WEBVTT - Thinking Sideways: Agatha Christie Disappearance 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:03.400 Thinking Sideways is not brought to you by Bicycle Tug 0:00:03.440 --> 0:00:07.040 of War. Instead, it's supported by the generous donations of 0:00:07.120 --> 0:00:11.760 our listeners on Patreon. Visit patreon dot com slash thinking 0:00:11.800 --> 0:00:20.320 Sideways to learn more and thanks Thinking Sideways. I don't 0:00:21.120 --> 0:00:29.800 I'm you never know stories of things we simply don't 0:00:29.840 --> 0:00:35.080 know the answer too. Hey, guys, welcome to an episode 0:00:35.080 --> 0:00:39.800 of Thinking Sideways the podcast. I am Devin, joined as 0:00:39.880 --> 0:00:45.720 usual by Steve Joe and the Ghost in the mixer, 0:00:45.760 --> 0:00:49.640 which is on, which is totally yes, it's on. Also, 0:00:49.800 --> 0:00:52.239 I haven't mentioned the tuper coper lately, so so why not. 0:00:52.400 --> 0:00:54.360 Let's just say he's here in spirit. Yeah, I think 0:00:54.360 --> 0:00:56.800 you really have upset some of our listeners. The tuper 0:00:56.840 --> 0:00:59.440 Copera hasn't made an appearance on the show in a while. 0:01:00.160 --> 0:01:02.120 I'm sure, I'm sure that we can work it into 0:01:02.120 --> 0:01:05.759 this before we get too far into it. And by 0:01:05.800 --> 0:01:08.840 too far into it, I mean into it at all. Uh, 0:01:09.280 --> 0:01:12.319 this suggests this is a listener suggestion. I believe it's 0:01:12.360 --> 0:01:16.640 pronounced tomorrow. I think that's right. It's like Maru the 0:01:16.680 --> 0:01:20.120 Cap but with an O Insteadmorrow. Yeah. Anyway, this week 0:01:20.120 --> 0:01:23.520 we're going to talk about what is up with the 0:01:23.560 --> 0:01:30.679 Agatha Christie disappearance? She vanished for eleven days? She did? Yeah, actions, well, 0:01:30.720 --> 0:01:35.720 maybe we're talking about that she disappeared in nineteen six. 0:01:36.160 --> 0:01:38.200 And if you're a doctor who nerd like me, you 0:01:38.240 --> 0:01:43.120 know that it's because of a giant space wasp. It's proven. No, 0:01:43.440 --> 0:01:45.920 I didn't see that particular episode, did he did he 0:01:45.959 --> 0:01:50.800 actually transport her like ten days forward in time? Spoilers? Sorry, Oh, 0:01:50.840 --> 0:01:54.320 come on, that was like season three those spoilers. Actually, 0:01:54.320 --> 0:01:57.559 I think of season five. It was the Donna season. 0:01:57.680 --> 0:02:01.880 So yeah, five, Oh it was, and then' like that season. 0:02:02.040 --> 0:02:04.240 Let's let's see this a doctor on now like thirty 0:02:04.280 --> 0:02:10.280 seven or something. This is a very long conversation. Yeah, 0:02:10.960 --> 0:02:13.400 so here's the story. You guys, Ready for the story? Yes, 0:02:13.600 --> 0:02:18.320 all right. On December three, Agatha Christie and her husband 0:02:18.560 --> 0:02:22.120 Archie had been fighting a little bit, just a little. 0:02:22.400 --> 0:02:25.240 He had asked her for a divorce because he was 0:02:25.280 --> 0:02:28.120 in love with another woman. By the way, this is 0:02:29.360 --> 0:02:31.280 kind of a jerk jerk thing from to do. Because 0:02:31.280 --> 0:02:35.840 her mother died recently, she was under a lot of stress. Yeah. Yeah, 0:02:35.880 --> 0:02:38.800 and to top it off, he had a quote unquote 0:02:38.800 --> 0:02:41.560 problem with sick people. Yeah, so he was nowhere to 0:02:41.600 --> 0:02:43.960 be seen, like a month or two. He was hanging 0:02:43.960 --> 0:02:46.359 out in London. Yeah, no, no, if I'm not coming 0:02:46.400 --> 0:02:50.399 to the the house, yeah yeah. Archie left the house that 0:02:50.600 --> 0:02:53.840 afternoon to spend some weeks with his mistress, who was 0:02:53.919 --> 0:02:56.239 named Nancy Neal. I thought they were just going to 0:02:56.320 --> 0:02:59.240 spend like a weekend again. I was gonna say, I didn't. 0:02:59.240 --> 0:03:01.480 I've seen both. That's why I was trying to see 0:03:01.480 --> 0:03:04.640 if you'd found anything that said he said X amount 0:03:04.680 --> 0:03:07.680 of time. Okay, I think a weekend, a long weekend. 0:03:08.160 --> 0:03:11.120 You know, it's British timing. I don't know what. I 0:03:11.160 --> 0:03:13.160 don't know what that is, but I don't know. There's 0:03:13.200 --> 0:03:15.000 a lot of stuff where you're kind of like, I 0:03:15.000 --> 0:03:18.200 don't actually know how what that's referencing. But okay, cool. 0:03:19.120 --> 0:03:22.320 So after a little while, I think it was like 0:03:23.240 --> 0:03:27.040 nine pm or something like that. After he left, Agatha 0:03:27.840 --> 0:03:30.440 got up from her chair, went upstairs, kissed her daughter, 0:03:30.720 --> 0:03:32.880 and left a note for her secretary saying that she 0:03:32.960 --> 0:03:35.680 was going to Yorkshire for a bit. Later that night, 0:03:36.280 --> 0:03:39.240 her car was found abandoned, lights on quote perched above 0:03:39.280 --> 0:03:41.920 a chalk quarry. Yeah you hear that differently suddeny here, 0:03:41.960 --> 0:03:44.920 it's like run into some sort of bush. Sometimes you 0:03:45.000 --> 0:03:47.840 hear it's like kind of on the precipice, yeah something, 0:03:48.040 --> 0:03:53.280 or just hood up lights on. Yeah. But I think 0:03:53.320 --> 0:03:55.880 the consistent thing and all of these versions is all 0:03:55.920 --> 0:03:57.880 of her stuff was in the car. I've never heard 0:03:57.880 --> 0:04:01.360 when where her stuff wasn't abandoned at the car. Most 0:04:01.400 --> 0:04:04.080 of her stuff. Yeah, it was a fur and a 0:04:04.120 --> 0:04:06.560 bag with a little bit of clothing and and of 0:04:06.600 --> 0:04:10.960 course your driver's license was in there. Yes, And interestingly 0:04:10.960 --> 0:04:14.640 it was found. It was found southwest of London, which 0:04:14.760 --> 0:04:16.480 is like totally the wrong direction to go if you 0:04:16.680 --> 0:04:19.359 want to have to the Yorkshire Yeah, fifteen miles. I 0:04:19.360 --> 0:04:21.680 pulled it up on the map. It's about fifteen miles 0:04:21.680 --> 0:04:27.240 south south west, southwest of Yeah, no southeast, yeah, from 0:04:27.320 --> 0:04:30.360 their home. From their home, she drove southeast, yeah, instead 0:04:30.360 --> 0:04:33.200 of driving northeast to go to Yorkshire. Correct. Yeah. Well 0:04:33.200 --> 0:04:36.320 maybe she was confused, Yeah, maybe maybe she couldn't read 0:04:36.320 --> 0:04:38.560 a map. Yeah. Anyway, that was it for eleven days, 0:04:38.640 --> 0:04:42.599 that the map upside down. Yeah, it's possible actually. Yeah. 0:04:42.880 --> 0:04:45.960 People suggested that this was the publicity stunt, after all, 0:04:46.120 --> 0:04:49.279 the murder of Roger Ackroyd had just been published I 0:04:49.320 --> 0:04:52.200 think within a year of the of her disappearance, and 0:04:52.240 --> 0:04:54.480 it was, you know, a massive success of course, yes, 0:04:54.880 --> 0:04:57.039 but for some reason people thought that she needed a 0:04:57.080 --> 0:04:59.120 publicity stunt on top of that. Maybe she wanted to 0:04:59.120 --> 0:05:02.080 give it a little boost. I guess, yeah, I'm going 0:05:02.120 --> 0:05:05.400 to disappear and give our ratings a booth. But most 0:05:05.440 --> 0:05:08.280 people suspected that her husband had something to do with it, 0:05:08.320 --> 0:05:10.880 which I think you would naturally assume a little bit 0:05:11.279 --> 0:05:13.679 after the search had been going on for a few days. 0:05:13.920 --> 0:05:16.040 It actually made the cover of the New York Times, 0:05:16.160 --> 0:05:20.560 the New York Times, So of course if that ended 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:25.520 up in a huge nationwide manhunt. Almost about fifteen thousand 0:05:25.520 --> 0:05:29.120 people volunteered to help search for her, as well as 0:05:29.200 --> 0:05:32.360 dogs and airplanes they had searching for her as well. 0:05:32.400 --> 0:05:37.400 Apparently that was an historical first for Britain. Yeah, the airplanes, Yeah, 0:05:37.560 --> 0:05:40.320 using them to search for people. And since they kind 0:05:40.360 --> 0:05:43.520 of feared the worst, they started dredging streams and lakes 0:05:44.080 --> 0:05:45.800 especially there was there was a little lake right and 0:05:45.880 --> 0:05:48.000 right near where a car was found, so that's the 0:05:48.520 --> 0:05:50.679 first place they turned to. Yeah, and there's a great 0:05:50.720 --> 0:05:54.080 picture that shows during the search when they're doing the dredging. 0:05:54.120 --> 0:05:57.040 And I don't know that everybody understands, so I had 0:05:57.080 --> 0:05:58.840 never really thought about it, But do you know how 0:05:58.839 --> 0:06:03.600 you dredge for a Well, what they were doing is 0:06:03.640 --> 0:06:07.320 they had basically a giant, three pronged hook on a rope, 0:06:07.920 --> 0:06:10.640 chucking it in, letting it sink and dragging it back 0:06:10.680 --> 0:06:14.880 to the top, which would have paid in the butt. 0:06:15.160 --> 0:06:16.680 And I would hate to be the guy who was like, 0:06:16.960 --> 0:06:21.880 I gotta bite yeah, really seriously, probably brought up a 0:06:21.880 --> 0:06:27.440 lot of logs, car tires, maybe some road signs, and 0:06:28.600 --> 0:06:33.080 probably some of Churchill's tea set. Wait, I mean a 0:06:33.160 --> 0:06:38.239 Turing t set. Yeah. Yeah, you guys you've heard about 0:06:38.279 --> 0:06:41.960 what happened with his teacup, right, didn't He used to 0:06:42.040 --> 0:06:44.320 like lock it to his death. It was just kind 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:48.000 of a weirdo move. Yeah, I don't know, like why. Well, 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:50.560 it turns out to somebody at Bletchley Park thought that 0:06:50.600 --> 0:06:54.680 they were a really funny prankster and would steal people's teacups, 0:06:55.360 --> 0:06:57.440 and nobody really knew what the deal was until a 0:06:57.440 --> 0:06:59.800 couple of years ago when they drained the pond and 0:07:00.000 --> 0:07:03.599 on them all in the middle. He just thought it 0:07:03.640 --> 0:07:05.360 was funny for them to disappear all of a sudden, 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:08.640 So that's criminally irresponsible. In the middle of a war. 0:07:09.520 --> 0:07:13.880 You're wasting precious teacups. Yeah, I'm not gonna I'm not 0:07:13.880 --> 0:07:17.200 gonna tell the whole story here, But someday, if you're curious, 0:07:16.960 --> 0:07:19.280 like you're listening to this, you should go out on 0:07:19.320 --> 0:07:22.640 the internet and try to find the story of Churchill's parrot. Oh, yes, 0:07:23.560 --> 0:07:26.000 that's a great story. Yeah, not for this show now, 0:07:26.880 --> 0:07:32.240 Batgar story. Sorry. Famous people started getting involved. Arthur Conan 0:07:32.280 --> 0:07:37.880 Doyle remember him. Yeah, he gave a psychic one of 0:07:38.160 --> 0:07:42.120 Agatha Christie's gloves. The psychic who was Horace Leaf. You guys, 0:07:42.320 --> 0:07:45.960 you've heard of I am not. Actually you haven't. I 0:07:46.000 --> 0:07:47.600 may have, but the name is not ringing a bell. 0:07:47.680 --> 0:07:49.960 So he was like one of the most He was 0:07:50.040 --> 0:07:53.160 kind of the spearhead of the spiritualist movement and he 0:07:53.200 --> 0:07:57.160 would hold all of these like seances and stuff like 0:07:57.200 --> 0:08:00.080 that and just with a total hack. There was a 0:08:00.080 --> 0:08:02.920 lot of that stuff going on. Yeah, yeah, there was. 0:08:03.760 --> 0:08:06.040 He said that he could tell she was still alive 0:08:06.240 --> 0:08:13.680 though quote half days and half purposeful unquote. Yeah, I 0:08:13.720 --> 0:08:15.880 mean that's that's the whole thing, right, it's like mediums 0:08:15.880 --> 0:08:21.640 and spiritualists. It's that like cold reading situation. Anyway, He however, 0:08:21.880 --> 0:08:24.320 did predict that she would surface a few days later, 0:08:24.440 --> 0:08:30.600 and accurately she did. Bob Tappen the banjo player at 0:08:30.640 --> 0:08:35.360 the then named Harrowgate Hydropathic Company or the hydro which 0:08:35.400 --> 0:08:39.000 is now called the Old swan In because sure he 0:08:39.360 --> 0:08:43.160 recognized Christie. She had apparently checked in some number of 0:08:43.200 --> 0:08:46.000 days ago. Though I've never been able to find out 0:08:46.120 --> 0:08:50.920 when under the assumed name of Mrs Teresa Neil. That 0:08:51.080 --> 0:08:59.920 theme sound familiar, does do? Who? Just? It's um archies 0:09:00.040 --> 0:09:04.160 love her? Nancy Neal? Oh used the same last name? Okay, 0:09:04.480 --> 0:09:07.600 got it? Yeah? No, sorry, not to res Nel, but yeah, okay, yeah, 0:09:07.679 --> 0:09:10.360 that's why I was confused. I wanted banjo player, by 0:09:10.360 --> 0:09:12.760 the way, the one of the London papers that offered 0:09:12.760 --> 0:09:15.520 a one hundred pound reward and he collected it. He 0:09:15.600 --> 0:09:17.960 got to collect it with hundred pounds back in those days, 0:09:18.080 --> 0:09:22.920 was you know, chunk changed nair amount of money? Definitely apparently? 0:09:23.040 --> 0:09:26.440 Oh sorry, that was also gonna say that. Apparently one 0:09:26.440 --> 0:09:27.960 of the stories goes that it was actually one of 0:09:27.960 --> 0:09:31.000 the one of the maids that recognized her, and she 0:09:31.080 --> 0:09:32.800 mentioned it to him, and he just so he jumped 0:09:32.800 --> 0:09:35.679 in there and grabbed the rewards. She should have kept 0:09:35.720 --> 0:09:39.680 her mouth shut, should have she should have told somebody. Yeah, Apparently, 0:09:40.160 --> 0:09:44.800 according to the prevalent theory, whatever, Christie had crashed, her 0:09:44.800 --> 0:09:47.880 car gone into the what the old timey doctors called 0:09:47.920 --> 0:09:52.080 the out of body amnesia experience, boarded a train to 0:09:52.160 --> 0:09:55.720 the Hydro, checked in with almost no luggage, and lived 0:09:55.720 --> 0:09:58.440 like a normal guest for eleven days. She had like 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:01.040 a pouchful of money, she like three hundred pounds or 0:10:01.080 --> 0:10:04.360 something like. She had a lot of money. She had 0:10:04.400 --> 0:10:08.960 like a money belt yeah yeah, which like, okay, I 0:10:08.960 --> 0:10:12.000 don't know why, like her driver's license and stuff weren't 0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:13.960 in there, but okay, fine, who goes around with a 0:10:14.000 --> 0:10:17.719 money belt stuffed full of cash all the time. I 0:10:17.760 --> 0:10:20.679 don't know rich people. I guess, I guess. Actually, when 0:10:20.720 --> 0:10:23.000 I travel, I usually have a money belt with money 0:10:23.000 --> 0:10:26.000 in it if I'm traveling overseas, right, yeah, but that's 0:10:26.080 --> 0:10:31.040 that's traveling overseas. Yeah, not when you're, you know, going 0:10:31.080 --> 0:10:34.480 to drive over to Yorkshire for a little bit. It 0:10:34.600 --> 0:10:40.040 is admittedly it's two miles something from It's a couple 0:10:40.120 --> 0:10:43.120 hour drive, is what it is. Though, that's that's not 0:10:43.280 --> 0:10:46.880 far enough to me to justify trapping on yield money belt. 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:51.320 I agree, Well, I'm sure a lot of people do 0:10:51.360 --> 0:10:55.079 that kind of thing. Yeah, she I guess she had 0:10:55.120 --> 0:10:58.040 read the newspapers with her name and picture plastered kind 0:10:58.080 --> 0:11:01.560 of all over it, without apparently recognizing herself nor anybody 0:11:01.600 --> 0:11:04.360 else looking at the you know, she's sitting there reading 0:11:04.400 --> 0:11:06.679 the newspaper. There's the picture of her. You know, you 0:11:06.720 --> 0:11:08.959 can play that in a movie, right, there's a picture 0:11:08.960 --> 0:11:11.280 of her. You look at that, You look at her, 0:11:11.440 --> 0:11:14.000 You look at that, You look at her, and you go, no, 0:11:14.200 --> 0:11:17.240 it's not her. It's not her at all. Did you 0:11:17.360 --> 0:11:20.280 did you look at the photos that they have of her, 0:11:20.280 --> 0:11:26.320 because they had renditions of hers. Yeah, they especially with 0:11:26.400 --> 0:11:29.360 that that weird little little um the glasses and the 0:11:29.400 --> 0:11:32.440 high shirt. Yeah, or that weird haircut, or she looked 0:11:32.480 --> 0:11:37.400 like what's his name from the three students? Yeah, yeah, yeah. 0:11:37.480 --> 0:11:40.800 And I kind of imagine, like, I don't know how 0:11:41.280 --> 0:11:45.680 tappens revelation played out, I guess I imagine him just 0:11:45.760 --> 0:11:47.280 kind of looking at her and saying, oh, hey, you're 0:11:47.280 --> 0:11:50.439 Agatha Christie, the people are looking for you, and her 0:11:50.520 --> 0:11:54.319 being like, no, I'm I'm miss Neil, and he's like, nah, no, no, 0:11:54.360 --> 0:11:58.520 I'm pretty sure you're Agatha. I'm going to call a police. 0:11:59.000 --> 0:12:01.280 You probably didn't say that because she might iran if 0:12:01.320 --> 0:12:05.040 she's maybe done that, that's true. Yeah, the police did 0:12:05.120 --> 0:12:08.079 show up, and her husband did as well. Apparently this 0:12:08.320 --> 0:12:11.000 rated on his like how much do I care about 0:12:11.040 --> 0:12:15.280 my soon to be ex wife scale her disappearance. I 0:12:15.320 --> 0:12:17.880 think the guy who philanders as much as he was 0:12:18.280 --> 0:12:21.480 this is it's really weird that this rank's okay, but 0:12:21.559 --> 0:12:24.240 the death of her mother doesn't. Yeah, but I think 0:12:24.280 --> 0:12:26.280 at this point he was under a lot of scrutiny 0:12:26.320 --> 0:12:28.320 from the press, and you know, you don't you know, 0:12:28.360 --> 0:12:30.559 it's like you're treating her so bad, you don't care 0:12:31.000 --> 0:12:32.680 care about her at all, and so you wanted to 0:12:33.080 --> 0:12:35.600 demonstrate that. I don't. I don't think you probably especially 0:12:35.600 --> 0:12:37.720 wanted to go. But I mean, I think in addition 0:12:37.760 --> 0:12:39.600 to that, it's, you know, you're treating her so bad, 0:12:39.960 --> 0:12:42.920 you're being horrible to her. You probably killed her. If 0:12:42.960 --> 0:12:45.839 we can't find her, we'll probably think that you killed her. 0:12:46.360 --> 0:12:49.880 He probably had a pretty big vested interest in trying 0:12:49.920 --> 0:12:52.000 to make sure that she was found safe and sound. 0:12:52.200 --> 0:12:56.040 True anyway, he without I guess, protests from her. I 0:12:56.120 --> 0:12:58.120 never read any stories about her, you know, kicking and 0:12:58.160 --> 0:13:02.280 screaming and protesting and saying, oh I'm not a good Christie. 0:13:03.200 --> 0:13:08.640 Um no ah. He took her from the hydro to 0:13:09.360 --> 0:13:12.720 Las Palmas, which like, why would you complain about that? 0:13:14.160 --> 0:13:18.880 Spain little island off Spain, got it, beautiful little resort community. 0:13:19.360 --> 0:13:20.839 Hang on, I'm gonna go see a check it out 0:13:20.880 --> 0:13:24.520 a street view. Yeah, you should have done that already. Yeah. 0:13:24.760 --> 0:13:28.480 So she fully recovered and never had a spell of 0:13:28.520 --> 0:13:31.040 lost time, at least that we know of. Again, never 0:13:31.080 --> 0:13:37.400 had out of body or not anesthesia the same thing, totally. 0:13:37.480 --> 0:13:42.600 Anesthesa does give you amnesia, does you know? So that's 0:13:42.600 --> 0:13:45.120 the story. We don't know anything. I mean, we don't 0:13:45.120 --> 0:13:47.400 know what happened during the love and days at all. 0:13:47.440 --> 0:13:49.760 There's no record of it, and she didn't talk about 0:13:49.800 --> 0:13:52.000 it in her memoirs at all either. She seems to 0:13:52.080 --> 0:13:57.120 not genuinely. She never wanted to talk about She didn't remember. 0:13:57.920 --> 0:14:00.520 That's what she said. That's what she said. Yeah, because 0:14:00.640 --> 0:14:02.840 there's a lot of questions how did she get from 0:14:02.840 --> 0:14:05.000 why did she go south? And then how did she 0:14:05.000 --> 0:14:07.960 get from the car to the train, because it's not 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:10.200 like it was across the street from the train depot 0:14:10.360 --> 0:14:13.240 or just down the street from it. There are there's 0:14:13.440 --> 0:14:15.320 that town just to the northwest of where they found 0:14:15.360 --> 0:14:18.480 the car, and it's it's spelled Guildford, but if I know, 0:14:18.559 --> 0:14:22.360 the British just pronounced Jolfer, but it's spelled Guildford. So 0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:24.440 there's a train station there and that's not very far 0:14:24.480 --> 0:14:27.000 from where she crossed your car five, not even that 0:14:27.080 --> 0:14:29.440 I don't, okay, Yeah, and so she but she would 0:14:29.480 --> 0:14:32.120 have to be aware of what's around her to then 0:14:32.160 --> 0:14:34.000 know to go that direction. I mean, it's just there's 0:14:34.000 --> 0:14:36.000 a lot of things. Well, I mean, I guess somebody 0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:39.440 could have picked her up. It it was dark. Somebody 0:14:39.440 --> 0:14:40.920 could have said, oh, yeah, i'll give you a right 0:14:40.920 --> 0:14:42.640 to the nearest town and you can, you know, deal 0:14:42.680 --> 0:14:44.920 with everything there. And she just was maybe a little 0:14:45.120 --> 0:14:48.600 you know, adult, and so it was like, oh, okay, cool, 0:14:48.600 --> 0:14:50.440 I'll get on the train. Well, yeah, it was one 0:14:50.440 --> 0:14:52.920 way to look at it. Yeah, it's possible. There was 0:14:52.960 --> 0:14:56.320 a rumor you'll read sometimes on the internet, um that 0:14:56.520 --> 0:14:58.960 there was a cottage not far by that was found 0:14:59.000 --> 0:15:01.920 with women's clothes like left in it. It was an 0:15:01.920 --> 0:15:05.360 abandoned cottage or something that it meant that Agatha had 0:15:05.360 --> 0:15:09.160 like changed her clothes. But that was total bunk. That 0:15:09.160 --> 0:15:12.280 didn't actually happen. It's like a late addition to the story. 0:15:12.840 --> 0:15:16.240 I want anything like that ever happened on the internet. Never, never, 0:15:16.880 --> 0:15:22.320 never ever. So theoris the first one is the doctor obviously, 0:15:23.160 --> 0:15:26.480 yeah for real, I mean the giant Wasp aliens could 0:15:26.840 --> 0:15:30.680 have been involved in the episode slash real life, because 0:15:30.680 --> 0:15:35.640 we all know the doctor, who is a documentary Agatha 0:15:35.760 --> 0:15:38.840 has been luring had been luring the Wasp away from 0:15:38.840 --> 0:15:41.560 a party when she crashed her car. She suffered some 0:15:41.600 --> 0:15:44.800 pain as the Wasp dies and she passes out, and 0:15:45.200 --> 0:15:48.480 the doctor realizes that, like, oh, I'm the reason that 0:15:48.520 --> 0:15:50.640 she was gone for eleven days, although in the episode 0:15:50.680 --> 0:15:53.160 it was ten days. So I'm just going to take 0:15:53.160 --> 0:15:56.000 her to the small where she was found. But no, 0:15:56.840 --> 0:15:58.760 you don't think that as much as I like, dr 0:15:58.800 --> 0:16:03.480 who is that not ane? I'm putting theory nobly not 0:16:03.560 --> 0:16:07.320 like yet, as you would say, okay, fine, all right, 0:16:07.520 --> 0:16:10.840 serious Option one, she was faking it yeah, I'm kind 0:16:10.840 --> 0:16:14.480 of liken this one. Okay, So in true again Devin fashion, 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:18.600 we're doing the titles subheadings. But and this one is 0:16:18.600 --> 0:16:20.880 actually pretty plausible that she was faking it. I mean again, 0:16:20.960 --> 0:16:23.200 you know, it's like what you see pictures of yourself 0:16:23.240 --> 0:16:25.520 all over the place, Like, how do you not? Yeah, 0:16:25.560 --> 0:16:29.040 because even if you've forgotten who you are, you're still 0:16:29.040 --> 0:16:30.680 looking in the mirror every day. I don't know what 0:16:30.720 --> 0:16:34.960 you look like. Yeah, um, but how many times have 0:16:35.080 --> 0:16:38.200 you gone and looked at yourself in the mirror and 0:16:38.440 --> 0:16:41.480 not notice something about yourself? You know, Let's say you've 0:16:41.520 --> 0:16:43.880 got some you know, there's a wrinkle in your forehead 0:16:43.960 --> 0:16:46.640 or something, you've got that distinct pattern, and you just 0:16:46.680 --> 0:16:49.880 don't notice those anymore. And it might be that if 0:16:49.920 --> 0:16:52.520 she's you know, a little screwed up in the head, 0:16:53.160 --> 0:16:55.600 you just ignore that. Your brain just says, well, I 0:16:55.640 --> 0:16:57.120 normally don't look at that, So I'm not gonna look 0:16:57.120 --> 0:16:58.400 at that. I'm not gonna look at this. I'm gonna 0:16:58.400 --> 0:17:00.040 look at that. And I just don't know who that 0:17:00.240 --> 0:17:03.440 that that funny bit of nose and eyebrow wiz, you know. Actually, 0:17:03.480 --> 0:17:05.359 and maybe she'd put out a whole lot of weight recently. 0:17:05.440 --> 0:17:08.560 You know, the pictures were not you know, taken just yesterday. Yeah, 0:17:08.560 --> 0:17:10.199 they weren't. Yeah, it's not like we were in the 0:17:10.240 --> 0:17:12.720 age of instant photos. Yeah. So maybe she had the 0:17:12.720 --> 0:17:15.000 picture those photos, that photo was taken and then she 0:17:15.080 --> 0:17:18.760 put on like three pounds. That didn't happen, But it 0:17:18.840 --> 0:17:20.880 might be a couple of years out of date. Yeah, 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:24.600 before we get too deep into this, this theory and 0:17:24.680 --> 0:17:28.600 kind of you know, why and and how, let's pause 0:17:28.680 --> 0:17:31.359 for a second to take a step out of the 0:17:31.920 --> 0:17:37.360 Agatha Christie story and into psychology. Whoo, who at least 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:40.880 favorite college class? He's my favorite college class. It's weird 0:17:40.920 --> 0:17:43.040 that they kept taking me stare at that black and 0:17:43.040 --> 0:17:48.320 white spinning wheel. Yeah, by and I wouldn't remember anything. 0:17:48.400 --> 0:17:52.119 Yeah yeah, well maybe you had this happen to Actually 0:17:52.200 --> 0:17:54.640 I have to have that sometimes when I've just sort 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:58.680 of lost memory. Yeah, usually alcohols involved. Yeah, usually yeah. Yeah. 0:17:58.880 --> 0:18:04.280 As I mentioned before, officially Agatha was diagnosed with out 0:18:04.280 --> 0:18:07.000 of body amnesia and I had to turn to our 0:18:07.040 --> 0:18:11.080 experts on this. So a huge thank you to Luke, Hannah, 0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:15.520 Aaron Jacob, and Elena and thanks guys. You guys were 0:18:15.560 --> 0:18:19.639 like crazy helpful. I can google all I want and 0:18:19.680 --> 0:18:22.199 read the Wikipedia articles that you quoted back to me, 0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:25.560 and it will never be as good as somebody you know, 0:18:25.680 --> 0:18:28.760 writing out in layman's terms what this means and giving 0:18:28.760 --> 0:18:33.080 me their professional opinion on something. So thank you. Everybody 0:18:33.080 --> 0:18:36.160 pretty much agreed that the modern diagnosis of an out 0:18:36.160 --> 0:18:40.159 of body amnesia experience would be what's called a FuG state. 0:18:40.800 --> 0:18:42.560 If you're a fan of Breaking Bad, you probably have 0:18:42.640 --> 0:18:45.359 a little bit of experience with this. You guys on 0:18:46.000 --> 0:18:49.480 Walter had to account for some lost time. What are 0:18:49.520 --> 0:18:58.000 you staring me? Yeah? Yeah, here right, yeah, any any 0:18:58.200 --> 0:18:59.720 you know? So he's naked in a store and he 0:19:00.080 --> 0:19:02.440 doesn't really know who he is, and thanks for spoiling 0:19:03.600 --> 0:19:05.480 that spoils a very small part of it. But in 0:19:05.520 --> 0:19:08.440 the in the episode, it's very clear that he isn't 0:19:08.480 --> 0:19:11.760 actually in state. He's faking it. Yeah. Essentially, as I 0:19:11.840 --> 0:19:14.919 understand it, when somebody is under a huge amount of 0:19:14.960 --> 0:19:20.199 stress or incredibly depressed, the brain basically decides to say, like, 0:19:20.240 --> 0:19:22.520 by Felicia, let's start a whole new life as a 0:19:22.520 --> 0:19:24.760 whole new person, and makes it up for you. I 0:19:24.760 --> 0:19:27.760 don't know how often this happens though, I well, nor 0:19:27.800 --> 0:19:31.720 do I, and we'll we'll talk about that. Yeah, there 0:19:31.720 --> 0:19:33.840 does seem to be Yeah, um, it can also be 0:19:33.960 --> 0:19:37.880 caused by trauma, like a car crash, right if you 0:19:37.960 --> 0:19:40.040 hit your head hard enough, your brain wakes up and 0:19:40.080 --> 0:19:43.600 it's like, I don't know what's going on. She ran 0:19:43.600 --> 0:19:46.960 her car into a bush. I thought, Yeah, have you've 0:19:46.960 --> 0:19:53.280 seen the hedgerows? Those things are stout? Didn't think, have 0:19:53.320 --> 0:19:55.040 you ever seen I've never seen a small headge in 0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:58.840 England and they're all massive. Yeah. I guess for me, 0:19:58.960 --> 0:20:00.960 it's a little bit like I don't know what caused 0:20:00.960 --> 0:20:03.000 her to crash her car, So I don't even know 0:20:03.000 --> 0:20:05.240 if it was crashed well, or to run off the 0:20:05.320 --> 0:20:07.520 road or whatever. You know, it wasn't in the middle 0:20:07.560 --> 0:20:09.760 of the road. It was off the road for some reason. 0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:14.000 So she might not have you know, this, this head 0:20:14.040 --> 0:20:16.680 injury that we're now talking about, might not even happen 0:20:16.760 --> 0:20:18.960 in the car. It may not have happened at all. 0:20:19.160 --> 0:20:21.520 It may have been you know, she may have slipped 0:20:21.560 --> 0:20:25.360 into a few state because because her husband, her mom 0:20:25.440 --> 0:20:28.119 just died and her husband is leaving her, and like 0:20:28.160 --> 0:20:31.600 that's a pretty a small child, pretty high level of stress. 0:20:31.720 --> 0:20:33.600 That is a lot of stress. Yeah, but you know, 0:20:33.640 --> 0:20:35.320 as far as the car thing goes, I'm not sure 0:20:35.359 --> 0:20:37.240 she even crashed. And I think what happened is this 0:20:37.280 --> 0:20:40.720 was this was early December in Britain. She's driving a 0:20:40.800 --> 0:20:43.199 British car. What does a British car have in it? 0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:47.480 Nothing that Lucas electrics, Yeah, which means that the car 0:20:47.480 --> 0:20:50.280 will just stop running for no reason whatsoever. Yeah, you 0:20:50.400 --> 0:20:54.000 never You never experienced Lucas electrics, so you haven't. I 0:20:54.119 --> 0:20:58.280 drive Japanese cars mostly. Yeah. Yeah, anyway, that's why I 0:20:58.880 --> 0:21:03.040 drive good cars. That's what I donna say. But yeah, yeah, 0:21:03.280 --> 0:21:07.760 no reliance, no Robin reliance. Um. So the experts did 0:21:07.760 --> 0:21:10.720 agree on that bit. Just across the board. Everybody said, yes, 0:21:12.000 --> 0:21:15.840 huge state, that's a thing. It's an actual thing. What 0:21:15.920 --> 0:21:19.640 they didn't super agree about is how common it is. 0:21:20.400 --> 0:21:25.600 The answers kind of varied from not uncommon to extremely uncommon. 0:21:26.040 --> 0:21:28.239 And I think that, you know, not uncommon is like 0:21:28.400 --> 0:21:31.359 the term that clinicians use when they're like, well, you 0:21:31.480 --> 0:21:36.000 might know somebody who has this happened to them. I don't, 0:21:36.760 --> 0:21:40.199 you know, It's not like I don't know either. I 0:21:40.240 --> 0:21:43.239 had one expert who said that, UM, in all you know, 0:21:43.280 --> 0:21:47.119 she's practicing clinician, And she said, in all of her time, 0:21:47.520 --> 0:21:50.840 like twenty years or whatever, and in everybody that she knows, 0:21:51.280 --> 0:21:56.040 none nobody has ever actually encountered, UM, somebody who's been 0:21:56.040 --> 0:22:00.119 in a few state. So I wonder, certain diagnosed this 0:22:00.800 --> 0:22:05.320 come into fashion and and things. More and more of 0:22:05.320 --> 0:22:09.919 the medical practicing, psychologist psychological practices seem to keep being 0:22:10.160 --> 0:22:15.320 subdivided into smaller, smaller, more finite answers. So I wonder 0:22:15.440 --> 0:22:19.600 if fugue state was kind of that blanket general term 0:22:19.600 --> 0:22:22.560 they used for this whole group of things they didn't understand. 0:22:22.640 --> 0:22:25.840 And as time has gone on and things have gotten 0:22:25.960 --> 0:22:30.200 more exact, they've kind of abandoned that term or even 0:22:30.440 --> 0:22:32.840 the whole thing, because then, oh no, it's actually this 0:22:32.960 --> 0:22:36.000 one thing, or it's, oh, this other thing. I don't 0:22:36.000 --> 0:22:39.240 think fugue state is an old term. It's that out 0:22:39.280 --> 0:22:42.000 of out of body amnesia is what they used to 0:22:42.040 --> 0:22:45.440