Speaker 1: My name is Clay and Nucleman. This is a production
Speaker 1: of the bear Grease podcast called The Bear Grease Render
Speaker 1: where we render down, dive deeper, and look behind the
Speaker 1: scenes of the actual bear Grease podcast, presented by f
Speaker 1: HF Gear, American made purpose built hunting and fishing gear
Speaker 1: that's designed to be as rugged as the places we explore.
Speaker 1: What's your favorite type of bonanza? Mine's when it's like
Speaker 1: all yellow, no brown spots, no greens either. The favorite bonanza. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't even know what that means, like the type
Speaker 1: of fruit. It sounds like he's describing fruit. Oh, that
Speaker 1: was like, yeah, because bananza and banana are spelled close together.
Speaker 1: Joke as much as just like a bad joke, like
Speaker 1: a bad maybe dad jokeing. I think it's a dead joke. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I didn't get category. I eat a lot of brown
Speaker 1: bananas because because it takes two seconds. I'll tell you
Speaker 1: who'd rather eat a brown one that's like about to
Speaker 1: be you know, look like turned out a banana. What
Speaker 1: we call real love, a real made it an ethical
Speaker 1: and moral you know statement inside of our house eat
Speaker 1: brown bananas. Well, so that's where it started for me,
Speaker 1: Like I'm not going to throw away bananas, but I
Speaker 1: would prefer a yellow one. You know what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: he would prefer I mean or did it like did
Speaker 1: it just shift that way because of the moral stand
Speaker 1: But I'm saying if he went to Walmart and there
Speaker 1: was like brown ones there, he'd pick those up and
Speaker 1: by the time we got home him, he would have
Speaker 1: told us you're gonna eat those brown ones and you're
Speaker 1: gonna love it, because not everybody gets something for free
Speaker 1: in life, right Gary, So play it's all about the
Speaker 1: money man. My question though, is would he eat a
Speaker 1: black bear bonanza? Yeah? Exactly where we're starting. We have
Speaker 1: one Well, we have many many special guests today. One
Speaker 1: of our special guest today James Brandenberg. James, this is
Speaker 1: your first time on the Bear Grease is render Now
Speaker 1: you're a longtime bear Grease scoring throwing a devote. So
Speaker 1: James would have been on the Bear Grease podcast, didn't
Speaker 1: last year that the black Bear Black Bears black Banza.
Speaker 1: So the reason part of the reason James here, well
Speaker 1: that's not why is here. He's here because he's James
Speaker 1: Brannenberg and he's just here because he's jas and he's
Speaker 1: got a cool truck. Got a good truck. He's got
Speaker 1: a chivy A simmit, what is it? Thing? That's a
Speaker 1: g m C a T four. It looks good. It's
Speaker 1: got some I've got a GMC, but it's not quite
Speaker 1: that new and fancy, James. It's got some nice flavor
Speaker 1: on the on the campershell. Yep, we've got a pebble
Speaker 1: mine stickers, a b H A sticker. It's got tires,
Speaker 1: it's got the wheels. I mean, it's got the stuff.
Speaker 1: You know. You walked right past his truck, then walked
Speaker 1: right past mine. What do you think of mine? I
Speaker 1: thought your truck looked real good, totally functional, Silverado work truck,
Speaker 1: edition to commercials, been to Montana pool and mules like
Speaker 1: four times, New Mexico, Colorado, been all over the country
Speaker 1: General Motors. And every time I think about that, that's
Speaker 1: every time I think about that truck and you hauling
Speaker 1: that mule trailer with two mules in it, with a
Speaker 1: V six in there, I'm always impressed. Oh me too.
Speaker 1: I can't believe that. Everybody I passed and my impressing.
Speaker 1: I want to know I drove it the V six
Speaker 1: in there, so with mules on the back and so
Speaker 1: I think that you know, that kind of gives it
Speaker 1: an extra layer of credibility because it was going about
Speaker 1: twenty miles faster than went Drum all the way to Montampa.
Speaker 1: Do you have to have a souped up new GMC
Speaker 1: to attend the black Bear Mananza? I hope not? Or
Speaker 1: are all vehicles welcome? All vehicles welcome? Okay, the teacher
Speaker 1: and me is wanting to put some structure to the
Speaker 1: black Bear Bonanza. And what we're talking about. You tell
Speaker 1: us about the black Bear Bonanza. Alright, alright, black Bear Bonanza.
Speaker 1: It's a educational fundraising event. Um. It's put on by
Speaker 1: Arkansas b h A. It'll be March four at the
Speaker 1: Benton County Quail Barn in Bentonville, Arkansas. Starts fourth is
Speaker 1: a Saturday. It is a Saturday. Let me start this over.
Speaker 1: He said, this is a fundraiser event. People don't like
Speaker 1: stop down, good time about Arkansas black Bears and a
Speaker 1: bunch of cool people in a podcast. And yeah, it'll
Speaker 1: be it'll be so much fun when people get there
Speaker 1: that they won't even know it's fundraiser, fundraiser, educational event. Fundraisers.
Speaker 1: I heard they were going to have a live Black
Speaker 1: Bear just roaming loose in the event, dancing black Don't
Speaker 1: let that secret get out. We need to keep that
Speaker 1: in the what are we doing? What are we doing
Speaker 1: at Black Bear? But okay, so we're gonna do we'll
Speaker 1: have some cooking demos. Um, we're gonna do a Bear
Speaker 1: Grease Render podcast. So we'll all be there, well, I
Speaker 1: mean there will be. I mean, I'm pretty confident everybody
Speaker 1: in this room will be there. Okay, I confident that
Speaker 1: everyone in this room will be there. I mean, I'll goot,
Speaker 1: we gotta talk to see if he'll come. I'll go
Speaker 1: with you. I really want to you'll go. If Josh goes, Okay,
Speaker 1: we gottas will be there. Yep. Brent's gonna he's gonna
Speaker 1: m see the ol Hoot contest this year. You're going
Speaker 1: to judge it this year. So last year Clay m
Speaker 1: seed and this year we're gonna put his judging skills
Speaker 1: to the test. That's what you need to do. I'll
Speaker 1: be the greatest Alhoot judge that ever walked this continent.
Speaker 1: I have no doubt. That means you can't compete exactly.
Speaker 1: It's like a food I'm not saying I'm the greatest
Speaker 1: al hooter, No, I know that, but I'm saying you
Speaker 1: can't compete. But he would be like if like the
Speaker 1: scary food critic came to your restaurant and was like
Speaker 1: picking apart every single thing he did when it comes
Speaker 1: to al he's the Gordon was lacking a little bit.
Speaker 1: Let me hear your laugh. Hey, you know what I
Speaker 1: want to see with this this al hooting contest. I'd like,
Speaker 1: I'd like to see the best guys in the world
Speaker 1: come in here. Who is the guy who's the guy
Speaker 1: on the front porch of that old house. He's just
Speaker 1: a dude from Missouri. A lot of good Missouri man,
Speaker 1: it is. And see what I want to do is
Speaker 1: I want to start bringing in these guys and like
Speaker 1: they would become you know how, like like a guy
Speaker 1: would have a racehorse and he would be like, I
Speaker 1: want that racehorse and he's up in the stands watching.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna pay for this guy to come down here,
Speaker 1: and he's gonna be like a ring you know my guy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm imagining like twenty years in the future this is
Speaker 1: turned into like the bass fishing Circuit where they have
Speaker 1: logos all over their and they pull in in the
Speaker 1: big trucks completely lowsed up, just to make an out.
Speaker 1: If you have, if you, if you are listening to
Speaker 1: this contiguous United States, Um, you should come to Bentonville,
Speaker 1: Arkansas for our hot contest. And when is it? And
Speaker 1: I think even it's March fourth. Even people from Alaska
Speaker 1: and Hawaiia welcome Clay. There's no barred owls over there.
Speaker 1: They don't know who I would think people in Canada.
Speaker 1: I feel like you're setting up a real underdog story
Speaker 1: for any or in Alaska. Yeah, I just shared half
Speaker 1: of Alaska, lot of or someone from the Caribbean. I mean,
Speaker 1: we could have a true cool Runnings kind of thing country.
Speaker 1: I'll be honest. I'm just gonna be Okay. So now
Speaker 1: I'm imagining Josh Spillmaker, who is in the room and
Speaker 1: a part of the Render today, as a real sort
Speaker 1: of John Candy esque X who moves to Jamaica and Antiga, okay,
Speaker 1: which is kicked out of the Render and you went
Speaker 1: down there, yeah with my team, Yeah, come back in here.
Speaker 1: I feel like this is a big high quality bear
Speaker 1: Grease intellectual property. The Disney move where Okay, alright, alright,
Speaker 1: so okay, we got heac hashtag. Isaac quit interrupted, Mike
Speaker 1: scited about the answer. Wait, let Misty talk, don't interrupt. Okay,
Speaker 1: so we got a contest, alhot contest. We're gonna Myron
Speaker 1: Means from the Game and Fish Commission, Large carnivoreologist. He
Speaker 1: will do another Q and A session for us how
Speaker 1: big it will be wearing a pair of overalls John Dear.
Speaker 1: If you have a question, asked how big he is?
Speaker 1: Clay did a video with him on a bear Den
Speaker 1: study that's available somewhere. Knew how big. Yeah, it's all
Speaker 1: about scale video. It is scale. Um. The newer things
Speaker 1: that we're adding to it this year will be we're
Speaker 1: gonna do a butchering demo. Part of this is a deer,
Speaker 1: hopefully a dear if we can get one. You know,
Speaker 1: if it's not that, we'll get a a pig or
Speaker 1: a goat or something like that. It's generally the same thing.
Speaker 1: But what we're trying to do is introduce people to
Speaker 1: the fact that we go outside. Yeah we can hike,
Speaker 1: we can bike, but we can also a hunting fish.
Speaker 1: These things are very normal activities that that we engage
Speaker 1: in and and we have a lot of people moving
Speaker 1: into the area who maybe don't do that but are
Speaker 1: interested in learning. How We're gonna try to break down
Speaker 1: the barriers to that so that they have a little
Speaker 1: bit more confidence. We're introducing them to b h as
Speaker 1: A as an avenue to gain those skills. And then
Speaker 1: the fundraising piece of it. Um, We've got a couple
Speaker 1: of things that we're going to uh raffle off. But
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna pass this around so metaphorically and
Speaker 1: physically it is. It's a very large knife. And and
Speaker 1: this knife was made by Garrett Polk. This knife, this
Speaker 1: is not one you just want to go trapes in
Speaker 1: through the woods on your hip. We'll see. And this
Speaker 1: is what Garrett told me yesterday. This is what he
Speaker 1: told me about it yesterday. It's a beautiful knife. The
Speaker 1: handle is made with a femur bone from Batman. That
Speaker 1: handlebone it looks like lp ivory. It is not. It
Speaker 1: is the beaver bone from the largest black bear I've
Speaker 1: ever killed. True story. We'll get some good pictures of
Speaker 1: this up on the Instagram, But um steel is probably
Speaker 1: four and a half five inch blade. I got the
Speaker 1: particulars And what Garrett told me is this knife is
Speaker 1: made to be used. He said, that's what they all said.
Speaker 1: He yeah, they all want them to be taken out
Speaker 1: into the field and used. And then he made the
Speaker 1: sheath for it, and it's got a beaver tail inlay
Speaker 1: on the sheath. That beaver was trapped on public land
Speaker 1: here in Arkansas by one of our board members, Brad Green.
Speaker 1: So we will so we're this knife will be in
Speaker 1: the special ticket and then put it in a bucket.
Speaker 1: And yeah that's great man. I really like that beare bone. Man,
Speaker 1: it for real looks like looks like ivory. Um. Can
Speaker 1: we talk about Josh this thing? Yeah? Your hat? Oh
Speaker 1: oh yeah, the sticks are high for the alhookm. Yes.
Speaker 1: So the winner, the winner of the Alhoot contest Clay
Speaker 1: is going to get handmade coon skin cap. That's a
Speaker 1: big deal. Yeah, made by Josh bu Winker. There's only
Speaker 1: a handful of those on this great planet. Yeah. So um,
Speaker 1: so last year we had people from all over the
Speaker 1: country come. We did. We had from Pennsylvania to Idaho.
Speaker 1: We had from the Dakotas all the way to South Texas,
Speaker 1: you know, from across major Last year I don't know
Speaker 1: how many people were there. We had about and that
Speaker 1: was our first year and we didn't It is the
Speaker 1: first year we did it. It's a good event and
Speaker 1: I'll be there all day just hanging out. It's family friendly,
Speaker 1: bring your kids. Everybody twelve and under gets in free
Speaker 1: this year. Tickets are super easy. It's ten bucks for
Speaker 1: adults to get in the door that you know, have
Speaker 1: a good time all day. Game and Fish Commission is
Speaker 1: going to support us as well, so they'll have some
Speaker 1: some educational booths and stuff like that. And then, you know,
Speaker 1: we can't do all of this without sponsors. So far,
Speaker 1: are big sponsors are um Rex, the airgun company. You know,
Speaker 1: people listen to this podcast would have heard their ads.
Speaker 1: Vortex has has just they were like, sign us up,
Speaker 1: we want to help out. And Numerax was the same way.
Speaker 1: They reached out to us. They're like, hey, when's that
Speaker 1: going on? We want to be a part of it.
Speaker 1: So good and we're gonna do a live beargrease render there.
Speaker 1: I'm not sure who's gonna be on it yet, so
Speaker 1: all of you in this room just be on your
Speaker 1: best behavior. Maybe you get picked, maybe you won't. This
Speaker 1: is our audition. Can we plead our case or is
Speaker 1: it a drawing? Well? Yeah, first tis well, that's great.
Speaker 1: So that's March the fourth, Benton County Quail Barn in
Speaker 1: Bentonville in Bentonville, Arkansas, doors open in nine. We'll go
Speaker 1: from nine to five. There will be things going on
Speaker 1: all day. Come for the whole day, have a good time.
Speaker 1: We'll have a website up so it's the easiest way
Speaker 1: to find it is go to Backcountry hunters dot org,
Speaker 1: look for the events page and look for black Bear
Speaker 1: Bonanza and by the time this podcast comes out, that
Speaker 1: page will be up and people can buy tickets, and folks,
Speaker 1: if you're coming, buy tickets and let us know you're coming.
Speaker 1: So we make sure and have enough of everything there
Speaker 1: for you. Corn dogs, enough corn dogs, water, and porta John's. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the three things. I'm gonna have corn dogs stand there. No,
Speaker 1: I'm not clay dogs. Well, great, fantastic. Mr Nukem had
Speaker 1: a big day yesterday. She killed her first duck. Congratulate
Speaker 1: everything you hoped it would be. I have things to say.
Speaker 1: All right, I'm not the big hunter in our family.
Speaker 1: The hunting that I've done done pretty much in the
Speaker 1: last twenty years. Yeah, it's it's actually Clay. You may
Speaker 1: be surprised, um, but the last twenty years I've gone hunting.
Speaker 1: Most of the time, I'm a chaperone. I'm sitting or
Speaker 1: like just coming along to hang out with Clay. I
Speaker 1: could get into duck hunting, like I could. I could
Speaker 1: be a duck hunter. And I believe that's Huntress, Huntress.
Speaker 1: That's right, that's right. We I really didn't know what
Speaker 1: to expect. I really like, I've seen pictures of people
Speaker 1: duck hunting and it kind of looks really different. And
Speaker 1: I knew waiters were involved, so I figured, Okay, it's
Speaker 1: gonna be cold, wet early. This doesn't sound like a
Speaker 1: lot of fun. But going to take one for the team.
Speaker 1: First of all, Amory, just as kind of a continuation
Speaker 1: from last from Amory Dramas, who was on the last podcast,
Speaker 1: gave me some tips that she learned from Kaylee that
Speaker 1: that she also learned and both were on the last
Speaker 1: part shooting tips. And so we went out the first
Speaker 1: day that evening we got there, and we also want
Speaker 1: to tell you I am right handed and left eye
Speaker 1: dominant as well. You're not the only one. Well, and
Speaker 1: it doesn't even matter, it turns out when you're shooting ducks,
Speaker 1: because you're looking at the target, not at the not
Speaker 1: down the barrel. And so that was a game changer.
Speaker 1: So she gave me a few tips and really, I
Speaker 1: I I couldn't believe what a difference it made in
Speaker 1: a matter of seconds, not hours, and not lots of practice.
Speaker 1: But I was able to shoot those skeat and that
Speaker 1: was fun, super fun. I mean not a percent, but
Speaker 1: still better than zero percent um. And then the next
Speaker 1: morning we woke up and I really didn't know what
Speaker 1: to expect. The dog situation in duck hunting is pretty
Speaker 1: amazing because the dogs just like it's super fun to
Speaker 1: watch a dog that's been bred to do something that
Speaker 1: has a function. It's really amazing to watch them. And
Speaker 1: so the dog was like antsy and he was sitting.
Speaker 1: They had this chair hooked up to a tree, and
Speaker 1: it was just really enjoyable to watch him. You know,
Speaker 1: we would we would talk and have which is like
Speaker 1: thing too, So thing one the dog, that's that's and
Speaker 1: I'll come back to the thing two in a second.
Speaker 1: But um, you can actually talking duck hunting. And but
Speaker 1: the dog was no nonsense he was just like sitting
Speaker 1: there and he was alert and watching and he if
Speaker 1: you watch the dog, you could see, Okay, here's where
Speaker 1: the ducks are coming in from. And so they were
Speaker 1: really everybody was so so nice, Brittain Clay especially, you know,
Speaker 1: we were with Amory Dramas, me and Brandt and then
Speaker 1: Luke Naylor who is the waterfowl biologist, no, the director chief,
Speaker 1: the chief and the wildlife the chief of the Wildlife
Speaker 1: Wildlife Division. Yeah, and they were so so nice. So
Speaker 1: when it's the first little the first thing of ducks
Speaker 1: came in, what do you call him? There? Well, what
Speaker 1: do you call? What do you call? Is it? So
Speaker 1: the first flock of ducks came in, they just let
Speaker 1: me shoot. No one else shot. And the first one
Speaker 1: came in, it was like, I don't know what to do.
Speaker 1: Where's my god? You know, I mean like it takes
Speaker 1: a minute to like get in position. You don't see
Speaker 1: him coming in. Yeah, I mean like you're just kind
Speaker 1: of you're kind of hide and trying to be steel,
Speaker 1: and it's just like all of a sudden, and so
Speaker 1: like I thought I would be prepared, but it took
Speaker 1: a second to get the gun up and I mean
Speaker 1: I think I shot that first time but definitely didn't
Speaker 1: hit anything. But then the second one that came in
Speaker 1: they did again. They just let me shoot and it
Speaker 1: was a group of a flock of teal, which apparently
Speaker 1: is a real fast little bird. And I shot and
Speaker 1: I got I got one, and it was super exciting,
Speaker 1: like super exciting. There's no film of it because we
Speaker 1: were just uh, you know, it was all hands on
Speaker 1: deck to get me. Yeah. And and then so what
Speaker 1: was Then they released the dog and the dog just
Speaker 1: jumps up and it looks like it's you know, this
Speaker 1: was this is what its purpose in life is and
Speaker 1: got to fulfill it. And it was so I love
Speaker 1: the dog. I mean, yeah, Baron, I'm probably probably gonna
Speaker 1: have to. So then we weren't working many mallards. We
Speaker 1: were sitting on the edge of a overgrown field that
Speaker 1: had just kind of been and had not been planted
Speaker 1: or tilled that year, and it kind of butted up
Speaker 1: against the slow and it had flooded. And so basically
Speaker 1: it was a flooded field that didn't have crops in it,
Speaker 1: but it had coffee bean and a lot of just
Speaker 1: like not actual weeds and vegetation in it, and they
Speaker 1: had they had seen some mallards right there the day before.
Speaker 1: So we were sitting there, but the mallards weren't working much,
Speaker 1: but we'd have Teal come bombing in. And so after
Speaker 1: Misty Kill, Misty Kill went on the second group of
Speaker 1: duck ducks that came in, and so we were like, sweet,
Speaker 1: we got a duck. And so she was getting some confidence.
Speaker 1: And so the next time I were working a group
Speaker 1: of like seven or eight Teal and they're about to
Speaker 1: light and I say, Misty, just start pulling the trigger
Speaker 1: and don't stop. You know, I just got a plug
Speaker 1: in there, and I said shoot three downs and she
Speaker 1: just looked at me, just like, oh, we can do that.
Speaker 1: I hope it wasn't bam bam bam. Well there we go,
Speaker 1: there we go. So thing that I like about duck
Speaker 1: hunting dogs thing too. You get to talk to people.
Speaker 1: It's real social. It's a lot more and and we
Speaker 1: were with great people. They were a lot of fun
Speaker 1: and everybody was I mean they were across the board
Speaker 1: just fantastic hosts. And I learned a whole lot about
Speaker 1: about ducks and and just it's just fun to be
Speaker 1: with people and it's a lot and then think three,
Speaker 1: it's just the intensity of it, like it's not like
Speaker 1: you know when you go to deer hunt for five
Speaker 1: weeks and and I remember going to Clay one time
Speaker 1: describing our ship when he was taking ship hunting, and
Speaker 1: he said it was like being in a sleeping bag
Speaker 1: with a coyote, just like just like you're restless. And
Speaker 1: I kind of felt like ship and all those deer hunts,
Speaker 1: it's like, well, I've just gotta sit here, and it's
Speaker 1: it's just not as it's rewarding at the end. But
Speaker 1: it's different than than duck hunting. Um, Whereas duck hunting,
Speaker 1: like they come in and it's like it's it's a
Speaker 1: lot of fun. Yeah. Yeah, you like the dog work
Speaker 1: I did, Yeah, that was pretty amazing to watch. I've
Speaker 1: got the perfect breed of dog that you guys, I mean,
Speaker 1: you get the perfect dog for me. I do Boykin Spaniel.
Speaker 1: How's it doing great? You're talking about Yeah, yeah, you
Speaker 1: talked about the and the dogs sitting there like, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: we went. We went this past Sunday and we had
Speaker 1: some geese come in and they landed too far out
Speaker 1: where we we had no shot at him, but he
Speaker 1: could see them. And I was sitting right next to him.
Speaker 1: We were on the on the bank of this strip
Speaker 1: pit pond, and he was vibrating like literally he wanted
Speaker 1: me to let him go so bad, you know, And
Speaker 1: I didn't have to hold onto him, but I was
Speaker 1: just in case. It's the I mean that there's a
Speaker 1: lot of good things in duck hunting, but that's probably
Speaker 1: the best part of it for me, is just watching
Speaker 1: that dog gets so excited to go out and catch
Speaker 1: the thing that it was made to do. And boys
Speaker 1: are boykins are great family dogs, they're great pets like ours.
Speaker 1: Just you know, he'll just lay around the house and
Speaker 1: be snugly and everything, and then when it's time to go,
Speaker 1: he's at the door winding ready to go. How big
Speaker 1: is he? He's thirty five pounds, he's about ya tall.
Speaker 1: You know what is that eighteen at the shoulder? Yeah,
Speaker 1: pretty small, smaller, much smaller than a than a lab. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think you've been deck hunting quite a bit. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: where you've been? I can't tell you tell me, you're
Speaker 1: tell me every single spot you've been. I've been in
Speaker 1: the Delta in Arkansas, a lot and then just uh
Speaker 1: you know west central Missouri quite a bit. There's a
Speaker 1: lot of scratching out no no lights out days up
Speaker 1: in Missouri, and I managed time and so that, uh
Speaker 1: I was my time down in Arkansas last week was
Speaker 1: book ended by two really great days on either side.
Speaker 1: A limit, A limit for mallards. Yeah so yourself. No, no,
Speaker 1: I I've got a buddy down there, and no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: they were limiting the day. The two days before I
Speaker 1: showed up, you weren't even there. I scratched out a
Speaker 1: few ducks and then they started killing them again once
Speaker 1: we left. So it feels good, got you, man. Okay,
Speaker 1: here's the thing that I have yet to well, I'm
Speaker 1: getting I'm starting to understand it. Just the more you're
Speaker 1: exposed to utting, the more you understand the the draw
Speaker 1: to it. And if you understand the draw to it,
Speaker 1: and that's not the best way to describe it, but
Speaker 1: the more that you can get through the hard part
Speaker 1: of um. Like, for instance, we took some people coon
Speaker 1: hunting the other night for the first time, and I
Speaker 1: was trying to understand their position inside this coon hunt.
Speaker 1: We just went out in the dark and turned this
Speaker 1: dog loose that they have no connection to, nor do
Speaker 1: they probably really have any value for a coon. I mean,
Speaker 1: like most people would see a con dead on the
Speaker 1: side of the road ode or truck ham pictures, and
Speaker 1: it's it's not this like highly valued animal. And you
Speaker 1: hear a lot of negative press about coons being overpopulated
Speaker 1: and all this stuff nest predators. To me, when I
Speaker 1: hear a dog bark just as faint as you could
Speaker 1: hear one, and you walk to it and you get
Speaker 1: like a hundred yards from the tree, and you see
Speaker 1: glowing orange eyes and you hear your dog underneath it,
Speaker 1: Like that is a incredible like feeling. And when you
Speaker 1: walk up and you see a ringtail hanging off the
Speaker 1: bottom of that tree, and you don't get that just
Speaker 1: in a moment. You get that over a lifetime of
Speaker 1: wanting to love something and and and kind of what
Speaker 1: it represents. So to me, a treed coon is just
Speaker 1: like wow. But somebody else, somebody just be like, dude,
Speaker 1: I see coons every day on side the road dead.
Speaker 1: I'm starting to learn about what that is for duck hunting,
Speaker 1: because duck hunting is a ton of work. Yes, it's
Speaker 1: you wake up extremely early, and more times than not
Speaker 1: you don't do very good. Yeah, and and this is
Speaker 1: the one thing about big game hunting is that you
Speaker 1: can go have a bad streak of deer hunting, but
Speaker 1: at the end of the season, you know maybe you're
Speaker 1: gonna get your buck, and the payoff is so big
Speaker 1: that it makes all that suffering worth it. And so
Speaker 1: I hiked. We hiked. We calculated about seven miles on
Speaker 1: Sunday at the place that we went duck hunting. Duck
Speaker 1: hunting and so in hiking, in carrying decoys, and then
Speaker 1: we did a little bit of just walking around, maybe
Speaker 1: jump shooting if we could find any and we couldn't
Speaker 1: find any. We didn't fire our guns on Sunday, hiked
Speaker 1: seven miles and even if we had, I mean, the
Speaker 1: most we would have brought home is six ducks, which
Speaker 1: is not nearly as much stuff as what you get
Speaker 1: off of one deer. Right, So it's but but the
Speaker 1: experience of being out there, you're out early, you get
Speaker 1: to see everything. It's exciting. You're talking about where are
Speaker 1: you gonna go, You're calling. That's the that's the fun part, right,
Speaker 1: is talking to the ducks and trying to get that
Speaker 1: figured out. Um, I don't think you can underestimate the
Speaker 1: like aspect of like the foolishness of it, and like
Speaker 1: so that goes hand in hand with like the talking
Speaker 1: like camaraderie right where you're all up in the middle
Speaker 1: of the night in the dark, standing in water hopefully
Speaker 1: it's really cold, like that's like the best case scenario. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: and you're like doing this all together with your friends
Speaker 1: and you're like, why are we doing why are we
Speaker 1: doing this? Yeah, exactly because I can't not and and then'
Speaker 1: and no, it's not like you get a trophy duck,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. It's like, you know, I
Speaker 1: used to think that, but there there are so first
Speaker 1: of all abandoned if that's a trophy. But we went
Speaker 1: on a guided hunt in Nebraska last year and we
Speaker 1: shot some widgeon that were we'd never even seen a
Speaker 1: region before. I'm not a very season duck hunter, but
Speaker 1: we shot a region that everybody else in the blind
Speaker 1: was like, oh my gosh, that's beautiful. And then when
Speaker 1: you start looking at it, you're like, oh, I understand
Speaker 1: why this is. It's really nuanced, I guess, but it's
Speaker 1: completely luck I mean it's duck on a trail camp
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna go hunt it. But but it's not
Speaker 1: I think that would Uh. I don't know that that's
Speaker 1: the best way to say it, Josh, but it is true,
Speaker 1: like you're not targeting a specific duck. You're not like
Speaker 1: I hope, I hope the other day we had that
Speaker 1: thing on trail camp for a week. I've got a
Speaker 1: serious question mile away. He wasn't daylighting. And then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, that's someone that's new too. I I
Speaker 1: picked up that bandits were banded ducks were really valuable.
Speaker 1: What's the Is it just that it's cool, It's just
Speaker 1: it's just that it's one and it's rare. But I
Speaker 1: don't know how many ducks literally are banded. I mean,
Speaker 1: let's say, in five thousand ducks. I don't know. It's
Speaker 1: and it's kind of neat that you can plug in
Speaker 1: the information on the band see where it was banded.
Speaker 1: It's like life cycle. That's that's a neat, little new
Speaker 1: And there is a lot of little neat things about
Speaker 1: duck hunting, and one of them is the diversity of ducks.
Speaker 1: Like when we go out here squirrel hunting, like we
Speaker 1: could kill fox squirrel or gray squirrel. And you go
Speaker 1: deer hunting, you know you're gonna kill a deer. When
Speaker 1: you go duck hunting, you all the different ducks are
Speaker 1: are there's different value added to how many different ducks
Speaker 1: can you kill in Arkansas? Oh? There there are forty
Speaker 1: one in North America. I don't know how many are specific.
Speaker 1: I would guess about fifteen to seventeen species just off
Speaker 1: the top of my You're probably in anyone given SI
Speaker 1: only gonna kill like two or three varieties. But the
Speaker 1: guys here in Arkansas at least want to kill mallards.
Speaker 1: They care less about most other ducks. Um, that's just
Speaker 1: what except for teal missing our big teal pieple. I'm
Speaker 1: a huge teal fan and they're really cool. Now, what
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask about the teal is how are
Speaker 1: you going to cook the teal? So I'm okay, So
Speaker 1: I have one, right, I mean I have a teal okay,
Speaker 1: And it's not bay Way. Wait, you just have one.
Speaker 1: So you shot at all the other ones and you
Speaker 1: guys didn't bring any more back. We Yeah, there was
Speaker 1: one other teal keeled okay, it was a two bird
Speaker 1: morning okay, and I I really want to mount mine.
Speaker 1: It is a really pretty birth and so um. And
Speaker 1: I was having a hard time deciding whether to mount
Speaker 1: it or to cook it, because the whole reason I
Speaker 1: went was I wanted to cook it back and anyway
Speaker 1: I got and the and the other one was donated
Speaker 1: to meat to cook. So um. But I think we
Speaker 1: had a gumbo, a duck gumbo, and I thought that
Speaker 1: would be super like it was you you would call
Speaker 1: it demo. That's a good idea. Um, I thought that
Speaker 1: would I want to do something where it's either pressure
Speaker 1: cooked or you know, low and slow. We tried some duck,
Speaker 1: but we try to cook duck last year. We're not
Speaker 1: rare meat people, and that I think makes a huge
Speaker 1: difference in whether you like duck or not. I think, yeah,
Speaker 1: And so since that's not who we are, we're gonna
Speaker 1: have to find another way than just like you know,
Speaker 1: smoking are grilling it up. Look up teal in a jar.
Speaker 1: That's a that's a way to do it, and you
Speaker 1: you know, put all the ingredients into a jar and
Speaker 1: cook it low and slow. Um, I've heard that's pretty good.
Speaker 1: I think I think I might have tried it once.
Speaker 1: But I can't remember for sure Brad that we were
Speaker 1: talking about earlier with the beaver tail. Okay, they did
Speaker 1: it once and he's not a big duck hunter. They
Speaker 1: thought it was okay. So it's really funny because I
Speaker 1: have this one teal and in the past two days
Speaker 1: everyone's given me a recipe, and it's like, well, guys,
Speaker 1: I've got this one deal a bunch of friends, yea
Speaker 1: for my plate. On my plate of deal, I'd like
Speaker 1: to talk about a man named Is that why we're here? Okay? Okay?
Speaker 1: I like I like the way they say his name
Speaker 1: to Comsy. Okay, well, there is a way, Robert Morgan said,
Speaker 1: is that the way you wanted to say it to
Speaker 1: t Comsa? I've always been it to comes a guy?
Speaker 1: What did you what? We started off to come see
Speaker 1: and then you and then you were code switching on me. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you'd be saying to come see, and then I say
Speaker 1: to Comsa, and then you'd switch over to Kamsa and
Speaker 1: then somebody. Then he goes back, yeah, well and it's
Speaker 1: neither one of them. To man on the way here,
Speaker 1: I said his brother's name like two hundred times so
Speaker 1: I could remember it. And now I forgot again ten squattawa,
Speaker 1: I said it different ways one tanks. Because this is
Speaker 1: what I want to start off on talking about comfort,
Speaker 1: is that I have never Isaac can vouch for this.
Speaker 1: We've I've never researched something so long. This was well
Speaker 1: over a year ago that I started researching two KOMPSA
Speaker 1: and as I, as I learned more and more, pronounced
Speaker 1: the names different and as I kind of nailed it down.
Speaker 1: But this was probably the most well, for sure, the
Speaker 1: most research that ever did. You went to New York, Maryland.
Speaker 1: I went to Wahoma. I went to New York to
Speaker 1: meet with Robert Morgan. To meet with New York Times
Speaker 1: bestselling author Robert Morgan. If I'm if I'm ever a
Speaker 1: New York Times best selling author, I want yall. You're
Speaker 1: just gonna have everything away. You're gonna have your friend
Speaker 1: New York Times bestselling author Morgan name. That's the way
Speaker 1: I want to introduce him. It's like you did this
Speaker 1: my man Maryland was bestselling author Stephen Ronella. Well he
Speaker 1: is for sure, yeah, multiple so the so Robert Morgan,
Speaker 1: I went to his house to talk to him, and
Speaker 1: UH also interviewed him about another topic that we haven't
Speaker 1: even done. Um. Then I went to I went to
Speaker 1: Maryland for Peter Cousins. Went to d C Washington, d C, Yeah,
Speaker 1: Maryland essentially, um to meet with Peter Cousins, who is
Speaker 1: the author of the book Two Comes in the Profit,
Speaker 1: which is I mean, I'm not really authorized to say
Speaker 1: what is the seminal work on two Comes to because
Speaker 1: there are a lot of books on two Comes To
Speaker 1: and a lot of stuff, but I've not found one
Speaker 1: that is that I liked as much as this one,
Speaker 1: and I looked at several of them. So this is
Speaker 1: a great book. Two Comes in the Profit. It's it's
Speaker 1: a it's a read, man, I mean, it's it's a read.
Speaker 1: It's not it's no joke. Um. So we went up there. Now,
Speaker 1: I went to Dallas, Texas to meet Dr Dave Edmonds,
Speaker 1: who basically has spent his life as a historical researcher
Speaker 1: of Native American history, but he's also very involved in
Speaker 1: with multiple tribes and and and stood before, been been
Speaker 1: involved in court cases and different things that have to
Speaker 1: do with tribal history. There's a lot of there, there's
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff going on right now that I
Speaker 1: mean that has always gone on with the tribes and
Speaker 1: the US government and land and treaty stuff. They're still
Speaker 1: I mean it's pretty wild. And so Dave Edmund's very
Speaker 1: very very knowledgeable guy. And uh Daves like eighty one
Speaker 1: years old. He was, Yes, he was a new guy.
Speaker 1: And then um Miami, Oklahoma and met with Chief Ben
Speaker 1: Barn which was a really I thought about that Miama, Oklahoma. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and you went to well, we went to Ohio watched
Speaker 1: the two Come Suh outdoor drama. Yeah, me and Isaac
Speaker 1: drove to drove to Ohio to watch There is an
Speaker 1: outdoor drama in Chillicothe, Ohio that's been going on for
Speaker 1: fifty years. I mean a major outdoor production with like
Speaker 1: a hundred cast members and outdoor stadium gunshots that they
Speaker 1: don't prepare you for gunshots. Two hour long outdoor play.
Speaker 1: We got live horses, Indian battles, hang out with the
Speaker 1: guy who produces it and the pyrotechnics guy who have
Speaker 1: both been there for a long time. Yeah. So there's
Speaker 1: a lot on two Come So. And the best part
Speaker 1: of it is is that I didn't know anything about
Speaker 1: to Come So a year and a half ago. Nothing
Speaker 1: I I'll tell you how I got interested in him
Speaker 1: as I was reading another book, a book by Alan
Speaker 1: Eckhart called The Frontiersman, which I didn't ball boy, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna make some enemies. I didn't like the book. I
Speaker 1: actually couldn't finish it. It was written in a it's
Speaker 1: a very famous book. It's it's, it's he wrote very
Speaker 1: well known, a well known biography of two Come sat
Speaker 1: And he also wrote the Outdoor Drama, didn't he And
Speaker 1: he's you know, he's art at heart. Yeah, he's he's
Speaker 1: passed away, but he, uh, his his books, especially The Frontiersman,
Speaker 1: were done. They're they're written what do they call it,
Speaker 1: like a historical narrative, historical fiction. Yeah, Basically they take
Speaker 1: real stuff that they know happened and kind of dramatize
Speaker 1: it inside of telling in the story form. So it's
Speaker 1: it's it's very informative and that you you probably get
Speaker 1: a really good picture of what happened. But they're totally
Speaker 1: just guessing about like you know, they would put words
Speaker 1: into comes his mouth about him talking to it would
Speaker 1: be a story that is informed by the historical figures
Speaker 1: and a lot of research, but factually it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I had a hard time. Yeah, my wife loves books
Speaker 1: like that. She loves a historical fiction. So but I
Speaker 1: was telling you, I was telling you why I was
Speaker 1: reading that book, and it was talking about two compsa
Speaker 1: because he's in the book and it and it talked
Speaker 1: about how his name meant panther crossing the sky. That's
Speaker 1: pretty They knew how to name yea and I mean Sylla.
Speaker 1: That's a good one. Yeah, it's so complex though, Tin
Speaker 1: Squaddo his name wasn't Tin Squatta until after he had
Speaker 1: the visions. His name was. I still think it's a
Speaker 1: It's a better name than Josh. Sorry, man, great, so
Speaker 1: so moms you need to work a little harder in
Speaker 1: their own way. The other thing that I wished I
Speaker 1: had known, which I declared on the podcast, was that
Speaker 1: I wish I had known about the burying a white
Speaker 1: tail antler with a Nambo's big chance. Did y'all do
Speaker 1: that with me? Dad? No, we did. You got that
Speaker 1: umbilical cord floating around anywhere? Is it too late to
Speaker 1: bury it? There another body part you could use. It's
Speaker 1: a cut off the finger. Yeah, yeah, maybe maybe. Well, um, misty,
Speaker 1: what do you think of the podcast? I thought it
Speaker 1: was really good. I thought, yeah, you're you're taking a
Speaker 1: pretty complex topic and you're just trying to look at it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: shoot it straight, get get the get the facts, and
Speaker 1: none of the other stuff around it. And you know,
Speaker 1: you acknowledged the podcast that this kind of stuff, for
Speaker 1: no good reason, can be difficult to talk about because
Speaker 1: people get so um, I don't know, people get so
Speaker 1: easily offended and and and don't necessarily want to look
Speaker 1: at things just yeah, there there are people want to
Speaker 1: make a lot of a lot of qualifying statements around everything.
Speaker 1: And I thought you did a good job of just
Speaker 1: like saying this is this is what happened. This is
Speaker 1: a story. It's a very intriguing story. I mean, there's
Speaker 1: so many different aspects of this particular story. As as
Speaker 1: you're going through it almost felt like it almost felt unreal.
Speaker 1: I mean, like the brother what did he I I
Speaker 1: remember your phrase? Do you think he called that down?
Speaker 1: What was what was told William Henry Harrison that he
Speaker 1: was going to go back to Detroit and stomp his
Speaker 1: foot and it was gonna earth was gonna shake his
Speaker 1: house down. Okay, yeah, and the yeah right right, so
Speaker 1: the earthquakes and but there are just several aspects of
Speaker 1: it that were, yeah, almost unbelievable. And I'm not saying
Speaker 1: that I don't believe these things happened, Like I I
Speaker 1: do believe these things happen. But I just thought it
Speaker 1: was a great It's a very intriguing tale. I'm looking
Speaker 1: forward to hearing the other two. I think there's it's
Speaker 1: a sad tale. I mean it's it's on a lot
Speaker 1: of different levels personal, like what happened to his people?
Speaker 1: If I put myself and I think that's what you
Speaker 1: did really well in this. You you made to come
Speaker 1: to come to a person, you know, you made him
Speaker 1: a person that you could relate to and not like
Speaker 1: this heroic figure what she was, but or or you
Speaker 1: took someone whose life had a whole lot of dynamics
Speaker 1: in it that that seemed too big to be real,
Speaker 1: and you could kind of feel like, well, if I
Speaker 1: was in his bow, if I was in his shoes,
Speaker 1: this is how I would. Uh. Yeah, I can understand.
Speaker 1: I can understand that. Yeah, I love love being an Indian. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he loved living the way that they wanted to live. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And it's you know, I think it also gives a
Speaker 1: level of well, I'll let someone else. I'll let someone
Speaker 1: else talking. If you don't think what was you can
Speaker 1: give an overarching statement, but like, what is one thing?
Speaker 1: I can think of one thing that if I were
Speaker 1: to talking to you, I would get excited about and
Speaker 1: I would say, man, you wouldn't believe this. I thought
Speaker 1: it was fascinating to overlap with Daniel Boone. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean that was Yeah, that was that. That kind of
Speaker 1: came out of nowhere. Like I didn't. I didn't quite
Speaker 1: you know, I listened today to the podcast and I
Speaker 1: didn't quite catch all the timelines. And then when you
Speaker 1: started talking about that, I'm like, oh, man, this is
Speaker 1: like two huge figures in American history just piling around,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. I think it's pretty incredible
Speaker 1: at the very least, and more of uh uh Daniel
Speaker 1: Boone's biographies it would come up. Oh and by the
Speaker 1: way he had these interactions with this probably the most prolific. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, Daniel Boone wouldn't have even eventually he would
Speaker 1: have known who I mean, surely too Compson would have
Speaker 1: known who Daniel Boone was, at least at the very least.
Speaker 1: And yeah, I thought that was pretty fascinating. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: but we do. There is no record right of the
Speaker 1: mac fully, No, they were just they were contemporaries all
Speaker 1: that stuff back there. It's so there is a lot
Speaker 1: of folklore around all those guys. Yeah, folklore meaning just
Speaker 1: we're not exactly sure how to dial it in. Possibly
Speaker 1: exaggerated Taylor, but that is not folklore. I mean like
Speaker 1: Tecumsa was was with black Fish, who was his adopted father,
Speaker 1: and it was the same black Fish that adopted Boone,
Speaker 1: and they would have absolutely overlapped. So, I mean, there's
Speaker 1: no question about that. The speculation is was was two
Speaker 1: comes one of the kids that Boone gave candy too.
Speaker 1: I didn't the statement I made. I made too just
Speaker 1: interesting statements that I remember. I remember Boone telling his
Speaker 1: son Nathan that Blackfish would suck on a sugar cube
Speaker 1: and give it to him. Man, when you think about uh,
Speaker 1: like a way to like caw sure a moment in history.
Speaker 1: Boone knew how to do that, and it showed so
Speaker 1: much of what Blackfish wanted from Boone and who he was.
Speaker 1: But the way I said it in the podcast, it
Speaker 1: made it sound like Blackfish was given candy to the kids.
Speaker 1: Boone was the one who also told Nathan, his son
Speaker 1: that hey, I would give candy. I guess he got
Speaker 1: sugarcubes from somewhere to the little kids in Chili coffee
Speaker 1: or they weren't Chili Coothee at that time. Uh well
Speaker 1: yeah they were. He could have given a sugar cube
Speaker 1: to two come that speculation. We don't know that. So
Speaker 1: I thought that was really fascinating. I also, um, you know,
Speaker 1: we've talked a little bit about Chief Ben Barnes. Fascinating
Speaker 1: guy to here speak. I mean just he seems very
Speaker 1: articulate and knowledgeable, and I'm hoping we're going to get
Speaker 1: to hear from him for sure. It was it was
Speaker 1: kind of I kind of hated it that he didn't
Speaker 1: show up more on this first episode. He just did.
Speaker 1: We didn't talk as much with him about the chronology
Speaker 1: of it comes to his life. So he weighs in
Speaker 1: a whole lot more in later episodes. And we're gonna
Speaker 1: hear about the Shawny Nation today. I'm looking forward to that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but Dad, what do you think? It's always very very good? Um,
Speaker 1: really deep. I mean, it was just like I just
Speaker 1: couldn't believe all the action in that thing. Um an
Speaker 1: amazing guy. You know, I read about Quanta Parker years ago.
Speaker 1: The two guys remind me of each other, umpire of
Speaker 1: the Summer Moon. And I'd never dreamed there'd be an
Speaker 1: Indian more popular and bigger significance than Quantum. I mean
Speaker 1: he entertained presidents and uh m hmm. But this guy
Speaker 1: was amazing. I mean I liked it when they said
Speaker 1: you have a personnelit on the arise. They didn't say
Speaker 1: a generation or every other generation, but you see it
Speaker 1: in sports. You know, you go, this is a generational athlete.
Speaker 1: But he was one in a many, many, many people
Speaker 1: that had the ability to lead. Uh just a natural ability.
Speaker 1: And you know his looks that was enter interesting, you know.
Speaker 1: I mean he had everything you would want in a leader.
Speaker 1: He even had a limp where people could tell who
Speaker 1: he was from a distance. I mean, he was a
Speaker 1: beautiful guy. He was built well, he was strong, he
Speaker 1: was his voice. I mean everything about him was said,
Speaker 1: I am the guy follow me. Now. I'm not sure. Uh,
Speaker 1: I assume he took the nation down the right path.
Speaker 1: I don't know about that. I mean, you know, he
Speaker 1: cost a lot of lives by taking that direction. But uh,
Speaker 1: it's also intriguing to me that it was just oh,
Speaker 1: how Wisconsin, Indiana, you know, Illinois, just a mid America. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, it's sounds like a pretty good plan to me.
Speaker 1: Let's go for that. Yeah, that's that's and that's so deep.
Speaker 1: It's it's hard to get everything right. But that's the
Speaker 1: simplest way to say it is that it comes to
Speaker 1: didn't think that the whole continent of North America was
Speaker 1: going to be given back to the Native Americans. They
Speaker 1: just wanted an Indian nation, and that, when you think
Speaker 1: about it, is really doesn't sound that wild. I mean,
Speaker 1: think about Europe. Think about Europe. Europe is full of
Speaker 1: different countries. I mean there's i mean a country like
Speaker 1: the U. S That has this much geographic land of
Speaker 1: of contiguous you know, geographic areas in the same jurisdiction
Speaker 1: of government. Is pretty wild. And you know, if there
Speaker 1: was a there was a country inside of this, we
Speaker 1: we wouldn't just be like yeah, that's it would have worked.
Speaker 1: I mean we would have combined forces together and been
Speaker 1: like one country. I mean, who knows where it would
Speaker 1: have gone. But pretty crazy. Yeah, well, and that's the
Speaker 1: thing about it comes to that so intriguing, and we
Speaker 1: really haven't even got into These things are so hard
Speaker 1: to put together because we haven't even got into really
Speaker 1: what he did. We described We spent a lot of
Speaker 1: time on his childhood, which I thought that's always one
Speaker 1: of the most interesting parts to me of these guys lives.
Speaker 1: Who made them and why are they the way they are?
Speaker 1: And when you see the crisis into comes to his life,
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, we can't. Now there are people on
Speaker 1: planet Earth today that can identify with living in a
Speaker 1: war zone and having people killed. I mean, this is
Speaker 1: not something that is unusual to human race. Yeah, for
Speaker 1: for us here in North America. Yeah, but I mean
Speaker 1: three major figures, like every father he ever had died
Speaker 1: by the time he was fourteen years old. His his
Speaker 1: older brother, who then was tasked to raise him dies.
Speaker 1: Chess Aqua says, I don't want to be buried like
Speaker 1: these You're not supposed to say that word anymore, squaw.
Speaker 1: They don't say that anymore. They don't, ye, so, but
Speaker 1: that's what that's what they said. Did He said, I
Speaker 1: I want the fouls of the air to pick my butt.
Speaker 1: Love that man. I just thought that was awesome. I'm thinking,
Speaker 1: that's kind of the way I want to go make
Speaker 1: that happen. That had to get renamed because it was
Speaker 1: called an old squaw. Yeah it's a long tail now, Yep.
Speaker 1: I'm for it, Yep, I just want it recorded. When
Speaker 1: I heard that, I immediately lived at Clay and said, hey,
Speaker 1: I don't feel the same way for those the Native Americans.
Speaker 1: And this goes back to what's so intriguing to me
Speaker 1: from a language and kind of folks each like, where
Speaker 1: did where did the kind of the American dialect come from?
Speaker 1: Is that the Native American orators were powerful. You go
Speaker 1: back and listen to the very first introduction of the podcast.
Speaker 1: I start off with a quote from Takompsa where he's
Speaker 1: talking to who would eventually become a US president, William
Speaker 1: Henry Harrison. Just listen to the way he spoke, and
Speaker 1: there are hundreds of two Compsa quotes where I mean,
Speaker 1: those guys, man, that's all they had. They didn't have
Speaker 1: written language, they didn't have they didn't have books to
Speaker 1: write stuff in. I mean, in most of their history,
Speaker 1: what they had was spoken language, and they were masters
Speaker 1: of it. And then when these Europeans came over here
Speaker 1: with the English language. They heard these guys talk and
Speaker 1: we're like wow. And and you know, Robert Morgan is
Speaker 1: the one who told me that. Well, I said of
Speaker 1: that to say, what chis Aqua said was that's just
Speaker 1: the way they spoke. They were just dramatic in the
Speaker 1: way that they spoke. You know, they said, I want
Speaker 1: the fouls of the air to pick my bones. I
Speaker 1: don't want to be buried back at camp. But that
Speaker 1: would have really impacted Ta Kompsa and the I'm picking
Speaker 1: on two things here, the fog of death over his life,
Speaker 1: but then that translated into him being this leader, visionary
Speaker 1: with with what he believed was in the best interest
Speaker 1: for his people, and then him being this great orator
Speaker 1: and leader. Incredible stuff, Isaac, What was your favorite part?
Speaker 1: I got three big ones. Okay, One the idea that
Speaker 1: he like stood up on on that the First War
Speaker 1: Party outing fifteen years old against Like, if I was
Speaker 1: in that position, I'd be like, Yep, we torture people.
Speaker 1: That's what I'm into now, Like because I had just
Speaker 1: no like personal authority or you know, identity. Yeah, to
Speaker 1: be able to be like, hey, guys, even if I
Speaker 1: felt that way, you know, and I'm not. I'm not
Speaker 1: trying to map my my current understanding of the world
Speaker 1: onto these people. But to see someone do that is
Speaker 1: truly remarkable to me. Yeah, to stand stand against a
Speaker 1: trend because you could not. But as a not as
Speaker 1: a full grown man, as a fifteen I mean to
Speaker 1: some degree he was, but like as a fifteen year
Speaker 1: old boy, I was, you know, lightening bottle rockets with
Speaker 1: my buddies and getting up to no good. He's like, hey,
Speaker 1: let's let's reconsider this tradition. Yeah too, I've been back
Speaker 1: and forth, so like, hey, let me stop you. I
Speaker 1: want to talk about that, because that was a definer
Speaker 1: of comes his life. That was what got back to
Speaker 1: the American people, that made them love to compsa was
Speaker 1: that that was that was part of what got back.
Speaker 1: And um, I had asked Peter Cozens, I said, where
Speaker 1: did where did that come from? And and in the
Speaker 1: section we used on the podcast, it was kind of
Speaker 1: like we don't know where he got that, Like how
Speaker 1: did that come What wasn't on the podcast because I
Speaker 1: just had to chop it was he He told me
Speaker 1: that there were some other chiefs, like way back, like
Speaker 1: a random chief every now and then would be like, hey,
Speaker 1: this is bad, we shouldn't do this. So he he
Speaker 1: he probably had that in his in the historic lineage
Speaker 1: at some point, but he still had to stand up vehemently.
Speaker 1: And we just told this time when he was fifteen,
Speaker 1: when he did that, that was the first time he
Speaker 1: made a stink about it. But all through his life,
Speaker 1: even to his deathbed, he was going in and like
Speaker 1: scolding guys for for torturing prisoners, which was extremely calm
Speaker 1: whole life. And to bring it back to uh Daniel Boone, Uh,
Speaker 1: it makes me wonder he was ten years old when
Speaker 1: Daniel Bunde was captured. Only five years later he's standing
Speaker 1: up to a war party saying, like, let's reconsider how
Speaker 1: we operate here. So it wouldn't surprise me if he
Speaker 1: stood out as a child in this circumstance, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, Like ten years to fifteen years old
Speaker 1: is not that big of a difference. Number two, I
Speaker 1: like my background. I maybe considered more of a bleeding
Speaker 1: heart or I don't know what you would want to
Speaker 1: call it, but like I empathize with the plight of
Speaker 1: Native Americans, and I feel kind of bad about the
Speaker 1: way that they have been treated historically speaking, And I
Speaker 1: was listening to a podcast recently that deals with a
Speaker 1: modern struggle of native rights against uh, the established government,
Speaker 1: and I got to thinking, like, in any other circumstance,
Speaker 1: a conquered people like it doesn't matter what they feel like.
Speaker 1: The history of people is that we conquer other people's
Speaker 1: and then it's like, too bad, you lose. And so
Speaker 1: I was like, is my feeling correct about this? But
Speaker 1: one of the things things that made me swing back
Speaker 1: to my original position on this is the idea that
Speaker 1: what is at stake here is not a conquered people
Speaker 1: versus a conqueror, but it is a powerful entity that
Speaker 1: operates in bad faith, giving treaties and then going back
Speaker 1: on their word, saying here's how we're going to deal
Speaker 1: with you, and then discovering that that was a lie
Speaker 1: or a ruse to whatever. And so ultimately what we're
Speaker 1: saying is not only is this a people who has
Speaker 1: treated poorly in terms of they had the bad luck
Speaker 1: to be overran by people who had better technology and
Speaker 1: a bunch of disease, but then those people who were
Speaker 1: operating in power dealt in bad faith with them and
Speaker 1: have continued to and so that's a lot of the
Speaker 1: issue that we're dealing with today, not this abstract comp
Speaker 1: concept of this people was treated poorly back then, but
Speaker 1: our government said, here's how we'll operate with you. Here
Speaker 1: is a legal document that says these are your rights,
Speaker 1: this is your place that cont annually was treated like garbage.
Speaker 1: And so I think that that is an interesting thing
Speaker 1: to view this through, because not only is there this
Speaker 1: moral question of what's right and wrong, but there's this
Speaker 1: legal question of we they are probably owed something to
Speaker 1: some degree, and and through that lens the idea of hey,
Speaker 1: I'd just like to set up this Indian country. That
Speaker 1: seems like a very valid and very small ask, especially
Speaker 1: because that was guaranteed to them by the way our
Speaker 1: government operated. And so I think that's an interesting concept.
Speaker 1: You touched on it in the podcast, but we didn't
Speaker 1: go in super deep. Yeah, which leads to my third point,
Speaker 1: which is it's he's so interesting and this is kind
Speaker 1: of what Gary was talking about in this like great
Speaker 1: like confluence of all of these personality and physical traits
Speaker 1: the oration. So much of the story of Native Americans
Speaker 1: is our government dealing with them a way that they
Speaker 1: don't understand like the idea of private landownership and so
Speaker 1: like to treat with them in that way is kind
Speaker 1: of dirty pool. And then here we have somebody like
Speaker 1: two Comes who understands the concept, is well versed in
Speaker 1: the way of the American people, but then also has
Speaker 1: the backbone to stand up and go I reject that.
Speaker 1: So I'm going to lead my people with this understanding
Speaker 1: into a way that could potentially um bring success. And
Speaker 1: I think that's another just really fascinating aspect of his
Speaker 1: unique personhood. Yeah, James, what do you think, Well, there
Speaker 1: are a couple aspects of it that jumped out to me.
Speaker 1: The first part of it that I was really struck by.
Speaker 1: I think if you if you took the names off
Speaker 1: of all the different parties in it and just told
Speaker 1: the story from from the standpoint of UM, a charismatic
Speaker 1: leader and oppressed people, or you could say it from
Speaker 1: an oppressed people, or you could even say it from
Speaker 1: the standpoint of people who are who felt like they
Speaker 1: were being treated badly maybe or they weren't, because history
Speaker 1: is full of UM these figures, and you touched on
Speaker 1: it this once in a lifetime or once in a generation,
Speaker 1: these people who come along, who can inspire a revolution? Right,
Speaker 1: So good revolutions and bad revolutions have have happened throughout history.
Speaker 1: So that was the first thing that kind of struck
Speaker 1: me is that this is one of those kind of
Speaker 1: stories that just didn't result in the kind of happy
Speaker 1: ending or um. You know, if it was if it
Speaker 1: was put Churchill in there or put Gandhi in there
Speaker 1: as two coomsa okay, and they were victorious, we would
Speaker 1: remember the history differently. But he wasn't victorious, right, and
Speaker 1: so ultimately what he doesn't win. Hear Ben Barnes comment
Speaker 1: on that. Love it? Sorry, go ahead, Yeah, it's up
Speaker 1: for debate. Okay, So so you I understand your point.
Speaker 1: I was making a joy It's a great point. But
Speaker 1: you that's the thing that struck me was how it's
Speaker 1: a charismatic it's a charismatic leader who in The second
Speaker 1: thing that that I kind of saw was you had
Speaker 1: said that you had this religious movement started as a
Speaker 1: religious movement and then you know, with his brother, and
Speaker 1: then he came along and added the political and military
Speaker 1: component to it. Okay, how often has that happened, even
Speaker 1: fairly recently? You know, So history has this way of
Speaker 1: repeating itself and then and then thinking about how you
Speaker 1: were You had mentioned that they back to the the
Speaker 1: storytelling in the way that they spoke, and how that
Speaker 1: was basically borrowed. Here you had people on essentially two
Speaker 1: opposite sides, right, So the Europeans who were moving in
Speaker 1: wanted to conquer, and there and their leadership and their
Speaker 1: you know, the religious leaders, their political leaders were looking
Speaker 1: at their opposition and copying what they admired that their
Speaker 1: opposition was able to do. I mean that still happens
Speaker 1: to every day. Um. You know, one side gets a
Speaker 1: little bit ahead, and then the other side copies their
Speaker 1: tactics and they get a little bit ahead or so.
Speaker 1: So the overarching thing there for me is that I
Speaker 1: was struck by how easily you could you could take
Speaker 1: this story and place it in so many other times
Speaker 1: in history. You just took the punchline from from episode two,
Speaker 1: James get the memo. That's a great observation because that's
Speaker 1: what I talked about it with Dave Edmonds, and it's
Speaker 1: so interesting to hear him describe it, and that when
Speaker 1: you turn a bunch of people loose in the in
Speaker 1: the same place and there's there's border conflicts and cultural
Speaker 1: conflicts like the Native Americans and the the Americans. Basically
Speaker 1: all the same stuff like always happens different different players,
Speaker 1: different characters, different little different scenarios, but some it's really similar.
Speaker 1: So yeah, that's a that's a good that's a good observation.
Speaker 1: I also thought it was really interesting how the reaction was, Hey,
Speaker 1: we got to get rid of this modern stuff that's
Speaker 1: coming in here and go back to our simpler way
Speaker 1: of life. And that interesting. I mean, so much of
Speaker 1: history is that conflict between progress and and our roots.
Speaker 1: It's like we feel it personally, we feel it generationally,
Speaker 1: we feel it as a country. And and that's always
Speaker 1: the political tension pretty much anywhere, it's the political tension
Speaker 1: in this country. Yep. Is that Well, you know, who
Speaker 1: was the America from fifty years ago? We're not that anymore.
Speaker 1: And and it's and it's an idealized way also can be.
Speaker 1: You know, we remember the good things from the past
Speaker 1: and we forget the whatever, you know, we forget the
Speaker 1: uh childhood poverty or you know, birth rates or you
Speaker 1: know whatever it is that we that we kind of
Speaker 1: gloss over from the past that wasn't as good. What
Speaker 1: do you think, Dad, I didn't have a thought. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well I've had a several, but forget them pretty quickly. Remember,
Speaker 1: you know the point you just made about going back
Speaker 1: the way we used to be. You know, I thought
Speaker 1: that was really critical. You see it all through our
Speaker 1: society today. I want to go back the way we
Speaker 1: were twenty years ago. I mean, uh, how we teach
Speaker 1: our kids all this stuff? They had the same issues.
Speaker 1: And if you go back to the Civil War, you know,
Speaker 1: wherever you go, I mean, it's we we fight the
Speaker 1: same demons. And when they when his brother received this
Speaker 1: vision or whatever it was his dream, he uh, he
Speaker 1: wouldn't run the country is an evangelist, And they said
Speaker 1: a lot of the early evangel were Indians like Paul Roberts. Uh.
Speaker 1: I don't know. That's a that overlap was really interesting
Speaker 1: and I saw it coming in the book before they
Speaker 1: actually said it. So in the way the book structured,
Speaker 1: it talks about Tin Squentawa's Tin Squaws, his vision and
Speaker 1: the components of the doctrine. And I'm as I'm reading it,
Speaker 1: I'm thinking, this is a lot there's a lot of
Speaker 1: overlap with Christian preacher. Yeah, you know, you got you
Speaker 1: got the serpent's and you got to master whatever they
Speaker 1: call it. So you got God in safe and and
Speaker 1: a lot of and you know, we couldn't get into
Speaker 1: like all the doctrine just because it's just there's only
Speaker 1: so much. I tried to give people just what they
Speaker 1: need to understand. But the whole thing was about gaining
Speaker 1: access back to the Great Spirit, which is essentially the
Speaker 1: story of Christianity, access to God, you know, And and
Speaker 1: so that it was the same thing. It was. It was.
Speaker 1: It was a similar story. And it was so interesting
Speaker 1: to hear go ahead, go ahead before I forget it. Yeah, uh,
Speaker 1: he said. The brother said that I've already forgotten it.
Speaker 1: But the point that I'm driving it. I've talked to Indians,
Speaker 1: you know, people that I know today, and they say,
Speaker 1: one great thing that came from all this was Christianity.
Speaker 1: And um, so there were some good that came. I
Speaker 1: raised my hand again. I'm getting too old to be
Speaker 1: on the river. Hey, hey, here you here's here's the point.
Speaker 1: Here's a point. Now, this isn't it? This is better? Okay,
Speaker 1: even better when I think about the render, the brotherhood,
Speaker 1: the bond that we have here we eat out of
Speaker 1: the same bowl, we eat out of the same with
Speaker 1: the same spoon, same stuff. Yeah, there you go. Some
Speaker 1: want the sugar cube, passed the sugar cube. That's all
Speaker 1: we're gonna start doing now. I thought, I thought that
Speaker 1: was super interesting that the at the time of the
Speaker 1: Great Awakening in this country and there were all there
Speaker 1: was this frontier Christian revival same same time this was happening.
Speaker 1: Super interesting and um yeah, the the the miracles were
Speaker 1: very interesting eclips. So when you read it, there's some
Speaker 1: guys that just straight up say Tin Squattawa knew there
Speaker 1: was an eclipse coming and it just it just Dom
Speaker 1: Henry Harrison just like you know, threw him a softball,
Speaker 1: you know, a slow pitch and just let him knock
Speaker 1: it out of the park. But I mean, I don't
Speaker 1: know how how fast does word travel about a solar eclipse?
Speaker 1: I mean today, even with Instagram, I only know him
Speaker 1: about a few days before they happened. And he was
Speaker 1: he said it fifty days before. Um, I don't know.
Speaker 1: And then but no one can predict an earthquake. No, no,
Speaker 1: you do you think do you think to come so
Speaker 1: it was like it happened or do you think he
Speaker 1: was like lucked out on that one shot. I asked
Speaker 1: Robert Morgan, Yeah, he said New York Times. Hey, he
Speaker 1: blamed a lot of the problems not own the white man,
Speaker 1: but on the way they were living. I mean, that
Speaker 1: was that was pretty insane. I mean, you know, I mean,
Speaker 1: they will we do the same thing today, We talked
Speaker 1: the same way today a lot of times. Yeah, they
Speaker 1: said that it was a it was a punishment for
Speaker 1: they believe that what was happening to their culture was
Speaker 1: was a punishment for them assimilating. Yeah. And the other
Speaker 1: part of this story, the more I learned about these
Speaker 1: things is that this all didn't happen real quick like
Speaker 1: right now, when we tell the story, we say, yeah,
Speaker 1: they were there, was as civil as they here, and
Speaker 1: then that civilization was basically moved and removed. This thing
Speaker 1: took place over the course of several hundred years. And
Speaker 1: so I was really, I mean almost disappointed in a
Speaker 1: way when I learned that a lot of the Shawnees rejected.
Speaker 1: Two comes to and his brother and he just kind
Speaker 1: of like it really ship j C. Man, I'm not
Speaker 1: too sure, but I mean he was the one who
Speaker 1: said a prophet was being set in his hometown. What
Speaker 1: what what? It's interesting to think about the timeline. So
Speaker 1: they accepted European settlement four two, Right, took a couple
Speaker 1: of goes to start. If you want to look at
Speaker 1: the Vikings settling sooner, that's a different thing. But if
Speaker 1: you just go with fourteen and two, we've not been
Speaker 1: the United States of America longer than we have, right,
Speaker 1: and so like it seems like this very short, compressed thing.
Speaker 1: But like that's almost three hundred years before it comes
Speaker 1: it comes along. Yeah, that's a that's a lot of time.
Speaker 1: That's a lot of time, especially in that they were
Speaker 1: talking about Christopher Columbus the same way we are. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean the difference free three five years. I mean
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, yeah, it's a complicated history and and
Speaker 1: it it is intimidating to do a series like this because, um,
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not trying to say that this is
Speaker 1: at all inclusive, that this podcast is going to cover
Speaker 1: everything about which comes to life. That'd be impossible, but man,
Speaker 1: I wanted to have as much as it it can
Speaker 1: that makes sense of the time, and to me, like
Speaker 1: the revelations that I have about these things as I
Speaker 1: study them is what I put on the podcast, and
Speaker 1: I thought it was a powerful metaphor the soccer game.
Speaker 1: It's great. It would be like trying to describe what
Speaker 1: it would be like for the Native Americans and and
Speaker 1: with an understanding of their understand ending of of private landownership,
Speaker 1: which I'm fascinated with. I own piece of land that's
Speaker 1: not here, small piece of land, and when I go there,
Speaker 1: that's not where I live, another little property. When I
Speaker 1: go there, can you drop me a pen? Negative? I'm
Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't own this place. This is ridiculous,
Speaker 1: this is this is a joke. I don't own this place. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've got the right to be here, nobody else does.
Speaker 1: I don't own this place for real. Feel like that.
Speaker 1: When I'm standing there, I'm like, this is not this
Speaker 1: is this is a very abstract, weird feeling. Identify with
Speaker 1: those guys, But okay, soccer game. When you understand that
Speaker 1: a the Native American a lot of the tribes, that
Speaker 1: their connection to their gods and the spiritual world is
Speaker 1: very site specific, super good, intel understand their culture, and
Speaker 1: then for a group to come in that had private
Speaker 1: land ownership worldview and understanding, it would be like a
Speaker 1: soccer game forming in your yard around you, and the
Speaker 1: rules of the game violate your worldview. You don't understand them,
Speaker 1: you don't know them, but you're in them. You find
Speaker 1: yourself in the middle of the game, and whoever wins
Speaker 1: gets the land. Just like flesh this out a little
Speaker 1: bit further on my point number two, I feel like
Speaker 1: the rules of the game are additionally convoluted by the
Speaker 1: fact that the opponent is telling you the rules, changing them.
Speaker 1: You can pick up the ball. Whistle number two is
Speaker 1: just way too long. And she just said that we'd
Speaker 1: all got it, and then they cheated at the soccer game.
Speaker 1: We all know what you meant. Additionally, you're not really
Speaker 1: aware that you're going to lose your house at the
Speaker 1: beginning of the game. It just slowly unfolds that, like,
Speaker 1: hold up and we're just gonna play for fun. Somebody
Speaker 1: just moved to back. They're going to give you somewhere else,
Speaker 1: but you gotta walk there. The most amazing thing to
Speaker 1: me is what James said, We've got a hero that
Speaker 1: lost that's just uncalled for and doesn't happen. It doesn't happen,
Speaker 1: I mean, but I bet, But I think history is
Speaker 1: probably full of that. Oh that's the thing is history
Speaker 1: is literate with these people that have done amazing things,
Speaker 1: but they just didn't win. And whoever one gets to
Speaker 1: write the history right absolutely and and the yeah, the
Speaker 1: just don't always win. I mean they don't they don't win. Um.
Speaker 1: I thought the other thing if I was if I
Speaker 1: had been asked, why don't you ask me? Did you
Speaker 1: got to make the podcast? What you asked me? What
Speaker 1: did you think? What did you what was your favorite
Speaker 1: part with thanks for asking? That's great to me. One
Speaker 1: of the most interesting parts was about the influence of
Speaker 1: Native American culture on early American identity. I think that's
Speaker 1: way underrated. And I'll walk you even more through what
Speaker 1: I said on the podcast, so the the and I
Speaker 1: hope it made sense. I think the difference between Europeans today,
Speaker 1: like you just go get a random sampling of a
Speaker 1: guy from Europe and you put him with a random
Speaker 1: guy from I don't know, just a state in this country,
Speaker 1: and it would help if that guy was somehow connected
Speaker 1: to the land in a way, not somebody from urban America.
Speaker 1: I think the difference between those guys, which would be
Speaker 1: a vast difference if you could really trace it back
Speaker 1: if you could do a ancestry and me dot com
Speaker 1: with culture and figure out kind of where they came from.
Speaker 1: I think the difference is the Native American influence that
Speaker 1: impacts us to this day. Because when you think, because
Speaker 1: the Daniel Boone was the first real American non governmental hero,
Speaker 1: America's first heroes were like George Washington and Thomas Jefferson
Speaker 1: and these kind of guys. The only guy's written more
Speaker 1: about than Boone are those two in American history, American literature,
Speaker 1: the only two guys written more about and boot So
Speaker 1: Boone in a philosophical level, taught us how to be
Speaker 1: an American. He was an archetype. And Daniel Boone was
Speaker 1: tried for treason Josh because they thought he was an Indian.
Speaker 1: He he he went and lived with them, became adopted
Speaker 1: with them, new new um, the Shawnee language, knew how
Speaker 1: to trade. He would come back and they wouldn't trust him, like, dude,
Speaker 1: you can't trust that guy. He's been with, you know,
Speaker 1: these domestic terrorists. And he was so influenced by the
Speaker 1: Native American and all these frontiersmen were I mean, they
Speaker 1: taught us how to live in this place. I think
Speaker 1: that's fascinating. I thought racin and uh uh point of
Speaker 1: order real quick. Uh my dad, who is wonderful and
Speaker 1: listens to the podcast religiously. Chris Neil called on the
Speaker 1: way down here and said, Chris, he said, is Clay
Speaker 1: sure that all of his descendants are quite Europeans? I said,
Speaker 1: most of them? You're a descendants. You did say that.
Speaker 1: I paid attention. Yeah, to be very sure about this.
Speaker 1: Actually you should be extremely sure. I didn't get it
Speaker 1: the first time he said it. He caught it. I
Speaker 1: caught it. I don't. Are you sure all of your
Speaker 1: miscendants are all your descendants? I listened to the podcast
Speaker 1: twice yesterday, missed it and missed it when he first said, yeah,
Speaker 1: I love it. It's like being on LinkedIn. But when
Speaker 1: you're on LinkedIn you make a grammatical air your hammer
Speaker 1: on Instagram, they'll let it slide. Instagram doesn't even let
Speaker 1: you edit some of your things to fix those grammatical
Speaker 1: or tell Chris, I'm sorry I did. I was listen
Speaker 1: the Meat Eater podcast with what they do the game
Speaker 1: the Game show one, and Spencer new Heart said pronunciation.
Speaker 1: He did, Oh, no, it's viral. It's spreading yesterday pronunciation.
Speaker 1: He did. He did. He said it in the podcast,
Speaker 1: and when I was listening to it, I paused and said,
Speaker 1: is that how do you say that? Surely that can't
Speaker 1: be right, your total influencer. Well, well, so what's coming
Speaker 1: up on episode number two? Clay second half of it
Speaker 1: comes to his life Okay, second half of his life.
Speaker 1: So we really haven't even got into the to what
Speaker 1: he he did, which is he was highly involved in
Speaker 1: the War of eighteen twelve, sided with the British. Okay,
Speaker 1: so he's totally totally in with the British. So now
Speaker 1: a fascinating guy. And uh, we didn't even talk about
Speaker 1: him being a hunter. That was the main thing he
Speaker 1: was known as as a young man, was a great hunter.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, none of us picked up on that forty deer.
Speaker 1: It's funny, that's the part that Clay really questioned the
Speaker 1: whole story. I know something about hunting, but it's possible.
Speaker 1: But no, when I'm reading all these things, especially when
Speaker 1: there's a guy that far back, a lot of the
Speaker 1: questions I have for some of these historians, and I've
Speaker 1: learned a lot from Robert Morrigan and from some of
Speaker 1: these other guys, it's like, how do we know that?
Speaker 1: How do we know he did that? Because I mean,
Speaker 1: I I hope he did that, but I want to
Speaker 1: know how. And a lot of them when they come
Speaker 1: from multiple verses, that's good. But some things are just
Speaker 1: like you trace it back and you'd be like, yeah,
Speaker 1: somebody wrote that in their journal and they never even
Speaker 1: met the guy. Yeah. And I think that that even
Speaker 1: if it was half that, if it was a tenth
Speaker 1: of that, you would be a great hunter. Like if
Speaker 1: I killed four days four deer in three days, somebody
Speaker 1: would be like, dude, that Isaac guy knows how to
Speaker 1: he's getting it done. Yeah, So I think the point stands. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and he was. He was known as a great hunter
Speaker 1: in the in the Shawnee Nation, and that was a
Speaker 1: major deal for them. That was like that was being
Speaker 1: that was like being a NBA athlete. Speaking of hunting,
Speaker 1: What's coming up on March four, Black Bear Bonanza nine
Speaker 1: am to five pm at the Benton County Quail Barn
Speaker 1: in Bentonville, Arkansas. YEP. Get your tickets ten dollars each.
Speaker 1: The website back Country hunters dot org. Go to the
Speaker 1: events page if you have if you have a protest
Speaker 1: you want to launch, you might try that. An audio
Speaker 1: based protest. You might try that during the Bear Grease
Speaker 1: render recording. What do you mean. I'm just I'm just
Speaker 1: trying to incentivize some people to come out that might
Speaker 1: not Oh, I think they might start like chanting, could
Speaker 1: be talk. I was thinking, if you have an olhood,
Speaker 1: you should be practicing, and it doesn't matter where you're
Speaker 1: I think we're going to get to the point where
Speaker 1: we're going to have to have like qualifying role. We
Speaker 1: might because it would be if it was like an
Speaker 1: hour and a half of people getting up there now hooting,
Speaker 1: you'd get tired of it. But you have to have
Speaker 1: how many competitors did you have last year? I mean,
Speaker 1: like probably forty. I think I think we had about
Speaker 1: forty people. It was a lot in Arkansas. We're good.
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna say that. I'm not saying they were
Speaker 1: all from Arkansas, but we've been to other places. But
Speaker 1: you do get that, you do get the guys that
Speaker 1: probably have never out hooded much. They just want to
Speaker 1: get up there and have a fun time, which is cool. Ye,
Speaker 1: what are the chances of me doing all right with
Speaker 1: a trench coat and a real owl. Man, if I
Speaker 1: get up there with an owl under your trench coat
Speaker 1: and make it hoot, I say, let him go. Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: That's yeah. Bonus points, bonus points for execution, right, yeah,
Speaker 1: will be there, so just where. That's what you bar
Speaker 1: dowl y. I wish I had a bar dol. I
Speaker 1: know you do, I know you do. Well, Hey, this
Speaker 1: has been great, this has been great. This is uh,
Speaker 1: this is a long this is a long time coming
Speaker 1: for me. I've been planning this for a long time.
Speaker 1: It's come, so it's true. Yeah, yeah, all right, good