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Speaker 1: Warrant. Today's episode can spoilers for season three episode nine

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Speaker 1: of Foundation. Hello, my name is Jason Zepsi and on Mersey.

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Speaker 2: Night and I'm a.

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Speaker 1: Boo Podcast where we dived video favorite drills, movies, colleagues

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Speaker 1: of pop culture, Cody Roi our podcast. We're reading three

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Speaker 1: episodes a week plus news on Saturday.

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Speaker 3: Wow, it's there's three episodes a week and three hosts.

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Speaker 3: Today is in today's episode because we are talking about

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Speaker 3: Foundation season three episode nine, unbelievable episode of television. Very

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Speaker 3: glad to have super producer at Boo here to not

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Speaker 3: only talk about it, but also give us some more

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Speaker 3: insight into where we expect the season to go as

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Speaker 3: we head towards the final episode.

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Speaker 4: But first we got to just recap it.

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Speaker 1: Let's recap it, okay, Foundation Season three episode nine, The

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Speaker 1: Paths That Choose Us. We open up seemingly minutes after

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Speaker 1: the events of that closed episode eight, with Gail and

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Speaker 1: her squad arrived on New Terminus, now being hunted by

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Speaker 1: the Mules folks led by the Warden. Gail kind of

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Speaker 1: pretty easily uses her metallic powers to negate the Mules

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Speaker 1: ground forces. She takes one of the mules lieutenants the

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Speaker 1: warden prisoner and interrogates her, probes her mind. The Warden

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Speaker 1: is insisting, listen, I'm just doing what I always did,

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Speaker 1: but now I'm doing it for the Mule, like I'm

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Speaker 1: protecting the citizens of New Terminus, and I want to

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Speaker 1: be doing this. I love what I'm doing, like the Mule.

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Speaker 1: How's its love? What's going on? Because you you wouldn't

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Speaker 1: even know the truth from Alie, because that's the power

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Speaker 1: that the Mule has. So I'm gonna have to like

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Speaker 1: go into your mind and check things out. So they

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Speaker 1: go into Gail's mind interrogation room, which is a hut

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Speaker 1: from her home planet that is like flooded with water,

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Speaker 1: and immediately Gale, like you know, knows basically all the

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Speaker 1: biographical information that she needs to do about the Warden.

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Speaker 1: She knows, but she wants to know more about the Mule.

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Speaker 1: Wants to know what he's planning. The Warden can't say

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Speaker 1: because and now the pain begins to come out, and

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Speaker 1: in the psychic plane, the Mule like swims up out

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Speaker 1: of the water, grabs a ward and drags her down

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Speaker 1: and begins to drown her. In real life, she's hemorrhage's

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Speaker 1: blood from all her orifices and dies while I have

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Speaker 1: never known such love.

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Speaker 3: Okay, first of all, horrific, extremely creepy, really great creepy moment,

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Speaker 3: and we get to see this kind of battle of

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Speaker 3: the mentallic powers in this really gory way.

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Speaker 2: In this episode, I draw the line of eye stuff

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Speaker 2: and this was too much.

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Speaker 1: Eye stuff for me, got me like freaks.

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Speaker 2: I hurt me for the rest of the episode.

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Speaker 3: I couldn't stop thinking about it. Also, this, I have

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Speaker 3: never known such love. You guys did a great interview

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Speaker 3: with Pillow, who plays a couple of episodes ago, who

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Speaker 3: plays the Mule, and he kind of talked about how

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Speaker 3: the Mule not being someone who necessarily had a lot

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Speaker 3: of love or a lot of following or a lot

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Speaker 3: of people around him kind of shaped him. And I

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Speaker 3: feel like, now this, I have never known such love.

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Speaker 3: He's kind of feels like he's like brainwashing people to

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Speaker 3: care about him, to agree with him, but also to

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Speaker 3: love him. That's kind of I got gathered from this moment.

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Speaker 3: Did you kind of pick up the same thing?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah, clearly I think that that's how

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Speaker 1: his as we are going to find out this is

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Speaker 1: how his power works. It feels like love, and that's

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Speaker 1: why the people who he touches with his powers seems

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Speaker 1: so absolutely devoted to him. Pritch appears out of the

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Speaker 1: woods and Gail's like, well, I got a mind scan

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Speaker 1: him to make sure that he hasn't been touched by

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Speaker 1: the Mule. She takes him into the Psychic Water Hut

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Speaker 1: and he's untouched by the Mule. He's fine, man, She's

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Speaker 1: so happy.

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Speaker 4: He's just he's just.

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Speaker 1: He's purely incompetent without any kind of his own pritchet.

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Speaker 1: And she's super sexy guy that's kind of been fucking

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Speaker 1: up for the whole season.

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Speaker 4: But it's fine, just like untouched by the mule taller

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Speaker 4: than me.

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Speaker 3: A hans I was like, you know what, go for it, Gail,

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Speaker 3: you just have something happy in your life.

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Speaker 1: Meanwhile, the Mule is up on his spaceship in orbit

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Speaker 1: around New Terminus and he's continuing to troll Dawn. Beta

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Speaker 1: is upset at this entire display. The Mule says that hey,

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Speaker 1: I just got a DM from the Galactic Council saying

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Speaker 1: they want to give me trantor what do you think

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Speaker 1: about that?

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Speaker 4: Feel doesn't sound good?

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Speaker 1: Dawn, we go to Trantor, the Galactic Council, the Cloud Dominion,

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Speaker 1: and the Aluminites, the three breakaway governments from within Empire

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Speaker 1: go to meet Demarzelle. Maassador Quent is there just observing

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Speaker 1: because she has technically no job anymore. She's just hanging

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Speaker 1: out now. Dusk is nowhere to be seen, and and

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Speaker 1: de Marcel is like, don't worry, that's not a problem.

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Speaker 1: I will I'm Empire today, I'm representing him. Quent disagrees

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Speaker 1: with forcing the Empire's hands. She basically tells the insurgents like, listen,

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Speaker 1: I understand, Empire. Listen, I've been fucking Dusk for a

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Speaker 1: little while now, so I understand like how he governs,

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Speaker 1: and he's just not going to take kindly to this

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Speaker 1: kind of ultimatum. You know, it's just really not gonna work.

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Speaker 1: Like there's a different way that we can get what

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Speaker 1: we want. They're like, whatever, sounds like, we're doing it.

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Speaker 1: We're handing Tran toward to the mule. Dusk appears via hologram,

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Speaker 1: and then the Mule arrives via hologram, which is actually,

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Speaker 1: you know, you're like, okay, Dusk smarter than we gave

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Speaker 1: him credit for it. Doesn't want to be close enough

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Speaker 1: to the mule so that the mule could affect his mind.

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Speaker 1: And so Dusk lays out the offer, okay, Trantor to

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Speaker 1: the mule in exchange for peace, and of course Dusk

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Speaker 1: is like, and if you knew where I was, you

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Speaker 1: would include me in that deal. I'm sure, but guess

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Speaker 1: what I'm keeping Trantur, no deal, And the Mules like, well,

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Speaker 1: that doesn't matter because I can very easily pick you off,

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Speaker 1: like it doesn't actually what you think doesn't actually matter.

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Speaker 1: But then Dusk's like, oh yeah, what about the navaculate

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Speaker 1: the big bomb baby?

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Speaker 4: He bought this thing out. I was like, are you

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Speaker 4: kidding me?

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Speaker 1: Big bomb baby? This is LaBamba Grande. And the insurrectionists

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Speaker 1: and Quent are like whoa big bomb? Like, what are

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Speaker 1: you going to do with that? This is That's not good.

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Speaker 1: Dusk then, without any further delay, no speech, nothing, there's

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Speaker 1: no fourthwith uses the bomb to wipe out the Galactic

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Speaker 1: Council homework.

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Speaker 4: It's Gonsane.

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Speaker 1: Just gone. And then Cloud Dominion and then the Maiden

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Speaker 1: Aluminite Home World want you. It's like Steph Curry from

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Speaker 1: Deep a Striple genocide by Dusk.

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Speaker 3: Also like, why does he have to be such a

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Speaker 3: fucking like he's he's so.

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Speaker 4: Over the top of it, Like when he says that,

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Speaker 4: you know, the iluminite hold world was called the Maiden.

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Speaker 3: It always made me think it needed to be deflowered.

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Speaker 4: And then he blows it up. I'm like, God, that

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Speaker 4: was crazy.

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Speaker 3: Like you gotta say, you're gonna crazy, You're gonna like

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Speaker 3: all the bomb, You're gonna the bomb, Like Dusk plays

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Speaker 3: chill out, so.

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Speaker 1: He does this, and listen, I think, like from a

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Speaker 1: purely geo strategic sense, you could say, Okay, I kind

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Speaker 1: of understand it, but truly a horror we've just witnessed.

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Speaker 4: You're talking about Billy.

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Speaker 1: Everybody.

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Speaker 4: It's like three.

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Speaker 1: Everybody is a ghast. Don is basically like, don't fuck

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Speaker 1: with Empire, okay. Mule immediately logs off down then turns

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Speaker 1: to the insurrectionist leader and it's like, hey, you've seen

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Speaker 1: what I've done for Ambassador Quent, who is in a

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Speaker 1: similar situation with no home world or home organization. Now

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Speaker 1: feel free to live here. I will give you refuge.

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Speaker 1: You guys canna hang out of the palace. It's fine.

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Speaker 1: And then you know, Quent is like crying. Even Demarzelle

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Speaker 1: seems shocked, like this is crazy. Dawn watching this from

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Speaker 1: the space station, can't believe what he's seen, and he

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Speaker 1: then warns the Mule, like, hey, Dusk might aim the

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Speaker 1: bombit at you, and Mule says no because he if

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Speaker 1: he knew, that's only if he would have done it already.

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Speaker 1: We go to New Terminus. Gail realizes that the fighting

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Speaker 1: on the planet means that not everyone is under the

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Speaker 1: mules control. And here again we're getting these hints that

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Speaker 1: while the Mule's powers are certainly nothing to sneeze at,

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Speaker 1: there are hints of vulnerabilities, and here is some that

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Speaker 1: there continues to be fighting and clean up on New Terminus.

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Speaker 1: Pritchard then takes Gail and her squad down to like

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Speaker 1: an underground area where the refugees are hiding, and torn

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Speaker 1: Mallow is down there as well as Professor Ebling Miss

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Speaker 1: They all meet Gail and Gail's like, okay, you guys

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Speaker 1: are clean without you're untouched by the Mule. I've got

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Speaker 1: some big reveals for you guys, And here they are.

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Speaker 1: One second Foundation. It exists and it's run by me.

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Speaker 1: Oh Harry Selden put me in charge of it. Now.

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Speaker 1: At this point in time, they don't realize that there's

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Speaker 1: two Harry's. But that's very complicated and they'll figure that out.

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Speaker 1: And then she says, I want all of your help

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Speaker 1: in killing the mule. That's my plan. That's my goal,

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Speaker 1: is to kill the mule. And Torn's like, I love it.

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Speaker 1: He's got my wife. Let's start in on it right now.

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Speaker 1: Mcgale's like, hold on one thing before we start. I

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Speaker 1: have to check the mind of this last guy, Magnificent,

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Speaker 1: the DJ who I am, And I've checked everybody.

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Speaker 4: Kim fast, seeing as he came from Okay.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot going on. So she's getting to it now,

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Speaker 1: and before she really gets into it, Magnifico is like love,

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Speaker 1: speaking of love. The only person I love is Beta. Oh,

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Speaker 1: I love her, She's been so kind to me. But

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Speaker 1: then as Gail reaches out to touch Magnifico's mind, she

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Speaker 1: finds love for the mule in there, so they have

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Speaker 1: to It's I.

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Speaker 3: Read how they showed this with the mule kind of

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Speaker 3: round his neck, like choking him, but hugging him. It

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Speaker 3: was like such a good visual. I thought, Yeah, I

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Speaker 3: feel like This is just such a strong panne on

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Speaker 3: the episode. It really feels up there with your kind

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Speaker 3: of bigger shows that more people are watching right now.

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Speaker 3: I feel like this is still a hidden jam.

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Speaker 1: So they tie up Magnifico, and Torren is like trying

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Speaker 1: to level with him, like, guy, let's listen, just let

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Speaker 1: go of the mule, like you just He's also arguing

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Speaker 1: to everybody else like let's not just execute Magnifico. He

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Speaker 1: must have there's got to be a use for him.

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Speaker 1: Gail is like, well, okay, for now, we won't do

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Speaker 1: it because if he is going to betray us, I

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Speaker 1: will sense it. I now feel like I now feel like,

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Speaker 1: hold on, magnifical is the mule is now back? I

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Speaker 1: think it's back in place, simply just like it's Vaggin.

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Speaker 4: Why is she just?

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Speaker 3: She immediately is just like yeah, I'll sense it, And

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Speaker 3: it's like, but you haven't even checked him before.

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Speaker 2: Very I the arguments on either side of the group,

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Speaker 2: Torn being like let's not kill this guy, trust me, right,

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Speaker 2: and everyone just agreeing, and then Gail being like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: let's not kill this guy. I'll he won't sneak attack

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Speaker 2: us because I'll sense it first Gail, when have you

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Speaker 2: ever sensed that first? Exactly never. There's no precedent for that,

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Speaker 2: So why do I trust you to do that?

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Speaker 1: It's it's very Yoda in the Clone War is saying,

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Speaker 1: you know that if there was a syth that he

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Speaker 1: would yeah, yeah, he know. Anyway, we go to Micigen.

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Speaker 1: Day wakes up down in the water at the bottom

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Speaker 1: of a bong.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely what it is.

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Speaker 3: I agree the giant gods of this well, they're smoking

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Speaker 3: out bong because that war is.

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Speaker 1: So down there. He's down there amongst the roaches and

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Speaker 1: the little pieces of ash and the different things. It's

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Speaker 1: gross down there. This is where the mushrooms are growing.

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Speaker 1: They start to grow in his skin. He tries to

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Speaker 1: climb out, but it's very difficult to climb out, but

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Speaker 1: then someone flushes the bong and he ends up out

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Speaker 1: in a sewer control room and Song is there. She

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Speaker 1: pulls the fungus off his skin, and she saved him

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Speaker 1: because she realizes like he was telling the truth about

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Speaker 1: Danielle slash Demersel, and that's their messiah. Something must be done.

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Speaker 1: Day says, listen, I'm gonna go up to the courtroom.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to confront mister Sunmaster confront Yeah, and I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna get that authentic robot head to bring to Demarzelle

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Speaker 1: and Song and her partner Ocean or all for it.

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Speaker 1: Sun Master's up there making some kind of spear way.

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Speaker 1: I need not reach out to the mule Ale. They

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Speaker 1: need to bide by time and see what the mule has.

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Speaker 1: And as he's doing this, as Day barges in kicking

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Speaker 1: people out of the way, then chases Sunmaster around the

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Speaker 1: courtroom and then it later impaled him with the staff

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Speaker 1: crazy throws him down onto the dais and takes off

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Speaker 1: with the head. Thus ends sun Master.

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Speaker 3: The head off to He's just like boom, like when

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Speaker 3: they've been using ly pay so well in this season,

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Speaker 3: Like every time he shows up, he makes such a

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Speaker 3: big impact. And this is just what it's like, such

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Speaker 3: a funny. It's a badass action sequence, but it's also

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Speaker 3: hilarious because he really just goes in there and fucking

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Speaker 3: kills him.

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Speaker 1: But were you hoping for one last speech, yes from

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Speaker 1: sun Master, one last.

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Speaker 2: I wanted one last like juicy confrontation between sun Master

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Speaker 2: and Day actually, and I was kind of like, oh, wait,

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Speaker 2: is he just shoving people what's happening here? Like it's

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Speaker 2: full on, like Rambo, like no negotiation at this point,

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Speaker 2: a quick way to get skull in Day's hands. But

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Speaker 2: I'll admit I was a little disappointed.

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Speaker 1: I know, I was hoping for one more pronunciation of

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Speaker 1: high high above in the palace, dusk is in the

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Speaker 1: throne room, or excuse me, the hall of clones. Basically

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Speaker 1: talking shit, talking ship about all the previous the conciliator,

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Speaker 1: give me a fucking the conger, get a load of

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Speaker 1: this guy. And then he then tells Demarzelle as he

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Speaker 1: comes to his own bust, that he does not like

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Speaker 1: his sobriquette, which I'm now forgetting. What was it the

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Speaker 1: was it the conciliator? I think it was the concilia.

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Speaker 1: He doesn't like that because nobody really understands what that means.

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Speaker 1: Also basically means like the nice guy.

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Speaker 3: Not a good piece going on. You have not conciliated anything,

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Speaker 3: my friend like this.

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Speaker 1: So he says, I would like the consequential, and Demarzelle's like, okay,

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Speaker 1: but let's not rush into it. A lot of things

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Speaker 1: going on. You're about to be ascended. We don't know

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Speaker 1: the outcome of your triple genocides, like, we don't know.

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Speaker 1: That's a huge disruption to the gallaxy.

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Speaker 3: We don't know how it's gonna happen.

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Speaker 1: Dusk then says, hold on, hold, who whoa whoa Demorselle,

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Speaker 1: let's not get it twisted. The triple genocide and the

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Speaker 1: navacular my ideas. So as we go forward, let's make

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Speaker 1: sure let's not forget this is why I want consequential,

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Speaker 1: because it was me, not Day, not dawn. They're out

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Speaker 1: of the picture. I came up with that. Okay, that's me, DeMars.

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Speaker 1: Demarsel says, Okay, listen, you're getting very very fired up

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Speaker 1: right now, but let's not forget that you are getting

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Speaker 1: ascended in tomorrow. Do you love it?

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Speaker 4: You think you get you can kill like two billion

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Speaker 4: people and incorrect.

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Speaker 3: She's like, you're get you're a naughty boy.

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Speaker 1: The Dusk is like, of course, I'm not. I would

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Speaker 1: not do something that is beg from my I know

293
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Speaker 1: I'm getting this. I'm fine with it.

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Speaker 5: I am.

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Speaker 1: Cool. All I want, Demarzelle, is when I am gone,

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Speaker 1: for you to say nice things about me and for

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Speaker 1: people to understand that I was consequential. Okay, And by

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Speaker 1: the way, demarselle, I can't help but notice the strain

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Speaker 1: upon your brow, A lot on your mind right now,

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Speaker 1: what's going on? Why don't you talk to the Zephyr

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Speaker 1: about it? And Demarsel's like, well, I think it's a

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Speaker 1: bad idea because you just wiped out. Aluminites are fucking dead,

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Speaker 1: and I think that would be that would be chaotic

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Speaker 1: and unpredictable, So I don't think it's a good idea.

305
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Speaker 1: So so Deusk's like, well, listen, I'm dying tomorrow anyway,

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Speaker 1: I got nothing but time right now. Let's why don't

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Speaker 1: you just unburden yourself, like, tell me right now. And

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Speaker 1: this is a fascinating moment because then de Marcella's like,

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Speaker 1: you know what, that's true. You are dying right now,

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Speaker 1: so I'll do it. She tells him about the meetings

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Speaker 1: with the Zephyr and the Garden. She tells him about

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Speaker 1: how as she walked the garden labyrinth, she thought of

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Speaker 1: her own mind, how the labyrinth had one path to

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00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,399
Speaker 1: enter and exit, one kind of labyrinthine path, and that

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00:19:18,520 --> 00:19:21,919
Speaker 1: was like her own fate. She thought she there was

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Speaker 1: only one possible option for her to choose, and that

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Speaker 1: was always her dedication to empire. But now she has realized, oh,

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Speaker 1: I think there are other choices and how do I

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Speaker 1: explore these? And now she's wondering, in this existential way,

320
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Speaker 1: has she been unconsciously examining these other options before her?

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Speaker 1: And do these options lead to the destruction of empire?

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Speaker 1: And is that what's causing her distress that she might

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Speaker 1: have been secretly working towards the destruction of Empire? And

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Speaker 1: Dusks like, hmmm, a lot to think about, Okay, silly

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Speaker 1: Billy Eddie Leeves. As he's leaving, He's like, now, I

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Speaker 1: don't forget. I want to see consequential on that bus

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Speaker 1: before I die. Get the wake somebody up.

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Speaker 3: If I put him on the mosel, I'd be given

329
00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:26,520
Speaker 3: him a new nickname of like Dusty annoying, Like this

330
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Speaker 3: man just cannot deal with his fate and the cycle

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Speaker 3: of how life works.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's fantastic. I thought this was a absolutely fascinating

333
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Speaker 1: conversation and your thoughts on this.

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Speaker 2: I agree. This was a highlight for me in this

335
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Speaker 2: episode because I'm realizing I think over the course of

336
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Speaker 2: this season we have been maybe over the course of

337
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Speaker 2: all three seasons, we have been witnessing a robot grapple

338
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Speaker 2: with free will and come to terms with free will

339
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Speaker 2: and what that means for its existence, something that humans

340
00:20:56,520 --> 00:20:59,919
Speaker 2: are quite intimately familiar with, right like, free will is

341
00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:03,560
Speaker 2: scary the way Demrosel describes it here, She's like, oh, am,

342
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Speaker 2: I obligated to explore all options? Do I what if

343
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Speaker 2: one of the options is bad?

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Speaker 3: You know?

345
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Speaker 2: That's humans do that all the time, and a thousand

346
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Speaker 2: different decisions. And a robot that's only had one directive

347
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Speaker 2: for thousands of years is now realizing it can maybe

348
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Speaker 2: do other stuff, And boy is that scary.

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Speaker 1: I think the other thing that is terrifying her is

350
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Speaker 1: the possibility that she's been exploring these options without fully

351
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Speaker 1: being connisant of it. She's been kind of finding these

352
00:21:40,160 --> 00:21:44,440
Speaker 1: unconscious loopholes to work against her programming. Is fascinating. This

353
00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:47,440
Speaker 1: conversation clearly awakens something in her, because she goes straight

354
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Speaker 1: to she wants to see the ninth Kale's ninth Proof

355
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:52,560
Speaker 1: of folding. She's like, I don't care that it's banned.

356
00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:56,040
Speaker 1: I'm fucking Demarsell, get me in there. She then examines

357
00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:59,040
Speaker 1: it using the prime radiant, and she sends her consciousness

358
00:21:59,080 --> 00:22:04,520
Speaker 1: into the primary to visit because her math was integral

359
00:22:04,600 --> 00:22:09,080
Speaker 1: to the design of the prime rating Calai herself. Calai

360
00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:13,320
Speaker 1: arrives and it's the lady who made the body for

361
00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:17,040
Speaker 1: Harry crazy the being of pure energy. This is a

362
00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:19,800
Speaker 1: crazy reveal and then very exciting and it makes a

363
00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:38,280
Speaker 1: lot of sense on tour new termin Ees excuse make

364
00:22:38,359 --> 00:22:40,879
Speaker 1: Gail and the team arrive before the vault. Gail and

365
00:22:40,920 --> 00:22:43,600
Speaker 1: Pritchard go up to it. Gail goes inside to see

366
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Speaker 1: Harry and he's like, Oh, it's so great to see

367
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Speaker 1: you after all these years. We go to the throne room.

368
00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:55,720
Speaker 1: Dusk meets with his girlfriend Quinn, who is obviously extremely

369
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Speaker 1: shaken by the triple genocide that she witness and you know,

370
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Speaker 1: it's kind of a big deal when it happens, and

371
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Speaker 1: even a big deal when your boyfriend did it. He's like, babe,

372
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Speaker 1: can you ever forgive me kill billion people?

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Speaker 4: I know?

374
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Speaker 3: This is like such a good scene too, because Quentn

375
00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:22,199
Speaker 3: is just like so disgusted and starts to kind of

376
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 3: have the same questions a lot of people, like, so

377
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:27,640
Speaker 3: this is what you're doing, Like does how does this

378
00:23:28,040 --> 00:23:30,679
Speaker 3: solve the problem? Like? How are these the numbers that

379
00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:33,000
Speaker 3: we and yet, Jason, why why do you think he

380
00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:35,480
Speaker 3: cares about getting out forgiveness when he's only got one

381
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Speaker 3: more day to live.

382
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Speaker 1: He's trying to crack when work correct before, I mean

383
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:46,239
Speaker 1: sincerity there, Like we all knew what he wanted. The

384
00:23:46,359 --> 00:23:50,760
Speaker 1: twinkle in his eye was very clear. Can you ever

385
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:54,880
Speaker 1: forgive me? Let's talk about this in my bed? And

386
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Speaker 1: of course Quent Quent can't let the destruction of billions

387
00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 1: of lives go. And they argue about this. Dusk then

388
00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:09,000
Speaker 1: points out that, well, you know, Seldon's plan wasn't much better.

389
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:11,479
Speaker 1: It's not like anybody has the answer right now. I

390
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:14,359
Speaker 1: was thinking on the spot and I did what I

391
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Speaker 1: had to do.

392
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Speaker 4: Yeah, who hasn't done that? Who amongst?

393
00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:22,200
Speaker 1: Quinn agrees that like, okay, the foundation has been discredited

394
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:26,480
Speaker 1: and Selden's psychohistory is clearly on. Shake your ground right now.

395
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:29,280
Speaker 1: But I can't agree with a triple genocide. That's just crazy.

396
00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:32,439
Speaker 1: And Dusk is like, well, that's when you sit in

397
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:34,800
Speaker 1: a big chair, you gotta make big boy decisions. I'm sorry,

398
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:38,159
Speaker 1: that's just how power works. And the mule made me

399
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:40,480
Speaker 1: do it, Like if the mule hadn't a waged war

400
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:42,439
Speaker 1: against the entire galaxy. I wouldn't have had to do that,

401
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:44,960
Speaker 1: but I had to do it. And Seldon ran away

402
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,720
Speaker 1: and everybody else ran away. It was only me, Dusk,

403
00:24:48,080 --> 00:25:03,560
Speaker 1: the consequential nickname. They're calling me, giving crazy. It's only me,

404
00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,600
Speaker 1: the consequential standing between the Mule and the galaxy. And

405
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:09,240
Speaker 1: Quinn is like, no, you're not consequentially, You're scared, and

406
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:12,560
Speaker 1: then she walks away crazy. We go back to the library,

407
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:15,600
Speaker 1: Demarsel and Kylie are chopping it up. Kyllie is very

408
00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:19,679
Speaker 1: very cagey about what she is and who she is

409
00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:22,560
Speaker 1: and how she can still be here in this moment.

410
00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 1: She's just very mysterious, but she is amazed at Demarzelle

411
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:29,639
Speaker 1: is like, man, they when they say they don't make

412
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,280
Speaker 1: them like they used to, they're right, because it's crazy

413
00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:35,400
Speaker 1: that you still work. Wow, robots still working after five

414
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:39,120
Speaker 1: thousand years. Demarsel then wants to know through Calais, if

415
00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 1: the vision she saw from Gail, the war between the

416
00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:47,439
Speaker 1: Mule and Gaale taking place in the library, if it

417
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:51,280
Speaker 1: was real and we learned that five thousand years ago,

418
00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:55,760
Speaker 1: the surviving robots hid in what was then the library,

419
00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:59,119
Speaker 1: where her vision of the battle with the mule takes place,

420
00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:02,360
Speaker 1: but they were all killed, you know, one by one,

421
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:04,680
Speaker 1: dragged out of there by the humans and killed. Del

422
00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 1: Rozelle says that in her vision, she thinks that she

423
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,160
Speaker 1: will offer to the humans the survivors of the Second Foundation.

424
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:15,440
Speaker 1: The library is a place to hide because now it's

425
00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:20,439
Speaker 1: buried like far under the city, and Cala says make

426
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:23,640
Speaker 1: some comment about, oh, so maybe this vision is all

427
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:27,520
Speaker 1: a computer's nightmare. Which what did you make of that?

428
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:30,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, aboo, tell us, tell us what you about that?

429
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:30,960
Speaker 3: Because that was in my notes.

430
00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:35,240
Speaker 2: This was my favorite conversation of this entire episode.

431
00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:36,919
Speaker 4: I mean, this is so good.

432
00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:43,200
Speaker 2: This is so so good. First, I want to say thematically,

433
00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 2: we're touching on some very very profound ideas about fate

434
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 2: and predestination, but the meaning we give to our lives

435
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:56,080
Speaker 2: it very much reminds me of the Exhalation short story

436
00:26:56,119 --> 00:26:58,960
Speaker 2: that we covered on the show a while back, the

437
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:01,880
Speaker 2: Merchant and the Alchemist game. This idea that like your

438
00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 2: life is predestined, the things that will happen will happen,

439
00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,359
Speaker 2: and that's something that Demoisel is grappling with. But what

440
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:11,440
Speaker 2: cal A is getting at is you can choose whether

441
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:15,760
Speaker 2: or not that the end result is because you're betraying

442
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:19,439
Speaker 2: Foundation or because you are helping Foundation. That choice is

443
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:22,639
Speaker 2: still yours, and that's where the power lies. The meaning

444
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 2: you apply to that final destination is entirely up to you,

445
00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:28,919
Speaker 2: even if there's no avoiding the fact that that is

446
00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:30,919
Speaker 2: where it will end up. That to me felt very

447
00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 2: very powerful and very profound.

448
00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:38,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is I'm still thinking about it, like, yeah,

449
00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:43,720
Speaker 1: that actually will mean in a decision making sense, Because

450
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:47,480
Speaker 1: what Demozela is struggling with is she knows that she

451
00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:50,040
Speaker 1: will probably offer the library as a place of refuge,

452
00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:54,280
Speaker 1: but she doesn't know if she is offering it as

453
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 1: a way as the pale death of Empire to wipe

454
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:01,680
Speaker 1: out Second Founded, to get them all in one place

455
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:05,200
Speaker 1: so they can be wiped out, or if it's if

456
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:09,320
Speaker 1: she's doing it to help Second Foundation as a way

457
00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:12,879
Speaker 1: to defeat them. She does not know right now, and

458
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:16,760
Speaker 1: Callie basically says, you don't need to worry about that now.

459
00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:20,840
Speaker 1: You can decide at the time which one of those

460
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:24,320
Speaker 1: things it's gonna mean, which is I'm just like, wow.

461
00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:25,400
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's really crazy.

462
00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:27,560
Speaker 3: Also, I don't know, I was really I've been feeling

463
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 3: this through the whole of season three, which I do

464
00:28:29,680 --> 00:28:31,480
Speaker 3: think for me is the best season of the show

465
00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,400
Speaker 3: so far. But I also feel like the time we're

466
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,359
Speaker 3: living in now, with everything going on, when you have

467
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:39,840
Speaker 3: these conversations, even though they are ostensibly fictional and very

468
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 3: far in the future, I can't help but feel like,

469
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 3: in like, depending on which way the world goes in

470
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:49,040
Speaker 3: like three or four years, we're going to be looking

471
00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:50,560
Speaker 3: at this kind of the same way we look at

472
00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:53,240
Speaker 3: the original series of Star Trek, which is like they

473
00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:57,320
Speaker 3: foresaw phones, they answered these They asked these huge questions

474
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:01,560
Speaker 3: about like, you know, if you get beamed up by Scotty,

475
00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:04,240
Speaker 3: are you actually still you? Or was your person that

476
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:06,640
Speaker 3: you left when you're beamed up and broken into many

477
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:07,520
Speaker 3: different pieces?

478
00:29:08,240 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 4: Will you?

479
00:29:09,320 --> 00:29:12,120
Speaker 3: Star Trek, you know, was sixty years ahead of its

480
00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 3: time with a lot of conversations and stuff it was having.

481
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:19,440
Speaker 3: But this feels like in five years we could be

482
00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:21,720
Speaker 3: looking back at this as kind of like a really

483
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 3: important text about the nature of AI, the nature of robotics,

484
00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:31,000
Speaker 3: what free will means. It just feels so relevant right now, and.

485
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:33,120
Speaker 1: We don't even know what Collie is or how right

486
00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 1: outside of the prim where she exists. Okay, so we

487
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 1: go to the vault. Gail reveals that she knows the

488
00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:43,840
Speaker 1: true nature. She knows how the vault works. Basically, it's

489
00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:48,080
Speaker 1: what you see. What people see is only a portion

490
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,520
Speaker 1: of the true structure of the vault, which exists between

491
00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 1: dimensions or in other dimensions. Mainly the main body of it,

492
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:58,440
Speaker 1: like an iceberg where only the tip is above the water.

493
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:02,240
Speaker 1: That above the water part is the reality that people perceive.

494
00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:08,800
Speaker 1: And Gay wants to know, basically, why did you run away?

495
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:13,640
Speaker 1: And Harry's kind of not committal. Harry could have used

496
00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:15,959
Speaker 1: the vault to save people, but he says he didn't

497
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 1: because and here we're seeing a little petulance from hologram Harry,

498
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:26,600
Speaker 1: which is kind of the theme of this conversation. He says, well,

499
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:29,560
Speaker 1: you know, I could have used the interdimensional properties to

500
00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,800
Speaker 1: save more people on New Terminus, but why nobody told

501
00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:39,840
Speaker 1: me what was going on? I was just like here,

502
00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:42,719
Speaker 1: like a little shadow of that that doesn't have all

503
00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 1: the story. And perhaps if I been allowed to know more,

504
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:49,160
Speaker 1: I would have done more. And Harry says that giving

505
00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:52,720
Speaker 1: DeMars all the prime the prime Radiant was one a

506
00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:57,320
Speaker 1: little bit of petulance because it would force his attention,

507
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 1: in other words, real Harry to notice what he was

508
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:02,320
Speaker 1: doing and that he was still in the mix, and

509
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:08,640
Speaker 1: would also provide for Demarselle a paradox bomb. It would

510
00:31:08,720 --> 00:31:13,280
Speaker 1: give her the opportunity to question her programming and to

511
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:17,720
Speaker 1: potentially break out of it by giving her choices. And

512
00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:24,960
Speaker 1: I found this to be another fascinating conversation about just

513
00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:28,440
Speaker 1: how much influence maybe Harry has had, especially in recent days,

514
00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 1: Like I think that giving the paradox bomb idea one

515
00:31:32,240 --> 00:31:36,040
Speaker 1: appears to have worked. Yeah, it really does appear to

516
00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:39,040
Speaker 1: have worked and thrown demarsel into a state of existential

517
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 1: despair almost And then I mean the forcing Harry to

518
00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:48,680
Speaker 1: notice him things. That's why I'm saying again like this,

519
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,040
Speaker 1: what is going to come out of it? Also because that,

520
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,040
Speaker 1: to me is the confrontation we're all waiting.

521
00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 3: This is also like asking questions in a really deep

522
00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:59,520
Speaker 3: way about stuff that we aren't even thinking about yet,

523
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:03,000
Speaker 3: like Halls, like how much information would you put into

524
00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 3: a holographic version of yourself that still represents you kind

525
00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:08,440
Speaker 3: of alien earthish, I guess with the hybrid But well,

526
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:10,360
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, all this section.

527
00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:12,880
Speaker 4: Because I'm just ooh. I never even considered that.

528
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:16,560
Speaker 3: And also it's always great in fiction when somebody creates

529
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:18,640
Speaker 3: the thing that is going to destroy them. So I

530
00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:20,920
Speaker 3: think this is very interesting conflict.

531
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:23,760
Speaker 1: This is very much an Alien Earth type of conversation,

532
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 1: because what if you create another consciousness of yourself. I

533
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:32,200
Speaker 1: assume a body to go off and do a jobs,

534
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:37,000
Speaker 1: but it doesn't know that you you are still running around.

535
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:40,920
Speaker 1: I mean, it would cause a real existential crisis. And

536
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:43,640
Speaker 1: I think that's what Harry's going through now. And I

537
00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:46,360
Speaker 1: wonder what Harry will do. I mean, I don't know

538
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:49,560
Speaker 1: about you a boot, but I feel like Harry hologram

539
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:51,920
Speaker 1: Harry is kind of the biggest wild card we.

540
00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:52,360
Speaker 3: Have for it.

541
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:55,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, truly, And I really like a lot of

542
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:57,680
Speaker 2: the episodes this season have done this. But we've gotten

543
00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:00,400
Speaker 2: these like mirror stories of two characters. Right, we had

544
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 2: My parents have abandoned Me. That was the flashback episode

545
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 2: of the Mule that we got. In this, I think

546
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 2: we're seeing two older guys who are maybe seeing the

547
00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:15,200
Speaker 2: end of the road, starting to like really spin out.

548
00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:19,280
Speaker 2: In Harry, It's dust. Both of them are making demands

549
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:21,800
Speaker 2: that quite literally have to do with their bodies. Right

550
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,600
Speaker 2: dusk says, let me keep my body, don't turn me

551
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:27,920
Speaker 2: into a pile of ash and oligraam. Harry negotiates here

552
00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:30,520
Speaker 2: with Gail and is like, give me a body. I

553
00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:32,400
Speaker 2: don't want to be just a hologram stuck in a

554
00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 2: box anymore. And both of them are quite petulant and

555
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:38,080
Speaker 2: lashing out at the universe in a way that says,

556
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:42,280
Speaker 2: look at me, pay attention to me. I'm consequential. And

557
00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:46,800
Speaker 2: I found that I found that parallel very very fascinating.

558
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 1: Of them me too, because it raises, you know, one

559
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 1: of the things that got me thinking about was, okay,

560
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:58,480
Speaker 1: let's say you know, Harry is a entirely unique preserved consciousness,

561
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 1: like a full mirror image of Harry Selden from a

562
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:07,240
Speaker 1: moment in time, but without a body. He's come to

563
00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:11,600
Speaker 1: the point now after centuries of existence, that he's not real.

564
00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:14,279
Speaker 1: Unless he has a body, he can't be real. He's

565
00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:16,880
Speaker 1: realizing now that he's just like a toy, like like

566
00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:20,680
Speaker 1: you mentioned, a toy in a box who has focused

567
00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:24,120
Speaker 1: the attention of all of this entire society at him,

568
00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:27,520
Speaker 1: who still worship him as this being that he isn't.

569
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:29,880
Speaker 1: But the problem is he now knows he's not that

570
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:33,319
Speaker 1: guy anymore and it's really fucking him up. So you

571
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 1: mentioned it. Gail makes the pitch, help me attack the mule.

572
00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:38,560
Speaker 1: Let's use the multi dimensional properties of the vault to

573
00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:41,120
Speaker 1: basically teleport me into the muleship and then we can

574
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:44,000
Speaker 1: attack him from the inside. And Harry says, sure, I'll

575
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:45,400
Speaker 1: do it, but you got to get me a body

576
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:48,799
Speaker 1: just like Harry that you know has go ask him

577
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:51,560
Speaker 1: how he got it. She's like, Okay, well, I guess

578
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:53,120
Speaker 1: I gotta figure out how Harry got his.

579
00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:54,319
Speaker 4: Body so crazy.

580
00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:58,759
Speaker 1: Gail and Harry both come outside the foundationers you know,

581
00:34:58,760 --> 00:35:03,120
Speaker 1: are so to see basically, you know, God, come out,

582
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,399
Speaker 1: Oh my God, Harry, Oh sir, it's so great to see.

583
00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,480
Speaker 1: And Harry basically tells Gail as they're all kind of

584
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:12,320
Speaker 1: breaking up and going their separate ways, that listen. One

585
00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:16,040
Speaker 1: more thing. The mule told me his backstory. There's something

586
00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:20,359
Speaker 1: wrong with it. And again, Magnifico is the Mule.

587
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:24,880
Speaker 4: Baby.

588
00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:28,320
Speaker 2: There's like two episodes in there where we started doubting it.

589
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:33,320
Speaker 4: But I feel but it's back. That theory is back

590
00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 4: on track.

591
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 3: Baby.

592
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:39,040
Speaker 1: That one that comment has me feeling like one hundred

593
00:35:39,120 --> 00:35:43,640
Speaker 1: percent is gonna. I feel like it's gonna happen.

594
00:35:43,719 --> 00:35:46,760
Speaker 3: I feel like, if you think about the Mule's powers,

595
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:52,280
Speaker 3: it would be really easy for Magnifico, But for the Mule,

596
00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:55,279
Speaker 3: if it is Magnifico to project an image of the

597
00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 3: guy who it pretends to be into somebody's mind.

598
00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 4: It's an unreliable nary reliable narratives.

599
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:05,480
Speaker 3: So I don't think that like her seeing the Mule,

600
00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:09,120
Speaker 3: as you know, Pilo's version is the thing, you know.

601
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:11,360
Speaker 3: I don't think it is the gotcha that means it

602
00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:15,239
Speaker 3: can't happen. I think very clearly something that's wrong about

603
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:19,120
Speaker 3: his backstory could very well find out that that's it,

604
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:20,759
Speaker 3: and that's kind of.

605
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:22,560
Speaker 2: Hey, I don't remember did he walk into the vault

606
00:36:22,600 --> 00:36:24,120
Speaker 2: with the group? Is he with the group right now?

607
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:26,200
Speaker 2: Or is he back in the refugee camp?

608
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:28,680
Speaker 1: No, I think he went back. Yeah, I think he

609
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:32,600
Speaker 1: went Okay, it was kind of unclear where they all went.

610
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:37,759
Speaker 1: He kind of going. Then we close the episode with

611
00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:42,080
Speaker 1: a bunch of little vignettes of our different characters moving

612
00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:45,799
Speaker 1: towards this epic confrontation that will surely take up all

613
00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:48,759
Speaker 1: of the finale. We see Dusk eating what appears to

614
00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:51,320
Speaker 1: be the brain of a cat. It's unhappy with it

615
00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:56,000
Speaker 1: as well. Camariselle, uh like in the hall of in

616
00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:58,440
Speaker 1: the Hall of History. Yeah, he was like this cat,

617
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:00,920
Speaker 1: My cat is not the it's not up to the

618
00:37:01,040 --> 00:37:05,880
Speaker 1: level of the consequential didings. And Demarzelle is in the

619
00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 1: Hall of History looking at the paintings, looking at the

620
00:37:09,080 --> 00:37:13,160
Speaker 1: images of her kind of robots. Day has emerged from

621
00:37:13,200 --> 00:37:15,640
Speaker 1: my Kagen. He's carrying the head up to the palace

622
00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:19,760
Speaker 1: to get into you know, like band Wi Fi range

623
00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:23,040
Speaker 1: of Demarzelle, and we are off to the finale. I

624
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:27,280
Speaker 1: can't wait. I have any predictions a boot prediction, predict, predict, predict.

625
00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:31,680
Speaker 2: Wow, I don't have predictions, but I can list the

626
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 2: things I'm very excited to see.

627
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 4: Okay, go for it.

628
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 2: When that bluetooth connection hits for Demarzel as soon.

629
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:42,160
Speaker 1: As he's in range, it's gonna be It's gonna be crazy.

630
00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:46,000
Speaker 2: That to me feels like an end of season cliffhanger

631
00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:50,160
Speaker 2: t season four, that type of thing. I'm I am

632
00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 2: genuinely incredibly excited for the showdown between Gail and Mule

633
00:37:56,960 --> 00:38:01,320
Speaker 2: because now I'm wondering with only one episode left, I

634
00:38:01,440 --> 00:38:03,640
Speaker 2: don't think that vision is coming to pass. This is

635
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:06,279
Speaker 2: not the final confrontation between the two of them. We're

636
00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:09,040
Speaker 2: not near Trantor at all. The Library isn't in play yet.

637
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:14,560
Speaker 2: So this feels like this, which I like because we

638
00:38:14,719 --> 00:38:17,320
Speaker 2: the viewer, don't know what this confrontation is going to

639
00:38:17,400 --> 00:38:19,320
Speaker 2: be or how it's gonna play out. This feels like

640
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:22,319
Speaker 2: a confrontation in which the Mule like wins or gets away,

641
00:38:22,600 --> 00:38:25,719
Speaker 2: and we roll over into season four with the Mule

642
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:28,880
Speaker 2: still as our antagonist. So I'm very much looking forward

643
00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:32,160
Speaker 2: to that, and honestly I.

644
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:33,960
Speaker 1: Am.

645
00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:39,920
Speaker 2: I'm incredibly excited to watch Dusk's ascension. I need to know.

646
00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:42,239
Speaker 4: I think he's going.

647
00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:49,640
Speaker 1: I don't think he's going. I think he's gonna find

648
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:52,480
Speaker 1: a loophole. I think he's going to pass like an

649
00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 1: executive order saying that actually ascension day, we're gonna have

650
00:38:57,160 --> 00:38:59,840
Speaker 1: to hold on is there's an emergency in the galaxy.

651
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:01,520
Speaker 1: We're gonna have to hold on to that for a

652
00:39:01,560 --> 00:39:02,719
Speaker 1: little while. And just.

653
00:39:04,280 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 3: Like the number one thing that presidents do if they

654
00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:10,279
Speaker 3: want to, or people in power do, is they go, oh, well,

655
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:12,200
Speaker 3: you know, it looks like maybe there's gonna be some

656
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:14,920
Speaker 3: kind of big war that's going to happen or something terrible,

657
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:17,359
Speaker 3: so I need to stay in office. And it's like, so, yeah,

658
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:20,880
Speaker 3: you did it, you create you genocided three planets, Like,

659
00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:23,640
Speaker 3: there's probably gonna be some consequences. Maybe you aren't the

660
00:39:23,719 --> 00:39:26,200
Speaker 3: one who needs to stick around, but yeah, his odds

661
00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:27,960
Speaker 3: are looking interesting.

662
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:29,920
Speaker 4: As we made a finale.

663
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:35,239
Speaker 2: A single episode, I'm a little nervous that that is

664
00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:39,080
Speaker 2: a lot of weight to put onto one episode, And

665
00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:42,680
Speaker 2: I wonder how much of these threads we will leave

666
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:44,480
Speaker 2: dangling for season four and how.

667
00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,040
Speaker 1: Many will get rid of a significant amount. Yeah, Well,

668
00:39:47,080 --> 00:39:49,440
Speaker 1: here's the one thing that I am really eager to

669
00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:53,160
Speaker 1: find out, and I feel like for me, it's the

670
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:55,439
Speaker 1: question that's been hanging over the season is whose plan

671
00:39:55,560 --> 00:39:55,960
Speaker 1: are we in?

672
00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:56,439
Speaker 5: Yeah?

673
00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:01,080
Speaker 1: Are we in? We're not in Hologram Harry's plan, although

674
00:40:01,080 --> 00:40:06,000
Speaker 1: he's been affecting events. The Mule feels like a guy

675
00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:10,719
Speaker 1: who worked even though the we probably all agree that

676
00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:12,760
Speaker 1: the true nature of the Mule has yet to be revealed.

677
00:40:14,520 --> 00:40:17,520
Speaker 1: The Mule does not feel like the final bond. The

678
00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:19,600
Speaker 1: Mule feels like a guy who works for another guy.

679
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 1: And are we in Cali's plan?

680
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:23,880
Speaker 3: Are we in?

681
00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:28,440
Speaker 1: Body? Harry's are we in the robots long term plan

682
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:33,480
Speaker 1: to come back? I don't like, where are we? How

683
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:35,959
Speaker 1: did this? That's what I'm waiting.

684
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:39,480
Speaker 3: If you're looking at whose plans are going best? Just

685
00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:44,000
Speaker 3: de Moselle like existing and then people from this religion

686
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:46,759
Speaker 3: like knowing it kind of puts the robots in a

687
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:49,440
Speaker 3: good stead because that's kind of what they've been looking for,

688
00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:52,520
Speaker 3: the messiahs. So I feel like I feel like there's

689
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:55,920
Speaker 3: a I feel like that would be very interesting, but

690
00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:58,600
Speaker 3: I honestly have no idea. I feel like the thing

691
00:40:58,719 --> 00:41:00,920
Speaker 3: I love about this season is they could do like

692
00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:04,440
Speaker 3: a random bottle episode finale and I'd probably just totally

693
00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 3: buy it, like whatever they were showing us, Like I am,

694
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:09,919
Speaker 3: I trust in the way they're telling the story. Yeah,

695
00:41:10,320 --> 00:41:13,160
Speaker 3: but I'm really interested because, yeah, as someone with like

696
00:41:13,360 --> 00:41:15,799
Speaker 3: very little knowledge, and I know this has veered quite

697
00:41:16,719 --> 00:41:19,600
Speaker 3: a lot from the original text, but it's very exciting

698
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:22,600
Speaker 3: to go into a finale and be like, wow, literally

699
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:23,640
Speaker 3: anything could happen.

700
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:24,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, truly.

701
00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:28,520
Speaker 3: Next up, we've got a chat with pill Our Aspect,

702
00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:30,440
Speaker 3: who plays the mule in Foundation.

703
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:48,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, Pilu, thank you for joining.

704
00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:52,239
Speaker 5: Us, Thank you for having me tell us about like,

705
00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:53,400
Speaker 5: was there a moment.

706
00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:54,960
Speaker 1: In preparing for this role where you figured out, you

707
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:59,000
Speaker 1: know this, you're playing this character who is someone of

708
00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:01,839
Speaker 1: a maniac has say powers. Was there a moment where

709
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:03,359
Speaker 1: you felt like, Okay, I've cracked this guy.

710
00:42:03,640 --> 00:42:04,239
Speaker 3: I know what to do.

711
00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:10,040
Speaker 1: I know I found the core of this murderous gentleman

712
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:11,960
Speaker 1: from space. I don't know.

713
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:15,160
Speaker 5: I don't know. First of all, it's always interesting when

714
00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:17,560
Speaker 5: you're doing an adaptation of something that's been created by

715
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:20,480
Speaker 5: in this case Asimuv and I've tried it before. We

716
00:42:21,320 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 5: the first time I tried it was on Game of Thrones.

717
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:25,480
Speaker 5: I tried it on Ghost in a Shell and I've

718
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:29,000
Speaker 5: done some Danish adaptations as well. So I have tried

719
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:33,960
Speaker 5: working with an ip before where people are aware of

720
00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:37,920
Speaker 5: them source material. And it's always tricky because you know,

721
00:42:38,080 --> 00:42:41,520
Speaker 5: with the hot core fans, they always want to how

722
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:45,319
Speaker 5: am I to battle your imagination? You know what I mean?

723
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:48,320
Speaker 5: How can I ever taught what you have been imagining

724
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:49,880
Speaker 5: as a kid or as an adult?

725
00:42:50,880 --> 00:42:52,960
Speaker 3: And so I was.

726
00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:56,960
Speaker 5: You always go in with a massive amount of gratitude,

727
00:42:57,160 --> 00:43:01,560
Speaker 5: a massive amount of respect, and a massive amount of

728
00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 5: fear because you want to do a good job, and

729
00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:10,520
Speaker 5: in this case we're talking about Asimov, who is like

730
00:43:10,640 --> 00:43:13,799
Speaker 5: one of the founding fathers of sci fi. You can't

731
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:19,440
Speaker 5: say a Star Wars, Star Trek, you do. You can't

732
00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:24,080
Speaker 5: mention any of those sci fi shows or movies without

733
00:43:25,080 --> 00:43:31,720
Speaker 5: mentioning Asimov's work. So I read. I read the things

734
00:43:31,800 --> 00:43:34,920
Speaker 5: I could find about the Mule. I didn't read all

735
00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:39,600
Speaker 5: of the books. My sincere apologies to the fans, but

736
00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:43,920
Speaker 5: I found I found the passages around the Mule. But

737
00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:46,200
Speaker 5: for me, when I read about him, first of all,

738
00:43:46,440 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 5: I'm six foot one, I look the way I look,

739
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:53,880
Speaker 5: I'm very different from how he's described in the books.

740
00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:57,320
Speaker 5: So I felt I had to do a different approach,

741
00:43:57,680 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 5: and I tried on Game of Thrones, which you can compare.

742
00:44:02,239 --> 00:44:06,120
Speaker 5: Because the reason why I got the Mule was that

743
00:44:06,239 --> 00:44:09,520
Speaker 5: David Goya, who had a collaboration with Mi Kay Piespont,

744
00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:12,920
Speaker 5: whom I'm a big fan of, he couldn't do the

745
00:44:12,960 --> 00:44:15,120
Speaker 5: next season for some weird reason. I don't know. I'm

746
00:44:15,160 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 5: not into the specific details. But nevertheless, which is very

747
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:21,920
Speaker 5: common in my world, that you you know, you you

748
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:25,239
Speaker 5: he can't do it, He'll do it. She did it,

749
00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:29,080
Speaker 5: She's going to do it afterwards, et cetera. And it's

750
00:44:29,120 --> 00:44:33,400
Speaker 5: a big show, and the show must go on. He

751
00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:35,440
Speaker 5: called me and he said he had seen Game of Thrones.

752
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:39,000
Speaker 5: I'll answer your question, but I'm trying to you know,

753
00:44:39,200 --> 00:44:42,160
Speaker 5: it's long, it's a big it's a big answer to

754
00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:46,040
Speaker 5: a very very not it's not a simple answer. It's

755
00:44:46,080 --> 00:44:48,839
Speaker 5: not a simple question because it's a it's a little

756
00:44:48,840 --> 00:44:51,239
Speaker 5: bit complicated. So I'm giving you the whole picture, the

757
00:44:51,320 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 5: big picture here.

758
00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:54,200
Speaker 3: So I am.

759
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:57,600
Speaker 5: I had a long talk with David Goya, and I

760
00:44:57,760 --> 00:45:00,719
Speaker 5: wasn't really into sci fi. I haven't watched a lot

761
00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:04,080
Speaker 5: of sci fi. I've seen a little bit of Star Wars,

762
00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:07,160
Speaker 5: I saw Doom when I was a kid, et cetera.

763
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:10,360
Speaker 5: That was about it. I'm into sports. I love I

764
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:12,520
Speaker 5: love soccer. I love American football.

765
00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:16,240
Speaker 1: I'm x who are your clubs?

766
00:45:16,680 --> 00:45:24,920
Speaker 5: Copenhagen and in NFL it's it's San Francisco forty Niners.

767
00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:32,800
Speaker 1: Okay, all right, but it's okay, Yeah.

768
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:35,399
Speaker 5: I know, I know. But we we we we kind

769
00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:37,560
Speaker 5: of like our new We like we like the last

770
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:38,640
Speaker 5: the last guy.

771
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:43,279
Speaker 2: Sure a good job, no, no, no.

772
00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:46,600
Speaker 5: So so back to the story, and David said, I

773
00:45:46,680 --> 00:45:48,759
Speaker 5: love what you did in Game of Thrones, and that's

774
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:53,040
Speaker 5: what I need. I need this for foundation because it's

775
00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:59,640
Speaker 5: such a static, statistic, visual, stunning universe world I've created,

776
00:46:00,400 --> 00:46:04,719
Speaker 5: and I need that that energy and that cass and

777
00:46:05,160 --> 00:46:10,960
Speaker 5: and unpredictable this that you bring into your characters. And

778
00:46:11,120 --> 00:46:15,040
Speaker 5: I said, David, I'm completely done with maniac pirates. I

779
00:46:15,640 --> 00:46:18,120
Speaker 5: oh wait, wait, wait, wait, wait wait, he's not a pirate.

780
00:46:18,520 --> 00:46:21,040
Speaker 5: David interrupted, He's not a pirate. He's not a pirate

781
00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:23,600
Speaker 5: at all. This is going to be completely different, I

782
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:27,719
Speaker 5: promise you, all right, I'll read the scripts. And I

783
00:46:27,840 --> 00:46:30,400
Speaker 5: read the scripts and on the first page on the

784
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:33,960
Speaker 5: first episode, on the first introduction to the Mule, it's

785
00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:42,480
Speaker 5: set space pirate. Thanks a lot, David, but he he

786
00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:44,800
Speaker 5: was phenomenal to work with. And then I read it

787
00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:47,879
Speaker 5: and then I know what's going to happen, and yeah,

788
00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:49,840
Speaker 5: I know what's going to happen in the season because

789
00:46:49,880 --> 00:46:52,040
Speaker 5: we we we we did it. And I thought, Okay,

790
00:46:52,160 --> 00:46:54,759
Speaker 5: I can I can, I can. I can do this.

791
00:46:54,960 --> 00:47:01,840
Speaker 5: I can bring that imminent threat to this world. But

792
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:04,120
Speaker 5: I want to change it up a bit. And I

793
00:47:06,400 --> 00:47:08,719
Speaker 5: because I know what's going to happen in seven, eight, nine,

794
00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:13,399
Speaker 5: and ten, I asked David if I could have him,

795
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:17,880
Speaker 5: have him a little bit more childish, and I was.

796
00:47:18,239 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 5: I was super inspired by Le Petit Ponce The Little Prince.

797
00:47:25,120 --> 00:47:27,760
Speaker 5: That's the reason why I'm wearing a red cape, because

798
00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:31,560
Speaker 5: the thing is with The Little Prince made a French

799
00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:36,200
Speaker 5: children's book by Sanctibs. It's about a little guy stuck

800
00:47:36,719 --> 00:47:39,320
Speaker 5: on a planet with his best friend as a rose.

801
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:42,800
Speaker 5: He doesn't understand human beings. He wants to understand animals,

802
00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:47,279
Speaker 5: he wants to understand fellow citizens, and he goes to

803
00:47:47,440 --> 00:47:50,279
Speaker 5: Earth to get to know these What is it to

804
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:52,719
Speaker 5: be a human? What is it to have friendship? What

805
00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:55,760
Speaker 5: is it to feel love? What is this weird, little

806
00:47:55,800 --> 00:48:01,239
Speaker 5: surreal place they called the world Earth? And I thought

807
00:48:01,280 --> 00:48:03,640
Speaker 5: that was kind of fitting to the Mule because he's

808
00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:06,000
Speaker 5: a guy who's never really felt any love, and the

809
00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:08,400
Speaker 5: love here. And now I can spoil this because we

810
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:12,320
Speaker 5: saw that in season in episode seven. I knew that

811
00:48:12,560 --> 00:48:14,680
Speaker 5: was gonna happen, so I just said, okay, but that's

812
00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:17,440
Speaker 5: making crazy ass. Let's make him disturbed, that's make him

813
00:48:17,440 --> 00:48:20,880
Speaker 5: my metallic, that's making all these things. That is inspired

814
00:48:20,920 --> 00:48:24,920
Speaker 5: by the books as well. And then the reason why

815
00:48:25,080 --> 00:48:29,680
Speaker 5: he's so keen. I'm saying, you will all come to

816
00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:32,120
Speaker 5: love me. He needs to love and love love is

817
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:34,440
Speaker 5: because the people that should have given him love, his

818
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:40,680
Speaker 5: parents didn't, and it's you know, a villain is a villain.

819
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:43,040
Speaker 5: But at least he wasn't just wanted to see the

820
00:48:43,120 --> 00:48:48,760
Speaker 5: world burn because he wanted to see the foundation burn.

821
00:48:49,360 --> 00:48:52,839
Speaker 5: He wanted to see them rot in hell because they

822
00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:57,520
Speaker 5: destroyed his life, They ruined his life, they divided his family,

823
00:48:57,960 --> 00:49:04,160
Speaker 5: and in his mind, you know, if you're evil, you

824
00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:09,640
Speaker 5: will justify your evilness by on logical thinking that he

825
00:49:09,920 --> 00:49:14,560
Speaker 5: killed his parents because of them, not because he's born

826
00:49:14,800 --> 00:49:17,800
Speaker 5: with evil within or he's got it within, but because

827
00:49:17,960 --> 00:49:21,800
Speaker 5: they forced him to do it. And I kind of

828
00:49:21,960 --> 00:49:25,080
Speaker 5: like that because most villains that I do, they're always

829
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:28,000
Speaker 5: just they want to just see the world burn, which

830
00:49:28,040 --> 00:49:30,239
Speaker 5: is interesting, but you know, I've done it for ten years.

831
00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:34,560
Speaker 2: So and did you think by the time you had

832
00:49:34,719 --> 00:49:37,760
Speaker 2: embodied the role and shot the season, do you agree

833
00:49:37,800 --> 00:49:39,760
Speaker 2: with David more than just a space pirate?

834
00:49:40,520 --> 00:49:40,719
Speaker 3: Yeah?

835
00:49:40,840 --> 00:49:43,959
Speaker 5: I agree with David, but I also think it would

836
00:49:43,960 --> 00:49:46,480
Speaker 5: have been kind of nice to have that revelation at

837
00:49:46,560 --> 00:49:52,440
Speaker 5: the beginning so people wouldn't be so uptight about the portray.

838
00:49:52,920 --> 00:49:57,800
Speaker 5: Actually I've gotten great, great, great response, but you know,

839
00:49:58,080 --> 00:50:02,400
Speaker 5: it's it's always nice to get the background story up front.

840
00:50:03,680 --> 00:50:06,000
Speaker 5: But I did a TV show called Borg and a

841
00:50:06,120 --> 00:50:09,160
Speaker 5: daily show about politics and Denmark, like ten years ago,

842
00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:12,400
Speaker 5: and that was like a woll phenomenon, sold to like

843
00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:15,360
Speaker 5: one hundred and ten countries before streaming, so that was

844
00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:17,719
Speaker 5: like a massive hit all over the world. And that

845
00:50:18,520 --> 00:50:21,000
Speaker 5: show was the reason the reason why I got Game

846
00:50:21,040 --> 00:50:25,680
Speaker 5: of Thrones because Dan and David had watched Dan Dan

847
00:50:25,719 --> 00:50:27,880
Speaker 5: and David, the showrunners of Game of Thrones, they had

848
00:50:27,920 --> 00:50:33,480
Speaker 5: watched Borg and there in that season one, he's molested.

849
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:36,040
Speaker 5: My characters molested as a child, and we don't know

850
00:50:36,200 --> 00:50:39,800
Speaker 5: that until episode six, and I learned there that you

851
00:50:39,960 --> 00:50:45,120
Speaker 5: cannot you cannot act the story of a character before

852
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:49,440
Speaker 5: it's presented to the audience. So I can always do

853
00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:52,200
Speaker 5: a lot of great acting or shit acting, depending on

854
00:50:52,280 --> 00:50:57,120
Speaker 5: the eyes of depending on the beholder, but it has

855
00:50:57,200 --> 00:50:59,560
Speaker 5: to be on the pages for you to illustrate it

856
00:50:59,640 --> 00:51:04,359
Speaker 5: on you know, so I can nuance it as much

857
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:06,839
Speaker 5: as possible, but at the end of the day, if

858
00:51:06,880 --> 00:51:09,759
Speaker 5: there isn't a background story, it might just be a

859
00:51:09,800 --> 00:51:14,160
Speaker 5: little bit more dimensional, one dimensional than a three dimensional villain.

860
00:51:15,360 --> 00:51:20,680
Speaker 1: Having a career that has spanned your work in Denmark

861
00:51:20,800 --> 00:51:24,880
Speaker 1: and Europe to now internationally streaming with Game of Thrones

862
00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:29,120
Speaker 1: and Foundation, you know, you've had this career that's not

863
00:51:29,239 --> 00:51:32,680
Speaker 1: only spanned this large geography, but has gone on for

864
00:51:32,840 --> 00:51:36,239
Speaker 1: now a decade plus. What changes have you seen in

865
00:51:36,360 --> 00:51:43,120
Speaker 1: that time, going from working in Denmark to now working

866
00:51:43,200 --> 00:51:44,960
Speaker 1: on these projects that go all over the world.

867
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:50,360
Speaker 5: It's, first of all, right now with industry, I'm just

868
00:51:50,440 --> 00:51:54,080
Speaker 5: super happy to work. Shares a massive crisis. There's a

869
00:51:54,160 --> 00:51:58,279
Speaker 5: massive crisis in Hollywood and in European cinema as well.

870
00:51:58,920 --> 00:52:00,880
Speaker 5: So just to be able to work is a gift,

871
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:06,719
Speaker 5: you know, it's it's it's it's hard to to to

872
00:52:07,520 --> 00:52:09,520
Speaker 5: live off your passion. I don't know if I can

873
00:52:09,560 --> 00:52:11,200
Speaker 5: say that. I don't know if that makes any sense

874
00:52:11,239 --> 00:52:13,520
Speaker 5: in English, but you know, I get to work with

875
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:17,480
Speaker 5: with what I love, and that is to act. And

876
00:52:17,640 --> 00:52:20,120
Speaker 5: right now there's not a lot of jobs, and for

877
00:52:20,239 --> 00:52:23,800
Speaker 5: some weird reasons, because the work I do in Denmark,

878
00:52:23,840 --> 00:52:26,759
Speaker 5: I'm always the hero. In my Danish work, in my

879
00:52:26,840 --> 00:52:30,560
Speaker 5: Scandinavian work, in my European work, I'm never the villain.

880
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:33,160
Speaker 5: But for some weird reason, the moment I crossed the

881
00:52:33,200 --> 00:52:36,360
Speaker 5: Atlantic Ocean, I become a villain. Maybe because I have

882
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:40,160
Speaker 5: an accent, maybe because that's how the world sees me.

883
00:52:40,880 --> 00:52:45,960
Speaker 5: I don't know. I just know that that. I just

884
00:52:46,040 --> 00:52:48,399
Speaker 5: know that a movie or TV show is only as

885
00:52:48,440 --> 00:52:51,880
Speaker 5: good as main villain. And I've done a few now,

886
00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:55,239
Speaker 5: But I can also say I love villains, but I'm

887
00:52:55,280 --> 00:53:02,840
Speaker 5: also I've done my share, I've done my chair, and

888
00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:05,080
Speaker 5: I love I got to mention one more villain, I said,

889
00:53:05,120 --> 00:53:07,960
Speaker 5: which I loved. I loved the guy. Did you ever

890
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:09,160
Speaker 5: see Overlord.

891
00:53:09,280 --> 00:53:10,760
Speaker 1: Overlord, the movie Overlord?

892
00:53:11,800 --> 00:53:15,279
Speaker 5: Yeah? Yeah, yeah. I was the villain in that one

893
00:53:15,280 --> 00:53:19,200
Speaker 5: as well. I was a Nazi soombie from the Third Reich.

894
00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:23,800
Speaker 5: And that was hysterical because I was talking to Mass Migleson,

895
00:53:24,480 --> 00:53:26,640
Speaker 5: who's a good friend of mine because he's also Danish,

896
00:53:26,680 --> 00:53:29,200
Speaker 5: and Mass and I were sitting and comparing villains because

897
00:53:29,280 --> 00:53:33,120
Speaker 5: Mass is always doing villains as well. And and and

898
00:53:33,239 --> 00:53:35,200
Speaker 5: you know when you when we were kids, you would

899
00:53:35,200 --> 00:53:38,600
Speaker 5: have those cards you could play like like like or

900
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:41,040
Speaker 5: like Pokemon cards, but you would play a part and

901
00:53:41,080 --> 00:53:43,880
Speaker 5: then you would go back and forth right and and

902
00:53:44,560 --> 00:53:46,680
Speaker 5: I ended up telling mess. But mass, I did a

903
00:53:46,760 --> 00:53:50,040
Speaker 5: Nazi zombie. How how are you gonna top that one?

904
00:53:50,800 --> 00:53:50,920
Speaker 6: Right?

905
00:53:51,840 --> 00:53:55,120
Speaker 5: And he was like, I did Hannibal. I'm like, still,

906
00:53:56,440 --> 00:54:00,759
Speaker 5: I did a Nazi zombie. Okay, tough, and that's why

907
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:01,920
Speaker 5: I'm everything.

908
00:54:02,880 --> 00:54:08,399
Speaker 2: Yeah, peeple, I'm curious. You've been referencing your Danish career

909
00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 2: a lot, and I wonder, now that you're working so

910
00:54:11,320 --> 00:54:15,080
Speaker 2: internationally and now that you're playing the villain, has your

911
00:54:15,239 --> 00:54:18,800
Speaker 2: career playing the hero for so many years prepared you

912
00:54:18,920 --> 00:54:21,239
Speaker 2: to play the villain better? Do you feel like, like, what,

913
00:54:21,440 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 2: what have you carried over from your years working in

914
00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:29,720
Speaker 2: Denmark and Europe into your villain roles.

915
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:34,359
Speaker 5: That's a great question because the thing is, when you're

916
00:54:34,400 --> 00:54:38,560
Speaker 5: doing a hero, he's always, in my case, the glue.

917
00:54:39,280 --> 00:54:41,239
Speaker 5: He's the one who's got to be steady throughout the

918
00:54:41,440 --> 00:54:45,360
Speaker 5: entire story. You're carrying this whole script on your shoulders,

919
00:54:45,480 --> 00:54:48,520
Speaker 5: along with the rights of the director and every single

920
00:54:48,560 --> 00:54:52,839
Speaker 5: other crew member. But you are carrying the story. If

921
00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:58,120
Speaker 5: your performance doesn't work, the story will crumble. That's the

922
00:54:58,200 --> 00:55:01,160
Speaker 5: same thing that when you're doing a villain, you're not

923
00:55:01,480 --> 00:55:04,600
Speaker 5: carrying the whole story on your shoulders. You're there to

924
00:55:06,040 --> 00:55:09,799
Speaker 5: submit or add your flavor to the script, your your

925
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:14,360
Speaker 5: color to the palette. And I wouldn't say it's easier,

926
00:55:14,600 --> 00:55:19,320
Speaker 5: but I would say it's more fun. And I'm super

927
00:55:19,520 --> 00:55:23,759
Speaker 5: privileged that I can be working both in America and

928
00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:26,840
Speaker 5: at home. I can do both. I can go to US,

929
00:55:27,320 --> 00:55:29,759
Speaker 5: I can do my villains, I can make a little

930
00:55:29,760 --> 00:55:32,080
Speaker 5: bit of money. I can get the house, I can

931
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:36,439
Speaker 5: get the car. I've had the same wife for twenty years.

932
00:55:36,840 --> 00:55:38,680
Speaker 5: We have a daughter, so I'm not going to get

933
00:55:38,680 --> 00:55:44,520
Speaker 5: a new marriage. But and then I can go home

934
00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:47,560
Speaker 5: and maybe do some work that is maybe a little

935
00:55:47,600 --> 00:55:51,360
Speaker 5: bit more challenging, a little bit more autistic, weird, surreal.

936
00:55:52,600 --> 00:55:55,520
Speaker 5: We call them festival films. You know, you do something

937
00:55:55,560 --> 00:55:57,440
Speaker 5: for the box office, and then you do something for

938
00:55:58,120 --> 00:56:00,080
Speaker 5: two people where one of them is your mom and

939
00:56:00,160 --> 00:56:05,800
Speaker 5: the other one is you. And I love it, I

940
00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:11,760
Speaker 5: think right. And also I think I'm in my beginning forties,

941
00:56:12,600 --> 00:56:14,600
Speaker 5: and the way I am as a person, the way

942
00:56:14,719 --> 00:56:16,960
Speaker 5: I read the script, the characters that I get to

943
00:56:17,120 --> 00:56:22,160
Speaker 5: portray or fitting my age now better than it did

944
00:56:22,239 --> 00:56:26,879
Speaker 5: ten years ago. So for me, I'm like, I'm knock

945
00:56:26,920 --> 00:56:30,200
Speaker 5: on wood. I should I should I've done this for

946
00:56:30,360 --> 00:56:33,279
Speaker 5: eighteen years now, so I should be pretty okay good

947
00:56:33,360 --> 00:56:37,440
Speaker 5: at it, but you're still learning. It's still a process.

948
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:41,360
Speaker 5: It's still an investigation into how far can we go

949
00:56:42,040 --> 00:56:44,880
Speaker 5: and what character can you be so lucky to portray.

950
00:56:46,680 --> 00:56:49,040
Speaker 5: But of course, if I had to do more villains,

951
00:56:49,480 --> 00:56:52,880
Speaker 5: which I will for sure, I would love to have

952
00:56:53,200 --> 00:56:58,000
Speaker 5: much more psychology into it, much more dimensional, much more

953
00:56:59,320 --> 00:57:03,279
Speaker 5: an anti hero who's more misunderstood. There's a bit of

954
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:05,080
Speaker 5: it in the Mule. There was zero in it in

955
00:57:05,160 --> 00:57:08,200
Speaker 5: Game of Thrones. There's a bit more of that kind

956
00:57:08,280 --> 00:57:12,799
Speaker 5: of layered character in the Mule. And hopefully I would

957
00:57:14,120 --> 00:57:16,880
Speaker 5: I would get to do one more. I think one

958
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:19,920
Speaker 5: like Breaking Bad. That's a great exam I think that's

959
00:57:20,160 --> 00:57:25,000
Speaker 5: that's a good antagonist. He's the executor and the victim.

960
00:57:25,600 --> 00:57:28,000
Speaker 5: And I always think that is the most interesting characters

961
00:57:28,040 --> 00:57:33,440
Speaker 5: because then you're working within within this space of of

962
00:57:33,640 --> 00:57:40,600
Speaker 5: people acknowledging, acknowledging and understanding but also fearing your character.

963
00:57:41,040 --> 00:57:45,560
Speaker 5: And I think that's a very interesting that's a very

964
00:57:45,720 --> 00:57:49,880
Speaker 5: interesting field to work within within yeap.

965
00:57:49,760 --> 00:57:51,840
Speaker 2: And oftentimes makes the most memorable villains.

966
00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:57,120
Speaker 5: Yeah, and and and and and For me, the top

967
00:57:57,240 --> 00:58:04,440
Speaker 5: three villains honestly, it's Hans Kuba die Hard. Yeah, because

968
00:58:04,440 --> 00:58:11,120
Speaker 5: it's just phenomenal. It's just Alan Rickman being fucking awesome. Yeah, sorry,

969
00:58:11,320 --> 00:58:14,800
Speaker 5: I didn't. I don't know if I can absolutely feel free.

970
00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:20,040
Speaker 5: And and Valdemort in Harry Potter, Yeah, because it's so

971
00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:24,360
Speaker 5: well written. It's it's it's it's it's a sad story.

972
00:58:24,520 --> 00:58:30,160
Speaker 5: He's a sad characters. He's talking about being misunderstood and

973
00:58:30,280 --> 00:58:33,520
Speaker 5: therefore he ends up becoming evil because it's something that

974
00:58:33,600 --> 00:58:38,880
Speaker 5: he's got within him. And and I've always loved Gary

975
00:58:38,960 --> 00:58:42,160
Speaker 5: Oldman in lyon the Professional.

976
00:58:43,120 --> 00:58:46,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, every.

977
00:58:48,640 --> 00:58:49,200
Speaker 5: And I did.

978
00:58:51,280 --> 00:58:55,960
Speaker 6: I didn't homage. I didn't homage in in in In

979
00:58:56,200 --> 00:59:02,440
Speaker 6: in the Mule. In episode two with the Little Girl, he's.

980
00:59:02,120 --> 00:59:05,640
Speaker 5: Talking about everyone loving him, everyone loving him, and I thought,

981
00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:08,080
Speaker 5: I'm gonna I'm gonna yell this line. I'm just gonna

982
00:59:08,080 --> 00:59:10,200
Speaker 5: tell you I want to go.

983
00:59:14,360 --> 00:59:19,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, Pelu, we'll leave you with this. So uh

984
00:59:20,200 --> 00:59:25,000
Speaker 1: F C Copenhagen currently sitting atop the standings your predictions

985
00:59:25,120 --> 00:59:29,320
Speaker 1: for the twenty five twenty six Danish Super League season?

986
00:59:29,400 --> 00:59:31,920
Speaker 1: How are you feeling about FC Copenhagen and then how

987
00:59:31,960 --> 00:59:32,760
Speaker 1: are you feeling about it?

988
00:59:32,960 --> 00:59:37,240
Speaker 5: Win the we're gonna win it. We're gonna win the league, okay,

989
00:59:38,440 --> 00:59:41,480
Speaker 5: and hopefully qualified for Champions League. We will know on

990
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:44,920
Speaker 5: Wednesday night. Yes, that's very important.

991
00:59:45,080 --> 00:59:48,360
Speaker 1: Yes, big money and a huge stage to get into

992
00:59:48,520 --> 00:59:52,200
Speaker 1: the Champions And how do you feel the forty nine ers,

993
00:59:52,240 --> 00:59:53,840
Speaker 1: how are you feeling as we head into the season.

994
00:59:54,560 --> 00:59:56,600
Speaker 5: I don't know, man. If we can just get the playoffs,

995
00:59:57,040 --> 00:59:59,360
Speaker 5: that would be We have a lot of injuries the

996
00:59:59,480 --> 01:00:04,640
Speaker 5: last season. Yes, and if McCarthy is up there, he's

997
01:00:04,720 --> 01:00:10,480
Speaker 5: eighty percent of the team. And I'm not expecting fortnit

998
01:00:10,720 --> 01:00:13,000
Speaker 5: Is to win. I think I think some of the

999
01:00:13,040 --> 01:00:16,000
Speaker 5: other teams are just too good. But if we can

1000
01:00:16,080 --> 01:00:18,520
Speaker 5: get to the playoffs, that would be awesome.

1001
01:00:20,240 --> 01:00:22,920
Speaker 1: Peelu, thank you so much for joining us, and congratulations

1002
01:00:22,960 --> 01:00:24,200
Speaker 1: on season three. Foundation.

1003
01:00:25,200 --> 01:00:28,320
Speaker 5: Thank you so much, and thank you guys for having me.

1004
01:00:28,560 --> 01:00:33,360
Speaker 5: And once again, this is for all the listeners. I

1005
01:00:33,560 --> 01:00:36,320
Speaker 5: forgot the first interview we're supposed to do and I

1006
01:00:36,440 --> 01:00:42,000
Speaker 5: came fifteen minutes late for this one, so my sincere apologies.

1007
01:00:42,320 --> 01:00:45,920
Speaker 5: But what a week we waited, because now with episode seven,

1008
01:00:46,280 --> 01:00:48,000
Speaker 5: we've got some more things to talk about.

1009
01:00:48,160 --> 01:00:50,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, thank you. Once again, I have a great

1010
01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:55,920
Speaker 1: one well, that's it for this episode. We're onto the finale.

1011
01:00:56,040 --> 01:00:58,160
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening, Aboo, thanks for joining us of course.

1012
01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:05,880
Speaker 3: Bye x ray.

1013
01:01:05,880 --> 01:01:08,560
Speaker 1: Vision is hosted by Jason Spcion and Rosie Knight and

1014
01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:10,280
Speaker 1: is a production of iHeart Podcast.

1015
01:01:10,680 --> 01:01:14,280
Speaker 3: Our executive producers are Joel Monique and Aaron Kaufman.

1016
01:01:14,520 --> 01:01:16,560
Speaker 1: Our supervising producer is Abu Zafar.

1017
01:01:16,960 --> 01:01:20,880
Speaker 3: Our producers are Common, Laurent Dean Jonathan and Bay Wag.

1018
01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:23,760
Speaker 1: A theme song is by Brian Vasquez, with alternate theme

1019
01:01:23,840 --> 01:01:25,120
Speaker 1: songs by Aaron Kaufman.

1020
01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:28,600
Speaker 3: Special thanks to Soul Rubin, Chris Lord, Kenny Goodman and

1021
01:01:28,760 --> 01:01:30,520
Speaker 3: Heidi our discord moderator.