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Speaker 1: This program features the individual opinions of the hosts, guests,

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Speaker 1: and callers, and not necessarily those of the producer, the station,

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Speaker 1: it's affiliates, or sponsors. This is True Crime Tonight.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to True Crime Tonight on iHeartRadio. Man, we are

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Speaker 2: talking true crime all the time. It's Monday, June twenty third,

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Speaker 2: and it might seem as though the world has gone crazy,

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Speaker 2: and maybe it has. But in the meantime, can we

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Speaker 2: all settle in and huddle up together because we have

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Speaker 2: some thinking to do, some solving, some unpacking, and it's

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Speaker 2: a stacked night of headline. So let's put our worries

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Speaker 2: behind and let's focus on Diddy, on Sean Dittycomb's and

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Speaker 2: his trial because guess what, his defense says they are

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Speaker 2: not going to bring any more witnesses and the prosecution

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Speaker 2: may rest and has and we could have a verdict

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Speaker 2: by the end of the week. So don't even get

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Speaker 2: us started, because there's so much to unpack there. One

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Speaker 2: number two also some fallout from the Karen retrial, one

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Speaker 2: of the jurors facing a lot of backlash, and also

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Speaker 2: prosecutor Hank Brennan. He wants to share his thoughts and

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Speaker 2: has come out publicly to do so. And then also

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Speaker 2: it's Pride Month and we are really going to do

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Speaker 2: a Pride story every single night because again, this is

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Speaker 2: an underinvestigated community. There's so many cold cases that have

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Speaker 2: not been looked into, and every day this week we're

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Speaker 2: going to do our parts. So more on that to come.

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Speaker 2: I'm Stephanie Leidecker and I head of KAT Studios, where

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Speaker 2: we make true crime podcasts and documentaries and I get

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Speaker 2: to do that every day with Courtney Armstrong and Body

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Speaker 2: move In. The three of us are here to sort

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Speaker 2: of take your calls, hear your woes, share your stories,

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Speaker 2: eight eight, eight to three to one crime. We have

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Speaker 2: so many things to unpack tonight, so please hit us

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Speaker 2: up on our socials at True Crime Tonight's show on

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Speaker 2: Instagram and TikTok, and at True Crime Tonight on Facebook. So,

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Speaker 2: Courtney Diddy your favorite topic? Oh wait, it's mine, right,

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Speaker 2: that's right.

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Speaker 3: Well, listen Stephanie in this moment. As much as he's

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Speaker 3: in the news, apparently he is everybody's. It's the beginning

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Speaker 3: of week seven in the trial against Sean Diddy Combs,

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Speaker 3: and today for the full day, there was a summary

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Speaker 3: witness a summary witness is a person who doesn't bring

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Speaker 3: forth any new information, but gathers and summarizes in a

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Speaker 3: clean way to present to the jurors. So summary witness

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Speaker 3: Joseph Cerciello, who he is a special agent for Homeland

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Speaker 3: Security investigations, and he spoke today. We're going to get

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Speaker 3: into that. Also, we're going to get into Friday, the

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Speaker 3: jury heard from another of Diddy's former assistants, Brendan Paul,

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Speaker 3: and the government does plan to rest their case tomorrow

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Speaker 3: is where at Sansia's moment, meaning closing arguments could begin

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Speaker 3: as soon as Thursday. The case is happening because the

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Speaker 3: state alleges that for twenty years Colmbs operated a criminal

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Speaker 3: enterprise kidnapping, arson, bribery, sex trafficking, and using his clout

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Speaker 3: and monumental money to really learn black blackmail people. He

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Speaker 3: is facing life in prison and has pled not guilty

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Speaker 3: to all charges.

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Speaker 2: So can you imagine to not taking no defense witness,

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Speaker 2: not taking the stand, which is not uncommon? Right, We've

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Speaker 2: done a bit of research and listen, that is not unusual.

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Speaker 2: You know, why take the stand and be a wild

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Speaker 2: card in the eleventh hour at your own defense and

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Speaker 2: remember did he is not on the hook to prove

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Speaker 2: himself innocent. He is innocent until proven guilty. So it's

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Speaker 2: really on the prosecution side. Have they proven racketeering? That's

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Speaker 2: the big one, right, has that been proven? I'm curious

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Speaker 2: what you guys think. I don't know.

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Speaker 4: I mean, listen, I think I think it's been proven,

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Speaker 4: but I'm not in the courtroom with them seeing the evidence.

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Speaker 4: And none of us have seen the evidence, right, We're

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Speaker 4: just getting told by people who are inside the courtroom.

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Speaker 4: So true, So I don't know if they've proven racketeering. Again,

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Speaker 4: they need a couple predicates for Rico, and I think

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Speaker 4: that they've met those. But does the jury buy it?

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Speaker 4: That's the most important question. Does the jury by it?

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Speaker 4: And there's so many questions with this juror. Right, So

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Speaker 4: we had one journey just dismissed couple right, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 4: So one was dismissed, right, So it was that jury

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Speaker 4: number three. They were dismissed because jurisicx infamously. Plus there

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Speaker 4: was the other that had vertigo that that seemed to

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Speaker 4: work itself out, and then there was that other witness,

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Speaker 4: a jur that kind of was up for conversation because

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Speaker 4: they had been they had received a text that basically

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Speaker 4: asked if they were Juror number six, which they weren't,

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Speaker 4: but that of itself kind of implied that they maybe

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Speaker 4: had been talking at home or talking to others, or

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Speaker 4: that that our identity wasn't you know, secret?

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Speaker 3: So this is interesting that you guys bring that up.

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Speaker 3: Last Monday, it was revealed that there was another issue,

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Speaker 3: as your guys just laid out with three of them,

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Speaker 3: but in this particular case, it was suspected that this

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Speaker 3: jur might have had some kind of conversations with a colleague.

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Speaker 3: I was very curious to find out what the out

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Speaker 3: of this was. Of course, court was canceled Friday because

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Speaker 3: of the vertigo you mentioned, but the court said that

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Speaker 3: the juror might have acted improperly, but that his fate

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Speaker 3: would be taken up after testimony, which was very interesting

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Speaker 3: to me. So right now there's been nothing published either

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Speaker 3: way about the judge's decision, but my question is, like,

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Speaker 3: do how would the jurors fate be dealt with after testimony?

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Speaker 3: Couldn't that nullify the jury pool?

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Speaker 2: Well, this is somebody who's looking at life behind bars.

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Speaker 2: So and al did he may never walk on the

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Speaker 2: streets again. And yeah, if there's an issue with one

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Speaker 2: of the jurors or potentially was and that wasn't addressed,

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Speaker 2: I would imagine that's perfectly good for appeal. So I

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Speaker 2: can't imagine that they would leave that loose thread out there, right.

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Speaker 2: I thought it would have been decided one way or another. So, actually,

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Speaker 2: if there's any lawyers.

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Speaker 3: Listening eighty to a three to one crime, please and

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Speaker 3: fill us in, because it's a it's a question hanging

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Speaker 3: over our heads.

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Speaker 2: Now that you mention it. What about jer What about

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Speaker 2: the victim number three? Wasn't her name Gina? That she

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Speaker 2: suddenly was not going to testify. She sort of disappeared

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Speaker 2: in the eleventh hour and never came forward. We had

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Speaker 2: the harrowing, you know, testimony of Ditty's ex girlfriend, Cassie Ventura.

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Speaker 2: She's the one that really laid out for us this

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Speaker 2: idea of freak offs. And you know, we've all gotten

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Speaker 2: maybe a little desensitized to what that means, but you'll

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Speaker 2: remember lots involved with those freak offs. And according to

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Speaker 2: Cassie Ventur and then later Jane, the second victim, also

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Speaker 2: an ex both of them were doing freak offs and

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Speaker 2: hotel nights multiple times a week. So Stephanie, can you

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Speaker 2: explain what a freak us is? Yes, thank you for

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Speaker 2: my mom, because it is a very confusing thing.

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Speaker 4: So a freak off is a sexual like a little

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Speaker 4: play of sorts that Diddy would put together and he

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Speaker 4: would have one of his you know girlfriends. Let's just

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Speaker 4: use Cassie Ventur for an example, and she would get

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Speaker 4: the benefit of going to a fancy hotel for the

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Speaker 4: night and or maybe two nights or sometimes even three nights,

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Speaker 4: and then they would have male escorts come and they

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Speaker 4: would perform sex. They would have sex with her, and

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Speaker 4: Diddy would just sit in the corner and pleasure himself

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Speaker 4: while observing his girlfriend with other men. Apparently the hotels

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Speaker 4: were so trashed for days they were put out of order,

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Speaker 4: the furniture and the floors were drenched with bodily fluids

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Speaker 4: and oil. If trigger alert, how gross I have to recover?

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Speaker 2: How gross? So again, these were like big events, but

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Speaker 2: the trick was Diddy was recording them and using them

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Speaker 2: later as revenge and basically saying, if you leave, I will.

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Speaker 3: Show It's kind of like that, right, yes, exactly, and

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Speaker 3: listen I want to get back to today for a

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Speaker 3: hot second, because Stephanie, those freak offs that you laid

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Speaker 3: out so well for your mom, that's odd.

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Speaker 2: I'm'll sorrycuss that later, but be cover your years.

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Speaker 3: So today's witness, Joseph Sarcielo, it had a lot to

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Speaker 3: do with really consolidating all of the testimony about the

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Speaker 3: freak offs. And what this testimony showed was that Diddy

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Speaker 3: indeed was directing staff to arrange the travel, to arrange

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Speaker 3: the escorts, to arrange the supplies including the baby oil

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Speaker 3: and drugs you spoke of, for the events. So this

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Speaker 3: is coordination and money and travel, which is part of

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Speaker 3: the larger rico that it was organized.

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Speaker 2: And it was these were people that were on staff

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Speaker 2: working for air Quotes, Combs enterprises. And let's just talk

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Speaker 2: about the freak offs for a moment, because this was

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Speaker 2: in testimony by two of his former assistants. Remember they

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Speaker 2: went to a fancy hotel, for example, and it was

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Speaker 2: standard that as soon as they left the hotel room

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Speaker 2: would be put out of order for scrubbing and cleaning

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Speaker 2: and all the horrible things that you could imagine. They

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Speaker 2: would pay one thousand dollars to make sure that that

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Speaker 2: room was just out of order, and then oftentimes staffers

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Speaker 2: would have to tip off the cleaning crew so that

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Speaker 2: they would be discreet, so that Diddy would have his

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Speaker 2: you know, incredible image never tarnished, God forbid. Can you imagine?

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Speaker 2: So I wonder, first off, our hotel's suffering. By the way,

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Speaker 2: the idea that this happens in fancy hotels does in

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Speaker 2: fact change my opinion about a Jigi's suite anywhere. But

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Speaker 2: think about that, this was they were being paid to

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Speaker 2: cover something up. We know that also with Cassie Ventura,

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Speaker 2: did He's x that infamous footage that we saw on

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Speaker 2: CNN that released it, that horrible footage where he's beating

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Speaker 2: her up at the elevator.

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Speaker 4: Like she's going to the elevator and he like grabs

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Speaker 4: her and like throws her down on the ground and

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Speaker 4: he's like kicking her.

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Speaker 2: Up his towel. By the way, he did it with

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Speaker 2: one hand, so casually beating her up. You can only

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Speaker 2: imagine what happens really behind closed doors. But you know,

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Speaker 2: security was paid on what was it, one hundred thousand

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Speaker 2: und k to make that go away, to make that

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Speaker 2: tape disappear, So isn't that at its core racketeering right there?

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Speaker 2: I definitely bribery. I mean, if your staff is cleaning up,

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Speaker 2: if you're chief of staff. You know Christina Korum, we've

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Speaker 2: heard about they call her. She Where is Christina Koran?

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Speaker 2: By the way, we say the word KK because that's

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Speaker 2: her nickname. We do not mean Kim kardaction this fai.

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Speaker 2: But you know, this person has been cited and a

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Speaker 2: lot of these lawsuits and has been brought up in

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Speaker 2: a lot of the testimony as somebody who's very right

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Speaker 2: hand to Diddy. That's a big person to be paying

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Speaker 2: the bill for score. This is a person to be

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Speaker 2: leaving out of this direct of this testimony. And you

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Speaker 2: would think even if if she could defend him, they

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Speaker 2: would present this. We always thought that was the thing

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Speaker 2: that she was. I thought that's what we go for

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Speaker 2: the defense, right Do you know what?

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Speaker 1: Though?

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Speaker 3: Because I had looked into a little bit just generally,

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Speaker 3: not even case specific of why someone would put on

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Speaker 3: no defense, taking out someone taking the stand for themselves

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Speaker 3: when they're on trial. But reasons include, as you said earlier, Stephanie,

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Speaker 3: if you don't think that the prosecution has proved their case,

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Speaker 3: you don't have to say anything. It's not your right.

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Speaker 2: So that could be one reason they to it. So

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Speaker 2: he's being confident.

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Speaker 3: Another, you know, another reason could be that you would

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Speaker 3: incriminate yourself. Makes sense. But also with KK, who as

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Speaker 3: his right hand as Diddy's right hand man, would have

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Speaker 3: we assume known all the inner workings. Another reason to

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Speaker 3: not put on any defense is that even someone that

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Speaker 3: you could put up in your defense, that could open

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Speaker 3: up cross examination to pull out more things about your defendant.

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Speaker 3: So maybe that's what it is. Because we've all been

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Speaker 3: wondering where's KK. Why isn't she testifying? And maybe that's

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Speaker 3: why she's not for the defense. I don't know.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, where is everybody? Why are they

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Speaker 2: only putting the assistance on trial? Like where are all

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Speaker 2: the big dogs? I know, we'll talk about this list

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Speaker 2: later of you know, VIP celebrities that we're supposed to

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Speaker 2: be in this trial. I don't know where is everybody?

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Speaker 2: Because we're really focusing a lot on the assistance and

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Speaker 2: the assistant to the assistant the lowest on the totem pole.

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Speaker 2: We want the top of the food chain.

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Speaker 4: Well, stay with us, we're going to be talking more

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Speaker 4: Diddy and the prosecution could rest tomorrow. Will the defense

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Speaker 4: will they pull a fast one? Will the colony witnesses?

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Speaker 4: Then later in the show, It's Pride month stick right

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Speaker 4: here true grins mighty Back to Ditty Courtney, Where should

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Speaker 4: we go?

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Speaker 3: I mean, so much is happening currently. So in the

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Speaker 3: Diddy trial, Brendan Paul gave his testimony on Friday. He

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Speaker 3: was a former assistant to Didty. He worked for him

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Speaker 3: for about two years, and Diddy is on trial for

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Speaker 3: sex trafficking and racketeering, which is alleged to have gone

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Speaker 3: on for twenty years. He is facing life in prison

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Speaker 3: and is pleading not guilty to all charges. So Brendan

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Speaker 3: Paul's testimony is interesting. First of all, did he fired

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Speaker 3: Paul multiple times? One time kind of my favorite, for

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Speaker 3: forgetting to bring Ditty's Lululemon fanny pack on a.

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Speaker 2: Walk, which that was in that fanny pack?

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Speaker 3: Well what was in the fanny pack? I mean, given

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Speaker 3: the testimony we've heard, it's not his drugs cash, it's

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Speaker 3: not his key some block, No, yes, no it's not.

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Speaker 3: But he also testified that he picked up drugs for

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Speaker 3: Combs a handful of times. His estimate was more than

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Speaker 3: five and less than ten. And he was transporting his

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Speaker 3: drugs for personal use. So he's saying he wasn't selling them,

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Speaker 3: but he was moving them. And I don't know if

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Speaker 3: he's moving them across state lines, what does that mean

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Speaker 3: for larger charges. So Brendan Paul, this former assistant, he

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Speaker 3: was arrested March of last year at the Miami Airport

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Speaker 3: and he was charged with felony possession of cocaine and

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Speaker 3: marijuana Le's candy. So, yeah, this all happened while the

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Speaker 3: federal raids were happening on Combs's properties. Do you guys

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Speaker 3: remember that I did?

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Speaker 2: It was such a big deal. I was watching it live.

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Speaker 2: But this guy really took a hit. So he was

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Speaker 2: flying private, So he was at a private area in Miami.

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Speaker 2: You know, just small distinction because you know, you fly private.

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Speaker 2: He's getting out of dodge, maybe he has some stuff

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Speaker 2: with him from Didty. He did get like tagged as

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Speaker 2: Diddy's drug mule. That's been said everywhere, you know, and

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Speaker 2: it sounds like he was actually carrying not that we're

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Speaker 2: condoning this, but a personal use amount of drugs that

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Speaker 2: he was holding for Didty not an amount that was

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Speaker 2: meant for sale, although it was like covered as though

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Speaker 2: this guy was like, you know, running kilos of coke

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Speaker 2: over the border and was a drug dealer essentially or

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Speaker 2: a drug mule. You know. He was a really acclaimed

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Speaker 2: basketball player and university and kind of you know, by

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Speaker 2: all accounts, was like a nice kid, happy probably to

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Speaker 2: work for Diddy and excited to be in the in

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Speaker 2: the eye of all this fame. We say, yeah, fly private, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: suddenly you're in these mansions. Again. We're not condoning any

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Speaker 2: of this, but you know, put yourself for a second

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Speaker 2: in a young.

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Speaker 4: Especially young, and like, yeah, I can see that I

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Speaker 4: would probably do it if I was that age.

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Speaker 2: I really no, you don't ask him question when you're

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Speaker 2: at the bottom of the you know, barrel. When I

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Speaker 2: was like, you know, an intern, or you don't ask

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Speaker 2: a million Thankfully I worked at a very safe, wonderful place,

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Speaker 2: but like, you don't ask a million questions. In fact,

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Speaker 2: your job is to get it to you. Don't ask

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Speaker 2: questions and don't be a nightmare. So imagine that rule

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Speaker 2: applies and you're dealing with somebody who you have no idea.

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Speaker 2: Behind closed doors is a maniac doing monstrous, abusive things.

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Speaker 2: But maybe on the outside looking in you don't see that.

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Speaker 5: Well.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I'll push back a little bit because Brendan

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Speaker 3: Paul did testify he was fired multiple times over year

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Speaker 3: and a half, and I usually believe that what was.

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Speaker 2: He fired for? What other things was he fired?

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Speaker 3: The one, the one, the one example I have top

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Speaker 3: of head is the Lululemon fanny back that wasn't brought

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Speaker 3: along for a stroll. But listen, so masculine Diddy. We

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Speaker 3: have heard from many others or several others of Ditty's assistance,

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Speaker 3: and it was chaotic, it was explosive, it was unpredictable,

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Speaker 3: it was was abusive, It was you know, prediculous, walking

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Speaker 3: around on eggshells and taking.

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Speaker 4: Like being held in a warehouse like for days, hooked

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Speaker 4: up to a light detector test, like you know, held

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Speaker 4: over the balcony by your ankles, like, oh my god.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, when you're in a circle something

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Speaker 2: that you you all start to get a little By

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Speaker 2: the way, I was just saying this, we're all, we're

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Speaker 2: all collectively and we shouldn't be, but we are, or

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Speaker 2: at least I am. Freak offs were so scary to

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Speaker 2: me when I first heard about what is it? What

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Speaker 2: goes on now? We're like, oh, yeah, the freak offs.

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Speaker 2: Oh you mean the hotel nights, as if it's real

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Speaker 2: common knowledge, right, We're all like whatever, imagine you're in

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Speaker 2: the behive of all things, you know, and Comb's enterprises,

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Speaker 2: and this is the ongoing behavior by everybody, security assistance,

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Speaker 2: the maids, the chief of Style, according night.

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Speaker 4: It's kind of normalized, normalized, you know, area right exactly.

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Speaker 2: Talked about that, thank you, and thank god we're talking

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Speaker 2: about it now. And I think that's an important piece

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Speaker 2: of this puzzle that I just want to encourage all

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Speaker 2: of us to keep discussing, because if we didn't hear

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Speaker 2: about this, we wouldn't know about this. Sure, there have

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Speaker 2: been rumors all kinds of things, but you know, we

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Speaker 2: try to ignore rumors. How do you prevent this type

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Speaker 2: of thing from happening if we don't really take a

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Speaker 2: time out to discuss it. And it's pretty common knowledge.

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Speaker 2: I guess a lot of people said these white parties

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Speaker 2: had shenanigans happening at them, but again, what level of shenanigans?

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Speaker 2: This is downright violent.

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Speaker 3: It's absolutely ran it ran the Gamut and just watching

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Speaker 3: several of the documentaries, and there have been many really

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Speaker 3: interesting ones put out with unparalleled access, each having its

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Speaker 3: own anyway, but the levels of party that I learned

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Speaker 3: through these documentaries at the White Party would be, Oh,

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Speaker 3: if someone is a girl who has caught Ditty's eye,

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Speaker 3: then someone who works for him goes over and it's

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Speaker 3: it's not just come in, it's come in, but you

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Speaker 3: need to put these special slippers on because these slippers

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Speaker 3: are going to be the key to get you into

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Speaker 3: this portion of the house.

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Speaker 2: And then it's fits the golden ticket for Willy Wonka.

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Speaker 2: But they don't realize it, so they're given the slippers.

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Speaker 2: By the way, they're like, oh, yeah, here have a cocktail. Meanwhile,

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Speaker 2: it's drugged, so now you're getting roofied and is that

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Speaker 2: that really very serious? Which there's many, not all of them,

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Speaker 2: but there's been much talk about, you know, people getting

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Speaker 2: drugged and being forced to use drugs or you're sort

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Speaker 2: of like this seems fun and you know, here take

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Speaker 2: this and suddenly you're not. Have you guys seen the

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Speaker 2: movie Blink twice? Don't get me started if you haven't.

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Speaker 2: Since you haven't seen it, this is not a fun game.

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Speaker 2: But if if you haven't seen it, I encourage it.

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Speaker 2: That's the movie that Zoe Kravitz directed, and it sort

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Speaker 2: of speaks to a little of this culture of like

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Speaker 2: something seems fun and oh yeah, take this, have a cocktail,

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Speaker 2: and next thing you know, things change and you can't

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Speaker 2: come back from it. And oh, hey, by the way,

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Speaker 2: here's a video just in case you want to tell anybody.

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Speaker 4: Blackmail and that's collateral, like that's what cults do, exactly

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Speaker 4: like the Exeum cult.

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Speaker 2: And by the way, we're going to show this video

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Speaker 2: to your mom, and then your mom's going to lose

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Speaker 2: your job. And then also you're not going to have

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Speaker 2: any job, but you're not going to have a career either,

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Speaker 2: so or just play along terrifying.

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Speaker 4: If you want to weigh in, give us a call

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Speaker 4: at eight eight eight thirty one Crime or send us

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Speaker 4: a talkback message on the iHeartRadio app. And speaking of calls,

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Speaker 4: we have a call Jen Hi, Jen Hi, Hi.

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Speaker 5: How's it going good?

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Speaker 2: How are you good?

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Speaker 3: Good?

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Speaker 2: What did you think?

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Speaker 5: Yeah? My biggest question with this entire scandals last trial

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Speaker 5: is if Diddy sexually abused Justin Bieber and or Usher.

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Speaker 2: Oh, goodness, my goodness, what a great question. Where has

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Speaker 2: this been? I'm so glad you brought this up. We've

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Speaker 2: been afraid to say it because we don't want to

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Speaker 2: we did any anything disparaging on the great Justin Bieber

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Speaker 2: and Usher. However, there have been long, long rumored that

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Speaker 2: they were either working for the FEDS or that perhaps allegedly, allegedly,

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Speaker 2: allegedly Justin Bieber was working for the FEDS, because perhaps

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Speaker 2: he was a very young boy in the system or

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Speaker 2: in the world, and he might have been fourteen years

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Speaker 2: old hanging out with Diddy and Usher. Remember, Usher had

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Speaker 2: custody essentially of Bieber. You know, Bieber was raised by

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Speaker 2: a single mom, and he was so widely talented. He

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Speaker 2: was discovered by Scooter Braun and I believe Usher, and

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Speaker 2: then he was to Los Angeles exactly, you know, under

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Speaker 2: the best of intentions. But in order to live with

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Speaker 2: a movie star or a rock star like Usher, you

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Speaker 2: have to sign over your parental rights, which I believe

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Speaker 2: his mother did again under the best of intentions, you know,

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Speaker 2: not realizing that Usher is perhaps allegedly, allegedly allegedly in

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Speaker 2: the Diddy world. We've all seen that video of Diddy

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Speaker 2: and you know, giving Justin Bieber a car and saying

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Speaker 2: you were going to party like Kings all weekend and

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Speaker 2: like the like man. Meanwhile, he's like a young teenage boy.

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Speaker 2: You can see his little faces, like, yeah, that sounds great, petrified.

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Speaker 2: You know this, this is a whole other underworld that

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Speaker 2: we're just learning about. I, as an adult woman, would

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Speaker 2: have lasted eighteen seconds. I would be the first to

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Speaker 2: be dead in any of these scenarios. So there's nothing

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Speaker 2: disparaging about we're saying about Diddy or I mean, we're

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Speaker 2: not saying anything disparaging about Justin Bieber or Usher, but

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Speaker 2: it's possible that they were victims.

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Speaker 4: Well, and you know, poor Justin has been acting kind

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Speaker 4: of since I started right like, and I'm not I'm

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Speaker 4: not judging him because.

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Speaker 2: It's the we have nothing but empathy, nothing.

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Speaker 3: Yes, And I just want to rearticulate that is a

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Speaker 3: big if and.

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Speaker 2: We have zeroactly. In fact, he said out loud, actually

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Speaker 2: he made a statement not that long ago basically saying

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Speaker 2: that he has nothing but you know, positive experiences with

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Speaker 2: Puffy in his experience, but that he has no doubt

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Speaker 2: that this was very negative for the victims. You know,

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Speaker 2: he's not suggesting that they're lying by any means, but

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Speaker 2: he did clarify through his PR person that not him. Listen,

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Speaker 2: it is possible that.

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Speaker 5: In the Yummy music video.

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Speaker 2: I haven't Oh my gosh.

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Speaker 5: Y Yes, it's a very interesting message that he's bringing

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Speaker 5: across in that music video about the music industry in

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Speaker 5: and of itself.

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Speaker 2: Allow to see it. You are so right. I never

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Speaker 2: even occurred to me just now waits So you, Jen,

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Speaker 2: you have to tell us about the Yummy video. For

430
00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:07,439
Speaker 2: those who don't know, it's a Justin Bieber song. It

431
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:10,040
Speaker 2: has a famous video to it. If I was a

432
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:14,040
Speaker 2: singer of any caliber, I would do a little medley

433
00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:16,680
Speaker 2: to make you recognize this song. But that will not

434
00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:19,840
Speaker 2: help Jen. You're up. But anyway, there was a video,

435
00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:24,000
Speaker 2: and the assertion is that it kind of speaks to

436
00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:27,600
Speaker 2: I think the pedophilia even Oh well, thank you, Jen

437
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:29,119
Speaker 2: for the call. Stay with Us.

438
00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:32,600
Speaker 4: Prosecutor Hank Brennan has released his thought on Karen Read's

439
00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:37,360
Speaker 4: verdict and aur Adjur is facing shocking allegations and don't

440
00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:39,160
Speaker 4: forget to call us at eight eight eight thirty one

441
00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:40,920
Speaker 4: Crime stay right here on True Crime.

442
00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:54,160
Speaker 2: Tonight, We're talking about the Diddy verdict to come because

443
00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:56,480
Speaker 2: that could happen this week allegedly, which I feel like

444
00:23:56,560 --> 00:24:00,719
Speaker 2: is impossible. My brain kind of can't handle it. Prosecution

445
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:05,280
Speaker 2: is all done in terms of bringing witnesses, and apparently

446
00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:07,880
Speaker 2: the defense is saying that they're not going to bring

447
00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:11,680
Speaker 2: any new witnesses. I wonder if that plays like mind

448
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:14,080
Speaker 2: games on the jury a little bit. It's playing it

449
00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:15,320
Speaker 2: on me, Yeah.

450
00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:16,800
Speaker 4: Like, are is the jury going to go back to

451
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:20,880
Speaker 4: deliberations and be like they didn't provide any defense testimony?

452
00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:25,720
Speaker 4: Are they that confident? And does that play into their verdict?

453
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:28,320
Speaker 4: I wonder I would want to talk to a juror.

454
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:30,600
Speaker 2: Like, let's unpack this. And by the way, if you

455
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:32,719
Speaker 2: have any feelings on this, call us eight eight eight

456
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:35,480
Speaker 2: three to one crime, please We're desperate for you to

457
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:37,960
Speaker 2: weigh in because this is a complicated one and just

458
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:41,280
Speaker 2: don't talk about it. Does it make it right? I'm

459
00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:43,639
Speaker 2: confused by that. I think that's a real show of

460
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,159
Speaker 2: confidence and it has played a couple of mind tricks

461
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,560
Speaker 2: on me today even as we were going through all

462
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:51,200
Speaker 2: of the jurors that had brought us up to date.

463
00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:53,640
Speaker 2: You know, that's the question, are we fatigued. Have they

464
00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 2: proven it? Maybe they haven't. Maybe he's very confident. Maybe

465
00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:58,280
Speaker 2: he knows he's going to get he's getting off at

466
00:24:58,280 --> 00:24:58,960
Speaker 2: the end of the week.

467
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,600
Speaker 4: Or maybe to know how much going to Maybe he

468
00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:03,520
Speaker 4: knows Cross is going to bury him.

469
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:05,280
Speaker 2: Or Cross is going to bury him. And like we

470
00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:07,879
Speaker 2: talked about earlier, why are all of the assistants in

471
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,760
Speaker 2: Low Hanging Fruit, people that are not so in the

472
00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:16,440
Speaker 2: system being brought to testify? Why are they taking the heat?

473
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:19,120
Speaker 2: Why are they being forced to get immunity? Where are

474
00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:21,840
Speaker 2: the big ticket items? Where's his chief of staff? Where's

475
00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:25,040
Speaker 2: d Rock, the main security person? Where are the people

476
00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:28,479
Speaker 2: being held accountable for making that video of Cassie Ventura

477
00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:32,399
Speaker 2: being you know, beaten up making that disappear? Instead of

478
00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:32,840
Speaker 2: all the.

479
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:36,320
Speaker 4: Celebrities, where are all the celebrities? So where are all

480
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:38,560
Speaker 4: the celebrities you eat? That's what I would like to know.

481
00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 2: I have one happyr people. I would assume that I'm

482
00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:44,159
Speaker 2: sure very hard to keep them out of this convo,

483
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:47,199
Speaker 2: but this list exists, so we would be remiss not

484
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:48,000
Speaker 2: to discuss it.

485
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:50,960
Speaker 3: Right. Okay, this isn't necessarily this is one that just

486
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,800
Speaker 3: stood out to me so much This isn't even about

487
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:57,399
Speaker 3: people who should allegedly have testified, but celebrities who have

488
00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:02,240
Speaker 3: come up. So Jane, she testified that her and Ditty

489
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:06,400
Speaker 3: when they were in threesomes would have special names. So

490
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:11,639
Speaker 3: Jane was Bryant, Diddy was Jordan, as in Michael Jordan,

491
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:14,840
Speaker 3: and the male escorts were known as Shaq.

492
00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:16,600
Speaker 2: That's weird. I just put that.

493
00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:21,320
Speaker 4: And as a reminder, Jane is Ditty's basically girlfriend at

494
00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:23,959
Speaker 4: the time, yep. And she was a single mom, and

495
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:26,800
Speaker 4: she testified under an anonymous name right.

496
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:30,720
Speaker 2: Correct, correct, and days on the stand that to day

497
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,879
Speaker 2: telling harrowy Dale and listen, I can we stop on

498
00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:36,320
Speaker 2: Jane for one second because we haven't talked much about her.

499
00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:39,040
Speaker 2: We have one just for one minute, because I listen,

500
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:41,280
Speaker 2: we get we get all these comments and we're we're

501
00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:43,879
Speaker 2: listening to all the chatter and reading all about it.

502
00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:46,359
Speaker 2: And it's two part. You know, I thought, you know,

503
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:49,520
Speaker 2: Jane's deestimony was really painful to your point, she's a

504
00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:53,240
Speaker 2: single mother. He like you know, seems to prey on

505
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,400
Speaker 2: women that maybe don't have the best financial means, that

506
00:26:57,520 --> 00:27:00,239
Speaker 2: are maybe you know, able to be brought into this

507
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:04,600
Speaker 2: like reign of terror pretty easily. Maybe they're just like

508
00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:08,639
Speaker 2: enabbered by his fame. Regardless, she's been through a lot

509
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:11,520
Speaker 2: and the other side of that has been and we've

510
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 2: heard even you know, Bill Maher say this publicly. Well,

511
00:27:15,119 --> 00:27:17,199
Speaker 2: you know, look at those texts where she says how

512
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:20,920
Speaker 2: much she enjoys him, or she says she's she's into it,

513
00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:23,520
Speaker 2: or look at these texts after the fact. She couldn't

514
00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:27,040
Speaker 2: have been that much distressed because look at these texts

515
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:30,119
Speaker 2: that would suggest otherwise. And I really do get that.

516
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:32,359
Speaker 2: That's a you know, I get that from an outsider

517
00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:35,000
Speaker 2: looking in. I'm just saying that's a trauma bond man.

518
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:39,560
Speaker 2: Sometimes people say things, text things just because a they

519
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:42,840
Speaker 2: want to self preserve, they want to keep the monster

520
00:27:43,080 --> 00:27:46,760
Speaker 2: at bay. But also sometimes there's real feelings kind of

521
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:49,679
Speaker 2: stuck in this. You know, she entered the situation in

522
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:52,439
Speaker 2: love with him. He starts asking her to do stuff,

523
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 2: she starts doing it, she starts to feel degraded. That continues,

524
00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 2: That continues. Now we add some drugs to the equation.

525
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:02,400
Speaker 2: Now add some cash to the equation. Next thing, you know,

526
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:04,879
Speaker 2: you're kind of in over your head again. I'm not

527
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:08,639
Speaker 2: making excuses, but it can be really complicated, and I

528
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:11,720
Speaker 2: kind of want to disagree a little bit about Bill. Please.

529
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:14,920
Speaker 4: I think it's real easy for Bill Maher, who is

530
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:21,359
Speaker 4: as white powerful man right to with his own affluence.

531
00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:23,399
Speaker 4: He's not like a single mother, right.

532
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:24,760
Speaker 2: Trying to make a single man.

533
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:26,600
Speaker 4: It's really easy for him to sit up on the

534
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:27,760
Speaker 4: pedestal and judge.

535
00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:29,960
Speaker 2: And it brought him a lot of attention, right, He

536
00:28:30,000 --> 00:28:31,960
Speaker 2: got a lot of clicks out of it. So his

537
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:36,520
Speaker 2: point was, listen, ladies as like a public service to leave,

538
00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 2: lad leave, Yeah, just leave. You know, you're in a

539
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:42,400
Speaker 2: tough spot. You know, we saw what happened when you know, Yeah,

540
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:45,520
Speaker 2: great question. Why why don't they just leave? I don't know.

541
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 2: Did you not see the tape of Casey Cassie Ventura

542
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:51,800
Speaker 2: at the elevator actually trying to leave. What happens then?

543
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:54,640
Speaker 2: What happened to Ditty's X. I'm not saying that he

544
00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:57,360
Speaker 2: took her life, but she did die mysteriously in her sleep,

545
00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:01,320
Speaker 2: and that's up for a lot of chatter and conversation allegedly. Allegedly,

546
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 2: it is not a safe circle to bust out of

547
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:08,000
Speaker 2: when you have security on lock, when you have all

548
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:10,320
Speaker 2: the people that you come in contact with that pay

549
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:13,200
Speaker 2: your bills, that do all of the hustles and coordinating,

550
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:17,440
Speaker 2: all working for the same person. There's no place to hide,

551
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:21,280
Speaker 2: even behind bars. There's no place to hide. That's harrowing.

552
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:25,480
Speaker 3: And there's a long term I mean a longstanding psychological

553
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:28,320
Speaker 3: condition that's been known used to be known as Battern

554
00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:31,360
Speaker 3: Women's syndrome when I was growing up. Now it's called

555
00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:35,120
Speaker 3: intimate partner violence. But listen, that happens and can develop

556
00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:39,400
Speaker 3: when you're experiencing abuse and you're not safe and you're

557
00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:42,080
Speaker 3: not happy, but you're terrified to leave for all the

558
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:45,280
Speaker 3: reasons you guys listed out. So it is a prison

559
00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:46,880
Speaker 3: within its own bill maher.

560
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:49,160
Speaker 2: Right, let's get into some of these celebrities, ladies. Yeah,

561
00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:50,959
Speaker 2: go ahead, hit us up with some celebrisy. I mean,

562
00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:52,720
Speaker 2: you have the list in front of you. Go ahead,

563
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:54,400
Speaker 2: go with one of the names. Toss it out.

564
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 3: Okay, So Jennifer Lopez and I know she's the biggest one,

565
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:02,680
Speaker 3: but it doesn't make it doesn't make any sense since

566
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:06,720
Speaker 3: she was involved A. She was involved with Ditty for

567
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:09,320
Speaker 3: a long time, but B was involved with him on

568
00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:14,600
Speaker 3: the very night of that messy situation with Shine that

569
00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 3: happened at Shine was another rapper, and when they were

570
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:22,480
Speaker 3: at a nightclub there was an altercation involving a gun

571
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:24,800
Speaker 3: and Stephanie, I think you might be able to speak

572
00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,000
Speaker 3: more eloquently to the details.

573
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,840
Speaker 2: But there because I love j Loo and this hurts

574
00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 2: me to say, so, Jlo, cover your ears because I'm

575
00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 2: really I think she's so beautiful. And you all remember

576
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 2: that green Versace dress that she wore iconically.

577
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,320
Speaker 4: Do you know why that's Google images was created because

578
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:42,920
Speaker 4: of that dress?

579
00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:46,120
Speaker 2: Yeah? Well Google image was created of that. And you

580
00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:49,080
Speaker 2: know why that dress exists. It was on Ditty's watch.

581
00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:53,080
Speaker 2: Ditty would really control her look, right, So those are

582
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:55,959
Speaker 2: the iconic like Jlo days when she really had this

583
00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:59,040
Speaker 2: big moment on the scene, you know. And she had

584
00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:01,120
Speaker 2: been dating Diddy for while, which is why it's a

585
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:05,040
Speaker 2: great question. She could offer some context either for Ditty

586
00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:08,680
Speaker 2: or against him. Right, But what is she accused of, Well,

587
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:11,360
Speaker 2: she's accused of Well, she was with him for a

588
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:14,680
Speaker 2: long time, so she has insight. Secondarily, she was at

589
00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:18,240
Speaker 2: this nightclub I believe it was in nineteen ninety nine. Diddy,

590
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:21,040
Speaker 2: j Lo, his girlfriend at the time, and a guy

591
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:23,760
Speaker 2: named Shine who was an up and coming rapper who

592
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:27,160
Speaker 2: had had some hits under Ditty's label. They were all there,

593
00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 2: you know, partying at this nightclub and shots fired, shots fired,

594
00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:35,200
Speaker 2: and although no one died, the victim I think was

595
00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:38,080
Speaker 2: like shot in the face, really riot, shot in the face,

596
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:41,040
Speaker 2: and like you know, lives to tell the tale, thankfully,

597
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 2: but barely. And then Diddy and j Lo allegedly allegedly allegedly,

598
00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:48,160
Speaker 2: we should make that a drinking game. They they dip,

599
00:31:48,280 --> 00:31:51,400
Speaker 2: they run out of the nightclub and they're off in

600
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:55,440
Speaker 2: a way. And when later discussed, uh, there was no

601
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:59,200
Speaker 2: talk of a gun, and apparent allegedly j Lo knew

602
00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:02,320
Speaker 2: of the gun and lied to a judge. Again, this

603
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 2: is the chatter we have. No we are not suggesting this,

604
00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:09,320
Speaker 2: so be kind to our Jlo. But this gentleman Shine,

605
00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:12,240
Speaker 2: who was at the nightclub, maybe the last man standing

606
00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:15,280
Speaker 2: when everybody else skadaddled. He ended up taking the fall.

607
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:18,360
Speaker 2: He did many years behind bars. He has since found

608
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:22,960
Speaker 2: God forgives all involved. But the chatter is that this

609
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:26,320
Speaker 2: was a real crime, that did he paid to have

610
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:29,560
Speaker 2: this go away, and that he offered, which we've heard

611
00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 2: in testimony. The driver of the car that night that

612
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:36,200
Speaker 2: had Jlo and Diddy in the backseat offered him cash

613
00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 2: to take the fall or to take the gun. And

614
00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:41,080
Speaker 2: I think Jlo always said there wasn't a gun, but

615
00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 2: maybe she had to lie about it because maybe she

616
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:46,520
Speaker 2: was being you know, she was probably scared by him too.

617
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:50,360
Speaker 2: You know, Jlo may be a victim also, And again,

618
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:52,600
Speaker 2: like who wants to be associated with us? It's such

619
00:32:52,760 --> 00:32:55,760
Speaker 2: yuck that I could imagine if I'm a superstar, you know,

620
00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:58,720
Speaker 2: like Jennifer Lopez. Some say that the reason that she

621
00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:01,720
Speaker 2: split with ben Afflack is because they had to get

622
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:06,160
Speaker 2: their finances sorted out real quick, and that was alleged, alleged,

623
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 2: alleged that there was video and a da da da.

624
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:10,760
Speaker 2: Who knows, none of that has really come to be

625
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 2: So Number one, is that just a real smear on

626
00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:17,080
Speaker 2: your great name, even just being associated with Diddy. So

627
00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:21,680
Speaker 2: maybe everyone's really distancing themselves and paying people people to

628
00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:25,479
Speaker 2: like keep away from the fray. Of course, especially if

629
00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:28,480
Speaker 2: you've built your whole career, your whole career by busting

630
00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:30,760
Speaker 2: it and working so hard. Nobody can take hard work

631
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:33,240
Speaker 2: away from our our j Low. But on the flip,

632
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:36,640
Speaker 2: if she has some insight to offer interesting. I don't know,

633
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:39,200
Speaker 2: you know, we have we don't know. No one's seen her.

634
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:42,520
Speaker 4: Wow, Well there's a bunch of celebrities. There's Jagger and

635
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:44,480
Speaker 4: Leonardo DiCaprio. What's the deal.

636
00:33:44,560 --> 00:33:47,800
Speaker 2: What's the deal with those two? Well, Leonardo DiCaprio used

637
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 2: to be at white parties. Okay, so he's just a

638
00:33:50,280 --> 00:33:50,720
Speaker 2: guest at it.

639
00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:53,280
Speaker 4: I mean, you're not on the list if you're just

640
00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:55,440
Speaker 4: a pure like either their buds.

641
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:58,480
Speaker 2: You know, those parties were huge. Everybody got invites, you know,

642
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:01,040
Speaker 2: like we all everybody I would have on it, just

643
00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:03,240
Speaker 2: like the timings didn't work out. But like those were

644
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:05,920
Speaker 2: packed houses, you know, whether you're in the Hamptons or

645
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,280
Speaker 2: Miami or in New York City. Like, those were big parties,

646
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:11,440
Speaker 2: but there were so many people. I think these freak

647
00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 2: offs and more intimate nights were kind of later in

648
00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:18,440
Speaker 2: the evening when the regular people the normis dipped or

649
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 2: the ones that weren't wearing the perfect slippers that were

650
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:24,399
Speaker 2: being assigned to them, or they were being targeted, and

651
00:34:24,520 --> 00:34:28,040
Speaker 2: you know, young women would come in maybe allegedly told oh, yeah,

652
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:30,640
Speaker 2: you're extra special, put these slippers on. Now you're invited

653
00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:37,879
Speaker 2: to the next fun VIPP party and like that isn't say, well,

654
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:39,919
Speaker 2: there was like a lot of urine talk. I can't

655
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:42,520
Speaker 2: I don't want to everybody out. No, that's true, but

656
00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:44,719
Speaker 2: that's sort of what seems. It kind of got real

657
00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:50,000
Speaker 2: weird after after a party, I think each but like

658
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:51,680
Speaker 2: if you don't know what you're getting into, that could

659
00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:54,000
Speaker 2: be horrified, that would be surprising.

660
00:34:54,600 --> 00:34:57,680
Speaker 4: I was scary, scary, scary. Whitney Houston, Mariah Carey, their mention.

661
00:34:57,760 --> 00:34:59,840
Speaker 4: I mean, there's a whole list of celebrities that are

662
00:34:59,840 --> 00:35:02,520
Speaker 4: be mentioned, but they're not being accused of anything. They're

663
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:07,160
Speaker 4: just being mentioned, right, like for her or you know,

664
00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:09,680
Speaker 4: but there's like the six degree of separation. But there's

665
00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 4: like this shroud of like they must have done something

666
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:14,360
Speaker 4: wrong to have been enlisted anyway.

667
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:17,319
Speaker 2: I know we all agree on so little and the

668
00:35:17,360 --> 00:35:19,960
Speaker 2: world seems so intense, but we can't all agree that

669
00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:23,640
Speaker 2: Ditty has not done the right thing by women period.

670
00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:28,720
Speaker 2: You cannot beat women up that way. You cannot use

671
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:32,680
Speaker 2: videotapes against them. I mean, not just women. Anybody can't

672
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:35,319
Speaker 2: do this, which is why again, it's so important that

673
00:35:35,360 --> 00:35:37,239
Speaker 2: we're talking about it, and I can't get this list

674
00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:39,120
Speaker 2: out of my head. Who's the other celebrity? And then

675
00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:42,120
Speaker 2: I promise we'll put Ditty to rest. Is Stephanie's favorite.

676
00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:45,960
Speaker 2: Somebody has to like shoot hit me over there.

677
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:48,640
Speaker 4: She was like depressed before we started, and I've never

678
00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:51,400
Speaker 4: seen her so alive, like I'm looking she is a

679
00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:52,839
Speaker 4: live ang day.

680
00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:57,360
Speaker 2: It was a hard day today, but somehow unpacking Ditty's

681
00:35:57,440 --> 00:36:01,360
Speaker 2: disasters makes it a little bit better because again, he

682
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:03,560
Speaker 2: might get away with it, he might get off, but

683
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 2: he won't really get off because we're going to talk

684
00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:08,759
Speaker 2: about it. And if nothing else, we can all say

685
00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:13,240
Speaker 2: he's been really horrendous to women and abusing them. Whether

686
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:16,880
Speaker 2: that's racketeering, we shall see. That's for the jurors to decide.

687
00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 2: But again, the violence against women, no can do. And

688
00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:23,279
Speaker 2: I think that's been kind of an eye opener in

689
00:36:23,320 --> 00:36:26,320
Speaker 2: this case, not kind of very much an eye open.

690
00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:29,279
Speaker 3: It's been very prevalent. And you asked about one of

691
00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 3: the celebrities. So Usher's name has come up several times.

692
00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:35,759
Speaker 3: We spoke about earlier in the show, his connection with

693
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:41,319
Speaker 3: Justin Bieber and Diddy, but also when Dawn Richards was

694
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:42,560
Speaker 3: on the stand and.

695
00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 2: She from Dannity Kane.

696
00:36:44,239 --> 00:36:50,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, so she testified that Diddy threatened her after she

697
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:55,440
Speaker 3: saw him, after she saw Diddy beat Cassie. That was

698
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:57,080
Speaker 3: her testimony that he threatened her.

699
00:36:57,600 --> 00:36:57,960
Speaker 2: Well.

700
00:36:58,239 --> 00:37:02,240
Speaker 3: Also during that testimony, what she said was that Usher

701
00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:05,760
Speaker 3: was at the dinner party where did he allegedly punched

702
00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:09,359
Speaker 3: Cassie in the stomach, which I don't know how big

703
00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:12,040
Speaker 3: this dinner would be. That would indicate he's a potential witness,

704
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 3: and that was why he came up, or maybe he was.

705
00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:17,400
Speaker 2: Like a list of people, But did he underneath? Did

706
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:20,880
Speaker 2: he was Usher? We're talking age wise, like I believe

707
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:24,360
Speaker 2: Usher was under Ditty's label and was a young boy

708
00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:28,400
Speaker 2: when his career began, and he was sort of in

709
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:30,840
Speaker 2: the diddy land. And again, nobody knew what the diddy

710
00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:35,239
Speaker 2: land was, right, so maybe those were different times. And

711
00:37:35,239 --> 00:37:39,640
Speaker 2: then Usher then brought Bieber to the table. Maybe they

712
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:42,279
Speaker 2: have all nothing to do with it, but I'm sure

713
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:44,680
Speaker 2: they have a little bit of insight. I'm sure they

714
00:37:44,680 --> 00:37:46,719
Speaker 2: have a little bit of insight. I know Michael B.

715
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:49,600
Speaker 2: Jordan's name keeps coming up. Thing and this is a

716
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:53,399
Speaker 2: brutal one too, by the way, and nothing scary about it,

717
00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:56,319
Speaker 2: just like there's nothing bad about justin Bieber. Nothing bad

718
00:37:56,360 --> 00:38:00,279
Speaker 2: about Usher. Michael B. Jordan was Cassie Ventura's ex boyfriend,

719
00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:03,840
Speaker 2: so it might just see somebody that he was jealous

720
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:07,560
Speaker 2: of that didn't jealous of leave him for Diddy. She

721
00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:10,320
Speaker 2: did know they were on a break. They were together

722
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:12,520
Speaker 2: for a short amount of time, and then I believe

723
00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:13,480
Speaker 2: they got back together.

724
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:17,600
Speaker 3: Not so dissimilar to the kid cutting for anybody for

725
00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:18,360
Speaker 3: any reason.

726
00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:21,279
Speaker 2: Go back to the boyfriend that's accusing you know you

727
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:24,520
Speaker 2: of scary things and is threatening to throw revenge porn

728
00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:28,239
Speaker 2: out into the world to prevent you from having any happiness.

729
00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:31,760
Speaker 2: That's the problem. And there were so many drugs involved. Again,

730
00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 2: this seems like oh, party, party, party, MDMA, ecstasy. This

731
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:38,319
Speaker 2: seems like very scary nights on ecstasy. I've never known

732
00:38:38,360 --> 00:38:40,840
Speaker 2: anybody who's just not happy on ecstasy, but like this

733
00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:45,400
Speaker 2: is like scary stuff. So that changes everybody's I guess

734
00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:46,240
Speaker 2: people's boundaries.

735
00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:49,319
Speaker 4: It changes like your whole perception exactly how you live

736
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:52,800
Speaker 4: your whole life exact. And you have this looming threat

737
00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:55,439
Speaker 4: of you know, you're you're gonna be humiliated in front

738
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:57,040
Speaker 4: of you your sweet mother.

739
00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:58,480
Speaker 2: Oh my god, you're so earnest.

740
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 4: You could tell me anything and to protect my mom,

741
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:03,080
Speaker 4: and I would do it, you know what I mean,

742
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:06,400
Speaker 4: like I would have done anything to protect my image

743
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 4: to my mother.

744
00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:10,680
Speaker 2: So I can kind of see that. Oh listen, we're

745
00:39:10,680 --> 00:39:12,560
Speaker 2: gonna come right back, I promise, not with more Diddy.

746
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:15,560
Speaker 2: We're going to talk about to Karen Reid trial, my

747
00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:18,960
Speaker 2: hand on the Bible, Bible, So please stay with us

748
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:22,200
Speaker 2: true crime all the time. This is true crime tonight.

749
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:35,799
Speaker 2: It's a week ahead, I might add, because listen, allegedly

750
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 2: Diddy is going to rest the case and we're going

751
00:39:39,080 --> 00:39:41,399
Speaker 2: to have a verdict potentially by the end of the week.

752
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:43,840
Speaker 2: So there's so much to unpack this week, so we

753
00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:47,240
Speaker 2: didy watch. Let's take bets. Let's take bets.

754
00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:51,160
Speaker 4: I'm going to say, by Friday morning, what's that? Quickly

755
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:55,520
Speaker 4: thought and I called. I called Karen read perfectly said

756
00:39:55,520 --> 00:39:57,280
Speaker 4: it was going to be Wednesday.

757
00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:00,439
Speaker 2: You did, you did? I'm going to say for morning,

758
00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:03,040
Speaker 2: having psychic predictions.

759
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:05,160
Speaker 3: I say it hangs over into next week. And I

760
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,279
Speaker 3: also think they're going to ask several times for you

761
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:11,719
Speaker 3: know how you can jurors can ask for specific testimony

762
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:15,080
Speaker 3: or definitions of things. And I think, particularly with the

763
00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:17,920
Speaker 3: Rico wach. I know I've talked about that's going to

764
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 3: be a hangover, so it's going to be into next week.

765
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:24,120
Speaker 2: What do you think? Stuff? My goodness, I am so

766
00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 2: confused just hearing these choices. First of all, I thought

767
00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:28,239
Speaker 2: this trial was going to go on for two more

768
00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:31,160
Speaker 2: months because the defense was going to have a million witnesses,

769
00:40:31,239 --> 00:40:34,480
Speaker 2: so or wanly I shouldn't really get a vote because

770
00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:36,920
Speaker 2: I'm already kind of at a deathicies. No, we all

771
00:40:36,960 --> 00:40:39,800
Speaker 2: thought that. I mean, I'm shocked that they're going to

772
00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:42,160
Speaker 2: be like and that's a wrap if I'm diddy. Let's

773
00:40:42,200 --> 00:40:44,720
Speaker 2: just put ourselves in his position for a hot minute.

774
00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 2: As he sits in prison or jail tonight in Brooklyn

775
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:55,040
Speaker 2: with Sam Bankman the fraud brought up on charges for

776
00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:57,960
Speaker 2: you know, a white collar crime, if you will, those

777
00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:00,880
Speaker 2: two were sitting together. Is he saying I'm going to

778
00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:03,320
Speaker 2: be home by Friday or be home by the weekend,

779
00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 2: or is he just looking for life behind bars? I

780
00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:08,719
Speaker 2: don't know. I think I would have a little more

781
00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:12,399
Speaker 2: fight in me if he wasn't super confident. Right, If

782
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:15,680
Speaker 2: you're him and you're looking at a lifetime in the

783
00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:18,239
Speaker 2: conditions that he's been in, which is no walk in

784
00:41:18,239 --> 00:41:18,960
Speaker 2: the park by allway.

785
00:41:19,000 --> 00:41:20,720
Speaker 4: I think it says a lot though, to the jury

786
00:41:20,760 --> 00:41:23,399
Speaker 4: that they're not putting on. I think it speaks to them.

787
00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:26,200
Speaker 4: I really do it. It's a subtle message like, listen,

788
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:29,000
Speaker 4: the government doesn't have a case, and we really don't

789
00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:29,560
Speaker 4: have anything to.

790
00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:32,279
Speaker 2: Say because it's so ludicrous. I think that's it.

791
00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:34,879
Speaker 3: I think it's you know, his confidence and we can

792
00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:38,360
Speaker 3: I don't know certainly what's in his brain, but his counsel,

793
00:41:38,719 --> 00:41:42,799
Speaker 3: of which there are ten attorneys being paid last I checked.

794
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:44,439
Speaker 4: And none of them are going to speak for him

795
00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:46,120
Speaker 4: like it's crazy.

796
00:41:45,840 --> 00:41:48,720
Speaker 3: Because it you know, it potentially could be too dangerous

797
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:50,400
Speaker 3: or it's a strategy either not like I'm going to

798
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:52,720
Speaker 3: tell it day off and you know, go golfing or something.

799
00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:55,879
Speaker 3: It's I can't imagine the amount of thought that went

800
00:41:55,920 --> 00:41:58,719
Speaker 3: into this with all of those ten legal minds. Oh

801
00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:00,440
Speaker 3: one thing, I don't know why this stuck out to me.

802
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:04,840
Speaker 3: You know how Diddy's hair has gone gray. He's fifty,

803
00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:07,520
Speaker 3: however old he is, so I just thought, oh, he

804
00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:10,960
Speaker 3: didn't have hair color in prison. But it turns out,

805
00:42:11,040 --> 00:42:13,359
Speaker 3: and this makes perfect sense, that it was it was

806
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:18,760
Speaker 3: someone who who helps you present well in front of jurors,

807
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:21,080
Speaker 3: and they said, no, you're going to look like an older,

808
00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:24,279
Speaker 3: more seasoned man, so let that hair go gray. Aw

809
00:42:24,600 --> 00:42:26,560
Speaker 3: that's a tangent. But I was something that I had

810
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:29,400
Speaker 3: read as an article. It's not a just interesting So

811
00:42:29,480 --> 00:42:32,239
Speaker 3: thought has been given to everything, and I'm sure that

812
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:33,800
Speaker 3: includes should we put up a different.

813
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 2: Everything's very calculated, right, right, So like it's going back

814
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:39,680
Speaker 2: to that because I had also read that he had

815
00:42:39,719 --> 00:42:43,040
Speaker 2: been dressing in sort of like old man clothes also

816
00:42:43,120 --> 00:42:45,880
Speaker 2: for optics, like he was wearing like, you know, a

817
00:42:45,920 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 2: little an old man sweater with like an old man.

818
00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:53,440
Speaker 2: He wasn't given like bad boy for life vibes, you know,

819
00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:57,560
Speaker 2: he was giving very church boy old I just have.

820
00:42:57,600 --> 00:43:00,520
Speaker 4: To point something out one of our guys the studio,

821
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:04,480
Speaker 4: Adam said, like Harvey Weinstein coming to courtneer wheelchair. Same

822
00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:06,799
Speaker 4: with Joseph DiAngelo, the Golden State Killer. Right, and then

823
00:43:06,840 --> 00:43:09,560
Speaker 4: he's doing push ups in his jail cell. Like here's

824
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:13,080
Speaker 4: the cool thing though, say with mom, no true crime,

825
00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 4: and like he's like he's learning.

826
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:17,719
Speaker 2: Good point, Adam is learning this is this is so true?

827
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:21,520
Speaker 2: Good question? Because that is accurate. It's all a show

828
00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:24,280
Speaker 2: it's like a play. That's why being a trial attorney

829
00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:26,440
Speaker 2: is such a big deal, because you're really putting on

830
00:43:26,600 --> 00:43:29,480
Speaker 2: a bit of a performance in Layman's terms, so that

831
00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 2: the jury is not like tone deaf or they're not

832
00:43:33,080 --> 00:43:36,000
Speaker 2: snoozing behind the wheel. Is it possible, just throwing this

833
00:43:36,040 --> 00:43:38,600
Speaker 2: out there, this the prosecution I think put on a

834
00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:41,360
Speaker 2: really great job. Not that I have much to compare

835
00:43:41,400 --> 00:43:43,160
Speaker 2: this to because a lot of this stuff is new.

836
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:45,319
Speaker 2: Even in this case, I had never heard of a

837
00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:47,799
Speaker 2: lot of these things before. Is it possible that there

838
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:51,160
Speaker 2: were maybe too many details and we've gotten sort of

839
00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:54,400
Speaker 2: exhausted from it, Like do you end with Cassie Ventura,

840
00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:59,799
Speaker 2: because maybe potentially she had the most full prong testimony

841
00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:03,560
Speaker 2: in terms of violence. We had seen the tape on CNN,

842
00:44:03,640 --> 00:44:06,080
Speaker 2: so people already have a feeling about it. You know,

843
00:44:06,120 --> 00:44:08,840
Speaker 2: she presents so beautifully, Jane. I'm not saying did not.

844
00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 2: I just don't. Physically I didn't see her. And then also,

845
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:14,800
Speaker 2: you know, she talked a bit about sort of the

846
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:19,840
Speaker 2: collaboration of the ditty staff to you know, book things

847
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:23,200
Speaker 2: and take care of things, and how she and her

848
00:44:23,239 --> 00:44:27,080
Speaker 2: mother were being basically you know, escorted with this you know,

849
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:31,799
Speaker 2: extorted with this tape and mom cass event, Toura's mom

850
00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 2: had to send twenty thousand dollars to a loan out

851
00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:37,440
Speaker 2: on her house so that she could pay off Diddy

852
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:40,960
Speaker 2: otherwise he was threatening to release the tape. Doesn't that

853
00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:45,719
Speaker 2: alone prove racketeering. Maybe some of the other testimony has

854
00:44:45,719 --> 00:44:48,040
Speaker 2: sort of muddied that a bit, But it's such a

855
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 2: good question. I have to assume he must feel pretty confident.

856
00:44:51,719 --> 00:44:53,239
Speaker 2: Or does he think he's just going to get a

857
00:44:53,239 --> 00:44:57,359
Speaker 2: pardon or is it like you just kind of throw

858
00:44:57,400 --> 00:44:59,560
Speaker 2: it up to the gods. I can't imagine that's the case.

859
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:01,399
Speaker 2: Mistakes are very high here.

860
00:45:01,880 --> 00:45:03,360
Speaker 4: I feel like they're throwing it up to the gods

861
00:45:03,360 --> 00:45:06,160
Speaker 4: by not providing any kind of defense. But again, I

862
00:45:06,160 --> 00:45:08,960
Speaker 4: think it is a kind of like a subliminal message

863
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:11,680
Speaker 4: basically to the jury, like we're so confident because the

864
00:45:11,719 --> 00:45:13,600
Speaker 4: prosecutions this is ludicrous.

865
00:45:13,640 --> 00:45:15,480
Speaker 2: We don't even have anything to say to it. And

866
00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:19,359
Speaker 2: why not get the Ashton Kutcher's or the you know,

867
00:45:19,680 --> 00:45:22,520
Speaker 2: justin bieber Is all of the people that maybe did

868
00:45:22,680 --> 00:45:25,040
Speaker 2: know him in a different way, or maybe they did

869
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:25,720
Speaker 2: have a difference.

870
00:45:25,719 --> 00:45:28,040
Speaker 4: Well, I would listen, they probably don't want to put

871
00:45:28,080 --> 00:45:29,280
Speaker 4: their own neck on the line.

872
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 2: True.

873
00:45:30,040 --> 00:45:32,840
Speaker 4: I mean if they go to the defense like Ashton

874
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:36,520
Speaker 4: Kutcher came to the defense of that one guy, Danny,

875
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:42,719
Speaker 4: and they got eviscerated in the public eviscerated. So I

876
00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:46,680
Speaker 4: cannot imagine that anybody of any social status would want

877
00:45:46,719 --> 00:45:49,080
Speaker 4: to come to Ditty's defense because they're like, I, I'm

878
00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:50,279
Speaker 4: not touching that with the ten foot pole.

879
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:52,239
Speaker 2: I don't care if he's my friend or not. Even

880
00:45:52,360 --> 00:45:56,280
Speaker 2: jay Z and Beyonce, who were his besties, absolute no dice.

881
00:45:56,600 --> 00:45:58,799
Speaker 2: I wonder if they know anything. I mean, these are

882
00:45:58,800 --> 00:46:01,759
Speaker 2: his best buds. I I can't imagine. I mean what

883
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:03,760
Speaker 2: I I don't want everybody coming for me. I'm afraid

884
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:05,560
Speaker 2: to say any of these names out loud at this point.

885
00:46:05,920 --> 00:46:09,520
Speaker 2: But again, this was a very big I would never

886
00:46:09,560 --> 00:46:12,120
Speaker 2: say anything. I mean, have you seen Blue Ivy on

887
00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:16,160
Speaker 2: that stage. She's trented. I can't even imagine, Like, I

888
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:19,320
Speaker 2: just want to be in the beehive literally, But again,

889
00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:21,360
Speaker 2: these were people that spend a lot of time together.

890
00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:24,040
Speaker 2: How do you not stand up for your friend or

891
00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 2: is it just complete professional suicide to do that.

892
00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:30,040
Speaker 3: We're now going to switch gears and we're going to

893
00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:32,480
Speaker 3: talk about Karen Reid.

894
00:46:34,080 --> 00:46:38,120
Speaker 2: Finally, Yes, go ahead, Where do we begin? Where do

895
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:38,560
Speaker 2: you begin?

896
00:46:39,000 --> 00:46:41,160
Speaker 4: So it's been what five six days?

897
00:46:41,480 --> 00:46:42,080
Speaker 2: Five days?

898
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:45,920
Speaker 4: Yes, five yeah, five very long days on the internet,

899
00:46:45,920 --> 00:46:49,879
Speaker 4: at least since the not the jury found Karen Read

900
00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:52,960
Speaker 4: not guilty of killing her Boston police officer boyfriend.

901
00:46:53,000 --> 00:46:55,279
Speaker 2: She was found guilty of d y.

902
00:46:56,400 --> 00:47:01,320
Speaker 4: Special prosecutor Hank Brennan issued a statement, first official statement.

903
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:03,160
Speaker 4: He said that the evidence in the Karen Reid case

904
00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:07,400
Speaker 4: led to only one person. He also said, they, you know,

905
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:12,480
Speaker 4: conducted an independent, brand new investigation into everything, and they

906
00:47:12,920 --> 00:47:16,400
Speaker 4: concluded it was Karen Reid, and so he felt fully

907
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:20,879
Speaker 4: confident prosecuting her with the evidence they had. However, I mean,

908
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:24,400
Speaker 4: he completely ignored this FBI report right like, there was

909
00:47:24,440 --> 00:47:27,760
Speaker 4: this big FBI report that basically said, you know, Karen

910
00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:31,400
Speaker 4: Reid likely is not guilty of this. He was not

911
00:47:31,520 --> 00:47:35,600
Speaker 4: hit by a car. John O'Keeffe, the victim rest in peace,

912
00:47:35,880 --> 00:47:39,360
Speaker 4: Rest in peace like eternal peace that you know. So

913
00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:42,480
Speaker 4: you know, Hank Brennan has possession of this FBI report,

914
00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:46,839
Speaker 4: who is now prosecuting this case, and in light of that,

915
00:47:47,000 --> 00:47:49,520
Speaker 4: can still wanted to prosecute it. And said that she

916
00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:53,360
Speaker 4: and still stands on that that she is the one

917
00:47:53,400 --> 00:47:56,799
Speaker 4: that killed him. So he's basically saying, we're not going

918
00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:59,440
Speaker 4: to be looking at anybody else because she's she's the perpetrator.

919
00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:02,880
Speaker 3: Well, he's ends alone, at least in terms of anyone

920
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:06,880
Speaker 3: else who is a medical expert to say that victim

921
00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:11,520
Speaker 3: John o'keyes the police officer, was hit by Karen Reid's cars,

922
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:12,160
Speaker 3: she backed up.

923
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:13,560
Speaker 2: I mean, you guys read the statement.

924
00:48:13,760 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 4: Is that the impression you got from the statement that

925
00:48:15,800 --> 00:48:17,799
Speaker 4: he was basically saying they're not going to be looking

926
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:21,240
Speaker 4: at anybody else, that he did this independent investigation and

927
00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:28,320
Speaker 4: outside of the trial one basically start over and decided that, yeah,

928
00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:29,000
Speaker 4: they're right.

929
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:31,400
Speaker 2: They have the right person. And that's the impression I

930
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:33,759
Speaker 2: got from his statement, which is interesting. And if you

931
00:48:33,840 --> 00:48:36,560
Speaker 2: haven't been playing along too and you haven't been keeping

932
00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:41,839
Speaker 2: up with the verdict, it's gotten so much backlash and excitement.

933
00:48:42,120 --> 00:48:44,360
Speaker 2: You know, people that were very pro Karen Reid have

934
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:47,840
Speaker 2: done some exciting things and also in some scary things.

935
00:48:47,880 --> 00:48:50,440
Speaker 2: I mean, I think his family, John O'Keefe's family, his

936
00:48:50,520 --> 00:48:53,799
Speaker 2: beloved mother and brother and dad, like they're they're they're

937
00:48:53,840 --> 00:48:57,239
Speaker 2: having weirdos showing up in front of their house and dancing, dance,

938
00:48:57,560 --> 00:49:02,840
Speaker 2: all sorts of Please let them rest, give them peace.

939
00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:07,520
Speaker 2: It's been so brutal for John O'Keefe's family, so first

940
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:11,360
Speaker 2: and foremost, can we please let them have some time

941
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:15,400
Speaker 2: to themselves and heal and grieve right like this has

942
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:18,200
Speaker 2: been brutal. I can only imagine for Peggy O'Keefe to

943
00:49:18,239 --> 00:49:21,440
Speaker 2: have to sit there for two full trials talking about

944
00:49:21,440 --> 00:49:24,120
Speaker 2: the loss of your son. Brutal. And we know she

945
00:49:24,200 --> 00:49:28,879
Speaker 2: feels not very excited by Karen Reid, certainly not her

946
00:49:28,920 --> 00:49:31,560
Speaker 2: being free. I'm curious if you guys have an opinion

947
00:49:31,600 --> 00:49:34,960
Speaker 2: about the interviews that many of the people who were

948
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:37,840
Speaker 2: at the house that night have done since the verdict.

949
00:49:38,600 --> 00:49:43,680
Speaker 2: Like an investigator and Trooper Proctor. He was the original

950
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:48,040
Speaker 2: man who was fired from his job because of misconduct

951
00:49:48,280 --> 00:49:50,399
Speaker 2: in the first trial. He did not take the stand

952
00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:53,640
Speaker 2: in the second. Brian Higgins, he was the guy that

953
00:49:53,880 --> 00:49:58,839
Speaker 2: was squaring off. Yeah, allegedly he's nowhere to be found

954
00:49:58,920 --> 00:50:00,960
Speaker 2: right now. He was on this valance camera, the one

955
00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:04,040
Speaker 2: that was kind of squaring off with John O'Keefe at

956
00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 2: the bar after a very long day of drinking. They

957
00:50:07,200 --> 00:50:10,319
Speaker 2: could have been just sort of like clowning around, or

958
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:12,719
Speaker 2: they could be be thing if you will, They had

959
00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:16,520
Speaker 2: been boozing for a long time. It could have been serious.

960
00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:19,200
Speaker 2: It could have been because of Karen Reid because there

961
00:50:19,239 --> 00:50:21,600
Speaker 2: was a bit of a love triangle there, or it

962
00:50:21,680 --> 00:50:24,600
Speaker 2: just could have been over you know, sports. It could

963
00:50:24,600 --> 00:50:26,399
Speaker 2: have been just nothing after a long while. It could

964
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:29,600
Speaker 2: have been like just men from men. Yeah, this horse

965
00:50:29,640 --> 00:50:32,520
Speaker 2: and arrests exactly. But he also was the one that

966
00:50:32,680 --> 00:50:35,920
Speaker 2: went at one thirty in the morning to the police

967
00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:42,640
Speaker 2: station that particular night to do some you know, clerical work. Random.

968
00:50:42,760 --> 00:50:45,480
Speaker 2: He's also the one that was allegedly, you know, in

969
00:50:45,520 --> 00:50:48,240
Speaker 2: the sally Port like there's just he's been the phone.

970
00:50:48,480 --> 00:50:49,480
Speaker 2: He destroyed his phone.

971
00:50:50,040 --> 00:50:53,600
Speaker 3: He destroyed his phone on a military base, and he

972
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:59,000
Speaker 3: separately took out these simcard to destroy it, including every contact,

973
00:50:59,480 --> 00:51:04,320
Speaker 3: photo and everything else, which no one on earth interesting.

974
00:51:04,440 --> 00:51:08,480
Speaker 3: And also that he shouldn't he should have gotten permission.

975
00:51:08,520 --> 00:51:10,960
Speaker 3: I hope these facts are correct, but I know there

976
00:51:11,040 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 3: was permissions that he was supposed to have gotten in

977
00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:15,400
Speaker 3: order to do anything with his phone.

978
00:51:17,160 --> 00:51:21,080
Speaker 2: You're atf agent the end. Now apparently he's missing. Now

979
00:51:21,120 --> 00:51:23,720
Speaker 2: the other side to that is what if he had

980
00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:27,200
Speaker 2: like sexy pictures or texts on his phone and that's

981
00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:30,080
Speaker 2: why he was destroying it and it was completely unrelated

982
00:51:30,120 --> 00:51:32,960
Speaker 2: to the case. He just didn't want those maybe photos

983
00:51:33,000 --> 00:51:36,400
Speaker 2: getting out. I'm just being devil's advocate here and maybe

984
00:51:36,680 --> 00:51:39,319
Speaker 2: all of this attention and all of this backlash is

985
00:51:39,320 --> 00:51:40,359
Speaker 2: like run him out of town.

986
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:44,040
Speaker 4: So one of the jurors came out, you guys, dur

987
00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:45,640
Speaker 4: number eleven.

988
00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:47,560
Speaker 2: I don't really want to say your name, but she

989
00:51:47,719 --> 00:51:48,200
Speaker 2: don't say it.

990
00:51:48,320 --> 00:51:48,520
Speaker 5: Yeah.

991
00:51:48,560 --> 00:51:50,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, she's been giving her name or whatever. But you know,

992
00:51:50,719 --> 00:51:53,520
Speaker 4: I what in light of what's been happening to her,

993
00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:55,680
Speaker 4: I'm just not comfortable with it, and I hope that's okay.

994
00:51:56,000 --> 00:52:00,080
Speaker 4: So her here's here's what's going on. Her Twitter bio

995
00:52:00,719 --> 00:52:02,560
Speaker 4: says that she is a true crime fan and a

996
00:52:02,640 --> 00:52:06,040
Speaker 4: lawyer from Brazil. Okay, So that's red flag number one

997
00:52:06,040 --> 00:52:07,960
Speaker 4: for people because they're like, how could you be a

998
00:52:07,960 --> 00:52:10,239
Speaker 4: true crime fan and not know anything about Karen Reid

999
00:52:10,280 --> 00:52:12,920
Speaker 4: and accept this jury position. So that's number one. And

1000
00:52:13,040 --> 00:52:16,360
Speaker 4: number two she follows like prominent free care and read people.

1001
00:52:16,600 --> 00:52:19,400
Speaker 4: So there's two camps. There's free Karen Reid who believe

1002
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:22,120
Speaker 4: Karen Reid is innocent and being framed, and then there's

1003
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:24,919
Speaker 4: the anti Karen Reid who believes she's one hundred percent

1004
00:52:24,920 --> 00:52:28,320
Speaker 4: guilty and basically got off Scott free and murdered somebody,

1005
00:52:28,360 --> 00:52:33,000
Speaker 4: like murdered somebody. So and these sides hate each other,

1006
00:52:33,080 --> 00:52:35,960
Speaker 4: like the there's no civil discourse.

1007
00:52:35,960 --> 00:52:41,520
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, it's very yeah, okay.

1008
00:52:41,560 --> 00:52:44,200
Speaker 4: So anyway, so she follows some free care and read people,

1009
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:46,560
Speaker 4: so that's another red flag for people. They're like, oh

1010
00:52:46,560 --> 00:52:49,080
Speaker 4: my god, I can't believe you're following turtle Boy, Like,

1011
00:52:49,120 --> 00:52:51,520
Speaker 4: how could you be following turtle board and be on

1012
00:52:51,560 --> 00:52:56,800
Speaker 4: the jury? Well, dummy, she followed them after getting released

1013
00:52:56,840 --> 00:52:59,280
Speaker 4: from the jury. It's not like she's following them before.

1014
00:52:59,520 --> 00:52:59,920
Speaker 2: Anyway.

1015
00:53:00,200 --> 00:53:02,760
Speaker 4: She was a lawyer in Brazil because she's from Brazil

1016
00:53:03,320 --> 00:53:05,359
Speaker 4: and who now lives in Boston and used to work

1017
00:53:05,360 --> 00:53:07,239
Speaker 4: at Target. People are like, how could you be a

1018
00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:10,920
Speaker 4: lawyer and work at Target? That's another thing. And in

1019
00:53:10,960 --> 00:53:15,319
Speaker 4: an interview with the Jess Machado Show, and I think

1020
00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:19,920
Speaker 4: I read this a couple of days ago, yeah, she said.

1021
00:53:20,160 --> 00:53:22,960
Speaker 4: Jess asked her what witnesses do you trust the most

1022
00:53:23,080 --> 00:53:25,759
Speaker 4: or did you trust the most? And she responded and

1023
00:53:25,800 --> 00:53:30,920
Speaker 4: she said, forensic scientists from the Massachusetts Police State Lab,

1024
00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:36,840
Speaker 4: like Maureen Hartlett and test Chart. Well that's a problem.

1025
00:53:37,280 --> 00:53:40,360
Speaker 4: And why it's a problem because test Chart did not

1026
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:44,880
Speaker 4: testify in trial to she only just a trial, So

1027
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:45,400
Speaker 4: that is big.

1028
00:53:47,120 --> 00:53:48,080
Speaker 2: How would she? Yeah?

1029
00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:53,040
Speaker 4: Right, So people are freaking out. Free Karen Reid, basically,

1030
00:53:53,040 --> 00:53:56,000
Speaker 4: that's what they call the movement to Free Current. Free

1031
00:53:56,040 --> 00:54:01,600
Speaker 4: Karen Reid infiltrated the jury. There's been jury because of this,

1032
00:54:01,920 --> 00:54:06,400
Speaker 4: She turned everybody. Everything needs to be investigated, The verdict

1033
00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:09,600
Speaker 4: needs to be overturned. This is corruption at its finest.

1034
00:54:09,800 --> 00:54:14,280
Speaker 4: You know, a cop murderer is getting off. Well, that's

1035
00:54:14,480 --> 00:54:18,600
Speaker 4: not what happened in any way. So Jess made a

1036
00:54:18,640 --> 00:54:21,640
Speaker 4: Twitter post and she was like, listen, I actually cleared

1037
00:54:21,640 --> 00:54:26,040
Speaker 4: this up. What if you put the juror. When she

1038
00:54:26,160 --> 00:54:28,839
Speaker 4: was answering the question, she couldn't remember. You don't get

1039
00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:32,239
Speaker 4: to take your notebooks home, Okay when you're on jury, dudo,

1040
00:54:32,239 --> 00:54:34,959
Speaker 4: you take notes? Yeah, you can't take your They become

1041
00:54:34,960 --> 00:54:36,960
Speaker 4: a property of the core. Yeah, so that they can

1042
00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:38,360
Speaker 4: review notes and whatnot.

1043
00:54:38,440 --> 00:54:39,000
Speaker 2: Jury notes.

1044
00:54:39,400 --> 00:54:42,120
Speaker 4: Well, she couldn't remember the lady's name, so she googled

1045
00:54:42,600 --> 00:54:46,120
Speaker 4: forensic expert soft voice, Karen read because that's all she

1046
00:54:46,160 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 4: could remember. And the person's picture that pop that popped

1047
00:54:50,640 --> 00:54:52,880
Speaker 4: up was test Chart. And if you put those pictures

1048
00:54:52,880 --> 00:54:57,640
Speaker 4: side by side between test Chart and Christina Hanley, who's

1049
00:54:57,680 --> 00:55:02,400
Speaker 4: who she meant, they look exactly like, oh interesting, they

1050
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:06,720
Speaker 4: look exactly like. So last night, Duror A number eleven

1051
00:55:06,960 --> 00:55:11,080
Speaker 4: went on Turtleboy's show and was telling, you know, like,

1052
00:55:11,239 --> 00:55:13,799
Speaker 4: you know, I just didn't the evidence wasn't there. She

1053
00:55:13,880 --> 00:55:17,680
Speaker 4: was explaining why they voted not guilty. They really believed

1054
00:55:17,880 --> 00:55:23,319
Speaker 4: the defense expert witnesses over the prosecution witnesses. Fair, that's fair, right,

1055
00:55:23,600 --> 00:55:26,040
Speaker 4: She was explaining all this, and she also explained that

1056
00:55:26,080 --> 00:55:28,680
Speaker 4: she's kind of having fun with these people because they're

1057
00:55:29,280 --> 00:55:33,759
Speaker 4: so crazy about the verdict and so upset that she's

1058
00:55:33,800 --> 00:55:37,640
Speaker 4: just kind of trolling back right right, Well, she's now

1059
00:55:37,960 --> 00:55:41,759
Speaker 4: getting like threats on her children's lives, like I hope,

1060
00:55:41,880 --> 00:55:44,080
Speaker 4: I hope your kids don't turn up dead then we

1061
00:55:44,080 --> 00:55:47,239
Speaker 4: can laugh at you. Like it's really really getting out

1062
00:55:47,239 --> 00:55:49,880
Speaker 4: of control, and you know, we can't be doing this

1063
00:55:50,000 --> 00:55:52,560
Speaker 4: kind of thing to jurors, Like we just can't. The

1064
00:55:53,719 --> 00:55:56,560
Speaker 4: idea of our system is so it's such on a

1065
00:55:56,600 --> 00:56:00,640
Speaker 4: pedestal right, we have to have faith in our in

1066
00:56:00,680 --> 00:56:02,839
Speaker 4: our system in order for it to work. And when

1067
00:56:02,880 --> 00:56:07,799
Speaker 4: we start harassing jury members, I think we've lost the plot.

1068
00:56:07,760 --> 00:56:10,279
Speaker 2: We have and we've lost our way. And that's such

1069
00:56:10,280 --> 00:56:13,000
Speaker 2: an interesting point. I mean, never before has it become

1070
00:56:13,120 --> 00:56:15,399
Speaker 2: either more dangerous to be your juror and a high

1071
00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:18,600
Speaker 2: profile case as we're seeing in the Ditty case, and

1072
00:56:18,680 --> 00:56:21,640
Speaker 2: as well as big business and many people just not

1073
00:56:22,120 --> 00:56:24,799
Speaker 2: say any jurors because you get to get a book

1074
00:56:24,840 --> 00:56:27,600
Speaker 2: deal or I'll do all this press right after. And

1075
00:56:27,640 --> 00:56:30,240
Speaker 2: maybe that should be part of the process. You shouldn't

1076
00:56:30,280 --> 00:56:32,440
Speaker 2: be able to do that. Maybe this is something that

1077
00:56:32,680 --> 00:56:35,439
Speaker 2: you should not do or put your face out there.

1078
00:56:35,440 --> 00:56:37,440
Speaker 2: But I guess in many ways it already was. In

1079
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:39,520
Speaker 2: Turtle Boy, in case you don't know who that is,

1080
00:56:40,040 --> 00:56:44,479
Speaker 2: Turtle Boy is a blogger and a blogger and an

1081
00:56:44,480 --> 00:56:49,480
Speaker 2: Instagram you know sensation, also a journalist, and he's kind

1082
00:56:49,520 --> 00:56:52,759
Speaker 2: of the person who was credited for really pounding the

1083
00:56:52,800 --> 00:56:56,200
Speaker 2: pavement on this case back in the day and frankly

1084
00:56:56,239 --> 00:56:59,280
Speaker 2: cracking it open. So he has a huge support group

1085
00:56:59,360 --> 00:57:02,000
Speaker 2: that follows him and they all are crazy for him.

1086
00:57:02,040 --> 00:57:05,120
Speaker 2: And you'll remember outside the courtroom so many were showing

1087
00:57:05,200 --> 00:57:09,040
Speaker 2: up in pink to support Karen Reid and chanting for her,

1088
00:57:09,200 --> 00:57:12,080
Speaker 2: which also could influence the jury. If you hear them

1089
00:57:12,200 --> 00:57:15,480
Speaker 2: chanting outside, they're supposed to be in a vacuum, not

1090
00:57:15,560 --> 00:57:19,760
Speaker 2: taking into consideration public outcry, and you know, enough is enough?

1091
00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:22,160
Speaker 2: Is that too much? Scary? It is?

1092
00:57:22,200 --> 00:57:24,640
Speaker 4: And I mean I would think that they would influence

1093
00:57:24,640 --> 00:57:28,800
Speaker 4: the jury, But the jury is not supposed to worry

1094
00:57:28,920 --> 00:57:31,600
Speaker 4: about the consequences of their verdict.

1095
00:57:32,120 --> 00:57:33,959
Speaker 2: So unless the kids lives.

1096
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:36,760
Speaker 4: Well, that didn't happen n till just now. You know,

1097
00:57:36,840 --> 00:57:39,320
Speaker 4: that's very recent. I mean, while they're in the courtroom,

1098
00:57:39,400 --> 00:57:41,800
Speaker 4: nothing was happening to her at all. You know, all

1099
00:57:41,880 --> 00:57:43,800
Speaker 4: she knew was that people were out there in pink

1100
00:57:44,200 --> 00:57:46,520
Speaker 4: cheering for Karen Reid. But when you're on a jury,

1101
00:57:46,520 --> 00:57:49,600
Speaker 4: you're instructed by the judge do not worry about the

1102
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:53,080
Speaker 4: consequences of your verdict. You cannot consider the consequences of

1103
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:54,360
Speaker 4: your verdict. And I think I.

1104
00:57:54,280 --> 00:57:56,479
Speaker 2: Think they did that. I think they did their job

1105
00:57:56,680 --> 00:57:59,120
Speaker 2: and we have to respect that. Nothing.

1106
00:57:59,240 --> 00:58:02,200
Speaker 4: Listen, the prosecution is not going to get a mulligan.

1107
00:58:02,640 --> 00:58:05,960
Speaker 4: You can't redo this. There's no redoing this trial. There's

1108
00:58:05,960 --> 00:58:09,240
Speaker 4: a double Jeopardy in play. She's not going to be retried.

1109
00:58:09,600 --> 00:58:12,680
Speaker 4: It's never going to happen. We need to move on

1110
00:58:13,160 --> 00:58:15,760
Speaker 4: the anti Karen read. People need to move on, and

1111
00:58:16,120 --> 00:58:18,760
Speaker 4: I've said it. I'll probably get some slack, but you've

1112
00:58:18,840 --> 00:58:19,600
Speaker 4: got to let it go.

1113
00:58:19,960 --> 00:58:24,200
Speaker 2: To advice per topic, What do you think, Courtney about

1114
00:58:24,240 --> 00:58:27,280
Speaker 2: some of the people that were in the house that night,

1115
00:58:27,440 --> 00:58:30,160
Speaker 2: or some of the friends of victim John O'Keeffe that

1116
00:58:30,280 --> 00:58:33,600
Speaker 2: have taken the stand and then since then have done

1117
00:58:33,720 --> 00:58:37,480
Speaker 2: interviews on either twenty twenty or Dateline, like there's been

1118
00:58:37,520 --> 00:58:40,080
Speaker 2: a lot of there's been a lot of interviews.

1119
00:58:40,320 --> 00:58:43,520
Speaker 3: There has been a lot of interviews. As an understatement,

1120
00:58:43,640 --> 00:58:46,680
Speaker 3: I can't wait to dig into all of them. But

1121
00:58:47,160 --> 00:58:50,040
Speaker 3: in the meantime, so hold that thought one second. Put

1122
00:58:50,040 --> 00:58:53,000
Speaker 3: on your happy pants, because we're going to pause Karen

1123
00:58:53,040 --> 00:58:55,960
Speaker 3: for a hot moment to go to Cameron, who is

1124
00:58:56,040 --> 00:58:58,960
Speaker 3: on the line with a question about Diddy. Cameron, what

1125
00:58:59,080 --> 00:58:59,680
Speaker 3: is your question?

1126
00:59:00,440 --> 00:59:00,560
Speaker 2: Hi?

1127
00:59:00,640 --> 00:59:04,280
Speaker 6: There, I've been thinking about the defensive decision not to

1128
00:59:04,280 --> 00:59:07,520
Speaker 6: put anyone on the stand. This is a pretty high

1129
00:59:07,520 --> 00:59:10,800
Speaker 6: profile case. Doesn't that risk making did he look guilty

1130
00:59:10,840 --> 00:59:12,480
Speaker 6: in the court of public opinion? Even if it is

1131
00:59:12,520 --> 00:59:14,400
Speaker 6: a smart legal move. What do you think that says

1132
00:59:14,440 --> 00:59:17,640
Speaker 6: about what the defense doesn't want the jury or the

1133
00:59:17,680 --> 00:59:18,840
Speaker 6: public to hear.

1134
00:59:19,920 --> 00:59:23,400
Speaker 2: I great question, Cameron, you're I think you're spot on.

1135
00:59:23,520 --> 00:59:26,360
Speaker 2: I think it is optically a bad look.

1136
00:59:26,400 --> 00:59:30,720
Speaker 4: Right, because he's not getting any play in the press

1137
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:32,960
Speaker 4: with what his defense is, right Like, I'm not going

1138
00:59:33,000 --> 00:59:35,760
Speaker 4: to be able to log in to TMZ tomorrow or

1139
00:59:35,760 --> 00:59:38,880
Speaker 4: something and read about what his defense is, and as

1140
00:59:39,040 --> 00:59:41,920
Speaker 4: a member of the public, I think that's optically going

1141
00:59:42,000 --> 00:59:42,480
Speaker 4: to look bad.

1142
00:59:42,560 --> 00:59:45,160
Speaker 2: What do you think, Steph. I think it's actually a

1143
00:59:45,200 --> 00:59:49,040
Speaker 2: sign of complete strength I think is what they're going for.

1144
00:59:49,560 --> 00:59:53,680
Speaker 2: I mean, look, this is it's kind of shocking to me, Cameron.

1145
00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:56,640
Speaker 2: I can't believe that he would not want to really

1146
00:59:56,720 --> 00:59:59,240
Speaker 2: leave on a high note and make sure that everybody

1147
00:59:59,360 --> 01:00:02,200
Speaker 2: knew his side of the story and that this was

1148
01:00:02,240 --> 01:00:05,680
Speaker 2: all just super super you know, consensual. I should say

1149
01:00:05,960 --> 01:00:09,080
Speaker 2: that's his Really his defense so far is that. Look,

1150
01:00:09,120 --> 01:00:12,120
Speaker 2: I'm not a great guy. Sure you know I've been

1151
01:00:12,160 --> 01:00:15,160
Speaker 2: a little abusive. I apologized for it. Okay, fine, he

1152
01:00:15,240 --> 01:00:17,440
Speaker 2: caught me at a bad moment. Sometimes I beat up

1153
01:00:17,480 --> 01:00:22,600
Speaker 2: my girlfriends and okay fine, sometimes I'm horrible to my staff, okay, fine,

1154
01:00:23,080 --> 01:00:28,080
Speaker 2: but does that mean it's racketeering? We're so confused ourselves.

1155
01:00:28,360 --> 01:00:30,280
Speaker 2: I'm not sure, Cameron. Do you think that they're going

1156
01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:31,400
Speaker 2: to walk? Oh?

1157
01:00:31,440 --> 01:00:32,120
Speaker 6: Absolutely not.

1158
01:00:33,080 --> 01:00:36,440
Speaker 2: Okay, so go away forever.

1159
01:00:37,000 --> 01:00:39,800
Speaker 6: I can't see how that doesn't happen.

1160
01:00:40,280 --> 01:00:42,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm kind of with you, Cameron. But if I

1161
01:00:42,520 --> 01:00:44,280
Speaker 2: think I'm going to go to prison for life, don't

1162
01:00:44,280 --> 01:00:46,040
Speaker 2: you think I would be fighting a little bit hard.

1163
01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:48,120
Speaker 2: I would be fighting for him. I would be screaming

1164
01:00:48,280 --> 01:00:52,160
Speaker 2: I didn't do anything. But you, guys, I think this.

1165
01:00:52,680 --> 01:00:55,400
Speaker 3: You know it is a legal strategy. I it is

1166
01:00:55,480 --> 01:00:58,520
Speaker 3: to it's and I'm going to in this moment trust

1167
01:00:58,600 --> 01:01:00,880
Speaker 3: that it is the best because think about it. Every

1168
01:01:00,920 --> 01:01:04,240
Speaker 3: single person they put up for the defense, they will

1169
01:01:04,360 --> 01:01:08,680
Speaker 3: be cross examined. And it appears from everything that the

1170
01:01:08,960 --> 01:01:13,160
Speaker 3: prosecution has put up so far that in every aspect

1171
01:01:13,760 --> 01:01:19,800
Speaker 3: personal professional service level, did he has had violent I

1172
01:01:19,840 --> 01:01:23,919
Speaker 3: mean violent encounters or people have more stylists?

1173
01:01:23,920 --> 01:01:27,800
Speaker 4: And it looks bad because I'm if that's your defense

1174
01:01:27,840 --> 01:01:30,560
Speaker 4: for not putting up a defense, that's that's terrible.

1175
01:01:31,040 --> 01:01:33,680
Speaker 2: No, I think of the defense charges. He's not looking

1176
01:01:33,720 --> 01:01:38,240
Speaker 2: at domestic violence charges. He's looking at racketeering charges, right,

1177
01:01:38,480 --> 01:01:41,320
Speaker 2: which is craziness in can you don't know where the

1178
01:01:41,640 --> 01:01:44,160
Speaker 2: many celebrities are as well? I'm so curious.

1179
01:01:44,520 --> 01:01:47,280
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, I wonder if that isn't Also part of

1180
01:01:47,320 --> 01:01:51,320
Speaker 6: the don't put him on stand rationale too is who

1181
01:01:51,320 --> 01:01:54,040
Speaker 6: are they afraid to be dragging into the conversation and

1182
01:01:54,080 --> 01:01:56,080
Speaker 6: what sort of levers did they have? But that might

1183
01:01:56,080 --> 01:01:57,960
Speaker 6: be going too far down there.

1184
01:01:59,160 --> 01:02:02,160
Speaker 2: You're singing myself, Stephanie with you.

1185
01:02:02,360 --> 01:02:03,280
Speaker 3: She's so on the road.

1186
01:02:03,520 --> 01:02:07,080
Speaker 2: I could not agree with you more right now? Yeah,

1187
01:02:08,480 --> 01:02:10,760
Speaker 2: you me and a pack of smokes and we're gonna

1188
01:02:11,360 --> 01:02:13,040
Speaker 2: free thank you, Cameron.

1189
01:02:13,360 --> 01:02:16,360
Speaker 3: All right, listen, we're going to continue with whatever this

1190
01:02:16,480 --> 01:02:19,439
Speaker 3: is in this moment. We're also be talking more Karen Reid,

1191
01:02:19,480 --> 01:02:22,120
Speaker 3: and then we have a really important case to highlight

1192
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:27,280
Speaker 3: in the LGBTQ community that needs attention. Keep it here

1193
01:02:27,720 --> 01:02:30,200
Speaker 3: true crime tonight. We're talking true crime all the time.

1194
01:02:41,080 --> 01:02:43,000
Speaker 2: So back to Karen Reid. We're just going to do

1195
01:02:43,280 --> 01:02:45,720
Speaker 2: a little bit more because we just can't get enough.

1196
01:02:45,920 --> 01:02:47,560
Speaker 2: But also it's Pride week, so we want to make

1197
01:02:47,600 --> 01:02:49,840
Speaker 2: sure that Pride month, I should say, but we're covering

1198
01:02:49,880 --> 01:02:52,600
Speaker 2: different cases all week, so we definitely want to make

1199
01:02:52,640 --> 01:02:56,000
Speaker 2: sure we leave proper time to unpack that correctly. But

1200
01:02:56,080 --> 01:02:58,560
Speaker 2: before we do that, back to Karen Reid. If you're

1201
01:02:58,600 --> 01:03:02,280
Speaker 2: just joining us, welcome. Karen Reid recently has been found

1202
01:03:02,480 --> 01:03:06,160
Speaker 2: not guilty of two of the three charges that she

1203
01:03:06,320 --> 01:03:09,680
Speaker 2: was facing in her retrial. This was a very big verdict.

1204
01:03:10,160 --> 01:03:13,520
Speaker 2: Has everybody very divided, and you know, we have a

1205
01:03:13,560 --> 01:03:15,640
Speaker 2: talkback right now that we can go to Hi.

1206
01:03:15,680 --> 01:03:18,520
Speaker 7: It's Sentia from Canada calling in regards to the Karen

1207
01:03:18,560 --> 01:03:21,800
Speaker 7: Reid guilty verdict on the DUI. I'm just wondering why

1208
01:03:21,840 --> 01:03:24,560
Speaker 7: none of the other individuals that were at that house

1209
01:03:24,600 --> 01:03:27,840
Speaker 7: party were charged with DUIs given that they knew that

1210
01:03:27,960 --> 01:03:31,120
Speaker 7: the individuals had been drinking and they drove to Fairview

1211
01:03:31,200 --> 01:03:34,760
Speaker 7: Road after leaving the bar. And my second question is

1212
01:03:34,920 --> 01:03:37,800
Speaker 7: did any of the other officers get brought up on

1213
01:03:37,880 --> 01:03:41,560
Speaker 7: disciplinary charges with the police services that they were assigned?

1214
01:03:41,600 --> 01:03:44,760
Speaker 2: Thanks, what a great great she's in her heads right now.

1215
01:03:44,840 --> 01:03:48,080
Speaker 2: Great question, because that's a fair one. If Karen Reid,

1216
01:03:48,200 --> 01:03:52,520
Speaker 2: who was accused of running over her then boyfriend victim

1217
01:03:52,640 --> 01:03:55,360
Speaker 2: John O'Keefe, she had been drinking, it seems like they

1218
01:03:55,400 --> 01:03:58,320
Speaker 2: all had been drinking by everybody's version of the story.

1219
01:03:58,400 --> 01:04:01,960
Speaker 2: That's been a boozy bad day turned into a boozy

1220
01:04:02,040 --> 01:04:05,000
Speaker 2: bad night and then a deadly one if she was

1221
01:04:05,040 --> 01:04:09,160
Speaker 2: found not guilty of hitting him and not guilty of

1222
01:04:09,280 --> 01:04:13,000
Speaker 2: hitting him and leaving the scene. She was found not

1223
01:04:13,040 --> 01:04:15,240
Speaker 2: guilty on that as well. Why are the rest of

1224
01:04:15,280 --> 01:04:18,880
Speaker 2: them not being brought up on drinking charges while you

1225
01:04:18,920 --> 01:04:21,560
Speaker 2: know driving. That's a fair question. I don't know. It

1226
01:04:21,600 --> 01:04:23,400
Speaker 2: is a fair It's a very fair question.

1227
01:04:23,560 --> 01:04:26,240
Speaker 4: And I think some of the other police officers were

1228
01:04:26,680 --> 01:04:29,600
Speaker 4: brought up on some disciplinary charges didn't But it was

1229
01:04:29,640 --> 01:04:33,360
Speaker 4: like stupid stuff right now, well, vacation days or something.

1230
01:04:34,240 --> 01:04:37,360
Speaker 3: Okay, So yes, Proctor got fired and it was it

1231
01:04:37,440 --> 01:04:40,479
Speaker 3: was vacation days, but there were certain people who were

1232
01:04:40,720 --> 01:04:43,520
Speaker 3: it's punishment and it's taking away. I mean, that's taking

1233
01:04:43,920 --> 01:04:46,520
Speaker 3: you can call it money out of someone's pocket. One

1234
01:04:46,520 --> 01:04:49,760
Speaker 3: of the sergeants he had to forfeit five days of

1235
01:04:49,840 --> 01:04:53,360
Speaker 3: vacation and that was because he failed to quote supervise

1236
01:04:53,440 --> 01:04:58,040
Speaker 3: and or council a subordinate who sent an inappropriate message

1237
01:04:58,080 --> 01:05:02,120
Speaker 3: regarding an ongoing investigation. And hmm, wondering if that could

1238
01:05:02,160 --> 01:05:06,280
Speaker 3: be regarding Michael Proctor, who sent we do know to

1239
01:05:06,520 --> 01:05:10,920
Speaker 3: his bosses going through Karen Reid's phone right now looking

1240
01:05:11,000 --> 01:05:15,520
Speaker 3: for nudes and his superiors thumbed it up.

1241
01:05:15,880 --> 01:05:20,000
Speaker 4: I think that goes to like a level of gravitiness,

1242
01:05:20,040 --> 01:05:22,840
Speaker 4: that that that he's used to saying to his bosses

1243
01:05:22,920 --> 01:05:25,959
Speaker 4: like that they're okay with you know, I would never

1244
01:05:26,080 --> 01:05:28,040
Speaker 4: say something like that to my boss because I know

1245
01:05:28,600 --> 01:05:31,160
Speaker 4: that they would not accept that. They would they would

1246
01:05:31,200 --> 01:05:34,240
Speaker 4: discipline me for that. So he is comfortable sending that

1247
01:05:34,280 --> 01:05:36,960
Speaker 4: to his boss. What other cases do they do this on?

1248
01:05:37,040 --> 01:05:39,920
Speaker 3: Well, yes, it's great. And that was the same for

1249
01:05:39,960 --> 01:05:43,640
Speaker 3: Lieutenant Brian Tully. He was another of Michael Proctor's supervisors.

1250
01:05:43,640 --> 01:05:46,440
Speaker 3: He lost six days of his time and it was

1251
01:05:46,520 --> 01:05:50,480
Speaker 3: for the same thing, failing, you know, to supervise or

1252
01:05:50,520 --> 01:05:55,760
Speaker 3: to admonish people about inappropriate text messages, which is putting

1253
01:05:55,800 --> 01:06:00,960
Speaker 3: it mildly. But one more is Kevin Albert and that

1254
01:06:01,080 --> 01:06:05,160
Speaker 3: Albert House lost three days of pay. I'd play a

1255
01:06:05,200 --> 01:06:08,400
Speaker 3: guessing game, but we're short on time. It's because he

1256
01:06:08,480 --> 01:06:09,680
Speaker 3: was found drinking on the job.

1257
01:06:10,000 --> 01:06:13,800
Speaker 2: I didn't weigh that previously or current because of this case.

1258
01:06:14,160 --> 01:06:17,360
Speaker 3: This was I don't where was this?

1259
01:06:17,400 --> 01:06:21,680
Speaker 2: I have the boozy bunch. This bunch was boozy, you know,

1260
01:06:21,760 --> 01:06:25,000
Speaker 2: and look there's no judgment on that. It's you know,

1261
01:06:24,560 --> 01:06:27,880
Speaker 2: I'm judging it, and it can't be boozy behind the

1262
01:06:27,920 --> 01:06:31,760
Speaker 2: wheel and boozy while being the leader investigator also not great.

1263
01:06:32,120 --> 01:06:34,840
Speaker 2: How about being the investigator in a case where you

1264
01:06:35,000 --> 01:06:37,439
Speaker 2: really know the victim in fact, it's a beloved, dear

1265
01:06:37,480 --> 01:06:40,040
Speaker 2: friend and on top and by the way, also a

1266
01:06:40,080 --> 01:06:43,960
Speaker 2: fellow man in blue. And then additionally you know the accused.

1267
01:06:44,480 --> 01:06:49,040
Speaker 2: How do you possibly get to text terrible things? Oh?

1268
01:06:49,120 --> 01:06:51,840
Speaker 3: Absolutely? And a little bit more clarity and what I

1269
01:06:51,920 --> 01:06:56,880
Speaker 3: brought up. So, Kevin Albert is the brother of Brian

1270
01:06:56,960 --> 01:07:01,080
Speaker 3: Albert where this entire thing took place, and he was

1271
01:07:01,160 --> 01:07:07,360
Speaker 3: under investigation after Proctor's testimony revealed that those two spent

1272
01:07:07,440 --> 01:07:10,760
Speaker 3: a night out drinking. I guess I actually it says

1273
01:07:11,000 --> 01:07:12,800
Speaker 3: in connection to this case. So yeah, I guess they

1274
01:07:12,800 --> 01:07:13,200
Speaker 3: were both.

1275
01:07:13,720 --> 01:07:17,120
Speaker 2: Is that the nephew because I thought the nephew Colin or.

1276
01:07:17,200 --> 01:07:19,280
Speaker 3: No, that's Colin. He's younger.

1277
01:07:20,120 --> 01:07:22,760
Speaker 2: So is he the one with the bruises on his knuckles?

1278
01:07:22,960 --> 01:07:23,440
Speaker 2: That everybody?

1279
01:07:24,600 --> 01:07:28,720
Speaker 3: Kevin Albert wasn't at his brother's house. But Kevin Albert

1280
01:07:28,800 --> 01:07:32,120
Speaker 3: is a friend of Michael Proctor. Oh okay, So Michael

1281
01:07:32,160 --> 01:07:36,120
Speaker 3: Proctor is an actual friend of this brother. He is

1282
01:07:36,160 --> 01:07:40,200
Speaker 3: not a friend of Brian Albert according to what he

1283
01:07:40,280 --> 01:07:44,280
Speaker 3: has said the homeowner. But anyway, so that's all. People

1284
01:07:44,320 --> 01:07:47,040
Speaker 3: got a couple of you know, a couple of vacation days.

1285
01:07:47,520 --> 01:07:50,280
Speaker 2: Is that technology? I mean it's I get it money

1286
01:07:50,320 --> 01:07:54,200
Speaker 2: out of the pocket. Yeah, really it seems small comparatively speaking.

1287
01:07:54,280 --> 01:07:57,800
Speaker 3: Oh and ps, there was you know, was why wasn't

1288
01:07:57,840 --> 01:08:00,880
Speaker 3: anyone else charged? I love this is my favorite talk back,

1289
01:08:01,000 --> 01:08:03,680
Speaker 3: not that I like to play favorites, but yeah, no,

1290
01:08:03,720 --> 01:08:07,360
Speaker 3: there were no other d UIs given out because nobody

1291
01:08:07,640 --> 01:08:12,040
Speaker 3: was investigated, much less looked at, not even talk to

1292
01:08:12,200 --> 01:08:13,800
Speaker 3: or asked to come out of the house where a

1293
01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:17,679
Speaker 3: police officer lay dead at the end of their driveway.

1294
01:08:17,920 --> 01:08:21,880
Speaker 2: So what you guys thought of their interviews? Oh? Shoot,

1295
01:08:22,280 --> 01:08:24,479
Speaker 2: I mean that's I think we might have to do

1296
01:08:24,520 --> 01:08:27,000
Speaker 2: that tomorrow. We might have to know that. I can

1297
01:08:27,040 --> 01:08:27,679
Speaker 2: wait that long.

1298
01:08:27,920 --> 01:08:30,880
Speaker 3: It's fine, Okay, I got two words or it's a

1299
01:08:30,960 --> 01:08:34,360
Speaker 3: Latin hyphen it it's a mea culpa for Michael Proctor.

1300
01:08:34,400 --> 01:08:37,639
Speaker 3: So we'll leave it there and tomorrow hitting the ground running.

1301
01:08:38,040 --> 01:08:39,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, we might have to. We might have to dig

1302
01:08:39,439 --> 01:08:41,720
Speaker 2: into it tomorrow. So I'm gonna. I'm going to get

1303
01:08:41,760 --> 01:08:44,599
Speaker 2: into this pride case. It's pride months.

1304
01:08:44,960 --> 01:08:50,160
Speaker 4: I am a member of the Alphabet mafia, as they say,

1305
01:08:50,760 --> 01:08:55,280
Speaker 4: never heard that saying having either. Oh so this is

1306
01:08:55,280 --> 01:08:59,360
Speaker 4: actually really sad. This is a really sad case. Twenty

1307
01:09:00,080 --> 01:09:02,640
Speaker 4: eight year old professional dancer and he's this guy's a

1308
01:09:02,640 --> 01:09:06,680
Speaker 4: professional dancer and choreographer. His name is O'shay Sibley and

1309
01:09:06,760 --> 01:09:11,320
Speaker 4: he was stabbed and killed while voguing to Beyonce in

1310
01:09:11,360 --> 01:09:13,920
Speaker 4: New York City on July twenty ninth of twenty and

1311
01:09:13,960 --> 01:09:17,120
Speaker 4: twenty three. So they him and some friends had gone

1312
01:09:17,160 --> 01:09:19,599
Speaker 4: out and you know, they were they were getting into

1313
01:09:19,640 --> 01:09:23,799
Speaker 4: a car, and he was just out waiting to get

1314
01:09:23,880 --> 01:09:25,799
Speaker 4: into the cars. You know, his friends are all piling

1315
01:09:25,840 --> 01:09:28,160
Speaker 4: in and he's just you know, having fun voguing, and

1316
01:09:28,320 --> 01:09:32,280
Speaker 4: a group of men approached him and started demanding that

1317
01:09:32,400 --> 01:09:35,920
Speaker 4: he stopped dancing and using like derogatory names and slurs,

1318
01:09:36,240 --> 01:09:40,000
Speaker 4: you know, homophobic slurs and anti black slurs.

1319
01:09:40,040 --> 01:09:41,000
Speaker 2: He was a black man.

1320
01:09:41,200 --> 01:09:45,200
Speaker 4: And as then confrontation escalated, one of them fatally stabbed

1321
01:09:45,280 --> 01:09:49,160
Speaker 4: him Siby in the rib cage. A seventeen year old,

1322
01:09:50,040 --> 01:09:53,360
Speaker 4: a seventeen year old high school student. What Yeah, it's

1323
01:09:53,360 --> 01:09:55,120
Speaker 4: really it's really sad. And you know, I don't know

1324
01:09:55,160 --> 01:09:58,000
Speaker 4: if you guys know anything about like voguing, but it's

1325
01:09:58,040 --> 01:10:01,400
Speaker 4: really it's really kind of important in especially with gay men.

1326
01:10:01,800 --> 01:10:05,680
Speaker 4: It's kind of you know the ballroom, yeah, you know

1327
01:10:05,720 --> 01:10:07,000
Speaker 4: exactly and whatnot.

1328
01:10:07,040 --> 01:10:11,080
Speaker 2: You haven't seen that. It's incredible, right, and like, yeah,

1329
01:10:11,120 --> 01:10:11,799
Speaker 2: it's incredible.

1330
01:10:11,920 --> 01:10:15,519
Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's this guy's a professional dancer, and he's like,

1331
01:10:15,680 --> 01:10:17,080
Speaker 4: it's an important to the culture.

1332
01:10:17,400 --> 01:10:18,519
Speaker 2: I mean, let's let's be real.

1333
01:10:18,600 --> 01:10:22,000
Speaker 4: This is like, uh, black men and then you know

1334
01:10:22,040 --> 01:10:25,360
Speaker 4: black women too, studs and whatnot. In the lesbian side

1335
01:10:25,360 --> 01:10:28,400
Speaker 4: of things, you know, it's it's important to their culture.

1336
01:10:28,479 --> 01:10:32,120
Speaker 4: It's it's it's significant to them. And so this was

1337
01:10:32,200 --> 01:10:35,559
Speaker 4: kind of like a double hate crime, right. So he's

1338
01:10:35,560 --> 01:10:37,400
Speaker 4: a seventeen year old high school student. He has been

1339
01:10:37,479 --> 01:10:41,080
Speaker 4: charged with second degree murder as a hate crime and

1340
01:10:41,120 --> 01:10:43,960
Speaker 4: criminal possession of a weapon obviously second degree because it

1341
01:10:44,000 --> 01:10:48,400
Speaker 4: probably wasn't premeditated in any fashion. He just confronted him,

1342
01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:50,720
Speaker 4: you know, kind of out of the blue. It's just

1343
01:10:50,760 --> 01:10:54,240
Speaker 4: really really sad. He you know, this guy, they have

1344
01:10:54,360 --> 01:10:56,720
Speaker 4: like parades now to honor him, and you know his

1345
01:10:56,960 --> 01:10:59,840
Speaker 4: you know, people in his community are voguing in these

1346
01:11:00,080 --> 01:11:01,840
Speaker 4: raids and it's a site to behold, and it's a

1347
01:11:01,880 --> 01:11:04,559
Speaker 4: really really nice way to honor him, you know, his

1348
01:11:04,720 --> 01:11:07,599
Speaker 4: After his deaths, hundreds of people gathered in his hometown

1349
01:11:07,600 --> 01:11:11,200
Speaker 4: of Philadelphia. He's from Philadelphia to Philadelphia Freedo, I love

1350
01:11:11,240 --> 01:11:15,839
Speaker 4: that song. City for his funeral, and his former dance company,

1351
01:11:16,400 --> 01:11:19,360
Speaker 4: fill In Dance Co I think is the name of it,

1352
01:11:19,920 --> 01:11:22,719
Speaker 4: launched a memorial fund in his name, So if you're interested,

1353
01:11:22,800 --> 01:11:25,960
Speaker 4: please search that and maybe donate to his fund. Costs

1354
01:11:26,000 --> 01:11:30,879
Speaker 4: across the country, ballroom communities, celebrities, and mourners paid tribute

1355
01:11:30,920 --> 01:11:36,960
Speaker 4: through voguing, public memorials and heartfelt messages. Beyonce even like

1356
01:11:37,160 --> 01:11:40,839
Speaker 4: because he was voging to Beyonce, Beyonce updated her website

1357
01:11:40,880 --> 01:11:43,840
Speaker 4: to say rest in power. Oh Shay Siby, can you

1358
01:11:44,080 --> 01:11:47,440
Speaker 4: imagine Beyonce extraordinary?

1359
01:11:47,600 --> 01:11:50,360
Speaker 2: I think that changes anything? No, it doesn't, of course.

1360
01:11:50,960 --> 01:11:56,000
Speaker 3: I mean speaking of things that need to change. LGBTQ people,

1361
01:11:56,120 --> 01:12:01,080
Speaker 3: they are five times more likely than non GBTQ people

1362
01:12:01,120 --> 01:12:03,640
Speaker 3: to be victims of violent crimes. Let that sink in

1363
01:12:03,800 --> 01:12:09,559
Speaker 3: five times wow. And in fact, black members of the

1364
01:12:09,600 --> 01:12:14,840
Speaker 3: gay community have the highest rates of victimization overall, and

1365
01:12:14,880 --> 01:12:19,280
Speaker 3: that's followed by Hispanic and white. But it's all too much,

1366
01:12:19,320 --> 01:12:22,760
Speaker 3: it's all too many, it's all too senseless.

1367
01:12:23,360 --> 01:12:25,559
Speaker 2: And that's what we have to all be talking about it. Right,

1368
01:12:25,640 --> 01:12:27,880
Speaker 2: So again, if there are cases like this that have

1369
01:12:27,920 --> 01:12:32,760
Speaker 2: been either underreported about or underinvestigated, because sometimes it's just

1370
01:12:32,800 --> 01:12:36,240
Speaker 2: not making the main headline, please like send us these

1371
01:12:36,320 --> 01:12:39,160
Speaker 2: cases in these stories, because we definitely want to dig in,

1372
01:12:39,439 --> 01:12:42,599
Speaker 2: we want to give a platform and highlight these cases.

1373
01:12:42,680 --> 01:12:47,400
Speaker 2: And it's unimaginable. Five times that's a staggering quote.

1374
01:12:47,200 --> 01:12:49,000
Speaker 4: Right, And a lot of times too of these these

1375
01:12:49,080 --> 01:12:52,839
Speaker 4: things aren't reported, and that's like another that's like another

1376
01:12:52,960 --> 01:12:57,800
Speaker 4: way to victim my somebody. Yeah, because maybe somebody isn't out,

1377
01:12:58,520 --> 01:13:00,280
Speaker 4: you know, and they're scared to report it.

1378
01:13:00,520 --> 01:13:01,840
Speaker 2: And that's really really sad.

1379
01:13:02,280 --> 01:13:04,200
Speaker 4: But on top of it too, and it's I think

1380
01:13:04,360 --> 01:13:05,840
Speaker 4: something that a lot of people don't consider, Like if

1381
01:13:05,880 --> 01:13:08,680
Speaker 4: you're not out and you've been you know, attacked for

1382
01:13:08,800 --> 01:13:12,840
Speaker 4: being you know somewhere, you know you're hidden, right, You're

1383
01:13:12,880 --> 01:13:14,360
Speaker 4: not going to call the police because then you know,

1384
01:13:14,400 --> 01:13:16,280
Speaker 4: maybe your mom and dad are going to find out,

1385
01:13:16,439 --> 01:13:18,760
Speaker 4: or your cousin is going to know your boss. You know,

1386
01:13:18,800 --> 01:13:22,799
Speaker 4: you're you live in the closet, you know. And another

1387
01:13:22,960 --> 01:13:26,120
Speaker 4: another thing too, and not in every state is uh,

1388
01:13:26,200 --> 01:13:29,800
Speaker 4: this a protected class. So in many states it gets

1389
01:13:29,840 --> 01:13:32,920
Speaker 4: under reported and police don't really do anything because it's

1390
01:13:32,960 --> 01:13:34,400
Speaker 4: not a protected class.

1391
01:13:34,680 --> 01:13:35,639
Speaker 2: So there's a lot of.

1392
01:13:36,000 --> 01:13:40,559
Speaker 4: Discrimination that you know, people are exhibiting, especially for the

1393
01:13:40,600 --> 01:13:43,080
Speaker 4: black and brown community, and I think it's important that

1394
01:13:43,120 --> 01:13:44,840
Speaker 4: we talk about it, and I'm really really glad to

1395
01:13:44,840 --> 01:13:48,280
Speaker 4: have a platform to do so, so thank you. Another

1396
01:13:48,360 --> 01:13:51,519
Speaker 4: issue specifically for trans victims too, is that they will

1397
01:13:51,560 --> 01:13:54,520
Speaker 4: be misgendered and dead named in police reports.

1398
01:13:54,760 --> 01:13:56,800
Speaker 2: It's just horrific. I know, I said I wasn't going

1399
01:13:56,840 --> 01:14:02,640
Speaker 2: to talk about ditty anymore, but all right, I'm tying

1400
01:13:58,880 --> 01:14:06,360
Speaker 2: one guy, just one little tease, little tease. So have

1401
01:14:06,439 --> 01:14:10,519
Speaker 2: you guys heard about a'l be Sure? Yes, that is

1402
01:14:10,800 --> 01:14:15,680
Speaker 2: a'l be Sure is the eldest Diddy son. Christian I

1403
01:14:15,720 --> 01:14:21,800
Speaker 2: believe is Justin, Justin's birth father. And Albi Shore used

1404
01:14:21,840 --> 01:14:26,040
Speaker 2: to be with kim Porter Diddy's ex and mother of

1405
01:14:26,080 --> 01:14:28,560
Speaker 2: his beautiful beloved children. And then I think did he

1406
01:14:28,600 --> 01:14:31,719
Speaker 2: adopted him? But then that's actually controversial because they're like, actually,

1407
01:14:31,880 --> 01:14:34,000
Speaker 2: he didn't really adopt him. But anyway, a'l be sure

1408
01:14:34,200 --> 01:14:38,760
Speaker 2: is basically saying there is no way that Diddy did

1409
01:14:38,880 --> 01:14:44,600
Speaker 2: not have a hand in Kim Porter's passing allegedly, allegedly allegedly.

1410
01:14:44,920 --> 01:14:47,160
Speaker 2: I want to unpack that because that's pretty major. This

1411
01:14:47,240 --> 01:14:50,799
Speaker 2: is a tomorrow thing, Sorry everybody, but there's more Diddy

1412
01:14:50,840 --> 01:14:53,840
Speaker 2: on a Tuesday, I'll be sure. And then also, do

1413
01:14:53,880 --> 01:14:59,240
Speaker 2: you guys know who Jaguar right is? I don't know. Okay,

1414
01:14:59,360 --> 01:15:02,680
Speaker 2: So she has been like doing all kinds of she's

1415
01:15:02,760 --> 01:15:04,200
Speaker 2: very close to the circle. She used to be in

1416
01:15:04,240 --> 01:15:06,120
Speaker 2: the jay Z world a bit, and then now she's

1417
01:15:06,160 --> 01:15:09,000
Speaker 2: been talking about everybody under the sun and her stuff

1418
01:15:09,040 --> 01:15:12,280
Speaker 2: is pretty controversial, but it's been tracking. So I'll share

1419
01:15:12,280 --> 01:15:14,479
Speaker 2: a little bit more about that tomorrow. And I think

1420
01:15:14,479 --> 01:15:17,720
Speaker 2: it's an important conversation for two reasons. Is all of

1421
01:15:17,760 --> 01:15:21,760
Speaker 2: the media attention sucking us all in and confusing the

1422
01:15:21,760 --> 01:15:24,920
Speaker 2: big ticket issues for people like me who are impressionable,

1423
01:15:25,000 --> 01:15:28,000
Speaker 2: who are like forever done a rabbit hole? Or are

1424
01:15:28,080 --> 01:15:31,599
Speaker 2: these people who are big time whistleblowers who have been

1425
01:15:31,720 --> 01:15:35,360
Speaker 2: raising their hand about stuff that is very dangerous and

1426
01:15:35,400 --> 01:15:38,040
Speaker 2: we've all been ignoring it or just assuming it's not

1427
01:15:38,080 --> 01:15:40,679
Speaker 2: happening behind closed doors. And that's what I think about

1428
01:15:40,720 --> 01:15:44,840
Speaker 2: the Ditty case. It has ripped open this underworld that

1429
01:15:44,920 --> 01:15:47,360
Speaker 2: maybe we wouldn't have known exists. So do you think

1430
01:15:47,400 --> 01:15:50,240
Speaker 2: you're caring by the celebrity, Oh? Yes, of it all?

1431
01:15:50,360 --> 01:15:53,479
Speaker 2: Oh interesting, I'm speaking for myself, like I'm sure I

1432
01:15:53,520 --> 01:15:55,439
Speaker 2: would have been back in the day and still am,

1433
01:15:55,520 --> 01:15:57,240
Speaker 2: you know, like we talked about it to day, but

1434
01:15:57,320 --> 01:16:00,639
Speaker 2: not today. No. But you know, if you're coming from

1435
01:16:00,880 --> 01:16:04,800
Speaker 2: a small town that doesn't really have a lot of

1436
01:16:04,840 --> 01:16:07,000
Speaker 2: that stuff, I get. I'm not saying that small town

1437
01:16:07,120 --> 01:16:09,720
Speaker 2: people get sucked in easier, quite the opposite, But you know,

1438
01:16:09,760 --> 01:16:12,799
Speaker 2: you could see all that glitteras sure, not always gold,

1439
01:16:12,880 --> 01:16:15,599
Speaker 2: but I think you can get preyed upon pretty quickly,

1440
01:16:16,000 --> 01:16:18,120
Speaker 2: especially with all that fame. And by the way, in

1441
01:16:18,160 --> 01:16:21,160
Speaker 2: the Karen Reid case has been so divisive because we're

1442
01:16:21,200 --> 01:16:25,320
Speaker 2: also getting a look into this underbelly of potentially nefarious

1443
01:16:25,600 --> 01:16:28,840
Speaker 2: law enforcement action, and that again has got us all

1444
01:16:29,000 --> 01:16:31,800
Speaker 2: tripped out. So I think it's really big stuff. Again,

1445
01:16:31,880 --> 01:16:35,320
Speaker 2: it's not necessarily just about Ditty or just about Karen Reid.

1446
01:16:35,479 --> 01:16:39,920
Speaker 2: It's like this big infrastructure around those cases they get

1447
01:16:39,960 --> 01:16:40,400
Speaker 2: to talk about.

1448
01:16:40,439 --> 01:16:43,160
Speaker 4: I'm interested in the discourse around the cases because I

1449
01:16:43,320 --> 01:16:45,960
Speaker 4: fear that moving forward, it's going to be like this

1450
01:16:46,000 --> 01:16:47,479
Speaker 4: for every case, and I don't want it to be

1451
01:16:47,479 --> 01:16:51,679
Speaker 4: because civil discourse is so important in this realm. And

1452
01:16:51,760 --> 01:16:55,080
Speaker 4: when we start getting like crazy, hostile, threatening children and whatnot,

1453
01:16:55,120 --> 01:16:55,519
Speaker 4: we've just.

1454
01:16:55,560 --> 01:16:56,240
Speaker 2: Lost the plot.

1455
01:16:58,280 --> 01:17:06,240
Speaker 3: Closing views, just hear them respectfully, and.

1456
01:17:04,439 --> 01:17:11,320
Speaker 4: It's okay to disagree, disagree all day.

1457
01:17:11,400 --> 01:17:14,240
Speaker 2: You should see Body and Courtney going toe to toe

1458
01:17:14,400 --> 01:17:19,280
Speaker 2: all day fighting for my lord. Yeah that's true, that's true,

1459
01:17:22,240 --> 01:17:27,880
Speaker 2: But no, those two will double trouble. Listen, we'll we're

1460
01:17:27,880 --> 01:17:29,800
Speaker 2: gonna have much more on this to come tomorrow. I'm

1461
01:17:29,800 --> 01:17:33,040
Speaker 2: crazy for you guys, Body, Courtney. Great night, Thank you

1462
01:17:33,080 --> 01:17:35,840
Speaker 2: all for joining us. We'll be back tomorrow, so make

1463
01:17:35,880 --> 01:17:38,719
Speaker 2: sure you tune in. This is true crime tonight. We're

1464
01:17:38,720 --> 01:17:41,400
Speaker 2: talking true crime all the time. Have a great night.