Speaker 1: Hey guys. Before we dive into the episode, we have
Speaker 1: exciting news. Betrayal is coming to substack, which is an
Speaker 1: online community. We're calling our substack Beyond Betrayal, a place
Speaker 1: where we dive deeper into the stories you hear on
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Speaker 1: I want to go back to where we started with
Speaker 1: the current family, back to early in the series, when
Speaker 1: we learned that Caroline's husband Joel, had been caught having
Speaker 1: sex in his police car. The day Joel was put
Speaker 1: on disciplinary leave pending termination. He could no longer keep
Speaker 1: his secret life a secret, so he finally came clean,
Speaker 1: and after an emotional family meeting, Joel awkwardly pulled at
Speaker 1: his wedding ring, trying to pry it off his hand.
Speaker 2: He never removed his wedding ring, he always kept an on,
Speaker 2: so he struggled for a long time, but finally gets
Speaker 2: his ring off. Inside of it, I had engraved forever
Speaker 2: and ever, and Joel sets it down on the fireplace
Speaker 2: and just walked out the door.
Speaker 1: It was April eleventh of twenty twenty two, the day
Speaker 1: the world no longer made sense to Caroline. She was
Speaker 1: at home with Nicole, just reeling and she needed her people.
Speaker 1: One of those people was a woman. We're going to
Speaker 1: call Suzanne. We've disguised her voice to protect her privacy.
Speaker 3: I remember exactly where we were. There was about seven
Speaker 3: or eight of us in the car going up to
Speaker 3: the Journey concert up in Denver. A friend was the
Speaker 3: one who received the phone call, and I was sitting
Speaker 3: right behind her, and her reaction was, oh my god,
Speaker 3: is he okay?
Speaker 1: And I'm like, oh my god. Suzanne's first fear was
Speaker 1: that Joel had been injured in the line of duty.
Speaker 3: And then this other person told me that Joel was
Speaker 3: having an affair and that Caroline said that her life
Speaker 3: is about to fall apart.
Speaker 1: I said, you know, let's go home.
Speaker 3: So we literally pulled off the highway and pulled into
Speaker 3: US seven eleven.
Speaker 1: They jumped out of that car and got her ride
Speaker 1: to Caroline's house. There were no words that could make
Speaker 1: it better, so Suzanne didn't try. She just listened and
Speaker 1: cried with Caroline.
Speaker 3: And we literally must have sat at the table with
Speaker 3: you know, wine and food from about seven o'clock till
Speaker 3: about eleven thirty that night. While we're there, Caroline said
Speaker 3: that Joel was having an affair, was.
Speaker 1: Having an affair with multiple people. Suzanne's chest tightened as she
Speaker 1: watched Caroline unravel. Her heart was broken for her friend.
Speaker 1: That night would be the first of many they'd spend
Speaker 1: together at Caroline's kitchen table. What Suzanne could have never
Speaker 1: imagined was that she would soon need Caroline to return
Speaker 1: the favor. I'm Andrea Gunning and this is Betrayal, Season four,
Speaker 1: Episode nine, three Little Birds. Over the past several episodes,
Speaker 1: we've pulled back the curtain on Caroline's family and the
Speaker 1: unraveling of her marriage to Joel Kern. Through conversations with relatives,
Speaker 1: close friends, and former officers from the Colorado Springs Police Department,
Speaker 1: we've worked a peace together a complex and often painful story.
Speaker 1: Before we wrapped up this season, we decided to make
Speaker 1: another trip out to Colorado Springs. It looked a lot
Speaker 1: different on our last visit. The streets were blanketed in snow,
Speaker 1: and we carefully navigated the mountain town, taking in its
Speaker 1: winter beauty. This time, spring was in the air, and
Speaker 1: along with the change of seasons, there were changes in
Speaker 1: the lives of Caroline and her friends.
Speaker 2: I'm like, this just must be for you, because this
Speaker 2: is not.
Speaker 1: The first time we visited Colorado Springs to meet Caroline.
Speaker 1: We were warmly welcomed into her Sunday supper club at home,
Speaker 1: surrounded by her close friends. We shared a meal, some wine,
Speaker 1: and plenty of laughter, and gave us a glimpse into
Speaker 1: her support system, the people who had stood by her
Speaker 1: through the discovery of Joel's betrayal. Suzanne was often at
Speaker 1: these dinners, but not that night. She was working training
Speaker 1: for a new job. Her husband was there, though, and
Speaker 1: spoke about his wife with great affection. When we returned recently,
Speaker 1: we joined Caroline and Suzanne on a walk. It was
Speaker 1: a windy one around a nearby lake on a typical
Speaker 1: Colorado day. It was sunny with a view of Pike's Peak,
Speaker 1: but that quickly changed to Cloud's rolling in around us.
Speaker 1: Caroline recalled the unconditional support she had received from Suzanne
Speaker 1: and her husband in her time of need.
Speaker 2: He and Suzanne had been at my house when my
Speaker 2: life blew up.
Speaker 1: Witnessing Caroline's distress, Suzanne and her husband held each other
Speaker 1: a little closer. Seeing firsthand how quickly a relationship can
Speaker 1: be decimated, has an unsettling effect.
Speaker 2: They were the people who said, uh, you got to
Speaker 2: get up so that we can go to Nicole's lacross game.
Speaker 2: We're going to sit with you in the stands. We're
Speaker 2: going to be next to Hey, this awards thing's going
Speaker 2: on tonight. You don't need to go to that alone.
Speaker 2: We're going to go with you.
Speaker 1: They were those friends. They showed up and they were
Speaker 1: one of those couples who truly enjoyed life together, running
Speaker 1: marathon side by side, always up for an adventure. They
Speaker 1: had met years earlier in another part of the country
Speaker 1: and moved to Colorado Springs. But something beside the weather
Speaker 1: had shifted since we were last in Colorado, something in
Speaker 1: Suzanne's marriage. A few months ago, Caroline was away visiting
Speaker 1: her daughter Nicole at college when she received a surprising
Speaker 1: text from Suzanne. The message said.
Speaker 2: Okay, I just want to let you know I appreciate
Speaker 2: you and I value what you have gone through. I've
Speaker 2: been thinking about you a lot, and I said, I
Speaker 2: really appreciate that. And then I got another text saying, Hey,
Speaker 2: when you get home, let's sit down and chat.
Speaker 1: The words of support weren't unusual, but it wasn't like
Speaker 1: Suzanne to wait to chat in person. Normally, she'd just call.
Speaker 3: Knowing what she had been through and knowing what she
Speaker 3: was going through, I did not want to Ruin a weekend.
Speaker 1: While Caroline was away, Suzanne stumbled upon something in her
Speaker 1: own home that changed her entire life. Eighteen years into
Speaker 1: their marriage, Suzanne discovered a series of emails that crossed
Speaker 1: the line. Messages her husband had been exchanging with women
Speaker 1: online and he had a fetish. She knew nothing about.
Speaker 1: That's all we can say legally about it. As she
Speaker 1: kept reading, it became clear this had been going on
Speaker 1: for a long time.
Speaker 3: After seeing the emails that I had seen, and I
Speaker 3: just needed to run.
Speaker 1: When Caroline returned home, Suzanne shared the whole story.
Speaker 3: The biggest hurt for me is that he would do
Speaker 3: this and not be open enough in our marriage after
Speaker 3: all that we've gone through. But that after hearing Caroline's
Speaker 3: story and going through everything for the last couple of years.
Speaker 1: You didn't think about.
Speaker 3: Sitting me down and saying, I got to tell you
Speaker 3: something like you don't think like what kind of secret
Speaker 3: keeping is.
Speaker 1: That Many women would have walked away if their husband
Speaker 1: confessed to this behavior. Suzanne was the type of person
Speaker 1: that would have been open to rebuilding if he had
Speaker 1: told her the truth, and if he was committed to
Speaker 1: addressing the behavior.
Speaker 3: And then in the end to find out that this
Speaker 3: biggest secret that you had, you've kept for so many years.
Speaker 3: Instead of getting help, he was.
Speaker 1: Someone who was helping and supporting Caroline, knowing full well
Speaker 1: the entire time that he was engaging in betrayal himself.
Speaker 1: Caroline was shaken, stunned. Really, Suzanne's husband was part of
Speaker 1: her inner circle.
Speaker 2: He was an ally. He saw the pain the kids
Speaker 2: and I went through like he witnessed the tears first hand.
Speaker 1: Suzanne was devastated. She had always believed her husband was
Speaker 1: the most loyal man in the world. He was her person,
Speaker 1: so she told him to leave. They separated, and Suzanne
Speaker 1: was left feeling lonely, distraught, and trying to make sense
Speaker 1: of the life she thought she knew. Caroline was furious.
Speaker 2: My anger toward him. I couldn't even hide it. When
Speaker 2: she disclosed to me what happened. I had just this
Speaker 2: utmost hurt for her because of knowing what your chapter
Speaker 2: of life has been and how long you've been with someone,
Speaker 2: and then to think now I have to start over
Speaker 2: and figure life out by myself, Like how do you
Speaker 2: recover from that? And knowing the array of emotions that
Speaker 2: were about ready to come was so heartbreaking to watch.
Speaker 1: Caroline had first hand knowledge of what lay ahead. She
Speaker 1: knew the grief that accompanies betrayal and how it shakes
Speaker 1: you to your core. It doesn't just break your heart,
Speaker 1: it takes a toll on your whole body.
Speaker 3: I've called her a couple of times, especially where I'm
Speaker 3: like I just can't breathe.
Speaker 4: She's like, Okay, stop, what happened?
Speaker 3: Nothing happened.
Speaker 4: I just can't breathe.
Speaker 3: I've had panic attacks, anxiety attacks, emotional attacks.
Speaker 1: The weight of the separation really hit Suzanne after a
Speaker 1: trip to visit her family.
Speaker 3: Coming home from visiting family is another rough day, ironically,
Speaker 3: because you come back to a life that is not
Speaker 3: what you used to come back to. I don't have
Speaker 3: that confidant and that person at my.
Speaker 4: House to lean on.
Speaker 1: For Caroline, that's a familiar feeling. It's one she remembers
Speaker 1: well from those first days of being an empty nester.
Speaker 2: Shortly after it was just me Nicole had left for
Speaker 2: school and it was just me lost in silence at
Speaker 2: the house.
Speaker 1: So instead of being alone, Caroline would spend time with
Speaker 1: people like Suzanne, friends who felt like family. Suzanne is
Speaker 1: still in those early days.
Speaker 3: I'm new at it right now, and I don't have
Speaker 3: three years in I'm starting to think of it like
Speaker 3: a death. You know, it never goes away. You compartmentalize,
Speaker 3: it's always going to be part of who you are
Speaker 3: now and it makes you who you are in the future.
Speaker 3: But I don't think it ever goes away.
Speaker 1: I wondered how long it takes for this trauma and
Speaker 1: loss to no longer be the first thing you remember
Speaker 1: when you open your eyes in the morning.
Speaker 2: I actually just had a conversation with Nicole about this today.
Speaker 2: She her brother, and myself. We've confessed to each other
Speaker 2: that a day does not start without remembering what he did.
Speaker 1: Suzanne shares the same experience.
Speaker 3: I can have a good time going out with friends
Speaker 3: and doing things, and then as soon as I turn
Speaker 3: the corner to my house. Bam, it all hits me again.
Speaker 3: I wake up in the morning and I realize that
Speaker 3: my house is empty.
Speaker 1: Having a close friend who knows that feeling.
Speaker 3: I wouldn't trade her for anybody in the world right now,
Speaker 3: because she does get it and she can answer those questions.
Speaker 3: The fact that you can have a friend that has
Speaker 3: these conversations with you is far and few between.
Speaker 2: I would never ever, ever, ever wish this on anyone ever.
Speaker 2: I would never want anyone to have the shock in
Speaker 2: awe and have to sit and relive and then rethink
Speaker 2: your entire life and question and if your family and
Speaker 2: marriage was a fraud. I never want anyone to ever
Speaker 2: experience that ever. And I think there's this piece of
Speaker 2: me that feels attached to Susanna.
Speaker 4: As a result of this, I've learned a lot from her.
Speaker 3: She has taught me to be more open and honest
Speaker 3: in my feelings about stuff. We're still being incredibly brutally honest,
Speaker 3: where other times in friendships you don't have that opportunity
Speaker 3: to be.
Speaker 4: I love you, I love you too.
Speaker 1: As we were getting closer to wrapping up Caroline's story,
Speaker 1: I asked her to join me to talk about what
Speaker 1: it has been like making this podcast. We've also seen
Speaker 1: a lot of listener feedback this season and received emails
Speaker 1: from people associated with the CSPD, and some of it
Speaker 1: is pretty shocking. Here are some of our conversation. Caroline.
Speaker 1: I am so grateful that you shared your story with
Speaker 1: us this season, and I'm curious about your experience. Would
Speaker 1: you say it's been therapeutic.
Speaker 2: For you doing this podcast was very helpful. I mean
Speaker 2: it wasn't just helpful to be able to finally say
Speaker 2: my truth, finally tell my side, but I will also
Speaker 2: tell you what was something that was also very helpful
Speaker 2: and very therapeutic and very cathartic. What a lot of
Speaker 2: people don't know about this podcast is everything I say
Speaker 2: is vetted. There is nothing thing that I can recount
Speaker 2: or big moments that is not fact checked, is not
Speaker 2: looked through by or coroborated by two, three, four other parties.
Speaker 2: Being able to have someone validate that this occurred it
Speaker 2: was extremely important.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I imagine that can be really powerful because it's
Speaker 1: validating your lived experience.
Speaker 2: Absolutely.
Speaker 1: I want to move on to some comments from listeners,
Speaker 1: and one thing I can say is people were really
Speaker 1: invested in your story? Are you down to hear some
Speaker 1: of them? I'd love to, Okay. The first one I'm
Speaker 1: going to share is from a former CSPD officer. He writes,
Speaker 1: do your Betrayal podcast host and team. I've been listening
Speaker 1: to Betrayal season four and I feel the need to
Speaker 1: share how deeply the story affected me. I was one
Speaker 1: class behind Joel Kern. Hearing what he did the multiple affairs,
Speaker 1: lying to internal affairs and his family was shocking. What
Speaker 1: devastated me even more was hearing how the department supported him. Meanwhile,
Speaker 1: I served with honor for nearly fifteen years. I continuously
Speaker 1: put my life on the line for this city. I
Speaker 1: suffered a mental breakdown on the job and was later
Speaker 1: diagnosed with PTSD and a traumatic brain injury, both directly
Speaker 1: tied to my service. I never disgraced the badge. All
Speaker 1: I did was ask for help, and I was denied
Speaker 1: again and again. The department psychologist said he didn't actually
Speaker 1: provide mental health care. I lost my job, I lost
Speaker 1: my identity. My family and I had built our entire
Speaker 1: life around my police career. Suddenly it was gone. I
Speaker 1: spiraled into nearly a decade of depression. I drank heavily.
Speaker 1: I was suicidal. At first, listening to this podcast made
Speaker 1: me sick. Then I felt ashamed, ashamed that I had
Speaker 1: ever worn the same badge. But as I kept listening,
Speaker 1: became angry because I remember the culture and unethical behavior
Speaker 1: among command staff. My betrayal didn't come from a spouse.
Speaker 1: It came from the department. I loved the one I
Speaker 1: believed would stand behind me the way I stood behind
Speaker 1: the public. It didn't thank you for telling hard stories.
Speaker 1: They matter. They remind the world that some of us
Speaker 1: were thrown away, not because we failed, but because we
Speaker 1: were no longer convenient. I won't share the name of
Speaker 1: the email, but I think I think you know this individual.
Speaker 2: I know who this person is and what their role
Speaker 2: was in the department, and their role was what you
Speaker 2: think of a police officer doing. I mean, you think
Speaker 2: of this person as engaging in heroic acts in very
Speaker 2: dangerous situations and circumstances. And knowing what this person did
Speaker 2: and what his assignment was, this email fills me with
Speaker 2: so much emotion. It just makes me feel nauseated to
Speaker 2: know that someone like him was cast aside and not
Speaker 2: provided the assistance and help that truly could have saved
Speaker 2: his career, truly could have saved him as an individual.
Speaker 2: It's just incredibly disheartening to me.
Speaker 1: It is disheartening. I mean, I guess all I can
Speaker 1: say is I'm grateful for this person's service and grateful
Speaker 1: that they felt safe enough to write in and share
Speaker 1: their story with us. And I hope this person feels
Speaker 1: hurt and appreciated. He's very much appreciated. Okay, This next
Speaker 1: email is interesting because it's not just from a different state,
Speaker 1: it's a different country. She writes, thank you for putting
Speaker 1: season four out. I was married to a former police
Speaker 1: officer in Calgary who is almost the same person as
Speaker 1: Joel Kern. The only difference is that the police service
Speaker 1: swept it all under the rug. My ex was able
Speaker 1: to resign in twenty twenty one while under five investigations.
Speaker 1: Since he chose to resign before he was fired, he
Speaker 1: has no record and can become a police officer anywhere
Speaker 1: in Canada. Unfortunately, these psychopaths get away with their crimes.
Speaker 1: Thank you for making these things known. It is wild
Speaker 1: that someone in Canada has such a similar experience to you.
Speaker 1: Is that surprising to you?
Speaker 2: I don't think that my story is necessarily an anomaly
Speaker 2: in the sense that I was married to a police officer.
Speaker 2: I knew what I was getting when I was married
Speaker 2: to a cop. I knew that he would have to
Speaker 2: work nights. I knew that there would be weird hours.
Speaker 2: I knew there would be times he would not be
Speaker 2: able to be home for holidays or special events. These
Speaker 2: are things that I accepted. What I did not sign
Speaker 2: up for, and I did not accept, was for him
Speaker 2: to deface his badge and was for him to defy
Speaker 2: our marital vows. I did not sign up for that, right.
Speaker 1: You didn't, And I think it's safe to say that
Speaker 1: in your case, and I would argue in the case
Speaker 1: of the person that wrote in that all the allowances
Speaker 1: you guys made to help accommodate their job and their
Speaker 1: work schedules were exploited.
Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, one hundred percent.
Speaker 1: Okay, we're going to talk about one more email, and
Speaker 1: it was one that we recently received, and it was
Speaker 1: a shock to our team when we received it. We
Speaker 1: said it to you, you've had some time to digest it.
Speaker 1: I mean I should say it's a shock, but not
Speaker 1: a complete surprise, because you know, having heard the number
Speaker 1: of people Joel was having affairs with. It's tough, But
Speaker 1: to your point earlier about validation, I think it's important
Speaker 1: for us to discuss it. Okay, okay, here we go
Speaker 1: to the host of Betrayal podcast. I don't know if
Speaker 1: my conscience will ever be clean, but writing you is
Speaker 1: a first step. I am one of Joel Kern's affairs.
Speaker 1: Was my lieutenant, and he held power. He also made
Speaker 1: me believe we were in a relationship and had a future.
Speaker 1: I remember seeing Caroline and talked to her a few times.
Speaker 1: She'd show up to the substation with dinner for him
Speaker 1: or cake and ice cream for everyone. For special occasions.
Speaker 1: She told our shift that everyone was welcome to eat
Speaker 1: Thanksgiving dinner at their home if we had nowhere to go.
Speaker 1: One year, she made Christmas dinner for the entire shift
Speaker 1: and set up a photo booth. I guess that's why
Speaker 1: it was flattering. When Joel started complimenting me. He started
Speaker 1: flirting with me and sending messages. When I was out,
Speaker 1: he asked what I looked like in regular clothes. Then
Speaker 1: he asked me to meet him for dinner on shift.
Speaker 1: Things started crossing the line and getting romantic. I told
Speaker 1: him that I couldn't believe he wanted someone like me
Speaker 1: when he had a pretty wife and kids. He told
Speaker 1: me that Caroline was only good to look at and
Speaker 1: said that she was sick with arthritis and didn't pay
Speaker 1: attention to him. Joel said she couldn't do anything or
Speaker 1: go anywhere. He said she was always in bed and
Speaker 1: he couldn't divorce her since she was so sick. I
Speaker 1: believed him. We had sex at my house after work
Speaker 1: and a few times before. I felt guilty when we
Speaker 1: had sex in his office because of all the pictures
Speaker 1: of his wife and kids around. He told me the
Speaker 1: pictures were for show. I started to realize I wasn't
Speaker 1: the only one he was sleeping with. I was embarrassed
Speaker 1: and ashamed. A friend showed his Facebook page. I was
Speaker 1: so mad when I saw pictures of Joel and Caroline
Speaker 1: after she ran a marathon. I confronted him about her
Speaker 1: being sick. How did she run a marathon if she
Speaker 1: was so sick. He laughed at me and told me
Speaker 1: I didn't know what I was talking about. I know
Speaker 1: I'm not the only affair he had at CSPD, but
Speaker 1: every day I wish I wasn't one of the people
Speaker 1: on his roster. If Caroline gets these emails, then I
Speaker 1: want her to know that I'm very sorry and hope
Speaker 1: she can move forward. This email is a great example
Speaker 1: of you know, what we explored in this season is
Speaker 1: you know, as you're trying to move forward and just
Speaker 1: live your life, you know, you take three steps and
Speaker 1: then bam, new information, a new affair you didn't see coming,
Speaker 1: and it's just another blow. It's just another hit.
Speaker 2: I'm desensitized to hearing about affairs like that. Part doesn't
Speaker 2: hit my soul hearing this email. The part that just
Speaker 2: as a gut punch to me is hearing the manipulation
Speaker 2: tactics and the lies used to garner his sexual affairs.
Speaker 2: Very few people know that I have rheumatoid arthritis. Very
Speaker 2: few people know that about me. It is not something
Speaker 2: that debilitates me and puts me bedridden. But for him
Speaker 2: to have used that and told someone that to manipulate
Speaker 2: them to have sex with him, it just sickens me.
Speaker 1: It honestly just feels like nothing was off limits in
Speaker 1: his pursuit. I mean, it's it's fascinating and horrifying how
Speaker 1: much Joel was manipulating everyone in his orbit.
Speaker 2: So a new friend from my women's group said something
Speaker 2: to me that had just really stuck with me. She said,
Speaker 2: it's like we were living in the Truman Show. Joel
Speaker 2: was the director and the rest of us were just
Speaker 2: cast members, just going along with the script without even
Speaker 2: knowing it. There was the life that he lived with us,
Speaker 2: or the one you know that he pretended to live
Speaker 2: with us, and then there was this version he showed
Speaker 2: to people at work. None of it was real, all
Speaker 2: of it was a performance.
Speaker 1: I think this is a good time to mention. We
Speaker 1: did reach out to Joel to give him the opportunity
Speaker 1: to share on the podcast, but he did decline our
Speaker 1: request for an interview. However, he did send us a
Speaker 1: written statement, and I'm going to read that now. Thank
Speaker 1: you for reaching out. I understand the nature of the
Speaker 1: series and appreciate the opportunity to respond. However, I've decided
Speaker 1: not to participate in the podcast. I do want to
Speaker 1: acknowledge that I've made mistakes and that others have their
Speaker 1: own stories to tell. While I will not be adding
Speaker 1: to the conversation publicly, I continue to reflect and work
Speaker 1: on becoming a better version of myself. I ask that
Speaker 1: this message be taken as my only comment. Sincerely, Joel,
Speaker 1: I think it's fair to say that we're probably never
Speaker 1: going to get to the bottom of why Joel did
Speaker 1: what he did, why he did this to your family,
Speaker 1: why he did this to you.
Speaker 2: But here's what I do know.
Speaker 1: There are so many people who've been betrayed by a partner,
Speaker 1: and it's isolating, and it's deeply lonely. In hearing your story,
Speaker 1: your honesty, your strength, your vulnerability, it might be the
Speaker 1: moment someone else realizes that they're not alone.
Speaker 2: Thank you for giving me the platform to do it.
Speaker 1: After months getting to know Caroline and her world, we
Speaker 1: had one more trip that we wanted to take to
Speaker 1: watch her son run the Boston Marathon. It wasn't his
Speaker 1: first time running, but this was the first time Caroline
Speaker 1: and Nicole would get to see him cross the finish line.
Speaker 1: We were excited to go along. Before race day, we
Speaker 1: all sat down at dinner together. Nicole was grateful not
Speaker 1: just to have the whole family in one place, but
Speaker 1: to finally share this experience and to talk together for
Speaker 1: the podcast. By the way, you'll hear the sounds of
Speaker 1: the restaurant in the background. This is our first time
Speaker 1: talking all three of us. Now that I had them
Speaker 1: all at one table, I wanted to ask them about
Speaker 1: something I noticed. Caroline has lots of images of birds
Speaker 1: around in her home and even in a tattoo. I
Speaker 1: asked the family about it, and no, I would probably
Speaker 1: be the best for that.
Speaker 2: So life blows up and we would check in with
Speaker 2: each other every day and we started talking about, you know,
Speaker 2: just different mantras and how we kept going. And one
Speaker 2: day my son said, I keep hearing the Bob Marley
Speaker 2: song and it just keeps chanting like everything's going to
Speaker 2: be all right. I actually thought to myself, how fitting that.
Speaker 2: Obviously the chorus is Everything's going to be all right.
Speaker 2: But the title of the song is three Little birds.
Speaker 2: And so we were a family of four, but we
Speaker 2: really dwindled down to three and it just became three
Speaker 2: little birds. And after that our mantra has been three
Speaker 2: little birds, or we sign everything off on to each
Speaker 2: other TL it just has become our thing.
Speaker 1: The next morning, we were off to the Boston Marathon.
Speaker 2: His freshman year, he had the goal of doing this
Speaker 2: and it was a big deal for him to train
Speaker 2: and cross the finish line, and he was scheduled to
Speaker 2: do this in April of twenty twenty two, and so
Speaker 2: just a week before that was our designated D day
Speaker 2: when Joel blew up our lives and we didn't know
Speaker 2: if he would follow through with it, and he said
Speaker 2: that it was a big deal for him to do it,
Speaker 2: that training and being a part of something bigger was
Speaker 2: just kind of keeping him on a path to heal
Speaker 2: for himself since he was so far away, and to
Speaker 2: keep his mind off of certain things. And so he
Speaker 2: did it.
Speaker 1: The first time he ran the marathon, Jewel's betrayal was
Speaker 1: painfully fresh.
Speaker 2: In the day that he did the race, Jewel called
Speaker 2: in the middle of the conversation. We were sitting in
Speaker 2: a car, and Nicole actually had to say, you do
Speaker 2: know that today is a bigger day than you. My
Speaker 2: brother's doing this marathon and you completely forgot about it.
Speaker 2: There's so much more that's bigger than you.
Speaker 1: Well, this is the first year that we have actually
Speaker 1: gotten Intisim across the finish line.
Speaker 2: It's just been a slow just to slow burn, a
Speaker 2: slow achievement to try to keep going. And if I
Speaker 2: were to tell you that I think the kids and
Speaker 2: I will ever cross like a finish line from the
Speaker 2: trauma that was caused. I just don't think that's realistic.
Speaker 2: I think we can keep going, and I think we
Speaker 2: can continue to figure out our way through it. But
Speaker 2: I'm not sure that we'll really truly ever understand no
Speaker 2: reasons why or.
Speaker 1: Really get over anything.
Speaker 2: But we will get through it.
Speaker 1: But today was a good day. Standing on the streets
Speaker 1: of Boston near the finish line, the sky was clear,
Speaker 1: and we cheered runners as they crossed. I was holding
Speaker 1: a sign that said free beer at finish line, and
Speaker 1: we waited with anthicipation for Caroline soun.
Speaker 2: A beer sounds been after line. The three of us
Speaker 2: have been through something that no three other people will
Speaker 2: ever have gone exactly through. And so to be able
Speaker 2: to say that we're still here, still standing, still achieving,
Speaker 2: and still together, I think that's incredible.
Speaker 1: Pure joy, pure love. Maybe every little thing is imperfect,
Speaker 1: but these three little birds are doing all right, just
Speaker 1: like the song said.
Speaker 2: That might be my baby boy.
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Betrayal season four. If you
Speaker 1: would like to reach out to the Betrayal team, email
Speaker 1: us at Betrayal pod at gmail dot com. That's Betrayal
Speaker 1: Pod at gmail dot com. Also, please be sure to
Speaker 1: follow us on Instagram at Betrayal Pod and me Andrea H.
Speaker 1: Gunning for all Betrayal content, news and updates. One way
Speaker 1: to support the series is by subscribing to our show
Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts. Please rate and review Betrayal five star
Speaker 1: reviews help us know you appreciate what we do. Betrayal
Speaker 1: is a production of Glass Podcasts, a division of Glass
Speaker 1: Entertainment Group, in partnership with iHeart Podcasts. The show is
Speaker 1: executive produced by Nancy Glass and Jennifer Fason. Betrayal is
Speaker 1: hosted and produced by me Andrea Gunning, written and produced
Speaker 1: by Carrie Hartman, also produced by Ben Fetterman. Our associate
Speaker 1: producers are Caitlin Golden and Kristin Melcurie. Our iHeart team
Speaker 1: is Ali Perry and Jessica Crincheck. Story editing by Monique Leboard,
Speaker 1: audio editing by mattel Vecchio and Tanner Robbins and mixed
Speaker 1: by mattal Vecchio and special thanks to Caroline and her family.
Speaker 1: Betrayal's theme is composed by Oliver Baines. Music library provided
Speaker 1: by my Music and for more podcasts from iHeart visit
Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.