new homeowners, all 142 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:25,680 Speaker 1: of these new car owners. Uh. And a lot of 143 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:30,440 Speaker 1: that stuff ends up being, like I mentioned at the top, appliances. Yeah, 144 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:35,400 Speaker 1: I love those. I'm a sucker for the retro television stuff. 145 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 1: Please send us your favorite weird commercials from the fifties 146 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:43,560 Speaker 1: and sixties. But not the Ronald McDonald one, I will 147 00:09:43,640 --> 00:09:47,679 Speaker 1: have no Uh, that too was always creepy to me. Um. 148 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:49,760 Speaker 1: It doesn't surprise me that they kind of phased him 149 00:09:49,800 --> 00:09:52,640 Speaker 1: out a bit, didn't they. Yeah, they did, they did. 150 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:58,920 Speaker 1: The original Ronald McDonald is a spooky, spooky dude. But yes, 151 00:09:59,120 --> 00:10:03,880 Speaker 1: this the lture became something that defined success and even 152 00:10:03,960 --> 00:10:08,040 Speaker 1: morality in terms of material It was both good and 153 00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:13,640 Speaker 1: just to have new things. Uh. The population of the 154 00:10:13,720 --> 00:10:19,960 Speaker 1: US was heavily incentivized to become consumers, more so than citizens. 155 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:22,720 Speaker 1: And the reason this happened is because of what you 156 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:25,920 Speaker 1: were talking about earlier, NOL, the real fear that industry 157 00:10:25,960 --> 00:10:29,920 Speaker 1: would die without the incentive to create more and more 158 00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:34,880 Speaker 1: weapons of war. So like automobile manufacturers who came to 159 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 1: the rescue during World War Two went back like they 160 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:42,600 Speaker 1: stopped making engines for planes and stuff like that, or 161 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:45,280 Speaker 1: making bombers like Ford did, and they went back to 162 00:10:45,320 --> 00:10:47,480 Speaker 1: making cars, and they were like, we had to move 163 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:51,600 Speaker 1: these whips. So people were very encouraged to buy this stuff. 164 00:10:51,920 --> 00:10:57,199 Speaker 1: New car sales quadruple between nineteen nineteen fifty five. This 165 00:10:57,280 --> 00:10:59,440 Speaker 1: is back in the day when it wasn't a terrible 166 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 1: idea to a brand new car. By the end of 167 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:07,040 Speaker 1: the nineteen fifties, like seventy five of American households had 168 00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 1: at least one car. That's a huge change. Also, people 169 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 1: were like crazy that oh yeah, the yie old baby boom. 170 00:11:19,880 --> 00:11:22,760 Speaker 1: Well yeah, I mean the war was over. Times are good. 171 00:11:22,760 --> 00:11:26,760 Speaker 1: Things are great. My house is filled with silver things 172 00:11:26,800 --> 00:11:32,040 Speaker 1: that can nuke, things, microwave, all this petroleum jelly laying around, 173 00:11:32,480 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: Like what am I gonna do? Not that, not that, 174 00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 1: but the it's we're gonna talk about a little bit. 175 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:46,199 Speaker 1: But it's interesting how you can see this as in 176 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:53,200 Speaker 1: as an ideological shift from hot warfare, from warfare actual 177 00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:56,200 Speaker 1: to cultural warfare in a way, and how all of 178 00:11:56,240 --> 00:11:58,960 Speaker 1: these things that are being produced are in some ways 179 00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:04,199 Speaker 1: promoting the America Rican way, the capitalist ideal. And it's 180 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:07,040 Speaker 1: really interesting to see that, like you're you're depicting, here 181 00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:11,600 Speaker 1: been a necessary shift for the economy to continue on. Yeah, 182 00:12:11,679 --> 00:12:16,080 Speaker 1: so this is so we were painting, I think, the 183 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:20,880 Speaker 1: the propagandistic image, which happened because for very real and 184 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:26,280 Speaker 1: valid reasons in this time of prosperity. For a portion 185 00:12:26,720 --> 00:12:31,839 Speaker 1: of the American population, about four million children are born 186 00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:36,199 Speaker 1: each and every year during the nineteen fifties, that's that, 187 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:40,120 Speaker 1: that is the baby Boomer generation. And for so many people, 188 00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:42,839 Speaker 1: this is still what a lot of people mean when 189 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:45,680 Speaker 1: they refer to the American dream. Right, this is back 190 00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:51,040 Speaker 1: when depending on your demographic, of course, you could without 191 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:54,240 Speaker 1: going into debt at a college, you could get a 192 00:12:54,280 --> 00:12:57,240 Speaker 1: solid job out of high school. You could buy a house, 193 00:12:57,400 --> 00:12:59,080 Speaker 1: you could buy a car, you could buy two cars. 194 00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:01,959 Speaker 1: You could afford to have kids. Every so often, you 195 00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:05,760 Speaker 1: might celebrate your anniversary or whatever with a nice trip, 196 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:08,640 Speaker 1: maybe to Hawaii. I don't know what people did, is 197 00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:10,840 Speaker 1: this is where kind of the middle class started becoming 198 00:13:10,880 --> 00:13:13,160 Speaker 1: a thing, because they were the ones that bought all 199 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:17,079 Speaker 1: this year. Right, Yes, so they there's kind of that 200 00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 1: feedback loop. Right, people are making more money than they 201 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:23,760 Speaker 1: did before, and they're putting it back in the economy 202 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:26,760 Speaker 1: which also employs them. There is a good argument that 203 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:30,080 Speaker 1: an economy is a Ponzi scheme or capitalism is, but 204 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 1: stress at the very least, right, it's the snake eating 205 00:13:33,760 --> 00:13:37,079 Speaker 1: its own tail, and as long as it continues the cycle, 206 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 1: then it will continue to exist. I'm probably oversimplifying it, 207 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:43,679 Speaker 1: but it certainly feels a little bit like a fairy 208 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:48,080 Speaker 1: tale kind of you know, yeah, this, I agree, and 209 00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:51,520 Speaker 1: I don't think you're oversimplifying it very much. You know, 210 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:56,240 Speaker 1: this is what was happening, and even now some people 211 00:13:56,320 --> 00:13:59,439 Speaker 1: will look back at that and ignore all the domestic 212 00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:04,040 Speaker 1: problems were occurring and say those were the good old days. 213 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 1: But this dream had a dark side because despite the 214 00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:11,119 Speaker 1: measurable improvements and the lives of so many Americans, experts 215 00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:15,720 Speaker 1: both domestic and abroad, knew that there were storms gathering 216 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:21,040 Speaker 1: on the horizon. Nuclear weaponry the other big advantage of 217 00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:25,080 Speaker 1: the US the Pandora's jar, and now the lid was unscrewed, 218 00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:29,520 Speaker 1: the seal was broken, that radioactive jin wasn't going back 219 00:14:29,560 --> 00:14:34,400 Speaker 1: in the bottle anytime soon. So the average American, whatever 220 00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 1: you want to take that to mean, was basking this 221 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:42,680 Speaker 1: moment of unprecedented prosperity, but US politicians, military officials, and 222 00:14:42,800 --> 00:14:47,600 Speaker 1: scientists were racing against the clock to prevent their enemies 223 00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:53,080 Speaker 1: from acquiring nuclear weapons. They ultimately failed in this pursuit. 224 00:14:53,520 --> 00:14:57,240 Speaker 1: They also continued to experiment with nukes. They were desperate 225 00:14:57,280 --> 00:15:00,760 Speaker 1: to maintain this strategic edge for as long as possible. 226 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:06,840 Speaker 1: Consequences be damned, because you know, we use the phrase 227 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:11,040 Speaker 1: allies right when we're talking about that World War two alliance, 228 00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:14,960 Speaker 1: but history proves it might be better to call them 229 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:19,520 Speaker 1: the frenemies, because you know, the Cold War basically started 230 00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:22,640 Speaker 1: like the day after World War Two ended. I think 231 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:25,920 Speaker 1: I think maybe the US Russia took it afternoon off 232 00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:28,680 Speaker 1: and then they were like, all right, back at it, 233 00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 1: but quieter this time. Yes, it's so quiet, it's almost silent, 234 00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:36,960 Speaker 1: and there's a desperation behind it, you guys. And it 235 00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:40,240 Speaker 1: leads us to what we're gonna talk about today, an 236 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:48,520 Speaker 1: actual dag um conspiracy for real, really really, yes, ever, ever, 237 00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:53,440 Speaker 1: forever ever. Because Uncle Sam, the government of the United 238 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:56,360 Speaker 1: States of America wasn't fit to just sit with those 239 00:15:56,440 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: nuclear weapons and say we are king now of just instruction, 240 00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:03,880 Speaker 1: we win ha ha. They wanted to see what else 241 00:16:04,000 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 1: could be done with these weapons? How far could this 242 00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:10,080 Speaker 1: be taken? What else can be done with this technology? 243 00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 1: And oh boy, yeah, well, I mean it's understandable, right 244 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:21,480 Speaker 1: because they knew that the number one goal of every 245 00:16:21,480 --> 00:16:25,880 Speaker 1: other country capable of doing so was to get nukes. 246 00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:29,200 Speaker 1: Everybody wants the new toy. Everybody wants the biggest gun, 247 00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:32,800 Speaker 1: you know, Like imagine if you were in the universe 248 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:35,560 Speaker 1: of Ghostbusters and you found out that you could build 249 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:38,920 Speaker 1: your own Goes or the Destroyer. That's that's what people 250 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:42,680 Speaker 1: were doing. And this is dangerous because in a very 251 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:46,120 Speaker 1: real way, this means that the world as we knew 252 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 1: it could end at any given moment. And although everyone 253 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 1: at this time was very much aware of the devastating 254 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:59,440 Speaker 1: impact a nuclear weapon could create. Everyone knew about Hiroshima 255 00:16:59,440 --> 00:17:03,440 Speaker 1: and Nagasa Hockey, but no one, not even the experts, 256 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:07,800 Speaker 1: understood the full extent of fallout. How did it affect 257 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:11,280 Speaker 1: the atmosphere? How long did it stay? Could dropping a 258 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:17,480 Speaker 1: bomb in you know, Nepal later create fallout in Europe? 259 00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:21,479 Speaker 1: Things like that, These questions whereas things you could model 260 00:17:21,960 --> 00:17:24,440 Speaker 1: and you could try to test, and they definitely did, 261 00:17:24,760 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 1: but they were also racing to learn more about how 262 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:32,959 Speaker 1: this affected ecosystems and organisms. They were driven, we have 263 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:38,080 Speaker 1: to say, by desperation, and as we continue, that's that's 264 00:17:38,119 --> 00:17:41,400 Speaker 1: something everybody needs to remember. These people did not see 265 00:17:41,440 --> 00:17:45,640 Speaker 1: themselves as villains, but that desperation is how we ended 266 00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:49,639 Speaker 1: up with a ghoulish plan called Project Sunshine. We'll be 267 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:59,680 Speaker 1: back after the break. Here's where it gets crazy. So 268 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:05,960 Speaker 1: you know, um, you've got these nuclear weapons. You know 269 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:10,119 Speaker 1: what they do in theory, You've tested them on you know, 270 00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 1: you've you've done nuclear test detonations, etcetera. But what do 271 00:18:14,200 --> 00:18:16,399 Speaker 1: they do to people? What do they do to human 272 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:20,040 Speaker 1: flesh and human bodies? You can do them with animals 273 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:24,800 Speaker 1: and in various environments lacking humans. Honestly, there were a 274 00:18:24,880 --> 00:18:27,560 Speaker 1: lot more animals back than ben you pointed out, So 275 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 1: the ethics of this was not as much of a 276 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:33,640 Speaker 1: concern as it certainly would be today. But it's again 277 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:37,080 Speaker 1: about how it affects that human tissue. Was it going 278 00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:40,520 Speaker 1: to do? Uh? The U s Atomic Energy Commission created 279 00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:44,800 Speaker 1: something called Project Gabriel, which was an investigation to figure 280 00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:50,720 Speaker 1: out the full impact on the human population in a 281 00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:55,680 Speaker 1: nuclear fallout zone. Through this project, the government concluded that 282 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:59,240 Speaker 1: the most dangerous part of this whole situation was the 283 00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:04,040 Speaker 1: radio act the isotope known as trontium ninety um, which 284 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:08,720 Speaker 1: is a calcium like radioactive substance that is produced when 285 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:13,200 Speaker 1: nuclear explosions occur um. It can be absorbed by plants 286 00:19:13,760 --> 00:19:17,280 Speaker 1: and animals, and it passes through food to humans, and 287 00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:20,119 Speaker 1: humans bones can absorb it too. And if I'm not mistaken, 288 00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 1: this is where a certain form of is it iodine 289 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:28,840 Speaker 1: or there's some some pill you can ingest that will 290 00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:33,080 Speaker 1: block the absorption of that isotope. Well, I don't know. 291 00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 1: The first thing you have to do to figure out 292 00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:37,159 Speaker 1: if something like that would function is you need to 293 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:41,640 Speaker 1: get those isotopes into human bones, exactly right. You gotta 294 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 1: test them. You gotta test it out. Did it go 295 00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:51,760 Speaker 1: from that cattle into Bill? It's a Bill. Yes, Bill 296 00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:53,720 Speaker 1: drew the short end of the straw at the lab. 297 00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:57,240 Speaker 1: So he's out there, you know, drinking milk straight from 298 00:19:57,240 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 1: the utter, just to see if he can get radiation 299 00:19:59,359 --> 00:20:02,000 Speaker 1: through it. It was. It was a weird, weird gig 300 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:06,159 Speaker 1: for Bill. But but you're right. They needed this data. 301 00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 1: They needed to figure out what happened when the radioactive 302 00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:15,159 Speaker 1: rubber hit the road, which means they needed human test subjects. 303 00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 1: They needed human tissue. The a e C. Commissioner at 304 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:23,800 Speaker 1: the time, a guy named Dr Willard Libby, complained about 305 00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:27,560 Speaker 1: this constantly because he knew the score, he knew what 306 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:31,040 Speaker 1: was up. He was like, look, it's ugly, but we're 307 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:33,920 Speaker 1: trying to save the world here. We need people because 308 00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:36,920 Speaker 1: they remember, they're not They're not just worried about their bombs. 309 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:39,719 Speaker 1: They're worried about other countries developing the tech and then 310 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:43,480 Speaker 1: dropping on them. Exactly. Yeah, so they so at the 311 00:20:43,600 --> 00:20:45,560 Speaker 1: very least, they need to figure out how that stuff, 312 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 1: uh interacts with the human body so that maybe they 313 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:53,679 Speaker 1: can figure out some mitigation, you know, procedures or whatever, 314 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:56,399 Speaker 1: like that pill that I can't remember the name, but 315 00:20:56,520 --> 00:20:58,639 Speaker 1: definitely is a thing that we'll probably get to. We 316 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:02,760 Speaker 1: have to mention this part, folks. Obviously, the government could 317 00:21:02,840 --> 00:21:07,680 Speaker 1: illegally experiment on disadvantaged populations. They have certainly done so 318 00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:10,680 Speaker 1: in the past, and there are people who will assure 319 00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 1: you that the experiments like this continue in the modern day. 320 00:21:14,280 --> 00:21:18,240 Speaker 1: But there's a problem with those experiments. Sometimes they have survivors, 321 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:21,520 Speaker 1: and survivors have a tendency to, you know, talk to 322 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:24,560 Speaker 1: people about the horrible things that happened to them, and 323 00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:29,000 Speaker 1: so Project Gabriel led to a classified program called Project 324 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:33,960 Speaker 1: Sunshine in ninety three. It started out as just another 325 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:37,680 Speaker 1: secret investigation, which is a weird sentence to say, but accurate, 326 00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:40,720 Speaker 1: and then it quickly took a dark turn. Do not 327 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:45,119 Speaker 1: let the name fool you. In fact, let's let Dr 328 00:21:45,359 --> 00:21:50,520 Speaker 1: Libby himself introduce his project with this infamous quote. This 329 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:54,360 Speaker 1: comes from a secret meeting in nineteen fifty five when 330 00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 1: he was talking about the importance of getting humans to 331 00:21:57,720 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 1: experiment on. I don't know how to get um, but 332 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:02,920 Speaker 1: I do say that it is a matter of prime 333 00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:07,520 Speaker 1: importance to get them, and particularly in the young age group. 334 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:11,879 Speaker 1: So human samples are often of prime importance. And if 335 00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:14,880 Speaker 1: anybody knows how to do a good job of body snatching, 336 00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:19,280 Speaker 1: they will really be serving their country hand hand nudge, nudge, 337 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:22,960 Speaker 1: wink wink. We need young bodies. Let's go snatch some 338 00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:26,800 Speaker 1: anyone good. Yes, we got your back, We got your back. 339 00:22:27,359 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 1: And the bluntness, the candid nature of that statement really 340 00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:35,080 Speaker 1: stood out to me. I I hope it stands out 341 00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:40,240 Speaker 1: to everybody listening, because with that, the US government got 342 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,760 Speaker 1: into the business of stealing the corpses of children. That 343 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,440 Speaker 1: is what today's episode is about, and that's part away. 344 00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:49,560 Speaker 1: It got to me this wasn't a small operation. This 345 00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:54,960 Speaker 1: was a global network. Sunshine created an invisible army of 346 00:22:55,119 --> 00:23:00,560 Speaker 1: modern day resurrection men, literal corpse thieves. And we we 347 00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:04,439 Speaker 1: talked about resurrection in the past, but somebody give us 348 00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 1: the quick and dirty just because it's such a cool 349 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:08,639 Speaker 1: term for such a horrible thing. Yeah, I mean it was. 350 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:14,760 Speaker 1: It was especially um during early days of say medical experimentation, 351 00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:19,000 Speaker 1: you know, when um surgeons were trying to figure out 352 00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:22,320 Speaker 1: how you know, the human body and the human anatomy functioned. 353 00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:25,320 Speaker 1: Uh So in order to do that, they would often 354 00:23:25,600 --> 00:23:29,040 Speaker 1: grave rob and then dig up corpses and cut them 355 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:33,360 Speaker 1: open to see what what's what? Yeah, nailed it. It's 356 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:35,600 Speaker 1: just like a well I think we talked about it 357 00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:38,720 Speaker 1: at length in our episode on whether or not Benjamin 358 00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:44,800 Speaker 1: Franklin was serial killer. The resurrection men came about because 359 00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:47,639 Speaker 1: of gaps and loopholes in the laws at the time, 360 00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:52,720 Speaker 1: Like it was legal to conduct medical experiments on cadavers, 361 00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:55,879 Speaker 1: but it was illegal to buy them, so you just 362 00:23:55,920 --> 00:24:00,960 Speaker 1: have plausible deniability, get some creepy and were desperate person 363 00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:03,840 Speaker 1: to like Will said, rob a grave for you, and 364 00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:06,520 Speaker 1: then you just pretend like, well, I don't know where 365 00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:08,720 Speaker 1: this body came from, officer, I'm just trying to learn 366 00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:10,919 Speaker 1: about kidneys. What do they just have like a body 367 00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:14,760 Speaker 1: drop off repository like the return thing and a library 368 00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:18,640 Speaker 1: like I mean what I mean, I know we're gonna 369 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:22,840 Speaker 1: get there, but jeezus, this is bleak. Yeah, it's true. 370 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:25,800 Speaker 1: This was a massive operation, even if even if it 371 00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:29,520 Speaker 1: was just sort of an implied operation. Right, Um, there 372 00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:33,760 Speaker 1: were project managers who didn't want to disclose the actual 373 00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:36,560 Speaker 1: nature of the research that was being done because if 374 00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:41,720 Speaker 1: they did, then it could put their personal contacts and 375 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 1: the people that were helping them out who were pimply 376 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,960 Speaker 1: breaking the law at risk. Um. So they decided to 377 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:51,920 Speaker 1: have researchers use people that they knew to recruit other 378 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:57,080 Speaker 1: people to do more of this stuff. Degrees of separation. 379 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,439 Speaker 1: That's how it works. I mean, that's that's the brilliant 380 00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:05,200 Speaker 1: part about surveillance programs like five Eyes. This network operated 381 00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:09,840 Speaker 1: everywhere from Australia to Europe through various means, and we 382 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,840 Speaker 1: still don't know the extent of this. We still don't 383 00:25:12,840 --> 00:25:16,199 Speaker 1: know the specifics, but through various means, by hook or 384 00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:19,880 Speaker 1: by crook, pieces of dead human beings were being stolen 385 00:25:20,359 --> 00:25:23,439 Speaker 1: and they were being shipped off to the US. It 386 00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:28,560 Speaker 1: seems that many of the governments of countries involved had 387 00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:31,800 Speaker 1: no idea what was happening. Um. And that's that in 388 00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:35,719 Speaker 1: itself is pretty distressing. And it's an important point, uh, 389 00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:38,920 Speaker 1: that that you make here. Because some of these people 390 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:43,159 Speaker 1: were gathering samples, Like you said, they were contacted informally, 391 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:46,119 Speaker 1: you know, kind of off the books operation like agent 392 00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:49,080 Speaker 1: between us. You want to help me steal somebodies. What 393 00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:53,600 Speaker 1: are you doing Wednesday? Uh. They were given different reasons 394 00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:57,360 Speaker 1: for this too, because the folks in charge of Projects 395 00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 1: Sunshine didn't want every and to know this was a 396 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:05,679 Speaker 1: program related to nuclear weaponry, so they made up a 397 00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:08,840 Speaker 1: couple of different reasons. And that means that not all 398 00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:13,720 Speaker 1: the people involved in this network understood exactly why they 399 00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:19,000 Speaker 1: were shipping these samples to the US. And there were 400 00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:21,080 Speaker 1: a lot of samples. This was not a one and 401 00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:26,200 Speaker 1: done thing. This was not tragic case of like half 402 00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:30,240 Speaker 1: a dozen very unfortunate families. Was way deeper and way 403 00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:34,720 Speaker 1: more extreme. Yeah, according to the documents available that you know, 404 00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:38,840 Speaker 1: are declassified on this stuff. There were at least fifteen hundred, 405 00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:43,560 Speaker 1: I believe samples. I'm not doing the sound because I 406 00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:46,480 Speaker 1: keep I'm going back and forth between whether or not 407 00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:49,880 Speaker 1: to do that sound, just depending on the listeners reactions. 408 00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:52,280 Speaker 1: Sometimes it's like I love it, give me some swish swish. 409 00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,360 Speaker 1: Sometimes this man leave me alone with that swish wish. Yeah, 410 00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:57,679 Speaker 1: but Matt, you just described like the internet, you know, 411 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:04,040 Speaker 1: I mean, people are okay, educate yourself. Oh dang, no, 412 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:09,240 Speaker 1: the tables have turned okay, So let's get back seriousness. 413 00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:15,400 Speaker 1: There were over fifteen hundred samples of human flesh tissue. 414 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:19,600 Speaker 1: A lot of them were from babies and young children, 415 00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:24,320 Speaker 1: as was stated by Dr Libby, that was important. Um again, 416 00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 1: they were stolen from all around the world. And here's 417 00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:30,040 Speaker 1: the weird thing, and I we can't tell you if 418 00:27:30,040 --> 00:27:32,280 Speaker 1: it's just what was reported, you know, and what was 419 00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:34,680 Speaker 1: put in official documents by people who were keeping track 420 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:39,240 Speaker 1: of this stuff or or not. But allegedly only five 421 00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:43,440 Speaker 1: hundred of those samples, so one third, were actually tested 422 00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:47,440 Speaker 1: for the purposes of Project Sunshine, which in itself it's 423 00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:49,880 Speaker 1: its own kind of heartbreak, you know what I mean? 424 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 1: All this for nothing for so little. It reminds me 425 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:58,440 Speaker 1: of our discussions about Unit seven thirty one in Japan, 426 00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:04,680 Speaker 1: or some of the atrocities committed by German scientists during 427 00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 1: World War Two. There was some useful science that came 428 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:11,679 Speaker 1: from this, but the big misconception that a lot of 429 00:28:11,720 --> 00:28:17,480 Speaker 1: people have is that this science was incredibly impactful or 430 00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:21,280 Speaker 1: even good science. The events of seven thirty one were 431 00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:24,320 Speaker 1: it was an APPATOI. It wasn't allowed. It was a 432 00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:28,399 Speaker 1: chartl house. Yeah, and the parents, you know of of 433 00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:32,760 Speaker 1: of these children had no idea what was going on. Look, 434 00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:34,520 Speaker 1: it's one of these things where it's like do the 435 00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:37,400 Speaker 1: means justify the ends. It's sort of like black ops 436 00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:41,760 Speaker 1: and stuff, where clearly laws are broken, uh, to the 437 00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:44,720 Speaker 1: greater good, for the greater good. But then when you 438 00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:48,720 Speaker 1: start seeing things like only five samples were analyzed, you 439 00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:50,920 Speaker 1: start to be like, well, why why do they need 440 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:53,520 Speaker 1: so many? And why was it such a widespread operation? 441 00:28:53,840 --> 00:29:00,520 Speaker 1: Because it really is absolutely abominable behavior, at least for 442 00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:04,400 Speaker 1: people that are religious. Can you imagine finding out that 443 00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:09,240 Speaker 1: your child's you know, body was desecrated, dug up used 444 00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:13,360 Speaker 1: for science experimentation. Well, that that's actually kind of where 445 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:16,280 Speaker 1: I want to go. I will will hit it more 446 00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:20,680 Speaker 1: at the end here, But I wonder if transparency would 447 00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:24,560 Speaker 1: have changed people's thinking. There's a there's a lot of 448 00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:27,640 Speaker 1: patriotism going around for a long time in the United 449 00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:32,160 Speaker 1: States after the Second World War, and I wonder if 450 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:34,880 Speaker 1: instead of doing it, you know, in the dark, surreptitiously 451 00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,960 Speaker 1: stealing bodies, it was, Hey, we we really need to 452 00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:41,400 Speaker 1: test this powerful weapon and the effects of it for 453 00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:45,360 Speaker 1: the safety of national security, for ours, the strength as 454 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:51,520 Speaker 1: a union. We need you, or children's corpses, because because 455 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:54,520 Speaker 1: you know, at least they're not asking for your firstborn 456 00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:59,360 Speaker 1: or you're young the way, or they're not killing children 457 00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:03,360 Speaker 1: and torturing children and people as in Unit one, they 458 00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:07,240 Speaker 1: are definitely experimenting on the thing that was once a 459 00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:12,360 Speaker 1: loved one. Yeah, um, call it Project HEROD. Sure you 460 00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:14,480 Speaker 1: gotta wonder too. I'm picturing the scenario in my mind 461 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:17,160 Speaker 1: where you know, like a representative comes and Knox and says, 462 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,560 Speaker 1: Mrs Jones, we we have your country needs you. There's 463 00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:24,200 Speaker 1: a thing you can do to really help us out. Um, 464 00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:27,000 Speaker 1: We're here to ask if we can you know, honor 465 00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:30,600 Speaker 1: the memory of your child by having it serve and 466 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:35,160 Speaker 1: potentially save the lives of millions, right, good line. Yeah, 467 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:39,280 Speaker 1: that's it's something that occurred to me as well, and 468 00:30:39,320 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 1: it's one of the one of the closing things we 469 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:45,680 Speaker 1: can really dive into towards the end of this episode. 470 00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:50,680 Speaker 1: So let's pause for a moment for word from our sponsors, 471 00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:56,600 Speaker 1: and then we'll return with some examples of how this 472 00:30:56,680 --> 00:31:07,520 Speaker 1: process occurred. And we're back. Uh. There's a British documentary 473 00:31:07,560 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 1: we'd like to draw your attention to came out in 474 00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:16,920 Speaker 1: n It's called Deadly Experiments. In Deadly Experiments, one of 475 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:21,040 Speaker 1: the people interviewed is a woman named Jane Pritchard. She 476 00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:24,440 Speaker 1: is British. She had a child that was still born 477 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:30,600 Speaker 1: in nine seven, and she learned that when her child 478 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:35,280 Speaker 1: when when she gave birth, the doctors who spirited the 479 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:39,400 Speaker 1: child away removed its legs and sent those legs off 480 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:44,120 Speaker 1: to the US for Projects Sunshine. She was forbidden to 481 00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:49,440 Speaker 1: dress her daughter for the funeral because the doctors knew 482 00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:52,680 Speaker 1: that if she did, she would find out what happened 483 00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:58,000 Speaker 1: to literally half of her child. She also continues and 484 00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:01,160 Speaker 1: she says, I asked if I could put her christening 485 00:32:01,240 --> 00:32:04,240 Speaker 1: robe honor, but I wasn't allowed to and that upset 486 00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 1: me terribly because she wasn't christened. No one asked me 487 00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:11,400 Speaker 1: about doing things like that, taking bits and pieces from her, 488 00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:14,840 Speaker 1: and that, you know, that goes that ties in exactly 489 00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:19,600 Speaker 1: to what you're talking about with the idea of religious practices. 490 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:21,480 Speaker 1: You know what I mean? These are these are some 491 00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:25,080 Speaker 1: of the most important sacred traditions in a lot of 492 00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:31,000 Speaker 1: belief systems. And words like we're three guys who were 493 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:35,720 Speaker 1: paid to talk, and words fail me to try to 494 00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:40,960 Speaker 1: describe the profundity of that experience. I mean, imagine you 495 00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 1: have you have a stillborn child. That is an emotional 496 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,840 Speaker 1: trauma that will follow you like a shadow for the 497 00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:54,120 Speaker 1: rest of your days. And then on top of that tragedy, 498 00:32:54,560 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 1: you learn that your child's body has been desecrated in 499 00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:06,240 Speaker 1: the name of nuclear war. So and he continues, So okay. 500 00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:10,640 Speaker 1: Even Canada and the UK for a number of years 501 00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,880 Speaker 1: had alleged that deaths like this occurred, but there wasn't 502 00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:18,280 Speaker 1: an official investigation for decades. It wasn't even until two 503 00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:23,000 Speaker 1: thousand and one. Remember this stuff was happening to fifty six. 504 00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:26,120 Speaker 1: It wasn't until two thousand and one that Britain's atomic 505 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:32,240 Speaker 1: Energy Agency acknowledged that they were stealing the bones of children, 506 00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:35,320 Speaker 1: which you know to to the point of fairy tale. 507 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 1: This sounds like a fable, This sounds like folklore. This 508 00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:44,880 Speaker 1: sounds like a boogeyman, a monster from ages past. Now 509 00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:49,880 Speaker 1: you're absolutely right. So what happens to the bodies of 510 00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:53,040 Speaker 1: the people that we love when they're gone? Um? There 511 00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:55,920 Speaker 1: are obviously options, you have things like cremation and burial, 512 00:33:56,200 --> 00:34:00,280 Speaker 1: em bombing, um. But it's not like h and deup 513 00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:03,480 Speaker 1: with some sort of inventory or a checklist of what 514 00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:08,480 Speaker 1: happens to organs. I'll only say this because I've been 515 00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:12,239 Speaker 1: watching six ft Under a lot lately. Apparently when a 516 00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:16,560 Speaker 1: body is picked up from the morgue or after an autopsy, 517 00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:20,239 Speaker 1: you know, by a an embalming um service or or 518 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:24,840 Speaker 1: company or uh funeral home, there is absolutely a checklist, 519 00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 1: like if, for example, if someone was in a you know, 520 00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:31,239 Speaker 1: accident where parts were severed. Um, there is a checklist 521 00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,560 Speaker 1: for things an episode involving a severed foot that points 522 00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:37,080 Speaker 1: that out in six ft Under, But we don't get that. 523 00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:40,279 Speaker 1: We could probably request it, but we don't. So it's 524 00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:43,160 Speaker 1: not like most of us would actually have some sort 525 00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:47,640 Speaker 1: of checklist as to where the organs especially end up, uh, 526 00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:52,160 Speaker 1: and where different body parts might turn up right, Yeah, absolutely, 527 00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:55,399 Speaker 1: I mean and and also think about, you know, think 528 00:34:55,440 --> 00:35:02,200 Speaker 1: about the grief that someone is going through. Uh. It's 529 00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:06,640 Speaker 1: it's easy to understand how figuring out what happened to 530 00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 1: specific body parts wouldn't be the highest priority because you're 531 00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:13,800 Speaker 1: just trying to make it from one day to the next. 532 00:35:14,080 --> 00:35:18,919 Speaker 1: And regulatory agencies exist in multiple countries to monitor these processes, 533 00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:22,000 Speaker 1: but the average person doesn't really have a way to 534 00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:26,560 Speaker 1: learn whether their loved ones body parts are being given 535 00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:31,919 Speaker 1: a dignified burial in accordance to their religious statutes, or 536 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:36,200 Speaker 1: whether they're being illicitly taken for other purposes. A few 537 00:35:36,280 --> 00:35:41,560 Speaker 1: years back here in our home state of Georgia, authorities 538 00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:46,000 Speaker 1: discovered this funeral home north of Atlanta was being paid to, 539 00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:49,120 Speaker 1: you know, do a typical burial service, but they were 540 00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:51,840 Speaker 1: taking the bodies and just like throwing them in freezers 541 00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:54,960 Speaker 1: and in the woods. It's um, these are you know, 542 00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:58,080 Speaker 1: this is taking advantage of very vulnerable people at one 543 00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:02,200 Speaker 1: of the worst moments in their lives. And that that's 544 00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:06,759 Speaker 1: one of the most frightening lessons about Project Sunshine that's 545 00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:09,160 Speaker 1: I think that's one of the two big things we 546 00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:13,520 Speaker 1: should keep in mind here. Something like this conspiracy could 547 00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:17,720 Speaker 1: easily happen again in the modern day. The only reason 548 00:36:18,200 --> 00:36:22,080 Speaker 1: it's if it's not happening now. The only reason stuff 549 00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:25,160 Speaker 1: like this is not happening is because people haven't found 550 00:36:25,280 --> 00:36:29,479 Speaker 1: a rationalization that they felt was noble enough. We're one 551 00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:32,920 Speaker 1: excuse away from something like this happening again, and and 552 00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:37,640 Speaker 1: and wasn't necessary back to thirty one, it's I mean, 553 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:42,640 Speaker 1: it is crucial to understand the effects of nuclear fallout, 554 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,680 Speaker 1: nuclear waste. Were there better ways to go about it? 555 00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:47,759 Speaker 1: Like what you guys were saying earlier, That's what I 556 00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:49,880 Speaker 1: keep thinking, Like what if you what if you phrased 557 00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:54,239 Speaker 1: it as this is a way for your family to 558 00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:57,600 Speaker 1: serve not only your country, but the world, you know 559 00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:01,600 Speaker 1: what I mean? Yeah, I mean I don't like, if 560 00:37:01,640 --> 00:37:04,200 Speaker 1: you check organ donor or something like that on your 561 00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:08,480 Speaker 1: on your registration and your you know, your license or whatever, 562 00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:14,359 Speaker 1: does that mean does this qualify? I don't know, it's 563 00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:17,080 Speaker 1: it's sort of silly question, but I'm not intending it 564 00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:19,880 Speaker 1: to be. I just mean, you know, this is obviously 565 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:25,120 Speaker 1: extenuating circumstances when you know, desperate times and all of that. 566 00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:28,239 Speaker 1: I'm just wondering if there would be a way to 567 00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:31,839 Speaker 1: kind of like interpret that as you're an organ donor 568 00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:33,560 Speaker 1: or you know, when people say they're doing in their 569 00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:36,080 Speaker 1: body the science, I always like, what does that actually mean? 570 00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:38,120 Speaker 1: Is that some sort of like writ that you have 571 00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:42,120 Speaker 1: to create that says which you know exactly which research 572 00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:44,120 Speaker 1: lab you want to donate your body too for a 573 00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:46,160 Speaker 1: specific project? Or is it just more like what do 574 00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:50,239 Speaker 1: you need here? I am excuse me, right? I I 575 00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:54,160 Speaker 1: imagine there's some way uh to there there's some way 576 00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:58,640 Speaker 1: to specify uh cause or an experiment or an institution 577 00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:02,960 Speaker 1: to which you donate your body or parts of your body, 578 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:07,040 Speaker 1: But I I don't know. The closest experience I have 579 00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:13,360 Speaker 1: had with consensual donation of body parts has been I 580 00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:15,760 Speaker 1: went through a phase where I really wanted to donate 581 00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:19,759 Speaker 1: my left eye to uh to someone. But they're they're 582 00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:24,239 Speaker 1: understandably there there's some there's some legal hurdles. If you're 583 00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:26,280 Speaker 1: a guy who's just like I want to give away 584 00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:30,399 Speaker 1: one of my eyes, first question is like, well, who 585 00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:33,920 Speaker 1: do you want to give this cornea too? And if 586 00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:37,680 Speaker 1: your answer is I d k L O L. Then 587 00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:41,120 Speaker 1: they're understandably going to be a little bit weirded out. 588 00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:46,360 Speaker 1: But why did you not give away your eye? It 589 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:52,960 Speaker 1: got too complicated, honestly, that's the reason, okay. Uh. And 590 00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:56,200 Speaker 1: and also you know it's something that would still be 591 00:38:56,280 --> 00:39:00,600 Speaker 1: interested in doing. I mean, giving giving someone power of 592 00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:06,160 Speaker 1: site is an amazing thing, you know. Um. But also 593 00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:11,359 Speaker 1: I wear contacts, so it's like it's like it's it's 594 00:39:11,400 --> 00:39:15,480 Speaker 1: like giving away a car, right is my is my 595 00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:18,280 Speaker 1: eyes so bad that it would be like giving someone 596 00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:21,879 Speaker 1: a lemon, a beat up car that they really don't 597 00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:23,799 Speaker 1: want to drive, you know, and it just sits in 598 00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:27,840 Speaker 1: the driveway of their skull. Uh. That phrase the driveway 599 00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:32,880 Speaker 1: of your skull. Then that's incredible. But but lets let 600 00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,719 Speaker 1: us know about that. No, I think your question about 601 00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:39,120 Speaker 1: organ donation is is really interesting. I haven't thought about 602 00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:42,120 Speaker 1: it in that way. I know, you know, I don't 603 00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:44,720 Speaker 1: know about you guys, but I think most people our 604 00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:49,040 Speaker 1: age in this state become organ donors because they knock 605 00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:52,680 Speaker 1: a couple of bucks off the license gate exactly. And again, 606 00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:56,799 Speaker 1: it's all does come down to um as as so 607 00:39:56,920 --> 00:40:01,160 Speaker 1: much so often burial does uh to religious belief and 608 00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:04,960 Speaker 1: I think that's the greatest betrayal. You know, is in 609 00:40:04,960 --> 00:40:09,040 Speaker 1: a country where supposedly we prize people's right to exercise 610 00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:14,640 Speaker 1: their religious you know, freedom so highly to betray that trust, 611 00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:19,279 Speaker 1: you know, is is this pretty pretty uh egregious? And 612 00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:23,000 Speaker 1: this goes to our second, perhaps the most important point. 613 00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:29,720 Speaker 1: No one in this conspiracy saw themselves as villains, right. 614 00:40:30,280 --> 00:40:34,680 Speaker 1: Everybody is the protagonist of their story. And these people 615 00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:39,920 Speaker 1: who consider themselves good people, through through a series of 616 00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:47,279 Speaker 1: slippery sloops, found themselves stealing corpses of children, Which makes 617 00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:49,840 Speaker 1: you think what lengths would you go to if you 618 00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:54,080 Speaker 1: genuinely thought you were saving the world. In this case, 619 00:40:54,080 --> 00:40:59,440 Speaker 1: it was not a hypothetical question, and it's something you know. 620 00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:04,839 Speaker 1: It's it's easy to say that these people were monstrous, 621 00:41:04,960 --> 00:41:06,920 Speaker 1: but then you have to ask yourself, what would you 622 00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:09,920 Speaker 1: do in that situation? If you thought that you could 623 00:41:09,920 --> 00:41:14,440 Speaker 1: save billions of people by breaking, by bending them breaking 624 00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:17,759 Speaker 1: some ethical rules, would you do it? I mean, what 625 00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:20,879 Speaker 1: would you prefer to be haunted by? Is another way 626 00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:23,719 Speaker 1: to put it. Would you prefer to spend the rest 627 00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:27,520 Speaker 1: of your life knowing that you literally still corpses? Or 628 00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:30,560 Speaker 1: would you prefer to be haunted by the idea that 629 00:41:30,880 --> 00:41:36,120 Speaker 1: you could have saved the world and decided not to. 630 00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:39,160 Speaker 1: I don't. I don't know an easy way out of that. 631 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:41,480 Speaker 1: I don't know the solution there. It's a it's a 632 00:41:41,520 --> 00:41:44,799 Speaker 1: weird thing. I gotta tell you. I'm really torn. I'm 633 00:41:44,880 --> 00:41:47,520 Speaker 1: genuinely torn because I know if someone did that to 634 00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:50,000 Speaker 1: my son, like if he had just passed away and 635 00:41:50,040 --> 00:41:52,160 Speaker 1: parts of him were taken away, I would be furious. 636 00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:54,759 Speaker 1: I'd be I'd be going on a little hunt for 637 00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:58,840 Speaker 1: the hunt for the resurrection people who took parts of 638 00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:02,840 Speaker 1: my son. But it's also you know, scientifically, if you 639 00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:06,520 Speaker 1: take belief out of it, it's a dead body and 640 00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:10,200 Speaker 1: it really is something that you know could potentially help. 641 00:42:10,760 --> 00:42:13,000 Speaker 1: But at the same time, they're researching the effects of 642 00:42:13,080 --> 00:42:18,200 Speaker 1: nuclear weapons, uh, like these terrifying weapons that the research 643 00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:23,719 Speaker 1: isn't necessarily going to save anybody, right, I mean, if 644 00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:25,919 Speaker 1: it's a weapon and you just realize, well, we've got 645 00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:28,840 Speaker 1: to protect people from the effects of this weapon, you 646 00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:33,520 Speaker 1: don't you don't necessarily need to know how it affects 647 00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:39,600 Speaker 1: the human body. I don't know. Just like I said, though, 648 00:42:39,640 --> 00:42:41,839 Speaker 1: I mean, it's about like trying to figure out how 649 00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:44,799 Speaker 1: can we guard our population against the use of these 650 00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:47,440 Speaker 1: weapons by others? You know? And by the way, that 651 00:42:48,239 --> 00:42:50,400 Speaker 1: thing that I was struggling so desperately, remember, it's just 652 00:42:50,440 --> 00:42:54,399 Speaker 1: it's called uh potassium iodide, and it's just a pill 653 00:42:54,520 --> 00:42:58,759 Speaker 1: that blocks radioactive iodine from entering the thyroid. So not 654 00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:00,759 Speaker 1: quite the same thing. But you know, they might not 655 00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:04,040 Speaker 1: have known how that worked if they hadn't studied the 656 00:43:04,040 --> 00:43:07,080 Speaker 1: effects of that on the human body and knowing that 657 00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:12,160 Speaker 1: the thyroid absorbs that particular radioactive material. So I I 658 00:43:12,239 --> 00:43:15,280 Speaker 1: do get it. But also I'm when I wanted to 659 00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:19,200 Speaker 1: ask a question, ben, Um, did I miss this or why? So? 660 00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:22,600 Speaker 1: Why children specifically or was that just part of the 661 00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:24,759 Speaker 1: you know, part of the whole deal. They were just 662 00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:28,480 Speaker 1: some children involved. Yeah, it was just their vibe, I guess. No, 663 00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:32,960 Speaker 1: I'm kidding. I'm kidding. That's a horrible thing to say. Yeah. 664 00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:39,719 Speaker 1: The the issue was that children would be children of 665 00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:43,719 Speaker 1: this era, would be the first kids born after the 666 00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:48,640 Speaker 1: creation and deployment of nuclear weapons. So they like you 667 00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:51,960 Speaker 1: could if you took anybody was born before that time, 668 00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:55,360 Speaker 1: you would only see the effect of what happened to 669 00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:59,560 Speaker 1: them at that moment later in life when they were exposed, 670 00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:01,319 Speaker 1: you know, when then when they're like fifty years old 671 00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:05,080 Speaker 1: or something. But if you if you look at children, 672 00:44:05,239 --> 00:44:09,360 Speaker 1: you're looking at an organism that is new to the environment. 673 00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:12,920 Speaker 1: So it's it's kind of like the study of microplastics, right. 674 00:44:13,040 --> 00:44:16,279 Speaker 1: It was a big deal when scientists found out that 675 00:44:16,360 --> 00:44:22,000 Speaker 1: microplastics are occurring in human bodies while children are in 676 00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:24,400 Speaker 1: the womb, you know what I mean. That means that 677 00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:28,000 Speaker 1: it's already something that's with you from day zero. So 678 00:44:28,040 --> 00:44:31,560 Speaker 1: if you have a stillborn child and you're able to 679 00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:36,240 Speaker 1: test it for levels of things like strontium ninety, then 680 00:44:36,520 --> 00:44:40,360 Speaker 1: what you can learn is that you can learn basically 681 00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:46,520 Speaker 1: whether the radiation or the contamination is ubiquitous enough to 682 00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:51,759 Speaker 1: enter through another filter. So it's because remember kids just 683 00:44:51,840 --> 00:44:55,840 Speaker 1: being born. If it's born and it has traces of 684 00:44:55,880 --> 00:45:00,160 Speaker 1: contamination in it already, that means that this contaminant, ever 685 00:45:00,239 --> 00:45:03,760 Speaker 1: it is, be a microplastics or strontium ninety, has managed 686 00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:08,600 Speaker 1: to pass through another filter. It's gone from the environment, 687 00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:11,719 Speaker 1: maybe to an animal, a cow or whatever, into a 688 00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:15,440 Speaker 1: human that is burying a child, and then from that 689 00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:18,880 Speaker 1: human into the other human inside of them. So there's 690 00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:22,680 Speaker 1: there's a logic to it. But it's um, it's it's 691 00:45:22,760 --> 00:45:26,040 Speaker 1: kind of a soulless logic, I would argue, And you're right, 692 00:45:26,160 --> 00:45:29,000 Speaker 1: you know, it's hard to parse this. It's not something 693 00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:34,200 Speaker 1: with an easy answer, and it's startling. It should be 694 00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:39,440 Speaker 1: startling that investigations are kind of ongoing. You know, you 695 00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:42,920 Speaker 1: would think that this guy would get much more press coverage. 696 00:45:43,280 --> 00:45:45,000 Speaker 1: It was in it was in the New York Times 697 00:45:45,040 --> 00:45:46,760 Speaker 1: a couple of times. You would think that it got 698 00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:52,319 Speaker 1: um much more attention, or that the American public at 699 00:45:52,320 --> 00:45:56,520 Speaker 1: the very least, which would be putting more eyes on 700 00:45:57,200 --> 00:46:01,040 Speaker 1: these kind of classified projects that occur. But for now, 701 00:46:01,760 --> 00:46:05,240 Speaker 1: what we can say is it's a conspiracy. It really happened, 702 00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:08,640 Speaker 1: and something like this, based on what we know about 703 00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:15,160 Speaker 1: human psychology, could easily happen again. Uh, this is a 704 00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:18,000 Speaker 1: tragedy all around, you know what I mean. There's not 705 00:46:18,680 --> 00:46:23,120 Speaker 1: there's there's not an evil mad scientist in here. There's 706 00:46:23,360 --> 00:46:27,399 Speaker 1: there there's just like like it always is, there's there's 707 00:46:27,440 --> 00:46:31,919 Speaker 1: a massive terrified, frightened people who are doing their best 708 00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:35,920 Speaker 1: not to die. What a doubter. Okay, who's got jokes? 709 00:46:36,480 --> 00:46:39,520 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, no, I don't don't think I have any 710 00:46:39,560 --> 00:46:42,120 Speaker 1: jokes after that, doing their best not to die. That's 711 00:46:42,120 --> 00:46:44,439 Speaker 1: the most emo thing I've heard all week. But it's true. 712 00:46:44,480 --> 00:46:47,200 Speaker 1: It's all we're that's what we're all doing. Yeah, thankfully 713 00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:51,240 Speaker 1: it's gotten a little easier, I think. Ah, these days, 714 00:46:51,400 --> 00:46:53,759 Speaker 1: it's there's a lot of things trying to kill us, 715 00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:58,759 Speaker 1: no question about that. Um. But now I didn't know 716 00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:01,239 Speaker 1: about this project, and I have to say this, this 717 00:47:01,320 --> 00:47:03,680 Speaker 1: is such a cliche thing, but how come all of 718 00:47:03,719 --> 00:47:07,040 Speaker 1: these government projects that are like involving horrible things. I'll 719 00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:13,280 Speaker 1: have names like Operation Twinkle Toes and Operations Starfruit, Operations 720 00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:17,759 Speaker 1: capri Son, you know, like they're all horrible, horrible thing. 721 00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:21,040 Speaker 1: I understand why they do it. It's like to get 722 00:47:21,040 --> 00:47:24,040 Speaker 1: people off the set of like how absolutely horrible and 723 00:47:24,080 --> 00:47:27,360 Speaker 1: maniacal what's actually going on is? But it's it's definitely 724 00:47:27,600 --> 00:47:31,120 Speaker 1: an interesting dichotomy when you read about so many of these, right, Yeah, 725 00:47:31,200 --> 00:47:35,080 Speaker 1: I like to I know this is not true, but 726 00:47:35,640 --> 00:47:39,680 Speaker 1: I like to imagine that there is in every government 727 00:47:39,840 --> 00:47:44,480 Speaker 1: there's like one person, one lady, one guy, just some 728 00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:48,200 Speaker 1: generic dude whose entire job is to think up these names, 729 00:47:48,719 --> 00:47:51,120 Speaker 1: and like they get up, you know, they get to 730 00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:54,120 Speaker 1: the office eight or nine or whatever, and they've got 731 00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:57,879 Speaker 1: a list of crazy stuff that their government is doing. 732 00:47:58,280 --> 00:48:00,200 Speaker 1: And then they you know, like they lean back, they 733 00:48:00,239 --> 00:48:02,799 Speaker 1: have some coffee, and they're like, let's call this one 734 00:48:02,800 --> 00:48:08,000 Speaker 1: project Artichokes. I like artichokes, and then let's torture some people, 735 00:48:08,960 --> 00:48:12,319 Speaker 1: right right, And I, um, yeah, I don't know, I 736 00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:14,960 Speaker 1: don't know the process. I know it can change. You know, 737 00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:20,000 Speaker 1: sometimes they really like acronyms or initialisms and then yeah, 738 00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:25,080 Speaker 1: like like you said, no, sometimes it's it seems purposefully misleading. 739 00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:29,480 Speaker 1: Like if we ever hear about a top secret government 740 00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:33,600 Speaker 1: project that's been declassified and its name is like Project 741 00:48:34,280 --> 00:48:39,080 Speaker 1: Fuzzy Warm Times, and that's clearly evil, right, gotta be 742 00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:42,759 Speaker 1: gotta be the most evil one. The more snuggly the name, 743 00:48:43,160 --> 00:48:47,880 Speaker 1: the more evil of the project. Um, that's my theory. Um. 744 00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:49,720 Speaker 1: But no, no, this is something that I think everyone 745 00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:53,640 Speaker 1: should know about. Um, certainly a dark period and history 746 00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:57,280 Speaker 1: in general, but also in like weird government conspiracies. And 747 00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:01,560 Speaker 1: it's far from the only example. We'd like to know 748 00:49:02,040 --> 00:49:05,359 Speaker 1: what you think, what lengths would you go to if 749 00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:09,360 Speaker 1: you genuinely thought you were saving the world. Uh, let 750 00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:13,200 Speaker 1: us know if you have experience with other similar stories 751 00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:16,880 Speaker 1: in your neck of the global woods. Obviously being based 752 00:49:16,880 --> 00:49:19,840 Speaker 1: in the US, we see a lot of stuff that 753 00:49:19,920 --> 00:49:23,880 Speaker 1: emerges from the US specifically, but that doesn't mean that 754 00:49:23,960 --> 00:49:29,000 Speaker 1: other countries aren't also doing dastardly things. We want to 755 00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:31,640 Speaker 1: hear from you as always. You're the most important part 756 00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:33,719 Speaker 1: of the show, so let us know. We try to 757 00:49:33,719 --> 00:49:36,359 Speaker 1: be easy to find online. You can find us on 758 00:49:36,360 --> 00:49:39,480 Speaker 1: Facebook and Twitter, where we are conspiracy Stuff. On Instagram 759 00:49:39,520 --> 00:49:42,960 Speaker 1: we are Conspiracy Stuff Show. You can find us on 760 00:49:43,000 --> 00:49:47,319 Speaker 1: YouTube where hey, we're conspiracy stuff again. Check it out. 761 00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:49,600 Speaker 1: And hey, while you're on the internet, why don't you 762 00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:52,440 Speaker 1: pop over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a glowing 763 00:49:52,520 --> 00:49:54,319 Speaker 1: review you know you want to, and if it makes 764 00:49:54,400 --> 00:49:58,480 Speaker 1: us all smile collectively in our hearts, um, then we 765 00:49:58,719 --> 00:50:01,120 Speaker 1: will read it on one of our our episodes. Yeah, 766 00:50:01,200 --> 00:50:03,359 Speaker 1: of course, I mean, if you if you feel like 767 00:50:03,840 --> 00:50:05,839 Speaker 1: if you feel like saying, I love how these guys 768 00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:09,880 Speaker 1: always ruined my day with these stories, probably not going 769 00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:11,520 Speaker 1: to read that one. Well maybe now that's a that's 770 00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:14,640 Speaker 1: a positive. I see what you did there, Ben, And 771 00:50:14,719 --> 00:50:17,400 Speaker 1: if you're not a person who really SIPs the social meds, 772 00:50:17,440 --> 00:50:19,879 Speaker 1: we totally get it. Why not give us a call 773 00:50:20,120 --> 00:50:24,080 Speaker 1: where one eight three three st d w y t 774 00:50:24,320 --> 00:50:28,160 Speaker 1: K three minutes. Those minutes belong to you. Let us 775 00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:31,320 Speaker 1: know what's on your mind, give us a cool nickname 776 00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:34,440 Speaker 1: to call you, and most importantly, let us know if 777 00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:38,319 Speaker 1: it's okay to use your voice or your name on air. 778 00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:41,200 Speaker 1: If you feel like three minutes is not enough time, 779 00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:43,319 Speaker 1: we totally get it. Please don't feel like you have 780 00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:46,120 Speaker 1: to censor or edit yourself. You can tell us your 781 00:50:46,160 --> 00:50:49,160 Speaker 1: story in full, write it out, send us a good 782 00:50:49,160 --> 00:50:52,439 Speaker 1: old fashioned email where we are conspiracy and I heart 783 00:50:52,520 --> 00:51:13,279 Speaker 1: radio dot com m m H. Stuff they don't want 784 00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:15,680 Speaker 1: you to know is a production of I Heart Radio. 785 00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:18,239 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit the i 786 00:51:18,320 --> 00:51:21,239 Speaker 1: heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to 787 00:51:21,239 --> 00:51:22,040 Speaker 1: your favorite shows.