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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A beautiful young girl goes

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Speaker 1: on a dream getaway with a friend, but she never

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Speaker 1: comes back to this day her case unsolved. Crime Stories

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Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. Robin Gardner needed a getaway. She had

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Speaker 1: recently lost her job as a dental assistant and was

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Speaker 1: having relationship issues with her boyfriend of two and a

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Speaker 1: half years, Richard Fordster. An invitation to vacation in a

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Speaker 1: Ruba seemed just the thing. Gardner had met Gary Giordano

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Speaker 1: onmatch dot Com the year before. Friends say the two

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Speaker 1: weren't super close and had a patime relationship. In fact,

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Speaker 1: Gardner and Giordano had an on again, off again relationship.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes they would be friendly for a while and then

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Speaker 1: not talk for a few months. Then came the invitation.

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Speaker 1: The pair arrived in Aruba July thirty first, you know,

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Speaker 1: and on again, off again email relationship is what it

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Speaker 1: sounds like, So she must have been really surprised. When

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Speaker 1: she had been emailing about wanting to get away having

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Speaker 1: problems with her boyfriend, she suddenly decides to go to

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Speaker 1: Aruba with this email friend again. Thanks for being with

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Speaker 1: us here at Fox Nations series Sex sim Now I

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Speaker 1: Want to introduce to you an all star panel. First

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Speaker 1: of all, Jim Elliott, veteran trial lawyer at Butlersnow dot com.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Jory Crawsen, police psychologist, Faculties Saint Leo University and

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Speaker 1: research consultant. Karen Smith, forensics expert, lecturer, University Florida and

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Speaker 1: host off Shattered Souls, a podcast. You can find her

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Speaker 1: at Bear Bones Forensics dot com. But first to Alexis

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Speaker 1: Teresia Crime online dot com Investigati reporter Alexis also with

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Speaker 1: Lead Stories, Alexis, I don't know if you realize it,

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Speaker 1: but also joining us today is Robin Gardner's sister, Danielle unclesby,

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Speaker 1: and she knows a thing or two about trips to

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Speaker 1: Aruba because she's with my Memories travel dot com. Hold

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Speaker 1: on just a moment, Alexis. Danielle, when you heard your

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Speaker 1: sister was traveling to Aruba with her email friend, what'd

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Speaker 1: you tell her? I didn't know. She didn't even tell me.

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Speaker 1: It was a total surprise to me. I didn't find

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Speaker 1: out until August the fourth, when she when I got

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Speaker 1: a call that you had disappeared. What was your first

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Speaker 1: thought when you realized she had disappeared in Aruba. I

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Speaker 1: was told that she was lost at sea, and I

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Speaker 1: just found that very surprising because I know that she

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Speaker 1: really doesn't swim or get into the water. Now, why

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Speaker 1: is it she doesn't swim or get into the water.

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Speaker 1: It's because she has extensions and makeup and got all

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Speaker 1: the hold up and she just didn't want to ruin that. Well,

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Speaker 1: I gotta tell you something. My daughter, who is an

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Speaker 1: excellent swimmer. I mean she's been has her Advanced Scout

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Speaker 1: Merit badge in swimming and that includes saving people, jumping

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Speaker 1: in the water and saving them, throwing them rasse, holding

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Speaker 1: a pole to them, the works. She had to swim.

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Speaker 1: I forgot how far a mile or whatever to get

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Speaker 1: the Merit badge. But she's not the one to just

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Speaker 1: jump into the water like my son. Some people are

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Speaker 1: just not predisposed to love the water. Now what you

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Speaker 1: said about your sister, she was a real glamour girl.

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Speaker 1: I mean the hair perfect, the makeup perfect. She's not

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Speaker 1: like me, put up my hair in a button and

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Speaker 1: out the door. I am. This woman is one of

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Speaker 1: those women that you think, does she always look like that?

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Speaker 1: And the answer would be yes. I'm looking at a

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Speaker 1: picture of her right now. She looks like a cover

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Speaker 1: girl with the big sunglasses and the hair and the

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Speaker 1: perfect outfit. That's just her. Is that what you're telling me? Yes,

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Speaker 1: I would call her red carpet robin, big personality, beautiful hair,

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Speaker 1: beautiful makeup, always wants the limelight and always wants to

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Speaker 1: live life to the fullest. You know what. I can

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Speaker 1: see that about her right now, because if somebody told

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Speaker 1: me that my daughter Lucy had gone out an isolated,

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Speaker 1: remote area of an island to snorkel alone and got

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Speaker 1: lost at sea, I mean number one, no, she's not

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Speaker 1: going to put a snorkel thing over her face unless

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Speaker 1: I'm with her. She's snorkel many many times. She swims

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Speaker 1: with the manatee, she does the whole thing. But that's

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Speaker 1: just not her cup of tea. Tell me that about

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Speaker 1: my son, I'd say, yes, that's totally him. But you

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Speaker 1: know it's interesting to doctor Jerry Crossen. Very often this

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Speaker 1: kind of evidence is discounted in court because it's not

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Speaker 1: hard evidence. It's called evidence behavioral evidence, evidence of behavior

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Speaker 1: of routine. This was not her routine. Robin Gardenwin mus

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Speaker 1: not have gone off to a remote area of a room,

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Speaker 1: but and god, storkling. It's just not her. Yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: so out of character. In fact, from the other readings

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Speaker 1: that I've seen on a report that she almost have

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Speaker 1: let's see, of fear. But there was anxiety about swimming.

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Speaker 1: I mean not only for the say, her appearance and everything,

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Speaker 1: but just you know, anxiety about going swimming and especially snorkeling.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know a form of cluster phobia. Is

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Speaker 1: I'm a diver, I know, so that will bring cluster

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Speaker 1: phobia out. Oh my good, I'm a diver as well,

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Speaker 1: doctor Jorian. One of the hardest things I ever did

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Speaker 1: was a tunnel dive, an underwater, deep, deep down tunnel dive.

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Speaker 1: In fact, I've stopped div Yeah, I stopped when I

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Speaker 1: had the twins. But there's just some things you're predisposed to, Okay,

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Speaker 1: Alexi's trust, Chuck. I'm sorry I got off on a tangent,

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Speaker 1: but I wanted to find out what Danielle Unclesby thought

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Speaker 1: when she either learned her sister was going to a

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Speaker 1: Ruba or learned she was missing Alexa's You start at

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Speaker 1: the beginning. She must have been very adventurous because she

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Speaker 1: has this email relationship. I guess a long time email

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Speaker 1: relationship with this person, and she's saying, I need to

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Speaker 1: get away. I need to get out of here. I

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Speaker 1: just lost my job as a dental Hygienis this is

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Speaker 1: a perfect time, and he says, great, let's go as friends.

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Speaker 1: Is that how it all happened? That's exactly right. If

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Speaker 1: you go, this is what you would call a trick date.

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Speaker 1: Back when I was girl, I would go, I mean

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Speaker 1: to go on means with your friends, guys who might

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Speaker 1: be sort of interested in And it's funding somewhere at

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Speaker 1: dotic and beautiful and y'all have a free time together.

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Speaker 1: So she goes on the stage kind of spur of

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Speaker 1: the moment, she says, let's go down to a rubus.

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Speaker 1: She says, amazing, beautiful, and they had down there. They

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Speaker 1: have a couple of days on vacations, nothing suspect, they're

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Speaker 1: having a good time, and then all of a sudden,

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Speaker 1: sheet is reported smissing. So how did everything suddenly turn

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Speaker 1: on its ear? Take a listen to our friend Josh

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Speaker 1: Maniquitz At Dateline NBC, Gary Giordano gave investigators his version

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Speaker 1: of what happened on the day Robin disappeared. He said

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Speaker 1: they drove from their hotel to an area called Baby Beach,

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Speaker 1: where they stopped at this beachside restaurant. It's a story

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Speaker 1: backed up by security video. Here are Gary and Robin

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Speaker 1: arriving around three and then leaving about an hour later.

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Speaker 1: Gary then took investigations to an isolated spot nearby called

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Speaker 1: Nankey Beach, where Gary said he and Robin went snorkeling. Robin,

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Speaker 1: he said, cut her foot on a sharp rock just

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Speaker 1: before they went in. Police say Giardano told them the

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Speaker 1: water was rough and at some point he felt he

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Speaker 1: was being pulled out to sea. He swam back, thinking

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Speaker 1: Robin was right behind him, but when he got close

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Speaker 1: to shore, he turned and she was gone. By now

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Speaker 1: it was after six pm. Security video at the restaurant,

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Speaker 1: now closed for the day, shows Gary returning, apparently to

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Speaker 1: look for help. Police put boats and divers in the water.

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Speaker 1: There was no trace of Robin. China take him when

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Speaker 1: I'm just hearing straight back to Robin Gardner's sister, Danielle

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Speaker 1: unglesby joining us. Danielle, I believe we're at the ten

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Speaker 1: year mark from when Robin went missing. Yes, this is

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Speaker 1: ten years. How do you feel? Be honest with me

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Speaker 1: when you see all of the media attention of another

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Speaker 1: young girl who goes missing from Aruba, Natalie Holloway, but

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Speaker 1: really nothing on Robin Gardner. I remember covering it very

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Speaker 1: much often when she first went missing, and believe me,

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Speaker 1: I want all the focus on missing people. I don't

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Speaker 1: deny one victim any media coverage to help solve their case.

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Speaker 1: But I often wonder how other victims' families feel when

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Speaker 1: their cases don't get any attention. Yeah, I feel quite slighted,

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Speaker 1: and I wish it was more in the media back then,

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Speaker 1: and as we've been going on, just you know, just

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Speaker 1: in case there are any clues, or in case anybody

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Speaker 1: wants to come forward and does remember something. Time stories

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Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. I'm listening to the story, the version

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Speaker 1: that the friend I guess i'll call him Gary Giordana

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Speaker 1: gave that the water was rough and the first thing

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Speaker 1: that happened is your sister cut her foot on a

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Speaker 1: sharp rock, So I guess she was on the rocks barefoot.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I can see being on the sand barefoot,

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Speaker 1: but not on rocks barefoot. And even after slicing her

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Speaker 1: foot pretty badly, according to Giordano, she still goes to

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Speaker 1: snorkel in rough water. How does that hit you? Doesn't

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Speaker 1: make any sense, doesn't make any sense whatsoever. Why because,

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Speaker 1: like you said, a rock, I mean, why would you

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Speaker 1: be walking on rocks? You would be if you were

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Speaker 1: in barefoot, you would be walking on sand. And then

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Speaker 1: why would you know? Like again, why would she go

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Speaker 1: in the water. She wouldn't go in the water. To

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Speaker 1: begin with, let's analyze what we're hearing straight, Yeah to you,

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Speaker 1: Karen Smith for expert. You hear Geordana's version of what happened.

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Speaker 1: There's security video involved. What do you make of it? Well,

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Speaker 1: the security video is going to be crucial to find

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Speaker 1: out timelines first of all. Second of all, behaviors and

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Speaker 1: body language, things like that, where they were headed, directionality,

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Speaker 1: things like that, you know, cutting your foot on a

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Speaker 1: rock and leaving blood behind. I mean, I don't know

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Speaker 1: if that's the truth or if it was a ruse.

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Speaker 1: I have no idea. But going into rough water and snorkeling,

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Speaker 1: the first question that I had was where was the

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Speaker 1: snorkeling equipment? Did they bring it with them? Did they

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Speaker 1: go to the car and get it? Is their surveillance

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Speaker 1: footage of that? Where did it come from? Okay. As

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Speaker 1: a matter of fact, take a listen to Matt Gutman

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Speaker 1: at ABC. He says, Robin and Giordano eight but didn't

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Speaker 1: drink here for about an hour the afternoon she vanished.

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Speaker 1: They went into the dive shop but didn't rent any gear.

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Speaker 1: So the dive shop owner told us that he saw

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Speaker 1: them out here on this dirt road that's in a

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Speaker 1: remote part of the beach. Now, he was surprised to

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Speaker 1: see anybody snorkeling out here because it's so rarely frequented

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Speaker 1: by anybody in a mask of fins gear. Donald claims

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Speaker 1: they came down to this beach to snorkel. We were

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Speaker 1: told it was an unusually calm day water flat, but

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Speaker 1: beyond crashing waves and treacherous currents, and it's here that

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Speaker 1: the trail goes cold. Rubert authorities were criticized for being

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Speaker 1: caught flat footed by the Natalie Holloway disappearance in two

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Speaker 1: thousand and five, so they've been tight lipped about this case,

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Speaker 1: flat footed more than once. You know, it's very interesting

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Speaker 1: to me, Alexis Teresha Crime online dot Com investigative reporter,

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Speaker 1: that I'm not hearing about renting any snorkeling gear. No,

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Speaker 1: there isn't. Annie, And in fact, an eyewitness said that

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Speaker 1: when they win, Gary came and said he was so

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Speaker 1: worried that Robin was swept out to see that he

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Speaker 1: wasn't even wet. His shorts weren't wet. His shoes were,

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Speaker 1: but his shorts weren't. Jim Elliott, I'm veteran, try a

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Speaker 1: lawyer at Butler Snow dot com. Jim, that would be

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Speaker 1: the first thing I would look at is did they

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Speaker 1: bring their own snorkeling gear? I mean, to your knowledge, Danielle,

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Speaker 1: uncle Speed, did your sister have her own snorkel gear?

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Speaker 1: Absolutely not? I mean, Jim, I do. Everybody in my

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Speaker 1: family does have snorkel gear because we swam with amanite

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Speaker 1: so many times. But Jim, that'd be the first thing

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Speaker 1: I would look at was did they ever rent snorkel gear?

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Speaker 1: You're hearing from her sister, Robin Gardner didn't have snorkel gear.

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Speaker 1: She didn't even want to get in the water. They're

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Speaker 1: a huge hole in his story, certainly, which would end

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Speaker 1: our country. Certainly should raise the eye of the suspicion

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Speaker 1: of those Okay, a hole in his story, but yet

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Speaker 1: a hole that can be shored up if he brought

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Speaker 1: the snorkel gear with him. But I also find it interesting,

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Speaker 1: and again, Geordano has not been found guilty, has not

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Speaker 1: been declared guilty in this case. Please keep that in

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Speaker 1: mind as a matter of fact. Let's listen to more.

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Speaker 1: This is more from our friends at Dateline NBC. Questions

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Speaker 1: quickly arose. Was this an accidental drowning or was it

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Speaker 1: something else? Baby knacko snarkling. You know this is not Robin.

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Speaker 1: Her roommate and hairdresser, Christina Jones, doubted that Robin, who

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Speaker 1: spent so much money on hair color and extensions, would

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Speaker 1: ever go snorkeling. There's no way that she would get

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Speaker 1: into the ocean, you know, after spending a couple ground

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Speaker 1: on her hair. Quickly, a Reuben police found inconsistencies in

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Speaker 1: the story Gary Giordana was telling them Immediate Solicitor General

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Speaker 1: Taco Stein. Mister Giardano says that he was snorkeling with

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Speaker 1: miss Gardner and that the water was rough. That's what

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Speaker 1: he told us in thee But it was a very

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Speaker 1: calm date. There was no current, no waves, nothing like that.

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Speaker 1: So okay, I'm getting conflicting reports. Was it calm or

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Speaker 1: was it rough? Alexis terres Chuck. The local reports and

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Speaker 1: everybody that was there said it was calm, stepped out

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Speaker 1: beyond the rocks that might have been choppy, but that's

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Speaker 1: because Wade would hit a rock, but the general water

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Speaker 1: was very calm. Okay, you know, I'm curious about this

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Speaker 1: snorkel gear. I'm very curious. Indeed, was anything of Robin

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Speaker 1: Gardner's ever recovered her flip flops or snorkel gear anything

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Speaker 1: at all? It was not. Okay, what are we learning

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Speaker 1: about surveillance video? Guys, Throughout the hotel where they were staying,

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Speaker 1: there was surveillance video, and I want to circle back

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Speaker 1: also to how the two met to start with. But

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Speaker 1: regarding surveillance video, to you, alexis terres Chuck, what do

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Speaker 1: we know about closed circuit TV video? So they were

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Speaker 1: staying at a Marriott resort in a Rivet, and there

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Speaker 1: was closer TV video in the hotel that actually showed

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Speaker 1: them on the last day that Robin was seen alive,

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Speaker 1: shows them arguing. They're kind of cuddling with each other

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Speaker 1: and then at one point Gary puts his hand on

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Speaker 1: the back of her neck and shoved her in the elevator,

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Speaker 1: telling me that was on August fourth, the day that

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Speaker 1: the last day she's ever seen alive. Yes, I understand

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Speaker 1: that the surveillance hotel shows them having quite an argument.

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Speaker 1: Reports that Giordano actually could be heard threatening her. He

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Speaker 1: denies this can't that's what they say, and go ahead

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Speaker 1: of fighting, and she says, I don't want to be

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Speaker 1: with you anymore, and he actually says to her I

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Speaker 1: will that, according to reports, but what started the whole thing,

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Speaker 1: My understanding is that, let me throw this to you,

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Speaker 1: doctor Jerry crawls In, police psychologist and professor at Saint

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Speaker 1: Leo University, that not a suspect. Gary Giordano read a

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Speaker 1: text that she Robin Gardner sent her boyfriend back home,

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Speaker 1: and whatever was in that text reportedly sparked a big

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Speaker 1: argument between the two of them. What do you make

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Speaker 1: of that, doctor Jorry. You know, I look at his

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Speaker 1: behavior from a predatorial nature, even from the initial engagement

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Speaker 1: with her through the dating service or through the Facebook,

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Speaker 1: and all that behavior remains consistent up to the very end.

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Speaker 1: You know, I'd also like know exactly when he purchased

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Speaker 1: that life insurance policy. You know, doctor Jerry Krausen, You're

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Speaker 1: so right. Take a listen to our friends at Dateline NBC.

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Speaker 1: But that was not the only suspicious thing Gary Giordano did.

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Speaker 1: Police discovered Gary had taken out an insurance policy on

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Speaker 1: Robin Gardner, a policy that would pay one and a

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Speaker 1: half million dollars in the event of her accidental death,

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Speaker 1: and the policy's beneficiary Gary Giordano himself. And just two

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Speaker 1: days after Robin went missing and before or he tried

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Speaker 1: to leave Aruba, Gary inquired about how to claim the

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Speaker 1: insurance pay out. Is it normal to ensure somebody's life

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Speaker 1: and makes yourself yourself the beneficiary or do you make

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Speaker 1: the relatives to beneficiary? And so police arrested Gary Giordano

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Speaker 1: at the airport just as he was about to fly

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Speaker 1: home to Maryland. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we

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Speaker 1: were talking about the disappearance of a gorgeous American woman,

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Speaker 1: Robin Gardner, who allegedly went storkling and was never seen again.

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Speaker 1: This although her sister tells us there's no way that

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Speaker 1: she would have gone storkling, she never would have gone

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Speaker 1: in the water, no way that that didn't happen. But

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Speaker 1: to her friend, Gary Giordano. That is what happened. He survived,

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Speaker 1: but she didn't straight back out to Alexis arrest check.

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Speaker 1: I know you just heard evidence from police that Giordano

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Speaker 1: had actually bought life insurance for Robin Gardner with him

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Speaker 1: as the beneficiary. What was his explanation for that? They

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Speaker 1: hardly knew each other. He said that he did this

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Speaker 1: with everyone, but he traveled with because he claimed it

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Speaker 1: would be you know, if the trip's got canceled or

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Speaker 1: you know, if something happened maybe there with some sort

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Speaker 1: of you know, an attack or something like a huge tsunami,

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Speaker 1: you know, a natural disaster that it was just covering

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Speaker 1: all the faces. But the thing is, it was all

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Speaker 1: written in his handwriting. But wouldn't that be travel insurance.

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Speaker 1: Wouldn't that be travel insurance? That would be that would

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Speaker 1: life insurance? Truth about it, okay, is that doctor Jory Yes,

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Speaker 1: jump in Dodger. The accidental again is very crucial to

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Speaker 1: me and far as his behavior goes, because the death

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Speaker 1: in order to collect has to be accidental. So if

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Speaker 1: he were again going to have an accidental drowning is

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Speaker 1: one thing. But there's something had to go wrong there,

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Speaker 1: because you know, there's no body really in order to collect.

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Speaker 1: If she just drowned, or if he drowned her or

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Speaker 1: something like that and had a body and could show

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Speaker 1: that drowning was the cause, then he would cash in.

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Speaker 1: But again it appears something went wrong and the body

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Speaker 1: wouldn't show as evidence of an accidental drowning. There may

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Speaker 1: have been a struggle, there may have been other injuries

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Speaker 1: to her body. We don't have any evidence of injury

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Speaker 1: to her body because her body was never found. But

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Speaker 1: to you, Jim Elliott, you're the veteran civil lawyer are

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Speaker 1: joining us from Butler snow dot com. Jim, can you

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Speaker 1: just take out a life insurance policy on somebody you're

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Speaker 1: not related to in any way? I guess technically you can.

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Speaker 1: I mean most companies do acquire the insured to consented

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Speaker 1: to that. I mean that's instin I guess probably there's

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Speaker 1: a package of travel when as insurance from the company.

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Speaker 1: But atract me, you're being very unusual. Yeah, so that's

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Speaker 1: going to be his claim. Jim Elliott, you're right, is

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Speaker 1: that this is some type of travel insurance. I know

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Speaker 1: whenever we've gone on Disney cruises with the children, I

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Speaker 1: think there is travel insurance and we take out travel

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Speaker 1: insurance in case the cruise gets canceled or to cover them.

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Speaker 1: What were you saying, or a hurricane or you know whatever. Yes,

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Speaker 1: and I would never think about it being the death

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Speaker 1: of my husband or myself or anybody in our family.

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Speaker 1: But that is his response to the fact that he

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Speaker 1: took out this insurance. Well, all right, take a listen

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Speaker 1: to more from our friends at NBC. When Gary here

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Speaker 1: Donald book the getaway to this tropical island, Aruban officials

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Speaker 1: say he also got travel insurance, one policy for himself

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Speaker 1: one for Robin Gardner. It covered the usual likely losses

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Speaker 1: airplane tickets and hotels, but it also provided a payout

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Speaker 1: in case of accidental death while on vacation. Aruba has

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Speaker 1: the policy. It was turned over by the US following

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Speaker 1: a search of Giordano's home last week. The Maryland man

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Speaker 1: volunteered the insurance information during questioning and after the search

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Speaker 1: along the beach where he reported Robin went missing. Giordano's

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Speaker 1: digital camera, cell phone, and computer from his hotel room

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Speaker 1: have been sent to nearby Curosoll for analysis, and sources

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Speaker 1: working the investigation tell NBC Aruba reporter Yenta Lou there

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Speaker 1: is new, potentially significant evidence. The possible evidence is a

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Speaker 1: rock with a full handprint and blood on it. Speaking

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Speaker 1: of blood, isn't sherwal Lex's terrests shut. Witnesses claim that

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Speaker 1: Giordano was sweating profusely the day Robbie goes missing, with

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Speaker 1: blood on a scratch on his throat. Yes, and that's

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Speaker 1: the things they said. They saw him. He was sweating profusely.

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Speaker 1: They didn't they said that he did. They did not

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Speaker 1: think he was wet, so he didn't look like he'd

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Speaker 1: been snorkeling, because that was one of his stories. He

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Speaker 1: was snorkeling in the water with her and it was

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Speaker 1: getting Roughney tried to grab her leg to pull her

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Speaker 1: back in, but she couldn't pull in. Some he swam in.

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Speaker 1: But the witnesses say no, No, he was sweating and

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Speaker 1: he had scratches on his neck and a lot of blood.

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Speaker 1: Not like a tiny little respect but they saw a

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Speaker 1: lot of blood on his neck as if he had

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Speaker 1: been attacked. To Danielle unclesby, this is Robin's sister. Did

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Speaker 1: you ever spake? Did Giordanna when he got back? Um?

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Speaker 1: Not when he not immediately? Um? My mom went down

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Speaker 1: to a Ruba and she spoke with him at the

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Speaker 1: police station when she arrived and what happened um um

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Speaker 1: at that point, I guess he was kind of getting

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Speaker 1: aunty to the um or know, you know, leave town

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Speaker 1: and it was just highly suspect. Guys were talking about

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Speaker 1: the disappearance Rob and Gardner who disappears in a Ruba

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Speaker 1: on a vacation turned deadly. Take a listen to our

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Speaker 1: friend doctor Phil Our cut thirteen. Once you're in there,

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Speaker 1: you're on ground. If you're safe, you turn around, she's

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Speaker 1: gone gone. Why not get your fins, your mask, go

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Speaker 1: get her. You are the most immediate trained help there.

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Speaker 1: You are a certified scuba diver with gear in your car,

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Speaker 1: fins and mask. Why didn't you go back into water?

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Speaker 1: And the same reason why I called the coastguard and

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Speaker 1: none of them got in the water. I stayed here,

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Speaker 1: told dark and that one single person got in that water.

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Speaker 1: You knew that. Hours later, I ask, just at the

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Speaker 1: most dangerous I'll tell you why, because I just came out.

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Speaker 1: I fought for my life to get back. I'm exhausted,

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Speaker 1: I'm completely exhausted. My heart is pounding out of my chest.

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Speaker 1: Exhausted and it's not going to do her or me

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Speaker 1: any good to jump back in that water, right, so

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Speaker 1: it's time to go get help. That's what I did.

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Speaker 1: It's a choice. Did you choice? Did you scream for help?

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Speaker 1: At the time, there was nobody screamed too, So I

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Speaker 1: ran to the restaurant to get help. But it didn't

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Speaker 1: occur to you to put your fans back on, get

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Speaker 1: your mask and snorkel, and you're you're tired, your heart

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Speaker 1: is pounding, you're exhausted. That didn't occur to you to

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Speaker 1: go back in with profit three times about this thing

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Speaker 1: that answered is best taken answer. I can answer a

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Speaker 1: third time, but it's the same answer. That's a choice

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Speaker 1: I made based on my physical being. That's a choice

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Speaker 1: I made. You're hearing Geordana defending himself to doctor Phil

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Speaker 1: and remind her Geordano has never been prosecuted for this case.

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Speaker 1: Take a listen to Jeff Rosen at NBC Official c

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Speaker 1: Gary Giordano won't budge that Robin went missing underwater and

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Speaker 1: he did nothing wrong. But now police say a fisherman

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Speaker 1: out on his boat that day says he saw the

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Speaker 1: couple and not only do they not go snorkeling. They

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Speaker 1: didn't even get in the water. That story has not

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Speaker 1: been proven yet, it has not been anchored in the reality.

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Speaker 1: But if that statement bears reality, it's something that might

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Speaker 1: change to Bathood the investigation. Law enforcement sources tell NBC

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Speaker 1: News the fisherman claims he saw Gary and Robin leave

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Speaker 1: the beach together. If true, that would shatter Giordano's timeline.

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Speaker 1: The sources say Giordanod's behavior after she went missing was

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Speaker 1: bizarre too. He left the search early to sleep at

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Speaker 1: his hotel. Okay, you know, to Jim Elliott, veteran trial

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Speaker 1: lawyer at butlersnow dot com, very often we see cases where,

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Speaker 1: let's just say, husbands don't join in the search for

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Speaker 1: the wife, and that's fuel for speculation, but that's really

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Speaker 1: nothing that proves a murder. No, I mean, certainly you're right,

423
00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:00,640
Speaker 1: But in this circumstance, I mean, you can't. I wouldn't

424
00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 1: think that the guy was distraught over her disappearance. They

425
00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:08,920
Speaker 1: didn't know each other, although will and very odd behavior

426
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:13,119
Speaker 1: and which certainly should have again keyed law enforcement to

427
00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:16,600
Speaker 1: take some more decisive action much more quickly. Well, in

428
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:20,240
Speaker 1: his defense, you state that they didn't know each other

429
00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:42,120
Speaker 1: very well crime stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, you're talking

430
00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:46,320
Speaker 1: about the disappearance of a beautiful young American woman, Robin Gardner.

431
00:27:46,640 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 1: He goes on a trip as friends with her email

432
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:56,080
Speaker 1: buddy and never comes back alive. What was their relationship,

433
00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 1: how did they know each other? And what do we

434
00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:03,240
Speaker 1: know about Giordano's past? Take a listen to our friends

435
00:28:03,240 --> 00:28:06,200
Speaker 1: at Dateline. Court records in the state of Maryland shed

436
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:09,760
Speaker 1: some light on Giordonald's life. Back in two thousand and three,

437
00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 1: Gary Giordano and his first wife went through a nasty divorce,

438
00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:18,399
Speaker 1: trading allegations of abuse in court papers. After becoming single,

439
00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:21,800
Speaker 1: he ended up with orders of protection against him from

440
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:25,320
Speaker 1: two different women. The picture that seemed to be emerging

441
00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:28,800
Speaker 1: from some of those who had dated Gary Giordano was

442
00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:32,359
Speaker 1: that he was capable of being charming one moment a

443
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:37,400
Speaker 1: monster the next. That's certainly what Christina says Robin told her.

444
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 1: He was aggressive sometimes and verbally abusive. Case in point.

445
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:48,480
Speaker 1: Just months before the Aruba trip, Gary invited Robin to

446
00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:52,640
Speaker 1: go on a cruise. She initially agreed, but then canceled

447
00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,960
Speaker 1: when her boyfriend objected. Christina says Robin showed her some

448
00:28:57,080 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 1: text messages Gary had supposedly sent Robin bailed. He said

449
00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:04,120
Speaker 1: that he was going to ruin her life. He said

450
00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:07,840
Speaker 1: he was going to get a hold of Richard he um,

451
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:10,040
Speaker 1: you know, I was going to let everyone know what

452
00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:13,880
Speaker 1: a horse she was. But three months later, Robin agreed

453
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:17,320
Speaker 1: to go to Aruba with Gary, and she just was

454
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 1: the clok, I can handle it. You know, I'm going away.

455
00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 1: You know. So often, doctor Jerry Crawsen, we go along

456
00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:31,960
Speaker 1: with situations when maybe a sixth sense, our gut, our

457
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:35,200
Speaker 1: instinct tells us not to. I don't think Rob mc

458
00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:39,200
Speaker 1: gardner really knew this guy before they went on vacation. No,

459
00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:43,360
Speaker 1: that's part again of the predatorial nature. You see how manipulative,

460
00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:47,920
Speaker 1: how sweet and convincing he can be, and then you know,

461
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 1: explode into violence and aggression. And even when those text

462
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:58,280
Speaker 1: messages when she denied or canceled out on the first cruise,

463
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 1: you saw how he responded like an instant aggression and

464
00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:07,800
Speaker 1: threatening to ruin her life. One thing with the behavior

465
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 1: also was when I have to hand it to him

466
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:16,200
Speaker 1: when he went to the hotel, because he basically kind

467
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:20,560
Speaker 1: of shut down and had a regroup mentally, so he

468
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:23,480
Speaker 1: didn't start filling up, which he still did a lot

469
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:26,240
Speaker 1: of filling up with what he was saying in his story,

470
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,200
Speaker 1: but at least that gave him some downtime to try

471
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:33,160
Speaker 1: to get his story better together than what you know,

472
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 1: he was doing on the instant makeup as he was

473
00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,280
Speaker 1: going along. You know, to this day, isn't she Alexa's

474
00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 1: trust shut that Gary Giordano and Cissy had nothing to

475
00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:46,440
Speaker 1: do with Robin's disappearance. Yep, he does. He says that

476
00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:50,720
Speaker 1: she disappeared in the water. He has not changed that

477
00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:54,600
Speaker 1: one aspect of his story. But also we were talking

478
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:57,000
Speaker 1: about the life intern faulty. He tried to claim it.

479
00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 1: You know, he was certain in his knowledge that she

480
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:04,320
Speaker 1: was gone, and I would think the only way that

481
00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:06,280
Speaker 1: you would be certain in the knowledge that she would call,

482
00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:08,960
Speaker 1: like if it was a regular person, you would hold

483
00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:10,959
Speaker 1: out hope that maybe a boat had picked her up,

484
00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 1: or you know, she had swum to the other side,

485
00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 1: maybe I don't know, knocked her head and had lost

486
00:31:16,120 --> 00:31:18,720
Speaker 1: her memory. But he was certain that she was dead,

487
00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:21,280
Speaker 1: and that's why he applied for the life insurance. Did

488
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:25,160
Speaker 1: he had never ever changed his story about that that

489
00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:27,400
Speaker 1: one part. How quickly did he apply for the life

490
00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:31,440
Speaker 1: insurance policy alexis well, I mean the travel insurance that

491
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:37,440
Speaker 1: covered accidental death. Right within days of her disappearance, he

492
00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:40,760
Speaker 1: called the company and asked about the claim to Alexis

493
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:43,719
Speaker 1: Terrestia Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, what can you

494
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 1: tell me about Giordano leaving? You said he left a

495
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:52,960
Speaker 1: Ruba very quickly. What happened? So he attempted to leave

496
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 1: a Aruba very quickly. Within about four days of Robin disappearing,

497
00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,120
Speaker 1: he went to the airport to fly home to the

498
00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:02,680
Speaker 1: United States, and he was supposed to have a travel companion.

499
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:06,240
Speaker 1: He told authorities there that she was taking a later flight.

500
00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:10,880
Speaker 1: The authorities at the airport found this very suspect. They

501
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:13,400
Speaker 1: alerted the police and he would detained and he was

502
00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 1: not allowed to leave the country. Karen Span, forensic expert

503
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 1: at the airport. Even though he knows Robin Gardner disappeared

504
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:26,840
Speaker 1: in the ocean, that's what he says happened, he actually

505
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:31,040
Speaker 1: tells authorities she's taking a later flight. I have a

506
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 1: problem with that. I have a huge problem with that. Nancy. Listen,

507
00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 1: the whole story falls apart on its face, and you know,

508
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:39,840
Speaker 1: I know he's not a suspect. I know he hasn't

509
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,280
Speaker 1: been charged, but there is so much forensic evidence and

510
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:46,520
Speaker 1: so much other information that's been brought forward that needs

511
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:50,160
Speaker 1: to be really carefully gone through. And one thing that

512
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:53,160
Speaker 1: I saw and read was he turned in his rental

513
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 1: car to the airport and said that it had been

514
00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:00,080
Speaker 1: cleaned and police were unable to do anything with it

515
00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:04,040
Speaker 1: at that point, which I also find completely untrue. It

516
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:06,160
Speaker 1: doesn't matter if a carson cleaned, do you still need

517
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,080
Speaker 1: to go through it for any forendic evidence that may

518
00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:10,920
Speaker 1: have been left behind. And you couple that with blood

519
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:14,320
Speaker 1: on a rock with it tested. Did anybody do any

520
00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:16,840
Speaker 1: forensics from that blood? Any DNA testing to find out

521
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:20,120
Speaker 1: whose blood it was? Lots and lots of questions on

522
00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 1: this case, Nancy. That just don't sit well with me

523
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:23,480
Speaker 1: at all. You know, I said it then and I'll

524
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:28,960
Speaker 1: say it again after Robbin's disappearance and Natalie Holloway's disappearance.

525
00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 1: I never understand why people keep going back to Aruba.

526
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:37,320
Speaker 1: To you, Danielle Unclesby, not only are you Robin's sister,

527
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 1: but you are also a professional travel planner with my

528
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:46,280
Speaker 1: Memories travel dot Com. It's so odd to me that

529
00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:49,760
Speaker 1: after Robin and Allie Holloway both go missing in Aruba,

530
00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:55,040
Speaker 1: tourism to Aruba Aruba actually spiked right right. Yeah, it

531
00:33:56,920 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 1: makes me question thing, absolutely wondering about this text. Have you,

532
00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:07,880
Speaker 1: Danielle uncles be spoken with Robin's hometown honey her boyfriend,

533
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:12,000
Speaker 1: because apparently the text I was referring to earlier where

534
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 1: she texted her boyfriend and then Giordano sees the text

535
00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 1: and has an angry confrontation with her. Did the boyfriend

536
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:25,279
Speaker 1: ever tell you what that text said? No, he never did,

537
00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:30,800
Speaker 1: because according to reports, she told the boyfriend back home

538
00:34:31,520 --> 00:34:34,400
Speaker 1: that she loved him and that they would sort out

539
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:38,480
Speaker 1: all of their issues when she got back home. To you,

540
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:44,359
Speaker 1: doctor Jory Crasen, if that's true, and if Geordano read it,

541
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 1: and here he is taking her on a trip, I

542
00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 1: bet that caused quite the ruckus. I think that would

543
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:56,240
Speaker 1: be the final straw for him to put the plan

544
00:34:56,520 --> 00:35:01,080
Speaker 1: in action, based upon his previous behaviors with his wife

545
00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:04,480
Speaker 1: in the aggressive nature he's already demonstrated. You know, I

546
00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:07,560
Speaker 1: wonder if they ever did go storkling because the photos

547
00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:10,440
Speaker 1: that I have looked at alexis terres chuck. She is

548
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:13,399
Speaker 1: fully closed. It looks like she has like a Hawaiian

549
00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:19,200
Speaker 1: wrap around skirt wrapped around her way. She's wearing wedge

550
00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:24,040
Speaker 1: I want to say they're more like wedge sandals. Her

551
00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:28,359
Speaker 1: hair is done according to witnesses, I can't see this

552
00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 1: from the video, but her hair was done as she

553
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:34,279
Speaker 1: was wearing makeup. And then you have this witness saying

554
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:37,520
Speaker 1: he saw the two walking along the beach and then

555
00:35:37,680 --> 00:35:42,279
Speaker 1: drive off at the time Jordano says they went storkling. Yep,

556
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:45,120
Speaker 1: there is no proof at all and no evidence that

557
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:48,000
Speaker 1: they ever went in the water. That all the photos,

558
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:53,439
Speaker 1: all the videos of her, it's actually address. I'm looking

559
00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:57,120
Speaker 1: at it right now, kind of it's address. She's got

560
00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:02,960
Speaker 1: a black other bag, like a pocket boo bag over

561
00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:05,719
Speaker 1: her shoulder. She's got off with where you have your

562
00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:07,960
Speaker 1: bikini just tossed in there, like she is dressed to

563
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:11,920
Speaker 1: go out. This is a fancy bag. She's got on

564
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 1: high hill wedges. She's got carry a drink. She's got

565
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:20,240
Speaker 1: jewelry on her She's got on a bracelet and other jewelry.

566
00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:24,279
Speaker 1: She's got her hair done, and she's wearing sunglasses. It

567
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:26,600
Speaker 1: looks like she's going out to a nice dinner out.

568
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:28,440
Speaker 1: It's what it looks like to me, it is And

569
00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:32,239
Speaker 1: this was a vacation output for her. You know, she's

570
00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:34,239
Speaker 1: been There's video from a couple of days of day

571
00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:36,160
Speaker 1: were in the hotel. She had worn this dress before.

572
00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 1: It was sort of a favorite output for the time.

573
00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:41,640
Speaker 1: You know, it's a tropical island. It's something that she

574
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:44,640
Speaker 1: really obviously loves to wear. And but there again, there's

575
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,279
Speaker 1: no evidence at all that they were in the water.

576
00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:50,440
Speaker 1: And I keep harping on the fact that there's no

577
00:36:50,480 --> 00:36:53,200
Speaker 1: evidence that he was in the water either nobody. He

578
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:57,000
Speaker 1: wasn't wet. He still had his shoes on. They were wet,

579
00:36:57,520 --> 00:37:00,520
Speaker 1: but his short smart wet, and he wasn't wearing a

580
00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:04,640
Speaker 1: bathing suit. Alexis, where does the case stand now? He

581
00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:08,799
Speaker 1: has never been formally charged now to this day, he

582
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:15,799
Speaker 1: maintains his innocence. Yes, he was detained in Aruba for questioning,

583
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 1: then released and came back to the US. He insists

584
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 1: he's innocent. Where does the case stand now, Alexis, if anywhere?

585
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:29,560
Speaker 1: Basically nowhere. It is an open case. They have not ascue,

586
00:37:29,600 --> 00:37:31,880
Speaker 1: did anybody. They haven't arrest charged him with the crime.

587
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,319
Speaker 1: They have never found her body, they have not had

588
00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 1: any breaks in the case in years, and nobody seems

589
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:41,719
Speaker 1: to be focusing on it at all. To Danielle Unglesby,

590
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:47,279
Speaker 1: this is Robin's sister. Do you ever get updates or

591
00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:52,359
Speaker 1: any information about your sister's disappearance? No, not at all.

592
00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:55,200
Speaker 1: It's quite sad. If you could speak to your sister

593
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:57,319
Speaker 1: right now, what would you tell Robin? I would tell

594
00:37:57,360 --> 00:38:02,360
Speaker 1: her that I love her, sir, I think about her

595
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 1: every single day, and I just wish that, um, you know,

596
00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:16,040
Speaker 1: um we could we could be together again. That's all. Danielle.

597
00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:19,760
Speaker 1: Do you believe there's any chance your sister is still alive?

598
00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:26,360
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, but you know, ten years later, I really have. Unfortunately,

599
00:38:26,800 --> 00:38:30,440
Speaker 1: I've really lost feat sad to say it. There's a

600
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:33,880
Speaker 1: tipline five zero three four two zero three one one

601
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:37,799
Speaker 1: five repeat five zero three four two zero three one

602
00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:41,640
Speaker 1: one five, and to this day, Giordano insists he's innocent.

603
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:45,800
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace crime story, signing off goodbye friend,