1 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:12,080 Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. You steal for your children. 2 00:00:12,320 --> 00:00:22,240 Speaker 1: You're the four. You're stealing the college money and spending 3 00:00:23,360 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 1: college Why an every penny you're spending right now is 4 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:38,000 Speaker 1: her money in Mile's money. Hold on a second, Adam, 5 00:00:38,040 --> 00:00:39,720 Speaker 1: I'd like you to come here. Hold on a second, 6 00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:42,840 Speaker 1: come in here place. Yeah, because you'll have a harget 7 00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:47,560 Speaker 1: five years in the twelve you never worked with your mother, 8 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 1: worked her off for every penny that he's spending. Let 9 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:54,760 Speaker 1: me tell you that, Dana Chefskis, I'm not wrong and 10 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:59,160 Speaker 1: maybe wrong about something, not the money. Worked and worked 11 00:00:59,200 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: and worked, and you're father seven. Now he refuses to 12 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:08,279 Speaker 1: get a job. He's spending your money. Okay, first of all, 13 00:01:08,760 --> 00:01:14,600 Speaker 1: he's spending. Oh. Nothing could make me happier than to 14 00:01:14,680 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 1: hear a secretly recorded argument between a grown man in 15 00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:22,959 Speaker 1: his in the home arguing with his parents, a man 16 00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:26,080 Speaker 1: who has quit work and gone off to be a 17 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:31,840 Speaker 1: professional bat gammin player. Did you hear that? Jack and 18 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:36,240 Speaker 1: I didn't move a hair as we were listening to 19 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 1: Rod Coughlin arguing with his parents. Did you hear his 20 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:44,000 Speaker 1: mom say, we worked our whoop off and you're spending 21 00:01:44,160 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 1: all your children's money. Your mother worked like a dog, 22 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:53,920 Speaker 1: and you're spending at all and you won't get a job. Well, yes, 23 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 1: what not having a job is the least of his 24 00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:01,040 Speaker 1: worries right now, because he is facing a murder charge 25 00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 1: for the brutal death of his wife, who ps did 26 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 1: have a job. Shelley Dennishevski, I'm talking about the case 27 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:15,480 Speaker 1: going on right now in a court of law against 28 00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 1: professional backgammon player Rod Covlin. I neanc Grace, this is 29 00:02:21,360 --> 00:02:25,680 Speaker 1: crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. I mean, Jackie, 30 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: what would you think if I said, you know what, 31 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:34,520 Speaker 1: I'm just quitting and I'm gonna play backgammon professionally. Oh 32 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 1: she's laughing to herself, laughing on the inside. She knows better. 33 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:43,640 Speaker 1: But that's what happened. But I want to hear more 34 00:02:44,040 --> 00:02:49,640 Speaker 1: of this secretly obtained, secretly recorded audio of Coblin, the 35 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:53,040 Speaker 1: professional backgamon player who's facing a murder who caught caught 36 00:02:53,080 --> 00:02:58,080 Speaker 1: a little murder charge? You know, um, Kathleen Murphy nor 37 00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:04,639 Speaker 1: North Carolina trial lawyer. I remember all the thousands, literally 38 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:09,960 Speaker 1: thousands of plea negotiations I would conduct, and very often 39 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:13,120 Speaker 1: I had one judge that did it this way. I 40 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: would sit there with all the files and one by 41 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: one would do the jail cases. First the lawyer would 42 00:03:18,840 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 1: come in, then bring in his line, and then sit down. 43 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:23,000 Speaker 1: I'd go through what I had. I'd read the police 44 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:25,760 Speaker 1: report with a lot of dramatic pauses and staring and 45 00:03:25,880 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 1: Harry eyeball looks anyway, and then you did X. And 46 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,000 Speaker 1: then the cops says you did Why. I think A'm 47 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 1: gonna be sick. Things like that, and gee, I wonder 48 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:42,680 Speaker 1: why they hated me. But long story short, as you 49 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:48,120 Speaker 1: are going through discussing what happened, very often one of 50 00:03:48,120 --> 00:03:51,160 Speaker 1: them would say, yes, miss Grace, I caught a little 51 00:03:51,240 --> 00:03:53,960 Speaker 1: murder charge, like they caught a cold or they caught 52 00:03:53,960 --> 00:03:58,400 Speaker 1: a baseball. Well, you know what, Rod Coblin has caught 53 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:00,840 Speaker 1: a murder charge. But let's take a listen to that 54 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:05,320 Speaker 1: secretly recorded argument. What you're saying now, what you are 55 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:08,560 Speaker 1: what you're saying now in front of Anna Miles. Okay, 56 00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 1: we'll ensure that you never see my children again if 57 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:15,240 Speaker 1: you continue. Okay, you've threatened us with you. I'm not 58 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:21,400 Speaker 1: excuse by October first. Okay, even I went down for 59 00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:29,360 Speaker 1: eleven years. Okay, even threaten me. Excuse me, evict me. 60 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:33,039 Speaker 1: You know what answers me. I spent a million dollars 61 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:35,479 Speaker 1: of mine money to make sure you didn't go to 62 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:37,360 Speaker 1: the Danish ships. Know you spend a million dollars of 63 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:43,200 Speaker 1: Bonnie's money. I owe the money. I'm gonna pay the money. 64 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:46,840 Speaker 1: You're never gonna pay me back. Beat out. You're gonna 65 00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 1: steal from me because you're gonna dig beat Okay, You're 66 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:54,280 Speaker 1: gonna steal from me. And if you steal from your children, wow, Okay, 67 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 1: And I'm sure that was just the tip of the iceberg. 68 00:04:56,839 --> 00:05:00,599 Speaker 1: Joining me right now, in addition to forensics expert Karen 69 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:05,600 Speaker 1: Smith out of the Florida jurisdiction. Karen Stark, psychologist, joining 70 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:08,200 Speaker 1: us out of Manhattan. This is in your back yard. 71 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:11,039 Speaker 1: You can find her at Karen starkn dot com. Kathleen 72 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:14,400 Speaker 1: Murphy right now, North Carolina family and divorced lawyer. But 73 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:17,040 Speaker 1: she's seen it all and joining me right now, of course, 74 00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:21,919 Speaker 1: with Jackie Howard and Alan Duke. Robin Willinski crime online 75 00:05:21,960 --> 00:05:25,520 Speaker 1: dot com investigative reporter and the author of an incredible book, 76 00:05:25,560 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 1: It's Beautiful Life, The CSI behind the Casey Anthony Trial. 77 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:33,640 Speaker 1: Robin how did this whole thing come to Like, let's 78 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:39,800 Speaker 1: just start at the beginning, because right now, the state, unwittingly, unwittingly, 79 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:43,679 Speaker 1: no malice, no intent, has got to deal with a horrible, 80 00:05:44,040 --> 00:05:48,240 Speaker 1: horrible snaphu, a boo boo, a misstep in the case 81 00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:52,080 Speaker 1: that may cost them a conviction. And there's nothing the 82 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:55,719 Speaker 1: prosecutor can do about it. It happened at the time 83 00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:59,719 Speaker 1: Shelley's body was found, and there's no fixing it, there's 84 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:03,400 Speaker 1: no turning back. They just simply have to hope that 85 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:07,400 Speaker 1: the rest of their evidence can overcome a big, big 86 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:09,760 Speaker 1: problem in their case. But I want to start at 87 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:13,120 Speaker 1: the beginning, Robin, what happened? Okay? Well, first of all, 88 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:14,839 Speaker 1: I want to say that when I hear that audio, 89 00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:19,600 Speaker 1: he sounds like an enabled forty something year old baby. 90 00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:24,760 Speaker 1: Are parents right in front of his children over the money? 91 00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:27,560 Speaker 1: You see his true self and his true colors there. 92 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:31,039 Speaker 1: But wait, wait, wait, Robin, Robin, Robin, Okay, I noticed 93 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 1: a little bit off topic. But have any of you 94 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:38,719 Speaker 1: ever seen mister Smith goes on vacation. It's with Jimmy Stewart, anybody, Okay, 95 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 1: at least Jackie has Okay, Jimmy Stewart takes his wife, 96 00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:46,720 Speaker 1: Marino Harra on vacation and they rent this horrible, horrible home. 97 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:50,040 Speaker 1: It's falling apart by the beach because the mom wants 98 00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:52,520 Speaker 1: family time and they get there. Jackie, I know you 99 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:54,600 Speaker 1: don't know where I'm going with this, but they have 100 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:57,839 Speaker 1: a foe that is a party line. And yes, we 101 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:00,359 Speaker 1: used to have a party line, and making George it 102 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: was with our neighbor, which makes it even worse because 103 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:04,920 Speaker 1: you know everything that's happening in their house. Anyway, every 104 00:07:04,920 --> 00:07:07,400 Speaker 1: time he would pick the phone up, he would hear 105 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:10,720 Speaker 1: these little little ladies talking about all their ailments and 106 00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:13,600 Speaker 1: this thing is oozing and this is a boil and 107 00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 1: all of her stomach and diarrhea, And every time he 108 00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 1: would pick the phone up, these two little old ladies 109 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 1: would be talking. My point is, Robin, even every time 110 00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:25,600 Speaker 1: I go, Mom, who lives with me? Now, Robin, you 111 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 1: know that I go, what's happening in making And she'll 112 00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:32,800 Speaker 1: start with the list of ailments and who died and 113 00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 1: how there was a poor tendance at the church, and 114 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 1: who this one got laid off, and that one got 115 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 1: laid off, and this one had a septic tank problem 116 00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:43,920 Speaker 1: and blah, and finally I'm like, I don't even want 117 00:07:43,920 --> 00:07:47,880 Speaker 1: the children to hear all this. And I was thinking 118 00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 1: that I don't want my children to hear who's sick 119 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:54,360 Speaker 1: and making Georgia within our little church at Liberty United 120 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 1: Methodist Church. But this dad actually dragged his children into it, 121 00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:03,480 Speaker 1: by name Anna and Miles. He dragged his children into 122 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:09,400 Speaker 1: the room to hear this bitter argument about him not working. Well, yeah, 123 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:13,120 Speaker 1: he wants the children to know how messed up and 124 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 1: entitled the father is, and what a spendthrift he is, 125 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:20,160 Speaker 1: and what a bad guy he is, and how he's 126 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:23,560 Speaker 1: stealing all the money and acting younger in age than 127 00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:27,680 Speaker 1: his own kids. You know, that's you know, Karen Stark, 128 00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 1: psychologist friend. We have sat through I don't even know 129 00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:37,760 Speaker 1: how many many hundreds of cases together since I first 130 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:41,120 Speaker 1: started at Court TV with Johnny Cochran way back when. 131 00:08:41,679 --> 00:08:46,360 Speaker 1: And I remember considering thinking about marrying David Lynch and 132 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:49,000 Speaker 1: you said, well, why would you marry him? Because I 133 00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:54,960 Speaker 1: was perfectly happy without being married, And I said, well, 134 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:57,000 Speaker 1: I want a family in one day. And plus I 135 00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:00,360 Speaker 1: know he's not going to be out whoring around. He's 136 00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 1: not going to be doing drugs or getting boozed up. 137 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:05,480 Speaker 1: He's not going to gamble away all the money. He's 138 00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 1: not gonna he works. I know where he is right now. 139 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 1: He's at work. I don't have to even call and 140 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 1: find out. I trust him, and I know that it's 141 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:18,800 Speaker 1: terrible when your husband is not there not to support you, 142 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:25,199 Speaker 1: because a woman can support herself. But reliable and trustworthy Karen. 143 00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:30,160 Speaker 1: I mean, that's the number one bedrock to me in anything. Yes, 144 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:32,960 Speaker 1: And I remember being very supportive of David. If you 145 00:09:33,000 --> 00:09:36,320 Speaker 1: would call at the time, Nancy. And here's a guy 146 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 1: who writes in the start this book, you listen to 147 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 1: what you were just playing. He absolutely has no boundaries. 148 00:09:45,520 --> 00:09:47,920 Speaker 1: He doesn't even understand that he shouldn't be calling his 149 00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:51,319 Speaker 1: children into the room. He doesn't care if he's not working. 150 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:56,559 Speaker 1: This is a very very despicable and scary guy. And 151 00:09:56,720 --> 00:10:01,160 Speaker 1: here he is in an investigation that has been completely 152 00:10:02,040 --> 00:10:05,040 Speaker 1: messed up. I just think about it, guys. We haven't 153 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:08,480 Speaker 1: even gotten murder yet. Friends and family of Shelley Coblin 154 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:11,040 Speaker 1: rushed out of him in Hattan courtroom without saying a 155 00:10:11,080 --> 00:10:15,120 Speaker 1: word inside. Her estranged husband Roderick, face charges for killing 156 00:10:15,120 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 1: her six years after she died. His attorney tells News 157 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:21,520 Speaker 1: four his client distunned. In the back of his mind, 158 00:10:21,559 --> 00:10:23,600 Speaker 1: he did not know this stay was going to come. 159 00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 1: It was right from the beginning, he said. He did 160 00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:30,080 Speaker 1: not commit the crime, So what changed? Prosecutors won't say. Shelley, 161 00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: a successful financial advisor, was found dead in her bathtub 162 00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 1: inside her Upper West Side apartment New Year's Eve two 163 00:10:36,400 --> 00:10:39,160 Speaker 1: thousand and nine. She had an appointment the next day 164 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 1: to meet with an attorney to cut her husband out 165 00:10:41,600 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 1: of her will. The medical examiner initially ruled Shelley's death accidental, 166 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:49,160 Speaker 1: her body exhoomed months later. This time, the emmy concluded 167 00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:51,880 Speaker 1: Shelley was strangled. Shelley and her husband were going through 168 00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:55,640 Speaker 1: a bitter divorce, their families fighting over custody and finances. 169 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:58,880 Speaker 1: The children now lived with Roderick's parents here in Scarsdale. 170 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:01,920 Speaker 1: We knocked today, but no one was home all the time. 171 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:07,040 Speaker 1: They're all said, riding bikes and playing beautiful kids. Late today, 172 00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:10,120 Speaker 1: the district attorney issued this statement, saying, it is our 173 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 1: hope that this prosecution will bring justice from Miss Denishevsky 174 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:17,280 Speaker 1: Covlin and provide closure for her grieving family and friends. 175 00:11:17,520 --> 00:11:21,120 Speaker 1: We are going to see whether they in fact have evidence, 176 00:11:21,400 --> 00:11:26,640 Speaker 1: credible evidence to support a murder indictment. Wow, you are 177 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:32,079 Speaker 1: hearing from our friends at w NBC, our friend Laurie Bordonio, 178 00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:35,640 Speaker 1: who is right there covering it on the courthouse steps. 179 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:40,480 Speaker 1: You know, I was reading one of my favorite newspapers. Yes, 180 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 1: an actual newspaper. Wait a minute, No, I wasn't because 181 00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:45,600 Speaker 1: it was on my iPad. But it was a newspaper 182 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:48,920 Speaker 1: on the iPad. It was a New York Post and 183 00:11:49,880 --> 00:11:54,120 Speaker 1: they actually had photos. I've dug up a lot of 184 00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:59,839 Speaker 1: the crime scene photos and her bed was totally bloody, 185 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:04,760 Speaker 1: and there was let me address the problem that has arisen. 186 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:09,719 Speaker 1: Robin Willinski here to tell us about it. But Shelley Denishevsky, 187 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:14,320 Speaker 1: the mother of Anna and Miles, beautiful, beautiful? What was she, Robin? 188 00:12:14,440 --> 00:12:17,280 Speaker 1: Was she a stockbroker? Yeah? She was earning lots of 189 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:20,200 Speaker 1: money on Wall Street, working hard every day, unlike her 190 00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:22,920 Speaker 1: husband who was playing games literally. And you know what, 191 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:25,480 Speaker 1: there's the thing about being a stockbroker on Wall Street. 192 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:28,400 Speaker 1: It's not like, you know, a lot of people work 193 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:32,760 Speaker 1: at home and they can actually sit at their laptop. 194 00:12:33,000 --> 00:12:34,520 Speaker 1: I mean I do it when I'm writing a book, 195 00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:39,719 Speaker 1: in their sweatpants and tshirt. So I'm all down with that, 196 00:12:40,440 --> 00:12:42,680 Speaker 1: but I remember all the days I had to be 197 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 1: in court at eight with one hundred and fifty case 198 00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:50,720 Speaker 1: files for a plea calendar and wearing then you couldn't 199 00:12:50,760 --> 00:12:53,640 Speaker 1: even wear pants in court. Women didn't anyway, and I 200 00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:57,560 Speaker 1: would have to have on heels, hose, a Sunday dress, 201 00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:01,560 Speaker 1: the hair up, the makeup, the everything, eight am, sharp, 202 00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:05,080 Speaker 1: ready to go. And that was my life, you know, 203 00:13:05,160 --> 00:13:08,880 Speaker 1: for ten years in court. So when you say a 204 00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:13,280 Speaker 1: stockbreaker on Wall Street, she was there a lot and 205 00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:16,280 Speaker 1: loaded when the bill went off. I guess at eight 206 00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:19,560 Speaker 1: o'clock in the morning, whatever time it goes off. To 207 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:26,439 Speaker 1: support his backgammon career. Anyway, Shelley Denishevski is found. Karen Smith, 208 00:13:26,440 --> 00:13:28,120 Speaker 1: you're the forensic sex braun. I'll let you tell it 209 00:13:28,200 --> 00:13:32,040 Speaker 1: how she's found. Well, this is such a convoluted story, Nancy, 210 00:13:32,080 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 1: and from what I've gleaned, according to Rod Coblin, and 211 00:13:37,679 --> 00:13:40,719 Speaker 1: I'll take this in his word for now, and we'll 212 00:13:40,760 --> 00:13:43,680 Speaker 1: work through that in a minute. He says she was 213 00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:47,800 Speaker 1: faced down in a tub full of water and there 214 00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:51,360 Speaker 1: was blood everywhere, and he pulled her from the water 215 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:58,040 Speaker 1: and attempted CPR covered her with a blanket. And this 216 00:13:58,240 --> 00:14:02,120 Speaker 1: all started when either his daughter either called him or 217 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:05,320 Speaker 1: came across the hall to his studio apartment and got him, 218 00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:08,600 Speaker 1: at which point he called for help. The police showed up, 219 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:12,480 Speaker 1: and then things literally spiraled down there, downhill from there. 220 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:15,720 Speaker 1: You know one fact that I love Robin Malinski, and 221 00:14:15,760 --> 00:14:17,679 Speaker 1: I argue this a lot in the add no On 222 00:14:17,800 --> 00:14:20,360 Speaker 1: Sayed case and in other cases as well that I 223 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:26,600 Speaker 1: tried myself, is it's called routine evidence, routine evidence, and 224 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: that means evidence of a particular routine. In this case, 225 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 1: Rod Covlin, the backgammon professional, never once in all the 226 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: years he lived in that building in his wife's apartment. 227 00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:42,680 Speaker 1: Let me tell you those apartments are not cheap, and 228 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:46,400 Speaker 1: they have apparently had two of them, had never once 229 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 1: spoken to the doorman ever, Robin. But that morning, early early, 230 00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 1: he goes out the door for the first time, and 231 00:14:55,680 --> 00:14:59,080 Speaker 1: let's just say ten years, he asked the doorman would 232 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:05,960 Speaker 1: they like a up of coffee? What? And they were stunned. 233 00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:09,800 Speaker 1: He goes, I'm going out on my morning walk, would 234 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:12,720 Speaker 1: you like me to bring you a cup of coffee? 235 00:15:13,280 --> 00:15:16,640 Speaker 1: Robert Rollinsky it's so fake and phony. He was trying 236 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:20,080 Speaker 1: to establish an aliba. Okay, Rob, you take it front 237 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:22,440 Speaker 1: and Karen gave me the forensics point of view. You 238 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 1: take it from what was observed. Well, I'll tell you 239 00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:27,520 Speaker 1: that's very odd. I lived in a dorman New York 240 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:30,440 Speaker 1: City building the majority of my life, and I was 241 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:33,520 Speaker 1: very friendly with the doorman. And you bring them, you know, 242 00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:37,240 Speaker 1: cookies and milk at night, and you do offer them coffee. 243 00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 1: But you have a relationship with these people, and they 244 00:15:39,800 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 1: know the people in the building that are oddballs that 245 00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:46,320 Speaker 1: don't speak to them. So his behavior of asking, you know, 246 00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:47,960 Speaker 1: do you want a cup of coffee in the morning 247 00:15:48,040 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: is extremely odd. And yes, he was trying to establish 248 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:54,000 Speaker 1: an alibi that he was leaving that particular building on 249 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:56,960 Speaker 1: the Upper West Side of Manhattan. That all said, Nancy, 250 00:15:57,000 --> 00:15:59,800 Speaker 1: what's so bizarre. You talk about collection of routine evidence. 251 00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:04,160 Speaker 1: They didn't collect any Here's a guy who claims, you know, 252 00:16:04,360 --> 00:16:07,440 Speaker 1: I pulled her out of the bathtub and his clothes 253 00:16:07,480 --> 00:16:12,720 Speaker 1: are dry, and the cops don't don't say ended CPR. 254 00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:16,760 Speaker 1: He claims he pulled her from the bathtub she was soaking, 255 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 1: and that he tried CPR and with all the blood 256 00:16:21,360 --> 00:16:25,400 Speaker 1: in the water and on the bed and on her 257 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 1: body from her wound in the back of her head. 258 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:33,920 Speaker 1: No blood, no water, no nothing, Robin, It's so bizarre. 259 00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:36,840 Speaker 1: You know, this is CSI class, you know, day one, 260 00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:39,560 Speaker 1: you go in there. Oh and by the way, the 261 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 1: lead detective, as I understand it, Nancy didn't even take notes. 262 00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:46,960 Speaker 1: So there's no notes from the lead detective who walks 263 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:51,040 Speaker 1: into the apartment. The apartment is not secure. She was 264 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:54,520 Speaker 1: Orthodox Jewish. They had a rabbi go in there who 265 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:58,040 Speaker 1: contaminated the crime scene. No fault of his, but they 266 00:16:58,440 --> 00:17:01,120 Speaker 1: let him in. Where was the yellow ape. They didn't 267 00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:05,879 Speaker 1: collect any fluids, no blood from the floor, the bathtub 268 00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:09,760 Speaker 1: was drained. There's no shirt from Rod Coblin. And oh, 269 00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:13,840 Speaker 1: get this, you know, she falls allegedly into the bathtub, 270 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:17,160 Speaker 1: the old flipping fall and there's a cabinet right over 271 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:21,520 Speaker 1: the bathtub, and the cabinet Nancy is kind of off kilter. Well, 272 00:17:21,560 --> 00:17:24,359 Speaker 1: they don't even dust it for fingerprints. Was it her 273 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:27,399 Speaker 1: hand that oh I'm falling until you hold onto that 274 00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:30,600 Speaker 1: cabinet as you're slipping into the tubs or were his 275 00:17:30,720 --> 00:17:33,440 Speaker 1: fingerprints on it? We don't know because they didn't even 276 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:37,080 Speaker 1: dust it for fingerprints. And that's where we are right now. 277 00:17:37,760 --> 00:17:42,240 Speaker 1: The children lived with their mom, Shelley Denishevsky, and their 278 00:17:42,359 --> 00:17:45,160 Speaker 1: Manhattan apartment. She would go off to work every single 279 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:48,600 Speaker 1: day to support the family. She had actually filed a 280 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:54,399 Speaker 1: protection order against her husband, okay, and then surprise, she 281 00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:58,080 Speaker 1: ends up dead. So the daughter, the little girl, she's 282 00:17:58,119 --> 00:18:01,360 Speaker 1: eight or nine years old, Anna, comes in and finds 283 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:04,199 Speaker 1: mommy in the tub, which I'm sure is something she 284 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:07,240 Speaker 1: will never forget the rest of her life. She calls 285 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:11,879 Speaker 1: her dad, who's out on his walk. Wink wink, nudge, nudge, 286 00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:17,240 Speaker 1: and Dad comes back. Coblin, he says, he finds her facedown, 287 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:21,880 Speaker 1: pulls her out and tries CPR. He is completely dry. Now, 288 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:27,200 Speaker 1: Robin mentioned that she's Orthodox Jewish. What that means as 289 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:29,720 Speaker 1: it relates to this case is that they do not 290 00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:35,320 Speaker 1: believe in autopsies. Karen Starr, isn't that correct, Nancy, That's 291 00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:38,720 Speaker 1: absolutely correct, and you're not allowed to do an autubsy 292 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:41,680 Speaker 1: and the body has to be buried as quickly as possible. 293 00:18:52,600 --> 00:18:58,720 Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace for religious reasons. Shelley was 294 00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:01,720 Speaker 1: buried the next day. Her death ruled an accident, but 295 00:19:01,920 --> 00:19:05,200 Speaker 1: months later her family had her body exhumed and autopsy 296 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:08,520 Speaker 1: was done, and the death was then ruled a homicide 297 00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:12,679 Speaker 1: by strangulation. When he was arrested yesterday morning, Covlin was 298 00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:15,320 Speaker 1: on his way to visit his kids, now fifteen and 299 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:18,600 Speaker 1: nine years old, who lived with his parents in a 300 00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:22,520 Speaker 1: home in this quiet call de sac. The two people 301 00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:28,320 Speaker 1: who who are suffering tremendously by this are the two 302 00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:33,239 Speaker 1: very young children, and mister Covlin is devastated by that. 303 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:37,720 Speaker 1: He's done everything in his power to watch over them 304 00:19:37,760 --> 00:19:41,479 Speaker 1: and take care of them, and still their money. You 305 00:19:41,520 --> 00:19:45,159 Speaker 1: were hearing from ABC New York, and that was reporter 306 00:19:45,280 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 1: Kimberly richardson our friend. That is what turns the case 307 00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:55,400 Speaker 1: on its head, right there, Karen Smith, forensics expert, this 308 00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:58,040 Speaker 1: is how you do it. That's a very big step 309 00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 1: to have a body examed. That hardly ever happens. Now listening, guys, 310 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:04,400 Speaker 1: you might think, wow, it happens all the time, because 311 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:07,000 Speaker 1: you sure to talk about it. That's because in high 312 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:10,960 Speaker 1: profile cases or intricate cases, very often you will see 313 00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 1: an exhimation, but typically you do not see a body 314 00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:19,040 Speaker 1: dug up out of the cemetery and re examined. But 315 00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:22,719 Speaker 1: thank the Lord, they did it because Karen Smith, forensics expert. 316 00:20:22,800 --> 00:20:24,480 Speaker 1: They found that she didn't die from a blow of 317 00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:27,919 Speaker 1: the head. She died from strangulation. And this is how 318 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:33,160 Speaker 1: they tell It's very simple. You look at the eyeballs, 319 00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:37,400 Speaker 1: because when you're a strangle, when you asphyxiate, there are 320 00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:41,880 Speaker 1: tiny blood vessels in your eyes, the particula. They are 321 00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:45,880 Speaker 1: invisible to the naked eye. They hemorrhage, they blow up 322 00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:50,000 Speaker 1: because of the pressure. And that's what they found. I 323 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:53,920 Speaker 1: assume Karen Smith, not only did they find that, and 324 00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:57,360 Speaker 1: you're absolutely right, Nancy, the potiqui I are a giveaway, 325 00:20:57,440 --> 00:21:01,040 Speaker 1: the little pinpoint blood vessels in capitalises that burst because 326 00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:03,840 Speaker 1: of the pressure in the head when you're strangled. What 327 00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:07,440 Speaker 1: they also found was a broken bone in her neck. 328 00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:09,919 Speaker 1: Now that didn't specify which one. I don't know if 329 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:12,560 Speaker 1: it was a cervical bone in the back or if 330 00:21:12,600 --> 00:21:15,600 Speaker 1: it was more telling, which is the highoid bone in 331 00:21:15,640 --> 00:21:17,840 Speaker 1: the front of the neck, and it covers the thyroid. 332 00:21:18,359 --> 00:21:21,520 Speaker 1: That highoid bone is very substile, it's very fragile, and 333 00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:23,840 Speaker 1: when you have a strangulation, when you have a chokehold, 334 00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:27,760 Speaker 1: type death. That bone will snap in half. That is 335 00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:31,199 Speaker 1: not indicative of a slip and fall. That is indicative 336 00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:35,080 Speaker 1: of somebody strangling you. And I also would like to 337 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:37,639 Speaker 1: know if this was an accidental death and she was 338 00:21:37,680 --> 00:21:41,760 Speaker 1: in water, was water found in her lungs? Did she 339 00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:46,320 Speaker 1: have any any type of evidence that she was under 340 00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:49,000 Speaker 1: that water while she was still alive? You know, Also, 341 00:21:49,800 --> 00:21:54,919 Speaker 1: dead bodies don't have a forceful bleeding. I read that 342 00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:58,160 Speaker 1: there was some blood spatter in the bathroom. Where did 343 00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:01,520 Speaker 1: that come from? What was she struck in the back 344 00:22:01,520 --> 00:22:03,760 Speaker 1: of the head or was she pushed into a wall? 345 00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:06,159 Speaker 1: All of these questions should have been answered at the 346 00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:10,879 Speaker 1: initial crime scene, which was bungled so badly that I 347 00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:13,600 Speaker 1: can't even begin to express the crime scene one oh 348 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:17,159 Speaker 1: one that Robin was talking about, the fingerprints, looking at 349 00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:19,719 Speaker 1: the blood scene, looking at the patterns, looking at her 350 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:22,880 Speaker 1: body position, looking at the bathtub, all of the evidence 351 00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 1: around the bathtub that was moved by this rabbi into 352 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 1: another room without even police supervision. I'm so disturbed by this. 353 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:34,920 Speaker 1: And this should not be a circumstantial case. This should 354 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:37,920 Speaker 1: be a factual case. It is open and closed. Yeah, 355 00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:43,080 Speaker 1: what Karen Smith just said is so critical because if 356 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:48,040 Speaker 1: Shelley Denishevski has this blow where she quote fell in 357 00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:51,640 Speaker 1: the back of her head, why would her hyoidal bone 358 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:54,960 Speaker 1: in the front of her neck be broken. But all 359 00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:58,760 Speaker 1: that really doesn't matter, and a lot of the bungling 360 00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:01,240 Speaker 1: by the state and hey, you know what, let's don't 361 00:23:01,280 --> 00:23:04,080 Speaker 1: be too hard on them. They come in. It looks 362 00:23:04,119 --> 00:23:07,240 Speaker 1: like a fall. The daughter found her. The dorman says, 363 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:12,199 Speaker 1: the dad was gone getting coffee, and they believe it. 364 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:15,240 Speaker 1: And because of the religious beliefs of the family, the 365 00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:17,959 Speaker 1: police bowed to the religious beliefs. They did not do 366 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:22,040 Speaker 1: an autopsy. A lot of that was cured by the 367 00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:26,440 Speaker 1: exhimation and the later autopsy by the medical examiner, because 368 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:28,679 Speaker 1: we find the true cause of death. She was strangled, 369 00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:32,399 Speaker 1: she was asphyxiated. So that means not only do we 370 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 1: know a predator did this, the children couldn't have the 371 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:40,760 Speaker 1: force to do that, but then the scene was actually 372 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:45,600 Speaker 1: staged to look like a fall in the tub. Wow, 373 00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:50,400 Speaker 1: who could have done that? Kathleen Murphy Nancy, there's only 374 00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:53,399 Speaker 1: one person, And it's typically my experience when there's that 375 00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:57,240 Speaker 1: protective order in place, it's in place for a reason. 376 00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,679 Speaker 1: They in wait County North. I want to do not 377 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:06,080 Speaker 1: just hand out protective orders without just cause, because there's 378 00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:09,479 Speaker 1: a protective order in place, and because there's a botched 379 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:12,479 Speaker 1: crime scene like it is. I hope he's got I 380 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:15,320 Speaker 1: hope he's convicted. I'm concerned about that. Did you know, 381 00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:18,200 Speaker 1: Robin Wilensk, I'm sure you do. One of the gars 382 00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:22,480 Speaker 1: actually fainted when the autopsy photos were shown. Did you 383 00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 1: know that one? And it was a mail. Now, you've 384 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:26,640 Speaker 1: got to go through a lot of hoops to get 385 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:30,160 Speaker 1: autopsy photos into evidence because they're not of the crime scene. 386 00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:34,200 Speaker 1: They're very, very upsetting, and you have to get them in. 387 00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 1: This is how you do it. By the way, you 388 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:38,119 Speaker 1: have to say, your honor. I've got to get this 389 00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:41,800 Speaker 1: autopsy photo in because it shows the nature of the 390 00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:46,119 Speaker 1: wound that cannot be shown from a shot of the 391 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:49,960 Speaker 1: body pre autopsy. I've got to prove this. And this 392 00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:53,760 Speaker 1: is why that's the way you get the autopsy photo in, 393 00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:56,800 Speaker 1: because it's normally deemed to be too gruesome. Robin Wilensky, 394 00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:01,200 Speaker 1: So Gerar actually fainted when they saw an autopsy photo. Yeah, 395 00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:02,920 Speaker 1: that's true. And you know what it reminds me of 396 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:05,159 Speaker 1: Nancy and I know you were there when they showed 397 00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,840 Speaker 1: the little skull of Kaylee Anthony and the Casey Anthony trial, 398 00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:11,520 Speaker 1: and it was on a Saturday morning, and I remember 399 00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:14,119 Speaker 1: looking up when they put it up on the video 400 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:18,560 Speaker 1: and there was this audible in the courtroom like, oh 401 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:21,720 Speaker 1: my god, there's her little skull with the weeds coming out. 402 00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:24,920 Speaker 1: And that's how bad these photos were as well that 403 00:25:25,040 --> 00:25:28,480 Speaker 1: the guy passed out. Same situation where people are overcome. 404 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:32,399 Speaker 1: People who are not used to seeing that graphic level 405 00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:36,159 Speaker 1: of horror either passed out or make an audible noise 406 00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:39,040 Speaker 1: in a courtroom. It does not surprise me. Take a 407 00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 1: listen to the prosecutor discussing the injuries of silly Danishevski 408 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:48,640 Speaker 1: in court. Look at her face. We know she's led 409 00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:57,359 Speaker 1: it right. You shot its mouth right, that's clear. You 410 00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:02,359 Speaker 1: know she's led him to a shot. By the way, 411 00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:07,200 Speaker 1: defense suggested people didn't hear screaming really with a hand 412 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:09,399 Speaker 1: or an arm over your mouth and ain't gonna be 413 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:14,800 Speaker 1: aby screaming. So we know she blood, that's clear. Question 414 00:26:14,880 --> 00:26:17,960 Speaker 1: is where she lea where the attack begin. That's the 415 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 1: bath match. By the way, please go ahead and take 416 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 1: that photo. Blow it up. And tell me that that 417 00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:27,520 Speaker 1: bath Matt made goes irregular math it's a figure. No, 418 00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:34,160 Speaker 1: pretty well, the irregular scratches on her face. Please, here's 419 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:39,560 Speaker 1: her face after the bloods washed off. That's not blood, 420 00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:44,880 Speaker 1: I mean those are scratches, dry bud. Next. Wow, I 421 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:51,080 Speaker 1: just saw a photo, an autopsy photo um off Shelley, 422 00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:55,600 Speaker 1: and it's heartbreaking. It's heartbreaking to think of the mom 423 00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:59,600 Speaker 1: wrenched away from her children in this manner. I want 424 00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:02,280 Speaker 1: to go back to Robin Mlensky. That morning, so the 425 00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:07,640 Speaker 1: daughter finds her, she calls the dad. They call police immediately, 426 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:11,520 Speaker 1: people from the synagogue or there. They ask the cops 427 00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:15,280 Speaker 1: if they can come in. And not only is there 428 00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:20,359 Speaker 1: not an autopsy Robin Mlynsky, but I guess the rabbi 429 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:25,120 Speaker 1: from her synagogue cleans the scene. He asks, and they 430 00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:28,320 Speaker 1: go yes. And because they don't want the children to 431 00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:31,159 Speaker 1: see the bloody bathwater and the bloody sheets and the 432 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 1: bloody bathroom. So the rabbi takes it about himself, thinking 433 00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:39,560 Speaker 1: he's doing a good deed, and he cleans and scrubs 434 00:27:39,640 --> 00:27:43,680 Speaker 1: the bathroom so the children will not be upset. And 435 00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:48,600 Speaker 1: there goes the evidence, Robin Lynsky that is exactly correct. 436 00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:52,320 Speaker 1: And not only does he drain the bathtub of blood 437 00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:56,080 Speaker 1: bodily fluids cleans the floor, he does use chemicals to 438 00:27:56,119 --> 00:27:59,160 Speaker 1: do it as well. It is you know, they call 439 00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:02,320 Speaker 1: it mind boggling missteps. I mean, there's no other word 440 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:05,399 Speaker 1: for it. And you know, who knows how this is 441 00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:07,800 Speaker 1: going to impact the jurors. But I want to bring 442 00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:10,159 Speaker 1: in one other nugget, Nancy, that we haven't gotten to, 443 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:14,760 Speaker 1: and that is this Rod Coblin lives in an apartment 444 00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:17,760 Speaker 1: on that same hallway, in the same New York City building. 445 00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:21,320 Speaker 1: He's in the studio apartment, and police, if you can 446 00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:26,240 Speaker 1: believe it, never search his apartment or examine his body. 447 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 1: You know, they say he's in the dry shirt, But sir, 448 00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 1: can you lift up your shirt? Can we see if 449 00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:34,600 Speaker 1: there's any wounds, any markie and he scratches any anything, 450 00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:37,600 Speaker 1: And they don't even go into his apartment and peek 451 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:40,680 Speaker 1: around and collect any evidence in a brown paper bag. 452 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:44,320 Speaker 1: Roderick Coblin sat mostly stone faced in court today as 453 00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:47,600 Speaker 1: the prosecutor spent two and a half hours laying out 454 00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:50,560 Speaker 1: a scathing timeline leading up to the murder of his 455 00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:54,160 Speaker 1: estranged wife, telling the story of a disgruntled and abusive 456 00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 1: husband obsessed with extramarital affairs, Backhammon and his wife's money, 457 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,720 Speaker 1: all alleged mode it is for murder. You're hearing from 458 00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:07,000 Speaker 1: w NBC New York reporter Ida Siegel. Listened cameras in 459 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,320 Speaker 1: the court only allowed us to capture the back of 460 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:11,640 Speaker 1: the prosecutor as he spoke to the jury. He's on 461 00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:15,360 Speaker 1: trial from murdering the woman he hated with an unrelenting, visceral, 462 00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:19,880 Speaker 1: ever growing, all consuming anger. Forty seven year old Shelley 463 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:23,520 Speaker 1: Kavlin was a successful money manager for ubs. She was 464 00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:26,440 Speaker 1: found dead in her bathtub on New Year's Eve two 465 00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:30,520 Speaker 1: thousand and nine by her own daughter, then nine years old. Initially, 466 00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:33,400 Speaker 1: police ruled it an accident, but after exuming her body, 467 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:37,400 Speaker 1: investigators found she had been strangled. Prosecutors argued her estranged 468 00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:40,880 Speaker 1: husband became enraged when he hacked into her email and 469 00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:43,640 Speaker 1: discovered that she was making moves to remove him from 470 00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:47,160 Speaker 1: her will, potentially denying him more than five million dollars. 471 00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:49,320 Speaker 1: The only human being on the planet, But the motive, 472 00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:51,840 Speaker 1: the opportunity, and the means to have done this is 473 00:29:51,840 --> 00:29:54,800 Speaker 1: sitting just across from you here in court. This prosecution. 474 00:29:56,000 --> 00:29:59,920 Speaker 1: The defense today vehemently denied the prosecution's version of events, 475 00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:03,040 Speaker 1: allowing that the divorce was contentious, but there was no 476 00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:06,480 Speaker 1: physical evidence connecting him to Shelley's death, and more so, 477 00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:10,200 Speaker 1: that there was no murder. They claim it was an accident. 478 00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:14,920 Speaker 1: But you heard was such a gross misleading distortion of 479 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:17,600 Speaker 1: the fact. I don't think it was a distortion at all. 480 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:22,480 Speaker 1: You're hearing from w NBC New York reporter Ida Siegel. 481 00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:26,160 Speaker 1: Long story short, We also know Shelley Denishevski, the victim, 482 00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:29,239 Speaker 1: had bright red scratches on her face, bruising on her 483 00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:33,480 Speaker 1: right hand. She was right handed, but there was never 484 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:38,520 Speaker 1: an autopsy. I guarantee you he had scratches on him. 485 00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:41,360 Speaker 1: I mean, bottom line, Kathleen Murphy in the middle of 486 00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:43,600 Speaker 1: a contentious divorce where she actually has to file a 487 00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:48,400 Speaker 1: protective order against him. We know, according to forensic evidence, 488 00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:51,760 Speaker 1: that he hacked into her emails and found out she 489 00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:53,680 Speaker 1: was cutting him out of her wheel as she should. 490 00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:58,240 Speaker 1: They're getting a divorce. She has money that saved and earned, 491 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,680 Speaker 1: and he had to stop her before she could change 492 00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:06,680 Speaker 1: the will. Motive, motive, motive, I mean, that's exactly what 493 00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:10,520 Speaker 1: we look for right, you're the criminal prosecutor. But in 494 00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:14,240 Speaker 1: family court, when I see protective orders, I take them 495 00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:18,120 Speaker 1: very seriously. And if he's violated the protective order in 496 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:22,480 Speaker 1: any way, shape or form, that's another clue. I am 497 00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:27,120 Speaker 1: shocked that we're able to list ten incidences where the 498 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:29,600 Speaker 1: police messed up this crime scene. And I'm very worried 499 00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:31,320 Speaker 1: about that. Well, I tell you I'm worried too, But 500 00:31:31,360 --> 00:31:36,160 Speaker 1: I still think the evidence is so overwhelming. Malinsky, what 501 00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:37,920 Speaker 1: do we know about him trying to actually frame his 502 00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:42,640 Speaker 1: nine year old daughter Anna. He taps into a computer 503 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:49,040 Speaker 1: and he writes an apology letter, a confession letter, allegedly 504 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:51,840 Speaker 1: in the words of how a nine year old world 505 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:56,520 Speaker 1: expressed herself. You know, Mommy, I pushed you. I'm so sorry, 506 00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,240 Speaker 1: And he fakes it. He pretends to be the nine 507 00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:05,000 Speaker 1: year old apologizing for pushing her mother. But it was 508 00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 1: totally bogus. I mean, right there to you, Karen Stark, 509 00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:16,000 Speaker 1: forensics expert. They can tell who went into the email, 510 00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:20,360 Speaker 1: who created this document. You can tell from your IP 511 00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:26,600 Speaker 1: address and in many many other ways, who wrote the document. 512 00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:31,240 Speaker 1: The nine year old girl didn't not push her mom, 513 00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:37,000 Speaker 1: and she died because she died of strangulation, okay number one, 514 00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:42,000 Speaker 1: So they know that he taps in and he writes 515 00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:46,280 Speaker 1: his confession by his nine year old daughter Anna, which 516 00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:49,320 Speaker 1: is ridiculous. That she pushed her mom or mom died 517 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:52,120 Speaker 1: from a fall. That's not how she died. So who 518 00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:55,000 Speaker 1: else would have motive to go in and frame their 519 00:32:55,040 --> 00:33:00,360 Speaker 1: own daughter from her Rod Hoblin. It's very simp He 520 00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:03,040 Speaker 1: went in and he's trying to cover his tracks. He's 521 00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:06,240 Speaker 1: writing this note which is just so despicable. I can't 522 00:33:06,240 --> 00:33:09,080 Speaker 1: even begin to describe, and you know, putting it in 523 00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:12,320 Speaker 1: the words of a nine year old girl. Really, they 524 00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:14,600 Speaker 1: can tell who wrote this, They know the time that 525 00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:16,840 Speaker 1: it was written, they know the IP address of where 526 00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:19,680 Speaker 1: it was written from it was. It's just such a 527 00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:22,880 Speaker 1: disgusting frame up. And to try to blame your own 528 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:26,520 Speaker 1: daughter for something this heinous. I can't wrap my head 529 00:33:26,520 --> 00:33:28,360 Speaker 1: around it. Well, that's what I always say when you're 530 00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:32,000 Speaker 1: looking at crime scenes. A random killer. And remember, there's 531 00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:35,720 Speaker 1: no robbery, there's no ray, nothing's missing from the home. 532 00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:38,840 Speaker 1: She's just murdered. So what's the motive to sneak in 533 00:33:38,960 --> 00:33:41,560 Speaker 1: while the children are there asleep and kill her? And 534 00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:44,160 Speaker 1: by the way, she was in full rigor, which means 535 00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:47,040 Speaker 1: that she had been dead for a long time. Rigor mortis. 536 00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:53,320 Speaker 1: Robert Lensky, what about this cell phone evidence, because what 537 00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:56,440 Speaker 1: we find out in court, Coblin had a key to 538 00:33:56,920 --> 00:34:02,360 Speaker 1: Denishevski's apartment still and cops say he took her iPhone 539 00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:05,480 Speaker 1: to search for information to give him an upper hand 540 00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:10,239 Speaker 1: in the divorce, and cell phone data shows it remained 541 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:15,280 Speaker 1: turned on after the murder, which means somebody was charging 542 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:20,440 Speaker 1: it and it never left the vicinity of the building. 543 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:24,160 Speaker 1: So bottom line, somebody was accessing her phone reading it 544 00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:29,680 Speaker 1: after she's dead. Wow, who did that? The eight year 545 00:34:29,719 --> 00:34:32,960 Speaker 1: old daughter? I mean, it just goes on and on 546 00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:39,920 Speaker 1: with the evidence. Go ahead, Well, Nancy, the thing is 547 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:42,759 Speaker 1: about the cell phone is that's how he found out 548 00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:45,840 Speaker 1: that she was supposed to be meeting with an attorney 549 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,680 Speaker 1: to write him out of the will on the first 550 00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:50,640 Speaker 1: of the year. Keep in mind, she's murdered on the 551 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:53,359 Speaker 1: thirty first, on New Year's Eve. The next day, he 552 00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:56,360 Speaker 1: finds out through her cell phone that she's meeting with 553 00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:59,640 Speaker 1: a lawyer to drop the papers to get him out 554 00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:03,240 Speaker 1: of the wi. Well, Nancy, this man Rod Coblin looked 555 00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:07,440 Speaker 1: at his wife as if she was a human ATM machine. 556 00:35:07,560 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 1: He didn't love her, he was cheating and all she 557 00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,360 Speaker 1: was good for in his mind was money so he 558 00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:18,239 Speaker 1: could continue to play games and Backgavin. It's outrageous. You know. 559 00:35:18,520 --> 00:35:24,440 Speaker 1: Another thing is that he Rod Colin actually bragged about 560 00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:31,399 Speaker 1: his martial arts death grip. His martial arts death grip. Now, 561 00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:36,839 Speaker 1: how do I know that? Because his friends talked about it. 562 00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:40,240 Speaker 1: During a night out with his friends from synagogue, Coblin 563 00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:46,160 Speaker 1: boasted about his mastery of his death grip, talking about 564 00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:50,040 Speaker 1: he could kill either the friend or somebody else. I 565 00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:53,080 Speaker 1: could kill you with one hand in a way no 566 00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:56,680 Speaker 1: one would ever find out. I mean Karen Stark, who 567 00:35:56,680 --> 00:35:59,799 Speaker 1: goes around bragging. I mean, Karen, if I walked up 568 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:02,080 Speaker 1: to you said I could kill you with one hand 569 00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:06,560 Speaker 1: and nobody would ever know, you would have me admitted 570 00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:10,680 Speaker 1: to the Luney Bean immediately, And they have it on tape, Nancy. 571 00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:15,000 Speaker 1: This whole thing is so outrageous. He was bragging about 572 00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:17,720 Speaker 1: it because he just doesn't think about what he's doing. 573 00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:20,840 Speaker 1: Even if you take a look as a psychologist, I 574 00:36:20,880 --> 00:36:23,480 Speaker 1: find a look at the fact that he faked that 575 00:36:23,560 --> 00:36:28,080 Speaker 1: note from his daughter, who doesn't have compassion, love, caring 576 00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:31,960 Speaker 1: about their children, want to protect them. He has no feelings, 577 00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:34,839 Speaker 1: he doesn't think about what he's doing. And he's so 578 00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:37,200 Speaker 1: full of himself that he needs to brag about the 579 00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:40,640 Speaker 1: sack that he can do the very thing that killed 580 00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:45,400 Speaker 1: his wife, snapping her net. And we also have video 581 00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:48,720 Speaker 1: that and you can find it a crime online dot com. 582 00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:52,680 Speaker 1: Here is Comlin in the common area in the jail 583 00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:58,760 Speaker 1: showing how to do the lethal next snapping martial arts hold, 584 00:36:59,239 --> 00:37:04,200 Speaker 1: I mean present video showing Ron Coughlin demonstrating a chokehold. 585 00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:08,600 Speaker 1: Does it never end? We wait as justice unfolds. Nancy 586 00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:10,800 Speaker 1: Grace Crime's Choice, signing off, goodbye friend,