1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,439
Speaker 1: Too Much Information is a production of I Heart Radio.

2
00:00:08,560 --> 00:00:11,840
Speaker 1: Hello everyone, and welcome to Too Much Information, the show

3
00:00:11,880 --> 00:00:14,720
Speaker 1: that brings you the secret history and little known fascinating

4
00:00:14,720 --> 00:00:17,919
Speaker 1: facts behind your favorite music, movies, TV shows, and more.

5
00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:20,880
Speaker 1: We're two guys with too much free time on our hands.

6
00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:23,520
Speaker 1: My name is Jordan run Tug and I'm Alex Hegel,

7
00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:27,840
Speaker 1: and today we're talking about the Spice Girls debut album Spice,

8
00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:30,680
Speaker 1: which was released in the US twenty five years ago

9
00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:33,000
Speaker 1: this year. That's incredible. I can't believe it's been that long.

10
00:00:33,240 --> 00:00:36,640
Speaker 1: I felt every year. Now I'm gonna go out on

11
00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:38,720
Speaker 1: a limb high gol and guess that you were not

12
00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:42,840
Speaker 1: the world's biggest Spice Girls fan. And it's not because

13
00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:45,520
Speaker 1: I had like any particularly advanced taste in pop culture

14
00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:47,159
Speaker 1: at the time. I mean, I like listen to the

15
00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:50,239
Speaker 1: Casey case on Top forty Countdown on Sundays. I like

16
00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:53,239
Speaker 1: still taping stuff off the modern rock radio like I

17
00:00:53,320 --> 00:00:55,960
Speaker 1: was not. That's adorable, but you know, it's dumbers. The

18
00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:57,920
Speaker 1: first CD I ever bought, which I think must have

19
00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:01,160
Speaker 1: been this year with my own money, was Eagle Eye

20
00:01:01,280 --> 00:01:06,200
Speaker 1: Cherries Debut because I liked Save Tonight. So no, I'm

21
00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:09,560
Speaker 1: not coming from a position of like authority or a

22
00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:12,119
Speaker 1: high moral value on this. My sister is four years

23
00:01:12,120 --> 00:01:13,760
Speaker 1: younger than me, so she was like very much the

24
00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:16,200
Speaker 1: target audience, and I just remember having it in our

25
00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:20,600
Speaker 1: household constantly, and also like every girl in my elementary

26
00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:24,199
Speaker 1: school like running around and like throwing the peace sign

27
00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:26,720
Speaker 1: in my face and screaming girl power. So that's my

28
00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:30,679
Speaker 1: memory of the Spice Girls. So fair to middling, I

29
00:01:30,720 --> 00:01:34,000
Speaker 1: would say, all right, I really enjoyed the Spice Giles

30
00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:37,720
Speaker 1: because I was and am a huge Beatles fan, and

31
00:01:37,840 --> 00:01:40,959
Speaker 1: I really thought it captured that whole energy of you know,

32
00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:45,000
Speaker 1: just fun being in a gang with your friends. It

33
00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:48,280
Speaker 1: felt very just very up. I liked how sort of

34
00:01:48,360 --> 00:01:51,600
Speaker 1: effervescent it all felt and catchy. I mean the songs

35
00:01:51,600 --> 00:01:53,840
Speaker 1: were really good too. I mean, yeah, this song's bang

36
00:01:54,280 --> 00:01:55,840
Speaker 1: are still really good and it's interesting. I mean, you

37
00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:58,840
Speaker 1: did mention the whole like girl power thing at the time.

38
00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:02,000
Speaker 1: I mean, granted was what ten When this album came out,

39
00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:04,600
Speaker 1: it felt like I wasn't allowed to openly like it,

40
00:02:04,640 --> 00:02:07,160
Speaker 1: and I deeply regret feeling that way now, because I mean,

41
00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:09,240
Speaker 1: these songs for everybody much in the same way that

42
00:02:09,280 --> 00:02:12,280
Speaker 1: feminism should be something that everybody participates in. Well, I

43
00:02:12,320 --> 00:02:15,040
Speaker 1: think this is sort of the first time. First time

44
00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:18,520
Speaker 1: I remember like feminism coming into the conversation in pop

45
00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:22,040
Speaker 1: culture in such a like concentrated way as part of

46
00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:25,320
Speaker 1: something that was so otherwise like frothy. And I don't know, man,

47
00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:27,440
Speaker 1: if you get like a bunch of teen girls being

48
00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:31,760
Speaker 1: like girl power, it's a great thing. Um the sort

49
00:02:31,760 --> 00:02:35,760
Speaker 1: of machiavellian put together aspects of this or maybe another

50
00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:38,720
Speaker 1: part of it. But you know, let's not put the

51
00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:41,080
Speaker 1: card ahead of the spice here. Do you have a

52
00:02:41,120 --> 00:02:48,640
Speaker 1: favorite spice girl? It's probably posh really yeah, I just yeah,

53
00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:53,200
Speaker 1: I mean Victoria Beckham's cheekbones. Man, I don't know, I

54
00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:57,200
Speaker 1: so pretty lady, role pretty lady. My favorite spice girl

55
00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:00,960
Speaker 1: was Jerry because she reminded me of my first love,

56
00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:06,120
Speaker 1: who was mad Line, the little French orphan, the animated character.

57
00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:11,640
Speaker 1: Have we not wow? Judging from your your seeming the

58
00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:14,720
Speaker 1: genuine laugh. Maybe I've never told you this. I think

59
00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:16,960
Speaker 1: you have told me that before. But I don't understand

60
00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:19,880
Speaker 1: the connection between like it was purely the red hair

61
00:03:20,040 --> 00:03:23,320
Speaker 1: thing and I my first actual real life you know,

62
00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:27,120
Speaker 1: human being crushed looked a lot like mad Line and Jerry,

63
00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:29,000
Speaker 1: And yeah, I was in fifth grade. I went out

64
00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:31,200
Speaker 1: during recess and picked her flowers that I left on

65
00:03:31,240 --> 00:03:34,680
Speaker 1: her desk, and I got poisoned from doing that. And

66
00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:36,960
Speaker 1: also she wasn't impressed in any way because I didn't

67
00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:38,720
Speaker 1: knock the dirt off of it, since she came back

68
00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:40,720
Speaker 1: in from recess and it was just a clump of

69
00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:43,680
Speaker 1: weeds and dirt on her desk, and I think she

70
00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:46,640
Speaker 1: was upset. And then the next day my hand swelled up,

71
00:03:47,080 --> 00:03:51,760
Speaker 1: and I've pretty much been just re enacting that scene

72
00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:57,520
Speaker 1: in various relationships for the last twenty five years. Good lord,

73
00:03:57,680 --> 00:04:00,560
Speaker 1: all right, well, folks, with all that in mind, keep

74
00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:03,880
Speaker 1: listening to find out what zig zigga actually means, Margaret

75
00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:07,320
Speaker 1: Thatcher's surprise influence on the legacy of girl power, and

76
00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:09,800
Speaker 1: how Baby Spice almost died during this say You'll Be

77
00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:13,440
Speaker 1: their video shoot. Here's everything you didn't know about the

78
00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:24,920
Speaker 1: Spice Girls first album, Spice. The Spice Girl's phenomenon began

79
00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:28,520
Speaker 1: with a classified ad in a London trade magazine called

80
00:04:28,560 --> 00:04:33,680
Speaker 1: The Stage. The listing read wanted are you just the letters?

81
00:04:33,720 --> 00:04:37,200
Speaker 1: Are you? Are you twenty three with the ability to

82
00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:43,400
Speaker 1: sing slash dance. Are you streetwise, outgoing, ambitious and dedicated.

83
00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:47,520
Speaker 1: Heart Management Limited are a widely successful music industry management

84
00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:52,679
Speaker 1: consortium currently forming a choreographed singing slash dancing all female

85
00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:56,200
Speaker 1: pop act for a recording deal. Open audition March four,

86
00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:59,760
Speaker 1: Please bring sheet music or back in cassettes. First of all,

87
00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:02,720
Speaker 1: Prince write that what is the R? Why would you

88
00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:05,080
Speaker 1: spell out are you? And then put all of those

89
00:05:05,160 --> 00:05:07,560
Speaker 1: other large words in there if you're paying by the

90
00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:11,080
Speaker 1: line for a classified So Heart Management not a consortium.

91
00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:14,880
Speaker 1: Three guys, a financier by the name of Chic Murphy,

92
00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:17,800
Speaker 1: and then a father and son duo Chris and Bob Herbert.

93
00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:22,120
Speaker 1: Chris Herbert, in the grand tradition of money men becoming

94
00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:25,880
Speaker 1: personality wranglers, was an accountant and then got involved in

95
00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:31,440
Speaker 1: the music industry. In he took a liking Wikipedia quote

96
00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:35,840
Speaker 1: to twin friends of his son Chris, and attempted to

97
00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:39,080
Speaker 1: market a group that he pitched as the eighties answer

98
00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:42,880
Speaker 1: to the Bay City Rollers. That did not take apparently,

99
00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:46,800
Speaker 1: and by the nineties they are putting together the Spice Girls.

100
00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:51,479
Speaker 1: This classified ad drew over four hundred women to this audition,

101
00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:53,960
Speaker 1: and they were split into groups of ten, and first

102
00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:57,039
Speaker 1: they were asked to perform a dance routine to the

103
00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:01,279
Speaker 1: song Stay by the group Eternal, which really like a

104
00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:04,240
Speaker 1: Spice Girls song. It does, Oh, it very much does. Yes,

105
00:06:04,279 --> 00:06:06,600
Speaker 1: they definitely had the sound in mind. And then they

106
00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:09,280
Speaker 1: had solo auditions where all of the hopeful sung a

107
00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:12,719
Speaker 1: song of their choice. Melby at her Spice Girls auditions

108
00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:19,680
Speaker 1: saying Whitney Houston's the Greatest Love of All. Melsie sung

109
00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:23,280
Speaker 1: the Pointer Sister's classic I'm So Excited, also very good.

110
00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:30,040
Speaker 1: Victoria Beckham sang Mine Hair from the musical Cabaret because

111
00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:33,440
Speaker 1: she had a background in musical theater. Uh, god damn

112
00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:38,000
Speaker 1: posh even then, good lord um. And so the four

113
00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:42,080
Speaker 1: hundred odd women were narrowed down to I say odd,

114
00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:44,440
Speaker 1: I meant like, not exactly four hundred. Not that they

115
00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:46,840
Speaker 1: were strange people. They might have been. Maybe they might

116
00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:49,080
Speaker 1: have been. I don't know. Uh. They were narrowed down

117
00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:53,520
Speaker 1: to about twelve before a final audition. Interestingly, Jerry Hollowell

118
00:06:53,640 --> 00:06:56,760
Speaker 1: missed the original audition, and there are conflicting reasons as

119
00:06:56,760 --> 00:06:59,320
Speaker 1: to why. The two most reported accounts so that she

120
00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:02,400
Speaker 1: was working and unable to make the appointment and the

121
00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:05,039
Speaker 1: other was that she had returned home from vacation in

122
00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:09,560
Speaker 1: Spain and was too sunburned to attend, which I mean,

123
00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:14,200
Speaker 1: that's the thing about you know, Ginger's burn. That's so

124
00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:16,760
Speaker 1: that could be real. Jerry gave an interview to Marie

125
00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:19,440
Speaker 1: Claire where she explained that she missed this audition because

126
00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:22,840
Speaker 1: she was in Spain, not being sunburned, but visiting her grandmother.

127
00:07:23,360 --> 00:07:26,200
Speaker 1: Kind of yeah, very nice. She returned to the UK

128
00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:30,080
Speaker 1: and decided to ring the Herbert's to see if they

129
00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:32,560
Speaker 1: were still looking for somebody for this group they're putting together.

130
00:07:32,760 --> 00:07:34,840
Speaker 1: It turns out they were, and she got a chance

131
00:07:34,880 --> 00:07:38,280
Speaker 1: to audition and got the gig. And Jerry wasn't the

132
00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:42,680
Speaker 1: only Spice Girl who missed the audition. Melsey also was

133
00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:45,680
Speaker 1: sort of a late arrival because she had tonsil itis

134
00:07:45,760 --> 00:07:47,880
Speaker 1: and missed one of the early rounds of the auditions.

135
00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:50,720
Speaker 1: And then she basically called them and begged them and said, look,

136
00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:53,440
Speaker 1: I can't even talk little one sink and we wait,

137
00:07:53,880 --> 00:07:55,880
Speaker 1: and the management said, at I'm sorry. You know, we

138
00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:58,560
Speaker 1: we We've got everybody we need. And then I guess

139
00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:00,440
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks later, one of the girls hadn't

140
00:08:00,440 --> 00:08:02,440
Speaker 1: worked out and they called her back to come on

141
00:08:02,600 --> 00:08:06,240
Speaker 1: do another round of auditions, and their performance obviously impressed

142
00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:09,520
Speaker 1: the management group because they invited to join. And that

143
00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:13,200
Speaker 1: wasn't the only near miss for the Spice Girls lineup

144
00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:16,640
Speaker 1: that we know and love. Yeah, the Lost Spice Girl

145
00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:18,960
Speaker 1: It should be just like the title of its own

146
00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:23,520
Speaker 1: seventeen part podcast. So the five girls who were initially

147
00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:25,600
Speaker 1: chosen as part of the lineup moved into a house

148
00:08:25,640 --> 00:08:29,440
Speaker 1: together in Maidenhead. I love this call out you put

149
00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:34,560
Speaker 1: in Headley Grange, the haunted former workhouse that was the

150
00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:38,400
Speaker 1: rehearsal choice for the seventies Rock Dinosaurs was not available

151
00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:43,080
Speaker 1: at the time, nor was Mick Jaggers Baronial Estate Star Groves. Um.

152
00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:46,120
Speaker 1: I love how these managed people just throw their you know,

153
00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:48,840
Speaker 1: they're putting a group together and they it's almost like

154
00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:52,120
Speaker 1: boot camp. I think Luke Pearlman did that with with

155
00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:54,000
Speaker 1: in Sync. I think he had them living in like

156
00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:56,880
Speaker 1: a barracks at his house in Orlando or something. And

157
00:08:57,200 --> 00:08:59,600
Speaker 1: do they do that with like K pop groups too? Dude?

158
00:08:59,600 --> 00:09:02,880
Speaker 1: I would I ever tell you my BTS story? No,

159
00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:07,520
Speaker 1: When I was at people, like right before BTS became

160
00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:12,120
Speaker 1: like the world conquering phenomenon. They were definitely on the upswing.

161
00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:14,280
Speaker 1: They were very much known quantity, and they were huge.

162
00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:17,920
Speaker 1: They came to people. What did I miss this? I

163
00:09:17,960 --> 00:09:21,720
Speaker 1: think so um. But they were marched into one of

164
00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:27,559
Speaker 1: the conference rooms looking drawn and emaciated and like they

165
00:09:27,559 --> 00:09:30,280
Speaker 1: had just been on a forced march here from Korea.

166
00:09:31,440 --> 00:09:34,600
Speaker 1: And they got a bunch of like Korean take out,

167
00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:37,160
Speaker 1: which seemed to be the only joy in their day.

168
00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:39,760
Speaker 1: And I was not allowed in the room while they

169
00:09:39,760 --> 00:09:43,840
Speaker 1: were like eating or pre hanging out. And then they

170
00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:48,800
Speaker 1: come back out made up in their clothes and just

171
00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:54,959
Speaker 1: on like mugging and laughing and like just camera ready.

172
00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:58,040
Speaker 1: But that was the starkest transition I have ever seen

173
00:09:58,280 --> 00:10:00,760
Speaker 1: in any celebrity of just going I'm like I want

174
00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:05,240
Speaker 1: to die, and my body is reflecting that too. Here

175
00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:08,640
Speaker 1: is my like one hundred watt star power just on

176
00:10:08,679 --> 00:10:10,480
Speaker 1: the turn, like over the course of an hour. It

177
00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:15,600
Speaker 1: must have been really good Korean food. Um. Anyway, the

178
00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:19,400
Speaker 1: girls who are put in this pressure cookare environment. Emma

179
00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:22,720
Speaker 1: Button is not among them. Instead, there was a seventeen

180
00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:27,920
Speaker 1: year old day Michelle Stephenson, who left voluntarily. But the

181
00:10:27,960 --> 00:10:31,160
Speaker 1: story behind that is somewhat murky. Some say she was fired,

182
00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:36,600
Speaker 1: uh classic Beck's sound bite. She would later claim that

183
00:10:36,640 --> 00:10:39,680
Speaker 1: Stephenson was fired because she just couldn't be arst to

184
00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:41,480
Speaker 1: put in the same amount of work as the rest

185
00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:44,840
Speaker 1: of the girls. But Stevenson is adamant that she left

186
00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:47,719
Speaker 1: to look after her mom, who had been diagnosed with

187
00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:52,360
Speaker 1: lung cancer. And if you take a quick look at

188
00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:55,320
Speaker 1: the where Are They Now file, she said that she

189
00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:58,959
Speaker 1: has no regrets about leaving those Spice Girls, and she

190
00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:02,199
Speaker 1: went on to become a tele Asian producer, television presenter,

191
00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:05,040
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, and then she started working as session singer

192
00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:07,560
Speaker 1: and doing songwriting work. She's been a backing singer for

193
00:11:07,679 --> 00:11:11,560
Speaker 1: Ricky Martin and do Iglesias. So yeah, she's still in

194
00:11:11,559 --> 00:11:15,080
Speaker 1: the industry. She apparently has no regrets hashtag no regrets.

195
00:11:16,040 --> 00:11:20,920
Speaker 1: Enter Emma Bunton, recommended by the girl's singing teacher. But

196
00:11:21,040 --> 00:11:24,840
Speaker 1: she actually had a bit of history with Bes with Victoria,

197
00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:26,959
Speaker 1: and this is interesting. They all kind of knew each

198
00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:29,880
Speaker 1: other and this is a really fascinating bit of apocrypha.

199
00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:33,479
Speaker 1: Male b and Jerry Halliwell apparently meant on an audition

200
00:11:33,520 --> 00:11:38,040
Speaker 1: for the movie Tank Girl, which is that utterly insane

201
00:11:38,440 --> 00:11:41,480
Speaker 1: movies starring Lori Petty. Have you seen Tank Girl? Years

202
00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:44,320
Speaker 1: and years? My main Lori Petty Association is a league

203
00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:47,600
Speaker 1: of their own where she was kit or Gina Davis's sister.

204
00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:50,839
Speaker 1: She isn't that right? But yeah, I forget most of

205
00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:54,160
Speaker 1: Tank Girl. That movie's wacky. So imagining one of the

206
00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:57,360
Speaker 1: Spice Girls and it is even wackier. But um yeah,

207
00:11:57,360 --> 00:11:59,920
Speaker 1: so Emma was shooting to become an actress. Spice worlds

208
00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:02,400
Speaker 1: so pretty wack you have to say, yeah, that's true.

209
00:12:02,600 --> 00:12:05,560
Speaker 1: So they all shared a small terraced house in the

210
00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:09,160
Speaker 1: London suburb of Maidenhead, and speaking to The Guardian in

211
00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:12,400
Speaker 1: twenty nineteen, Emma Button gave us a little view into

212
00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:15,920
Speaker 1: the life of the Spice house. Melsie and Jerry were

213
00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:18,720
Speaker 1: in charge of taking out the bins and she was

214
00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:21,240
Speaker 1: on cooking duty, and she said, I used to make

215
00:12:21,320 --> 00:12:24,320
Speaker 1: beans on toast for everyone, while Melby used to cook

216
00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:29,079
Speaker 1: corned beef and rice because British food is disgusting. Hearing

217
00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:31,360
Speaker 1: you read all these British isms is giving me so

218
00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:35,800
Speaker 1: much joy, especially because I'm a huge anglophile and you

219
00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:39,440
Speaker 1: not so much. Not so much. It cuts off right

220
00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:42,480
Speaker 1: around Eric Clapton. Do you like British food? Does your

221
00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:47,160
Speaker 1: angle behind? Well, I don't. I mean chicken pop pies great,

222
00:12:47,240 --> 00:12:51,280
Speaker 1: cheppers pies great, they make good Bland curry for my

223
00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:55,520
Speaker 1: weak stomach. They're candy rules, British candies the best candy.

224
00:12:55,800 --> 00:13:00,040
Speaker 1: British sweets are the best sweets. Wow, Willy Wonka is

225
00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:06,800
Speaker 1: a real story. Yeah, I'm just gonna keep trying to

226
00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:09,840
Speaker 1: stump you by saying like baffling things that you then

227
00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:14,079
Speaker 1: have to edit around. Another fun inside look into the

228
00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:20,000
Speaker 1: Spice House um hashtag spice House Baby Spice is apparently

229
00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:25,160
Speaker 1: frightened of large things, which is a deeper bizarre factoid.

230
00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:27,680
Speaker 1: But there's a Rolling Stone cover story in the Band

231
00:13:27,679 --> 00:13:34,199
Speaker 1: in July by Chris Heath. Incredible story. Incredible. It's more

232
00:13:34,320 --> 00:13:36,920
Speaker 1: for what's included than what's left out. As like a

233
00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:40,160
Speaker 1: hagiographical work. He says this of babies of Emma Button

234
00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:43,880
Speaker 1: she can't look at an airplane close up. She thinks

235
00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:46,240
Speaker 1: it might stem from when she visited the Center of

236
00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:49,720
Speaker 1: London as a little girl and saw a gigantic model

237
00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:52,960
Speaker 1: of King Kong on the side of the building. One

238
00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:55,600
Speaker 1: thing she very much wants to do while in New

239
00:13:55,679 --> 00:13:59,600
Speaker 1: York is avoid seeing the Statue of Liberty. I think

240
00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:03,920
Speaker 1: she'd scare me. Ma says she might fall on me. Ah,

241
00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:08,280
Speaker 1: good lord, what is that? Is bizarre? Anyway, Apparently, as

242
00:14:08,320 --> 00:14:11,080
Speaker 1: far as I know, scary Spice is not scared of

243
00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:15,800
Speaker 1: not scary things, Posh Spice is uh not scared of

244
00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:19,800
Speaker 1: tacky things, sporty Spice is not scared of inactivity, and

245
00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:24,560
Speaker 1: ginger Spice is not afraid of what's the opposite of

246
00:14:24,600 --> 00:14:28,640
Speaker 1: ginger mayonnaise. I don't know, some kind of British food. Surely,

247
00:14:29,840 --> 00:14:36,000
Speaker 1: uh continue, uh now this is really mind blowing to me.

248
00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:39,640
Speaker 1: The group We're not originally called the Spice Girls. Early

249
00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:42,480
Speaker 1: in the group's development, they were known as Touch. Just

250
00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:45,360
Speaker 1: actually has that name been taken? Since that's a good

251
00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:47,800
Speaker 1: group name, Touch for the kind of music they're doing

252
00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:50,760
Speaker 1: for pop group, that's a good pop group name. So yeah,

253
00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:53,400
Speaker 1: Early in the group's development they were known as Touch,

254
00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:56,880
Speaker 1: but then they became known as simply Spice. But then

255
00:14:56,920 --> 00:14:59,960
Speaker 1: they ultimately added the girls part. And there are two

256
00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:02,920
Speaker 1: reason sided for this. One is that there's an American

257
00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:05,320
Speaker 1: rapper who went by the name Spice, so they changed

258
00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:08,400
Speaker 1: their name to avoid the confusion and the other stories

259
00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:10,360
Speaker 1: at the industry. Inside it was just referred to the

260
00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:14,200
Speaker 1: group kind of dismissively as the Spice Girls, and the

261
00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:16,040
Speaker 1: name just stuck. I just want to get into a

262
00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:19,400
Speaker 1: quick aside about the rapper Spice. He's a Californian man

263
00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:23,400
Speaker 1: named Robert Lee Green Jr. And he went by Spice one,

264
00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:28,560
Speaker 1: with Spice being an acronym for sex, pistols, indo cash

265
00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:33,800
Speaker 1: and entertainment, which rules uh. He started putting out music

266
00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:37,320
Speaker 1: in two It was apparently Buddies with Tupac and was

267
00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:40,600
Speaker 1: on the last song that Tupac recorded before being shot.

268
00:15:41,120 --> 00:15:44,960
Speaker 1: Spice was also shot in two thousand seven, just sitting

269
00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:48,000
Speaker 1: outside his parents house, but he has since recovered. You

270
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:51,360
Speaker 1: know who hasn't been shot any of the members of

271
00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:54,920
Speaker 1: the Spice Girls. This is kind of an amazing badass

272
00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:56,920
Speaker 1: story about I mean that that they were really were

273
00:15:56,960 --> 00:15:59,920
Speaker 1: living girl power. They got out of the really terrible

274
00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:05,040
Speaker 1: management contract by stealing their demos from their office and

275
00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:08,680
Speaker 1: literally skipping town. So you know, as we talked about earlier,

276
00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:10,960
Speaker 1: the band was put together by the father's son team

277
00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:14,840
Speaker 1: Bob and Chris Herbert Heart Management, but the situation really

278
00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:18,440
Speaker 1: backfired for them, and they were basically sort of destroyed

279
00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:21,920
Speaker 1: by their own Frankenstein monster hoisted by their own petard,

280
00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:24,920
Speaker 1: if you will. The girls and the Spice Girls disagreed

281
00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:27,080
Speaker 1: with the material that they were being asked to sing

282
00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:29,840
Speaker 1: the stuff they're being told to where who should sing lead?

283
00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:32,080
Speaker 1: Because I guess in the early days they wanted the

284
00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:34,240
Speaker 1: band to have like kind of the opposite of what

285
00:16:34,280 --> 00:16:37,240
Speaker 1: they became a uniform look. Everybody was supposed to wear

286
00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:40,040
Speaker 1: the same, like basically Adidas track suits and stuff, which

287
00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:43,200
Speaker 1: is so weird because the opposite happened. They all kind

288
00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:47,000
Speaker 1: of became known for their distinct individual personalities. So the

289
00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:50,080
Speaker 1: group were really dissatisfied that their management and the split

290
00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:54,320
Speaker 1: came in October, and the reasons for this very The

291
00:16:54,360 --> 00:16:57,520
Speaker 1: Spice Girls claim it was because management were forcing them

292
00:16:57,680 --> 00:17:00,960
Speaker 1: to sign what they thought was really on uptable contract,

293
00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:04,639
Speaker 1: and the soon to be X management team claimed it

294
00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:07,159
Speaker 1: was because they were planning to throw out one of

295
00:17:07,200 --> 00:17:10,440
Speaker 1: the five Spice Girls and the intended victim knew it

296
00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:13,120
Speaker 1: and uh, the Spice Girl that was about to get

297
00:17:13,160 --> 00:17:16,720
Speaker 1: the axe basically played on the loyalty of her fellow

298
00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:18,840
Speaker 1: Spice Girls and said, let's get out of this and

299
00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:21,320
Speaker 1: just kind of amazing that they didn't say who it

300
00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:22,840
Speaker 1: was that they wanted to. I was gonna say, who

301
00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:24,520
Speaker 1: do you think it was? I don't know. The most

302
00:17:24,520 --> 00:17:26,840
Speaker 1: information that they gave was they said that she was

303
00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:29,639
Speaker 1: a strong enough character to persuade the other girls to

304
00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:34,000
Speaker 1: leave the management contract. And they also said, kind of catale,

305
00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:37,760
Speaker 1: you always find the least talented is the biggest danger

306
00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:41,600
Speaker 1: in the group. I mean, based on that, no shade,

307
00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:45,119
Speaker 1: but I kind of think it's Posh. I can't see

308
00:17:45,160 --> 00:17:51,040
Speaker 1: her as staging a you know, fast a walkout and

309
00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:55,320
Speaker 1: a heist, like stealing their their demo masters. I don't know, well,

310
00:17:55,320 --> 00:17:58,480
Speaker 1: because Posh didn't sing live right and she was like,

311
00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:00,480
Speaker 1: I'm not the best singer in the group, and if

312
00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:02,560
Speaker 1: I remember correctly, she was no great shakes as a

313
00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:06,960
Speaker 1: dancer either, so all she had with those cheekbones and

314
00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:11,800
Speaker 1: apparently I'm cutting way with a SoundBite, So, um, I

315
00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:14,760
Speaker 1: don't know. That's interesting. That's a real one for conjecture. Yeah,

316
00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:16,399
Speaker 1: so we don't know who was going to be the

317
00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:18,400
Speaker 1: spice girl that was supposedly going to get the ax.

318
00:18:18,560 --> 00:18:21,919
Speaker 1: But Jerry, Melcy and mel B paid a visit to

319
00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:27,520
Speaker 1: Heart management's offices where they absconded with the master recordings.

320
00:18:27,840 --> 00:18:29,359
Speaker 1: I don't even know if that's the right use of

321
00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:33,200
Speaker 1: the word absconded, but we're leaving that kidnapped, kidnapped, stole.

322
00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:36,240
Speaker 1: We'll just go with stole the demo recordings for the

323
00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:39,280
Speaker 1: songs they had written so far, including Wannabe. And they

324
00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:41,000
Speaker 1: met up with the rest of the Spice Girls at

325
00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:44,040
Speaker 1: the side of the road and drove up north. I mean,

326
00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:46,600
Speaker 1: this is a full on heist here, uh, and the

327
00:18:46,920 --> 00:18:51,280
Speaker 1: Son of a Bitch I'm in yeah, I mean, this

328
00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:54,320
Speaker 1: is the real Oceans eight here. This is like, it's

329
00:18:54,359 --> 00:18:56,639
Speaker 1: pretty incredible. And then they so they drove up north

330
00:18:57,040 --> 00:19:00,680
Speaker 1: where they booked their own sessions with some songwriters, negotiated

331
00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:05,000
Speaker 1: new management deal with Simon Fuller, who basically is the

332
00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:10,000
Speaker 1: king of British pop in the nineties. He created pop Idol,

333
00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:13,199
Speaker 1: which became American Idol in this country, X Factor. He

334
00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:16,600
Speaker 1: signed Madonna, Chrysalis, when Yeah, when he's an A and

335
00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:19,280
Speaker 1: R guy, I didn't really signed when he signed signed

336
00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:23,720
Speaker 1: on holiday, I did not realize that. Wow. So they

337
00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,399
Speaker 1: kind of they basically bought their way to freedom. They

338
00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:29,280
Speaker 1: paid off the original managers and signed with Simon Fuller.

339
00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:32,160
Speaker 1: Simon was persuaded to sign the group to his management

340
00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:35,359
Speaker 1: company after hearing one of the demos, and amazingly, it

341
00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:38,000
Speaker 1: wasn't want to be or say you'll be there, or

342
00:19:38,040 --> 00:19:41,600
Speaker 1: to become one. It was the more low key R

343
00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:44,680
Speaker 1: and B song, something kind of Funny, which is kind

344
00:19:44,680 --> 00:19:46,320
Speaker 1: of more of a deep cut. That was the song

345
00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:50,959
Speaker 1: that he really thought had hit potential. Yeah, no, it's

346
00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:54,719
Speaker 1: kind of a deep cut. The girls celebrated their record

347
00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:59,800
Speaker 1: deal by throwing Posh Spice's panties out of a taxi window,

348
00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:04,360
Speaker 1: as one does. They talked about this, Uh, I think

349
00:20:04,359 --> 00:20:06,439
Speaker 1: it was an article in the Guardian. Yeah, they were

350
00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:08,800
Speaker 1: so excited when they were signed with Virgin Records that

351
00:20:08,880 --> 00:20:12,359
Speaker 1: they tore victorious knickers off this is a quote and

352
00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:14,760
Speaker 1: through them out a taxi window. And speaking of the

353
00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:18,560
Speaker 1: Spice Girls underwear, the quintet had a real sort of

354
00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:21,600
Speaker 1: novel use for their knickers, as it were. In the

355
00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:26,320
Speaker 1: aforementioned interview with Rolling Stone, in they revealed that they

356
00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:29,200
Speaker 1: often didn't use scrunch ees to tie up their hair.

357
00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:33,640
Speaker 1: Instead they used their underwear, which was a trend apparently

358
00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:36,760
Speaker 1: inspired by mal b h. The girls revealed in this

359
00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:38,879
Speaker 1: interview that they used a G string that was their

360
00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:41,440
Speaker 1: favorite because there was less material to get in the

361
00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:44,000
Speaker 1: way of tying it. Um, probably, we'll get us out

362
00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:46,000
Speaker 1: of here. What's the next guy? We got good, lord,

363
00:20:46,119 --> 00:20:47,960
Speaker 1: let's get We're in the weeds here. We gotta get

364
00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:50,040
Speaker 1: out of here. Uh. Well, you can't talk about the

365
00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:54,320
Speaker 1: Spice Girls without talking about their nicknames. And none of

366
00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:58,000
Speaker 1: them came up with this or anyone involved that wasn't

367
00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:01,080
Speaker 1: part of the original structure of the group. Those incredible

368
00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:04,520
Speaker 1: and after signing with Simon follow they were interviewed by

369
00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:08,159
Speaker 1: Peter Lorraine for Top of the Pops magazine and this

370
00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:11,159
Speaker 1: was I remember these articles everywhere in the nineties like

371
00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:14,639
Speaker 1: teen Beat Tiger read these guides to the Spice Girls,

372
00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:17,240
Speaker 1: and you would get every single pop group had one.

373
00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:20,520
Speaker 1: You had, like their favorite food, their nickname for their

374
00:21:21,119 --> 00:21:25,400
Speaker 1: dog and anyway. So he said, we thought we could

375
00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:27,679
Speaker 1: make up some stupid names for them, but it was

376
00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:30,440
Speaker 1: never quote from him, by the way, Yeah, that was quote. Sorry,

377
00:21:30,560 --> 00:21:32,800
Speaker 1: that's Lorraine's quote. We thought we could make up some

378
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:36,040
Speaker 1: stupid names, but it was never meant to be adopted globally.

379
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:39,600
Speaker 1: They were going to call one of them old Spice

380
00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:45,400
Speaker 1: just hilarious, but he declined to mention who Yeah. Jennifer Cotherrne,

381
00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:49,200
Speaker 1: one of the magazine's staff writers, explained how the nicknames

382
00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:52,600
Speaker 1: were chosen. She said, and I quote, Victoria was posh

383
00:21:52,640 --> 00:21:55,639
Speaker 1: Spice because she was wearing Gucci style mini dresses and

384
00:21:55,680 --> 00:22:00,960
Speaker 1: seemed powdy and reserved. Emma wore pigtails and to lollipop,

385
00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:05,399
Speaker 1: so obviously she was baby Spice. Melci spent the whole

386
00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:08,080
Speaker 1: time leaping around in her track suit, so we called

387
00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:12,399
Speaker 1: her sporty Spice. I named Melby scary Spice because she

388
00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:17,040
Speaker 1: was so shouty, and Jerry was ginger Spice simply because

389
00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:20,080
Speaker 1: of her hair. Not much thought went into that one,

390
00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:26,360
Speaker 1: or any of them. Really, Baby Spice does not sit

391
00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:29,560
Speaker 1: well with me anyway. So Top of the Pops publishes

392
00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:33,119
Speaker 1: this article with an illustration of a spice rack and

393
00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:40,439
Speaker 1: lo and behold, a legend is minted. What do you

394
00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:47,359
Speaker 1: what do you say about this? Nicknames? Man? Um pretty rough? Uh?

395
00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:52,720
Speaker 1: Sexy baby? Yeah? The only black one's nickname is scary Yeah.

396
00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:56,119
Speaker 1: That that's the one that really because she was shouty.

397
00:22:56,240 --> 00:23:01,239
Speaker 1: Good lord, British people, man, all right, moving on uh

398
00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:08,639
Speaker 1: please tweeted that's using the hashtag sexy baby. Um. You

399
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:11,000
Speaker 1: mentioned this earlier, but it's ironic that they that the

400
00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:13,320
Speaker 1: whole part of this brand is every single one having

401
00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:17,560
Speaker 1: such a distinct personality, because originally they were pitched as

402
00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:21,240
Speaker 1: like sort of like the uniformly dressed group. You bring

403
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:23,600
Speaker 1: this up the early shots of the Beatles all in

404
00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 1: the matching suits. Uh. And as recently seen, Jerry was

405
00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:30,880
Speaker 1: talking about this, she told Marie Claire, we bought tight

406
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:33,560
Speaker 1: white vintage Adidas T shirts for everyone in the band

407
00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:35,800
Speaker 1: because when you're in a band, you should all look

408
00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:38,400
Speaker 1: the same, right, she says. We wore them at our

409
00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:40,760
Speaker 1: first ever performance for our family and friends and a

410
00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:44,840
Speaker 1: community center in Finchley neighborhood and hear the bile was

411
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:48,560
Speaker 1: rising at your throat the British names still, all the

412
00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:51,600
Speaker 1: all the neighborhood names are so funny to me. Uh.

413
00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:55,200
Speaker 1: It quickly became obvious that Victoria and Emma weren't exactly

414
00:23:55,240 --> 00:23:57,960
Speaker 1: comfortable in the T shirts we'd picked out. It was

415
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:00,640
Speaker 1: also obvious that the only way forward was to celebrate

416
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:06,040
Speaker 1: our individuality and let everyone be herself. So we did yes,

417
00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:08,760
Speaker 1: and that really this starts to get to the heart

418
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,920
Speaker 1: of girl power. The Spice Girls, they really started out

419
00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:13,920
Speaker 1: a sort of the female answer to all the boy

420
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:16,359
Speaker 1: bands who had been cluttering up the charts. I mean,

421
00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:18,159
Speaker 1: the new kids on the block and what have you.

422
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:20,639
Speaker 1: And this was pre Backstreet Boys and in Sync. But

423
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,639
Speaker 1: who are the other boy groups around this time? Boys?

424
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:27,960
Speaker 1: Two men would probably be, but they were actually yeah,

425
00:24:28,040 --> 00:24:30,280
Speaker 1: I mean they're like I think they were marketed as such,

426
00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:33,919
Speaker 1: like all wearing like the big baggy sweaters and like

427
00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:36,600
Speaker 1: that kind of thing. But would have been new kids

428
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:39,960
Speaker 1: would have been the biggest phenomenon at the time, right, Yeah,

429
00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 1: maybe new addition, although that was probably a little a

430
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:44,879
Speaker 1: little further back than that. But uh. But so the

431
00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:47,119
Speaker 1: Spice Girls were kind of marketed as sort of an

432
00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:49,720
Speaker 1: answer to these boy bands, and the idea seems really

433
00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:53,560
Speaker 1: obvious now, But when They're pr first started toting this

434
00:24:53,600 --> 00:24:56,960
Speaker 1: group around the team magazines, no one was interested. And

435
00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,760
Speaker 1: the rationale was that girls don't want to see girls

436
00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:01,960
Speaker 1: in hands, they want to see good looking boys to

437
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:05,879
Speaker 1: pin up on their walls, which is an insanely reductive

438
00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:10,320
Speaker 1: approach to how people appreciate music. And the magazines were wrong,

439
00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 1: as it happens. And this was due not just because

440
00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:15,520
Speaker 1: of the quality the songs, which are so great, but also,

441
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:18,160
Speaker 1: it has to be said, because of the whole message

442
00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:21,080
Speaker 1: of girl power, which was such an instrumental part of

443
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:25,439
Speaker 1: the group's image, uh and just something that cropped up

444
00:25:25,440 --> 00:25:26,919
Speaker 1: in all the interviews they gave. It was just a

445
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,240
Speaker 1: big part of their story. And it's difficult to imagine

446
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:32,879
Speaker 1: this now, but five women in a band sharing equal

447
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:36,359
Speaker 1: vocals and songwriting credits. This was a novel concept in

448
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:40,080
Speaker 1: the mid nineties. And obviously they were manufactured, you know,

449
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:43,160
Speaker 1: in quotes to some degree. But the Spice Girls were

450
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:46,359
Speaker 1: the quintessential girl gang. You know. They were working class

451
00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:50,679
Speaker 1: women projecting individualism and spreading the word about feminism that

452
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 1: was understandable and palatable to their teenage fans. And the

453
00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:58,120
Speaker 1: Spice was particular approach to girl power was seen as

454
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 1: the sort of boisterous, independ and sex positive response to

455
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:05,880
Speaker 1: something called lad culture, which is more of a British thing.

456
00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:08,399
Speaker 1: It didn't really make it too much over into the States.

457
00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:12,040
Speaker 1: If you aren't familiar, right, it's like it's like the

458
00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:16,359
Speaker 1: notion of like it's like meathead, like loudish. I mean,

459
00:26:16,359 --> 00:26:20,000
Speaker 1: think you on Liam Gallagher, like whacking themselves with guitars

460
00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:22,600
Speaker 1: like cricket bats and then dumping points of beer over

461
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:26,680
Speaker 1: each other's heads. I mean, that's that's lad culture and

462
00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:30,480
Speaker 1: the Spice girls, you know, saying about putting their friends

463
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:33,959
Speaker 1: before boyfriends, and about having confidence in yourself and not

464
00:26:34,040 --> 00:26:37,280
Speaker 1: letting people put them down, and kind of most importantly,

465
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:39,880
Speaker 1: they seem to just be having a blast. I mean,

466
00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:41,600
Speaker 1: I mentioned this at the start of the episode. I mean,

467
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:44,240
Speaker 1: it was that whole thing that the Beatles sort of embodied.

468
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:46,199
Speaker 1: Where did they just look like they were having the

469
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:49,320
Speaker 1: time of their lives whatever they were doing, they were

470
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 1: just at like the top of their game and everything.

471
00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:54,879
Speaker 1: They were just on the buzz of their fame, and

472
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:57,600
Speaker 1: it just seemed like they were really enjoying themselves and

473
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:00,520
Speaker 1: that was just so infectious. And you know, I'm mean, obviously,

474
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 1: there have been critics, especially at the time, who dismissed

475
00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:08,199
Speaker 1: Girl Power as basically a shallow marketing tactic, and you know,

476
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:12,160
Speaker 1: went even further and accused the group of commercializing feminism,

477
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:14,560
Speaker 1: as you know, as a way to sell records. But

478
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:17,640
Speaker 1: to a generation of young women at the time, that

479
00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:20,959
Speaker 1: message stuck, and you know, it was the first step

480
00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:25,359
Speaker 1: in a lot of people's education towards feminism. I didn't

481
00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:28,960
Speaker 1: realize this, uh Hallowell said that she didn't come across

482
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:34,800
Speaker 1: the term girl power until the single by Shampoo. And

483
00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:40,480
Speaker 1: this is funny to a week before Wannabe hits the charts.

484
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:43,760
Speaker 1: This band Shampoo has a single come out called girl power,

485
00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:46,360
Speaker 1: and they were They were eclipsed by those who they

486
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,680
Speaker 1: by those they spawned. Yeah. I think the whole girl

487
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 1: power slogan I think you're out of like the riot

488
00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 1: girl movement, and I think was first coined by Bikini Kill.

489
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,480
Speaker 1: It was interesting. The late feminist writer Kathy Acker interviewed

490
00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:04,240
Speaker 1: the Spice Girls for The Guardian, and early on in

491
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 1: her Peace, she summed up the period feminism, especially to

492
00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:12,320
Speaker 1: female intellectuals, had become extinct. Where of all the women

493
00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:15,520
Speaker 1: gone to? She asked? Then came a twist named the

494
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:19,280
Speaker 1: Spice Girls. The Spices, though they deny it, are babes,

495
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:23,159
Speaker 1: the blonde, the redhead, the dark, sultry fashion model, and

496
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:26,760
Speaker 1: they're more. They both are and represent a voice that

497
00:28:26,800 --> 00:28:30,119
Speaker 1: has too long been repressed. The voices not really the

498
00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:34,040
Speaker 1: voice of young women, and just as important, of women

499
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:38,120
Speaker 1: not from the educated classes. The Spice Girls and girls

500
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 1: like them and the girls who liked them resemble their

501
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:45,960
Speaker 1: American counterparts in two ways. They're sexually curious, certainly pro sects,

502
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,120
Speaker 1: and they do not feel that they are stupid or

503
00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:50,200
Speaker 1: that they should not be heard because they didn't attend

504
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 1: the right universities. If any of the speculation is valid,

505
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 1: then it is up to feminism to grow, to take

506
00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:59,000
Speaker 1: on what the Spice Girls and women like them are saying,

507
00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:01,680
Speaker 1: and to do what feminism has always done in England,

508
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:05,640
Speaker 1: to keep on transforming society as society is best transformed

509
00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:11,080
Speaker 1: with lightness and enjoy. That's a great quote, it is. Yeah,

510
00:29:11,280 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 1: it's a great piece. That's Kathy Acker in The Guardian.

511
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:17,760
Speaker 1: A google and check it out. It's a really great article. Alright,

512
00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:20,560
Speaker 1: so Jordan's in their own words, what was girl powder

513
00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 1: to the Spice Girls? Yes, there was an interview also

514
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:27,160
Speaker 1: from nine, also in the Guardian by Cheryl Garratt I

515
00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:28,920
Speaker 1: think her name is, where she asked each of the

516
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:32,239
Speaker 1: Spice Girls what their definition of girl power is and

517
00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 1: Victoria said, it's looking at yourself in the mirror and

518
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 1: saying this is me. I'm going to make the best

519
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:39,920
Speaker 1: of it. I'm going to have fun. I'm going to

520
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:42,560
Speaker 1: have a positive attitude and not going to be dominated

521
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:46,640
Speaker 1: by anyone, especially not men. We're up for equality for

522
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:50,320
Speaker 1: having a laugh. Melby says, it's giving yourself that little

523
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:52,920
Speaker 1: bit of liberation. If you want to stand up and

524
00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 1: go arg then do it. You decide the kind of

525
00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:59,600
Speaker 1: life you want to lead, whether you're black, white, gay,

526
00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:02,520
Speaker 1: single parent, whatever, just go for it. I don't think

527
00:30:02,560 --> 00:30:04,720
Speaker 1: I even realized the class component to the Spice Girls.

528
00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:07,000
Speaker 1: I actually really like that definitely as a really interesting

529
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 1: nuance to it. Mel C said this, there is a

530
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:14,840
Speaker 1: new attitude. Girls are taking control. If you want to

531
00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: wear a short skirt, then you go on and wear it.

532
00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:19,600
Speaker 1: You should wear what you want. It's worth noting that

533
00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:23,040
Speaker 1: Melc also has a girl power tattoo or words of

534
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:25,200
Speaker 1: that effect. She's a tattoo and her upper right arm,

535
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:29,160
Speaker 1: and it's two Japanese symbols women and strength, So girl power.

536
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:32,640
Speaker 1: In other words, what did Jerry say about girl power?

537
00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:36,959
Speaker 1: None of us are conventional beauties which come on and

538
00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:39,920
Speaker 1: in a way and in a way that's really inspiring

539
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 1: for girls because it shows you don't have to be

540
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,560
Speaker 1: gorgeous to be up there doing it. That's the one

541
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:46,480
Speaker 1: that rings the falsest to me. I mean, we're two

542
00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:48,080
Speaker 1: straight white guys. I'm not really going to weigh in

543
00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 1: on their definition of feminism, but calling none of the

544
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:55,480
Speaker 1: Spice Girls conventional beauties feels like a stretch to me.

545
00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:59,160
Speaker 1: And finally, Emma says, the message we're putting across is

546
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:02,000
Speaker 1: we're doing it girls. So can you even if you

547
00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 1: have to shout a bit louder barge through all these people,

548
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:07,000
Speaker 1: then do it. And you know, there are all these

549
00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:09,080
Speaker 1: jokes at the time when the Spice Girls came out

550
00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:10,840
Speaker 1: that oh you know, it took a boardroom full of

551
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 1: male music executives and marketing gurus to come up with

552
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:16,840
Speaker 1: the concept of girl power. And that's not true. I

553
00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:18,760
Speaker 1: mean it. As you mentioned earlier, this was a slogan

554
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 1: that grew out of the riot girl movement and it

555
00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:25,040
Speaker 1: was initially coined by the US punk band Bikini Kill.

556
00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 1: I wonder if favorite cross paths gonna guess no, yeah,

557
00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 1: the Spice Girls come in and hit Olympia Washington, the

558
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:38,920
Speaker 1: d i y circuit. As you meditate on that, we'll

559
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:42,200
Speaker 1: be right back with more too much information after these messages,

560
00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:01,360
Speaker 1: you know, who was a who the Spice Girls cited

561
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:07,600
Speaker 1: as a pioneer of girl power. Highel who Jordan's Margaret

562
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:10,800
Speaker 1: Thatcher first female prime minister. I guess when you view

563
00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 1: it with that single fact to oid first female prime

564
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:18,000
Speaker 1: minister of England, that's pretty cool. But then when you

565
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 1: dive in much more, uh yeah, I mean, what's the

566
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:26,000
Speaker 1: reader's digest version of Margaret Thatcher. She destroyed the mining

567
00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:30,000
Speaker 1: unions in Wales, in Scotland, she got architect of the

568
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:34,640
Speaker 1: Falklands War. Whatever. Please read this so that I can

569
00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 1: choke down my bile. Yes. There was an interview that

570
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:41,320
Speaker 1: the Spice Girls gave to a what's traditionally seen as

571
00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:44,240
Speaker 1: a right wing magazine called The Spectator just after their

572
00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:47,680
Speaker 1: first album came out. When the Spicycles were asked about

573
00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:53,440
Speaker 1: conservative ex Prime Minister Argret Thatcher and Ginger Spice proudly announced,

574
00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:56,920
Speaker 1: we Spice Girls are true. Thatcher rights. That's the quote.

575
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 1: She went on to suggests that Thatcher still a pretty,

576
00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:04,040
Speaker 1: I can't even say a divisive figure, a figure pretty

577
00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:06,560
Speaker 1: much of scorn of most of the youth of Britain

578
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:10,000
Speaker 1: at this time. Jerry called her the original Spice Girl.

579
00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:15,480
Speaker 1: The pioneer of her ideology girl power. Uh posh. I

580
00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:18,280
Speaker 1: guess weighed in on this too. We met Tony Blair.

581
00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:20,480
Speaker 1: His hair is all right, but we don't agree with

582
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:25,280
Speaker 1: this tax policies. Um. This was like a whole miniature

583
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 1: scandal all the time about the Spice Girls being uh

584
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:32,000
Speaker 1: conservatives and although sport. He later said in a different interview,

585
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:34,280
Speaker 1: and this is her quote, I think Thatcher is a

586
00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:38,080
Speaker 1: complete prick. So my favorite quote on Margaret Thatcher of

587
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:41,840
Speaker 1: all time is this a comedian named Frankie Boyle. He

588
00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 1: was talking about the funeral for Margaret Thatcher and how

589
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:46,600
Speaker 1: much it cost three million pounds and he said, three

590
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 1: million for the funeral of Margaret Thatcher. For three million,

591
00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 1: you could give everyone in Scotland to shovel and we

592
00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:53,600
Speaker 1: could dig a hole so deep we could hand her

593
00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:56,440
Speaker 1: over to Satan in person. I love Frankie bole So

594
00:33:56,600 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 1: I mean, when when this whole interview with this conservative

595
00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:01,880
Speaker 1: magazine came out, the news papers went absolutely nuts, and

596
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:04,440
Speaker 1: the Spice Girls were on the front page of all

597
00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,959
Speaker 1: these British tabloids and there were articles for weeks in

598
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:12,560
Speaker 1: every newspaper debating the significance of the Spice girls political positions,

599
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:16,000
Speaker 1: and three of the Spice Girls had very divergent views.

600
00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:20,680
Speaker 1: Melcy was labor which is like democrats here, Melby described

601
00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 1: herself as an anarchist and how much Emma Goldman did

602
00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:29,480
Speaker 1: you read Melby like talk to me about your oh

603
00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:33,600
Speaker 1: my god, and Emma has declared herself uninterested in politics.

604
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:35,400
Speaker 1: But yeah, the message that was picked up was that

605
00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:40,160
Speaker 1: the Spice Girls were basically a conservative trojan horse and

606
00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:44,080
Speaker 1: this was like discussed on the floor of Parliament. They

607
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 1: became known as the Spice Vote, which was basically became

608
00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:50,360
Speaker 1: as much of an issue in the British election in

609
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,400
Speaker 1: as like the soccer mom's vote had been in America.

610
00:34:54,680 --> 00:34:57,839
Speaker 1: And uh, on May one, Britain elected Tony Blair as

611
00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:01,120
Speaker 1: a new Prime minister by a landslide, and after all that,

612
00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:05,040
Speaker 1: none of the Spice schools voted. That's truly the perfect

613
00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:10,600
Speaker 1: capstone to this. Well, speaking of toilets, uh, one of

614
00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:13,160
Speaker 1: the most famous bits of the Spice Girl's lore may

615
00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:16,200
Speaker 1: have been inspired by Melby's trip to the toilet. Well,

616
00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:23,200
Speaker 1: that's right, I'm talking about the phrase zig zig ah okay,

617
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,640
Speaker 1: so wanna be you know, the opening riff to that

618
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:34,640
Speaker 1: is inspired by Summer Nights in Greece Bam Bama Bay,

619
00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:38,240
Speaker 1: the guy named with the tremendously British name of Richard

620
00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:43,160
Speaker 1: Biff Stannard and his musical collaborator Matt Rowe, written under

621
00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:45,840
Speaker 1: an hour group received writing credits on it, so was

622
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:50,040
Speaker 1: a collaborative work. Halliwell in particular inspired a ton of stuff.

623
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:52,440
Speaker 1: She would jot down a bunch of ideas in a notebook,

624
00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:57,640
Speaker 1: different scribblings, different jokes, lyrics, song titles, and mel B

625
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:01,319
Speaker 1: wrote the here's the story from a to z app Uh.

626
00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:05,400
Speaker 1: She wrote it in the toilet in eight minutes, and

627
00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 1: she's credited for Ziggazig go ahead Jordan's Yeah, we could

628
00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:14,280
Speaker 1: tag team this one. But there are many, many, many,

629
00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:18,359
Speaker 1: many theories about what exactly zig Zigga really means. Some

630
00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:21,960
Speaker 1: critics have theorized that it was about female sexual desire.

631
00:36:22,440 --> 00:36:25,640
Speaker 1: There's the musicologist Sheila Whitely said that it was a

632
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:30,240
Speaker 1: made up phrase, the kind of Lewis Carroll invented, like jabberwockie,

633
00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:34,600
Speaker 1: which is, yeah, that's that's a very um generous read

634
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:37,239
Speaker 1: of what zig zigov probably means. And this, this whole

635
00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:40,759
Speaker 1: theory gained a lot of purchase in when Melci told

636
00:36:40,800 --> 00:36:42,520
Speaker 1: the journalists, you know when you're in a gang and

637
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:45,000
Speaker 1: you're having a laugh and you're making up silly words. Well,

638
00:36:45,080 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 1: we were having a giggle and we made up the

639
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:52,920
Speaker 1: silly words zig zig ah and what are some other theories? Heigel, Well, Jordan,

640
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:54,840
Speaker 1: I'm so glad you asked. Some people have pitched it

641
00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:58,920
Speaker 1: as being shorthand for sucker, which is yeah, as well

642
00:36:58,960 --> 00:37:02,239
Speaker 1: as care. This brings us back to the toilet. Yeah,

643
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:05,040
Speaker 1: so Moby says, working in the same studio as them,

644
00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:07,680
Speaker 1: there was an eighties pop singer who she didn't name,

645
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:11,160
Speaker 1: who was smoking a cigar in the toilet. Who was it?

646
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:14,360
Speaker 1: Was it? Richard Marks, Phil Collins, Mike from Mike and

647
00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:18,120
Speaker 1: the Mechanics, one of the Mechanics. It's probably a basis

648
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:23,160
Speaker 1: David uh And one of the guys who co wrote

649
00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:25,880
Speaker 1: the song, Richard Stannard, says, it does mean something, but

650
00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:29,759
Speaker 1: we're never going to tell anyone what. I'll say one thing,

651
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:34,120
Speaker 1: it's quite rude. So in the annals of pop music,

652
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:37,399
Speaker 1: question Marks, it's probably up there with your so vain

653
00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:42,319
Speaker 1: as far as and yeah being about Dave Coulier or not.

654
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:45,960
Speaker 1: And you know, despite all that, they didn't even want

655
00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:49,080
Speaker 1: it to be the lead single. That is absolutely nuts

656
00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:52,120
Speaker 1: to me. I mean, yeah, apparently the record company I

657
00:37:52,320 --> 00:37:55,000
Speaker 1: just didn't think that Want to Be was the song

658
00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 1: to launch the group, and they wanted to use the

659
00:37:57,320 --> 00:38:01,359
Speaker 1: song love Thing, which I mean, I hate to call

660
00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:03,040
Speaker 1: it a deep cut because Spicy Schools don't have that

661
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:07,240
Speaker 1: many songs, but it's not one of their better known ones.

662
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:10,839
Speaker 1: And I guess the group, sort of led by Mail

663
00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:13,960
Speaker 1: b and Jerry Halliwell, were so adamant that their debut

664
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:17,680
Speaker 1: song should be want to Be that Hallowell apparently told

665
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:20,279
Speaker 1: Simon Fuller, their manager, you know, it's not negotiable as

666
00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:22,600
Speaker 1: far as we're concerned. Want to Be is our first single.

667
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 1: So they really put their foot down and they got

668
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 1: their way, and it's they were right, and they were

669
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:31,919
Speaker 1: absolutely right because the song broke a thirty two year

670
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:35,640
Speaker 1: old Beatles record on its release. Uh. In addition to

671
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:39,840
Speaker 1: the many commercial plot it's received, I Want to Be

672
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:44,040
Speaker 1: entered the US Hot one hundred at number eleven, and

673
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:46,440
Speaker 1: it remains the highest debut on the chart by a

674
00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:49,439
Speaker 1: brand new British act, and the Beatles have previously held

675
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:52,080
Speaker 1: this record from four When I Want To Hold your

676
00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:54,759
Speaker 1: Hand debut at number twelve. What do you say about

677
00:38:54,760 --> 00:38:59,879
Speaker 1: want to Be? Um It is indelible pop song um Si,

678
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:03,280
Speaker 1: typically proven to be the catchiest song of all time,

679
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:06,840
Speaker 1: according to a two fourteen study by the University of

680
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:12,799
Speaker 1: Amsterdam and Manchester's Museum of Science and Industry. Participants in

681
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:15,600
Speaker 1: this project identified want to Be in just two point

682
00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:19,319
Speaker 1: to nine seconds, probably due to the laugh that she

683
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:21,600
Speaker 1: does at the start of the track, which talk about

684
00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:27,480
Speaker 1: uh right, yeah. What other songs did this beat? Jordan's

685
00:39:27,480 --> 00:39:32,720
Speaker 1: It beat lou Bega's Mambo number five, which was recognized

686
00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:36,280
Speaker 1: in two point four eight seconds, as opposed to Wanna

687
00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:39,239
Speaker 1: Be two point to nine, and it also beat I

688
00:39:39,440 --> 00:39:43,000
Speaker 1: of the Tiger by Survivor, which clocked in at being

689
00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:46,880
Speaker 1: recognized after just two point six two seconds. I refuse

690
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:50,360
Speaker 1: to believe you can't identify the Tiger from a downbeat

691
00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:54,279
Speaker 1: of that song, Like that's one of the most recognizable

692
00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:57,760
Speaker 1: openings of all time. But you know, another person who

693
00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:01,880
Speaker 1: finds want to Be catchy is Jerry because she's sang

694
00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:06,080
Speaker 1: it at her own wedding to f one racing boss

695
00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:09,200
Speaker 1: Christian Horner, And I guess she played like a ballad

696
00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:13,400
Speaker 1: version like what's the like the slow moving torch song

697
00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:16,640
Speaker 1: version of Wanna Be? Yeah, I mean, because the song

698
00:40:17,360 --> 00:40:21,279
Speaker 1: sung to a man is kind of a threat, so

699
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:23,120
Speaker 1: I guess I haven't really thought too much about it

700
00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:29,600
Speaker 1: until right now. But anyway, speaking of harmonicas, moving off

701
00:40:29,640 --> 00:40:33,480
Speaker 1: of Wanna Be to another incredible track on The Spicycle's debuts,

702
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,120
Speaker 1: Say You'll Be There. You know, the harmonica solo on

703
00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:38,399
Speaker 1: that song was played by the same guy who played

704
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:42,640
Speaker 1: the harmonica break on Karma Chameleon. Like Culture Club, I

705
00:40:42,680 --> 00:40:44,840
Speaker 1: love that. I mean, there aren't too many harmonica solos

706
00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:48,280
Speaker 1: in the Top forty in the last twenty issue years.

707
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 1: But harmonicist, if that's what you call somebody who plays

708
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:56,560
Speaker 1: a harmonicas, that sounds right. Harmonicist Judd Lander can like

709
00:40:56,719 --> 00:40:59,920
Speaker 1: claim on playing two harmonica solos on top forty hit

710
00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:03,439
Speaker 1: in the last probably thirty years at this point. But yes,

711
00:41:03,560 --> 00:41:06,080
Speaker 1: jud Lander played the harmonica solo on both Say You'll

712
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 1: Be There and Culture Club's Karma Chameleon. Um Say You'll

713
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:13,719
Speaker 1: Be There also borrows from an obscure nineties R and

714
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 1: B track. This is so funny to me because like

715
00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:18,600
Speaker 1: there's always these lawsuits that come out with a big song.

716
00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:21,000
Speaker 1: But this is truly one of the most bizarre cases,

717
00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:24,560
Speaker 1: so please yes. Not long after Say You'll be There

718
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:26,960
Speaker 1: enter the charts, it became the target of a few

719
00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:31,359
Speaker 1: plagiarism cases, and the first came in December, when an

720
00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:35,200
Speaker 1: Israeli soldier named a Deep sheetschman I think it's how

721
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:37,759
Speaker 1: you say her name, accused the group of copying her

722
00:41:37,800 --> 00:41:42,680
Speaker 1: song bow a Lie, which translates to come to me uh.

723
00:41:42,719 --> 00:41:44,919
Speaker 1: And this was realleast two years before we Say You'll

724
00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:48,800
Speaker 1: be There in Israel, and her lawyers threatened to sue,

725
00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:52,360
Speaker 1: and a spokesman for the Spice Girls later declared, where

726
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:56,120
Speaker 1: there's a hit, there's a writ there's always someone who

727
00:41:56,160 --> 00:41:58,480
Speaker 1: crawls out of the woodwork claiming to have written a

728
00:41:58,560 --> 00:42:01,120
Speaker 1: hit song. We look for were to seeing her in court.

729
00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:03,879
Speaker 1: Um I think they settled. I'm not actually sure how

730
00:42:03,920 --> 00:42:06,799
Speaker 1: that one left off. But there was another lawsuit from

731
00:42:06,800 --> 00:42:10,560
Speaker 1: an American singer songwriter named Jonathan David Buck who goes

732
00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:13,480
Speaker 1: by John B. And his lawsuit was a little bit

733
00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:16,439
Speaker 1: more successful. He claimed that the chorus of say You'll

734
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:18,479
Speaker 1: Be There was similar to an R and B track

735
00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:22,399
Speaker 1: he'd written for a group called After Seven called what

736
00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:26,400
Speaker 1: are you to me? Very prince like it's let her you?

737
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:28,880
Speaker 1: Let her are number two me? What are you to me?

738
00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:32,000
Speaker 1: And you can check this out on YouTube. There are

739
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:35,719
Speaker 1: definitely a lot of similarities, and there's enough similarities that

740
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:38,640
Speaker 1: I think he ended up having his name added to

741
00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:41,440
Speaker 1: the song's credits when it was reissued in later years.

742
00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 1: So there's that. But I mean, in the analys of

743
00:42:46,440 --> 00:42:51,319
Speaker 1: pop music plagiarism lawsuits, surely this song stands alone in

744
00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:55,799
Speaker 1: having acclaim against it levied by an Israeli soldier. Yeah. No,

745
00:42:55,920 --> 00:42:57,600
Speaker 1: that's a new one. I've never heard that. I don't

746
00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 1: know do we know how that one? How that left? No?

747
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:03,759
Speaker 1: I actually just googled her and yeah, I can't find

748
00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:06,440
Speaker 1: that it got settled. Well, whatever it was, it went away,

749
00:43:06,760 --> 00:43:09,400
Speaker 1: which is probably all the spiceman all what Simon Fuller

750
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:12,840
Speaker 1: ever wanted. It's true. Uh, speaking of say You'll be

751
00:43:12,880 --> 00:43:18,120
Speaker 1: There and sun Stroke, Yes, I mean Say You'll be

752
00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:22,839
Speaker 1: There has a really amazing video that would do who

753
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 1: would it do? Proud Bruce Lee? No? Get dare you

754
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:34,239
Speaker 1: bring up Bruce Lee's name? Keep his name out of

755
00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:39,239
Speaker 1: your mouth? Well, okay, it's Bruce Lee, as done by

756
00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 1: Quentin Tarantino casting a sportish pop group, we'll go with that.

757
00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:46,480
Speaker 1: And Emma Bunton was the m v P of the

758
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:49,960
Speaker 1: shoot because she was trained in karate. Baby Spice was

759
00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:53,239
Speaker 1: trained in karate because her mom was an instructor, so

760
00:43:53,280 --> 00:43:54,520
Speaker 1: she was kind of the one on to say it

761
00:43:54,520 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 1: will be their shoot. The taught the other girls had

762
00:43:56,680 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 1: a you know, properly kick and punch and this These

763
00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:02,479
Speaker 1: girls really pushed themselves to the limit for their work.

764
00:44:03,000 --> 00:44:05,440
Speaker 1: They shot this video in the desert, the middle of

765
00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:09,920
Speaker 1: Mojave Desert from five am to nine pm, and Victoria

766
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:12,239
Speaker 1: was like standing on the hood of a car in

767
00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:14,160
Speaker 1: the middle of the desert. You know, I mean that's

768
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:16,359
Speaker 1: just like a hot plate, and you mean you are

769
00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 1: an aunt on a sidewalk and they're doing that basically,

770
00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:21,040
Speaker 1: And she was doing that for like forty minutes at

771
00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:23,400
Speaker 1: a stretch and she later said you could ring the

772
00:44:23,480 --> 00:44:25,880
Speaker 1: sweat out of the cat suit she was wearing. Afterwards,

773
00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:31,359
Speaker 1: she was so hot. I was trying to speak as

774
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:33,160
Speaker 1: quickly as I could and not give you it in

775
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:37,719
Speaker 1: there anyway. Unfortunately, Baby Spice couldn't stand the heat and

776
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:41,720
Speaker 1: ended up collapsing due to sunstroke after doing her martial

777
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:43,680
Speaker 1: arts moves in the middle of the desert all day,

778
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:46,160
Speaker 1: and despite this, she later said that it was her

779
00:44:46,200 --> 00:44:49,520
Speaker 1: favorite Spice Girls video, which suggests some kind of Stockholm

780
00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 1: syndrome because that sounds absolutely awful. Speaking of grueling video shoots, yes,

781
00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:58,640
Speaker 1: the video for Wanna be one of the most unforgettable

782
00:44:58,719 --> 00:45:01,520
Speaker 1: videos in the nineties. Really they're they're just tearing up

783
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:04,759
Speaker 1: a fancy hotel in London. It was originally gonna be

784
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:08,520
Speaker 1: shot at a house in Barcelona, but the director Johann

785
00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 1: Comments failed to get permission for this house in Spain,

786
00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:15,440
Speaker 1: so the shoot was relocated much more locally to the

787
00:45:15,480 --> 00:45:18,920
Speaker 1: Midland Grand Hotel in London. It's still there. It's uh

788
00:45:19,160 --> 00:45:21,880
Speaker 1: by St Pancras Station up in North London if you

789
00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:23,759
Speaker 1: ever want to visit. I think that staircase is still

790
00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:26,640
Speaker 1: all there. But that wasn't the only minor downgrade going

791
00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:30,760
Speaker 1: from Spain to just locally in London. They initially approached

792
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:35,680
Speaker 1: Tony Blair two guests in this video. Um, I guess

793
00:45:35,800 --> 00:45:38,560
Speaker 1: Jerry Hollowell approached the I don't think he was Prime

794
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:40,520
Speaker 1: Minister just yet. I think it was before he was

795
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:44,439
Speaker 1: elected at the brit Awards when the group were still

796
00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:47,120
Speaker 1: basically nobody's and she went up to and said, Mr Blair,

797
00:45:47,160 --> 00:45:49,359
Speaker 1: I'm Jerry and I'm in an old girl band. We're

798
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:51,760
Speaker 1: gonna be huge. We're about to make our first video.

799
00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:55,560
Speaker 1: Would you be interested in appearing in it? And apparently

800
00:45:55,640 --> 00:45:58,680
Speaker 1: he was not, which is a shame because that would

801
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:01,560
Speaker 1: have just been the perfect cool Britannia touch at that

802
00:46:01,600 --> 00:46:03,400
Speaker 1: time if they got Tony Blair to be on their

803
00:46:03,480 --> 00:46:06,120
Speaker 1: music video for Wanna Be. This is truly wild. Do

804
00:46:06,239 --> 00:46:09,560
Speaker 1: you know the other music video that Johann Commits directed,

805
00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:14,799
Speaker 1: No Save Tonight by Eagle a Cherry No Where, Yeah,

806
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:18,200
Speaker 1: no way. That was the only two he's done well,

807
00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:22,160
Speaker 1: really incredible. Well, apparently he was in August of two thousand.

808
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:24,480
Speaker 1: He was just like out on a night of the

809
00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:27,920
Speaker 1: town in Manhattan, was crossing the street and he was

810
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:31,879
Speaker 1: hit by an suv. The driver of the suv had

811
00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:35,560
Speaker 1: been shot in a gang incident and was trying to

812
00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:38,839
Speaker 1: flee the scene, but lost control of the vehicle and

813
00:46:38,920 --> 00:46:42,359
Speaker 1: drove it up onto the sidewalk, killing Cammits. And then

814
00:46:42,400 --> 00:46:45,239
Speaker 1: that driver died from his gunshot wounds. I guess the

815
00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:47,080
Speaker 1: guy was more of an ad guy. I mean he

816
00:46:47,239 --> 00:46:51,319
Speaker 1: gone Advertising Industry Awards for doing ads for Nike and Volkswagen.

817
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:56,560
Speaker 1: That is that is really interesting. Wow. Um, hard to

818
00:46:56,680 --> 00:47:02,000
Speaker 1: really cut back to, uh, to the the lighthearted want

819
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:04,640
Speaker 1: to be video, But yeah, this shoot was it was

820
00:47:04,680 --> 00:47:06,600
Speaker 1: extremely low budget. It was around I think it was

821
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:09,160
Speaker 1: a hundred and sixty six thousand dollars, which is cheap

822
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:10,960
Speaker 1: for these sort of things. And it was cheap enough

823
00:47:11,000 --> 00:47:14,320
Speaker 1: that the Spice girls actually dressed themselves. Um Jerry wore

824
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:16,759
Speaker 1: a twenty dollar outfit she got from a notting Hill

825
00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:20,279
Speaker 1: flea market reportedly. And the music video it appears to

826
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:22,000
Speaker 1: be shot in one take. That's like one of the

827
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:25,840
Speaker 1: things that's cool about it. I think they actually spliced

828
00:47:25,880 --> 00:47:28,960
Speaker 1: it together. There's there's two very subtle edits that occur,

829
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,400
Speaker 1: but it's still pretty amazing. And they rehearsed it to

830
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:35,560
Speaker 1: be done in one take, so they worked really hard

831
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:39,279
Speaker 1: to work out through this entire elaborate ballet, not just

832
00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:42,480
Speaker 1: with the you know, the actors Spice girls doing the thing,

833
00:47:42,520 --> 00:47:44,759
Speaker 1: but having to get the cameraman with the with the

834
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:47,319
Speaker 1: steady cam going. It's funny that this was so cheap

835
00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:52,160
Speaker 1: because this isn't the era that music videos were expensive. Um,

836
00:47:52,200 --> 00:47:56,480
Speaker 1: just a year earlier, the Scream video, which was Michael

837
00:47:56,520 --> 00:48:02,120
Speaker 1: Jackson and Janet Jackson. That video cost even million dollars.

838
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:04,400
Speaker 1: Still the most expensive video. It is it is. Do

839
00:48:04,400 --> 00:48:08,520
Speaker 1: you know who has the next three entries in this list? Madonna?

840
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:12,359
Speaker 1: I guess Katie Perry, Oh, Madonna. But Joseph Cohn, who

841
00:48:12,360 --> 00:48:14,600
Speaker 1: did a bunch of those Katie Perry videos, has seven

842
00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:18,359
Speaker 1: of the top most expensive ones. Unsurprisingly, Michael Jackson has

843
00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:20,920
Speaker 1: a boatload. Here's a weird one that pops up in

844
00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:25,520
Speaker 1: the middle, the Fred Durst directed clip for the song

845
00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:30,400
Speaker 1: Roland from two thousand, budget of three million dollars to

846
00:48:30,440 --> 00:48:35,240
Speaker 1: make a video for that. Wow. Yeah. So anyway, Uh,

847
00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:38,400
Speaker 1: it was apparently very cold in this hotel and they

848
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:40,400
Speaker 1: didn't want to do it anymore takes and than they

849
00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:45,120
Speaker 1: had to. Um and uh, it was apparently quite cold

850
00:48:45,200 --> 00:48:48,839
Speaker 1: in there. And why was that? Well you can see

851
00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:54,560
Speaker 1: you can see quote Wikipedia, Wikipedia, Brown's erect nipples. Uh,

852
00:48:54,600 --> 00:48:57,279
Speaker 1: and you know mel c can probably be in there

853
00:48:57,360 --> 00:49:03,360
Speaker 1: as well. So this uh, wardrobe, I guess we'll loosely

854
00:49:03,480 --> 00:49:07,359
Speaker 1: term it a wardrobe bow function actually have fairly dire consequences.

855
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:11,520
Speaker 1: Because dire, we'll say, I'll say dire in quote suggesting

856
00:49:11,600 --> 00:49:14,680
Speaker 1: anything and this has dire consequences When the director was

857
00:49:14,760 --> 00:49:18,640
Speaker 1: later killed in a freak accident. Is feels like a

858
00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:23,560
Speaker 1: cognitive disconnect, but go off, okay, fair, yes, m. The

859
00:49:23,680 --> 00:49:27,520
Speaker 1: video was actually banned in some Asian countries for this

860
00:49:27,880 --> 00:49:31,160
Speaker 1: what i'll I guess i'll loosely term a this wardrobe

861
00:49:31,200 --> 00:49:35,200
Speaker 1: bow function um and the Spice Girls record company Version

862
00:49:35,239 --> 00:49:38,240
Speaker 1: Records was really not happy about the video for that reason,

863
00:49:38,600 --> 00:49:41,200
Speaker 1: and they also just didn't like it artistically. They thought

864
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:44,080
Speaker 1: that the lighting was too dark and gloomy, and a

865
00:49:44,120 --> 00:49:45,799
Speaker 1: lot of the takes that are in the final video

866
00:49:45,920 --> 00:49:49,000
Speaker 1: show the Spice Girls like bumping into furniture and looking

867
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:50,960
Speaker 1: behind them, and you know, because a lot of what

868
00:49:50,960 --> 00:49:53,799
Speaker 1: they're doing they're like moving backwards and stuff, and it

869
00:49:53,880 --> 00:49:56,520
Speaker 1: just looked to the record executives at least, it looked

870
00:49:56,600 --> 00:50:00,719
Speaker 1: kind of unfinished and unprofessional, uh, and they asked them

871
00:50:00,920 --> 00:50:03,360
Speaker 1: to reshoot it. Actually. The other thing I think is

872
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:05,960
Speaker 1: really amusing too is that they thought that basically the

873
00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:09,480
Speaker 1: Spice Girls looked too threatening in this video because they're

874
00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:12,280
Speaker 1: just you know, dancing through a hotel and kind of

875
00:50:12,360 --> 00:50:15,000
Speaker 1: getting in like stodgy people's faces. And they thought that

876
00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:17,960
Speaker 1: was just like a bad look, especially for the video

877
00:50:18,040 --> 00:50:21,080
Speaker 1: for their debut single. I guess so, I guess I

878
00:50:21,080 --> 00:50:24,440
Speaker 1: could almost kind of sort of maybe if squint understand

879
00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:27,360
Speaker 1: where they're coming from, but still seems stupid. So the

880
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:30,239
Speaker 1: label asked for reshoots and also for an alternative version

881
00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:32,680
Speaker 1: of the video for the American market, but the Spice

882
00:50:32,680 --> 00:50:35,560
Speaker 1: Girls refused, and that was totally fine because it went

883
00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:40,320
Speaker 1: on to win Best Dance Video at MTV Video Music Awards,

884
00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:43,480
Speaker 1: So it all worked out just fine. You know what

885
00:50:43,560 --> 00:50:45,759
Speaker 1: else was banned in the Far East? What was that?

886
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:48,880
Speaker 1: Jordan's the song to Become One. So this song was

887
00:50:48,880 --> 00:50:53,640
Speaker 1: apparently inspired by the quote special relationship developing between Hallowell

888
00:50:53,760 --> 00:50:58,440
Speaker 1: and writer Matt Rowe. Melby hinted at this in her autobiography, saying,

889
00:50:58,760 --> 00:51:02,520
Speaker 1: when he and Jerry started making eyes at each other,

890
00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:05,239
Speaker 1: I knew what was going on, even though they denied it.

891
00:51:05,480 --> 00:51:07,360
Speaker 1: I knew them both too well for it to be

892
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:12,759
Speaker 1: a secret for me. Producer Richard Stannard commented about the

893
00:51:12,800 --> 00:51:17,160
Speaker 1: fondness between hallow Well and Raw Was that yours the fondness? Probably?

894
00:51:18,560 --> 00:51:20,480
Speaker 1: He said, I don't want to get into the side

895
00:51:20,480 --> 00:51:24,440
Speaker 1: of things. They were very close. They clicked it's a

896
00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:26,920
Speaker 1: good euphemism, and I think the lyrics and to Become

897
00:51:26,960 --> 00:51:29,560
Speaker 1: One came from that, especially the first verse, which they

898
00:51:29,560 --> 00:51:32,640
Speaker 1: wrote together. I really hope that Jerry Halliwell and one

899
00:51:32,680 --> 00:51:35,520
Speaker 1: of her song co writers had I hope that this

900
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:38,400
Speaker 1: song came from there, the flame between them. So you

901
00:51:38,400 --> 00:51:40,920
Speaker 1: know what's really interesting. They changed the second verse to

902
00:51:41,040 --> 00:51:43,680
Speaker 1: be supportive of gay rights. The second line of the

903
00:51:43,719 --> 00:51:46,960
Speaker 1: second verse, any deal that we endeavor, which is a

904
00:51:46,960 --> 00:51:50,759
Speaker 1: clunker boys and girls feel good together. They changed it

905
00:51:50,800 --> 00:51:53,480
Speaker 1: in the single version two once again, if we endeavor,

906
00:51:53,680 --> 00:51:56,840
Speaker 1: love will bring us back together to make it less heteronormative.

907
00:51:57,320 --> 00:52:00,359
Speaker 1: And Button later said that this change was necessary because

908
00:52:00,360 --> 00:52:03,120
Speaker 1: they realized that the group had become LGBT icons. I

909
00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:07,640
Speaker 1: think that's actually remarkably progressive of them. Hong Kong disagreed.

910
00:52:09,360 --> 00:52:12,080
Speaker 1: The Hong Kong release of the album To Become One

911
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:15,520
Speaker 1: was left off for reasons that were never made totally clear,

912
00:52:15,600 --> 00:52:18,800
Speaker 1: but probably obvious to anyone with two years and a heart,

913
00:52:19,480 --> 00:52:21,640
Speaker 1: But they left the song naked on there. There are

914
00:52:21,680 --> 00:52:25,280
Speaker 1: so many people I know that would sing to Become

915
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:27,760
Speaker 1: One around the house when they were like little kids,

916
00:52:27,880 --> 00:52:32,000
Speaker 1: and their parents would just kind of look at them. Um. Yeah,

917
00:52:32,239 --> 00:52:34,680
Speaker 1: numerous friends of mine can't listen to that song now

918
00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:36,560
Speaker 1: because they just remember singing it in the car where

919
00:52:36,600 --> 00:52:39,719
Speaker 1: their parents are side eyeing them. Yeah. What else was

920
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:42,040
Speaker 1: left off the record? Jordan's Yes, there was a track

921
00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:45,600
Speaker 1: in the early stages of recording this album called see

922
00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:49,560
Speaker 1: You Next Tuesday. Yeah, a little on the nose there,

923
00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:53,640
Speaker 1: and apparently the song is never surfaced in its entirety

924
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:57,000
Speaker 1: see You Next Tuesday. Of course, if you take the

925
00:52:57,080 --> 00:53:01,719
Speaker 1: sea is the is the it's an anagram for it's

926
00:53:01,760 --> 00:53:09,200
Speaker 1: not even an antagram acrostic, it's a mnemonic. What is it?

927
00:53:09,360 --> 00:53:13,120
Speaker 1: What is it? Jordan's it's a it's a I actually

928
00:53:13,160 --> 00:53:15,719
Speaker 1: don't know what it is. It's dumb, is what it is.

929
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:20,239
Speaker 1: It's an anachronism. It's dumb. It's what every It's what

930
00:53:20,320 --> 00:53:23,719
Speaker 1: every edgy person discovers. At some point. The Toolbag from

931
00:53:23,880 --> 00:53:27,600
Speaker 1: vander Pump Rules has his DJ His DJ night was

932
00:53:27,640 --> 00:53:31,160
Speaker 1: called see You Next Tuesday. Like I used to do

933
00:53:31,600 --> 00:53:33,400
Speaker 1: trivia nights and it was on a Tuesday, and there

934
00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:35,640
Speaker 1: was a team that always came that always called themselves

935
00:53:35,680 --> 00:53:39,160
Speaker 1: see You Next Tuesday. So funny, ha ha ha but

936
00:53:39,239 --> 00:53:42,160
Speaker 1: for anyone, for any particularly sheltered people out there. I mean,

937
00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:46,759
Speaker 1: the c is is the letter C, the U is

938
00:53:46,880 --> 00:53:50,160
Speaker 1: the letter you, and the first letter of next and

939
00:53:50,280 --> 00:53:53,760
Speaker 1: the first letter of Tuesday spell out a rude word.

940
00:53:54,920 --> 00:53:57,319
Speaker 1: But apparently wasn't even that that they've left it off.

941
00:53:57,400 --> 00:53:59,959
Speaker 1: You know. Melcy just said that the track was left

942
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:02,960
Speaker 1: off because it was a pile of So that's that's

943
00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:05,600
Speaker 1: the quote. Doesen mince dozen mince words? Yeah, her words,

944
00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:09,759
Speaker 1: not mine. It was vetoed for the twenty anniversary reissue

945
00:54:09,800 --> 00:54:12,759
Speaker 1: of the album, but Melsey also said that she still

946
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:15,080
Speaker 1: has plans for it because she thinks it sounds like

947
00:54:15,120 --> 00:54:18,239
Speaker 1: a long lost Lily Allen song, which I kind of like.

948
00:54:18,400 --> 00:54:23,120
Speaker 1: I can hear that. Yeah, I like that too. We're

949
00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:25,200
Speaker 1: going to take a quick break, but we'll be right

950
00:54:25,200 --> 00:54:27,880
Speaker 1: back with more too much information in just a moment.

951
00:54:44,719 --> 00:54:50,399
Speaker 1: So we got to talk about spice Mania. I never

952
00:54:50,400 --> 00:54:52,000
Speaker 1: thought I would hear you say that. We got to

953
00:54:52,000 --> 00:54:56,240
Speaker 1: talk about spice Mania, the absolute global insanity that greeted

954
00:54:56,239 --> 00:54:59,080
Speaker 1: this group. But yeah, this is wild to me. Their

955
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:02,840
Speaker 1: first arena a concert was like after they had already

956
00:55:02,920 --> 00:55:07,040
Speaker 1: become a complete global world conquering phenomenon. This is October

957
00:55:07,120 --> 00:55:12,040
Speaker 1: twelfth and thirteenth, a full year after their first album

958
00:55:12,040 --> 00:55:14,759
Speaker 1: was out in the UK, which is just wild. When

959
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:17,200
Speaker 1: they were about to go on, Jerry told the other

960
00:55:17,239 --> 00:55:20,400
Speaker 1: girl she was scared, and Victoria, once again proving that

961
00:55:20,480 --> 00:55:24,920
Speaker 1: she is the champion of the SoundBite, replied, don't worry.

962
00:55:24,960 --> 00:55:27,080
Speaker 1: They're only here to see your big hair and your

963
00:55:27,080 --> 00:55:31,560
Speaker 1: big boobs. My most indelible memory of this band is

964
00:55:31,600 --> 00:55:35,839
Speaker 1: the Union Jack dress, So Jordan's take us away. Yes,

965
00:55:36,280 --> 00:55:38,440
Speaker 1: the Union Jack dress, which I always thought was like

966
00:55:38,480 --> 00:55:41,480
Speaker 1: this custom made hot couture, like you know, a lot

967
00:55:41,520 --> 00:55:43,880
Speaker 1: of thought and effort, in time and money went into this,

968
00:55:44,400 --> 00:55:48,080
Speaker 1: was actually just an ordinary dress that I think Jerry

969
00:55:48,320 --> 00:55:52,920
Speaker 1: herself sewed a tea towel on. That British flag is

970
00:55:52,960 --> 00:55:54,880
Speaker 1: just a tea towel that had been sewn on to

971
00:55:55,560 --> 00:55:58,319
Speaker 1: an ordinary mini dress. It was a black Gucci mini

972
00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:00,880
Speaker 1: dress that she had been given to perform at the

973
00:56:01,120 --> 00:56:04,719
Speaker 1: at the brit Awards, which were like the British Grammys,

974
00:56:05,239 --> 00:56:07,600
Speaker 1: and you know, it was a Goocci dress expensive, she'd

975
00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:10,000
Speaker 1: been given it to performing and she just thought it

976
00:56:10,040 --> 00:56:13,160
Speaker 1: was two, in her words, boring, and she decided she

977
00:56:13,200 --> 00:56:16,520
Speaker 1: wanted to and this again her words celebrate being British,

978
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:19,479
Speaker 1: and she asked her sister to actually stitch this Union

979
00:56:19,600 --> 00:56:22,200
Speaker 1: Jack t towel onto the front of this black dress

980
00:56:22,640 --> 00:56:24,840
Speaker 1: as you know, a patriotic gesture. It was just that

981
00:56:24,920 --> 00:56:29,359
Speaker 1: was always meant to be and to avoid being associated

982
00:56:29,400 --> 00:56:32,640
Speaker 1: with the National Front, which was like this right ring

983
00:56:32,719 --> 00:56:35,400
Speaker 1: extremist group in the UK. She had a peace symbol

984
00:56:35,480 --> 00:56:37,640
Speaker 1: stitched onto the back of the dress too, and the

985
00:56:37,680 --> 00:56:40,799
Speaker 1: group went on to win two brit Awards that night. Uh.

986
00:56:40,880 --> 00:56:45,239
Speaker 1: In so, a year after this performance, she auctioned off

987
00:56:45,320 --> 00:56:49,240
Speaker 1: this by this point instantly iconic dress at the London

988
00:56:49,280 --> 00:56:53,840
Speaker 1: branch of Southebys and it sold for three D twenty

989
00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:57,960
Speaker 1: pounds and the buyer was um Peter Morton, who ran

990
00:56:58,280 --> 00:57:01,600
Speaker 1: hard Rock Cafe, Rock hotel els and all that. And

991
00:57:01,840 --> 00:57:04,440
Speaker 1: uh it's actually it's still I think holds the world

992
00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:07,400
Speaker 1: record for the most expensive piece of pop star clothing

993
00:57:07,520 --> 00:57:11,160
Speaker 1: ever sold at auction, and Jerry gave the proceeds of

994
00:57:11,160 --> 00:57:17,160
Speaker 1: the sale to children's cancer charity. Very nice. We touched

995
00:57:17,200 --> 00:57:23,600
Speaker 1: on this earlier, but apparently, uh, you know, Bex was

996
00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:26,120
Speaker 1: not the strongest singer of the group in the early

997
00:57:26,200 --> 00:57:28,320
Speaker 1: days when she joined she was still Victoria Adams. She

998
00:57:28,360 --> 00:57:32,000
Speaker 1: hadn't yet married world class soccer player and handsome man

999
00:57:32,520 --> 00:57:36,320
Speaker 1: David Beckham. The group was still called Touch at that point.

1000
00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:41,800
Speaker 1: When she replaced Melanie lack o he Um and she

1001
00:57:41,960 --> 00:57:44,960
Speaker 1: was apparently too good of a singer. According to The Mirror,

1002
00:57:45,240 --> 00:57:47,200
Speaker 1: she was twenty two. She was told her voice would

1003
00:57:47,200 --> 00:57:50,960
Speaker 1: overpower the others, and she was replaced by Beckham. Lack

1004
00:57:51,040 --> 00:57:53,320
Speaker 1: of he now works for the National Health Service as

1005
00:57:53,320 --> 00:57:57,120
Speaker 1: a hospital administrator in Cambridgeshire, and she still sings in

1006
00:57:57,160 --> 00:58:00,120
Speaker 1: a band. Saving lives and making the saving lives was

1007
00:58:00,160 --> 00:58:05,480
Speaker 1: making music go hand in hand. But good old Victoria,

1008
00:58:05,720 --> 00:58:10,760
Speaker 1: despite her cheekbones, h was not known for her singing voice.

1009
00:58:10,880 --> 00:58:13,240
Speaker 1: She's the only one who doesn't have a solo verson

1010
00:58:13,360 --> 00:58:15,240
Speaker 1: want to be. She's the only one who didn't put

1011
00:58:15,240 --> 00:58:17,800
Speaker 1: out any solo records after the band broke up. And

1012
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:21,360
Speaker 1: uh really wow, I say, really, I'm the one who

1013
00:58:21,400 --> 00:58:24,280
Speaker 1: wrote that fact. I know this, but I still that

1014
00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:27,320
Speaker 1: really that still surprises me. I just remember her being

1015
00:58:27,360 --> 00:58:30,920
Speaker 1: like the scary, intimidating one. But it turns out she

1016
00:58:31,040 --> 00:58:32,640
Speaker 1: was the self proclaimed when she said she was the

1017
00:58:32,680 --> 00:58:35,480
Speaker 1: most reserved one, and then she knew this I mean,

1018
00:58:35,520 --> 00:58:38,080
Speaker 1: she told The Independent in that they would turn her

1019
00:58:38,080 --> 00:58:41,480
Speaker 1: microphone off live because my voice wasn't up to the

1020
00:58:41,520 --> 00:58:45,520
Speaker 1: other girl's standards. She said, they used to turn my

1021
00:58:45,600 --> 00:58:48,880
Speaker 1: mic off and just let the others sing. Luckily, because

1022
00:58:48,920 --> 00:58:51,320
Speaker 1: I used to wear heels, I just used to jig

1023
00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:53,360
Speaker 1: about a bit and I got away with it. But

1024
00:58:53,440 --> 00:58:56,720
Speaker 1: it never came easily. I was always much more reserved

1025
00:58:56,800 --> 00:59:00,640
Speaker 1: than the other girls. But one thing about Paul that

1026
00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:05,560
Speaker 1: uh is authentic is that she was loaded. Her father

1027
00:59:05,680 --> 00:59:10,040
Speaker 1: was an electrical supplies retailer and she was a kid.

1028
00:59:10,520 --> 00:59:13,960
Speaker 1: She used to ask her father to not bring her

1029
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:18,200
Speaker 1: to school in the family rolls Royce. But again, I

1030
00:59:18,240 --> 00:59:21,560
Speaker 1: gotta give this woman her way with a SoundBite. She

1031
00:59:21,680 --> 00:59:24,760
Speaker 1: was asked once with the most offensive thing the British

1032
00:59:24,800 --> 00:59:27,600
Speaker 1: press ever wrote about her, and she said that I

1033
00:59:27,720 --> 00:59:35,040
Speaker 1: wear cheap makeup. Chanelle does not come cheap, darling. She

1034
00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:38,040
Speaker 1: is awesome. Did you ever see when she and um

1035
00:59:38,160 --> 00:59:41,600
Speaker 1: David Beckham were interviewed by Ali g No, I haven't

1036
00:59:41,640 --> 00:59:43,840
Speaker 1: seen that. It's so funny. I think it was for

1037
00:59:43,960 --> 00:59:45,880
Speaker 1: it was for some charity show. It might have been

1038
00:59:45,920 --> 00:59:49,960
Speaker 1: like Red Nose Day or um Comic Relief or something

1039
00:59:50,000 --> 00:59:53,800
Speaker 1: like that. It's so funny. She is so funny and

1040
00:59:53,920 --> 00:59:56,720
Speaker 1: quick and as evidenced by all these sound bites, but

1041
00:59:56,800 --> 01:00:00,880
Speaker 1: also like really humble and self deprecating and great. It

1042
01:00:01,040 --> 01:00:04,080
Speaker 1: made me like her so so so much more than

1043
01:00:04,120 --> 01:00:05,880
Speaker 1: I already did. It's definitely worth check out. As much

1044
01:00:05,920 --> 01:00:07,800
Speaker 1: of a himbo as Beckham is, I bear him no

1045
01:00:08,000 --> 01:00:11,120
Speaker 1: ill will I like. I remember one of the page

1046
01:00:11,160 --> 01:00:12,840
Speaker 1: six items I read about him was that he was

1047
01:00:12,960 --> 01:00:16,160
Speaker 1: spending a lot of his pandemic time beekeeping, which I

1048
01:00:16,240 --> 01:00:20,640
Speaker 1: was just like that, so endearing, Like you're just famous

1049
01:00:20,640 --> 01:00:23,240
Speaker 1: for being good looking and mega rich, and you what

1050
01:00:23,280 --> 01:00:25,840
Speaker 1: do you do? And you're like doted years like yours,

1051
01:00:25,920 --> 01:00:29,080
Speaker 1: your decline into middle aged you beekeep. I love that.

1052
01:00:29,800 --> 01:00:32,120
Speaker 1: There any other famous beekeepers out there? I feel like

1053
01:00:32,200 --> 01:00:34,400
Speaker 1: there's a lot of them. Flee Flee from the Chili

1054
01:00:34,400 --> 01:00:36,400
Speaker 1: Peppers is probably one of the most famous. It's a

1055
01:00:36,400 --> 01:00:39,640
Speaker 1: bit on the nose, I know, I know, we have. Well,

1056
01:00:39,680 --> 01:00:44,600
Speaker 1: he's got a lot to atone for. I can hate

1057
01:00:44,600 --> 01:00:48,880
Speaker 1: that band all right. Speaking of things, I hate, Prince

1058
01:00:49,000 --> 01:00:53,760
Speaker 1: Charles Jordan take it away. Yes, at the height of

1059
01:00:53,760 --> 01:01:00,840
Speaker 1: spice Mania, Ginger spice pinched, Prince Charles butt and say

1060
01:01:00,880 --> 01:01:03,240
Speaker 1: it with a straight face. I I forgot that I

1061
01:01:03,280 --> 01:01:06,520
Speaker 1: had written this literally until I was reading this line

1062
01:01:06,600 --> 01:01:12,960
Speaker 1: right now. Um, yes, uh, change your spice pinch Prince Charles,

1063
01:01:13,000 --> 01:01:17,320
Speaker 1: but and asked him if he had his um, his

1064
01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:20,440
Speaker 1: little Charles Pierce. Yes, thank you. This is in May

1065
01:01:20,440 --> 01:01:23,680
Speaker 1: of ninety seven. Yes, there is some backstory to this

1066
01:01:23,800 --> 01:01:26,040
Speaker 1: that we should probably get into. The Spice rules are

1067
01:01:26,080 --> 01:01:29,880
Speaker 1: performing at a charity gig called the Prince's Trust Benefit Concert,

1068
01:01:30,240 --> 01:01:32,000
Speaker 1: and they were on the receiving line that they do

1069
01:01:32,040 --> 01:01:34,360
Speaker 1: it all these charity shows where everybody it's like at

1070
01:01:34,360 --> 01:01:36,280
Speaker 1: the end of a wedding, all the talent lines up

1071
01:01:36,280 --> 01:01:39,280
Speaker 1: and the royal family goes down the line and shakes

1072
01:01:39,280 --> 01:01:42,400
Speaker 1: everybody's hand and pretends to be interested for six seconds

1073
01:01:42,400 --> 01:01:46,560
Speaker 1: and then moves on. Um and Jerry Hallowell and Melby

1074
01:01:46,640 --> 01:01:50,320
Speaker 1: broke royal protocol by planting kisses on both his cheeks

1075
01:01:50,360 --> 01:01:52,640
Speaker 1: because there's you know, there's all sorts of protocol for

1076
01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:55,200
Speaker 1: how you approach royals, and you know you don't turn

1077
01:01:55,280 --> 01:01:57,600
Speaker 1: your back on them, and you address you know, speaking

1078
01:01:57,680 --> 01:02:02,880
Speaker 1: less spoken to and you know mouth well, Um, Jerry

1079
01:02:02,920 --> 01:02:07,640
Speaker 1: got somewhat close. She supposedly grabbed his bottom and when

1080
01:02:07,720 --> 01:02:11,000
Speaker 1: asked about this by Rolling Stone, she replied, I pinch

1081
01:02:11,080 --> 01:02:13,920
Speaker 1: everyone's bottom. Why am I going to stop at the Prince.

1082
01:02:14,280 --> 01:02:16,680
Speaker 1: He's just a man, just like anybody else who wants

1083
01:02:16,720 --> 01:02:22,040
Speaker 1: to laugh. Sure. Oh later, when Melby was sticking her

1084
01:02:22,040 --> 01:02:24,960
Speaker 1: tongue out and showing off her tongue piercing, Jerry asked

1085
01:02:25,000 --> 01:02:28,320
Speaker 1: Prince Charles if he had a Prince Albert and uh,

1086
01:02:28,360 --> 01:02:33,440
Speaker 1: Prince Albert, named probably Apocryphale after Queen Victoria's husband, Prince

1087
01:02:33,520 --> 01:02:38,280
Speaker 1: Charles's great great great grandfather, is Um, well, it's a

1088
01:02:38,360 --> 01:02:43,480
Speaker 1: ring through the head of the penis, folks. Um. Sports fans.

1089
01:02:44,440 --> 01:02:46,440
Speaker 1: Never let anyone say that we don't have any take

1090
01:02:46,480 --> 01:02:50,240
Speaker 1: home value on this show. Um. But if you didn't

1091
01:02:50,280 --> 01:02:54,640
Speaker 1: know that, don't feel bad, because apparently Prince Charles didn't

1092
01:02:54,680 --> 01:02:58,560
Speaker 1: know either, and he asked point blank, what's a Prince Albert?

1093
01:02:59,320 --> 01:03:03,480
Speaker 1: And H and I guess I think. The British comedian

1094
01:03:03,600 --> 01:03:06,600
Speaker 1: Stephen Fry was also on the line, and he tried

1095
01:03:06,600 --> 01:03:09,240
Speaker 1: to clue him in and said, um, it's it's a

1096
01:03:09,600 --> 01:03:15,480
Speaker 1: it's a piece of intimate jewelry, sir, all time great euphemism. Yes,

1097
01:03:15,560 --> 01:03:17,840
Speaker 1: And then am I guess? During as this whole exchange

1098
01:03:17,920 --> 01:03:21,320
Speaker 1: was going on about bottom pinching and Prince Albert's Emma

1099
01:03:21,480 --> 01:03:24,280
Speaker 1: Baby Spice was asking after Prince William, who at this

1100
01:03:24,280 --> 01:03:28,000
Speaker 1: point was fourteen years old, and he apparently he supposedly

1101
01:03:28,040 --> 01:03:31,680
Speaker 1: took down his Pam Anderson poster at boarding school and

1102
01:03:31,720 --> 01:03:34,640
Speaker 1: replaced it with one of Emma Baby Spice was his

1103
01:03:34,680 --> 01:03:38,240
Speaker 1: favorite Spice Girl, so she asked about him, and Prince

1104
01:03:38,320 --> 01:03:41,680
Speaker 1: Charles said, don't be a cradle snatcher. It's pretty rich

1105
01:03:41,760 --> 01:03:47,840
Speaker 1: considering Prince Andrew's stature in two giving my air horn

1106
01:03:47,880 --> 01:03:54,040
Speaker 1: app open. Yeah, oh man, And Prince Charles was not

1107
01:03:54,120 --> 01:03:57,680
Speaker 1: even the only global figure that the Spice Girls had

1108
01:03:57,680 --> 01:03:59,960
Speaker 1: to run in with. Yeah, I love this so much.

1109
01:04:00,080 --> 01:04:03,360
Speaker 1: The Spice Girls met Nelson Mandela. A lot of listical

1110
01:04:03,440 --> 01:04:06,880
Speaker 1: site Nelson Mandela is calling the Spice Girls his personal heroes.

1111
01:04:07,240 --> 01:04:09,160
Speaker 1: I can't tell if he was just doing a bit

1112
01:04:09,400 --> 01:04:12,760
Speaker 1: no offense. I'm I'm guessing he's just doing a bit,

1113
01:04:13,360 --> 01:04:17,760
Speaker 1: but um, I guess. During this visit, Melby stole some

1114
01:04:17,880 --> 01:04:21,280
Speaker 1: of Nelson Mandela's toilet paper and gave squares of it

1115
01:04:21,360 --> 01:04:24,760
Speaker 1: as gifts to her hair and makeup people all due respect.

1116
01:04:24,840 --> 01:04:28,560
Speaker 1: That feels like a piece of Ira you would own Yeah, no, um,

1117
01:04:29,520 --> 01:04:33,520
Speaker 1: square of Nelson Mandela's toilet paper. Yeah this, Yeah, and

1118
01:04:33,840 --> 01:04:36,680
Speaker 1: hopefully uh this is early on in this show, and

1119
01:04:36,720 --> 01:04:39,800
Speaker 1: I'm sure this will be a much beloved recurring segment

1120
01:04:39,960 --> 01:04:44,640
Speaker 1: of uh useless ephemera that I own. I have framed

1121
01:04:44,640 --> 01:04:48,160
Speaker 1: over my desk a piece of carpet from John Lennon's house.

1122
01:04:48,480 --> 01:04:51,360
Speaker 1: I also have a piece of carpet from Elvis Presley's graceland.

1123
01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:54,040
Speaker 1: I have what else do I have? I I have

1124
01:04:54,080 --> 01:04:56,760
Speaker 1: like a fishing log haming away, Yeah, deck would from

1125
01:04:56,800 --> 01:04:59,680
Speaker 1: the Titanic, a piece of the Berlin wall, all sorts

1126
01:04:59,680 --> 01:05:04,160
Speaker 1: of use crap. Yeah. Um, so I do have to say,

1127
01:05:04,200 --> 01:05:07,320
Speaker 1: as I researched that fact toy, I was privately jealous

1128
01:05:07,360 --> 01:05:10,120
Speaker 1: that I don't have a piece of a square of

1129
01:05:10,120 --> 01:05:14,000
Speaker 1: toilet paper from Nelson Mandela's house. Also, but the Spice

1130
01:05:14,040 --> 01:05:17,320
Speaker 1: Girls wouldn't have to steal Nelson Mandela's toilet paper for

1131
01:05:17,400 --> 01:05:21,880
Speaker 1: long because Spice is the best selling girl group album

1132
01:05:21,880 --> 01:05:25,160
Speaker 1: of all time. We mentioned earlier about the debut success

1133
01:05:25,160 --> 01:05:27,760
Speaker 1: of Wannabe, but the record debut at number six on

1134
01:05:27,800 --> 01:05:31,880
Speaker 1: the Billboard two hundred. Eventually we reaching number one for

1135
01:05:31,960 --> 01:05:36,000
Speaker 1: five weeks and selling one point four six million copies

1136
01:05:36,040 --> 01:05:40,240
Speaker 1: within its first twelve weeks of release, became the biggest

1137
01:05:40,280 --> 01:05:45,240
Speaker 1: selling album five point three million copies sold by the

1138
01:05:45,320 --> 01:05:47,520
Speaker 1: end of the year. After the album went to number one,

1139
01:05:47,640 --> 01:05:50,040
Speaker 1: Virgin gave each of the women a five hundred dollar

1140
01:05:50,120 --> 01:05:57,320
Speaker 1: Tiffany's voucher, which seems kind of chintzy. Richard, what is that?

1141
01:05:59,800 --> 01:06:03,400
Speaker 1: You're record made us untold millions? Here's and it allowed

1142
01:06:03,440 --> 01:06:07,280
Speaker 1: me to make a spacecraft. Yeah, here's three figures of

1143
01:06:07,320 --> 01:06:10,720
Speaker 1: a gift card at Tiffany that. I mean, what can

1144
01:06:10,760 --> 01:06:13,320
Speaker 1: you buy it? Tiffany's that's five I mean that's like

1145
01:06:13,360 --> 01:06:16,080
Speaker 1: that doesn't even buy you a full thing. Yeah, it

1146
01:06:16,160 --> 01:06:19,000
Speaker 1: gets you in the door. Uh. There have been a

1147
01:06:19,080 --> 01:06:23,160
Speaker 1: reported thirty one million copies of this record sold worldwide.

1148
01:06:23,280 --> 01:06:25,200
Speaker 1: It's the biggest selling album by a girl group in

1149
01:06:25,280 --> 01:06:27,800
Speaker 1: music history and one of the most successful albums of

1150
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:30,200
Speaker 1: all time. That's up there, and like Michael Jackson and

1151
01:06:30,280 --> 01:06:33,560
Speaker 1: like a C d C back in Black Territory, right, Yeah,

1152
01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:35,880
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm gonna check that. But it has to

1153
01:06:35,920 --> 01:06:41,600
Speaker 1: be total certified copies three million, which puts it in

1154
01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:46,440
Speaker 1: the Backstreet Boys Millennium. Purple Rayan Joshua Tree Bridge over

1155
01:06:46,480 --> 01:06:50,440
Speaker 1: Troubled Water. You know my favorite it does that's yes,

1156
01:06:50,560 --> 01:06:52,720
Speaker 1: But do you know what one of I love the

1157
01:06:52,760 --> 01:06:55,440
Speaker 1: fact that Back in Black is supposedly one of the

1158
01:06:55,560 --> 01:07:00,120
Speaker 1: most He's like the number two per wiki at rules

1159
01:07:00,160 --> 01:07:06,200
Speaker 1: so hard, right after thriller Back and It's crazy. I

1160
01:07:06,280 --> 01:07:09,320
Speaker 1: love that. Good for them, But I'll tell you who

1161
01:07:09,520 --> 01:07:12,360
Speaker 1: didn't make this one of the best selling records of

1162
01:07:12,360 --> 01:07:18,760
Speaker 1: all time? Critics? How's that for a clunky segue? Also

1163
01:07:18,880 --> 01:07:23,280
Speaker 1: the Recording Academy no Grammy nominations. Rolling Stone gave it

1164
01:07:23,400 --> 01:07:27,520
Speaker 1: one point five stars in a review written by Christina Kelly.

1165
01:07:27,640 --> 01:07:30,720
Speaker 1: The magazine said, following in the footsteps of Take That

1166
01:07:30,920 --> 01:07:33,760
Speaker 1: and New Kids on the Block to other bubblegum pop

1167
01:07:33,800 --> 01:07:36,840
Speaker 1: groups that were also huge in England, Spice Girls offer

1168
01:07:36,880 --> 01:07:40,840
Speaker 1: a watered down mix of hip hop and cheesy pop baladry,

1169
01:07:40,920 --> 01:07:43,400
Speaker 1: and like New Kids in the Block, Spice Girls are

1170
01:07:43,480 --> 01:07:47,200
Speaker 1: five attractive young things, each with a distinct personality. Allow

1171
01:07:47,240 --> 01:07:50,280
Speaker 1: the village people God brought I know, brought together by

1172
01:07:50,280 --> 01:07:54,480
Speaker 1: a manager with a marketing concept. Despite their pro woman posing,

1173
01:07:54,720 --> 01:07:57,360
Speaker 1: the girls don't get bogged down by anything deeper than

1174
01:07:57,440 --> 01:08:00,560
Speaker 1: mugging for promo shots. And giving out tips on getting

1175
01:08:00,560 --> 01:08:04,280
Speaker 1: boys in bed. So some salient points there, but has

1176
01:08:04,320 --> 01:08:07,000
Speaker 1: not aged well. I do think it's really interesting that

1177
01:08:07,400 --> 01:08:10,280
Speaker 1: people were towing them as being a marketing creation for

1178
01:08:10,360 --> 01:08:13,440
Speaker 1: having such distinct personalities, but that was their own direction

1179
01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:15,680
Speaker 1: that their manager was like, we want you all to

1180
01:08:15,680 --> 01:08:19,160
Speaker 1: be interchangeable anyway. The Spice Girls, I mean, despite all

1181
01:08:19,160 --> 01:08:20,800
Speaker 1: those kind of bad reviews, it kind of set the

1182
01:08:20,840 --> 01:08:23,320
Speaker 1: stage for a lot of the There was that great

1183
01:08:23,360 --> 01:08:25,360
Speaker 1: the New Chuck Classroom in book that just came out

1184
01:08:25,439 --> 01:08:28,880
Speaker 1: called the Nineties, where and he makes the point of

1185
01:08:28,920 --> 01:08:31,439
Speaker 1: they're kind of being two very distinct nineties where the

1186
01:08:31,479 --> 01:08:36,080
Speaker 1: first half, at least musically was sort of the grunge era,

1187
01:08:36,520 --> 01:08:39,759
Speaker 1: and then the second half, the dividing line being Kurcle

1188
01:08:39,840 --> 01:08:42,479
Speaker 1: bay AND's suicide in and on the second half of

1189
01:08:42,479 --> 01:08:45,400
Speaker 1: the nineties being would he loosely termed the t r

1190
01:08:45,600 --> 01:08:48,799
Speaker 1: L era, which you really see being filled with uh

1191
01:08:48,880 --> 01:08:50,720
Speaker 1: pop groups. I mean, you get your Britney Spears, you

1192
01:08:50,840 --> 01:08:54,240
Speaker 1: se aguileras, You're instincts, your Backstreet Boys, and the Spice

1193
01:08:54,280 --> 01:08:58,559
Speaker 1: Girls phenomenon. I think is is sort of among the

1194
01:08:58,600 --> 01:09:02,040
Speaker 1: first of that crowd to really connect over here. I

1195
01:09:02,120 --> 01:09:04,960
Speaker 1: can't remember exactly when all those others came out, but

1196
01:09:05,000 --> 01:09:08,559
Speaker 1: I think it was closer to so it kind of

1197
01:09:08,600 --> 01:09:12,200
Speaker 1: set the stage for um, for the pop explosion at

1198
01:09:12,200 --> 01:09:14,840
Speaker 1: the end of the decade. And um, you know, I

1199
01:09:14,840 --> 01:09:18,960
Speaker 1: mean this was a time when in n alternative rock,

1200
01:09:19,040 --> 01:09:21,880
Speaker 1: hip hop, and R and B dominated the global music charts.

1201
01:09:22,200 --> 01:09:24,400
Speaker 1: I mean, the Spicy Cools even said this in there.

1202
01:09:24,680 --> 01:09:26,760
Speaker 1: I think it was their first ever interview in May

1203
01:09:27,640 --> 01:09:30,880
Speaker 1: six with the outlet Music Week, Jerry Hallowell said, we

1204
01:09:30,920 --> 01:09:33,080
Speaker 1: want to bring some of the glamor back to pop

1205
01:09:33,280 --> 01:09:35,840
Speaker 1: like Madonna had when we were growing up. Pop is

1206
01:09:35,880 --> 01:09:39,719
Speaker 1: about fantasy and escapism, and the Spicyols phenomenon was credited

1207
01:09:39,720 --> 01:09:42,840
Speaker 1: as changing the music landscape by reviving the pop music

1208
01:09:42,920 --> 01:09:45,920
Speaker 1: genre and like I said, bringing about this wave in

1209
01:09:45,960 --> 01:09:48,280
Speaker 1: the late nineties and early two thousands of these team

1210
01:09:48,320 --> 01:09:51,720
Speaker 1: pop acts like Backstreet Boys, Britney Spears, Christina Aguilera in

1211
01:09:51,800 --> 01:09:54,120
Speaker 1: Sync ninety eight degrees. I mean, go on and on

1212
01:09:54,920 --> 01:09:59,320
Speaker 1: Limp Biscuit. You forget how much they were on MTV. Dude.

1213
01:09:59,400 --> 01:10:03,880
Speaker 1: I mean one thing, Fred Durris is whatever, but that

1214
01:10:04,000 --> 01:10:07,000
Speaker 1: dude played the game. They were on t r L

1215
01:10:07,360 --> 01:10:11,879
Speaker 1: so much. I remember seeing that Yankee. That's stupid backwards

1216
01:10:12,000 --> 01:10:14,120
Speaker 1: Yankee cap more than the face of my loved ones.

1217
01:10:14,640 --> 01:10:22,439
Speaker 1: Um Anyway, what else you got speaking of fred Durst, Yeah,

1218
01:10:22,479 --> 01:10:26,040
Speaker 1: I mentioned the piece written by Cheryl Garratt in The

1219
01:10:26,080 --> 01:10:30,000
Speaker 1: Guardian and she has a really great quote in ten

1220
01:10:30,120 --> 01:10:33,000
Speaker 1: years time, this was right after I Want to Be

1221
01:10:33,080 --> 01:10:36,160
Speaker 1: Single came out in ten years time, long after the

1222
01:10:36,240 --> 01:10:39,479
Speaker 1: lesser brit pop guitar bands have been forgotten. You'll hear

1223
01:10:39,520 --> 01:10:41,599
Speaker 1: want to Be on the radio. You'll hear them tell

1224
01:10:41,640 --> 01:10:44,000
Speaker 1: you what they want, what they really really want, and

1225
01:10:44,000 --> 01:10:48,080
Speaker 1: you'll smile because it'll bring back some memory of something

1226
01:10:48,120 --> 01:10:49,840
Speaker 1: you were doing when you heard them sing of their

1227
01:10:49,920 --> 01:10:53,120
Speaker 1: ziga ziga. And by then there'll be a whole generation

1228
01:10:53,160 --> 01:10:55,200
Speaker 1: of twenty year old girls who will owe just a

1229
01:10:55,240 --> 01:10:58,080
Speaker 1: little bit of who they are to the Spice Girls, which,

1230
01:10:58,280 --> 01:11:00,640
Speaker 1: as it happens, it's not a add thing at all.

1231
01:11:01,880 --> 01:11:05,120
Speaker 1: It's a good note to end on. I feel like, yeah, well, folks,

1232
01:11:05,560 --> 01:11:08,639
Speaker 1: thank you for taking this trip through Spice World with us,

1233
01:11:09,160 --> 01:11:11,559
Speaker 1: which is not available on streaming services. By the way,

1234
01:11:11,560 --> 01:11:12,880
Speaker 1: if there is anyone who works for any of these

1235
01:11:12,960 --> 01:11:15,960
Speaker 1: streaming platforms, please put that movie on because I would

1236
01:11:16,000 --> 01:11:17,599
Speaker 1: love to see it aside from you know, my old

1237
01:11:17,680 --> 01:11:22,280
Speaker 1: VHS copy. Please thanks for listening, folks, this has been

1238
01:11:22,280 --> 01:11:25,800
Speaker 1: too much information. I'm Alex Hegel, I'm Jordan Runtalg. Thanks

1239
01:11:25,840 --> 01:11:34,000
Speaker 1: for spending this time with us. Too Much Information was

1240
01:11:34,040 --> 01:11:37,120
Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radio. The show's executive producers

1241
01:11:37,120 --> 01:11:40,240
Speaker 1: are Noel Brown and Jordan runt Talk. The supervising producer

1242
01:11:40,280 --> 01:11:43,360
Speaker 1: is Mike John's. The show was researched, written and hosted

1243
01:11:43,360 --> 01:11:46,519
Speaker 1: by Jordan Runtalg and Alex Heigel, with original music by

1244
01:11:46,520 --> 01:11:49,280
Speaker 1: Seth apple Bomb and the Ghost Funk Orchestra. If you

1245
01:11:49,360 --> 01:11:51,639
Speaker 1: like what you heard, please subscribe and leave us a review.

1246
01:11:51,920 --> 01:11:54,519
Speaker 1: For more podcasts on iHeart Radio, visit the I heart

1247
01:11:54,600 --> 01:11:57,439
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to your

1248
01:11:57,439 --> 01:12:07,080
Speaker 1: favorite shows agin that Let Band at backas and s