1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,840 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Tutor Dixon Podcast. Today. I want to 2 00:00:02,880 --> 00:00:06,160 Speaker 1: dig into all things Middle East because I think many 3 00:00:06,280 --> 00:00:08,840 Speaker 1: of us are learning all about this region of the world, 4 00:00:09,119 --> 00:00:11,319 Speaker 1: and I see a lot of people on social media 5 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:14,880 Speaker 1: making assessments of the situation. But one thing I've noticed 6 00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:18,920 Speaker 1: is that they're making those assessments from a very Western perspective. 7 00:00:19,160 --> 00:00:21,680 Speaker 1: And while I know that we're going to talk today 8 00:00:21,680 --> 00:00:25,720 Speaker 1: about Israel being a very westernized country, that is not 9 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:28,320 Speaker 1: the case for the entire Middle East. So I think 10 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:31,440 Speaker 1: it's crucial for us to understand the culture in the 11 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: Middle East surrounding Israel and Israel. So we decided that 12 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 1: the best way to do that was to chat with 13 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 1: a gentleman who can break down everything that's happening in 14 00:00:39,840 --> 00:00:42,200 Speaker 1: the Middle East and why some of these hot takes 15 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:45,239 Speaker 1: in the US are way off based. Are bringing in 16 00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 1: David Wormser. He is a senior analyst for Middle East 17 00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:52,960 Speaker 1: Affairs at the Center for Security Policy. He previously served 18 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:56,400 Speaker 1: as a senior advisor to Ambassador John Bolden and Vice 19 00:00:56,440 --> 00:00:58,880 Speaker 1: President Dick Cheney. David, Welcome to the podcast. 20 00:00:59,720 --> 00:01:01,920 Speaker 2: Thank you, and it's a pleasure and honor to be 21 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:02,440 Speaker 2: here with you. 22 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:05,560 Speaker 1: Thank you so much. I know you're just getting back 23 00:01:05,600 --> 00:01:09,480 Speaker 1: from Israel yourself, and you were there throughout the whole 24 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:12,640 Speaker 1: entire conflict. You got there about a day before this started. 25 00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:15,160 Speaker 1: But you were telling me, sharing with me that you're 26 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:17,520 Speaker 1: there with all of these families, and it's just like 27 00:01:17,600 --> 00:01:20,760 Speaker 1: being in the United States. This is a very westernized 28 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 1: country within the Middle East, within really the Arab world, 29 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 1: surrounded by a culture that is not very much like ours. 30 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:29,720 Speaker 1: But tell us a little bit about Israel. 31 00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:33,440 Speaker 2: Well, sure, I mean, it's it's not a very large country. 32 00:01:33,480 --> 00:01:35,800 Speaker 2: It's only about ten million people, of which about eight 33 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:38,920 Speaker 2: million all well, it's nine million people. About wh's seven 34 00:01:38,959 --> 00:01:42,199 Speaker 2: million are Jews, so about eighty percent, But there's twenty 35 00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 2: percent which are Muslim Arabs. There's Christian Arabs, Christians who 36 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:50,600 Speaker 2: more and more do not consider themselves Arabs. They are Drus, 37 00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:54,800 Speaker 2: which is an ancient Middle East sect. There are others 38 00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:58,840 Speaker 2: as well, and they're all citizens and they all vote, 39 00:01:58,920 --> 00:02:02,000 Speaker 2: and they even have part in parliament. So it looks 40 00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:05,160 Speaker 2: like a very functional western country, and it is. It 41 00:02:05,200 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 2: has all the services you'd expect. It's a fairly wealthy country. 42 00:02:09,320 --> 00:02:14,960 Speaker 2: It's per capita income is surpassed Japan and Britain's and 43 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 2: is now creeping over the line with Germany's. So it's 44 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 2: a very well to do well functioning Western country, much 45 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:28,600 Speaker 2: like San Diego is. But then it is the Middle East. 46 00:02:28,639 --> 00:02:30,680 Speaker 2: It's at the edge of the Middle East, and Israelis 47 00:02:30,720 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 2: themselves often forget that, and maybe that's part of what 48 00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:41,440 Speaker 2: just happened. Is they imagine themselves to be departed from 49 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:44,240 Speaker 2: the mentality of the Middle East, and they project that 50 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:47,920 Speaker 2: onto their neighbors and it leads to breakdowns, which is 51 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:51,960 Speaker 2: what we just may be seeing. So any rate, so 52 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:55,440 Speaker 2: Israel is like that, but now it's at war. So 53 00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 2: it's very much kind of a surreal environment at the moment. 54 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:02,000 Speaker 2: Usually it's like being in San Diego. 55 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:07,040 Speaker 1: So explain to us a little bit about the territory there. 56 00:03:07,080 --> 00:03:09,800 Speaker 1: I know, in nineteen sixty seven, I believe it was, 57 00:03:09,880 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 1: there was a war where Syria and Lebanon ended up 58 00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:17,880 Speaker 1: with harsh parts of what was Israel, and then it 59 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:21,640 Speaker 1: sounds like Egypt ended up being in control of Gaza. 60 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:23,680 Speaker 1: But Gaza seems to still be a part of Israel. 61 00:03:23,800 --> 00:03:25,679 Speaker 1: And so I think we're all a little bit confused 62 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:29,840 Speaker 1: about this what this argument is about, because we're hearing 63 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:34,600 Speaker 1: a lot about oppressors, and we're hearing a lot about colonists, 64 00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:38,000 Speaker 1: and you know they are on stolen land and all 65 00:03:38,040 --> 00:03:41,520 Speaker 1: of this, But tell us exactly what the breakdown is 66 00:03:41,560 --> 00:03:44,240 Speaker 1: and why there is Gaza and Israel and what the 67 00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 1: difference is. 68 00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 2: Sure, you know one thing right off the bat is 69 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:52,160 Speaker 2: that the Jewish people, the whole point of Israel is 70 00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:55,280 Speaker 2: the Jewish people, after two thousand years of exile, came back. 71 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:59,360 Speaker 2: So they are the original indigenous population. And there's lots 72 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:03,480 Speaker 2: of proof of it for everything from DNA to archaeology, 73 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:08,800 Speaker 2: language linguistics, et cetera, et cetera. And there was a 74 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:14,240 Speaker 2: contiguous or continuous Jewish presence throughout There were times that 75 00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:18,720 Speaker 2: was very thin, only a couple thousand, and sometimes it 76 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:21,240 Speaker 2: was even an outright majority, like it was up until 77 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:26,799 Speaker 2: the fourth century. But Jews have always been there, and moreover, 78 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:32,640 Speaker 2: they never, even when they were in the diaspora, stopped 79 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:35,280 Speaker 2: dreaming of going back. It was a central element of 80 00:04:35,360 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 2: Judaism as the return. So it is very much an 81 00:04:39,360 --> 00:04:43,040 Speaker 2: indigenous population that considers that land its land. To really 82 00:04:43,040 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 2: go to the history of it, we can do it 83 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:47,560 Speaker 2: late in twenty seconds, basically in nineteen twenty the League 84 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:50,479 Speaker 2: of Nations after World War One. The land had not 85 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:53,839 Speaker 2: been the sovereign a sovereign state of anybody in the 86 00:04:53,880 --> 00:04:56,440 Speaker 2: two thousand years since the Jewish exile was always a 87 00:04:56,440 --> 00:05:01,719 Speaker 2: province of an empire, whether it's Roman Empire, Teen Empire, Persia, whatever, 88 00:05:01,880 --> 00:05:04,320 Speaker 2: it was always a province of The Arab Empire was 89 00:05:04,360 --> 00:05:08,719 Speaker 2: a province until nineteen nineteen when the Ottoman Empire collapsed 90 00:05:08,720 --> 00:05:11,400 Speaker 2: and the British took over, and they took over under 91 00:05:11,440 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 2: what's called a mandate, which is they were mandated to 92 00:05:13,800 --> 00:05:16,320 Speaker 2: take the territory as a trust to create a state. 93 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:18,840 Speaker 2: And the mandate said there should be a Jewish state 94 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:22,480 Speaker 2: there because the deed to the land belongs to the 95 00:05:22,560 --> 00:05:26,479 Speaker 2: Jewish people. So and it defined the area which is 96 00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 2: roughly what Israel is today. In nineteen forty eight, after 97 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:35,159 Speaker 2: much internal fighting because of the internal Arab population that 98 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 2: had grown a lot in that period, the Jewish population 99 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:41,359 Speaker 2: which started seeing return from the diaspora, especially after World 100 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:44,440 Speaker 2: War II in the Holocaust, you started seeing the internal 101 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:49,560 Speaker 2: fighting escalate, and the UN basically said, you know what, 102 00:05:49,640 --> 00:05:53,000 Speaker 2: let's just cut the land in half. And did the 103 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:56,000 Speaker 2: Arabs get this? The Jews get that. The Jews said, yes, 104 00:05:56,080 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 2: we accept that state. Anything great, we have our state back. 105 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:02,279 Speaker 2: It was about forty percent of the land the Arabs 106 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:05,839 Speaker 2: would get about sixty The Arabs said no. They did 107 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:10,640 Speaker 2: an internal uprising and every Arab nation bordering Israel invaded 108 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 2: to wipe it out, and that started the process of 109 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:17,880 Speaker 2: continuous warfare and no recognition. And sixty seven all the 110 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:22,240 Speaker 2: Arab armies gathered to wipe Israel out. But Israel won 111 00:06:22,680 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 2: and took the remainder of that territory from the partition 112 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 2: of nineteen forty eight and essentially completely took possession of 113 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:37,000 Speaker 2: the Mandate, and the air world essentially said yeah, but 114 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:39,480 Speaker 2: we will not recognize you, not talk to you, and 115 00:06:39,520 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 2: never make peace. The three nos, no, no, no, And 116 00:06:43,880 --> 00:06:46,160 Speaker 2: that was the case until Egypt made peace, and then 117 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 2: Jordan made peace. And then two years ago, three years ago, 118 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:53,840 Speaker 2: under the Trump administration, a series of countries about four 119 00:06:53,920 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 2: or five made peace with Israel and the Abraham Accords. 120 00:06:56,960 --> 00:07:01,320 Speaker 2: Saudi Arabia was on the verge of making peace. Egypt 121 00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:03,760 Speaker 2: and Jordan, two countries bordering Israel, are at peace. So 122 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:08,800 Speaker 2: you really had a slow grinding movement toward acceptance of 123 00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:11,560 Speaker 2: Israel as a legitimate country in the region, and that's 124 00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:15,600 Speaker 2: where we are now. The Palestinians, Palestinian Arabs, those Arabs 125 00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:20,400 Speaker 2: that lived in Israel before nineteen forty eight, and those 126 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:22,880 Speaker 2: are the ones who live in Gaza, the West Bank, 127 00:07:22,920 --> 00:07:26,680 Speaker 2: which is what biblically is called Juday and Samaria, and 128 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 2: they're not part of Israel because it's territory that the 129 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 2: Israelis haven't asserted their sovereignty over, even though it is 130 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:36,120 Speaker 2: part of the mandate that was given them. Because of 131 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 2: demographic reasons, they don't want to absorb it because if 132 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:41,800 Speaker 2: you become part of Israel, you get full rights, you 133 00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 2: can vote, you do all those things. So the Israelis 134 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:49,920 Speaker 2: don't want to absorb a population that would make themselves 135 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:54,920 Speaker 2: only a fifty or sixty percent majority. So they're not 136 00:07:54,960 --> 00:07:57,480 Speaker 2: sure what to do with that land because it's theirs, 137 00:07:57,520 --> 00:08:01,800 Speaker 2: but it's also very well, I don't want to say 138 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:05,880 Speaker 2: it's theirs. It's land that's considered of disputed sovereignty, so 139 00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:10,760 Speaker 2: it's nobody's but the mandate had given it to them. 140 00:08:11,120 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 1: But do they have some sort of control over it, 141 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:16,440 Speaker 1: because we're hearing that they're stopping supplies from going in 142 00:08:16,480 --> 00:08:19,160 Speaker 1: there and water and electricity and all that. So how 143 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 1: does that work on the ground. 144 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:24,480 Speaker 2: Right, So there's two categories here. I didn't mention the 145 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 2: Oslo Accords as a peace treaty because it was it 146 00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 2: turned into anything but peace. But in nineteen ninety three, 147 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:35,240 Speaker 2: the Israelis said, you know what, we can't keep controlling 148 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 2: all these Arabs, but we can't quite give up all 149 00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:41,880 Speaker 2: the territories. So they cut a deal with the arch enemy, 150 00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:44,920 Speaker 2: the Palestinian Liberation Order Organization, which was very much a 151 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:48,120 Speaker 2: Soviet orient one of these classic chig of Art like 152 00:08:48,200 --> 00:08:51,920 Speaker 2: liberation organizations. The Israeli said, you know what, we'll give you. 153 00:08:52,040 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 2: We'll give you control of all the population areas. And 154 00:08:54,559 --> 00:08:57,160 Speaker 2: they gave up about thirty percent of the territory and 155 00:08:57,240 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 2: all of Gaza to the PLO and said, you know what, 156 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:03,160 Speaker 2: you run your lives, you run your police, you run everything. 157 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:06,040 Speaker 2: Just no foreign policy that you weres you're not a 158 00:09:06,080 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 2: sovereign country. But every other element is self wrong with 159 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 2: the idea of eventually creating a sovereign country. And the 160 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:18,440 Speaker 2: moment the Israelis withdrew from territory, it became essentially a 161 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:22,720 Speaker 2: spring board for terrorism. So ninety three was the Oscolo course. 162 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:26,000 Speaker 2: By ninety five, Israel was facing hundreds dead by terrorism 163 00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 2: a year. They were down to five to ten before that, 164 00:09:30,559 --> 00:09:34,319 Speaker 2: and by two thousand and three it just completely collapsed, exploded. 165 00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:38,640 Speaker 2: Israel lost almost a thousand people in two weeks to terrorism, 166 00:09:39,520 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 2: and they essentially had to tighten their control. They didn't 167 00:09:42,520 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 2: give take back control of the cities, but they tightened 168 00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:52,400 Speaker 2: their control and used hot pursuit pretty free handedly after that. 169 00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:55,600 Speaker 2: So if they see a terrorist or see terrorism emerging 170 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:58,120 Speaker 2: in the West Bank, they go in, which is why 171 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 2: you did not see very much violence this round from 172 00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 2: the West Bank, because it just was never allowed to grow. Goza. However, 173 00:10:07,679 --> 00:10:10,319 Speaker 2: nineteen in two thousand and five, the Israeli said, you 174 00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:14,640 Speaker 2: know what, it's so populated, it's so concentrated, it is 175 00:10:14,840 --> 00:10:16,960 Speaker 2: just not ever going to be part of Israel. Just 176 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:19,839 Speaker 2: give it up, walk away, build a wall around it, 177 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:23,679 Speaker 2: and let Egypt take it. Let it become independent, let 178 00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 2: it do what it once. And they thought they could 179 00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:29,080 Speaker 2: handle it, and that they couldn't. That became now not 180 00:10:29,160 --> 00:10:32,560 Speaker 2: only a springboard for terrorism, but essentially an army, an 181 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:34,559 Speaker 2: advanced army for the Iranians. 182 00:10:34,720 --> 00:10:37,480 Speaker 1: Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on 183 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:42,880 Speaker 1: a Tutor Dixon podcast. You know, we hear about the 184 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 1: fighting back and forth. You talked about it being kind 185 00:10:45,520 --> 00:10:49,240 Speaker 1: of an understanding in Israel that you hear the sirens, 186 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:51,320 Speaker 1: you have ninety seconds to get into a safe room, 187 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:55,960 Speaker 1: that there's always a fear of missiles coming in. But 188 00:10:56,360 --> 00:11:00,360 Speaker 1: how did this attack happen? It seems like were this 189 00:11:00,440 --> 00:11:03,679 Speaker 1: attack to happen, for them to somehow get through all 190 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:08,080 Speaker 1: of their defenses, come in with these paratroopers, exact this 191 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:13,560 Speaker 1: kind of horrific attack against the Israeli people that would 192 00:11:13,640 --> 00:11:17,920 Speaker 1: take millions of dollars, if not billions of dollars and 193 00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:19,160 Speaker 1: years of planning. 194 00:11:19,920 --> 00:11:24,280 Speaker 2: Yes, well, the Hamasa's wash a wash with money. It 195 00:11:24,280 --> 00:11:27,640 Speaker 2: gets money from Qatar. It gets most of its money 196 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:32,440 Speaker 2: almost I've heard up to ninety some percent from Iran, 197 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:37,240 Speaker 2: and it also gets money from the United States, the Europeans, 198 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:42,640 Speaker 2: the UN supposedly as humanitarian aid, which is good natured 199 00:11:42,840 --> 00:11:46,600 Speaker 2: and intent, but we saw the United States gave a 200 00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 2: lot of money in the last two three years to 201 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:52,960 Speaker 2: lay down new water pipes in Gaza so that everybody 202 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 2: would have fresh and good water. And Hamas dug up 203 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:58,720 Speaker 2: those pipes, cut them to pieces and are using them 204 00:11:58,760 --> 00:12:00,120 Speaker 2: for missile fuselages. 205 00:12:00,920 --> 00:12:03,240 Speaker 1: So that oh lovely. 206 00:12:03,520 --> 00:12:06,319 Speaker 2: Yeah, so you see how this is the money is diverted, 207 00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:12,120 Speaker 2: and really Gaza is food with poverty, except for of 208 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:15,800 Speaker 2: course the leadership which is living quite handsomely, but also 209 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:18,760 Speaker 2: the huge amounts of money and resources to go to 210 00:12:18,800 --> 00:12:21,440 Speaker 2: building an army. So that's where all the money goes. 211 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:23,920 Speaker 2: It's the building an army. It doesn't go to feeding people, 212 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:29,560 Speaker 2: creating jobs, infrastructure of any meaningfulness for the population. It's 213 00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:35,360 Speaker 2: all about the military, the Hamas military to attack Israel. 214 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 2: So that's where all the money goes. But it's a 215 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:40,360 Speaker 2: lot of money from a lot of sources, including Iran. 216 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:45,720 Speaker 2: We are talking billions and billions of dollars, and that's 217 00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:49,280 Speaker 2: of course a big question. Why didn't anybody cut it off. 218 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:54,360 Speaker 1: It seems as though this is not going away anytime soon. 219 00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 1: Obviously Israel it still has hostages over there. They want 220 00:12:57,559 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 1: to get them back. They want to exactly the avenge. 221 00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:04,439 Speaker 1: But you see, now Hasbola is coming in, they are 222 00:13:04,880 --> 00:13:07,160 Speaker 1: looking like they're going to get more involved in this. 223 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:12,359 Speaker 1: Hamasa is still sending over missiles on a daily basis. 224 00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:16,240 Speaker 1: If they have this. If they are so flush with money, 225 00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:19,240 Speaker 1: how does Israel fight back? And I know, we see 226 00:13:19,240 --> 00:13:20,640 Speaker 1: a lot of people in the United States saying, we 227 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:22,920 Speaker 1: don't want to get involved. We have this kind of 228 00:13:22,960 --> 00:13:25,280 Speaker 1: America first attitude now and a lot of people think 229 00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:28,280 Speaker 1: that America first means that we are just all about America. 230 00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:31,920 Speaker 1: We don't engage. You have stated that you believe that 231 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:35,280 Speaker 1: Israel should fight this war and they should be the 232 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:38,080 Speaker 1: ones to defeat them so that they can show that 233 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:40,640 Speaker 1: they have force. Are they able to do that? 234 00:13:41,679 --> 00:13:45,160 Speaker 2: Yeah? You know, you've raised a lot of really excellent 235 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:49,559 Speaker 2: points here. And the first one is, and this is 236 00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:53,439 Speaker 2: a warning for Americans. Israel was asleep. We said it's 237 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:56,760 Speaker 2: sort of a Western country. They think like Western country. 238 00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:01,920 Speaker 2: They did not imagine their attitude. As you know, guys, 239 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:05,520 Speaker 2: has less than two million people. It's pretty poor as 240 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:08,200 Speaker 2: a whole. Even with all this money coming in. How 241 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:11,520 Speaker 2: big can Hamas build an army, and that army against 242 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:15,880 Speaker 2: the modern Western army that is so powerful and much larger, 243 00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:19,400 Speaker 2: I mean. And then the Israelis also open up the 244 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:22,880 Speaker 2: borders for laborers to come across into Israel, tens of 245 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:27,120 Speaker 2: thousands a day from Gaza so they thought, there's economics 246 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:31,680 Speaker 2: is developing. They're giving them the access to Israel's economy 247 00:14:32,720 --> 00:14:37,160 Speaker 2: much larger and more powerful. What interest, what interest possibly 248 00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:41,440 Speaker 2: conceivably could Hamas have to do something like this? So 249 00:14:41,480 --> 00:14:44,240 Speaker 2: the Israelis fell asleep and they let this build and 250 00:14:44,280 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 2: build and build and build, and with each round it 251 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:50,120 Speaker 2: was like a whack them all. They whack Thamas back 252 00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:53,000 Speaker 2: down and they say, now they learned their lesson. And 253 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:55,520 Speaker 2: in the end we saw how much they did learn 254 00:14:55,560 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 2: their lesson, which is not at all. And the Israelis 255 00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 2: are facing a very very difficult circumstance now. So and 256 00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 2: I think this is a microcosm for the West, is 257 00:15:06,680 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 2: that we project to the world and we don't quite 258 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:14,360 Speaker 2: understand that there is a threat emerging globally that we're 259 00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:18,360 Speaker 2: kind of asleep toward. This is really the local man. 260 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 1: I feel like you're talking about the United States when 261 00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 1: you say this, because I can see the same thing 262 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:26,520 Speaker 1: applying to us as well. 263 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:30,240 Speaker 2: Right, It's like Tolkien in The Lord of the Rings. 264 00:15:30,240 --> 00:15:34,080 Speaker 2: There's a sleepless malice that stirs and you feel it. 265 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:37,040 Speaker 2: You feel it. Whether it's China and Russian, you feel it, 266 00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:41,520 Speaker 2: whether it's Iran, or whether it's North Korea or Venezuela 267 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:45,560 Speaker 2: or Bogotan. Now with the Narco terrorists there, you feel 268 00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:50,880 Speaker 2: that there's this crowd out there that is stirring and 269 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:54,480 Speaker 2: it means ill for the West, and it feels America's 270 00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:58,400 Speaker 2: limping and it's challenging the system at the edges. Now 271 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 2: Israel is the edge, so that's where you see the challenge. 272 00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:04,680 Speaker 2: But it's really I think a part of the larger 273 00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:08,840 Speaker 2: one larger challenge emerging in the West, and the Israelis 274 00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:13,320 Speaker 2: suffered every single illness the West has. The kids didn't 275 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:16,840 Speaker 2: ever think they'd fight wars. They're more warriors, you know, 276 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:20,760 Speaker 2: just very much like Western kids had all these weird 277 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:23,200 Speaker 2: ideas et cetera, et cetera. 278 00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:26,080 Speaker 1: And I mean even when we see the kids that 279 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:29,720 Speaker 1: were at that festival, they were celebrating peace and they 280 00:16:29,760 --> 00:16:32,680 Speaker 1: were it sounds like a lot of these areas that 281 00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:35,280 Speaker 1: were invaded were like, we're going to make peace with 282 00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:38,360 Speaker 1: these folks, and they felt like they were going to 283 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:42,760 Speaker 1: be the next generation to bring everyone together. And that 284 00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:44,400 Speaker 1: must have been a big wake up call. 285 00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:47,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a big wake up call. And many of 286 00:16:47,760 --> 00:16:50,960 Speaker 2: them now are in uniform and on the border. So 287 00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 2: those that survived there was in that peace festival that 288 00:16:56,240 --> 00:16:59,440 Speaker 2: was where the greatest death was about two hundred and 289 00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:02,560 Speaker 2: seventy people I think in that concert. But any rate, 290 00:17:02,680 --> 00:17:06,560 Speaker 2: so you do see that sort of reality collapse that 291 00:17:06,600 --> 00:17:09,760 Speaker 2: the Israelis have. So now they're trying to deal with 292 00:17:09,800 --> 00:17:12,840 Speaker 2: this reality collapse. What do you do about Guaza? I mean, 293 00:17:12,880 --> 00:17:18,119 Speaker 2: this is a populated area urban warfare, so they're trying 294 00:17:18,119 --> 00:17:21,520 Speaker 2: to warn the population in the north of Gaza go south. 295 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:24,399 Speaker 2: By the way, we're not talking very large areas. Israel 296 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 2: as a whole is only about this includes the West 297 00:17:28,080 --> 00:17:32,400 Speaker 2: Bank and Gaza. Israel and the West Bank and Gaza wide, 298 00:17:32,520 --> 00:17:35,880 Speaker 2: it's only about sixty to seventy miles from very well 299 00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:38,640 Speaker 2: to the very bottom of Israel is only about two 300 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:42,879 Speaker 2: hundred miles, So you're talking about a whole country, the 301 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:46,080 Speaker 2: whole conflict in a state about the size of Connecticut. 302 00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 2: So Gaza is much smaller than that. It's part of 303 00:17:50,840 --> 00:17:54,920 Speaker 2: that equation. So the Israelis told north Gaza to move 304 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:58,200 Speaker 2: south so that they don't have to do urban warfare. 305 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:02,000 Speaker 2: But Jamas essentially is threatening the population that they'll kill 306 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:04,919 Speaker 2: them if they move south. So because they use them 307 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:09,120 Speaker 2: essentially as a human shield. So the Israelis are really 308 00:18:09,160 --> 00:18:11,600 Speaker 2: in a very difficult place. But then you also have 309 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:15,800 Speaker 2: the larger realization the Israelis had, which is why didn't 310 00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:22,320 Speaker 2: deterrence work? What Hamas must have known that Israel's reaction 311 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:25,239 Speaker 2: after this is going to be to destroy them. So 312 00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:29,240 Speaker 2: why did they do it? Who commit suicide? And the 313 00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:33,880 Speaker 2: answer that the Israelis feel is like a suicide bomber 314 00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 2: does what he does and you can't deter him to 315 00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 2: advance the strategic goals of the terrorist organization. There are 316 00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:46,560 Speaker 2: suicide terrorist organizations that operate to advance the strategic goals 317 00:18:46,920 --> 00:18:51,000 Speaker 2: of their patrons, which in this case is Iran. So 318 00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:54,680 Speaker 2: the Israelis look at this not as a Palestinian Israeli 319 00:18:54,800 --> 00:18:58,920 Speaker 2: or even as a Hamas Israeli fight. They look at 320 00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:03,760 Speaker 2: it as the local part of an Iranian Israeli fight. Specifically, 321 00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:08,600 Speaker 2: the Iranian regime is the Israelis really they have a 322 00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:12,919 Speaker 2: lot of connections with the Iranian opposition, the uprising in 323 00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:15,400 Speaker 2: Iran and so forth. They're working very closely a lot 324 00:19:15,440 --> 00:19:18,080 Speaker 2: with them and so forth. So there's a lot of 325 00:19:18,359 --> 00:19:22,879 Speaker 2: people to people interactions. But the government of Iran of 326 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:25,919 Speaker 2: the Ayatolas and Israel. Of course there are mortal enemies, 327 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:29,280 Speaker 2: so these really see that to be one of the 328 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:33,159 Speaker 2: one of the main strategic points here. And if that's 329 00:19:33,200 --> 00:19:35,359 Speaker 2: the case, then the sort of war they have to 330 00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:40,760 Speaker 2: fight is far bigger and broader than just Gaza. And 331 00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 2: that is where the Israelis are right now. They're essentially 332 00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 2: collapsing what would be normally a ten year strategic debate, contemplation, 333 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:53,720 Speaker 2: public argument, and they have to make decisions within a 334 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:57,680 Speaker 2: week or two weeks that normally take nations a decade 335 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:02,040 Speaker 2: to make that shape their strategic confine. But one of 336 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:05,320 Speaker 2: the things they do realize is that their image of 337 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 2: power has been shattered. They're in a region where the 338 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:14,879 Speaker 2: strong horse and not a lame donkey survives. That peace 339 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:18,359 Speaker 2: with their Arab neighbors was in part anchored to the 340 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:22,479 Speaker 2: idea that their Arab neighbors felt threatened by Iran and others, 341 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:24,960 Speaker 2: and they saw Israel as a strong horse that was 342 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:28,920 Speaker 2: consistent and to some extent even replacing America as America 343 00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:31,880 Speaker 2: withdrew some of its power from the region. So they 344 00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:35,960 Speaker 2: understand both peace and war now rides on their ability 345 00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:39,520 Speaker 2: to restore their image of power, and they're not sure 346 00:20:39,560 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 2: that they can do that strictly by defeating Hamas. They 347 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:46,920 Speaker 2: think they really need to end this war ultimately by 348 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:52,159 Speaker 2: throwing Iran itself on the strategic defense and taking the 349 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:53,040 Speaker 2: war to Iran. 350 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:56,000 Speaker 1: Let's take a quick commercial break. We'll continue next on 351 00:20:56,040 --> 00:21:02,639 Speaker 1: a Tutor Dixon podcast. In the last what two and 352 00:21:02,680 --> 00:21:06,000 Speaker 1: a half years, they've been able to amass tens of 353 00:21:06,119 --> 00:21:10,280 Speaker 1: billions of dollars through oil production. And how much of 354 00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:14,879 Speaker 1: that is because of the change in our oil policies 355 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:16,280 Speaker 1: in the United States. 356 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:18,359 Speaker 2: Oh, I think a lot of this has a lot 357 00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:20,760 Speaker 2: to do with that. Two years ago, two and a 358 00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:24,640 Speaker 2: half years ago, Iran had been choked to death, essentially 359 00:21:24,720 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 2: the regime that you heard demonstrators across Iran screaming no 360 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:33,199 Speaker 2: to Gaza, No to Lebanon, where his Bala is another 361 00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:37,200 Speaker 2: front in this war, not of his Bala, No to Gaza, 362 00:21:37,760 --> 00:21:40,520 Speaker 2: No to Yemen, which is yet another front. Yemen tried 363 00:21:40,520 --> 00:21:43,480 Speaker 2: to send missiles into Israel. Yemen, which is almost two 364 00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:48,320 Speaker 2: thousand miles away south of Saudi Arabia. So you heard 365 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:51,879 Speaker 2: Iranian say no to Yemen, no to Gaza, no money. 366 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 2: You know, Iran for Iranians which meant we don't want 367 00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:57,159 Speaker 2: to waste. We're poor, we want our money for ourselves. 368 00:21:57,240 --> 00:22:00,200 Speaker 2: We're starving. We don't want to sacrifice for all these 369 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:04,400 Speaker 2: people all over Iran. For Iranians, essentially an Iran first 370 00:22:04,520 --> 00:22:07,600 Speaker 2: sentiment among the population, they were angry at their government, 371 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:11,000 Speaker 2: and the government was becoming bankrupt. It was down to 372 00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:15,199 Speaker 2: four billion dollars of foreign reserves, which is nothing really, 373 00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:18,000 Speaker 2: and they need that money. They need that money to 374 00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:22,000 Speaker 2: buy weapons and technology from abroad. They need that money 375 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 2: to send the broad to Hamas, Kazbala, Yemen, etc. To 376 00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:29,479 Speaker 2: have these proxies that they can employ. They need that 377 00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:35,240 Speaker 2: money to pay their own services, security services of repression, 378 00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:39,400 Speaker 2: to kill other Iranians that try to rise up. There's 379 00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:42,320 Speaker 2: a lot of money involved here and they were running out. 380 00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:46,200 Speaker 2: So when the Biden administration comes it essentially it never 381 00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:50,399 Speaker 2: formally lifted sanctions, but it didn't it didn't stand on 382 00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:55,360 Speaker 2: imposing them. So Iran managed to in the last two 383 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:57,919 Speaker 2: years have over one hundred billion dollars a year of 384 00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 2: income from oil that is to technically sanctioned but isn't 385 00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:06,680 Speaker 2: being sanctioned. The United States has allowed in various deals 386 00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:10,040 Speaker 2: other countries to unfreeze their assets. So there's tens of 387 00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,560 Speaker 2: billions there. And then we had the latest deal, which 388 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:15,960 Speaker 2: is America itself to get its hostages out. Four or 389 00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:20,960 Speaker 2: five of them paid between six and eight billion dollars directly, 390 00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:24,040 Speaker 2: and from what I'm hearing, anywhere between twenty five and 391 00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:28,520 Speaker 2: forty billion dollars indirectly through unfreezing assets of other countries 392 00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:31,480 Speaker 2: and so on and so forth. So Iran now has 393 00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:33,360 Speaker 2: a lot of money, and a lot of that money 394 00:23:33,400 --> 00:23:35,920 Speaker 2: wound up in Lisbala, which is bearing down on Israel 395 00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:39,800 Speaker 2: in the north. And by the way, that's a hot front. 396 00:23:40,160 --> 00:23:45,800 Speaker 1: So why does Iran want so badly to go after Israel? 397 00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:48,240 Speaker 1: I mean, if we look at the Trump administration, the 398 00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:51,840 Speaker 1: Trump administration had obviously ratcheted back anything that they could make. 399 00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:55,040 Speaker 1: They were in a situation where they didn't have a 400 00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:57,280 Speaker 1: lot of power, They didn't have the ability to go 401 00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 1: after these weapons. When you're talking about these sanctions, it 402 00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:03,920 Speaker 1: was preventing them from making all this money. And then 403 00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:10,080 Speaker 1: Biden gets into office. It really defies logic that Biden 404 00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 1: would say, We're going to let the world's sponsor of 405 00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:18,720 Speaker 1: terror just breake in cash and prepare. But you look 406 00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:24,879 Speaker 1: at the murder of taking Solemony out and then Biden 407 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:27,320 Speaker 1: gets into office pretty quickly after that. And if you 408 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:31,119 Speaker 1: follow the Supreme Leader's tweets or whatever, we want to 409 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 1: call him the ultimate dictator in Iran, he has been 410 00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: pretty clear that he wants to exact revenge on that, 411 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:43,119 Speaker 1: on Solomoni's death, and so he said that, really, I 412 00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:47,480 Speaker 1: mean almost weekly since then. Is that is this his 413 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:50,800 Speaker 1: some sort of revenge for him to go after Israel 414 00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:59,959 Speaker 1: is making this unrest and causing this kind of you know, 415 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:04,240 Speaker 1: diversion out in the Middle East. Is this a way 416 00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:07,520 Speaker 1: that you could actually create a world war? 417 00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:12,800 Speaker 2: Yeah? You know. Both. Again, a lot of really good 418 00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:15,360 Speaker 2: parts of your question. I mean, first of all, yes, 419 00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:18,040 Speaker 2: this is if you go back to Soleimani, it's part 420 00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:22,520 Speaker 2: of a larger thing. The United States was choking Iran, 421 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:27,199 Speaker 2: and the Israelis felt a tailwind they felt backing to 422 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:33,199 Speaker 2: take on Iran. But most importantly, the Saudis, the United 423 00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:39,960 Speaker 2: Arab Emirates, Bahrain, Morocco, a whole series of countries felt 424 00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:44,399 Speaker 2: that the West and Israel are they have their heads 425 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:50,680 Speaker 2: on correctly, They're sober. Even if America is withdrawing some 426 00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 2: forces and some forces were withdrawn under under President Trump 427 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,600 Speaker 2: as well, but there was an understanding that America was 428 00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:01,280 Speaker 2: clearheaded and as a result, which you started seeing was 429 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:07,640 Speaker 2: a block emerging of allies. Essentially, you had Israel Saudis 430 00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:10,159 Speaker 2: were cross didn't cross the threshold to peace. But the 431 00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:14,480 Speaker 2: truth was there was huge amount of under the table interaction, 432 00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:20,760 Speaker 2: some of which very very powerful strategic interactions that really 433 00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:24,119 Speaker 2: meant more than any formal peace treaty. UAE crossed the 434 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:27,159 Speaker 2: line and made peace as the Bahrain and Morocco and 435 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:30,720 Speaker 2: several other countries. So all of a sudden, here was 436 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:35,080 Speaker 2: Iran not only denied money, but it was not It 437 00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:40,480 Speaker 2: began to see this strategic block emerging to itself that 438 00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:43,239 Speaker 2: on one side link could link up to India and 439 00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:46,280 Speaker 2: on the other side link up to Greece. That really 440 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:51,439 Speaker 2: is beginning to provide a strategic a strategic alliance that 441 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:54,320 Speaker 2: bears down on which is part of the reason why 442 00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:57,320 Speaker 2: you started seeing the Iranian people rising up because they 443 00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 2: felt their regime was under sea and they felt maybe 444 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 2: now's the chance to free themselves. And that had but 445 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:10,080 Speaker 2: that was all contingent on removing the Palestinians from having 446 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 2: veto over peace because The Iranians had, of course Hamas 447 00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:18,680 Speaker 2: and a lot of influence over even the Palestinian Liberation 448 00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:22,159 Speaker 2: Organization of Palestinian Authority, which is still ruling in the 449 00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:26,320 Speaker 2: West Bank. Basically, the Iranians have huge influence over all 450 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:30,679 Speaker 2: the various factions among the Palestinians. So the moment that 451 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:34,240 Speaker 2: the Saudis, the Bahraines, the UAE, Israel, and the United 452 00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:37,080 Speaker 2: States all agreed, you know, the Palestinians can't have a 453 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:40,440 Speaker 2: veto here. Israel can make peace with these countries directly 454 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:45,080 Speaker 2: without solving the Palestinian issue, the Iranians lost their leverage. 455 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,040 Speaker 2: But there was also born in this war that the 456 00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:52,320 Speaker 2: Iranians realized the way to destroy this alliance. Which remember, 457 00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:55,320 Speaker 2: just before this war broke out three weeks ago, we 458 00:27:55,320 --> 00:28:01,399 Speaker 2: were in advanced stages of discussion with the Israelis and 459 00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:05,760 Speaker 2: the Saudi's about to reach peace, a formal peace. The 460 00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:10,560 Speaker 2: Biden administration reintroduced the Palestinians and kept trying to reinsert 461 00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:15,280 Speaker 2: the Palestinian question and that framework because they were so 462 00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:18,280 Speaker 2: upset that. I mean, it's sad to say, but I 463 00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:22,280 Speaker 2: think they just never forgave Trump for making peace without 464 00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:27,880 Speaker 2: the Palestinians. And so they constantly reinjected them, and that 465 00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 2: gave the Palestinians a lot of leverage to start blocking this. 466 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:35,120 Speaker 2: But moreover, it's set the stage for the Iranians pushing 467 00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:39,280 Speaker 2: the Palestinians into this massive explosion. So I think it 468 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:41,600 Speaker 2: has a lot to do with that that the Iranians 469 00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:45,800 Speaker 2: are trying to burst the bubble of this Western alliance, 470 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:50,680 Speaker 2: which strategically created momentum on behalf of Israel, on behalf 471 00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:53,840 Speaker 2: of the Moderate Arabs, and on behalf of the United States, 472 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:57,000 Speaker 2: and Iran looked like it was in the strategic retreat. 473 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:01,000 Speaker 2: Now all of a sudden, the Israelis look weak, battered. 474 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:05,600 Speaker 2: The Iranians are saying, look, you're a spider web, You're 475 00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:09,560 Speaker 2: falling apart. The Saudis are running for cover, are scared, 476 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:11,400 Speaker 2: They're not sure the Israelis are going to do what 477 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,440 Speaker 2: they need to do. The Americans are confused and reaching 478 00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:16,760 Speaker 2: out to the Iranians and trying to calm things down 479 00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:20,479 Speaker 2: and not seeing it is a strategic event between Israel 480 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:24,959 Speaker 2: and the Iran America is still living in the paradigms 481 00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:27,360 Speaker 2: of the first two years of the Biden administration. They 482 00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:30,960 Speaker 2: want to have Israel may be able to knock out Flaimas, 483 00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:34,600 Speaker 2: but let's reintroduce to Palestinians again and Iran, we can 484 00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:37,400 Speaker 2: still make a deal for region. So everybody's sort of 485 00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:40,120 Speaker 2: running for cover, and they're the Israeli standing all alone 486 00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:43,560 Speaker 2: facing this war now, and that really tells you the 487 00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:46,640 Speaker 2: direction the war has to go. It has to end 488 00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:51,120 Speaker 2: in a tremendous Israeli victory that restores its image of power, 489 00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:55,320 Speaker 2: and through it, the Western Alliance feels confident and begins 490 00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:59,160 Speaker 2: to restore itself and the momentum in the region changes. 491 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,800 Speaker 2: The last part of your question about Israel fighting alone, 492 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:07,200 Speaker 2: I think that's a critical point because if Israel relies 493 00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:10,440 Speaker 2: on American troops, and it's never in its history relied 494 00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:14,680 Speaker 2: on American troops to fight its wars, it's always fought alone. 495 00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:19,200 Speaker 2: If this time it's different and it uses American forces 496 00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 2: in any shape or form other than maybe resupply or 497 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:26,200 Speaker 2: perhaps shoot down a missile or two that's coming from Yemen, 498 00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:30,840 Speaker 2: if American boots on the ground are fighting for Israel, 499 00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:34,040 Speaker 2: then it proves the point that Iran is trying to 500 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:36,760 Speaker 2: make that Israel's not a viable country. It's a colonial 501 00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:41,200 Speaker 2: Western country that relies on American troops to survive. It 502 00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:45,600 Speaker 2: actually confirms Israel's weakness, it doesn't confirm Israel's strength. So 503 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,560 Speaker 2: Israel really needs to win this war on its own, 504 00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:51,280 Speaker 2: and it needs to come out of it very strong 505 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:55,240 Speaker 2: so that the Saudis and others feel the confidence to 506 00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,600 Speaker 2: proceed with this peace alliance that is really a strategic 507 00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:04,360 Speaker 2: allign and anchors the Western interests, while the United States 508 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:08,040 Speaker 2: really needs to focus in Asia and Europe and really 509 00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:11,800 Speaker 2: can't continue to put so much strategic capital in the 510 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:12,400 Speaker 2: Middle East. 511 00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,120 Speaker 1: Well, before I let you go, I appreciate the fact 512 00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:18,239 Speaker 1: that you've gone through all of this with us and 513 00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:20,160 Speaker 1: explain it to us. But before I let you go, 514 00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:23,200 Speaker 1: what is your prediction on this? Can Israel do that? 515 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:26,880 Speaker 2: Israel can do it. It has the power. It's woken up. 516 00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:31,200 Speaker 2: I mean Israel. When they called up the reserves, they 517 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:33,640 Speaker 2: didn't have one hundred percent turnout. They had one hundred 518 00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:37,240 Speaker 2: and seventy percent turnout, which was a problem. They didn't 519 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:39,160 Speaker 2: even have enough weapons for some of the people, which 520 00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:42,600 Speaker 2: is why you're seeing this massive airlift of American aircraft 521 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:47,240 Speaker 2: coming and bringing simple things guns, helmets, etc. The Israelis 522 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:52,480 Speaker 2: literally didn't expect so many soldiers to units mobilize themselves 523 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:57,040 Speaker 2: without being asked to mobilize. So Israel, the country's very powerful, 524 00:31:57,320 --> 00:32:00,120 Speaker 2: very strong. It has the power to do it needs 525 00:31:59,920 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 2: to do. But it's a it's a it's a it's 526 00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:07,400 Speaker 2: a dreadful. I mean, when I kept talking to Israelis, 527 00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:11,560 Speaker 2: there is a sense of optimism, but there's also a 528 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:14,920 Speaker 2: sense of dread. They know the cross will be huge, uh, 529 00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:17,560 Speaker 2: but they're willing to pay it. Is I suppose where 530 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:20,080 Speaker 2: America was after nine to eleven and certainly after Pearl 531 00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:23,720 Speaker 2: Harbor is we know what we're up against after Pearl Harbor. 532 00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:25,960 Speaker 2: So the Israelis are similar that they know what they're 533 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:28,720 Speaker 2: up against and they know they're going to pay a price, 534 00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:31,080 Speaker 2: and that what they paid three weeks ago was a 535 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:34,560 Speaker 2: down payment on a bigger price. But they're willing to 536 00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:38,520 Speaker 2: pay it now. And they're they've woken up from the slumber. 537 00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:43,080 Speaker 2: And by the way, they're screaming at everybody who comes there. America, 538 00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:46,640 Speaker 2: wake up, Europe, Wake up, South Korea, Wake up Japan, 539 00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:49,720 Speaker 2: Wake up, especially South Korea. This can happen to you. 540 00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:53,680 Speaker 2: A lot of cons's weapons were North Korean, so North 541 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:57,000 Speaker 2: Korea can do this, so but they have the power, 542 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,280 Speaker 2: but it is a it is a dread. There is 543 00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:02,920 Speaker 2: a sense of dread that the cost will be very high. 544 00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:04,240 Speaker 2: But my son, I mean that. 545 00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,920 Speaker 1: I think what you've been saying is really how we've 546 00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:13,480 Speaker 1: felt here. We're kind of screaming, you're letting Chinese companies 547 00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:16,760 Speaker 1: come into the United States. You're selling US land to 548 00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:18,920 Speaker 1: the Chinese, which they would never allow us to go 549 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:22,959 Speaker 1: in there and buy land. We are allowing our enemies 550 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:27,160 Speaker 1: to come across our border every single day. How can 551 00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:30,360 Speaker 1: we be in this situation? And as we've watched this 552 00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:32,960 Speaker 1: happen in other countries, I mean, if you look at 553 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,480 Speaker 1: Germany right now, doesn't look a lot like Germany. If 554 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,360 Speaker 1: you look at Sweden, they're dealing with a whole bunch 555 00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:42,080 Speaker 1: of issues that they would never have been dealing with 556 00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:45,680 Speaker 1: forty years ago. You know. So I think that this 557 00:33:45,840 --> 00:33:49,720 Speaker 1: message is at a critical time where I think it's 558 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:53,760 Speaker 1: time for Americans to say, if you are coming to 559 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:56,120 Speaker 1: this country, are you coming here because you want to 560 00:33:56,160 --> 00:33:58,760 Speaker 1: be an American? And we were just having this conversation 561 00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:02,080 Speaker 1: over dinner the other night. It was like, Hey, we've 562 00:34:02,120 --> 00:34:04,760 Speaker 1: always kind of felt like we don't care what your 563 00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:07,520 Speaker 1: background is, what you you know, where you come from, 564 00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:10,800 Speaker 1: who you are, as long as you're coming here because 565 00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:13,439 Speaker 1: you want to be an American. And that I think 566 00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,759 Speaker 1: has been the question that we're seeing right now as 567 00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,480 Speaker 1: these Chinese companies move in and as they are bringing 568 00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:23,600 Speaker 1: in their CCP operations on the grounds. Wait a minute, No, 569 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:26,920 Speaker 1: this is very dangerous, and that's a whole nother conversation. 570 00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:29,080 Speaker 1: I'm sure we could go for another half an hour 571 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:31,719 Speaker 1: talking about that, so someday I'd love to have you 572 00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:32,959 Speaker 1: back in chat a little bit more. 573 00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:35,839 Speaker 2: If there's one thing the Americans should take from this war, 574 00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:39,520 Speaker 2: is that what you just said that we need to 575 00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:43,600 Speaker 2: begin to think seriously about our own slumber and the 576 00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:46,360 Speaker 2: threats that are emerging and the collapse of our border 577 00:34:47,120 --> 00:34:49,880 Speaker 2: and the fact that Israel saw Hamas come across the 578 00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:53,000 Speaker 2: border and do what they do. We're not seeing who's 579 00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:55,080 Speaker 2: coming across our border, and we know. 580 00:34:55,480 --> 00:34:58,520 Speaker 1: I think it's key what you said earlier about they 581 00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:01,239 Speaker 1: were bringing folks across to work every day and this 582 00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:05,600 Speaker 1: was like, yeah, let's were they felt like peace was happening. 583 00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:10,720 Speaker 1: They felt this comfort level that they should not have felt. 584 00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:13,400 Speaker 1: And I think that it's hard to see when it's happening, 585 00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:16,239 Speaker 1: but now that we're seeing it from the other perspective, 586 00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:18,360 Speaker 1: we can look at that and go, Wow, we have 587 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:22,400 Speaker 1: to really really protect our sovereignty, our national security, and 588 00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:25,040 Speaker 1: it's just not a place that we've been for many, 589 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:27,880 Speaker 1: many years. But I appreciate you waking us up today, 590 00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:31,840 Speaker 1: David Wormser, thank you so much, Thank you, Tutor, and 591 00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:34,640 Speaker 1: thank you all for joining us on the Tutor Dixon Podcast. 592 00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:37,919 Speaker 1: For this episode and others. Go to Tutor disonpodcast dot 593 00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:40,640 Speaker 1: com and subscribe right there, or head over to the 594 00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:44,400 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts 595 00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:47,280 Speaker 1: and join us the next time on the Tutor Dixon Podcast. 596 00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:49,759 Speaker 1: Have a blessed day.