1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:04,800 Speaker 1: Hi, everyone, It's me James, and I'm coming at you today, sweaty, smelly, 2 00:00:05,480 --> 00:00:08,520 Speaker 1: and exhausted from my pickup truck out in the desert 3 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 1: where I have been spending the weekend trying my best 4 00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 1: to help, along with lots of other dedicated mutual aid workers, 5 00:00:17,079 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 1: to mitigate the damage done by an entirely preventable humanitarian 6 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:25,160 Speaker 1: crisis at the United States Southern border. People are being 7 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 1: held in the open desert in Hakomba, where it gets 8 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:31,640 Speaker 1: hot in the day gets very cold at night, and 9 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:34,120 Speaker 1: there are children, there are old people, there are young people. 10 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:37,360 Speaker 1: All the support they're getting it's from mutual aid workers, 11 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:40,760 Speaker 1: then maybe get some water from border patrol, from federal government, 12 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 1: and not much else. And I'm here before your podcast 13 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:47,920 Speaker 1: to ask you if you can to help. We've all 14 00:00:47,960 --> 00:00:50,640 Speaker 1: spent all of our time and most of our money 15 00:00:51,159 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 1: the last few days week trying to help, and we're 16 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:57,320 Speaker 1: all pretty broke, and we're all pretty tired. But I 17 00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:00,160 Speaker 1: could really do with your support, and I'm going they 18 00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:02,480 Speaker 1: give the venmos and cash apps and PayPal information for 19 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 1: two organizations who ideally love and whose work I have 20 00:01:05,959 --> 00:01:10,440 Speaker 1: seen is extremely effective and is the only thing keeping 21 00:01:10,440 --> 00:01:13,119 Speaker 1: this situation from being a lot worse. And please don't 22 00:01:13,120 --> 00:01:15,360 Speaker 1: think that if you don't have much money that you 23 00:01:15,480 --> 00:01:19,040 Speaker 1: shouldn't give. We can do a lot with a little. 24 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: So if you only have five bucks, that is great. 25 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:22,839 Speaker 1: And five bucks is are top for someone to sleep 26 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 1: under or a few hot meals. And what we're going 27 00:01:24,959 --> 00:01:29,000 Speaker 1: to buy is food, blankets, tarps, water, the things that 28 00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:32,200 Speaker 1: stop people dying in the desert. Those two organizations, Border 29 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 1: Kindness and Free Shit Collective can be found online at 30 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:39,959 Speaker 1: border Kindness and at free ship pb on Twitter. For Borderkindness, 31 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:43,520 Speaker 1: the venmo is at border hyphen Kindness. The cash app 32 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:46,840 Speaker 1: is dollar sign border Kindness cash and the xell and 33 00:01:46,880 --> 00:01:51,120 Speaker 1: PayPal information is info at Borderkindness dot org. Free Ship 34 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 1: Collective are at free Ship Collective on cash app and 35 00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 1: PayPal and at free shippbe on Twitter. Thank you very much, guys. 36 00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 2: Welcome to tag it Appened Here, a podcast about why 37 00:02:05,640 --> 00:02:09,080 Speaker 2: everything absolutely sucks. I'm your host, Nia Long. I'm back 38 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:14,760 Speaker 2: again and last episode we talked about the problems with 39 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 2: conceiving of all of labor as production from a sort 40 00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:22,640 Speaker 2: of macro feminist perspective of you know, thinking about how 41 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 2: you know, thinking of all labor, as production doesn't actually 42 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 2: capture what most labor is. And you know, we looked 43 00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 2: at how this allowed patriarchy to become a wedge to 44 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:36,080 Speaker 2: private workers movement apart. But there's another sort of more 45 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:41,800 Speaker 2: micro problem with thinking about productive labor, and that micro 46 00:02:41,919 --> 00:02:45,680 Speaker 2: problem is that people are just absolutely unable to think 47 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:52,120 Speaker 2: about productivity in anything other than moral terms. As to 48 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:54,000 Speaker 2: you know, why this is the case, I'm not going 49 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:57,840 Speaker 2: to go forward an answer. I've seen every theory from 50 00:02:57,919 --> 00:03:01,359 Speaker 2: like it's Christianity, to like it's ductual feature of capitalism 51 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 2: to its human nature or whatever. I'm I don't know, 52 00:03:05,200 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 2: pick pick your theory about why everyone is incapable of 53 00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:12,680 Speaker 2: being normal about productivity. But this turns out to be 54 00:03:12,760 --> 00:03:15,840 Speaker 2: a real problem for anyone who is trying to use 55 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:21,160 Speaker 2: productive versus unproductive labor in a purely technical sense. Now, 56 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 2: the most famous person to do this is, as some 57 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:28,560 Speaker 2: of you probably know, one, Karl Marx. And you know 58 00:03:28,639 --> 00:03:33,680 Speaker 2: I was hard on Mark's last episode, but this one 59 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:37,800 Speaker 2: and the stuff that's going to follow isn't really his fault. 60 00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:41,240 Speaker 2: Marx here is actually doing one of the times where 61 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:43,960 Speaker 2: he's being very reasonable and he's being very specific about 62 00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:49,240 Speaker 2: what productive labor is and everyone else is being extremely unreasonable. 63 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 2: And you know, given the incredibly dark places this is 64 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:57,120 Speaker 2: going to go, maybe this is one of those things 65 00:03:57,120 --> 00:04:00,000 Speaker 2: where like, I don't know, you need to pick differ 66 00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:03,320 Speaker 2: words that aren't as emotionally charged as like productive and 67 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 2: unproductive labor. But all in all, like this, the catastrophe 68 00:04:08,240 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 2: that's about to unfold is not Marx's fault. There was 69 00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 2: really no way that he could have known how nuts 70 00:04:15,160 --> 00:04:18,920 Speaker 2: everyone was going to go over this. So what actually 71 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:23,039 Speaker 2: is the distinction between productive and unproductive labor? From Marx? So, 72 00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 2: first off, and this is very important, productive versus unproductive 73 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 2: labor is a technical term. It has no moral content 74 00:04:31,839 --> 00:04:36,120 Speaker 2: at all. All it means is that some labor produces 75 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,120 Speaker 2: capital for the capital owning class and some labor doesn't. 76 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:44,360 Speaker 2: That that's literally it. Here's Marx. The commodities the capitalists 77 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:48,280 Speaker 2: buys for his own private consumption are not consumed productively. 78 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 2: They do not become factors of capital. Just as little 79 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:56,200 Speaker 2: to the service as he buys for his consumption voluntarily 80 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:59,120 Speaker 2: or through compulsion from the state, et cetera, for the 81 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:01,919 Speaker 2: sake of their useful value, They do not become a 82 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:06,080 Speaker 2: factor of capital. They are not therefore productive kinds of labor, 83 00:05:06,120 --> 00:05:09,880 Speaker 2: and those who perform them are not productive workers. As 84 00:05:09,880 --> 00:05:13,000 Speaker 2: you can see, this has literally nothing to do with 85 00:05:13,080 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 2: the contents of the labor itself or morality whatsoever. If 86 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:20,680 Speaker 2: a dancer works for production company and gives a performance 87 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:24,160 Speaker 2: you know, working for the company, that's productive labor because 88 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:27,040 Speaker 2: the company has turned their capital into more capital by 89 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:30,360 Speaker 2: using the dancer to produce a commodity, which is to performance, 90 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:33,440 Speaker 2: and then selling it. Right if that same dancer puts 91 00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:37,159 Speaker 2: on the same performance in the same place for a 92 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:39,839 Speaker 2: crowd of you know, just like their friends or even 93 00:05:39,880 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 2: the same people, but who aren't paying a production company 94 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:45,520 Speaker 2: for it, Suddenly the dancer, who again is doing the 95 00:05:45,560 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 2: same thing in the same place like even could be 96 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:51,440 Speaker 2: on the same day, is doing non productive labor because 97 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:54,400 Speaker 2: no capital is being created from it. Or, as you know, 98 00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:57,719 Speaker 2: here's how Marx puts it, labor with the same content 99 00:05:57,800 --> 00:06:02,200 Speaker 2: can therefore be both productive and unproductive. Milton, for example, 100 00:06:02,240 --> 00:06:06,279 Speaker 2: who did Paradise Loss, was an unproductive worker. In contrast 101 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 2: to this, the writer who delivers hack work for his 102 00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:12,880 Speaker 2: publisher is a productive worker. Later on, Milton sold the 103 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:15,440 Speaker 2: product for five dollars, and to that extent became a 104 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:19,760 Speaker 2: dealer in a commodity. But the Leipzig literary proletarian who 105 00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:24,800 Speaker 2: produces books e g. Compendium Political Economy at the instruction 106 00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:28,560 Speaker 2: of his publisher is roughly speaking, a productive worker insofar 107 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 2: as his production is subsumed under capital and only takes 108 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 2: place for the purpose of the latter's valorization. This is 109 00:06:35,240 --> 00:06:39,160 Speaker 2: a valorization of capital, which is like having capital make 110 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:42,680 Speaker 2: more capital. A singer who sings like a bird is 111 00:06:42,680 --> 00:06:46,000 Speaker 2: an unproductive worker. If she sells her singing for money, 112 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:48,880 Speaker 2: she is to that extent a wage laborer or a 113 00:06:48,880 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 2: commodity dealer. But the same singer when she is engaged 114 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:55,839 Speaker 2: by an entrepreneur who has her sing in order to 115 00:06:55,880 --> 00:07:00,159 Speaker 2: make money, is a productive worker, for she directly produces capital. 116 00:07:01,240 --> 00:07:04,240 Speaker 2: A school master who educates others is not a productive worker, 117 00:07:04,480 --> 00:07:07,599 Speaker 2: but a schoolmaster who was engaged as a wage laborer 118 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:11,200 Speaker 2: and an institution alongside along with others, in order to 119 00:07:11,280 --> 00:07:14,440 Speaker 2: make in order through his labor to valorize the money 120 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:17,400 Speaker 2: of the entrepreneur of the knowledge mongering institution is a 121 00:07:17,440 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 2: productive worker. Now, okay, reading a lot of Marx here, 122 00:07:21,440 --> 00:07:24,880 Speaker 2: I'm focusing on Marx, you know, because whether or not 123 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 2: someone in you know, the eighteen hundreds is a Marxist 124 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:30,560 Speaker 2: or not. And if you picked this like a random 125 00:07:30,600 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 2: worker in the period when this is being written, the 126 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:35,960 Speaker 2: odds are really bad that they're going to be a Marxist. 127 00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:39,880 Speaker 2: Marx was enormously influential, particularly in Europe as sort of 128 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:43,400 Speaker 2: social democracy swept through the Germany's and then communism sort 129 00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:46,480 Speaker 2: of swept back through Europe. In the US, and Marx 130 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:50,520 Speaker 2: is also and this is something that Marx himself like 131 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:53,120 Speaker 2: takes great pains to conceal a lot of the time. 132 00:07:53,680 --> 00:07:56,640 Speaker 2: Marx is a kind of medium through which the broad 133 00:07:56,680 --> 00:08:01,000 Speaker 2: cultural consensus on labor was transformed into capital T theory. 134 00:08:02,120 --> 00:08:05,880 Speaker 2: And in this capital T theory, productive versus unproductive labor 135 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:08,040 Speaker 2: is not a moral claim at all. It's a measure 136 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:12,480 Speaker 2: of whether any given labor produces capital for the bourgeoisie. Now, 137 00:08:12,680 --> 00:08:14,960 Speaker 2: part of what Marx is trying to do here is 138 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:18,559 Speaker 2: to intervene in existing discourse about productive and unproductive labor, 139 00:08:18,640 --> 00:08:20,760 Speaker 2: to turn it into useful theory instead of people just 140 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 2: yelling stuff at each other and Marks, I feel you, buddy, 141 00:08:25,320 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 2: oh boy. Taking this as a validation of what I'm doing. God, 142 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 2: here's an example I'm just going to put in here 143 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 2: of Marx being very mad about this. The self employed laborer, 144 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 2: for example, is his own wage laborer, and his own 145 00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:43,079 Speaker 2: means of production confront him in his own mind as capital. 146 00:08:43,800 --> 00:08:47,720 Speaker 2: As his own capitalist, he employs himself as a wage laborer. 147 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 2: Anomalies of this type then offer a favorable field for 148 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:56,480 Speaker 2: outpourings of drivel about productive and unproductive labor. So, you know, 149 00:08:56,640 --> 00:09:01,000 Speaker 2: even in the eighteen hundreds, people are sit being incredibly 150 00:09:01,040 --> 00:09:04,959 Speaker 2: normal about this. They're saying things that are great and good, 151 00:09:05,080 --> 00:09:10,600 Speaker 2: and only only that they're being exceptionally good. Marx isn't 152 00:09:10,600 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 2: slowly being driven mad by reading at all. But you know, 153 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:20,480 Speaker 2: when when it's being used as a technical category, the 154 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:25,080 Speaker 2: sort of productive versus unproductive distinction, you know, it can 155 00:09:25,120 --> 00:09:28,840 Speaker 2: tell you a lot of stuff about how a capitalist 156 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:34,120 Speaker 2: economy functions. But when it inevitably becomes a moral category, 157 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:38,560 Speaker 2: things get very bad, very quickly. And so we're going 158 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:41,840 Speaker 2: to go into two times that this has gone very badly, 159 00:09:42,520 --> 00:09:47,079 Speaker 2: the Nazis and Ronald Reagan. Now, the Nazis and Reagan 160 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:49,560 Speaker 2: aren't quite doing the same thing, although there's a lot 161 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:52,199 Speaker 2: of similarities, which is, you know, to be expected from 162 00:09:52,240 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 2: a band who went to a Nazi cemetery that included 163 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:57,640 Speaker 2: a bunch of SS dudes and then gave a speech 164 00:09:57,640 --> 00:10:00,600 Speaker 2: defending his actions where he said, and I quote they, 165 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:04,359 Speaker 2: which is referring to Nazi soldiers, quote they were victims 166 00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 2: just as surely as the victims and the concentration camps, 167 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:11,679 Speaker 2: which I I, I. 168 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:15,000 Speaker 3: What the fuck, what are you even supposed to do 169 00:10:15,040 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 3: with that? Like, I just this guy was a president 170 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,000 Speaker 3: of the United States. I mean, I like, I don't 171 00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:22,880 Speaker 3: know it makes sense, but like it never even crossed 172 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:25,320 Speaker 3: my mind that it was like it would even be 173 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:29,400 Speaker 3: possible to have a take that is, people in the 174 00:10:29,480 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 3: Nazi army are actually just as much victims as the 175 00:10:32,000 --> 00:10:36,079 Speaker 3: people in the concentration camps. Like I, I don't know, 176 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:39,440 Speaker 3: baffling stuff by Reagan, I mean, I guess not baffling, 177 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:42,439 Speaker 3: considering how closely his administration is tied to a. 178 00:10:42,440 --> 00:10:46,320 Speaker 2: Bunch of sort of Nazis who became like anti communists 179 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:48,240 Speaker 2: while here were always anti coomicist, but who became part 180 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:51,120 Speaker 2: of sort of like institutional anti communism and like the 181 00:10:51,559 --> 00:10:56,199 Speaker 2: post war era. But god, what a terrible thing I'm 182 00:10:56,200 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 2: getting my shots in at Reagan now because this is 183 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:08,280 Speaker 2: about to get so incredibly bleak. So yay, so okay. 184 00:11:08,320 --> 00:11:11,480 Speaker 2: So the Right is able to sort of, you know, 185 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 2: very successful in fact, in transforming this distinction between productive 186 00:11:17,600 --> 00:11:22,000 Speaker 2: and non productive labor into a moral category, and then 187 00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:27,120 Speaker 2: they infuse it with anti Semitism, and through this sort 188 00:11:27,200 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 2: of I don't know, the horror of anti Semitism, productive 189 00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:34,960 Speaker 2: labor is transformed into you know, productive and unproductive members 190 00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:37,840 Speaker 2: of society. And this is one of the origins of 191 00:11:37,880 --> 00:11:40,240 Speaker 2: sort of Nazi race science and race craft. You know, 192 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:44,160 Speaker 2: they have their attempt to quote unquote purify their race, 193 00:11:44,200 --> 00:11:46,800 Speaker 2: which relies on a distinction between sort of productive and 194 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:50,439 Speaker 2: non productive members of society who's like quote unquote value 195 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:53,360 Speaker 2: and productive capacity you know, come to be seen as 196 00:11:53,400 --> 00:11:57,520 Speaker 2: like genetically heritable, which you know, from the Nazi perspective, 197 00:11:58,120 --> 00:11:59,920 Speaker 2: they are like, oh, this is stuff, this is heritable. 198 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:02,720 Speaker 2: We need to do eugenics and mass exterminations of you know, 199 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:06,360 Speaker 2: increasing numbers of disabled, queer communists and especially Jewish and 200 00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:09,640 Speaker 2: Groma people to ensure that only the quote unquote like 201 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:12,640 Speaker 2: productive members society remain and like pass down their traits. 202 00:12:13,360 --> 00:12:18,600 Speaker 2: And this is fucking horrible. But this is also too 203 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 2: simple for an explanation for what actually happens. In order 204 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 2: to actually fully grasp the depths of what's happening here 205 00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:44,640 Speaker 2: and how this stuff functions, we need to go deeper 206 00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:50,480 Speaker 2: into specifically looking at anti Semitism, And in order to 207 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:52,600 Speaker 2: do this, I'm going to turn to the great sort 208 00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:56,240 Speaker 2: of the great social theorist moist pistone Dressed in Peace 209 00:12:56,320 --> 00:13:00,040 Speaker 2: died a few years ago. Apparently a great guy. I 210 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:04,800 Speaker 2: don't know, but yeah, postone and his essay Anti Semitism 211 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:08,199 Speaker 2: and National Socialism. This is something I recommend people read 212 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:10,959 Speaker 2: it in full. It's a bit theoretically intense. It's also 213 00:13:11,880 --> 00:13:14,520 Speaker 2: like one of the most heartbreaking things I've ever read. 214 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:19,040 Speaker 2: But I think it's important to understand what national socialism 215 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:22,920 Speaker 2: actually was and what it's what it's sort of ideological 216 00:13:22,960 --> 00:13:28,440 Speaker 2: basis was, because it, oh boy, not only has it 217 00:13:28,480 --> 00:13:32,079 Speaker 2: not gone away, it you know, it's it's it's it's 218 00:13:32,120 --> 00:13:34,640 Speaker 2: it's doing. It's doing it's doing a lot of the 219 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 2: sort of work that we've we've been sort of discussing. Okay, 220 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:44,640 Speaker 2: so what what what is what is pistone actually talking about? 221 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:49,240 Speaker 2: So postone sees Nazi anti Semitism not just as you know, 222 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:52,560 Speaker 2: the sort of socialism of fools where like Jewish people 223 00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:55,560 Speaker 2: get substituted for capitalists to see the worker and okay, 224 00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:57,680 Speaker 2: like yeah, it's like it's it serves as function to 225 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:04,360 Speaker 2: some extent, but for postone, like Nazi anti Semitism is 226 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:08,120 Speaker 2: its own sort of horrific, incomplete anti capitalist system. It's 227 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:12,719 Speaker 2: this sort of ghastly aryan mirror of like Marxism, and 228 00:14:12,760 --> 00:14:15,280 Speaker 2: you know, okay, so, so to to get an understanding 229 00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:19,760 Speaker 2: of what he means by this, because this is something 230 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:25,160 Speaker 2: that is you know, like it's it's it's deeply it's 231 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 2: kind of theoretically intense, but it's worth it. So in Marxism, 232 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:32,040 Speaker 2: this the central mystery of the commodity is that a 233 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:35,040 Speaker 2: commodity is a well, I mean, central mystery isn't the 234 00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:36,400 Speaker 2: right word, but this is this is one of the 235 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:40,840 Speaker 2: one of the opening things in capital is that, you know, 236 00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:43,800 Speaker 2: this is this is this thing called the commodity fetish. 237 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:47,280 Speaker 2: You have a commodity. A commodity is simultaneously a concrete 238 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:53,680 Speaker 2: physical object that nonetheless contains within it an abstract social relation. 239 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 2: It has at the same time a use value, which 240 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:58,760 Speaker 2: is like, you know, the thing that makes it useful. Right, 241 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:01,520 Speaker 2: Like take a pencil, right, pencil, it has a used value. 242 00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:04,120 Speaker 2: The use value is that you can like use it 243 00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:06,240 Speaker 2: to write things, right, and you can use it to 244 00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:10,840 Speaker 2: erase things. But the pencil also has an exchange value. 245 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:14,400 Speaker 2: And the exchange value, you know, is the value quote 246 00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:17,680 Speaker 2: unquote that you use it to compare it to other commodities. Right, 247 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:19,200 Speaker 2: it's like how much is this thing? How much is 248 00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 2: this thing worth? How much is this compared to like 249 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 2: other commodities, And this is a that's simply an enormous 250 00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:27,960 Speaker 2: that's that's kind of a simplication of it. But what's 251 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:32,120 Speaker 2: happening here is that the sort of the exchange value 252 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:34,120 Speaker 2: that lets you compare how much a pencil is worth 253 00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:36,760 Speaker 2: and how much a bracelet is worth. Right, that's not 254 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:40,000 Speaker 2: an actual characteristic of the pencil or the bracelet. That 255 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:43,720 Speaker 2: is a serious you know that that's an embedded social relation, right, 256 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:47,200 Speaker 2: is an embedded capitalist social relation that allows a commodity 257 00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:51,200 Speaker 2: to be compared to all other commodities by again like 258 00:15:51,240 --> 00:15:55,640 Speaker 2: embedding this capitalist social relation into it. The important part 259 00:15:55,920 --> 00:15:58,480 Speaker 2: for our purposes is that the commodity has at the 260 00:15:58,520 --> 00:16:02,320 Speaker 2: same time a concrete component, which is the physical object, 261 00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:04,480 Speaker 2: and an abstract component, which is the sort of capitalist 262 00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:08,560 Speaker 2: social relation embedded in the pencil that makes it appear 263 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 2: to have value. Here's pistone, as indicated above. On the 264 00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:18,920 Speaker 2: logical level of the analysis of the commodity, the quote 265 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:23,000 Speaker 2: double character allows the commodity to appear as a purely 266 00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:28,440 Speaker 2: material entity rather than as an objectification of mediated social relations. 267 00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:32,320 Speaker 2: So this is a more complicated way of saying what 268 00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:34,000 Speaker 2: I've sort of been trying to get at, which is 269 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:37,200 Speaker 2: that the commodity, you know, because it's a physical object, right. 270 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:42,440 Speaker 2: The commodity fetish allows the commodity to appear as if 271 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 2: it's just a pure physical object instead of something that 272 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 2: is produced by capitalism and contains within it capitalist social 273 00:16:50,040 --> 00:16:53,920 Speaker 2: relations that give it value. So we'll back back back 274 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:59,000 Speaker 2: to pistone. Relatedly, it allows concrete labor to appear as 275 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:03,840 Speaker 2: a purely cial creative process separate from capitalist social relations. 276 00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 2: On the logical level of capital, the double character labor 277 00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:12,600 Speaker 2: process and valorization process. And by valorization process he means 278 00:17:12,600 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 2: the process that turns, you know, capital into more capital. 279 00:17:16,840 --> 00:17:19,000 Speaker 2: So the fact that there's both a labor process, and 280 00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 2: a valorization process allows industrial production to appear as a 281 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:28,720 Speaker 2: purely material, creative process, separable from capital. The manifest form 282 00:17:28,760 --> 00:17:32,600 Speaker 2: of the concrete is now more organic. Industrial capital can 283 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:36,600 Speaker 2: then appear as linear descendant of quote natural artismal labor 284 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:42,600 Speaker 2: as quote organically rooted in opposition to rootless, quote parasitic 285 00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:46,560 Speaker 2: finance capital. You can see here where the whole sort 286 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 2: of productive versus unproductive labor distinction has ended up right. 287 00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:55,480 Speaker 2: It's been transformed into the sort of organic concrete rooted 288 00:17:55,600 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 2: like productive national worker and like entrepreneur versus like rootless 289 00:18:00,080 --> 00:18:08,000 Speaker 2: parasitic finance capital. This is unbelievably dangerous because now having 290 00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:11,159 Speaker 2: set the concrete against the abstract, the fascist proceeds to 291 00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:14,800 Speaker 2: turn the abstract into a people, which is Jewish people. 292 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,399 Speaker 2: The result of this is that in the fascist mind, 293 00:18:18,440 --> 00:18:21,520 Speaker 2: the sort of concrete productive worker and the entrepreneurs stand 294 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:25,679 Speaker 2: against the abstract anti national finance capital personified in the 295 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:29,280 Speaker 2: figure of the jew. Here's postona again of what happened next. 296 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:33,119 Speaker 2: The extermination of European jeury is the indication that it 297 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:35,560 Speaker 2: is far too simple to deal with Nazism as a 298 00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:39,119 Speaker 2: mass movement with anti capitalist overtones. Which shed that husk 299 00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:42,440 Speaker 2: in the nineteen thirty four Rome push. At the latest, 300 00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:45,400 Speaker 2: once dead served its purpose in state power have been seized. 301 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:49,639 Speaker 2: In the first place, ideological forms of thought are not 302 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:55,080 Speaker 2: simply conscious manipulations. In the second place, this view misunderstands 303 00:18:55,119 --> 00:18:59,080 Speaker 2: the nature of Nazi anti capitalism, the extent to which 304 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 2: it was intrinsically bound to the anti Semitic worldview. Auschwitz 305 00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:07,000 Speaker 2: indicates that connection. It is true that the somewhat too 306 00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:10,800 Speaker 2: concrete and Plebeian quote unquote anti capitalism of the essay 307 00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:14,960 Speaker 2: was dispensed with by nineteen thirty four, not, however, the 308 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:19,200 Speaker 2: anti Semitic thrust the knowledge quote unquote that the source 309 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:23,639 Speaker 2: of evil is abstract the Jew. A capitalist factory is 310 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:28,080 Speaker 2: a place where value is produced, which unfortunately has to 311 00:19:28,160 --> 00:19:31,080 Speaker 2: take the form of the production of goods of use values. 312 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:36,040 Speaker 2: The concrete is produced as the necessary carrier of the abstract. 313 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 2: The extermination camps were not a terrible version of the factory. 314 00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:45,400 Speaker 2: The extermination camps were not a terrible version of such 315 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,280 Speaker 2: a factory, but rather should be seen as its grotesque 316 00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:54,320 Speaker 2: aryan quote anti capitalist and negation. Auschewist was a factory 317 00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 2: to quote unquote destroy value, that is, to destroy the 318 00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:02,399 Speaker 2: personifications of the abstract. Its organization was that of a 319 00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:06,200 Speaker 2: fiendish industrial process, the aim of which was to liberate 320 00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:10,440 Speaker 2: the concrete from the abstract. The first step was a dehumanize, 321 00:20:10,440 --> 00:20:13,600 Speaker 2: that is, to rip away the quote unquote mask of humanity, 322 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:19,440 Speaker 2: of qualitative specificity, and reveal the Jews for quote what 323 00:20:19,520 --> 00:20:25,879 Speaker 2: they really are shadows Cipher's numbered abstractions. The second step 324 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:31,919 Speaker 2: was to then eradicate that abstractness, to transform it into smoke, 325 00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:35,880 Speaker 2: trying in the process to rest away the last remains 326 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:42,480 Speaker 2: of the concrete material use value, clothes, gold hair, soap. Auschwitz, 327 00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:44,840 Speaker 2: not the Nazi seizure of power in nineteen thirty three, 328 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:49,240 Speaker 2: was the real German Revolution. The attempted to overthrow not 329 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:52,720 Speaker 2: merely of a political order, but of the existing social formation. 330 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:55,840 Speaker 2: By this one deed, the world was to be made 331 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:59,120 Speaker 2: safe from the tyranny of the abstract. In the process, 332 00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:04,480 Speaker 2: the Nazis quote unquote liberated themselves from humanity. The Nazis 333 00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:07,800 Speaker 2: lost the war against the Soviet Union, America and Britain. 334 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:12,959 Speaker 2: They won their war, their revolution against the European Jews. 335 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 2: And this ideology, this pitting of the abstract against the 336 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:24,240 Speaker 2: concrete is so powerful that it was never defeated. By 337 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:26,959 Speaker 2: the time the Nazis were defeated militarily, they had, you know, 338 00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:29,520 Speaker 2: by the combined might of five of the largest empires 339 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 2: in human history, they had already won, and their ideology 340 00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:37,640 Speaker 2: never went away. If you look closely, you can still 341 00:21:37,680 --> 00:21:40,840 Speaker 2: see it moving throughout the world. You can see it 342 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 2: in the left making exactly the same mistakes it made before, 343 00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:47,119 Speaker 2: waging war against the abstract in the name of an 344 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:50,040 Speaker 2: anti capitalism that can never end with the actual destruction 345 00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:53,600 Speaker 2: of capitalism in that specific form. You can see it 346 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:56,560 Speaker 2: in a right that openly espouses these exact same ideas, 347 00:21:56,560 --> 00:21:59,639 Speaker 2: in the form of pitting their nationalists and patriots against 348 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:03,800 Speaker 2: the glblists, in the way it pits national American or 349 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:09,439 Speaker 2: Russian or Hungarian workers against George Soros. It is the 350 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:13,280 Speaker 2: basis of all modern right wing thought. And when we 351 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 2: come back from ADS, we're going to talk about right 352 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:33,840 Speaker 2: wing thoughts other basis Ronald Reagan's rampant racism. We've now 353 00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:37,800 Speaker 2: seen one way that the productive and unproductive working distinction 354 00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:42,560 Speaker 2: can be turned into unfathomable right wing violence. And now 355 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:46,560 Speaker 2: we're going to take a look at another one, which 356 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:50,040 Speaker 2: is the myth of the welfare queen. So one of 357 00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:52,920 Speaker 2: the ways that Reagan eventually took power was by I 358 00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:55,520 Speaker 2: mean literally he was doing this for like a decade. 359 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:59,560 Speaker 2: He does it for like twenty fucking years. It's insufferable, 360 00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:03,399 Speaker 2: is screaming about the myth of the welfare queen. So 361 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:08,600 Speaker 2: the welfare queen for people who like, I don't know, 362 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,080 Speaker 2: we're too young to like remember what I mean. I 363 00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:13,359 Speaker 2: wasn't around for the original height of it, but like 364 00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:16,480 Speaker 2: I fucking remember from when I was a kid. It's 365 00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:19,239 Speaker 2: this sort of like mythical racist caricature of like a 366 00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:24,120 Speaker 2: black woman who lives off of scamming the welfare system. 367 00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:27,840 Speaker 2: And you can see what's happening here pretty clearly, right, 368 00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:32,080 Speaker 2: This is not like a particularly subtle political maneuver. The 369 00:23:32,119 --> 00:23:34,359 Speaker 2: plan is to pit you know, sort of so called 370 00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:38,919 Speaker 2: like productive workers and entrepreneurs versus people on welfare and 371 00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 2: through through the sort of incredible power of racism and 372 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:47,320 Speaker 2: specifically misogyn noir, which is, you know, through the power 373 00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:50,480 Speaker 2: of America. Is just like specific a bideen casured to 374 00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:53,560 Speaker 2: black woman, the identity of the worker is transformed into 375 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:57,919 Speaker 2: a racial category. So what you're actually dealing with is 376 00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:01,639 Speaker 2: this opposition Reagan is trying to between quote unquote like 377 00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:05,280 Speaker 2: productive white people who like work for a living or whatever, 378 00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 2: and you know black welfare queens quote unquote who are 379 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:10,840 Speaker 2: dependent on the state and don't work. And this is 380 00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:14,240 Speaker 2: this is this is sort of Reagan's framing of it. Now, 381 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 2: if you go back to the sort of older Marxist 382 00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:20,600 Speaker 2: conception of class, right, like unemployed black people are like 383 00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:24,760 Speaker 2: unambiguously part of the working class. And this is something 384 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,359 Speaker 2: that Reagan understood. Now, part of what was going on 385 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:30,400 Speaker 2: here actually was Reagan attempting to sort of crack down 386 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:32,320 Speaker 2: on black welfare activists who were doing a lot of 387 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:35,719 Speaker 2: you know, really incredible organizing, ranging from sort of like 388 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:40,159 Speaker 2: you know, organizing mass protests to like doing squats to 389 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:44,360 Speaker 2: doing like full it's full on building occupations and Reagan 390 00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:47,000 Speaker 2: and more so the people sort of around Reagan by 391 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:50,560 Speaker 2: the end because you know, by like by like term two, 392 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 2: Reagan has like basically checked out. You know. But but 393 00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:56,280 Speaker 2: the people around Reagan can see which way the wind 394 00:24:56,359 --> 00:24:59,240 Speaker 2: is blowing, and you know, they are busy sort of 395 00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:01,399 Speaker 2: like lining up every fan they can find to make 396 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:03,320 Speaker 2: the wind blow a bit stronger, And the way that 397 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:06,399 Speaker 2: the winds are blowing is that a bunch of people 398 00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:08,520 Speaker 2: are about to be spat out of the capitalist system 399 00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:11,879 Speaker 2: and too increasingly precarious service jobs or just no jobs 400 00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:15,800 Speaker 2: at all. And as the sort of crisis dynamics emerged 401 00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:19,160 Speaker 2: and intensified, and people tend to forget this. But Reagan's 402 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:22,320 Speaker 2: term started with him nuking the economy, setting off a 403 00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:26,280 Speaker 2: recession and jacking employment up to ten percent. But you know, 404 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:30,920 Speaker 2: as this unfolds, Reagan sees a perfect opportunity to sever 405 00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:34,520 Speaker 2: what Marks would call the industrial reserve army. Who are 406 00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:36,399 Speaker 2: you know, all the people who've been spat out of 407 00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:38,880 Speaker 2: the capitalist system and forced to face sort of precarity 408 00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:42,639 Speaker 2: and unemployment. He sees an opportunity to like to split 409 00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:46,200 Speaker 2: these people from workers who held onto their jobs. And 410 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,280 Speaker 2: the way you do this is by talking about class 411 00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:53,320 Speaker 2: in a way that's really about race. This new sort 412 00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:56,639 Speaker 2: of moral division of like productive non productive worker is 413 00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,280 Speaker 2: incredibly racialized, which is to say that, like, I mean, 414 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 2: it's just it's just really racist. There's no sort of 415 00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:06,399 Speaker 2: I don't know, there's no I'm I'm not gonna do 416 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,840 Speaker 2: the circumlocution on that ship it is. It is really racist, 417 00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:13,240 Speaker 2: and it's it's specifically designed to pit white workers against 418 00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:15,160 Speaker 2: black workers. And it's also this is something we should 419 00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:19,120 Speaker 2: point out here, like reality has no effect on on 420 00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 2: the sort of like dash repropaganda value. But like the 421 00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:27,120 Speaker 2: people who are on welfare who are working like they're off, 422 00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:29,800 Speaker 2: they're working a lot, they're working really shit jobs. They're 423 00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:32,040 Speaker 2: working more than the people who aren't on welfare in 424 00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:34,680 Speaker 2: a lot of cases. What's happening here, right is this 425 00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:38,040 Speaker 2: is this, this, this entire thing is very specifically designed 426 00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:41,800 Speaker 2: to pit white workers against black workers by invoking racial 427 00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:46,840 Speaker 2: prejudice and slightly more subtly, it's designed to remove black 428 00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:51,240 Speaker 2: workers from the category of labor altogether through you know, 429 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:53,800 Speaker 2: the sort of sort of means of America's like deep 430 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:59,040 Speaker 2: in abiding hatred of black women. Now back in sort 431 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:01,919 Speaker 2: of reality, and again bearing in mind, reality has no 432 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:05,280 Speaker 2: effect on this bullshit, but you know, back in reality, 433 00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:08,720 Speaker 2: like the actual biggest welfare cheat of the modern era 434 00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:12,240 Speaker 2: is Brett Farr, former quarterback in the Minnesota Vikings. Please 435 00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:15,960 Speaker 2: send all complaints at irite, Okay on Twitter, far managed 436 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:19,840 Speaker 2: to spend seventy seven million dollars of welfare money on 437 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:22,800 Speaker 2: a bunch of bullshit that includes like trying to get 438 00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:26,400 Speaker 2: a multimillion dollar volleyball facility built at his daughter's school. 439 00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:30,679 Speaker 2: The actual woman who was like the model for the 440 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:35,720 Speaker 2: first like welfare queen thing like may have stolen eight 441 00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:40,840 Speaker 2: thousand dollars. But you know this, this doesn't matter at 442 00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:45,320 Speaker 2: all because again, like reality's ability to combat propaganda is 443 00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:49,800 Speaker 2: incredibly weak. And you know, and the other thing that's 444 00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:51,720 Speaker 2: that's important to understand about this, right is this was 445 00:27:51,760 --> 00:27:55,320 Speaker 2: never actually about the money, and this is something that 446 00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:57,360 Speaker 2: people use to try to combat this stuff, right, which 447 00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,520 Speaker 2: people will point out and they're right that like, yeah, 448 00:28:00,560 --> 00:28:02,560 Speaker 2: like you know, in order in order to like quote 449 00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:06,520 Speaker 2: unquote combat welfare fraud, like you spend more money try 450 00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:08,439 Speaker 2: to combat the fraud than you save on the fraud. 451 00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:11,000 Speaker 2: But that's not the point. That's not the point at all. 452 00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:15,600 Speaker 2: The point is again, like turning white workers against black 453 00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:18,840 Speaker 2: workers happen to be unemployed, and it works incredibly well 454 00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:22,399 Speaker 2: because they tap into two just really powerful wells of 455 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:25,680 Speaker 2: emotion racism, and they happen to do a second one, 456 00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:29,119 Speaker 2: which is people hating work. But because this is the 457 00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:32,159 Speaker 2: right the way they tap into people hating work was 458 00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:36,240 Speaker 2: they transform it into the seething hatred and resentment at 459 00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:40,480 Speaker 2: the possibility of someone not having to have the suffering 460 00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:43,120 Speaker 2: that you have and doing the thing that you always 461 00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:45,960 Speaker 2: want to do, which is not work, and then tying 462 00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:49,040 Speaker 2: that to, oh, these people don't have to suffer the 463 00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:50,960 Speaker 2: way that I do because they're living off of like 464 00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:56,000 Speaker 2: the product of my labor. And you know, you can 465 00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:59,600 Speaker 2: you can see the sort of ghosts right of like 466 00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,040 Speaker 2: an anti capitalist critique of labor, which is like, yeah, 467 00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:04,360 Speaker 2: there are a bunch of people who like don't work 468 00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:06,960 Speaker 2: a fucking day in their lives off the prophecy proceeds 469 00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:10,360 Speaker 2: of our labors. They wear a bunch of suits and 470 00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:15,040 Speaker 2: they you know, they they're like seventeenth generation like descendants 471 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 2: of the Walton family or whatever. But you know, this 472 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:19,720 Speaker 2: is this is the sort of right wing version of it. 473 00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:22,640 Speaker 2: And so through the sort of lens of racism and 474 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:27,240 Speaker 2: through the sort of transformation of class and productivity like 475 00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:33,880 Speaker 2: into into sort of like pure race discourse, they've managed 476 00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:39,720 Speaker 2: to sort of, you know, they've managed to completely transform 477 00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:42,920 Speaker 2: the way people think about class. And this is a 478 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:46,560 Speaker 2: this is a big part of the reason why the 479 00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:49,720 Speaker 2: way Americans think about class is so incredibly messed up, 480 00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:52,320 Speaker 2: and it's a big part of the reason why you know, 481 00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:56,360 Speaker 2: the United States has spent i mean, spent the next 482 00:29:56,520 --> 00:30:04,840 Speaker 2: fifty years doing this unbelie evenly merciless like ruthless purge 483 00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:09,200 Speaker 2: and just like mass infliction of suffering on the poorest 484 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:13,320 Speaker 2: people in the US. It's because of this shit. And 485 00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:16,080 Speaker 2: this is also the reason that no one, you know, 486 00:30:16,280 --> 00:30:19,080 Speaker 2: if you're fucking reading the New York Times, right, you 487 00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:22,320 Speaker 2: will never hear anybody talk about black workers. They will 488 00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:26,400 Speaker 2: only ever talk about white workers. And this is because 489 00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:30,080 Speaker 2: that ideological project, the ideological project that Reagan was attempting 490 00:30:30,120 --> 00:30:32,680 Speaker 2: to do, was a big part of it was again 491 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:36,800 Speaker 2: about an attempt to expel black workers from the popular 492 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:40,560 Speaker 2: collective imagination of the working class. And it fucking worked. 493 00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:42,840 Speaker 2: If you're a white pundit, you can do this thing. 494 00:30:43,280 --> 00:30:45,400 Speaker 2: You can make an entire career off of study and 495 00:30:45,440 --> 00:30:48,600 Speaker 2: quote unquote the working class only ever talk to white people, 496 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:50,640 Speaker 2: because that's the only part of the working class that 497 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:55,760 Speaker 2: like exists, to these people that they even will pretend matters. 498 00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:58,960 Speaker 2: And then you know, never mentioned black workers even existing 499 00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:02,240 Speaker 2: at all, much less like engage with black workers is 500 00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:04,520 Speaker 2: like the core of the workers movements, and no one 501 00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:07,000 Speaker 2: outside of like actual leftist circles or even bad and 502 00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:09,440 Speaker 2: I no one, no one even thinks this is fucking weird, right, 503 00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:11,640 Speaker 2: And you can get away with this ship because you know, 504 00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:14,320 Speaker 2: eighty percent of all discourse about class is really about 505 00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:17,840 Speaker 2: race or gender. And you know eighty percent of all 506 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:20,080 Speaker 2: discourse but race is fucking white people talking to other 507 00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:23,720 Speaker 2: white people. And that's what we're going to end for today. 508 00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:27,240 Speaker 2: We will we will come back to the sort of 509 00:31:27,280 --> 00:31:32,080 Speaker 2: ruling class reaction to this another time. But in the meantime, 510 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:35,120 Speaker 2: this has been naked Happen here. Go out into the 511 00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:42,080 Speaker 2: world and make something that's not this one. It could 512 00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:44,440 Speaker 2: Happen here as a production of cool Zone Media. For 513 00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:47,240 Speaker 2: more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool 514 00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:50,160 Speaker 2: zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, 515 00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. 516 00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:55,400 Speaker 3: You can find sources for It could Happen Here, updated 517 00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:58,600 Speaker 3: monthly at cool zonemedia dot com slash sources. 518 00:31:58,720 --> 00:31:59,560 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening.