WEBVTT - Is the impossible drive possible? 0:00:08.480 --> 0:00:11.480 Hey, Daniel, how do you feel about breaking the laws 0:00:11.480 --> 0:00:14.840 of physics? Boy? That needs some context. It really depends 0:00:15.320 --> 0:00:18.040 on whether you have a good physics lawyer to back 0:00:18.120 --> 0:00:21.680 you up. It really depends on which law you're gonna break. 0:00:21.760 --> 0:00:24.079 I mean, you might get a misdemeanor. In some cases, 0:00:24.120 --> 0:00:26.040 you might even end up with a felon. Really there's 0:00:26.040 --> 0:00:29.040 a range here, all right, So then what's the equivalent 0:00:29.280 --> 0:00:32.559 of getting life in prison for physics too? I think 0:00:32.560 --> 0:00:34.720 they put you in a room with a cartoonist and 0:00:35.120 --> 0:00:40.120 they're the worst defenders. Really. But really, but when you 0:00:40.120 --> 0:00:43.040 hear about an idea that breaks a law of physics, 0:00:43.320 --> 0:00:45.720 even if it's a big one, are you hoping it's 0:00:45.760 --> 0:00:48.840 true or you hoping it's wrong? Well, you know, anytime 0:00:48.960 --> 0:00:53.560 somebody claims to disprove Einstein, I get pretty skeptical because 0:00:53.760 --> 0:00:56.640 that's been tested a lot. But in my heart of hearts, 0:00:56.680 --> 0:01:00.440 I'm really hoping that someone disproves a big law physics, 0:01:00.640 --> 0:01:03.440 like relativity. I mean that that's how we learned something 0:01:03.440 --> 0:01:06.000 new about the universe. That's a good spin. I think 0:01:06.000 --> 0:01:08.200 I'll hire you as my physics lawyer. In that case, 0:01:08.400 --> 0:01:10.440 you're going to go to physics jail. Because I am 0:01:10.520 --> 0:01:28.919 not a good physics lawyer. Hi am r handa cartoonists 0:01:28.920 --> 0:01:32.080 and the creator of PhD comics. Hi I'm Daniel. I'm 0:01:32.120 --> 0:01:35.000 a particle physicist, and I once thought I wanted to 0:01:35.040 --> 0:01:36.880 be a lawyer, and then I got argued out of it. 0:01:36.920 --> 0:01:41.119 Oh yeah, wow, history almost went a different way for you. Yeah. 0:01:41.160 --> 0:01:43.440 I was big into debate in high school and I 0:01:43.520 --> 0:01:46.280 liked arguing, or I thought I liked arguing. I did 0:01:46.280 --> 0:01:48.400 a lot of it, But then I discovered that, you know, 0:01:48.520 --> 0:01:51.320 in debate there's sort of never really any truth. You 0:01:51.360 --> 0:01:54.000 can just persuade people of anything. And in the end 0:01:54.320 --> 0:01:57.680 I liked physics because it had a hard negative objectivity 0:01:57.720 --> 0:02:00.080 at its core. Like I want certainty, just like in 0:02:00.200 --> 0:02:04.960 quantum physics where everything's for sure and there's no funny names. Well, 0:02:05.000 --> 0:02:07.760 I want objectivity. You know, the universe comes down on 0:02:07.760 --> 0:02:10.160 one side or the other. You try the experiment and 0:02:10.200 --> 0:02:13.040 it either works or it fails. You can't persuade somebody 0:02:13.120 --> 0:02:16.919 some things, right if the experiments say no, at least 0:02:17.040 --> 0:02:21.680 on a probabilistic kind of sense, Right, there's certainty. Yeah, alright, well, 0:02:21.720 --> 0:02:24.840 we are certainly starting our podcast. Daniel and Jorge Explain 0:02:24.919 --> 0:02:27.280 the Universe, a production of I Heart Radio in which 0:02:27.320 --> 0:02:30.919 we talk about all the amazing things certain and uncertain 0:02:30.960 --> 0:02:32.880 about the universe, the things that we know and the 0:02:32.919 --> 0:02:36.120 things that we do not yet know, the things that work, 0:02:36.160 --> 0:02:39.000 and the things that we are still working on. Our 0:02:39.040 --> 0:02:41.520 goal in this podcast is to educate you about everything 0:02:41.520 --> 0:02:44.320 that science understands, everything that science is still working on, 0:02:44.639 --> 0:02:47.839 and everything that human beings wonder about. All the things 0:02:47.880 --> 0:02:50.680 that are possible out there in this big, beautiful universe 0:02:50.800 --> 0:02:53.200 of ours, and also maybe all of the things that 0:02:53.240 --> 0:02:58.120 are impossible in this universe, things that cannot be or 0:02:58.160 --> 0:03:00.880 that we maybe wish they could be. And history is 0:03:00.919 --> 0:03:04.520 filled with examples of scientists saying something is impossible and 0:03:04.520 --> 0:03:07.520 then somebody coming along and proving them wrong. So one 0:03:07.520 --> 0:03:11.320 of the most fun experience in science is pushing that boundaries, 0:03:11.520 --> 0:03:15.320 developing something new, is understanding the universe at a deeper 0:03:15.440 --> 0:03:18.799 level and figuring out something that we thought was impossible, 0:03:19.000 --> 0:03:21.519 and maybe even giving us a tool to explore the 0:03:21.639 --> 0:03:24.360 universe right, because you know, sometimes some of the biggest 0:03:24.400 --> 0:03:27.200 ideas in physics have been that they thought they were 0:03:27.200 --> 0:03:29.480 they were impossible, you know, like when quantum physics first 0:03:29.480 --> 0:03:31.480 came out, people thought it were like, that's a crazy 0:03:31.840 --> 0:03:34.560 why would nature be like that? Right? Even Einstein thought 0:03:34.960 --> 0:03:37.800 it was kind of impossible. That's right. Sometimes you have 0:03:37.960 --> 0:03:40.920 to change your perspective and open your mind to something 0:03:41.000 --> 0:03:44.480 totally new. On the other hand, sometimes the universe is 0:03:44.560 --> 0:03:47.640 just hard and cold and it says no to your idea. 0:03:47.920 --> 0:03:52.000 It's impossible to deal with this universe. But yeah, so dude, 0:03:52.080 --> 0:03:54.320 on the podcast, we'll be talking about one such idea, 0:03:54.360 --> 0:03:57.520 which today sounds kind of impossible. In fact, it has 0:03:57.560 --> 0:04:04.120 impossible in its brand name. Are we talking about impossible burghers? Oh, 0:04:04.280 --> 0:04:07.680 that sounds delicious, That sounds as possible to resist. That's right, 0:04:07.720 --> 0:04:11.920 because one struggle plaguing humanity's desire to explore the universe 0:04:12.240 --> 0:04:15.760 is just physically getting out there into the universe. The 0:04:15.840 --> 0:04:21.080 universe is frustratingly, amazingly beautifying, le vast and enormous, which 0:04:21.120 --> 0:04:24.120 makes it difficult to explore. And so to get out there, 0:04:24.120 --> 0:04:26.560 to get to a neighboring star, to find those aliens, 0:04:26.600 --> 0:04:29.480 to visit black holes and unravel the secrets of general 0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:32.800 relativity and quantum mechanics, we need a device, a drive 0:04:32.880 --> 0:04:35.039 that could actually get us there. Yeah, maybe we need 0:04:35.200 --> 0:04:40.160 an impossible idea to solve a seemingly impossible problem. And 0:04:40.240 --> 0:04:42.680 so today on the podcast, we'll be asking the question, 0:04:47.520 --> 0:04:52.680 what is the impossible drive? And is it possible? Possibly 0:04:53.600 --> 0:04:56.359 in a possible kind of way. This is a this 0:04:56.400 --> 0:05:00.400 is a very certain podcast episode here today, Daniel, is 0:05:00.440 --> 0:05:04.120 it possible the impossible drive may possibly be possible? While 0:05:04.120 --> 0:05:08.760 eating an impossible burger and watching Mission Impossible with con Cruise. 0:05:11.320 --> 0:05:13.560 That does sound like an impossible combination of things to 0:05:13.600 --> 0:05:17.479 pull off all that one. But yeah, so this is 0:05:17.760 --> 0:05:19.440 kind of a crazy idea. I have to say, I 0:05:19.480 --> 0:05:22.840 had not heard of this before getting your notes this morning, 0:05:23.000 --> 0:05:24.880 and so this is all sort of an idea to 0:05:25.480 --> 0:05:28.800 solve the problem of how to get across base, like 0:05:28.839 --> 0:05:32.720 how to get two distant stars without having to bring 0:05:32.760 --> 0:05:35.360 a whole bunch of fuel with you. That's right, because 0:05:35.360 --> 0:05:38.360 there's just a basic problem in getting to those stars, 0:05:38.680 --> 0:05:40.760 Like you want to get to those stars, they're really 0:05:40.800 --> 0:05:43.760 far away, all right. So to get really far away 0:05:43.800 --> 0:05:46.880 you have to get going really really fast. And to 0:05:46.920 --> 0:05:49.440 get going really fast, you need an engine, something that's 0:05:49.440 --> 0:05:52.880 going to push you, and the current rockets that we 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:56.120 have you require a lot of fuel. So you can 0:05:56.120 --> 0:05:59.240 do like a pretty simple calculation and ask like how 0:05:59.360 --> 0:06:02.039 much raw good fuel would it take to accelerate a 0:06:02.160 --> 0:06:05.000 very very small object, you know, something like a toothpick 0:06:05.560 --> 0:06:07.800 up two, I don't know five of the speed of 0:06:07.880 --> 0:06:10.120 light really the kind of the kind of speed that 0:06:10.120 --> 0:06:12.680 would make it take like only a hundred years to 0:06:12.720 --> 0:06:16.320 get to alpha centar. So my spacecraft was just a 0:06:16.360 --> 0:06:19.680 toothpick zero point one, Grahams, how much fuel would it 0:06:19.680 --> 0:06:21.600 take to get it to alpha centri within like a 0:06:21.680 --> 0:06:24.600 hundred years? Yeah, And the problem is that your spaceship 0:06:24.680 --> 0:06:27.240 is not just a toothpick. It's a toothpick plus all 0:06:27.279 --> 0:06:30.960 the fuel, right, Your fuel has to push the fuel 0:06:30.960 --> 0:06:33.760 you're going to need in the future. And so if 0:06:33.800 --> 0:06:37.080 the payload is just a toothpick, then most of your 0:06:37.200 --> 0:06:40.560 rocket ship is actually fuel, and that means you need 0:06:40.600 --> 0:06:42.320 more fuel. And the more fuel you have, the more 0:06:42.320 --> 0:06:44.720 fuel you need, and so it grows very very quickly. 0:06:44.839 --> 0:06:46.960 You got to like fill up the tank and take 0:06:47.000 --> 0:06:48.839 it with you, exactly. You have to do. You have 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:51.080 to bring an oil tanker, not just like a little 0:06:51.120 --> 0:06:53.560 prious exactly, and then you've got to accelerate that oil tanker. 0:06:53.560 --> 0:06:56.280 That oil tanker also needs a tank of gas, right, 0:06:56.760 --> 0:06:59.159 And so it very quickly grows to a huge number. 0:06:59.440 --> 0:07:02.000 And the number is actually ridiculous, Like, in order to 0:07:02.040 --> 0:07:04.960 have enough fuel to get your toothpick up to five 0:07:05.360 --> 0:07:08.920 of the speed of light takes more mass than exists 0:07:09.000 --> 0:07:13.520 in the observable universe by a huge by huge number. 0:07:13.640 --> 0:07:18.200 How much hen to the That's not a number, Daniel, 0:07:18.720 --> 0:07:22.520 you made that up. It's impossible. I didn't make that up. 0:07:22.720 --> 0:07:26.040 There's an impossible mathematics behind this. It's just it's frustratingly 0:07:26.080 --> 0:07:28.680 difficult one with two thousand zeros in front of Yeah, 0:07:28.840 --> 0:07:31.200 and it's not hard to imagine how the number gets 0:07:31.200 --> 0:07:33.120 so big. I mean, say your spaceship is the size 0:07:33.160 --> 0:07:36.200 of Jupiter. How much fuel you're gonna need. You're gonna 0:07:36.200 --> 0:07:38.600 need as much fuel as like the Sun. All right, Well, 0:07:38.640 --> 0:07:41.280 now your spaceship is Jupiter and the Sun. How much 0:07:41.320 --> 0:07:43.080 fuel a you're gonna need to push that? Well, you're 0:07:43.080 --> 0:07:47.600 gonna need like more suns. So it just grows just 0:07:47.640 --> 0:07:51.520 to push this toothpick. So the lesson is chemical rockets 0:07:51.520 --> 0:07:53.800 that require this kind of fuel are not going to 0:07:53.920 --> 0:07:56.640 get us across the stars. You need a better way, right, 0:07:56.880 --> 0:07:58.960 one where you don't have to bring your fuel with you. 0:07:59.000 --> 0:08:00.920 That's right, when where you don't have to bring the 0:08:01.040 --> 0:08:03.760 fuel with you, that's the idea, even if you use like, 0:08:04.040 --> 0:08:06.680 you know, is this the current fuel technology, you know, 0:08:06.760 --> 0:08:09.080 like you know, the current rocket fuel or is this 0:08:09.200 --> 0:08:12.480 like imagining like what if we invent fusion drives or 0:08:12.760 --> 0:08:15.040 you know, we managed to invent fission drives. Yeah, the 0:08:15.080 --> 0:08:17.800 basic limitation is that you need something to push off of, 0:08:18.080 --> 0:08:20.520 and so it's not so much limited by the technology 0:08:20.560 --> 0:08:23.120 of that push as to just having to carry the 0:08:23.120 --> 0:08:25.680 fuel along with you. I see, like how much mass 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:28.160 you have to expel in order to be pushed to 0:08:28.400 --> 0:08:31.880 the speed of light? Yeah, precisely. So this this cool, 0:08:31.960 --> 0:08:35.320 crazy new idea out there, This e M drive sometimes 0:08:35.360 --> 0:08:39.600 called a impossible drive, that some people think may have 0:08:39.640 --> 0:08:43.440 the possibility to overcome this problem. And that's why they 0:08:43.480 --> 0:08:46.680 call it an impossible drive because it seems to violate 0:08:46.760 --> 0:08:50.520 some laws of physics. But some experimenters out there claimed 0:08:50.600 --> 0:08:53.160 to have built one and made it work. Wow. And 0:08:53.240 --> 0:08:55.200 this came to us from a question from one of 0:08:55.200 --> 0:08:58.440 our listeners, right Russell Alert. Yeah, he wrote to us 0:08:58.440 --> 0:09:00.080 about a year ago and said, hey, you could you 0:09:00.120 --> 0:09:03.400 guys explain this drive to me. Is it impossible? Doesn't work? 0:09:03.640 --> 0:09:06.080 Could it actually get us to the stars? And it's 0:09:06.160 --> 0:09:10.320 taken us a year to answer just to well, I 0:09:10.440 --> 0:09:12.880 built one of these things. I welcome to a centauri 0:09:13.000 --> 0:09:14.600 and I came back. I mean, I do some real 0:09:14.640 --> 0:09:18.040 field research. Did you think I was just googling? You know, 0:09:18.080 --> 0:09:19.520 we don't want to just give you an idea and 0:09:19.600 --> 0:09:22.000 say it's impossible or not possible. We have to see 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:24.320 for ourselves. That's right. I'm an experimentalist. I backed my 0:09:24.360 --> 0:09:26.560 answers up with real research. Man, this is not just 0:09:26.679 --> 0:09:30.360 googling around. Okay, right, So we're actually recording this from 0:09:30.360 --> 0:09:34.280 a toothpick as we're as we're making our way to 0:09:34.280 --> 0:09:38.200 to pick podcast studios, inc well as usually what we 0:09:38.200 --> 0:09:40.080 were wondering how many people out there had heard of 0:09:40.120 --> 0:09:43.960 this impossible drive or e M drive? And so, as usual, 0:09:44.040 --> 0:09:46.240 Daniel went out there into the wilds of the internet 0:09:46.280 --> 0:09:49.439 to ask people what is an e M drive and 0:09:49.559 --> 0:09:52.520 could it ever work? So think about it for a second, 0:09:52.559 --> 0:09:55.440 if you had ever heard of it or not, and 0:09:55.480 --> 0:09:58.360 if physicist ask you, what would you say. Here's what 0:09:58.400 --> 0:10:00.800 people had to say, Honey, I'm trying if I haven't 0:10:00.840 --> 0:10:02.920 heard of. I'm going to presume that e M stands 0:10:02.960 --> 0:10:06.559 for electromagnetic and drive as some sort of propulsion systems. 0:10:06.600 --> 0:10:09.720 So maybe some sort of rocket buster or engine that 0:10:09.760 --> 0:10:13.600 doesn't require few but relies on electromagnetic waves to propel itself. 0:10:13.840 --> 0:10:18.000 I think theoretically it could work, but it's on the 0:10:18.040 --> 0:10:24.959 realm of theoretical really tbt. But nothing has been done, 0:10:25.160 --> 0:10:28.320 but it there. Supposedly you need a lot of energy 0:10:28.400 --> 0:10:32.440 to make it work. And E M drived I think, well, 0:10:32.480 --> 0:10:34.960 first of all, it sounds really familiar, like I like 0:10:35.040 --> 0:10:37.920 a lot of sci fi, so I it's a term 0:10:38.000 --> 0:10:40.120 that has come up a lot, and I think it 0:10:40.160 --> 0:10:42.880 doesn't exist yet. And I think it also has to 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:47.600 do with time travel, but I'm not sure. I'm so 0:10:47.640 --> 0:10:50.040 excited to look at up later. And E M drive 0:10:50.240 --> 0:10:52.880 is an electromagnetic drive that functions by putting a lot 0:10:52.920 --> 0:10:56.720 of microwaves together. Currently Toshiba in general Electric have the 0:10:56.760 --> 0:11:00.600 best ratings by consumer reports. Anyways, a bunch of these 0:11:00.640 --> 0:11:02.960 together and shoot microwaves out one end to get the 0:11:02.960 --> 0:11:06.040 ship to go in the opposite direction. It definitely doesn't 0:11:06.040 --> 0:11:08.480 work and will kill the grass in your backyard if 0:11:08.520 --> 0:11:12.240 you attempt to achieve launch. I have no idea what 0:11:12.280 --> 0:11:16.280 an E M drive is. I'm assuming that means electromagnetic, 0:11:16.920 --> 0:11:19.559 but I'm not sure, so I have no idea to work. 0:11:20.600 --> 0:11:25.240 I don't know exactly what this is. Some kind of propulsion, 0:11:25.320 --> 0:11:28.839 but I don't have any idea. I have never heard 0:11:28.880 --> 0:11:32.000 of an e M drive, so I'm going to get 0:11:32.120 --> 0:11:36.079 then E M stands for electromagnetic, and of course drive 0:11:36.200 --> 0:11:40.320 means it's some sort of a of an engine um 0:11:40.320 --> 0:11:46.200 with they can use electromagnetic pulses to create thrust. I 0:11:46.240 --> 0:11:49.000 guess I don't know what an e M drive is, 0:11:49.080 --> 0:11:51.760 but I do know another type of drive. It's called 0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:55.800 the infinite probability drive. It was installed on the starship 0:11:55.880 --> 0:11:58.560 part of Gold, and it was and it is still 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:01.960 in use today. I can explained it properly, but I 0:12:02.000 --> 0:12:06.160 know it's more possible than a warp drive. Sorry, Daniel, 0:12:06.600 --> 0:12:11.280 no idea. Maybe a device for driving around the universe. 0:12:11.679 --> 0:12:15.480 I have not ideal EM drive. So the M drive 0:12:15.720 --> 0:12:19.760 I've heard, Uh it's not the Canay drive where it's 0:12:19.920 --> 0:12:25.480 uh slotted resonance space um. But the idea is that 0:12:26.200 --> 0:12:29.200 momentum is quantized, and so if you have a smaller 0:12:29.240 --> 0:12:30.760 space on one side and the larger space on the 0:12:30.760 --> 0:12:35.760 other side. It can bounce back some kind of microwave frequency, 0:12:35.800 --> 0:12:39.720 I think, and create propulsion lists thrust, but I don't 0:12:39.760 --> 0:12:43.360 think it's anything that actually works. I don't know what 0:12:43.440 --> 0:12:46.400 an e M drive is exactly. I think it would 0:12:46.440 --> 0:12:52.120 be electromagnetic, where you're using some kind of electromagnetic reaction 0:12:52.360 --> 0:12:56.160 to throw particles out of the back of a spaceship 0:12:56.240 --> 0:12:59.440 to accelerate it. I suppose that would work, but it's 0:12:59.600 --> 0:13:02.880 probably not what you mean, all right, not not a 0:13:02.920 --> 0:13:04.760 lot of recognition, but some people seem to know what 0:13:04.800 --> 0:13:08.080 it was, or maybe they just lashed onto the electromagnetic 0:13:08.120 --> 0:13:10.560 cart it. He asked some good guesses there, and some 0:13:10.600 --> 0:13:13.360 people had definitely heard about this, and this really made 0:13:13.400 --> 0:13:17.400 some waves. Pun intended about ten years ago. So there's 0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:19.520 a lot of splash in the media about this drive, 0:13:19.960 --> 0:13:22.559 and then recently there's been some more news and so 0:13:22.720 --> 0:13:24.679 I'm not surprised that a few a few of our 0:13:24.679 --> 0:13:28.240 listeners have heard about this discussion. Oh nice, nice, I 0:13:28.240 --> 0:13:31.240 guess my first question is is it vegetarian? Does it 0:13:31.320 --> 0:13:34.800 come from plant based products like the Impossible Burger? No 0:13:34.960 --> 0:13:38.040 meat was harmed in the creation of this impossible only 0:13:38.120 --> 0:13:43.760 laws of physics were totally destroyed, and all life depends 0:13:43.760 --> 0:13:45.600 on the laws of physics. So I don't really know 0:13:46.000 --> 0:13:48.600 is it vegan to break the laws of physics or not. 0:13:48.679 --> 0:13:50.280 I need of ruling on that. We need a better 0:13:50.840 --> 0:13:54.880 physics lawyer or a physics judge. I guess we need 0:13:54.920 --> 0:13:58.240 to go to the International Court of Physics cosmological Court 0:13:59.040 --> 0:14:04.360 of Impossibility. I was let's step thraight here. Uh. First 0:14:04.360 --> 0:14:06.200 of all, well what is it and where did this 0:14:06.240 --> 0:14:08.320 idea come from? So the idea for the e M 0:14:08.440 --> 0:14:11.240 drive is to try to build a drive where you 0:14:11.320 --> 0:14:14.600 don't need to bring along with you something to push against. 0:14:14.920 --> 0:14:19.040 You don't need something to have a propellant. And remember 0:14:19.080 --> 0:14:21.800 that all rockets that we've ever invented so far have 0:14:21.960 --> 0:14:26.440 two basic elements. One is some source of energy, you know, 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:29.840 like fuel or laser or something, and the other is 0:14:29.880 --> 0:14:33.880 something to push against. And this comes from the conservation 0:14:33.880 --> 0:14:37.000 of momentum. If you're gonna move left, the only way 0:14:37.040 --> 0:14:39.800 to do that is to push something else right. That's 0:14:39.800 --> 0:14:42.600 the only way really in the universe, the only way. 0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:45.920 There's no magic in the universe, not that we're aware of, 0:14:46.480 --> 0:14:49.480 and the law of conservation of momentum is very very 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:52.400 deeply ingrained in physics and has been tested a zillion 0:14:52.520 --> 0:14:56.480 times that you know, the scales of galaxies and particles, 0:14:56.840 --> 0:14:59.800 so we're pretty confident it's true. And it just basically 0:15:00.160 --> 0:15:04.240 is that momentum is conserved, so momentum doesn't change. You 0:15:04.280 --> 0:15:07.440 can take a brick and split it in half and 0:15:07.520 --> 0:15:09.640 send one half to the left, but then you have 0:15:09.720 --> 0:15:11.640 to send the other half to the right so that 0:15:11.680 --> 0:15:14.600 their momentum balances. Like if your brick and initially has 0:15:14.680 --> 0:15:17.400 zero momentum, in the final state, it also has to 0:15:17.440 --> 0:15:20.040 have zero momentum. There can be motion, there can be 0:15:20.120 --> 0:15:23.560 kinetic energy, but there has to be zero net momentum. 0:15:23.840 --> 0:15:25.040 So it's almost like if you want to go to 0:15:25.080 --> 0:15:30.120 alpha centari, you have to push yourself there. Almost it's 0:15:30.120 --> 0:15:31.720 like you have to if you want to get your 0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:34.080 toothpick to alpha centor you have to push the equivalent 0:15:34.160 --> 0:15:37.400 of a toothpick and the opposite direction. Yeah, you have 0:15:37.440 --> 0:15:40.480 to sit in your ship and throw stuff out the back. Right. 0:15:40.920 --> 0:15:43.480 You know, some people out there wonder, like do rockets 0:15:43.520 --> 0:15:46.040 work in empty space? Because they imagine that rockets work 0:15:46.080 --> 0:15:48.920 by pushing on the air. They're not pushing on the air, 0:15:48.960 --> 0:15:52.280 they're just throwing stuff out the back, right, because if 0:15:52.280 --> 0:15:55.080 they want to move forward, something else has to move backwards. 0:15:55.080 --> 0:15:58.680 So the whole system, the combination of all the original stuff, 0:15:58.720 --> 0:16:01.040 has the same momentum is when it's starting. And this 0:16:01.080 --> 0:16:04.080 is pretty familiar. Like if you fire a gun, right, 0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:07.920 you're pushing a bullet and there's a recoil. So imagine, 0:16:08.040 --> 0:16:09.920 you know, the rocket example is the bullet is the 0:16:09.960 --> 0:16:12.360 stuff you're pushing at the back, and the gun is 0:16:12.400 --> 0:16:15.440 your rocket. A one way to power a rocket ship 0:16:15.480 --> 0:16:16.800 is to stand in the back of it and shoot 0:16:16.800 --> 0:16:19.720 bullets out the back. Oh hey, that's an idea that 0:16:19.960 --> 0:16:22.320 you guys thought about, that one. That is basically the idea. 0:16:22.360 --> 0:16:24.440 I mean, that's what a chemical rocket is, right, You 0:16:24.520 --> 0:16:27.760 start a big explosion and focus all the stuff and 0:16:27.800 --> 0:16:29.960 shoot it out the back, and that's why it goes. 0:16:30.600 --> 0:16:33.040 You take the energy, and that energy is used to 0:16:33.080 --> 0:16:35.880 push stuff out the back. So that's what a rocket is. 0:16:36.040 --> 0:16:38.240 But it needs those two elements, one energy and to 0:16:38.800 --> 0:16:41.960 something to throw out the back. Because you can just 0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:43.720 stand there and throw things off the bag, you would 0:16:43.760 --> 0:16:46.400 get tired. You need you need some energy to do 0:16:46.440 --> 0:16:50.040 it right. Well, it's like you can't push yourself up 0:16:50.040 --> 0:16:52.840 by your bootstraps, right, You can't stand in your spaceship 0:16:52.920 --> 0:16:55.400 and like get it going by pushing on the inside 0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:58.120 of it. Okay, that's the basic idea of every rocket 0:16:58.160 --> 0:17:00.400 we've ever had. You need energy, and you need something 0:17:00.480 --> 0:17:04.280 to recoil against. You need propellant to throw at the back, right, right, 0:17:04.320 --> 0:17:06.399 And then the problem is that you need to bring 0:17:06.560 --> 0:17:09.200 that mess with you, the stuff you're gonna explode with 0:17:09.280 --> 0:17:11.800 you in order to keep going. Yes, and then you 0:17:11.840 --> 0:17:15.240 need to push that stuff. Right, So you need to 0:17:15.240 --> 0:17:17.560 today push all the stuff you're gonna need tomorrow, and 0:17:17.600 --> 0:17:19.480 the stuff you need in a week and in a year, 0:17:19.560 --> 0:17:21.880 and that stuff adds up, which means today you need 0:17:21.920 --> 0:17:24.119 even more stuff to push. And that's how you end 0:17:24.200 --> 0:17:27.199 up with, you know, spaceship Jupiter, just to go to 0:17:27.200 --> 0:17:31.720 Alpha Centauri, the paler of the size of the Sun. Yeah, exactly. 0:17:31.840 --> 0:17:34.240 And so the idea for the impossible drive is like, well, 0:17:34.320 --> 0:17:37.159 can we skip that step? Can we somehow have a 0:17:37.240 --> 0:17:41.120 drive that doesn't need any recoil, that doesn't throw anything 0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:45.480 out the back? Wow? Like um, something that somehow violates 0:17:45.560 --> 0:17:48.320 the laws of conservation of momentum. Yes, exactly, And that's 0:17:48.320 --> 0:17:50.960 why it's called the impossible drive because it would totally 0:17:51.080 --> 0:17:54.919 violate the laws of conservation of momentum. Or you know, 0:17:55.200 --> 0:17:58.040 maybe there's something else going on, like if you would 0:17:58.040 --> 0:18:01.680 build a device that seems to the laws of conservation momentum, 0:18:01.680 --> 0:18:04.359 that means that either one you screwed something up in 0:18:04.400 --> 0:18:08.400 your experiments to momentum isn't actually conserved, you know, which 0:18:08.400 --> 0:18:11.640 would be like a huge deal, or this momentum is conserved, 0:18:11.640 --> 0:18:13.720 but there's something else in your system you weren't to 0:18:13.760 --> 0:18:17.000 wear it. You've discovered some new force field or some 0:18:17.320 --> 0:18:19.640 thing in the quantum foam or something. Right, so you've 0:18:19.680 --> 0:18:21.720 learned something about the universe. And at that point, like 0:18:21.760 --> 0:18:23.480 why would you want to go to a centaur. Just 0:18:23.520 --> 0:18:28.400 stay here and monetize your amazing physics breaking idea. That's right, 0:18:28.400 --> 0:18:31.840 your impossible foam or whatever it is you've discovered. Yeah, 0:18:31.880 --> 0:18:34.000 and and you know, so this is a different class 0:18:34.000 --> 0:18:35.919 of ideas. This e M drive is a different class 0:18:35.920 --> 0:18:38.920 of ideas than ideas like a solar sales. Solar sales 0:18:38.960 --> 0:18:41.840 of another really cool way to get to high speeds. 0:18:42.119 --> 0:18:44.679 But the idea there is you sort of leave the 0:18:44.720 --> 0:18:48.000 engine at home and you push the photons and they 0:18:48.000 --> 0:18:51.320 get captured by your spaceship, which just gets pushed by 0:18:51.359 --> 0:18:54.000 those photons, and so the whole engine. You can think 0:18:54.000 --> 0:18:55.760 of it like as the laser that stays home, and 0:18:55.800 --> 0:18:57.679 the sale is the part of the ship. Right. It's 0:18:57.680 --> 0:18:59.919 like you you're that's that's different idea where you kind 0:18:59.920 --> 0:19:02.240 of catch things that are out there and use them 0:19:02.240 --> 0:19:04.199 to kind of hit your ride. Yeah, exactly, that's a 0:19:04.200 --> 0:19:08.320 different idea, but that requires some like huge laser focused 0:19:08.359 --> 0:19:11.439 on your ship from really, really really far away. This 0:19:11.520 --> 0:19:13.560 would be a drive you could take anywhere. You could 0:19:13.640 --> 0:19:15.840 use it to lift off the surface of the Earth 0:19:15.920 --> 0:19:18.000 and zoom around the whole galaxy and get up to 0:19:18.040 --> 0:19:20.640 really high speeds. I mean, it's sounds awesome. I want 0:19:20.680 --> 0:19:22.959 the impossible drive to be impossible. I want a car 0:19:23.000 --> 0:19:26.520 with the impossible drive. I do. Yeah, I want to 0:19:26.560 --> 0:19:29.000 take it to you know, the Burger Joint and by 0:19:29.000 --> 0:19:31.600 an impossible burger. All right, Well, it sounds too good 0:19:31.600 --> 0:19:34.040 to be true, almost kind of like a Tom Cruise 0:19:34.080 --> 0:19:36.840 movie almost. But let's get into how it actually works 0:19:36.840 --> 0:19:40.280 and whether or not it's possible or possible and what 0:19:40.359 --> 0:19:42.680 people have done about it. But first let's take a 0:19:42.760 --> 0:19:58.360 quick break, all right, Daniel, we're talking about the impossible drive, 0:19:58.520 --> 0:20:01.800 which is maybe a crazy easy idea that violates the 0:20:01.880 --> 0:20:04.760 laws of physics, but which could potentially get us to 0:20:05.080 --> 0:20:08.520 other star systems in other galaxies. Because it's a it's 0:20:08.520 --> 0:20:11.000 a tough problem. It's a tough problem, and we should 0:20:11.080 --> 0:20:13.800 keep an open mind. We should think, hey, some fresh 0:20:13.840 --> 0:20:16.520 ideas out there could crack an age old problem or 0:20:16.560 --> 0:20:19.440 reveal something new about physics and the universe. So we 0:20:19.440 --> 0:20:22.560 should definitely not just scoff and dismiss. We should analyze it, right, 0:20:22.680 --> 0:20:24.680 But then we also have to be skeptical. We can't 0:20:24.720 --> 0:20:27.359 just take every crazy ideas, right. You gotta eat that 0:20:27.400 --> 0:20:31.520 impossible burger just to see for yourself, because it maybe 0:20:31.560 --> 0:20:33.199 it can't take it's just like real or maybe the 0:20:33.200 --> 0:20:36.280 beyond burger is beyond the impossible burger. Who knows, right, 0:20:36.600 --> 0:20:40.840 data is the only is there beyond engine? Also not 0:20:41.000 --> 0:20:44.560 yet I'm working on I see. Oh sorry, sorry, that's 0:20:44.600 --> 0:20:48.560 beyond the scope of today's podcast, beyond my nda agreement 0:20:48.600 --> 0:20:50.480 I have with you. We'll have to edit that out, 0:20:50.720 --> 0:20:53.080 all right, Well, maybe i'd step us through. How does 0:20:53.080 --> 0:20:56.119 this impossible drive work, Like, what's the basic physics idea 0:20:56.440 --> 0:20:59.200 or not physics idea behind. It's kind of a crazy idea, 0:20:59.280 --> 0:21:01.640 and frankly, I don't really understand how it's even supposed 0:21:01.680 --> 0:21:05.040 to work, but if you look around online you discover 0:21:05.240 --> 0:21:09.320 some basic fact about it. So it's a copper cylinder, right, 0:21:09.400 --> 0:21:12.359 It's made out of metal, and the cylinders have two 0:21:12.359 --> 0:21:15.040 flat ends like a cylinder, but one side is bigger 0:21:15.040 --> 0:21:17.800 than the other. And the idea is that this kind 0:21:17.800 --> 0:21:21.719 of copper cylinder is a resonant chamber for microwaves. So 0:21:21.840 --> 0:21:24.520 microwaves are just a kind of light, they're kind of photon. 0:21:24.880 --> 0:21:27.359 You put them in there, and this chamber is the 0:21:27.440 --> 0:21:29.679