Speaker 1: Welcome to J dot Ill, a production of iHeartRadio. What
Speaker 1: up everybody? It's like EA and as you know, Jill
Speaker 1: is on tour, and so it's Asia and Fantine. As
Speaker 1: a matter of fact, everybody celebrating the anniversaries on tours,
Speaker 1: so make sure you find them in your city, wherever
Speaker 1: you are in the meanwhile, we got a show to do,
Speaker 1: so we are all selecting our favorite episodes of jdi
Speaker 1: ill thus far. Shout out to Amber. She did hers
Speaker 1: last week and now is my turn. Wasn't easy. As
Speaker 1: a matter of fact, I asked Amber, could we do
Speaker 1: a top five? She said no, So now I had
Speaker 1: to hurry up and force myself to pick my favorite. Now,
Speaker 1: my favorite is one that incorporates to fellas. Because you
Speaker 1: don't believe it or not, we got a couple of
Speaker 1: not a couple, quite a few episodes of jdi ill
Speaker 1: where we incorporate the fellas not just as guests, but
Speaker 1: also as subject titles. So in this episode we talk
Speaker 1: about our daddies, yep, the religationship between daddy's and daughters.
Speaker 1: It's complicated and best believed between me, Jill and Aga.
Speaker 1: That's what you got. But y'a also got something real
Speaker 1: beautiful and kind of funny. Yeah, So take a listen
Speaker 1: to Daddy's Love, one of my favorite episodes of jdi IL,
Speaker 1: along with the Fronte episode, the Rory Ward Junior episode,
Speaker 1: The White People Do. Okay, I'm gonna stop because before
Speaker 1: ever catch me doing this, But y'all get what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: Listen to a bunch of episodes of jdi ILL. Thank y'all. Okay,
Speaker 1: like it's coming out of her clothes. Girl ain't got
Speaker 1: no windows open, so I'm make no noise outside, so
Speaker 1: I'm like, let me come out. I'm sorry, y'all. Y'all
Speaker 1: gonna get pure sports for our you got to come
Speaker 1: on out. Boot book release release. Oh. I felt that
Speaker 1: my sister shoutouts is going through menopause, and it is fair.
Speaker 1: You doin't have to do that. You ain't have to
Speaker 1: do that. I knew. I'm just saying it's fascinating. I shouldn't.
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't want it, but I don't want
Speaker 1: to not want it. Yeah. I mean, like watching her
Speaker 1: that that sweat start coming out to something. I'm amazed.
Speaker 1: I'm like, wow, it's happening right now. It ain't fine
Speaker 1: I don't think it's fine. It's funny either. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm not looking forward to it, but it's a it's
Speaker 1: a reality, right, that's my point. Like, I can't dread
Speaker 1: it either. We're right, We're got to talk to somebody
Speaker 1: on the show about that some one day about how
Speaker 1: to prepare for that, because it's it's kind. But it
Speaker 1: seems like though I ain't even gonna lie to y'all,
Speaker 1: Like the precursor is just like that, the that the
Speaker 1: thing just gets super juicy for about five six, seven
Speaker 1: years right before, so it's like and then you're super
Speaker 1: dry and then it goes super dry. This is this
Speaker 1: is what it seemed like. I don't know. I don't
Speaker 1: want to say nothing because I'm experienced it. I buying
Speaker 1: that with you and nothing right now and you fixed you.
Speaker 1: Oh hallelujah. Oh yeah, what a good time. Oh that's wonderful.
Speaker 1: This is not appropriate for where we're about to go,
Speaker 1: is it. No, it's not appropriate at all. As you
Speaker 1: can tell, we are definitely going to have a conversation
Speaker 1: about menopause. I mean we just got to anyway. Today.
Speaker 1: Welcome to Jay Dot Elder Podcast. It is me Jill
Speaker 1: Scott and Aja Graydon dancler like Yah Saint clair Man. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're all here today. We are going to be talking
Speaker 1: about what we learn from our fathers. Oh oh baby, Okay,
Speaker 1: first of all, let's start here. Aga. You got a daddy, Well,
Speaker 1: I have a daddy in the spirit. My dad has
Speaker 1: passed away. He's been, you know, with the ancestors. Now
Speaker 1: for oh girl, it's eight years almost nine actually, but yes,
Speaker 1: that's a yes. That's an affirmative that you grew up
Speaker 1: with the father. Yes, I did, I did, I did.
Speaker 1: I grew up with the father. Layah Oh for show,
Speaker 1: I grew up with a father and for show. He
Speaker 1: has listened to his first episode of jed Ill because
Speaker 1: he loved a good compliment. Yes, ma'am, for show and
Speaker 1: for myself. Yes, I grew up with a father as well.
Speaker 1: He wasn't in our house. But interestingly enough, my father
Speaker 1: was my godfather for many years. What's in the Philly?
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, what now you in the Philly? Yes, my
Speaker 1: father was my godfather for many many years. I knew
Speaker 1: he was my father because I looked just like him
Speaker 1: and I made just like him. It's not even fair,
Speaker 1: and I can't run. I can't run. It's my daddy,
Speaker 1: then what you want? Yeah, but for grown up reasons.
Speaker 1: He was my godfather for how long? From most of
Speaker 1: my life till I think I hit about twenty three
Speaker 1: twenty four, and then I was just like, what are
Speaker 1: we doing? Like seriously, like what are we doing? Why?
Speaker 1: Why are we acting like this elephant ain't in this room? Huh?
Speaker 1: Because because he was there. What he was, he was
Speaker 1: my godfather, so he was always around. I still want
Speaker 1: to hear that conversation. So you had the conversation in
Speaker 1: your twenties like let's stop playing this game, let's stop
Speaker 1: playing these games. And he was like yeah, okay. And
Speaker 1: I my sister who was my god sister. I was like,
Speaker 1: I'm your biological sister at her wedding in the guard
Speaker 1: and she was like yeah okay, and we just moved
Speaker 1: on from there. That was pretty much the gist of
Speaker 1: the conversation. And then years later I must have been
Speaker 1: about forty maybe forty, and I was like, Daddy, let's
Speaker 1: just take this blood test. My mother, of course, was
Speaker 1: like she you ain't. Guys like, no, blind tis, I'll
Speaker 1: tell you I know what I know. Doubt doubt me
Speaker 1: if you walk to I'll show you, and I was like, okay,
Speaker 1: let's just let's just do it was nine point nine
Speaker 1: nine nine nine nine that I was like, okay, got it,
Speaker 1: got it. Yeah. So our dad's our dads, Yeah, what
Speaker 1: did we learn from our dad's so much? Well, my
Speaker 1: dad was married five times and he picked right the
Speaker 1: last one. But I watched him make financial choices. Um,
Speaker 1: he was like, how much you got? You got seven dollars,
Speaker 1: I got seven dollars, we got fourteen dollars, let's go.
Speaker 1: My dad was an orphan, so his thought process was
Speaker 1: to build. I don't know if it was necessarily to love.
Speaker 1: So he got married four five times and divorced four. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So one of the things that I would say that
Speaker 1: I learned is that I don't I don't have to
Speaker 1: be unhappy. Yeah, I mean, I don't. I don't have
Speaker 1: to do that. I don't have to you know, I
Speaker 1: understand people who want to stay married forever, but I
Speaker 1: ain't gonna be miserable. Yeah, I mean, just because it's
Speaker 1: a vow. Yeah, just I'm not. I mean, it's a
Speaker 1: it's a big deal. Anybody would prefer to get married
Speaker 1: and stay married. I want to have that union and
Speaker 1: that partnership and that friendship and that hopefully passionate lover,
Speaker 1: you know, for a lifetime. But you know, I've learned
Speaker 1: that there's a way out. And every time my dad
Speaker 1: lost the house, yep, every time, and he'd start all
Speaker 1: over from the beginning, and he would just let them,
Speaker 1: you know, take whatever they wanted and he would move on.
Speaker 1: M you know, yeah, I learned that, you know, let
Speaker 1: them take whatever they wanted, and he moved on, and
Speaker 1: he moved on. I'm just saying that what I got
Speaker 1: out of that is one that I don't have to
Speaker 1: stay in a bad situation, and two not to make
Speaker 1: choices about marriage just financially. M Okay, yeah, Okay. It's funny.
Speaker 1: I always feel strange talking about my relationship with my
Speaker 1: father because I'm in a I feel like, I don't
Speaker 1: know why. I feel like I'm in a small collective
Speaker 1: of people who had like just amazing daddy love and
Speaker 1: even in a home that was like divorce. My parents
Speaker 1: got divorced when I was six years old, but me
Speaker 1: and my daddy been best friends since I came out
Speaker 1: the womb. And he sat there and talked to me
Speaker 1: about my life and what was going to happen, and
Speaker 1: the joy that I brought into his life. My dad
Speaker 1: taught me about joy and the differences between joy and happiness,
Speaker 1: and I oftentimes feel very guilty talking about his love
Speaker 1: because I I don't have an equal, like bad story
Speaker 1: to tell outside of the fact that I grew up
Speaker 1: with an artist. My daddy is a drummer. He's a photographer,
Speaker 1: so he didn't always have the money. My mom was
Speaker 1: a flight attendant. She had a job that came with
Speaker 1: a pension and things like that. And although he wasn't
Speaker 1: always able to provide for me, and some of those
Speaker 1: Christmases were like bags of thrift store clothes, like the
Speaker 1: love that my dad expressed to me and showed me
Speaker 1: at times, I tell him that he has given me
Speaker 1: so much love that he has made it hard for
Speaker 1: the men in my life because I'm like, I have
Speaker 1: a standard. I know how I want to be loved,
Speaker 1: and I know it's as possible even though my daddy
Speaker 1: is a man, So the love that he has for
Speaker 1: me as a daughter, I'm sure the women in his
Speaker 1: life would be like because I too have had a
Speaker 1: father who has been married a couple of times. You know,
Speaker 1: he is an artist, a New York artist. Okay, so
Speaker 1: he was, but he also is eighty. He's gonna hear
Speaker 1: that I say this. He eighty one, but he looked
Speaker 1: every day at fifty five, so that you know what
Speaker 1: I'm saying, right. But as far as like the arts,
Speaker 1: jazz music, my dad came up with Michael Peters and Debbie.
Speaker 1: It's just it's so many things and arts and culture
Speaker 1: and things that my father has brought into my life
Speaker 1: that I'm so grateful for, even though we argue almost
Speaker 1: every other day. And that's fine too, because he's getting older.
Speaker 1: He don't want to hear about my womanly problems, my
Speaker 1: physical babe, just talk about anything but that period. But yeah,
Speaker 1: it's that it's always interested to talk about Ron Saint
Speaker 1: Clair because, like I said, he you know, he was there.
Speaker 1: He was there. The money wasn't always there, but Ron
Speaker 1: will show up. So oh, I love that, and and
Speaker 1: I'm sorry that you that you have to cherry that
Speaker 1: or feel like you can't talk about that, because it's
Speaker 1: so needed for us to know that there are men
Speaker 1: out there from multiple generations that have shown up for
Speaker 1: their families and really like loving on their daughters and
Speaker 1: as black women, that we have black women out here
Speaker 1: whose fathers were loving them thoroughly and beautifully, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, Like it hurts me that there's energy
Speaker 1: where you feel like you have to hold back that
Speaker 1: story because girl, I want to hear that story again
Speaker 1: and again and again and again and again. That makes me,
Speaker 1: That makes me thrilled, you know. But it's hard to
Speaker 1: watch your girlfriend women sometimes who don't have that in
Speaker 1: their lives, and you see it and you see that
Speaker 1: they didn't have like a foundation of that, and that's
Speaker 1: all they needed to not go through that issue that
Speaker 1: they went through, you know what I mean, not understand
Speaker 1: that that man wasn't good enough for them. So it's
Speaker 1: just it's interesting because I know it shouldn't be hard,
Speaker 1: but it's. Yes, it's like, yeah, I grew with some
Speaker 1: daddy love and I our guilt. Girl. No, girl, let's
Speaker 1: let's ditch it. Let us let us take all of
Speaker 1: your guilt and put it in a ten can and
Speaker 1: set it a blaze and let it go up into
Speaker 1: the atmosphere. Because I'm gonna tell you something, that story
Speaker 1: we need that story to heal. Yeah, we need to
Speaker 1: that's a that's a crown, and yes it's a crown. Yea.
Speaker 1: I don't know. This man called me. He'd be like, baby,
Speaker 1: if I miss your call, it's like missing a season.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, oh my god. Yeah, okay, okay, So
Speaker 1: your father has set the standard for what you require
Speaker 1: in this life, for what you're in this life. And
Speaker 1: because of that, now all you have to do, my friend,
Speaker 1: is to call it. Call it, but you don't look.
Speaker 1: Call for it the specifics of what you want in
Speaker 1: your life as a partner. You know what it looks like. Yeah,
Speaker 1: be as specific as possible. Call it and don't look
Speaker 1: out the window, don't pay the floors, enjoy every moment
Speaker 1: of your existence, but know that it is coming. That
Speaker 1: is not myth. That's the laws of attraction. That's what says. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's like, that is all you have to do. And
Speaker 1: so many of us, you know, young women, black women particularly,
Speaker 1: we didn't see our fathers loving us like that. You know,
Speaker 1: we didn't get a chance to watch. You know, if
Speaker 1: you had a mother and father together, you didn't get
Speaker 1: a chance to see them making out or dancing together,
Speaker 1: or you know, having an argument and fixing it. And
Speaker 1: we're learning with a disadvantage in so many ways. But
Speaker 1: I got some odd stuff going on over here. Because
Speaker 1: Kareem and Ron are like you know, they check on
Speaker 1: each other. I make sure like they're friends, my family,
Speaker 1: my parents. They're the best divorced couple you will ever meet.
Speaker 1: He spends the night when I come to visit, like
Speaker 1: and that's not a problem. He got a room. You
Speaker 1: just stay in Grandmammy room. You know, it's beautiful. It is.
Speaker 1: I think that is amazing, like I said, and I
Speaker 1: feel like we need to make sure that there's room
Speaker 1: for you to tell this story because this is also
Speaker 1: something that for women who do not have this to
Speaker 1: I don't want to say live vicariously, but to see
Speaker 1: a thing exists, you can also hold some ownership to
Speaker 1: it as well. Because there's gonna be a young woman
Speaker 1: who's gonna listen to this episode and she's going to
Speaker 1: remember that missing a call from me was like missing
Speaker 1: a season. She's going to remember that she's going to
Speaker 1: to to store that away as a standard, to store
Speaker 1: that away as a standard for not only how love
Speaker 1: should feel, but how you should give it. All these
Speaker 1: things I mean, honestly, to me, that's everything. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's value. It's it's such a value, place such value,
Speaker 1: or you are like, oh I love it, so yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it's a beautiful thing. I really want to make
Speaker 1: sure that we have ample space for Ron Saint Clair
Speaker 1: in this in this moment, I want us to go, Lord,
Speaker 1: he gonna flip. Lord, he's gonna flip baby, let's say
Speaker 1: the name. Shoot yeah, because he don't be sad. I
Speaker 1: get overwhelmed by his love and I sometimes I'm like,
Speaker 1: I don't know how to even get that back, Daddy,
Speaker 1: after you said, what do I just when you tell
Speaker 1: me what I brought to your life, receive it, receive it,
Speaker 1: Receive it and know that you're worthy of it. Receive
Speaker 1: it and know you're worthy of it. We'll be back
Speaker 1: after the break. My situation my dad is so complicated
Speaker 1: because I mean I was deeply loved, do you know
Speaker 1: what I mean? Like, my dad and I had a
Speaker 1: very interesting relationship. My stepbrother said this to me one time.
Speaker 1: He was like, you know, you know you was Daddy's
Speaker 1: hip And that's set with me for a long time.
Speaker 1: Because my situation with my father. He was a complicated guy,
Speaker 1: and so there were times in which he was very
Speaker 1: absent in my life, and then there were times when
Speaker 1: he was very very present in my life. He was
Speaker 1: good with the love part, definitely good with the love part,
Speaker 1: not so good with the support part. Wasn't really a
Speaker 1: good husband to my mother nor to his wife prior
Speaker 1: to my mother, and wasn't really a present and good
Speaker 1: father for my other siblings before I was born. And
Speaker 1: so it just became a very complicated thing about my
Speaker 1: dad and my relationship with my father because even with
Speaker 1: some of my siblings, we just had very different interactions
Speaker 1: with him, and so having to reconcile the way is
Speaker 1: that he wasn't able to show up for them just
Speaker 1: was really really weird, odd for me. So I guess
Speaker 1: I can understand how Lie is her old guilt, which
Speaker 1: she no longer is carrying, but her old guilt, you know,
Speaker 1: for having that kind of relationship with her dad that
Speaker 1: was so loving, and you having a kind of, you know,
Speaker 1: a guilt as well. A complicated situation because your siblings
Speaker 1: didn't receive the kind of love that you absolutely And
Speaker 1: let me tell you something, I got very close with
Speaker 1: my sister and it affected my relationship with my father
Speaker 1: because I have like dude, like I can't look at
Speaker 1: you the same. I knew that things was odd with
Speaker 1: the two of you, but but it caused me the
Speaker 1: second guess and look at him differently. And I always
Speaker 1: say to my and I have another sister, So gosh,
Speaker 1: my situation is so black and messy, messy. I don't
Speaker 1: want to I do not want to claim that just
Speaker 1: for black people, because right, So, Okay, my mother has
Speaker 1: two children. Okay, my sister and I have different fathers. Okay,
Speaker 1: but my mother married my dad, and my dad kind
Speaker 1: of adopted my sister. So my sister has two dads.
Speaker 1: She's had her biological father and my father. Okay, but
Speaker 1: all of that's interesting until you adding to the fact
Speaker 1: that my father had three children before I was ever born,
Speaker 1: and so he was living in the household with me
Speaker 1: and my sister, who was not his biological child in
Speaker 1: many ways, raising her at the time that my parents
Speaker 1: were together, when he wasn't involved with his other children's lives. Oh,
Speaker 1: so this is it gets very very messy. They don't
Speaker 1: about you, though, No, No, I'm his prize that that
Speaker 1: because you know, I got cousins right now. They don't
Speaker 1: like my ass because I grew up in Grandmam house,
Speaker 1: like I had something to do with it, like I
Speaker 1: chose where I lived, or you know, like they're still
Speaker 1: annoyed by my very presence because I listen. I'm sure
Speaker 1: that there were complicated feelings, particularly when I'm very close
Speaker 1: to one of my sisters, And I'm sure that I
Speaker 1: know that there were complicated feelings when she was younger.
Speaker 1: Obviously you know all of those things. But we're so
Speaker 1: close now that is yeah, all of that is whatever
Speaker 1: whatever water the bridge and water under the bridge and
Speaker 1: just so layered and so were all working through our stuff.
Speaker 1: In terms of what I learned from my dad, my
Speaker 1: dad has been a person who always made me feel
Speaker 1: like I just was the dopest person in the room,
Speaker 1: like he just was, Like I never questioned that because
Speaker 1: he always feel like I was fun, like I was smart,
Speaker 1: He was always listening, you know what I'm saying, And
Speaker 1: so I always felt like, yeah, like my daddy think
Speaker 1: I'm special. Fuck y'all right, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: I just always felt like, Okay, I'm good to go.
Speaker 1: But I also learned from my dad that that whole
Speaker 1: thing that Mina Angelus says about what you said and
Speaker 1: what you did, but people will never forget the way
Speaker 1: you make them feel. I've had to reconcile that my
Speaker 1: dad showed up in ways that were not good for
Speaker 1: other people, and how they felt was important, and I
Speaker 1: had to learn how to separate that from myself. That's
Speaker 1: hard because that's my blood. And so I've had to
Speaker 1: reconcile who this person was as my father and what
Speaker 1: does that mean about who I am? And I learned
Speaker 1: from my dad that yeah, you can be funny and charming,
Speaker 1: and you can be all these different things, but you
Speaker 1: got to be aware of how people will feel, and
Speaker 1: you have to show up as the person that you
Speaker 1: say that you are. You just have to do that
Speaker 1: because it affects people for a very very long time.
Speaker 1: You know. It's funny. Care care Gains and I were
Speaker 1: just we're just having this conversation a moment ago, and
Speaker 1: we were talking about fame and how challenging it could
Speaker 1: be because you know, you know my position. I'm still
Speaker 1: like listening. We all people don't put nobody on a pedestal.
Speaker 1: They're gonna fall off just the way it is, because
Speaker 1: everybody's people anyway. Um, I was saying that the tough
Speaker 1: part is that you might catch somebody. Somebody might catch
Speaker 1: me on a bad day, at a literal bad day.
Speaker 1: You know, something in my family, something in my body,
Speaker 1: something just something that's heavy to me. And I've learned
Speaker 1: now to say something like, listen, I'm not in a
Speaker 1: good place today. Says I'm just I'm not in a
Speaker 1: good place today. Because you're right, what they remember is
Speaker 1: how they felt. So you know, they walk away with this, well,
Speaker 1: she was so nasty, she was mean, she she was
Speaker 1: just that and the other. Instead of that, I'm like, okay, look,
Speaker 1: let me just be up front and say what it is.
Speaker 1: But you're absolutely right, you know, it's how people make
Speaker 1: you feel. And with my dad, I was short. I
Speaker 1: was in school, I was at Temple, and I was
Speaker 1: short eight hundred dollars. And I tried to figure out how,
Speaker 1: just because I was trying to get through the semester,
Speaker 1: how I was gonna get this eight hundred dollars. I
Speaker 1: don't know. So I called my dad and I said, Dad,
Speaker 1: can I borrow you know, trying to be a big girl,
Speaker 1: can I borrow eight hundred dollars? He said, yes, Jilly,
Speaker 1: I'll bring it to you. So he shows up gives
Speaker 1: me the eight hundred dollars. I paid my tuition, and
Speaker 1: I you know, I made it a point to get
Speaker 1: that money, to get that money and put some aside,
Speaker 1: put some aside so that when I gave it back
Speaker 1: to him, it would be the whole eight hundred dollars. Now,
Speaker 1: where by the time I got the whole eight hundred dollars,
Speaker 1: I literally had maybe seventeen dollars to my name. So
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, my dad is gonna be proud
Speaker 1: of me. He's going to he's going to say, oh, oh,
Speaker 1: thank you, Jilly, and then he's gonna give me it back,
Speaker 1: or he's gonna give me some back, you know, just
Speaker 1: because I did my I did. I did what I
Speaker 1: was supposed to do. And I'm his daughter, right you know.
Speaker 1: You know I'm huffing and puffing through school. Two jobs
Speaker 1: money daddy. Yeah, I thought that he was gonna give
Speaker 1: me at least some of the day he took that
Speaker 1: ship and put it in his pocket, and we continued today,
Speaker 1: and I was like, Okay, at any time he's gonna
Speaker 1: go now and if he's gonna give me something back,
Speaker 1: you know, at least one hundred dollars at least one
Speaker 1: hundred dollars that that man kissed me goodbye and went
Speaker 1: on about his business. I was is a so mad?
Speaker 1: I was so mad? H. I internalized that thing, and
Speaker 1: at that point I was like, I will never in
Speaker 1: my life need a man for money again. You used
Speaker 1: to borrow or how you mad? You used to be
Speaker 1: word you used to be worth the L word, which
Speaker 1: was loan? Don't you should I have? If only you
Speaker 1: should have? I played myself. I played myself, but it
Speaker 1: did give me a valuable lesson. I decided I would
Speaker 1: never in my life again have to borrow or get
Speaker 1: a loan from a man again in my life somebody
Speaker 1: like somebody that's in my life like a boyfriend. So yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, while other people are looking at you know,
Speaker 1: I'm supposed to date a successful actor or a successful
Speaker 1: singer or a successful something, I do not think about
Speaker 1: money at all because from him I from me right
Speaker 1: and now with the state of pre nups and agree,
Speaker 1: we ain't gonna take nothing from me, even motherfucker get
Speaker 1: out of here with the mike. Ain't never had no money, girl,
Speaker 1: So that's whatever. I wasn't never gonna borrow ship from
Speaker 1: my dad. But like I said, my dad was big fun.
Speaker 1: Now this is one thing and I and then I
Speaker 1: was sitting here thinking, I was like, oh shoot, I
Speaker 1: didn't think of this new enough. As a parent. I'm
Speaker 1: fun and I got that from my parents. Both my
Speaker 1: parents were being fun people to be around. But my
Speaker 1: dad was big fun. Yes, oh girl, yes, Like my
Speaker 1: dad would take me ice skating, but he couldn't really
Speaker 1: do it that well. But he would skate top speed,
Speaker 1: girl to speed. And he had this brown coat and
Speaker 1: he would fall on the ice and all the white
Speaker 1: from the from the ice would get all over his car.
Speaker 1: And it was just embarrassing to me, Like we didn't care.
Speaker 1: When when it was snow. He would break open the
Speaker 1: um cardboard box because we didn't have no money so
Speaker 1: we had no carboar a cardboard box. He break up
Speaker 1: in the cardboard box. Girl, you would think he's doing
Speaker 1: this for us. No, no, ma'am. She's going down the
Speaker 1: hill first, head first, running start. I didn't start, you
Speaker 1: Know's what I'm saying. Asian, did y'all ever do the
Speaker 1: paddle boating on the base and you and your dad yo,
Speaker 1: Me and my daddy had all the time paddle boat
Speaker 1: y'all listen, I mean just fun, just goofy, goofy, goofy,
Speaker 1: and fun sing was sing with me, dance with me,
Speaker 1: all those different things, very very because mamma was straight
Speaker 1: and Daddy was the fun one, right, Dad was a
Speaker 1: fun one. But in my household, honestly, I won't even lie,
Speaker 1: my mother was really fun too. God let me go on, Asian,
Speaker 1: hold on, hold on, because she might be growing. Let
Speaker 1: me just say this, mommy, I didn't mean that you
Speaker 1: were straight. I just saying you was more strict and
Speaker 1: I had so much fun. And thank you for taking
Speaker 1: me around the world. Yes, face the thing though about
Speaker 1: that for me again, it's just like I said, complicated
Speaker 1: my dad. God made it hard for me when I
Speaker 1: became an adult and I had to have boundaries with
Speaker 1: my father because I was in love with him. You
Speaker 1: understand why I'm saying boundaries because he was messy, he
Speaker 1: was a drug addict, He was a liar sometimes. And
Speaker 1: you know you talk about borrowing money, my dad would
Speaker 1: borrow money from me. My dad would borrow money from
Speaker 1: other people. Like I'm saying all this to say, and
Speaker 1: you know me, God rest his soul, But I gotta
Speaker 1: be honest about who he was. And it was hard
Speaker 1: for me because right, you know, and when I got older,
Speaker 1: I felt like I'm mature. I'm not a baby anymore,
Speaker 1: so not to deal with you like an adult. I
Speaker 1: can't just let you get away with it because you're
Speaker 1: my daddy, and because I love you and he laugh,
Speaker 1: and because you're cute, because you're handsome, and everybody think
Speaker 1: you're handsome and they say I look like you, so
Speaker 1: I must I must be handsome, you know, and you know,
Speaker 1: and all of the ways that I was so attached
Speaker 1: to him, and it was painful because it was like
Speaker 1: the daddy that I love, I gotta let him die
Speaker 1: to deal with the reality of the dad that the
Speaker 1: people don't love and that he is. And so that
Speaker 1: began my adult relationship with my father, which was so
Speaker 1: off off on, so much so that two years before
Speaker 1: my dad passed away for two years I didn't speak
Speaker 1: to him. I had an unfortunate incident with him involving
Speaker 1: my older sister, and I just decided that I was
Speaker 1: no longer going to be communicating with him anymore. And
Speaker 1: my husband warned me against this. He said, listen, I
Speaker 1: have a complicated thing too. I gotta complicated daddy's story too.
Speaker 1: He was like, but you care about that relationship, and
Speaker 1: now you in here lying to yourself about how much
Speaker 1: you care about it. And he was like, if something
Speaker 1: happens to your dad, you're gonna be devastated. And I
Speaker 1: was like, no, I'm right, I'm correct, and I was correct.
Speaker 1: This is where it gets tough with parents. I was
Speaker 1: right about what I was upset about, but how I
Speaker 1: chose to handle it, it isolated our relationship worse than
Speaker 1: it had ever been my whole life. I'd never gone
Speaker 1: my birthday not talking to my dad. I'd never gone
Speaker 1: holiday seasons and thinks without speaking to my father. And
Speaker 1: I didn't talk to him for two years straight. And
Speaker 1: I gotta call literally right after my birthday. We had
Speaker 1: not spoken. This was the third cycle of birthday going
Speaker 1: through the unspell. Got a call and it was like
Speaker 1: he'd been diagnosed with cancer. And I drove down to
Speaker 1: see him, and oddly enough, my mother was with me.
Speaker 1: My mother was in Philly at the time, and she
Speaker 1: drove with me and we went down there. And I
Speaker 1: hadn't laid eyes on my father in two and a
Speaker 1: half years, and so when I went down there. I
Speaker 1: walked into the room and he was in bed and
Speaker 1: he looked sick, and I walked in there and the
Speaker 1: two of us just cried, probably for about the first
Speaker 1: thirty minutes that I was there, and I just laid
Speaker 1: in the bed with him and we just cried and
Speaker 1: cried and cried. I don't say nothing else to each other.
Speaker 1: We just cried. And it was a pain of the mistakes.
Speaker 1: It was the pain of the non consistent nature of
Speaker 1: who he was in my life. It was all the
Speaker 1: unsaid things, all of the stuff, and we just cried
Speaker 1: that shit out. And then eight months later he died.
Speaker 1: And I'm grateful that I had that eight months because
Speaker 1: it was pancreatic cancer and that can be really, really aggressive.
Speaker 1: So I'm grateful for the eight months. In that eight months,
Speaker 1: I feel like I made as much closure as I
Speaker 1: could have, and I was okay, and I was with
Speaker 1: him the day that he passed, you know. So I'm
Speaker 1: grateful to have had that moment. But I always think
Speaker 1: about my dad, my relationship with him, and I'm still
Speaker 1: learning things about that relationship. And what I learned from
Speaker 1: that whole journey was that a person is a lot
Speaker 1: of things, and now we just a lot of things.
Speaker 1: A person is a lot of things. You cannot compartmentalize
Speaker 1: a human being. You know. We've been talking about this
Speaker 1: when we talked about our mothers, you know, and and
Speaker 1: humanizing our mothers when we had that conversation. You know,
Speaker 1: it's the same thing with our fathers. Yeah, my dad's
Speaker 1: is a kind of guy who would who would yell
Speaker 1: hey baby out the window, and then he would turn
Speaker 1: to me and say, oh, that's your cousin. And I
Speaker 1: realized that not every woman. It took me a long time,
Speaker 1: but it took me, you know, to realize that not
Speaker 1: every woman that he was yelling, hey baby was family.
Speaker 1: You know, we're gonna take a quick break and then
Speaker 1: we'll be right back. He was, I say, was, And
Speaker 1: it's not fair. But my dad has dementia and he's
Speaker 1: at the state where the majority of the time he sleeps,
Speaker 1: you know. Um he I had a moment. Fucked me up,
Speaker 1: and they fucked me up, no other words for it.
Speaker 1: I went to go see him, and my dad flirted
Speaker 1: with me. He thought I was my mom and patted
Speaker 1: my ass. Shit. No, I left out of there with
Speaker 1: this strange sound in my spirit. It was a strange sound,
Speaker 1: and I didn't know what to do. But but just
Speaker 1: like bees, weirded out and crying, and I had to,
Speaker 1: you know, realize, my dad doesn't he don't know who
Speaker 1: I am. Yeah, he has no idea whatsoever. If he
Speaker 1: don't see you every day, he really really ain't gonna yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, And that was hard. And then before he
Speaker 1: had to go to a home. My dad as an
Speaker 1: ex police officer, retired police officer, and he had gotten
Speaker 1: to a point where he couldn't stay at home anymore
Speaker 1: because sometimes he didn't know who his wife was. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and if she went room and startled him, you know,
Speaker 1: he very well could hurt her or you know, worse.
Speaker 1: So he was put into a home and it's just, honestly,
Speaker 1: it's just been downhill from there. The before that though,
Speaker 1: this was the one that got me too. He had
Speaker 1: been diagnosed. I could tell because he had visited me
Speaker 1: in California for famis. That's our Christmas time he visited
Speaker 1: for famists and he was driving and it was so reckless.
Speaker 1: It was so scary that when I got back to
Speaker 1: my family, I was like, Daddy can never drive again,
Speaker 1: Like he could never drive again, and I knew it
Speaker 1: was you know, it was progressing. The dementia was progressing.
Speaker 1: The next day, they were leaving, my sister and my
Speaker 1: brother in law and my nephews were leaving and I
Speaker 1: was standing next to my dad and he pushed me.
Speaker 1: He pushed me like a stranger. He pushed me out
Speaker 1: of the way to hug my sister. Go about oh
Speaker 1: hard though, like real hard, like I almost get the
Speaker 1: fuck out the way. Yeah, it was that. And there
Speaker 1: again I was just like, Okay, he doesn't know who.
Speaker 1: You know, he didn't know you at that moment, you know,
Speaker 1: at that one moment he didn't know And I, oh,
Speaker 1: I was. I went through the whole thing, like that's
Speaker 1: how he really feels about me. I know, but I did,
Speaker 1: but as dementia, but I did. I did. I went
Speaker 1: through the whole thing, and I was like, that's how
Speaker 1: my dad really feels about me. You know, it's like
Speaker 1: when somebody's drunk. But that ain't it, ain't it? You know,
Speaker 1: truth say you know what. I definitely did that And
Speaker 1: that was a lot. So, you know, him pushing me
Speaker 1: was one thing, and then him going into the home
Speaker 1: and flirting that was something else. Like it was like
Speaker 1: tearing the relationship that I had, you know, with my
Speaker 1: father apart. Just dementia just was destroying it. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: it made it really challenging for me to go and visit,
Speaker 1: very hard. And you know, I have to say that
Speaker 1: the staff where he was, they didn't help much, you know,
Speaker 1: because I'm really there to visit my father, and they
Speaker 1: will come in on our meetings and you know, I
Speaker 1: want to talk about something, you know that I really
Speaker 1: I don't even have the headspace. I'm looking at my
Speaker 1: father who can't say words anymore. I'm looking at my
Speaker 1: dad who just groans, you know. And you know that
Speaker 1: was that was another challenging portion. But the last time
Speaker 1: I went to visit him, there was nobody yet that
Speaker 1: I knew in there. Yeah he was he was, he
Speaker 1: was gone. He's gone. So you're working on cherishing what
Speaker 1: you knew, the man that you knew. How do you
Speaker 1: take care of yourself in that way? And I just, oh,
Speaker 1: I grieve him, Yeah, yeah, I grieve him, even though
Speaker 1: his body is still alive. And you know, I just
Speaker 1: grieve him. And my stepmother, you know, God bless her.
Speaker 1: She definitely, you know, makes it a point to always
Speaker 1: visit and to you know, to talk about him, and
Speaker 1: you know, she goes there and before COVID and she's
Speaker 1: watching a football game. She put a hat on him,
Speaker 1: you know, Eagles hand and stuff. And after a while
Speaker 1: I had to ask her to please stop, just stop
Speaker 1: sending me pictures because he don't ain't in there, He
Speaker 1: doesn't look like he's in there. He doesn't seem aware
Speaker 1: of his surroundings or what he's doing in any way,
Speaker 1: shape or form. It was just painful. She's she's dealing
Speaker 1: with it, but I'm asking her not to make me
Speaker 1: deal with are dealing with it, because I can't take
Speaker 1: it right. I can't take it. I find it, you know.
Speaker 1: But you know, it's like when people put clothes on dogs.
Speaker 1: You know that dog don't want that. Damn the boots on,
Speaker 1: you know, like that's just the only thing I could
Speaker 1: think of it, the boament. But just just yeah, I
Speaker 1: understand what you mean. So the last time that I went,
Speaker 1: and I know that it's the last time that I'm going,
Speaker 1: but I send representatives just to see, you know, how
Speaker 1: he is and how his room smells and all of
Speaker 1: those things. And the last time that I went, and
Speaker 1: he just was not in there and at all. I
Speaker 1: rubbed his hand and I smelled him. I used to
Speaker 1: I love the hair on his hand and on his
Speaker 1: on his arm. I love that hair. I could just
Speaker 1: rub it and rub it. And I rubbed the hair
Speaker 1: and I talked to him and I told him, you know,
Speaker 1: all the places that I forgive him, you know, and
Speaker 1: that I hope that he would forgive me too. And
Speaker 1: you know, I let jet see me more in my father,
Speaker 1: in front of my father, because because he's my son
Speaker 1: and that's his grandfather, and I needed him to know
Speaker 1: that I love my dad. I needed him to know that,
Speaker 1: you know, even though you know, he's not himself anymore,
Speaker 1: and he's in this place that he needs because it's
Speaker 1: he's heavy, like you know, just trying to take it.
Speaker 1: It's a lot, and he needs twenty four hour care,
Speaker 1: you know, and consideration. So I cry real hard, and
Speaker 1: I mean, whoa, Okay, the whole game and all the snots,
Speaker 1: all the tears, all of it. I kissed my father
Speaker 1: all over and I asked him to you know, relinquish, yeah,
Speaker 1: to to let go, because the only thing is it's
Speaker 1: his body, you know, just just go. So as selfish
Speaker 1: as that may seem to some people. I actually it wasn't.
Speaker 1: I was really as you were talking to Jail, I
Speaker 1: was like, damn, he's still here. So in a way,
Speaker 1: I guess you feel like you can't even speak to
Speaker 1: his spirit because he's still here. But when he's when
Speaker 1: he's not here, you will have his spirit, you'll have
Speaker 1: access to it, and then you just feel so I'm
Speaker 1: just say it did not. It's a it's a it's
Speaker 1: a limbo kind of feeling. Yes, yeah, yeah, it's like
Speaker 1: I feel so sorry, Like I feel like he's trapped, right, Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: he's just trapped. It makes perfect sense. Oh boy, I
Speaker 1: mean it makes sense when when the week that my
Speaker 1: father transition, let me let me just say this last
Speaker 1: thank you age. I walked out of there with Jet
Speaker 1: and I cried some more, and a white butterfly landed
Speaker 1: on me and stayed for a while and flew away,
Speaker 1: and I laughed. I was like, okay, daddy, okay, like
Speaker 1: you know, just you know, those moments matter, those moments mattered,
Speaker 1: and that the fact that the butterfly landed on me
Speaker 1: and stayed. I was like, thank you, dad, you know
Speaker 1: that we I just felt like we've made our piece,
Speaker 1: you know, whatever piece that we needed because, like I said,
Speaker 1: I was his god daughter for a long time, and
Speaker 1: he rode with that. I know that I wouldn't you
Speaker 1: know what I'm saying, Like, I wouldn't. I wouldn't ride
Speaker 1: with that. There's no way that I wouldn't be like,
Speaker 1: wait a minute, hold up, this is my baby, you know,
Speaker 1: So that whole not being clean thing, despite when anybody
Speaker 1: else is trying to say, um, fuck with me, did
Speaker 1: you have that conversation with him? Ever? Yes, yes we did.
Speaker 1: We had that conversation. We had to And why say
Speaker 1: that he did the thing that you you know you
Speaker 1: would have never dined. Well, it's a tough situation because
Speaker 1: this is my mother's story, that's right. So I just okay,
Speaker 1: never mind, sorry, miss Joy, And I'm not trying to
Speaker 1: get you into the trouble I've been in. So I'm
Speaker 1: just it's her story to tell it is. But nonetheless,
Speaker 1: they had an understanding, in an agreement they proceeded in
Speaker 1: life with that. He was not privy to that understanding
Speaker 1: and agreement. All I knew is that my sister, you know,
Speaker 1: was getting all of the daddy and I was getting
Speaker 1: guyfather vibes, you know, shout out to the guyfathers. Nonetheless,
Speaker 1: you know, so that that was a that was a thing.
Speaker 1: And I'm still you see me, I'm still over here
Speaker 1: clutching my pearls because you know, he's still he's trapped
Speaker 1: in there. I just feel like he's checked or is
Speaker 1: he You saw the butterfly the body, Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe he's only you know what I mean. We can't
Speaker 1: pretend to know the spear, can't. We can't. We don't
Speaker 1: know it. We don't know it, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: We can only put our intentions out there. And you did.
Speaker 1: You did you put your intentions out there and the
Speaker 1: spirit communicated with you in the ways that was familiar
Speaker 1: to you. Yeah. Yeah. I mean when I talk to
Speaker 1: guys y'all, at this point, I'm like, listen, you know me,
Speaker 1: make a real plain, make a real plain and simple
Speaker 1: for me, because you know, when it's too convoluted, I
Speaker 1: go into myself and I start thinking my own thoughts
Speaker 1: and things. Just make it real, real simple, you know,
Speaker 1: please for me, Thank you kindly. Yeah. And I felt
Speaker 1: like that was confirmation for me. That's what I needed.
Speaker 1: That my dad said, okay, baby, more conversation after this break.
Speaker 1: I think of these men and what they know of
Speaker 1: a love and parenting and as black men from a
Speaker 1: certain age group and a time period. And not saying
Speaker 1: that this is not to excuse anything that was done
Speaker 1: to anyone, right, but just how much of these things
Speaker 1: are they really capable of, you know, just in terms
Speaker 1: of just all of the all the things that they
Speaker 1: have to grapple with and what they just didn't understand
Speaker 1: and know you were talking about talking to Kiera earlier,
Speaker 1: and he's such a part of a newer generation of
Speaker 1: black fathers, husband and husbands and fathers, but particularly fathers
Speaker 1: because and he has a little girl, which is you
Speaker 1: know right, And it's like, you know, they have, oh
Speaker 1: a skill set in a language, a vocabulary and emotional vocabulary,
Speaker 1: a life vocabulary that is different than what our days.
Speaker 1: It's no, they have it, and they wouldn't have it
Speaker 1: if not for what our dads went through too. And
Speaker 1: that's the thing. So I remember when during my dad's
Speaker 1: eight months, we talked about a lot of things and
Speaker 1: he told me something that he had never told me before.
Speaker 1: He said, I worried if my daughters would find good
Speaker 1: men ship. He said, I wondered. I worried if they would.
Speaker 1: He said, Fatine has mastered something that I never could.
Speaker 1: He said, he understands how to hustle with his family
Speaker 1: and toe. That's beautiful. He said, I didn't know how
Speaker 1: to do both. I would have bawled. And he said
Speaker 1: that I'm so grateful that you found someone that understood
Speaker 1: the things that I wasn't able to teach you about,
Speaker 1: but he didn't have the resources to do it. Also, like,
Speaker 1: and I'm saying that he did a lot, but he
Speaker 1: did didn't have any It's just so different, different times.
Speaker 1: It's just so interesting. So of course, yes, you're right.
Speaker 1: And as I've pulled back the layers, and also too,
Speaker 1: as I've learned more about history in general, it helped
Speaker 1: me put my own father into contexts. You know, we
Speaker 1: know that our dads went to war, right, nod went
Speaker 1: to war? Yea, that is true? Romatic. Yeah, I'm so glad, Yes,
Speaker 1: because you're right, right, my dad went from an orphanage
Speaker 1: to war. Baby, My dad's my dad's father. His own
Speaker 1: father passed when he was three, so you have a
Speaker 1: situation where he went to war. My father also went
Speaker 1: to prison man. Can I tell you my father little war,
Speaker 1: but his experiences in the army were so traumatic that
Speaker 1: he was good on it, like the things that I
Speaker 1: saw brown men, I'm good on it. Yeah, So you know,
Speaker 1: And I think about these men and the kind of
Speaker 1: emotional I don't know, Wheelhouse, whatever we expect from them,
Speaker 1: what the man say, we're with him? Where with the roll?
Speaker 1: Where with the roll that we needed from them? But
Speaker 1: that how can we really truly expect for them to
Speaker 1: have delivered it? I don't know where my dad got
Speaker 1: it from being born in nineteen thirty nine and then
Speaker 1: the youngest of nine, I do not know. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't know where he got his love from. That's
Speaker 1: why I know he's a what you call that unicorn
Speaker 1: in a way. So girl, and you know what, and
Speaker 1: I hope that you're able to get a good deal
Speaker 1: of his story so as you. I'm not old, Asia,
Speaker 1: I'm working on receiving better in that way and not
Speaker 1: being a daughter and just going yeah yah, yeah, I
Speaker 1: heard that story already. I think we got to be
Speaker 1: and it's bad ter you know, if you recorded, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean, Just put your little phone down
Speaker 1: and listen. To you if I to talk about stuff,
Speaker 1: even though he said it a thousand times, because those stories,
Speaker 1: my dad, those stories, yeah, oh jelly, I was. I
Speaker 1: was in Kawai and they wanted me to sing a song.
Speaker 1: And I've got this great picture of my father, all
Speaker 1: young and his little in his little uh what I
Speaker 1: was about to say, costume uniform. He had one song,
Speaker 1: one song only, and he would sing it all night long.
Speaker 1: I got a gal name Boni. As I say, go back,
Speaker 1: I rode it all the time. And they, he said,
Speaker 1: every time, they would chair and celebrate. So I say
Speaker 1: it again. He said. I entertained everybody all night long,
Speaker 1: and they would say good. I don't know. They might
Speaker 1: have just been bored. I've heard. I'm gonna listen to
Speaker 1: my daddy tell me this story one more time about
Speaker 1: his Mamma yn't get him off the stage because the
Speaker 1: kids were singing jumped down turn around Thingabella cotton um
Speaker 1: jumped down turnaround Thingabella. Hey, oh, my son, that's not
Speaker 1: my son. My son ain't about to do that that gee,
Speaker 1: Grandma said, not my son, cool, get you, grandma, come home.
Speaker 1: My dad loved jazz. He was addicted to jazz, and
Speaker 1: my father is famous for he's a DC native sort
Speaker 1: of that is famous for having said that he much
Speaker 1: prefers King Pleasure's version of There I Go, There I Go.
Speaker 1: No he he must yeah, yeah, yeah, he much. He
Speaker 1: much prefers King Pleasure's version of Moody's Moved for Love.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, listen, I'm sorry DC people. Y'all gonna be
Speaker 1: mad at my daddy, but don't be mad at him.
Speaker 1: Should compare compare my dad saying, well, he was a
Speaker 1: big jazz head, but my dad sang that song to
Speaker 1: us as kids, so much pleasure, pleasure, that's the original
Speaker 1: James Mooney, James Pleasure. Is that there? Yes, James with pleasure.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Jio, that's the one right there. Yes, come
Speaker 1: on playing Jill please? Oh doesn't me my daddy song?
Speaker 1: Too real? Baby, you are the soul who snaps my control.
Speaker 1: Such a funny thing. But every time you hear me,
Speaker 1: I never and I wrapped up in your magic. There's
Speaker 1: music all around me, great music music that you're calling
Speaker 1: me so very close to you, churne me your slave,
Speaker 1: come into with me and they little thing you want
Speaker 1: to anything, Baby, Just let me get next to you.
Speaker 1: Am high insane. Heaven in your eyes right it stars
Speaker 1: that shine up skies? How worry about you? Just getting
Speaker 1: in my life without you? Baby? Don't wonderful? Come on, ladies,
Speaker 1: I'm really feeling in the move for love. Oh, ladies
Speaker 1: and gentlemen, Thank you so much for listening. Saith dot
Speaker 1: Elder Podcast Shout out to the fathers. Thank you, Ron
Speaker 1: Saint Clair, Thank you, Ron Saint Clair, Thank you, Will German,
Speaker 1: Thank you, Richard Burris Graden. Hi. If you have comments
Speaker 1: on something we said in this episode, call eight six six.
Speaker 1: Hey Jill, if you want to add to this conversation,
Speaker 1: that's eight six six four three nine five four five five.
Speaker 1: Don't forget to tell us your name and the episode
Speaker 1: you're referring to. You might just hear your message on
Speaker 1: a future episode. Thank you for listening to Jill Scott
Speaker 1: Presents Jay dot il the Podcast. This podcast is hosted
Speaker 1: by Jill Scott, Laia Saint Clair, and Aga Graden Danceler.
Speaker 1: It's executive producers are Jill Scott, Sean Gee, and Brian Calhoun.
Speaker 1: It's produced by la Saint Clair and me Eve Jeff Cope.
Speaker 1: The editing and sound design for this episode, We're done
Speaker 1: by Christina Lawnger. Guys, can you hear this? Windows open?
Speaker 1: It's a little bit, a little It's not gonna make
Speaker 1: you hot, though, because you know I don't want you
Speaker 1: to start. You know, I don't have these problems right now.
Speaker 1: I'm just warm because it's warm. Sure, sure, sure, sure sure.
Speaker 1: J dot Ill is a production of iHeartRadio. For more
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