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Speaker 1: Hey, lady, is doctor dom here. If you like this

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Speaker 1: show and you want to make your own, let me

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Speaker 1: tell you about the free platform Anchor. It's a creation

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Speaker 1: too that allows you to record and edit your podcast

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Speaker 1: are looking for. Anchor will distribute it all for you

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Speaker 1: so it can be heard on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and more.

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Speaker 1: Download the free Anchor app or go to anchor dot

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Speaker 1: fm to get started.

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Speaker 2: On this week's episode in her Space.

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Speaker 1: If I'm having a conversation with a friend or someone

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Speaker 1: that I feel close and connected to, then how I

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Speaker 1: dive into that conversation may be a little bit different. Right. So,

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Speaker 1: I know that if I'm going into a conversation with

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Speaker 1: a friend, the consequences of if this conversation doesn't go

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Speaker 1: well is different than the consequences of if the conversation

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Speaker 1: with my boss doesn't go well.

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Speaker 3: Right, And so I.

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Speaker 1: May be more willing to take more risks and be

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Speaker 1: really and truly more open minded in the conversation with

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Speaker 1: my friend versus my boss.

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Speaker 4: Today's episode is sure to provide you with motivation, inspiration,

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Speaker 4: or even a fresh perspective. If you have any AHA moments,

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Speaker 4: or if you feel comforted throughout the episode, Lady, please

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Speaker 4: leave us a review and tell us what we're doing

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Speaker 4: right so we can stay on track. Also, we release

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Speaker 4: episodes every Friday, so be sure to subscribe on iTunes

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Speaker 4: and visit Herspace podcast dot com and enter your email

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Speaker 4: address to get updates about our live events and all

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Speaker 4: the new beginnings that we have for this year.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to her a podcast dedicated to uplifting women like you.

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Speaker 1: We're your hosts, Doctor Dominique Broussard, a college professor and psychologist.

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Speaker 2: And Terry Lomax, a techie and motivational speaker. In a

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Speaker 2: world where black women are often misrepresented and misunderstood, please

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Speaker 2: join us as we initiate authentic conversations on everything from

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Speaker 2: fibroids to fake friends and create a safe space where

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Speaker 2: black women can just be.

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Speaker 5: Hey, Lady, is doctor Dom here from the Herspace Podcast.

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Speaker 5: Do you have a burning question you're dying to get

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Speaker 5: feedback on. Do you want an unbiased perspective on a

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Speaker 5: situation you're facing. If so, visit herspacepodcast dot com and

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Speaker 5: click ask doctor Dom under the start here option. Every Tuesday,

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Speaker 5: I'll choose a few questions and answer them at random.

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Speaker 1: Okay, our quote of the day. Not everything that is

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Speaker 1: faced can be changed, but nothing can be changed until

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Speaker 1: it is faced. That quote comes to us from James Baldwin. So, team, today,

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Speaker 1: we are diving into a conversation that is inviting us

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Speaker 1: to face some things that can be a bit challenging,

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Speaker 1: can be a bit uncomfortable.

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Speaker 3: And so when I think about this topic.

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Speaker 1: Of having conversations with white people, particularly around microaggressions and

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Speaker 1: the current racial climate, what are your thoughts?

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Speaker 2: I will say, dom one thing that came to mind

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Speaker 2: first when we were having this conversation or when we

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Speaker 2: planned to talk about this, is that, I mean, we

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Speaker 2: know that black people are not monolithic. You and I

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Speaker 2: what we're going to share today is not representative of

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Speaker 2: the black community. And Lady, I just want to say,

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Speaker 2: as you're listening today, you may have you may be

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Speaker 2: a black person with a white partner, right. You might

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Speaker 2: be one of those black people with lots of white friends. Right.

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Speaker 2: We all have different upbringings and environments that were raised

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Speaker 2: in or you might even have a white parent, and

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Speaker 2: so our experiences are processing it will vary but hopefully

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Speaker 2: you can take something away. And I think for me,

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Speaker 2: Dom it makes me think about, you know, what has

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Speaker 2: my experience been like with white people, because over the years,

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Speaker 2: my experiences have shifted drastically. And so in order to

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Speaker 2: answer that question, it takes me back to my childhood,

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Speaker 2: right being raised in San Diego, where I had a

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Speaker 2: very diverse group of friends. One of my best friends

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Speaker 2: was white, one of my other best friends was Mexican,

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Speaker 2: and then we had so many different races, you know,

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Speaker 2: nationality people, you know, just various people that I grew

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Speaker 2: up around. And I remember being raised in this now

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Speaker 2: white area and I would like call home to Philly,

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Speaker 2: like speak to my family, and they'd be like, you

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Speaker 2: sound like a white girl. And so I had a

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Speaker 2: very different experience as a black person being raised in

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Speaker 2: that type of environment. But then when I moved to

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Speaker 2: Philly when I was a preteen, I was just like,

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Speaker 2: oh damn, am I really black? Because I went to

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Speaker 2: school in the hood, and so I didn't really you know,

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Speaker 2: fit in with my people. And it's been a very

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Speaker 2: interesting journey for me, I'll say. And so for me,

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Speaker 2: you know, being raised in San Diego, being this black

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Speaker 2: valley girl right, and then moving to the hood in

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Speaker 2: Philly or going to a hood school in Philly. It

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Speaker 2: was a huge culture shock, and so for me don

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Speaker 2: it was sort of like an identity crisis where I

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Speaker 2: was like, where do I fit in with black people?

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Speaker 2: Because I know I'm not white. They say that I'm white,

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Speaker 2: and I talk white and I'm you know, a square

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Speaker 2: and all this stuff, But then I don't fit in

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Speaker 2: with my own people even though we have the same color.

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Speaker 2: So for me, it's been a very interesting journey of

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Speaker 2: figuring out where I fit in, figuring out, you know,

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Speaker 2: how to interact with white people after, you know, having

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Speaker 2: been in this public like you know, Philly school system

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Speaker 2: where it was sort of like a different culture than

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Speaker 2: I was accustomed to. And so I think for me, Dom, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I mean, the best thing I can say is like,

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Speaker 2: it's been a journey, and I know we're gonna dive

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Speaker 2: in deeper into that. But I'm curious to also hear

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Speaker 2: about your experiences too, because I also think about church, right,

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Speaker 2: I had a lot of black leaders in church, but

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Speaker 2: when I think about my schooling, a lot of the people,

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Speaker 2: a lot of the authority figures in life outside of church,

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Speaker 2: were white people, whether it was the teachers, whether it

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Speaker 2: was and this is kind of a mixture of in church,

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Speaker 2: but whether you're in my Bible school and you see

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Speaker 2: a white Jesus up in there, which is like hmm,

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Speaker 2: you know, you see all the authority figures are white,

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Speaker 2: whether it's the cops come into your house because of

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Speaker 2: domestic violence, which is something that was in my past.

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Speaker 2: So I think it really shapes it. And so that's

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Speaker 2: kind of like an overview, Don, But I'm curious to

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Speaker 2: hear what has your experience been like just with white

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Speaker 2: people in general.

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Speaker 1: You know, I'm from New Orleans, and New Orleans has

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Speaker 1: been predominantly blessed for a really long time, right, And

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Speaker 1: I say really long time because I'm not a historian

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Speaker 1: and I don't know the exact dates, but I know

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Speaker 1: also now with gentrification, the numbers of black folks in

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Speaker 1: New Orleans are decreasing. And that's a whole nother story

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Speaker 1: for a whole nother day. But what I can recall

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Speaker 1: growing up is that I was in public school where

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Speaker 1: the majority of the people, I'd say over ninety percent

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Speaker 1: of the people that I were around were black. We

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Speaker 1: had a mix of teachers but we had an overwhelming number.

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Speaker 1: The majority of our teachers were also black, So I

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Speaker 1: think I had a different experience than some other people

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Speaker 1: across the country, right. And I think that the times

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Speaker 1: when I was most around white people was at church

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Speaker 1: because I grew up and the church that we went

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Speaker 1: to was a mixed church, and so there were a

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Speaker 1: lot of black families as well as a lot of

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Speaker 1: white families there. As I got older and when I

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Speaker 1: started college, college was probably the first time when I

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Speaker 1: was in a space where I could look around and

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Speaker 1: count on one hand the number of black students in

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Speaker 1: the classroom.

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Speaker 2: Wow.

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Speaker 1: Then getting jobs at like college, graduate school, having jobs,

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Speaker 1: the majority of those spaces were white, except for when

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Speaker 1: I taught at Texas Southern, which is in HBCU.

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Speaker 3: But there were white folks that work at TSU. Right.

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Speaker 1: So It's not that I've never gone without interacting with

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Speaker 1: white people, but I've also been privileged to be able

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Speaker 1: to be around people who look like me. And I

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Speaker 1: know that that's not always everyone's experience, because even in

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Speaker 1: spaces where I could count on my hand the number

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Speaker 1: of black folks, there were opportunities for me to engage

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Speaker 1: with people who looked.

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Speaker 2: Like me, that sounds amazing, actually, Don, because I think about,

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Speaker 2: you know, from a young age, being the only black

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Speaker 2: in my class right now, the only black woman or

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Speaker 2: a girl, but the only black person. And you know

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Speaker 2: those times of the year when we it was Black

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Speaker 2: History Month and we talked about slavery, those were the

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Speaker 2: worst because you know, everybody looking at it. You like,

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Speaker 2: you can provide live experience of you know, your time

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Speaker 2: in that era, and it's just like, yo, what what

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Speaker 2: are you doing? So I think that sounds amazing your experience,

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Speaker 2: and that's new for me because I didn't really know

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Speaker 2: that was your background. I will say, Don. For me,

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Speaker 2: after going to the hood school, you know, then going

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Speaker 2: back to the suburbs and going to a predominantly white school,

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Speaker 2: I was kind of back and forth in these different

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Speaker 2: spaces that I felt pretty comfortable being in a diverse

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Speaker 2: space because that's kind of what I came from. After

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Speaker 2: those experiences of being in schooling. It wasn't until I

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Speaker 2: moved to Silicon Valley and started working in tech that

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Speaker 2: I began to have like white acquaintances and friends as

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Speaker 2: an adult. And for me, that was a new experience

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Speaker 2: down because this is not I mean, ever since my

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Speaker 2: best friend who was I mean, we were in grade

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Speaker 2: school together. So ever since that white friend that I had,

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Speaker 2: I never really had any super close like white friends

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Speaker 2: that I cared about until adulthood. And so for me,

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Speaker 2: this has been a new journey for me because I

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Speaker 2: think many of us have grown up in households where

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Speaker 2: it's like, we don't trust no white people. That's just

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Speaker 2: what you're taught because of the history, because of you know,

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Speaker 2: the ways in which people that we know have been

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Speaker 2: slighted by them in the workplace, right they may you know,

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Speaker 2: hold information or you have this air sometimes that it's

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Speaker 2: like it's a business relationship, even if you thought it

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Speaker 2: was a friendship. So there are many things that have

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Speaker 2: happened to people that we know, lots of trauma, lots

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Speaker 2: of bad experiences. And I'm sure other people can say

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Speaker 2: the same thing about black people, right. I know a

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Speaker 2: lot of friends where in their household dark skinned people

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Speaker 2: and black people, you don't bring a black person home,

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Speaker 2: right to date, and there are other conversations that happen

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Speaker 2: in their household about black people, and many of us

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Speaker 2: black people were taught the same thing about white people.

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Speaker 2: I know some of the black guys in my family.

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Speaker 2: When I was grown up, it was like, don't bring

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Speaker 2: no white girl home, right, And so I think about

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Speaker 2: me being faced with all these things that I heard

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Speaker 2: growing up, But then now I having white people that

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Speaker 2: I care about deeply, It's like, WHOA, this is interesting.

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Speaker 1: You know. I think what the conversation that we kind

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Speaker 1: of want to dive into today is considering the current

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Speaker 1: climate that we're in, right, the current racial and political climate.

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Speaker 1: I know that what I've seen on the internet would

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Speaker 1: conversations that you and I have had conversations that I've

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Speaker 1: had with other friends and colleagues over these last couple

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Speaker 1: of months around Okay, now it feels as if a

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Speaker 1: couple of things.

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Speaker 3: One white people want to engage us.

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Speaker 1: In dialogue, right, and then two we still have to

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Speaker 1: deal with being black in the workplace. There are still

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Speaker 1: moments where we experience microaggressions, we experience discrimination, we experience

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Speaker 1: aggressive acts of racism against us.

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Speaker 3: So where do we begin?

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Speaker 2: T Where do we begin? That's a good point, dom.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's definitely uncomfortable, it's tough, but I'm with you.

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Speaker 2: I have also realized that the white people in my

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Speaker 2: life now are definitely open to having these conversations. So

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Speaker 2: when it comes to having these conversations, Dom, I think

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Speaker 2: about what are the types of conversations that we might

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Speaker 2: have with them, right, And so I know one is

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Speaker 2: like explaining microaggressions, and microaggressions are basically those I want

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Speaker 2: to say, commonplace verbal or behavioral indignities, right, whether it's

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Speaker 2: intentional or unintentional, because your intent doesn't really you know,

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Speaker 2: always align with the impact. And so these are things

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Speaker 2: that typically communicate a hostile, derogatory, or negative attitude toward

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Speaker 2: a stigmatized group.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 2: So for example, Dom being in the workplace and trying

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Speaker 2: to explain to this person why it's not okay to

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Speaker 2: touch my hair, right, or why it's not okay give

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Speaker 2: me a hip hop nickname that I didn't ask for

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Speaker 2: and call me like t Dizzle out of nowhere, and

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Speaker 2: it's just like that's not appropriate, and that is microaggressions, right,

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Speaker 2: And so it's like, how do you have those conversations?

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Speaker 2: So that's one thing that comes to mind for me, Dom,

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Speaker 2: I want to give you just a little list and

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Speaker 2: maybe we can talk about the tips, but I want

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Speaker 2: to hear what difficult conversations come up for you as well.

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Speaker 2: The next I would say is racism. And I think

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Speaker 2: that's a tricky one because you know, I've noticed lately

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Speaker 2: Dom there are lots of white people that I've had

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Speaker 2: to unfollow that I may have gone to school with

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Speaker 2: because the true colors show. And I remember this guy

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Speaker 2: I went to school with. He was really buying into

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Speaker 2: this respectability politics, and he's like, yeah, you know something

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Speaker 2: like if black people were to just do x y z,

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Speaker 2: you know, pup their pants and do this thing, then

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Speaker 2: they be successful and da da dad, And I was

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Speaker 2: just I damn, Like that was just so hurtful for me,

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Speaker 2: because it's like, you really don't understand how deep white

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Speaker 2: supremacy and racism runs in this country. We can be

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Speaker 2: those perfect citizen and still be murdered by police officers.

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Speaker 2: There is no excuse. But I think a lot of

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Speaker 2: people are bamboozled and they believe that, oh, well, black

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Speaker 2: people could just do x y z. Some black people

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Speaker 2: even believe it, right, black people could just do x

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Speaker 2: y Z, then all the problems will be solved. No

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Speaker 2: black people are at the bottom of the totem pole for

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Speaker 2: a reason, you know, And so I think conversations about race.

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Speaker 2: And then also, this is another one that's really interested dom,

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Speaker 2: especially for white people. They're white to us, and they're

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Speaker 2: white in the US because the US has changed who

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Speaker 2: they deem is white over the years to allow a

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Speaker 2: larger majority to fit into the white class. I want

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Speaker 2: to say, but there was a time where Jewish people

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Speaker 2: were not considered white, right, And I think about the

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Speaker 2: black plight and that being another difficult conversation to have

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Speaker 2: with certain white people because when you think about, you know,

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Speaker 2: me being a woman from a very tough upbringing, right,

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Speaker 2: and then a black woman at that, there's just a

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Speaker 2: certain level of you know, trauma and struggle that I've

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Speaker 2: had to experience. But I remember talking to a white

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Speaker 2: woman at one of my previous jobs, and she had

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Speaker 2: a rough upbringing, like she had a rough upbringing, and

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Speaker 2: she was just like, she didn't understand how, you know,

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Speaker 2: people could just make this assumption about white people and say, oh, well,

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Speaker 2: you're better off or you have some type of privilege,

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Speaker 2: and she's like, no, but I had to struggle. My

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Speaker 2: family was poor. And she didn't get it until someone

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Speaker 2: had shared an analogy with her about a baseball field

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Speaker 2: and basically letting her know, yes, you may have struggled.

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Speaker 2: No one's taken that away, but you were born on

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Speaker 2: second base. Black people, many of us were born in

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Speaker 2: the parking lot, so we had to walk to the

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Speaker 2: fucking field try to get her space. And so it's

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Speaker 2: just a difference as far as you may not feel privileged,

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Speaker 2: but it's like your skin color affords you a certain

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Speaker 2: privilege that you may not be aware of. So those

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Speaker 2: are three conversations that come to mind for me. You know,

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Speaker 2: the microaggressions, racism, and then the black plight in general

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Speaker 2: that are typically really tough. And I know we'll talk

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Speaker 2: a bit more about that, but I want to hear

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Speaker 2: from you. What are conversations that have historically been difficult

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Speaker 2: for you when it comes to chatting with white people.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think about the conversations that more recently are

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Speaker 1: coming up, right of white folks reaching out because you know,

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Speaker 1: right at the start of the summer, when the protests

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Speaker 1: regarding George Floyd and Breonna Taylor were taking off, and

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Speaker 1: there were all these things on the internet about check

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Speaker 1: on your black friends, right, so then you have white

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Speaker 1: folks reaching out to their black colleagues and their black

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Speaker 1: friends to kind of say, oh, I acknowledge what you're

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Speaker 1: going through. I'm sorry that you're dealing with this as

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Speaker 1: a black person. And there's layers to it for me personally, right,

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Speaker 1: I can't speak to how other people respond, and we

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Speaker 1: can dive into later on, we'll dive into tips on

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Speaker 1: how to navigate those conversations. But for me, those conversations

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Speaker 1: are different. My intention and approach when I'm engaging a

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Speaker 1: white person who I know or have a closer relationship

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Speaker 1: with is different than how I'm going to engage a

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Speaker 1: white person who I'm not as close to and so,

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Speaker 1: and I think that that's an important distinction as well.

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Speaker 1: I think that the other types of conversations that can

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Speaker 1: be difficult are those conversations when you have a white parent,

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Speaker 1: or a white partner, or a white family member. That

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Speaker 1: hasn't been my experience, but I know that that is

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Speaker 1: a difficult conversation that lots of other black folks are

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Speaker 1: having to engage in because those are people that they

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Speaker 1: truly love. And so, how do you engage in the

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Speaker 1: dialogue with someone who's in your household, right, someone who

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Speaker 1: you may share children with, who you share a bed with.

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Speaker 1: How do you engage in those difficult dialogues.

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Speaker 3: So those are the two that come up for me.

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Speaker 2: That makes sense toime. Those are really good examples. And

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Speaker 2: I will say I know that our girl, Rachel Cargo

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Speaker 2: look corrupt. She has resources. I remember her posting a

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Speaker 2: resource maybe a couple of years ago about how to

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Speaker 2: have those conversations about race at like Thanksgiving, and so

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Speaker 2: go to her page. She has tons of resources about

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Speaker 2: how to chat with white people about those difficult topics.

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Speaker 2: But I do want to say, dom I want to

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Speaker 2: shout out some of the white people in my life

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Speaker 2: because I messaged them late last night, like, hey, can

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Speaker 2: I get your perspective on this, because I know I

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Speaker 2: could bring my own assumption on what white people think

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Speaker 2: about and how they interact with black people. So I

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Speaker 2: did get some feedback from a few white people in

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Speaker 2: my life, and I just want to shout them out

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Speaker 2: and appreciate and just share my appreciation for them being

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Speaker 2: vulnerable enough for me to just like send them this

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Speaker 2: message and share. So one person said that he sees

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Speaker 2: the discrepancies and racism and tries to be mindful not

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Speaker 2: to offend. Gave me an example of being in the

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Speaker 2: workplace and stating how if he had a white colleague

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Speaker 2: that was giving a presentation and if he did something

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Speaker 2: very impressive and like broke down a certain system, he

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Speaker 2: would feel comfortable going to that colleague. And he doesn't

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Speaker 2: find an issue with saying, man, that was so articulate,

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Speaker 2: you did a great job x y Z. But based

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Speaker 2: on his experiences and what he knows about how that

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Speaker 2: word can be offensive to black people, he said he

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Speaker 2: would definitely think twice about saying it to me or

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Speaker 2: another black colleague. He knows the weight that it holds

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Speaker 2: for us because of yeah, and some people don't know that, right.

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Speaker 2: Some people don't know. And I've had people say I

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Speaker 2: was articulate, and there was a time in life where

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Speaker 2: I was like, oh, cool, thanks, And then as I

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Speaker 2: began to learn more about the nuances behind that, and

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Speaker 2: I just noticed that oftentimes in my experience, I didn't

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Speaker 2: see white people saying it to other white people. And

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Speaker 2: so then in my eyes, I was like, well, you're

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Speaker 2: saying you're articulate. It sounds like there's this unspoken for

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Speaker 2: a black person behind it, you know what I mean exactly,

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Speaker 2: And so that was one point of feedback that I

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Speaker 2: got that I thought was really interesting from pretty aware.

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Speaker 2: I want to say, most of the people I chatted with,

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Speaker 2: they were white. They're pretty aware white people, so just FYI.

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Speaker 2: But the next person said that these were all men

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Speaker 2: that happened to get back to me. The women I

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Speaker 2: didn't hear back from them because I guess it was

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Speaker 2: a short timeline. But he said that he realizes his privilege,

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Speaker 2: and he said, you know, he sees the inquality. It's

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Speaker 2: one thing to hear about it, but when you see

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Speaker 2: people are going through it, you know, it's definitely tough

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Speaker 2: to see. But he was saying, when and how do

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Speaker 2: we have these conversations because for him, it doesn't feel authentic,

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Speaker 2: like you were saying, dom to reach out every time

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Speaker 2: a black man is murdered and say, oh, hey friend,

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Speaker 2: I hope you're well. I see you. This shit happens

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Speaker 2: so often. It's like his question for me was like,

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Speaker 2: how do we have these ongoing conversations that are important?

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Speaker 2: But how do we have them in a way that's

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Speaker 2: authentic and in a way that doesn't have to sort

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Speaker 2: of follow a tragedy? If that makes sense. How can

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Speaker 2: this be an ongoing thing? I don't have an answer

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Speaker 2: for that. But I think this is a good question

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Speaker 2: that needs to be considered, right, like how do we

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Speaker 2: have those conversations? And then he was also saying how

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Speaker 2: some of the white people that he knows, they may

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Speaker 2: see the injustices, but they're scared to offend and don't

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Speaker 2: even know where to start or what to say, because

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Speaker 2: I think for I will say, for the well intentioned

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Speaker 2: white people, yes, there are a lot of white supremacists

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Speaker 2: and racist out there right For the well intentioned white people,

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Speaker 2: I think one of their greatest fears is being labeled

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Speaker 2: racist when that's not how they're trying to show up, right.

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Speaker 2: So that's his feedback. And then the last thing, Don

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Speaker 2: the last person, said that the question that I asked

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Speaker 2: him about providing feedback for this, it was a big

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Speaker 2: question for him and it brought up a lot of

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Speaker 2: stuff which I can imagine based on personal experiences. But

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Speaker 2: he said that you know, right now in the world,

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Speaker 2: we want more honest and authentic communication. And many of

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Speaker 2: us have empathy and curiosity and some trauma. And when

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Speaker 2: we come together, when people come together and their trauma

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Speaker 2: intersects with each other, you get misunderstandings, you get some hurt,

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Speaker 2: and you also get perpetuated injustices, and I thought that

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Speaker 2: was really a great way to sort of phrase that,

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Speaker 2: because we're all coming to the table. Yes, we as

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Speaker 2: black people, we have our own experience, and I've never

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Speaker 2: really it's been very hard for me Dom to see

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Speaker 2: the plight of white people, like white people that are

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Speaker 2: not well off, like I was giving you the example

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Speaker 2: about the woman who came from upbringing. For me, sometimes

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Speaker 2: I am so blinded by the black plight and what

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Speaker 2: I go through that it is sometimes hard to see

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Speaker 2: what white people go through. Some white people, and then

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Speaker 2: also Dom, I think that sometimes there's this very strong

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Speaker 2: frustration because for so long I think we have been unseen,

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Speaker 2: we have been unheard, and to see people sometimes I

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Speaker 2: don't know if it's envy. I have to maybe explore

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Speaker 2: this within myself. But sometimes I remember being on Bart

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Speaker 2: and there was this white guy just lying back with

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Speaker 2: his head back and his mouth open, and he was

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Speaker 2: knocked out. I was so angry, and I think this

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Speaker 2: was around the time that Nia Wilson had got murdered.

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Speaker 2: The young black girl who had got murdered on Bart,

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Speaker 2: I would say suspected white supremacist. He stabbed her and

434
00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:47,119
Speaker 2: her sister, but killed Nia Wilson. And now I remember

435
00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:49,080
Speaker 2: looking at that white guy, and I just had so

436
00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:50,879
Speaker 2: much anger. And that's my own personal stuff. I had

437
00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 2: so much anger because I was like, damn, it must

438
00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:55,160
Speaker 2: be fucking nice. It must be nice to be able

439
00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:57,840
Speaker 2: to just lie back in public with not a care

440
00:22:57,920 --> 00:23:01,280
Speaker 2: in the world and just sleep. I could never, Okay, Like,

441
00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:03,320
Speaker 2: I would never, I would not ever do that because

442
00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:05,520
Speaker 2: I have to be mindful of my safety. And so

443
00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:08,600
Speaker 2: I think sometimes there's a frustration that damn, white people

444
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:10,679
Speaker 2: just don't get it, or you just don't know what

445
00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:13,560
Speaker 2: we experience, you know. And so I think for me

446
00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:16,640
Speaker 2: sometimes it makes those conversations difficult because of the lack

447
00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:20,879
Speaker 2: of understanding and also because of the privilege.

448
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:24,240
Speaker 1: You know, yes, and I think you know, there's multiple

449
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:29,800
Speaker 1: responses that I have there that you received, right. So

450
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:32,400
Speaker 1: I think the first thing that we have to acknowledge

451
00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:36,240
Speaker 1: is that we are living in a country that operates

452
00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:37,240
Speaker 1: in white supremacy.

453
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:37,600
Speaker 5: Right.

454
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:43,000
Speaker 1: Because we are operating in a country that focuses or

455
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:47,000
Speaker 1: that lives in white supremacy, I think it's important for

456
00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:52,240
Speaker 1: us to always acknowledge that each one of us has

457
00:23:52,280 --> 00:23:55,439
Speaker 1: a role in that. Right, whether we own up to

458
00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:58,960
Speaker 1: it or not. Right, we all are like kind of

459
00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:01,440
Speaker 1: complicit in this white supremacist country.

460
00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:04,600
Speaker 2: Wait, don dive in Moore, what does that mean?

461
00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:09,600
Speaker 1: So to me, how I look at it is that

462
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:14,600
Speaker 1: when you have this system that's set up, every person

463
00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:18,760
Speaker 1: who is a part of that system has a role

464
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:24,840
Speaker 1: right and so as black people, the thing that we

465
00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:29,680
Speaker 1: are constantly battling against is trying to fight to reduce

466
00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:34,639
Speaker 1: white supremacy. But part of what we have to acknowledge

467
00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:38,600
Speaker 1: within ourselves in order for us as black people to

468
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:42,159
Speaker 1: make change is that there are ways in which we

469
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:45,280
Speaker 1: are complicit in uplifting white supremacy.

470
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:46,239
Speaker 3: You know.

471
00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:51,679
Speaker 1: So, for instance, if I engage in respectability politics and

472
00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:59,840
Speaker 1: trying to police other black folks, and I'm engaging in

473
00:24:59,880 --> 00:25:05,400
Speaker 1: the this respectability politics, where is this respectability politics coming from?

474
00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:09,440
Speaker 1: What is it rooted in? It's rooted in white supremacy.

475
00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:12,720
Speaker 1: So in that moment, I am complicit.

476
00:25:13,640 --> 00:25:16,320
Speaker 2: So you're saying if you say things like, oh, if

477
00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 2: only black women will stop twerking, if only black women

478
00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:22,200
Speaker 2: will pull their pants up, if only so, making excuses

479
00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:24,760
Speaker 2: for why black people are where they are based on

480
00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:26,399
Speaker 2: their behavior, which is not true.

481
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:31,960
Speaker 1: Exactly exactly, And so I think that once we can

482
00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:36,520
Speaker 1: acknowledge that, then that allows us to take the conversation

483
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:40,280
Speaker 1: a little bit further, right. I think the other part

484
00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:45,159
Speaker 1: of the conversation that can be uncomfortable is for white

485
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 1: folks to acknowledge that because their role in white supremacy

486
00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:54,399
Speaker 1: affords them privilege, but that there will be times in

487
00:25:54,520 --> 00:26:00,120
Speaker 1: which their actions are perceived as racist. Every single white

488
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:04,520
Speaker 1: person in America, I don't care how progressive or liberal

489
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:10,240
Speaker 1: you are as a white person in America, because of

490
00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:17,280
Speaker 1: your inherent privilege, there will be times in which something

491
00:26:17,400 --> 00:26:20,320
Speaker 1: you say or do is racist.

492
00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:22,040
Speaker 3: Now again, I'm.

493
00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 1: Not saying that that's your intention, but intention and impact

494
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:28,040
Speaker 1: are two different things.

495
00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:31,840
Speaker 2: And Tom, can you give a few subtle examples on

496
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:34,919
Speaker 2: like when those situations happen that may just like go

497
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,280
Speaker 2: over something like a white person's head if they're like, wait,

498
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:39,680
Speaker 2: I'm not racist, but I did a racist thing, right

499
00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:41,520
Speaker 2: or I thought in a racist way. Can you give

500
00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:42,439
Speaker 2: a few examples on that.

501
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:45,800
Speaker 1: You're sitting in your car doing whatever you're doing in

502
00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:52,080
Speaker 1: your car, right, who knows, and it's broad daylight and

503
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:56,800
Speaker 1: you see a black person walking down the street and

504
00:26:56,880 --> 00:27:00,399
Speaker 1: your first instinct is to check to make sure your doors.

505
00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:04,240
Speaker 1: That's racist, because what is your assumption in that moment.

506
00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 1: Your assumption in that moment is that that black person

507
00:27:07,119 --> 00:27:10,399
Speaker 1: is a danger to you. And that thought that black

508
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:12,680
Speaker 1: person is a danger to you is rooted in white

509
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:18,399
Speaker 1: supremacy and is rooted in that the narrative. Right, And

510
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:20,840
Speaker 1: if you're unsure about what that narrative is, go back

511
00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 1: and listen to our episode from last week where we

512
00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:26,840
Speaker 1: talk about what the narrative is and the detrimental impact

513
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:30,360
Speaker 1: that it has on us as black folks. Another instance,

514
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 1: let's say, now this is a pre COVID example, but

515
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:41,080
Speaker 1: let's say you work in the department store Bloomingdale's. Okay,

516
00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:49,399
Speaker 1: young black woman is walking around Bloomingdale's and you work

517
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 1: in the perfume department and you see her walk by

518
00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 1: and something catches her eye and she stops. You stop

519
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 1: chatting with your co workers to watch her, and you

520
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 1: don't take your eye off her the entire time. Meanwhile,

521
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:14,040
Speaker 1: five other customers have walked by you. Yeah, that's racist, right.

522
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:16,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, those are good examples down. It also makes me

523
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:20,000
Speaker 2: think about the unconscious bias. And we did this our

524
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:22,760
Speaker 2: diversity lead at work, had us do this well. We

525
00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:24,840
Speaker 2: did an unconscious bias training and she gave us an

526
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:28,399
Speaker 2: example of how there are these two resumes exactly the

527
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:31,520
Speaker 2: same content, but one person's name is like Jamal and

528
00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:35,399
Speaker 2: the other person's name is like John and literally like clockwork.

529
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 2: Employers chose John over Jamal in a great degree based

530
00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:41,600
Speaker 2: on the name. And there was another one with like

531
00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:44,520
Speaker 2: I want to say, stereotypical black woman name as opposed

532
00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 2: to a stereotypical white woman name. And I think about

533
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:49,560
Speaker 2: situations like that too, and it's like that is racist,

534
00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:51,360
Speaker 2: you know what I mean? Or wouldn't it be racist?

535
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 2: Or is it unconscious bias?

536
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:52,600
Speaker 3: Oh?

537
00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:55,400
Speaker 2: Okay, cool, Okay, I'm like, I think, so, okay, just

538
00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 2: make it sure.

539
00:28:56,200 --> 00:29:00,000
Speaker 1: Racism can be rooted in unconscious bias and conscious bises.

540
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 1: But I think that oftentimes the people that engage in

541
00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:08,680
Speaker 1: that have these unconscious biases don't view themselves as racists exactly.

542
00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:11,800
Speaker 1: And the reality is that every one of us have

543
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 1: unconscious biases right that shape how we engage with other people.

544
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: And so I think the thing is is that to

545
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:27,840
Speaker 1: engage in these uncomfortable conversations, it takes all of us

546
00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 1: being aware of what we are coming into the room with, right,

547
00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:37,960
Speaker 1: So as a black person, me being aware of how

548
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:41,400
Speaker 1: I'm being perceived and what the other person may be

549
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:45,800
Speaker 1: coming in with, as the white person, being aware of

550
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:51,360
Speaker 1: your positionality and how you may be perceived in that moment.

551
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:51,880
Speaker 3: Right.

552
00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 1: And I think too, that what makes it so uncomfortable

553
00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:05,240
Speaker 1: is that as black folks, we are doing so much juggling.

554
00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 1: I think that there is a lot of emotional labor

555
00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 1: that we carry as black people that we should not

556
00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 1: have to carry. And so for me, being mindful of

557
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:26,520
Speaker 1: not wanting to continue to carry that emotional labor is

558
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:31,560
Speaker 1: what kind of guides how I approach these conversations because

559
00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:37,720
Speaker 1: I recognize that what happens is that we experience racial

560
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 1: battle fatigue, right, which is this constant feeling of exhaustion.

561
00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:49,560
Speaker 1: So let's say that we are in a works environment

562
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 1: or maybe our home environment where we are daily engaging

563
00:30:56,360 --> 00:31:04,720
Speaker 1: in these conversations about race or having to justify our experiences,

564
00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 1: and as we are constantly having to justify our experiences.

565
00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:14,760
Speaker 3: That breeds exhaustion.

566
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:21,240
Speaker 1: Every day you're having to explain to people why you

567
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 1: are deserving of being treated like a human being. That's exhausting.

568
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:31,480
Speaker 1: We should not have to engage in that conversation. And

569
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:35,880
Speaker 1: maybe it's not explicitly stated, Hey, white person, I need

570
00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: you to treat me like a human being. But when

571
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 1: we have to have that conversation around don't touch my hair,

572
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 1: or we have to have that conversation around yes, we

573
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:51,960
Speaker 1: do need to look at Keisha and Jamal's resumes and

574
00:31:52,040 --> 00:31:55,360
Speaker 1: why we need to look at their resumes, or when

575
00:31:55,360 --> 00:32:00,200
Speaker 1: we have to explain that we don't need to know, oh,

576
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:06,040
Speaker 1: this black person's entire life story to believe what they

577
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:11,080
Speaker 1: just shared with us. That leads to racial battle fatigue,

578
00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:15,600
Speaker 1: and that affects our physical, mental, emotional well.

579
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:17,400
Speaker 2: Being and amen.

580
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 1: And when we are constantly engaging in that, I could

581
00:32:21,840 --> 00:32:25,080
Speaker 1: see where it makes it hard for us to feel

582
00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:29,880
Speaker 1: motivated to engage in some of those uncomfortable conversations.

583
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:32,560
Speaker 2: You know, when I think about the black community, there

584
00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:36,520
Speaker 2: are some of us who are I want to say,

585
00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:39,360
Speaker 2: not fit to have some of these conversations. And what

586
00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 2: I mean by that is like, for me personally, I'm

587
00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 2: not interested in having raised conversations with white people. That's

588
00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:46,680
Speaker 2: just not where I'm at. I think I need to

589
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,120
Speaker 2: do more work on myself personally in order to have

590
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 2: those deeper conversations, and honestly, with my mental health plan

591
00:32:54,040 --> 00:32:56,240
Speaker 2: and where I am right now, I just don't have

592
00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:58,800
Speaker 2: the capacity or interest to do that. However, there are

593
00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:01,760
Speaker 2: other uncomfortable conversations that I may have around, you know,

594
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 2: things in the workplace and addressing the microaggressions and maybe

595
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:07,520
Speaker 2: being a bit more reactive. But there are some people

596
00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 2: I think about Rachel we mentioned earlier, that's her work,

597
00:33:10,600 --> 00:33:12,600
Speaker 2: that's her life's work, that's what she does, and so

598
00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:16,040
Speaker 2: sometimes it's okay to forward people over to the experts

599
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,160
Speaker 2: to have that conversation so that you don't have to,

600
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 2: you know, expend that emotional labor. I will say, we

601
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:24,960
Speaker 2: have quite a few tips on having uncomfortable conversations with

602
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 2: white people. Dom and I both sort of compiled our

603
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:30,480
Speaker 2: own tips here, and so there may be some tips

604
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 2: that you know, one of us has shared that the

605
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:35,880
Speaker 2: other one's like, well, no, I thought about this one.

606
00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:38,480
Speaker 2: And that's all good because these are tips that you

607
00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 2: can take from based on how they resonate with you.

608
00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 2: And there are other tips where we're like, yes, girl,

609
00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 2: like I'm glad you added that. So now I'm going

610
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:47,520
Speaker 2: to pass it over to you to dive into our

611
00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:49,680
Speaker 2: first one and I'll take the next one.

612
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:53,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I think you know the tips that we compiled,

613
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 1: Like the first tip right out of the gate is

614
00:33:57,120 --> 00:34:00,720
Speaker 1: what sets the stage for both of us, right, and

615
00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:04,560
Speaker 1: how we approached these tips in general. So the first

616
00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:09,600
Speaker 1: tip is to know your audience and context. And I

617
00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:14,319
Speaker 1: think t that goes right back to what you were

618
00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:20,239
Speaker 1: just saying about, Okay, knowing where you are and who

619
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 1: you're going to be engaging with and whether or not

620
00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:25,880
Speaker 1: you need to refer them to someone else.

621
00:34:26,280 --> 00:34:26,560
Speaker 5: Right.

622
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:32,279
Speaker 1: So, if you know that the conversation you're about to

623
00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:39,160
Speaker 1: dive into is with your boss and you don't feel

624
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:46,360
Speaker 1: comfortable having a full on dialogue because that's your boss

625
00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:50,799
Speaker 1: and they're in a position of evaluative power over you,

626
00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:57,239
Speaker 1: then you don't want to totally avoid the conversation, but

627
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:02,720
Speaker 1: you don't have to get into a full on deep

628
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 1: dive because you want to protect your energy, you want

629
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 1: to respect your positionality. So know your audience and the context.

630
00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:14,800
Speaker 2: I love that, don That is spot on. That's a

631
00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:18,040
Speaker 2: great grounding tip to to begin with the others. I

632
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:20,480
Speaker 2: would say number two is being open minded. And the

633
00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:23,640
Speaker 2: reason I say that is because in my conversations as

634
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:25,440
Speaker 2: hard as it is. I said this before. One of

635
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:29,080
Speaker 2: my big struggles was, I want to say, not letting go,

636
00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:32,839
Speaker 2: but sort of holding the black plight and understanding things

637
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:34,880
Speaker 2: from someone else's perspective. I've been able to do this

638
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:36,759
Speaker 2: in my personal life with people who look like me,

639
00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:39,480
Speaker 2: but it has been very challenging for me to, like

640
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 2: I said before, see things from a white person's perspective

641
00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:48,160
Speaker 2: or understand or not even understand, but hear them out

642
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:51,839
Speaker 2: as far as how they did not understand their ignorance

643
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:55,719
Speaker 2: or their lack of you know, acknowledgement or understanding about

644
00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:57,879
Speaker 2: a black person's experience. And so that's why I say

645
00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:00,359
Speaker 2: be open minded, because I think that if the goal

646
00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:03,759
Speaker 2: of the conversation is for learning and understanding, it is

647
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 2: important for us to also show up correctly if that's

648
00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:09,840
Speaker 2: what we're doing in this conversation, right, and so be

649
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:12,600
Speaker 2: in a place of you know, openness, so that we

650
00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:16,080
Speaker 2: can receive here, learn, grow and evolve. So I think

651
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:18,480
Speaker 2: that is important because we all do have different experiences.

652
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:23,600
Speaker 1: Okay, So tip number three is to think ahead regarding

653
00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 1: consequences of your words and actions.

654
00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:28,479
Speaker 3: And so.

655
00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:32,600
Speaker 1: With that one, I think that kind of goes back

656
00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:38,239
Speaker 1: to Terry what you were saying about being open minded, right,

657
00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:43,359
Speaker 1: and also knowing your audience and your context. So if

658
00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:47,319
Speaker 1: I'm having a conversation with a friend or someone that

659
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:51,240
Speaker 1: I feel close and connected to, then how I dive

660
00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:55,080
Speaker 1: into that conversation may be a little bit different.

661
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:55,640
Speaker 3: Right.

662
00:36:56,719 --> 00:37:01,200
Speaker 1: So I know that if I'm going into a conversation

663
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:06,400
Speaker 1: with a friend, the consequences of if this conversation doesn't

664
00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:13,920
Speaker 1: go well is different than the consequences of if the

665
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:19,000
Speaker 1: conversation with my boss doesn't go well, right, And so

666
00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:24,480
Speaker 1: I may be more willing to take more risk and

667
00:37:25,080 --> 00:37:30,280
Speaker 1: be really and truly more open minded in the conversation

668
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:35,480
Speaker 1: with my friend versus my boss. And so just you know,

669
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:40,239
Speaker 1: remember to think ahead regarding your consequences of your words

670
00:37:40,360 --> 00:37:43,279
Speaker 1: and your actions because you know, also, I do want

671
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:46,080
Speaker 1: to add a caveat too, that if you're willing to

672
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:48,920
Speaker 1: go all out and you know that your actions may

673
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:52,880
Speaker 1: lead to you maybe going to jail, right, because sometimes

674
00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:56,680
Speaker 1: we're there, right, I think about every person that's out

675
00:37:56,719 --> 00:38:01,279
Speaker 1: there protesting, that's a risk. And so but that is

676
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:03,839
Speaker 1: a risk that we are willing to take when we

677
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:07,880
Speaker 1: go out there and we protest. So just thinking ahead

678
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:11,160
Speaker 1: and knowing what the potential consequences are going to be

679
00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:15,760
Speaker 1: before you dive into that dialogue or that action.

680
00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:18,600
Speaker 2: I love that great tip there, Dom. I would say

681
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:21,319
Speaker 2: number four is setting ground rules or safe words, and

682
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:23,600
Speaker 2: that all depends on what type of conversation you're having.

683
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:26,080
Speaker 2: The reason I chose this tip is because I envisioned

684
00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:28,400
Speaker 2: a world where, at some point in the future, I

685
00:38:28,520 --> 00:38:30,640
Speaker 2: may want to, you know, pull one of my white

686
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:32,759
Speaker 2: friends aside and say, hey, let's have a conversation about race.

687
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 2: Because I'm very a curious person. I want to understand

688
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:37,280
Speaker 2: what it's been like from your perspective. And so I think,

689
00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 2: because I can be sensitive about some of those topics,

690
00:38:40,160 --> 00:38:42,880
Speaker 2: it might be nice to have some ground rules or

691
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:44,719
Speaker 2: a safe word so that if we get to an

692
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:47,319
Speaker 2: impasse and we're like, we're not seeing idea I have.

693
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:49,920
Speaker 2: This is such a sensitive topic that's filled with so

694
00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:53,880
Speaker 2: many emotions, we may need to use that code word

695
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:56,040
Speaker 2: or safe word and then take a break right or

696
00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:58,680
Speaker 2: we may need to let the person know, you know,

697
00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:02,000
Speaker 2: in a safe way, that I feel triggered and maybe

698
00:39:02,040 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 2: we need to like shift or move in a different direction.

699
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:06,560
Speaker 2: So that's why I chose that one. If it's those

700
00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:08,400
Speaker 2: types of conversations.

701
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:09,919
Speaker 1: Let me ask a quick question on that one, though,

702
00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:13,319
Speaker 1: would you recommend this particular tip if we're having a

703
00:39:13,360 --> 00:39:15,400
Speaker 1: conversation with an employer.

704
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:18,440
Speaker 2: I think it depends, like I'm trying to think of

705
00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:21,600
Speaker 2: an example of like what that would be. I'm trying

706
00:39:21,600 --> 00:39:23,239
Speaker 2: to think dumb, I'm trying to think of a real

707
00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:24,680
Speaker 2: life Do you have a real life example, because that

708
00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:25,360
Speaker 2: would help me.

709
00:39:26,080 --> 00:39:26,560
Speaker 3: I don't.

710
00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:30,839
Speaker 1: I'm just curious about, like, is it so I'm having

711
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:34,040
Speaker 1: a difficult dialogue with my boss, how would that look

712
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:36,640
Speaker 1: to set ground rules or safe words or is this

713
00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:40,000
Speaker 1: a context? Is that an example where maybe that's not appropriate.

714
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:42,719
Speaker 2: See, I'm down for like anything as possible. I think

715
00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:44,719
Speaker 2: there is a world where it could be appropriate in

716
00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:46,480
Speaker 2: the work setting. The first thing comes to mind for

717
00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:48,600
Speaker 2: me for tip number four would be like if it's

718
00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:52,240
Speaker 2: a diversity or unconscious bias training where you have a

719
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 2: you know, a group of people and you're going to

720
00:39:54,080 --> 00:39:56,319
Speaker 2: be having these difficult conversations. That is the place in

721
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,080
Speaker 2: the work environment where I can one hundred percent, hands down,

722
00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:02,320
Speaker 2: see you use safe words and setting ground rules because

723
00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 2: differing perspectives coming to the place but if I'm chatting

724
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:08,799
Speaker 2: with my manager about something, I think maybe a disclaimer

725
00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 2: of like this is a sensitive topic. But it depends

726
00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:12,920
Speaker 2: on the manager too, Like I don't know how ground

727
00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:16,720
Speaker 2: rules me coming into the conversation with the ground rules

728
00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:18,560
Speaker 2: might be perceived to the manager. And that kind of

729
00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 2: goes back to what you were saying about, like, know

730
00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:22,840
Speaker 2: your audience. But I do think we had, Lady, if

731
00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:25,080
Speaker 2: you have an example, you have the idea. I do

732
00:40:25,120 --> 00:40:26,920
Speaker 2: think there's a world where it could exist. That's a

733
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:27,640
Speaker 2: good question though.

734
00:40:28,360 --> 00:40:31,439
Speaker 1: Okay, so I agree that it goes back to knowing

735
00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:33,640
Speaker 1: your audience, and if you had that type of relationship

736
00:40:33,680 --> 00:40:37,840
Speaker 1: with your manager, then yes, you could set ground rules

737
00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:43,200
Speaker 1: for the conversation. So tip number five is to keep

738
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:48,080
Speaker 1: the focus of the conversation away from comforting the other person.

739
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:53,560
Speaker 1: So for me, that tip came about based on white

740
00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:58,080
Speaker 1: folks reaching out to check in, right. For some white people,

741
00:40:58,560 --> 00:41:02,440
Speaker 1: them reaching out to check is for them to assuage

742
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:07,239
Speaker 1: their guilt. They want to be let go of the

743
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:11,040
Speaker 1: guilt of being a white person in America right now, right,

744
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:14,920
Speaker 1: And so they reach out to you to see how

745
00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:17,120
Speaker 1: you're doing. But it's not necessarily genuine.

746
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:19,640
Speaker 2: I was gonna say, do I'm also that, but then

747
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:23,240
Speaker 2: also the sort of good Samaritan vibe where it's like, okay, cool, checkbox.

748
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 2: I reached out to a black person today, All right,

749
00:41:24,719 --> 00:41:26,440
Speaker 2: let me get back to work. I feel good, you

750
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:27,920
Speaker 2: know what I mean. So I think it could be

751
00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:30,080
Speaker 2: a combination of those one or two you know what

752
00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:30,839
Speaker 2: I mean? Right?

753
00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:33,759
Speaker 1: I agree, And so I think then it becomes a

754
00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:36,840
Speaker 1: matter of again knowing your audience, right.

755
00:41:37,360 --> 00:41:39,320
Speaker 3: But the key is.

756
00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:44,080
Speaker 1: Whether they are genuine or not to keep the conversation

757
00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:50,240
Speaker 1: away from comforting them. As black folks, particularly as black women,

758
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 1: we have been socialized to believe that we have to

759
00:41:55,280 --> 00:42:01,360
Speaker 1: take care of and comfort everyone, and we don't have

760
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:06,720
Speaker 1: to in that moment because in that moment, again, whether

761
00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:11,200
Speaker 1: they're being genuine or not, the assumed intention is for

762
00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:12,399
Speaker 1: them to check in on.

763
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:15,600
Speaker 2: Us real quick, Tom, because I know we're almost at

764
00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:17,200
Speaker 2: the end of our episod. Can you give an example

765
00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:19,279
Speaker 2: of what it looks like to comfort someone while they're

766
00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:21,279
Speaker 2: reaching out about that? Just I want to make sure

767
00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:22,400
Speaker 2: that we're clear on that.

768
00:42:23,160 --> 00:42:27,480
Speaker 1: So someone reaches out to you and they say, hey, Terry,

769
00:42:28,040 --> 00:42:31,200
Speaker 1: I just wanted to check in on you, you know,

770
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:35,319
Speaker 1: with everything happening. I wanted to see.

771
00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:36,640
Speaker 3: How you're doing.

772
00:42:37,239 --> 00:42:40,680
Speaker 1: I just feel so bad about everything that's going on

773
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:45,600
Speaker 1: right now. Your instinct to comfort them would be to say, oh,

774
00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:48,640
Speaker 1: thank you for checking on me. I'm so sorry that

775
00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:54,879
Speaker 1: you're feeling this way. Pause, hold on, m hm, let's

776
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:59,400
Speaker 1: step back, because their intention is supposed to be to

777
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:04,759
Speaker 1: check on ups us. So instead of responding with thank you,

778
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:10,160
Speaker 1: because one saying oh, thank you, that's giving them praise

779
00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:13,799
Speaker 1: right in that moment, we don't necessarily have to do that,

780
00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:17,520
Speaker 1: we are not obligated to do that. And then two

781
00:43:17,600 --> 00:43:19,640
Speaker 1: when we the next piece is when we step in

782
00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:22,799
Speaker 1: to say, oh, I'm so sorry you're feeling that way.

783
00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:27,279
Speaker 1: What usually comes next the conversation then shifts to them.

784
00:43:27,719 --> 00:43:30,919
Speaker 1: So in that moment, instead of saying those things you say,

785
00:43:31,400 --> 00:43:35,600
Speaker 1: your response can be something as simple as yes, things

786
00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:36,520
Speaker 1: are really.

787
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:37,080
Speaker 3: Tough right now.

788
00:43:37,560 --> 00:43:39,359
Speaker 1: I think what's going to be most helpful for me

789
00:43:39,520 --> 00:43:41,759
Speaker 1: is to take a break from all of it. And

790
00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:44,279
Speaker 1: here's how you can help me if that's what you

791
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:47,200
Speaker 1: want to do, right If you're looking to give them

792
00:43:47,200 --> 00:43:48,840
Speaker 1: a tip on how to help you out.

793
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:52,200
Speaker 2: I appreciate that down too, because it sounds like oftentimes

794
00:43:52,200 --> 00:43:55,200
Speaker 2: we rob ourselves of an opportunity to be cared for

795
00:43:55,800 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 2: or comforted by putting it on the other person. So

796
00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:01,080
Speaker 2: I'm glad that you painted that example beautiful. And the

797
00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:03,400
Speaker 2: next one, number six is have a purpose or goal

798
00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:07,880
Speaker 2: in mind. And what I was thinking here is for me, honestly, really,

799
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:10,359
Speaker 2: with anything in life at this point, I'm always like, Okay,

800
00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:12,000
Speaker 2: what is the purpose? What is the goal? I don't

801
00:44:12,040 --> 00:44:14,360
Speaker 2: like to just go into a conversation without having like

802
00:44:14,400 --> 00:44:16,680
Speaker 2: an end result. Am I trying to educate the person?

803
00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:20,719
Speaker 2: Am I trying to learn? Am I trying to you know,

804
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:22,880
Speaker 2: let them know how they've offended me? I think getting

805
00:44:22,920 --> 00:44:25,120
Speaker 2: clear on that will allow you to sort of build

806
00:44:25,360 --> 00:44:28,840
Speaker 2: out your conversation appropriately and make sure that you focus

807
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:30,799
Speaker 2: on your main point. So I think always having a

808
00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:34,319
Speaker 2: purpose or goal in mind for specific conversations, especially if

809
00:44:34,320 --> 00:44:35,920
Speaker 2: it's like in the workplace, you don't want to kind

810
00:44:35,920 --> 00:44:38,319
Speaker 2: of ramble and go off on tangents. I think being

811
00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:40,200
Speaker 2: very clear on what am I here for and what

812
00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:42,240
Speaker 2: is the goal of this conversation is important.

813
00:44:42,400 --> 00:44:44,279
Speaker 1: Yes, I agree, I think that that is a good

814
00:44:44,320 --> 00:44:47,520
Speaker 1: one to because again it helps you. Also, having that

815
00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 1: goal in mind helps you to also focus on Okay, well,

816
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:55,680
Speaker 1: what are the potential consequences here? How do I engage

817
00:44:55,719 --> 00:44:59,000
Speaker 1: in this dialogue? Like it really helps set the tone.

818
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:04,640
Speaker 1: The next tip is to use eye statements. And eye

819
00:45:04,719 --> 00:45:07,719
Speaker 1: statements can be really hard for some of us, but

820
00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:13,920
Speaker 1: I would encourage us to really try hard to use

821
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:17,839
Speaker 1: those eye statements in those conversations because what that does

822
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:21,200
Speaker 1: is it allows the focus to center on you and

823
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:24,279
Speaker 1: what it is that you are thinking and feeling and

824
00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:28,440
Speaker 1: what it is that you need, while also making it clear,

825
00:45:28,680 --> 00:45:33,879
Speaker 1: hopefully that how you're speaking is from your perspective and

826
00:45:33,960 --> 00:45:36,800
Speaker 1: not representative of all black people in America.

827
00:45:37,640 --> 00:45:39,920
Speaker 2: Love that and also takes the person off the defensive

828
00:45:40,040 --> 00:45:42,840
Speaker 2: because no one can deny the way that you feel

829
00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:47,640
Speaker 2: right right, So that's powerful. Number eight is leaning into curiosity.

830
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:50,160
Speaker 2: I think it's always important to lean into curiosity because

831
00:45:50,160 --> 00:45:53,719
Speaker 2: when we make assumptions, sometimes that can cause division and

832
00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 2: sometimes we can, you know, just bring a certain energy

833
00:45:57,080 --> 00:45:59,759
Speaker 2: to the conversation. So I love to ask questions to

834
00:45:59,800 --> 00:46:02,359
Speaker 2: get clarity, like what did you mean when you said this?

835
00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:02,680
Speaker 5: Right?

836
00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:05,000
Speaker 2: So I want to understand your perspective before I'm like, yo,

837
00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:07,440
Speaker 2: you racist pieces I gave me understand what did you

838
00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:09,120
Speaker 2: mean when you said this? Because that will give me

839
00:46:09,160 --> 00:46:11,080
Speaker 2: more insight and sometimes I know for me, when I

840
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:14,280
Speaker 2: shut the hell up and listen, I get some gems. Okay,

841
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:15,600
Speaker 2: So lean into curiosity.

842
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:18,279
Speaker 1: Yes, I love that because I think that allows us

843
00:46:18,360 --> 00:46:22,760
Speaker 1: to really learn more about their perspective and that allows

844
00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:26,680
Speaker 1: us to see is their attention genuine or not exactly,

845
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:30,440
Speaker 1: which can change how we might approach the conversation. And

846
00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:36,399
Speaker 1: our final tip is to pour into yourself before and

847
00:46:36,760 --> 00:46:41,439
Speaker 1: after the conversation. Now, granted, I know that sometimes those

848
00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:43,600
Speaker 1: conversations come out of nowhere, so you might not be

849
00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:48,200
Speaker 1: able to pour into yourself before, right, But if you

850
00:46:48,520 --> 00:46:53,400
Speaker 1: know the conversation is coming, you pour into yourself before

851
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:57,360
Speaker 1: and after the conversation is done. And what that looks like,

852
00:46:57,560 --> 00:46:59,719
Speaker 1: at least for me, and what I like to tell

853
00:46:59,760 --> 00:47:05,160
Speaker 1: other folks to do, is to one go through all

854
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:08,399
Speaker 1: these tips that we've already outlined, right, So think about

855
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:11,360
Speaker 1: how you're going to approach each of those tips, but

856
00:47:11,480 --> 00:47:15,880
Speaker 1: to take some deep breaths to really ground and center

857
00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:22,040
Speaker 1: yourself into the moment that's approaching. Maybe it may also

858
00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:25,839
Speaker 1: mean listening to some uplifting music. Whatever you need to

859
00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:31,640
Speaker 1: get you into the headspace to dive into that dialogue, right,

860
00:47:32,719 --> 00:47:38,080
Speaker 1: and then afterwards, if you can, giving yourself some space

861
00:47:38,160 --> 00:47:42,040
Speaker 1: to just breathe, because again we know that diving into

862
00:47:42,120 --> 00:47:47,720
Speaker 1: these difficult conversations can require a lot of emotional labor

863
00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:51,799
Speaker 1: on our part, right, And so you want to make

864
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:55,760
Speaker 1: sure that as this conversation is pulling out of your cup,

865
00:47:56,360 --> 00:48:00,839
Speaker 1: that you are doing something to replenish your cup. One

866
00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:04,719
Speaker 1: thing I like to recommend is to, if possible, not

867
00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:08,920
Speaker 1: have another intense meeting set up right after it, to

868
00:48:09,080 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 1: really give yourself some space to decompress, because even if

869
00:48:13,080 --> 00:48:17,719
Speaker 1: the conversation goes well and you don't experience in the

870
00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:24,480
Speaker 1: moment like heightened emotions, chances are because it's an uncomfortable dialogue,

871
00:48:25,719 --> 00:48:31,319
Speaker 1: your emotions are heightened. Your body is probably tense, and

872
00:48:31,360 --> 00:48:34,160
Speaker 1: you're just because you're in it, you're not necessarily aware.

873
00:48:34,880 --> 00:48:39,440
Speaker 1: So after that dialogue, give yourself some space to breathe

874
00:48:40,160 --> 00:48:42,960
Speaker 1: and relax and decompress.

875
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:45,400
Speaker 2: All right, ladies, So we have quite a few tips

876
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:47,920
Speaker 2: for you today, so be sure to listen to our

877
00:48:47,960 --> 00:48:51,640
Speaker 2: recap and take what resonates and leave the rest. So

878
00:48:51,719 --> 00:48:55,359
Speaker 2: number one is know your audience in context. Number two,

879
00:48:56,080 --> 00:49:00,080
Speaker 2: be open minded. We all have different experiences. Number three

880
00:49:00,440 --> 00:49:04,040
Speaker 2: think ahead regarding consequences of your words and actions, and

881
00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:08,359
Speaker 2: number four setting ground rules or safe words. Number five

882
00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:11,600
Speaker 2: is keep the focus of the conversation away from comforting

883
00:49:11,600 --> 00:49:15,200
Speaker 2: the other person. Number six have a purpose or goal

884
00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:20,520
Speaker 2: in mind. Number seven use those I statements. Number eight

885
00:49:20,840 --> 00:49:24,880
Speaker 2: lean into curiosity, and number nine probably the most important,

886
00:49:25,200 --> 00:49:31,720
Speaker 2: pour into yourself before and after the conversation. Hey lady,

887
00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:34,319
Speaker 2: it's Terry here from the Hersby's podcast and I have

888
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:36,960
Speaker 2: a question for you. Do you want to start your

889
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:40,520
Speaker 2: own podcast? Have you been thinking to yourself? You know what,

890
00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:43,120
Speaker 2: I want to start a podcast, but you just haven't

891
00:49:43,160 --> 00:49:47,239
Speaker 2: taken the leap. If that's you, I got you. I'm

892
00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:50,560
Speaker 2: hosting a free podcasting masterclass where I'm going to teach

893
00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:53,600
Speaker 2: you how to create your own podcasts from start to finish.

894
00:49:53,920 --> 00:49:56,120
Speaker 2: So visit Terry Limax dot com and click on the

895
00:49:56,160 --> 00:49:59,040
Speaker 2: pink link in the middle of your screen and register

896
00:49:59,160 --> 00:50:02,400
Speaker 2: for my free pot podcasting masterclass.

897
00:50:01,360 --> 00:50:06,320
Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us today in her Space. Please note

898
00:50:06,360 --> 00:50:10,759
Speaker 1: that our show may contain conversations about self help, advice,

899
00:50:11,200 --> 00:50:14,520
Speaker 1: self empowerment, and mental health, but it is by no

900
00:50:14,719 --> 00:50:17,960
Speaker 1: means meant to be a substitute for an ongoing formal

901
00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:22,759
Speaker 1: relationship with a trained mental health provider. If you are

902
00:50:22,800 --> 00:50:25,680
Speaker 1: someone you know is in need of mental health care,

903
00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:30,360
Speaker 1: please visit the Therapy for Black Girls directory Psychology Today

904
00:50:30,920 --> 00:50:32,800
Speaker 1: or contact your insurance provider.

905
00:50:33,360 --> 00:50:35,000
Speaker 2: If you liked what you heard and want to keep

906
00:50:35,040 --> 00:50:38,440
Speaker 2: the conversation going, connect with us on Facebook, Instagram, and

907
00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:43,440
Speaker 2: Twitter at her space podcast or check out our website

908
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:47,720
Speaker 2: at herspacepodcast dot com. And before we meet again, repeat

909
00:50:47,719 --> 00:50:51,520
Speaker 2: after me. I am not limited by any past thinking.

910
00:50:52,239 --> 00:50:54,040
Speaker 2: I choose my thoughts with care.

911
00:50:54,840 --> 00:50:56,239
Speaker 3: We'll see you next week, Lady