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Speaker 1: Once the last time you took a time out. I'm

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Speaker 1: Ev Rodsky, author of the New York Times bestseller fair

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Speaker 1: Play and Find Your Unicorn Space, activists on the gender

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Speaker 1: division of labor, attorney and family mediator. And I'm doctor

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Speaker 1: Addina Rukar, a Harvard physician and medical correspondent with an

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Speaker 1: expertise in the science of stress, resilience, mental health, and burnout.

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Speaker 1: We're so excited to share our podcast, time Out, a

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Speaker 1: production of I Heart Podcasts and Hello Sunshine, repealing back

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Speaker 1: the layers around why society makes it so easy to

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Speaker 1: guard men's time like it's diamonds and treat women's time

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Speaker 1: like it's infinite like sand. And so whether you're partnered

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Speaker 1: with or without children, or in a career where you

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Speaker 1: want more boundaries, this is the place for you for

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Speaker 1: people of all family structures. So take this time out

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Speaker 1: with us to learn, get inspired, and most importantly, reclaim

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Speaker 1: your time. Listen to Time Out, a fair Play podcast

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Speaker 1: on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or We're

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Speaker 1: ever you get your podcasts. I'm Colleen with Join Me,

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Speaker 1: the host of Eating Wall Broke podcast while I Eat

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Speaker 1: a meal created by self made entrepreneurs influencers and celebrities

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Speaker 1: over a meal they once eight when they were broke.

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Speaker 1: Today I have the lovely aj Crimson, the official Princess

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Speaker 1: of comfin Asia kidding and Asia. This is the professor.

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Speaker 1: We're here on Eating Wall Broke, and today I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: break down my meal that got me through a time

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Speaker 1: when I was broken. Listen to Eating Wall Broke on

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Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app, on Apple podcast or wherever

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Speaker 1: you get your podcasts. Executive producer Paris Hilton brings back

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Speaker 1: the hit podcast How Men Think. And that's good news

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Speaker 1: for anyone that is confused by men, which is basically everyone.

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Speaker 1: It's real talk, straight from the source. How Men Think

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Speaker 1: podcast is exactly what we need to figure them out.

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Speaker 1: It's going to be fun and formative and probably a

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Speaker 1: bit scary at times because we're literally going inside the

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Speaker 1: minds of men. Listen to How Men Think on the

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Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get

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Speaker 1: your podcasts. Hey, everybody, Robert Evans here and I wanted

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Speaker 1: to let you know. This is a compilation episode, So

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Speaker 1: every episode of the week that just happened is here

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Speaker 1: in one convenient and with somewhat less ads package for

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Speaker 1: you to listen to in a long stretch if you want.

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Speaker 1: If you've been listening to the episodes every day this week,

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Speaker 1: there's gonna be nothing new here for you, but you

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Speaker 1: can make your own decisions. Welcome to It could Happen

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Speaker 1: Here the show where I had to change the introduction

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Speaker 1: because Sophie said it would confuse people. So now we're

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Speaker 1: just doing the boring thing and saying the actual name

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Speaker 1: of the show, which is it could happen here. Um.

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Speaker 1: It's a show about the fact that the society is

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Speaker 1: kind of falling apart or changing, depending on your perspective

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Speaker 1: of things, and people need to prepare for what's coming,

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Speaker 1: which is a world of greater instability and economic collapse

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Speaker 1: and rising at ratarianism and increasing fights in order to

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Speaker 1: reverse and stymy all of those terrible things. UM. And

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Speaker 1: you know, one of the things I've seen in some

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Speaker 1: early feedback from um other stuff I've done on other shows,

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Speaker 1: and also from earlier episodes of this is people who

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Speaker 1: will go like, Hey, everything you're saying about mutual aid

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Speaker 1: is rad But I live in X town and whatever state,

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Speaker 1: and there's there's nothing here. There's not not an organized left.

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Speaker 1: I don't I don't know of any mutual aid groups. Um,

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Speaker 1: how can I get involved? Or like, how could I

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Speaker 1: start my own organization and try to get people involved?

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Speaker 1: And then the another thing we get asked a lot

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Speaker 1: is like, Hey, what you're saying about building resiliency and

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Speaker 1: preparing for difficult times, gardening and whatnot sounds great. But

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Speaker 1: I'm poor as ship and I live in a tiny

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Speaker 1: apartment um or whatever. I I have no resources or

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Speaker 1: no room. Um, even if you're not none of enough money, like,

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Speaker 1: I'm in the middle of some horribly dense city. So

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Speaker 1: this week we're gonna be talking around those sub objects

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Speaker 1: in a number of different ways. And to kind of

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Speaker 1: kick us off, I've got, of course, Garrison with me.

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Speaker 1: Wokeme up at nine in the morning. How are you doing, Garrison,

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Speaker 1: ungodly early? Yeah, it's it's it's hideous, it's hideous. Um.

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Speaker 1: And then Margaret Killjoy, who's up at a much more

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Speaker 1: reasonable hour because time zones are a wild ass thing. Margaret,

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Speaker 1: how do you? How do we how do we introduce you?

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Speaker 1: You're an author? Uh, you're a writer of fiction. You

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Speaker 1: host a podcast called Live like the World is Dying, right,

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Speaker 1: and you've had me on and you talk about a

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Speaker 1: lot of the same things we talked about, and it

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Speaker 1: could happen here. We're actually shamelessly stealing your your your

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Speaker 1: podcast in order to make it corporate and sold out.

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Speaker 1: How are you doing, Margaret, I'm excited to be part

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Speaker 1: of the corporate sold out its podcast, um, and and

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Speaker 1: actually very glad that you all do a wider audience thing.

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Speaker 1: But um, I think that is a decent way to

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Speaker 1: introduce me. I do a lot of different things, and

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Speaker 1: I've been doing also, like organizing and trying to seek

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Speaker 1: radical political change for about twenty years, to degrees of success.

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Speaker 1: Actually mostly not to any success, because we actually still

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Speaker 1: live in maybe a worse society than we were in

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Speaker 1: two years ago. I tell people that I dropped out

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Speaker 1: of college to ride freight trains and overthrow the government,

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Speaker 1: and I wasn't good at either of those things. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you have all your limbs, that's true. I do have

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Speaker 1: all of my limbs. Yeah. And you're not in prison, um,

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Speaker 1: which is really all anyone can ask of the universe. UM.

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Speaker 1: So you have started a number of organizations in your

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Speaker 1: career as an activist in kind of that hat and

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Speaker 1: I guess let's start with like, yes, somebody who lives

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Speaker 1: in a place, there's no kind of really really organized left.

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Speaker 1: There's probably not in a lot of these places much

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Speaker 1: of even like a Democratic party. There's certainly not mutual

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Speaker 1: aid efforts UM. And I do think that there's a well, well,

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Speaker 1: mutual aid is a concept is is pretty firmly rooted

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Speaker 1: an anarchism. There's mutual aid kind of organizations that are

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Speaker 1: are not particularly leftist, or at least people doing stuff

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Speaker 1: like that. Like I think a good recent example will

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Speaker 1: be the Occasion Navy, who did a lot of rescues

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Speaker 1: after the most recent set of hurricanes, where certainly not

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Speaker 1: a left or an anarchist organization, but a lot of

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Speaker 1: what they're doing is um is a community aiding itself. UM. So,

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Speaker 1: I don't know where where do we Where? Where do

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Speaker 1: you want to start here? Well, I guess I mean

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Speaker 1: specifically in disaster times, you don't necessarily work with the

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Speaker 1: people that you would assume that you're expecting to work with.

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Speaker 1: And you know, one of the one of the stories

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Speaker 1: that really sticks with me is like a friend of mine,

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Speaker 1: who is this you know, UM train riding anarchistic governed

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Speaker 1: in tattoos and and all of that. And during flood

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Speaker 1: relief in eastern North Carolina was like flying into storms

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Speaker 1: and small planes with libertarians because the people who are

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Speaker 1: willing to fly small planes into storms and own planes

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Speaker 1: tend to be the more libertarian side of things. And

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Speaker 1: so here's anarchists and libertarians working together to get people

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Speaker 1: what they need. And one of the things that I try,

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Speaker 1: because this is one of the biggest questions I think

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Speaker 1: that the left faces, and you know, people trying to

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Speaker 1: make the world better faces, is how do we get

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Speaker 1: people involved? And also how do people get involved if

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Speaker 1: no one's helping them get involved? And um, I don't

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Speaker 1: have all the answers about it, but it's something that

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Speaker 1: I I think about obsessively some a lot. And one

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Speaker 1: of the things that I really try and focus on

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Speaker 1: with people as people say, well, I want to be prepared,

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Speaker 1: and you talk about community being a very important part

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Speaker 1: of apparedness, but I don't feel like I have a

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Speaker 1: community because we live in a very isolated society. And

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Speaker 1: one of the main things I try and remind people though,

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Speaker 1: is that in the same way that property relations break down,

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Speaker 1: like someone's like, oh, I don't have any stuff and

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Speaker 1: if the apocalypse comes, what will I do? And like, well,

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Speaker 1: the kind of the answer is that like whence property

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Speaker 1: relations break down, there's a lot of stuff, and it's

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Speaker 1: very there will be much stuff around, like wherehouses exist

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Speaker 1: all of stuff and yeah, Amazon warehouses are going to

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Speaker 1: become like fun boxes. Yeah, exactly, slash fortified outposts alleged. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And community is the same way, not that you would

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Speaker 1: go raid community but instead that um some people, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's true, And but you can you can create community

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Speaker 1: in times of crisis in a way that's actually harder

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Speaker 1: to do when the existing social order exists. And and

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Speaker 1: the the thing I always say uses my my dumb

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Speaker 1: example of this about how people come together during times

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Speaker 1: of crisis is you know, when I'm waiting for the

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Speaker 1: bus and you know, some city or something, and no

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Speaker 1: one talks to each other if you don't know each

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Speaker 1: other until the bus is like five minutes late, and

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Speaker 1: then everyone is comparing notes about where they think they

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Speaker 1: saw the bus last, and everyone's friends and sharing snacks

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Speaker 1: and things. You know. So in some ways I'm like,

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Speaker 1: be optimistic if you don't already no community, Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: I think there's also things you can do that don't

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Speaker 1: necessarily cost a lot of money to both kind of

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Speaker 1: build resiliency and kind of community connections. Now, one of

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Speaker 1: those things I've had a lot of friends in different

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Speaker 1: cities work for. There. There will be different farming co ops, right,

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Speaker 1: and generally the arrangement is you volunteer some sort of

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Speaker 1: time helping them with you know, there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: ship work on farms, and in return you generally get

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Speaker 1: some amount of produce or whatever. But really what you're

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Speaker 1: getting is practical experience growing food, and you're meeting the

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Speaker 1: kind of people who are interested in growing their own food,

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Speaker 1: and you know, those kind of connections can be really

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Speaker 1: helpful when things get worse. And so I think it

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Speaker 1: doesn't necessarily it doesn't have to cost much to to

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Speaker 1: try building community now, or to at least try putting

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Speaker 1: yourself in some of the spaces where the kind of

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Speaker 1: people you might want to be in, the kind of

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Speaker 1: people you you might want to know when things get

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Speaker 1: worse might be. Yeah, and there's a lot of um,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of like opportunities the world kind of

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Speaker 1: wants you to volunteer. You there's there's all of these

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Speaker 1: things that if you reach out to people and you're like, hey,

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Speaker 1: I don't have any connections, but I'm interested in volunteering.

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Speaker 1: There are types of organizations that do interesting things that

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Speaker 1: are open to that. You know, I kind of maybe

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Speaker 1: it's terrible, but whenever my friends, especially my friends were

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Speaker 1: in their twenties or something who who don't really feel

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Speaker 1: kind of lost and without direction for a while, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: go sit in a tree, like, go join direct action

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Speaker 1: environmentalist groups that are desperate for people to come live

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Speaker 1: their lives in this like self sustaining community. That is

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Speaker 1: incredibly traumatic and hard to do. And I don't necessarily

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Speaker 1: recommend this to everybody, but you know, it's a thing

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Speaker 1: that you can do, is that you can go participate

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Speaker 1: in in different movements, some of which do want strangers,

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Speaker 1: you know, some of which don't. Write. Um, you can't

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Speaker 1: show up to everything and be like why aren't you

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Speaker 1: including me? You're a bunch of assholes? Yeah, and um,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. So when when it comes to actually

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Speaker 1: like trying to start something, um like like like going

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Speaker 1: out and accepting, okay, there's not maybe I can't. I

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Speaker 1: can't leave my family behind and go do a tree set,

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Speaker 1: but I would like to, you know, start a community

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Speaker 1: engaging in something direct Maybe that's not illegal direct action,

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Speaker 1: maybe it is. It's none of my business. Um, how

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Speaker 1: do you recommend people just kind of start organizations? Find

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Speaker 1: people avoid pitfalls? Like, you know, if you've got to

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Speaker 1: make your own mutual aid group because there's not one

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Speaker 1: in your town and you you wanna. I mean, people

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Speaker 1: have expressed a desire to understand how to do that.

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Speaker 1: So I'm you know, I've never I'm not an organizer.

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Speaker 1: I'm barely a journalist. I am curious for your thoughts

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Speaker 1: on that. Well, okay, so as my own caveat is,

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Speaker 1: I'm no longer an organizer. I spent much of my

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Speaker 1: twenties being part of organizations and then I finally, um

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Speaker 1: realize that I can just kind of do whatever I

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Speaker 1: want and then figure out how to plug that into

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Speaker 1: other people's things. But I will say the the main

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Speaker 1: way of heard this express and I believe in, is

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Speaker 1: that we should do if you want to start getting involved,

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Speaker 1: is you think about what you're good at, and where

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Speaker 1: you think about what you want to be good at,

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Speaker 1: and then you think about the problems that you're facing,

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Speaker 1: and then you think about how to apply what you're

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Speaker 1: good at to the problems that you're facing. So if

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Speaker 1: you're sitting there and you're like, well, i'm a I'm

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Speaker 1: a really good illustrator, right, I'm not. I'm a terrible illustrator.

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Speaker 1: But let's say you're a good illustrator, and then you

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Speaker 1: you could basically reach out to organizations that maybe you

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Speaker 1: aren't even close and be like, hey, I'm an illustrator.

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Speaker 1: Is there anything I can do for you? All? Um?

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Speaker 1: But if what you want to do is start an

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Speaker 1: organization locally, it's okay to start small and build up.

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Speaker 1: It's okay to you know, it's kind of a if

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Speaker 1: you build it, they will come kind of thing in general,

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Speaker 1: like if you start, if you figure out what you

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Speaker 1: need to do, you know, we want to distribute supplies, right,

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Speaker 1: then you just do it like you just. Um, even

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Speaker 1: if you start by yourself or ideally you kind of

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Speaker 1: start with yourself and a couple of friends that you

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Speaker 1: drag into it, and then you see what gets inertia

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Speaker 1: like rather than like forcing, rather than starting off, don't

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Speaker 1: start off by writing your by laws. Um, you know,

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Speaker 1: maybe start with an idea of like if you have

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Speaker 1: a cool name that you want to use, like sometimes

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Speaker 1: that's great to start with, like a hook, and like

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Speaker 1: starting a band or something, you know you'd start with

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Speaker 1: like the thing that brings everyone together, which is sometimes

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Speaker 1: a clever name, but but mostly you just start by

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Speaker 1: doing it. And um, you know, one of the one

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Speaker 1: of the ways that's longest standing that people can get

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Speaker 1: involved with locally or start locally, and there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of resources about how to do it is is Food

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Speaker 1: not Bombs. Food Not Bombs is a a mutual aid

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Speaker 1: project that's existed and I wish I knew off the

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Speaker 1: top of my head since when I want to say,

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Speaker 1: the late seventies, but I really couldn't tell you. And

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Speaker 1: it's just food. It's just organizing food to give to

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Speaker 1: people in public. And it's actually wild how illegal it

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Speaker 1: is in some places, Like people get arrested for food

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Speaker 1: not Bombs all the time in Florida, in a couple

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Speaker 1: of other places. But yeah, we talked about them in

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Speaker 1: the first part of the season because there have been

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Speaker 1: a couple of point. I don't think nationally the FBI

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Speaker 1: is talked about them as a terror threat, but like

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Speaker 1: in the Austin Field, US, and I think one or

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Speaker 1: two other places, they've been like discussed as a terrorist

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Speaker 1: threat for handing out food. I've had like helicopters flying

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Speaker 1: overhead and like riots around the corner and stuffed for

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Speaker 1: for handing out food with food ut bombs. Yeah, it's ah,

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Speaker 1: they missed the second half of the name. I guess,

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know. I think maybe if

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Speaker 1: we were to create bombs, not food, we we might

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Speaker 1: not get as much police attention. But that's just a theory. Yeah. Well,

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Speaker 1: what everyone says is that we need food. And no

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Speaker 1: one says this, no one would ever say this, no

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Speaker 1: one would ever believe this. But we need food and bombs,

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Speaker 1: you know, food hand bombs, yea, bombs for some food

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Speaker 1: for others. We don't judge. We provide explosives and we

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Speaker 1: provide food. Yeah, okay, So if you can, I think

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Speaker 1: if you can, you start by working. You figure out

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Speaker 1: what you're good at. You find a group of people

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Speaker 1: that are interested in accomplishing the same thing, who maybe

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Speaker 1: have similar skill sets or different skill sets, and you

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Speaker 1: figure out what you can do, and you start doing it,

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Speaker 1: and you organize calling people and being like hey, well

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Speaker 1: you donate to us, or getting all your friends together

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Speaker 1: to give you stuff to to redistribute or whatever, right

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Speaker 1: putting out calls on social media for things to redistribute.

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Speaker 1: You know, most structures start grassroots, and most of the

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Speaker 1: time they kind of tend to do best when they're

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Speaker 1: grassroots instead of becoming a little more codified. So if possible,

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Speaker 1: do that. But if you're just you, um, sometimes tying

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Speaker 1: into existing organizations is a thing worth doing. And if

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Speaker 1: there's nothing locally, you can look at things a little

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Speaker 1: further away, or you can look at things that are

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Speaker 1: on maybe on a national level. But there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of dangers in joining existing organizations and structures, and I guess,

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Speaker 1: I guess I would say there's like three types of danger,

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Speaker 1: and one is that you talked about all the time.

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Speaker 1: And thanks for bringing into the leftist vocabulary the word grifter.

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Speaker 1: I never heard anyone use the word grifter until your podcasts.

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Speaker 1: It's the most important word in the American English for sure.

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Speaker 1: We live in a fucking grifter republic. It's incredible and

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Speaker 1: we always have this isn't new, Yeah, but we need

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Speaker 1: more words because we also need the word for people

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Speaker 1: who are looking for useful idiots. And there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of social movements and not to be like I I

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Speaker 1: support the Left. I think that what we're attempting to

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Speaker 1: do is very worthwhile, and I like us more than

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Speaker 1: the other side by a fair amount. But there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of things that there's a lot of problems with

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Speaker 1: the left, and one of them is that people are

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Speaker 1: looking either to just have you as a body with

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Speaker 1: no decision making power and no autonomy, which doesn't actually

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Speaker 1: build a better world because you're just stop being a

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Speaker 1: cog in their machine and become a cog in our machine. Right.

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Speaker 1: And then there's also people who are kind of um

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Speaker 1: looking for useful idiots can and fodder, like people to

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Speaker 1: hang around while they while they do stuff or you know,

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Speaker 1: and I don't want to go to hard bodies to

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Speaker 1: stand out in front of cop shops. Sometimes yeah, and

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Speaker 1: even like you know, even like movements that I really

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Speaker 1: care about that might do a lot of like non

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Speaker 1: violence of this obedience, although I don't I'm not particularly

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Speaker 1: I'm not passed us personally, but you know, it's a

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Speaker 1: very useful strategy and non violence of those obedience. But

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Speaker 1: sometimes they're like, oh, you're young and new, lock yourself

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Speaker 1: to this thing. Get arrested, And I would definitely say

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Speaker 1: to people, don't get arrested on purpose at your first actions,

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Speaker 1: like don't be anyone else's cannon fodder, and so you

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Speaker 1: feel like you are part of the decision making and

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Speaker 1: part of like like you really matter, and like then

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Speaker 1: then don't um do dangerous things for other people's projects

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Speaker 1: like the ship that states do. That's so messed up

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Speaker 1: is is turn human bodies into resources that then get

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Speaker 1: sacrificed for unclear ends. Um, And unless you feel like

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Speaker 1: you have some sort of like there are times we're

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Speaker 1: being arrested is necessary and helpful, but unless unless you

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Speaker 1: feel you fully understand not just why you're doing it,

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Speaker 1: but also that like you you you're not being told

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Speaker 1: to do it, you have autonomy and like, I'm going

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Speaker 1: to do this thing that I know will end in

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Speaker 1: my arrest because I like, I don't know. That's probably

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Speaker 1: like I think most people in that position know this.

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Speaker 1: But I definitely have encountered some uncomfortable situations in the past,

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Speaker 1: I'm sure similar to once you have, where it did

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Speaker 1: seem like people were kind of being pushed to take

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Speaker 1: that risk for reasons they didn't fully understand or in

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Speaker 1: a situation they didn't fully rock you know, yeah, which

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Speaker 1: which gets at one of the things that when I

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Speaker 1: talk about how I think this is the biggest problem

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Speaker 1: with not not the cannon fodder issue, but the getting

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Speaker 1: people involved is the biggest issue I think we currently

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Speaker 1: face because there's so many people who want to be

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Speaker 1: involved right now because the world is even worse than

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Speaker 1: usual and um, and it's hitting groups of people who

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Speaker 1: haven't been hit by before, and people are often also

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Speaker 1: looking for a sense of community. And there's a thing

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Speaker 1: that people we don't talk about enough when people are

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Speaker 1: getting involved. There's two different reasons people get involve aolved,

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Speaker 1: and both are entirely valid, and one is to fix

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Speaker 1: things and another is to find to break out of

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Speaker 1: the isolation that they live in in their daily lives. Um.

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Speaker 1: And we need to be aware of that when we

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Speaker 1: talk about how to onboard people, and we need to

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Speaker 1: be aware about that. If you are getting involved, you

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Speaker 1: should think about your own desires. Are you looking for

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Speaker 1: community and if so, you can find it within radical

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Speaker 1: action right um. But if you are doing that, then

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Speaker 1: you especially need to be on guard against peer pressure

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Speaker 1: because it's a really easy way to feel like you're

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Speaker 1: involved with things is to go hang out with people

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Speaker 1: who are all doing a release scary thing and and

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Speaker 1: that's beautiful. And I absolutely did that when I when

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Speaker 1: I first got involved in anarchism, I I and politics

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Speaker 1: in general. I I joined in head first, and you know,

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Speaker 1: spend a night in jail within the first couple of months.

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Speaker 1: And I don't have any particularly regrets about that. And

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Speaker 1: I found community in a way that I had never

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Speaker 1: had in my life because of how isolated our society is.

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Speaker 1: But that's not the only reason to go do these

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Speaker 1: and that is I mean, I think a lot of

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Speaker 1: people experienced that last year during the George Floyd protests.

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Speaker 1: Is the kind of I mean, it's the thing we've

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Speaker 1: talked about on in the first season. If it could

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Speaker 1: happen here, that times like that, this war does this too,

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Speaker 1: can actually provide meaning that that people have lacked. And

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Speaker 1: a lot of it is that community that like community

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Speaker 1: of sufferers, the trauma bonding UM that feels like the

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Speaker 1: most important thing, even because maybe it is the most

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Speaker 1: important thing you've ever done. I think in a lot

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Speaker 1: of cases it is UM. But that's also mind altering,

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Speaker 1: and it um it can lead to situations that are

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Speaker 1: not entirely dissimilar to cults. Um. I'm not saying that

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Speaker 1: they are cults, because cults are number one. With cult

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Speaker 1: there's generally going to be like a leader and a

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Speaker 1: in such but like, there are things that happened that

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Speaker 1: that draw people into cults that are just human things,

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Speaker 1: their aspects in some cases, as I've said before, of

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Speaker 1: like a good party. Um, but there are cult like

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Speaker 1: aspects to the kind of groups that form in these

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Speaker 1: traumatic situations that can lead people to start making really

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Speaker 1: poor decisions. Um. And and so you have to really

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Speaker 1: you always have to be kind of analyzing not just

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Speaker 1: what you're doing, but what's going on in your own head,

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Speaker 1: in the head of the heads of the people around you. UM.

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Speaker 1: That's that's just always important. But I think particularly when

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Speaker 1: you're when you're trying to do something new and different

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Speaker 1: in a lot of ways, bigger than anything you've done before.

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Speaker 1: Do you have any specific advice for like kind of

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Speaker 1: avoiding the cults of personality that sometimes form in new organizations. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so you have both informal and formal structures can both

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Speaker 1: cause problems with cult of personality. There are these brilliant

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Speaker 1: essays that I haven't read like twenty years that come

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Speaker 1: from the feminist movement, and one of them is called

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Speaker 1: the Tyranny of structurelessness. And as best as I remember,

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Speaker 1: these are very short essays. As best I remember, at

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Speaker 1: the tyranny of actuallessness is, if you don't have a

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Speaker 1: formal structure in your organization, you're going to have this

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Speaker 1: informal leader who basically tells everyone wants to do. And

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Speaker 1: that's a problem and and it's a very important piece,

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Speaker 1: and I believe it comes from a Marxist feminist perspective,

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Speaker 1: but I'm not certain. And then there was an anarchist

429
00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:20,560
Speaker 1: feminist response around the same time, maybe I'm not sure,

430
00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:24,040
Speaker 1: called the tyranny of tyranny that was like, yes, that's true.

431
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 1: And also when you have a formal structure and put

432
00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:29,160
Speaker 1: someone in charge there in charge, and that has other

433
00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:31,560
Speaker 1: problems too, And I think that it's just we we

434
00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:34,920
Speaker 1: have to be aware of both of these things. That, UM,

435
00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:39,080
Speaker 1: you know, the fact that most movements are very decentralized

436
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,200
Speaker 1: in grassroots as as huge advantages, right, but it does

437
00:22:42,280 --> 00:22:48,280
Speaker 1: have problems of causing informal cults of personality. UM. Podcasting

438
00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:51,040
Speaker 1: is a big part of this problem. Um And actually,

439
00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:54,280
Speaker 1: I really appreciate that you're not an organizer, like frankly,

440
00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:56,840
Speaker 1: and it's part of why I'm not an organizer on

441
00:22:56,920 --> 00:23:01,159
Speaker 1: some level is because when people read the books that

442
00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:04,040
Speaker 1: someone writes or listen to someone's voice all the time,

443
00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:08,720
Speaker 1: it is very influential, right, and being aware of that

444
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:14,480
Speaker 1: and therefore not exerting that power is a very good thing. Um.

445
00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:18,040
Speaker 1: And but there's okay, So the other thing, like when

446
00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:20,080
Speaker 1: I worry about like people getting involved with like don't

447
00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:22,520
Speaker 1: get peer pressured into stuff when you first join. There's

448
00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:25,160
Speaker 1: also this thing that is needs to be talked about.

449
00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:29,400
Speaker 1: And maybe I'll have talked about this some previously, but entrapment.

450
00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:35,000
Speaker 1: Entrapment is a huge problem, and specifically, the FEDS tend

451
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:40,040
Speaker 1: to look for young idealist activists who can be peer

452
00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:43,520
Speaker 1: pressured into actions that they may or may not have

453
00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:46,639
Speaker 1: otherwise ideologically agreed with, like hey, let's go blow up

454
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:50,640
Speaker 1: a bridge or let's go blow up a damn And

455
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,680
Speaker 1: and this doesn't just happen to the left. It happens um.

456
00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:58,280
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's all around. Yeah for sure, Like there's

457
00:23:58,320 --> 00:23:59,960
Speaker 1: that case of the guys who are trying to kid

458
00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:03,639
Speaker 1: nap the governor of was it Michigan. A lot of

459
00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:06,880
Speaker 1: that was informants who were there's a lot of there's

460
00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:11,240
Speaker 1: You can debate heavily whether or not it was entrapment. Obviously,

461
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:16,080
Speaker 1: what we we might consider entrapment morally often isn't entrapment

462
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:19,920
Speaker 1: legally because the FBI does know where the lines are legally,

463
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:24,119
Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean it isn't morally entrapment, right, And

464
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:27,560
Speaker 1: they do that a lot, and they usually succeed um, well,

465
00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:30,520
Speaker 1: they may not usually succeeded, though they usually succeeded the case,

466
00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 1: and entrapment defenses are hard to succeed with. And so

467
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:42,040
Speaker 1: really just like and thinking about I think developing your

468
00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:44,200
Speaker 1: own moral compass and sticking to it is one of

469
00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:47,040
Speaker 1: the single most important things that a new activist can

470
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 1: can do. And not to be afraid of radical action

471
00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:56,960
Speaker 1: necessarily like militant action, but but be wary of it. Um.

472
00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,680
Speaker 1: But then again I mean in terms of like being

473
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:03,960
Speaker 1: where are of what the other thing to avoid doing

474
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,640
Speaker 1: is like accusing each other, like fed jacketing, like being like, oh,

475
00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:08,240
Speaker 1: well that person is doing the same thing a FED

476
00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:12,040
Speaker 1: might do, like wink wink, you know, Um, it's a

477
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:14,600
Speaker 1: really complicated an annoying game to play, and if you're

478
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:16,240
Speaker 1: just getting involved, you're gonna have to learn how to

479
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:20,160
Speaker 1: get it play this game of not fed jacketing and

480
00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:24,880
Speaker 1: also not um falling into stuff. And it's annoying because

481
00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:26,919
Speaker 1: you probably have to kind of learn some of the stuff,

482
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 1: even if all you want to do is give away blankets.

483
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:32,920
Speaker 1: You know, if you want to tie what you're doing

484
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:37,240
Speaker 1: to a larger ideological structure, then it's going to come

485
00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:41,320
Speaker 1: up that you need to be aware of how repression

486
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:45,160
Speaker 1: applies to that larger ideological structure. Yeah, like all this

487
00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 1: is very useful specifically if you're trying to find something

488
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:55,520
Speaker 1: kind of pre existing um or you know, looking you know,

489
00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 1: or you know, starting something in the bigger city where

490
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:00,920
Speaker 1: you have like connect This can be made to other

491
00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:04,160
Speaker 1: existing organizations. And I'm trying to think, you know, there's

492
00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:06,880
Speaker 1: a lot of people who live in more like rural areas.

493
00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:09,320
Speaker 1: It's not much like a liberal or like you know,

494
00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:13,200
Speaker 1: especially left is kind of subculture. How would how would

495
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:15,399
Speaker 1: you recommend people who live in those kind of scenarios

496
00:26:15,480 --> 00:26:18,479
Speaker 1: try to start building this community? Wouldn't say like they

497
00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:21,919
Speaker 1: only have like a few friends, Um, what what steps

498
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,520
Speaker 1: do you think people can take if they have more,

499
00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:30,480
Speaker 1: you know, a secluded set up, So it is harder.

500
00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:33,800
Speaker 1: And I live in a red area close to a

501
00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:36,480
Speaker 1: blue area, right And I do most of my organizing

502
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:38,840
Speaker 1: and as much as I do organizing within the the

503
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:44,920
Speaker 1: nearby small hippie city, even though theoretically the thing that

504
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,680
Speaker 1: I care the most about is connections to my immediate neighbors. Right. Um,

505
00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:50,919
Speaker 1: that is harder, And it is harder for a lot

506
00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:55,639
Speaker 1: of different reasons, especially if you have cultural differences between

507
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,120
Speaker 1: you and the people that you're around. Right, Like I'm

508
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:00,639
Speaker 1: a trans woman and live around a lot of like

509
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:04,159
Speaker 1: farms and stuff, right And and previously this wasn't a

510
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:06,159
Speaker 1: problem before Trump. This what kind of just wasn't a

511
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:08,320
Speaker 1: problem after Trump. Now all of a sudden, the fact

512
00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:10,480
Speaker 1: that I'm trans as like an attack against people in

513
00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:13,359
Speaker 1: a way that it never used to be. And and

514
00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:15,320
Speaker 1: so now they all have an opinion about the fact

515
00:27:15,320 --> 00:27:19,159
Speaker 1: that we're an address. But still, at the end of

516
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:21,960
Speaker 1: the day, I would say that most of the people

517
00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:25,399
Speaker 1: that I'm around are actually totally chill. Like there's a

518
00:27:25,600 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 1: vocal minority of really horrid people, right, Um, But even

519
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:33,280
Speaker 1: the people who might be and might have even voted

520
00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:37,040
Speaker 1: for Trump or whatever. Um are not necessarily, at least

521
00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:40,240
Speaker 1: along my own identity lines, amoso white, are not necessarily

522
00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:42,399
Speaker 1: going to give me ship. And you know, I can

523
00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:44,360
Speaker 1: go talk to them and address and they might be

524
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:47,239
Speaker 1: sort of confused, and they might not be. But if

525
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:50,199
Speaker 1: you have more culturally in common with the people around you,

526
00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:51,639
Speaker 1: then there is a lot of room that you can

527
00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:53,280
Speaker 1: start working on from there. And this actually ties into

528
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:55,200
Speaker 1: something that I think applies to people across the board,

529
00:27:55,480 --> 00:27:58,280
Speaker 1: which is we have this especially new activists, but also

530
00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:00,200
Speaker 1: including people who've been in it for a long time,

531
00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:02,720
Speaker 1: and there's like real arrogance about the fact that we're

532
00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,080
Speaker 1: like right, And when you want to change the world,

533
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:06,639
Speaker 1: you need a certain amount of arrogance, you need a

534
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:08,960
Speaker 1: certain amount of like I mean, I literally believe we

535
00:28:09,760 --> 00:28:11,800
Speaker 1: need to not have a government or capitalism, and these

536
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 1: are very major changes to our existing structure. Just a

537
00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:17,439
Speaker 1: huge amount of arrogance to that. Although not having a

538
00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:20,080
Speaker 1: government is slightly less of a major change now that

539
00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 1: it was a couple of years ago, it's true. And

540
00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:26,720
Speaker 1: also like something like sometimes actually it's funny, I used

541
00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:28,399
Speaker 1: that it more in common with these neighbors. But then

542
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:32,760
Speaker 1: all the libertarians went goddamn authoritarian. That bummed the funk

543
00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:36,560
Speaker 1: out of me. Yeah, there's there's some good ones. Still,

544
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:39,360
Speaker 1: there's like again, there's the there's the there's the taking

545
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 1: your private plane and do a disaster area libertarians, and

546
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:46,320
Speaker 1: God bless them totally, and you know, they're like they

547
00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:48,800
Speaker 1: just don't want them. You know. It's like my dad

548
00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:50,720
Speaker 1: is sort of on the libertarian side of things and

549
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:52,960
Speaker 1: keeps twenty dollar bills in the visor of his truck

550
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:54,840
Speaker 1: to give to people flying signs, and he just doesn't

551
00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 1: want the government redistributing his money. He doesn't mind redistributing

552
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 1: his money. Yeah, And I'm like, all right, I don't

553
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:05,880
Speaker 1: have any real objection to that. He's also no longer anyway.

554
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 1: If you come at people with this attitude of like

555
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 1: I'm right and you're wrong, the kind of people that

556
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:13,840
Speaker 1: you can get to join your side by saying I'm

557
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:15,680
Speaker 1: right and you're wrong are not the people you want.

558
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:20,800
Speaker 1: You want people who challenge authority, including the authority of

559
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:24,920
Speaker 1: people who claim there should be authority, and and so

560
00:29:25,040 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: just actually listening to people and like hearing people out

561
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:32,480
Speaker 1: and um when possible, avoiding Drawing lines between people is

562
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:34,680
Speaker 1: one of the main ways to connect with people across

563
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:38,920
Speaker 1: either cultural divides or especially political divides. And this this

564
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 1: can't always happen, right, Like I walk down the street

565
00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:44,400
Speaker 1: and address and someone like calls me a bad word,

566
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,480
Speaker 1: like I'm not going to be like. I understand why

567
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 1: you think to call me that, And I understand how

568
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:53,800
Speaker 1: like me dressed this way kind of challenges your sense

569
00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:56,120
Speaker 1: of masculinity that you've been brought up into. Is the

570
00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 1: only way that you can hold yourself strong in a

571
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:01,800
Speaker 1: very hard world. No, I don't do that. I um scream,

572
00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,960
Speaker 1: funk you and chase them. Um, I would ever chase

573
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:07,600
Speaker 1: anyone with a knife. I think that's not legal, So

574
00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 1: I wouldn't do that, but um, you know that might work.

575
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 1: And you know, like, funk those people. I don't care

576
00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:19,240
Speaker 1: what they have to say. No, of course not. And

577
00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:23,800
Speaker 1: it when I think one of the things that I

578
00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:26,360
Speaker 1: don't know Twitter brain has done is that like when

579
00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:28,800
Speaker 1: you when you talk about reaching out and talking to

580
00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:31,480
Speaker 1: people who you know don't agree with you, aren't aren't

581
00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:35,680
Speaker 1: on your side ideologically, there's folks who will kind of assume, like, oh,

582
00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:37,680
Speaker 1: so you're saying I should like try to be friendly

583
00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:39,240
Speaker 1: with people who would have murder me. Like, no, I'm

584
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:40,840
Speaker 1: not saying that. I'm not saying that like, as a

585
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:42,800
Speaker 1: trans person or black person, you should go talk to

586
00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:48,440
Speaker 1: um a militant anti LGBT activist or a fucking klansman

587
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:51,360
Speaker 1: or something. I'm saying that, like, that's not within the

588
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:53,840
Speaker 1: broad I'm saying what you need to recognize. But what

589
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:57,160
Speaker 1: I think is important to recognize, especially if you're when

590
00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 1: we talk about like post you know, collapse or whatever,

591
00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:03,760
Speaker 1: is that within broad political tendency. So I'm not talking

592
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 1: about like fascist or whatever, but I'm talking about like liberal, conservative, progressive,

593
00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:12,600
Speaker 1: very broad political tendencies. You have roughly the same percentage

594
00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:15,440
Speaker 1: of people who are ship. So in an anarchist group,

595
00:31:16,120 --> 00:31:17,760
Speaker 1: the amount of people who are shitty is going to

596
00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 1: be similar to the amount of the general population that

597
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 1: are shitty. It's the same with every political tendency. But

598
00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:25,880
Speaker 1: the corollary to that is, again, within broad tendencies, you'll

599
00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 1: find roughly the same amount of people who are basically

600
00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:32,040
Speaker 1: rad and maybe yeah there's some they have their brain

601
00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:34,240
Speaker 1: got poisoned with dis info and they believe some stupid

602
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:37,320
Speaker 1: shit and they vote like an asshole. But you know,

603
00:31:37,760 --> 00:31:40,320
Speaker 1: they'll stop their car if they see someone in an accident,

604
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:42,200
Speaker 1: and they keep a fucking medical kit in their bag,

605
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 1: and you know there that it's the it's the it's

606
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:46,440
Speaker 1: the ship that you know. I talk a lot about this,

607
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 1: the stabbing on the Portland Max train. Well, the two

608
00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:55,480
Speaker 1: people who who died confronting that asshole um where a

609
00:31:55,800 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 1: Republican retired veteran and a far left social justice activists,

610
00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,080
Speaker 1: and they both you know, put their bodies on the lines.

611
00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:05,920
Speaker 1: I think that like when we talk about like being

612
00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:10,320
Speaker 1: willing to kind of talk with people who are who

613
00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:14,080
Speaker 1: are not on the same ideological boat as you, that's

614
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 1: that's what I mean, Not you should make nice with

615
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 1: the people who want to exterminate you, Like fuck those people. Yeah,

616
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:23,040
Speaker 1: because the thing you're looking for, the thing I'm looking

617
00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:26,360
Speaker 1: for is the Republican who's going to, hopefully, instead of

618
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:30,479
Speaker 1: dying to saw alongside me, successfully defeat the you know,

619
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:34,239
Speaker 1: actual far right person. But yeah, yeah, totally, And and

620
00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:36,960
Speaker 1: I think that that actually is part of the It's

621
00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:39,680
Speaker 1: not always the answer for every person who's isolated, right,

622
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:42,440
Speaker 1: everyone who's socially isolated, but it is part of it.

623
00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:44,600
Speaker 1: If you're trying to organize with people where you say

624
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 1: you're the only leftist or the only anarchist in your area,

625
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:51,200
Speaker 1: then maybe you don't start. And this is actually funny.

626
00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,520
Speaker 1: I'm very into being very public about my political ideology

627
00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:56,560
Speaker 1: so that people know what bias is UM coming into

628
00:32:56,560 --> 00:32:59,400
Speaker 1: things with. But but maybe you don't start your rural

629
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:02,160
Speaker 1: mutuoid project calling it the rural mutu Aid project, or

630
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:05,240
Speaker 1: maybe you do, and maybe you you just start doing

631
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:07,040
Speaker 1: it and you find people who are willing to have

632
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:11,239
Speaker 1: the same goals and means as you, and and I

633
00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:13,720
Speaker 1: think you can do alongside of that, you can also

634
00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 1: just be really public about what you believe. I mean,

635
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:17,920
Speaker 1: you know, UM Again, as an anarchist, I end up

636
00:33:17,960 --> 00:33:21,200
Speaker 1: working with like church groups and things that I don't

637
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 1: necessarily agree with on a lot of a lot of things.

638
00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:27,240
Speaker 1: But they're not mad when I'm like, oh I'm an anarchist.

639
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 1: They're just like, huh, okay, I'm a church person or

640
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:35,640
Speaker 1: what you know, and like, okay, I'm not. I don't

641
00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:38,120
Speaker 1: expect different of them, and they don't expect different of me.

642
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:40,160
Speaker 1: And we we know what we have in common and

643
00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:41,920
Speaker 1: what we don't to a certain degree, and then we

644
00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:44,240
Speaker 1: work on what we have in common and so airing

645
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:46,479
Speaker 1: and so this is both true if you're within the

646
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 1: movement and you're hoping to try and solve this problem

647
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: for other people. But I also think it's going to

648
00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:53,640
Speaker 1: be true for people who are trying to build things

649
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:55,520
Speaker 1: in areas where they don't have, where they don't feel

650
00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 1: like the part of something larger is airing on the

651
00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:00,400
Speaker 1: side of inclusion versus exclusion and not And like you're

652
00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 1: talking about, it's about airing on the side of not

653
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:05,560
Speaker 1: always include everyone, not always committing to a hard and

654
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:09,880
Speaker 1: fast rule. Yeah, yeah, totally. Yeah, be be open to

655
00:34:09,920 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 1: the fact that people can surprise you in ways that

656
00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 1: aren't terrifying. Yeah. Also, because you get terrified enough by

657
00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:19,399
Speaker 1: enough like people who you think are on your side

658
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,799
Speaker 1: that you're like, oh, yeah, I'm sad you all don't

659
00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:25,799
Speaker 1: do the ad pivots in this show, because you can

660
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 1: do it. We can do it, we can we can

661
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:32,040
Speaker 1: cut it in during one of the long awkward pauses.

662
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:35,160
Speaker 1: Go for it, and we'll keep all this up to

663
00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:38,520
Speaker 1: it in, but we'll actually cut the actual so you'll

664
00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:40,880
Speaker 1: hear it. It's like Finnigan's Wake. You're going to hear

665
00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:44,200
Speaker 1: it out of order, okay, and I hopefully you all

666
00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:45,640
Speaker 1: be able to figure out the second half of it,

667
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:47,479
Speaker 1: but the first the first half is anyone who claims

668
00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:51,480
Speaker 1: to have all the answers is selling you something? Oh

669
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:54,120
Speaker 1: uh huh yeah, oh oh you know who else is

670
00:34:54,160 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 1: selling you something? Is it the ADSs go listen to

671
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:02,640
Speaker 1: the guy Geico or or Jesus. We've had some bad

672
00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:06,600
Speaker 1: ones lately. Um, there's that s os Cuba show that

673
00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 1: sounds we're rough. Uh. There was that one that was

674
00:35:11,640 --> 00:35:13,880
Speaker 1: just like God. It was just like, there's something the

675
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:18,640
Speaker 1: concept of gus we are sponsored by God. I think

676
00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:21,239
Speaker 1: I've gotten like Walmart and McDonald's on your show before.

677
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:27,879
Speaker 1: Remember that's the people's food. Oh yeah, organized actually try

678
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 1: to organize around the Walmart. That could be very so Anyway,

679
00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:36,879
Speaker 1: here's ads. If someone is trying to start something new

680
00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:40,120
Speaker 1: inside in one of these more secluded areas and like

681
00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:43,680
Speaker 1: they have decided like yeah, I'm willing to do something,

682
00:35:43,719 --> 00:35:46,440
Speaker 1: I'm willing to actually just like start it. How how

683
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:49,360
Speaker 1: would you recommend they try to figure out what some

684
00:35:49,440 --> 00:35:52,360
Speaker 1: of the like biggest needs of the community are that

685
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:55,000
Speaker 1: they can actually tackle. Like, how how does someone find

686
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:58,279
Speaker 1: out what to do with their mutual late because they

687
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:00,560
Speaker 1: can like commit like, yeah, I can do something around supplies,

688
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,319
Speaker 1: something around this, you know whatever. Really, how does one

689
00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 1: try to actually gauge what is important try to tackle?

690
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:09,759
Speaker 1: I guess it depends on whether you feel like you're

691
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:14,200
Speaker 1: totally Like if in my head, if I'm totally inside

692
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:18,319
Speaker 1: Annissie community but an area, right, I probably kind of

693
00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:21,520
Speaker 1: know because I'm also experiencing whatever the thing is. But

694
00:36:21,640 --> 00:36:24,360
Speaker 1: if I'm if I'm a little bit detached from it,

695
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:26,600
Speaker 1: then I do need to like do kind of you know.

696
00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:29,080
Speaker 1: The sort of traditional method is I think it's called

697
00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:31,880
Speaker 1: listening projects. I've never actually personally done a listening project.

698
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:34,520
Speaker 1: I've been around many people who do. Where you basically

699
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:37,879
Speaker 1: like sometimes you go door to door and you're like, hey,

700
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:39,799
Speaker 1: what's up, Like what do you need? Like what's going on?

701
00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:42,520
Speaker 1: You know? Um? But like say, for example, in the

702
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:45,360
Speaker 1: area that I live, there is a a rural organizing

703
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:47,840
Speaker 1: It's not the actual Rural Organizing project, which is a

704
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:51,440
Speaker 1: specific structure, but there is a rural mutual aid group

705
00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 1: in the largely red area that I live in that's

706
00:36:55,200 --> 00:37:00,640
Speaker 1: run by by leftists and they I think it largely

707
00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:03,360
Speaker 1: they did a lot of like firewood delivery, for example,

708
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:05,760
Speaker 1: because a lot of the areas around here are heated

709
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 1: by wood stoves, and you have a lot of poverty

710
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:10,680
Speaker 1: in rural areas. And of course poverty looks very different

711
00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:13,879
Speaker 1: in rural areas versus urban areas. And you know, one

712
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:17,640
Speaker 1: of the advantages of being rural poor. There's many disadvantages,

713
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:21,280
Speaker 1: like lack of access to certain types of services, right, um,

714
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:24,480
Speaker 1: But one of the sometimes advantages of rural poverty, as

715
00:37:24,560 --> 00:37:28,319
Speaker 1: I understand it, I'm not specifically an expert, um, is

716
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:31,560
Speaker 1: do you have space? Right, you just don't have stuff

717
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:34,240
Speaker 1: for money, and so you can have stuff if people

718
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:36,440
Speaker 1: give you stuff, so you can like story your firewood

719
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:39,920
Speaker 1: and so. And then also because it's this very specific

720
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:42,239
Speaker 1: tangible thing, people can get really excited about, like, oh,

721
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:45,560
Speaker 1: I can chop firewood, or maybe even I can't chop

722
00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 1: firewood because my legs busted because I work in the

723
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:50,080
Speaker 1: paper mill or whatever. But I can. But I got

724
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 1: a trailer on my truck, you know, um, and I

725
00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:54,959
Speaker 1: can haul that. And people get really excited when there's

726
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:58,239
Speaker 1: like things that they specifically are good at, especially things

727
00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:00,320
Speaker 1: that I kind of have alienated them from other people,

728
00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 1: but they're that they're good at that they can then

729
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:09,399
Speaker 1: participate in and so, which isn't totally answer your question,

730
00:38:09,440 --> 00:38:11,719
Speaker 1: but I would say, if anyone specifically is in a

731
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:13,879
Speaker 1: rural situation I was looking to start a mutual a group,

732
00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 1: look at the Rural Organizing Project. I don't believe that

733
00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:20,120
Speaker 1: they specifically do rural mutual aid organizing, but they talk

734
00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:23,000
Speaker 1: a lot about what it means to be an organizer

735
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,799
Speaker 1: within areas that are largely controlled by the far right,

736
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:28,759
Speaker 1: but are not. It's not like the people are all

737
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:31,759
Speaker 1: far right. They're just controlled by the far right, you know. Yeah,

738
00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:34,520
Speaker 1: the people actually there, once you talk to them, might

739
00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:38,920
Speaker 1: actually be a lot more reasonable than like the media

740
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:41,879
Speaker 1: influencers who are part of this you know, same thing. Yeah,

741
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:44,080
Speaker 1: and it is. It is one of those things. This

742
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 1: is a topic we're drifting too. But it's when we

743
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:49,279
Speaker 1: drift to regularly on this show, we're like, when I

744
00:38:49,320 --> 00:38:54,120
Speaker 1: talk with conservatives, it's it's not uncommon that I can

745
00:38:54,239 --> 00:38:58,160
Speaker 1: without especially if I don't start by mentioning anarchy, I

746
00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:00,799
Speaker 1: can get them to agree to a lot of the

747
00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:03,399
Speaker 1: things I believe, which is like, yeah, maybe people don't

748
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:06,040
Speaker 1: need to be governed. Maybe that doesn't work out good.

749
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:09,680
Speaker 1: Maybe politicians are corrupt and should have less power, and

750
00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:12,239
Speaker 1: like that doesn't mean that you're gonna you're gonna get

751
00:39:12,280 --> 00:39:15,759
Speaker 1: them on the barricades with you, um, because any productive

752
00:39:15,840 --> 00:39:18,960
Speaker 1: kind of relationship starts from like a base of shared

753
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:24,040
Speaker 1: interests and it's not a useless endeavor to engage in

754
00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:26,799
Speaker 1: kind of trying to subtly. You know, if you if

755
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:30,359
Speaker 1: you feel out people around you who are ideologically not

756
00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:35,520
Speaker 1: particularly similar to you, but also decent people, um, you

757
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:39,480
Speaker 1: can kind of try and work in some some something

758
00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:42,040
Speaker 1: you've not not just some common ground, but you can

759
00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:44,359
Speaker 1: try and get them to see that they agree with

760
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:46,440
Speaker 1: you one more than they think, um, and that that

761
00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,439
Speaker 1: has an effect of changing the way people think about

762
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:52,920
Speaker 1: the world. It really does. Yeah, and you but you

763
00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:56,160
Speaker 1: also have to go into it open to yes. Maybe

764
00:39:56,160 --> 00:39:57,800
Speaker 1: maybe it's not going to change your opinion about the

765
00:39:57,840 --> 00:40:00,759
Speaker 1: way the economy should be structured or the way that works, right,

766
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:03,680
Speaker 1: but you know, you definitely have to go into it

767
00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:08,279
Speaker 1: with a I can now understand why you drive a

768
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:10,719
Speaker 1: big pickup truck that burns a lot of gas or

769
00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:16,600
Speaker 1: whatever whatever thing. You might be coming into it thinking yeah,

770
00:40:16,760 --> 00:40:20,040
Speaker 1: or at least it might help you understand why they

771
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,839
Speaker 1: believe or do certain things outside of you know, Dave

772
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:27,239
Speaker 1: Reuben broke their brain because they got on YouTube at

773
00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:29,480
Speaker 1: the wrong time. I don't know, Margaret, did you have

774
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:32,480
Speaker 1: anything else you wanted to really get into. I guess to.

775
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:34,080
Speaker 1: One of the other questions that you all brought up

776
00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:36,440
Speaker 1: was about preparedness, like maybe kind of almost in the

777
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:39,759
Speaker 1: inverse situation where let's say that you live in a

778
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:43,640
Speaker 1: small apartment and you want to be prepared and in

779
00:40:43,640 --> 00:40:46,399
Speaker 1: which case maybe you have better access to community. Maybe

780
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:47,759
Speaker 1: you don't write a lot of people who live in

781
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:50,640
Speaker 1: the city are just as isolated socially as people elsewhere,

782
00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 1: But at least you kind of have like there's a

783
00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:57,479
Speaker 1: little bit more easy access to ways to break out

784
00:40:57,560 --> 00:40:59,800
Speaker 1: of certain types of isolation if you put work into it,

785
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:02,480
Speaker 1: because there's more likely to be groups around that are

786
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,880
Speaker 1: that are public that you can go interface with. UM.

787
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:08,040
Speaker 1: But in terms of like actual preparedness, you have the

788
00:41:08,040 --> 00:41:10,560
Speaker 1: inverse problem, right of if you live rural you might

789
00:41:10,600 --> 00:41:13,040
Speaker 1: have room to store beans and rice, and if you

790
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:16,880
Speaker 1: live in the city, you might not write UM. But

791
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:19,319
Speaker 1: I I will say it's the other thing that I

792
00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:21,960
Speaker 1: find people the two things that people talk to me

793
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:24,799
Speaker 1: about I think you all run into. Also is that

794
00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:27,799
Speaker 1: people are either I don't have any community or I

795
00:41:27,800 --> 00:41:31,200
Speaker 1: don't have any money in space. Yeah. And so if

796
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:33,719
Speaker 1: you don't have any money in space, I mean, I

797
00:41:33,719 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 1: mean in some ways, it's like, well, maybe your focus

798
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:39,160
Speaker 1: isn't like stockpiling stuff. Stockpiling and stuff is like the

799
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:43,600
Speaker 1: single most overrated part of individual or community preparedness. Um.

800
00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:46,520
Speaker 1: I mean I do it, but you know it's because

801
00:41:46,560 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 1: I M my brain works that way. Um. But also

802
00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:55,280
Speaker 1: the level of like stuff that you might be looking

803
00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:57,719
Speaker 1: for might be a lot less than like, like you know,

804
00:41:57,719 --> 00:42:00,279
Speaker 1: it's like prepper media is filled with like here's how

805
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:04,799
Speaker 1: to build a bunker under your pool, And I'm like, what, Yeah,

806
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:08,520
Speaker 1: there's there's so many levels I mean, somebody other things

807
00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:12,640
Speaker 1: that you should be doing before you go to that stitch. Yeah. Yeah,

808
00:42:12,680 --> 00:42:13,759
Speaker 1: I mean, like, don't get me wrong, if I had

809
00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:15,719
Speaker 1: a pool, I'd be stoked, And if I had absolutely

810
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:20,440
Speaker 1: under it, I'd be even more stoked. I'd be so happy. Yeah.

811
00:42:20,640 --> 00:42:22,640
Speaker 1: But but you know what it's like, it's the first

812
00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:27,200
Speaker 1: five gallon bucket of like dried food you store is

813
00:42:27,480 --> 00:42:31,399
Speaker 1: far and away more important than the tent, right, and like,

814
00:42:31,880 --> 00:42:36,319
Speaker 1: so just having a five gallon jerry canful of water

815
00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:38,040
Speaker 1: so that you're like, you know what, if the water

816
00:42:38,080 --> 00:42:40,320
Speaker 1: turns off or we have a boil advisory, which happens

817
00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:45,320
Speaker 1: all the time, I'm good for a couple of days, right,

818
00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:48,080
Speaker 1: because most of the time people think about preparedness as like,

819
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:50,680
Speaker 1: I'm preparing for the end times, and usually what it

820
00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:53,280
Speaker 1: is is the end times are real slow and chunky

821
00:42:53,360 --> 00:42:57,759
Speaker 1: and crumbles, that's the word, um. And so you're just

822
00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:00,239
Speaker 1: really looking to like smooth out interruptions and all that

823
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:03,000
Speaker 1: can be done very cheaply and honestly, when when you

824
00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:05,720
Speaker 1: start storing your fifth five gallon jerry can of water,

825
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:08,160
Speaker 1: you're not storying it for you anymore. You're storying it

826
00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:10,640
Speaker 1: for your neighbor. Yeah. Yeah, and that's good, but not

827
00:43:10,920 --> 00:43:14,960
Speaker 1: exactly not the first step, you know. Yeah, it's better

828
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:17,439
Speaker 1: to prepare for if you have like a week's worth

829
00:43:17,440 --> 00:43:19,439
Speaker 1: of power outages or a week's worth of the water

830
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:22,520
Speaker 1: not working, right, And those are more incremental steps, because

831
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:24,520
Speaker 1: we're not just gonna drop off and have no water

832
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:27,640
Speaker 1: forever starting in a month, right, probably not, but we

833
00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:32,360
Speaker 1: mean very likely there's gonna be there's enough remaining systems

834
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:34,799
Speaker 1: that that they want to fix it. You know, it's

835
00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:37,879
Speaker 1: more likely that some some disasters gonna happen that we're

836
00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:40,880
Speaker 1: gonna have, you know, a week worth of stuff gone,

837
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:44,080
Speaker 1: you know, and that's the thing that's actually more more

838
00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:51,160
Speaker 1: reasonable to prep for. Yeah, that makes sense. Um, well, Margaret,

839
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:54,000
Speaker 1: where can? Where can the good people and hopefully not

840
00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:57,520
Speaker 1: the bad people, but statistically some of them will suck

841
00:43:57,640 --> 00:44:02,279
Speaker 1: find you? Um, good people can find me on I

842
00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:04,479
Speaker 1: have a podcast called Like the World Is Dying, which

843
00:44:04,480 --> 00:44:06,239
Speaker 1: they can listen to you on if they would like,

844
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:11,040
Speaker 1: and it's about individual community preparedness. I also am on

845
00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:14,239
Speaker 1: Twitter way too much, at Magpie kill Joy, Instagram, at

846
00:44:14,239 --> 00:44:18,000
Speaker 1: Margaret Killjoy, my websites Birds before the Storm dot net

847
00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:20,160
Speaker 1: or Margaret Killjoy dot com. And that has like a

848
00:44:20,200 --> 00:44:22,520
Speaker 1: list of all the books that I have out. And

849
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:25,359
Speaker 1: I have a new book, an old book being reissued

850
00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:28,400
Speaker 1: that is coming out in November from a K Press.

851
00:44:28,920 --> 00:44:30,799
Speaker 1: The book is called a Country of Ghosts and it's

852
00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:33,040
Speaker 1: an anarchist utopian book because I was sick of people

853
00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:35,239
Speaker 1: being like, but how would an anarchist society work? And

854
00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:36,479
Speaker 1: I was like, you know what, I wrote a book,

855
00:44:37,320 --> 00:44:40,480
Speaker 1: damn straight. Um it also has a plot, so it's

856
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:48,359
Speaker 1: not fancy kind of boogie with yours. If you write

857
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:52,720
Speaker 1: a plot, you get the wall. No plot allowed, only

858
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:56,560
Speaker 1: post structural literature. Well, okay, so this has actually happened

859
00:44:56,600 --> 00:45:03,560
Speaker 1: to anarchist fiction writers before U so much. Buda was

860
00:45:03,600 --> 00:45:08,759
Speaker 1: this anarchist fiction writer. Um oh, I can't remember where

861
00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:12,120
Speaker 1: from I'm gonna this is terribly embarrassing. But he moved

862
00:45:12,120 --> 00:45:17,200
Speaker 1: to England from a colonized African country. Um, yeah, what

863
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:19,560
Speaker 1: did Rhodesia become? This is the most embarrassing. Oh it

864
00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:23,440
Speaker 1: became a Zimbabwe, right, okay, yeah, so yeah, so he

865
00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:26,360
Speaker 1: was from there and then everyone and he moved to

866
00:45:26,520 --> 00:45:28,640
Speaker 1: London until he realized that they're a bunch of racists

867
00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:31,200
Speaker 1: and he would like breaksh it at awards ceremonies and

868
00:45:31,200 --> 00:45:33,600
Speaker 1: then go back home. But when he was a squatter

869
00:45:33,600 --> 00:45:35,640
Speaker 1: for a while in the eighties, but he wasn't writing

870
00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:40,840
Speaker 1: in the proper post colonial like Marxist realist tradition, because

871
00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:44,239
Speaker 1: instead he was writing postmodern fiction, which is stuck getting

872
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:47,920
Speaker 1: and terrible. So he just like was like I don't care,

873
00:45:49,320 --> 00:45:52,960
Speaker 1: and so he's great. That is anyway. I love to

874
00:45:53,000 --> 00:45:59,600
Speaker 1: see it. Um, that's the episode. That's the episode, Go

875
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:07,719
Speaker 1: out and right, post modern jump on a train. That yeah,

876
00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:10,160
Speaker 1: probably also a bad idea. I talked to somebody who

877
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:22,719
Speaker 1: lost their legs doing that once. Anyway, Episodes over. I'm

878
00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:25,439
Speaker 1: Ev Rodsky, author of the New York Times bestseller fair

879
00:46:25,440 --> 00:46:28,720
Speaker 1: Play and Find Your Unicorn Space, activists on the gender

880
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:32,239
Speaker 1: division of labor, attorney and family mediator. And I'm Dr

881
00:46:32,360 --> 00:46:35,840
Speaker 1: adding A Rucar, a Harvard physician and medical correspondent with

882
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:39,160
Speaker 1: an expertise and the science of stress, resilience, mental health,

883
00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:42,960
Speaker 1: and burnout. We're so excited to share our podcast Time Out,

884
00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:46,959
Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Podcasts and Hello Sunshine. We're

885
00:46:47,040 --> 00:46:49,880
Speaker 1: uncovering why society makes it so hard for women to

886
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:52,600
Speaker 1: treat their time with the value it deserves. So take

887
00:46:52,680 --> 00:46:55,920
Speaker 1: this time out with us. Listen to Time Out, a

888
00:46:56,000 --> 00:46:59,919
Speaker 1: fair Play podcast on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

889
00:47:00,160 --> 00:47:04,600
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, guys. I'm

890
00:47:04,640 --> 00:47:06,520
Speaker 1: a Shop Bloud and I am Troy Millions and we

891
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:08,920
Speaker 1: are the host of the Earnier Leisure podcast, where we

892
00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:12,600
Speaker 1: break down business models and examine the latest trans and finance.

893
00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:14,719
Speaker 1: We hold court and have exclusive interviews with some of

894
00:47:14,719 --> 00:47:17,439
Speaker 1: the biggest names of business, sport, and entertainment, from DJ

895
00:47:17,560 --> 00:47:20,239
Speaker 1: Khaled to Mark Cuban, Rick Ross and Shaquille O'Neil. I

896
00:47:20,239 --> 00:47:22,959
Speaker 1: mean our alumni lists expansive. Listen in as our guests

897
00:47:22,960 --> 00:47:26,200
Speaker 1: reveal their business models, hardships and triumphs and their respective fields.

898
00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 1: The knowledge is in death and the questions are always

899
00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:30,719
Speaker 1: delivered from your standpoint. We want to know what you

900
00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:33,520
Speaker 1: want to know. We talk to the legends of business,

901
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:36,239
Speaker 1: sports and entertainment about how they got their start and

902
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Speaker 1: most importantly, how they make their money. Earni a Leisia

903
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Speaker 1: is a college business class mixed with pop culture. Want

904
00:47:41,320 --> 00:47:43,680
Speaker 1: to learn about the real estate game, unclears, how the

905
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Speaker 1: stock market works? We got you Interested in starting a

906
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Speaker 1: truck and company or vending machine business? Not really sure

907
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:52,040
Speaker 1: about how taxes or credit work. We got it all covered.

908
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:55,200
Speaker 1: The Earnier Leisure podcast is available now. Listen to Earnie

909
00:47:55,280 --> 00:47:58,600
Speaker 1: Leisure on the Black Effect Podcast Network, I Heart Radio, app,

910
00:47:58,880 --> 00:48:06,880
Speaker 1: Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Look for

911
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Speaker 1: your children's eyes to see the true magic of a forest.

912
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913
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Speaker 1: a tree, they see the wrinkled face of a wizard

914
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Speaker 1: with arms outstretched to the sky. They see treasuring pebbles,

915
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Speaker 1: they see a windy path that could lead to adventure,

916
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917
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Speaker 1: Find a forest near you and start exploring and discover

918
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Speaker 1: the forest dot org brought to you by the United

919
00:48:34,440 --> 00:48:43,680
Speaker 1: States Forest Service and the ad Council. Welcome this is

920
00:48:43,719 --> 00:48:47,319
Speaker 1: it could happen here daily. Uh. This week, we are

921
00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:51,279
Speaker 1: focusing on different ways to actually start doing things. You know,

922
00:48:51,320 --> 00:48:54,520
Speaker 1: we've talked a lot about ideas that we like, you know,

923
00:48:54,600 --> 00:48:58,360
Speaker 1: made some broad recommendations um and you know, had people

924
00:48:58,400 --> 00:49:00,919
Speaker 1: on to give specific insights and to you know, different things.

925
00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:04,560
Speaker 1: But we're trying to focus this week and then you

926
00:49:04,560 --> 00:49:06,880
Speaker 1: know more in the future. Is like, if you're brand

927
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:09,040
Speaker 1: new to this sort of thing, how to actually start

928
00:49:09,200 --> 00:49:12,040
Speaker 1: doing stuff. And one of the things we talked about

929
00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:14,200
Speaker 1: a lot is a lot almost everyone we've interviewed has

930
00:49:14,239 --> 00:49:17,680
Speaker 1: mentioned this at some point, that trying to get more

931
00:49:17,760 --> 00:49:22,319
Speaker 1: active in the things you're consuming and the things that

932
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,319
Speaker 1: you're eating. And one of the ways to do that

933
00:49:24,480 --> 00:49:28,600
Speaker 1: is by just literally growing your own food. I went

934
00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:31,920
Speaker 1: when I was growing up, I mean my grandparents operate,

935
00:49:32,480 --> 00:49:34,359
Speaker 1: I mean like they stopped right like like like like

936
00:49:34,520 --> 00:49:37,040
Speaker 1: a large, large farm. Now they operate kind of like

937
00:49:37,080 --> 00:49:39,960
Speaker 1: a farm that just like feeds them. So whenever I'm

938
00:49:40,080 --> 00:49:42,960
Speaker 1: at my grandparents in Canada, usually we you know, we

939
00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:44,799
Speaker 1: just eat all the food they grow, whether that be

940
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:48,160
Speaker 1: like produce. Um. They also do like their own hunting.

941
00:49:48,239 --> 00:49:51,200
Speaker 1: They make their own sausage, like you know, they preserve meats.

942
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:54,120
Speaker 1: So like, I kind of grew up around this type

943
00:49:54,120 --> 00:49:58,640
Speaker 1: of thing because just how self reliant some of my

944
00:49:58,719 --> 00:50:01,759
Speaker 1: family is. But not everyone may have this kind of background,

945
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:03,839
Speaker 1: and so you know, this idea of growing your own

946
00:50:03,840 --> 00:50:07,759
Speaker 1: food can feel maybe a little bit daunting. Um. And

947
00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:10,520
Speaker 1: to help us talk about food and then eventually soil

948
00:50:10,600 --> 00:50:14,439
Speaker 1: and other kind of things, I have invited a guest

949
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:18,960
Speaker 1: on from another kind of podcast in this that operates

950
00:50:18,960 --> 00:50:22,560
Speaker 1: in the same rough, rough framework, I would say probably

951
00:50:23,239 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 1: how to how to kind of slowly improve improve the world?

952
00:50:26,520 --> 00:50:29,879
Speaker 1: Um uh do I don't explain who you are and

953
00:50:29,920 --> 00:50:33,160
Speaker 1: what's your what's your what your project is? Sure? So

954
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:36,160
Speaker 1: my name is Andy. I'm the post of the Poor

955
00:50:36,239 --> 00:50:40,800
Speaker 1: Pole's Almanac. We're a podcast that's focused on thinking about

956
00:50:40,840 --> 00:50:43,600
Speaker 1: after collaps how do we things like climate change and

957
00:50:43,600 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 1: collaps impact things like food systems, and what can we

958
00:50:46,680 --> 00:50:52,680
Speaker 1: do today to prepare for what's coming in the future. Yeah,

959
00:50:52,719 --> 00:50:56,200
Speaker 1: I feel like it's not not a coincidence that all

960
00:50:56,239 --> 00:51:01,360
Speaker 1: of these different kind of projects are getting more popular

961
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:03,600
Speaker 1: at the same time because we're looking at the world

962
00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:07,080
Speaker 1: and being like, huh, this doesn't seem very sustainable, so

963
00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:09,799
Speaker 1: we better we better start figuring out what to do

964
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:14,600
Speaker 1: with all these systems kind of slowly, you know, start

965
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:17,399
Speaker 1: losing parts. I want to talk about kind of food today.

966
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:20,120
Speaker 1: I want to want to maybe branch off into like

967
00:51:20,160 --> 00:51:24,120
Speaker 1: a few different directions. Branch that's a plant plant plant

968
00:51:24,239 --> 00:51:28,440
Speaker 1: pun um, what a branch off of a few different

969
00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:30,640
Speaker 1: directions both like, you know, what do you do if

970
00:51:30,640 --> 00:51:32,520
Speaker 1: you have like your own house and yard, or maybe

971
00:51:32,520 --> 00:51:34,920
Speaker 1: you're like more rule you have lots of space, and

972
00:51:34,960 --> 00:51:37,000
Speaker 1: then also the kind of the inverse of like let's

973
00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:38,600
Speaker 1: say you lived in, like I don't know, a cramped

974
00:51:38,600 --> 00:51:41,240
Speaker 1: city apartment, different things that you can do. Let's probably

975
00:51:41,280 --> 00:51:43,440
Speaker 1: start with like the rule just to like give a

976
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:46,239
Speaker 1: you know, a more like base background on you know,

977
00:51:46,719 --> 00:51:48,440
Speaker 1: you have more of like a standard set up for

978
00:51:48,520 --> 00:51:52,560
Speaker 1: what you're able to do. If someone's never grown anything before,

979
00:51:52,719 --> 00:51:55,480
Speaker 1: they've never like maybe they've had like one house plant,

980
00:51:55,520 --> 00:51:58,080
Speaker 1: but like they've never grown anything. What what do you

981
00:51:58,080 --> 00:52:00,840
Speaker 1: think is the best first like preparation and steps before

982
00:52:00,840 --> 00:52:04,200
Speaker 1: you actually, you know, go and start buying seeds and stuff. Sure,

983
00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 1: so when it comes to growing food, it's really not

984
00:52:07,719 --> 00:52:11,040
Speaker 1: that complicated. Chances are if you have a front yard

985
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:14,320
Speaker 1: we're talking about someplace that's pretty rural, assuming the climate

986
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:17,319
Speaker 1: is in someplace super dry, you're generally going to be

987
00:52:17,320 --> 00:52:21,240
Speaker 1: thinking about growing food someplace where grass probably already grows.

988
00:52:21,920 --> 00:52:24,000
Speaker 1: So if grass is already growing there, you know things

989
00:52:24,080 --> 00:52:27,680
Speaker 1: can grow there. And really that's that's as simple as

990
00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:31,160
Speaker 1: it can be. It can be more complicated. We can

991
00:52:31,200 --> 00:52:34,560
Speaker 1: start talking about things like soil pH and nutrients and

992
00:52:34,600 --> 00:52:37,000
Speaker 1: all of these other things, but really, when it comes

993
00:52:37,040 --> 00:52:38,560
Speaker 1: down to it, if you put a seed in the

994
00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:40,880
Speaker 1: ground and the temperature is not too warm or cold,

995
00:52:41,120 --> 00:52:43,719
Speaker 1: and it gets rained but not too much rain, the

996
00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:47,880
Speaker 1: plant's going to grow. And if you've got some say

997
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:49,719
Speaker 1: a couple of acres, and you want to cut out

998
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:52,719
Speaker 1: a little section of it to grow some food, uh,

999
00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:56,200
Speaker 1: that's that's as simple as it really can be. And

1000
00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:59,160
Speaker 1: you can go to whatever store and buy seeds. So

1001
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:01,960
Speaker 1: like that that a good place to start. And obviously

1002
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:03,840
Speaker 1: depending on where you live, you want to think about

1003
00:53:03,840 --> 00:53:06,960
Speaker 1: things like lead in the in the soil if you

1004
00:53:07,000 --> 00:53:09,600
Speaker 1: live someplace near an old house, or maybe if you're

1005
00:53:09,600 --> 00:53:12,520
Speaker 1: near some place where there was manufacturing. And one of

1006
00:53:12,560 --> 00:53:14,000
Speaker 1: the things to keep in mind is that a lot

1007
00:53:14,040 --> 00:53:17,399
Speaker 1: of older settlements, even if there isn't a factory there now,

1008
00:53:18,320 --> 00:53:22,520
Speaker 1: it's very possible there was a factory years ago, it's

1009
00:53:22,520 --> 00:53:24,719
Speaker 1: been demoed and you never even knew it was there.

1010
00:53:25,120 --> 00:53:27,080
Speaker 1: So it's really important if you do live in someplace

1011
00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:30,560
Speaker 1: that has that manufacturing background or an old house to

1012
00:53:30,640 --> 00:53:32,920
Speaker 1: really check for things like lead in the soil because

1013
00:53:33,200 --> 00:53:37,400
Speaker 1: that can be really dangerous. And there's yeah, very accessible

1014
00:53:37,520 --> 00:53:42,239
Speaker 1: like soil testing kits available that star is on online. Okay, yeah,

1015
00:53:42,239 --> 00:53:44,600
Speaker 1: it's like I think fifteen dollars. You can have a

1016
00:53:44,680 --> 00:53:47,480
Speaker 1: soil sample taken and you can find out everything that's

1017
00:53:47,480 --> 00:53:51,200
Speaker 1: in it, like the pH and you know if it's

1018
00:53:51,239 --> 00:53:54,360
Speaker 1: too acidic and things like that. So yeah, you you

1019
00:53:54,400 --> 00:53:56,800
Speaker 1: figure out you wanna you want to start growing stuff,

1020
00:53:56,800 --> 00:53:58,560
Speaker 1: you have you have some space, whether it be like

1021
00:53:58,640 --> 00:54:00,759
Speaker 1: a front yard or maybe like even like an open

1022
00:54:00,800 --> 00:54:04,200
Speaker 1: field if you're lucky, Um, what kind of what kind

1023
00:54:04,200 --> 00:54:06,799
Speaker 1: of stuff do you think? You know? Should I just

1024
00:54:07,160 --> 00:54:09,919
Speaker 1: jump in and buy any kind of seed that looks fun,

1025
00:54:10,080 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 1: or should I like start with specific things I don't know.

1026
00:54:12,760 --> 00:54:14,920
Speaker 1: It's like if I really like potatoes, or just go

1027
00:54:14,960 --> 00:54:17,560
Speaker 1: to potatoes, If I really like cauliflowers, just to cauliflower.

1028
00:54:17,920 --> 00:54:20,640
Speaker 1: What's kind of the if I'm brand new, what's the

1029
00:54:20,640 --> 00:54:23,719
Speaker 1: different things that would be worth first drawing out? So

1030
00:54:23,840 --> 00:54:27,719
Speaker 1: generally speaking, you really want to think about what your

1031
00:54:27,760 --> 00:54:30,600
Speaker 1: climate is, and I think that's one of the things

1032
00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:32,080
Speaker 1: that gets missed a lot of times as you want

1033
00:54:32,080 --> 00:54:33,720
Speaker 1: to grow things. So like I live in New England,

1034
00:54:34,239 --> 00:54:38,160
Speaker 1: growing say watermelon is really a challenge in a lot

1035
00:54:38,160 --> 00:54:40,120
Speaker 1: of ways because you have to think about the length

1036
00:54:40,120 --> 00:54:42,160
Speaker 1: of my season versus the length it takes for a

1037
00:54:42,239 --> 00:54:46,120
Speaker 1: watermelon to be a full sized fruit for you to eat. So,

1038
00:54:46,880 --> 00:54:48,640
Speaker 1: depending on where you live, the one thing you need

1039
00:54:48,719 --> 00:54:50,799
Speaker 1: to keep in mind is what that length of your

1040
00:54:50,840 --> 00:54:53,680
Speaker 1: season is. Now, to get back to the main subject

1041
00:54:53,760 --> 00:54:56,719
Speaker 1: of the podcast, talking about things like climate change and collapse,

1042
00:54:57,560 --> 00:55:01,400
Speaker 1: that season is changing rapidly right now. We're adding days,

1043
00:55:01,440 --> 00:55:04,800
Speaker 1: so the seasons are getting longer, but also we're having

1044
00:55:04,840 --> 00:55:08,799
Speaker 1: weird cold snaps later and later into spring, so what

1045
00:55:08,960 --> 00:55:12,280
Speaker 1: might have been a traditional season no longer really applies anymore.

1046
00:55:12,920 --> 00:55:15,319
Speaker 1: So if you're thinking about this is your first year,

1047
00:55:15,360 --> 00:55:17,680
Speaker 1: you don't want to grow anything that might be right

1048
00:55:17,719 --> 00:55:21,239
Speaker 1: at the cusp of um being in your season. Or

1049
00:55:21,280 --> 00:55:23,319
Speaker 1: you don't want to start a plant inside and then

1050
00:55:23,400 --> 00:55:25,400
Speaker 1: have to move it outside and you have to know

1051
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:27,040
Speaker 1: whether or not it has a tap root and all

1052
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:29,240
Speaker 1: these other things to make sure that you don't damage

1053
00:55:29,280 --> 00:55:31,880
Speaker 1: the plant. Then you definitely want to grow something with

1054
00:55:31,880 --> 00:55:39,280
Speaker 1: a shorter season, things like um. Cold weather plants, lettuces, broccolis, cauliflowers,

1055
00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:42,600
Speaker 1: things like that will generally do pretty good in short seasons,

1056
00:55:43,239 --> 00:55:46,440
Speaker 1: but they don't really do well in really warm climates.

1057
00:55:46,760 --> 00:55:49,279
Speaker 1: So if you're in say Florida, it's gonna be really

1058
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:52,480
Speaker 1: difficult um. But that that's kind of how you want

1059
00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:54,839
Speaker 1: to start thinking about those processes. Learning what the cold

1060
00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:58,160
Speaker 1: season plants are, what the warm season plants are, where

1061
00:55:58,400 --> 00:56:00,480
Speaker 1: you fit in in terms of the zone that you

1062
00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:03,400
Speaker 1: live within, and again starting to think about, okay, the

1063
00:56:03,440 --> 00:56:05,720
Speaker 1: last couple of years, when did we get the last frost,

1064
00:56:06,120 --> 00:56:08,920
Speaker 1: Because it's not what it might say ten years ago

1065
00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:12,280
Speaker 1: is your average last frost. Those days are pretty much gone.

1066
00:56:12,680 --> 00:56:15,200
Speaker 1: I know here in Portland we're currently growing a lot

1067
00:56:15,239 --> 00:56:18,399
Speaker 1: of potatoes and that's been that's been kind of our

1068
00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:22,359
Speaker 1: our our big haul. Also, tomatoes did very good this year,

1069
00:56:22,600 --> 00:56:27,080
Speaker 1: particularly because of our big heat domes they got we got.

1070
00:56:26,840 --> 00:56:29,080
Speaker 1: The tomatoes did so much better than what they what

1071
00:56:29,120 --> 00:56:33,080
Speaker 1: they usually do. We've like canned so many tomatoes just

1072
00:56:33,120 --> 00:56:35,200
Speaker 1: because we just we have so many more than what

1073
00:56:35,200 --> 00:56:37,880
Speaker 1: we're used to. That if I do find that interesting

1074
00:56:37,960 --> 00:56:42,279
Speaker 1: being like, you know, climate change obviously being generally a

1075
00:56:42,360 --> 00:56:45,600
Speaker 1: net bad, but you know, in some cases for growing,

1076
00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:48,440
Speaker 1: it's gonna make certain crops easier to grow, but you know,

1077
00:56:48,440 --> 00:56:50,920
Speaker 1: other crops will be harder to grow. It's something I

1078
00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:53,160
Speaker 1: wanted to talk more about in the first five heavily

1079
00:56:53,200 --> 00:56:56,200
Speaker 1: scripted It could happen here season two episodes. It's like,

1080
00:56:56,239 --> 00:56:59,839
Speaker 1: particularly how different growing regions are going to shift up

1081
00:56:59,840 --> 00:57:01,920
Speaker 1: and how like, you know, Canada, for instance, is going

1082
00:57:01,960 --> 00:57:05,799
Speaker 1: to have a lot more agriculture in the next years

1083
00:57:05,840 --> 00:57:09,520
Speaker 1: just because so many, so many climates are slowly inching upwards.

1084
00:57:09,520 --> 00:57:11,279
Speaker 1: But you know, even in places like Georgia and other

1085
00:57:11,360 --> 00:57:14,520
Speaker 1: places where different. If we know specific plants are growing,

1086
00:57:14,719 --> 00:57:16,520
Speaker 1: all that stuff is going to be changing. Obviously, this

1087
00:57:16,640 --> 00:57:19,920
Speaker 1: is affecting coffee and how we're getting less and less

1088
00:57:21,840 --> 00:57:24,600
Speaker 1: space and land that's actually able to grow coffee because

1089
00:57:24,600 --> 00:57:27,640
Speaker 1: basically plants, you know, growers have to move their plants

1090
00:57:27,720 --> 00:57:29,520
Speaker 1: up a mountain every year in order to make the

1091
00:57:29,560 --> 00:57:31,720
Speaker 1: coffee actually work, which is why we're it's gonna We're

1092
00:57:31,720 --> 00:57:34,440
Speaker 1: just gonna run up a space. Um So yeah, that

1093
00:57:34,560 --> 00:57:38,720
Speaker 1: is obviously the more negative sides of things and California

1094
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:41,960
Speaker 1: lack of rain, water and just and just lack of rain.

1095
00:57:42,040 --> 00:57:45,200
Speaker 1: Yeah absolutely, rain, yeah, absolutely, And that brings up a

1096
00:57:45,200 --> 00:57:48,080
Speaker 1: really important point that you know, you're talking about moving

1097
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:51,000
Speaker 1: the coffee trees further and further up a mountain as

1098
00:57:51,120 --> 00:57:56,480
Speaker 1: the areas that are considered prime agricultural areas moves north

1099
00:57:56,560 --> 00:57:59,840
Speaker 1: for us, you have to think about the infrastructural challenges

1100
00:57:59,880 --> 00:58:02,439
Speaker 1: that brings. So it's not just you're going to grow

1101
00:58:02,520 --> 00:58:05,440
Speaker 1: the crops in one place, but the infrastructure, the trains,

1102
00:58:05,560 --> 00:58:08,600
Speaker 1: all these different things don't exist in the places where

1103
00:58:09,160 --> 00:58:12,480
Speaker 1: we'll be able to grow those foods. So speaking of

1104
00:58:12,560 --> 00:58:14,840
Speaker 1: something you know around that rough kind of idea is

1105
00:58:14,880 --> 00:58:17,840
Speaker 1: like if someone's never never done this before. They're out

1106
00:58:17,840 --> 00:58:22,000
Speaker 1: to go get stuff. Where would you where would someone

1107
00:58:22,000 --> 00:58:24,160
Speaker 1: like that find seeds? Um, Let's say that they don't.

1108
00:58:24,240 --> 00:58:27,560
Speaker 1: Let's say they don't use the internet's tons um whereabouts

1109
00:58:27,560 --> 00:58:29,800
Speaker 1: where you think they'll go and get cauliflower seeds or

1110
00:58:29,840 --> 00:58:31,480
Speaker 1: carrot seeds if they if they want to start doing

1111
00:58:31,480 --> 00:58:34,920
Speaker 1: this stuff. Yeah, So there's a bunch of different growers

1112
00:58:34,960 --> 00:58:37,400
Speaker 1: that offer seeds. And one of the things to keep

1113
00:58:37,400 --> 00:58:40,120
Speaker 1: in mind with annuals is that it does make sense

1114
00:58:40,160 --> 00:58:43,360
Speaker 1: if you can to buy them locally, because what within

1115
00:58:43,400 --> 00:58:47,320
Speaker 1: a couple of generations, plants will start evolving towards local conditions.

1116
00:58:48,080 --> 00:58:50,600
Speaker 1: It's it's really beneficial, especially with like I said, with

1117
00:58:50,640 --> 00:58:53,920
Speaker 1: climate change, to start thinking about how can we integrate

1118
00:58:54,040 --> 00:58:57,400
Speaker 1: our food systems into the ecological conditions where we live,

1119
00:58:57,720 --> 00:59:00,520
Speaker 1: and that ecology includes the climate. So we have to

1120
00:59:00,520 --> 00:59:04,520
Speaker 1: continuously more thoughtfully start thinking about these things and how

1121
00:59:04,520 --> 00:59:06,800
Speaker 1: we grow food and where those foods come from in

1122
00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:09,240
Speaker 1: order to really be able to deal with and mitigate

1123
00:59:09,280 --> 00:59:12,720
Speaker 1: the effects of climate change. So a great resources Johnny's

1124
00:59:12,720 --> 00:59:15,480
Speaker 1: Seed they do a lot of really good work and

1125
00:59:15,560 --> 00:59:19,520
Speaker 1: there they have good quality stuff and there's a bunch

1126
00:59:19,520 --> 00:59:21,479
Speaker 1: of seed companies out there that have done some really

1127
00:59:21,640 --> 00:59:25,160
Speaker 1: problematic stuff that I won't go into or talk about.

1128
00:59:25,240 --> 00:59:27,960
Speaker 1: But they're these guys, as far as I'm aware, are

1129
00:59:28,000 --> 00:59:32,760
Speaker 1: pretty good. So I would definitely recommend them. Awesome. Yeah,

1130
00:59:32,760 --> 00:59:35,560
Speaker 1: their website is just Johnny Seeds dot com, just for

1131
00:59:35,600 --> 00:59:38,640
Speaker 1: everyone who's looking at up at Johnny with a Y.

1132
00:59:38,760 --> 00:59:44,280
Speaker 1: Good for Johnny with a Y. Great. All right. Let's now,

1133
00:59:44,360 --> 00:59:48,360
Speaker 1: let's say someone lives in a downtown apartment in a

1134
00:59:48,400 --> 00:59:51,520
Speaker 1: metropolitan area. They don't have immediate access to you know,

1135
00:59:51,840 --> 00:59:56,040
Speaker 1: tons of dirt or you know, grass, but they want

1136
00:59:56,080 --> 00:59:58,680
Speaker 1: to start kind of growing some stuff. If if you

1137
00:59:58,720 --> 01:00:01,880
Speaker 1: were in that position, would you start doing and to that,

1138
01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:04,800
Speaker 1: I want to to part that that would be somebody

1139
01:00:04,920 --> 01:00:07,280
Speaker 1: with a balcony where they have access to like even

1140
01:00:07,400 --> 01:00:11,240
Speaker 1: like a little patti area or those and then without Yeah, sure,

1141
01:00:11,320 --> 01:00:13,840
Speaker 1: So there's a bunch of different things you can do.

1142
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:17,680
Speaker 1: Starting with if you have a balcony, you can start

1143
01:00:17,680 --> 01:00:21,240
Speaker 1: thinking about getting pots, filling them up with soil, amending

1144
01:00:21,240 --> 01:00:24,280
Speaker 1: that soil as needed as you add plants, and again

1145
01:00:24,760 --> 01:00:27,400
Speaker 1: the general rule is to think about how big a

1146
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:29,800
Speaker 1: plant gets, and how big a plant gets is how

1147
01:00:29,800 --> 01:00:31,800
Speaker 1: big its root system is going to get I mean,

1148
01:00:31,800 --> 01:00:34,560
Speaker 1: that's not accurate by any means, but it's just a

1149
01:00:34,600 --> 01:00:37,040
Speaker 1: good rule of thumb to think about as you're doing

1150
01:00:37,080 --> 01:00:40,200
Speaker 1: something like this, and you know, if you have a

1151
01:00:40,240 --> 01:00:42,480
Speaker 1: tiny pot, then something that gets big is not going

1152
01:00:42,520 --> 01:00:44,840
Speaker 1: to work. It might be better for a lettuce or whatever.

1153
01:00:45,400 --> 01:00:47,200
Speaker 1: And there's a bunch of different places you can look

1154
01:00:47,240 --> 01:00:50,200
Speaker 1: online for how to grow things on balconies and things

1155
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:53,080
Speaker 1: like that. You can also, and this is really dependent

1156
01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:56,320
Speaker 1: on money, is start thinking about things like grow lights,

1157
01:00:56,360 --> 01:00:59,120
Speaker 1: which really are not that complicated once you start learning

1158
01:00:59,160 --> 01:01:02,520
Speaker 1: a bit about them, hydroponics which comes with their own

1159
01:01:02,600 --> 01:01:05,200
Speaker 1: challenges because at the end of the day, while it's

1160
01:01:05,240 --> 01:01:06,840
Speaker 1: nice to be able to grow food in your house,

1161
01:01:07,160 --> 01:01:11,240
Speaker 1: you're still relying on extractive processes. So you know your

1162
01:01:11,320 --> 01:01:14,960
Speaker 1: nutrients are coming from fossil fuel essentially, So that's just

1163
01:01:15,040 --> 01:01:17,600
Speaker 1: something to be aware of. It's probably still better than

1164
01:01:18,000 --> 01:01:20,640
Speaker 1: the alternative of buying food on the shelf, but it

1165
01:01:20,760 --> 01:01:23,080
Speaker 1: is something to be aware of in that process that

1166
01:01:23,120 --> 01:01:27,480
Speaker 1: it's not really a sustainable quote unquote practice. Got it?

1167
01:01:27,840 --> 01:01:30,760
Speaker 1: And what are some of the go toos for a

1168
01:01:30,800 --> 01:01:33,440
Speaker 1: balcony garden that you would recommend for people that are

1169
01:01:33,440 --> 01:01:37,240
Speaker 1: just starting out. Definitely, those leafy greens are a good

1170
01:01:37,240 --> 01:01:40,480
Speaker 1: place to start. They grow small, they have smaller roots systems.

1171
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:44,080
Speaker 1: Most times, things like lettuces don't need a ton of

1172
01:01:44,120 --> 01:01:47,200
Speaker 1: sun to grow super well. As long as they get

1173
01:01:47,200 --> 01:01:49,400
Speaker 1: a decent amount, they'll be fine. They're not like a

1174
01:01:49,440 --> 01:01:52,880
Speaker 1: tomato that's gonna like be desperately looking for that that

1175
01:01:53,040 --> 01:01:57,040
Speaker 1: sun in that energy. So those smaller greens are generally

1176
01:01:57,080 --> 01:02:01,160
Speaker 1: a better option, right. Yeah, I was able to grow

1177
01:02:01,240 --> 01:02:04,200
Speaker 1: kale and like a pot this of this winter and

1178
01:02:04,240 --> 01:02:07,560
Speaker 1: it was great. Yeah, kale is a great one here

1179
01:02:07,560 --> 01:02:09,880
Speaker 1: in New England. It's really nice because you can grow

1180
01:02:09,920 --> 01:02:12,240
Speaker 1: it under glass during the winter, so even if you

1181
01:02:12,320 --> 01:02:14,840
Speaker 1: have a cold spell, it will stay just warm enough

1182
01:02:14,880 --> 01:02:19,160
Speaker 1: to make it pretty much throughout the winter. All right, Now,

1183
01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:22,280
Speaker 1: I have no balcony. I only have, you know, two

1184
01:02:22,320 --> 01:02:25,160
Speaker 1: small windows, you know I have. I have like a

1185
01:02:25,200 --> 01:02:26,880
Speaker 1: counter and stuff, you know, I can like can set

1186
01:02:26,920 --> 01:02:31,040
Speaker 1: up stuff, but I do not have tons of outdoor access.

1187
01:02:31,080 --> 01:02:34,400
Speaker 1: But I would like to stop buying dill every time

1188
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:36,000
Speaker 1: I go to the store because I use it in

1189
01:02:36,080 --> 01:02:39,160
Speaker 1: my homemade ranch dressing. Now, can I just buy those

1190
01:02:39,200 --> 01:02:42,480
Speaker 1: like pre pre potted stuff and just water them or

1191
01:02:42,520 --> 01:02:44,320
Speaker 1: kind of like if if, if, if I want to

1192
01:02:44,360 --> 01:02:46,200
Speaker 1: get more in depth, what are they you know, some

1193
01:02:46,280 --> 01:02:50,160
Speaker 1: things that are beyond that, but not you know, making this,

1194
01:02:50,320 --> 01:02:53,880
Speaker 1: you know, making this giant set up, so you could

1195
01:02:53,920 --> 01:02:59,800
Speaker 1: be creative and do something that's less than eagle. And

1196
01:03:00,440 --> 01:03:04,360
Speaker 1: there's this practice known as gorilla gardening. I was I

1197
01:03:04,440 --> 01:03:07,920
Speaker 1: was gonna mention girly grilla gardening soon. Yeah. Sure, So

1198
01:03:08,120 --> 01:03:10,680
Speaker 1: this is like something that works really well, and there's

1199
01:03:10,680 --> 01:03:12,680
Speaker 1: a bunch of different ways you can do it, and

1200
01:03:12,720 --> 01:03:15,720
Speaker 1: it really depends on your local conditions and what can

1201
01:03:15,800 --> 01:03:17,680
Speaker 1: grow out in the wild and needs a lot of

1202
01:03:17,680 --> 01:03:21,320
Speaker 1: maintenance and what doesn't. And I don't know the Pacific

1203
01:03:21,360 --> 01:03:24,120
Speaker 1: Northwest that well, but it is warm enough that I

1204
01:03:24,120 --> 01:03:26,040
Speaker 1: think Bill would probably do fine, and it is wet

1205
01:03:26,160 --> 01:03:28,680
Speaker 1: enough that Bill would probably do fine. So you could

1206
01:03:28,760 --> 01:03:31,640
Speaker 1: just go anywhere where there's green space that nobody checks

1207
01:03:31,680 --> 01:03:34,880
Speaker 1: things and just drop some plants in. You could start

1208
01:03:34,920 --> 01:03:37,240
Speaker 1: seedlings in your house and bring them where you want

1209
01:03:37,240 --> 01:03:39,680
Speaker 1: to harvest it later, and it's on your walk to

1210
01:03:39,760 --> 01:03:42,880
Speaker 1: work or where you get coffee or whatever. Drop it

1211
01:03:42,880 --> 01:03:45,200
Speaker 1: in the ground, make sure the roots are you know,

1212
01:03:45,320 --> 01:03:47,880
Speaker 1: not bound up, and make sure it's got a nice

1213
01:03:47,880 --> 01:03:49,680
Speaker 1: watered wrench right when you put it in the ground,

1214
01:03:49,720 --> 01:03:53,160
Speaker 1: so it starts adjusting and that's you know, that's that's

1215
01:03:53,200 --> 01:03:56,280
Speaker 1: the first step in something as simple as guerrilla agriculture.

1216
01:03:56,840 --> 01:03:59,080
Speaker 1: One of the first things that we tried to do

1217
01:03:59,160 --> 01:04:02,360
Speaker 1: when I got kind of started in you know, the

1218
01:04:02,640 --> 01:04:06,200
Speaker 1: you know Portland's kind of more lefty scened, was you know,

1219
01:04:06,280 --> 01:04:10,919
Speaker 1: ideas for you know, building a community garden somewhere. And yeah,

1220
01:04:11,000 --> 01:04:14,200
Speaker 1: because there is just a lot of dirt, especially like

1221
01:04:14,320 --> 01:04:17,520
Speaker 1: Portland's specifically lucky just because we just have so much

1222
01:04:17,560 --> 01:04:20,520
Speaker 1: green space. Uh, there's a lot of places to to

1223
01:04:20,600 --> 01:04:24,440
Speaker 1: start grilla gardening, to start doing our own little community garden.

1224
01:04:25,360 --> 01:04:30,360
Speaker 1: Do you do you have any alleged experience in gorilla gartening. Yes,

1225
01:04:31,200 --> 01:04:34,400
Speaker 1: So if you're on Instagram, I post a bit about

1226
01:04:34,440 --> 01:04:37,280
Speaker 1: some of the grilla gardening stuff that I do. UM.

1227
01:04:37,360 --> 01:04:42,560
Speaker 1: I generally focus on guerrilla gardening, not necessarily for my

1228
01:04:42,560 --> 01:04:46,920
Speaker 1: own consumption, but more for ecological mitigation for damage from

1229
01:04:47,080 --> 01:04:50,280
Speaker 1: um clear cutting and things like that. So I go

1230
01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:52,160
Speaker 1: out and try to plant things that are native to

1231
01:04:52,200 --> 01:04:54,880
Speaker 1: regions and try to bring them back a little bit.

1232
01:04:55,440 --> 01:04:57,880
Speaker 1: So that's one of the challenges that we see here

1233
01:04:57,880 --> 01:05:00,840
Speaker 1: on the East Coast is not only are our city

1234
01:05:00,920 --> 01:05:03,720
Speaker 1: is not really designed with green space and mind and

1235
01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:06,760
Speaker 1: for community gardens, I almost never recommend them, just because

1236
01:05:06,760 --> 01:05:10,360
Speaker 1: in places like Boston they're hard to get into and

1237
01:05:10,400 --> 01:05:12,080
Speaker 1: a lot of major cities like you can be on

1238
01:05:12,080 --> 01:05:16,439
Speaker 1: waitlists for years, so that's not really a short term

1239
01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:18,760
Speaker 1: solution or a solution for a lot of people that

1240
01:05:18,800 --> 01:05:22,280
Speaker 1: are rather transient where you might move communities every three

1241
01:05:22,320 --> 01:05:26,360
Speaker 1: or four or five years. Um. So, like guerrilla gardening

1242
01:05:26,360 --> 01:05:29,240
Speaker 1: works really great for those folks because you can do

1243
01:05:29,360 --> 01:05:31,800
Speaker 1: it when you want and how you want. Nothing says

1244
01:05:31,880 --> 01:05:36,640
Speaker 1: community like a waitlist, right No. But like in terms

1245
01:05:36,680 --> 01:05:38,840
Speaker 1: of community gardens, I think, you know, there's been a

1246
01:05:38,880 --> 01:05:41,000
Speaker 1: lot of people asking about how they get involved in

1247
01:05:41,040 --> 01:05:43,360
Speaker 1: mutual aiden stuff, especially if they don't have like friends

1248
01:05:43,440 --> 01:05:46,680
Speaker 1: or like they don't have many friends or connections to activism.

1249
01:05:47,080 --> 01:05:49,320
Speaker 1: I think one of the best ways to start anything

1250
01:05:49,320 --> 01:05:51,440
Speaker 1: like that is just all you need is like yourself

1251
01:05:51,480 --> 01:05:53,360
Speaker 1: and maybe one or two other people that you know

1252
01:05:53,880 --> 01:05:56,080
Speaker 1: to just start a community garden somewhere. And that's a

1253
01:05:56,200 --> 01:06:00,600
Speaker 1: very very nice on rep into like community organizing. Absolutely

1254
01:06:00,920 --> 01:06:03,720
Speaker 1: Back in Portland when I used to live in the Southwest,

1255
01:06:04,360 --> 01:06:07,440
Speaker 1: there was, there's just whole like community plots that are

1256
01:06:07,440 --> 01:06:11,760
Speaker 1: like you know, more like official but still pretty like decentralized.

1257
01:06:12,080 --> 01:06:14,000
Speaker 1: That you could just basically go up to one of

1258
01:06:14,040 --> 01:06:16,320
Speaker 1: the bank at plots and just start planting food in

1259
01:06:16,320 --> 01:06:19,240
Speaker 1: this community setting, and like once a month, all of

1260
01:06:19,280 --> 01:06:21,600
Speaker 1: the different gardeners would like get together and talk about

1261
01:06:21,600 --> 01:06:23,880
Speaker 1: what they're growing and stuff, and they could, you know,

1262
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:27,840
Speaker 1: could trade produce. Be like, I'm growing I'm growing pumpkins,

1263
01:06:28,040 --> 01:06:30,800
Speaker 1: You're growing butternut squash. I want one of your squash.

1264
01:06:30,800 --> 01:06:32,440
Speaker 1: I want one of your pumpkins. Right, you can like

1265
01:06:32,800 --> 01:06:35,400
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff. Um or if you know, if

1266
01:06:35,400 --> 01:06:37,800
Speaker 1: you end up having with having like a larger hole,

1267
01:06:37,840 --> 01:06:40,080
Speaker 1: you could just give it out to random people. It

1268
01:06:40,200 --> 01:06:44,439
Speaker 1: turns out people might like receiving fresh produce. That could

1269
01:06:44,480 --> 01:06:47,200
Speaker 1: be another way of making friends and making connections. If

1270
01:06:47,240 --> 01:06:49,560
Speaker 1: you're kind of isolated in the city and you only

1271
01:06:49,560 --> 01:06:52,680
Speaker 1: have one or two other people, you can't start start

1272
01:06:52,720 --> 01:06:56,200
Speaker 1: a new community garden somewhere in the city just like

1273
01:06:56,640 --> 01:07:00,200
Speaker 1: scope out of spot, start growing and then and not

1274
01:07:00,440 --> 01:07:02,320
Speaker 1: get to speak to that. You know. One of the

1275
01:07:02,360 --> 01:07:04,520
Speaker 1: things is that if you act like you're official and

1276
01:07:04,560 --> 01:07:06,560
Speaker 1: you're supposed to be there, and you know you're supposed

1277
01:07:06,600 --> 01:07:09,360
Speaker 1: to be there. People generally don't really question you, especially

1278
01:07:09,400 --> 01:07:12,800
Speaker 1: when it comes to plants, Like if I go to

1279
01:07:12,840 --> 01:07:15,280
Speaker 1: like a median and go plant some trees, Like as

1280
01:07:15,320 --> 01:07:17,040
Speaker 1: long as I act like I know what I'm doing

1281
01:07:17,120 --> 01:07:20,200
Speaker 1: and like don't look like I'm trying to be sneaky,

1282
01:07:20,320 --> 01:07:22,920
Speaker 1: no one ever questions me. And that that's the key thing,

1283
01:07:22,960 --> 01:07:25,000
Speaker 1: is to really make it clear that like, you know,

1284
01:07:25,120 --> 01:07:28,480
Speaker 1: you're supposed to be there when whenever I eventually I'll

1285
01:07:28,480 --> 01:07:31,360
Speaker 1: put together an episode on like urban Stealth and stuff,

1286
01:07:31,400 --> 01:07:34,480
Speaker 1: And there's nothing more powerful than like a hive is

1287
01:07:34,560 --> 01:07:39,720
Speaker 1: vest just an incredibly powerful tool for making people glaze

1288
01:07:39,760 --> 01:07:42,360
Speaker 1: over you and think you're a professional. It's amazing. Or

1289
01:07:42,400 --> 01:07:44,320
Speaker 1: in this case, like when I'm doing what I do,

1290
01:07:44,640 --> 01:07:48,200
Speaker 1: you know, I'll borrow someone's old beat up pickup truck

1291
01:07:48,480 --> 01:07:50,200
Speaker 1: and throw a couple of big trees in the back

1292
01:07:50,360 --> 01:07:52,040
Speaker 1: and like you see that pulled over on the side

1293
01:07:52,040 --> 01:07:54,000
Speaker 1: of the road with its hazard lights on, nobody's going

1294
01:07:54,040 --> 01:07:55,920
Speaker 1: to question that. It's like a town or a city,

1295
01:07:55,960 --> 01:07:58,000
Speaker 1: and if somebody from the town shows up as I'm

1296
01:07:58,000 --> 01:08:02,640
Speaker 1: from the DPW or whatever, Yeah, there's it's incredibly incredibly

1297
01:08:02,720 --> 01:08:06,240
Speaker 1: useful um and yeah, but like getting to know you know.

1298
01:08:06,280 --> 01:08:07,720
Speaker 1: If you're like I don't know where to find a

1299
01:08:07,760 --> 01:08:09,800
Speaker 1: local you know, I don't know how to like where

1300
01:08:09,840 --> 01:08:12,320
Speaker 1: I would pick a local community garden spot, be like

1301
01:08:12,600 --> 01:08:14,680
Speaker 1: you should like get to know your local area. In

1302
01:08:14,720 --> 01:08:17,439
Speaker 1: another great way of figuring out how to start doing

1303
01:08:17,479 --> 01:08:19,639
Speaker 1: any mutulate or anything. It's like you need to know

1304
01:08:19,880 --> 01:08:22,400
Speaker 1: where you live and like what's what's around you? Who

1305
01:08:22,439 --> 01:08:24,679
Speaker 1: others who you know? Maybe in your search to find

1306
01:08:24,680 --> 01:08:27,479
Speaker 1: a community garden you might find one that already exists.

1307
01:08:27,520 --> 01:08:30,240
Speaker 1: If you're unfamiliar with your you know, with if you're

1308
01:08:30,240 --> 01:08:32,720
Speaker 1: in a metropolitan area or if you're more out in

1309
01:08:32,720 --> 01:08:35,200
Speaker 1: the middle of nowhere, you may not know what's around you.

1310
01:08:35,400 --> 01:08:38,240
Speaker 1: And I mean looking out to see what's actually in

1311
01:08:38,240 --> 01:08:40,040
Speaker 1: a community. It is one of the first big steps

1312
01:08:40,640 --> 01:08:43,200
Speaker 1: to have any kind of and that plays out also

1313
01:08:43,360 --> 01:08:46,120
Speaker 1: in ecology. So you know, if you're in a city,

1314
01:08:46,160 --> 01:08:49,920
Speaker 1: most cities have public horst parks, whatever it might be.

1315
01:08:50,520 --> 01:08:53,080
Speaker 1: And part of not knowing what's around you, or knowing

1316
01:08:53,200 --> 01:08:56,200
Speaker 1: rather what's around you is starting to identify the plants

1317
01:08:56,240 --> 01:08:59,439
Speaker 1: that are already around you. And while there's been a

1318
01:08:59,439 --> 01:09:01,439
Speaker 1: lot of action and in terms of thinking about things

1319
01:09:01,520 --> 01:09:05,439
Speaker 1: like foraging. Um, there's there's a ton of opportunity for

1320
01:09:05,560 --> 01:09:08,479
Speaker 1: us to start looking at foods that we don't traditionally

1321
01:09:08,479 --> 01:09:13,519
Speaker 1: think of foods but produce a ton of calories. So

1322
01:09:13,640 --> 01:09:17,240
Speaker 1: something like oaks. Oaks are across the United States. I

1323
01:09:17,240 --> 01:09:20,480
Speaker 1: don't think there's any state without oak trees and acorns

1324
01:09:20,479 --> 01:09:22,639
Speaker 1: can be a huge part of anyone's diet if they're

1325
01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:24,920
Speaker 1: willing to take the time and warn about them. And

1326
01:09:24,960 --> 01:09:27,719
Speaker 1: that's not something that's radical or anything. It's something that's

1327
01:09:27,760 --> 01:09:30,920
Speaker 1: been done for thousands of years. It's just in in

1328
01:09:31,000 --> 01:09:34,800
Speaker 1: our lifetime, in our parents lifetime, that that knowledge and

1329
01:09:34,880 --> 01:09:37,880
Speaker 1: that experience has been mostly lost. But it's not something

1330
01:09:37,920 --> 01:09:43,880
Speaker 1: that's weird or unaccessible or any of those types of things. Absolutely, Um,

1331
01:09:44,200 --> 01:09:46,840
Speaker 1: I think this is actually a decent cutting off point

1332
01:09:46,920 --> 01:09:50,240
Speaker 1: for this episode and then the next in in in

1333
01:09:50,280 --> 01:09:52,400
Speaker 1: the In the next episode in the feed here we

1334
01:09:52,479 --> 01:09:57,040
Speaker 1: will focus more on ecology, um, books, more on soil,

1335
01:09:57,160 --> 01:09:59,120
Speaker 1: and maybe get into permaculture and some other kind of

1336
01:09:59,120 --> 01:10:01,240
Speaker 1: stuff because I would love to. Yeah, I learn more

1337
01:10:01,240 --> 01:10:05,599
Speaker 1: about you know, specific soil stuff and you know different

1338
01:10:05,680 --> 01:10:08,439
Speaker 1: you know, more insight to our current like growing situation.

1339
01:10:08,479 --> 01:10:10,719
Speaker 1: Overall as like a country and how you know stuff

1340
01:10:10,760 --> 01:10:14,160
Speaker 1: is changing. But um, would you like to plug anything

1341
01:10:14,160 --> 01:10:16,799
Speaker 1: really to you or any other resources on this topic

1342
01:10:16,880 --> 01:10:20,879
Speaker 1: before we head out? Absolutely so we are a podcast.

1343
01:10:20,920 --> 01:10:24,320
Speaker 1: Go check us out or Pearls dot com or Spotify.

1344
01:10:24,360 --> 01:10:26,559
Speaker 1: Wherever you're listening to this podcast, you can go check

1345
01:10:26,600 --> 01:10:29,240
Speaker 1: out some of our work. We're also on Instagram and

1346
01:10:29,240 --> 01:10:32,200
Speaker 1: Facebook like everyone else, and you can go follow us

1347
01:10:32,200 --> 01:10:35,640
Speaker 1: over there. Fantastic. Um. If you want to keep up

1348
01:10:35,640 --> 01:10:38,000
Speaker 1: to date on stuff for this show, you can follow

1349
01:10:38,080 --> 01:10:40,640
Speaker 1: cool Zone cool Zone Media and Happen Here pod on

1350
01:10:40,640 --> 01:10:43,439
Speaker 1: Twitter and Instagram and you can catch more. It could

1351
01:10:43,479 --> 01:10:47,080
Speaker 1: happen here daily in this feed. Uh see you tomorrow.

1352
01:10:47,439 --> 01:11:02,679
Speaker 1: By the art, it is essentially a money laundering business.

1353
01:11:03,200 --> 01:11:05,800
Speaker 1: The best fakes are still hanging on people's walls. You

1354
01:11:05,840 --> 01:11:09,240
Speaker 1: know they don't even know or suspect that they're fakes.

1355
01:11:09,439 --> 01:11:13,360
Speaker 1: I'm Alec Baldwin and this is a podcast about deception,

1356
01:11:13,720 --> 01:11:17,080
Speaker 1: greed and forgery in the art world. You knew the

1357
01:11:17,080 --> 01:11:23,840
Speaker 1: painting was fake. Um, Listen to Art Fraud starting February

1358
01:11:23,960 --> 01:11:28,240
Speaker 1: one on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or

1359
01:11:28,320 --> 01:11:40,200
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. I call the Union Hall

1360
01:11:40,520 --> 01:11:43,519
Speaker 1: as it's about life and death. I think these people

1361
01:11:43,560 --> 01:11:48,200
Speaker 1: of planning to kill Dr King. On April four, Dr

1362
01:11:48,280 --> 01:11:50,800
Speaker 1: Martin Luther King was shot and killed in Memphis. A

1363
01:11:50,840 --> 01:11:54,400
Speaker 1: petty criminal named James Earl Ray was arrested. He pled

1364
01:11:54,400 --> 01:11:56,439
Speaker 1: guilty to the crime and spent the rest of his

1365
01:11:56,520 --> 01:12:02,000
Speaker 1: life in prison. Case closed right, James Hill Ray was

1366
01:12:02,040 --> 01:12:06,800
Speaker 1: a pawn For the official story, the authorities would parade, Oh,

1367
01:12:06,920 --> 01:12:09,720
Speaker 1: we found a gun the James L. Ray bought in

1368
01:12:09,840 --> 01:12:13,880
Speaker 1: Birmingham that killed Dr King. Except it wasn't the gun

1369
01:12:13,920 --> 01:12:17,120
Speaker 1: that killed Dr. King. One of the problems that came

1370
01:12:17,160 --> 01:12:20,640
Speaker 1: out when I got the Ray case was that some

1371
01:12:20,800 --> 01:12:23,920
Speaker 1: of the evidence, as far as I was concerned, did

1372
01:12:23,960 --> 01:12:28,280
Speaker 1: not match the circumstances. This is the MLK Tapes. The

1373
01:12:28,320 --> 01:12:31,479
Speaker 1: first episodes are available now. Listen on the I Heart

1374
01:12:31,560 --> 01:12:35,080
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

1375
01:12:37,080 --> 01:12:40,200
Speaker 1: Raffie is the voice of some of the happiest songs

1376
01:12:40,240 --> 01:12:45,320
Speaker 1: of our generation, Baby the Luga. So who is the

1377
01:12:45,360 --> 01:12:50,320
Speaker 1: man behind Baby Bluga? Every human being wants to feel respected.

1378
01:12:50,720 --> 01:12:55,400
Speaker 1: When we start with all good things can grow from there.

1379
01:12:55,640 --> 01:12:58,799
Speaker 1: I'm Chris Garcia, comedian, New Dad and host of Finding

1380
01:12:58,840 --> 01:13:01,360
Speaker 1: Raffie a new pod cast from my Heart Radio and

1381
01:13:01,479 --> 01:13:04,679
Speaker 1: Fatherly Listen every Tuesday on the I Heart Radio app

1382
01:13:04,880 --> 01:13:17,120
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. It's Soil Tom. Hello,

1383
01:13:17,280 --> 01:13:21,559
Speaker 1: Welcome to it could happen here. We're talking about We're

1384
01:13:21,560 --> 01:13:26,040
Speaker 1: talking about dirt today, big big, big dirt fans here.

1385
01:13:26,240 --> 01:13:30,000
Speaker 1: We love we love dirt, we love soil. Um. And

1386
01:13:30,080 --> 01:13:33,320
Speaker 1: to help us talk about soil, dirt, ecology, growing, for

1387
01:13:34,040 --> 01:13:38,280
Speaker 1: forging all of this kind of stuff, we have Andy

1388
01:13:38,479 --> 01:13:42,080
Speaker 1: from the Poor Pearl's Almanac podcast about you know what

1389
01:13:42,240 --> 01:13:45,960
Speaker 1: to do after you know, stuff kind of crumbles away slowly,

1390
01:13:46,040 --> 01:13:48,840
Speaker 1: kind of kind of like kind of like our podcast. Um,

1391
01:13:48,880 --> 01:13:52,800
Speaker 1: and we're not like our soil hopefully. Well I got

1392
01:13:52,800 --> 01:13:55,840
Speaker 1: some bad news for you there. Some of us are

1393
01:13:55,840 --> 01:13:58,519
Speaker 1: not great at cultivating soil, which is what we are

1394
01:13:58,520 --> 01:14:01,519
Speaker 1: talking about today is how to avoid getting a lot

1395
01:14:01,520 --> 01:14:04,000
Speaker 1: of void, Like how can we help help against our

1396
01:14:04,040 --> 01:14:09,080
Speaker 1: soil just blowing away? Um? Yeah, that is that is

1397
01:14:09,120 --> 01:14:11,160
Speaker 1: that is our discussion. I I wrapped up like a

1398
01:14:11,200 --> 01:14:16,639
Speaker 1: week of research on California's specific climate and drought and

1399
01:14:16,680 --> 01:14:19,240
Speaker 1: what all the farmers are doing. Um, and a lot

1400
01:14:19,280 --> 01:14:21,639
Speaker 1: of their soil is blowing away and so far their

1401
01:14:21,680 --> 01:14:23,920
Speaker 1: solution to that is just spray more water on it,

1402
01:14:24,120 --> 01:14:28,000
Speaker 1: which the problem is there's not tons of water. Um,

1403
01:14:28,120 --> 01:14:32,400
Speaker 1: so let's talk about dirt. Let's talk about soil. I

1404
01:14:32,439 --> 01:14:36,000
Speaker 1: will hand it over to the residents. Soy boy, the

1405
01:14:36,080 --> 01:14:39,599
Speaker 1: soil expert here, because I don't know what I'm talking

1406
01:14:39,600 --> 01:14:43,280
Speaker 1: about with dirts are getting famous, I know I have.

1407
01:14:43,439 --> 01:14:46,200
Speaker 1: That was that was just that I was just ripping,

1408
01:14:46,479 --> 01:14:48,840
Speaker 1: ripping off of a title of one of his episodes.

1409
01:14:48,920 --> 01:14:52,240
Speaker 1: So that's not original. Blame him for the pond. Sorry,

1410
01:14:52,400 --> 01:14:57,160
Speaker 1: I do that a lot. So in terms of building soil,

1411
01:14:57,400 --> 01:15:02,160
Speaker 1: there's it's really a basic idea of how to do it,

1412
01:15:02,400 --> 01:15:05,800
Speaker 1: and it generally comes down to understanding what a soil

1413
01:15:05,880 --> 01:15:09,160
Speaker 1: needs and how to let the soil build through rest

1414
01:15:09,920 --> 01:15:13,040
Speaker 1: and generally speaking, when we plant our annual crops, what

1415
01:15:13,160 --> 01:15:15,360
Speaker 1: happens is you put your tomato plants in the ground,

1416
01:15:15,400 --> 01:15:19,040
Speaker 1: whatever it might be, you've got a great harvest, you know,

1417
01:15:19,120 --> 01:15:21,800
Speaker 1: let them die, clear them out, and then the next

1418
01:15:21,880 --> 01:15:24,519
Speaker 1: year maybe you throw some more compost on it, or

1419
01:15:24,560 --> 01:15:26,800
Speaker 1: maybe you're like, yeah, I just don't want time, I

1420
01:15:26,840 --> 01:15:28,600
Speaker 1: won't do it, and you'll grow and you might have

1421
01:15:28,640 --> 01:15:31,040
Speaker 1: a pretty decent crop again. And then usually by like

1422
01:15:31,080 --> 01:15:33,120
Speaker 1: the third year, you start to notice that your plants

1423
01:15:33,120 --> 01:15:35,800
Speaker 1: just aren't doing as well, like all the nutrients and

1424
01:15:35,840 --> 01:15:38,280
Speaker 1: the minerals have started to get taken out of the soil.

1425
01:15:38,760 --> 01:15:42,200
Speaker 1: So you can either continuously add new material to it,

1426
01:15:42,240 --> 01:15:46,040
Speaker 1: which comes from somewhere. Doesn't seem very sustainable. Yeah, it's

1427
01:15:46,080 --> 01:15:49,639
Speaker 1: absolutely not sustainable. And the alternative is to think about

1428
01:15:49,640 --> 01:15:51,960
Speaker 1: how can I build up that soil without doing that,

1429
01:15:52,360 --> 01:15:54,200
Speaker 1: And there's a couple of different ways we can do that.

1430
01:15:55,360 --> 01:15:59,200
Speaker 1: The soil can get built from things like cover crops,

1431
01:15:59,479 --> 01:16:03,080
Speaker 1: so we can add cover crops generally things like nitrogen

1432
01:16:03,160 --> 01:16:07,759
Speaker 1: fixing plants, Clover's hairy vetch and a number of others

1433
01:16:07,760 --> 01:16:10,639
Speaker 1: that we can use to help fix nitrogen into the soil.

1434
01:16:11,200 --> 01:16:13,800
Speaker 1: Or we can add other things to add biomass. So

1435
01:16:14,000 --> 01:16:17,160
Speaker 1: certain grasses and things like that can be planted and

1436
01:16:17,200 --> 01:16:19,960
Speaker 1: they'll mind deep into the soil to pull up nutrients

1437
01:16:20,200 --> 01:16:22,400
Speaker 1: when they die off, or you can cut them down

1438
01:16:22,760 --> 01:16:25,559
Speaker 1: they start breaking down, they return those nutrients back, but

1439
01:16:25,600 --> 01:16:27,920
Speaker 1: they're on the top soil now, So that's another way

1440
01:16:27,920 --> 01:16:31,080
Speaker 1: we can do it. Alternatively, if we're talking about a

1441
01:16:31,120 --> 01:16:33,720
Speaker 1: little bit more land, you can take advantage of using

1442
01:16:33,760 --> 01:16:39,680
Speaker 1: animals so chickens, rabbits, cheap cows, whatever it might be,

1443
01:16:40,200 --> 01:16:44,439
Speaker 1: reintroduce nutrients back into the soil through things like rotational grazing.

1444
01:16:44,960 --> 01:16:47,280
Speaker 1: And there's a you know that, that's a whole other

1445
01:16:47,360 --> 01:16:50,600
Speaker 1: subject of you know, how different methods are better or

1446
01:16:50,680 --> 01:16:54,080
Speaker 1: worse for fixing nitrogen and all the other nutrients back

1447
01:16:54,080 --> 01:16:57,080
Speaker 1: into the soil. And we can talk about it. I

1448
01:16:57,120 --> 01:16:59,000
Speaker 1: don't know if you want to spend an hour talking

1449
01:16:59,000 --> 01:17:02,360
Speaker 1: about it. I assume that that definitely depends on the

1450
01:17:02,439 --> 01:17:05,559
Speaker 1: scale of your operation. I would assume absolutely. And you

1451
01:17:05,600 --> 01:17:08,839
Speaker 1: can do that on a smaller scale, not necessarily cows,

1452
01:17:08,920 --> 01:17:12,839
Speaker 1: but like chickens. Chickens can be run through chicken tractors,

1453
01:17:12,840 --> 01:17:15,280
Speaker 1: which can be as small as you know, three ft

1454
01:17:15,280 --> 01:17:18,519
Speaker 1: by six ft. We were making, yeah, we were making

1455
01:17:18,560 --> 01:17:23,759
Speaker 1: some fertilizer a few months ago and basically we raked

1456
01:17:23,840 --> 01:17:27,000
Speaker 1: up well I didn't. I watched as people did this

1457
01:17:27,040 --> 01:17:30,840
Speaker 1: because I was lazy. I watched people just rake up

1458
01:17:31,000 --> 01:17:35,439
Speaker 1: tons of sheep shit, um, because there we have there's

1459
01:17:35,439 --> 01:17:37,920
Speaker 1: a little sheep set up, um. And they were just

1460
01:17:38,160 --> 01:17:40,840
Speaker 1: raking up all the ship and putting into a pile

1461
01:17:40,840 --> 01:17:44,760
Speaker 1: of dirt. And now it's been like a it's been

1462
01:17:44,800 --> 01:17:46,640
Speaker 1: like a month or two, and we should have some

1463
01:17:46,760 --> 01:17:49,960
Speaker 1: okay fertilizer by now, which we can you know, use

1464
01:17:50,320 --> 01:17:54,800
Speaker 1: however we see fit. But chickens, chickens, chickens as well

1465
01:17:55,560 --> 01:17:59,520
Speaker 1: not not everyone probably has sheep or access to sheep um,

1466
01:17:59,560 --> 01:18:02,960
Speaker 1: but chicks are surprisingly easy to get. Yeah, and depending

1467
01:18:03,000 --> 01:18:05,400
Speaker 1: on the city or in h you can live in

1468
01:18:05,439 --> 01:18:08,559
Speaker 1: pretty dense places and still legally have chickens. You might

1469
01:18:08,560 --> 01:18:10,599
Speaker 1: have to get comfortable with the idea of slaughtering a rooster,

1470
01:18:10,760 --> 01:18:13,840
Speaker 1: but other than that, you know, there's it's funny because

1471
01:18:13,840 --> 01:18:15,880
Speaker 1: what you'll see is like in the early spring everyone

1472
01:18:15,880 --> 01:18:19,880
Speaker 1: gets chickens, and then by like July, you on on

1473
01:18:20,040 --> 01:18:26,240
Speaker 1: Craigslist or Facebook or Instagram, everyone's like, free rooster to

1474
01:18:26,320 --> 01:18:31,840
Speaker 1: good home because they can't slaughter themselves. Yeah, I've had

1475
01:18:31,920 --> 01:18:35,240
Speaker 1: I've had to watch a few roosters get the get

1476
01:18:35,280 --> 01:18:38,920
Speaker 1: the old old acts. There was there was this one

1477
01:18:39,040 --> 01:18:42,160
Speaker 1: rooster that would always wake up as we were all

1478
01:18:42,200 --> 01:18:43,840
Speaker 1: going to bed. We would have like we have like

1479
01:18:43,840 --> 01:18:46,519
Speaker 1: a movie night, um, and we're like going to bed

1480
01:18:46,560 --> 01:18:49,880
Speaker 1: at four am, and that's when the rooster starts. We're like, no,

1481
01:18:50,000 --> 01:18:51,920
Speaker 1: we're trying to sleep and we're like we need to

1482
01:18:52,000 --> 01:18:56,800
Speaker 1: kill that rooster. It's only time one bad day to

1483
01:18:56,840 --> 01:19:02,040
Speaker 1: be like I cannot listen to that sound again. At

1484
01:19:02,080 --> 01:19:04,679
Speaker 1: least at least it went to some good use. Yeah,

1485
01:19:04,720 --> 01:19:08,439
Speaker 1: anyway back to dirt. Yeah, let's see where we keep

1486
01:19:08,439 --> 01:19:12,720
Speaker 1: talking about reintroducing stuff via you know, chemical means, I mean,

1487
01:19:12,880 --> 01:19:17,280
Speaker 1: or or just using animals and stuff, or or rotating plants. Yeah.

1488
01:19:17,320 --> 01:19:19,280
Speaker 1: So there's a bunch of different ways you can do it,

1489
01:19:19,320 --> 01:19:23,200
Speaker 1: and obviously it's all defined by what your site needs.

1490
01:19:23,880 --> 01:19:25,840
Speaker 1: You know, the way we're talking at this point has

1491
01:19:25,880 --> 01:19:28,080
Speaker 1: been mostly about like you already have a garden and

1492
01:19:28,120 --> 01:19:30,880
Speaker 1: that soil needs to be amended to improve it. But

1493
01:19:30,920 --> 01:19:33,599
Speaker 1: if you're working with, say a site that has almost

1494
01:19:33,600 --> 01:19:37,400
Speaker 1: no top soil. So for example, a friend of mine

1495
01:19:37,400 --> 01:19:40,360
Speaker 1: out in California lives near a highway and they had

1496
01:19:40,479 --> 01:19:44,080
Speaker 1: scraped all the top soil around the highway to build

1497
01:19:44,160 --> 01:19:47,439
Speaker 1: up the highway. So now there's no top soil, it's

1498
01:19:47,479 --> 01:19:50,519
Speaker 1: just garbage. So how do you build that soil up?

1499
01:19:50,600 --> 01:19:52,360
Speaker 1: And there's a bunch of different ways we can do that,

1500
01:19:52,400 --> 01:19:57,320
Speaker 1: whether it's through taking advantage of free resources like um mulch,

1501
01:19:57,720 --> 01:19:59,600
Speaker 1: like if you see a tree getting cut down, and

1502
01:19:59,640 --> 01:20:02,120
Speaker 1: they it it all up. Those guys have to pay

1503
01:20:02,160 --> 01:20:03,600
Speaker 1: to get rid of it most of the time, or

1504
01:20:03,640 --> 01:20:06,760
Speaker 1: they get paid just enough to cover their gas. So

1505
01:20:06,800 --> 01:20:08,120
Speaker 1: if you see it down the street and say, hey,

1506
01:20:08,120 --> 01:20:09,559
Speaker 1: you want to drop it off in my house, they'll

1507
01:20:09,640 --> 01:20:12,479
Speaker 1: happily do it. Yeah. We we just found out there

1508
01:20:12,560 --> 01:20:16,320
Speaker 1: is this business in Portland that you can email them

1509
01:20:16,360 --> 01:20:18,600
Speaker 1: to do a chip drop where they take all of

1510
01:20:18,640 --> 01:20:21,000
Speaker 1: their mulchion wood chips and drop them off in your

1511
01:20:21,080 --> 01:20:24,120
Speaker 1: driveway and it's completely free you you you you don't

1512
01:20:24,120 --> 01:20:26,360
Speaker 1: need to pay for it. You can just schedule them

1513
01:20:26,360 --> 01:20:28,880
Speaker 1: to drop it off anywhere. And a short aside, we

1514
01:20:28,920 --> 01:20:32,160
Speaker 1: also found out that they don't require address verification, so

1515
01:20:32,200 --> 01:20:34,759
Speaker 1: you can do this as a prank. Um. You can

1516
01:20:34,800 --> 01:20:38,320
Speaker 1: find out where the mayor lives, um or where I

1517
01:20:38,360 --> 01:20:41,599
Speaker 1: don't know a particularly bad person lives. Let's say he

1518
01:20:41,640 --> 01:20:45,360
Speaker 1: wears armor and he brutalizes people and threatens them with

1519
01:20:45,360 --> 01:20:48,120
Speaker 1: guns while having a bad you can find out if

1520
01:20:48,280 --> 01:20:49,960
Speaker 1: you know where it lives, you can just deliver tons

1521
01:20:50,000 --> 01:20:52,760
Speaker 1: of wood chips right right on this driveway. Um. And

1522
01:20:52,760 --> 01:20:55,320
Speaker 1: and they have a rule on their website is once

1523
01:20:55,400 --> 01:20:58,200
Speaker 1: a delivery has been initiated, it's like once the truck leaves,

1524
01:20:58,360 --> 01:21:01,280
Speaker 1: you know, their office, it cannot be stopped. There's no way,

1525
01:21:01,760 --> 01:21:04,240
Speaker 1: there's no way preventing it, and they don't contact the

1526
01:21:04,280 --> 01:21:07,960
Speaker 1: house beforehead, no way preventing it. Just a random, random

1527
01:21:08,200 --> 01:21:12,200
Speaker 1: wood chip drop anywhere in any driveway. It's a magical system.

1528
01:21:12,240 --> 01:21:13,880
Speaker 1: But you can also just use this for you know,

1529
01:21:13,960 --> 01:21:16,679
Speaker 1: getting wood chips to help grow things. Yeah, and we'll

1530
01:21:16,840 --> 01:21:19,400
Speaker 1: just such an underrated medium. It's like really good for

1531
01:21:19,479 --> 01:21:22,840
Speaker 1: like water retention and helping soil not dry out too fast.

1532
01:21:22,920 --> 01:21:26,600
Speaker 1: It's it's not just like aesthetically nice looking and accessible,

1533
01:21:26,680 --> 01:21:29,400
Speaker 1: it's also like really good for the plants. So I'll

1534
01:21:29,400 --> 01:21:31,880
Speaker 1: add two caveats to that. And the first is that

1535
01:21:32,600 --> 01:21:34,920
Speaker 1: it's really important to know what species you're dealing with

1536
01:21:35,040 --> 01:21:38,440
Speaker 1: that are the wood chips, because certain species have chemicals

1537
01:21:38,439 --> 01:21:42,679
Speaker 1: on them that will reduce growth or stop it completely.

1538
01:21:43,160 --> 01:21:46,000
Speaker 1: So like black walnuts are really well known and on

1539
01:21:46,040 --> 01:21:49,679
Speaker 1: the East Coast as having what's called juglone, And there's

1540
01:21:49,680 --> 01:21:52,719
Speaker 1: a bunch of different species that again are probably unique

1541
01:21:52,720 --> 01:21:54,559
Speaker 1: to where you live that you should just be aware of.

1542
01:21:55,280 --> 01:21:58,479
Speaker 1: And the second one is that mulch and wood chips

1543
01:21:58,520 --> 01:22:02,840
Speaker 1: are fantastic for your arden However, the one drawback is

1544
01:22:02,880 --> 01:22:06,040
Speaker 1: that for the wood chips to break down, they actually

1545
01:22:06,120 --> 01:22:08,800
Speaker 1: utilize a lot of the nitrogen in the soil. So

1546
01:22:08,840 --> 01:22:10,600
Speaker 1: that's just so you may have a bit of a

1547
01:22:10,720 --> 01:22:13,240
Speaker 1: nitrogen problem or some kind of nitrogen fixing, So it

1548
01:22:13,240 --> 01:22:16,320
Speaker 1: would be more important to think about cover crops and

1549
01:22:17,080 --> 01:22:20,559
Speaker 1: either adding fresh compost or whatever it might be help

1550
01:22:20,640 --> 01:22:24,040
Speaker 1: offset some of that nitrogen absorption. So so it's not

1551
01:22:24,560 --> 01:22:26,920
Speaker 1: it's a great resource. It's just not perfect. You just

1552
01:22:26,960 --> 01:22:30,720
Speaker 1: have to be aware of the limitations of it. I

1553
01:22:30,720 --> 01:22:34,880
Speaker 1: would like to touch on why we're in a bit

1554
01:22:34,880 --> 01:22:37,160
Speaker 1: of a pickle, like what what what what have we

1555
01:22:37,280 --> 01:22:41,800
Speaker 1: done agriculturally to kind of make our soil so unfragile?

1556
01:22:41,880 --> 01:22:45,000
Speaker 1: Like what what did we do wrong? Um on? Like

1557
01:22:45,080 --> 01:22:47,800
Speaker 1: even on like a larger scale, and how how might

1558
01:22:47,920 --> 01:22:50,360
Speaker 1: someone like me who just has a small set up,

1559
01:22:50,680 --> 01:22:52,720
Speaker 1: you know, not make the same mistakes in my own

1560
01:22:52,720 --> 01:22:58,799
Speaker 1: personal garden. Sure, so the beginning of the food system

1561
01:22:58,960 --> 01:23:02,439
Speaker 1: becoming what it is to day really started with oil.

1562
01:23:03,880 --> 01:23:08,679
Speaker 1: Access to things like petrochemicals allowed us to start rethinking

1563
01:23:08,720 --> 01:23:14,080
Speaker 1: about how we grew food and forgetting about traditional methods. Summarily,

1564
01:23:14,160 --> 01:23:16,120
Speaker 1: things like using the newer I mean, you think about it,

1565
01:23:16,560 --> 01:23:20,800
Speaker 1: you eat, all the nutrients go out the sewer, and

1566
01:23:20,840 --> 01:23:23,320
Speaker 1: then they never go back into the soil. And we're

1567
01:23:23,800 --> 01:23:27,000
Speaker 1: constantly taking from the same soils year after year, and

1568
01:23:27,360 --> 01:23:29,720
Speaker 1: the only way we continue to produce is because we're

1569
01:23:29,760 --> 01:23:32,840
Speaker 1: dumping chemicals and forcing the soil, which is just a

1570
01:23:32,920 --> 01:23:36,679
Speaker 1: medium at this point, just dirt. It's not soil, and

1571
01:23:36,800 --> 01:23:38,760
Speaker 1: we're just making it grow food because we're adding the

1572
01:23:38,840 --> 01:23:41,519
Speaker 1: chemicals the plants need. But we've destroyed things like the

1573
01:23:41,560 --> 01:23:45,240
Speaker 1: bacterial community, the fungag community, all these different things that

1574
01:23:45,280 --> 01:23:48,680
Speaker 1: are so crucial for our food systems to be resilient

1575
01:23:49,320 --> 01:23:53,160
Speaker 1: in terms of how can we move forward. Building that

1576
01:23:53,240 --> 01:23:55,840
Speaker 1: soil is super important and understanding these cycles of where

1577
01:23:55,840 --> 01:23:59,479
Speaker 1: our food comes from. The biggest challenge really is that

1578
01:23:59,760 --> 01:24:04,000
Speaker 1: we're trying to create ethical food systems under an inethical

1579
01:24:04,600 --> 01:24:08,920
Speaker 1: economic model. Sure, so, like you'll see, like perma culture

1580
01:24:09,000 --> 01:24:11,800
Speaker 1: is like a really big thing today and for a

1581
01:24:11,840 --> 01:24:16,559
Speaker 1: lot of good reasons because it challenges that methodology. However,

1582
01:24:16,960 --> 01:24:20,000
Speaker 1: because of things like capitalism, we can't really have an

1583
01:24:20,000 --> 01:24:22,960
Speaker 1: honest conversation about the fact that a lot of people

1584
01:24:23,000 --> 01:24:25,400
Speaker 1: will tell you you can make money doing perma culture

1585
01:24:25,439 --> 01:24:28,640
Speaker 1: and you some people do, but it's not it's not

1586
01:24:28,720 --> 01:24:32,680
Speaker 1: really what people think. Like there's no way to ethically

1587
01:24:32,680 --> 01:24:37,920
Speaker 1: grow food and not have the problems of yeah, you're

1588
01:24:38,240 --> 01:24:41,519
Speaker 1: you're facing or competing with somebody that doesn't have any

1589
01:24:41,520 --> 01:24:44,640
Speaker 1: ethical guidelines or framework that you have to compete with.

1590
01:24:45,400 --> 01:24:47,120
Speaker 1: And I mean, there's plenty of things we can say

1591
01:24:47,120 --> 01:24:49,479
Speaker 1: that there are problems with perma culture, and if you want,

1592
01:24:49,560 --> 01:24:52,880
Speaker 1: we can talk about that further. But this is the

1593
01:24:52,960 --> 01:24:56,360
Speaker 1: primary reason why we can't really fundamentally rethink our food

1594
01:24:56,400 --> 01:25:01,679
Speaker 1: system until things either fall apart or capitalism no longer exists,

1595
01:25:01,760 --> 01:25:04,720
Speaker 1: or there are major subsidies for these alternatives, whatever it

1596
01:25:04,800 --> 01:25:09,360
Speaker 1: might be. Yeah, let's see, Like is even something like

1597
01:25:10,200 --> 01:25:13,720
Speaker 1: would you even say, just like someone buying pre made

1598
01:25:13,760 --> 01:25:16,439
Speaker 1: fertilizers should be avoided in that case, like would you

1599
01:25:16,479 --> 01:25:18,799
Speaker 1: would you rather you know, someone trying to make it ourselves?

1600
01:25:18,800 --> 01:25:20,720
Speaker 1: And like what's cheaper you know, like it is just

1601
01:25:20,840 --> 01:25:23,840
Speaker 1: buying fertilizer or cheaper than I would actually make it yourself.

1602
01:25:23,880 --> 01:25:26,320
Speaker 1: There's another kind of problem with these types of things

1603
01:25:26,320 --> 01:25:27,680
Speaker 1: that it turns out, you know, the way to make

1604
01:25:27,720 --> 01:25:30,920
Speaker 1: things better might cost some people more money, you know,

1605
01:25:30,960 --> 01:25:33,160
Speaker 1: than people who don't really have as many resources, you know,

1606
01:25:33,240 --> 01:25:34,920
Speaker 1: just like a regular person who's trying to do this,

1607
01:25:35,640 --> 01:25:37,519
Speaker 1: you know, they don't have as much money and would

1608
01:25:37,640 --> 01:25:40,960
Speaker 1: would just buying pre made chemicals be you know, easier

1609
01:25:40,960 --> 01:25:43,320
Speaker 1: and cheaper than doing work to kind of build it

1610
01:25:43,400 --> 01:25:48,320
Speaker 1: up more like quote unquote naturally. I mean, obviously, I

1611
01:25:48,360 --> 01:25:52,360
Speaker 1: think under capitalism, anything that's efficient in terms of time

1612
01:25:52,560 --> 01:25:56,960
Speaker 1: and um, taking advantage of things like scalability, which you know,

1613
01:25:57,560 --> 01:26:00,680
Speaker 1: mining nutrients is always going to be more efficient when

1614
01:26:00,680 --> 01:26:03,640
Speaker 1: you're doing it on a massive global scale, Like you

1615
01:26:03,680 --> 01:26:07,920
Speaker 1: really can't compete dollar for dollar. And that's at least

1616
01:26:07,960 --> 01:26:09,960
Speaker 1: with what I do with the poor pros almanac. We

1617
01:26:10,000 --> 01:26:12,640
Speaker 1: don't really focus on that and instead say this is

1618
01:26:12,680 --> 01:26:15,080
Speaker 1: how things should be, and how do we do that

1619
01:26:15,439 --> 01:26:17,760
Speaker 1: and when do we need to start doing that if

1620
01:26:17,920 --> 01:26:21,320
Speaker 1: we know that what exists today isn't sustainable and that

1621
01:26:21,520 --> 01:26:26,240
Speaker 1: ultimately this is gonna fall apart in some capacity. Yeah,

1622
01:26:26,400 --> 01:26:29,479
Speaker 1: you talked more about like trees specifically, and I would

1623
01:26:29,479 --> 01:26:31,519
Speaker 1: love to love to hear more about that, you know,

1624
01:26:32,160 --> 01:26:35,200
Speaker 1: outside of just you know, making your own like edible garden,

1625
01:26:35,920 --> 01:26:40,240
Speaker 1: doing doing other kind of ecology related related work. Sure,

1626
01:26:40,320 --> 01:26:44,439
Speaker 1: so trees have you know, so many benefits outside of

1627
01:26:44,479 --> 01:26:47,599
Speaker 1: the fact that they can produce food. Um, we could

1628
01:26:47,800 --> 01:26:50,760
Speaker 1: look at things like how they can manage a landscape

1629
01:26:50,800 --> 01:26:55,439
Speaker 1: and reduce temperature extremes, the way they can maintain soil

1630
01:26:55,600 --> 01:26:59,719
Speaker 1: quality because of um reducing things like runoff from major

1631
01:26:59,760 --> 01:27:03,000
Speaker 1: store arms, which are happening more and more frequently. YEA. Further,

1632
01:27:03,240 --> 01:27:06,400
Speaker 1: like I said, they do produce food, and they sometimes

1633
01:27:06,439 --> 01:27:09,080
Speaker 1: they produce food for us, sometimes they produce food for

1634
01:27:09,400 --> 01:27:14,240
Speaker 1: our livestock. Um. Additionally, there's a process called silvil pasture,

1635
01:27:14,280 --> 01:27:17,120
Speaker 1: which is essentially when you think of a farm, you

1636
01:27:17,160 --> 01:27:19,599
Speaker 1: think of a cow walking around in a field instead

1637
01:27:19,640 --> 01:27:23,640
Speaker 1: that cows walking around and a managed forest and the

1638
01:27:23,720 --> 01:27:27,240
Speaker 1: forest floor gets enough sunlight to grow grass, so you're

1639
01:27:27,240 --> 01:27:29,960
Speaker 1: getting the benefits of the grass as well as the trees.

1640
01:27:30,520 --> 01:27:32,799
Speaker 1: And you can either be using those trees for lumber

1641
01:27:33,000 --> 01:27:35,600
Speaker 1: or for food crops or whatever it might be, and

1642
01:27:35,640 --> 01:27:38,479
Speaker 1: you're getting the best of both worlds. And in a

1643
01:27:38,520 --> 01:27:42,520
Speaker 1: lot of ways, the civil pasture system more accurately represents

1644
01:27:42,560 --> 01:27:45,000
Speaker 1: the way the landscape had been managed, especially here in

1645
01:27:45,040 --> 01:27:49,559
Speaker 1: the northeast and generally the East coast by indigenous people. Um.

1646
01:27:49,600 --> 01:27:52,400
Speaker 1: You know, they weren't using cows, they were doing prescribed

1647
01:27:52,439 --> 01:27:55,479
Speaker 1: burns and things like that. But those environments are actually

1648
01:27:55,520 --> 01:27:58,640
Speaker 1: better for things like a deer which like to like

1649
01:27:58,760 --> 01:28:02,680
Speaker 1: to exist on like the margins of forests where they're

1650
01:28:02,680 --> 01:28:04,840
Speaker 1: getting the best of both worlds. So that was how

1651
01:28:04,880 --> 01:28:11,160
Speaker 1: they managed a wild Essentially they're wild grazing the native species. Yeah,

1652
01:28:11,160 --> 01:28:14,120
Speaker 1: and we just I'm just trying to think there's like

1653
01:28:14,280 --> 01:28:16,360
Speaker 1: we we don't really have anything like that on a

1654
01:28:16,520 --> 01:28:20,080
Speaker 1: on a large scale anymore. We've we've just jumped right

1655
01:28:20,080 --> 01:28:24,120
Speaker 1: into like the the field and pastor thing. Yeah, I mean,

1656
01:28:24,160 --> 01:28:26,000
Speaker 1: you think about it, it it makes sense that we haven't

1657
01:28:26,040 --> 01:28:30,600
Speaker 1: because of the fact that to do that requires individuality.

1658
01:28:30,800 --> 01:28:33,120
Speaker 1: In terms of how we manage a landscape. You can't

1659
01:28:33,160 --> 01:28:36,800
Speaker 1: run a machine through SBA pasture. You can't just make

1660
01:28:36,840 --> 01:28:39,240
Speaker 1: like a template and apply to every situation. Everything is

1661
01:28:39,280 --> 01:28:43,120
Speaker 1: much more unique based on their individual environment and ecosystem. Yeah,

1662
01:28:43,160 --> 01:28:45,639
Speaker 1: and then it becomes less efficient to manage in terms

1663
01:28:45,720 --> 01:28:49,120
Speaker 1: of how we manage things as a successional thing where

1664
01:28:49,120 --> 01:28:52,000
Speaker 1: we have you go through the field and you seat

1665
01:28:52,040 --> 01:28:54,240
Speaker 1: it with a giant machine, because you can do it

1666
01:28:54,320 --> 01:28:57,479
Speaker 1: faster that way, you can add whatever amendments you need

1667
01:28:57,960 --> 01:28:59,960
Speaker 1: more quickly. When it's just a flat piece of land

1668
01:29:00,200 --> 01:29:02,400
Speaker 1: with nothing in the way, so on and so on.

1669
01:29:02,479 --> 01:29:04,719
Speaker 1: It's just it doesn't It goes right in the face

1670
01:29:04,800 --> 01:29:07,880
Speaker 1: of how we think of efficiency, despite the fact, through

1671
01:29:07,920 --> 01:29:11,840
Speaker 1: its diversity it's more resilient to what's coming in terms

1672
01:29:11,840 --> 01:29:15,840
Speaker 1: of climate change, especially the logs run. Yeah. Yeah. In

1673
01:29:15,840 --> 01:29:18,120
Speaker 1: the last episode we talked a bit about grilla gardening.

1674
01:29:18,400 --> 01:29:21,080
Speaker 1: Can this like intersect with with this idea of like

1675
01:29:21,240 --> 01:29:24,120
Speaker 1: growing in the forest? Um is there? You know? I

1676
01:29:24,120 --> 01:29:28,400
Speaker 1: assume there's like a decent cross over there. Absolutely. So.

1677
01:29:28,800 --> 01:29:31,759
Speaker 1: Generally speaking, a lot of people that are into silvil

1678
01:29:31,840 --> 01:29:35,000
Speaker 1: pasture are also thinking about things like tree crops. And

1679
01:29:35,040 --> 01:29:36,920
Speaker 1: one of the things that I really focus on is

1680
01:29:36,960 --> 01:29:40,920
Speaker 1: thinking about foods that we don't traditionally think of as foods,

1681
01:29:41,000 --> 01:29:43,559
Speaker 1: or at least not as like staple crops. So like,

1682
01:29:43,560 --> 01:29:46,080
Speaker 1: while people might be familiar with kind of the odd

1683
01:29:46,080 --> 01:29:48,720
Speaker 1: fruits like per simmons, you might know what a persimmon is.

1684
01:29:48,720 --> 01:29:50,519
Speaker 1: You might have one or two, or maybe make per

1685
01:29:50,560 --> 01:29:54,960
Speaker 1: simmon bread. That's not usually a large part of anyone's diet, no,

1686
01:29:55,479 --> 01:29:57,800
Speaker 1: And that's like, that's the challenge that we really have,

1687
01:29:58,000 --> 01:30:00,920
Speaker 1: is while people like to incorporate rate these types of things,

1688
01:30:00,920 --> 01:30:04,000
Speaker 1: in permaculture into you know, how they think about their

1689
01:30:04,000 --> 01:30:07,799
Speaker 1: relationship with the environment. Like nobody's giving up their toast

1690
01:30:07,840 --> 01:30:09,479
Speaker 1: in the morning and that's you know, a third of

1691
01:30:09,520 --> 01:30:11,599
Speaker 1: your diet or whatever it might be. And that's where

1692
01:30:11,640 --> 01:30:14,479
Speaker 1: we need to fundamentally shift how we think about food.

1693
01:30:15,400 --> 01:30:18,000
Speaker 1: So you're saying that we need to change in order

1694
01:30:18,000 --> 01:30:21,000
Speaker 1: to address these large systemic issues that have caused many problems.

1695
01:30:21,320 --> 01:30:24,680
Speaker 1: We need to change the way we extract resources from

1696
01:30:24,680 --> 01:30:28,800
Speaker 1: the earth and maybe reevaluate how much we do. So yeah,

1697
01:30:28,880 --> 01:30:30,960
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, it's it's no small feed, is

1698
01:30:31,000 --> 01:30:33,120
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. I know, I'm just saying, like, you know,

1699
01:30:33,320 --> 01:30:37,360
Speaker 1: that's the this specific thing around like food and diet

1700
01:30:38,200 --> 01:30:41,200
Speaker 1: is the same root problem we have with climate change

1701
01:30:41,400 --> 01:30:44,840
Speaker 1: on a larger scale of like just doing you know,

1702
01:30:45,360 --> 01:30:49,000
Speaker 1: progress for progress's sake without realizing that this is not

1703
01:30:49,200 --> 01:30:52,559
Speaker 1: a sustainable way to do things. And infinite growing and

1704
01:30:52,600 --> 01:30:56,240
Speaker 1: like infinite expansion, maybe it is a bad idea and

1705
01:30:56,280 --> 01:30:59,320
Speaker 1: maybe it has some consequence. Who has some consequences? Who

1706
01:30:59,320 --> 01:31:01,920
Speaker 1: would have thought that infinite growth on a finite planet

1707
01:31:02,000 --> 01:31:08,280
Speaker 1: wasn't sustainable? Oops? Yeah, The point that I'm really trying

1708
01:31:08,320 --> 01:31:11,360
Speaker 1: to drive home is that we really need to rethink

1709
01:31:11,439 --> 01:31:13,760
Speaker 1: what food looks like and it has to be in

1710
01:31:13,760 --> 01:31:16,839
Speaker 1: a meaningful way that it can't just be those odds

1711
01:31:16,840 --> 01:31:20,200
Speaker 1: and ends. And that the thing I think people forget

1712
01:31:20,360 --> 01:31:22,719
Speaker 1: is that food is a huge component of our culture

1713
01:31:22,720 --> 01:31:26,240
Speaker 1: and our identity. Absolutely think about food and identity. The

1714
01:31:26,320 --> 01:31:28,960
Speaker 1: reason why our identity is surrounded around food is because

1715
01:31:29,000 --> 01:31:31,559
Speaker 1: food is the byproduct of the environment that we live in.

1716
01:31:32,080 --> 01:31:34,720
Speaker 1: And it's you know, for it's been a couple of generations,

1717
01:31:34,720 --> 01:31:38,040
Speaker 1: and we went from the reason why Italians eat x

1718
01:31:38,160 --> 01:31:41,160
Speaker 1: y z s because that's what grows there. Two I

1719
01:31:41,280 --> 01:31:43,920
Speaker 1: eat this because my family does, but I don't know why.

1720
01:31:44,240 --> 01:31:47,400
Speaker 1: And that's the way those things relate to one another

1721
01:31:47,600 --> 01:31:50,439
Speaker 1: is been completely lost, and we need to figure out

1722
01:31:50,479 --> 01:31:53,559
Speaker 1: how to do that again. Can you point to any

1723
01:31:54,160 --> 01:31:56,960
Speaker 1: examples of these things you're talking about of like you know,

1724
01:31:57,360 --> 01:31:59,920
Speaker 1: of systems existing now or in the past out of

1725
01:32:00,080 --> 01:32:04,400
Speaker 1: kind of shown these methods of viewing food and viewing

1726
01:32:05,000 --> 01:32:10,720
Speaker 1: you know, growing and soil cultivation, so like any indigenous practice,

1727
01:32:11,200 --> 01:32:13,640
Speaker 1: and like we say indigenous, and we usually mean like

1728
01:32:14,040 --> 01:32:17,360
Speaker 1: North America or South America or Australia, but even if

1729
01:32:17,400 --> 01:32:21,840
Speaker 1: you look across Europe, you know, before capitalism kind of

1730
01:32:22,320 --> 01:32:25,400
Speaker 1: got its clause into the rest of Europe or all

1731
01:32:25,439 --> 01:32:28,840
Speaker 1: of Europe, Like, there were plenty of indigenous practices and

1732
01:32:28,880 --> 01:32:33,920
Speaker 1: in some places they continue and the way that people

1733
01:32:34,000 --> 01:32:38,360
Speaker 1: lived um reflected the needs of their ecology and how

1734
01:32:38,400 --> 01:32:41,639
Speaker 1: people could relate to that ecology. The reason why Nordic

1735
01:32:41,680 --> 01:32:44,360
Speaker 1: countries have high amounts of meat in their diet is

1736
01:32:44,360 --> 01:32:46,719
Speaker 1: because of what grows there and what how they can

1737
01:32:46,960 --> 01:32:50,200
Speaker 1: utilize book grows there to feed themselves through animals and

1738
01:32:50,240 --> 01:32:54,240
Speaker 1: things like that. M hmm, yeah, I mean that is

1739
01:32:54,360 --> 01:32:57,559
Speaker 1: that is generally what we hear is you know, look

1740
01:32:57,560 --> 01:33:01,479
Speaker 1: at the various indigenous methods of growing um and how

1741
01:33:01,520 --> 01:33:03,400
Speaker 1: they how they fed people in their media the area,

1742
01:33:03,400 --> 01:33:05,920
Speaker 1: and thinking like how can we take those similar ideas

1743
01:33:05,960 --> 01:33:09,000
Speaker 1: and scale it up? Because I mean, they weren't growing

1744
01:33:09,040 --> 01:33:11,639
Speaker 1: food for seven billion people. But I know, like we

1745
01:33:11,680 --> 01:33:14,599
Speaker 1: grow way too much food for what for many people,

1746
01:33:15,280 --> 01:33:17,320
Speaker 1: maybe not too much food, just we distribute it in

1747
01:33:17,320 --> 01:33:19,840
Speaker 1: a very unefficient way because we don't do it for

1748
01:33:19,920 --> 01:33:21,519
Speaker 1: what we need. We do it for profits, and like

1749
01:33:21,560 --> 01:33:23,320
Speaker 1: we we we throw away so much food that we

1750
01:33:23,360 --> 01:33:27,040
Speaker 1: grow as you know, globally UM. But I you know,

1751
01:33:27,040 --> 01:33:29,479
Speaker 1: when I think of these more like older methods of

1752
01:33:29,479 --> 01:33:32,479
Speaker 1: growing food. It's it's harder for me to picture that,

1753
01:33:32,520 --> 01:33:36,080
Speaker 1: you know, feeding an entire city, right, And I don't

1754
01:33:36,080 --> 01:33:38,360
Speaker 1: know what the solution is here. This isn't really the

1755
01:33:38,439 --> 01:33:40,920
Speaker 1: thing I focus on a lot. But is there a

1756
01:33:40,920 --> 01:33:43,080
Speaker 1: way to kind of scale up these like smaller scale

1757
01:33:43,120 --> 01:33:44,559
Speaker 1: things that you know, people can do in their own

1758
01:33:44,640 --> 01:33:47,439
Speaker 1: yards on any kind of mass level or is that

1759
01:33:47,479 --> 01:33:49,479
Speaker 1: just kind of rely back on the same thing. We've

1760
01:33:49,600 --> 01:33:52,080
Speaker 1: need to like re reevaluate how much we consume and

1761
01:33:52,080 --> 01:33:54,559
Speaker 1: how we consume it. So I think there's a little

1762
01:33:54,560 --> 01:33:56,600
Speaker 1: bit of both. I think we do need to reevaluate

1763
01:33:56,720 --> 01:33:59,800
Speaker 1: what we're consuming in the volume that we're consuming as well,

1764
01:34:00,080 --> 01:34:04,000
Speaker 1: is um, you know, the the waste specifically in terms

1765
01:34:04,040 --> 01:34:06,680
Speaker 1: of those two things that we tend to lose a

1766
01:34:06,680 --> 01:34:10,639
Speaker 1: lot of food that otherwise is useful um. But also

1767
01:34:10,760 --> 01:34:14,320
Speaker 1: there is a lot of opportunity and wild places like

1768
01:34:14,360 --> 01:34:17,960
Speaker 1: maybe New York City because of the development around the

1769
01:34:17,960 --> 01:34:21,000
Speaker 1: city might not there might not be any way possible

1770
01:34:21,120 --> 01:34:24,479
Speaker 1: to grow food like within the metropolitan or even the region.

1771
01:34:25,280 --> 01:34:28,800
Speaker 1: We know that like, and this is something I probably

1772
01:34:28,840 --> 01:34:31,080
Speaker 1: should have checked before the staff, but it's something like

1773
01:34:31,120 --> 01:34:34,639
Speaker 1: there's four acres of arable land for every person on Earth,

1774
01:34:35,240 --> 01:34:39,760
Speaker 1: and four acres is like that's plenty, that's plenty, That's

1775
01:34:39,760 --> 01:34:44,120
Speaker 1: absolutely plenty. Um. But like one of the things that's

1776
01:34:44,120 --> 01:34:46,559
Speaker 1: really important is to start thinking about how we can

1777
01:34:46,560 --> 01:34:50,439
Speaker 1: decentralize these systems in order to have those clusters of

1778
01:34:50,800 --> 01:34:55,040
Speaker 1: places where those things are more um capable of growing

1779
01:34:55,080 --> 01:34:58,960
Speaker 1: and handling the production that's necessary. And so maybe rethink

1780
01:34:59,000 --> 01:35:02,040
Speaker 1: about what urbanization really should be and what it should

1781
01:35:02,120 --> 01:35:05,760
Speaker 1: look like. And you know, in the future, while things

1782
01:35:05,800 --> 01:35:08,000
Speaker 1: may seem like, well, you can't ask people to leave

1783
01:35:08,040 --> 01:35:11,200
Speaker 1: New York City as climate change worsens in our food

1784
01:35:11,240 --> 01:35:13,960
Speaker 1: systems start to fall apart, that might be a much

1785
01:35:14,000 --> 01:35:17,840
Speaker 1: easier conversation to have, while today that seems kind of radical. Yeah,

1786
01:35:17,920 --> 01:35:19,880
Speaker 1: and at the very least, maybe we should maybe we

1787
01:35:19,880 --> 01:35:25,280
Speaker 1: shouldn't make any more New York cities absolutely, Um. Is

1788
01:35:25,280 --> 01:35:27,920
Speaker 1: there any like resources online that you can point to

1789
01:35:28,120 --> 01:35:30,000
Speaker 1: that talks more about these types of topics, or like

1790
01:35:30,000 --> 01:35:32,920
Speaker 1: books or like anything in this general was growing on

1791
01:35:32,960 --> 01:35:34,599
Speaker 1: the growing side of things and then like the more

1792
01:35:34,600 --> 01:35:37,439
Speaker 1: like ecology side of things. So Tom Wessels has this

1793
01:35:37,520 --> 01:35:41,040
Speaker 1: really great book called The Myth of Progress, which talks

1794
01:35:41,080 --> 01:35:44,080
Speaker 1: about complex system science and essentially what that is is

1795
01:35:44,160 --> 01:35:49,880
Speaker 1: decentralization and um, the benefits of having diversity within a

1796
01:35:49,960 --> 01:35:54,120
Speaker 1: community and the fact that any any power that's you know,

1797
01:35:54,560 --> 01:35:57,800
Speaker 1: centered in one specific place ends up having imbalances and

1798
01:35:58,120 --> 01:36:02,040
Speaker 1: has less resiliency, and that plays until it's focused around ecology.

1799
01:36:02,080 --> 01:36:05,080
Speaker 1: But I think it's really helpful, especially if you're an anarchist.

1800
01:36:05,080 --> 01:36:08,479
Speaker 1: I think you can through the lens. Yeah. Yeah, so

1801
01:36:08,520 --> 01:36:11,679
Speaker 1: that that's definitely one place to look in terms of

1802
01:36:11,880 --> 01:36:14,880
Speaker 1: like growing food. I don't know if there's really any

1803
01:36:14,880 --> 01:36:17,559
Speaker 1: books that really address it from this perspective of climate

1804
01:36:17,640 --> 01:36:21,719
Speaker 1: change and decentralization, but there's plenty of work online about

1805
01:36:21,760 --> 01:36:25,080
Speaker 1: silver pasture and you know, food force, any of these

1806
01:36:25,120 --> 01:36:29,600
Speaker 1: types of things. YouTube has like a vast array of resources,

1807
01:36:30,080 --> 01:36:32,960
Speaker 1: and of course if you're interested in this kind of stuff,

1808
01:36:33,000 --> 01:36:35,479
Speaker 1: you can come check us out on our podcast or

1809
01:36:35,479 --> 01:36:39,080
Speaker 1: proslamanac we Uh, the entire show is pretty much around

1810
01:36:39,160 --> 01:36:41,639
Speaker 1: this subject matter, So you want to learn more about

1811
01:36:41,680 --> 01:36:45,840
Speaker 1: it and check it out, Yeah, absolutely definitely. UM if

1812
01:36:45,920 --> 01:36:49,120
Speaker 1: this specific topic, you have a wonderful catalog of stuff

1813
01:36:49,160 --> 01:36:51,840
Speaker 1: discussing this UM And I just want to thank you

1814
01:36:52,000 --> 01:36:54,400
Speaker 1: they and thank you so much for coming on this

1815
01:36:54,400 --> 01:36:57,040
Speaker 1: show to kind of talk about these topics. You know,

1816
01:36:57,520 --> 01:37:00,120
Speaker 1: me and Robert and you know Chris Weed more like

1817
01:37:00,120 --> 01:37:02,519
Speaker 1: a background and like history and that kind of thing.

1818
01:37:02,560 --> 01:37:05,559
Speaker 1: We are. We are not super avid plant people. Like

1819
01:37:05,600 --> 01:37:09,519
Speaker 1: we're trying to start growing more stuff to our ourselves personally,

1820
01:37:09,760 --> 01:37:12,519
Speaker 1: but I'm definitely not educated to talk on this, and

1821
01:37:12,560 --> 01:37:15,720
Speaker 1: I'm very very happy that you were able to when

1822
01:37:15,760 --> 01:37:18,599
Speaker 1: you're generous with your time and knowledge. So thank you,

1823
01:37:18,600 --> 01:37:22,639
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Yeah, definitely check out their show

1824
01:37:22,920 --> 01:37:26,080
Speaker 1: on you know, wherever you get your podcasts, and you

1825
01:37:26,120 --> 01:37:30,160
Speaker 1: can follow the show Twitter, on Instagram at cool Zone

1826
01:37:30,200 --> 01:37:33,639
Speaker 1: Media and happen here pod um any any any final

1827
01:37:33,760 --> 01:37:38,320
Speaker 1: final notes? Grow some food? Yeah, grow some food. Grow

1828
01:37:38,439 --> 01:37:41,559
Speaker 1: some food. That is what if I've I've asked that

1829
01:37:41,640 --> 01:37:45,120
Speaker 1: question a lot and that answer has come up many times.

1830
01:37:45,160 --> 01:37:58,679
Speaker 1: Just growth, grow food. Okay, grow food. Hi. I'm Robert

1831
01:37:58,760 --> 01:38:01,920
Speaker 1: sex Reese, host of The Doctor sex re Show. And

1832
01:38:02,000 --> 01:38:05,160
Speaker 1: every episode I listened to people talk about their sex

1833
01:38:05,200 --> 01:38:09,000
Speaker 1: and intimacy issues, and yes, I despise every minute of it.

1834
01:38:09,439 --> 01:38:13,160
Speaker 1: And she she made mistakes too, she kill everyone at

1835
01:38:13,160 --> 01:38:16,120
Speaker 1: her wedding. But hell is real. We're all trapped here

1836
01:38:16,400 --> 01:38:18,640
Speaker 1: and there's nothing any of us can do about it.

1837
01:38:18,920 --> 01:38:21,800
Speaker 1: So join me, won't you? Listen to the Doctor Sex

1838
01:38:21,840 --> 01:38:24,479
Speaker 1: re Show every Tuesday on the I Heart Radio app,

1839
01:38:24,560 --> 01:38:28,120
Speaker 1: Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast. Hey Leeth

1840
01:38:28,200 --> 01:38:31,720
Speaker 1: the listeners take here. Last season on Lethal Lit, you

1841
01:38:31,800 --> 01:38:35,120
Speaker 1: might remember I came to Hollow Falls on a mission

1842
01:38:35,560 --> 01:38:39,479
Speaker 1: clearing my aunt best name and making sure justice was

1843
01:38:39,600 --> 01:38:43,479
Speaker 1: finally served. But I hadn't counted on a rash of

1844
01:38:43,560 --> 01:38:47,839
Speaker 1: new murders tearing apart the town. My mission put myself

1845
01:38:47,880 --> 01:38:51,880
Speaker 1: and my friends in danger. Though it wasn't all bad,

1846
01:38:52,320 --> 01:38:56,320
Speaker 1: I'm going to be reality take I like you, but

1847
01:38:56,400 --> 01:38:59,640
Speaker 1: now all signs point to a new serial killer in

1848
01:38:59,680 --> 01:39:03,639
Speaker 1: Hollow Falls. If this game is just starting, you better

1849
01:39:03,680 --> 01:39:08,920
Speaker 1: believe I'm gonna win. I'm tig Torres and this is

1850
01:39:09,040 --> 01:39:12,120
Speaker 1: Lethal Lit. Catch up on season one of the hit

1851
01:39:12,160 --> 01:39:15,559
Speaker 1: murder mystery podcast Lethal Lit, a tag Taara's Mystery out now,

1852
01:39:15,920 --> 01:39:18,240
Speaker 1: and then tune in for all new thrills in season two,

1853
01:39:18,479 --> 01:39:21,800
Speaker 1: dropping weekly starting February nine. Subscribe now to never miss

1854
01:39:21,800 --> 01:39:23,880
Speaker 1: an episode. Listen to Leave the Lit on the I

1855
01:39:23,960 --> 01:39:27,240
Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

1856
01:39:28,400 --> 01:39:32,879
Speaker 1: The Black Effect Presents features Honest conversations and exclusive interviews,

1857
01:39:33,280 --> 01:39:37,679
Speaker 1: a space for artists, everyday people and listeners to amplify, elevate,

1858
01:39:38,000 --> 01:39:42,000
Speaker 1: and empower black voices with great conversations. Make sure to

1859
01:39:42,040 --> 01:39:45,280
Speaker 1: listen to The Black Effect Presents podcast on I Heart Radio,

1860
01:39:45,360 --> 01:39:58,320
Speaker 1: Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcast. What's Spicy

1861
01:39:58,560 --> 01:40:04,759
Speaker 1: the Pumpkins? No, it was clipping where it's not clipping.

1862
01:40:04,840 --> 01:40:07,160
Speaker 1: You just don't like me saying what's spicy my pumpkins?

1863
01:40:07,640 --> 01:40:09,680
Speaker 1: But I said it and it can't be unsaid. It

1864
01:40:09,800 --> 01:40:12,240
Speaker 1: was because this is it could happen here, a daily

1865
01:40:12,320 --> 01:40:16,080
Speaker 1: podcast about the end of some things and the beginning

1866
01:40:16,120 --> 01:40:19,080
Speaker 1: of other things. And right now it's an episode about

1867
01:40:19,080 --> 01:40:21,200
Speaker 1: the beginning of fall. Because it's officially fall and I'm

1868
01:40:21,280 --> 01:40:25,160
Speaker 1: drinking a pumpkin spice black coffee. It's also not officially

1869
01:40:25,160 --> 01:40:27,920
Speaker 1: fall yet. It may it may be officially fall by

1870
01:40:27,960 --> 01:40:30,439
Speaker 1: the time that podcast comes in legally fall when I

1871
01:40:30,479 --> 01:40:32,880
Speaker 1: have my first pumpkin spice black coffee of the year

1872
01:40:32,920 --> 01:40:35,960
Speaker 1: and it's cool outside, that's because you're a monster. It's

1873
01:40:35,960 --> 01:40:39,400
Speaker 1: because I'm a happy man who is enjoying a fault beverage.

1874
01:40:39,920 --> 01:40:44,479
Speaker 1: On this episode, today, we have, of course Garrison. Garrison, Hello, Hi, Garrison.

1875
01:40:45,200 --> 01:40:48,120
Speaker 1: Are you doing I'm doing fine great. We also have

1876
01:40:48,800 --> 01:40:51,800
Speaker 1: my friends be in a lane b E lane. You

1877
01:40:51,800 --> 01:40:54,080
Speaker 1: you you were on the show recently to talk about

1878
01:40:54,120 --> 01:41:00,320
Speaker 1: terrorism a year ago recently everything before yesterday is a

1879
01:41:00,400 --> 01:41:02,960
Speaker 1: year ago. And uh and now you're on to talk

1880
01:41:03,000 --> 01:41:12,080
Speaker 1: about surviving. Yeah, yeah, like crafty surviving punc. We on

1881
01:41:12,360 --> 01:41:14,800
Speaker 1: because you were like two of the most useful skill

1882
01:41:14,880 --> 01:41:19,000
Speaker 1: filled people that I know. You're both wilderness survival instructors,

1883
01:41:19,040 --> 01:41:21,560
Speaker 1: primitive skill instructors for a while, and you have a

1884
01:41:21,600 --> 01:41:24,920
Speaker 1: small farm in a town that I won't name, and

1885
01:41:24,960 --> 01:41:27,080
Speaker 1: you do all sorts of cool ship like storing food

1886
01:41:27,200 --> 01:41:31,679
Speaker 1: and making arrows and other things that are alleged. And

1887
01:41:31,720 --> 01:41:33,280
Speaker 1: what I like about that is that, you know we

1888
01:41:33,280 --> 01:41:36,200
Speaker 1: talk about like collapse and and things falling apart, there's

1889
01:41:36,240 --> 01:41:38,920
Speaker 1: this kind of like I don't know, almost like mimetic

1890
01:41:39,320 --> 01:41:41,080
Speaker 1: obsession with like I want to get out into the

1891
01:41:41,080 --> 01:41:42,800
Speaker 1: woods and away from the city, and that's the only

1892
01:41:42,800 --> 01:41:45,520
Speaker 1: way to survive, and like the reality of the situations,

1893
01:41:45,560 --> 01:41:48,040
Speaker 1: that's a terrible way to survive. It's awful. There's nobody

1894
01:41:48,080 --> 01:41:51,840
Speaker 1: in there's nobody in the woods and people and it's

1895
01:41:52,200 --> 01:41:54,800
Speaker 1: you know, there's there are there are a small chunk

1896
01:41:54,840 --> 01:41:58,200
Speaker 1: of the human race that is capable with with just themselves,

1897
01:41:58,320 --> 01:42:02,320
Speaker 1: of like surviving in the middle of nowhere with nobody.

1898
01:42:02,360 --> 01:42:05,320
Speaker 1: But there's even among that population, there's a small fraction

1899
01:42:05,320 --> 01:42:08,080
Speaker 1: who are capable of doing that and not shooting themselves

1900
01:42:08,120 --> 01:42:10,599
Speaker 1: after a long enough period of time, and you wouldn't

1901
01:42:10,600 --> 01:42:12,880
Speaker 1: want to meet that person generally. Well, and I think

1902
01:42:12,920 --> 01:42:15,000
Speaker 1: the other the other thing about that is like the

1903
01:42:15,160 --> 01:42:20,639
Speaker 1: sort of fetishization of of you know, individualist survival skills

1904
01:42:21,320 --> 01:42:25,280
Speaker 1: is based on this idea that what people when people

1905
01:42:25,280 --> 01:42:28,320
Speaker 1: were like living off the land, that they were doing

1906
01:42:28,360 --> 01:42:34,880
Speaker 1: it by themselves alone. There's very few people that survived

1907
01:42:34,960 --> 01:42:37,519
Speaker 1: alone for a long time, and even of the people

1908
01:42:37,520 --> 01:42:40,559
Speaker 1: that had the skills, like even I, she wandered out

1909
01:42:40,560 --> 01:42:43,400
Speaker 1: of the woods after I think eight years of being

1910
01:42:43,600 --> 01:42:48,040
Speaker 1: by himself and was finally like fuck it. I was lonely.

1911
01:42:49,479 --> 01:42:53,880
Speaker 1: He was the last of a indigenous group in California,

1912
01:42:53,920 --> 01:42:57,360
Speaker 1: where everyone else in his tribe had been basically with

1913
01:42:57,520 --> 01:43:01,120
Speaker 1: been genocided and him and like the last like five

1914
01:43:01,360 --> 01:43:05,679
Speaker 1: people went off and hid for very good reason um

1915
01:43:05,800 --> 01:43:08,720
Speaker 1: and then after disease and stuff, then it was just

1916
01:43:08,920 --> 01:43:11,799
Speaker 1: him and he spent I forget how many years by himself,

1917
01:43:12,320 --> 01:43:15,240
Speaker 1: and after a while he finally was like, fuck it,

1918
01:43:15,680 --> 01:43:17,439
Speaker 1: being by myself is not worth it, and he came

1919
01:43:17,439 --> 01:43:19,839
Speaker 1: out and it was just after the turn of the century,

1920
01:43:20,240 --> 01:43:23,720
Speaker 1: and so he ended up being adopted by a bunch

1921
01:43:23,760 --> 01:43:26,040
Speaker 1: of anthropologists and spending the rest of his time in

1922
01:43:26,040 --> 01:43:28,479
Speaker 1: San Francisco. It's actually where we get most of a

1923
01:43:28,479 --> 01:43:31,519
Speaker 1: lot of like the anthropological knowledge of how to make arrows,

1924
01:43:31,560 --> 01:43:34,160
Speaker 1: because he was very much like, I'm the last of

1925
01:43:34,200 --> 01:43:36,600
Speaker 1: my group, so I will actually show people how to

1926
01:43:36,760 --> 01:43:39,200
Speaker 1: do flint napping and how I make arrows and how

1927
01:43:39,240 --> 01:43:42,439
Speaker 1: I hunt and yeah, and that's but I mean, and

1928
01:43:42,680 --> 01:43:45,040
Speaker 1: that's there's kind of the point there that like, with

1929
01:43:45,080 --> 01:43:47,000
Speaker 1: all of those skills, being one of that very small

1930
01:43:47,080 --> 01:43:49,240
Speaker 1: number of people, who could you drop that guy alone

1931
01:43:49,280 --> 01:43:51,200
Speaker 1: with nothing in the woods and he'll figure it out.

1932
01:43:51,479 --> 01:43:57,280
Speaker 1: He didn't want to do that. He in fact went

1933
01:43:57,560 --> 01:44:01,000
Speaker 1: into San Francisco and was like, well, people wiped out

1934
01:44:01,000 --> 01:44:06,840
Speaker 1: my entire gonna make friends with these anthropologists that live

1935
01:44:06,880 --> 01:44:09,679
Speaker 1: with them and teach them what I know. Yeah. Again,

1936
01:44:09,720 --> 01:44:11,240
Speaker 1: a lot of the folks who are kind of reaching

1937
01:44:11,240 --> 01:44:12,640
Speaker 1: out online being like, hey, I don't have a lot

1938
01:44:12,640 --> 01:44:14,280
Speaker 1: in the way of money, I'm never gonna be able

1939
01:44:14,320 --> 01:44:16,880
Speaker 1: to move to the woods and buy a farm or something. Well,

1940
01:44:16,920 --> 01:44:19,160
Speaker 1: you don't, you don't really need to. And like if

1941
01:44:19,160 --> 01:44:21,400
Speaker 1: shi it really does hit the fan. Where you live,

1942
01:44:21,400 --> 01:44:25,599
Speaker 1: there's probably parks, unless it's Detroit Um, in which case

1943
01:44:26,200 --> 01:44:28,599
Speaker 1: there's abandoned Walmart's. Like you can make it work, like

1944
01:44:28,640 --> 01:44:31,320
Speaker 1: there's it's so so this is an episode about kind

1945
01:44:31,320 --> 01:44:33,960
Speaker 1: of the skills that you can acquire and build for

1946
01:44:34,040 --> 01:44:36,640
Speaker 1: not a lot of money, more or less wherever you

1947
01:44:36,720 --> 01:44:40,519
Speaker 1: live that will help you build resiliency um but also

1948
01:44:40,560 --> 01:44:43,040
Speaker 1: build resiliency is part of a community, as opposed to

1949
01:44:43,360 --> 01:44:45,599
Speaker 1: living in the woods with a knife, sleeping under mud.

1950
01:44:47,000 --> 01:44:49,519
Speaker 1: There's a great short story that you'll turned me onto

1951
01:44:49,520 --> 01:44:52,560
Speaker 1: by Cory Doctor in a book of short stories called Radicalized.

1952
01:44:52,600 --> 01:44:54,120
Speaker 1: That was was it just called The Mask of the

1953
01:44:54,160 --> 01:44:57,120
Speaker 1: Red Death? I mean that's called The Master. Yeah. The

1954
01:44:57,160 --> 01:44:59,599
Speaker 1: original Mask of the Red Death is set obviously during

1955
01:45:00,120 --> 01:45:02,439
Speaker 1: I'm sure everybody read it in high school, like right,

1956
01:45:02,479 --> 01:45:05,280
Speaker 1: It's is set during the Bubonic plague with these rich

1957
01:45:05,320 --> 01:45:07,400
Speaker 1: people who like decided to just hold up in party

1958
01:45:07,400 --> 01:45:09,839
Speaker 1: to escape the plague and they all die of the plague.

1959
01:45:10,560 --> 01:45:14,639
Speaker 1: And doctors is a bunch of like libertarians survivalist crypto

1960
01:45:14,720 --> 01:45:17,840
Speaker 1: bros who build a fortress in the desert in order

1961
01:45:17,880 --> 01:45:20,439
Speaker 1: to survive the end of days. And it turns out

1962
01:45:20,479 --> 01:45:22,559
Speaker 1: that like a bunch of bad stuff happens, like there's

1963
01:45:22,600 --> 01:45:25,880
Speaker 1: disease in in in civil conflict, but like people figure

1964
01:45:25,920 --> 01:45:28,160
Speaker 1: it out, and all of the crypto bros die shooting

1965
01:45:28,200 --> 01:45:33,760
Speaker 1: themselves to death because the system. It's obvious from the

1966
01:45:33,800 --> 01:45:37,040
Speaker 1: start what's going and everybody who comes along to help them,

1967
01:45:37,200 --> 01:45:40,679
Speaker 1: they start shooting at you. We'll just wait until you're

1968
01:45:40,680 --> 01:45:43,240
Speaker 1: dead because you're shooting yourself because your water is bad.

1969
01:45:43,640 --> 01:45:45,519
Speaker 1: I think we all have, we all have elements of

1970
01:45:45,560 --> 01:45:48,680
Speaker 1: some libertarian tendencies in us, which you know, it's not

1971
01:45:48,760 --> 01:45:51,200
Speaker 1: bad to learn self reliance, and it's certainly not not

1972
01:45:51,320 --> 01:45:54,440
Speaker 1: even bad to want to like live outside of the city.

1973
01:45:54,640 --> 01:45:57,320
Speaker 1: But in a lot of ways, living in a living

1974
01:45:57,320 --> 01:46:00,519
Speaker 1: in an urban environment surrounded by a community, depending on

1975
01:46:00,560 --> 01:46:03,800
Speaker 1: the situation, can be even more resilient because like, yeah,

1976
01:46:03,800 --> 01:46:06,960
Speaker 1: an isolated farm instead there's benefits to but also it's

1977
01:46:07,000 --> 01:46:09,120
Speaker 1: really easy to surround and just shoot people who were

1978
01:46:09,280 --> 01:46:11,080
Speaker 1: living on their farm in the middle of nowhere. If

1979
01:46:11,160 --> 01:46:14,040
Speaker 1: ship really does hit the Fai, hap it happens all

1980
01:46:14,080 --> 01:46:16,120
Speaker 1: the time. It happened in like Al Salvador and ship

1981
01:46:16,120 --> 01:46:18,360
Speaker 1: when they had their economic crash. So I don't know

1982
01:46:18,520 --> 01:46:19,680
Speaker 1: where do you want to Where do you guys want

1983
01:46:19,720 --> 01:46:22,599
Speaker 1: to start? I know you had a couple of different

1984
01:46:22,600 --> 01:46:24,880
Speaker 1: things that you want that I want to talk about,

1985
01:46:24,960 --> 01:46:27,599
Speaker 1: Like preserving food is a big one, and then I

1986
01:46:27,600 --> 01:46:32,240
Speaker 1: mean making stuff and doing things is kind of they're

1987
01:46:32,240 --> 01:46:34,080
Speaker 1: sort of different. Where would you like to actually start

1988
01:46:34,120 --> 01:46:35,680
Speaker 1: with that? I think we can start with kind of

1989
01:46:35,680 --> 01:46:38,439
Speaker 1: the d I Y element, branching off of our original

1990
01:46:38,439 --> 01:46:41,479
Speaker 1: discussion on primitive skills, and then in like part two,

1991
01:46:41,520 --> 01:46:43,559
Speaker 1: we can go more into like food and like skin,

1992
01:46:43,720 --> 01:46:47,639
Speaker 1: like in like foraging, um and preservation and stuff. Cool.

1993
01:46:47,880 --> 01:46:52,360
Speaker 1: I mean, so d I why um? I guess now

1994
01:46:52,400 --> 01:46:56,680
Speaker 1: there's a lot of stuff about, Like there's I don't know,

1995
01:46:56,720 --> 01:46:59,360
Speaker 1: there's all this stuff about like survival skills and all

1996
01:46:59,439 --> 01:47:02,240
Speaker 1: this stuff, and both of us kind of came into

1997
01:47:03,240 --> 01:47:05,000
Speaker 1: the idea of making stuff and doing things by being

1998
01:47:05,040 --> 01:47:08,880
Speaker 1: punks um and it's kind of funny, yeah, having no money,

1999
01:47:08,960 --> 01:47:12,559
Speaker 1: but also just their d I Y like do it

2000
01:47:12,600 --> 01:47:17,200
Speaker 1: yourself was a very like kind of nineties punk thing

2001
01:47:17,240 --> 01:47:19,679
Speaker 1: that came into the mainstream like I actually was pulling

2002
01:47:19,680 --> 01:47:21,400
Speaker 1: out some of my old books, and I think it's

2003
01:47:21,400 --> 01:47:25,160
Speaker 1: funny to see the like progression because I have, you know,

2004
01:47:25,479 --> 01:47:28,519
Speaker 1: the really lovely like Food Not Lawns that goes into

2005
01:47:28,560 --> 01:47:32,880
Speaker 1: a whole pile of really fantastic things that came out

2006
01:47:33,280 --> 01:47:36,000
Speaker 1: that I don't know, the first Food Not Lawns house

2007
01:47:36,080 --> 01:47:39,280
Speaker 1: I saw at the town as in was in like

2008
01:47:39,479 --> 01:47:42,080
Speaker 1: two thousand five or six, but this book came out

2009
01:47:42,080 --> 01:47:43,679
Speaker 1: in two thousand and six. But it was this entire

2010
01:47:43,760 --> 01:47:47,160
Speaker 1: movement of like making community and doing and like how

2011
01:47:47,200 --> 01:47:51,080
Speaker 1: to do stuff yourself on your front lawn. Yeah, and

2012
01:47:51,120 --> 01:47:54,720
Speaker 1: then I have from eleven the bus d i Y

2013
01:47:54,760 --> 01:47:57,400
Speaker 1: Guide to Life that includes everything from like how to

2014
01:47:57,439 --> 01:48:00,160
Speaker 1: do warm composting to how to make your own makeup

2015
01:48:00,200 --> 01:48:04,160
Speaker 1: and like finance the house. And that's that's like the magazine, right. Yes,

2016
01:48:04,560 --> 01:48:07,400
Speaker 1: So it's kind of interesting because it definitely like was

2017
01:48:07,400 --> 01:48:10,840
Speaker 1: the thing that I watched come into the mainstream. But

2018
01:48:11,520 --> 01:48:16,639
Speaker 1: you know, it started as a lot of punks trying

2019
01:48:16,680 --> 01:48:18,519
Speaker 1: to figure out how to do things because they had

2020
01:48:18,520 --> 01:48:22,640
Speaker 1: no money, and but also different from a lot of

2021
01:48:22,680 --> 01:48:25,120
Speaker 1: you know, like woodworking or craft books that really are

2022
01:48:25,240 --> 01:48:28,559
Speaker 1: you know, by these seven thousand dollars worth of tools

2023
01:48:28,680 --> 01:48:33,719
Speaker 1: and now you too can learn Yes. And there's also

2024
01:48:33,800 --> 01:48:37,120
Speaker 1: there's also an ethos behind it, right that, like before

2025
01:48:37,760 --> 01:48:40,240
Speaker 1: I was, I came at it first and foremost through

2026
01:48:40,280 --> 01:48:43,320
Speaker 1: being like a bike punk in the in the late

2027
01:48:43,400 --> 01:48:45,800
Speaker 1: nineties early two thousands, being a bike punk, and the

2028
01:48:45,840 --> 01:48:49,679
Speaker 1: idea of like the d I y ethos was less

2029
01:48:49,720 --> 01:48:54,200
Speaker 1: about the grid is going to collapse and like everything

2030
01:48:54,320 --> 01:48:55,960
Speaker 1: is going to fall apart and you're going to need

2031
01:48:56,000 --> 01:48:58,200
Speaker 1: to survive by the skin of your teeth, and it

2032
01:48:58,280 --> 01:49:01,320
Speaker 1: was a lot more you at the tail end of

2033
01:49:01,400 --> 01:49:04,960
Speaker 1: the nineties and like the sort of golden era of

2034
01:49:05,040 --> 01:49:09,040
Speaker 1: neoliberal capitalism and office space and that whole cultural moment,

2035
01:49:09,520 --> 01:49:13,760
Speaker 1: the idea that life was alienated and shitty and it

2036
01:49:13,920 --> 01:49:17,000
Speaker 1: felt better to know how to do things that you

2037
01:49:17,080 --> 01:49:19,960
Speaker 1: needed in your day to day life for yourself, using

2038
01:49:20,040 --> 01:49:24,320
Speaker 1: stuff you had made yourself or gotten from your community members. Um. Yeah,

2039
01:49:24,400 --> 01:49:27,000
Speaker 1: resiliency is less about knowing you have a pile of

2040
01:49:27,080 --> 01:49:29,320
Speaker 1: dried food in the house and know more about looking

2041
01:49:29,360 --> 01:49:31,200
Speaker 1: at fresh food and knowing, I know how to make

2042
01:49:31,240 --> 01:49:33,560
Speaker 1: that last the winter. Yeah, And it's been interesting to

2043
01:49:33,600 --> 01:49:35,920
Speaker 1: see the way that like as that has gotten kind

2044
01:49:35,920 --> 01:49:41,920
Speaker 1: of mainstreamed into like, you know, the the what is

2045
01:49:41,960 --> 01:49:45,200
Speaker 1: it primitive. There's a bunch of different like primitive x

2046
01:49:45,320 --> 01:49:48,040
Speaker 1: y Z YouTube channels that get lots of show trick

2047
01:49:48,080 --> 01:49:50,760
Speaker 1: and ship, and as that all gets mainstreamed, there's this

2048
01:49:50,840 --> 01:49:54,200
Speaker 1: idea of like expertise that creeps back into it. And

2049
01:49:54,360 --> 01:49:57,719
Speaker 1: d I I was like firmly committed to the idea

2050
01:49:57,800 --> 01:50:02,760
Speaker 1: that everybody could learn stuff and listening to somebody who

2051
01:50:02,760 --> 01:50:04,880
Speaker 1: said they were an expert was a trapped and a

2052
01:50:04,880 --> 01:50:06,600
Speaker 1: lot of that was coming out of like the seventies

2053
01:50:06,600 --> 01:50:09,360
Speaker 1: when there was all of the like you know, CULTI

2054
01:50:09,400 --> 01:50:12,240
Speaker 1: lifestyle ship that was like, hey, look we're going to

2055
01:50:12,360 --> 01:50:14,960
Speaker 1: teach you how to change your life, and yeah, we're

2056
01:50:14,960 --> 01:50:17,400
Speaker 1: gonna we're gonna buy up all this land and Antelope,

2057
01:50:17,439 --> 01:50:21,280
Speaker 1: Oregon and and so d I Y was emphatically not

2058
01:50:21,360 --> 01:50:24,439
Speaker 1: that it was like there's skills, and you can learn skills,

2059
01:50:24,479 --> 01:50:26,960
Speaker 1: and the Internet doesn't really exist yet or not really,

2060
01:50:27,040 --> 01:50:28,880
Speaker 1: so you can read books about it and you can

2061
01:50:28,960 --> 01:50:31,639
Speaker 1: have skills fare because there wasn't Twitter, we also all

2062
01:50:31,680 --> 01:50:33,760
Speaker 1: had a lot more time on our hands and like

2063
01:50:33,960 --> 01:50:40,599
Speaker 1: each other more. But there's also expertise was something that

2064
01:50:40,960 --> 01:50:43,360
Speaker 1: was handy to have you know, like if I needed

2065
01:50:43,360 --> 01:50:48,320
Speaker 1: to rebuild my wheel on my bike and respoke, it,

2066
01:50:48,800 --> 01:50:50,800
Speaker 1: wanted somebody who knew how to do it. And so

2067
01:50:50,840 --> 01:50:52,639
Speaker 1: it's good to have a couple of people who had

2068
01:50:52,680 --> 01:50:56,920
Speaker 1: really intense, deep knowledge of skills. But the idea that

2069
01:50:56,960 --> 01:50:59,439
Speaker 1: you would ask someone like I need to change my

2070
01:50:59,479 --> 01:51:02,360
Speaker 1: bike or two because I popped it with everyone would

2071
01:51:02,360 --> 01:51:05,280
Speaker 1: have been kind of like really really like everyone should

2072
01:51:05,280 --> 01:51:08,439
Speaker 1: know how to do basic stuff and it's and it's okay,

2073
01:51:08,600 --> 01:51:11,439
Speaker 1: Like the whole you know, Jack of All Trades was

2074
01:51:12,680 --> 01:51:15,719
Speaker 1: is as a desirable goal, like it's okay to dabble

2075
01:51:16,400 --> 01:51:19,200
Speaker 1: in a million little things and be kind of mediocre,

2076
01:51:19,439 --> 01:51:22,000
Speaker 1: but have a sort of baseline understanding of a bunch

2077
01:51:22,000 --> 01:51:25,320
Speaker 1: of stuff. Now, you know, there's places that I kind

2078
01:51:25,360 --> 01:51:27,519
Speaker 1: of think that we went too far, but also, you know,

2079
01:51:27,600 --> 01:51:33,040
Speaker 1: before the American Healthcare Act, we all definitely did a

2080
01:51:33,080 --> 01:51:36,240
Speaker 1: lot of at home medcare that we should not have.

2081
01:51:36,920 --> 01:51:39,400
Speaker 1: But there's also a lot of low stakes places that

2082
01:51:40,040 --> 01:51:43,479
Speaker 1: I think people have gotten away from just practicing and

2083
01:51:43,520 --> 01:51:46,680
Speaker 1: trying all sorts of crafty stuff as an ethos that

2084
01:51:46,840 --> 01:51:50,080
Speaker 1: is actually really good and there's no harm to learning things,

2085
01:51:50,080 --> 01:51:52,160
Speaker 1: like you're not going to quote anything and the only

2086
01:51:52,200 --> 01:51:53,960
Speaker 1: thing that's going to happen is you will have more

2087
01:51:54,080 --> 01:51:57,719
Speaker 1: skills and more to offer the people around you. There's

2088
01:51:57,720 --> 01:52:00,840
Speaker 1: this idea under capitalism that we should all specialized because

2089
01:52:00,880 --> 01:52:03,519
Speaker 1: that is like the most profit generating thing to do

2090
01:52:03,600 --> 01:52:05,639
Speaker 1: is just specialize anything that makes you the most money.

2091
01:52:05,640 --> 01:52:08,720
Speaker 1: But it's like, not only is it like not the

2092
01:52:08,760 --> 01:52:12,600
Speaker 1: best in a dangerous situation to only know how to

2093
01:52:12,600 --> 01:52:14,240
Speaker 1: do one thing that makes you money, but it's like

2094
01:52:14,280 --> 01:52:17,160
Speaker 1: it's not particularly good for your soul either. And there's

2095
01:52:17,200 --> 01:52:23,760
Speaker 1: also lots of different behavioral psychology, like group analysis of

2096
01:52:24,520 --> 01:52:28,160
Speaker 1: if you present people with a situation that they feel

2097
01:52:28,200 --> 01:52:31,800
Speaker 1: unprepared for and there's a person that they identify as

2098
01:52:31,800 --> 01:52:33,640
Speaker 1: an expert in a group who they can defer to

2099
01:52:34,320 --> 01:52:37,200
Speaker 1: pretty much every time, the group that's like, oh, we'll

2100
01:52:37,240 --> 01:52:41,600
Speaker 1: defer to this one expert because they know everything and

2101
01:52:41,640 --> 01:52:44,680
Speaker 1: we'll just do whatever they say ends up making worse decisions.

2102
01:52:45,280 --> 01:52:48,559
Speaker 1: Then if you have a group where everybody feels like, oh, well,

2103
01:52:48,640 --> 01:52:51,760
Speaker 1: I like I can at least get a handle on

2104
01:52:51,800 --> 01:52:54,080
Speaker 1: what's going on and we can all talk through it

2105
01:52:54,120 --> 01:53:00,000
Speaker 1: and like make make calls. Deferring to experts doesn't necessary

2106
01:53:00,040 --> 01:53:04,360
Speaker 1: severally help you know, that there's obviously cases we've mentioned

2107
01:53:04,400 --> 01:53:08,919
Speaker 1: medical care already, where like there's actually knowledge is very important.

2108
01:53:09,000 --> 01:53:11,559
Speaker 1: Skill sets are very important. But the idea that there's

2109
01:53:11,600 --> 01:53:15,479
Speaker 1: people who are just like, yeah, inherently more knowledgeable of

2110
01:53:15,520 --> 01:53:22,040
Speaker 1: things that you couldn't possibly understand. Is so where where

2111
01:53:22,040 --> 01:53:24,840
Speaker 1: do you recommend? Like people start with, like, like, you've

2112
01:53:24,880 --> 01:53:26,640
Speaker 1: got a bunch of books right now, and obviously, if

2113
01:53:26,680 --> 01:53:30,880
Speaker 1: you can afford books, that's a good call. A lot

2114
01:53:30,880 --> 01:53:34,679
Speaker 1: of these books on a preserving food and like growing

2115
01:53:34,720 --> 01:53:36,400
Speaker 1: stuff on your lawn, but even if you don't have

2116
01:53:36,400 --> 01:53:39,360
Speaker 1: a lawn, you can still Like there's certain like one

2117
01:53:39,360 --> 01:53:41,839
Speaker 1: thing that strikes me because we've been canning and pickling

2118
01:53:41,840 --> 01:53:45,839
Speaker 1: a bunch lately, is you know, different vegetables and fruits

2119
01:53:45,840 --> 01:53:48,000
Speaker 1: and whatnot are cheaper at different points in the year.

2120
01:53:48,280 --> 01:53:50,400
Speaker 1: And even if you live in an apartment in the

2121
01:53:50,439 --> 01:53:52,799
Speaker 1: inner city and will never have more than a garden

2122
01:53:52,880 --> 01:53:55,840
Speaker 1: box at best, you can buy food when it's cheap

2123
01:53:55,880 --> 01:53:59,680
Speaker 1: and preserve it um and not only save yourself a

2124
01:53:59,720 --> 01:54:03,679
Speaker 1: little the money, but you can like also, uh, you'll

2125
01:54:03,760 --> 01:54:07,040
Speaker 1: you'll understand every time you encounter preserved food and like

2126
01:54:07,040 --> 01:54:08,960
Speaker 1: a grocery store, you'll be looking at a thing that

2127
01:54:09,000 --> 01:54:11,080
Speaker 1: you know where it comes from. It's not just like

2128
01:54:11,120 --> 01:54:13,880
Speaker 1: a mystery jar of preserved food that was made by

2129
01:54:13,920 --> 01:54:18,680
Speaker 1: some process of science. So I don't know. I'm interested in,

2130
01:54:18,720 --> 01:54:23,080
Speaker 1: like where you guys someone coming in having only uh

2131
01:54:23,200 --> 01:54:25,920
Speaker 1: specialized in whatever it is allowed them to pay the rent?

2132
01:54:26,800 --> 01:54:31,320
Speaker 1: Where where where's your where's your recommended start point for people? UM,

2133
01:54:31,360 --> 01:54:33,880
Speaker 1: I think it's picking something that is low stakes that

2134
01:54:33,960 --> 01:54:40,240
Speaker 1: you enjoy. Like honestly, one of my friends, um, her

2135
01:54:40,360 --> 01:54:44,040
Speaker 1: entry into doing d I Y stuff was, you know,

2136
01:54:44,160 --> 01:54:45,920
Speaker 1: she had lots of makeup and everything, and she was like,

2137
01:54:45,960 --> 01:54:48,440
Speaker 1: I'm going to make body scrubs? How do I do that?

2138
01:54:48,600 --> 01:54:51,560
Speaker 1: And you know, looked up how to make body scrubs,

2139
01:54:51,600 --> 01:54:54,280
Speaker 1: how to make you know, A lot of it is, oh,

2140
01:54:54,320 --> 01:54:58,440
Speaker 1: getting salt and grinding up rosemary that she found in

2141
01:54:58,480 --> 01:55:01,160
Speaker 1: someone's front yard and putting it together, you know. But

2142
01:55:01,360 --> 01:55:05,960
Speaker 1: just something simple that you enjoy, that you would love

2143
01:55:06,040 --> 01:55:08,920
Speaker 1: to be able to, you know, have a little bit

2144
01:55:08,960 --> 01:55:13,080
Speaker 1: more say over because it's most basic. A lot of

2145
01:55:13,080 --> 01:55:14,640
Speaker 1: the d I Y stuff is you can make something

2146
01:55:14,800 --> 01:55:19,480
Speaker 1: very specific to what you like. So for myself, actually,

2147
01:55:19,520 --> 01:55:21,160
Speaker 1: one of the first things I ever started doing was

2148
01:55:21,200 --> 01:55:26,640
Speaker 1: in high school just altering clothing. I had an old yeah,

2149
01:55:26,960 --> 01:55:32,000
Speaker 1: I had an old thirty dollar junk practice uh like

2150
01:55:32,160 --> 01:55:35,680
Speaker 1: kids sewing machine and just the cheapest one that Sears

2151
01:55:35,760 --> 01:55:41,720
Speaker 1: used to sell, And could definitely just take that and

2152
01:55:42,120 --> 01:55:44,640
Speaker 1: start putting scenes in an alter clothing and be like

2153
01:55:44,720 --> 01:55:46,480
Speaker 1: this shirt is now a T shirt. It was long

2154
01:55:46,520 --> 01:55:49,680
Speaker 1: sleep before. And that also ties in with you know,

2155
01:55:50,080 --> 01:55:52,320
Speaker 1: d I I just to sound like old punks for

2156
01:55:52,320 --> 01:55:54,600
Speaker 1: a minute. That d I I definitely also came out

2157
01:55:54,680 --> 01:55:57,280
Speaker 1: of things like the riot girl scene in a big way,

2158
01:55:57,400 --> 01:56:02,320
Speaker 1: and like the attention to like body awareness and like

2159
01:56:02,480 --> 01:56:07,000
Speaker 1: moving away from body negativity and the recognition that as

2160
01:56:07,000 --> 01:56:10,840
Speaker 1: a general rule, off the rack clothes are not and

2161
01:56:11,000 --> 01:56:16,360
Speaker 1: certainly twenty years ago were extra not actually designed to

2162
01:56:16,480 --> 01:56:19,360
Speaker 1: fit most people's bodies, and it was hard to find

2163
01:56:19,440 --> 01:56:22,440
Speaker 1: clothes that fit you right. And yeah, so like sewing

2164
01:56:22,560 --> 01:56:26,760
Speaker 1: was a big one. Um bikes because we were broken,

2165
01:56:26,840 --> 01:56:29,200
Speaker 1: didn't have cars, so figuring out how to fix bikes

2166
01:56:29,240 --> 01:56:32,520
Speaker 1: and you know, everything that mechanically happens on a bike

2167
01:56:32,680 --> 01:56:34,480
Speaker 1: is right there and you can see it happen, and

2168
01:56:34,560 --> 01:56:37,800
Speaker 1: it maybe requires a screwdriver and then eventually maybe some

2169
01:56:37,840 --> 01:56:40,920
Speaker 1: other tools. But there's lots of three resources a lot

2170
01:56:41,040 --> 01:56:43,120
Speaker 1: most cities I've spent any amount of time and you

2171
01:56:43,160 --> 01:56:46,000
Speaker 1: can find like you can find like a community bike

2172
01:56:46,040 --> 01:56:48,600
Speaker 1: shop where if you have to pay anything, it's very minimal.

2173
01:56:48,640 --> 01:56:50,080
Speaker 1: And a lot of cases are just sort of like

2174
01:56:50,160 --> 01:56:54,000
Speaker 1: show up and you know there's space to use. Yeah

2175
01:56:54,040 --> 01:56:57,880
Speaker 1: when um, Like I know in Santa Cruz there was

2176
01:56:57,920 --> 01:57:00,920
Speaker 1: the bike Church. In Portland there's the bike Farm and yeah,

2177
01:57:00,960 --> 01:57:03,160
Speaker 1: and Philly there was also a bike church because it

2178
01:57:03,160 --> 01:57:05,760
Speaker 1: turns out the basements of churches are are. There were

2179
01:57:05,800 --> 01:57:07,840
Speaker 1: a couple of spots like that in Dallas and it's

2180
01:57:08,000 --> 01:57:10,760
Speaker 1: uh yeah. And I think it is like this mix of,

2181
01:57:11,600 --> 01:57:13,400
Speaker 1: like with the body scrub stuff, like what is something

2182
01:57:13,400 --> 01:57:15,680
Speaker 1: that appeals to you that you you're interested in? And

2183
01:57:15,720 --> 01:57:18,000
Speaker 1: also what is with the bike stuff, what is something

2184
01:57:18,040 --> 01:57:20,960
Speaker 1: that's like just doggedly practical, Like you get a bike,

2185
01:57:21,240 --> 01:57:23,160
Speaker 1: you need a bike to get around, you should probably

2186
01:57:23,200 --> 01:57:25,600
Speaker 1: know how to fix it on it. I think the

2187
01:57:25,640 --> 01:57:28,040
Speaker 1: reason I say you should pick something that appeals to

2188
01:57:28,080 --> 01:57:33,840
Speaker 1: you especially is because a big thing with d I

2189
01:57:34,040 --> 01:57:37,600
Speaker 1: Y was that you're doing it yourself, and there are

2190
01:57:37,680 --> 01:57:40,280
Speaker 1: so many skills that are valuable to learn from other people.

2191
01:57:40,520 --> 01:57:43,520
Speaker 1: It is wonderful to craft in community. It is wonderful

2192
01:57:43,560 --> 01:57:46,240
Speaker 1: to work with other people in community. It's wonderful to

2193
01:57:46,320 --> 01:57:50,840
Speaker 1: teach skills and gain them. But also I've seen this

2194
01:57:50,960 --> 01:57:56,120
Speaker 1: growing idea with the as specialization for so many things,

2195
01:57:56,280 --> 01:58:01,720
Speaker 1: especially services comes in that people are always like, oh, wow, knitting,

2196
01:58:01,840 --> 01:58:03,440
Speaker 1: I've always wanted to learn. I need to take a

2197
01:58:03,480 --> 01:58:06,480
Speaker 1: class in that, or I need to And it's really important,

2198
01:58:06,520 --> 01:58:10,560
Speaker 1: I think, for people to realize that you can learn things.

2199
01:58:11,000 --> 01:58:13,160
Speaker 1: We are very good at learning things, and you don't

2200
01:58:13,200 --> 01:58:16,480
Speaker 1: necessarily need a teacher for more complex things you do.

2201
01:58:16,560 --> 01:58:19,480
Speaker 1: But starting with something that you really like and that

2202
01:58:19,560 --> 01:58:23,640
Speaker 1: you find really interesting, you've already thought about it. So

2203
01:58:23,680 --> 01:58:25,720
Speaker 1: when you start with you know, for my friends, starting

2204
01:58:25,720 --> 01:58:28,640
Speaker 1: with making bath salts and face masks and stuff, it

2205
01:58:28,720 --> 01:58:31,040
Speaker 1: was something she had already been thinking about quite a

2206
01:58:31,040 --> 01:58:33,960
Speaker 1: bit and thinking about stuff. So when she started looking

2207
01:58:33,960 --> 01:58:37,080
Speaker 1: at recipes to mix and looking on the internet and

2208
01:58:37,120 --> 01:58:39,400
Speaker 1: looking at ingredients, it was saying she already cared about.

2209
01:58:39,520 --> 01:58:43,600
Speaker 1: So it's easier to learn something that you are interested in,

2210
01:58:43,680 --> 01:58:46,640
Speaker 1: and it's easier to learn something that you want to do.

2211
01:58:46,760 --> 01:58:51,960
Speaker 1: But we are all capable of learning for ourselves, not

2212
01:58:52,040 --> 01:58:55,160
Speaker 1: every single thing, but especially just for craft projects and

2213
01:58:55,200 --> 01:58:57,360
Speaker 1: so starting with that so that you can pick up

2214
01:58:57,360 --> 01:58:59,360
Speaker 1: a book, or you can read an article, or you

2215
01:58:59,360 --> 01:59:01,840
Speaker 1: can watch a YouTube video and you don't need to

2216
01:59:02,000 --> 01:59:05,760
Speaker 1: take some like hundred and fifty dollar a weekend class

2217
01:59:05,880 --> 01:59:08,960
Speaker 1: before you can. It's, you know, a big part of

2218
01:59:09,000 --> 01:59:12,040
Speaker 1: the resiliency building. Like something you may scoff, like when

2219
01:59:12,040 --> 01:59:16,320
Speaker 1: you're thinking about survivalism and talking about like making bath scrubs,

2220
01:59:16,360 --> 01:59:18,840
Speaker 1: But a lot of the skills you would learn putting

2221
01:59:18,880 --> 01:59:22,040
Speaker 1: that together are useful in making like a salve or

2222
01:59:22,080 --> 01:59:26,160
Speaker 1: making like making soap, making soap things that you actually need.

2223
01:59:26,240 --> 01:59:28,160
Speaker 1: Like when I was traveling, I lived on the road,

2224
01:59:28,560 --> 01:59:30,480
Speaker 1: like out of a car and out of backpacks for

2225
01:59:30,640 --> 01:59:32,040
Speaker 1: off and on all over the world for years, and

2226
01:59:32,040 --> 01:59:33,960
Speaker 1: I would make my own medicated because we would get

2227
01:59:34,160 --> 01:59:36,440
Speaker 1: we would get cuts and scrapes and rashes, and we

2228
01:59:36,440 --> 01:59:38,960
Speaker 1: were poor as ship and often there weren't doctors where

2229
01:59:38,960 --> 01:59:40,840
Speaker 1: we were. So I learned how to use things like

2230
01:59:40,920 --> 01:59:43,800
Speaker 1: plantain and comfrey and yarrow and like bees wax and

2231
01:59:43,880 --> 01:59:47,400
Speaker 1: stuff in order to to make medicated saves. And it

2232
01:59:47,400 --> 01:59:49,440
Speaker 1: it was something that interested me. But like there's also

2233
01:59:49,520 --> 01:59:52,800
Speaker 1: a lot of like there's there's a number of roots

2234
01:59:52,840 --> 01:59:54,800
Speaker 1: into learning that sort of thing. And if you're learning

2235
01:59:54,800 --> 01:59:56,560
Speaker 1: how to make again something as simple as like a

2236
01:59:56,600 --> 02:00:00,320
Speaker 1: face scrub, learning where to find that information and for

2237
02:00:00,400 --> 02:00:02,920
Speaker 1: free learning some of the basic techniques in order to

2238
02:00:02,960 --> 02:00:08,640
Speaker 1: do that. That learning how to learn is is applicable

2239
02:00:08,680 --> 02:00:11,680
Speaker 1: in a wider variety of skill sets, and it I

2240
02:00:11,960 --> 02:00:15,320
Speaker 1: think it's so important to focus on what are you

2241
02:00:15,360 --> 02:00:17,680
Speaker 1: what are you interested in first, as as opposed to

2242
02:00:17,680 --> 02:00:19,360
Speaker 1: just being like, okay at first, Now I have to

2243
02:00:19,400 --> 02:00:21,600
Speaker 1: learn how to like splint a broken arm, because like

2244
02:00:21,840 --> 02:00:24,320
Speaker 1: ship is gonna hit the fans, like, well, maybe focus

2245
02:00:24,360 --> 02:00:26,840
Speaker 1: on something that's more exciting to you first, and and

2246
02:00:26,840 --> 02:00:29,280
Speaker 1: and and build time in your life to learn things.

2247
02:00:29,320 --> 02:00:32,160
Speaker 1: That's an enjoyable process. One of the first things I did,

2248
02:00:32,200 --> 02:00:35,160
Speaker 1: like years ago, was I learned to sew, specifically to

2249
02:00:35,200 --> 02:00:38,040
Speaker 1: make a cause play because you know so, so I

2250
02:00:38,040 --> 02:00:40,520
Speaker 1: would just I would make me and my whole family

2251
02:00:40,760 --> 02:00:43,040
Speaker 1: different outfits for comic Con. So every year I would,

2252
02:00:43,120 --> 02:00:45,440
Speaker 1: I would sew us whole whole new things. But then

2253
02:00:45,480 --> 02:00:47,080
Speaker 1: not only taught me sewing, it taught me how to

2254
02:00:47,120 --> 02:00:51,040
Speaker 1: do like like vacuum forming to molding, how to use

2255
02:00:51,080 --> 02:00:53,120
Speaker 1: like a heat gun, how to use like all these

2256
02:00:53,120 --> 02:00:56,000
Speaker 1: other types of tools, Um, how do you like molding

2257
02:00:56,000 --> 02:00:58,400
Speaker 1: and casting? Like all of these types of things I

2258
02:00:58,480 --> 02:01:01,880
Speaker 1: learned just wanting to make silly costumes. But now they're like,

2259
02:01:01,920 --> 02:01:04,120
Speaker 1: you know, useful in a lot a lot of other ways.

2260
02:01:04,520 --> 02:01:07,120
Speaker 1: And that can be that can be expensive at the

2261
02:01:07,200 --> 02:01:10,280
Speaker 1: high end when you're like vacuum forming and stuff your

2262
02:01:10,320 --> 02:01:14,080
Speaker 1: storm trooper armor. But the cheapest side of that thing again,

2263
02:01:14,400 --> 02:01:16,520
Speaker 1: you can get a basic hand sewing kit for like

2264
02:01:16,600 --> 02:01:20,480
Speaker 1: five dollars from a Walmart. And there's also and there's

2265
02:01:20,520 --> 02:01:23,640
Speaker 1: maker spaces and like YouTube will do the teaching. You

2266
02:01:23,640 --> 02:01:25,600
Speaker 1: don't have to pay for a teacher. The Taliban learned

2267
02:01:25,600 --> 02:01:27,960
Speaker 1: how to fly helicopters. On YouTube, you can learn how

2268
02:01:28,000 --> 02:01:31,240
Speaker 1: to fix your pants. And then I think also you

2269
02:01:31,320 --> 02:01:34,840
Speaker 1: mentioned specialization before. It's come up a couple of times, um,

2270
02:01:34,960 --> 02:01:38,120
Speaker 1: and there is you know, the idea of specialization. The

2271
02:01:38,200 --> 02:01:41,080
Speaker 1: rationale behind specialization is, oh, well, you'll be better at

2272
02:01:41,120 --> 02:01:43,680
Speaker 1: it because that's what you do all the time. But

2273
02:01:43,880 --> 02:01:47,080
Speaker 1: that cuts both ways, because if you only do one

2274
02:01:47,160 --> 02:01:50,320
Speaker 1: thing all the time, then as you know, whatever the

2275
02:01:50,360 --> 02:01:53,400
Speaker 1: maximum threshold of your abilities is that's required of you,

2276
02:01:53,760 --> 02:01:57,120
Speaker 1: that becomes your baseline like whatever in your day to

2277
02:01:57,200 --> 02:01:59,480
Speaker 1: day life, whatever it is that you're being asked to do.

2278
02:02:00,040 --> 02:02:03,280
Speaker 1: That's what you feel capable of. And on the flip side,

2279
02:02:03,280 --> 02:02:06,200
Speaker 1: there's with with the d I I approach with like

2280
02:02:06,240 --> 02:02:10,760
Speaker 1: teaching yourself ship, learning interesting ship. It's also practical and

2281
02:02:10,880 --> 02:02:12,960
Speaker 1: important and useful to be like this is a thing

2282
02:02:13,000 --> 02:02:15,720
Speaker 1: that I'm gonna do on a regular basis so I'll

2283
02:02:15,760 --> 02:02:18,680
Speaker 1: get better at it. But also it's not you know,

2284
02:02:19,280 --> 02:02:21,360
Speaker 1: there was you know, the whole idea of there's what

2285
02:02:21,440 --> 02:02:24,200
Speaker 1: you do and then there's your job, and that these

2286
02:02:24,320 --> 02:02:26,800
Speaker 1: need not be the same thing, because you want to

2287
02:02:26,800 --> 02:02:30,360
Speaker 1: be able to think think through things in a way

2288
02:02:30,400 --> 02:02:33,400
Speaker 1: that's not the way you're supposed to process things to

2289
02:02:33,440 --> 02:02:35,960
Speaker 1: make your boss happy. That it is not just what

2290
02:02:36,000 --> 02:02:37,880
Speaker 1: you do when you clock in. You are more than

2291
02:02:37,920 --> 02:02:41,720
Speaker 1: your career, more than your career, and and and your

2292
02:02:41,760 --> 02:02:45,360
Speaker 1: skill set need not be purely extracted as you know,

2293
02:02:45,520 --> 02:02:48,040
Speaker 1: not just like Okay, I have to go do the

2294
02:02:48,080 --> 02:02:50,120
Speaker 1: thing in order to make money, and then everything else

2295
02:02:50,240 --> 02:02:53,960
Speaker 1: is consumption. Like you can you can transition, like we're

2296
02:02:54,760 --> 02:02:57,080
Speaker 1: and this is not a societal level solution because we

2297
02:02:57,120 --> 02:02:58,840
Speaker 1: talk a lot about like, well, yeah, you're not gonna

2298
02:02:58,840 --> 02:03:01,760
Speaker 1: you're not gonna make small person changes to fix climate change,

2299
02:03:01,960 --> 02:03:05,680
Speaker 1: but changing your own particular attitude on how you approach

2300
02:03:05,720 --> 02:03:08,400
Speaker 1: the world from one that is I I produce and

2301
02:03:08,400 --> 02:03:11,680
Speaker 1: that I consume to to when we're you're thinking more

2302
02:03:11,720 --> 02:03:13,520
Speaker 1: about resiliency and what do I know how to do

2303
02:03:13,560 --> 02:03:16,000
Speaker 1: and what can I learn how to do? UM is

2304
02:03:16,880 --> 02:03:21,800
Speaker 1: helpful in a variety of ways on the note of

2305
02:03:21,960 --> 02:03:26,760
Speaker 1: you know, the transferability of skills and recognizing that you

2306
02:03:26,800 --> 02:03:28,840
Speaker 1: already do things on a day to day basis that

2307
02:03:28,880 --> 02:03:32,680
Speaker 1: requires specialized knowledge and require skill sets. UM. One of

2308
02:03:32,720 --> 02:03:35,200
Speaker 1: the things that I try and trot out at every

2309
02:03:35,240 --> 02:03:37,840
Speaker 1: possible opportunity. I worked with somebody in one of those

2310
02:03:37,920 --> 02:03:42,440
Speaker 1: volunteer bike shop spaces down New Orleans years ago, UM,

2311
02:03:42,480 --> 02:03:46,280
Speaker 1: and the whole purpose of that particular space was to

2312
02:03:46,480 --> 02:03:50,040
Speaker 1: make the skill set of bike repare more accessible to

2313
02:03:50,240 --> 02:03:53,920
Speaker 1: a population that relied on bikes to get places. And

2314
02:03:54,200 --> 02:03:57,040
Speaker 1: one of the folks I worked there with was like

2315
02:03:57,400 --> 02:04:01,040
Speaker 1: a very familiarity and was great because we would have

2316
02:04:01,400 --> 02:04:03,120
Speaker 1: young girls come into the shop and be like, my

2317
02:04:03,160 --> 02:04:05,760
Speaker 1: bike doesn't work. Somebody fixed my bike. My bike doesn't work.

2318
02:04:05,760 --> 02:04:08,040
Speaker 1: I don't know how to fix a bike. And she

2319
02:04:08,200 --> 02:04:11,320
Speaker 1: was the one who would just be like, your tires flat,

2320
02:04:11,480 --> 02:04:13,000
Speaker 1: and they're like, yeah, I don't know how to fix it?

2321
02:04:13,040 --> 02:04:15,000
Speaker 1: Can you fix it? And she'd be like, well, you're

2322
02:04:15,000 --> 02:04:17,800
Speaker 1: wearing press on nails, right, And I'd be like yeah,

2323
02:04:17,800 --> 02:04:19,520
Speaker 1: I'm like cool, how do you put on your press

2324
02:04:19,520 --> 02:04:21,400
Speaker 1: on nails? And they walked through the steps of like, well,

2325
02:04:21,400 --> 02:04:23,800
Speaker 1: you sand your nails and then you put the glue

2326
02:04:23,800 --> 02:04:26,080
Speaker 1: on your nails, and then you hold the press on

2327
02:04:26,200 --> 02:04:28,880
Speaker 1: nails on your fingernails for a little while and let

2328
02:04:28,920 --> 02:04:31,120
Speaker 1: them set and then you're good to go. And she's like, great,

2329
02:04:31,160 --> 02:04:34,080
Speaker 1: you've just described exactly how you patch a bike inner tube.

2330
02:04:34,640 --> 02:04:36,240
Speaker 1: So now we just need to get the bike inner

2331
02:04:36,240 --> 02:04:39,120
Speaker 1: tube out, and here's the part that corresponds to your nail,

2332
02:04:39,160 --> 02:04:41,480
Speaker 1: and here's the part that corresponds like here's the glue

2333
02:04:41,520 --> 02:04:43,960
Speaker 1: and here's the you know, it's the same process. We

2334
02:04:44,040 --> 02:04:45,520
Speaker 1: just have to get the bike inner two out and

2335
02:04:45,520 --> 02:04:47,080
Speaker 1: then back in again. But you already know how to

2336
02:04:47,080 --> 02:04:48,960
Speaker 1: do the part where you make the bike tube work again,

2337
02:04:49,720 --> 02:04:52,160
Speaker 1: and that does hit on another important like you know,

2338
02:04:52,280 --> 02:04:55,160
Speaker 1: apocalypse or whatever survival point where again all of our

2339
02:04:55,280 --> 02:04:58,000
Speaker 1: like fiction and movies, focuses on like knowing how to

2340
02:04:58,080 --> 02:05:00,720
Speaker 1: use a gun or like being a wood one of

2341
02:05:00,720 --> 02:05:03,680
Speaker 1: the most useful skills, maybe the most useful skill you

2342
02:05:03,680 --> 02:05:06,080
Speaker 1: can have in any disaster situation, is being able to

2343
02:05:06,120 --> 02:05:09,800
Speaker 1: teach people, like like knowing how to understand figure out

2344
02:05:09,800 --> 02:05:12,040
Speaker 1: what people know, and how to get them the additional

2345
02:05:12,080 --> 02:05:16,040
Speaker 1: information they need in order to be more resilient and competent,

2346
02:05:16,120 --> 02:05:18,920
Speaker 1: because you're always better in a community of people who

2347
02:05:18,960 --> 02:05:22,640
Speaker 1: know to handle their ship than alone. And it builds

2348
02:05:22,680 --> 02:05:25,800
Speaker 1: on itself too. You know, we both come from different backgrounds,

2349
02:05:25,880 --> 02:05:28,760
Speaker 1: but as we've been together and with the different trainings

2350
02:05:28,800 --> 02:05:31,600
Speaker 1: that we've had in just life, the projects that we

2351
02:05:31,640 --> 02:05:34,800
Speaker 1: take on have become more and more complex. So you know,

2352
02:05:35,040 --> 02:05:40,120
Speaker 1: where I like to practice gardening and stuff and doing

2353
02:05:40,160 --> 02:05:42,720
Speaker 1: a little bit of woodworking and things, and now you know,

2354
02:05:42,760 --> 02:05:47,400
Speaker 1: we're doing various construction projects that we're kind of self taught,

2355
02:05:47,480 --> 02:05:50,000
Speaker 1: and we have some various home depot books on how

2356
02:05:50,040 --> 02:05:52,720
Speaker 1: to do them. But it's it doesn't feel nearly as

2357
02:05:52,760 --> 02:05:56,120
Speaker 1: intimidating because we've done steps to go to it, and

2358
02:05:56,160 --> 02:05:57,800
Speaker 1: because it's not an all or nothing, you don't have

2359
02:05:57,840 --> 02:05:59,640
Speaker 1: to suddenly be like I'm going to d I why

2360
02:05:59,640 --> 02:06:02,160
Speaker 1: am I in entire life? Like I definitely get that

2361
02:06:02,200 --> 02:06:04,520
Speaker 1: way sometimes where I'm like, I want to one day

2362
02:06:04,560 --> 02:06:07,240
Speaker 1: have everything in my house be made by someone that

2363
02:06:07,360 --> 02:06:11,000
Speaker 1: I know or myself. And it's really lovely to know

2364
02:06:11,080 --> 02:06:13,720
Speaker 1: crafts people or to you know, make do sit down

2365
02:06:13,720 --> 02:06:15,640
Speaker 1: at a pottery wheel and make your own bowls or whatever.

2366
02:06:15,720 --> 02:06:19,240
Speaker 1: But a lot of it is about practicing stuff when

2367
02:06:19,280 --> 02:06:22,120
Speaker 1: it's not an emergency so that when you later on

2368
02:06:22,280 --> 02:06:25,800
Speaker 1: have need or you have the ability, you have the time,

2369
02:06:25,920 --> 02:06:28,960
Speaker 1: like you can do a bunch of different things. So

2370
02:06:29,280 --> 02:06:34,240
Speaker 1: you know, we refloored the room that we're in right

2371
02:06:34,280 --> 02:06:38,920
Speaker 1: now like a process, but we didn't get there from nothing.

2372
02:06:39,000 --> 02:06:41,800
Speaker 1: And we've both done lots of different construction and measuring

2373
02:06:41,840 --> 02:06:44,920
Speaker 1: and other things in little bits just for fun, for work,

2374
02:06:45,080 --> 02:06:48,880
Speaker 1: for other stuff beforehand. And a lot of these projects

2375
02:06:49,160 --> 02:06:52,880
Speaker 1: are things that are fun to do as a one

2376
02:06:52,880 --> 02:06:57,360
Speaker 1: off as a project. I've done, you know, embroidery with

2377
02:06:57,440 --> 02:07:00,640
Speaker 1: my kids just for fun, not because they need too

2378
02:07:01,200 --> 02:07:04,680
Speaker 1: suddenly embroider all of their clothing or they have two

2379
02:07:04,720 --> 02:07:07,240
Speaker 1: sew everything, but it's because it's a fun thing to

2380
02:07:07,280 --> 02:07:12,000
Speaker 1: do on a rainy day. Or you know, try fixing

2381
02:07:12,000 --> 02:07:14,800
Speaker 1: a book, not because there's no ability to go on

2382
02:07:14,840 --> 02:07:17,840
Speaker 1: Amazon and order another book. But hey, look I just

2383
02:07:17,920 --> 02:07:19,760
Speaker 1: we didn't add one thing to the landfill waste, and

2384
02:07:19,760 --> 02:07:22,520
Speaker 1: we don't have to fix all of the stuff we have.

2385
02:07:22,680 --> 02:07:25,160
Speaker 1: It's a one time craft. But then later on when

2386
02:07:25,200 --> 02:07:28,320
Speaker 1: stuff is falling apart, or when we have supply chain issues,

2387
02:07:28,560 --> 02:07:32,360
Speaker 1: or when stuff's not there, it's handy to know, like, oh,

2388
02:07:32,480 --> 02:07:34,920
Speaker 1: you know what, Like we're having water rationing right now,

2389
02:07:35,040 --> 02:07:37,960
Speaker 1: because during the one of the droughts that grew up

2390
02:07:37,960 --> 02:07:40,280
Speaker 1: in California, we had water rationing and it was my

2391
02:07:40,320 --> 02:07:43,640
Speaker 1: mom hauled out of the basement my grandmother's old ringer

2392
02:07:43,680 --> 02:07:46,160
Speaker 1: machine and we were doing the laundry and that because

2393
02:07:46,280 --> 02:07:48,880
Speaker 1: it could conserved a hell of a lot of water

2394
02:07:48,920 --> 02:07:51,520
Speaker 1: and you could use the same water for load after load.

2395
02:07:52,280 --> 02:07:55,560
Speaker 1: It's good to just have those things just kind of

2396
02:07:55,560 --> 02:07:58,200
Speaker 1: on hand that you've tried, because when an emergency hits,

2397
02:07:58,560 --> 02:08:00,360
Speaker 1: you don't want to be trying to search the internet

2398
02:08:00,360 --> 02:08:02,640
Speaker 1: are looking for something because you've never done it before

2399
02:08:02,720 --> 02:08:06,800
Speaker 1: and now it's necessary. And it's it's again to the

2400
02:08:06,840 --> 02:08:10,840
Speaker 1: point of like how the how collapse really looks versus

2401
02:08:10,840 --> 02:08:13,600
Speaker 1: how it's often pictured. You're not trying to replicate when

2402
02:08:13,640 --> 02:08:15,600
Speaker 1: you're when you're doing your own laundry. That way you're

2403
02:08:15,600 --> 02:08:18,960
Speaker 1: not trying to replace civilization. You're patching a hole, like

2404
02:08:19,040 --> 02:08:21,480
Speaker 1: and and that's a lot of building resiliency is knowing

2405
02:08:21,480 --> 02:08:23,000
Speaker 1: that you have. It's like it's being able to fix

2406
02:08:23,000 --> 02:08:24,880
Speaker 1: a bike tire, it's patching a hole. And I do

2407
02:08:25,040 --> 02:08:29,720
Speaker 1: want to acknowledge that, like this is a little bit

2408
02:08:29,720 --> 02:08:34,320
Speaker 1: more outside of the dead center of mainstream in you know,

2409
02:08:34,400 --> 02:08:38,760
Speaker 1: the United States and some other like wealthy industrialized countries.

2410
02:08:38,880 --> 02:08:43,120
Speaker 1: And it's not like it has never stopped being the

2411
02:08:43,120 --> 02:08:46,280
Speaker 1: way most people in the world kind of I have

2412
02:08:47,400 --> 02:08:50,560
Speaker 1: to tell from these people that was billeted with an Iraq.

2413
02:08:50,760 --> 02:08:52,960
Speaker 1: These these guys were like pulling people out of air

2414
02:08:53,000 --> 02:08:55,880
Speaker 1: strike craters every day, and we wanted to watch TV.

2415
02:08:56,000 --> 02:08:58,040
Speaker 1: One nine We were in like a bombed out mosque

2416
02:08:58,040 --> 02:09:01,240
Speaker 1: that Isis had been using and they had a refrigerator

2417
02:09:01,280 --> 02:09:03,240
Speaker 1: that worked in a TV that Isis had cut the

2418
02:09:03,280 --> 02:09:06,760
Speaker 1: chords with. And this guy just started pulling chords out

2419
02:09:06,800 --> 02:09:09,920
Speaker 1: of the fridge in about five minutes, had the TV working,

2420
02:09:09,960 --> 02:09:12,240
Speaker 1: had like hooked it, lashed everything together. It was like

2421
02:09:12,240 --> 02:09:14,360
Speaker 1: he wasn't a TV repairment or refrigerate. He just knew

2422
02:09:14,400 --> 02:09:16,760
Speaker 1: how electricity and ship worked and was able to figure

2423
02:09:16,760 --> 02:09:18,520
Speaker 1: out like, Okay, I can just put all this ship together,

2424
02:09:19,000 --> 02:09:21,200
Speaker 1: We're good to go. And and just also to loop

2425
02:09:21,200 --> 02:09:24,720
Speaker 1: back around to the whole like survival mentality a little bit.

2426
02:09:24,920 --> 02:09:28,360
Speaker 1: One of the things that like people that we've worked with,

2427
02:09:28,440 --> 02:09:34,200
Speaker 1: people who like have been in emergency situations that require,

2428
02:09:34,760 --> 02:09:37,680
Speaker 1: you know, complex skill sets and things that one of

2429
02:09:37,720 --> 02:09:41,920
Speaker 1: the big things is to have a role that you

2430
02:09:41,960 --> 02:09:46,920
Speaker 1: are competent in that you are ready to fulfill. So

2431
02:09:47,040 --> 02:09:50,560
Speaker 1: you don't have to figure out your first step. You

2432
02:09:50,640 --> 02:09:52,960
Speaker 1: can get moving. You can figure out your first step.

2433
02:09:53,320 --> 02:09:56,480
Speaker 1: So for example, in the you know, the supply chain

2434
02:09:56,520 --> 02:09:58,680
Speaker 1: issues that hit at the start of COVID and are

2435
02:09:58,760 --> 02:10:02,760
Speaker 1: hitting still and are recurring. Um the idea of like

2436
02:10:02,880 --> 02:10:08,240
Speaker 1: oh there's no way to like there's no laundry soap,

2437
02:10:08,400 --> 02:10:13,000
Speaker 1: Say okay, well we've got borax and these other making

2438
02:10:13,080 --> 02:10:17,640
Speaker 1: soda borax, right, we can we can make our own

2439
02:10:17,840 --> 02:10:21,240
Speaker 1: laundry detergent in a pinch and it'll work well enough. Cool.

2440
02:10:21,640 --> 02:10:23,839
Speaker 1: Don't have to have that be the thing that stresses

2441
02:10:23,880 --> 02:10:28,240
Speaker 1: us out and like adds to our like paralysis. Yeah,

2442
02:10:28,280 --> 02:10:29,720
Speaker 1: and again, a huge part of is even how you

2443
02:10:29,760 --> 02:10:32,240
Speaker 1: approach the problem. It's not freaking out, like oh my god,

2444
02:10:32,280 --> 02:10:34,480
Speaker 1: there's no laundry soap. Hell am I going to clean

2445
02:10:34,480 --> 02:10:36,240
Speaker 1: the clothes? It's being like, oh, there's no laundry soap,

2446
02:10:37,280 --> 02:10:39,640
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go online because we still have that and

2447
02:10:39,680 --> 02:10:41,600
Speaker 1: try to figure out either other things that can make

2448
02:10:41,680 --> 02:10:44,480
Speaker 1: laundry soap that there are, and like it's it's accepting.

2449
02:10:45,000 --> 02:10:47,720
Speaker 1: Like you talk about like wanting to be competent in

2450
02:10:47,760 --> 02:10:49,600
Speaker 1: a role, you don't have to know what that is

2451
02:10:49,640 --> 02:10:51,720
Speaker 1: from the start, as long as like the starting point

2452
02:10:51,760 --> 02:10:54,640
Speaker 1: isn't I'm going to be the medic I'm gonna be this,

2453
02:10:54,800 --> 02:10:56,680
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be the food or it's like no, I'm

2454
02:10:56,680 --> 02:10:59,080
Speaker 1: going to start learning how to do things I don't

2455
02:10:59,080 --> 02:11:02,040
Speaker 1: know how to do, and over a period of time,

2456
02:11:02,080 --> 02:11:04,560
Speaker 1: if I am dedicated that I will figure out the

2457
02:11:04,560 --> 02:11:07,400
Speaker 1: thing that I want to get most competent at. Yeah,

2458
02:11:07,440 --> 02:11:09,880
Speaker 1: because I mean none of none of what we've been

2459
02:11:09,920 --> 02:11:14,200
Speaker 1: talking about in terms of the various crafts and projects

2460
02:11:14,240 --> 02:11:18,040
Speaker 1: that we've undertaken, are things that are like our primary

2461
02:11:18,080 --> 02:11:21,840
Speaker 1: function in the world. It's just like, well, at some

2462
02:11:21,920 --> 02:11:24,440
Speaker 1: point it seemed like it was worth doing, and so

2463
02:11:24,560 --> 02:11:26,280
Speaker 1: we did some of it, and then we kept doing

2464
02:11:26,280 --> 02:11:29,880
Speaker 1: it now and there's always pretty good at something literally

2465
02:11:29,920 --> 02:11:34,200
Speaker 1: everything we've talked about. There's the you're a I don't know,

2466
02:11:34,440 --> 02:11:37,600
Speaker 1: bougie hipster version of like doing it expensively. Even with

2467
02:11:37,640 --> 02:11:39,840
Speaker 1: like woodworking, there could be a dirt cheap. I built

2468
02:11:39,840 --> 02:11:42,080
Speaker 1: a table for almost nothing when I was younger, because

2469
02:11:42,080 --> 02:11:44,240
Speaker 1: it was like, well, I found this would that the

2470
02:11:44,240 --> 02:11:47,400
Speaker 1: city chopped down, and I bought sand paper and staying

2471
02:11:47,480 --> 02:11:50,400
Speaker 1: for fifteen dollars, and then I got like a fucking

2472
02:11:50,640 --> 02:11:53,200
Speaker 1: base from Ikea, and I had a functional table and

2473
02:11:53,240 --> 02:11:56,000
Speaker 1: I figured it out using YouTube. And it's you know,

2474
02:11:56,320 --> 02:11:58,120
Speaker 1: not as good a table as I could have made

2475
02:11:58,200 --> 02:12:01,040
Speaker 1: if I had ten or thousands of dollars and woodworking tools.

2476
02:12:01,040 --> 02:12:03,040
Speaker 1: But I had a table for years because of it

2477
02:12:03,640 --> 02:12:06,800
Speaker 1: um And it's it's accepting the because I think people

2478
02:12:06,800 --> 02:12:09,760
Speaker 1: do get freaked out. There's such an emphasis on like

2479
02:12:09,880 --> 02:12:12,800
Speaker 1: having the gear, getting the equipment, stockpiling things, and like

2480
02:12:12,920 --> 02:12:18,480
Speaker 1: really stockpiling competency is better because yeah, and I think

2481
02:12:18,480 --> 02:12:21,120
Speaker 1: the Amazon wish list ability to just be like, oh,

2482
02:12:21,160 --> 02:12:23,879
Speaker 1: I want this specific thing, I can in three seconds

2483
02:12:23,920 --> 02:12:25,920
Speaker 1: look it up online and find the exact thing that

2484
02:12:25,960 --> 02:12:29,880
Speaker 1: I want definitely pushes in the opposite direction and makes

2485
02:12:29,880 --> 02:12:33,960
Speaker 1: people a little less resilient. In that capacity because there's

2486
02:12:34,000 --> 02:12:35,640
Speaker 1: less of that idea that you can just have stuff.

2487
02:12:35,720 --> 02:12:37,080
Speaker 1: And I would just say, if people want to get

2488
02:12:37,120 --> 02:12:41,680
Speaker 1: started with it, it's really pick something low stakes, pick

2489
02:12:41,800 --> 02:12:48,320
Speaker 1: something simple, because you build the abilities, you build the

2490
02:12:48,320 --> 02:12:51,760
Speaker 1: ability to learn. And um, I had to explained to

2491
02:12:51,760 --> 02:12:55,080
Speaker 1: me once, it's like a hangar. Every skill you get

2492
02:12:55,240 --> 02:12:58,600
Speaker 1: X as a hangar, and having really basic simple things

2493
02:12:58,720 --> 02:13:02,400
Speaker 1: is actually super necessary arry because even even the like

2494
02:13:02,600 --> 02:13:08,080
Speaker 1: hardcore primitive skills. I have some amazing books that I

2495
02:13:08,120 --> 02:13:11,480
Speaker 1: bought when I was eighteen, and I remember I had

2496
02:13:11,520 --> 02:13:13,080
Speaker 1: them and I looked through and I read it and

2497
02:13:13,080 --> 02:13:17,840
Speaker 1: I was like, this is like reading magic. I understand

2498
02:13:17,960 --> 02:13:21,160
Speaker 1: absolutely none of it. And after a few years of

2499
02:13:21,240 --> 02:13:26,720
Speaker 1: doing things, not even necessarily traditional skills, but just things,

2500
02:13:26,880 --> 02:13:31,800
Speaker 1: practicing stuff, picking stuff, there was so much more framework

2501
02:13:31,840 --> 02:13:33,840
Speaker 1: that I had that I looked through and suddenly there

2502
02:13:33,920 --> 02:13:37,280
Speaker 1: was stuff concepts that I could hang all of these

2503
02:13:37,320 --> 02:13:42,320
Speaker 1: incredible skills on. And we're like, oh, that never made

2504
02:13:42,400 --> 02:13:45,160
Speaker 1: sense to me. I understand it now because I've done

2505
02:13:45,240 --> 02:13:48,440
Speaker 1: simpler things and starting with thing that doesn't seem like

2506
02:13:48,720 --> 02:13:52,839
Speaker 1: overwhelming to learn something simple and something something most steakes,

2507
02:13:52,840 --> 02:13:56,040
Speaker 1: something that if you utterly mess it up. If you

2508
02:13:56,200 --> 02:14:00,360
Speaker 1: have a what are the like like the regret see

2509
02:14:00,360 --> 02:14:03,800
Speaker 1: like craft epic craft fails that it's okay, it's not

2510
02:14:03,920 --> 02:14:07,040
Speaker 1: a big deal because failing is part of learning. And

2511
02:14:07,280 --> 02:14:09,560
Speaker 1: so pick things that it's okay to fail at as

2512
02:14:09,600 --> 02:14:12,480
Speaker 1: your as your projects, and and don't as many of

2513
02:14:12,600 --> 02:14:15,400
Speaker 1: us did in the late nineties and early two thousand's

2514
02:14:15,480 --> 02:14:18,800
Speaker 1: when we didn't have health insurance of any description, you know,

2515
02:14:19,120 --> 02:14:22,120
Speaker 1: experiment on ourselves and our friends with herbs because we

2516
02:14:22,120 --> 02:14:25,680
Speaker 1: didn't have healthcare, access to doctors. Avoid doing that is

2517
02:14:25,720 --> 02:14:30,120
Speaker 1: not low stakes. Yeah, I'm about to go do open

2518
02:14:30,160 --> 02:14:32,680
Speaker 1: surgery on my own infected wound now that you've told

2519
02:14:32,680 --> 02:14:36,000
Speaker 1: me this, and I'm really excited, really excited. I got

2520
02:14:36,440 --> 02:14:38,880
Speaker 1: I got an exact deal, I got some vodka. At

2521
02:14:38,920 --> 02:14:42,880
Speaker 1: least we're good to go. No, the key is really

2522
02:14:43,080 --> 02:14:50,920
Speaker 1: hot glue, same as I have similar because then it

2523
02:14:51,040 --> 02:14:55,680
Speaker 1: sterilizes the wound, hardly doesn't stick to anything. This is

2524
02:14:55,720 --> 02:14:57,440
Speaker 1: how I know you are not a crafter or is

2525
02:14:57,480 --> 02:15:00,760
Speaker 1: hot glue does not stick to anything. You just you

2526
02:15:01,120 --> 02:15:02,800
Speaker 1: squirt it in there, You get it in there real good,

2527
02:15:02,800 --> 02:15:05,360
Speaker 1: and then you cover it with with superglue. I do

2528
02:15:05,440 --> 02:15:08,440
Speaker 1: have a grand plug in the world. I would put

2529
02:15:08,480 --> 02:15:11,120
Speaker 1: superglue in first. I do have a grandpa that has

2530
02:15:11,200 --> 02:15:14,560
Speaker 1: used superglue so many times sticklue his body back together.

2531
02:15:14,600 --> 02:15:20,880
Speaker 1: It is that's very funny, it's effective at that. Anyway,

2532
02:15:21,280 --> 02:15:24,440
Speaker 1: here's our medical advice. Don't do any of the things

2533
02:15:24,520 --> 02:15:26,440
Speaker 1: that we just said. But if you do want to

2534
02:15:26,520 --> 02:15:29,040
Speaker 1: learn how to do suitos, you can find guides where

2535
02:15:29,040 --> 02:15:30,840
Speaker 1: people do it on chicken, which is how if you're

2536
02:15:30,840 --> 02:15:32,440
Speaker 1: an E M T you learn how to do it.

2537
02:15:32,520 --> 02:15:34,400
Speaker 1: And it's that's a that is a skill you can

2538
02:15:34,440 --> 02:15:36,640
Speaker 1: build for very little money. That's useful and you don't

2539
02:15:36,680 --> 02:15:39,000
Speaker 1: have to start on your friends bodies. And I will

2540
02:15:39,040 --> 02:15:42,879
Speaker 1: put in a plug for like wilderness first aid courses

2541
02:15:43,080 --> 02:15:47,480
Speaker 1: are not cheap and there are some real good ones

2542
02:15:47,520 --> 02:15:50,320
Speaker 1: out there, and as a as like a baseline that

2543
02:15:50,520 --> 02:15:53,360
Speaker 1: is a real handy and helps you think about things

2544
02:15:53,360 --> 02:15:57,120
Speaker 1: creatively because wilderness first aid unlike an ambulance driver. An

2545
02:15:57,160 --> 02:15:59,080
Speaker 1: ambulance driver is driving in a box with all the

2546
02:15:59,080 --> 02:16:02,400
Speaker 1: tools they need, and wilderness first aid the assumption is

2547
02:16:03,000 --> 02:16:05,760
Speaker 1: don't have a box. You don't have to and so

2548
02:16:05,840 --> 02:16:09,120
Speaker 1: you have to work it out probably you know, uh,

2549
02:16:09,200 --> 02:16:11,920
Speaker 1: some plantain or something or some the right fucking kind

2550
02:16:11,960 --> 02:16:15,560
Speaker 1: of sap. There's like ship you can use which we

2551
02:16:15,600 --> 02:16:17,920
Speaker 1: will not proceed to attempt to lift off here and

2552
02:16:17,960 --> 02:16:23,520
Speaker 1: provide medical advice. Don't go to a doctor, No use

2553
02:16:23,600 --> 02:16:27,280
Speaker 1: pine needles, make your own needle t don't go to

2554
02:16:27,320 --> 02:16:30,960
Speaker 1: the craft books, cure your COVID, find a bee hive

2555
02:16:31,080 --> 02:16:37,560
Speaker 1: and start sucking. And the other sources are any other

2556
02:16:37,640 --> 02:16:42,080
Speaker 1: sources are you have a great book called Making stuff

2557
02:16:42,120 --> 02:16:44,920
Speaker 1: and Doing Things from way back in the day, definitely

2558
02:16:44,920 --> 02:16:48,200
Speaker 1: recommend that one. Um country know how, like there's some

2559
02:16:48,640 --> 02:16:52,560
Speaker 1: a lot of old craft books actually, um, the entire

2560
02:16:53,040 --> 02:16:58,400
Speaker 1: back collection of the Mother Earth magazine skills stuff like

2561
02:16:58,640 --> 02:17:02,240
Speaker 1: I have definitely made any steadying magazine, not Emma Goldman's

2562
02:17:02,240 --> 02:17:06,880
Speaker 1: anarchist newspaper, but I've definitely made solar powered dehydrators out

2563
02:17:06,920 --> 02:17:10,920
Speaker 1: of cardboard boxes and saran rap from the from Mother

2564
02:17:10,959 --> 02:17:15,280
Speaker 1: Earth magazine stuff. And it's absolutely fantastically just old school

2565
02:17:15,280 --> 02:17:18,040
Speaker 1: guide books, um. And but also anything that's listened as

2566
02:17:18,040 --> 02:17:20,080
Speaker 1: like d I Y guides that have stuff that you

2567
02:17:20,120 --> 02:17:23,039
Speaker 1: would like to make and like to do are great.

2568
02:17:23,200 --> 02:17:27,560
Speaker 1: The library is great. Use the library. Research librarians at

2569
02:17:27,600 --> 02:17:30,640
Speaker 1: the library are great. And if you're like I'm trying

2570
02:17:30,680 --> 02:17:32,880
Speaker 1: to learn how to do this thing? Can you help

2571
02:17:32,920 --> 02:17:35,720
Speaker 1: me find books on it? Research librarians at the library

2572
02:17:35,800 --> 02:17:38,440
Speaker 1: they have doctorates in how to help you do that,

2573
02:17:38,600 --> 02:17:40,680
Speaker 1: and that's they just sit at desks all day waiting

2574
02:17:40,680 --> 02:17:44,120
Speaker 1: for me. And what you'll learn from them about how

2575
02:17:44,160 --> 02:17:47,000
Speaker 1: to answer those questions for yourself is also useful in

2576
02:17:47,040 --> 02:17:50,520
Speaker 1: their long run. We'll go out and make a reflux.

2577
02:17:50,520 --> 02:17:56,080
Speaker 1: Still is that legal? Well, no, not in most places,

2578
02:17:56,080 --> 02:17:58,360
Speaker 1: but it's easy. You just need a box inside of

2579
02:17:58,360 --> 02:18:00,880
Speaker 1: a box and you pour old beer in the center box.

2580
02:18:02,680 --> 02:18:19,000
Speaker 1: That's the episode. After thirty years, it's time to return

2581
02:18:19,040 --> 02:18:21,320
Speaker 1: to the halls of West Beverly High and hang out

2582
02:18:21,360 --> 02:18:23,920
Speaker 1: at the peach pit. On the podcast nine O two one,

2583
02:18:24,000 --> 02:18:27,520
Speaker 1: OMG joined Jenny Garth and Tori Spelling for a rewatch

2584
02:18:27,520 --> 02:18:30,240
Speaker 1: of the hit series Beverly Hills nine O two one oh.

2585
02:18:30,240 --> 02:18:33,360
Speaker 1: From the very beginning, we get to tell the fans

2586
02:18:33,560 --> 02:18:36,240
Speaker 1: all of the behind the scenes stories to actually happen,

2587
02:18:36,360 --> 02:18:39,160
Speaker 1: so they know what happened on camera obviously, but we

2588
02:18:39,200 --> 02:18:41,800
Speaker 1: can tell them all the good stuff that happened off camera.

2589
02:18:41,879 --> 02:18:44,680
Speaker 1: Get all the juicy details of every episode that you've

2590
02:18:44,720 --> 02:18:47,400
Speaker 1: been wondering about for decades. As nine O two one oh.

2591
02:18:47,480 --> 02:18:50,320
Speaker 1: Super fan and radio host Sisson E sits in with

2592
02:18:50,440 --> 02:18:54,039
Speaker 1: Jenny and Tory two reminisce, reflect and relive each moment,

2593
02:18:54,120 --> 02:18:58,080
Speaker 1: from Brandon and Kelly's first kiss to shouting. Donna Martin graduates,

2594
02:18:58,360 --> 02:19:02,240
Speaker 1: you have an amazing memory. You remember everything about the

2595
02:19:02,400 --> 02:19:05,000
Speaker 1: entire ten years that we filmed that show, and you

2596
02:19:05,200 --> 02:19:08,520
Speaker 1: remember absolutely nothing of the ten years that we filmed

2597
02:19:08,720 --> 02:19:11,600
Speaker 1: that show. Listen to nine O two one O MG

2598
02:19:11,800 --> 02:19:14,440
Speaker 1: on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

2599
02:19:14,480 --> 02:19:18,640
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts. Adoption of teens from foster care

2600
02:19:18,680 --> 02:19:20,920
Speaker 1: is a topic not enough people know about, and we're

2601
02:19:20,959 --> 02:19:23,440
Speaker 1: here to change that. I'm April Dinuity, host of the

2602
02:19:23,480 --> 02:19:27,600
Speaker 1: new podcast Navigating Adoption, presented by adopt Us Kids. Each

2603
02:19:27,640 --> 02:19:31,280
Speaker 1: episode brings you compelling, real life adoption stories told by

2604
02:19:31,280 --> 02:19:34,360
Speaker 1: the families that lived them, with commentary from experts. Visit

2605
02:19:34,440 --> 02:19:37,880
Speaker 1: adopt us Kids dot org, slash podcast, or subscribe to

2606
02:19:38,000 --> 02:19:41,320
Speaker 1: Navigating Adoption presented by adopt Us Kids, brought to you

2607
02:19:41,360 --> 02:19:43,279
Speaker 1: by the U. S Department of Health, that Human Services

2608
02:19:43,320 --> 02:19:53,119
Speaker 1: Administration for Children and Families, and the ACT Council. What's

2609
02:19:53,520 --> 02:20:00,120
Speaker 1: Avoiding Starvation? My autonomous neighborhood collectives. Uh, this is it

2610
02:20:00,160 --> 02:20:03,920
Speaker 1: could happen here a podcast about things not being as

2611
02:20:03,920 --> 02:20:06,960
Speaker 1: good as they are and trying to make them better.

2612
02:20:07,680 --> 02:20:11,640
Speaker 1: I'm Robert Evans, my co host today as many days,

2613
02:20:11,920 --> 02:20:15,560
Speaker 1: Garrison Davis Garrison say hello to the people, high people, Garrison.

2614
02:20:15,600 --> 02:20:16,879
Speaker 1: What are we? What are we? What do we? What

2615
02:20:16,920 --> 02:20:18,040
Speaker 1: do we? What do we? What do we? What do

2616
02:20:18,200 --> 02:20:24,760
Speaker 1: we do? What do we do? What are we doing today?

2617
02:20:25,320 --> 02:20:31,599
Speaker 1: Thank you? We are going to be having a discussion

2618
02:20:31,879 --> 02:20:37,960
Speaker 1: on um food and food preservation and finding you mean

2619
02:20:38,000 --> 02:20:41,200
Speaker 1: like putting in the freezer. Well, what if the freezer

2620
02:20:41,280 --> 02:20:44,840
Speaker 1: is not working? The freezer is always working. This is America.

2621
02:20:45,560 --> 02:20:51,960
Speaker 1: Thanks never breaking the power goes out for two weeks. Well,

2622
02:20:51,959 --> 02:20:55,080
Speaker 1: that's one of our guests for today. My friends be

2623
02:20:55,200 --> 02:20:58,240
Speaker 1: in a lane um who you've heard earlier this week,

2624
02:20:58,280 --> 02:21:01,040
Speaker 1: and we're going to talk about food storage and particularly

2625
02:21:01,120 --> 02:21:03,680
Speaker 1: again our focus this week is like we keep getting

2626
02:21:03,680 --> 02:21:06,320
Speaker 1: a lot of people being like I have no money

2627
02:21:06,480 --> 02:21:08,879
Speaker 1: or very little money or very little space. I'm not

2628
02:21:08,879 --> 02:21:11,120
Speaker 1: gonna be able to grow things. How can I possibly

2629
02:21:11,720 --> 02:21:15,120
Speaker 1: you know, gather food store food, like build resiliency. I

2630
02:21:15,160 --> 02:21:18,160
Speaker 1: don't have any any kind of farmland. And the good

2631
02:21:18,160 --> 02:21:21,040
Speaker 1: news is no matter where you live, things that are

2632
02:21:21,120 --> 02:21:23,920
Speaker 1: edible grow and you can get those things and you

2633
02:21:23,959 --> 02:21:25,920
Speaker 1: can find ways to make them last longer than they

2634
02:21:25,920 --> 02:21:28,240
Speaker 1: would if you just kept them in a sack. And

2635
02:21:28,400 --> 02:21:29,920
Speaker 1: that's a pretty cool thing to do. So I'm going

2636
02:21:29,959 --> 02:21:32,120
Speaker 1: to hand it over to be in a lane. I

2637
02:21:32,200 --> 02:21:35,520
Speaker 1: love that. Okay, I don't have much space, I don't

2638
02:21:35,520 --> 02:21:38,480
Speaker 1: have much money. Was kind of how I got into

2639
02:21:38,840 --> 02:21:43,440
Speaker 1: doing canning in the first place. For myself, I used

2640
02:21:43,440 --> 02:21:46,440
Speaker 1: to be very very poor. I was on food stamps,

2641
02:21:46,480 --> 02:21:49,880
Speaker 1: I had no money. I was a broke punk. And

2642
02:21:50,280 --> 02:21:52,640
Speaker 1: one of my friends was like, oh, man, there's this

2643
02:21:52,760 --> 02:21:55,880
Speaker 1: farmer at the farmer's market, and if you help them

2644
02:21:55,920 --> 02:21:59,600
Speaker 1: clean up, they'll let you take away whatever leftover produce

2645
02:21:59,680 --> 02:22:02,280
Speaker 1: they have of that they don't want. So you can

2646
02:22:02,320 --> 02:22:04,520
Speaker 1: just load up a bag with produce. All you gotta

2647
02:22:04,560 --> 02:22:06,520
Speaker 1: do is help them load the truck at the end

2648
02:22:06,560 --> 02:22:11,039
Speaker 1: of the day. So that's what I did every single

2649
02:22:11,959 --> 02:22:16,480
Speaker 1: Wednesday for the next five years, no matter what come,

2650
02:22:16,520 --> 02:22:19,440
Speaker 1: hell or high water. But with that that also came

2651
02:22:19,760 --> 02:22:23,320
Speaker 1: there's you started realizing that there's gluts and then lacks

2652
02:22:23,360 --> 02:22:27,760
Speaker 1: of things. Um much like you know, everything that's happening

2653
02:22:27,760 --> 02:22:31,400
Speaker 1: in society now, just in general, there was seasons when

2654
02:22:31,440 --> 02:22:33,959
Speaker 1: there was nothing but you were It was easy to

2655
02:22:34,120 --> 02:22:36,520
Speaker 1: at the end of a farmer's market day walk home

2656
02:22:36,920 --> 02:22:41,560
Speaker 1: with a fifty pound flat of tomatoes, and you know

2657
02:22:41,680 --> 02:22:44,400
Speaker 1: times of the year where it was nothing but cabbage

2658
02:22:44,800 --> 02:22:47,080
Speaker 1: and you might have wanted tomatoes a lot. And canning

2659
02:22:47,160 --> 02:22:49,879
Speaker 1: was great because it helped to equal out when I

2660
02:22:49,879 --> 02:22:52,800
Speaker 1: could get things without having to dive into the you know,

2661
02:22:53,240 --> 02:22:55,360
Speaker 1: sixty books a month I got in food stamps and

2662
02:22:55,400 --> 02:22:58,080
Speaker 1: spend it at the farmers market. On that instead, I

2663
02:22:58,080 --> 02:23:00,879
Speaker 1: could use it to have a variety of vegetables or

2664
02:23:00,920 --> 02:23:05,000
Speaker 1: canned goods or other things in order to flavor my raman. Yeah.

2665
02:23:05,120 --> 02:23:09,040
Speaker 1: I first came at this kind of from working on farms,

2666
02:23:09,320 --> 02:23:12,840
Speaker 1: where similarly there are gluts. There are times of year

2667
02:23:12,920 --> 02:23:18,560
Speaker 1: where you literally cannot eat melons fast enough, and everybody

2668
02:23:18,560 --> 02:23:20,800
Speaker 1: who works on farms talked about getting the melon ships

2669
02:23:20,879 --> 02:23:23,320
Speaker 1: because you're eating as many melons as you possibly can,

2670
02:23:23,440 --> 02:23:25,400
Speaker 1: and it turns out that doesn't always agree with you.

2671
02:23:26,000 --> 02:23:30,560
Speaker 1: Um and uh. And then you know there's the time

2672
02:23:30,560 --> 02:23:33,440
Speaker 1: of year where, well, if you want to eat some

2673
02:23:33,879 --> 02:23:38,400
Speaker 1: month old potatoes and some two month old squash and

2674
02:23:38,520 --> 02:23:43,520
Speaker 1: maybe some storage cabbage great, and otherwise there's no produce

2675
02:23:43,560 --> 02:23:46,600
Speaker 1: to be had. So preserving food is well, there's a

2676
02:23:46,600 --> 02:23:48,920
Speaker 1: lot of different ways to do it, and it seems

2677
02:23:48,920 --> 02:23:50,959
Speaker 1: really intense a lot of the time because people talk

2678
02:23:51,000 --> 02:23:53,440
Speaker 1: about like batchul is um, you're going to die of

2679
02:23:53,440 --> 02:23:57,360
Speaker 1: battulism if you have home canned food. And so first off,

2680
02:23:57,440 --> 02:24:01,600
Speaker 1: there's just to dispel a lot of myths about things.

2681
02:24:01,920 --> 02:24:07,160
Speaker 1: There's actually really really really low instances of botuli is

2682
02:24:07,240 --> 02:24:09,920
Speaker 1: um um. I'm not going to say it doesn't happen,

2683
02:24:10,240 --> 02:24:14,680
Speaker 1: but there's actually very few cases of bauchuli is um

2684
02:24:14,720 --> 02:24:17,119
Speaker 1: per year, and a lot of them are from industrial

2685
02:24:17,160 --> 02:24:20,840
Speaker 1: canned goods. Don't eat a can if it's bowing out

2686
02:24:20,879 --> 02:24:24,720
Speaker 1: in the sides of the top, throw the can, well

2687
02:24:24,879 --> 02:24:27,280
Speaker 1: bury the can, bury it in the woods far away.

2688
02:24:27,720 --> 02:24:30,480
Speaker 1: But then also beyond canning, there's a lot of different

2689
02:24:30,480 --> 02:24:32,520
Speaker 1: ways of food preservation. You know, you were joking about, like,

2690
02:24:33,160 --> 02:24:35,520
Speaker 1: but don't toss it in the freezer. I don't know.

2691
02:24:35,720 --> 02:24:38,040
Speaker 1: I toss a lot of things in the freezer. Shouldn't

2692
02:24:38,120 --> 02:24:41,400
Speaker 1: not a bad idea? Yeah, I mean, we got all

2693
02:24:41,440 --> 02:24:44,400
Speaker 1: sorts of animals from the farm in the freezer right now,

2694
02:24:44,440 --> 02:24:47,760
Speaker 1: We've got a lot of blueberries because a couple of squirrels.

2695
02:24:48,959 --> 02:24:52,680
Speaker 1: Yeah that was a random thing. Um, just just some

2696
02:24:52,760 --> 02:24:57,400
Speaker 1: squirrels on the side for squirrel for heat is, but yeah,

2697
02:24:57,600 --> 02:25:01,000
Speaker 1: they were the trumpet. Having a freezer is a bad idea.

2698
02:25:01,160 --> 02:25:04,560
Speaker 1: It's just that the freezer depends on, you know, having

2699
02:25:04,920 --> 02:25:09,080
Speaker 1: power or at least having a backup power source or

2700
02:25:09,120 --> 02:25:15,080
Speaker 1: a generator or or or um. And in the case

2701
02:25:15,240 --> 02:25:17,880
Speaker 1: that you don't have access to those things, or can't

2702
02:25:17,879 --> 02:25:21,000
Speaker 1: afford to get a whole extra freezer, and that fills

2703
02:25:21,040 --> 02:25:24,720
Speaker 1: up a substantial part of or can't afford the power

2704
02:25:24,760 --> 02:25:28,280
Speaker 1: the freezer. Um. You know, we we definitely saw this

2705
02:25:28,320 --> 02:25:33,520
Speaker 1: past winter with the power outages that were caused by um,

2706
02:25:33,560 --> 02:25:38,040
Speaker 1: you know, in clement weather, and it suddenly became very

2707
02:25:38,080 --> 02:25:43,760
Speaker 1: hard to acquire dry ice because dry ice will keep

2708
02:25:43,840 --> 02:25:47,800
Speaker 1: stuff cold for longer. But everybody who's gone camping and

2709
02:25:47,879 --> 02:25:50,720
Speaker 1: use dry ice and they're cooler knows that. So as

2710
02:25:50,760 --> 02:25:53,840
Speaker 1: soon as there's an interruption in people's ability to refrigerate

2711
02:25:53,879 --> 02:25:57,480
Speaker 1: their food, the entire regional stock of dry ice is

2712
02:25:57,520 --> 02:26:00,800
Speaker 1: going to disappear. So what we're looking at more in

2713
02:26:00,879 --> 02:26:02,520
Speaker 1: what we're talking about today is a little bit more

2714
02:26:02,720 --> 02:26:06,199
Speaker 1: like the things that you don't need to keep anywhere,

2715
02:26:06,240 --> 02:26:10,680
Speaker 1: but like a cabinet that maybe doesn't get boiling hot,

2716
02:26:10,879 --> 02:26:13,840
Speaker 1: and if it's sort of a room temperature cabinet, you

2717
02:26:13,879 --> 02:26:17,520
Speaker 1: can store a lot of stuff. I've personally found the

2718
02:26:17,560 --> 02:26:20,320
Speaker 1: backs of closets, like, think about all of the areas

2719
02:26:20,360 --> 02:26:22,720
Speaker 1: that you don't clean that you're like, I just shove

2720
02:26:22,800 --> 02:26:25,160
Speaker 1: things back here and hope that they disappear because I

2721
02:26:25,160 --> 02:26:27,600
Speaker 1: don't actually care about them, or like the backs of

2722
02:26:27,640 --> 02:26:30,840
Speaker 1: broom closets. Um that actually, for a long time was

2723
02:26:30,879 --> 02:26:32,920
Speaker 1: my place where I would store canned goods because you

2724
02:26:32,920 --> 02:26:36,400
Speaker 1: can just stack the palettes of jars, the flats of them.

2725
02:26:36,400 --> 02:26:40,440
Speaker 1: Because if you buy jars from this supermarket, um buy

2726
02:26:40,560 --> 02:26:45,280
Speaker 1: mar Canning stores anywhere, safe Way has them, Walmart has them,

2727
02:26:45,600 --> 02:26:48,800
Speaker 1: you can They're not expensive. You can just they come

2728
02:26:48,800 --> 02:26:50,960
Speaker 1: in a little square flat and so after I would

2729
02:26:50,959 --> 02:26:52,640
Speaker 1: fill them, I just put them all back in there

2730
02:26:52,680 --> 02:26:55,240
Speaker 1: and then I could just stack those as a little

2731
02:26:55,280 --> 02:26:58,480
Speaker 1: tower and then you know, hand them out as gifts

2732
02:26:58,480 --> 02:27:01,199
Speaker 1: for the rest of the year, which is also definitely

2733
02:27:01,240 --> 02:27:03,440
Speaker 1: saying that you do when you have absolutely no money

2734
02:27:03,480 --> 02:27:05,320
Speaker 1: and people are like, oh, we're having a New Year's

2735
02:27:05,320 --> 02:27:07,440
Speaker 1: Eve party. And you're like, I brought you jam, and

2736
02:27:07,440 --> 02:27:12,320
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, great, blueberry lovely, but it's nice, has

2737
02:27:12,360 --> 02:27:16,760
Speaker 1: something to be you can give people beyond canning because sometimes,

2738
02:27:16,800 --> 02:27:19,960
Speaker 1: like right now, it's incredibly hard to find the metal

2739
02:27:20,080 --> 02:27:23,360
Speaker 1: lids that go on canning jars or in some cases

2740
02:27:23,400 --> 02:27:27,760
Speaker 1: the jars. That's actually was recently looking for more jar

2741
02:27:27,920 --> 02:27:30,760
Speaker 1: lids and ended up buying flats of jars instead, because

2742
02:27:31,240 --> 02:27:34,959
Speaker 1: as four different stores told me, there's a supply chain

2743
02:27:35,040 --> 02:27:38,520
Speaker 1: disruption in getting jar lids. There's also a lot of

2744
02:27:38,520 --> 02:27:42,240
Speaker 1: ways that you can preserve stuff with drying. You can

2745
02:27:42,400 --> 02:27:46,200
Speaker 1: also do a lot with salt, vinegar and sugar preserving

2746
02:27:46,240 --> 02:27:50,480
Speaker 1: as well, so that you don't necessarily need the recealable

2747
02:27:50,560 --> 02:27:53,160
Speaker 1: jars or like new lids for that. So there's a

2748
02:27:53,160 --> 02:27:57,000
Speaker 1: bunch of different methods um lact of fermentation as well,

2749
02:27:57,160 --> 02:28:00,160
Speaker 1: like fermenting things. So what would you like to talk

2750
02:28:00,200 --> 02:28:02,760
Speaker 1: about first? Let's start with just like what is what

2751
02:28:02,879 --> 02:28:05,520
Speaker 1: is the actual process of canning beyond like just dumping

2752
02:28:05,520 --> 02:28:08,320
Speaker 1: stuff into a can and sealing it. Um. So there's

2753
02:28:08,800 --> 02:28:13,199
Speaker 1: canning by itself is ceiling jars with heat. So that

2754
02:28:13,600 --> 02:28:19,560
Speaker 1: was oh God really really came into its own around

2755
02:28:19,600 --> 02:28:23,240
Speaker 1: like World War two was like industrial canning. And the

2756
02:28:23,320 --> 02:28:28,720
Speaker 1: thing about it is even within canning, there's two different types.

2757
02:28:28,800 --> 02:28:31,560
Speaker 1: There's low heat and high heat canning. Low heat is

2758
02:28:31,560 --> 02:28:35,880
Speaker 1: actually just boiling water temperature, and high heat you actually

2759
02:28:35,879 --> 02:28:39,520
Speaker 1: need to go above the temperature of boiling water so

2760
02:28:40,520 --> 02:28:43,480
Speaker 1: you can pressure can. Um you need a pressure cooker.

2761
02:28:43,680 --> 02:28:47,600
Speaker 1: They terrify me. I don't pressure can because I haven't

2762
02:28:47,760 --> 02:28:51,320
Speaker 1: quite gotten over the images of when they explode and

2763
02:28:51,360 --> 02:28:53,720
Speaker 1: give people steam burns um. I know plenty of people

2764
02:28:53,720 --> 02:28:56,440
Speaker 1: who do pressure can and it's great for them. You

2765
02:28:56,440 --> 02:28:59,680
Speaker 1: can pressure can at high heat. Anything. You can toss

2766
02:29:00,040 --> 02:29:02,440
Speaker 1: raw fish or raw meat in oil and jars or

2767
02:29:02,440 --> 02:29:04,480
Speaker 1: in water in jars, and you can pressure can it

2768
02:29:04,560 --> 02:29:07,440
Speaker 1: and it will cook and seal the jars and it

2769
02:29:07,560 --> 02:29:12,240
Speaker 1: is very safe. Low temperature canning is still relying on

2770
02:29:12,240 --> 02:29:15,520
Speaker 1: one of the other methods like salt, sugar, acid for

2771
02:29:15,720 --> 02:29:19,440
Speaker 1: the to keep down bacteria. So all it does, though

2772
02:29:19,440 --> 02:29:21,240
Speaker 1: is it makes the same so you can do this

2773
02:29:21,320 --> 02:29:23,920
Speaker 1: with or without canning. It just makes the jars keep

2774
02:29:23,959 --> 02:29:27,680
Speaker 1: a lot longer because it preserves them. So it's the

2775
02:29:27,680 --> 02:29:30,400
Speaker 1: process of you take a jar and then you either

2776
02:29:30,560 --> 02:29:34,360
Speaker 1: use a clean ring if you're using those latching reusable

2777
02:29:34,440 --> 02:29:36,840
Speaker 1: jars with these nice rings on them that you can

2778
02:29:36,920 --> 02:29:39,360
Speaker 1: use over and over again. Really handy when there are

2779
02:29:39,360 --> 02:29:41,879
Speaker 1: supply chain disruptions to know that you can reuse your

2780
02:29:42,000 --> 02:29:44,280
Speaker 1: jar and ring. We're talking about like the Mason jars

2781
02:29:44,320 --> 02:29:47,680
Speaker 1: that you you you would get in uh bars that

2782
02:29:47,720 --> 02:29:49,760
Speaker 1: are too expensive five years ago. They would pour your

2783
02:29:49,800 --> 02:29:52,039
Speaker 1: terrible I P A in them. Yeah, but you can

2784
02:29:52,120 --> 02:29:54,520
Speaker 1: use them for other things too. These are the well

2785
02:29:54,560 --> 02:29:58,000
Speaker 1: there's two. There's the jars that have a lid that

2786
02:29:58,160 --> 02:30:02,520
Speaker 1: is attached and it latch, oh with the YEA and

2787
02:30:02,560 --> 02:30:06,240
Speaker 1: so those have a Those have a rubber gas that

2788
02:30:06,320 --> 02:30:08,520
Speaker 1: you can and as long as you keep those oiled

2789
02:30:08,520 --> 02:30:10,720
Speaker 1: and clean, you can reuse those for years. They do

2790
02:30:10,800 --> 02:30:13,840
Speaker 1: eventually wear out, but they use a long time. Others

2791
02:30:13,920 --> 02:30:18,039
Speaker 1: is Mason or Ball canning jars, and those actually have

2792
02:30:18,320 --> 02:30:21,800
Speaker 1: a two piece top. They have a middle ring that

2793
02:30:21,879 --> 02:30:23,920
Speaker 1: you just need to make sure it's not like horrifically

2794
02:30:24,000 --> 02:30:26,840
Speaker 1: dented or rusted throat. It's reusable for a very long time.

2795
02:30:26,879 --> 02:30:29,360
Speaker 1: And then you have a lid and the lid can

2796
02:30:29,400 --> 02:30:32,119
Speaker 1: only really they are recommended to only use once I've

2797
02:30:32,160 --> 02:30:34,640
Speaker 1: re used them like twice. May used to can once

2798
02:30:34,680 --> 02:30:36,720
Speaker 1: you can like once it's canned and you you can

2799
02:30:36,720 --> 02:30:38,200
Speaker 1: take stuff out put it back on. You don't have

2800
02:30:38,240 --> 02:30:40,520
Speaker 1: to like replace the lid every time you get some

2801
02:30:40,560 --> 02:30:43,240
Speaker 1: preserves out. Yeah, but the tiny piece of rubber that

2802
02:30:43,360 --> 02:30:45,840
Speaker 1: is what steals it is very thin and so it's

2803
02:30:45,879 --> 02:30:51,840
Speaker 1: not very reusable for multiple can't batches of food and

2804
02:30:51,840 --> 02:30:55,039
Speaker 1: and true to farm. You know, if you go looking

2805
02:30:55,080 --> 02:31:01,840
Speaker 1: around in you know, rummage sales, vintage stores, whatever, you

2806
02:31:01,879 --> 02:31:05,879
Speaker 1: will probably find either very cheap or very overpriced some

2807
02:31:06,000 --> 02:31:10,160
Speaker 1: of those old hinged jars and tons of Mason jars

2808
02:31:10,200 --> 02:31:12,520
Speaker 1: and tons of Mason jars. You will often need to

2809
02:31:12,560 --> 02:31:17,039
Speaker 1: replace either the lids or the rubber gaskets in order

2810
02:31:17,080 --> 02:31:19,680
Speaker 1: to make them safe to star food in. But in

2811
02:31:19,720 --> 02:31:24,040
Speaker 1: either case, whether you're using the little the mason or

2812
02:31:24,080 --> 02:31:26,160
Speaker 1: ball jars that you'll find in lots of stores or

2813
02:31:26,200 --> 02:31:28,959
Speaker 1: the big latching ones, um, the jars are the more

2814
02:31:28,959 --> 02:31:33,359
Speaker 1: expensive spots things. The lids and the rubber rings are

2815
02:31:33,400 --> 02:31:36,959
Speaker 1: more inexpensive to replace. So if you can find them

2816
02:31:37,000 --> 02:31:40,440
Speaker 1: at Goodwill, if you can find them at Goodwill bins

2817
02:31:40,800 --> 02:31:44,480
Speaker 1: or the places, it's great, you should always grab them.

2818
02:31:44,640 --> 02:31:50,039
Speaker 1: Jars are never a bad idea, so canning. There's a

2819
02:31:50,080 --> 02:31:56,640
Speaker 1: million different ways to can. I do a lot of jams, jellies, pickles,

2820
02:31:56,720 --> 02:31:59,360
Speaker 1: and tomatoes, which are all things that are camped that

2821
02:31:59,400 --> 02:32:03,160
Speaker 1: are preserved either with acid or sugar. In either case, Um,

2822
02:32:03,280 --> 02:32:05,520
Speaker 1: James and jella is being sugar and pickles and stuff

2823
02:32:05,520 --> 02:32:09,520
Speaker 1: being acid. Yes, those are my two favorites. They're very

2824
02:32:09,560 --> 02:32:12,840
Speaker 1: simple to learn, and then you can always expand recipes

2825
02:32:12,879 --> 02:32:16,640
Speaker 1: and everything else. Um. But with pickles and tomatoes and

2826
02:32:16,680 --> 02:32:21,039
Speaker 1: other things, having the PHB very acidic is what actually

2827
02:32:21,040 --> 02:32:25,000
Speaker 1: does the preservation of the food and keeps down fungus is, molds,

2828
02:32:25,080 --> 02:32:29,040
Speaker 1: bacterias and stuff. And with jams and jellies, the natural

2829
02:32:29,360 --> 02:32:32,960
Speaker 1: acidity of the fruit mixed with a lot of sugar

2830
02:32:33,800 --> 02:32:37,720
Speaker 1: is what keeps the fruits from going bad or anything.

2831
02:32:38,240 --> 02:32:40,320
Speaker 1: And the great thing about canning fruit is that, like

2832
02:32:40,360 --> 02:32:42,480
Speaker 1: when you when you're thinking about what is the greatest

2833
02:32:42,520 --> 02:32:45,360
Speaker 1: number of free calories available to most people in a

2834
02:32:45,440 --> 02:32:49,040
Speaker 1: city during the seasons where fruit grows, it's often going

2835
02:32:49,080 --> 02:32:51,400
Speaker 1: to be fruit, And like you, you'd be surprised. Like

2836
02:32:51,400 --> 02:32:53,119
Speaker 1: where you can do like Los Angeles where I used

2837
02:32:53,120 --> 02:32:56,480
Speaker 1: to live, there was much of the year, like seven

2838
02:32:56,520 --> 02:32:58,600
Speaker 1: eight months you could fill your arms with fruit if

2839
02:32:58,640 --> 02:33:00,520
Speaker 1: you knew where to go and there's an app falling

2840
02:33:00,520 --> 02:33:03,240
Speaker 1: fruit that you can use to find people mark like

2841
02:33:03,240 --> 02:33:05,880
Speaker 1: where different trees are a lot of like you'll be

2842
02:33:05,920 --> 02:33:07,800
Speaker 1: surprised even if you think, like, well, there's no fruit

2843
02:33:07,879 --> 02:33:10,000
Speaker 1: in my area, to try falling fruit, you you may

2844
02:33:10,040 --> 02:33:11,959
Speaker 1: find that out. Actually there's a shipload of fruit. And

2845
02:33:11,959 --> 02:33:14,560
Speaker 1: I just was not looking or as you often find,

2846
02:33:14,600 --> 02:33:16,600
Speaker 1: I didn't realize that was an edible plant. I assume

2847
02:33:16,640 --> 02:33:20,280
Speaker 1: those berries were. We're not food and they can be.

2848
02:33:20,440 --> 02:33:23,760
Speaker 1: And and that's a lot of like free you know

2849
02:33:23,760 --> 02:33:26,400
Speaker 1: when you especially when you're making preserves that's really calorically dense.

2850
02:33:27,040 --> 02:33:29,600
Speaker 1: And and that also ties in with in the sort

2851
02:33:29,600 --> 02:33:34,680
Speaker 1: of survival utility aspect of this, because like canning is fun,

2852
02:33:34,760 --> 02:33:37,720
Speaker 1: and harvesting fruit is fun, and having stuff you made

2853
02:33:38,480 --> 02:33:42,400
Speaker 1: to feel pomegranates from rich people's houses do it, sure, absolutely,

2854
02:33:42,440 --> 02:33:44,760
Speaker 1: I mean, but part of part of the other thing

2855
02:33:44,800 --> 02:33:47,760
Speaker 1: to think about here is that like providing yourself with

2856
02:33:47,800 --> 02:33:52,840
Speaker 1: a reserve of different kinds of nutrition and different like

2857
02:33:52,920 --> 02:33:56,600
Speaker 1: there's you get an assortment of stuff so you know

2858
02:33:56,720 --> 02:34:00,160
Speaker 1: you aren't having to constantly buy it because honestly, the

2859
02:34:00,200 --> 02:34:03,199
Speaker 1: most expensive in terms of carbon output. The most expensive

2860
02:34:03,240 --> 02:34:08,640
Speaker 1: in terms of cost per calorie in grocery stores tends

2861
02:34:08,720 --> 02:34:10,920
Speaker 1: to come from the stuff that's you know, been shipped

2862
02:34:10,959 --> 02:34:13,640
Speaker 1: up from Argentina because it's not in season up here.

2863
02:34:13,800 --> 02:34:17,039
Speaker 1: That's while you're getting grapes in January, right and blueberries,

2864
02:34:17,080 --> 02:34:19,800
Speaker 1: you can actually watch them move all the way down

2865
02:34:19,800 --> 02:34:22,760
Speaker 1: the northern hemisphere over the course of the growing season

2866
02:34:22,840 --> 02:34:25,160
Speaker 1: until they're like growing them down in Chile right before

2867
02:34:25,200 --> 02:34:27,720
Speaker 1: they start being able to grow them again. So yeah,

2868
02:34:27,800 --> 02:34:31,000
Speaker 1: So just thinking about like the things that are available

2869
02:34:31,120 --> 02:34:33,440
Speaker 1: when they are available, um. And you'll see this all

2870
02:34:33,480 --> 02:34:36,640
Speaker 1: the time, like the good forage spots. When they're available,

2871
02:34:36,680 --> 02:34:41,720
Speaker 1: there will be crowds of people all they're all collecting stuff, um.

2872
02:34:41,840 --> 02:34:45,760
Speaker 1: And getting to know some of the things that you

2873
02:34:45,920 --> 02:34:49,440
Speaker 1: like and that grow near you and what time of

2874
02:34:49,600 --> 02:34:54,040
Speaker 1: year they come into season, and maybe forming some relationships

2875
02:34:54,080 --> 02:34:56,920
Speaker 1: with people and being like, hey, I noticed you have

2876
02:34:57,600 --> 02:35:00,640
Speaker 1: a chestnut tree in your backyard. Can I come and

2877
02:35:00,840 --> 02:35:05,320
Speaker 1: harvest chestnuts? Hey, you have this kind of oak, Can

2878
02:35:05,360 --> 02:35:07,520
Speaker 1: I come and get acorns from you? Because I want

2879
02:35:07,560 --> 02:35:10,600
Speaker 1: to do a leeching project. Hey, I was grabbing apples

2880
02:35:10,600 --> 02:35:13,160
Speaker 1: and I noticed that you're harvesting all these acorns. I

2881
02:35:13,160 --> 02:35:15,120
Speaker 1: didn't know that you could do anything with acorns. What

2882
02:35:15,200 --> 02:35:18,040
Speaker 1: is what are you doing with all those acorns? And

2883
02:35:18,040 --> 02:35:20,480
Speaker 1: one of the greatest things, too, is that a good

2884
02:35:20,520 --> 02:35:23,840
Speaker 1: fruit tree makes a lot of fruit. So much so,

2885
02:35:23,920 --> 02:35:27,320
Speaker 1: you know, we have a little plum that's near our house.

2886
02:35:27,480 --> 02:35:31,120
Speaker 1: It's a little plum tree. And since this year we

2887
02:35:31,200 --> 02:35:33,360
Speaker 1: managed to get to it before the raccoon did that

2888
02:35:33,440 --> 02:35:37,600
Speaker 1: likes to clamber over the roof. We got about two

2889
02:35:38,040 --> 02:35:41,560
Speaker 1: and fifty pounds of plums off of the small fruit tree.

2890
02:35:42,120 --> 02:35:44,240
Speaker 1: And it is not very big. It has a footprint

2891
02:35:44,400 --> 02:35:48,480
Speaker 1: of maybe about ten ft in diameter of the widest

2892
02:35:48,480 --> 02:35:51,080
Speaker 1: part of the tree. But it drops quite a bit

2893
02:35:51,080 --> 02:35:52,560
Speaker 1: of fruit, especially if we get to it before it

2894
02:35:52,600 --> 02:35:54,600
Speaker 1: all drops on the ground and our cars and the

2895
02:35:54,680 --> 02:35:57,680
Speaker 1: driveway and the walkway and the cat and the cat.

2896
02:35:57,920 --> 02:36:01,320
Speaker 1: But if we get to it, it's a lot. So honestly,

2897
02:36:01,360 --> 02:36:04,880
Speaker 1: I set aside about a fifty pound tub that was like, okay,

2898
02:36:04,879 --> 02:36:07,200
Speaker 1: we're gonna make some jam. We're gonna dry some of these,

2899
02:36:07,200 --> 02:36:09,200
Speaker 1: we're going to do things with it, and the rest

2900
02:36:09,240 --> 02:36:11,280
Speaker 1: we were able to give to friends. We toss some

2901
02:36:11,320 --> 02:36:13,080
Speaker 1: of the free fridges, We toss some all you know,

2902
02:36:13,160 --> 02:36:16,520
Speaker 1: we handed out because one good fruit tree makes a lot.

2903
02:36:16,560 --> 02:36:18,840
Speaker 1: So when you see fruit trees around town, when you

2904
02:36:18,879 --> 02:36:23,440
Speaker 1: walk under someone's cherry tree, it's okay to ask for

2905
02:36:23,600 --> 02:36:26,560
Speaker 1: fruit too, because I don't know anyone that uses every

2906
02:36:26,600 --> 02:36:28,760
Speaker 1: single piece of fruit off of any other fruit trees.

2907
02:36:29,400 --> 02:36:31,480
Speaker 1: And you know, one of the things that you will

2908
02:36:31,520 --> 02:36:35,720
Speaker 1: see is that um a lot of cities try to

2909
02:36:35,800 --> 02:36:42,640
Speaker 1: discourage people from planting fruit trees along roads precisely because

2910
02:36:42,800 --> 02:36:45,440
Speaker 1: when they come into fruit, they produce so much fruit

2911
02:36:45,480 --> 02:36:48,480
Speaker 1: that it causes the problem. Also, it's a good way

2912
02:36:48,480 --> 02:36:51,480
Speaker 1: to form relationships in your neighborhood. You say like, hey,

2913
02:36:51,760 --> 02:36:54,440
Speaker 1: we have a whole bunch of plums, we have a

2914
02:36:54,520 --> 02:36:58,080
Speaker 1: ton of whatever is dropping all over your front yard.

2915
02:36:58,520 --> 02:37:02,280
Speaker 1: And then your neighbors may be like, oh, those weirdos

2916
02:37:02,280 --> 02:37:05,480
Speaker 1: who were collecting fruit that one time. This tree in

2917
02:37:05,560 --> 02:37:07,920
Speaker 1: my backyard that's about to drop all this stuff. I'll

2918
02:37:08,000 --> 02:37:10,000
Speaker 1: let them know and maybe they'll come so I don't

2919
02:37:10,000 --> 02:37:13,120
Speaker 1: have to clean it up afterwards. Yeah, which is again,

2920
02:37:13,160 --> 02:37:15,200
Speaker 1: like people, we talk a lot about the importance of

2921
02:37:15,200 --> 02:37:18,240
Speaker 1: building like community resiliency and community self defense, and folks

2922
02:37:18,280 --> 02:37:20,160
Speaker 1: act like, well, how do I actually do that? Well,

2923
02:37:20,200 --> 02:37:22,240
Speaker 1: that's maybe that's a start for you. Maybe the start

2924
02:37:22,320 --> 02:37:23,760
Speaker 1: is like you get to know what do they have?

2925
02:37:23,840 --> 02:37:25,960
Speaker 1: What do I have? And then you start talking about like, well,

2926
02:37:25,959 --> 02:37:27,520
Speaker 1: I'm gonna can some stuff. Do you want to learn

2927
02:37:27,560 --> 02:37:29,080
Speaker 1: how to can? You're like, oh, well, I was going

2928
02:37:29,120 --> 02:37:30,400
Speaker 1: to dry at East. Do you want to learn it? Like?

2929
02:37:30,520 --> 02:37:32,040
Speaker 1: Or do you want to borrow a dehydrator? And then

2930
02:37:32,080 --> 02:37:35,680
Speaker 1: you're making connections that are very practical and also social

2931
02:37:35,720 --> 02:37:39,320
Speaker 1: in your area. Also one plug, we've talked a little

2932
02:37:39,360 --> 02:37:43,840
Speaker 1: bit about the process of canning. Dehydrators are great and

2933
02:37:43,920 --> 02:37:48,000
Speaker 1: are pretty affordable, and they're not expensive. Yeah, like I

2934
02:37:48,040 --> 02:37:50,840
Speaker 1: think you know, for sixty to eighty bucks, you can

2935
02:37:50,959 --> 02:37:54,040
Speaker 1: usually get a decent dehydrator. And if you don't have one,

2936
02:37:54,080 --> 02:37:56,520
Speaker 1: but you have an oven, if you put things on

2937
02:37:56,560 --> 02:37:59,520
Speaker 1: a baking rack very low heat, you can just put it.

2938
02:37:59,600 --> 02:38:02,240
Speaker 1: I would just turn my oven onto warm and you

2939
02:38:02,280 --> 02:38:05,720
Speaker 1: can lay out things in your oven. I have a

2940
02:38:05,800 --> 02:38:08,400
Speaker 1: nicer oven now that won't let me do this. But

2941
02:38:08,480 --> 02:38:11,440
Speaker 1: when I used to live in like my first junkie apartment,

2942
02:38:11,800 --> 02:38:15,879
Speaker 1: I would literally just stick a metal spoon, like a

2943
02:38:15,920 --> 02:38:17,840
Speaker 1: one of my big cooking spoons in the door of

2944
02:38:17,920 --> 02:38:19,920
Speaker 1: the ovens so that it would open and that would

2945
02:38:19,920 --> 02:38:22,320
Speaker 1: just vent all of the steam of whatever I was

2946
02:38:22,440 --> 02:38:25,440
Speaker 1: drying in the oven. So and meanwhile, if you live

2947
02:38:25,480 --> 02:38:28,760
Speaker 1: in say a really dry climate or a climate where

2948
02:38:28,840 --> 02:38:31,360
Speaker 1: you have a really dry stretch of time when fruit

2949
02:38:31,480 --> 02:38:35,880
Speaker 1: is in season, and you have windows, screens and an

2950
02:38:35,920 --> 02:38:38,720
Speaker 1: area where you can make sure there's a steady breeze

2951
02:38:38,920 --> 02:38:42,880
Speaker 1: flowing across your your fruit, cut it thin, lay it

2952
02:38:42,879 --> 02:38:45,320
Speaker 1: out in the sun. And that's why there's so much

2953
02:38:45,440 --> 02:38:48,119
Speaker 1: sun dried X, Y and Z. That's really expensive when

2954
02:38:48,120 --> 02:38:50,200
Speaker 1: you go to dram Joe's or whatever, and it's you know,

2955
02:38:50,360 --> 02:38:52,080
Speaker 1: it's not just a matter we shouldn't just say that

2956
02:38:52,120 --> 02:38:54,160
Speaker 1: like this is you have to forage for all this stuff,

2957
02:38:54,160 --> 02:38:56,119
Speaker 1: like it could be a matter of like, well, during

2958
02:38:56,160 --> 02:38:59,080
Speaker 1: these months, beef is is much cheaper, It's half as

2959
02:38:59,160 --> 02:39:01,280
Speaker 1: much as it will be later. I'm going to buy

2960
02:39:01,320 --> 02:39:04,199
Speaker 1: beef when it's cheap, and I'm going to make jerky now,

2961
02:39:04,360 --> 02:39:07,200
Speaker 1: and then I will have protein when I can't afford

2962
02:39:07,280 --> 02:39:10,240
Speaker 1: to purchase protein or as much protein later. In the

2963
02:39:10,280 --> 02:39:12,240
Speaker 1: air speaking of jerky, I mean like one of the

2964
02:39:13,080 --> 02:39:15,280
Speaker 1: just in the vein of you know, building your own

2965
02:39:15,320 --> 02:39:18,600
Speaker 1: dehydrat or something one other thing that uh that that

2966
02:39:18,720 --> 02:39:21,080
Speaker 1: I've done is you can just get a you know,

2967
02:39:21,160 --> 02:39:24,320
Speaker 1: a decent box fan and some furnace filters and strap

2968
02:39:24,400 --> 02:39:27,600
Speaker 1: them all together, and that can very successfully dry out

2969
02:39:27,680 --> 02:39:31,120
Speaker 1: jerky um so D dehydrators. There's a lot of different

2970
02:39:31,120 --> 02:39:35,480
Speaker 1: ways to Yeah, it is literally just kind of warm

2971
02:39:37,959 --> 02:39:41,000
Speaker 1: or less in some cases, and air that is moving,

2972
02:39:41,640 --> 02:39:44,080
Speaker 1: and it's it's like everything we've been talking about. There's

2973
02:39:44,120 --> 02:39:47,480
Speaker 1: the you can buy very expensive dehydrators if you want to.

2974
02:39:47,520 --> 02:39:50,720
Speaker 1: If you want to get a primo jerky making together,

2975
02:39:50,800 --> 02:39:53,480
Speaker 1: you can you can make that a real expensive thing,

2976
02:39:53,640 --> 02:39:56,440
Speaker 1: or you can do it for like trash, like with

2977
02:39:56,440 --> 02:39:59,320
Speaker 1: with discarded crap that you find around in people's like

2978
02:39:59,520 --> 02:40:01,959
Speaker 1: take aisles. And I think also the other thing to

2979
02:40:01,959 --> 02:40:04,760
Speaker 1: think about we're talking about it's not all foraging, is

2980
02:40:04,800 --> 02:40:08,119
Speaker 1: to think about we've been talking about supply chain disruptions,

2981
02:40:08,280 --> 02:40:12,080
Speaker 1: but also one of the things in our current circumstances

2982
02:40:12,240 --> 02:40:17,160
Speaker 1: is the weird gluts and excesses and surpluses that are

2983
02:40:17,160 --> 02:40:21,000
Speaker 1: produced by our supply chains. And again, one of the

2984
02:40:21,040 --> 02:40:24,560
Speaker 1: big ways that I learned about food preservation was food

2985
02:40:24,560 --> 02:40:28,800
Speaker 1: not bombs and food preservation and also just food preparation

2986
02:40:29,080 --> 02:40:31,160
Speaker 1: was food not bombs. Way back in the day, like

2987
02:40:31,200 --> 02:40:34,720
Speaker 1: you need a special sound every time on specifically it

2988
02:40:34,760 --> 02:40:37,160
Speaker 1: could happen here. Someone mentions food not bombs At this

2989
02:40:37,240 --> 02:40:40,280
Speaker 1: point that was my entry back when I was just

2990
02:40:40,400 --> 02:40:44,680
Speaker 1: kind of a liberally journalist guy to like anarchist practice.

2991
02:40:44,840 --> 02:40:47,280
Speaker 1: Was like every protest I go to, there's these like

2992
02:40:47,800 --> 02:40:51,360
Speaker 1: rusty punks handing out sandwiches, um, and then they have

2993
02:40:51,440 --> 02:40:54,560
Speaker 1: neat stickers. I wonder what's going on here and well,

2994
02:40:54,640 --> 02:40:56,879
Speaker 1: And one of the important things about food not bombs

2995
02:40:56,959 --> 02:40:58,760
Speaker 1: is that food not bombs has sort of two different

2996
02:40:59,400 --> 02:41:03,240
Speaker 1: ways that you obtain food for food not bombs. One

2997
02:41:03,480 --> 02:41:10,480
Speaker 1: is you form relationships with first farmers, Yeah, people who

2998
02:41:10,480 --> 02:41:12,720
Speaker 1: are going to have a lot of food, a lot

2999
02:41:12,760 --> 02:41:15,640
Speaker 1: of supply coming in and there's stuff they're not going

3000
02:41:15,720 --> 02:41:20,119
Speaker 1: to be able to use, either because it's ugly or

3001
02:41:20,160 --> 02:41:22,480
Speaker 1: you know, it's carrots that look like dicks and they

3002
02:41:22,480 --> 02:41:24,760
Speaker 1: don't feel comfortable putting the carrots that look like dicks

3003
02:41:24,800 --> 02:41:30,720
Speaker 1: on the shop. Or Yeah, so you have your relationships

3004
02:41:30,760 --> 02:41:34,480
Speaker 1: with like local businesses and local suppliers who aren't going

3005
02:41:34,520 --> 02:41:36,560
Speaker 1: to be able to sell or use some of their stuff.

3006
02:41:36,600 --> 02:41:40,440
Speaker 1: And right day Old Bread we are a bakery and

3007
02:41:40,480 --> 02:41:42,640
Speaker 1: we pride ourselves on fresh bread. So we're going to

3008
02:41:42,720 --> 02:41:45,000
Speaker 1: give our day olds and it makes us feel good

3009
02:41:45,000 --> 02:41:47,680
Speaker 1: as liberals to give it to food not bombs. And

3010
02:41:47,720 --> 02:41:51,760
Speaker 1: then on the flip side, there's the the fact that

3011
02:41:52,120 --> 02:41:55,120
Speaker 1: the supply chain is designed to produce these excesses. But

3012
02:41:55,160 --> 02:41:57,160
Speaker 1: then if it can't make money off of them, dispose

3013
02:41:57,240 --> 02:41:59,200
Speaker 1: of them. That's where you end up with, you know,

3014
02:41:59,280 --> 02:42:03,879
Speaker 1: cop starting, copscarding dumpsters for example, don't dumpster from the

3015
02:42:03,920 --> 02:42:08,400
Speaker 1: cops that the cop guarded dumpsters. Those are the other dumpsters.

3016
02:42:08,560 --> 02:42:12,240
Speaker 1: Go to other dumpsters because it's infuriating, it's very frustrating.

3017
02:42:12,240 --> 02:42:14,280
Speaker 1: I get the desire to yell at the cop, but

3018
02:42:14,320 --> 02:42:16,600
Speaker 1: there will you can find dumpsters that are not started.

3019
02:42:17,160 --> 02:42:21,640
Speaker 1: If you are a store or restaurant, you're legally protected

3020
02:42:21,680 --> 02:42:26,280
Speaker 1: to let people go through your dumpster. Yeah, not to you. Yeah.

3021
02:42:26,760 --> 02:42:30,080
Speaker 1: During the Clinton administration, there's legislation that was passed that

3022
02:42:30,280 --> 02:42:33,240
Speaker 1: straight up said, like at a federal level, if you

3023
02:42:33,360 --> 02:42:37,920
Speaker 1: present I think the wording is seemingly wholesome and healthful

3024
02:42:38,040 --> 02:42:41,600
Speaker 1: food two people for free, even if it has pastic

3025
02:42:41,800 --> 02:42:46,160
Speaker 1: expiration date, that you are legally protected because it's dumb

3026
02:42:46,320 --> 02:42:49,119
Speaker 1: to throw out food just because the thing that stamped

3027
02:42:49,120 --> 02:42:52,000
Speaker 1: on the package has expired. Now that does mean if

3028
02:42:52,040 --> 02:42:54,760
Speaker 1: you pick up some meat that's expired and the package

3029
02:42:54,760 --> 02:42:58,080
Speaker 1: is puffy, don't eat that. And it also there are

3030
02:42:58,120 --> 02:43:01,160
Speaker 1: also local ordinances and local laws that do restrict that

3031
02:43:01,200 --> 02:43:03,280
Speaker 1: more because there are places where people get arrested for

3032
02:43:03,320 --> 02:43:06,000
Speaker 1: handing out food to like you know, homeless people and whatnot.

3033
02:43:06,040 --> 02:43:09,000
Speaker 1: But you know, check your local laws before doing anything

3034
02:43:09,080 --> 02:43:11,400
Speaker 1: is radical and violent as giving out as giving out

3035
02:43:11,440 --> 02:43:15,039
Speaker 1: free food to poor people. Yeah, there are these gluts

3036
02:43:15,160 --> 02:43:17,280
Speaker 1: um and there are these points where the supply chain

3037
02:43:17,360 --> 02:43:21,120
Speaker 1: is going to dump huge amounts of stuff into the system.

3038
02:43:21,200 --> 02:43:23,680
Speaker 1: For example, right now, we just talked about how canning

3039
02:43:23,680 --> 02:43:26,120
Speaker 1: supplies are kind of in short supply right now, which

3040
02:43:26,200 --> 02:43:29,240
Speaker 1: is weird. I guarantee you that that means in a

3041
02:43:29,280 --> 02:43:32,640
Speaker 1: couple of months there's going to be tons of canning

3042
02:43:32,680 --> 02:43:36,720
Speaker 1: supplies everywhere. Or you know, when there were power outages

3043
02:43:36,760 --> 02:43:39,600
Speaker 1: in Portland then there was a bunch of stuff, even

3044
02:43:39,640 --> 02:43:43,000
Speaker 1: stuff that doesn't need to be refrigerated was getting thrown

3045
02:43:43,000 --> 02:43:46,640
Speaker 1: out if it was stored in the refrigerated section because

3046
02:43:46,720 --> 02:43:50,720
Speaker 1: stores have their specific protocols about like oh well if

3047
02:43:50,760 --> 02:43:53,920
Speaker 1: this is left, if this freezer is unplugged, we have

3048
02:43:54,000 --> 02:43:56,200
Speaker 1: to throw out everything in the freezer. Never mind that

3049
02:43:56,200 --> 02:43:58,199
Speaker 1: a bunch of stuff in the freezer straight up says

3050
02:43:58,320 --> 02:44:01,160
Speaker 1: right there on it does not require refrigeration, or only

3051
02:44:01,200 --> 02:44:05,439
Speaker 1: refrigerate after opening after opening, So think about, like, where

3052
02:44:05,480 --> 02:44:09,920
Speaker 1: are your local systems going to produce these huge bloods,

3053
02:44:10,040 --> 02:44:12,920
Speaker 1: or maybe it's super cheap at certain times of year,

3054
02:44:13,000 --> 02:44:17,760
Speaker 1: you know, you maybe corn goes down to like cents

3055
02:44:17,800 --> 02:44:20,640
Speaker 1: an ear or five cents an ear at the end

3056
02:44:20,640 --> 02:44:23,600
Speaker 1: of at the at the end of August, right, so

3057
02:44:23,800 --> 02:44:26,000
Speaker 1: maybe you can get a whole ton of corn and

3058
02:44:26,000 --> 02:44:29,920
Speaker 1: then you can dry it. Like you know, when I

3059
02:44:30,000 --> 02:44:32,280
Speaker 1: was a kid, we lived in California, and we were

3060
02:44:32,320 --> 02:44:34,240
Speaker 1: not doing a ton of canning. I did not grow

3061
02:44:34,320 --> 02:44:37,640
Speaker 1: up canning. I didn't grow up preserving food. I didn't

3062
02:44:38,360 --> 02:44:41,520
Speaker 1: in that type of way. But one thing that my

3063
02:44:41,600 --> 02:44:44,440
Speaker 1: mom would do is when our little mire lemon tree

3064
02:44:44,560 --> 02:44:48,119
Speaker 1: was covered in lemons, she would just juice a whole

3065
02:44:48,160 --> 02:44:51,119
Speaker 1: pile of them and then poured into ice cube trays

3066
02:44:51,520 --> 02:44:53,760
Speaker 1: and then empty the ice cube trays into gallon bags,

3067
02:44:53,800 --> 02:44:55,440
Speaker 1: and then we had lemon you know, we would make

3068
02:44:55,520 --> 02:44:58,879
Speaker 1: lemonade all year round. And her recipe literally called for

3069
02:44:59,600 --> 02:45:02,879
Speaker 1: three lemon cubes to how much sugar and stuff as

3070
02:45:02,879 --> 02:45:05,120
Speaker 1: she had it measured out, and so she would just

3071
02:45:05,120 --> 02:45:06,680
Speaker 1: pop those in and that would just live in the

3072
02:45:06,760 --> 02:45:10,600
Speaker 1: refrigerator all year round. Was just constant lemonade. One other

3073
02:45:10,879 --> 02:45:13,920
Speaker 1: plug in terms of preserving stuff that I want to

3074
02:45:13,959 --> 02:45:16,800
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about, but with the disclaimer that

3075
02:45:16,840 --> 02:45:20,000
Speaker 1: I am by no means an expert. Um. One of

3076
02:45:20,040 --> 02:45:23,480
Speaker 1: the other things that you know, the punks of Yesteryear

3077
02:45:23,560 --> 02:45:26,119
Speaker 1: with their food not bombs houses got really excited about

3078
02:45:26,200 --> 02:45:29,600
Speaker 1: was things like crowd and kombucha um and there are

3079
02:45:29,600 --> 02:45:33,960
Speaker 1: some really great resources out there, specifically um wild Fermentation

3080
02:45:34,040 --> 02:45:36,080
Speaker 1: and the Art of Fermentation, which are both by a

3081
02:45:36,160 --> 02:45:41,080
Speaker 1: guy named Sander Cats on how to ferment food without

3082
02:45:41,400 --> 02:45:47,600
Speaker 1: you you know, you're using naturally occurring bacteria, and fermentation

3083
02:45:47,680 --> 02:45:50,960
Speaker 1: as a means of preservation is possibly the oldest means

3084
02:45:51,000 --> 02:45:55,920
Speaker 1: of deliberate food storage that human beings have, and you

3085
02:45:55,959 --> 02:45:59,640
Speaker 1: can do it with a wide variety of things. And

3086
02:45:59,680 --> 02:46:02,320
Speaker 1: so again, if you're faced with one of those gluts

3087
02:46:02,800 --> 02:46:05,360
Speaker 1: where you have a ton of stuff and nowhere you

3088
02:46:05,400 --> 02:46:10,240
Speaker 1: can store it in your refrigerated storage areas, there's probably

3089
02:46:10,280 --> 02:46:12,440
Speaker 1: a way you can jam it, you can dry it,

3090
02:46:12,560 --> 02:46:15,680
Speaker 1: you can ferment it. You can you know, make vinegar

3091
02:46:15,760 --> 02:46:18,280
Speaker 1: out of it, and you can find guides for all

3092
02:46:18,320 --> 02:46:20,480
Speaker 1: of this for free online. Like all of this is

3093
02:46:20,520 --> 02:46:22,320
Speaker 1: accessible if you have a phone. There are people in

3094
02:46:22,400 --> 02:46:25,080
Speaker 1: people putting up videos on YouTube where you can watch

3095
02:46:25,120 --> 02:46:26,560
Speaker 1: them do it too to make it. You do not

3096
02:46:26,680 --> 02:46:30,480
Speaker 1: have to purchase books in order to learn. There's also

3097
02:46:30,520 --> 02:46:32,200
Speaker 1: a lot of ways you know, you can make cold

3098
02:46:32,240 --> 02:46:35,440
Speaker 1: storages in your backyard. You can definitely, like I have

3099
02:46:35,560 --> 02:46:37,879
Speaker 1: a lot of guides on how to make your own

3100
02:46:37,920 --> 02:46:41,400
Speaker 1: roots sellers than very small spaces and do things. Because

3101
02:46:41,440 --> 02:46:44,560
Speaker 1: as long as you're not having your food produce the

3102
02:46:44,600 --> 02:46:46,400
Speaker 1: thing that makes it that makes your food go bad,

3103
02:46:47,040 --> 02:46:48,840
Speaker 1: there's a lot of different ways that you can prevent

3104
02:46:48,879 --> 02:46:53,359
Speaker 1: food spoilage but that you can learn from. But honestly,

3105
02:46:53,680 --> 02:46:56,000
Speaker 1: crowd and canning are probably some of the quickest and

3106
02:46:56,080 --> 02:47:00,840
Speaker 1: easiest and as a general rule, um, you know, similarly,

3107
02:47:00,879 --> 02:47:02,959
Speaker 1: if you don't have access to building a garden, you

3108
02:47:03,000 --> 02:47:05,800
Speaker 1: probably also don't have access to like digging a root seller.

3109
02:47:06,320 --> 02:47:10,160
Speaker 1: That being said, if you have a room or a

3110
02:47:10,320 --> 02:47:14,800
Speaker 1: space in your house where you can reliably keep it

3111
02:47:15,000 --> 02:47:20,280
Speaker 1: cool and dark, like below, I don't know, seventy degrees dark. Yeah,

3112
02:47:20,480 --> 02:47:23,440
Speaker 1: like closets, there's probably a spot in your basement if

3113
02:47:23,440 --> 02:47:25,040
Speaker 1: you live in a house where you have a basement,

3114
02:47:25,200 --> 02:47:26,879
Speaker 1: or if you live in a basement, because if you

3115
02:47:26,920 --> 02:47:31,760
Speaker 1: live in a situation, yeah, um, it's pretty easy. And

3116
02:47:31,959 --> 02:47:34,760
Speaker 1: for that matter, when we talk about like roots sellers,

3117
02:47:34,879 --> 02:47:39,080
Speaker 1: there are totally some d i y schematics for literally

3118
02:47:39,200 --> 02:47:44,320
Speaker 1: digging a like three foot cube hole in your yard

3119
02:47:44,800 --> 02:47:47,920
Speaker 1: and sinking in something to line it, and then that's

3120
02:47:47,959 --> 02:47:51,360
Speaker 1: where you store stuff because if you dig down a

3121
02:47:51,400 --> 02:47:54,320
Speaker 1: few feet below ground, it stays fifty degrees year round.

3122
02:47:55,640 --> 02:47:58,080
Speaker 1: And I get like when you hear again, we keep

3123
02:47:58,120 --> 02:47:59,480
Speaker 1: coming back to this, Like, I think a lot of

3124
02:47:59,480 --> 02:48:03,520
Speaker 1: people get overwhelmed or get very anxious when they think

3125
02:48:03,520 --> 02:48:06,440
Speaker 1: about trying to build resiliency because they live in a

3126
02:48:06,440 --> 02:48:08,360
Speaker 1: tiny apartment, they don't have much in the way of money.

3127
02:48:08,600 --> 02:48:10,920
Speaker 1: The important one of the most important things to understand

3128
02:48:11,000 --> 02:48:13,240
Speaker 1: that like a lot of people, no matter how poor

3129
02:48:13,280 --> 02:48:16,360
Speaker 1: you are, poorer than you have been doing this kind

3130
02:48:16,400 --> 02:48:18,600
Speaker 1: of stuff for generations. Like it's why most of our

3131
02:48:18,640 --> 02:48:22,440
Speaker 1: grandparents survived the thirties. Yeah, And I think one thing

3132
02:48:22,480 --> 02:48:25,360
Speaker 1: that people have a misinterpretation of with canning and stuff

3133
02:48:25,400 --> 02:48:26,680
Speaker 1: is that they are going to put stuff up, and

3134
02:48:26,680 --> 02:48:29,400
Speaker 1: they're gonna like put up their cans and their jars

3135
02:48:29,560 --> 02:48:33,320
Speaker 1: and then they will eventually build this. You know, I

3136
02:48:33,520 --> 02:48:38,160
Speaker 1: have food for twelve years buried here. Nothing has that

3137
02:48:38,440 --> 02:48:41,760
Speaker 1: great of a shelf life. I mean, I've definitely pulled

3138
02:48:41,760 --> 02:48:46,120
Speaker 1: out some jerim that was from definitely didn't do that

3139
02:48:46,160 --> 02:48:47,920
Speaker 1: this year that I had forgotten in the back of

3140
02:48:47,920 --> 02:48:50,480
Speaker 1: a cupboard and eating it and it's fine. It's fine,

3141
02:48:50,720 --> 02:48:54,480
Speaker 1: but usually a couple three years couple. But the idea

3142
02:48:54,600 --> 02:48:57,680
Speaker 1: of canning and preserving was not that you are saving

3143
02:48:57,760 --> 02:49:02,520
Speaker 1: food in case the eye falls in and everyone is doomed.

3144
02:49:03,080 --> 02:49:06,280
Speaker 1: The reason that people preserve food was to extend the

3145
02:49:06,280 --> 02:49:09,920
Speaker 1: bounty of a harvest season for a few additional weeks

3146
02:49:10,040 --> 02:49:12,760
Speaker 1: or months. And if you think about it that way,

3147
02:49:12,920 --> 02:49:16,000
Speaker 1: you're extending what you have two times when it would

3148
02:49:16,000 --> 02:49:18,400
Speaker 1: be more enjoyable to eat it when it feels special. No,

3149
02:49:18,520 --> 02:49:20,360
Speaker 1: I mean, it's like jam. A big part of the

3150
02:49:20,400 --> 02:49:23,680
Speaker 1: reason for jam is there's really important nutrients in fruit

3151
02:49:23,720 --> 02:49:25,640
Speaker 1: that maybe you can't get in the dead of winter,

3152
02:49:25,840 --> 02:49:28,120
Speaker 1: but you can if you have jam. Just to be

3153
02:49:28,240 --> 02:49:30,760
Speaker 1: a farm nerd for a minute, because Robert, I know

3154
02:49:30,800 --> 02:49:33,959
Speaker 1: that you are a huge fan of pumpkin spice. Oh

3155
02:49:34,000 --> 02:49:36,840
Speaker 1: the reason that had my first cup of the season today,

3156
02:49:37,120 --> 02:49:43,760
Speaker 1: amazing monster. The reason that pumpkins and cinnamon and apples

3157
02:49:44,080 --> 02:49:47,360
Speaker 1: and baking goods, baked goods with reasons in them are

3158
02:49:47,400 --> 02:49:51,480
Speaker 1: all like a big deal and are all like apples

3159
02:49:51,560 --> 02:49:55,240
Speaker 1: are a fruit that if you put apples in, say

3160
02:49:55,280 --> 02:49:59,280
Speaker 1: a barrel, there's the saying about one bad apple. Because

3161
02:49:59,280 --> 02:50:01,680
Speaker 1: if you make sure that an apple isn't rotting and

3162
02:50:01,720 --> 02:50:04,840
Speaker 1: you put it in a cool, dark space with decent ventilation,

3163
02:50:05,240 --> 02:50:09,119
Speaker 1: apples will keep for a very long time. Squash are

3164
02:50:09,160 --> 02:50:11,640
Speaker 1: a big deal. Pumpkins are a big deal around this

3165
02:50:11,680 --> 02:50:15,680
Speaker 1: time of year because buttercup squash, for example, and but

3166
02:50:15,760 --> 02:50:20,119
Speaker 1: are not squash are both storage squash. They taste better

3167
02:50:20,320 --> 02:50:23,879
Speaker 1: if they have been sitting in a dark storage area

3168
02:50:24,040 --> 02:50:26,959
Speaker 1: for like two months. Then they have metabolized more of

3169
02:50:27,000 --> 02:50:29,959
Speaker 1: their starches into sugars and their tastier. A lot of

3170
02:50:30,080 --> 02:50:32,680
Speaker 1: a lot of like squash, root, vegetables, all of that

3171
02:50:32,720 --> 02:50:35,879
Speaker 1: sort of stuff that you associate with, you know, all

3172
02:50:35,920 --> 02:50:41,480
Speaker 1: harvest season is specifically storage crops. Because I'm originally from

3173
02:50:41,800 --> 02:50:45,840
Speaker 1: New England. That's the time of year where you stop

3174
02:50:45,920 --> 02:50:48,520
Speaker 1: being able to get food out of the ground, and

3175
02:50:48,640 --> 02:50:51,800
Speaker 1: everything freezes and dies, and then it doesn't start up

3176
02:50:51,800 --> 02:50:54,640
Speaker 1: again until April, and you need a way to keep

3177
02:50:54,680 --> 02:50:57,720
Speaker 1: eating in the meantime. And also, though, let's just remember

3178
02:50:57,760 --> 02:51:02,959
Speaker 1: that a lot of preserved foods are also neat, not

3179
02:51:03,080 --> 02:51:06,040
Speaker 1: just because they are a substitutor because they're staying the harvest,

3180
02:51:06,320 --> 02:51:08,800
Speaker 1: but because in order to preserve the food and keep

3181
02:51:08,840 --> 02:51:12,440
Speaker 1: the nutrients, you have to go through a process. You

3182
02:51:12,440 --> 02:51:14,680
Speaker 1: want to have the salt be too high, or the

3183
02:51:14,720 --> 02:51:17,600
Speaker 1: acidity be too high, or the sugar content be too high,

3184
02:51:17,680 --> 02:51:21,760
Speaker 1: or the water content be too low to enable bacterial growth,

3185
02:51:21,959 --> 02:51:24,680
Speaker 1: and so that the fruits and vegetables and meats or

3186
02:51:24,720 --> 02:51:27,000
Speaker 1: whatever don't rock. But that means that you get so

3187
02:51:27,040 --> 02:51:30,920
Speaker 1: many awesome and different flavors that you would never you know, grapes,

3188
02:51:30,959 --> 02:51:34,720
Speaker 1: grapes are great. Whatever grapes preserved in wine vinegar. That

3189
02:51:34,800 --> 02:51:36,920
Speaker 1: sounds really cool. You can do that, and then you

3190
02:51:36,959 --> 02:51:39,480
Speaker 1: have a completely different thing that you normally don't eat,

3191
02:51:39,879 --> 02:51:43,560
Speaker 1: you know, dried dried figs, apple chips, like. You also

3192
02:51:43,560 --> 02:51:47,240
Speaker 1: get a whole new variety of foods that are not

3193
02:51:47,360 --> 02:51:50,240
Speaker 1: just extending in harvest but are also other things to eat.

3194
02:51:50,760 --> 02:51:53,200
Speaker 1: You know, my kids are not going to toss a

3195
02:51:53,240 --> 02:51:56,879
Speaker 1: whole pile of fresh fruit in their backpacks sometimes because

3196
02:51:57,000 --> 02:51:59,600
Speaker 1: it squishes at the bottom of their backpacks and I

3197
02:51:59,640 --> 02:52:04,360
Speaker 1: find weeks later, and it's absolutely terrifying fortunate. On the

3198
02:52:04,400 --> 02:52:07,160
Speaker 1: other hand, a bunch of you know, dried dried prunes,

3199
02:52:07,600 --> 02:52:10,000
Speaker 1: plums and stuff from the garden that dried out. They'll

3200
02:52:10,000 --> 02:52:11,959
Speaker 1: take baggies of those, And if I find them a

3201
02:52:12,000 --> 02:52:15,320
Speaker 1: month later because they didn't eat them, it isn't the

3202
02:52:15,400 --> 02:52:19,279
Speaker 1: end of the world either. And and again like there's

3203
02:52:19,760 --> 02:52:22,720
Speaker 1: a lot of fun stuff, like you know, yeah, grapes

3204
02:52:22,760 --> 02:52:26,240
Speaker 1: by themselves are are fine. You can also turn grapes

3205
02:52:26,320 --> 02:52:29,320
Speaker 1: into stuff that will help you preserve other stuff. And

3206
02:52:30,160 --> 02:52:33,520
Speaker 1: raisins in baked goods. If you've ever had a loaf

3207
02:52:33,560 --> 02:52:36,240
Speaker 1: of raisin bread and a loaf of white bread in

3208
02:52:36,920 --> 02:52:41,480
Speaker 1: the same bread box, the white bread will mold first.

3209
02:52:42,080 --> 02:52:45,080
Speaker 1: Raisins are actually a preservative. It's why people started putting

3210
02:52:45,120 --> 02:52:48,320
Speaker 1: raisins in bread. Yeah, and I think we should we

3211
02:52:48,360 --> 02:52:50,360
Speaker 1: should close out, but I kind of wanted to do

3212
02:52:50,440 --> 02:52:53,240
Speaker 1: that by circling back to the overall topic of this week,

3213
02:52:53,240 --> 02:52:55,680
Speaker 1: which is like building resiliency when you don't have much

3214
02:52:55,680 --> 02:52:57,760
Speaker 1: in the way of money or resources. And one of

3215
02:52:57,800 --> 02:52:59,400
Speaker 1: the things that you may not think of his building

3216
02:52:59,440 --> 02:53:01,800
Speaker 1: resiliency is exactly what you were talking about. Being in

3217
02:53:02,280 --> 02:53:05,480
Speaker 1: you aline paying attention to what is available, what time

3218
02:53:05,520 --> 02:53:07,440
Speaker 1: of the year, what is cheap, what time of the year,

3219
02:53:07,680 --> 02:53:09,720
Speaker 1: what is like, when do the gluts happen, and when

3220
02:53:09,800 --> 02:53:13,480
Speaker 1: do the shortages happen, Because that doesn't actually cost any money.

3221
02:53:13,480 --> 02:53:15,440
Speaker 1: You don't even have to buy things like you're already

3222
02:53:15,440 --> 02:53:17,680
Speaker 1: you're all always going to be going out to the

3223
02:53:17,720 --> 02:53:20,800
Speaker 1: store to get food occasionally. It's it's it's keeping an

3224
02:53:20,800 --> 02:53:23,760
Speaker 1: eye on understanding what is available growing naturally and what

3225
02:53:23,920 --> 02:53:27,280
Speaker 1: is available in the economy, because that connects you more

3226
02:53:27,400 --> 02:53:30,160
Speaker 1: to the environment you live in, to the climate as

3227
02:53:30,160 --> 02:53:33,520
Speaker 1: it changes, um into your community, all of which make

3228
02:53:33,600 --> 02:53:35,680
Speaker 1: you more resilient, and none of which costs you a dime.

3229
02:53:35,720 --> 02:53:38,680
Speaker 1: It just costs you attention. Also just a plug for

3230
02:53:38,800 --> 02:53:43,400
Speaker 1: you know, people who have access to the ecosystems where

3231
02:53:43,400 --> 02:53:47,320
Speaker 1: this is relevant. Things like shellfish licenses are great. I'm

3232
02:53:47,320 --> 02:53:49,240
Speaker 1: not going to tell anyone that they should, you know,

3233
02:53:49,600 --> 02:53:55,160
Speaker 1: seek out sport fishing as a means of obtaining calories.

3234
02:53:55,280 --> 02:53:57,880
Speaker 1: On the other hand, in Oregon, at least for I

3235
02:53:57,920 --> 02:54:00,840
Speaker 1: think it's five five bucks, nine bucks. Oh, it's up

3236
02:54:00,879 --> 02:54:03,240
Speaker 1: to ten bucks now. But so for ten bucks, get

3237
02:54:03,280 --> 02:54:06,959
Speaker 1: a shellfish license. You go down to a cove and

3238
02:54:07,000 --> 02:54:09,280
Speaker 1: you rape cockles for an hour and then you have,

3239
02:54:09,560 --> 02:54:13,920
Speaker 1: you know, an enormous amount of food that you can

3240
02:54:14,160 --> 02:54:16,680
Speaker 1: do all of the preservation that we've talked about. You

3241
02:54:16,680 --> 02:54:19,720
Speaker 1: can also just make chowder and freeze it, you know whatever.

3242
02:54:19,920 --> 02:54:23,359
Speaker 1: But there's a lot of ways to to cheaply obtain

3243
02:54:23,480 --> 02:54:28,480
Speaker 1: calories from out in the world. Yeah, all right, well

3244
02:54:28,600 --> 02:54:31,879
Speaker 1: that's going to do it for us today. Um, until

3245
02:54:31,959 --> 02:54:36,080
Speaker 1: next time, remember experiment on your friends with different medical

3246
02:54:36,240 --> 02:54:39,040
Speaker 1: care treatments. Don't do that. Although on the other hand,

3247
02:54:39,080 --> 02:54:41,879
Speaker 1: look up the if you are in the Pacific Northwest,

3248
02:54:42,000 --> 02:54:45,520
Speaker 1: there is the Portland Fruit Tree Project up here, which

3249
02:54:45,680 --> 02:54:49,600
Speaker 1: goes around and connects gleaners with fruit trees that need

3250
02:54:49,680 --> 02:54:52,720
Speaker 1: to be gleaned. Um, so people who have over abundant

3251
02:54:52,720 --> 02:54:54,920
Speaker 1: trees that they don't want all the stuff. That's a

3252
02:54:54,920 --> 02:54:57,840
Speaker 1: really great resource. In other cities, I'm sure there's other things.

3253
02:54:57,879 --> 02:55:03,320
Speaker 1: And also the Falling Fruit Maps map, so you can

3254
02:55:03,360 --> 02:55:06,560
Speaker 1: go online and if there's not already one in your area.

3255
02:55:06,640 --> 02:55:08,840
Speaker 1: They also make it really easy to be able to

3256
02:55:08,920 --> 02:55:12,040
Speaker 1: chart and put in trees in your area. So if

3257
02:55:12,040 --> 02:55:14,560
Speaker 1: it's saying that you're excited about and you love identifying trees,

3258
02:55:14,879 --> 02:55:17,320
Speaker 1: you can go in and actually start charting your neighborhood.

3259
02:55:18,040 --> 02:55:22,520
Speaker 1: Also figure out how to identify, you know, five wild

3260
02:55:22,560 --> 02:55:24,959
Speaker 1: plants that grow in your area that you can eat,

3261
02:55:25,320 --> 02:55:29,400
Speaker 1: because it's always nice to have more variety and it's

3262
02:55:29,440 --> 02:55:31,240
Speaker 1: fun to be out on a walk and be like,

3263
02:55:31,280 --> 02:55:33,800
Speaker 1: oh cool, now I have a thing that I can

3264
02:55:33,840 --> 02:55:36,280
Speaker 1: toss in with dinner when I get back. Yeah, And

3265
02:55:36,280 --> 02:55:38,200
Speaker 1: we've talked about how there's like the poor version of

3266
02:55:38,200 --> 02:55:41,400
Speaker 1: the cheap version. There's also like the centrist version and

3267
02:55:41,440 --> 02:55:43,280
Speaker 1: the radical version of that. The centrist version is like

3268
02:55:43,320 --> 02:55:44,880
Speaker 1: I just want to know, like what kind of edible

3269
02:55:44,879 --> 02:55:47,720
Speaker 1: fruits grow naturally in my area. The more radical version

3270
02:55:47,760 --> 02:55:50,439
Speaker 1: is I'm going to start guerrilla grows of edible foods

3271
02:55:50,480 --> 02:55:53,119
Speaker 1: on like available in my area. I'm gonna seed ball

3272
02:55:53,240 --> 02:55:56,160
Speaker 1: some ship. I'm gonna like very get insurgent with my

3273
02:55:56,320 --> 02:55:59,680
Speaker 1: yeah to prepare food. Yeah. Things that grow rise only

3274
02:56:00,200 --> 02:56:03,280
Speaker 1: take root real easy in the ecosystems they like and

3275
02:56:03,320 --> 02:56:05,600
Speaker 1: are real hard to get rid of once they get

3276
02:56:06,400 --> 02:56:09,200
Speaker 1: crime gardens I'm not going to say people should tear

3277
02:56:09,280 --> 02:56:12,240
Speaker 1: out the random trees that cities plant and then replace.

3278
02:56:12,440 --> 02:56:17,320
Speaker 1: No one can say that, but it's possible to do

3279
02:56:17,800 --> 02:56:21,000
Speaker 1: trees didn't make food with trees that did make food

3280
02:56:21,080 --> 02:56:24,440
Speaker 1: in the same spot, probably nobody would notice except the

3281
02:56:24,440 --> 02:56:27,000
Speaker 1: people who got and there would be more free calories

3282
02:56:27,040 --> 02:56:29,720
Speaker 1: in your area. If you know the kind of things

3283
02:56:29,720 --> 02:56:32,199
Speaker 1: that have been happening the last several years, continue to happen.

3284
02:56:32,720 --> 02:56:46,000
Speaker 1: All right, that's the episode. That's the episode. Hey, We'll

3285
02:56:46,000 --> 02:56:49,080
Speaker 1: be back Monday, with more episodes every week from now

3286
02:56:49,200 --> 02:56:52,000
Speaker 1: until the heat death of the universe. It Could Happen

3287
02:56:52,000 --> 02:56:54,360
Speaker 1: Here is a production of cool Zone Media. For more

3288
02:56:54,360 --> 02:56:57,160
Speaker 1: podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool zone

3289
02:56:57,200 --> 02:56:59,039
Speaker 1: Media dot com, or check us out on the I

3290
02:56:59,120 --> 02:57:02,439
Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

3291
02:57:02,959 --> 02:57:05,119
Speaker 1: You can find sources for It Could Happen here, updated

3292
02:57:05,160 --> 02:57:08,359
Speaker 1: monthly at cool Zone me to dot com slash sources.

3293
02:57:08,360 --> 02:57:12,560
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3310
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3316
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